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From Bagpipes To Boardrooms With James Laughlin · That Home Loan Hub

0:10
He coaches champions, he's written the playbook on high performance.
0:14
And today he's on that Homeland Hub, James Lochlan.
0:17
Hello.
0:18
Welcome to that.
0:20
Lovely to be here.
0:21
Thanks for having me.
0:22
Thank you so much for saying yes.
0:23
I'm so excited to have you because you're gonna be number one author this year.
0:28
Did you know that?
0:29
Oh, that's nice.
0:30
Yeah, last year we got number one, number one bestseller.
0:32
So that'd be good to get it again this year.
0:34
I'll take that.
0:34
Yes.
0:35
Well, I voted for you.
0:36
I've got your book.
0:37
Um I voted for you, and I've told everyone to vote for you because it's just an incredible, incredible book that you've written.
0:44
But before we dive into all of that, what I want to find out is who is James Loughlin and how did he get here?
0:51
Yep, so I live down in Christchurch and I've been here 21 years.
0:55
I'm clearly a very slow learner because I haven't quite mastered the Kiwi accent yet.
1:00
So I came from Ireland and my mission was simple.
1:03
I came here at 19, and school in Christchurch wanted to become the first world champions.
1:09
And it was very specific.
1:11
They want to become the first Kiwis to win the world championships in piping and drumming.
1:16
So think bagpipes and drums.
1:18
So I was a world champion drummer as a youngster.
1:21
I won it at 13, I won it at 14, again at 18.
1:24
And so they wanted me to come down and run a drumming program.
1:27
So I came down, it took many years, but eventually they did become the first and still the only Kiwis to win the world championships.
1:34
And so that's what brought me here.
1:36
And many years into that, I got a little bored with drumming, but realized that high performance is high performance.
1:43
And so started looking at different industries.
1:46
And now I actually coach prime ministers, armies, people down in Antarctica, mortgage brokers, people running small companies, large companies, the lot.
1:56
I love it.
1:56
I absolutely love it.
1:57
Because when I was reading about you, I was like, wow, a drama.
2:00
And now he is like coaching people on stuff.
2:04
This is incredible.
2:04
And you're right.
2:05
Like I was trying to find where's that line, the connector line.
2:10
And it's all about the habits.
2:12
It's all about who we are as humans, what made us who we are, and how can we change that for the better?
2:20
100%.
2:21
And we are so in control of our destiny.
2:23
I know there's lots of variables that we tend to focus on, like macroeconomics, war, weather.
2:29
But actually, there's so many things we can control.
2:31
And if that becomes a habit of controlling your controllables, I've just seen so many people take things from good to great in a short space of time.
2:40
That's amazing.
2:40
So tell me a little bit about your life in Christchurch now.
2:43
Like obviously, you talk a lot in your book about the leadership, the habits, the mental load that we all take in.
2:52
And finance is one of the key instruments that plays in people's lives, right?
2:56
If finance are bad, people tend to have a worse of lives.
3:00
If finance is better in life, then usually we tend to have a better quality of life.
3:04
Usually.
3:06
What's your take on that?
3:07
I'm curious to know because obviously, with my hat on as a mortgage advisor, as a person in finances, I'm always curious about people's mindset around money and how did they change for them over time?
3:18
Great question, Zibanis.
3:20
So I want to say, first of all, you are full of BS, belief systems, right?
3:26
So I want you to just take that in the listener as well.
3:29
You are full of BS belief systems.
3:31
So I grew up in Ireland, 12,000 miles from here.
3:35
You were in Tajikistan?
3:36
Yes.
3:37
Okay, so long way from Ireland and a long way from New Zealand.
3:41
So I'm gonna ask you to conf complete this sentence out loud and see if you can finish it.
3:47
So money doesn't grow on trees.
3:53
Trees, right?
3:54
So there we go.
3:55
Boom.
3:55
We didn't grow up anywhere next to you, you probably had a different language.
3:58
I'm sure you in your country, your first language is probably not English.
4:02
So you still completed it the same.
4:03
In America, when I asked the question, they still complete it with money doesn't grow on trees.
4:07
New Zealand, same.
4:09
That's our BS.
4:10
That's our belief systems.
4:13
When anything is repeated to us, or we repeat anything over and over, we start to believe it is true, even without evidence.
4:21
That's really what a belief is.
4:22
There's often not physical belief or physical evidence about this belief.
4:26
So money doesn't grow on trees.
4:28
Does that help me make money?
4:29
No.
4:30
Does that help me invest money?
4:31
No.
4:32
Does that help me pay a mortgage down?
4:34
No.
4:34
There's going to be scarcity, there's going to be lack.
4:37
So the only thing we need to do is change our BS, change our belief systems.
4:43
So I did that at about 19, started doing it.
4:46
It takes a while.
4:46
I read a book called The One Minute Millionaire.
4:51
And it was just so transformational.
4:53
I backed that up with Think and Grow Rich, two great books.
4:57
And for me, that really shifted it to money grows on trees.
5:01
Money is everywhere.
5:03
Money is for the taking, and money is so helpful.
5:06
And I don't say that with any level of arrogance, but with belief.
5:10
I've seen it.
5:10
I've seen when I changed my own mindset, how that's transformed my life and my connection with money and finance and how it's helped the people I coach.
5:19
Even if I make it more simple, a little story, my son.
5:22
So my son's now 10.
5:24
When he was about five or six, we went back to Ireland and he asked one of his family members there, Hey, could I have that toy?
5:32
And they said, Look, son, you had one yesterday.
5:35
Money doesn't grow on trees.
5:37
And he said, Oh, but it's at five years of age.
5:41
And they says, What do you mean?
5:43
Well, dad told me that money grows on trees and money's everywhere.
5:46
And he says, Well, can you explain yourself?
5:48
Yeah, yeah.
5:49
So dad said that money, the money tree, is your mind.
5:53
And if you keep watering your mind by learning and being curious and going to school, then you become more valuable.
5:59
And when you add value, the money just shows up.
6:02
And I laugh my head off as like, he's got it, he's got it down.
6:05
That's what I believe about money.
6:07
It is there, it grows on trees, the tree is your mind.
6:10
You've got to keep learning.
6:11
I love that.
6:12
I I read that in your book last night, and I was just thinking, what a beautiful way to teach the next generation, you know, because you and I, I think we're quite similar age, of course, 10 years younger, although I've been here 23 years as well in New Zealand.
6:27
I love it.
6:28
And I also have a 10-year-old, you know, and it's incredible to see how what we've been brought up with, where there is scarcity, that you know, there is no abundance, you have to make sure you squirrel away enough for the next day.
6:42
And, you know, life is hard.
6:45
And you've got to work hard at it.
6:47
So for me, when I when I'm looking at my kids and what I'm trying to teach them, is basically what you're saying, is that if you work hard, if you actually expand your brain, if you keep asking why, why is this and why is that, then staying curious helps you, regardless of your age, regardless whether you're 70 years old, 90 years old, or 15.
7:08
I think the moment you stop being curious, that's when you become a bit of a hard shell.
7:14
But while you've got that soft shell and the brain consistently is working, because brain is a muscle, right?
7:20
We can work on it, we can create new neural signals.
7:24
And that's where I'm I always get excited when I work with my clients, when they come in and they've got all those mindsets.
7:29
You know, I work with a lot of Maurian Pacificists where they come in and they go, our generation never, you know, my parents never had a house.
7:36
We grew up in state homes.
7:38
We never even thought it would be possible to buy a house.
7:41
So to see them to shift that relationship with money from going living week to week, where money just disappears and you don't even know where money went, to a situation where you suddenly feel empowered and you know what to do with money.
7:59
That's so cool to see, isn't it, James?
8:02
Honestly, it is.
8:02
And I think the key here is getting yourself around people that know more about finance than you.
8:09
And for me, I started with that one-minute millionaire book.
8:13
It was an awesome read.
8:14
Then I also read Tony Robbins.
8:16
I'm in my mid-20s, it would have been uh Money Master the Game.
8:19
It's about a 600-page book.
8:21
And I looked at it, I was like, there's no way I'm going to read a book like that.
8:23
And I started reading, going, oh, this information is so valuable.
8:27
But still, there was blocks for me.
8:30
So for me, a mortgage is 25 years, right?
8:32
25 years of say, let's say your house is 30 New Zealand.
8:37
30, right?
8:40
So you buy your house, let's say roughly 700K, you're going to end up paying almost one and a half million in total for that house.
8:47
It's an absolute joke.
8:49
So I then spent some time with a mortgage broker.
8:52
I'd never heard of what a mortgage broker was.
8:55
And so I started chatting, and they were like, James, we've got nothing to sell you.
8:58
Like, we're not going to charge you anything, but we've got a product that could actually really help you.
9:02
And we can represent you and go to the banks on your behalf.
9:04
And it blew my mind.
9:07
It went from, I think I had 24 years left, down to just a few years.
9:13
I'm like, oh my God, this is a game changer.
9:16
And you know, getting rid of a mortgage, it's like that's never going to happen before the age of 65.
9:21
That's never going to happen in the next few years.
9:23
But with the right structure, the right advice, the right support, it changed my entire life.
9:29
So I'm a big advocate of brokers, that's for sure.
9:32
Wow.
9:32
Thank you.
9:33
Thank you.
9:33
And you know, I usually have a joke about it that if you decide to take a 30-year mortgage, you're actually not just buying yourself a house, you're buying a bank a house as well.
9:41
100%.
9:42
Let's not do that.
9:43
Yeah, let's not do that.
9:45
Let's not give bank another house.
9:46
How do we tackle that?
9:48
And what I find is a lot of first-time buyers, when they come in, they normally get educated by the BS system of their parents or the environment where they are.
9:57
So usually it's that, yeah, you know, you just make the minimum repayments or you just stick on to one year fixed rate, you know, that's the best for you.
10:04
The other joke I have is usually about the Uncle Bob at the barbecue, because the Uncle Bob has the best advice, you know, but then he's the one that actually doesn't even have a house, probably, and never owned a house in his entire life.
10:16
So I I truly believe that you've got to surround yourself with people that know a little bit more than you, but also how do you implement that knowledge then?
10:24
You know, because a lot of people then the ego kicks in and they go, Well, I know better.
10:28
And that's where you have to drop the ego and go, how can I learn from that person?
10:33
How can I do better?
10:34
And how can I not not that fully trust or not trust, but about applying your own feelings and your own mindset to that as well, and what feels right for you.
10:45
Yeah, I think ego is a big part of it.
10:47
You know, money is probably one of the most uncomfortable topics for people to talk about.
10:51
So if I walk into a room, like, hey, how much do you earn?
10:54
People are like, excuse me, how much do you earn?
10:56
I don't want to talk about that.
10:58
Why not?
10:59
Let's chat.
10:59
How much do you earn?
11:00
I'll tell you how much I earn.
11:01
No way, that's so private.
11:03
It's so taboo.
11:05
And yet it's the one thing that we should be more open about because the fact that it is taboo means that we tend to not understand how it actually works, how to grow it, how to invest it.
11:16
Over the last decade, I've spent so much time around people who are so much further down the track than me with property, with finance, with lending, with investing.
11:27
I get them on my podcast, I work with them, I coach them.
11:30
And yeah, I might be coaching them in their lives, but I'm learning so much about their area of skill.
11:36
And so I think it's one area that we should all dolls not know at all about.
11:42
Yeah, absolutely.
11:42
You know, when I first came to New Zealand, I didn't know much about money at all because, like you, you know, I grew up in a family where we didn't really talk much about money.
11:51
And my mom was academic, my dad was academic, so it was from a very academic family, they don't talk about money.
11:58
And especially to kids, like kids shouldn't know about money.
12:01
It's sort of a taboo thing, you know, it's an adult topic.
12:04
You don't talk about kids about money and how to save.
12:07
So when I came to New Zealand, I was 16, and I remember my brother set me up with this bank account, and I would go into the ATM and I'll take the money out.
12:14
And this, I don't think I've told anyone the story recently at all, but it was hilarious.
12:19
I came up to the ATM one time, I was out with my friends, and I knew I normally had like hundred dollars to spend.
12:24
So I took the money out, and I was like, oh, actually, you know, I'll see if I I've got another 20.
12:29
I didn't know how to press check balances at that time.
12:32
I my English was really bad.
12:33
So I just kept withdrawing money and it kept spitting out money.
12:36
And I was so excited.
12:37
I was like, oh my god, I hacked into someone else's account, and ATM is giving me free money.
12:42
I didn't realize I was going into overdraft.
12:46
I discovered that a few days later when my brother got the statement and he said to me, What have you done?
12:51
I think I took out like another hundred or two hundred dollars extra.
12:54
That's brilliant.
12:56
And I didn't realize the repercussions of that, you know, the overdraft, the unarranged overdraft fees, the interest rate on those funds that you withdrawn and things like that.
13:05
And that's when it hit me that oh, money doesn't grow on trees, money doesn't just get spit out by ATM, but you can learn about money and you can educate yourself.
13:14
So, one of the first things um I've done in my 20s is apart from getting a job at the bank, which was an absolute fluke in my in my mindset, because I was actually going towards counseling.
13:24
I was going to become a counselor, work with students, I really enjoyed that side.
13:28
And I ended up getting a part-time job at the bank.
13:31
And that's what absolutely changed my relationship with money in my early 20s, going, huh.
13:36
I see a lot of people coming in here.
13:38
And it was a different because I was on a teller, you know, at the front line, and I could see various people.
13:44
I could see people that had multiple properties.
13:47
I and then I saw people that were on benefit, you know, and the the contrast of what people were earning and what were they doing with the money, and it was really interesting to see the beneficiaries would come in every Tuesday and Thursday and take the money out and they would spend it all.
14:01
So by next week, they would be out there again, waiting.
14:04
Versus the rich people just kept coming in, they would always put money in to the account, they would always have lots of money dropping into the account.
14:12
Now start wondering how does it work?
14:14
Because they're not really earning much, but somehow the money's coming from somewhere.
14:17
What's going on here?
14:19
And one of the courses I did was with Tawananga outaroa, they had certificate in money management.
14:24
And I swear by that program was the best free course I've ever done in my life.
14:29
And the coach was teaching us about how to buy an investment property using your own house.
14:36
And you know, how do you grow from there?
14:37
And what do you do with the money and the term deposits and the shares and investments?
14:41
Like as a little 23, 24-year-old, absolutely blew my world.
14:46
And then what that was a catalyst for me.
14:49
Then in the next 10 years, we sort of went from one house to 14 properties, you know, by working hard and by applying those simple rules.
14:58
And we weren't earning anything extra.
14:59
I think I was on like 45k per annum salary, and my husband at the time was also on about similar wage, but it was just about how to apply those rules in life and how can you catapult yourself from there?
15:12
How amazing.
15:13
Did you have something similar happen to you where there was like, I know you said about the book, but what else?
15:17
I'm really curious to get under that skin of yours to find out what else happened in your life that triggered you to be better with money.
15:26
Yeah, like I didn't grow up with money, so like we had enough uh to get by.
15:30
And my parents always made sure we had got clothes on, shoes on, food in the bellies, but we didn't have an abundance of money around.
15:38
So I always wondered what it would be like to have money.
15:41
And so I just started spending time with people who were much better off than I was, and you know, we're very successful, and they were very kind to give me their time and lend their time.
15:51
So some of them were, you know, billionaires, multi-millionaires, running countries, running Fortune 50 companies.
15:58
Getting a chance to be around those people really shifts what you believe is possible, and it goes from this minuscule thinking to this possibility thinking.
16:06
And sitting in what's possible allowed me to start making some changes.
16:11
And at one point I was building a property portfolio, and then I met someone and they showed me a different path, and that was through investing in shares and stocks and bonds, and so I took things in a totally different direction.
16:25
But I don't think that matters what the vehicle is, the vehicles all work, but you've got to pick one and stick to it and be disciplined.
16:33
Yeah, so for me, it was just the fact that there could be more in life, and the more I have, the more I get to give.
16:40
And so I love to be able to give, whether it's of time, of money, and I love giving quietly.
16:45
So I don't need to tell people, hey, I'm going to donate this to this charity.
16:48
It's so nice to do it quietly where nobody knows, and it's anonymous.
16:54
And I think that some people get it wrong where it's like, hey, I've got to be so public about all of my giving.
16:59
Like, well, I don't think you do.
17:00
I think giving quietly and tithing is a really good way to live.
17:04
I love that.
17:05
Can we just talk for a minute about meds in your book?
17:09
You talk a lot about how people should be really on meds.
17:12
Let's decipher that.
17:14
Yeah, so I'm work with a lot of high performers, whether they're athletes or business folk, and often they're busy, sometimes burnt out, sometimes, you know, just frustrated with how full on their life is.
17:25
So once a month, I'll ask these guys to take their meds.
17:29
And I'm gonna ask the listener to do it right now.
17:31
So M stands for mental training or meditation.
17:36
In the last month, how much mental training have you done?
17:39
Have you just been busy?
17:40
Have you been just flat out working?
17:42
Or have you made time for mental training?
17:45
So one to five, one being terrible, five being awesome in the last month.
17:48
E, exercise.
17:50
Right?
17:51
Common sense yet rarely common practice.
17:54
You know, how much exercise have you done in the last month?
17:57
Has it been every day?
17:58
Has it been intense?
17:59
Has it been varied?
18:00
Give yourself a one to five there.
18:02
D is diet.
18:04
You know, what are you putting in your mouth?
18:05
What are you drinking?
18:06
What are you consuming?
18:07
Is it whole foods or is it ultra-processed?
18:10
One to five there.
18:12
Alcohol is included in that one, of course.
18:15
And last but not least, the most important one, S sleep.
18:20
What's your sleep been like over the last month?
18:22
The people I work with that are at the highest element of their performance are always nurturing their sleep.
18:28
So I've got certain protocols that I take my clients through to elevate their sleep because I know when they sleep better, they perform better and they can go for longer and faster.
18:37
So that's your meds.
18:38
I suggest everyone takes it once a month, a little 90-second snapshot.
18:43
Sebony, so if you were to think about that, which one of those is your lowest ranking this past month?
18:50
Interesting, because I thought I was quite good.
18:53
Because every morning when I wake up, what I do is I just hit the button on my phone.
18:57
And I know we usually talk about, you know, don't go on your phone first thing in the morning.
19:00
But what I do is I open the phone and I hit the YouTube button that's already pre-programmed on meditation channel.
19:05
And it's just a sometimes it's really random meditation, sometimes it's the ones I like.
19:10
So just whatever hits me hits me in that moment.
19:13
And I try to spend about 10 to 15 minutes every single morning, no excuses.
19:17
The kids could be jumping all over me, all around me, and I just lie there with my eyes shut and I listen to the meditation.
19:24
And I've noticed the difference.
19:26
If I don't do those mornings with the meditation, it's like the whole day just keeps going wrong for me.
19:31
But the mornings when I do, things tend to flow better.
19:34
Then usually I get up and I do my yoga again, 10 to 15 minutes.
19:37
It doesn't have to be long.
19:39
And this is what I'm trying to also show to my friends who are a lot of busy mums, and they say, Oh, I don't have the time for this.
19:45
Actually, you do, you just need to find the time for this important thing.
19:49
Because, as you say in your book, if you don't find the time for your health, you will have to find the time for sickness.
19:55
It will catch up with you at some point.
19:57
So, 10 to 15 minutes every day, yoga.
20:00
Again, it's on the app.
20:02
I just hit the button, I don't even have to think about things.
20:04
And this is the beauty of the times that we live in these days.
20:07
Everything can be on your phone at the touch of your palm.
20:10
You just have to know what you're using.
20:12
Instead of sitting there scrolling mindlessly, you can actually have apps that are useful to get you to that next level.
20:18
Then with the diet, again, I tend to eat, I think, quite healthy.
20:23
I don't eat chips, chocolates, I don't drink, I don't smoke, I don't vape.
20:28
So I'm kind of boring.
20:29
That's good.
20:30
This is a very good thing.
20:32
The only thing I found, I don't eat enough fruit.
20:34
So when I travel, like Bali, you know, if we go somewhere, oh my god, the fruit is in abundance, right?
20:39
It's deer.
20:40
But I find in New Zealand I really struggle finding fruit that I enjoy that doesn't cost me an arm and a leg.
20:47
Yes.
20:48
And that's going to be the most important one because under the age of 50, one of the biggest rise is uh colorectal cancer and so colon cancer.
20:55
So it's really important to get as much fiber in as you can.
20:58
Yes, exactly.
20:59
So that's where I would probably rate myself the lowest is the diet, is I need to eat more fruits.
21:05
I don't eat fried stuff, I don't really have takeaways.
21:08
So I think I'm okay there, but I definitely could be better.
21:11
And then sleep.
21:12
Oh my god.
21:13
I actually programmed my phone to switch off at 10 o'clock.
21:16
It goes into sleep mode, it goes black and white.
21:19
Even if I have to do something on it, it just shuts off.
21:23
And I just have to put it away.
21:25
So I trained my brain to go, cool, if the alarm goes off at sleep time, I need to put my phone away, and then I just need to spend either if I can't get to sleep, read a book.
21:34
And that usually puts me to sleep really fast.
21:37
But yeah, fair enough.
21:38
I'm the same.
21:39
Yeah.
21:40
Sleep has definitely been one of the ones that does get affected for me because I still have young kids that like to walk around at night.
21:46
You know, they either have a bleeding nose or they're not feeling well, or there's a monster under their bed.
21:51
So that's where probably the two where I would rate myself the lowest.
21:55
And that's why it's important for me to go to bed as early as possible.
21:58
So if I do get interrupted at night, I'm not an absolute wreck the next morning.
22:02
What about you?
22:03
100%.
22:05
Lowest one in the last month, it would be exercise.
22:10
And since we got we were in Europe for a month, and then when I got back, it was within 24 hours back on a plane to Melbourne, then Fiji, then back to New Zealand, then back to Fiji.
22:20
It's been nonstop for keynotes.
22:22
I do a lot of keynote speaking at events.
22:24
And so my exercise hasn't been consistent.
22:26
So June just started as as we're the day that we're recording here.
22:29
I'm gonna make June my month to focus on exercise for sure and re-establish that rhythm.
22:35
Nice.
22:36
I've just joined the gym again.
22:37
I've never been an exercise person.
22:39
I grew up in a country where we were, you know, it used to be historically a Muslim country, and then we had a war.
22:45
So growing up as a girl in a Muslim country, you don't really get to do much exercise.
22:50
So I grew up with not much exercise apart from climbing trees on my own.
22:55
So growing up in New Zealand, then I exercise was never part of my thing.
23:00
So you'll be shocked to know, but I can't even ride a bike.
23:03
And I'm not a good swimmer.
23:06
So I'm trying to push myself now to learn those things as an adult.
23:10
Cool.
23:11
Because if I'm in the water and if my kids are in trouble or whatever, you know, I have that responsibility.
23:16
I suddenly realized.
23:17
So I really need to get my A into G and learn those things.
23:21
And doing those things are great for your brain.
23:22
Learning new things as an adult creates new neural pathways, which will serve you at work as well.
23:28
So I think go for it, get the bike out, get in the swimming pool, have fun.
23:32
Well, it actually terrified me.
23:34
The other day I was at the swimming pool with the kids, and we had they pull out this.
23:37
I don't know if you guys go got it in Christchurch as well, but it's a blow-up thing and you can run on it, like uh, I don't know, ninja warriors or whatever they call it.
23:46
Yeah, so my kids were challenging me.
23:48
They're like, Come on, mom, you can do this.
23:49
I was like, Oh my god.
23:50
But I didn't realize it was at the deepest part of the pool because I never usually go there.
23:54
I usually hang out with the kids at the kitties pool.
23:57
So I was like, Cool, I'll prove my kids that I can run this Ninja Warrior thing.
24:01
So I was actually doing really well.
24:02
I was running and then I fell and I didn't realize how deep it was, it was like three meters deep.
24:08
And as I was underwater, I was like, Well, there's no one's coming to save me, so I have to save myself.
24:13
So swim for your life, really.
24:14
And I had to like pedal, pedal, pedal, pedal to get to the top.
24:18
And I realized in that moment that it's very irrelevant in life as well.
24:22
You know, sometimes there's no one else coming to save you.
24:25
You've got to save yourself.
24:26
You you are the one that can just pedal yourself to the top.
24:29
And in that moment, I also realized I should probably learn how to swim.
24:32
Good.
24:33
Yeah, you've got to participate in your own rescue in life, in business, in your wealth.
24:37
Nobody's coming to fix it for you.
24:39
Uh so yeah, I think it's a great mantra to live by.
24:42
Yeah, and it's funny because a lot of people say to me, you know, how did you get to where you are?
24:46
You know, you must have been lucky.
24:48
But I look at your book and it's yeah, it's not luck, right?
24:52
The harder you work, the luckier you get.
24:54
And, you know, high performance, you know, whether I'm working with someone who's in the all blacks, someone who's a gold medalist in Olympics or a great tennis player, they were not lucky.
25:04
They just got a really consistent set of habits.
25:07
They stuck to them for a long time, and they became world class.
25:11
It's the same in any field.
25:13
You know, if we've got someone listening right now who's in finance, stick to it, become an expert, play the long game.
25:19
Just name any other field, it doesn't matter what it is, get radically clear on how good you want to become, stay in your lane, stay there for a long time, and you will get all the results you ever wanted.
25:30
But how do you deal with frustration?
25:31
Because a lot of a lot of the time people would get frustrated of not seeing the results straight away or not seeing improvements in where they want to go.
25:40
How do you s stick to the course?
25:43
Yeah, so people will get frustrated.
25:46
And most people, when they get frustrated and don't get results, they'll change course.
25:52
And they'll go on that course for a little bit until they get impatient and frustrated and they'll change course again.
25:58
So over the course of 10 years, they might have three or four different paths.
26:02
Get to the end of the decade and they go, Hmm, I don't really have a lot to show for this.
26:08
Which one's going to be more painful?
26:10
Getting to the end of the decade, going, I have nothing to show because I kept being frustrated and impatient, or sticking to one thing, uh pushing through the impatience, being more patient, getting rid of the frustration, staying at it for 10 years and becoming the most well-known person in that field.
26:29
You're financially abundant, you're physically abundant, you've got everything you want in life.
26:34
Which one would you rather have?
26:36
I think the answer is obvious, but most people don't realize the gold is just a little bit further ahead.
26:41
Stay in the game a little bit longer, and you will get the results.
26:46
Because in your book, you also talk a lot about the shiny object syndrome.
26:51
And I think a lot of high-performing people can also get distracted.
26:56
Yeah.
26:57
Because you get frustrated, as you were saying.
26:59
So, how do you stay, like, how do you ignore the noise?
27:02
And how do you even know what's the right noise, what's the wrong noise?
27:05
How do you like how do you get that tunnel vision?
27:07
Yeah, let me tell you a story.
27:09
So I had a young guy come to me and say, Look, hey, could you be my coach?
27:13
Yeah, I could be, yeah.
27:15
So we rock along, first session, and uh, I ask him the first question, and I'm gonna ask him three questions.
27:21
And for your listener, I'm gonna ask him to write these questions down.
27:24
Doesn't matter who I'm working with, it's these same three questions.
27:27
So he rocks up for a first session.
27:29
I say, What do you want?
27:32
And he goes, I says, I'll stop you right there and I'll see you next week.
27:38
He says, What?
27:39
I've just paid you a small fortune to coach me.
27:41
Like, what do you mean, see you next week?
27:43
We're just getting started.
27:44
I says, No, I'll see you next week.
27:46
We're done for today.
27:47
He says, I'm so confused.
27:49
I says, Yes, I know you are.
27:50
That's why I'm sending you home.
27:52
So off he went.
27:53
And he was confused because he started with when I ask most people, what do you want?
27:59
They don't know.
28:00
They go, you know, what's your financial abundance number that you could retire at?
28:05
Oh, hey, what would your dream job make you feel like?
28:09
Tell me about your dream relationship.
28:11
As soon as you start with any of the ums or the ahs, you've no clue what you want.
28:16
So he comes back the following week.
28:18
I look him in the eye and I say, What do you want?
28:22
And he says, To be a great all black.
28:26
I was like, okay, great.
28:28
I can deal, I can work with that.
28:29
Second question, we're gonna move to the second question today.
28:32
Why do you want that so badly?
28:35
And that's a question we all need to be able to answer.
28:37
Why do we want the big goal so badly?
28:39
And so he rhymed off so many reasons why.
28:42
And family were involved, and it would make his grandparents proud, and it was his dream since he was four years old, and awesome.
28:49
Third and final question, and he says, James, we've been chatting for two minutes.
28:54
I mean, I'm paying you for a whole hour.
28:55
I was like, no, no, no.
28:56
You're not paying me for time, you're paying me for an outcome.
29:00
Third and final question How much are you willing to suffer to get that result?
29:07
And he says, What?
29:08
I'm not I'm not paying you to make me suffer.
29:10
I'm paying you to coach me to get there faster.
29:12
I want to become an all-black as quick as possible.
29:15
And I says, Look, let me get a pen and paper.
29:18
I'll write a little number down.
29:19
It's gonna be your lucky number.
29:21
So I write the number down for him.
29:23
I give it to him.
29:24
I says, please read that number out.
29:26
So he goes.
29:28
Plus 6'1, 4'4.
29:30
And he says, James, what is this?
29:32
I says, My friend, that is the number for the head coach of the Wallabies, the Australian rugby team.
29:40
I hear they're hiring.
29:41
I suggest you go and join them because you're never going to make the all blacks if you're not prepared to suffer.
29:47
And he started laughing.
29:48
He's seen the funny side to it.
29:49
I must apologize to your Australian listeners, Zeboniso.
29:53
He's seen the funny side.
29:54
And I says, look, if you really want to become the all black, and you know why you want to do it, there's got to be some sacrifice involved.
30:02
It might take you four, five, six years.
30:04
It might mean you're at the gym three times more.
30:06
It might mean that you don't get to watch married at first sight as much as you wish.
30:11
Let's get to work.
30:12
He did, and within a couple of years he became an all-black, and he's still an all black.
30:16
It's not my secret sauce.
30:18
It's the fact that he was able to answer those three questions I asked him.
30:22
Every listener, please do that.
30:24
What do I want?
30:25
What do I really want in life, work, relationships, money?
30:29
Why do I want it so badly?
30:30
And last but not least, how much am I willing to suffer to get there?
30:34
I loved it.
30:35
I absolutely love it because that's pretty much what I ask my clients, you know, when they come in and they go, I want to buy a house, da-da-da.
30:42
And I go, why?
30:44
And they look at me like, come on, that's common sense.
30:48
Why else would I need to buy a house?
30:49
You know, to have a house.
30:50
But why?
30:51
Why do you really want to buy a house?
30:54
And it's interesting because until you dig down and I find that those people that can answer the question why quite clearly, they're the ones that will buy the house in the next one month to three months.
31:05
The ones that can't answer the question clearly, they're usually the ones that I end up seeing, you know, every few months for reapproval and re-approval and reapproval.
31:14
Because every house they look at, it's not the right house, it's not the right area, it's not the right kitchen, it's not the right garage, whatever.
31:21
They will find 100 million excuses not to buy the house.
31:25
But because they think they have to buy a house, because their family thinks it's time or their friends bought a house, so they don't want to want to miss out, etc.
31:32
So it's really interesting how when I came across that in your book, I was like, huh, this is exactly what I do with my people, you know, because how is irrelevant?
31:41
I'll get you to that point.
31:42
I will find the money for you, I'll get the pre-approval, I'll I'll find you the money.
31:47
That's not that's my job.
31:49
But why is your job?
31:51
And if until you understand that part, we're not gonna move anywhere.
31:56
100%.
31:57
One of the greatest things I learned from a mortgage broker years ago was James, it's not about the rate.
32:03
Stop focusing on the rate.
32:04
The rate is irrelevant, the structure is everything, and until I actually embraced that, nothing changed.
32:11
As soon as I embraced that, my financial landscape changed very, very quickly.
32:16
That's interesting you say that because often I find myself like, I don't want to argue with clients because you know, clients are right in New Zealand, especially, you know, customers always right.
32:26
And you just sit, you just sit there and you're like, man, I wish you would really listen to what I'm trying to say.
32:34
And often, um, for those that are listening, especially when they approach me and they go, you know, what are the best rates you can get me?
32:40
I and I I often reply, I don't work for rates.
32:43
I work for you for your long-term prosperity and wealth building.
32:47
I don't work for rates.
32:48
If you want the best rate, go find someone else to get you that best rate, because if that's the only thing you're after, you will never win in life.
32:56
There's a much bigger picture here than just the rate.
33:01
Yeah, you're right.
33:01
Like my my broker, he instead of saving me a couple of thousand dollars a year with a better rate, he saved me just over$500,000 over a lifetime of a mortgage.
33:12
And like that, that to me is a game changer.
33:14
Like, I don't want to save a couple of grand to save a half a million, count me in.
33:18
Like that's a game changer.
33:19
So the work you do is life-changing.
33:22
Yeah, it's it's amazing.
33:23
A lot of people think we just you know process documents and send it to the bank for an okay, and that's it, that's all we do.
33:29
But no, uh, there's definitely a lot more thought process to the game.
33:33
And also, you know, it's really hard to predict the market, right?
33:36
Like, yeah, cool, it's it's the best rate right now, but what's gonna happen next year?
33:40
What's gonna happen in two years' time when you come off the interest rate?
33:43
No, nobody has a crystal ball.
33:45
We can't well, I did buy a crystal ball, I left it in the office, and um, I pull it out as a joke for clients.
33:51
I love that when they ask me to predict the rates.
33:53
I'm like, hold on a second, let me just get my crystal ball here, put your hand on it, let's guess.
33:58
100%.
33:59
That's right.
34:00
What sort of recommendations you can make to those people that are listening right now and they're going, oh, I don't know what what am I doing in life?
34:07
I don't even know.
34:08
Like, you know, some people are lucky, they know what they want to be.
34:10
They want to be an all-black or they want to be, you know, a drama, or they want to be some something and someone in life.
34:16
I don't know what I want to be.
34:17
How do I find that?
34:19
Yeah, probably the simplest way I think to do that is there's the two Ps.
34:23
And the two Ps in life are passion and purpose.
34:27
And passion is for you, purpose is for others.
34:30
So find something you're passionate about.
34:32
So, Zebony, so if I look at your situation, so I imagine you're somewhat passionate about finance.
34:38
Would that be fair to say?
34:40
I'm passionate about people.
34:42
I love people.
34:44
Finance comes second.
34:45
Um but but finance is there, you're still passionate about it.
34:48
Yes.
34:49
Okay, yes.
34:51
Good.
34:51
So then I go to the second P, which is purpose.
34:54
And what I'm gonna think about more is that your purpose is likely people.
34:59
So your passion would be finance, and my purpose is I want to help others and free them and bring their financial freedom.
35:05
Yes.
35:06
Awesome.
35:07
So, what you want to do in life for the listener is go, what are my passions?
35:12
And what brings me purpose?
35:14
And your purpose is not something for you, it's something for others.
35:19
So take the time to go, what am I interested in?
35:21
What lights me up?
35:22
For others, it's what makes me cry, or what keeps me up at night, or what makes me angry about the world.
35:29
Sometimes that drives a passion.
35:31
You know, Greta Thunberg, good example.
35:33
You know, her passion is to fight for what she believes is right.
35:38
And in the end, it drives her purposes, which is to help the world and the people on that planet.
35:43
So people just take your time, don't put too much pressure on yourself to find purpose.
35:48
Just ask, what am I passionate about?
35:50
What keeps me up at night?
35:51
What makes me cry?
35:52
What gets me excited, what gets me out of bed, and follow that pathway.
35:56
The one regret that most people live with.
35:59
This is from a book called Top Regrets of the Dying.
36:02
And it was a palliative carse who spent many months with people dying, their last couple of weeks of life.
36:10
She's what's your biggest regret?
36:12
The number one regret of the dying was this.
36:15
I regret making decisions in my life based upon what I thought other people thought of me.
36:22
So that accounts for kids who go to university to study law or medicine because mum and dad thought that's what would be a good idea.
36:30
That goes for the person who bought the Tesla or the Range Rover because they thought it would look good amongst their colleagues' cars or in the posh neighborhood they live in.
36:40
You know, buy the car because you love the car, not because you want to impress other people.
36:45
Goes for the person who makes a career decision based upon, oh, that would look good on my CV, versus this job is boring the hell out of me.
36:54
Why am I doing this?
36:55
Listen to your inner whisperings and do what drives your passion, not making decisions based upon what you think other people perceive.
37:04
I love that.
37:05
You know, I grew up in a culture where a lot of decisions are made for you.
37:09
Like from the young age, there would be marriages that would be already arranged for you.
37:15
You know, your family would know who you're gonna marry, which into which family, um, what sort of education the other person needs to have, etc., etc.
37:22
So I grew up in a place, and that's why I fled, because by the time I was 16, there was definitely a lineup of men that my grandmother would have married me off to, based on that people's family status and what are they bringing to the table, sort of thing.
37:39
So for me, when I look where I've come from, and then I look in New Zealand, and you're right, like I I ran away from that not to follow the standard of what should have been.
37:52
And when I was here in New Zealand and I hated it, my first year was so hard, I didn't really speak English, I had to learn a new culture, a new country, everything.
38:00
And I remember I sat down by I think six months later, I sat down and I wrote myself a list and I divided the page into two.
38:08
I was only 16 at the time.
38:09
I'm like, where did I learn that?
38:11
No idea.
38:11
The knowledge incredible.
38:13
And I divided the page into two.
38:15
And I in one, I put, what would life look like if I went back home?
38:19
And then I put, what would life look like if I stayed?
38:23
And to me, that's what determined my purpose at that time and my passion of I didn't want to go home because I knew the moment I I go home, I would be married off to some guy I just met at the wedding, probably, and then I would have to be a servant to his family because that's what happens to girls back home.
38:40
You get married into a family, and the girl has to look after his entire family and pretty much cook and clean and be a breeding machine.
38:48
So um, funny enough, I have four kids now.
38:54
Didn't fully run away.
38:56
Um yeah, so for me, you know, that prospect didn't really excite me.
39:00
I I was not excited by that.
39:02
And then on the other flip of the page, I looked and I was like, cool, I could stay in New Zealand, I've got all this freedom in the world, I could go study, I could be a journalist, because that was my passion at the time, as I wanted to become a journalist.
39:14
That's why I guess I ended up as a podcast.
39:16
So amazing.
39:17
Yeah, so for me it was just all these things that were going through my head, and often I do this with my clients as well now is I go, okay, what would life look like in the next year, in the next five years, in the next 10 years, as you were saying, you know, if you don't make those decisions, like even just dividing the page into two and writing two different scenarios often helps your brain to tell you what feels the right, what feels like the most right decision.
39:44
Yeah, people have got to get out of their head and onto the page.
39:46
It's one of the greatest things.
39:48
I mean, I travel everywhere with my journal.
39:50
No matter where I go, it goes with me.
39:52
And getting things out of your head, your ideas, your thoughts, your concerns, your feelings, getting them on a page gives you some distance between yourself and your thoughts, which allows you to make better decisions.
40:02
And that's why I wrote the book is that I wanted people to have a roadmap, to be able to map out what success looks like, how to get there, how to make sure and be aware of what's going to stop people.
40:13
And I've studied the best of the best and go, what can we learn from them and pull into our everyday lives to help us succeed?
40:22
I absolutely love your book.
40:23
And I said that to you before we started recording that this book is not a book, it's a manual.
40:28
People should not just read it and put it away, they should really hold on to it and refer to it on a frequent basis.
40:35
Like it should be the, I don't know, like almost, I don't want to say a Bible, but it's one of those things that you wanna you wanna return to.
40:42
And and this is not just me, you know, being nice to you by saying it, but it's I've read a lot of books, I listened to a lot of books on self-growth and motivation and that sort of stuff.
40:51
But this I really, really enjoyed because you sort of grabbed all that knowledge from various places, and you just did this your own mix in a very simple language that is anyone can understand.
41:04
It's not just, you know, when you read, when you look at the cover, it says habits of high performance.
41:08
And you would think people that are high performers should be reading that.
41:12
Not at all.
41:13
I think it's everyday people like I'll be forcing my 13-year-old to read this afternoon because we force him to read all sorts of different books.
41:21
I think he's already finished Reach Dad, Poor Dad, and and a few other books.
41:25
So I think this sort of books are helpful even if you're not a sporty person, even if you don't have high ambitions of becoming a CEO or a director.
41:36
Uh it's even good for like mums, I think, just everyday people that are busy in life, that a little bit lost.
41:43
Because a lot of us, let's face it, James, and I think you'll find that as well.
41:46
A lot of people are lost these days.
41:47
The the noise of AI, the noise of technology has really dumpened people's spirits.
41:54
Yeah, a hundred percent.
41:55
There is so much noise around us, and it's about going, how do I focus on WMI?
42:01
What's most important?
42:03
Like I talk about it a lot in the book, and I think that's really important for people to get clear what's most important to you?
42:08
What is your primary focus in life?
42:11
And we've had tens of thousands of people read the book since it launched last year.
42:14
And the thing I love the most is getting quiet little notes from them going, My God, this changed my family life, or this changed my health, or James, I'm on track now to doing the thing I want to do in my career.
42:26
I just want people to follow their dreams, their passions, and have a roadmap to get there.
42:32
To me, what I read is not anything extraordinary.
42:36
It's basically common sense, but put together in such a way of a caring big brother that just hugs you and like, hey, this is what you need to know to get better in life.
42:46
You know, you you've got one life, one shot, one opportunity.
42:51
Mm.
42:52
There we go.
42:52
Love it, love it.
42:54
I was like, damn, did I just say that?
42:55
Yeah, well done.
42:57
But you know, how do you make that life the best?
42:59
And I think I was lucky, and I'm putting the quote marks for those that are listening and not seeing it.
43:05
My dad passed away really young.
43:07
I lost him when I was seven.
43:08
Wow.
43:09
And then I lost my uncle.
43:10
So for me, I had to learn that life is so, so short that you just gotta take what's given to you and you just gotta run with it and make the best, best thing.
43:21
And you know, in your book, you also have this message that you can send to your friends about hey, what's my um was it my trait?
43:28
Yes, the trait that you could take and apply to your own life.
43:31
And the feedback I started getting last night was kind of kind of cool.
43:34
And I was like, wow, is that how you guys see me?
43:37
This is awesome.
43:38
So, you know, again, for those that are listening, take this book, have a read of it.
43:42
It's got some beautiful gems that you can just apply straight away, hit the ground running.
43:47
And James, I I don't know how you've come to this knowledge, but you know, at your young age of 30.
43:54
Thank you.
43:54
You can you can tell me more, tell me more.
43:57
But honestly, it's it's almost you downloading this information from a spectrum that I think we we all have that.
44:04
It's that ancient knowledge that sort of inbuilt in us, but not many of us have tapped into.
44:09
And you really tapped into it really well, and you put it on paper, and I really, really think that it's gonna help thousands of people.
44:16
So thank you.
44:17
I just really my heartfelt thanks to you for producing something so easy to read.
44:23
No, I deeply appreciate it.
44:24
May I give a gift to your listeners as well?
44:27
Ah, okay.
44:28
Go ahead.
44:28
So I have a planner and it's a I'll give it to your listeners for free.
44:33
And so I can send you the link, but it'll be jjlochland.com forward slash planner.
44:38
And if you want to pop that in the show notes, it's the exact same planner that I use, that my clients use, whether they're running busy families or they're running countries or sports teams.
44:48
I'd like them all to have a copy of that.
44:51
That's awesome.
44:51
We'll definitely put it in the show notes.
44:53
Thank you for that, James.
44:54
My final question to you as a podcaster to podcaster: how did you end up getting all those Fortune 500 people and you know the people that run the nations and high performing athletes and stuff on your shows?
45:07
What's the secret?
45:09
No real secret, just like high performance, just staying in the game long, uh, knowing who you're speaking to, knowing who your audience is, being really consistent, showing up.
45:19
At one stage, I was doing three episodes a week.
45:21
I did that for about two years, and that really helped get momentum building and build trust.
45:26
Then we went to two episodes, now we do one, and we do one consistently.
45:30
So we've been around for about seven years.
45:31
So I think the key thing with podcasting is most people do it for a bit, get a bit burnt out, quit, stay in the game, be consistent, be authentic.
45:40
You'll get all the guests you've ever wanted, I promise you.
45:44
Thank you.
45:45
I'm really looking forward to it.
45:47
You know, when in your book you talk about envisioning the future, and in that was part of the thing.
45:52
I was like, cool, if I've got James on my podcast, I know now I can get more people on my podcast.
45:57
You can do it.
45:57
Go get them, and you're an amazing host.
45:59
So thank you for having me.
46:01
Oh no, thank you so much for saying yes.
46:03
This is cool.
46:03
And I want to send you a gift as well.
46:05
I've got my own gratitude diaries that I've created last year because I also believe in journaling.
46:10
And so if um, you could please ask Caroline to send me through the address, I'll post you high Caroline one.
46:16
Thank you so much.
46:16
I look forward to it.
46:17
Oh, thank you.
46:18
So, James, just to wrap it up, what's your final message to those that are listening today?
46:23
Yeah, stop sitting in an indecision, make a decision, get on with it, do the work, and get radically clear on what success looks like for you.
46:31
Who cares about what anyone else thinks?
46:33
You can care about other people, but stop caring about what they think.
46:37
Get after your own goals, get radically clear.
46:39
Answer those three questions we talked about earlier, and I promise you that the oh, you just cut off.
46:47
Can you just say that last sentence again?
46:49
I think your internet is playing up.
46:51
Oh, is it?
46:51
Christ church.
46:52
So get radically I know.
46:55
Get radically clear on what success looks like, and I promise you the fruits will be your reward.
47:00
Thank you.
47:00
James, thank you so, so much.
47:02
Really, really enjoyed having you on today.
47:04
And and I hope we can cross path at some point as well.
47:07
That'll be really cool.
47:08
I've no doubt, but we will.
47:09
Hopefully at a conference, uh, if I'm speaking, come and say hello.
47:12
Yes, absolutely.
47:13
Thank you.
47:13
Awesome.
47:14
Thank you so much, Ivanisa.
47:15
We'll chat soon.
47:16
Thank you, James.
47:17
See you.
47:17
Bye bye.