Latest / Sweat Community / Ep. 15 Oakwell Beer Spa: More Than a Beer Bath | Jessica Zouaoui on Wellness, Risk & Reconnection

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Ep. 15 Oakwell Beer Spa: More Than a Beer Bath | Jessica Zouaoui on Wellness, Risk & Reconnection · Sweat Community

• Sheena: Welcome back to the Sweat Community Podcast where we introduce you to the people, places, and ideas shaping Colorado's health and wellness community. Today, I have Jessica Zuwawii, who left a corporate successful career in New York, sold nearly everything she and her husband had owned, traveled through 25 countries, and along the way discovered an idea that would completely change the direction of their lives. Today, Jessica and Damien, her husband, are founders of Oakwell Beer Spa, of Colorado's most unique wellness experiences, a place that's redefining what recovery, relaxation, and connection can look like. We're talking about taking risks, building a business from scratch, creating community, and of course, what exactly a beer spa is. Jessica, welcome to Sweat Community Podcast. Jessica Zouaoui: I'm so excited to be here. Sheena: I'm so excited that you are here. before we talk about Oakwell, I'd love to go back to the beginning because your story starts long before Denver. can you tell us a little bit about yourself and what career you had before Oakwell? Jessica Zouaoui: Absolutely. our story really starts in New York City. I was working a corporate job at the time. Funny enough, I went to school for neuroscience. I thought I was gonna be a research professor and study the brain. Now I own a beer spa, so it's funny the paths our lives take Sheena: Hahaha Jessica Zouaoui: us. but after I didn't get into the PhD program that I wanted to get into. I started working in the IT staffing industry. I worked my way up, started as a recruiter, moved into sales, and then moved into management. I'm originally from Florida and they gave me a call and said, Hey, are you interested in moving to New York City? We have an office that's really struggling there. We have a 12-month contract for you. We want you to come, see if you can turn the office around. and then you can decide if you want to stay in New York or we'll move you back to Florida. I had never been to New York before, but I was in my early 20s. I was like, sure, why not? This sounds great. it was two weeks after moving there that I met my now husband, Damien. he worked in the sales and marketing industry. for a boutique event management company. So they would do really high-end events, things like if a high net worth individual was coming to New York City and really wanted to see a play on Broadway, like they wanted to see Hamilton. he would arrange for them to have dinner with the cast beforehand, they'd have orchestra seats, then you would go backstage and cheers with the cast after. But even though we had these corporate jobs, we were very professionally unfulfilled. You know, we are both entrepreneurs at heart. We knew we wanted to open a business together. And when we'd get home from our corporate jobs, we would brainstorm different business ideas. We'd sit around a glass of wine or a pint of beer. we knew pretty quickly that we wanted to do something different. We didn't want to do a coffee shop or a restaurant or something that had been done a million times before. So it was the month after getting married. We decided if we're gonna do something risky, now is the time before we have kids, before we have a mortgage. So we quit our corporate jobs at the same time. We sold everything we owned. Packed two backpacks and headed off on what was to be an indefinite round the world trip. And the plan was that we weren't going to come home until we found the perfect business idea that we could bring back and scale in the United States. Sheena: holy cow, talk about just taking a leap of faith. Amazing, Jessica Zouaoui: Yes, for sure. Sheena: So from the outside, life looked pretty successful. What was missing? you felt unfulfilled. was it that you realized that you wanted something different? Jessica Zouaoui: in both of our jobs, we were constantly trying to take on new projects get promotions and move on to the next thing. We felt like we kept mastering the role that we are currently in and then we're like, what's next? What's next? What's next? And you can only go so far when you're within a company, right? It's like there's other people and there's positions that you can't take unless they leave. And so we just felt like we were always trying to do more and bigger and better. And we were very constrained in the companies that we worked for. and we also just felt like, end of the day, what's the worst that can happen? You know, we leave our jobs and let's say we travel the world and we end up not finding something or we try something that ends up not working out. we can always find another job. We can always go back to the corporate world. There's always a plan B. so might as well take the risk. Sheena: I love that. Yeah, it takes a lot of courage, but then We can always go back to a job. So what did your friends and family think when you told them that you were just going to take off and leave? Jessica Zouaoui: Well, the other funny thing, so Damien and I knew each other for nine months before getting married. So first Sheena: What? Jessica Zouaoui: off, and I proposed to him after only knowing each other for three months. So already we're like, okay, what's going on? She's like moving off to New York City. She proposed Sheena: Amazing! Wow! Jessica Zouaoui: to this Frenchman that she's only known for a few months, and they get married a few months later. so I think at that point my friends and family were just like, thinking that I'm a little nuts already. So she's like, it's just one of her adventures again. Sheena: Yeah, I love it. So when you were traveling, was it your goal to go out and visit different spas? Did you kind of have wellness in mind? Because you set out to look for a business. So What made you go and start to visit these spas? Jessica Zouaoui: Yeah. We are very interested in hospitality. We love hosting people. We love curating experiences and events, I've always been very into wellness. I got my yoga teacher certification when I was in India. I've always gone to spas with my mom and with my sister growing up. So that's definitely more of my interest than it was of Damien's. but we were exploring anything that was just a unique thing to do, hospitality or wellness focused. there was a couple of criteria. So we wanted something that was scalable. So we didn't want to be a mom and pop business We wanted to find a concept that we could bring back to the United States and scale nationally. we were really interested in franchising, finding something that we could franchise the concept. There was a lot of really interesting things like Mario Kart racing in the streets of Tokyo, right? Where you're driving go-karts on the literal highway in Tokyo in a full-body Sheena: Yeah. Jessica Zouaoui: Yoshi costume. Sheena: Hahaha Jessica Zouaoui: but I was like, okay, this is probably not so scalable. It's interesting and fun, but doesn't check that box. we also wanted something that we could be passionate about. There's a lot of great business concepts that may be very profitable, but at the end of the day, do I want to work there day in and day out? Is it something that I get excited talking about? And a lot of the things that we found just weren't that. so it was about halfway into our travels. We were in Zakko Pane, Poland, which is in the Polish Alps. it was a rainy day. We were looking for an indoor activity to do, and a beer spa popped up on TripAdvisor. Naturally, beers and spas is a great combination and had never heard of such a thing before. So we decided to check it out. And 30 minutes later, we were soaking in this cedar barrel tub that was infused with hops and malt. The aroma was just absolutely delicious. there was a free-flowing keg of cold Polish beer next to us. and there was also a bed of hay in the room, which fun fact, all other beer spas that exist in the world have a bed of hay. but it was really one of the most relaxing experiences that we had ever had. Damien actually fell asleep in the tub after two minutes. He barely had anything to drink. And in my mind, I'm like, okay, I think this is it. This is. Combined so many things like a social wellness experience. I feel like in the United States as well, spas are so transactional. You just go in, you get your massage, you get harassed for a membership, and you leave. It's not really a place that's you want to hang out and spend time in. and to have a true couples experience, like all of the spas in the US, you go for your couples massage you pay all this money, you're just face down on tables in the same room, and then all of the amenities are typically still gender separated. So it's never really the connection that you're looking to get out of it. we felt like this was really a big gap in the marketplace. So I, splashed Damien while we were still in Sheena: you Jessica Zouaoui: this tub and Zacko Potty Poland, it's like, hey, wake up. Like, I think this is it. We have to open a beer spa. And he was like, okay, let's do a little bit more research first. And it was from then on out that we really dug into the spa cultures around the world. So we went to Onsons in Japan, which are these. like hot spring facilities that have all these different temperature pools. and then there is a little restaurant in the middle where you can have some sake and you can eat a bowl of noodles or have a cool beer. We went to Jim Jubangs in South Korea, which are these multi-level, like seven-floor, ginormous spa facilities that have like 10 different types of saunas and pools with different herbs infused into them. And there's relaxation rooms with massage chairs playing videos on Netflix and multi-generations families go together. So you have the grandparents coming with their kids and their grandkids and they spend the whole day going back and forth between the saunas and the tubs. We went to wine spas in south of France and in Spain where they infuse wine into the tubs and there's always a communal space where you can have a glass of wine as well. So we ended up taking bits and pieces of all of these spa experiences that we found around the world and turned it into what is now Oakwell beer spa. Sheena: That is incredible. it seems like anywhere aside from the US, this is something that they value and this spa brings people together Jessica Zouaoui: Yeah, And another big thing that we noticed in the United States is that spas are really tailored towards the female demographic, and it is not that way around the world. so in the US, they're very feminine, they're tailored towards the healthy, the wealthy. It's it's this very small subset of the population that really goes to spas with any sort of frequency. But all around the world you have all different ages, all different socioeconomic backgrounds. so we really felt like we can open the spa experience up to a much wider audience than we felt like spas in the US were currently serving. Sheena: That's so cool because if I told my husband, hey, let's go to a spa. He'd be like, no, that's like you and your girlfriend. So to have this wellness experience that is so catered to everyone is lacking here. I know you said you took bits and pieces from every spa that you went to Was there anything that you were like, specifically I want to bring and specifically I want to take out? Jessica Zouaoui: Yeah. we really wanted to Americanize the concept. there's several other beer spaws that exist in the United States. I think we're one of maybe four or five now. in every other beer spa that exists, copied and pasted exactly what they have in Eastern Europe and the Czech Republic and Prague, and and just put it here. They have the bed of hay, they have these communal rooms where the tubs are all together. and one big thing that we realize through talking with, our friends and family is that Americans really value their privacy. And if we want to open this experience up to people that aren't traditionally going to spas, they really need to feel comfortable and don't want to be intimidated by the spa etiquette. you know, there's a way to talk and to act, and you have to interact with the massage therapist and the aesthetician So how do we make it less intimidating? And for us, that was creating private spa suites. So we actually have private rooms that have an infrared sauna, a rain shower, and a hydrotherapy tub that's infused with hops and malt inside. And this room is yours for the 90 minute session. That's just you and whoever you came with. So you can have up to three guests per session. but 90% of our guests come as couples, So You're not interacting with any other guest. you're also not interacting with any staff, This is really your own private room. And that helps get over that hurdle of, I don't know how to act or I don't know what I'm supposed to do when I'm in front of this therapist. but also when you think about it, when we go to spas, most people are there for different reasons. Some people are there by themselves. They're reading a book and they want a very quiet. meditative type of experience. And then you also have the Bachelorette party where they're all having mimosas and they're laughing and they're chatting. And then, I'm here trying to read my book and I'm like very annoyed that these people are being so loud. And I paid $300 for this experience. And now they're completely ruining what I came here for, even though it's what they came there for. So by having these private spa suites, it's really a choose your own adventure. So everyone is there for a different thing and you can make it a relaxing experience. You can make it a social experience and you're not going to bother those around you. And I think that was one of the biggest adaptations that we had. then other than that, just talking to business owners that own spas, we heard that labor was a really big challenge for them. So finding, retaining, hiring massage therapists and aestheticians. But also if they call out sick for the day, you're canceling their entire appointment book. so how do we get around that? And for us, it was really making sure all of our services are self-guided and technology enabled. Sheena: Mm, when you were explaining it, it was making me think and laugh a little bit. my friend just came back from Japan and was telling me her spa story. And like you said, it's usually a big communal space. And she said they were going into the bath house and this and that. And everybody was naked. And she was like, I Jessica Zouaoui: Yes. Sheena: didn't know what to do. Like it was, but that was just the thing. And it was a communal space, Jessica Zouaoui: Yes. Sheena: not this. private room. So I love that you have that, that it can be unique for everybody to make it their own experience, whether they do want to relax or more socialize which I can't believe 90 % of your guests are couples. I love that. And I'm excited to get into that in a little bit, but I do have to ask why hay at a beer spot? What is the pile of hay? What does that even mean? Jessica Zouaoui: I have no idea. I've it's it's really not comfortable. It was itchy. So we've been to I think Sheena: So you sit on it? Jessica Zouaoui: s you lay in it. It's a bed. This had like you're a barn style or something. I don't know how hygienic it is either. I'm like, how often do they change this hay? Like you're in the tub and then you lay in this hay and it's like sticking to you. We did not find it enjoyable. And we've been to maybe five or six beer spells around the world now. So we went to three in Eastern Europe. We've been to all the ones in the United States. and they all have this bed of hay. I'm like, why? What I don't get it. Sheena: Okay, yeah, I was like, what is the reason behind it? But I am with you. I feel like that would be so unhygienic, unless they're changing it out every time. But then again, that sounds so uncomfortable. Next question that you guys probably had when you were bringing this idea to the US is, where do we build it? So neither of you are from Colorado. How did Denver end up on your list? how did you narrow it down? And then once you did, how did you decide on Rhino for your first location? Jessica Zouaoui: It was really all market research that we did on our laptops and we were on the other side of the world. I think we were actually in Australia when we made the decision to come to Denver. We had both never been to Denver before, like never even visited before. but we were just looking at, where's the wellness cities, the craft beer cities, what cities have support for small businesses. As much as we love New York City. Personally, to open a business is just way too expensive. We didn't want outside investors. It's oversaturated when it comes to tourist activities. So we wanted a more mid-sized market where we could get started quicker and could make, more of an impact. And so we had really narrowed it down to Austin, Portland, and Denver. kind of these more hipster cities that have a thriving craft beer scene but are also outdoorsy. and at the time. Colorado had over 400 craft breweries when we were doing our research. So it was like, you know, arguably the craft beer mecca of the US. Denver also had a lot of great funding programs that we were able to find just through our research online. the city of Denver has an Office of Economic Development that they have loan programs that they will provide low-interest loans to people that can't get traditional, funding from the larger banks. so we knew that we wanted to go that route, like find a way to get a loan, even though we had no collateral and we didn't have a lot of money to put down. we just decided to give Denver a shot. We flew right here, like after traveling. We still had our backpacks on, but now business plan in hand. when we first got here, we didn't know anything like where the neighborhoods were, where anything was. So we were house sitting. so there's a site called trustedhouse sitters.com where you can basically stay in people's homes for free. In exchange for washing their pets or watering their plants while they're on vacation. And so we stayed in like various people's homes around Denver just trying to get a feel for, the different areas. and we ended up getting the funding that we had found online through the city of Denver. And part of that requirement was we had to be in specific areas that were in need of economic development. So we couldn't go to Cherry Creek, to Platte Street. It had to be an area that they really wanted to invest money in to create jobs, etc. And so we had this map that showed the main corridors and it was very specific like one side of the street you couldn't get funding for and but the other side of the street you could. so we had narrowed it down to Colfax, which now with the construction on Colfax, I'm like, oof, we were very close Sheena: Thank Jessica Zouaoui: to signing a lease on, but I'm like, that would have been really rough. So I'm glad we didn't do that. and Sheena: Dodge the bullet. Jessica Zouaoui: yeah, and then South Broadway was the other area that we were looking at. and then Rhino. We couldn't be in the heart of Rhino, we would have to be on the outskirts. So we're technically in the five points neighborhood. but we're really close, like a five-minute drive to all the breweries and all the action that's in Rhino. and we just felt like that neighborhood really fit what we were going for, was like industrial, it was a it's a little quirky, they have different things to do. we were close enough to the breweries that we would be able to entice them to partner with us to provide their beer on tap. but we could also potentially share customers, right? It's like, hey, we'll have you on tap and we'll encourage people to go over to your tap room after their spa experience. so we thought there'd be some interesting synergy there. Sheena: Yeah, what made you believe that this community would embrace something so different? Jessica Zouaoui: I think Denver has a reputation for being like forward thinking and wanting to try new things. And also from a franchise perspective, there's been a lot of very successful franchises that have started here. So Quisnos started, quick service restaurant, which is different, but so like Quiznos, Chipotle. Sheena: Chipotle. Jessica Zouaoui: Yeah, we have Crocs was here, I think Smash Burger. it's just a really good testing grounds for franchises and a lot of successful businesses have started here and then expanded nationally. And we also felt like in addition to the craft beer, people are really adventurous and outdoorsy. They want to spend their money on experiences rather than material things. And so we felt like it would fit in with the culture here. Sheena: my gosh, Yeah, I think that's a big thing like even for birthdays and Christmas, we want to give experiences for our kids versus material stuff. So I think we've made everybody wait long enough. Let's get into the experience. Let's finally talk about the beer spot. So for somebody Jessica Zouaoui: Yes, for Sheena: who's, right? So for somebody who's never been to Oakwell, can you walk us through the experience from the moment they walk through the doors? How much time does someone typically plan to spend there and what does a typical visit look like? Jessica Zouaoui: The first thing I have to say is you do not bathe in actual beer. That's the number one question that we get. Everyone says, is it real beer in the tubs? Even though I'm sure, you know, cores would be appropriate being in Denver, it is not Sheena: Ha Jessica Zouaoui: actual beer. The baths are infused with hops and malt, which are beer's key ingredients, and I'll get into that in a little bit. But just wanted to lay the ground there that you're not bathing in actual beer. Sheena: I love it because that's the next question I had and it's bolded. like, are you actually bathing in beer and how does that even work? Like anyway, okay, go ahead. Jessica Zouaoui: I know that's that's the first thing, right? You hear beer spa you're like, are you sitting in a tub of beer like gross that's sticky and what is that gonna smell like? Like, I don't know if I'm Sheena: Yes! Yes! Jessica Zouaoui: interested. So no, it's it's not that. But it catches people's interest, right? You hear beer spa and you wanna know more. but yes, you're not bathing in beer. So basically, if you're coming for the full spot experience, our team greets you as soon as you walk through the door with your name. Like, hi Sheena, we're so excited that you're here. I hear you're celebrating your anniversary. Thank you for coming. we check you in and then we escort you into our tap room. Our tap room is set up more like a boutique hotel lobby than it is an industrial brewery tap room. we have conversation starter cards on the tables that have fun little questions and topics that you can ask the person that you came with. And then we have 10 tasks. So we have a self-service system. If you've ever been to First Draft or one of these other places where you get an RFID card, you can play your own bartender. And one of our beer therapists, which is the legal job title of our employees. Sheena: Hahaha Jessica Zouaoui: our beer therapist will walk you through a curated tasting of what we have on tap. We only feature local breweries. we have five taps that we change out pretty regularly depending on the season. We always have something light, something hoppy, something fruity, something sour, and then in the wintertime, we'll do like something dark, a stout or a porter. so those are all of our beer taps. We have a house beer as well, which spice trade brewery created for us. It's called Spa Sidekick. It's a cucumber lemon ghosa. Tastes like fresh cucumber. Juice like it is so delicious. They actually juice the cucumbers in house and then they put lemon peel in it, Utah rock salt, it's lightly soured. so it really tastes like fresh cucumber juice. It's our play on spa water, except we have spa beer. we always have that one on tap. and then we also have a wine spritzer that we get from Odell Wine Project, so like a guava spritz or a play on April spritz. we have a hard cider and then we also have a red wine and a white wine on tap. So even if you don't drink beer, or don't even drink alcohol at all, and they still come and have a good time. The tap room doesn't smell like Beer either. We created a custom scent specifically for the spa. It's really earthy, it's woodsy, and it's diffused throughout the space. And it's one of the first comments that we get when people walk through the door is like, wow, it smells really good in here. They probably thought it was gonna smell like a stale sports bar, but it doesn't. and then the music is curated as well. So we don't play top charts. in the daytime it could be something more like jazz or bossa nova. And then in the afternoons we'll get into French pop or Thai pop. just really energetic and different music, not the whale sounds that you'll hear at a normal spa. so then you'll hang out in the chap room for about 30 minutes before your private spa suite session. And then at your appointment time, one of our beer therapists will come and get you from the tap room, bring you on a tour of the space so you're comfortable with where all the amenities are, and then introduce you to your private spa suite. So inside this room, you have an infrared sauna, a rain shower, and a hydrotherapy tub that's infused with hops malt in your choice of herbs. depending on your selection, have different therapeutic benefits. So you have this private room for 90 minutes, and it's a choose your own adventure. We suggest starting with the infrared sauna for 20 minutes to sweat, detox, really open up your pores. and then you'll go into the shower for our version of a cold plunge. So you take a quick 20-second cold shower. this contrast bathing basically going from the hot to the cold back to the hot is really good for your circulation. And then you end with the rest of the time in the tub. so that's what we suggest for first timers, but it's your own private room. So especially after you come for multiple visits, a lot of people like to start and end with the sauna. They just sit in the tub for the entire time. we do have bubbles in the tub as well. We have a beer therapy mini bar. So it is like a hotel mini bar except instead of alcohol, there's beer and CBD-infused cosmetic products that you can use while you're in the room and self-apply. a beer hair mask that's really great to put in your hair before sitting into the sauna. we have a CBD bath bomb that you can drop into the tub, just really help further that relaxation. and if you need to refill your drink while you're in your private spa suite, you don't need to leave the comfort of your room. We have room service. So you just ring a little doorbell. One of our beer therapists will come to your room, grab your tumblers, refill your drinks, and bring them back to you. after your 90-minute session, you go into what's called our cool-down area, which is a separate room. The air conditioning is cooler. The music is a little bit lower. It just helps you kind of re-emerge from this private spa suite that you were just in And you get your body temperature back to normal as well, we want you to cool down for about 15 minutes. And then you go into our relaxation lounge, which is where we have our zero gravity massage experience. So these are high-tech robotics-enabled massage chairs that scan your body and adjust itself to your unique. Pressure point. So no two massages are the same. It reclines you back so your spine is parallel to the floor. Your legs are elevated above your heart, which helps with circulation. And then it uses an L-Trac roller that goes all the way down your spine to your glutes, as well as my favorite, which is the air compression. So there's actually air bags that go over your arms, on your feet, on your calves. that can be either 1530 or 60 minutes long. So I think it's the the unofficial nap room after relaxing Sheena: Hahaha. Jessica Zouaoui: in the private spa suite, then you do your massage. And then the tap room is yours afterwards to hang out for as long as you want. So it's not like most other spas where it's more of a waiting room than it is a a communal space. We have guests, especially on the weekends, that will come two hours before their appointment and just have a drink And the other really neat thing is that the tap room is open for anyone, not just those using the spa services. So especially in Highlands Ranch, where as you know, there's not a lot of things to do down there. you can just come and have a drink in the tap room. You can use the massage chairs. but it overall, on average, our guests spend two and a half to three hours if you're doing the full spa experience. Sheena: Amazing. it sounds here like everything planned out is extremely intentional. Like you said, the music even changes the vibe from earlier to afternoon to later. The smells you were talking about, you have Colorado beers on your beer tap. how do you decide which brewery you're featuring? Because you said there's five at a time. Jessica Zouaoui: Yeah, so we have five taps that are our rotating taps, and the other ones are more or less permanent. They stay on for longer. So with the rotating taps, we have a brewery relations manager that oversees our two locations, and he really picks what are the hottest beers right now? What are the most common beers that we're getting requests for from our guests? but because it's such a unique experience, we now have a lot of the breweries that come to us and say, Hey, we'd love to be featured in your tap room. Just because it's such a different environment for guests to experience their beers. we want a variety of different beers on those five taps, as much as I would love five sours. Not everyone likes sours. Sheena: you Jessica Zouaoui: so we always make sure that we have a little something for everyone. And Sheena: forever. Jessica Zouaoui: then ABV is another thing we look at. So because you have the tubs and the hot saunas. we don't do anything over seven percent A D V. So we just don't want, a triple or some, nine percent beer that people don't realize is sneaking up on them. because we do have a lot of tourists as well, especially in our downtown location that are coming from sea level, like Florida or other places, and now they're at altitude. And we just want to make sure they're staying safe our guests drink on average two pints. It's not a place where you're coming to party. the wellness is the primary focus. And then you're just having a pint or two to help with that. it's not a drinking first establishment. Sheena: Okay, And then you were saying that you have more than just beer, you have the wines. Do you have non-alcoholic options for people who might not want to drink alcohol? Jessica Zouaoui: Absolutely. And I'm sure you've heard how that's a big trend right now as people are consuming less alcohol, especially the younger generations. we wanted to make sure that while we are a beer spot, you don't have to even drink alcohol and you definitely don't have to drink beer in order to come enjoy the experience. So we have a list of nine different NA options, everything from cold brew for the morning time, which was actually a recent addition from getting so many requests from our guests. We have kombucha, we have electrolyte infusions, we have CBD infusions, we have juices, so a lot of different options that are non-alcohol and non-beer. Sheena: good, so because of the younger generation not drinking as much, have you found that affecting you, Jessica Zouaoui: We've been talking a lot about this lately, it ebbs and flows, but I think people are drinking more responsibly, certainly. And because we're not a volume consumption environment, we really have not been impacted. Well, certainly, maybe your nightclubs and other type places that really rely on people like slamming several drinks in a row. for us, our business model was built around, sipping on a pint of beer, sipping on a glass of wine. we don't rely on volume So we haven't had any sort of impact. And I really think we're well set up for this new trend of while I don't think alcohol is going anywhere. That's not the primary focus. And people want an activity to do where they might have a drink at that activity. But it's not like, when I was younger, you pre-game and you play flip cup and beer pong, and then you, go to the bar and you drink as I mean, it was just like the focus was the drinking, and that's just Sheena: you Jessica Zouaoui: not, thankfully, not what the focus is anymore. Sheena: Yes. Yes. Jessica Zouaoui: and so you know, for us it's like our experience is the spa and you ha of course can have a drink or not while you're here, but that's not the sole focus. Sheena: Okay, that makes so much sense. I like everything you were saying I was nodding to because yes, that is exactly how we were. We're drinking was a soul focus. So I love that this it's more the wellness and the activity like you're connecting, but you do have that beer to enjoy it with but not get drunk. So Jessica Zouaoui: Yes. Sheena: So going back to what you were also saying about the tubs you have hops and herbs and hydrotherapy. What are the benefits of that? why would somebody want to be in a tub with these ingredients Jessica Zouaoui: People have been bathing in beer ingredients for hundreds and hundreds of years, dating back to Eastern Europe. There was actually kings and queens that used to have these baths for them with hops and malt, because everyone's known of the therapeutic benefits. But over time, I think we've especially in the United States, we've gotten away from that. My husband Damien's from France originally, and his parents used to wash their hair with beer because they knew that it made their hair shinier back in the day. hops is really a natural sedative. The aromatherapy is really relaxing. And so that's what you're getting from the hops component, is more of that like mental relaxation. And then the barley has lots of antioxidants, a lot of vitamins, a lot of nutrients. It's really soothing, especially how dry it is here in Colorado. when you have dry, like cracking skin. it's very similar to taking an oatmeal bath. So it's just really coats your skin and you feel it right after getting out of the bath, how soft your skin is afterwards. and then depending on which infusion that you choose, the herbs have different properties. for example, our muscle relaxing lager blend. has arnica in it. And, most people aren't familiar with arnica nowadays, but it helps with muscle tension, joint pain. People are really active here in Colorado. So if you've been doing yoga hiking snowboarding or skiing, having Arnica infused in that bath is really great. So we always use the hops and barley as a base. And then we add these different ingredients on top of it. a little sneak peek, we haven't officially released this yet, but next month we're launching a wine bath. Which we are really excited about. so Sheena: Wow. Jessica Zouaoui: we have wine, grape skin powder in grape seed powder that we are infusing into the tubs, which there's French brand actually named Codeli, their whole thing is venotherapy. So they have a skincare line that uses grapes and wine. there's a ton of benefits to grapes and using that in skincare and and on your body. and so we're just putting the finishing touches on our wine bath formulation, and we'll be launching that next month. Sheena: Amazing! Congratulations! That is so exciting! Wow! So I do want to go back. You were saying that your husband's parents would actually shower their hair with the hops. So do you see people at your tubs actually submerge their head or topicals that people can put on their body? to get these benefits? Jessica Zouaoui: All of the above. we always encourage people to submerge themselves completely. So get the bath water in your hair, on your face. But we also have our sister company, Oakwell Cosmetics, that we have our own line of beer-infused bath and body products. So we have a beer hair mask, which we actually boil down beer and make it into a concentrate and then infuse it into these different products. you can use this beer hair mask as well just to really get more of those ingredients. in the showers that are in the private spa suites, we have our beer shampoo, our beer conditioner, and our beer body wash. so yes, you get the benefits from the tub, but then we also have these different products that you can self-apply while you're in there to further that even more. Sheena: Awesome, and that's included when you get in, like those topicals are all part of it to apply, or those separate costs. Jessica Zouaoui: ones in the shower, the the beer hair mask, our face mist, they're little travel size products that are on our beer therapy mini bar that you can use while you're in your private spa suite. they're usually two to four uses, so then you take the rest of it with you. And so that is an Sheena: How cool. Jessica Zouaoui: additional charge. You just charge for whatever you consume, just like a hotel mini bar. but we have all of the shower products and then in our vanity we have our beer body lotion, which we use in oatmeal stout. It smells like cookies, it's really, really delicious. it's not greasy, but it leaves your skin super soft. That's one of our top-selling products, and we have that complimentary for you to use in the vanity area. Sheena: Amazing. I love that you were saying when you're in the tub, you feel the benefits immediately on your skin. Do you ever hear people say that, this is a gimmick, this doesn't work, or once they actually try it, they're like, holy cow, I see it. Jessica Zouaoui: I think a lot of people when they're first coming, Sheena: skeptical. Jessica Zouaoui: they're like, this is strange. We'll do it because you know, we can tell our friends we took a beer bath and that's about it. It is funny the number of people that when they're walking in, you can tell they're a little hesitant and they're like, Yeah, whatever, we'll give it a try. But then when they're out, they're like, When can I book again? Can I buy a membership? I mean, it really sells for itself after you try the experience. You can feel the benefits on your skin, immediately after. And the other neat thing in the tub, so how we infuse the hops and mulch is like a giant tea bag basically. So it's like an oversized what you would have like an herbal tea that you drink. and we encourage you to use that to kind of exfoliate your skin and rub it on your body as well. And when you smell it, it smells absolutely delicious with the different herbs, with the aromatherapy from the hops. And then one other thing is that we also have a gluten-free option. So some people that maybe are celiac or have gluten sensitivities and they're not sure how they're going to react with having gluten on all over their skin. We have a version that uses milled millet instead of the barley. so they can still enjoy all of the same benefits, without having to be concerned about having gluten on their skin. Sheena: That's amazing my mother-in-law is celiac and cannot touch gluten. you wonder, is it just if you ingest it or if it's also topical? So I love that you have that precaution that nobody even has to worry about it. You've covered the bases. Jessica Zouaoui: Yes. you always wonder, like if I'm bathing in a vat of gluten, what's going to happen? So better safe than sorry. We'd rather just do Sheena: Absolutely. Jessica Zouaoui: the gluten-free option just so you don't have to be concerned. Sheena: Yes, yes, I love that you have that. So I get the ick easy. thinking this is a beer spy, no, it's not like you're just in beer, but how do you clean out the tubs? in between every person? Like how do you keep this sanitary? Jessica Zouaoui: That is a great question. It was one thing that we were super focused on when we were coming up with our business plan. Because in addition to privacy, the other big thing for Americans is cleanliness and a lot of the spas that you find around the world. And even here, if you go to the places that have, the cold plunges and various things, like you see a hair floating in it and the floor is wet and it's just like, oof, it's gross. so we made a promise that any Our guests enter a private spa suite, it should feel like they are the first ones to ever use it. we completely drain, clean, and refill the tubs after each use. You are not sitting in someone else's beer bath water. same thing, all of the linens are refreshed, the shower is disinfected, wiped down, like the chrome is shined, the shower is not wet, even though we just clean it, we dry everything. we do a thorough cleaning. We leave ample time in between each appointment so we can fully reset the room. and we have different checks as well. So we have our spa keeping team that goes and cleans the room, but they're cleaning room after room after room. So we're not just relying on them. One of our beer therapists before they bring you to the private spa suite does what we call a room check and a tub check. So they actually have a flashlight. That they systematically look I mean, we are very, very meticulous with making sure people don't get the ick cleanliness is one of our top priorities and we've never ever had a bad comment from a guest about the state of our facility. Sheena: That's so great to hear. And especially, I mean, it would say it for itself. Like you have repeated guests all the time. And if anybody did get that ache or did see hair, you know, that if it wasn't clean, they wouldn't be coming back. So I love how thorough you are and how high a priority that is for you guys. So the more that I learn about Oakwell, the more it feels just so much more than beer, your mission is to help humanity feel more relaxed and more connected, what does that mean to you? Jessica Zouaoui: We were finding a business that we wanted something that did better for the world. we're not in it just for the money or for the fame or anything like that. We wanted to have a positive impact on others. And naturally, by opening a spa, we're gonna help people feel more relaxed. But the feeling more connected was something that was really important to us, especially, you know, Damien and I are husband and wife. We have kids, like we have a very busy, chaotic life. and I feel like often couples are missing opportunities to be able to connect because the environments just aren't conducive. If you think of the date nights that most people go to, you go to the movies, okay? You're not really interacting much there. You go to the same restaurants over and over again. You're distracted on your phone, or you're talking about, this table over there, or the server's interrupting you. so we wanted to curate an environment that was very conducive to actually spending time talking and discussing and and being with one another rather than having all of these other distractions around. And so things like the table topic cards that we have in the tap room. And we printed off questions as well in the sauna. And so we see these couples that, have probably been married for a long time and are used to just scrolling on their phones, sitting next to each other, having these very deep conversations that they've told us like this is the most connected I felt to my husband and our 30 years of marriage, or this is our weekly therapies or monthly therapy session, because everything else we can forget about. And we're in this tub, like We have no choice but to talk to each other, right? and of course, if you add a pint of beer or a glass of wine, it like helps the conversation Sheena: Yeah Jessica Zouaoui: flow a little bit more easily. and we've seen that as I said, 90% of our guests come as couples, and especially since launching our membership, we have a lot of couples that this is their monthly date night now. They're no longer going to that same boring restaurant over and over again. and I think the cool thing is is that, finally the guys are willing to come to the spas I mean, half of our employees are men, like, you know, big bearded men that look like they hang out in breweries. And so I think The environment makes both the men and the women feel equally comfortable coming. Sheena: Yeah, it's not intimidating for anybody there, which is so cool. do you actually see people disconnecting from their phones? and really using those cards and talking with each other. Jessica Zouaoui: it's it's the most incredible thing to watch. the majority of our guests, when they're leaving the spa and walk out of the front doors, they give each other a big hug and a kiss. Like you can tell, just like they feel really connected. it's rare that we actually see people on their phones in the tap room. We always point out, like, hey, we have these fun conversation starter cards, and normally they'll pick them up and start asking people questions and then they start laughing and like really getting into the conversation. same in the private spa suits, like you really don't want to bring a phone into an infrared sauna, like it gets really hot, right? I'd say the majority of people are really connecting. It's a rarity that you see people just scrolling on their phone, which is the opposite of what you see in most places. Sheena: It's exactly, and I think people probably actually really look forward to that because it gives them a reason to disconnect because we're always on our phone, at least I am, I'm always on my phone. So to have that basically like permission to let it go, kind of thing, I think people really crave that. So I love that you're giving them the space to do that. So obviously Denver has embraced this idea because now you've expanded. When did you realize it was time to have a second location? Jessica Zouaoui: When we were traveling the world looking for business concepts, we knew we wanted to find something that we could scale across the United States. We knew we wanted to franchise something. and with the first location, we were really underfunded. Like we did a lot of construction ourselves. We got our furniture and different equipment from auctions of businesses that were closing during COVID. we really did everything that we could and were very scrappy at the beginning just to get the first location open. But we knew that we couldn't expect franchisees to do that. So our construction costs on the first one was like half or a third of what the actual construction cost would be. So we knew we would have to go through the process again of having enough funding and hiring a professional general contractor, an architect, an interior designer, like building it out properly. And this was also post-COVID. when we first moved here, We were doing construction during COVID. So we knew that a lot of pricing and supply chain issues had changed we knew we had to go through that exercise again of opening the second location. It took us a while to figure out where we wanted to put it and we wanted to be able to have enough demographic information from our first location about where our guests were actually coming from. So Damien built out this really incredible business intelligence platform that basically gave us a heat map of, okay, here's where our guests are driving from. The first at our rhino location was directly within, you know, two miles from around. But then the second biggest location was down south. So people were already driving from Highlands Ranch, from Parker, Colorado Springs, even to visit us. And so that's why we decided to look south for our second location. we also knew that we wanted to go through the process of training and hiring a team from scratch so we could practice that for our franchisees. Because our franchisees aren't going to have the luxury of having their existing employees from one location that they can just go to the other location. So we did it the hard way, which we could have pulled a bunch of people from our first location down to Heightens Ridge, but we didn't. We hired a completely new team, new set of managers, trained everyone from scratch, and made sure that we could eventually step back from those day-to-day operations because franchisees aren't looking to buy themselves a job where they're going to be working in a spa seven days a week, you know, 12-hour days. So we wanted to make sure that all of our systems were set up where you could truly open it, train people, and then be able to step back from the operations as the owner. we were able to successfully do that with our Highlands Ranch location. we've been open for a little over a year now. and really Damien and I just had to spend the first few months there training and now it's, performing just as well. as our Denver location is, and we've really been able to step back and focus on franchising and not running the the day to day operations at that spa. Sheena: And with the Denver location, it was so popular. You had wait lists of like people trying to get in. Has that eased up since opening the Highlands Ranch location or now are they both wait listed? Jessica Zouaoui: So we were booked and it always sounds like I'm over exaggerating here, but no joke, 100% occupancy, 8 a.m. to 10 30 p.m., seven days a week for the first three and a half years in business. that was getting really frustrating for our guests. We'd have a wait list that was over a hundred people long at any given time. a lot of people were frustrated because they'd have an event, they'd have a birthday or an anniversary that they wanted to celebrate with us, or they had friends coming into town and they just could never find an appointment. So I I don't think that it's healthy to operate at 100% occupancy. Also for our team, it's like if there was a an equipment issue or any sort of preventative maintenance, we'd be coming in at, you know, 1 a.m. So we could do it in the middle of the night and get everything ready for the next day. so when we opened the second location, we had those guests that were driving downtown that now moved naturally to our Highlands Ranch location. So it reduced the occupancy to a healthy level at our Denver location. and then it took really about six months for Highlands Ranch to wrap up and match where Denver is performing. So they're really now neck and neck in terms of occupancy and revenue. and both operating at a very healthy level where, we are fully booked still every weekend. So Saturday and Sunday's like book out quite far in advance. same with after business hours like Monday to Friday are still pretty busy, but you know, you're not having to wait two months for an appointment, Sheena: Impressive. That's so impressive. So now, like, because you're talking about franchising and the Highlands Ranch location is also getting pretty busy too. Do you have plans to open a third location for on your own or immediately start franchising? Jessica Zouaoui: we're gonna immediately start franchising. we've spent the last year and a half putting everything together to get ready to franchise. So there's a lot of legal work, like creating our franchise agreement, franchise disclosure document, but then creating our operations manual. So we had a lot of SOPs and training documents already, but compiling that into one master document, like end-to-end, this is how you run the spa. we want to focus on states that are kind of surrounding Colorado first. We're reserving Colorado expansion for our corporate expansion later on. We have no immediate plans. it's also important that we prove this out in a different state as well. Like people in Colorado know who we are. And so in order to prove that this is scalable nationwide, we need to go into a market where no one really knows who Oakwell is. we're targeting Las Vegas, we're targeting Texas, so Austin, Houston, Dallas, San Antonio, Kansas City, and then Scottsdale, Arizona. Sheena: That is incredible. thinking that this was your goal from the beginning when you are abroad and that you wanted to create something scalable. And now look at you. already ready to expand to these other states and take off the sky's the limit. This is amazing. Jessica Zouaoui: It's been an adventure for sure. Sheena: my gosh. for someone listening who's sitting in a career that doesn't excite them anymore, but they're scared to take the leap, what would you tell them? Jessica Zouaoui: What's the worst that can happen? Right? It's like Sheena: Yeah Jessica Zouaoui: you can always find another job at the end of the day. do it, you know, take the risk. just make sure you always have something to come back to. Don't burn any bridges. I think it's the biggest thing if you're gonna leave a career. Just make sure that you give them plenty of notice and that you do it nicely, that you don't go out yelling and screaming. but at the end of the day, you can always go back to what you're doing right now, but there may not be a second chance to be able to take this leap. Sheena: Yes, absolutely. Look at where you are now and if you didn't take the leap, you wouldn't be here. We wouldn't be chatting right now. So amazing. Okay, so we are gonna go into a little fun section, rapid fire, quick questions, first thing that comes to mind. You ready? All Jessica Zouaoui: Ready. Sheena: right, let's go. Favorite country that you've visited. Jessica Zouaoui: Japan. Hands down. Sheena: Ooh, Most underrated travel destination. Jessica Zouaoui: Vietnam. We went from the south of Vietnam all the way to the north. We spent a month backpacking through Vietnam. I feel like everyone goes to Thailand, but they miss Vietnam. The people there are so friendly. The beaches are beautiful. The food is delicious. so I feel like more people should go Sheena: Love it. This one might be tough. Favorite Colorado brewery, or it might not be tough at all, actually. Jessica Zouaoui: I'm a huge sour fan, so I love Cricut Stave. Their sour rose is my go-to summer beverage. Sheena: Beer or mocktail? Jessica Zouaoui: beer. I'm still a beer drinker. Sheena: Beer. Yeah, easy. Sauna or cold plunge? Jessica Zouaoui: sauna. I can't do a cold plunge. I'm such a wimp. I'm like, if it's sixty degrees, it's fine. Anything less than that, I can't do. Sheena: It's so hard. I can't even do the cold showers. like once my heart starts to go beat really fast, I'm like, get me out of this. Right. Jessica Zouaoui: Yeah, I'm like, I think I'm gonna pass out. Like this is not good. Sheena: Mountains or beach? Jessica Zouaoui: beach. We talk about this all the time. I know we live in Colorado, but I'm still such a Florida beach girl. Honestly, it's like beach, desert, and then mountains are probably number third for me. I like looking Sheena: you Jessica Zouaoui: at the mountains from afar, but I don't know, they're kind of scary. I know, but cactus. Sheena: desert comes before mountains to you? Jessica Zouaoui: Cactus I mean, they're so beautiful. Sheena: They are, Morning or evening workout. Jessica Zouaoui: I wish I morning I would like morning, but realistically it doesn't happen till the evening. But it in my mind I would love to be a morning workout person. Sheena: Yeah, I feel like I do too. And then I stall and then by the time I'm ready to work out, I have an excuse and I'm like, let's bring the wine. Yeah, Jessica Zouaoui: Exactly. Sheena: favorite recovery tool. Jessica Zouaoui: Yoga. Sheena: Yes, that's a good way to wind down, especially being so busy. yeah, Jessica Zouaoui: Yes. Sheena: One wellness habit you never skip. Jessica Zouaoui: My morning lemon water. Damien and I are very religious about that. We squeeze our lemons in the morning. So funny, our daughter, we have a two year old daughter that's just learning to speak. And so every morning she said, lemon, lemon. Like she's very excited for us to have our lemon water because she wants a sip of it too. So that's yeah, we never skip our our morning lemon water. Sheena: Great, and I love that you're getting her into the habit of it nice and early. And complete this sentence. First one, travel taught me. Jessica Zouaoui: Travel taught me To never forget to eat. There's been so many times that I was like super crappy and like angry at Damien because I missed the opportunity to get food. And then we're like now on this three hour bus ride and I'm hangry and like I'm getting very grumpy. So it's like if you're hungry, eat. That's what travel taught me. Sheena: Yeah, that's a very good tip, Last one, owning Oakwell taught me. Jessica Zouaoui: Resilience a hundred percent. It's like never give up, which is very cliche, but there were plenty of times when we were in the middle of construction we were broke when we were building the first location. I was selling my blood plasma, we were maxing out any credit card we could get approved for. I mean, there was times were very tough at the beginning, and so you know, resilience to a level that I had never had to learn before. Sheena: Wow, you believed in this theory so much that you're like, are willing to literally sell our plasma to keep this going. Wow, Jessica Zouaoui: Yes. Yes. Sheena: And then last question I ask everybody, what made you sweat this week? Jessica Zouaoui: We are very close to signing our first few franchisees. And so it's always really, you know, nerve-wracking. Just like waiting to get to that next step, getting their feedback. the first few are the most critical. We've been super selective. We've had a lot of interest and we want to make sure that we're bringing on the right people that can be good stewards of the brand, that we I mean, it's like a marriage, right? It's like a 10-year contract that you're signing with these people. so we've been very, very selective, but there's a few that we're really excited about and we think that they would be great. And so we're at the finish line with a couple of them. and so it's like every day just, you know, hoping we get to that next step. Sheena: Oh my gosh, you're like, just let us sign everything. Let this be official final. Like, let's make it happen. Wow. Jessica Zouaoui: Exactly. Sheena: Oh my gosh. That is fantastic. so exciting. Congratulations on that. I know this is a huge step. So for anybody who is interested, How can they find Oakwell or just kind of follow along and stay up to date? Jessica Zouaoui: Our website is Oakwell.com on social media. We are on Facebook, Instagram, TikTok. It's Oakwell Beer Spa. If you would like to learn about franchise opportunities, it's Oakwellfranchise.com. And then our sister company that does beer-infused bath and body products, that's Oakwell Cosmetics. So Oakwellcosmetics.com. Sheena: Awesome. Well, this was great. I love learning how just one bold decision led to creating such a unique space for recovery and connection right here in Colorado. So thank you so much for bringing this here I cannot wait to visit soon. Jessica Zouaoui: Yes, we can't waste to host you. Sheena: Amazing. Thank you so much. Jessica Zouaoui: Yes, this was great. Sheena: Thank you so much to Jessica and to you for listening. I loved learning how one bold decision led to a space that's redefining relaxation and connection right here in Colorado. And since recording with Jessica, I got to experience Oakwall myself. My husband and I went in for a date night, and it was incredible to just talk and reconnect without distractions. it lived up to every bit of the hype. You can find them at Oakwell.com or Oakwell Beer Spot on social media. if this episode made you want to disconnect and reconnect with someone you love, send it to them. And head on over to sweatcommunity dot com and subscribe to stay in the know. Until next time.