Latest / Yes And Land / Encanto and Breaking Generational Trauma | Cindy Chia on Healing What Was Never Spoken

Transcript

Encanto and Breaking Generational Trauma | Cindy Chia on Healing What Was Never Spoken · Yes And Land

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  I went through some kind of a childhood abuse
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  from my dad. I grew up with a really angry dad.
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  So when I watched Encanto, I was crying because
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  it was so much of that generational trauma, breaking
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  generational trauma, right? Yeah. Like not having
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  any support, no network, you don't know anybody,
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  no friends or family, especially being a foreigner.
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  How relatable is Lalisa, honestly? Like, she
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  can't show any cracks. Right. She can't because
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  she has to be strong. She has to do everything
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  that she's asked to do. So that the family can
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  stay strong. So the family can keep doing things
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  to serve others. And meanwhile, she is experiencing
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  the insecurity and the weight of it all. In my
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  perspective, Bruno was also the only one who
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  told the truth. Yeah. That nobody was ready for
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  it. So they exiled him. So I spent a lot of time
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  being angry. But then I realized that anger is
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  not bringing me anywhere. But as an adult, you
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  have to realize your life is what you make out
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  of it. Life is too short to live in your own
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  BS. The BS is what's keeping us from feeling
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  true to ourselves. Living a true life, like a
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  very authentic life. I wear fur coat to the gym.
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  Do I care? No. Do you like it? Because I love
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  it! Welcome to Yes And Land, where we say yes
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  to the reality of yesterday and today. And we
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  say and to the possibility... growth, and imagination
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  of tomorrow. Welcome to our next episode of Yes
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  and Land. We're very excited to have Cindy with
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  us today. Thank you, Ryan. We're talking about
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  some fun things. I'm actually here to learn.
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  In kind of our prep, we talked about the topic
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  today. I thought, okay, this is something I don't
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  know a lot about. And I'm just going to take
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  the opportunity during this conversation to really
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  learn. But also we're going to do it through
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  the lens of my favorite, which is Encanto. Yay.
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  Absolutely love Encanto so much. It's so good.
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  We were doing a little pre -recording listening
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  to one of the songs too. Kind of got me in the
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  mood. I love it. Encanto is such a good one.
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  It was interesting. I usually try to watch the
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  night before the movie that we're going to talk
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  about just to make sure I'm like. Ready to go?
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  Yeah. Like I didn't need to rewatch this one.
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  No. I've watched this so many times. So many
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  times, right? I'm like, I'm excited. This is
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  good. Yeah. So what I want to do to kind of get
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  us kicked off, Cindy, is if you want to just
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  talk a little bit about kind of your background,
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  what you do professionally. And then we kind
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  of explore kind of how you got there. Because
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  I always just love hearing about somebody's story
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  themselves personally, like how they got to be
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  doing the things they do. We'd love to have really
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  cool and interesting people on. And you're certainly
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  one of those. So I'd love for people to learn
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  about your background. And then we can kind of
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  dive into the topic and then talk about the movie.
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  Yeah, let's go. So my name is Cindy Chia, born
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  and raised in Malaysia. Malaysia, so interesting.
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  Yeah. So in Malaysia, it's, you know, in the
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  Asian continent. So a lot of that cultural stigma.
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  surrounding mental health still to this day.
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  I went through some kind of a childhood abuse
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  from my dad. I grew up with a really angry dad.
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  So when I watch Encanto, ah, I was crying because
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  there was so much of that generational trauma,
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  breaking generational trauma, right? I can relate
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  so much with Mirabelle, who was the one who actually
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  kind of... took that step forward for the family.
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  So my background comes from trauma. And then
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  I went into psychology wanting to heal myself.
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  No, actually, I went into psychology wanting
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  to heal other people first. Of course. Okay,
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  of course. Everybody else is the one that's got
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  the problem. They got to get fixed. It's not
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  me. Exactly. Yes, exactly. Everyone else's problem.
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  I want to help other people. That was my goal
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  to go into psychology. Okay, so I have a question
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  for you, though, about Malaysia. Yes. What's
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  the culture like there? Especially when it comes
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  to men. Yeah. And the way that they interact
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  with women, with their wives, with their daughters.
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  How is that different from American culture if
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  there are any differences? I just don't know
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  Malaysia really much at all. Love it. I love
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  talking about Malaysia. So Malaysia is a Muslim
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  country. So a lot of the laws are written according
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  to the Muslim law. So in some states, there are
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  still men and women cannot walk together or cannot
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  hold hands out in public. You have to have your
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  own lane. movie theaters as well. Men and women
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  have to be separated. So there's still some kind
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  of segregation. Where I come from, the state
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  of Sarawak, we are more harmonious. We live more
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  harmoniously. We have a lot of cultures there.
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  So my grandparents immigrated from China. And
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  there's a lot of people that immigrated from
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  India as well. And there's the locals, Malays,
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  Indonesia, and a lot of other countries as well.
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  So it's kind of like a melting pot. So the gender
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  roles are... still pretty prominent i would say
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  like the men are the decision maker the breadwinner
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  and all of those things um it's changing though
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  i mean as as the world's changing is changing
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  to that um i talked i talked to a lady who had
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  from here from uh the states And had gone to
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  live there for a year with her husband. In Malaysia?
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  Uh -huh. Oh, I didn't know that. And she said
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  that it was just very different, a bit of a culture
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  shock. And about halfway into their stay there,
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  she went to go get her hair cut. And she wanted
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  to have it cut quite a bit different. Like she
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  was going to take a bunch of length off and have
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  it cut pretty short. Uh -oh. Yes. Uh -oh is the
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  right thing because you know exactly where it's
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  going. Yeah. Because the guy that was going to
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  cut her hair was like, oh, I can't do it without
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  your husband's permission. She was like, oh,
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  no, no, it's just my hair. I just want to cut
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  my hair. He's like, oh, no, no. Like, I have
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  to have his permission. Okay. And basically the
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  way that she had described it was like it wasn't
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  really that this hairdresser was like trying
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  to do anything wrong. Yeah. He had just been
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  burned before. Right, right. Like he had cut
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  a woman's hair and then the husband came in and
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  like. What did you do? Yeah. Like he was in big
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  trouble because he didn't have the sign off.
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  Oh, wow. And this was probably, I don't know,
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  seven, eight years ago that she was there. Sure,
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  I think not that long ago. And so it was just
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  interesting because it was such a different experience
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  that she had there. And she wasn't describing
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  it in a negative way. She actually loved her
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  time in Malaysia. She just thought it was a really,
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  really wonderful, great experience to get out
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  and experience something different. But something
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  was a little bit different culturally. Yeah,
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  she would probably be in the more conservative
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  state. So I would say it goes by state to state.
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  So the one that the state I'm from, they're pretty
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  cool in general. And we celebrate each other's
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  celebration. too so for example over here you
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  guys usually do what Christmas Thanksgiving right
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  over there we have Christmas we celebrate Christmas
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  Chinese New Year the Muslim New Year the Deepavali
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  so there's what was that last one Deepavali what's
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  that Diwali We call it Diwali over there. And
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  Gawai, which is the indigenous New Year as well.
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  So we celebrate. I only know Diwali from The
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  Office. Have you ever seen The Office? No, I
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  haven't. Oh, it's so great. They're celebrating
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  Diwali because one of their employees does. And
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  so the main character, played by Steve Carell,
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  goes and he has this little song about... And
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  it's really hilarious. It's really great, actually.
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  Great episode. I was like, okay, that actually
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  looks like really fun. Like, I want to celebrate
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  Diwali. Yeah, lots of colors, lots of food. Yeah,
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  lots of people. So, okay, so that's kind of where
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  you grow up. What brings you to the United States?
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  How did that happen? Yeah, so I went to school.
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  I pursued my undergrad in Australia. Didn't really
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  have a good time there. I would say it was about
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  20 years ago now, but still not a long time ago.
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  A lot of racism there. People would throw water
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  bottles at me, eggs at me when I'm walking down
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  the street. It's just not a great experience.
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  No. No, it was. And, you know, the narrative
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  there. Yeah, the racism is just kind of hard.
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  I wouldn't say it's everybody though, right?
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  You get some bad eggs here and there. So I didn't
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  have a good experience. I got a scholarship to
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  study abroad anywhere I wanted. I initially wanted
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  to go to England because I loved their accent.
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  I was learning English. I wanted to have an English
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  accent. Of course. But I would have been the
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  only one there kind of like in Australia. So
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  I didn't want to have a repeat of being alone.
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  So I picked America. I picked Oklahoma. Oklahoma.
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  Oklahoma. Because my cousin's there. Oklahoma.
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  You're like, of all the states in the United
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  States, it's Oklahoma. All right, let's go. I
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  had the best time. Good. Oh, my gosh. I'm having
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  the best time in the U .S. for sure. I feel like
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  the psychology field here is so much, so diverse.
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  And I learned so much. So this is a place for
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  me to grow my career for sure. What school did
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  you go to in Oklahoma? University of, sorry,
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  Oklahoma State and then University of Central
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  Oklahoma. Okay. And enjoyed both those universities?
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  Yeah. I work with Robert Sternberg. I don't know
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  if you know. He's like one of the biggest psychologists
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  in the world. Really? Yeah, crazy. He developed
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  the love triangle and all of this philosophy.
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  So really cool. So you were learning from one
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  of the experts in the field. Yeah. Which had
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  to be just an amazing experience. Amazing. And
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  we did research together and we did conferences
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  and presentations and all of that. So I had a
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  great time. Yeah. Very grateful. So you finish
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  up your studies there and then did you end up
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  practicing there or did you come straight to
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  Utah or what happened? Yeah. So I did my fellowship
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  in Harvard in Boston. Oh, in Boston. Yeah. That's
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  kind of fun. It was fun. I would have lived there
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  if I could. How come you didn't? Well, it was
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  for a boy. My ex -husband's from here, so I had
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  to move here. It's all good, but in Harvard.
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  Boston's great, though. Yeah, so great. I learned
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  so much there. So I worked with Mona Westmark,
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  Dr. Westmark, who also is a war renown. So her
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  parents was in a concentration camp from the
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  Nazi. Oh, my goodness. So she was doing research
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  about breaking generational trauma, which is
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  so great, which is something that I was passionate
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  about, breaking generational trauma in the Asian
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  culture, too. So she was doing it with the Jews
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  and the black slaves, like research on those,
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  the owner of black slaves, and I was doing the
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  research on Asian families. So it was so groundbreaking.
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  Yeah, that's great. So was she at Harvard? Is
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  that what you said? Yeah, she was at Harvard.
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  So you're there in Boston. You're doing something
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  with someone who's at Harvard, which is like
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  one of the preeminent institutions really in
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  the world, certainly in the United States. That
• 10:16
  would be a great experience. A great experience.
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  So grateful for that, honestly. What was your
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  favorite thing about Boston? People. Okay. Tell
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  me more. Tell me more. is a bit biased because
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  i feel like i was surrounded so i was in cambridge
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  you know i live on campus and everything so i
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  was surrounded by students mostly right and all
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  of them are mostly international students um
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  just like how open people are and how how just
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  like, I don't know, like they just don't judge
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  you. Like I come from this and I eat this and
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  all of that. Like I feel like I get a lot more
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  scrutinies here. Like, oh, why are you eating
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  fish for lunch? You know, kind of stuff like
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  that. But like in Boston, I just felt very included
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  in general. That's great. I didn't have to explain
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  myself. Yeah. Which is such a hard thing to do
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  sometimes. Absolutely it is. And when you feel
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  like you can just be yourself. Yeah. Right? Right.
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  I know we're talking about Disney stuff, but
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  to take it to K -pop Demon Hunters, if you're
• 11:15
  familiar with that. I love those too. I remember
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  hearing a couple of interviews with the ladies
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  that are the singers for it, right? Because I
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  think that actresses that played the voices when
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  they're regular talking were different than those
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  that sang. And those that sang, one in particular
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  wrote it. Now her name escapes me right now.
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  But I remember her talking about when they were...
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  watching the movie back the first time right
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  when it was totally done and they're watching
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  it and one of the gals had said that it was a
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  really cool scene for her when they're in the
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  plane at the very beginning of the movie you
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  familiar with this and they're eating some particular
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  kind of food And it was like this flood of emotion,
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  she said, that came to her because when she was
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  growing up with the Korean food that she would
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  be eating at school, she would feel judged. And
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  so she would like try to hide that she was eating.
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  She would hide it in her paper lunch sack and
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  she would quickly try to eat it so no one could
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  see her eating it. And that now she's being part
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  of this movie that's this phenomenon. And they're
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  eating the very foods that she ate, that she
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  grew up with, that she loved. And it was out
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  there for everyone. And it was just this amazing
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  experience for her because she didn't have to
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  hide it. I just thought, oh, my goodness. It
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  was just like, oof. And it's something small
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  like food. Everybody eats something. And why
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  do some people have to hide it and some people
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  don't? And you don't want to have to be judged
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  by eating something that. You love. That's part
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  of your culture. You just grew up eating. Yeah.
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  You don't want to explain yourself. Yeah. So
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  I'm glad that was your experience in Boston.
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  That's really great. Yeah. Another reason for
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  me to like Boston. Yay. I've only been once,
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  and I thought it was absolutely terrific. We
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  only spent a couple of days there, and I thought,
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  I've got to spend some more time here. It was
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  so fun. I mean, the people, the history, the
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  culture, the places. It's just amazing. Yeah.
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  No doubt. I mean, Utah is great, too. Utah has
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  some great things, for sure. Utah has some great
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  things. So you're in Boston. You're doing your
• 13:03
  research there. Then where do you go from there?
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  Then Utah. Okay, then Utah. Yeah. So I started
• 13:08
  my residency in a big private practice here and
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  then I started my own private practice now with
• 13:12
  Spire Psychological in Riverton. And okay, so
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  talk me through, you're with a bigger place.
• 13:18
  Talk me through the decision to then go out on
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  your own and do your own thing. Yeah. Because
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  that is not an easy thing to do. No, especially
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  being a foreigner. Yeah. Why? Like not having
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  any support, no network, you don't know anybody,
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  no friends or family. I knew from the beginning
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  that I wanted something bigger for myself. And
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  I wanted to do it right. So when you're working
• 13:38
  for other people, there's a lot of policy that
• 13:40
  makes sense for them, right? So the place that
• 13:42
  I worked at, I wasn't very... happy with how
• 13:46
  they ran their practice so of course I wanted
• 13:49
  to run it better but then you learn too like
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  oh my gosh owning a business is really really
• 13:53
  hard so I wanted to do it better I wanted to
• 13:57
  do it more ethically I wanted to do it more comprehensively
• 14:01
  to where like people feel hurt as a whole not
• 14:04
  so much of like oh you're anxious and we're just
• 14:06
  going to treat it anxiety no I want to see a
• 14:08
  person as a whole and I also want to see a person
• 14:10
  I want to treat a person as from the root too
• 14:13
  like I don't want to just to like give you band
• 14:15
  -aids for your symptoms like i want to go to
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  the root of your problems which brings to trauma
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  you know the the work that i've been doing the
• 14:22
  research that i've been doing the generational
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  trauma so i do a lot of that in my work yeah
• 14:27
  and the practice didn't really you know focus
• 14:30
  on that yeah i didn't really like want me to
• 14:32
  pursue that okay yeah so tell me again the name
• 14:35
  of your of your place yeah aspire psychological
• 14:37
  we're in riverton and vegas okay And I've driven
• 14:41
  by it, especially since you and I first talked.
• 14:43
  I'm like, oh, that's where Cindy works. That's
• 14:44
  her place. So tell me about what you guys do
• 14:48
  specialize in at your practice. So we mainly
• 14:51
  specialize in trauma. So any kinds of trauma,
• 14:54
  family trauma, relationship trauma, domestic
• 14:56
  violence, sexual trauma, and all of that. So
• 14:59
  I have a team of people who specialize in different
• 15:01
  kinds of things. For me, myself, I specialize
• 15:04
  in cultural trauma. and breaking generational
• 15:07
  trauma and all of that. So a lot of trauma stuff.
• 15:10
  And what are the types of therapy that y 'all
• 15:12
  offer there? We only offer, we pride ourselves
• 15:16
  in offering evidence -based treatments. So all
• 15:19
  or maybe a lot of our treatments are evidence
• 15:22
  -based. So it has been researched, it has been
• 15:24
  studied and all of that. So we use those modalities
• 15:27
  mostly. Talk therapy, individual group, couples,
• 15:32
  family therapy is what we do. Okay. So when it
• 15:36
  comes to then this intergenerational trauma,
• 15:39
  I guess it's totally appropriate. That's what
• 15:42
  we're talking about today because that's where
• 15:43
  you have a lot of expertise. So when we think
• 15:46
  about it, let's take a step kind of back and
• 15:49
  kind of set the stage for Encanto and why this
• 15:53
  is such an appropriate topic to discuss when
• 15:56
  it comes to Encanto. If you wouldn't mind, for
• 16:00
  anybody who might be listening or watching that
• 16:02
  doesn't know the story of Encanto, maybe set
• 16:05
  a 30 ,000 -foot view of overall what's going
• 16:08
  on in this story. What kind of is happening?
• 16:10
  Yeah, yeah. Okay, so I love Encanto because it's
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  a mix of so many people and a mix of traumas
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  as well. So if you watch Encanto, I think the
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  root of it is that trauma came from survival.
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  you know, they had to hold their family together
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  to survive in the first place. And then it becomes
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  like a rigid family roles. It became like a rigid
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  family roles for everybody, right? Like Luisa.
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  Yeah, because Abuela, when the story first starts,
• 16:43
  she just has these triplets, right? With her
• 16:44
  husband. And then they've got to go escape what
• 16:47
  appears to be these people attacking their town.
• 16:49
  You can't really tell, but clearly someone's
• 16:51
  attacking them. They're trying to leave. Her
• 16:53
  husband tries to stop him. He ends up being killed.
• 16:55
  So now she's really... on her own. Like she's
• 16:57
  experiencing a lot of trauma in what this is,
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  losing her husband, losing security, losing the
• 17:03
  safety that she had and then have to take on
• 17:05
  this whole new experience. Yeah. Triplets by
• 17:08
  yourself. Like how scary would that be? And so
• 17:12
  I think you're right. I think through that experience,
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  she ends up becoming pretty rigid in certain
• 17:16
  things. Right. And I don't think it was. negatively
• 17:20
  motivated either. No. They needed that for survival,
• 17:24
  right? They needed Luisa to step up to do something.
• 17:26
  They needed, you know, Bruno to do something.
• 17:28
  So it was a lot of like survival skills, like
• 17:31
  just wanting the family to use their gifts to
• 17:34
  survive. Yeah. And what's interesting too is
• 17:36
  I think whether it was even... Trying to have
• 17:39
  all of her children and grandchildren use their
• 17:42
  abilities to serve others. Yes. It became so
• 17:46
  rigid in the application of you have to do this
• 17:49
  because it is our responsibility and there's
• 17:50
  no flexibility and it's all on your shoulders
• 17:52
  and you have to do everything. Right. And you
• 17:53
  have to do it in this way. Right, right. That
• 17:56
  she really lost sight of what really makes a
• 18:00
  family a family, what really makes a community
• 18:02
  a community. Right, exactly. And it becomes shunned,
• 18:05
  right? Like hard conversations becomes. becomes
• 18:08
  like invisible. You can't talk about it. And
• 18:11
  that's how trauma lives in a family is when we
• 18:15
  don't talk about it. When they say you cannot
• 18:17
  talk about Bruno, you know, when you don't talk
• 18:19
  about something, it persists. It still exists.
• 18:22
  Doesn't mean that it goes away. So that's so
• 18:25
  interesting to look at that song in that way.
• 18:27
  I hadn't thought of that before. Yeah. Right.
• 18:30
  Because they're, they're like. It's still there.
• 18:32
  Yeah. Like he's actually physically still there,
• 18:36
  right? Right. But I think it's really what's
• 18:38
  that represent? What does that represent for
• 18:39
  us when we do have something that does need to
• 18:42
  get addressed and we just want to shun it and
• 18:44
  not talk about it? No, no, no. We can't possibly
• 18:46
  talk about that. That's too big of a deal. Too
• 18:49
  much stress, too much trauma associated with
• 18:51
  that. We're not going to deal with it. We're
• 18:53
  going to set it aside. We're going to keep it
• 18:54
  locked away in the walls, so to speak. Right.
• 18:57
  And not address it or deal with it. Right. And
• 18:59
  the trauma continues to live, right? People are
• 19:01
  still miserable. And how I reflected that in
• 19:03
  my own story is that people don't like to talk
• 19:05
  about my dad's anger outbursts, you know? Once
• 19:08
  he's good, we're good. Don't bring it up. Don't
• 19:11
  talk about it. You know, dad's good. Let's not
• 19:13
  rock the boat. But the trauma is still there,
• 19:15
  and it's going to come up again when you get
• 19:17
  triggered again. But we cannot talk about it.
• 19:20
  So trauma continues to live on. Yeah. It's something
• 19:23
  that we hadn't talked about before, but I think
• 19:26
  it fits in here that I would love to hear you
• 19:27
  kind of teach us more about, which is when it
• 19:29
  comes to triggers. I think what's interesting
• 19:33
  for me from a layperson's perspective is that
• 19:36
  what I've seen is like certainly we all can have
• 19:39
  triggers, especially with trauma we've experienced.
• 19:42
  I think this sometimes happens, and this is not
• 19:44
  all the time, and by no means is trying to discount
• 19:46
  experiences people have, but sometimes people
• 19:48
  use a trigger as like a weapon. Oh, an excuse.
• 19:53
  Oh, no, no, that triggers me. Yeah, yeah. No,
• 19:54
  no, no, you can't. Nope, that triggers me. I
• 19:56
  can't do that. That triggers me. And then it
• 19:59
  really kind of shuts things down. I'm interested,
• 20:01
  where does that come from, right? Because, and
• 20:03
  how do we find that balance of something like
• 20:05
  acknowledging a trigger actually exists and being
• 20:07
  able to like respect somebody's boundaries, set
• 20:09
  boundaries? Yeah. but not having it become a
• 20:12
  weapon. Yes. I think in the pop psychology culture,
• 20:16
  people use boundaries as like a gate, right?
• 20:19
  Like you can't cross my boundary because this
• 20:21
  is my boundary. But in a true psychology world,
• 20:24
  boundaries is connection. We want to have boundaries
• 20:27
  with you so I can connect with you better. So
• 20:29
  for example, you have a boundary of, you know,
• 20:34
  spending time, you know, you clock out at five
• 20:36
  o 'clock every day, right? Why? So that you can
• 20:38
  spend more time with your family. You want to
• 20:40
  be a good dad. You want to be a good spouse.
• 20:41
  So that's your boundary. So in order for me,
• 20:45
  so if I work with you, I have something come
• 20:48
  up at like 6 p .m. I cannot, I don't want to
• 20:51
  interrupt that because that will disrupt our
• 20:54
  connection. Because I want what's best for you.
• 20:56
  And your boundary is that you want to spend five
• 20:59
  o 'clock onwards with your family. So I'll respect
• 21:01
  that. But then I will also say like, hey, can
• 21:04
  we touch base tomorrow instead? So it's not to
• 21:07
  keep me away from your family time. It's more
• 21:10
  of like, how can I show up for you and you show
• 21:13
  up for me in a way that makes sense for us so
• 21:15
  we can connect outside of the boundary. Does
• 21:18
  that make sense? It does. And I think the kind
• 21:21
  of the next step there too, where I think sometimes
• 21:23
  people, miss out on the next step, which is,
• 21:27
  okay, if somebody's boundary is not to work after
• 21:29
  five and there are things that come up, then
• 21:31
  you've got to have that conversation. Okay. These
• 21:33
  kinds of things do come up. How can we effectively
• 21:35
  deal with these things within the time that we
• 21:38
  have? Do we need to have a different prioritization
• 21:41
  during the eight to five? So we can make sure
• 21:44
  that these things appropriately get handled.
• 21:45
  So if it can't happen at six and it's got to
• 21:47
  happen the next morning. Will it happen? Can
• 21:49
  it reliably happen by setting out priorities
• 21:51
  based on the boundaries that you do have? Because
• 21:53
  then it's a give and take. Exactly. Right. Right.
• 21:55
  I want what's best for you, too. And you want
• 21:57
  what's best for me. But we need to work together
• 21:59
  so we can connect when we can connect. Yeah.
• 22:02
  Yeah. Because otherwise it just becomes a one
• 22:04
  way street. It's like, oh, no, sorry. After five,
• 22:07
  can't do it. Right. Not going to address it.
• 22:08
  Not going to deal with it. Right. Just sorry.
• 22:10
  It's you're out of luck. Right. It's not it's
• 22:12
  not the other way. It's not. OK, what is that
• 22:14
  person's needs? What is that person's boundaries?
• 22:16
  How do I how do I. implement or want the best
• 22:19
  for them and help to make that happen. Right.
• 22:21
  Right. Boundary is not gate, gatekeeping. It's
• 22:23
  a lot of connection. Like I want, I want what's
• 22:25
  best for you and I want to connect with you.
• 22:27
  That makes meaning for you. Yeah. I think that's
• 22:30
  such a helpful way to look at that as the, the
• 22:34
  connection. That's what we want is the connection
• 22:36
  that really helps to inform me about what that
• 22:38
  means and how I can do that differently. Yeah,
• 22:41
  for sure. Yeah. Okay. So a couple of quotes,
• 22:43
  I'm going to lay, I'm going to lay at your feet.
• 22:45
  Okay. So a couple of things that, I went back
• 22:48
  to when it came to Encanto and some of the things
• 22:51
  that I heard. And I want to get your take on
• 22:53
  these things. Before we jump back in, can I ask
• 22:56
  you a quick favor? If you're enjoying the journey
• 22:59
  so far, will you like, rate, and subscribe to
• 23:02
  our show? It helps us reach more people like
• 23:05
  you. We can design and create and build the most
• 23:09
  wonderful place in the world, but it takes people
• 23:11
  to make the dream a reality. So one of the things
• 23:16
  that Abuela says, and when she's talking to Mirabel,
• 23:19
  is you have to stop, Mirabel. The cracks started
• 23:23
  with you. Bruno left because of you. Luisa's
• 23:26
  losing her powers. Isabel is out of control because
• 23:29
  of you. I don't know why you weren't given a
• 23:31
  gift, but it is not an excuse for you to hurt
• 23:33
  this family. Oh, that is absolutely brutal. Well,
• 23:39
  I don't know that I fully digested it the very
• 23:42
  first time that I saw it. But when I've seen
• 23:43
  it since, that is such a, oh, that's such a hard
• 23:47
  thing. Yeah. You know, for Abuela to have said
• 23:50
  to me that. Oh, yeah. But don't you think it's
• 23:52
  a projection? It totally is. So explain more
• 23:55
  about that. Tell more about that. Yeah. I think
• 23:56
  a lot of it is projection of insecurity. Like
• 23:59
  I said, I think Abuela started this whole thing,
• 24:02
  magical casita thing out of survival. Right.
• 24:05
  The trauma starts from survival. So when. the
• 24:08
  survival cracked like you know Luisa lost her
• 24:11
  magic skills and all of those things it became
• 24:15
  a threat It suddenly becomes like, oh my gosh,
• 24:18
  I no longer serve a purpose that I thought was
• 24:20
  purposeful. Or my family no longer serve a purpose
• 24:23
  that I thought was purposeful. So that threatened
• 24:25
  her security, her identity, her purpose. So the
• 24:29
  way that she dealt with that was projecting it
• 24:32
  on Mirabelle. Because that was obvious. Mirabelle
• 24:34
  was the problem. That was obvious in the scene,
• 24:36
  right? At the time. Sure. She was the problem,
• 24:38
  right? So a lot of us do that. When we're frustrated
• 24:42
  with something, we project our anger towards
• 24:45
  other people. and have other people deal with
• 24:47
  that instead of us regulating that. Yeah. So
• 24:50
  that's so interesting because that, I think,
• 24:52
  and I want to hear your take on this, I think
• 24:54
  this plays into the next thing that I was going
• 24:56
  to ask you about, which is then you've got Mirabel
• 25:00
  talking to Isabella. Mm -hmm. And she's telling
• 25:03
  Isabella that she's selfish. Right. Right. Because
• 25:07
  from Mirabelle's perspective, like, oh, OK, like
• 25:09
  I'm in all these things happen to me and she's
• 25:11
  rude to me. And so obviously she's got everything
• 25:13
  perfect. So she is so selfish. She's all about
• 25:15
  her. Yeah. And Isabella's response was selfish.
• 25:19
  I've been stuck being perfect my whole entire
• 25:22
  life. And literally the only thing you have ever
• 25:24
  done for me is mess things up. I never wanted
• 25:27
  to marry him. I was doing it for the family.
• 25:29
  Mm hmm. And so. Was Mirabel projecting onto Isabella?
• 25:35
  For sure, right? I think in a lot of ways, also
• 25:37
  her own insecurity. Yes. Because she didn't really
• 25:40
  have much, no magic in that sense. Yes. And so
• 25:43
  she projected her own insecurity to Isabella,
• 25:46
  but not knowing Isabella's part of the story
• 25:49
  too. Because she's struggling too. Totally. She's
• 25:51
  trying to be perfect to save the family, to please
• 25:54
  the family. Yeah, she's going to marry this guy
• 25:55
  because that's what she's supposed to do. Right,
• 25:57
  exactly. Not because she wants to. How many of
• 26:00
  us do that? Yeah, we take action because we think
• 26:02
  that's what our family wants. That's what our
• 26:04
  parents want. We're trying to please them. Which
• 26:07
  is, I think, back to that, like, I guess tie
• 26:10
  that in. Tie that in how that's manifesting intergenerational
• 26:14
  trauma for her to have done that and acted in
• 26:18
  the way that she did. Yeah, it's survival again,
• 26:21
  right? So Isabella thinks that she needs to be
• 26:24
  perfect to survive because imagine if she's not
• 26:27
  perfect. What's that going to look like? And
• 26:29
  I think we did see that in the movie, too, where
• 26:31
  she didn't want to marry the guy, I think, right?
• 26:34
  Totally. And people didn't like her because of
• 26:36
  that. So to save herself, to keep her in that
• 26:40
  position of admiration from the family and all
• 26:44
  of that, she needs to play that role. Same with
• 26:46
  Louisa and Bruno. Even Bruno. Bruno's the hard
• 26:49
  one. Where if she told the truth, sorry, if he
• 26:54
  told the truth, he would be shunned. Because
• 26:57
  he did that, nobody wants to do that. So that
• 26:59
  disruption, I think, taught everybody to just
• 27:01
  stay quiet and just do whatever you do to survive.
• 27:03
  Yeah, because Bruno said when they were asking
• 27:05
  him, when Mirabelle was asking about it afterwards,
• 27:08
  my gift wasn't helping the family. Right. But
• 27:10
  I love my family, you know? Yeah. Like, that's
• 27:12
  going to make me emotional. Yeah. He thinks the
• 27:17
  things that he's doing aren't helping. Right.
• 27:19
  And he loves them. Right. And so what's his option?
• 27:21
  Just leave. I'm going to leave. I'm going to
• 27:23
  leave. I don't want to hurt him anymore. Exactly.
• 27:25
  Because we haven't dealt with that trauma that's
• 27:27
  there. Exactly. We haven't dealt with how do
• 27:28
  we get to the bottom of this so we can actually
• 27:30
  fix it. Right. And so he feels like he has to
• 27:33
  just leave. Like, oh my gosh, that just gets
• 27:34
  me to my core. And Bruno, I think, in my perspective,
• 27:37
  Bruno was also the only one who told the truth.
• 27:39
  Yeah. That nobody was ready for it. Yeah. So
• 27:42
  they exiled him. Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, then...
• 27:46
  you know, as we see kind of this story play now,
• 27:49
  let's hit Louisa as well, right? She clearly
• 27:51
  has a bit of that same thing, right? And I think
• 27:53
  that's why her song, Surface Pressure, is so
• 27:56
  emblematic of this. where she's just taking everything
• 27:59
  literally on her shoulders and figuratively on
• 28:02
  her shoulders, right? Because she's the strong
• 28:03
  one. I mean, how relatable is Louisa, honestly?
• 28:06
  Like, she's the strong one. She's got to carry
• 28:08
  the weight for everybody in the family. She can't
• 28:10
  show any cracks. She can't because she has to
• 28:13
  be strong. She has to do everything that she's
• 28:15
  asked to do so that the family can stay strong,
• 28:19
  so the family can keep doing things to serve
• 28:21
  others. And meanwhile, she is experiencing, like,
• 28:27
  the insecurity and the weight of it all and the
• 28:30
  stress of it all. Pressure. Surface pressure,
• 28:34
  yeah. It's all this pressure that she's being
• 28:36
  saddled with just because people think she can
• 28:39
  handle it. Right, right. And without ever asking
• 28:41
  her. That's why I think it's so interesting when
• 28:44
  we look at what this story is with the way that
• 28:46
  Isabella and Luisa and Bruno and others, it's
• 28:50
  playing out in what Mirabel, even though she
• 28:53
  did some projection, what she's able to do to
• 28:55
  help start. breaking that intergenerational trauma
• 29:00
  right right and that's the way that i'm thinking
• 29:02
  that this is playing out is that kind of the
• 29:03
  way that you're seeing it yeah for sure how does
• 29:05
  that happen how is she able to start doing that
• 29:07
  when she starts actually sitting down and listening
• 29:10
  to her like her siblings and her cousins yeah
• 29:12
  i think that's an interesting question i never
• 29:15
  thought about it that way i feel like she was
• 29:17
  put in that position because she didn't have
• 29:20
  any magical powers i felt like she was forced
• 29:24
  into needing to address all of these because
• 29:26
  she didn't have any magical powers but can you
• 29:28
  imagine if she did i don't think the trauma will
• 29:30
  be addressed i think that's right right i think
• 29:34
  that's right you know uh it's like she's she's
• 29:37
  not given a gift at least not in the traditional
• 29:39
  sense right right so she thinks that she doesn't
• 29:43
  have something to offer but in the absence of
• 29:46
  that traditional gift she's able to see something
• 29:49
  everybody else isn't. Yes. That was such a pivotal
• 29:52
  moment for the movie because if she was given
• 29:55
  a gift, this would not have happened. And because
• 29:57
  she wasn't given the traditional gift, I think
• 29:59
  that forced everybody to address it because,
• 30:03
  you know, that's the elephant in the room at
• 30:05
  the moment. Yeah. And then I think especially
• 30:08
  with Abuela, she's forced to reconcile that,
• 30:11
  right? What role did she actually play? and causing
• 30:15
  this pressure that each one of them was under
• 30:17
  to be perfect, to not do things wrong, to have
• 30:20
  to never worry about themselves, only ever worry
• 30:24
  about somebody else, because it's a born of necessity.
• 30:28
  That's what we have to do. We have to do this.
• 30:29
  It's their identity. It became such an identity
• 30:32
  that they couldn't break away with it. But how
• 30:34
  beautiful is that, that Abuela was able to say,
• 30:37
  I was wrong. That was her exact word, right?
• 30:39
  I was wrong. Accountability. And then it came
• 30:43
  in. in this really beautiful way, right? It's,
• 30:48
  you know, with it. So the song Dos Orguitas,
• 30:51
  you're familiar with that song, right? When I
• 30:55
  think about that song and break it down, especially
• 30:57
  in relation to exactly what we're talking about,
• 30:59
  it's this idea of they're kind of like these
• 31:03
  little caterpillars, right? And in your life,
• 31:05
  these little caterpillars. What they're having
• 31:08
  to do and go through this experience is they're
• 31:10
  having to go in that cocoon and they're having
• 31:12
  to reemerge, having been healed from and learned
• 31:16
  from and break free from the actual cocoon or
• 31:19
  break free figuratively from this trauma that's
• 31:21
  bound them up. They had to do it. They go in
• 31:23
  this cocoon. They're having to protect themselves
• 31:25
  from the world. They're having to protect themselves
• 31:27
  from all these bad things that were happening
• 31:28
  around them. But now it's kept it constricted.
• 31:32
  So they're not actually able to fully recognize
• 31:35
  and realize. what gifts they truly have. Right.
• 31:39
  Because they're still stuck in this little cocoon.
• 31:41
  It was so rigid. So rigid. Right. It was kind
• 31:44
  of like gender roles almost, right? They have
• 31:47
  their own roles and they have to do it. When
• 31:49
  they pivot away from it, they get burned. Yes.
• 31:52
  Like they get shunned. Yes. Again, like Bruno.
• 31:55
  Yeah. Right. And then when they're actually able
• 31:57
  to break free from that and actually able to
• 32:01
  become the butterfly. Right. right? Spread their
• 32:05
  wings. Now they're actually able to recognize
• 32:07
  and realize. And then the very end, the song
• 32:10
  where they're rebuilding the casita, right? And
• 32:14
  then it's just really this magical moment where
• 32:16
  they're all kind of lined up in the pathway leading
• 32:19
  up to the home and Mirabelle's walking up and
• 32:21
  they give her the little doorknob to put on the
• 32:24
  home. And they're talking very specifically and
• 32:27
  Bruno says it too, like, hey, the real gift is
• 32:29
  you, kid. Yeah. Right? Like, it's not some...
• 32:32
  gift that you're given. No, it's you. It's each
• 32:34
  one of us. Like we are independently the gift.
• 32:38
  Yes. So we have certain skills and we can use
• 32:41
  those skills, but ultimately like we have to
• 32:43
  be healed from within because we ourselves are
• 32:46
  the gift, which I think is really, I mean, it's
• 32:48
  a really great message, right? Such a great message.
• 32:50
  And also kind of to tap into that, right. It's
• 32:54
  also like, we don't have to prove something to
• 33:00
  be loved. Yeah. You know, like that worth, right?
• 33:03
  That self -worth. I think sometimes when you
• 33:06
  get into like our jobs, our career, like we get
• 33:08
  into the mode of like, we need to prove something.
• 33:10
  We need to make certain amount of money to prove
• 33:12
  something that we're great or whatever. But like,
• 33:15
  I think at the end of that movie, it's like the
• 33:17
  gift is you. Like you don't need to prove anything
• 33:20
  to be worthy to be in this family. Yeah. That's
• 33:23
  beautiful. So I had a couple other quotes from
• 33:25
  you, for you, not in the movie. Other quotes
• 33:28
  from other people. Do you know Brene Brown? Yes.
• 33:30
  Of course you do. I love Brene Brown. Right?
• 33:32
  She talks a lot about shame. Yeah. Right? And
• 33:35
  one of the things she talks about in shame in
• 33:38
  her TED Talk was, she said, if you put shame
• 33:40
  in a Petri dish, it needs three ingredients to
• 33:42
  grow exponentially. Secrecy, silence, and judgment.
• 33:46
  And that's what these people experience. If you
• 33:48
  put the same amount of shame in the Petri dish
• 33:50
  and douse it with empathy, it can't survive.
• 33:53
  So it's like... To me, it was so much of what
• 33:56
  they're experiencing, right? Was this shame.
• 33:59
  Yeah. And then the empathy, I think, in part
• 34:02
  came from Mirabel. Where she was able to be empathetic
• 34:06
  to what they're going through. Yeah. And that's
• 34:08
  a gift. Yes. Right? That's exactly right. Right.
• 34:12
  Because no other family members could empathize
• 34:15
  for so long. And she was the only one who could
• 34:17
  break through that. That was beautiful. That's
• 34:20
  such a great take on that. Her gift was empathy.
• 34:24
  Yeah. Which is born from love, right? Yeah, right.
• 34:26
  You can't have empathy without love. Right. And
• 34:28
  when she was able to have that empathy and show
• 34:30
  that love to Luisa. Right. To Isabella. To Isabella
• 34:33
  too, yeah. To Dolores. Right. Right. To Bruno.
• 34:36
  To Bruno. Yeah. Oh, especially to Bruno. Right.
• 34:38
  Then suddenly. the secrecy that they all have
• 34:41
  with what their hardship is because each one
• 34:44
  of them was yeah bruno actually silent leaves
• 34:46
  luisa not telling anybody about her cracks isabella
• 34:48
  just trying to be perfect all the time not saying
• 34:50
  it right dolores knowing a lot and holding it
• 34:53
  back she knew bruno was there the whole time
• 34:55
  because she can hear him like i can't say anything
• 34:57
  i'm not gonna be the one that says something
• 34:59
  nope this won't be a secrecy right because he's
• 35:01
  got shame i've got shame we can't do it yeah
• 35:04
  So then as Mirabelle comes in with her gift,
• 35:08
  which I think you're exactly right, is empathy,
• 35:10
  able to help. break down that petri dish of shame.
• 35:14
  Yeah, and understanding and curiosity, right?
• 35:17
  I think we don't live our lives with enough curiosity
• 35:20
  to understand people. I think a lot of time,
• 35:24
  even in that movie, it's that everyone has their
• 35:26
  own struggles. We just don't talk about it. But
• 35:28
  when we come on the lens of curiosity, we know
• 35:30
  people struggle more and we can connect better
• 35:33
  when we know that too. And we can show up better.
• 35:36
  I think Mirabelle just really wanted to show
• 35:38
  up with the sisters and the cousins. She just
• 35:42
  didn't know how. Right. And you can see her efforts,
• 35:43
  too. Yeah. She's trying to, when they're first
• 35:45
  putting together the party for Antonio to get
• 35:50
  his gift. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And she's trying
• 35:51
  to make the little things with the little candles.
• 35:53
  And she's trying to do everything she can to
• 35:54
  participate. Right. She didn't have a gift. Everyone's
• 35:57
  kind of like, ah, you don't need to do that.
• 35:59
  Like, Abuela's like, hey, step aside. Like, let
• 36:01
  other people do it. Right. But she's trying to.
• 36:03
  She's trying to find ways that she can serve.
• 36:05
  To show up, yeah. And then ultimately finds,
• 36:07
  you know. I think the best way, which was through
• 36:09
  empathy. So when we think about, we take a step
• 36:11
  away specifically from incontinence, we'll still
• 36:14
  look at the lens. When we think about intergenerational
• 36:17
  trauma that people have, what do they do with
• 36:21
  that? First off, how does somebody recognize
• 36:23
  that they have some of that in their life, in
• 36:26
  their family? And then what do they do with that
• 36:28
  information once they recognize that that's something
• 36:30
  that is harming them or something they are experiencing?
• 36:34
  Yeah, such a good question. How do we know if
• 36:37
  we have some kind of an intergenerational trauma?
• 36:41
  A big indication is when you're with your family
• 36:45
  and you cannot talk about something. There's
• 36:47
  always something. In my work, what I see a lot
• 36:52
  is abuse. We cannot talk about the abuse, usually
• 36:56
  from a family member. We cannot talk about the
• 36:59
  addiction. When there's addiction in the family,
• 37:02
  usually you can't talk about that. So I would
• 37:04
  say if there's something that you feel like you
• 37:06
  cannot talk about and it triggers that kind of
• 37:09
  really ugh emotions for you, I would say that's
• 37:12
  a good indicator that you're going through some
• 37:14
  kind of a trauma in your family. And so once
• 37:17
  you recognize it, what do you do about it? Yeah.
• 37:20
  Because it's not always easy, right? No, yeah.
• 37:22
  If there are certain things that are very taboo
• 37:24
  to talk about, you can recognize it's there,
• 37:27
  but then how in the world do you approach it?
• 37:30
  I think the first question you need to ask yourself
• 37:32
  is what do you want to do with this? Kind of
• 37:35
  circling back to my own story, right? You don't
• 37:39
  know you grew up in the... you know in the abusive
• 37:42
  childhood until you get out of it and you're
• 37:45
  like like that's not normal right that's not
• 37:47
  normal like oh your dad don't yell at you all
• 37:49
  the time like that's weird so you so i would
• 37:53
  say you live in it for so long you don't know
• 37:54
  until you know something different and you're
• 37:57
  like oh that's not normal so when you get the
• 38:00
  aha moment i want you to ask yourself like what
• 38:02
  do you want to do with this so for me when i
• 38:05
  realized that i had quite an abusive childhood
• 38:08
  and not like canny or like not physical. It was
• 38:10
  a lot of emotion, emotional abuse. Um, I asked
• 38:13
  myself like, what do I want to do with this?
• 38:15
  At first I wanted kind of like a revenge, right?
• 38:19
  Like kind of like, I want my dad to feel it.
• 38:21
  You know, I want my dad to feel like how it was,
• 38:24
  like how painful it was and stuff like that.
• 38:26
  So I spent a lot of time being angry, being angry
• 38:29
  with him at him and like, you know, like journaling
• 38:31
  a lot of just angry stuff and kind of want to,
• 38:33
  you know, yell at him and stuff like that. Um,
• 38:37
  So I spent a lot of time being angry, but then
• 38:39
  I realized that anger is not bringing me anywhere.
• 38:42
  I think a lot of people get stuck just in that
• 38:44
  phase, the anger part, where you blame, you shame,
• 38:47
  you blame, and it's everyone else's problem.
• 38:50
  But as an adult, you have to realize your life
• 38:53
  is what you make out of it. If you want to continue
• 38:56
  to be angry at your dad, you can. But do I want
• 38:58
  to live that life and be miserable? I actually
• 39:00
  love my dad. I want to have a connection with
• 39:02
  him. So what I did was I went to therapy. I had
• 39:05
  to be really, really honest with myself. Like,
• 39:07
  you know, I didn't have a part in it, right?
• 39:10
  But I can make a change now as an adult. So as
• 39:14
  an adult, what can I do? I'm a mother now. Obviously,
• 39:18
  I have some tendencies from my dad. Sure. That
• 39:20
  absolutely happens, right? Right. Like, you know,
• 39:23
  like in your head, I don't want to be my dad.
• 39:24
  But then, you know, you are your dad sometimes
• 39:26
  when you're triggered and all of that. So I have
• 39:28
  to check myself so much to like, OK, not repeat
• 39:31
  this and not, you know, change the pattern. I'm
• 39:34
  learning some things because in my culture, there's
• 39:36
  a lot of shaming you. If somebody if the kid
• 39:39
  doesn't want to do what you said, you shame them.
• 39:42
  Like, you're going to be stupid. You're going
• 39:44
  to be homeless and stuff like that. You shame
• 39:45
  them until they do something that you want to
• 39:47
  do. But that's not usually the best thing to
• 39:49
  do with your kids. Yeah, shaming is not an effective
• 39:52
  tool for, like, lasting impact. Right. You might
• 39:57
  get them to take that action in that moment.
• 40:00
  Right. But long term, no. For you, Brene Brown
• 40:04
  talks a little bit about this. What's the difference
• 40:05
  between shame and guilt? I think she talks about
• 40:08
  it like shame is generally bad. Guilt's not necessarily
• 40:10
  bad. What's the difference? I think shame is
• 40:14
  very internally judging. You're judging yourself
• 40:19
  internally. You feel like you're in trouble a
• 40:21
  lot. Guilt can fuel action. So if you feel guilty,
• 40:27
  you feel like, oh, you want to do something different.
• 40:29
  So I would say shame is more internal. Guilt
• 40:32
  is more maybe action -based for some people.
• 40:34
  Okay. I like that. I like that difference there.
• 40:36
  Yeah. Okay. So somebody is experiencing this.
• 40:39
  They recognize it. They've got to decide what
• 40:42
  they want to do with it. You said that sometimes,
• 40:45
  like for you, you felt anger. Yeah. Is that?
• 40:47
  Is that an essential step that somebody needs
• 40:50
  to go through that emotion of feeling the anger
• 40:54
  and not shying away from feeling anger about
• 40:56
  it? Or what component does that play in this
• 40:58
  process of trying to heal from this intergenerational
• 41:02
  trauma? Yeah, I think when it comes to healing
• 41:05
  trauma or like trauma from the past, especially.
• 41:10
  There's two, I feel like there's two kinds of
• 41:12
  people. One who would say like, oh, everything's
• 41:15
  fine. I was fine. You know, it wasn't such a
• 41:17
  big deal or like I got through it. It was fine.
• 41:19
  But there are a lot of time, a lot of time when
• 41:22
  that happens is that they are not wanting to
• 41:25
  address the feelings, not wanting to even go
• 41:27
  there because they know if they go there, the
• 41:29
  feelings are overflowing, right? It's hard to,
• 41:31
  it's hard to engage or like regulate. So there's
• 41:35
  that one. And then the other ones are like feeling
• 41:37
  a lot, right? Anger and just being. stuck there
• 41:40
  it's like just being stuck in that negative loop
• 41:42
  of like oh it's it's his fault it's whatever
• 41:44
  it's other people's fault and I'm not going to
• 41:46
  acknowledge that so so there's two types of people
• 41:49
  so I think in a way I think it's really good
• 41:52
  to kind of process like what you want to get
• 41:54
  out of that so yes feeling the feelings it very
• 41:57
  important but we need to get out of that feelings
• 42:00
  too yeah and more action -based and what do we
• 42:03
  want to get out of that feelings So when someone's
• 42:06
  experiencing those emotions of anger for past
• 42:09
  trauma and they decide what they want to do with
• 42:13
  it, how do they decide? How do they come up with
• 42:16
  what that is they want to do? If they're unsure,
• 42:20
  if they're lost about what that means or... what
• 42:24
  the options even are. How do they go about figuring
• 42:26
  out what it is they want to do with that? Yeah,
• 42:28
  good question. I think for me, it was just more
• 42:32
  of like, do I want to live a life where I'm just
• 42:35
  really angry with my dad all my life? You're
• 42:37
  talking 80 years, maybe potentially 80 years
• 42:41
  of like hating somebody. Not really. Like, I
• 42:43
  don't want to have that kind of a negative feeling
• 42:46
  in me, right? Because ultimately, I'm the one
• 42:47
  suffering. My dad's fine. He's gone through it.
• 42:50
  He's fine. He's healed, right? the one who's
• 42:54
  like carrying all of that so i would say check
• 42:56
  in with that and the next move will just be you
• 43:00
  know once you decided what you want out of it
• 43:02
  the next one will be seeking resources and help
• 43:04
  asking for support like maybe going up um sorry
• 43:09
  connecting with people who went through similarly
• 43:11
  siblings are usually good but even with siblings
• 43:14
  everyone usually have very different experiences
• 43:17
  childhood experiences too um therapy is always
• 43:20
  good you know having that third person that don't
• 43:24
  know you and don't know the dynamics and not
• 43:26
  really engage in, you know, all of this trauma,
• 43:28
  have them help you kind of sort it out for you.
• 43:31
  Um, and making sure that that's a good fit too,
• 43:34
  because a lot of people do not understand cultural
• 43:36
  drama, uh, trauma. Sorry. Sure. Yeah. So we need
• 43:39
  to make sure that the people that we seek out,
• 43:41
  seek help for from is also in line to our values.
• 43:45
  Yeah. Yeah. That's a great, that's a great point.
• 43:47
  You know, if somebody can't at all understand.
• 43:50
  what that experience was. They can't relate to
• 43:53
  it at all. It's going to make it a little bit
• 43:55
  harder for them to give you good advice about
• 43:56
  what to do. I mean, just as something as simple
• 43:59
  as culture, right? Like I come from Asian culture
• 44:02
  and you come from Western culture. When we talk
• 44:05
  about boundaries, when we talk about families.
• 44:07
  it's so different right like i think in the western
• 44:10
  culture it's very socially acceptable to cut
• 44:13
  people off cut your family off but in asian culture
• 44:16
  oh my gosh like we have a lot of intermingling
• 44:19
  things and culturally it's just not something
• 44:22
  that we do so if you go to a therapist who who
• 44:25
  you know who's okay with cutting people off there
• 44:28
  will be a lot of this alignment there with values
• 44:29
  too so seeking appropriate help with a good fit
• 44:33
  is important yeah definitely true So then somebody
• 44:37
  goes and kind of seeks that help and they're
• 44:40
  able to start breaking down this trauma and breaking
• 44:46
  out of the patterns that they might be stuck
• 44:48
  in because of this trauma. What does that look
• 44:52
  like in that process of trying to get rid of
• 44:55
  those patterns? Yeah. Oh my gosh, so hard. You
• 45:00
  will see a lot of people who rather, and I'm
• 45:04
  not saying this lightly, who rather stay in a
• 45:06
  trauma because it's easier. Yeah. Easier to deal
• 45:09
  because you know what to expect. You know how
• 45:12
  to deal with it when you're triggered. You know
• 45:14
  what happens next. You know your own narrative,
• 45:16
  right? But when you are trying to break out of
• 45:19
  it, it's going to be so uncomfortable because
• 45:21
  you need to sit with feelings that are very uncomfortable.
• 45:23
  Like, I need to take accountability on my life.
• 45:26
  A lot of trauma victims don't feel like they
• 45:29
  need to take accountability because it's not
• 45:31
  their fault. And it is not their fault. But the
• 45:33
  accountability comes from living the life that
• 45:35
  you want to live. That's the accountability that
• 45:37
  you need to take. And that's where the decision
• 45:39
  has to be made. What do you want to do with this
• 45:42
  trauma? How do you want to heal from it? So I
• 45:44
  would say a lot of sitting with the discomfort
• 45:47
  of changing patterns. So for example, for me,
• 45:50
  when my daughter, I have a seven -year -old daughter.
• 45:54
  Seven -year -old, of course. She's like, you
• 45:56
  know, she wants everything. She's just a mess.
• 45:58
  Like, she just wants to do everything. When she
• 46:02
  talks back at me in my culture, in the past,
• 46:06
  my dad would be like, you don't talk to me like
• 46:08
  that. You know, just shut it down right away
• 46:09
  and yell it back to her. To break that intergenerational
• 46:14
  trauma, I need to catch myself to not react to
• 46:17
  that the same way that I was reacted to because
• 46:19
  that doesn't make her feel safe, right? So I
• 46:22
  need to be more mindful of listening to respond
• 46:25
  instead of listening to react. That's accountability.
• 46:29
  That's breaking your own generational trauma.
• 46:31
  It stops with you. Well, I mean, that leads perfectly
• 46:34
  to, I guess, a little bit further down that path,
• 46:36
  the same basic thing, which is once someone's
• 46:39
  able to break the patterns they have, how do
• 46:43
  you help make sure you don't pass those on? How
• 46:47
  do you make sure that now you don't continue
• 46:49
  that intergenerational trauma and your kids continue
• 46:52
  to experience those same things that you had
• 46:53
  experienced? Because I think for a lot of people,
• 46:56
  that's hard. Even though we know certain things
• 47:00
  that we didn't like that our parents did. Right?
• 47:02
  We could even name them. Yeah. And probably many
• 47:04
  of them. Right. And yet in the moment, in the
• 47:07
  heat of the moment especially, we revert to what
• 47:09
  we know because it's the only thing that we know.
• 47:11
  Right. Exactly. Like, okay, I experienced that
• 47:13
  before. I saw that. I'm going to do that. Right.
• 47:16
  How do you go about, like, really breaking that
• 47:19
  pattern? Yeah. I always ask, I always tell my,
• 47:22
  this is what I do. I always tell myself, like,
• 47:24
  is this worth spiraling for? so is this worth
• 47:29
  the battle picking like for example she didn't
• 47:32
  she wants to have chick -fil -a for dinner you
• 47:34
  know but i have already cooked dinner so then
• 47:37
  How do we manage that? Do we hear her what she
• 47:43
  wants? Or do we cave in too? Sometimes that can
• 47:46
  be seen as spoiling as well, right? Or do we
• 47:50
  set that boundary and be firm with that? And
• 47:52
  what did your family do that made you feel unsafe
• 47:56
  at the time? And what can you do to make your
• 47:58
  kids feel safe? So I would say taking that pause.
• 48:01
  Taking that pause before you respond. Taking
• 48:03
  that pause before you react. Even a one second
• 48:06
  or two. second breathe in and breathe out that
• 48:09
  could change so much of the trajectory of how
• 48:11
  you handle the situation because a lot of the
• 48:13
  time we know what we don't want to be sure but
• 48:16
  in the moment in the heat of moment we kind of
• 48:18
  cave into what we know yeah but when we take
• 48:20
  that step just that one or two seconds to breathe
• 48:22
  just one or two second i'm not taking not saying
• 48:25
  take five minutes just one or two second i think
• 48:27
  a lot of things can change that's how you break
• 48:30
  international intergenerational trauma is you
• 48:32
  change that pattern you stop that pattern how
• 48:35
  do you How do you resolve the inherent conflict
• 48:40
  there between spoiling a kid and holding really
• 48:45
  firm boundaries? Yeah, that will have to come
• 48:49
  from your family value. Like, what do you value?
• 48:53
  I think that example. Right. I think for me,
• 48:55
  what was happening there is that I had to tell
• 48:57
  her, like, hey, we're so privileged to be able
• 49:00
  to have a choice to go out or to eat in. So I
• 49:03
  had to tell her, like, I've already cooked the
• 49:05
  food and this is something that we have to eat
• 49:07
  tonight. But tomorrow we can do Chick -fil -A.
• 49:10
  So having her be heard as well and be safe and
• 49:14
  not react and be like, how dare you? suggest
• 49:17
  chick -fil -a there's dinner on the table you
• 49:19
  know just kind of how you respond really totally
• 49:22
  yeah so okay so so let me take a different slant
• 49:26
  at this uh same idea which is how do you help
• 49:32
  to break the patterns when you're dealing with
• 49:35
  a co -parenting situation as you know i'm a divorce
• 49:39
  attorney so i'm dealing with these things all
• 49:40
  day i also happen to have two boys with an ex
• 49:43
  yeah And so I think in co -parenting situations,
• 49:46
  a lot of things are more complicated. 100%. I'm
• 49:51
  also co -parenting, so I get you. Okay, so you
• 49:53
  get it. Yeah. You get it. So what was your question?
• 49:56
  How do you break those patterns? How do you help
• 49:59
  your kids not experience that same intergenerational
• 50:02
  trauma when you do have a co -parenting situation?
• 50:05
  So you can't. Always be there for those situations
• 50:08
  because they're only with you half the time or
• 50:09
  whatever it is. Right. Oh, this is so hard. And
• 50:13
  I tell this to myself, too. You control what
• 50:16
  you can control. You cannot control when your
• 50:20
  kids are away from you, but you can control when
• 50:22
  they're with you. So how do you want them to
• 50:24
  feel when they're with you? Do you want them
• 50:26
  to feel safe? What does safety look like for
• 50:29
  your kids? Maybe just listening to them more
• 50:31
  or being present with them, not scrolling on
• 50:34
  our phone. Or being that safe place to where
• 50:37
  they can tell us uncomfortable things without
• 50:39
  reaction. And that itself, just that, just three
• 50:42
  things, is already breaking a lot of generational
• 50:45
  trauma from a lot of families because we don't
• 50:47
  do that enough. So we control what we can control,
• 50:50
  and kids will know. I mean, you know, right?
• 50:52
  Kids know. And they'll find out. I think that's
• 50:55
  really insightful where... you know how do we
• 50:57
  want our kids to feel in our home and we want
• 50:59
  them to feel safe yeah and when we look at it
• 51:03
  through that lens i mean i'm already thinking
• 51:05
  right now about different decisions i would have
• 51:06
  made yesterday with my five -year -old right
• 51:08
  i'm already literally thinking about these things
• 51:10
  when we were trying to watch beauty and the beast
• 51:12
  last night okay we were experiencing the same
• 51:14
  thing and she's five But I can totally see this,
• 51:17
  like, I want her to feel safe. I do. And so some
• 51:20
  of the things that she and I were having this
• 51:22
  back and forth on at 5 and 43, like, oh, okay,
• 51:26
  I want her to feel safe, though. I could have
• 51:28
  made a different decision in the way that I held
• 51:30
  to this boundary or asked her to do that or she's
• 51:34
  getting upset and I need her to do something
• 51:35
  different. If my goal is, like, I actually want
• 51:38
  her to feel safe and loved, okay, I need to take
• 51:41
  a second or two. I need to think about this differently.
• 51:44
  And I can still have. a boundary that I set with
• 51:46
  her, but boy, it would have played out different.
• 51:48
  I would have totally done it different if I would
• 51:50
  have looked at that lens. I love that so much.
• 51:52
  Yeah, you're welcome. And I use that for myself
• 51:55
  so much. Even just yesterday, you know, she had
• 51:58
  a tantrum, of course, seven -year -old. She threw
• 52:00
  a fit because she wanted to draw another thing
• 52:01
  because we were drawing and she wanted to draw
• 52:03
  another thing and it's bedtime. So she threw
• 52:05
  a fit and then she went to her room. Her room
• 52:07
  is more like a safe place where I have combing
• 52:10
  posters and stuff like that, coping skills that
• 52:13
  she can use. So after like 10 minutes, she was
• 52:16
  in there. She came out and said, Mommy, I want
• 52:21
  to talk. I'm like, oh, that's cool that you said
• 52:23
  that. And then she's like, well, you don't love
• 52:27
  me. She said, well, Mommy, you don't love me.
• 52:29
  I'm like, that's... i love you maya in what ways
• 52:32
  have i shown that i don't love you today and
• 52:35
  then she's like well you didn't come and talk
• 52:36
  to me oh is that what you needed i can do that
• 52:39
  you know so just taking that even that pause
• 52:42
  and just really listening to what she needed
• 52:43
  she really just needed a hug after that yeah
• 52:46
  and i can give it to her i don't need to and
• 52:48
  you asked her Yeah, and I ask her, too. You asked
• 52:50
  her, what would you need to feel loved? Yeah.
• 52:53
  And I think a lot of times we don't. We're like,
• 52:55
  well, of course I love you. Right. Like, I do
• 52:56
  everything for you. I literally, everything you
• 52:58
  have in this house, everywhere you go, I buy
• 53:00
  it for you. Right. Like, of course I love you.
• 53:02
  Yes. Instead of just saying, oh. What do you
• 53:05
  need to feel loved? Yes. Yeah. So it's so important
• 53:08
  to like even just having that respect for your
• 53:10
  child that they have feelings, too, and they
• 53:12
  have needs, too. And we show up in ways that
• 53:14
  make sense for us in how we show love. But maybe
• 53:17
  it doesn't make sense for them. For sure. Yeah.
• 53:20
  Interesting. OK, I love it. OK, so I'm going
• 53:23
  to take us to a couple of quick segments and
• 53:25
  then we'll kind of do our final thoughts and
• 53:27
  then our three actionable takeaways. So before
• 53:30
  we do, we're going to do a this or that. Okay.
• 53:31
  I'll just give you a this or that and you say
• 53:33
  which one you think. Awesome. And you might have
• 53:34
  to defend your controversial opinion. All right.
• 53:37
  Let's do it. And then after that, it'll be a
• 53:38
  rapid fire. So the rapid fire is I'll just ask
• 53:40
  you a question and whatever first thing comes
• 53:42
  to your mind. Okay. Okay. So here's the this
• 53:44
  or that. This is the first one. Mirabelle or
• 53:47
  Isabella? Mirabelle. Bruno or Luisa? Ooh. This
• 53:53
  one was a little harder. Ooh. Um. Ooh, then I
• 53:59
  have to defend it, right? Luisa. I really love
• 54:09
  Luisa. Yeah. She might be my favorite. She's
• 54:13
  so great. I just think it's so relatable. So
• 54:15
  relatable. What she goes through. Yeah, in a
• 54:17
  lot of ways. And she didn't run away. I think
• 54:20
  that was why I would defend her is because she
• 54:22
  didn't run away from the cracks. Yeah, from her
• 54:25
  side. The Magic Candle or The Casita? Oh, The
• 54:31
  Casita. Yeah, I think it's got way more character.
• 54:33
  Yes, super fun. Let's see. Let's go with Family
• 54:39
  Dinner or Solo Night Out? Oh, Family Dinner,
• 54:43
  100%. I love my Family Dinner. That's why we
• 54:45
  talk. So good. Talk It Out or Ride It Out? Oh,
• 54:51
  I'm a talking it out person. Same. Yeah. Some
• 54:54
  people love to write and that's their way to
• 54:57
  kind of get it out. Oh, I just want to talk.
• 54:58
  I just want to talk. Yeah. Totally. Until your
• 55:00
  ear's out. Okay. Call your therapist or call
• 55:06
  your best friend? Therapist. I feel like my best
• 55:09
  friend will tell me what I want to hear. See,
• 55:12
  my best friend's different. He will tell me.
• 55:14
  He'll be way too hard on me. He'd be like, you're
• 55:17
  an idiot. Stop doing that, you moron. Right,
• 55:19
  right, right. He'd just give it to me straight.
• 55:22
  I think that's a good best friend to keep. He
• 55:24
  works for the sheriff's office, so he's used
• 55:26
  to not messing around. He's just going to give
• 55:28
  it to you like it is, which is actually really
• 55:30
  good for me to hear sometimes. But sometimes
• 55:32
  it is nice to have someone who's going to talk
• 55:34
  through it and think through it a little bit
• 55:35
  more thoroughly with you. Yes, I just feel like
• 55:37
  with therapists, they have a different perspective
• 55:39
  to where they're not biased, to where they can
• 55:41
  help me through it. I just feel like best friends
• 55:43
  know me through and through, and know my BS too.
• 55:45
  And they will tell me my BS. For sure. Okay,
• 55:49
  here's our rapid fire. Favorite Disney movie?
• 55:52
  Encanto. So good. Same. Favorite Disney song?
• 55:57
  Oh, Reflection. From Mulan. Oh, such a powerful
• 56:03
  song. Such a powerful song. We just did Mulan
• 56:07
  on an episode a couple of weeks ago. And that
• 56:11
  song came up. And it's really... It's really
• 56:13
  moving, you know, when she's just talking about
• 56:15
  the, like, when she's looking at that reflection,
• 56:17
  you know, is it who she wants to be? What does
• 56:20
  she need to become? Going back to that people
• 56:22
  pleasing, right? Yeah. Who are you? Yeah, because
• 56:24
  initially, like, all she's wanting to do is please
• 56:26
  everybody else around her. I've got to go be
• 56:28
  this perfect little wife and go be this bride
• 56:31
  and, like, do these things that they asked. And
• 56:32
  she has to learn to break free from that. It's
• 56:35
  so good. I love that. So relatable. Favorite
• 56:37
  Disney princess? Wow. Oh, my gosh. Elsa's sister.
• 56:47
  Oh, Anna. Anna. She's so great. It's not Elsa.
• 56:50
  Anna's so great. Anna's so great. I feel like
• 56:52
  Anna is such a connector, and she's so funny.
• 56:56
  She is. Yeah, she's so funny. She's got some
• 56:57
  similarities to Mirabel. Yeah, she does. Because
• 56:59
  neither of them has powers. Yeah, right. And
• 57:01
  yet they're still able to do great things even
• 57:04
  without powers. Right. And a lot of it's based
• 57:06
  in love, right? And empathy. Empathy, yes. Right?
• 57:09
  With Elsa. Like, she just wanted to, like, understand
• 57:12
  her. Like, why do we not want to build a snowman?
• 57:14
  So good. So good. Okay, favorite Disney hero
• 57:16
  or heroine? Oh, I'm not really a hero person.
• 57:24
  I would still say Anna. I think she saved Arendelle.
• 57:27
  She's a heroine. 100 % she is. Yeah, absolutely.
• 57:29
  Especially in Frozen 2. Yes. Yeah, what she was
• 57:32
  able to do to take the information that she had
• 57:35
  and make the super, super hard choice. Like,
• 57:37
  we're going to destroy this dam. It's going to
• 57:40
  flood all of Arendelle. Right. But it has to
• 57:42
  right the wrong. I've got to do it. Right. And
• 57:44
  she did it. She does it. She has the power to
• 57:46
  do it. Right. So good. I love her. So good. Favorite
• 57:48
  Disney villain? I would say Bruno. At first it
• 57:54
  was like a villain, right? Because you think
• 57:56
  he's the villain. Right. You think he is, and
• 57:57
  then it turns out that he's not at all. It's
• 57:59
  not, yeah. Which is, that's a good one, because
• 58:01
  then he's actually this great character, this
• 58:03
  lovable character who's only out there trying
• 58:05
  to love his family and help his family. Right.
• 58:06
  So totally redeemable. I love Bruno. Love it.
• 58:10
  Okay, here's a couple others. Which family member
• 58:15
  of the family Madrigal would you most want to
• 58:17
  have dinner with? I would say Abuela. Okay. Yeah.
• 58:24
  Tell me more. I want to know her story. I want
• 58:27
  to know how she survived single parenting with
• 58:31
  three triplets. I'm like drowning, but she had
• 58:34
  three. And what kind of pain did she need to
• 58:38
  survive to get to that point of the magical kingdom,
• 58:42
  right? And sustain that and what kind of stress
• 58:45
  she had. I just really want to talk to her. That's
• 58:47
  actually a really great one. I wasn't even thinking
• 58:49
  that one. That's awesome. If you could have any
• 58:52
  gift that any of the family members of the family
• 58:55
  Madrigal have, which would you choose? That's
• 58:59
  a hard question. The same Mirabelle health? Would
• 59:04
  that count? Sure, because we just talked about
• 59:07
  the fact that she's got the gift of empathy and
• 59:09
  love. I say that because I feel like I could
• 59:12
  relate. I am the first one and the only one in
• 59:16
  my family. that wants to break the trauma the
• 59:19
  generation of trauma and i could relate it so
• 59:21
  much because she was going through to so many
• 59:24
  people like help me understand like help me help
• 59:26
  me and nobody really wanted to right so it felt
• 59:30
  like i could yeah i could relate to her a lot
• 59:32
  okay so it was very personal to me i love that
• 59:34
  that's a great answer that's a great answer all
• 59:37
  right so let's kind of come to our kind of final
• 59:39
  um kind of conclusion thoughts or kind of takeaways
• 59:43
  that we have from here so What's kind of the
• 59:46
  overall closing reflection that somebody could
• 59:49
  have on this idea of intergenerational trauma
• 59:51
  within Kanto? And then let's get our three actionable
• 59:55
  takeaways. Yeah. So I wrote this down because
• 1:00:00
  I really want to distill this one thing. Yes.
• 1:00:03
  Breaking generational trauma isn't about rejecting
• 1:00:05
  your family. It's about loving them enough to
• 1:00:09
  change the story. Say it again. Yeah. Breaking
• 1:00:13
  generational trauma isn't about rejecting your
• 1:00:17
  family. It's about loving them enough to change
• 1:00:20
  the story. Kind of like boundaries. I want to
• 1:00:24
  have boundaries so I can connect with you. I
• 1:00:26
  want to love you enough so it's meaningful for
• 1:00:28
  you. So that we can actually have a family. Kind
• 1:00:30
  of like my family now, right? We're so close.
• 1:00:33
  I go home once every year, at least once every
• 1:00:35
  year, and I'll fly my parents here once every
• 1:00:37
  year too for my daughter's birthday. And why
• 1:00:39
  is that so important to break that? Trauma is
• 1:00:42
  that without that, without those work, we won't
• 1:00:45
  have this relationship. So I wanted to go through
• 1:00:48
  that rough patch, that really, really hard time,
• 1:00:50
  hard two years of just really processing with
• 1:00:54
  them and really talking with them and really
• 1:00:56
  like taking accountability for my own life so
• 1:00:59
  that I can have a relationship with my family.
• 1:01:02
  Yeah, I think it's so good. And especially in
• 1:01:05
  light of your explanation about what a boundary
• 1:01:07
  really means. It's not to keep somebody out.
• 1:01:09
  It's actually to. create the connection, which
• 1:01:12
  is so good. Okay. So what are three actionable
• 1:01:16
  takeaways that somebody could put into effect
• 1:01:20
  in their lives today or this week to start breaking
• 1:01:25
  this intergenerational trauma and really moving
• 1:01:28
  forward to a happier life? Yeah. First thing,
• 1:01:31
  name it. You have to name it. If you don't name
• 1:01:34
  it, you don't know. And I think a lot of people
• 1:01:36
  live a life where we don't really want to know
• 1:01:41
  or we don't want to address it. So naming it
• 1:01:45
  is so important. So what is it? What are you
• 1:01:46
  struggling with on a day -to -day? Why are you
• 1:01:49
  struggling? Why are you struggling with anxiety?
• 1:01:51
  What is the root of it? So naming the root of
• 1:01:54
  it is important. So that's step one. Step two
• 1:01:57
  would be... getting like what do you want out
• 1:02:00
  of this right so for myself like the childhood
• 1:02:02
  abuse i don't want to pass this on so in order
• 1:02:04
  not to pass this on i need to do something so
• 1:02:07
  i took parenting classes i took parenting courses
• 1:02:09
  i even went to one of my friend's house so she
• 1:02:13
  she's the same age as me but she has um she had
• 1:02:16
  kids earlier than me so she was the mom first
• 1:02:19
  and whatever so i had to go to her house and
• 1:02:21
  watch her play with her kids. Like I never had
• 1:02:26
  my parents play with me. So I don't know what
• 1:02:28
  playing with kids mean. I hated kids before I
• 1:02:30
  had kids. So it's like you need to learn from
• 1:02:33
  the ground up. You need to, you know, the nitty
• 1:02:36
  gritty. You cannot lie to yourself anymore. You
• 1:02:38
  need to be really honest with yourself. So whatever
• 1:02:41
  that is, take accountability and do that. What
• 1:02:44
  direction you want to do with the trauma, right?
• 1:02:49
  And then the third one is taking accountability.
• 1:02:51
  What can we do to take accountability for this
• 1:02:54
  trauma? What can we do to break this so that
• 1:02:57
  we don't pass it on? This is something that we
• 1:02:59
  can control, so we want to control that. That's
• 1:03:02
  fantastic. I think if somebody can put those
• 1:03:06
  into effect, they're going to see a major shift.
• 1:03:10
  Yes. And I think their overall happiness, frankly,
• 1:03:13
  I think it's actually that important. Right.
• 1:03:15
  I think I always say life is too short to live
• 1:03:20
  in your own BS. Yeah. We have a lot of excuses.
• 1:03:24
  We have so many of our own BS that we tell ourselves,
• 1:03:27
  you know. Of course. But the BS is what's keeping
• 1:03:30
  us from feeling true to ourselves, being honest
• 1:03:33
  with ourselves, you know, living a true life,
• 1:03:36
  like a very authentic life. I wear fur coat to
• 1:03:39
  the gym. Do I care? No. Because you like it.
• 1:03:42
  Because I love it. And if you do, that's what
• 1:03:44
  you should do. Right. Absolutely. Who cares about
• 1:03:47
  what other people think, right? Because I love
• 1:03:50
  it. I think I look good in it and I feel good
• 1:03:53
  in it. So that's all that matters is that what
• 1:03:55
  you feel about it and take accountability for
• 1:03:58
  that as long as you're not hurting other people.
• 1:03:59
  Sure. I think it's funny you mention that. A
• 1:04:03
  lot of times I'll get from people because I wear
• 1:04:05
  suits a lot. Yeah. Like, oh, don't you just hate
• 1:04:07
  having to wear a suit every day because you're
• 1:04:08
  an attorney? And I was like, actually, no. I
• 1:04:11
  actually really like wearing suits, truth be
• 1:04:13
  told. Right, right. I wear suits when I don't
• 1:04:15
  have cord. I wear suits because I like wearing
• 1:04:17
  suits. Yeah. It makes me feel fancy. It makes
• 1:04:19
  me feel professional. And I like the way it makes
• 1:04:22
  me feel. Yes. And so I like wearing suits because
• 1:04:24
  of that. And that's authentic to you. That's
• 1:04:27
  why it makes you feel good because it aligns
• 1:04:29
  with your value. Right. So I think that's so
• 1:04:31
  important. Aligning your life with your values.
• 1:04:34
  Yeah, no question. Well, I appreciate the conversation
• 1:04:37
  with you so much today. Thank you. Learned a
• 1:04:39
  ton about. intergenerational drama, trauma about
• 1:04:43
  boundaries, about creating connection from the
• 1:04:46
  boundaries as opposed to barriers. Really, really
• 1:04:49
  lovely conversation. I appreciate it. Thank you,
• 1:04:51
  Ryan. Thank you for having me. It was such a
• 1:04:53
  great movie to unpack. Yeah, for sure. My pleasure.
• 1:04:56
  Thanks. Thank you. As you lead this conversation,
• 1:05:00
  remember that yes, the past can hurt and you
• 1:05:03
  can either run from it or you can learn from
• 1:05:06
  it. So here's to learning. and finding joy in
• 1:05:09
  the journey. See you real soon.