Latest / The Dr. Psych Mom Show with clinical psychologist Dr. Samantha Rodman Whiten / Should You Ever Marry Someone If Sex Isn't Good When Dating?

Transcript

Should You Ever Marry Someone If Sex Isn't Good When Dating? · The Dr. Psych Mom Show with clinical psychologist Dr. Samantha Rodman Whiten

• 0:05
  Hi everybody. And welcome to the doctors.
• 0:07
  Psych mom show. Today we're going to talk about
• 0:10
  whether you should ever marry somebody.
• 0:13
  When sex is not good with them when you are dating and really,
• 0:18
  what does that even mean? Because there's plenty of
• 0:20
  people, I need that say, oh yes, sex was great.
• 0:23
  What we were dating when we talk about it and it wasn't and, and
• 0:27
  in very obvious ways that could have saved them.
• 0:30
  A lot of trouble. Had they paid attention before
• 0:34
  we get to this. Topic which I know you are on
• 0:36
  the edge of your seat to learn about, please do subscribe, my
• 0:40
  most recent subscriber episode was about handjobs, everybody's
• 0:44
  favorite thing that isn't a blowjob or sex, so, and
• 0:49
  sometimes better than either, and we will talk about when and
• 0:52
  where, and how, you know, where you could figure out, but the
• 0:55
  other ones and lots and lots of other subscriber episodes over
• 1:01
  probably now, God knows. But Five or so.
• 1:06
  Okay. So moving on.
• 1:08
  Should you ever marry somebody thinking that sex will get
• 1:12
  better or or that that sex is, you know, fine.
• 1:16
  And so it's not going to be a problem.
• 1:18
  Okay, what does this look like? Because y'all like examples as
• 1:22
  everybody does a lot more than just abstractions, okay?
• 1:26
  So for example, a man is dating a woman and she never has an
• 1:31
  orgasm and he brings it up and she doesn't really care to have
• 1:34
  an Kasim. Is this a good sign?
• 1:37
  Why is their sex life, good? Can anybody say it with me?
• 1:40
  Honeymoon stage? So honeymoon, stage a man could
• 1:44
  be fucking a cantaloupe, and it would be fine, you know, because
• 1:47
  his hormones are racing, his adrenaline is high, it's got a
• 1:51
  lot of oxytocin in the bloodstream, the cuddle hormone.
• 1:55
  He's visualizing a life with her.
• 1:57
  He's big romantic. So, does he understand that?
• 2:01
  It's like, you know, not ideal that she doesn't have an orgasm.
• 2:05
  Sure. But he's not thinking with his
• 2:07
  brain, he's thinking with his dick and his heart, you know,
• 2:11
  and he's telling himself that this is not bad because sex is
• 2:14
  good, what is? Sex is good mean, well, later on
• 2:18
  after the honeymoon stage faith, and for people, with more sexual
• 2:22
  experience at the get-go, it means that two people are
• 2:26
  involved in the sex life. They are engaged.
• 2:30
  They are present and they are both interested in giving and
• 2:34
  receiving With pleasure in a reciprocal, Mutual kind of way.
• 2:39
  Now, am I saying that no woman who has an orgasm can be a good
• 2:42
  wife, certainly not. But if you very much value sex,
• 2:48
  this is not a good sign. It's just not why?
• 2:52
  Because she doesn't care, you know?
• 2:55
  Like if I said a woman hasn't had an orgasm and so, we're
• 2:57
  really, you know, using a lot of new techniques and we're
• 3:00
  discovering it and she got close once and she was really excited
• 3:04
  and And now you know then not but you know we're still trying.
• 3:08
  Yeah that's a different kind of thing.
• 3:11
  She's interested in her own sexuality.
• 3:14
  Do I think people have to be interested in their sexuality to
• 3:16
  be loving Partners? No.
• 3:19
  But they do within if the other person's very interested in
• 3:22
  their sexuality and insects in general it's like anything.
• 3:26
  Like people just like they they don't see that.
• 3:29
  It's like every other thing like if you're into physical fitness,
• 3:33
  don't marry couch potato. Though, if you're into looking
• 3:36
  at art in museums, don't marry somebody who doesn't get art,
• 3:40
  that's the best analogy, right? Or music, right?
• 3:43
  So if forget about orgasm, not orgasm, if you like music, you
• 3:48
  don't want somebody who goes to a concert and is like, oh ha ha
• 3:54
  good. I guess that was a good one.
• 3:57
  Great. And then they just never listen
• 4:00
  to music. They don't give a shit.
• 4:02
  They don't seem to feel the music.
• 4:04
  They don't seem to be Moved by the music.
• 4:06
  They don't seem to be happy from the music.
• 4:07
  They don't have any favorite songs.
• 4:10
  They don't care what you put on, if you're really into music,
• 4:14
  that's not gonna do it for you. You're always going to feel like
• 4:17
  you're from different species and that's what I'm trying to
• 4:20
  get at. If you feel like your partner
• 4:23
  does not even and really, by the way this is both genders is
• 4:26
  going to say. If you don't feel like, they
• 4:27
  really even understand what you mean by good sex or valuing sex
• 4:31
  or prioritizing sex, then it's not a good fit.
• 4:35
  It. But and this also happens with
• 4:36
  women for their male Partners. So there's a lot of women who
• 4:39
  are much, kinkier and More Adventurous than the man is he
• 4:42
  just wants to have missionary sex a little kissing before,
• 4:46
  maybe doggy style and that's it. And he's done, there's no like
• 4:49
  mental component, there's no erotic component to it, you
• 4:53
  know, it's, um, I did the podcast and I have a post on
• 4:57
  erotic blueprint, so that really overlaps with this.
• 5:00
  If your erotic blueprint is kinky or Sensual and then you're
• 5:07
  with somebody who's just sexual straight up, it's not going to
• 5:10
  work, you know, like it's really not going to work long-term and
• 5:13
  maybe that can work certainly better than somebody who's just
• 5:16
  not into it really at all. So when guys end up in my office
• 5:21
  later on, and I say, guys, because most of the time, 80% of
• 5:24
  the time, you guys are in the situation in my office, it's 2/3
• 5:28
  of the time. So I'll just use guys, I'll make
• 5:31
  an example for women to, I guess the The point is guys come in
• 5:36
  and they're like, yeah, sex was great when we were dating.
• 5:39
  So I'm like, oh, what is that look like she never said, no,
• 5:42
  well did she ever initiate? No, she never initiated.
• 5:45
  Did she ever give you head? No, she never went down on me.
• 5:47
  That's something she just doesn't do.
• 5:48
  And I knew that from the beginning and that was fine.
• 5:51
  Why was that fine by the way? Why was that fine?
• 5:54
  Oh well, you know, cuz, you know, and what's the reason
• 5:59
  literally always, because they had no self-esteem, because they
• 6:02
  grew up with a mother. Usually, sometimes a father
• 6:05
  Other who is a difficult person, a fragile person, they got used
• 6:09
  to dealing with and walking on eggshells around somebody who's
• 6:13
  rigid in difficult around Myriad issues.
• 6:16
  And then so it makes sense to them to be dating.
• 6:19
  And the only 20s they're ever going to have to be dating a
• 6:22
  woman who really doesn't like their penis.
• 6:25
  You know? I mean it makes sense because
• 6:26
  you know what? We don't get to have these kind
• 6:28
  of things. That's the Mantra of the
• 6:29
  dysfunctional, family. We don't have things like that.
• 6:33
  You know, we don't have, we can have Have things other people
• 6:35
  have. So while they know
• 6:37
  intellectually that there must be other men out there who are
• 6:40
  getting blowjobs from their girlfriends or who are getting
• 6:42
  girlfriends, who initiate sex, or seemed to enjoy it or have an
• 6:46
  orgasm, or like do even the things, you know, crazy things
• 6:50
  like things that they look up in porn, you know, they just think
• 6:53
  this isn't meant for them. It feels a lot more familiar to
• 6:56
  be with somebody who has a million problems around
• 6:59
  everything and you have to do everything.
• 7:00
  Exactly just ride for them to give you any tiny Taste of You
• 7:05
  want and of course this is true with the gender inverse.
• 7:08
  So women will come in and say guy never went down on me guy.
• 7:11
  Never went down on you, you know, I mean I did a whole
• 7:14
  podcast about this this is not usual, guys.
• 7:17
  Love to do shit like that. Guys are more sexual, they have
• 7:19
  more testosterone, they have lowered discussed, they have
• 7:22
  lower inhibition around sex. So to get a guy who doesn't go
• 7:24
  down on you, you got to be a special kind of person and that
• 7:27
  kind of person is called an enabler of a difficult man,
• 7:31
  something that you probably learned as a kid watching your
• 7:33
  mother with your father or five. US versus it doesn't always go
• 7:36
  along gender lines. So the point is is if you're not
• 7:39
  having awesome sex, when you're dating and of course it can get
• 7:42
  even more awesome. After you get married for some
• 7:45
  particularly in the early years. If you're really learning about
• 7:47
  each other's bodies, before kids come into the mix at cetera or
• 7:51
  with a Renaissance after the kids get older, you know, that's
• 7:54
  some people. And I've discussed what a
• 7:55
  healthy sex life looks like in a different podcast but if sex is
• 7:59
  just kind of never exactly what you want and you're always like,
• 8:02
  waiting for it to be even kind of, okay.
• 8:05
  And the best part of it is that they don't say no don't marry
• 8:09
  that person. You know you're just gonna end
• 8:11
  up with a big therapy bill later on, you know?
• 8:14
  And it is that does that mean that sex is only the only
• 8:18
  important thing in marriage certainly not but you know what?
• 8:21
  Having kids isn't the only part of marriage either but you would
• 8:24
  divorce on that not divorce. You would choose not to marry
• 8:26
  somebody if they didn't want kids and you did.
• 8:29
  So right. I mean like anything like being
• 8:32
  employed isn't the only part of Being married.
• 8:35
  But if somebody during the dating phase said, you know
• 8:38
  what, I don't want to work like at all.
• 8:41
  You be like, what the fuck right?
• 8:42
  I mean in probably not be with them anymore.
• 8:45
  Like there's just certain things that are not the some entity,
• 8:48
  they're not the sum total of the entity of marriage, but they're
• 8:52
  like important. You know, like they are
• 8:54
  certainly important and sex is one of them and if you've been
• 8:57
  raised in a religious or a sex - home as a man then especially as
• 9:03
  a woman but even as Man because men have higher sex drive.
• 9:06
  You may think that like well it's not reasonable to expect
• 9:10
  some sort of good woman to also be sexual.
• 9:13
  That's some bullshit. I, you know, work with a lot of
• 9:16
  people and whether you have a high libido it really doesn't
• 9:20
  have to do with religion. Sometimes, I mean, makes it
• 9:24
  harder, you know, to be sex-positive.
• 9:26
  If you were raised in a super like Purity culture, environment
• 9:30
  or something, certainly. But I've dealt with people who
• 9:32
  are like Orthodox, Jewish, who are religious, It's Catholic and
• 9:36
  all the religions Muslim as well.
• 9:38
  It's based on the person there's High libido women and men of
• 9:43
  obviously, of every religion. So, so, it doesn't mean that
• 9:49
  like, you can't get a woman who's, like, a good or even
• 9:52
  religious woman. If that's important to you, that
• 9:55
  is going to be sex-positive within marriage now.
• 9:57
  Some people say, well, we didn't have sex at all before marriage.
• 10:00
  Well, I can't help you people, you know, like you're doing it
• 10:03
  to yourself there. Like, I I can't help you.
• 10:06
  It's like saying like, you know, getting like a business
• 10:09
  consultant and being like I refuse to do interviews for my
• 10:12
  positions. So then I end up with all of
• 10:14
  these people that don't know how to do the job.
• 10:17
  It's like, okay. Well I know one way to fix that
• 10:19
  but like you're kind of putting me in an impossible situation
• 10:22
  here because you know, it's kind of like I did a whole podcast on
• 10:25
  help rejecting complainers, you know?
• 10:27
  So like if your mean, if you are, here's here's the truth of
• 10:31
  it. If you are truly that religious,
• 10:33
  that you do not want to. Have sex before marriage because
• 10:36
  it's against your religion, then you got a lot bigger fish to
• 10:40
  fry, I guess, then you're living a very different kind of life.
• 10:43
  Post-marriage you are living you go in a church or synagogue
• 10:48
  whatever you're doing and you this is the point the point is
• 10:52
  to have children and to raise them in the same religion to be
• 10:55
  like a Pious person. In that case I keep the maybe
• 11:00
  it's not that important that you don't get a blow job you know I
• 11:03
  mean maybe it is completely on a When playing a different
• 11:05
  spiritual plane of existence then doesn't truck with what I
• 11:08
  see in my office. But I mean you can have both
• 11:13
  things right? Like you cannot have sex before
• 11:14
  marriage but also somehow magically want sex to be good
• 11:20
  after marriage because the people that want to have good
• 11:23
  sex lives sometimes and this is something that I've heard from
• 11:27
  many people decide not to listen to that rule of religion.
• 11:33
  It's a pretty big after they wanted to explore, you know,
• 11:37
  their sexuality, they want to have boyfriends and girlfriends,
• 11:39
  they want to be physically intimate, you could do plenty of
• 11:42
  things without sex, you know. So.
• 11:44
  So I guess for some people, the compromises they do, quote
• 11:47
  everything bought. And then for some reason they
• 11:50
  think that God likes oral sex better than, than intercourse,
• 11:54
  maybe Gods like every man. So you know.
• 11:58
  So so then they say, okay, we're doing everything but, and the
• 12:01
  person is very, you know, giving I'm good and game or whatever,
• 12:06
  GGG and doing this stuff doing everything.
• 12:10
  But so good. So that is a good green flat,
• 12:13
  right? So you're doing everything but
• 12:16
  and the person's really into it. They have orgasms.
• 12:19
  They give you orgasms. Everything's cool.
• 12:22
  So that's that's like a compromise.
• 12:24
  I guess. You know what, even if they end
• 12:26
  up hating intercourse, you can do all these other things,
• 12:29
  right? So that seems like something
• 12:31
  that people used to do also you know not all the oral because
• 12:35
  that's only in recent Generations.
• 12:37
  That's not like in the 50s it was more intercourse but people
• 12:40
  used to dry hump at least a lot you know.
• 12:42
  And if a girl can get off when your dry humping, then she's
• 12:47
  probably not going to be that sex - later on.
• 12:50
  Or at least we know she has a libido of some sort.
• 12:54
  So, you know, you got to kind of think rationally, if you are
• 12:59
  dating. Now, most of the people that I'm
• 13:01
  talking to are not going to be dating in their 20s, there's a
• 13:03
  people who are dating again after divorce.
• 13:05
  So in this case, if the sex life is not great, get out.
• 13:10
  What do you, how many marriages do you need?
• 13:12
  You know, to where things are not good, right?
• 13:15
  So if you're not having good sex, when you're dating, you
• 13:18
  give it a few more times if you You know, maybe a few more weeks
• 13:22
  months, something but don't marry somebody where the sex is
• 13:25
  not great because at that stage of the game, certainly you have
• 13:28
  one life and you why would you want to be with somebody where
• 13:31
  they did not share a similar value.
• 13:33
  It's like being a foodie that's with somebody who likes to you
• 13:37
  know, not eat. You know, like why would you do
• 13:39
  that? There's, it's foolish.
• 13:41
  Like sex is something that you enjoy that you that you Delight
• 13:45
  in. That is a big part of who you
• 13:47
  are at least, you know, in whatever stage of your If you're
• 13:51
  in understanding, it's not the sum total again of a
• 13:54
  relationship that it is a big important part.
• 13:57
  And so, why would you compromise on that?
• 14:00
  That one seems to make people the most unhappy to compromise
• 14:03
  on particularly males. You know.
• 14:05
  So hopefully this was interesting for you guys and
• 14:10
  again like because when people are very sexy - not that a lot
• 14:14
  of super sex - people listen to me because it would not like my
• 14:17
  podcast. But knots remember, as I told
• 14:20
  Told you if you're trying to share my stuff with your partner
• 14:23
  and they don't like it cool, don't keep forcing it down their
• 14:27
  throat, right? Just try to share some of the
• 14:30
  you know the moral of the story like that you got from the
• 14:33
  podcast in your own words. Don't bombard them with my stuff
• 14:36
  if they don't like it. Right.
• 14:38
  So in this case you know, I mean there might not be much to say
• 14:43
  to a partner whose sex - on the part about, we shouldn't have
• 14:47
  got married and then like that. That's not what you would want
• 14:50
  to share but Could share is something about, you know, what
• 14:54
  it really is for me. It's kind of like you know, a
• 14:57
  foodie being with somebody who doesn't really like to go out to
• 15:00
  eat, you know? So that's more what it is.
• 15:02
  I feel like there's like a big part of me that can't be
• 15:06
  understood by you and it would be very meaningful to me.
• 15:09
  If you could try to empathize with that situation with that,
• 15:13
  this is a big core part of me and I know it's never been a big
• 15:17
  core part of you. I realized that now that I was
• 15:20
  kind of wishing it was and it wasn't but you know, maybe with
• 15:24
  work. Maybe if we go to therapy, maybe
• 15:26
  if we go to, you know, sexologist a couple's counselor,
• 15:30
  whatever. Then we can try to get to
• 15:32
  somewhere that's in between where you can understand how big
• 15:35
  of a deal. This is to me and try a little
• 15:38
  bit to get outside your comfort zone.
• 15:39
  And I can try to empathize with how kind of you don't really
• 15:43
  perceive this as anything, that is even a remote part of your
• 15:47
  identity. It's a lot of guys, struggle
• 15:50
  with that. Struggle with it.
• 15:51
  They think those things. Like if she's not getting it
• 15:53
  from me she must be getting it from someone else and something
• 15:56
  like that in reality the woman just dislikes it like well, you
• 15:59
  know, when she feels she's been consistently on brand saying
• 16:02
  that pretty much from the beginning.
• 16:04
  She, I mean she she didn't like it much ever, and she certainly
• 16:07
  didn't say to the guy boy that sucked after every time of
• 16:10
  intercourse, because she felt like it was pretty obvious.
• 16:12
  She wasn't that into it and that he loved her anyway.
• 16:15
  And sex is not a big part of a relationship and, you know, it
• 16:18
  is what it is, and sometimes it can be very Very transformative
• 16:21
  for men to even understand that and validate that in their
• 16:24
  wife's. You know, that that that's how
• 16:26
  their wife felt because otherwise she keeps feeling
• 16:29
  like, but man, I was never into sex like what is it with you?
• 16:32
  Of course, we did it. More at the beginning.
• 16:33
  You wanted to do it more at the beginning and I was young,
• 16:36
  everything worked a little different.
• 16:38
  There was no pain. There was no nothing we had no
• 16:40
  kids. Sure I did it with you more but
• 16:42
  of course, I never really liked it.
• 16:44
  Didn't you see that? Like didn't, you know that I
• 16:46
  thought that was understood? And meanwhile the guy had
• 16:48
  deluded himself that things were very Different than they were
• 16:52
  even if, for example, she never orgasmed, or she never asked to
• 16:55
  do it to pretty big indicators. But if you're young and you want
• 17:00
  to think different. And as I said, a key key
• 17:02
  takeaway from this is, if you are used to dealing with, if you
• 17:07
  grew up in a home where things were just kind of different and
• 17:10
  worse for your family and that was like a culture of your
• 17:13
  family, like we don't get to have nice things, then, you
• 17:17
  know, that's kind of what you end up doing and who you end up
• 17:20
  married. Be somebody who can't give you
• 17:22
  quote nice things because you don't really think you deserve
• 17:24
  them. And you've never really been
• 17:26
  somebody who has thought that you would get these good or nice
• 17:30
  things that other people got whether their sexual or
• 17:33
  emotional or anything else. All right?
• 17:36
  Well, I hope this left you with something to think about and I
• 17:39
  will talk to everybody soon. Bye.
• 17:40
  Bye guys.