Latest / Stronger Business Together / E38 Managing Global Clients with Paul Newton

Transcript

E38 Managing Global Clients with Paul Newton · Stronger Business Together

• Granger Forson: So this is the Stronger Business Together podcast where business owners learn from other business owners. No theory, no gurus, just real journeys and overcoming real hurdles. today, I'm joined by Paul Newton, who runs Jet. Like any owner, he's in that middle of building things, fixing things and growing something that really matters to him. So Paul, welcome. Paul Newton: Hi, great to meet you. Granger Forson: Awesome! Well, let's get on now. Act 1. In plain English, what does your business do? Paul Newton: We are an offline marketing agency. So effectively we manage campaigns for clients that are in home. So whether that's a direct mail campaign, a door drop campaign, effectively anything going to an individual in a home that's our speciality. Granger Forson: So physical print stuff going through envelopes things like that yeah well Paul Newton: Yeah, v very very much the old fashioned but hopefully Granger Forson: Yeah, Paul Newton: making it modern. Granger Forson: yes, no, fantastic. And interesting, I used to work in the printing industry and we used to Paul Newton: Okay. Granger Forson: do mail shot campaigns and all things like that. So I have some knowledge of what you're talking about. Paul Newton: Amazing. Granger Forson: So who do you love helping then and what are they typically dealing with? Paul Newton: Yeah, so our our clients are traditionally it's kind of a phrase we've coined as attainable luxury. So it doesn't necessarily mean Rolexes and Bentleys, but it's just anything aspirational, any industry that people would love to be involved with. So travel works fantastically well, fashion, food, but sort of say premium food. anything in that world where it's a fast growing team, traditionally that have just had investment and are looking to try and get to the next phase. And that's where the offline comes in to tap into the acquisition or retain the client as well as possible. Granger Forson: Well, yes, customers with money, hopefully. Paul Newton: Yeah. Yeah, yeah, very true. That was much easier to say it in that way, yeah. Granger Forson: Both sorts, what they're looking for and who you can help. So fantastic. Paul Newton: Absolutely. Granger Forson: I fully appreciate and understand that. So how did the business start? What was that original spark then? Paul Newton: So I worked in print marketing, to an extent digital marketing for best part sort of twenty years. started when I was sixteen. and effectively just over the years built up a lot of expertise in Dormel campaigns. when I got to a certain element with my previous company, I really realised my passion is campaigns and performance. i.e. really creating a campaign from start to finish and approaching businesses with something that can really change their company, something that can really spark growth. So we started jet off the back of that really. rather than just sort of facilitating and sort of order taking, we decided we wanted to proactively go out to businesses and implement things that were going to make change. Granger Forson: Wow, that's really exciting. So what does the business look like today in terms of shape and size? Paul Newton: It's still a young business, truthfully. this is our third year as a company. Obviously very experienced in the industry, but the business is young. we only have a team of six at the moment, including some part-time. we're very fortunate that we've got great partners and a fantastic network to to lean on from our years of experience really. So we've got a head office in Worcester, most of our clients are London based or US based. So there's a hell of a of travelling involved. but that's the that's the basic structure of it as it stands. Granger Forson: Awesome, Yeah, so three years old and growing rapidly from that sounds as 16. Fantastic. Yeah, you've got a really interesting Paul Newton: Yeah, that's the plan. Granger Forson: business model there. So we hope to explore that. why do Paul Newton: Yeah. Granger Forson: your customers pick you then? How do you delight them? Paul Newton: If I was going to pinpoint one thing, I I would I would say the fact that it's performance led. we don't approach clients and say, You're already doing this, can we just do it a bit better? We will approach businesses that aren't doing it at all and we will tell them why they should. our proposals will include the exact figures we would expect them to achieve, the process and how that looks, what the results actually look like, so when you get them, the impact that's gonna have long term for you. We find out what your important element is to what you want to achieve. So do you want to acquire new customers? Is it a high sort of revenue ROI that you're looking to achieve? Is CPA the most important thing? What is it that you need? What is it your team needs within your business? And we make sure that the campaign we put together applies to that perfectly effectively. So it's not a case of saying you should do DM. It's a case of doing this is the approach you should take and this is what's going to give you the success. And here's why. Granger Forson: Excellent. So DM being direct marketing. Absolutely. No, Paul Newton: Yeah, apologies, yeah. Granger Forson: no, that's fine. No. You use the word performance, which is interesting because I've met so many marketing people that run away from numbers. What do you mean by performance then? Paul Newton: It i yeah, it kind of what you've hinted to there really. It's it's we will tell the client what they're going to invest and we will tell the client what they're going to get back from it and whichever metric that client needs. which truthfully I think is the distinguishable feature of of JET. we've got a a a long body of work. We have a lot of results that we rely on to be able to say if you're in a certain industry, if you invest X and you send to this certain quantity. Here's what you're gonna get. And we tell you your worst case, we tell you your best case, we tell you everything in between. And ultimately, stance tends to be if you're comfortable with the worst case, and that is actually success for yourselves, that's a great place to start. And then we sort of look to grow together and improve as and when. But there isn't a metric we can't deliver when it comes to direct mail, which I know is very different to how Direct Mail used to be. But the advancements Granger Forson: Yeah. Paul Newton: in technology and data nowadays means there's no reason your direct mail campaign shouldn't be as sort of answerable as your digital campaign. Granger Forson: And you talked about designing the campaign. Are you creating the creatives as well? Are you doing the ad copy? Are you creating layouts? Are you doing the printing? What's the part that you do within that campaign structure then? Paul Newton: Yeah, it it varies depending on the client and the partner with that working with. we effectively can do all of it. That's that's the that's the easy answer. what actually realistically happens is we know the frame, we know the skeleton structure that needs to happen to make a campaign successful. And we will let the customer lean on us however they need us to. We kind of like to see ourselves as almost like a plug in extension of their brand rather than a separate agency sort of trying to do DM. So if our client has a fantastic creative team, which we're very lucky, the vast majority of our clients do, we'll use their skill set in their creative and we will just advise tweaks that need to be made to optimise performance. So structures, there's certain very boring structures truthfully, which is the postal area needs to go here to make sure that it actually lands. There's that kind of stuff. But then there's the more exciting stuff, i.e. if this offer goes here, we're probably gonna see a ten percent uplift in performance. Or if you if you see what I mean, it's So from a creative perspective, lean on us how you want to. We have clients where we do the whole thing. And yep, truthfully, we we absolutely love that. Sort of the the suppressed creative person and me loves getting projects like that. But we do have projects where actually the customer has all of the assets. They're fantastic at what they do. It's just a case of we need to tell them what order to do them in. Granger Forson: Okay, fantastic. Yeah, no, I can fully appreciate that. And as I said, I have a bit of a background in DM Paul Newton: Yeah. Yeah. Granger Forson: and direct printing, know, other types of stuff, but we did do some DM work, etc. from that. So leads, you're about helping your clients generate more leads, okay, leads turn into sales. How do you go about generating leads? Paul Newton: It's a tough one and you can probably tell by the side. It's we we we we're very fortunate we get a lot of leads. the vast majority of referrals, truthfully, and leaning on a network that as I say, we've done this for a very long time now. Success breeds success. So if we have a successful campaign with a certain business, it it it does somehow navigate and sort of get to another business that then gets in touch with you and can you reciprocate that and and and so on and so on and so on. So referrals is probably the main bulk of how we generate leads. direct sales, we do do direct sales, we do actively approach businesses that we think are perfectly suited for what we offer. We're not a sales business as such, but it is a portion you you have to do, as as you'll know better than me. You have to grow as a company or you stagnate effectively. Granger Forson: Yeah. Yeah. Paul Newton: But in terms of lead generation over and above that, we do we do awareness pieces, we do some brand pieces, we enter awards. although if I'm honest, we enter those more because we enjoy the process as opposed to necessarily Because of what it's going to get from us. that's probably a bit of ego in there, but that's that's the truth of it. in terms of just employing a lead agency, it is something we've struggled with to date. we work some really nice people, we've worked with some people who are very good at what they do, but we truthfully have found that difficult to employ a lead agency to create fresh leads from us that aren't as a result of a referral. So that's that's very much a work in progress as it stands. Granger Forson: Interesting, yes we could have debate about that for a very long time no doubt. And Paul Newton: Yeah. Yeah. Granger Forson: interestingly our lead generation for this podcast is a written letter that we send out to people like yourself. Paul Newton: Yeah, which really stood out to me. Yeah. Granger Forson: Because that's one of the best ways of interacting with people so I totally agree that DM works. Excellent. Paul Newton: Hundred percent. Yeah. Granger Forson: So what are you aiming for in the business for the next 12 months and why? Paul Newton: So our our key objective, and it's myself and my business partner who who set up the business in the first place. We've always tried, and it might sound a little bit corny, but we've always tried for our objective to be we want to be the best solution at what we do in the country. now I know that isn't probably very sexy or exciting and most people want this turnover, this this staff level, this investment. Our goal is conclusively we want to be the best. it's subjective, but what it does is it pushes us to always evolve, to always want to improve because ultimately that that sort of mountain we're trying to climb, it it isn't actually fully climbable, which just pushes us to improve. It's kind of the you know the the the rod that that keeps us pushing, I suppose. but in Granger Forson: Fantastic. Paul Newton: terms of in terms of assets and to what we look really we want to just to improve and grow across the next twelve months, what we can offer people. we we need a better bigger team and we've got a great team, but it's a very small, compact team. We need more experts in what we do. so a larger team and more facilities that we can offer our clients effectively. Granger Forson: Brilliant, no I love that. mean, interestingly, know, my co-founder and I, created stronger business together and our actual, our why, our statement is to be the best lean two-person business in the world to add value to all of our customers so they're happy to pay us. And that's Paul Newton: Yeah. Granger Forson: all about, as you say, being the best at what you do rather than necessarily that growth is... what you chase, if you chase really excellence, actually growth is a by-product of exactly that. So yeah, fantastic. Totally agree. Paul Newton: A hundred percent. Huh a hundred percent. It i i it it it tunes up your motivation, doesn't it? If you if you're trying to do it for Granger Forson: Yeah. Paul Newton: the right reasons, that will resonate and as long as you are good at what you do, which you guys clearly are, it it will come true if you know effectively. So yeah, it we're we're aligned on that, definitely. Granger Forson: Brilliant. Well, let's move on now to act two, your journey. building a business, there are highs, there are lows, there are tough times, et cetera. What have you discovered about yourself when times are hard? Paul Newton: I think the main I suppose self discoveries if if we're looking at that is some good. I work really hard. W we we myself, my business partner, we will do absolutely anything it takes to to make it work, regardless of what the situation is. And that's something that you can only really know when you have probably started a business truthfully. It's the pressure of the book falls on you, doesn't it, the end of the day. So the ability to know that, yeah, that was incredibly tough and we made it through. That's a really nice thing. in terms of things that we've learned about myself, I suppose in not such a positive light, but it's probably important to be honest about, is I always thought I'd be a fantastic manager or team leader, or I always thought if I could set up a business on my own, I think I'd set up a company that would be, you know, a dream for somebody to join. And I do think there are aspects of that that are true. But what I realised was I was setting up a company that I would want to work in. Not that everybody would want to work in. and that naivety probably has made certain things harder than it should have been, let's put it that way. So yeah, I've definitely learned take a step back. Don't do necessarily just what you think. Make sure that what you're implementing, especially when it's for other people, is for other people, not just based on your own opinion. But that was a definite learning that's that that's come as a result of the journey that Jets taken us on today. Granger Forson: Awesome. you know, sticking with people, stronger business together, we believe in growing your people so they grow your business rather than being stuck in the middle of it all. What have you learned Paul Newton: Yeah. Yeah. Granger Forson: about growing people over the last three years? Paul Newton: I I think one of the things kind of probably harps back to the point that I just made, which is don't assume you know what people will want. I don't mean with clients and campaigns, but I mean with a team, you know, it's some people really want progression, some people really want ambition, and you know, want to be s seen to say that and feel that. Some people don't, and there's absolutely nothing wrong with that. I kind of naively would have in the past thought, I I I'm gonna put in place the this role for this person who wants to be the best who wants to but it's not right. Basically make what I've learned about growing a team is genuinely find out what that person wants, genuinely find out what's gonna give them fulfillment in their role, which is what you need, because if you feel like you're just doing a job to do a job, why would you push yourself? Why would you make sure that you go the extra mile? so I think Yeah, the the biggest learning about building a team is it's exactly that. And we're still evolving and we're still learning and we're still a small team. But yeah, I think take a step back, ask the questions, listen and absorb. That's a that's a big, big part of what we've learned about growing a team. Granger Forson: Brilliant, I love that answer, that was absolutely fantastic. Yeah, I totally agree Paul Newton: great. Granger Forson: with that when you start to take on people and grow and develop, it's so important to have that listening attitude as well. Paul Newton: Yeah. Granger Forson: Your products, your product evolves and changes over the time. What did you maybe used to sell and that you don't sell now or what's changed in your product portfolio over time? Paul Newton: I think the products probably haven't changed hugely. in terms of direct mail is direct mail, you know, door drop's a door drop, programmatic mail is it. So the the headline of what you would say in terms of a product, that probably hasn't evolved massively. However, the depth of learning and the the reason for doing it, that has changed massively. So for example, with direct mail. It probably would have been that we would have just said, it works for everybody and and we will help any business. And then over time you begin to learn that actually it doesn't it it it for some businesses actually it isn't suitable. Their business model doesn't suit something that is a high investment product, truthfully, compared to certain digital methods, should we say. So I think we've we've definitely changed that we will only ever approach businesses that we know it or we're certainly extremely confident that it will work for. so the products probably haven't changed but who we work with has there has been evolved you know evolution within the product. I mean data, what you can do with data now is absolutely incredible. mind blowing and not something I ever thought would be in existence when the business started even which wasn't that long ago. But but yeah, the actual core product is probably the same. Granger Forson: Excellent. No, it's interesting. Yeah, I think you we learn over the first few years of a business of who we actually like to work with. And usually they're the people that Paul Newton: Yeah. Granger Forson: we can add the most value to and help that grow and that business achieve what their problems and overcoming their problems are. So yeah, I think it's absolutely Paul Newton: Hundred percent. Granger Forson: right. It's that that's often evolves rather than a specific change in the offer. We talked about lead gen. If you were to lose all your leads tomorrow, what would you do in the next 30 days to rebuild? Paul Newton: the first thing I would do realistically, that's you know, so for example we lost all the phones and we've got a r sort of start from scratch. I'd use the learnings that we've learned to date, which is we've got a really, really good understanding of what our niche is. We we we can pretty much tell you from a quick glance at a website, is that person or is that business going to be perfectly suited for direct mail? So I'd use those learnings. probably realistically use LinkedIn, use Google, use Chat GPT to get a list of who those people are and I'll get contacting them as quickly as possible. It's probably a very boring answer because it's it's old fashioned sales, but it works. So as long as you're talking to the right people and you're talking about the right product, there's nothing wrong with that. Granger Forson: Yeah, no, totally agree. Maybe old fashioned, but it really does work. I don't think it's old fashioned. It's just the way that things sell. And that's what we have to do. People buy from people. People buy from communication and contact. They don't buy specifically. When they're spending a lot of money on a campaign, they're not going to buy it randomly over the web. They need to know that, build and trust and understand. And that comes from that human connection that takes place. Absolutely. Paul Newton: Without doubt, that expertise. Granger Forson: Yeah, absolutely. Yes, yeah, we use the phrase know, like and trust. You know, get to know you, get to like Paul Newton: Yeah. Granger Forson: you and then trust you. You know, that's what the sales activity is about. definitely. Paul Newton: I might steal that phrase. Granger Forson: simplification. One of the things that Stronger Business Together, one of our four key principles, is simplifying everything you do. So what's something maybe you've removed from the business that's brought energy back into it? Paul Newton: This the point about the simplification I one hundred percent agree with. I am somebody who boils everything down to the core of what it is. So then I could fully understand it and then look to improve it. I I'm a big believer at, you know, if you can't explain something properly, you don't understand it well enough. And if it's my business, that's my responsibility. So that basic principle couldn't agree more. is there something we simplified? You know what, I think I know it's probably quite a boring answer because it's very similar to the one that I just gave, but I think the main change was don't just try to sell to everybody. Don't just approach everybody. Make sure that we only ever approach people that we really, really, really can help. and that, as I say, it sort of leans back to the previous answer, but but that was a huge change. It didn't feel that big at the time. It actually felt more like because it was time saving. It felt like we are limited in how much I can do or how much the team can do. So let's just make sure that we go right back down to basics and just go after the ones that we're really confident of a conversion on. but that was a huge, huge change and yeah, it did give us a real impetus and and it made the activity exciting because at the end of the day, if it's your business and you're approaching who you want to approach and you think it's going to work, there's not really a lot more exciting than that, is there? If you if you started a business, you enjoy business, don't you? so yeah, Granger Forson: Yeah. Yeah. Paul Newton: that that made a big, big difference, especially from an energy level perspective. Granger Forson: Fantastic. No, I love that. And that's so true that, you know, realising when you find those people that you really love working with, that actually brings massive amount of energy all the time. And Paul Newton: Yeah. Granger Forson: those are the people often that then get the most from you as well. And that's that dual interaction Paul Newton: Completely. Granger Forson: that takes place. AI. Paul Newton: Completely. Yeah. Granger Forson: Everybody's talking about AI, using AI or not. Where's AI genuinely saved you time and where is it probably just a complete distraction and consumed time rather than saved it? Paul Newton: So we are probably one of the few businesses in the country that aren't absolutely AI obsessed just because the nature of what we do obviously is a physical product. It's the tangible nature of something turning up at the home. AI, you know, it it doesn't do the creative. It does some of the creative, it can help people, but it doesn't do the whole creative. AI doesn't send it, AI doesn't put it in the home, and obviously AI doesn't read it. So we're probably one of the few businesses that aren't absolutely smothered in all things AI. But that's not to say it's not been really important to our company and it will help us moving forward. So it's more structures really. It's more the internal processes, proof checking, double checking certain elements. We can use it within accounts. It's more just a case of, I guess, elements that we were reliant on an individual to do. We can now get the support of AI, which just ensures mistakes that are inevitable. You can't avoid mistakes. It just ensures we've got an extra sort of safety net to make sure that those mistakes never affect anyone else negatively, if I suppose really. So so it's yeah, it's it it it's not a huge change for what we do as a company, but it has hugely helped us to ensure that we're as professional as we can possibly be. Granger Forson: I love that. I totally agree with that. think there's, too much sort of running down the AI bandwagon, syncing, this is going to replace everything. The actual reality of it is if you really understand how to delight and add value to your customer, you look for those improvements and you see where AI can add to the improvement of making better value for your customer, not that replacing of everybody and replacing systems. So yeah, fantastic. I totally agree with your answer there. And we're very similar. We use AI to help improve, to make things a bit faster, to speed things up, to improve quality to... do checking, my typing skills is atrocious, so I use AI to help rewrite Paul Newton: Mine's it. Granger Forson: and improve that. But it's all about adding that quality level rather than actually replacing. There's no automations in any of our processes which are automated by AI because it's the human touch that people really understand and buy from us. So yeah, brilliant. So Paul Newton: Completely. Completely. Granger Forson: let's move on to Act 3 now, our hurdle Paul Newton: Mm-hmm. Granger Forson: or challenge round. So what have you brought for us to discuss day. What's your hurdle? Paul Newton: Th there are several as a business owner as as you will be aware of. the one that would probably be of interest to certain people listening is we have ended up creating a great client base in the US. not just in the US, sort of globally in other areas, but the US particularly, because there is a real sort of it resonates between a US audience and a and a UK audience. that's fantastic. Opportunities are brilliant, the results are fantastic, which is just as important. But as you can imagine, it does create its problems in terms of we're a small business in Worcester working on UK time, but we all of a sudden now have to facilitate US time, which is completely the other side. so that that's a hurdle. That's a that's a challenge that we're overcoming. It's a challenge we're grateful to have, but it is certainly a challenge. Granger Forson: Fantastic. Yes. How do we deal with different time zones and clients that are in different time zones for that? do you just sort of elaborate about do you then get the the print and mail distribution done within the US you don't ship it from the UK? What's that? Paul Newton: Well, it's actually quite interesting. Well it's interesting for me, but I am a print nerd. So so so th th th Granger Forson: Hahaha. Paul Newton: the the answer to that is a mixture. There isn't one answer. depends Granger Forson: Okay. Okay. Paul Newton: on the campaign size, depends on everything. But effectively what we see as high quality print and what we would expect as a standard in the UK, it is different in the US. there is a different expectancy of the base level, but the Granger Forson: Yeah. Paul Newton: cost in the US is a lot more expensive. Just because the machines and the way everything is set up, it isn't It isn't like for like effectively, nor should it be. It's you know, horses for courses, as we would say. so there are instances where producing in the UK is absolutely the right thing to do, send to the US and make sure it taps into the efficiencies over there. there are instances where producing it in the US is the right thing to do. It i it it depends on the client, the the size, the approach, even the seasonality comes into play with that. But Granger Forson: Right. Paul Newton: yeah, mixture of both. Granger Forson: Okay, so let's start with our current condition, where we are today. So what are the types of problems that you are experiencing today with the interaction? Let's just pick US clients rather than distributors as well. So what are you feeling today? Paul Newton: suppose the the main issue it really is time it is time difference not just time difference but also time in the day for a for a business owner with a with four kids and a wife and the real life pressures that obviously have to coincide with your company. Granger Forson: Yeah. Paul Newton: that's that's the biggest pressure it's you have to be we pride ourselves on being there for our clients no matter what. So from the point of Granger Forson: Okay. Paul Newton: us approaching you to tell you what you can achieve, you putting your faith in us to prove that to you We won't stop working with you until that's achieved. and then obviously once you've got the results, that's your prerogative as to what you want to do with that. Hopefully it's continued to work with us for a for a lot longer. But we will not change that or compromise that because we're working with a US client. The process, the understanding, the the purpose has to be exactly the same. So time because of that, because if a client wants to talk, if they've got something they need to discuss, if it's a new concept or even if it's just a little bit of handholding to get to a place where they feel confident in what's being achieved, we need to be there for them during that. And with us currently being UK based, it is difficult 'cause it's a lot of nine PM calls or later or earlier Granger Forson: Yeah. Paul Newton: at some time. So if we've got a client in New Zealand where it was a six AM call. Again, not a problem, happy to do it, but it's real life. It is it's a lot of time. Granger Forson: Yeah, which is fine under the current condition because current condition is you do that as you said you and your business partner will do anything to make the business successful Paul Newton: Yeah. Granger Forson: because that's what we do as founders as entrepreneurs but actually as the business scales we're going to have problems now because if we are UK based as you say we've got UK people with UK hours that won't be able to do that same type of interaction activity with people. Okay, yeah. Paul Newton: Completely. Completely. So but well having said that, we are incredibly fortunate. The people that are with our company are very committed. almost to the point where I will quite often tell them to not worry about doing something after hours or before hours kind of thing. But yeah, th th the attitude Granger Forson: Yeah. Yeah. Paul Newton: is exactly where I would want it to be, but we need to implement structures and systems to ensure that it never is detrimental to the client, but it's also never detrimental to anyone in our team. We can't have it where, you know, they miss getting home to see their child in the evening because they were working too late. I don't want that pressure to be what we've done. That doesn't need to happen. We need to make sure the structure's in place to ensure that it's all done in the right way. Granger Forson: yeah, so what are you thinking about then how to get over that at this moment in time? What are your current sort of aspirations of trying to fix some of those things? Paul Newton: Yeah, of course. What we're doing and what we've done is implemented really strong partnerships over there, in Granger Forson: Okay. Paul Newton: every aspect. So whether that's the print, the postage, the fulfillment, the any element of it whatsoever, we are well, we already have created partnerships that hopefully will be longstanding. the standards are completely understood and met. We've run all the trials, we've been there, we've looked into it, we we we we know what the press looks like, we know what the person looks like, we've shaken hands, we've y we all that trust is there as much as it possibly can be within business. and we need to ensure that it's as robust as the UK system effectively. And I'm I'm pleased to say it definitely appears that way and it's just continuing to grow. Granger Forson: So that's the first out of setting, finding people that you can trust in those time zones to be able to do the jobs that need to get done through the partnership you're building. But if we also think about the interaction with the client, we have two types of interaction with the client, don't we? We have a sort of that initial setup where we are working with the client on the campaign. going backwards and forwards with design ideas and opportunities, building the structures of it, the technology, the first off prints, et cetera. those are things that, initially that we need to build, but as we build that confidence over time, we don't need as many of those. But then we move into the ongoing project phase and often clients want update meetings and information of where things are. So one of the things that, so I used to manage an international team when I was in the print and mailing house I was working in. And so one of the things that we introduced was an asymmetric update, but a video update. Because one of the key things that I've read about and felt was why do people want to have a conversation? Because they want to see us. They want to see how we're feeling through what we're seeing in our face. An email is very cold, it doesn't actually do it and it doesn't actually understand that. So we had various updates we had to do with various clients around the world. So those project updates were done through a video. So the project manager did a video status update to them. And we saw a massive drop off of the client needing update calls and information calls because at key stages, once a week, once a fortnight, wherever it was agreed, we'd send them a video conference. But it wasn't a conference, a video of the project manager talking through the project status, showing where we were, what was going on, et cetera. So sometimes finding what they call asymmetric type updates is a powerful way and if you can find a way that your client can send a video call back to you you can then pick that up in the next hours you know when it's UK time rather than their time you can pick up on where we are. Now there are always crisis situations absolutely that's what we then need Paul Newton: Okay. Granger Forson: to do but hopefully we can avoid crisis situations by having a type of project update system which allows for flexibility but gives the level of information that everybody wants and needs. What's your thoughts on that? Paul Newton: It's really interesting. It's not something I've never thought of. And actually, as you were saying, Git, and I was playing through that in my mind, particularly with clients or partners that are based in other regions. I actually think that would solve an awful lot of problems. as you will know by the sounds of it better than myself, it internationally working is different, isn't it? Every every nation has a different expectancy of what is the norm. US as an example. They expect a lot of meetings. I tend to find, you know, high level marketers in the UK. It's always nice, it's always enjoyable, but it's quite concise. You do tend to get to the point and you have a meeting when you need a meeting. You don't necessarily have a meeting for the sake of a meeting, which is absolutely how I like to work. However, US partners do tend to, exactly as you just mentioned, have that kind of maybe it's a visual affirmation, I suppose really, of of of where you are and how you feel. That's alien to to to us to date and we're getting better at it. But what you've just mentioned there could be a really good sort of halfway house. and it's not something I've considered, but it's definitely something I'm gonna discuss and see if we can implement that. Yeah, really interesting. Granger Forson: Yeah, and it just allows that. asymmetric as in I can do it at 8 o'clock tonight they pick it up their time they watch it and they give a video conference video back and we can understand each other so much quicker you know what one of the things I do with my clients is I highly recommend banning internal emails yeah Paul Newton: Yeah, okay. Granger Forson: we never communicate by email yeah we communicate by voice or we commute by video it's absolutely important to do that because we understand If it's tasks, we put tasks on people's task managers, we don't use emails. But actually, thinking about that is also, a client is almost part of the team for that period of time they're working with us. So if we can find that way of working with them that allows them to have that, I'm part of a team, I know my status and updates, but I'm doing it in a visual way, we get a better understanding and activity from that. So yeah, some really interesting ways of doing things. Paul Newton: No, I d I like that a lot. Granger Forson: So what would you do next then to try and see? Paul Newton: in terms of potentially implementing that, y it would be exactly that. It would be on the next conversation. Ask if they believe that would be helpful. 'cause obviously you want to make sure that it's collaborative rather than me saying I'm now going to do this. But yeah, ask if they're comfortable with it and trial it. But it does seem extremely logical. I do think, as I say, it's not just the US. We have worked all around the world over over the years in in various different ways. And and there are little nuances and differences. So I can definitely Granger Forson: Yeah. Paul Newton: see certain clients where that would work incredibly well. Granger Forson: And most of the time within a project, we just want an update. Where are we? What's going on? Paul Newton: Okay. Granger Forson: And we end up creating meetings for meeting sake, because that's what we want. Actually, this is a way that they can now even watch it whenever they need to, rather than, we've got to have a meeting within my time. I can now even see the project status and update of where we are within my working day whenever I want to do that. The other thing I'd also recommend is maybe picking a client that you're pretty sure this would work with and just running a few experiments because it's not going to be easy as just, we'll just do video updates. You know, you could just use WhatsApp to do that. We could just use something else. You you need to... try the different technologies, but it's worth sort of experimenting first and agreeing the structure of format because you're going to pick up a phone the first time and leave a video update and you go, what's the update going to be? Yeah, so you need to think about the types of update and what you're going to say, what you're going to update it, how you're going to come across, etc. So doing some experiments first, even before your very first client that you run it with, is a way of building some knowledge and activity first. maybe try with your team. internally between yourself over a few weeks and see if that helps even just within the team activity rather than having some meetings could you replace some of project status meetings I'm not talking about business meetings your own business meetings about your team coming together and understanding status but you know I've stayed in projects you could do some experimentations that way as well. Paul Newton: Yeah, test it first, learn it. Because it the first time you do anything, it it it's never perfect. It's never perfect at the end, but it that that learning process it's better to happen with your team than with your client. Granger Forson: Absolutely, absolutely fantastic. Awesome, so let's move into our wrap up and close. What did you hear yourself say today that maybe surprised you? Paul Newton: I'm very analytical of my business and of myself, to be honest with you. So there probably wasn't anything I said that I didn't expect to feel or to think or to understand. The main thing that did kind of surprise me, the I really appreciate that bit of advice you just gave on the asymmetrical process. That's i I I was not expecting to come out of this for something as potentially useful as that. So in terms of what I said that's surprising, probably not an awful lot. I definitely enjoyed it. I've enjoyed running through the process and reliving the moments I suppose that have got us to where we are, but I wouldn't say I've necessarily surprised myself with anything. Granger Forson: Super, well Paul, thank you for your honesty. Finally, where can people find out more about you if they want to follow your business and your business journey? Paul Newton: So we're we're on Instagram, we're on LinkedIn, you can find us anywhere on all the various social media platforms. But our website's www.jet.co.uk, that's J H E T. all our content details are on there. So if anyone ever wants to reach out, please do. And yeah, we're we're marketing nerds. So even if it's just to talk through marketing in general, we're we're happy to talk. Granger Forson: Awesome. Paul, thank you so much for being open on this fantastic conversation today. I know our listeners will get a lot from this. It's been fantastic. Thank you very much. Paul Newton: No, thank you, guy. I've really enjoyed it. Thank you. I appreciate your time. Granger Forson: for spending your time with us today. We're on a mission to make business owners stronger together. If this conversation has helped you, please like, comment and follow on whatever platform you're using. About 60 % of our audience hasn't done this yet and these small actions will help us reach more business owners just like you. If you'd to join in the conversation as a guest or if you have a hurdle question for us to tackle, reach out to us at info at strongerbusinesstogether.com. Now, go meet this next week really successful and we'll see you in the next one. Cheers!