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Are We Raising Kids or Performing Motherhood with Ingrid Bretschger, LCSW, Ph.D. · Bump + Thrive

• Ingrid 8.21.26: Welcome back to the Bumpitari Podcast. I'm Lauren and I'm here joining today with my dear friend Ingrid Bretchger. We are talking all things about the invisible competition and pressures of motherhood. Thanks for being here. Thanks so much for having me. Of course. I feel like with school starting next week, this has just been amped up. Absolutely. Just on Instagram, the day one of school with the balloons and the, know. Lauren 8.21.26: Welcome back to the Bumpitari Podcast. I'm Lauren and I'm here joining today with my dear friend Ingrid Bretchger. We are talking all things about the invisible competition and pressures of motherhood. Thanks for being here. Thanks so much for having me. Of course. I feel like with school starting next week, this has just been amped up. Absolutely. Just on Instagram, the day one of school with the balloons and the, know. Ingrid 8.21.26: Cute little plates for just getting all this stuff ready for your kids and like making them excited. I'm freaking out, and the amount of shit I have purchased on Amazon to seem like the perfect mom is outrageous. Yeah, and I think that's a really common experience because everybody is trying to manage new routines, signing up for new activities, planning last-minute birthday parties, vacations, all of the things. And Lauren 8.21.26: Cute little plates for just getting all this stuff ready for your kids and like making them excited. I'm freaking out, and the amount of shit I have purchased on Amazon to seem like the perfect mom is outrageous. Yeah, and I think that's a really common experience because everybody is trying to manage new routines, signing up for new activities, planning last-minute birthday parties, vacations, all of the things. And Ingrid 8.21.26: While we want to create beautiful experiences for our family, I think it leaves a lot of us wondering: like, who are we doing this for? Are we doing this for our kids or are we doing this for ourselves? And I think a lot of people sometimes end up sort of in both camps. And when you're noticing that you're doing things for your kids, you feel a lot of joy, right? There's like a lot of excitement surrounding it, and you feel very motivated. Lauren 8.21.26: While we want to create beautiful experiences for our family, I think it leaves a lot of us wondering: like, who are we doing this for? Are we doing this for our kids or are we doing this for ourselves? And I think a lot of people sometimes end up sort of in both camps. And when you're noticing that you're doing things for your kids, you feel a lot of joy, right? There's like a lot of excitement surrounding it, and you feel very motivated. Ingrid 8.21.26: But when you're doing something that maybe you wouldn't do if nobody else was watching, it makes you sort of question what's the motive behind it? Right. I mean, you know me and what I do for a living, I'm all about competition. So why is it that mother motherhood feels so competitive these days? What is it that's driving this? Is it social media to blame, do you think? Do you think it's just our Lauren 8.21.26: But when you're doing something that maybe you wouldn't do if nobody else was watching, it makes you sort of question what's the motive behind it? Right. I mean, you know me and what I do for a living, I'm all about competition. So why is it that mother motherhood feels so competitive these days? What is it that's driving this? Is it social media to blame, do you think? Do you think it's just our Ingrid 8.21.26: Childhood and like how we want to like kind of keep up with what our parents did or did not do for us. So I think comparison and competition has always been here. So I think mothers unfortunately have probably been comparing themselves to other mothers for centuries. But I will say that with the onset of social media, we certainly have access to 247 streaming content of what other people are doing. Lauren 8.21.26: Childhood and like how we want to like kind of keep up with what our parents did or did not do for us. So I think comparison and competition has always been here. So I think mothers unfortunately have probably been comparing themselves to other mothers for centuries. But I will say that with the onset of social media, we certainly have access to 247 streaming content of what other people are doing. Ingrid 8.21.26: What other people's bodies look like, what their houses look like, what their vacations look like, what their vacation homes look like, right? The renovations, everything. And so the other missing piece of it is that there's no context surrounding it. So what we're exposed to on social media is just the visible aspects of somebody's life, and we don't have additional information of what's going on behind the scenes, which is that important context to give all you're seeing on social media the meaning behind it. Lauren 8.21.26: What other people's bodies look like, what their houses look like, what their vacations look like, what their vacation homes look like, right? The renovations, everything. And so the other missing piece of it is that there's no context surrounding it. So what we're exposed to on social media is just the visible aspects of somebody's life, and we don't have additional information of what's going on behind the scenes, which is that important context to give all you're seeing on social media the meaning behind it. Ingrid 8.21.26: And do you think areas like where geographically you live things can be worse? You know, we're in Fairfield County. Mm-hmm. We go to the same nursery school. Mm-hmm. We're doing a combined birthday party this weekend. Yep. With two other families. Yep. do you think it's elevated here? I mean, I remember it growing up. I really do. But my I feel like I would say like my family was kinda like middle of the pack in terms of like Lauren 8.21.26: And do you think areas like where geographically you live things can be worse? You know, we're in Fairfield County. Mm-hmm. We go to the same nursery school. Mm-hmm. We're doing a combined birthday party this weekend. Yep. With two other families. Yep. do you think it's elevated here? I mean, I remember it growing up. I really do. But my I feel like I would say like my family was kinda like middle of the pack in terms of like Ingrid 8.21.26: We had a vacation home, which was really nice, but we like didn't have the yacht and like all this other stuff that like a lot of people had, right? So I grew up very grounded. My parents came from basically nothing. So I understood the the the power of a dollar pretty early, early days. And then 2008 crash, yada yada. Living in Fairfield County outside of Manhattan is a whole nother ballgame. So I thought that I like kind of understood it growing growing up an hour north of here. This is a whole different. Lauren 8.21.26: We had a vacation home, which was really nice, but we like didn't have the yacht and like all this other stuff that like a lot of people had, right? So I grew up very grounded. My parents came from basically nothing. So I understood the the the power of a dollar pretty early, early days. And then 2008 crash, yada yada. Living in Fairfield County outside of Manhattan is a whole nother ballgame. So I thought that I like kind of understood it growing growing up an hour north of here. This is a whole different. Ingrid 8.21.26: Subset. Totally. Which has its perks, mind you, of course. Yeah. In terms of accessibility and all that stuff. But do you think that plays a role, or is it just me kind of coming from more of like the burbs of the burbs that I notice it more? I think it does play a role because while being in an area that is you're surrounded by very ambitious people and high achievers, I think there's a lot of positives surrounding that, right? Because there can almost be the sort of Lauren 8.21.26: Subset. Totally. Which has its perks, mind you, of course. Yeah. In terms of accessibility and all that stuff. But do you think that plays a role, or is it just me kind of coming from more of like the burbs of the burbs that I notice it more? I think it does play a role because while being in an area that is you're surrounded by very ambitious people and high achievers, I think there's a lot of positives surrounding that, right? Because there can almost be the sort of Ingrid 8.21.26: Ripple effect where you're noticing the ways in which people are living their own lives and you're thinking, wow, they're able to do that. I want to create space in my own life to do the same thing. So it can be sort of a catalyst for change or motivation. But I think one problem, especially amongst women, if it's high-achieving women, there's a lot of rewards in continuing to push through even when there's discomfort. Right? That's sort of a rewarded character trait in the highly ambitious. But the problem then becomes Lauren 8.21.26: Ripple effect where you're noticing the ways in which people are living their own lives and you're thinking, wow, they're able to do that. I want to create space in my own life to do the same thing. So it can be sort of a catalyst for change or motivation. But I think one problem, especially amongst women, if it's high-achieving women, there's a lot of rewards in continuing to push through even when there's discomfort. Right? That's sort of a rewarded character trait in the highly ambitious. But the problem then becomes Ingrid 8.21.26: If you're a mother, you know, when is enough enough then? Right. You know? and I think people struggle, particularly in areas where they are competitive, and there are a lot of ambitious people, of there's a lack of willingness to really say one enough of is enough if you see somebody else doing what you perceive to be as more. So when it comes to having like a tool for that in your practice, so we we should also just talk about what it is that you do and how you support people first and foremost. Yeah. Lauren 8.21.26: If you're a mother, you know, when is enough enough then? Right. You know? and I think people struggle, particularly in areas where they are competitive, and there are a lot of ambitious people, of there's a lack of willingness to really say one enough of is enough if you see somebody else doing what you perceive to be as more. So when it comes to having like a tool for that in your practice, so we we should also just talk about what it is that you do and how you support people first and foremost. Yeah. Ingrid 8.21.26: So I am a licensed clinical social worker and I also have my PhD in marriage and family therapy. Yeah. So I work as a therapist. I'm exclusively remote, which has been great because I'm able to access people throughout the state of Connecticut. And I'm also licensed in Virginia. So it's been giving me the opportunity to speak with people that otherwise I would never have, you know, have the ability to do so. Of course. Yeah. And so I would say that if someone's struggling with Lauren 8.21.26: So I am a licensed clinical social worker and I also have my PhD in marriage and family therapy. Yeah. So I work as a therapist. I'm exclusively remote, which has been great because I'm able to access people throughout the state of Connecticut. And I'm also licensed in Virginia. So it's been giving me the opportunity to speak with people that otherwise I would never have, you know, have the ability to do so. Of course. Yeah. And so I would say that if someone's struggling with Ingrid 8.21.26: Understanding when enough is enough, there's a few steps that they can take to help facilitate that process. The first thing would be sort of rejecting that societal push to keep doing more. Right? It's not yielding you the results that you want. Maybe you're feeling burnt out. when people fall in that comparison trap, they might feel guilty, they may have low self-esteem. So it's not providing them with what they're looking for. So it doesn't work, right? Right. So instead, the sh the focus would be shifting on. Lauren 8.21.26: Understanding when enough is enough, there's a few steps that they can take to help facilitate that process. The first thing would be sort of rejecting that societal push to keep doing more. Right? It's not yielding you the results that you want. Maybe you're feeling burnt out. when people fall in that comparison trap, they might feel guilty, they may have low self-esteem. So it's not providing them with what they're looking for. So it doesn't work, right? Right. So instead, the sh the focus would be shifting on. Ingrid 8.21.26: Well, what is important to me in my life, because one thing that happens for people is if they don't live life in accordance to their values, they don't feel good. Right? So let's say, you know, like you're a trainer, right? So I would suspect that you highly value physical health and well-being, right? You probably rank it even like a nine or a ten, I would suspect. Right. Right? So but let's say that for whatever reason you weren't regularly engaging in physical activity. So it's rated as a nine or a ten, but if somebody were to look in on Lauren 8.21.26: Well, what is important to me in my life, because one thing that happens for people is if they don't live life in accordance to their values, they don't feel good. Right? So let's say, you know, like you're a trainer, right? So I would suspect that you highly value physical health and well-being, right? You probably rank it even like a nine or a ten, I would suspect. Right. Right? So but let's say that for whatever reason you weren't regularly engaging in physical activity. So it's rated as a nine or a ten, but if somebody were to look in on Ingrid 8.21.26: And it's sort of observe how you're living your life. Maybe your lifestyle choices really aren't conveying the level of importance that physical health has in your life. Okay. People feel down by that. Yeah. Right? Like, you know, people don't feel good when they're liv when there's a discrepancy between how they're living their life and what they value. So if someone's struggling with, you know, what is enough, the first thing would be, well, what are the priorities that you have for you and your family? What's important for you and your family? Even start with like two to three things. It does not have to be this need to be this gigantic list, right? Lauren 8.21.26: And it's sort of observe how you're living your life. Maybe your lifestyle choices really aren't conveying the level of importance that physical health has in your life. Okay. People feel down by that. Yeah. Right? Like, you know, people don't feel good when they're liv when there's a discrepancy between how they're living their life and what they value. So if someone's struggling with, you know, what is enough, the first thing would be, well, what are the priorities that you have for you and your family? What's important for you and your family? Even start with like two to three things. It does not have to be this need to be this gigantic list, right? Ingrid 8.21.26: So two things, two, three things that you really prioritize for your family. Commit to them, right? So step two, take a look at how you're spending your days. So many people would be surprised about, you know, the things that they value for themselves and their family, but if they look at how they're spending their time, they're not really engaging in activities that promote that. Right. So if there are two things that are really important to you and your family, maybe it's like Sunday dinners or making a meal with your kids, whatever it is. Lauren 8.21.26: So two things, two, three things that you really prioritize for your family. Commit to them, right? So step two, take a look at how you're spending your days. So many people would be surprised about, you know, the things that they value for themselves and their family, but if they look at how they're spending their time, they're not really engaging in activities that promote that. Right. So if there are two things that are really important to you and your family, maybe it's like Sunday dinners or making a meal with your kids, whatever it is. Ingrid 8.21.26: Look at how you're spending your time each day. Are you creating opportunities to be doing those things? If not, this gives you an opportunity to kind of course correct and make that space. Okay. Right? The third thing would be pay attention to your triggers. So if you notice that when you're doom scrolling at 10 o'clock, that you're left feeling anxious, a little bit miserable, you're second-guessing the ways that you've been parenting. Lauren 8.21.26: Look at how you're spending your time each day. Are you creating opportunities to be doing those things? If not, this gives you an opportunity to kind of course correct and make that space. Okay. Right? The third thing would be pay attention to your triggers. So if you notice that when you're doom scrolling at 10 o'clock, that you're left feeling anxious, a little bit miserable, you're second-guessing the ways that you've been parenting. Ingrid 8.21.26: It's probably not an effective strategy for you to be using to feel motivated to make changes in your life or to feel good, right? So you want to be self-aware about the emotional experiences that you're having and what's triggering them. Then you want to be making sure that you're scheduling and creating space and time to implement these new priorities that you have in your life, right? So I use sort of the example of like cooking with your kids. Lauren 8.21.26: It's probably not an effective strategy for you to be using to feel motivated to make changes in your life or to feel good, right? So you want to be self-aware about the emotional experiences that you're having and what's triggering them. Then you want to be making sure that you're scheduling and creating space and time to implement these new priorities that you have in your life, right? So I use sort of the example of like cooking with your kids. Ingrid 8.21.26: Making sure you're really actually carving out that time and following through with it. And then the final thing I would say, which is probably the most important, is being comfortable saying no. I think that's probably a boundary that sometimes people feel reluctant to actually set. But if there are, if you're asked to maybe do things with your kids' school or there's other types of events that you're being asked to maybe help organize, but you really just feel like your your bandwidth is just at capacity. Lauren 8.21.26: Making sure you're really actually carving out that time and following through with it. And then the final thing I would say, which is probably the most important, is being comfortable saying no. I think that's probably a boundary that sometimes people feel reluctant to actually set. But if there are, if you're asked to maybe do things with your kids' school or there's other types of events that you're being asked to maybe help organize, but you really just feel like your your bandwidth is just at capacity. Ingrid 8.21.26: You can't keep saying yes, right? So even just like having small opportunities to practice saying no without like a long, unnecessary explanation, yeah, like no is a full sentence, right? I love that. So well, you know that I say yes to everything. I know this is conversation literally at a birthday party over the weekend. You're like, Lauren, you are in your yes phase. I'm like, yeah. And you're like, I'm in my no phase. And I'm like, I probably should be better at flexing that muscle because. Lauren 8.21.26: You can't keep saying yes, right? So even just like having small opportunities to practice saying no without like a long, unnecessary explanation, yeah, like no is a full sentence, right? I love that. So well, you know that I say yes to everything. I know this is conversation literally at a birthday party over the weekend. You're like, Lauren, you are in your yes phase. I'm like, yeah. And you're like, I'm in my no phase. And I'm like, I probably should be better at flexing that muscle because. Ingrid 8.21.26: That's why I had to take a nap before this, and I'm drinking coffee at 4:30 in the afternoon on a Friday because I say yes to everything. But I think to your point, I'm at a phase where like right now it's very important for me to be showing my children like I want to be a mentor to my p my kids in terms of like following your dreams. And you know, my mom went back to work much later in life when when my sister and I were in public school and middle school, high school. Lauren 8.21.26: That's why I had to take a nap before this, and I'm drinking coffee at 4:30 in the afternoon on a Friday because I say yes to everything. But I think to your point, I'm at a phase where like right now it's very important for me to be showing my children like I want to be a mentor to my p my kids in terms of like following your dreams. And you know, my mom went back to work much later in life when when my sister and I were in public school and middle school, high school. Ingrid 8.21.26: And so I got to see that later on. But like I love the fact that my kids get to see me out here, like and they come out in their jammies at 6 a.m. and I'm with clients and they respect that. They know that we're in here right now. So I know that Tripp's mommy is in here with me. it's funny to talk about the trigger. It's not funny, but I I've really been working on that. And part of that I think is your environment too, right? Like who you're socializing with and all that. And I have Lauren 8.21.26: And so I got to see that later on. But like I love the fact that my kids get to see me out here, like and they come out in their jammies at 6 a.m. and I'm with clients and they respect that. They know that we're in here right now. So I know that Tripp's mommy is in here with me. it's funny to talk about the trigger. It's not funny, but I I've really been working on that. And part of that I think is your environment too, right? Like who you're socializing with and all that. And I have Ingrid 8.21.26: You know, really amazing friends who are like me, go-getters, but like sometimes it's a little bit too much. Yeah. And that's why I don't think I'm like seeking like outside, like like last night we went out to and we played mahjong. I was awful. But doing something that maybe isn't like going and playing tennis or go that's like very, very com it's a different kind of competitiveness of mahjong. But like, you know, I think that's kind of nice. I think where we are too, and every I it's all over the place, but the sports and athletics are so like shoved. Lauren 8.21.26: You know, really amazing friends who are like me, go-getters, but like sometimes it's a little bit too much. Yeah. And that's why I don't think I'm like seeking like outside, like like last night we went out to and we played mahjong. I was awful. But doing something that maybe isn't like going and playing tennis or go that's like very, very com it's a different kind of competitiveness of mahjong. But like, you know, I think that's kind of nice. I think where we are too, and every I it's all over the place, but the sports and athletics are so like shoved. Ingrid 8.21.26: Down the parents' throats with their kids. And I have some friends who are like, well, my kids doing this on Mondays and this on Tuesdays and this on one. I'm like, ha. And you instantly feel less than. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. But I would say that's an opportunity to look at the thought you're having. So if you think about selecting like the two or three activities that are aligned with you and your family's priorities, you would take a look at that, right? And sort of determine how does that fit within this mold. Lauren 8.21.26: Down the parents' throats with their kids. And I have some friends who are like, well, my kids doing this on Mondays and this on Tuesdays and this on one. I'm like, ha. And you instantly feel less than. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. But I would say that's an opportunity to look at the thought you're having. So if you think about selecting like the two or three activities that are aligned with you and your family's priorities, you would take a look at that, right? And sort of determine how does that fit within this mold. Ingrid 8.21.26: Does this fit right now? Are we at capacity? I know in the past when I've responded in a situation like that because I've felt anxious. Yes. I've actually ironically felt more anxious about taking more on. Right. Right. So it hasn't really yielded me the result that I want. It certainly doesn't reduce anxiety. It oftentimes complicates things. Interesting. So c that's that no again, right? Like that's an opportunity to practice. Even say no to yourself. It doesn't have to be, you know, to other people, but And it's funny too, like preparing for this, one of the Lauren 8.21.26: Does this fit right now? Are we at capacity? I know in the past when I've responded in a situation like that because I've felt anxious. Yes. I've actually ironically felt more anxious about taking more on. Right. Right. So it hasn't really yielded me the result that I want. It certainly doesn't reduce anxiety. It oftentimes complicates things. Interesting. So c that's that no again, right? Like that's an opportunity to practice. Even say no to yourself. It doesn't have to be, you know, to other people, but And it's funny too, like preparing for this, one of the Ingrid 8.21.26: you know, questions that kept popping up for me was like, Am I performing? Are we performing to be an amazing mom? Or are we performing actually for our children? Mm-hmm. Like w or who are we performing for? Like I think a lot of times going back to kind of how I started, like preparing for the first day of school next week, I'm like, I need to get like the streamers and like the blow up fucking crayons and this like bus thing to stick our head in. I'm like, but is that for like my Instagram? Is that for me to have on my phone later on? Is it me Lauren 8.21.26: you know, questions that kept popping up for me was like, Am I performing? Are we performing to be an amazing mom? Or are we performing actually for our children? Mm-hmm. Like w or who are we performing for? Like I think a lot of times going back to kind of how I started, like preparing for the first day of school next week, I'm like, I need to get like the streamers and like the blow up fucking crayons and this like bus thing to stick our head in. I'm like, but is that for like my Instagram? Is that for me to have on my phone later on? Is it me Ingrid 8.21.26: For my memories, or is it actually for my daughter to be excited to get on the goddamn bus? Right? And it kind of goes back, like it's an interesting loop that I feel like a lot of us are playing, especially at this time of the year with a lot of like anxiety. Yeah. And something people can even do in those moments is ask themselves, like, if nobody were to see that I was doing this, would I do it anyway? Right? Because if the answer is yes, then it's probably, you know, is for you and your family, right? If the answer is no, then Lauren 8.21.26: For my memories, or is it actually for my daughter to be excited to get on the goddamn bus? Right? And it kind of goes back, like it's an interesting loop that I feel like a lot of us are playing, especially at this time of the year with a lot of like anxiety. Yeah. And something people can even do in those moments is ask themselves, like, if nobody were to see that I was doing this, would I do it anyway? Right? Because if the answer is yes, then it's probably, you know, is for you and your family, right? If the answer is no, then Ingrid 8.21.26: It's an opportunity for exploration, okay, you know, to see well, what am I getting out of this? Like, am I feeling compelled to do this because I see that everybody else is doing it? Mm-hmm. Or what's what's the drive behind it? Interesting. Makes sense. Yeah. A lot of us are performing, I think. But you know what? There's nothing wrong with wanting to establish really nice family traditions and to make your kids excited about going back to school. Lauren 8.21.26: It's an opportunity for exploration, okay, you know, to see well, what am I getting out of this? Like, am I feeling compelled to do this because I see that everybody else is doing it? Mm-hmm. Or what's what's the drive behind it? Interesting. Makes sense. Yeah. A lot of us are performing, I think. But you know what? There's nothing wrong with wanting to establish really nice family traditions and to make your kids excited about going back to school. Ingrid 8.21.26: Right. And creating some of these things and these like balloons, all of that kind of stuff. Because it really then fosters and enhances the excitement about going into a new transition. And even just establishing those memories. You know, there's those are nice things to be able to do as you're growing alongside with your kids and going through these new chapters right next to them. Right. I think about that often because it's like it's the first that we're doing this to. Lauren 8.21.26: Right. And creating some of these things and these like balloons, all of that kind of stuff. Because it really then fosters and enhances the excitement about going into a new transition. And even just establishing those memories. You know, there's those are nice things to be able to do as you're growing alongside with your kids and going through these new chapters right next to them. Right. I think about that often because it's like it's the first that we're doing this to. Ingrid 8.21.26: Yeah. So if it makes us a little bit more excited and more for me, I get emotional. And so like I don't want to get too emotional in front of Remy, for example, who's a sensitive kid going to school kindergarten for the first day, right? So I'm trying to be like what keeps it really light and fun and airy so that she gets on that bus. Because if she doesn't get on that bus, like I'm like worried I'm gonna have to like put her on with the school bus driver. That's my biggest fear. Lauren 8.21.26: Yeah. So if it makes us a little bit more excited and more for me, I get emotional. And so like I don't want to get too emotional in front of Remy, for example, who's a sensitive kid going to school kindergarten for the first day, right? So I'm trying to be like what keeps it really light and fun and airy so that she gets on that bus. Because if she doesn't get on that bus, like I'm like worried I'm gonna have to like put her on with the school bus driver. That's my biggest fear. Ingrid 8.21.26: or I get that call like 90 minutes and being like, She's so crying, like, you know what I mean? So, I think that's where I've been trying to like keep my laser focus of like what keeps everything really like light and fun and exciting, where she's like, This is great, this is the best day ever, versus don't make me get on that bus. Totally. But you know, only so much is within your control. Lauren 8.21.26: or I get that call like 90 minutes and being like, She's so crying, like, you know what I mean? So, I think that's where I've been trying to like keep my laser focus of like what keeps everything really like light and fun and exciting, where she's like, This is great, this is the best day ever, versus don't make me get on that bus. Totally. But you know, only so much is within your control. Ingrid 8.21.26: Right. So even like then you said like that's your biggest fear, you know, is if she were to be reluctant to get on the bus or even perhaps tearful. But if you think about it, you know, it's sort of reasonable if a kid is going to a new school for the first time and entering into a brand new transition that they're gonna have different feelings surrounding it, right? So even if that were to happen, so h your hypothetical sort of worst case scenario, you would still be able to get through it. Right. She would still be able to get through it. Lauren 8.21.26: Right. So even like then you said like that's your biggest fear, you know, is if she were to be reluctant to get on the bus or even perhaps tearful. But if you think about it, you know, it's sort of reasonable if a kid is going to a new school for the first time and entering into a brand new transition that they're gonna have different feelings surrounding it, right? So even if that were to happen, so h your hypothetical sort of worst case scenario, you would still be able to get through it. Right. She would still be able to get through it. Ingrid 8.21.26: That's good point. We'll be all right. You'll be all right. Do you need my hand yelled during that whole day? And the answer is yes. I wanna shift a little bit to like the comparison trap because you and I have talked about this a lot, like privately and living in this area, like we were saying kind of before. what can when we get into these loops? Lauren 8.21.26: That's good point. We'll be all right. You'll be all right. Do you need my hand yelled during that whole day? And the answer is yes. I wanna shift a little bit to like the comparison trap because you and I have talked about this a lot, like privately and living in this area, like we were saying kind of before. what can when we get into these loops? Ingrid 8.21.26: I'm I'm just thinking specifically, and this isn't by no means an offensive thing to any of my friends who went to went to Nantucket this summer. But I love me a Nantucket trip. We were talking about it last night at dinner too. We had a staycation summer. We stayed here. We didn't go anywhere. And so it was hard, I have to admit, for the travel bug in me to be like seeing all these moms, all these families on beaches of Nantucket, the Cape, the wherever. Mm-hmm. How can when I'm in a spiral like that? Lauren 8.21.26: I'm I'm just thinking specifically, and this isn't by no means an offensive thing to any of my friends who went to went to Nantucket this summer. But I love me a Nantucket trip. We were talking about it last night at dinner too. We had a staycation summer. We stayed here. We didn't go anywhere. And so it was hard, I have to admit, for the travel bug in me to be like seeing all these moms, all these families on beaches of Nantucket, the Cape, the wherever. Mm-hmm. How can when I'm in a spiral like that? Ingrid 8.21.26: Of like getting down on myself. Shit, we should have done that. Why didn't we just plan it? Why didn't I take the time to and getting down on myself for not, you know, pulling those triggers? What can I do? Well, I think there's like two parts to it. Because ca comparison's not necessarily inherently negative. So there is this whole notion of like you know, comparison is a thief of joy, which I think in many ways is true, right? But if you're using comparison Lauren 8.21.26: Of like getting down on myself. Shit, we should have done that. Why didn't we just plan it? Why didn't I take the time to and getting down on myself for not, you know, pulling those triggers? What can I do? Well, I think there's like two parts to it. Because ca comparison's not necessarily inherently negative. So there is this whole notion of like you know, comparison is a thief of joy, which I think in many ways is true, right? But if you're using comparison Ingrid 8.21.26: and you're looking at it through a lens of admiration, right? Yeah, I think that's one thing versus looking at it through a lens of attacking your self-esteem. So for example, if you were looking at people who were able to go on various vacations this summer and you're thinking, my God, I wish I was able to do that, right? It's clearly eliciting some kind of feeling in you. And so if you find that you're getting into a comparison loop, I'd be curious, even what your thoughts are surrounding it. So, because one thing is that Lauren 8.21.26: and you're looking at it through a lens of admiration, right? Yeah, I think that's one thing versus looking at it through a lens of attacking your self-esteem. So for example, if you were looking at people who were able to go on various vacations this summer and you're thinking, my God, I wish I was able to do that, right? It's clearly eliciting some kind of feeling in you. And so if you find that you're getting into a comparison loop, I'd be curious, even what your thoughts are surrounding it. So, because one thing is that Ingrid 8.21.26: One way of looking at it is that seeing people regularly traveling this summer made you realize that traveling's maybe more important to you than perhaps you previously thought it was. Right? Which means that there are strategies that you can implement to help yield you the results that you want, right? So maybe that makes you realize, hey, this summer, even though we had a lot of opportunities for family connection, we did staycations, which is great because we live in a beautiful area, and we were able to enjoy a lot of amenities that are only available during the summer. Lauren 8.21.26: One way of looking at it is that seeing people regularly traveling this summer made you realize that traveling's maybe more important to you than perhaps you previously thought it was. Right? Which means that there are strategies that you can implement to help yield you the results that you want, right? So maybe that makes you realize, hey, this summer, even though we had a lot of opportunities for family connection, we did staycations, which is great because we live in a beautiful area, and we were able to enjoy a lot of amenities that are only available during the summer. Ingrid 8.21.26: I did realize that I also really enjoy creating memories through vacations with my families. So I think next summer I'm going to be intentional about ensuring there's carved out time so we can do that. Okay. Right? It's sort of like admiring other people's experience in a way that's not beating yourself up. Like you'll notice, like, I didn't say anything negative about, right? Yeah, I know. But if you look at it through a lens of like, my gosh, like I was so busy this year, I really, you know. Lauren 8.21.26: I did realize that I also really enjoy creating memories through vacations with my families. So I think next summer I'm going to be intentional about ensuring there's carved out time so we can do that. Okay. Right? It's sort of like admiring other people's experience in a way that's not beating yourself up. Like you'll notice, like, I didn't say anything negative about, right? Yeah, I know. But if you look at it through a lens of like, my gosh, like I was so busy this year, I really, you know. Ingrid 8.21.26: didn't do what I should have done, you know, to plan a summer that was active and filled with vacations, you know, this sucks. Right. You know, that is the kind of loop that I agree. That's not very productive, right? It's not really it's not leading to a problem solving. It's really just like continuing on this thing where you're attacking your self esteem, in which case you'd want to break that loop. And so the way to break that would be you need to acknowledge what's happening, right? here I go again. I'm comparing. How is it making me feel? Not amazing. Lauren 8.21.26: didn't do what I should have done, you know, to plan a summer that was active and filled with vacations, you know, this sucks. Right. You know, that is the kind of loop that I agree. That's not very productive, right? It's not really it's not leading to a problem solving. It's really just like continuing on this thing where you're attacking your self esteem, in which case you'd want to break that loop. And so the way to break that would be you need to acknowledge what's happening, right? here I go again. I'm comparing. How is it making me feel? Not amazing. Ingrid 8.21.26: Right? Like if my goal is to be feeling in good spirits and feel motivated, getting in this loop is not doing that. It's not yielding me the results that I want. So what is it that I really need in this moment? Do I feel unsure of the decisions that I made that resulted in us not going on a trip this summer? Do I feel tired, honestly? Do I feel like I need just some rest? So identifying what it is, which in this case would be a comparison loop, and then Lauren 8.21.26: Right? Like if my goal is to be feeling in good spirits and feel motivated, getting in this loop is not doing that. It's not yielding me the results that I want. So what is it that I really need in this moment? Do I feel unsure of the decisions that I made that resulted in us not going on a trip this summer? Do I feel tired, honestly? Do I feel like I need just some rest? So identifying what it is, which in this case would be a comparison loop, and then Ingrid 8.21.26: Really identifying what your needs are in those moments and then starting there and breaking that cycle so you're not just continuing on this loop that's not giving you what you need. Right. That's that's really helpful. And it's funny because I would get on these, like, you know, I'd see these beautiful vacations of like, well, we just had an amazing day though. Like, why can't I practice gratitude? Like I think sometimes like when I started feeling that way, I was like, but like stop comparing to them because I did have a wonderful. Lauren 8.21.26: Really identifying what your needs are in those moments and then starting there and breaking that cycle so you're not just continuing on this loop that's not giving you what you need. Right. That's that's really helpful. And it's funny because I would get on these, like, you know, I'd see these beautiful vacations of like, well, we just had an amazing day though. Like, why can't I practice gratitude? Like I think sometimes like when I started feeling that way, I was like, but like stop comparing to them because I did have a wonderful. Ingrid 8.21.26: summer weekend in July or we did go see fireworks. They were just in town, not on the beach of where have you, right? So I was trying to focus on that. And I know that you use even faith a little bit in your practice, which I found when I was reading your bio. I was like, my God, that like totally tracks as your friend. I like can see that. But you don't not that you shut that down your throat, but it's funny, I feel like I've turned a little bit more to again, our our kids go to nursery school together and it's at the Presbyterian church in town. Lauren 8.21.26: summer weekend in July or we did go see fireworks. They were just in town, not on the beach of where have you, right? So I was trying to focus on that. And I know that you use even faith a little bit in your practice, which I found when I was reading your bio. I was like, my God, that like totally tracks as your friend. I like can see that. But you don't not that you shut that down your throat, but it's funny, I feel like I've turned a little bit more to again, our our kids go to nursery school together and it's at the Presbyterian church in town. Ingrid 8.21.26: So I feel like I've been almost more apt also to f to feel that in like moments of those like let's focus on like the why I'm feeling this way, like you were saying, but also like practice some more gratitude and be like so filled with love and whoever what's you feel that love from. Yeah. which has also been so I was really I love that you include that in your practice. Yeah. Yes. Really beautiful. Yeah. in terms of also like redefining like what enough looks like. Lauren 8.21.26: So I feel like I've been almost more apt also to f to feel that in like moments of those like let's focus on like the why I'm feeling this way, like you were saying, but also like practice some more gratitude and be like so filled with love and whoever what's you feel that love from. Yeah. which has also been so I was really I love that you include that in your practice. Yeah. Yes. Really beautiful. Yeah. in terms of also like redefining like what enough looks like. Ingrid 8.21.26: Especially, you know, with working moms or high achieving mothers. I'm sure we all go to bed at some point in a week and we're like, fuck. Like I did not do enough as on the mom front today. Or vice versa. I am so slammed at work because X, Y, R, Z was sick and this person had this and blah blah blah. My husband's traveling. Right. How can we maybe also again like tools wise, like pull us out of that negative Lauren 8.21.26: Especially, you know, with working moms or high achieving mothers. I'm sure we all go to bed at some point in a week and we're like, fuck. Like I did not do enough as on the mom front today. Or vice versa. I am so slammed at work because X, Y, R, Z was sick and this person had this and blah blah blah. My husband's traveling. Right. How can we maybe also again like tools wise, like pull us out of that negative Ingrid 8.21.26: Space. Space. Well, it's similar to even what you were just describing, where you were really intentionally shifting your focus. Right? It sounds like you were sort of previously noticing that were there'd be like certain triggering things, whether it's like, you know, social media's kind of highlight reels, right? which is all that we're seeing, you know, when people are posting. And that might make you think like, man, like I wish I went on a vacation, right? But in that moment, you made a decision to choose actually what you were focusing on. Like you could focus on the negative. Lauren 8.21.26: Space. Space. Well, it's similar to even what you were just describing, where you were really intentionally shifting your focus. Right? It sounds like you were sort of previously noticing that were there'd be like certain triggering things, whether it's like, you know, social media's kind of highlight reels, right? which is all that we're seeing, you know, when people are posting. And that might make you think like, man, like I wish I went on a vacation, right? But in that moment, you made a decision to choose actually what you were focusing on. Like you could focus on the negative. Ingrid 8.21.26: Or you could focus on the positive. Right? And you made a choice to focus on the positive. So I think that demonstrates that while we will have automatic thoughts that come up for us when we're exposed to certain situations, we actually have the control over choosing what we focus on. Right? And so if someone is left at the end of the day sort of beating themselves up, either they didn't do enough or they did too much, what have you. Lauren 8.21.26: Or you could focus on the positive. Right? And you made a choice to focus on the positive. So I think that demonstrates that while we will have automatic thoughts that come up for us when we're exposed to certain situations, we actually have the control over choosing what we focus on. Right? And so if someone is left at the end of the day sort of beating themselves up, either they didn't do enough or they did too much, what have you. Ingrid 8.21.26: It's really about paying attention to how they're feeling in those moments, because your feelings are messengers. So if you're feeling like, let's say your self-esteem is down as a result, or you're feeling really depleted, maybe you're feeling irritable, you might ask yourself, like, well, what am I thinking right now? Well, I'm thinking that I should have done more. Okay, well, what evidence do you have to support that? Because when you go through your day, it looks like it was actually pretty busy. And you provided a lot of opportunities for meaningful connection with your kids, which is really the biggest measure of motherhood, right? Right. It's not like Lauren 8.21.26: It's really about paying attention to how they're feeling in those moments, because your feelings are messengers. So if you're feeling like, let's say your self-esteem is down as a result, or you're feeling really depleted, maybe you're feeling irritable, you might ask yourself, like, well, what am I thinking right now? Well, I'm thinking that I should have done more. Okay, well, what evidence do you have to support that? Because when you go through your day, it looks like it was actually pretty busy. And you provided a lot of opportunities for meaningful connection with your kids, which is really the biggest measure of motherhood, right? Right. It's not like Ingrid 8.21.26: That they went to 15 different activities, it's like what opportunities that I have to share a connection moment with them. Right. You know? Yeah. And so taking a look at what you're feeling, what you're thinking, and then really addressing whether or not there's evidence to support the thought you're having. Because in most circumstances where people are feeling a pretty strong negative response to a situation in terms of their thinking, it's usually not overly accurate. It's usually just like one side of it. And so I think with motherhood, people tend to put Lauren 8.21.26: That they went to 15 different activities, it's like what opportunities that I have to share a connection moment with them. Right. You know? Yeah. And so taking a look at what you're feeling, what you're thinking, and then really addressing whether or not there's evidence to support the thought you're having. Because in most circumstances where people are feeling a pretty strong negative response to a situation in terms of their thinking, it's usually not overly accurate. It's usually just like one side of it. And so I think with motherhood, people tend to put Ingrid 8.21.26: what their perceived deficits are on a pedestal, and then the things that they do really well is such a smaller focal point for them. And that's distorted. Mm-hmm. No, that totally tracks. I'm like, I could think of multiple occasions this week alone. You know, it's funny because I know that you also deal with like the relationship side of all of this, right? With like the partnerships and all that. And Lauren 8.21.26: what their perceived deficits are on a pedestal, and then the things that they do really well is such a smaller focal point for them. And that's distorted. Mm-hmm. No, that totally tracks. I'm like, I could think of multiple occasions this week alone. You know, it's funny because I know that you also deal with like the relationship side of all of this, right? With like the partnerships and all that. And Ingrid 8.21.26: I have been so down on myself. My husband does all the drop-offs. He's done drop-off all week with my daughter for camp. I did a little bit with my son for hockey camp this week, but like I had work a lot of these mornings. And there was this like guilt, right? That I'm not doing as much as him. But then there's also this, like, we had this birthday party this weekend. Do you think he's done anything for this birthday party? Granted, we've Lauren 8.21.26: I have been so down on myself. My husband does all the drop-offs. He's done drop-off all week with my daughter for camp. I did a little bit with my son for hockey camp this week, but like I had work a lot of these mornings. And there was this like guilt, right? That I'm not doing as much as him. But then there's also this, like, we had this birthday party this weekend. Do you think he's done anything for this birthday party? Granted, we've Ingrid 8.21.26: Divided and conquered with the four moms that are at this birthday. Yes. But like I had a moment of sheer panic the other day. I was like, my God, I've only gotten a present for trip. I have two other ki children I need to get presents for. And it's funny because I think we do downplay those. Like at the end of the day, I'm doing all the paperwork for n nursery school. I'm also do Yeah. So it's I feel like the divide and conquer with parenting. Sometimes one one parent gets the shit under the sick in terms of like getting the Lauren 8.21.26: Divided and conquered with the four moms that are at this birthday. Yes. But like I had a moment of sheer panic the other day. I was like, my God, I've only gotten a present for trip. I have two other ki children I need to get presents for. And it's funny because I think we do downplay those. Like at the end of the day, I'm doing all the paperwork for n nursery school. I'm also do Yeah. So it's I feel like the divide and conquer with parenting. Sometimes one one parent gets the shit under the sick in terms of like getting the Ingrid 8.21.26: you are doing that kind of stuff behind the scenes, right? Yeah. And I also think, you know, you use the word guilt, which to me is interesting because guilt implies there was intentional harm. Right? Okay. So like if you think about a court of law or legal system, right? Someone could there could be a really tragic accident. The charges are gonna look different for that than let's say someone who went out with intention to cause harm. Okay. You know what I mean? Yes. and so with guilt, the p there's intention there, right? So even people will use like the phrase mom guilt. Yeah. Lauren 8.21.26: you are doing that kind of stuff behind the scenes, right? Yeah. And I also think, you know, you use the word guilt, which to me is interesting because guilt implies there was intentional harm. Right? Okay. So like if you think about a court of law or legal system, right? Someone could there could be a really tragic accident. The charges are gonna look different for that than let's say someone who went out with intention to cause harm. Okay. You know what I mean? Yes. and so with guilt, the p there's intention there, right? So even people will use like the phrase mom guilt. Yeah. Ingrid 8.21.26: People that are feeling guilty that they're not giving their kids enough to me typically aren't people that are probably intentionally causing harm. You know what I mean? Yeah. So like even when you use the word guilt, what what you were describing that, you know, you were here working and you're a very visible mother, right? Your kids are always around, they can see you. You were referencing how they'll see you at 6 a.m. kind of starting your day, and now you've modeled certain behaviors for them that there's actually some carryover with them now, which is probably really cool to see. You know, how could you be guilty? Lauren 8.21.26: People that are feeling guilty that they're not giving their kids enough to me typically aren't people that are probably intentionally causing harm. You know what I mean? Yeah. So like even when you use the word guilt, what what you were describing that, you know, you were here working and you're a very visible mother, right? Your kids are always around, they can see you. You were referencing how they'll see you at 6 a.m. kind of starting your day, and now you've modeled certain behaviors for them that there's actually some carryover with them now, which is probably really cool to see. You know, how could you be guilty? Ingrid 8.21.26: Do you wanna like there's nothing to be guilty about because there there was no intentional, you know, harm that you're trying to cause. Right. Yeah. So even how you talk to yourself. Maybe it's just like n instead of saying guilt, I guess it is like feeling maybe like I didn't do enough. But then that goes back to what we were talking about before, which is like full circle. Yeah. Crazy. Yeah. in terms of back to school. Lauren 8.21.26: Do you wanna like there's nothing to be guilty about because there there was no intentional, you know, harm that you're trying to cause. Right. Yeah. So even how you talk to yourself. Maybe it's just like n instead of saying guilt, I guess it is like feeling maybe like I didn't do enough. But then that goes back to what we were talking about before, which is like full circle. Yeah. Crazy. Yeah. in terms of back to school. Ingrid 8.21.26: Just since we were I'm thinking about my Amazon list literally as I'm chatting, which is a disgusting amount of things that are in my cart. What could you tell like a mother who's maybe sending their kids to the fr I mean, I think any back to school is tough, no matter what. For parents, not even just moms, right? For parents. What could what advice could you give to a parent listening right now who's maybe having a really tough second week or just to kind of Lauren 8.21.26: Just since we were I'm thinking about my Amazon list literally as I'm chatting, which is a disgusting amount of things that are in my cart. What could you tell like a mother who's maybe sending their kids to the fr I mean, I think any back to school is tough, no matter what. For parents, not even just moms, right? For parents. What could what advice could you give to a parent listening right now who's maybe having a really tough second week or just to kind of Ingrid 8.21.26: make them feel a little bit less alone in this world. I mean, I'm just thinking about my watching my daughter literally behind this camera right now, riding her bike and I'm like, how is she going to kindergarten? Like I can't handle it. I know. How can we ha like manage this? Help. Well well, I think a lot of it is really being aware of the things you're telling yourself. You know, are you are you feeling like she can't handle it? You know, like is that what you're telling yourself? Are you tell you know, what are the stories you're telling yourself about what her kindergarten experience is going to be like? Lauren 8.21.26: make them feel a little bit less alone in this world. I mean, I'm just thinking about my watching my daughter literally behind this camera right now, riding her bike and I'm like, how is she going to kindergarten? Like I can't handle it. I know. How can we ha like manage this? Help. Well well, I think a lot of it is really being aware of the things you're telling yourself. You know, are you are you feeling like she can't handle it? You know, like is that what you're telling yourself? Are you tell you know, what are the stories you're telling yourself about what her kindergarten experience is going to be like? Ingrid 8.21.26: Because change can involve uncomfortable emotions, but it's also really exciting. Like it's exciting that she's embarking on this new chapter and she's growing older and she's gonna be now really growing into herself and creating new interests, new friends, having access to a whole new community. It there's a lot of exciting things happening. So I think what sometimes parents will get sort of stuck in is looking at the sort of Lauren 8.21.26: Because change can involve uncomfortable emotions, but it's also really exciting. Like it's exciting that she's embarking on this new chapter and she's growing older and she's gonna be now really growing into herself and creating new interests, new friends, having access to a whole new community. It there's a lot of exciting things happening. So I think what sometimes parents will get sort of stuck in is looking at the sort of Ingrid 8.21.26: Deficits that this new situation is creating, where it's sort of like life's changing. I don't like change. I'd rather things continue as they are. I don't want to see my kid get older. And while that's reasonable to e you know, I understand that, right? Because it's sort of like you're feeling like you're racing against the clock. Yeah. There's also the flip side of it though, right? So if you think back to like you what you focus on, there's exciting opportunities that now come with kindergarten. You know, like their personality is really blossoming. And you have you get to have now sort of next level conversations with them that you can't have the same way with like a two-year-old. Lauren 8.21.26: Deficits that this new situation is creating, where it's sort of like life's changing. I don't like change. I'd rather things continue as they are. I don't want to see my kid get older. And while that's reasonable to e you know, I understand that, right? Because it's sort of like you're feeling like you're racing against the clock. Yeah. There's also the flip side of it though, right? So if you think back to like you what you focus on, there's exciting opportunities that now come with kindergarten. You know, like their personality is really blossoming. And you have you get to have now sort of next level conversations with them that you can't have the same way with like a two-year-old. Ingrid 8.21.26: Right. and so it's not really about necessarily putting a positive spin on things, because having an over an overly positive outlook can also feel kind of artificial if if you're struggling, right? So like if someone's having a bad day and they're like today's actually the best day ever, well there's no buy-in, right? Like they don't actually believe that. So the same way that being overly negative is not authentic. So it's the goal is really to to find yourself somewhere in the middle where you're balanced, where you're Lauren 8.21.26: Right. and so it's not really about necessarily putting a positive spin on things, because having an over an overly positive outlook can also feel kind of artificial if if you're struggling, right? So like if someone's having a bad day and they're like today's actually the best day ever, well there's no buy-in, right? Like they don't actually believe that. So the same way that being overly negative is not authentic. So it's the goal is really to to find yourself somewhere in the middle where you're balanced, where you're Ingrid 8.21.26: Willing to take a look at both sides of it. So kindergarten might be hard because it's a transition and it's something I'm not used to. But there's been plenty of times in my life where I've also had new chapters and transitions, and I felt unsure about what it was gonna look like. And a lot of really cool things came of it. Yeah. Well, it's funny, I was thinking today, I was like, well, you know, she doesn't know anyone in her class, perfect example. And I was so bummed that two of her dear friends who are also going to the same elementary school, I was like, okay, they'll put Lauren 8.21.26: Willing to take a look at both sides of it. So kindergarten might be hard because it's a transition and it's something I'm not used to. But there's been plenty of times in my life where I've also had new chapters and transitions, and I felt unsure about what it was gonna look like. And a lot of really cool things came of it. Yeah. Well, it's funny, I was thinking today, I was like, well, you know, she doesn't know anyone in her class, perfect example. And I was so bummed that two of her dear friends who are also going to the same elementary school, I was like, okay, they'll put Ingrid 8.21.26: Right? Like from they they try to do that and then they didn't. But I was like, you know what? She didn't know anyone going to the threes program at her little, you know, NPNS, like a little nursery school. And look at the friendships we've built as families with those, you know, because of that. Yeah. And I would have met you if it wasn't for yeah, this school. So it's there's beautiful things that come out of it. So I've been trying to so is it more just kind of I again it goes kind of back to this gratitude. It's just kinda like switching that Lauren 8.21.26: Right? Like from they they try to do that and then they didn't. But I was like, you know what? She didn't know anyone going to the threes program at her little, you know, NPNS, like a little nursery school. And look at the friendships we've built as families with those, you know, because of that. Yeah. And I would have met you if it wasn't for yeah, this school. So it's there's beautiful things that come out of it. So I've been trying to so is it more just kind of I again it goes kind of back to this gratitude. It's just kinda like switching that Ingrid 8.21.26: internal dialogue a little bit and I don't want to say it's distraction because sometimes I need distraction. No, it's to be honest, like even with what you said, that doesn't even necessarily like it sounds like maybe there's some gratitude kind of woven in, but it seems more so you're pulling from evidence, right? You have evidence that you've been faced with similar circumstances and not only was everything okay, it actually enhanced your life in a lot of ways. Right. Right. And it gave you access to people you would have otherwise maybe not had access to. So Lauren 8.21.26: internal dialogue a little bit and I don't want to say it's distraction because sometimes I need distraction. No, it's to be honest, like even with what you said, that doesn't even necessarily like it sounds like maybe there's some gratitude kind of woven in, but it seems more so you're pulling from evidence, right? You have evidence that you've been faced with similar circumstances and not only was everything okay, it actually enhanced your life in a lot of ways. Right. Right. And it gave you access to people you would have otherwise maybe not had access to. So Ingrid 8.21.26: While you have gratitude because of those experiences, that's actual evidence that goes against your line of thinking. So like pulling from evidence is very helpful. Okay. Because it's right, because it's like great. Right? Because you're challenging, right? Like if you're thinking, my gosh, this is gonna be so hard, she's gonna have such a hard time. You're pulling from real life experiences where like, no, she's actually done this before on on multiple occasions. Right. And sure, maybe the beginning tit, you know. Lauren 8.21.26: While you have gratitude because of those experiences, that's actual evidence that goes against your line of thinking. So like pulling from evidence is very helpful. Okay. Because it's right, because it's like great. Right? Because you're challenging, right? Like if you're thinking, my gosh, this is gonna be so hard, she's gonna have such a hard time. You're pulling from real life experiences where like, no, she's actually done this before on on multiple occasions. Right. And sure, maybe the beginning tit, you know. Ingrid 8.21.26: People need to adjust. But it actually ended up being really good for her and it also was really good for us. So this could be really exciting. That's great. I'm not just a hopeful optimist. Actually, because there's really pulling from real life. Yeah. Look at that. Yeah. Can you tell I've been in therapy? Do you advise therapy to like every mom? Like would you be like most moms need to be just like seeing her in like a different light? Is I know that's kind of a crazy like I mean I d Lauren 8.21.26: People need to adjust. But it actually ended up being really good for her and it also was really good for us. So this could be really exciting. That's great. I'm not just a hopeful optimist. Actually, because there's really pulling from real life. Yeah. Look at that. Yeah. Can you tell I've been in therapy? Do you advise therapy to like every mom? Like would you be like most moms need to be just like seeing her in like a different light? Is I know that's kind of a crazy like I mean I d Ingrid 8.21.26: It's nice to have a sounding board. Right. And it's also nice to have someone who's objective that's got like no skin in the game. Do you know what I mean? Like in terms of like they're not it's not a family member, it's not a friend, it's not a neighbor. Yeah. It's someone who is really just there to listen and sort of give you the space for you to sort of navigate you know, whatever challenges you might be f having to deal with at that time. Yeah. So I f I feel like in that sense, like most people could benefit. Yeah. You know? Is that a generational thing, do you think? Like I totally have a family that like did not believe in therapy. Lauren 8.21.26: It's nice to have a sounding board. Right. And it's also nice to have someone who's objective that's got like no skin in the game. Do you know what I mean? Like in terms of like they're not it's not a family member, it's not a friend, it's not a neighbor. Yeah. It's someone who is really just there to listen and sort of give you the space for you to sort of navigate you know, whatever challenges you might be f having to deal with at that time. Yeah. So I f I feel like in that sense, like most people could benefit. Yeah. You know? Is that a generational thing, do you think? Like I totally have a family that like did not believe in therapy. Ingrid 8.21.26: yeah, no. My mom was like, go for a run. Like Absolutely. Like that wasn't and it's not to shit on my mother. I think she we like I obviously For sure. I think it was just more. She like she'd still be like, Well, she was seeing a shrink, Lauren. I'm like, Well, mother, I see a shrink every other week. So what does that mean for me? Shrink And like I love the show shrinking. yeah, yeah, yeah. But it's funny because I think that that was definitely like our generation, like I think Lauren 8.21.26: yeah, no. My mom was like, go for a run. Like Absolutely. Like that wasn't and it's not to shit on my mother. I think she we like I obviously For sure. I think it was just more. She like she'd still be like, Well, she was seeing a shrink, Lauren. I'm like, Well, mother, I see a shrink every other week. So what does that mean for me? Shrink And like I love the show shrinking. yeah, yeah, yeah. But it's funny because I think that that was definitely like our generation, like I think Ingrid 8.21.26: The vast majority of my friends are CFS. And then I think it's just like, yeah. It's not like taboo thing. Correct. Like we do that, we go to yoga, we yeah for our CrossFit class and we grab coffee. Like that's just like part of your like daily or weekly schedule. Yeah. That's so funny. What do you think I miss? What like anything else on this subject? I feel like we we need we have so many things that we can get into and I think it could be a weekly round table. Lauren 8.21.26: The vast majority of my friends are CFS. And then I think it's just like, yeah. It's not like taboo thing. Correct. Like we do that, we go to yoga, we yeah for our CrossFit class and we grab coffee. Like that's just like part of your like daily or weekly schedule. Yeah. That's so funny. What do you think I miss? What like anything else on this subject? I feel like we we need we have so many things that we can get into and I think it could be a weekly round table. Ingrid 8.21.26: But when it comes to like the comparison game, I feel like I'm fortunate I haven't really dealt with mom bullies really yet. Like you hear in the news, I feel like, you know, the Hilary Duff versus who is that? Like Ashley Tisdale. yeah. There was a lot of that. So there's like a show coming out, which I like will absolutely be watching. Same. But I'm fortunate I haven't like dealt with that yet. Yeah. But I don't know, like what else is there like that I missed. Lauren 8.21.26: But when it comes to like the comparison game, I feel like I'm fortunate I haven't really dealt with mom bullies really yet. Like you hear in the news, I feel like, you know, the Hilary Duff versus who is that? Like Ashley Tisdale. yeah. There was a lot of that. So there's like a show coming out, which I like will absolutely be watching. Same. But I'm fortunate I haven't like dealt with that yet. Yeah. But I don't know, like what else is there like that I missed. Ingrid 8.21.26: So the only thing I think is with comparison is again like are you viewing it through a lens of admiration or is it attacking your self-esteem? So like I think of you in the line of work you're in, right? You have you see predominantly women, right? Yes. I'm assuming many of whom are mothers. Yeah, right? Okay. And these are women who have a lot on their plate, right? They're either balancing careers, families, relationships. Lauren 8.21.26: So the only thing I think is with comparison is again like are you viewing it through a lens of admiration or is it attacking your self-esteem? So like I think of you in the line of work you're in, right? You have you see predominantly women, right? Yes. I'm assuming many of whom are mothers. Yeah, right? Okay. And these are women who have a lot on their plate, right? They're either balancing careers, families, relationships. Ingrid 8.21.26: They're being pulled in multiple directions at the same time. Yeah. Right. And despite that, they're still regularly showing up for themselves and making their physical health a priority. Yeah. Right? So if someone were, let's say, comparing themselves to some of your clients in that sense, right? If they're looking at it through a lens of admiration, of like, you know what? XYZ is able to still show up for herself regularly and make her physical health such an important part of her life, despite Lauren 8.21.26: They're being pulled in multiple directions at the same time. Yeah. Right. And despite that, they're still regularly showing up for themselves and making their physical health a priority. Yeah. Right? So if someone were, let's say, comparing themselves to some of your clients in that sense, right? If they're looking at it through a lens of admiration, of like, you know what? XYZ is able to still show up for herself regularly and make her physical health such an important part of her life, despite Ingrid 8.21.26: Being pulled in multiple directions at multiple times of the day. I want to do that. You know, like I want to create the space in my life so I can live my life in the way that she because I admire that about her, right? Like that's now you're seeing someone doing something that you want to do for yourself because you love yourself, right? So that's different than saying, you know, XYZ is so good about, you know, making time for her physical health. She's such a better mom than I. Lauren 8.21.26: Being pulled in multiple directions at multiple times of the day. I want to do that. You know, like I want to create the space in my life so I can live my life in the way that she because I admire that about her, right? Like that's now you're seeing someone doing something that you want to do for yourself because you love yourself, right? So that's different than saying, you know, XYZ is so good about, you know, making time for her physical health. She's such a better mom than I. Ingrid 8.21.26: She can just balance more than I can. Right. You know, like I I can't do all of that, right? Like now you're beating yourself up. So that's where the comparison trap can be toxic, you know, when you're when you're beating yourself up over things. Right. And and kind of putting a label on that as bad mom. exactly. Like the using somebody else as your sort of measuring stick. Because it's like if you're using another mom as your measuring stick. Lauren 8.21.26: She can just balance more than I can. Right. You know, like I I can't do all of that, right? Like now you're beating yourself up. So that's where the comparison trap can be toxic, you know, when you're when you're beating yourself up over things. Right. And and kind of putting a label on that as bad mom. exactly. Like the using somebody else as your sort of measuring stick. Because it's like if you're using another mom as your measuring stick. Ingrid 8.21.26: It's automatically gonna be that, you know, their wins mean that I'm losing. Mm-hmm. And with that, I think also like kind of back to the social media being like such a highlight reel. Like, I always am like, whenever I raise my voice at my kids, for example, I'm like, ugh, I didn't want to do that. Like I'm a sh that like negative point for you on the mom scale today. But it and I'm like, I bet I bet Ingrid doesn't do that. I do. Lauren 8.21.26: It's automatically gonna be that, you know, their wins mean that I'm losing. Mm-hmm. And with that, I think also like kind of back to the social media being like such a highlight reel. Like, I always am like, whenever I raise my voice at my kids, for example, I'm like, ugh, I didn't want to do that. Like I'm a sh that like negative point for you on the mom scale today. But it and I'm like, I bet I bet Ingrid doesn't do that. I do. Ingrid 8.21.26: It's funny, I was thinking about this the other day and I hope you don't mind I'm sharing this, but I'll never forget this summer. I I always loved you prior, but I remember you called me after that we had a birthday party and Trip was just having a rough day. yeah. You called and you're like, was I like just off my rock like was I off my rocker? I've remembered like the yeah you said you're like, was I just such a bat? I'm like, no. I was like, first of all, the kid we have three year old boys running around at a fire station. What do you think is Lauren 8.21.26: It's funny, I was thinking about this the other day and I hope you don't mind I'm sharing this, but I'll never forget this summer. I I always loved you prior, but I remember you called me after that we had a birthday party and Trip was just having a rough day. yeah. You called and you're like, was I like just off my rock like was I off my rocker? I've remembered like the yeah you said you're like, was I just such a bat? I'm like, no. I was like, first of all, the kid we have three year old boys running around at a fire station. What do you think is Ingrid 8.21.26: Recipe for disaster, cutest birthday party ever. Go list that was the cutest birthday. 100%. But I was like, no one was judging you. But isn't that a funny full circle moment with what we're talking about? 100%. It's in your field. You were like, does did people think I was like crazy? Like, no. Yeah. If anything, I was like, I love you more because I see that you're like, we're all struggling. We're all yeah. And it wasn't, you weren't even struggling. It was just Trump was not having a good day. And Lauren 8.21.26: Recipe for disaster, cutest birthday party ever. Go list that was the cutest birthday. 100%. But I was like, no one was judging you. But isn't that a funny full circle moment with what we're talking about? 100%. It's in your field. You were like, does did people think I was like crazy? Like, no. Yeah. If anything, I was like, I love you more because I see that you're like, we're all struggling. We're all yeah. And it wasn't, you weren't even struggling. It was just Trump was not having a good day. And Ingrid 8.21.26: So you're probably didn't have a good day the next day as r you what I mean? They all totally we all have our moments. Yep. But in terms of like I at the end of the day, not that I'm like s standing on my vibration plate, like contemplating like what grade I got as a mother that day, but we have those moments of like, God, I really didn't do what I wanted to do today. Or like kind of am I was I enough? Or did I do this for myself or did I do that for my kids? And this constant loop. Do men have this? God damn it. I know. Lauren 8.21.26: So you're probably didn't have a good day the next day as r you what I mean? They all totally we all have our moments. Yep. But in terms of like I at the end of the day, not that I'm like s standing on my vibration plate, like contemplating like what grade I got as a mother that day, but we have those moments of like, God, I really didn't do what I wanted to do today. Or like kind of am I was I enough? Or did I do this for myself or did I do that for my kids? And this constant loop. Do men have this? God damn it. I know. Ingrid 8.21.26: Dude's have his scale that we seemingly have. She's Louise. We put so much pressure on ourselves. I know. I know. I know. But I think that's why we're all burnt out sometimes. I know. We have and not to bring it into like the light of what's going on in the world, but this ironically the week that we're filming this is when the Lindsay Clancy case is going on, the hate and peneteer which is away. But I think all of a sudden women's mental health is really being put on this. Lauren 8.21.26: Dude's have his scale that we seemingly have. She's Louise. We put so much pressure on ourselves. I know. I know. I know. But I think that's why we're all burnt out sometimes. I know. We have and not to bring it into like the light of what's going on in the world, but this ironically the week that we're filming this is when the Lindsay Clancy case is going on, the hate and peneteer which is away. But I think all of a sudden women's mental health is really being put on this. Ingrid 8.21.26: It's having a spotlight moment. And so it's kind of interesting we're we're having this conversation because of the pressures and all of that that we're we we're constantly battling. I know. I know. And that's why it's so important to provide support to people. You know, like everybody functions better when they're supporting one another versus like people feeling isolated and that they have to be comparing to keep up. Lauren 8.21.26: It's having a spotlight moment. And so it's kind of interesting we're we're having this conversation because of the pressures and all of that that we're we we're constantly battling. I know. I know. And that's why it's so important to provide support to people. You know, like everybody functions better when they're supporting one another versus like people feeling isolated and that they have to be comparing to keep up. Ingrid 8.21.26: And so just any opportunities that people have to just like lend a helping hand, check in with somebody, you don't know what impact it will have on somebody's life. You would be s completely surprised. Something that you think is sort of just a benign sort of pleasantry exchange can honestly touch somebody because they're in a place where just that reaching out for that sort of minimal connection can be transformative. So especially, you know, especially just with women, I think that instead of it, you know, people sort of like coming against each other. Lauren 8.21.26: And so just any opportunities that people have to just like lend a helping hand, check in with somebody, you don't know what impact it will have on somebody's life. You would be s completely surprised. Something that you think is sort of just a benign sort of pleasantry exchange can honestly touch somebody because they're in a place where just that reaching out for that sort of minimal connection can be transformative. So especially, you know, especially just with women, I think that instead of it, you know, people sort of like coming against each other. Ingrid 8.21.26: You know, it's such an opportunity for people to come together and just reach out even when you're reluctant to do so. Right. You know? Oftentimes when you feel that little bit like should I, should not? You should you should. Exactly. I've noticed that and I have like for perfect example, a friend of mine just had a baby and I like send a random message just because I remember I needed that. Yeah. You know, it's just like when in doubt, just just send the message, just drop off the care package. Yeah. Lauren 8.21.26: You know, it's such an opportunity for people to come together and just reach out even when you're reluctant to do so. Right. You know? Oftentimes when you feel that little bit like should I, should not? You should you should. Exactly. I've noticed that and I have like for perfect example, a friend of mine just had a baby and I like send a random message just because I remember I needed that. Yeah. You know, it's just like when in doubt, just just send the message, just drop off the care package. Yeah. Ingrid 8.21.26: you know, ask if they want a cup of coffee or to go for a walk 'cause if you're having a a sense of something's off or you know? Yeah. Mother's mother's mother's intuition. Intuition is always right damn. Exactly. Exactly. Ingrid, where can we work with you? How can we work with you? If someone is interested, I'll send the I'll put the link in the show notes obviously. But you're accepting patients in Connecticut. Yes, in Connecticut and Virginia. Virginia. it's exclusively online and I take insurance. Look at you. People love that, right? Lauren 8.21.26: you know, ask if they want a cup of coffee or to go for a walk 'cause if you're having a a sense of something's off or you know? Yeah. Mother's mother's mother's intuition. Intuition is always right damn. Exactly. Exactly. Ingrid, where can we work with you? How can we work with you? If someone is interested, I'll send the I'll put the link in the show notes obviously. But you're accepting patients in Connecticut. Yes, in Connecticut and Virginia. Virginia. it's exclusively online and I take insurance. Look at you. People love that, right? Ingrid 8.21.26: We love an insurance benefit. Dead. So yeah, you can just like Google my name and you'll see the platforms that are affiliated with Alma and Headway and you can make an appointment. Done. Should you be interested. I love that. I wish I wasn't a conflict of interest. That's why we just walk and talk and all the things. Exactly. Exactly. thanks for being here. Thank you so much for having me. The first of many. Exactly. We have so many things to talk about. I know. But we covered a lot of ground. We did. Lauren 8.21.26: We love an insurance benefit. Dead. So yeah, you can just like Google my name and you'll see the platforms that are affiliated with Alma and Headway and you can make an appointment. Done. Should you be interested. I love that. I wish I wasn't a conflict of interest. That's why we just walk and talk and all the things. Exactly. Exactly. thanks for being here. Thank you so much for having me. The first of many. Exactly. We have so many things to talk about. I know. But we covered a lot of ground. We did. Ingrid 8.21.26: This sufficient. All right, Bummin Thrive. Thank you so much for coming on or sharing with us this lovely combo today. And I will see you in the next episode. Lauren 8.21.26: This sufficient. All right, Bummin Thrive. Thank you so much for coming on or sharing with us this lovely combo today. And I will see you in the next episode.