Latest / Closing Sales in Nigeria - Sales For The Nigerian Business Person: The Sales and Marketing Blueprint / Small Talk, Big Results: Why Casual Chat Matters in Business

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Small Talk, Big Results: Why Casual Chat Matters in Business · Closing Sales in Nigeria - Sales For The Nigerian Business Person: The Sales and Marketing Blueprint

0:01
Hello and welcome to the show. Today we're going to be tackling
0:05
the question whether rapport and small talk mean the same thing.
0:11
For those of you who listened to the previous episode, yeah,
0:14
sure, no problem, you understand.
0:15
So let's let's keep moving. But for those of you who are
0:19
just discovering this podcast for the first time, there is
0:22
sort of like a Part 1, maybe a part 2:00-ish to this episode.
0:27
So after you're done listening to this, skip back, listen to
0:30
the prior one and then the one before, and you'll get caught up
0:34
to speed. You'll understand the whole
0:36
context. You understand what rapport
0:38
means, and you understand why we are disturbing ourself about
0:43
this topic, Rapport. Why should Nigerian business
0:47
people, why should Nigerian entrepreneurs bother themselves
0:50
about rapport? Not now talk of small talk,
0:55
which is what we're going to tackle today.
0:59
Now, of course, the reason why we're tackling this is because,
1:02
you know, there have been people asking questions on LinkedIn
1:05
about this sort of thing. You know, it's good that in 2026
1:09
more people are aware of the fact that your business is not
1:12
going to grow unless you learn how to sell.
1:15
And so because of that, people are becoming interested in lots
1:19
of topic topics around, you know, what is sales, what is
1:24
selling? How do you sell?
1:25
How do you convince people? Can you even convince people?
1:28
So I'm glad that I've started seeing discussions on social
1:31
media about these sorts of things.
1:34
So yeah, anyway, so that's the reason why I'm we're looking at
1:38
this question today, whether rapport means the same thing as
1:41
small talk. Now to understand or rather to
1:47
answer this question, there are a couple of things that we need
1:50
to understand. So First off, we need to
1:51
understand what is rapport. For those of you who listened to
1:55
the last episode, you already know, then we also need to
1:58
understand what is small talk. Then we also have to ask ourself
2:02
what does small talk do? So for those of you who are
2:06
listening for the first time, don't worry, we're going to get
2:08
to the definitions. But before we do that, for the
2:11
benefit of those who are discovering the podcast for the
2:14
first time, because there is always someone who just happens
2:17
to be discovering the podcast for the first time.
2:20
Even though I've been here for over six years and even though
2:24
I've been here for over 1300 episodes.
2:28
So my name is Tavi Shima IED, I'm a former lawyer turned
2:31
business consultant. And the whole point of this
2:33
podcast is to solve business problems, especially problems
2:37
that can be solved by talking to customers one-on-one, typing to
2:41
customers one-on-one, calling customers one-on-one, Skyping
2:46
customers or Zoom calling customers or Google meeting
2:49
customers, one-on-one SHA, problems that we can solve when
2:54
you are face to face with your potential customer.
2:57
So those are the kinds of problems that we saw over here.
2:59
And the way I like to put it on this podcast, I bring you guys
3:02
some business goodness. So if you're discovering the
3:05
show for the first time, subscribe on Spotify, YouTube,
3:08
Apple iTunes, any player of your choice.
3:11
And if you'd love to connect with me, you can call, send me a
3:15
text message or a WhatsApp message on 08064662140.
3:24
In this season of my life, or rather or in this season of the
3:27
podcast, I would love to hear particularly from those of you
3:30
who are trying to start businesses and you have 3456
3:33
ideas and you can't figure out which one in particular you
3:38
should build a business around. I'd love to hear from you guys.
3:40
Reach out because I can help you to select the best idea.
3:44
Reach out because after we select that idea, we can
3:48
validate the idea together. We can figure out if there's any
3:51
demand. We can figure out if people are
3:53
willing to pay for this thing. We can figure out if people are
3:56
willing to pay enough for this thing so we can build a business
3:58
around it. And reach out so that we can
4:02
figure out how to create a selling system.
4:05
Because the whole goal or the whole point rather, it's not
4:11
just to get someone to buy something from you once, but you
4:14
want repeat purchases, you want the person to come back again
4:17
and again. And also you want the person to
4:20
also make introductions. You want people to refer you to
4:24
other people so that their friends, their family members
4:27
come and buy and also, you know, could become customers of yours
4:30
as well. So if you are in that phase of
4:33
your business growth, business journey, you're thinking I'm
4:36
good at this, I would like to do this, but moms and pops, they
4:39
say I should do this. Reach out.
4:41
I'd love to hear from you. So now back to the topic of the
4:43
day. Does rapport mean the same thing
4:45
as small talk? Now, what is rapport?
4:48
Like I said, this episode is kind of like a Part 2 or maybe a
4:51
Part 3. So when you're done listening,
4:53
listen to the last episode and the one that came before.
4:56
But summary rapport just means you're having a conversation
5:00
with someone, whether in the personal context or in the
5:02
business. OK, you know what, let's just
5:04
keep it business. Let's keep it proper.
5:05
Let me stop talking relationships.
5:07
So in a business context, now you're there with an investor,
5:12
or you're there with a stakeholder, or you're there
5:15
with your business partner, or you're there with a potential
5:19
customer, a potential client, or you're there, you're just shy,
5:23
like, you know, open networking, you know, that kind of thing.
5:26
So like for those of us who have kids, like today was my
5:30
children's in the house sports day and we were at Agui Agui
5:35
Rossi Cantonment in Abuja. And you know, was fun, very hot
5:40
day, very hot day was fun. And you know, some people who
5:45
are social butterflies, you know, they come into their
5:47
element like, oh, there'll be other parents there.
5:49
So some people show up, you know, all fly, you know, deck to
5:53
the nines and they're ready, you know, networking because people
5:57
their eye, they shine like they're thinking business money,
5:59
money, money, money, money, money, money.
6:01
Speaking of money, everybody that was sitting around me had
6:07
this phone, this mad phone, the one that opens up Samsung V
6:11
fold. And I just I just kept thinking
6:14
every time somebody would bring the phone and then open it and
6:16
begin the, you know, record video, you know, like when your
6:18
child is performing and all that.
6:20
So I recording video I say now wow, is this 3.5 million I'm
6:24
looking at like that. Then while I'm marveling another
6:27
person I'll bring out the owners.
6:29
No wow, see 3.5 million. So that's how just see 3.5
6:33
million three-point 53.53.5. Then I heard that what's this
6:39
one called the iPhone something something pro Max and I was like
6:43
5 M then that's how I'll see another person see 5,000,005
6:47
million, 5 million. Wow, that people are paid up,
6:51
really paid up. How did I enter this level now
6:57
rapport. So, so I was saying that, you
7:00
know, when you're in that kind of session now, like you, your
7:03
children are doing the house sports, you're coming there
7:05
because you want to network. You want to see if you can make
7:08
one or two business connects and then you happen to be talking to
7:11
somebody. And then as you and that person
7:13
are talking is the level of comfort.
7:15
You guys are just cool. There's some ease, there's some
7:19
relatability. You know, that is rapport.
7:23
If your auntie says, oh, you, you're, you're doing fashion
7:28
design, I'd be say yes, auntie. Well, go and call Mama.
7:32
They couldn't be. I've told her that you're
7:33
coming. She wants to design something
7:36
some you know, something for 60 years, wedding anniversary
7:41
something, something, blah, blah, blah.
7:42
And then you go over and in front of Mama Identica and as
7:48
you all are talking between you and Mama, there's a certain
7:51
level of comfort, there's a certain level of ease, certain
7:55
level of relatability, conversation, just the flow,
7:57
everything smooth, everything soft, everything gentle.
8:01
That is rapport. You sell insurance, You walk
8:06
into the D GS office, you know, DJ says sit down.
8:11
After 2 minutes, you and DJ are talking as if you know, you have
8:14
known yourself for a very long time.
8:16
And it looks as if, oh, I might be able to sell a policy to DG.
8:21
Apart from that, I might even get permission from DGDG is
8:25
director general. Yeah, Director general, the head
8:27
of the parasito. I might even get DG to even, you
8:31
know, allow me to make presentation to the, you know,
8:36
to the other departments. Maybe I can close some of these
8:38
as well. So when you are sitting down
8:40
with DG and then this level of comfort, this level of ease,
8:44
there's relatability, conversation smooth.
8:48
That is what we call rapport. So especially in the business or
8:54
sales context, it also applies in the personal context as well.
8:57
What? I'll leave that for later since
8:59
this is not a relationship show, but basically, if you listen to
9:02
this podcast for the first time, skip back after listening to
9:05
this thing, listen to the last episode, you're going to get
9:07
caught up to speed. Then another thing that you're
9:10
going to be able to learn about if you listen to the older
9:14
episode, the one before this is what Rapport does.
9:18
Now. Rapport makes it easy to talk to
9:20
someone, like I said, whether in front of DG or Mama Adenica or
9:26
you know, whoever it is, that could be a potential customer or
9:29
maybe you're looking to someone investing in your business.
9:31
You're talking to a potential business person.
9:35
If you are able to achieve a certain level of rapport, it
9:38
makes it easy to talk to that person.
9:40
They will trust you, they will relax and then you'll now be
9:44
able to figure out if this is a good person that you should be
9:47
talking to anyway because now everybody should be doing
9:50
business with. There are some people that once
9:52
you feel them like you get, once you get their character.
9:57
Just know that Kai, this person will give me problem and then
10:00
just run. And I told you all about this,
10:03
my client, the one who is in or into audio production services,
10:07
creating audiobooks for Nigerian authors.
10:10
There's one particular author that I spoke with, you know,
10:12
well accomplished and everything, but the we, that
10:14
first conversation, they were just grating on each other.
10:17
You know, it's like like when you take sandpaper, take two
10:23
sandpaper and start rubbing it and that kind of thing.
10:27
So he had to weave the situation because he knew that this mommy,
10:31
even if this mommy pays me my fee in dollars, they'll be
10:35
serious squirrel. So it's not everybody you should
10:37
be doing business with. So yeah, once you achieve a
10:43
certain level of rapport, you're going to be able to figure out,
10:45
is this person a good person for me to continue this business,
10:48
this this conversation with then do they even have a need for my
10:51
product or service? And then what's the best way
10:54
that I can solve this problem for them?
10:56
Or what's the best proposal that I can come up with so that I'll
11:00
collect good money and also give them good results.
11:03
So these are the reasons why we try and build rapport when we're
11:06
having a business in the business context.
11:09
So like I said, see the last episode for more details after
11:13
you don't listening to this, skip back, listen to the other
11:15
one. So for those of you who are
11:17
discovering this podcast for the first time, can you see why this
11:19
is the best podcast in Nigeria? The absolute best.
11:23
No other one, none, none other because no other podcast is
11:28
going to give you this level of detail that I'm talking about
11:30
here. They'll inspire you, they'll
11:31
motivate you. They'll bring somebody who has
11:34
built, you know, 50 million whatever business and you learn
11:37
how to acquire, to perspire, to refire and desire and attain
11:40
what you desire and aim hire and you know all that motivational
11:44
crap by the end of the day, you wake up tomorrow motivated, you
11:47
will know the next step to take. This is the only podcast where
11:51
you wake up tomorrow morning and you know, OK, this is exactly
11:54
what I need to do tomorrow. So how do you achieve rapport?
11:59
Again, listen to to the last episode.
12:01
You do that by active listening and you do that by building
12:03
commonality. So listen to the last episode
12:06
and you're going to know what's up.
12:08
Then small talk, because now remember, people are asking
12:13
questions on LinkedIn because LinkedIn is the only social
12:16
media I have. That's why I hang out.
12:18
And some people are asking this thing that you would like saying
12:21
rapport, rapport and small talk. I did the same thing.
12:27
You know what, let me be frank with you.
12:31
You could say they're the same. You also say is not, they're not
12:34
the same. And at some points you'll see
12:37
that we can use the same the terms interchangeably.
12:40
But I'm still going to tackle this question just to tease out
12:45
something really, really important that you guys are
12:49
missing. Whether you are trying to build
12:52
rapport or whether you are engaging in small talk, a lot of
12:55
times you will have fumbling because you're missing one key
12:59
thing. All right, one key thing, but
13:04
let's continue. So small talk now.
13:06
Small talk just means pointless conversation, that's all.
13:10
If you're in the UK, it means pointless conversations about
13:13
the weather. And there was one thing I
13:15
couldn't understand when I was schooling in the UK.
13:18
Like today is raining. Oh, tomorrow sunshine.
13:21
Oh, this cloud, oh, snow, snow. Like, what is your fascination
13:24
with the weather? Is that all you people talk
13:26
about? You jam somebody and then the
13:28
only thing they can talk about is weather.
13:31
So anyway, if you're in the UK, small talk means pointless
13:34
conversations about the weather. Now, for those of us who like
13:42
I'm a Township boy, I'm a city boy, let me not lie, I'm a
13:48
Nigerian, but you know, I'm not really hardcore Nigerian, if you
13:51
catch my drift, because I'm a Township boy.
13:54
I was born in Makodi. From Makodi, we moved to Suleja.
13:59
Suleja is also a town. From Suleja we moved to Abuja.
14:03
From Abuja we moved to Lagos. Then from Lagos, I spent a lot
14:07
of time in IFA because I went to the greatest university in the
14:09
world of Buffalo University. Then after that I moved to Kano
14:14
and then from Kano I moved to Aberdeen, Scotland.
14:17
I'm from Scotland. I came back Lagos, Abuja.
14:19
So you can see that I'm a Township boy.
14:21
I'm Nigerian, but I've been on, you know, my levels.
14:26
My movement has always been Township, Township, Township,
14:28
Township. My parents on the other hand,
14:32
are a different kind of Nigerians, a different class of
14:34
Nigerians, an older school. My parents are not razzle at
14:40
all. OK, well, my father is late, but
14:43
my mom, See, if you talk to mom so you see that she's well put
14:46
together, you'll be impressed. But The thing is, mom, say and
14:49
Popsy were born in the village. Popsy was born at home.
14:56
Momsy. In fact, not just Momsy was born
14:58
at home. All her siblings, all of them,
15:00
how many are they self? Like I've been there like 9.
15:03
I've been the boys, that's like 4.
15:06
The girls, that's like 5. Yeah, 99.
15:09
All of them were born in the house, not in the hospital, born
15:13
in the house in the village. So Mumsy is from that generation
15:17
where people grew up in Township.
15:19
They grew up in village, sorry, not Township.
15:21
They grew up in village. Popsy is also from that
15:23
generation where people grew up in Villa.
15:27
So when I say I'm Nigerian, but I'm, you know, not really
15:32
Nigerian, that's what I mean. I'm not one of those people who
15:34
grew up in the village. That's all we are saying.
15:38
What does this have to do with small talk?
15:39
Relax, I'm getting there. Just be patient.
15:41
I know that's one problem with my own podcast, I talk too much,
15:43
but just calm down, I'm going somewhere.
15:46
So where was I now? So in the UK now, small talk is
15:51
pointless conversation about the weather.
15:53
Anybody you jam in the UK will be telling you all winter has
15:56
been cold this year. Winter was not cold this year.
15:59
The rain is too much. The rain is not raining.
16:02
The rain did not rain at all. The sun is sunny or the sun did
16:05
not sun. It's just weather, weather,
16:07
weather. That's their own small talk,
16:10
pointless conversations about the weather in Nigeria.
16:13
Now. Small talk is all those
16:16
pointless conversations about family and the economy.
16:20
Now, this is the reason why I'm saying the difference between me
16:24
and like my parents generation, because for the generation I
16:27
belong to those of us who are those of us who are Township
16:33
children, you know, there's a way of seeing the world that we
16:36
don't understand. All those ones who grew up on
16:40
frozen chicken, Greek chicken, you know, So like for my own
16:43
parents, you know, they're going to eat chicken.
16:46
You go, you grab the chicken, you slaughter the chicken and
16:49
then you cook it and eat it local chicken.
16:51
Then those us who grew up on imported chicken, you know,
16:56
aggreek chicken, chicken that you pump up with fertilizer,
17:01
Different generation. In fact, like I think it was
17:06
like 5 years ago, like 5-6 years ago, my former landlord was
17:11
during Christmas time and the guy was a very nice man.
17:13
God rest his soul. He's late now, Barrister.
17:17
And then let me not say his full name out of respect, for
17:20
example. So Barrister was like, hey,
17:23
happy Christmas. So now I will send something to
17:26
you later on. That's how excuse me, Barrister
17:29
sent live chicken to live chicken.
17:33
So by star by star, thank you very much.
17:35
Oh, but I don't know how to slaughter chicken.
17:39
I should have seen the way Barrister looked at me.
17:41
His eyes are open. He could not believe that
17:44
there's Nigerian who doesn't know how to slaughter chicken.
17:47
Yes, that's what I mean. I'm from that generation.
17:49
I don't know how to slaughter chicken.
17:50
I've never slaughtered chicken in my life.
17:52
I mean, I butchered meat but that is after they have killed
17:54
it and then you give me, then I'll cut it.
17:57
But unlike my parents generation and barristers generation where
18:01
if they want to cook chicken, they will tell you as the man in
18:04
the house, go and kill the chicken or go and kill the goat
18:07
or go and kill the cow, you're one.
18:09
I was slaughtered. And then every, every.
18:12
So how did I get here? Now, for those people who grew
18:19
up in the village, there's some kind of conversations that they
18:21
have that young bred young, you know, young blood Nigerians like
18:25
us. It just confuses us.
18:27
So like for my parents generation, you jam somebody,
18:30
there's something was supposed to discuss, but then they start
18:32
asking, oh, how is uncle So so so how is daddy?
18:36
How is this person, you know, like, you know, Yoruba people
18:38
now, for instance, say, ah, the Kuja meta echo, this echo that
18:44
bound your call Mama. So so and so on call this person
18:48
on call. That person will call.
18:49
And I'm like, what is with this ritual?
18:51
You keep on talking about family and family and family and family
18:54
and family. And then after that, you know,
18:57
you talk about the economy and I'm like, what is going on with
19:00
this ritual? So for those of us who are
19:03
Township children, you know, modern Nigerian kids, it can be
19:06
a bit confusing because it looks as if this small talk, they're
19:09
engaging. That's as if it's pointless.
19:12
This conversation is going nowhere.
19:15
You start off asking how, how are you?
19:16
How are the children? And then 45 minutes later,
19:19
people are talking about a common relative that you have
19:21
in, you know, in some fire or something.
19:24
And I'm like, you know, from where to where?
19:26
In my mind, I'm thinking that's when my dad was still alive.
19:29
I'm thinking, look, that the reason why we're here is because
19:32
we're supposed to discuss these things with chief.
19:35
Can we get this ball rolling so that we can finish and then be
19:40
on the road? Because I saw me.
19:43
I'm not planning to sleep in the village because sleeping in the
19:45
village ain't fun at all. You know, it's mosquitoes and no
19:49
light. And, and for those of you who
19:51
know, you know, so in Nigeria, that is small talk, pointless
19:57
conversations about family and sometimes the economy.
20:04
So that's one definition of small talk.
20:07
Now, another definition of small talk that I found online is just
20:10
an easy conversation that people have when they're not talking
20:15
about anything serious or they're not talking about
20:18
anything deep. So like I said, for those of us
20:23
Nigerians now who are Township children, I won't hear that this
20:28
like I think is it burger? I think they call them burger
20:30
children or something like because I have a cousin who's
20:32
good in Ghana and I think over in Ghana they talk about people
20:35
who are burger, burger children, like they're raised on
20:38
hamburgers or something. I don't know.
20:40
So those who are Township children or burger children,
20:45
when we go to the UK and people are talking about the weather
20:48
and then we come back here, people are spending 45 minutes
20:51
asking about the family and children and how is your wife
20:54
and how is your goat and how's your chicken.
20:57
We wonder, OK, what is all this thing about now?
21:02
Even though this thing looks like empty talk, it actually is
21:05
very important small talk, whether in the UK contact
21:10
talking about the weather or whether in Nigerian context
21:13
talking about the wife, the children, the farm, you're
21:16
checking your goats, your neighbor, your uncle's second
21:22
wife's first child, all those conversations.
21:25
It actually is a bridge. The small talk that they're
21:29
doing is a bridge. They're trying to lay one or two
21:32
steps before they get somewhere. So me and Popsy were in the
21:37
villa, were in front of Chief and then Popsy is talking about
21:44
all kinds of things, you know, how was the last harvest?
21:47
How was this person? How was so and so?
21:50
Or is this person in school yet or what is this person starting
21:53
round around around now? Young boy meet Avishima.
21:56
I'm sitting down there and I'm thinking that what the hell are
21:59
you doing that? What's going on?
22:03
Can we talk this thing quickly is already 3:00 in the afternoon
22:08
and the villa is like 2 hours away from Makuti.
22:12
So if we finish this conversation now, sharp, sharp
22:15
and we entered the road, we can be back in Makudi City capital
22:18
by 5 because my pops used to like night journey. 9:00 in the
22:23
night was still on the road. 10 PM 11:00 PM was still on the
22:26
road. Now after that, my parents go to
22:29
quarrel. I say Charles, that's my that's
22:31
my late father's name that Charles, you shouldn't be
22:33
carrying shooting around like this at night.
22:36
Anyway, that was fun. So when your popsy or when a
22:42
Nigerian businessman or when UK business people are sitting down
22:46
and they're talking about the weather, it rained, it didn't
22:49
rain, it snow, it didn't snow. Harvest was good, harvest was
22:53
bad. How was your grandfather's
22:55
second wife is a bridge. They're getting somewhere that
23:00
it helps people feel comfortable with each other.
23:03
Before you get into the story, all of you guys understand what
23:07
I'm saying. Now, it's hard to understand we
23:11
Township babies, but actually in the Nigerian context, when they
23:15
get together and then it's Bao Unko, Kunle Unko, this one core,
23:19
that one core, they're getting somewhere, they're building a
23:22
bridge. They're helping people to feel
23:24
comfortable with each other before they start talking about
23:28
the important things. Small talk, especially in this
23:31
part of the world where we haven't lost the heart of small
23:34
talk, is politeness in Nigeria. So don't be confused.
23:39
See, I won't lie till today, the thing so confuses me because I
23:41
remember when Popsy died and we had to go home for the burial.
23:46
As far as I was concerned, me and my brother were concerned.
23:47
Like, look, we have things to do.
23:50
You know, he's unfortunate, but the guy in all pie.
23:52
So let's let's get moving. But there are some things that
23:58
needed to be said. I want to talk.
23:59
My mother would just tap my leg. I was OK.
24:04
Now it's not time to talk. My brother, somebody agitated.
24:06
He wants to talk more so just his leg, no need to talk.
24:12
One of us guests agitated. We look at moms issue, shake her
24:14
head. OK, now is not the time to talk.
24:17
There are some things that needed to be said.
24:20
But then eventually things reached an emotional crescendo
24:23
and moms, you just tapped my leg and just did a hard front like,
24:26
OK, it was now time to broach the matter.
24:28
So it's confusing whether it's personal things or whether it's
24:32
business things. It's confusing, but its
24:37
politeness or building a bridge or changing the emotional
24:42
temperature before you launch into business.
24:46
In the UK, they use it to break up the silence because if you're
24:49
there before you get into the agenda, OK, the agenda for this
24:53
business meeting is 1234. You just break the silence now,
24:58
like, oh, this is the first time we're seeing, oh, happy New
24:59
Year. Oh, by the way, what you do for
25:01
the holidays. Did you enjoy the winter?
25:02
Oh, this winter was dreadful. We had three weeks of snow,
25:05
blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. You know, UK people can talk.
25:10
It's just breaking the silence. Before you get into a hair.
25:13
This is the agenda item one item 2, Item 3, item 4.
25:19
So in Nigeria, small talk can be all kinds of things.
25:25
Like the weather right now in Abuja is hot as hell.
25:29
I heard somebody say that is as if Satan left the door of hell
25:31
open and then the fire is entry into entry into Abuja.
25:39
So those are so excuse me common small small talk topics.
25:44
The weather Abuja is too hot or the rain is too much then
25:53
current events. Did you hear wiki said this or
25:57
Tinbu did this? Did you hear that Tinbu went to
25:59
go and prostate in Turkey, you know, and then on and on and on
26:02
current events. Then of course, work and school.
26:06
How are things that work? How was your DG?
26:08
Oh your children? How are their school OK Abdul
26:14
Rahman is getting into university now.
26:15
I'll be we thank God. That's small talk and then of
26:19
course compliments. I'm not as a woman do that a
26:21
lot. So I like these your shoes.
26:23
Where do you get them? That one is also small talk.
26:25
So all these kind of things, think of it like social
26:30
handshake. People are just trying to say I
26:32
see you, I'm friendly, we're cool, no animosity, relax, I'm
26:41
OK. So now that we know that small
26:44
talk is a bridge, even though we don't understand, even though we
26:52
don't understand those are was a Township children.
26:58
Excuse me. So now that we know that small
27:04
talk is a bridge, can you guys see that small talk?
27:07
It sounds a lot like what we were talking about in the last
27:12
broadcast episode when we're talking about rapport building.
27:16
Can you see that? It sounds similar.
27:20
Maybe the context is different, like small talk is mostly
27:23
personal issues. Rapport building is not like
27:25
getting ready to talk business. You know, I don't know what the
27:27
difference is, to be frank. What can you see that they sound
27:31
similar? So if you were a small boy like
27:35
me who was repopsy and people went to go and see Chief and it
27:40
looked like this talk was pointless.
27:42
It wasn't pointless. They were using it as a bridge
27:47
to a serious conversation. So what I'm going to advise you
27:51
guys to do is this just like you listened to the previous
27:54
episode, to learn about rapport building and how you can use
27:58
that in a business context. Learn small talk, watch, watch
28:04
and learn in the traditional context and you will see that
28:08
small talk is not pointless. It is a bridge to something.
28:15
So this is the key thing that I wanted to emphasize that a lot
28:19
of us miss whether it comes to when it comes to building
28:23
rapport already comes to small talk.
28:29
We forget or how do I put it, we engage in pointless
28:33
conversations. We're not looking for a bridge,
28:38
We're not looking for an off ramp point where we can glide in
28:42
to serious matters. So should you avoid small talk
28:48
because people are going to say avoid small talk, it's
28:50
pointless? I would say no, don't avoid
28:53
small talk if the small talk truly is pointless.
28:58
So you're in the UK, there was someone able to disco discussing
29:01
the winter because I think, you know, this is February of 2026.
29:06
I'm making this recording and in the the previous winter, I'll be
29:11
a recently winter now. So that's for those of you in
29:14
the UK. In December there was correct
29:18
snow in Aberdeen in Scotland, correct snow.
29:22
It doesn't really snow like that.
29:23
But the snow was like, I was impressed because there's
29:27
somebody who I'm currently mentoring and she's still in
29:31
Aberdeen. She's a management consultant
29:34
trainee. So she sent me some video.
29:36
I was like, correct snow. Like she, I wish I was there.
29:41
Make snowballs and stuff, correct snow.
29:44
So if you're talking to somebody about the snow and truly, truly,
29:49
truly like you don't have where you're going with this
29:53
conversation, then why are you wasting your time?
29:56
Avoid the conversation about the snow.
29:59
However, if you're talking to someone you actually want to
30:06
discuss a contract or discuss this or there's something,
30:09
there's some agenda on the table, but then you will are
30:12
discussing the snow. It's all right, continue to
30:16
discuss the snow. You are now looking for an off
30:19
ramp from how you transition from the snow to now put your
30:22
agenda on the table. If you are in the villa or if
30:27
you are with a potential investor or whatever and looks
30:31
as if this conversation people are having truly there's no
30:33
point. It's just on a personal, on the
30:35
whatever level, OK, perhaps you shouldn't dwell that long, but
30:39
if you have a point, if you have an agenda, something that you're
30:42
trying to slide into, then it's OK.
30:46
Stay here, listen to the previous Bodyhouse episode and
30:50
you will see how you can use rapport building, small talk,
30:57
you know, whatever, just to set the emotional temperature.
31:01
And then from there you'll be able to slide in and start
31:03
discussing these serious things they're supposed to talk about.
31:08
So don't worry whether what you're doing is small talk or
31:11
rapport building, Don't worry. Don't worry about what it's
31:14
called. So long as your conversation
31:18
isn't pointless. Even your heart of hearts, you
31:22
know that this conversation is pointless.
31:23
OK, then do your best, get out. You're wasting your time.
31:26
But if you get where you are plotting this thing, don't
31:30
worry. Whether this is small talk or a
31:31
poor building, continue. You'll find a way to land this
31:35
plane. So avoid pointless conversations
31:40
in business, whether it is small talk you're doing or a poor
31:43
building you're doing, use it as a bridge to answer these
31:47
questions. Is this person the kind of
31:49
person that I like to do business with?
31:51
So when people are asking Mama Ke me uncle, I want your uncle,
31:58
this one uncle that one uncle, that one uncle of our people.
32:02
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. This.
32:06
Yeah, yeah. That.
32:06
The whole point of the yeah, yeah, this.
32:08
Yeah, yeah, that and bound need this and bow this one called.
32:12
That one called. They're trying to figure out is
32:14
this a person I like to do business with?
32:16
That's the whole point. That's the whole point of how
32:22
are you? How are the children or your
32:24
children are doing OK now. Oh, now your first one is now in
32:27
secondary school. Glory be to God.
32:29
Which school did she go to? Lorela J Sweet.
32:33
All that talk you're trying to figure out is this person I like
32:36
the is this the kind of person I like to do business with, use
32:42
small talk or use rapport building as a bridge to answer
32:45
that question, Do I like this person?
32:47
Can I do business with this person?
32:49
Another question you should be asking in your mind and should
32:52
be using the small talk or the rapport building to try and
32:54
figure out, does this person have a problem that my product
32:59
or my service can solve or my skill set can solve?
33:03
So when I'm talking to people who are shouting greatest defect
33:05
grades and we're talking Netflix and all whatnot, these are the
33:08
things I'm trying to source out. This person, is this person
33:11
cool? Can we vibe?
33:14
Can we flow? Eventually we'll be shifting it
33:19
towards much more official things and I'm trying to figure
33:21
out is there a problem here that I can solve with my skill set?
33:30
So we start talking general business issues.
33:33
I was still doing rapport building.
33:34
I've not hit the nail on the head to say I'm a sales
33:37
consultant. I'm a sales coach, I'm a sales
33:39
trainer. Before we get there, all the
33:41
general general business conversations I'm having, I'm
33:43
trying to figure out is there a problem here that I can solve?
33:48
You should do the same too. So whether it's small talk or a
33:53
poor building, Shah, these are the kind of issues you're trying
33:56
to tease out. Since we've been here 30
34:00
minutes, let me bring today's episode to a close and let me
34:04
ask my final question now. Should we always engage in
34:06
rapport building on small talk? Because some people now assume
34:10
that whenever we start, we should start with rapport
34:12
building or should start with small talk.
34:15
So if you are raised in the Niger local context and you're
34:18
really, really good at the small talk thing, some people assume
34:21
that every single time you land, you should always say good
34:24
morning, Sir. Good morning, chief.
34:25
How's Madam? How are the children, how's
34:29
this, how things that work, how's whatever, how is, you
34:31
know, is that how we should always start?
34:36
And then for those of us who, you know, Township children, we
34:40
never quite understood or we never quite mastered the art of
34:44
this traditional form of small talk, talking about family and
34:47
the economy and you know, or not.
34:50
So instead, we want to do rapport building, you know,
34:52
where Western kids want to do rapport building.
34:57
Should we always start with rapport building?
35:02
Another way of asking that question is are there times when
35:05
we can show up to chief's house and just go, ma'am, straight to
35:08
the point without how is this? How is this?
35:11
How is this? How is that?
35:14
That is what we're going to tackle in the next episode.
35:17
So if this is your first time listening to the podcast, please
35:21
subscribe and hang around for the next episode because you're
35:26
going to find stuff that is very, very practical that you
35:29
can use in your Business Today. If you haven't started a
35:34
business yet, you have 3-4 possible ideas.
35:37
You're wondering which one should you start?
35:39
That's not a problem. Reach out to me.
35:40
The phone number to call to text or to send a WhatsApp message to
35:43
is 08064662140. I'd like to hear from you.
35:52
Let's talk. Let's figure out which of these
35:57
ideas should you pursue? Which one can we validate to
36:02
show that there is demand for this product, for this service,
36:05
for this, your idea, for your app, for whatever it is?
36:09
Which one can we show that people are willing to pay for
36:12
and they're willing to pay for that amount that will make sense
36:14
for you to continue in this business?
36:16
And then finally, we'll try and figure out if we can build a
36:19
selling system around this. So if you have these problems,
36:24
reach out to me. The number to call to send a
36:26
text message or a WhatsApp message to is 08064662140.
36:34
Please don't send me a message on Telegram.
36:36
I use Telegram mostly. OK, well, I only started using
36:40
it recently, but Telegram for me is still a training thing.
36:43
So if you send me a message on Telegram, it's not until I have
36:46
scheduled a training, then I'll see your message.
36:49
But if you want a sharp, sharp response, you know, SMS or
36:51
WhatsApp message. And then if you're listening to
36:54
this podcast and you're wondering these rapport things
36:58
self, how can I apply it to my business concretely?
37:01
You've listened to this episode, you listened to the last
37:03
episode. I was still having issues.
37:05
You still don't know how you can use rapport building in your
37:08
business. Call me, send me a text message,
37:11
send me a WhatsApp message on 08064662140.
37:18
So that's it. And that is all for today.
37:21
I will catch you all some other time.