Latest / Friendship IRL: Real Talk About Friendship, Community, and What It Actually Takes / How to Help Your Teen With Friendship Drama with Sheri Gazitt

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How to Help Your Teen With Friendship Drama with Sheri Gazitt · Friendship IRL: Real Talk About Friendship, Community, and What It Actually Takes

• 0:00
  Podcast Intro/Outro: All right, gang. Here's to nights that turn into mornings and friends that turn into family. Cheers. Hello, hello, and welcome to the Friendship IRL podcast. I'm your host, Alex Alexander. Each week we talk about what is working(and what is not) in our friendships, community and connections. Have you ever wished you could sit down and have a conversation about what is really going on in your friendships? Well, you found your people. Join us as we dive into real life stories and explore new ways to approach these connections. Together, we're reimagining the rules of friendship
• 0:52
  Alex Alexander [Narration]: A specific kind of conversation that I have with people all the time is about like those lingering friendship beliefs from their teen years. Messages that say, "I was always the kid who was left out. I was bullied.
• 1:15
  Alex Alexander [Narration]: I always felt like an outsider, and I still feel that way." And I read those, and I think, wow, those are some really formative friendship years. What happened in those hallways, in those lunch rooms, the group chats? It still shows up in our adult friendships, in how we walk into a room, whether we believe people actually want to get to know us. That is why today's episode is so important. My guest today is Coach Sheri Gazette. She's the founder of Teen Wise. She has spent 30 years working with girls as a coach and a speaker. She has a master's degree in counseling psychology and a BA in psychology from Rice University, and she knew from the start every paper, every project was focused on kids. Her work is
• 2:08
  featured all over the place: books, podcasts, television shows, radio programs, magazines. She presents to schools, cooperations, moms groups, Girl Scout troop leaders, and more. Every month, she connects with over 20,000
• 2:24
  moms talking about one thing: How do we help our teens, normally specifically teen girls, make and maintain friendships? Because she knows that the friendship skills that you build or don't build in your teen years are the ones that you will carry forward. So today's episode is for all of you, literally hundreds of you, who have sent me a message asking,"How do I help my teen who is in the middle of some serious girl drama move forward through this.
• 2:59
  moms talking about one thing: This episode is for you, but there's also a second audience today, and that is an adult who is still carrying around beliefs from your own teen years. You're going to hear in this episode, don't blame yourself. It's a lot of skills. It's a lot of work on the parents' part to really stay active and engaged and try and help the kids in your life. If you didn't receive that, well, this episode might be a great place to re-parent yourself to consider how you're gonna move forward from some of these limiting beliefs. So, with that, let's dive in.
• 3:40
  Alex Alexander: Hi, Sheri.
• 3:40
  Alex Alexander: Welcome to the Friendship IRL podcast. I'm so excited you're here. You know, I think that this is actually going to be-I mean, don't quote me now-but like this could end up being one of my most downloaded episodes ever. I get so many questions about the topics we're going to cover today.
• 3:58
  Sheri Gazitt: Well, I'm glad to be here and to lend my voice to this really important topic.
• 4:04
  Alex Alexander [Narration]: Well, I honestly didn't know that there was an expert like you out there until you found me, which is wild because we don't live very far from each other. So I'm happy we were able to connect and not go a bunch, you know, like five more years until we knew of each other. But you have a background in counseling psychology. What made you go more towards teen friendship than maybe some potential other avenues you could have gone?
• 4:31
  Sheri Gazitt: Well, what I found over the years is that a lot of times we wait until girls need clinical help with things, and I wanted to help girls before that, and one of the things that makes such a big impact, as you talk about all the time, is friendships and connections. And this is why I thought this is
• 4:50
  the place I want to be: is helping those girls to create those connections, which positively impacts their life, their motivation, their mental.
• 4:58
  the place I want to be: Health, everything that they're doing-if they've got those great connections, it just-it's-it's very impactful.
• 5:06
  Alex Alexander [Narration]: I mean, yeah, I think it seeps into every area of your life, and you carry it into every room. I was actually just on a webinar before this with somebody talking about, you know, like business networking, and if you're carrying all these feelings with you that you've had since your youth-that's going to seep into every area of your life when you're trying to make new connections.
• 5:28
  Sheri Gazitt: Absolutely, there's a lot of research on it.
• 5:30
  Sheri Gazitt: Actually, of of how you saw yourself as a teen, it really impacts how you see the reactions of people around you.
• 5:39
  Sheri Gazitt: So they may actually like you, but if you were bullied, you might come into the room expecting people to not like you, and so you interpret behaviors in that way. And that's why we've got to help them in their teen years when they're formulating how do people think about me, how do they react to me.
• 5:56
  Alex Alexander: Yeah, I mean, I just think so often. I'm so happy you're doing this, and that we're doing this conversation today. Because I do get a decent number of messages from adults being like, "I was always the kid that was left out. I was bullied. I always felt like an outsider. I had a bunch of friends, but I never felt like I really connected with anybody," and it's such a long-standing pattern for so many people.
• 6:32
  Sheri Gazitt: It is. I was doing a talk. It was for some Girl Scout troop leaders, and we're talking about friendship and the importance of it. We're talking about it in terms of the girls they were supporting, right? But one of the women, she was probably 43 ish at the time. She shared with the room, "This is why I don't connect with women at my age because of her experiences as a teen." And she was like teary-eyed and crying, re-experiencing that. But it was an aha moment that oh yeah, I am staying stuck in my teen social life.
• 7:09
  Alex Alexander: Wow. Well, luckily today we're going to talk about it, and luckily you do this work to help people move on from you know like rewrite their beliefs and their patterns and find a new way forward, so they're not stuck in it. So, for all of my parents out here, because I get so many messages being like, "Thank you for talking about friendship, but I really want to help my teen.
• 7:39
  Alex Alexander: "Generally, they say teen, but every so often I do get specifically like my teen daughter. Can you talk a little bit about when parents come to me? They come to you, and they're saying like my daughter is dealing with girl drama, and I think that it's easy to just kind of dismiss that and be like, "Oh well, it's just teen friendship; it's fine." But why do we need to push back on that?
• 8:12
  Alex Alexander: And like, what are they actually describing?
• 8:14
  Sheri Gazitt: Well, what they're describing is girls who haven't learned the skills of having healthy relationships and friendships are so incredibly important to everyone, but especially girls in their teen years. And so, if they are feeling insecure in those friendships, that's why it can become girl drama. And we always think, oh, it happened. There was no reason for it, but there was a reason. We just don't know what it was. Some girl had a thought, and that thought led to those behaviors. The thought may be I might lose my best friend because this new girl is a friend of hers now, or nobody's talking to me in the lunch room, and so that spirals into all of these other thoughts of nobody wants to be my friend, and you know nobody likes me. They think I'm annoying. So we have to realize that it's not these evil masterminds out there that are, you know, doing girl drama behaviors. It is girls who are really striving to create deep connections, and when they don't have that, that's when we start to see the girl drama. And when we're there to support them, then we help to defeat those beliefs that you're talking about and those patterns that they carry into their adult years.
• 9:26
  Alex Alexander [Narration]: What would you say, right? Because I think there's kind of two camps here. I guess is often what I hear. We have like the people who feel like they are on the receiving end of the girl drama, but then we also have maybe parents who are coming to me being like, other parents keep complaining to me that my daughter is causing the drama, and I dislike that because now we're giving kind of a label that I'm sure gets carried on. I just did an episode where. About why I really dislike the term toxic friend.
• 10:04
  Sheri Gazitt: Yeah,
• 10:04
  Alex Alexander [Narration]: and I also think girls can carry this label of like, I'm the problem, I create the drama, I am the one like swirling,
• 10:15
  Sheri Gazitt: yeah, the dynamic.
• 10:15
  Sheri Gazitt: Even labels sometimes, right?
• 10:18
  Sheri Gazitt: And if somebody says you're the bad girl. You're the Mean Girl.
• 10:21
  Sheri Gazitt: You're the toxic friend. Then not only do other people accept that label for that person, but they internalize it for themselves, and they're like,"Well, this is who I am."
• 10:31
  Alex Alexander [Narration]: Yeah, yeah. I think I have a number of people who just feel like they have always been the problem, and so they're almost scared to initiate because they feel like eventually they're going to mess it up.
• 10:44
  Sheri Gazitt: Yes. Oh, I see that. Yeah, I see that in the younger years where it's starting to girls will say,"Well, nobody likes me once they really get to know me," and so they just put up this hard shell around them, like I'm not going to try to connect because it's going to end badly. But I do want to backtrack just a moment to the girls who are the ones who are initiating these girl drama behaviors, and there's always parents who ask me that too. And what those girls need is the exact same thing that the girls on the receiving end need.
• 11:17
  Sheri Gazitt: They need to be loved unconditionally by their parents, they need to be taught new skills of how to connect with people. We need to avoid that toxic friend label. Or if you find out your daughter's doing something, don't go at it from a disciplinarian view of a hey, what can she learn, and what does she need support with, and what is she struggling with, what are her insecurities and her limiting beliefs? So be there to support her, not condone the behaviors, but to support her to have a different path, see herself differently.
• 11:51
  Alex Alexander [Narration]: Yeah, I mean, this is really something we both believe in, right? That like friendship and connection is a skill. So these teens are learning a skill set that, honestly, there's not a lot of curriculum for in schools. Like, where are people learning this?
• 12:06
  Alex Alexander [Narration]: And most of it is through their parents or caregivers, maybe through other adults or communities, things like that.
• 12:15
  Alex Alexander [Narration]: But you know, I think it's good for all of us to think about like where did we learn these skills, and most of it was through trial and error.
• 12:24
  Sheri Gazitt: Yes, trial and error, and that's why we have to step in as they're experiencing those things. That we are there to guide and support them. We can't prepare them for every situation that's going to come up, but we can certainly give them a really good foundation so that when they go out there to create connections or in their friendships, if they want deeper friendships, or if there is some sort of disagreement, how do you talk that through and create a deeper friendship that way? We need to really think about what skills do they need and be alongside them in this journey, so they can learn about themselves, they can learn about the others, but also learn about the skill of having a successful and healthy relationship.
• 13:04
  Alex Alexander [Narration]: Well, I mean, let's go there then, because I have done some research. I poked around your website, and you have four pillars of what teens actually need. So, can we talk through each of those pillars?
• 13:19
  Sheri Gazitt: Yes. So, this is one area that I looked at and kind of comparing therapy and coaching a little bit here of what are girls getting in therapy and what do they need in addition to that. And so sometimes I'll work with kids who are seeing a therapist and I'm a complement to therapy, but there's four key areas that really we need to wrap around all four of these to make an impact on girls who are feeling lonely or who are in the midst of girl drama, and the first is identity. They need to be comfortable in who they are. Now it's tricky at this stage because if we're looking at the psychological stages, it's identity versus confusion, according to Erikson. So they're constantly trying to figure that out, and it can change. We see it as parents week to week, month to month, of who they are, how they're talking, how they're dressing, what their interests are. So that's a tricky one. But we have to figure out what is the basic idea of who they are, and as they change, that they accept that person that they're becoming. The second is beliefs, and you touched on this-the limiting beliefs that girls are gathering up and putting in their backpack. I think of it as their backpack of life. What are they taking along with them? If they have someone who ends a friendship, are they taking away from that friendships are always going to end poorly, or that it's not worth having friends, or everybody thinks I'm annoying? What are the beliefs that are there? And we're not trying to say they can never have any negative thoughts and beliefs. We just need to recognize them, and when they are able to recognize them, then they can start to see the other expansive beliefs instead. The third is emotional resilience.
• 14:56
  Sheri Gazitt: If we are going to encourage girls to get out there and get vulnerable and connect, they have to be ready for rejection, because not everybody connects.
• 15:09
  Sheri Gazitt: You see this, I'm sure, and you know the big circles that you're in. You know all these people can gather and have a great time, but it doesn't mean that the person sitting over on one side is going to really connect with the person on the other, because not everybody does. It's kind of like dating; you have to have some sort of connection.
• 15:26
  Sheri Gazitt: You just feel that connection, so they have to get ready to be vulnerable. And when they have that big emotion that comes from rejection, then they fall back on those beliefs, right? And then the fourth piece is the interpersonal skills. So this is often what is fueling social anxiety or girls withdrawing that they just don't feel confident in creating connections. So we can go through all of those skills that they need in that section, and that depends on where they are and what they're going through.
• 16:00
  Sheri Gazitt: For some of them, they need to know how to respond to girl drama, like to snarkiness or overly teasing. For other girls, it's they don't know how to initiate a conversation with someone they don't really know, or they don't know how to enter a group, or they don't know how to create a deeper friendship.
• 16:18
  Sheri Gazitt: So there's just so much to this that we can teach our girls, and this is gonna sound really weird, but I get so excited when a mom calls me and is telling me my daughter is doing ABC because I'm like, you were in the right place. We can help you with this.
• 16:33
  Alex Alexander [Narration]: Yeah, I mean, there's just not a lot of people thinking about it as a skill, and when it's you and I, like anybody who messages me, and I also get excited, and they send you know these big messages with like every dynamic, and I'm reading pages and pages of things that someone sent me, and it's I don't know if you feel this way. People feel like it's like set in stone. It just this is what it is, and I'm almost like a last resort. And it's like, oh no, I can see the patterns that are existing here.
• 17:08
  Alex Alexander [Narration]: I can see the like limiting beliefs and the skill set that you're struggling with, and you just think you're quote unquote bad at friendship or antisocial person or forever the introvert, but really, there's like one specific skill that if we could get you to practice it and feel more confident in that skill, your four-page email you just wrote me, you would feel so much more capable in that moment.
• 17:41
  Sheri Gazitt: Absolutely, yeah.
• 17:41
  Sheri Gazitt: And what you point out there is that it's the skill building, and then you go out and connect.
• 17:48
  Sheri Gazitt: So many times we tell girls, and I see this even with moms who have girls in college, just go join a club,
• 17:54
  Alex Alexander [Narration]: yeah,
• 17:54
  Sheri Gazitt: or just go talk to somebody; they'll love you,
• 17:57
  Alex Alexander: yeah.
• 17:57
  Sheri Gazitt: And if they don't have the skill, it's going to actually create more limiting beliefs. So right now, it's you know before we're heading into the school year, it's really a good time for girls to uplevel their interpersonal skills and their friendship skills, so they can go back into the new school year with this newfound social confidence.
• 18:18
  Alex Alexander: Yeah, and as a reminder of like, this is a great time to practice. We are all always practicing, even you and I now, as people who talk about this stuff, I am constantly practicing. There are moments, actually. I don't know if I've told this story on the podcast recently, but like I have a newer friend, and we went to an activity together for the first time that was like outside of the work context that we know each other. It's like a personal hangout. I made it through the entire hangout. It went great. I got to the last 10 minutes, and I made the most awkward comment, truly of all time, like I was trying to reference something that was very personal that I knew about her, but the way that it came out of my mouth sounded really bad, like really bad, to the point where I think she tried to give me the benefit of the doubt and rephrased it in a much gentler way, and I was like, yeah, that's what I meant to say. That is a skill. Like I am still learning how to recover when I say something that is quite honestly like slightly offensive.
• 19:35
  Sheri Gazitt: Yeah,
• 19:36
  Alex Alexander [Narration]: I did not mean to do that. It just came out of my mouth. We are all always practicing, especially if you're a teen.
• 19:45
  Sheri Gazitt: Yeah, middle school. There's a lot of those oops, right? They're yeah, they're trying to figure out sarcasm and humor, and there's a lot of stuff that they'll say that's completely inappropriate.
• 19:53
  Sheri Gazitt: And girls, especially perfectionists, will just stay silent because they don't want to. Take a chance of making a mistake.
• 20:02
  Alex Alexander [Narration]: Yeah, yeah. I hadn't even thought about the perfection, but that's so true. And I honestly can think of friends when I was in middle school who kind of did that. I think I took a little bit more of the trial and error risk,
• 20:16
  Sheri Gazitt: yeah,
• 20:17
  Alex Alexander [Narration]: mode.
• 20:17
  Alex Alexander [Narration]: But I can think of friends at that age who definitely stayed quiet unless they were in a very small, like proven group, like their core closest friends. Then they would speak more. But if it was a bigger group, their lips were zipped.
• 20:33
  Sheri Gazitt: Yeah, and that's one thing that a lot of parents want their kids to be in these bigger friend groups. That feels like safety, right? If that friendship goes bad, they've got another friend, but there are girls who need that closer net, those small groups, or even one-on-one, because they are so in their head of what am I going to say and do. So they're able to, in a one-to-one, pivot a little more, and just the other person knows them better, so they'll talk more. And if a girl's in a big group and doesn't talk, that doesn't allow her to get close to anyone. So she's becomes the floater friend, the girl that's always picked last, or maybe not at all when they're going to go do activities. And you have to be vulnerable and open up to create those connections.
• 21:19
  Alex Alexander [Narration]: Wow.
• 21:19
  Alex Alexander [Narration]: Okay, we just breezed over so many topics. Like as I'm listening back in my head, I'm just like, we have an episode for that. We have an episode for that. We have an episode for that. So if you're listening to this and you're thinking that's great that you can tell me about this certain dynamic, but what do I do about it? I actually probably have an episode about that. So if you are new here, I'm going to give you a couple of episodes. Go to the show notes. Go listen to those episodes. But also, there are other topics that we talk about later in the podcast episode that I have episodes on. Go search the archives. There's so many. We're almost to 200 episodes, friends. There are so many episodes. Some specific ones I want to mention. Episode 134 talks about being the fringe friend. Episode 15 covers a lot of friendship, like friend group dynamics, and like I said, go scroll through the archives. I have had hundreds of parents message me saying that they used something from one of my podcast episodes, or they had my teen, their teen, listen to one of the episodes, and it offered a reframe or a totally new way to try and approach their problem.
• 22:40
  Alex Alexander [Narration]: So, go search for whatever you're currently struggling with, and if you don't find it, my messages, my DMs are always open. Send me a request. I would love to add it to my ideas list, and either I'll record an episode or I will find an expert to talk about it.
• 23:00
  Alex Alexander: Hmm, the beginning of the floater friend.
• 23:02
  Alex Alexander: We both probably hear a lot about that too. You know, when you were talking about limiting beliefs, something I would love to hear your take on specifically is how parents' limiting beliefs about friendships impact their kids.
• 23:21
  Sheri Gazitt: Ooh, this is a big one. Yeah, it goes back to we carry forward what happened in our teen years, and sometimes moms will use the phrase "girls are just mean" in a way to it feels like I'm going to minimize this and normalize it for my daughter so she doesn't feel so bad. But it really then becomes a filter in which girls see peers and see friendships and see behaviors. They're looking for that Mean Girl behavior, and when we say girls are just mean, we have to think about this because our daughter is a girl.
• 23:52
  Sheri Gazitt: We're girls slash women, and so what are we saying about all of us? We're just setting it up for them to expect that from friendships. Are girls mean?
• 24:03
  Sheri Gazitt: Sometimes girls do mean things as do boys. I don't know why girls get called out for this, and it's not all girls. It's not all the time. It's just moments in time as they're learning.
• 24:16
  Alex Alexander: Yeah, I mean, I'm also just thinking, like, you know, somebody. Another example I have of this is a while back. A person I know-I'm not going to tell who this person is-but a person I know was talking to me about how they have always had really bad friendship experiences, and so they didn't even want to put their kiddo in preschool because they were just like so sure that their kiddo was going to get bullied. I was like, "Whoa, that is a deep belief."
• 24:53
  Sheri Gazitt: Yes,
• 24:54
  Alex Alexander [Narration]: you have about friendship. Yeah, and that is so important. Impacting your kid probably, and I think we can have so many. Like, there's that belief. There's the one you talked about with Mean Girls. Another one I hear all the time, especially when it comes to teens, is people will maybe there'll be a little drama with like your closest friends in high school, and it'll be like, well, these friendships don't matter because you're gonna find new friends in college and when you're an adult. So if it's really causing you this much drama, just leave these friends.
• 25:32
  Sheri Gazitt: Yeah, not so easily done. Okay, you know.
• 25:37
  Sheri Gazitt: Yeah, it's always when people say that you won't even remember them. I'm like, oh yeah, they will. They're gonna remember their names, their faces, you know, things they said because it is that moment that they are figuring out themselves in relationships. There's three ways that parents often try to support their kids. One is dismissive, and that's a great example of that. You won't even remember them. Another is dramatic, and that is, oh my gosh, this is like so awful.
• 26:04
  Sheri Gazitt: They're horrible people. They were never your friends if they said or did that, or just getting super emotional over like putting this shadow over your daughter's emotions and experiences. And then the third is intrusive, and that's the mom that comes in and tries to fix it all. And all of these behaviors are loving, well-intentioned moms, but it's not allowing them to go out, as you mentioned, the trial and error, go do these things and get support. It's trying to create a bubble around them and to fix everything for them.
• 26:34
  Alex Alexander [Narration]: Well, I mean, let's talk a little bit more about that because you work with both teens and their moms, so obviously you feel like the parent piece is so important that you are also offering coaching services for the parents.
• 26:50
  Sheri Gazitt: Yes, because they're the ones who are there with them all the time. If I'm working privately with a girl, I see her 45 minutes a week, and the mom and the dad are there a lot during the week. They hear everything. They see the tears at the end of the day, and they hear about you know the weekend drama. So they need to know how to be there for their daughter in a way that's not doing all these things, minimizing or adding drama or being intrusive.
• 27:14
  Sheri Gazitt: They need to know how to talk about it, how to empower their daughter, how to listen in a different way, how to discard some of their own limiting beliefs-all of this is just so key.
• 27:30
  Alex Alexander [Narration]: So, if we're not minimizing or rescuing or making it more dramatic, we're I think being more of a guide. What are some positive attributes? Like, what do we want as the parent to do?
• 27:46
  Alex Alexander: We want to first of all create a good connection with our kids because if they're going through girl drama or they're feeling lonely and excluded, they're not feeling heard or understood or seen.
• 27:56
  Alex Alexander: They can feel invisible and powerless. So we need to be there to connect with them to make them feel loved and for them to understand their self worth. What we want to do as they're talking about it is, I talk about the love framework.
• 28:10
  Alex Alexander: So the first and foremost thing we need to do is to listen to them without asking a ton of questions. Just let them get it off their brain. Many times that's all they need because that helps them to work through that. What happened? What did I say? What did they do? Where did this come from? And then we want to offer our advice, not give it unless they say yes. We're just planting the seed, like, hey, I've got some ideas. But that allows them to be in the emotional piece of it first, and then later we can talk about what are we going to do about it. We need to validate their feelings, even if they're the kid who's doing the mean behavior. Their feelings are still valid. The behavior is not, so we're not going to condone that. But we can be there for them as they feel that, and then empower them. And that's where the skills come in.
• 28:56
  Alex Alexander: We don't do it by lecturing them. We do it by asking questions, problem solving with them, not for them. That way, they can think through it and figure out what they want to do.
• 29:06
  Alex Alexander: But one of the key things we have to remember is, while we have lots of wisdom that we can bring to the table, they're still teens, and so we might say, "Just go talk to her. You need to have this conversation and stand up for yourself." We need to recognize that they may not be able to do that yet. They don't have the confidence or the skills, so we have to make sure that we're there to support them. But also, don't be harsh on them if they aren't able to follow through with some of those things.
• 29:35
  Alex Alexander: Well, that was what I was just thinking. Is like as the parent remembering, this is a process of trial and error. Like you might have determined, you know, like worked out together what your teen is going to go do in this situation. They're going to bring up that they were hurt.
• 29:52
  Alex Alexander: They're going to ask for an apology. They're going to make an apology. Whatever it is. And then in the moment, because this is a skill that they are practicing, it might go horribly wrong, or they might panic, and instead of apologizing, they might start yelling at their friend because they're even in this situation. Like you don't know, and they you might have to go through three, four, five iterations, of the same problem until they actually maybe have the conversation they wanted to have in the first place.
• 30:30
  Sheri Gazitt: Yeah, I mean that's so true. When I'm private coaching with girls, what I'll do is I'll give them challenges in between our sessions, and if they don't do it, I always tell them, "If you don't do it, that's fine. Tell me, and let's talk through why." What was it that held you back from doing that? Because that is a lesson as well. If you tell your daughter, go apologize, and as you said, they start yelling or doubling down. Don't criticize them. Say, okay, well, what happened there? What were you thinking? Or and they may say, well, she was really mean to me again. So, I mean, there's an explanation, but we have to really look at it as what can they learn from this, even if they don't follow through with that skill. You really want them to learn.
• 31:11
  Alex Alexander [Narration]: Yeah, to me, it just sounds like an incredible amount of patience as the parent.
• 31:19
  Sheri Gazitt: Yes,
• 31:19
  Alex Alexander [Narration]: so much conversation, and figuring out where you're having those conversations, you know, like maybe it's not sitting down at the table face to face of like this is a huge problem. I know so many people do this, like in the car after pickup, where it's just kind of a random conversation because it's got to be a continuous conversation.
• 31:40
  Sheri Gazitt: Yeah, yeah. We have to realize that they're not always going to be ready to talk about things. If they start talking, let them talk freely.
• 31:46
  Sheri Gazitt: But if they get into the car and they're really upset, you don't want to just say, "Tell me, tell me, what is it?" Even though we're dying to know, we have to realize that all day long they've held it together, probably, or they've gone to the bathroom to cry, which is what I hear from so many girls. So they've held it together in front of their peers, and then they get in the car, and it's like, oh my gosh, a release, right? They can let it all go.
• 32:11
  Sheri Gazitt: So sometimes they just need that time. And if you have a daughter who's like that, I always recommend putting on their playlists so they don't automatically put in their AirPods and let them choose what music, but don't ask questions.
• 32:25
  Sheri Gazitt: You have to get to know your daughter and what she needs in those moments, right? Because she's always changing and what her needs are, and if she needs that silence, just let her have it.
• 33:41
  Alex Alexander: I'm also curious, again, on your take on this. So something I get a lot of is parents, the moms, who are saying, you know, like I want to befriend the other moms. My kids are all in the same sports team.
• 33:59
  Alex Alexander: They're all in the same theater club. They all go to the same school, and we're doing all these activities. I'm on the PTA, we're at the bingo nights and the school dances and the this and the that, and so I really want a good group of friends with the parents. Now we have two layers of dynamics. We have the parents who are all trying to coach their kids and have their own friendships, and we have the kids with their own dynamics and drama and trial and error and things that have gone wrong, and somebody didn't handle it quite maybe the way an adult would have, but they're 13,
• 34:45
  Sheri Gazitt: right?
• 34:46
  Alex Alexander: And then that becomes maybe a topic of conversation or something that the moms feel like they need to address with each other. Do you have any thoughts or tips for parents that are navigating this kind of dual layer situation?
• 35:04
  Sheri Gazitt: Yeah, I think one of the things, if possible, it's not always possible, but to keep the two separate, that the parents have their relationships and the daughters have theirs.
• 35:14
  Sheri Gazitt: And if a mom calls you and says your daughter did this or said this, you need to talk to her. I always recommend saying I appreciate you calling and telling me this. I'm going to talk to her about this. I'm going to support her from my side, and I know you'll be supporting your daughter from your side, so that the moms aren't talking it out of you know it's between them now that the girls are still having the relationship and the friendship, and they're the ones who need support as they figure it out.
• 35:41
  Sheri Gazitt: Sometimes it'll work where the parents orchestrate meeting up with the girls to talk it out, but it has to be accepted by the girls. Otherwise, it just becomes very fake, and that meeting is like looks great and wonderful. And then when they go back into their ecosystem in the high school or middle school, it goes back the other way, and sometimes even gets worse.
• 36:05
  Alex Alexander: Well, and do you have any tips if the kids can't figure it out.
• 36:10
  Sheri Gazitt: Yeah, I mean, you can still stay friends if your relationship is important.
• 36:13
  Sheri Gazitt: Sometimes the friendships are in groups like that, more activity friends, right? More PTA friends. But if you have a really good relationship, you can get through that and understand your girls are going through it. They're learning it, and that's okay. They don't have to be perfect. They don't have to be best friends either.
• 36:32
  Alex Alexander: Yeah, like really trying to separate them.
• 36:35
  Alex Alexander: I mean, that's just how I think of an adult friend group. It's like sometimes two people have a conflict, and they're gonna have their conflict, and that doesn't mean I don't have my individual relationships with those two people, and trying you know not to take a side. And I get that's different when it's your own child, but like really trying to see it as it's not necessarily the group dynamic. Like the kids have their own relationships too.
• 37:04
  Alex Alexander: to because the initial issue to with two people who are not
• 37:05
  Sheri Gazitt: Yeah, and the teams thing, as you said, taking a side is something that I do talk to girls about, and how do you avoid that? I call it the football effect. That two people have an issue instead of talking it out, they go talk becomes 100 times as big when everybody else is talking about it, right?" And if you're the person that somebody comes to getting along.
• 38:04
  Alex Alexander [Narration]: Yes, yeah, and we don't necessarily.
• 38:07
  Alex Alexander [Narration]: I mean, there's so many layers to this. Like, you don't necessarily have Yes, it's not all or nothing. I guess is what I'm trying to say to people here.
• 38:32
  Sheri Gazitt: There's layers, and you might be the bestest of friends with someone that you're, you know, your kids are on a softball team together because you see each other all the time. You spend a lot of time together, but maybe one of them quits softball. You don't see each other as much, so it's not that you're not friends anymore. You just aren't as So that softball mom friend that Sheri just mentioned, I actually have a term for that. That is a defined friend, and that is language straight from my Wheel of Connection framework. So I wanted to pause here and tell you a little bit more about that close because you don't see each other as much.
• 39:26
  Sheri Gazitt: framework because I cannot tell you how many parents have
• 39:27
  Alex Alexander [Narration]: Yeah, yeah. There are so many layers and so much nuance, and it's not all or nothing.
• 39:31
  Alex Alexander [Narration]: messaged me saying that that one framework in particular changed
• 39:34
  Sheri Gazitt: Yes
• 39:34
  Alex Alexander [Narration]: I guess there's anything from my everything for them when it comes to their teens and entire podcast, all like 180 plus episodes, that is maybe the friendship. Understanding the different types of friends and people in your lives and the roles that those relationships core one of the core messages of the entire thing.
• 39:48
  Alex Alexander [Narration]: play, especially in your kids' friendships, giving them the language, complete game changer is what I'm hearing from parents. I did not create this framework thinking that it would be used for teens, but teens love it. If you want the full breakdown, go listen to episode 100, or grab a copy of my book, or head to the show notes, and I do have a free downloadable guide about the Wheel of Connection. Let me give you the short version, though, of why this matters. Especially, honestly, if you have this like dual overlapping mom friends and kid friends dynamic, this is so relevant. This will make such a big difference. If you are treating all of these friendships like they are some really significant central relationship for you or for your kid, when actually they're a defined friend, so maybe in your mind, your kid's friend-it's a friend, right? They're important. We have to treat this with the utmost respect and expectations, and we need to get this problem solved. When in reality, this friend might be a theater friend, a soccer friend, someone that your kid is friends with in a very specific context and that changes how you understand it, the pressure, the energy you put into it. There's so many things that shift when you can see this as just another relationship in your wheel, but not one that maybe you're gonna tell you about it, right? This is what's going on. Whose side have the same expectations of.
• 41:22
  Alex Alexander [Narration]: Same goes for the parent side.
• 41:23
  Alex Alexander [Narration]: are you going to be on? You can say You might be feeling all this pressure around these other moms when actually they might be defined or familiar friends, not your present friends. These are all terms on the Wheel of Connection. With a defined friend, you show up for that one shared context. You keep it warm, you keep it enjoyable, and then you release this expectation of like deep connection, deep reciprocity.
• 41:51
  Alex Alexander [Narration]: Once you have the language for these friendships, things get a lot clearer for how you show up in them. So, if this is something that sounds helpful to you, I have yet to tell a parent or have a parent tell me it's not helpful for them. Head to the show notes, check out one of the places with the Wheel of Connection, and with that, let's get back to the episode.
• 42:19
  Alex Alexander: So let's pivot, kind of, but not really, because we're already talking about adult friendship. Can we talk about how the patterns that we develop as teens and how they continue to show up for us as adults?
• 42:39
  Sheri Gazitt: It's very subconscious, and this is why it's so good to talk about it because we can become aware with friends, it's an energy exchange, right? So if you walk into a room and you're bringing this pattern of nobody wants to talk to me or I don't know how to have conversations, you are going to probably be sitting on the outskirts of the room.
• 43:23
  Sheri Gazitt: You're maybe going to be busy on your phone, so you don't feel awkward, and you're doing this self-fulfilling prophecy thing, right? Nobody talks to you because you're on your phone, or you have your AirPods in, or you're sitting away from everybody. We have to figure out what those patterns are. What are the ones that are serving us, and what are the ones that we want to change and start practicing those skills instead of just saying this is just how it is, right?
• 43:50
  Alex Alexander: When you were talking about that, it was making me think of this story. A listener messaged me, and she was talking about how her husband had definitely some really strong, like limiting beliefs around friendship. That he had realized while they were talking to their kids about friendship, and he decided he was going to break them. Like he was really going to try and be better about putting himself out there and trying new things with people that he didn't know, and like making new friends. And they made it a family goal. So he actually would talk about his own journey of like going on a hike with new friends, going to a sporting event with new friends. Like dad making friends became a family conversation.
• 44:44
  Sheri Gazitt: I love it.
• 44:44
  Alex Alexander: I always think that's like a really cool story to share with people.
• 44:47
  Sheri Gazitt: Yeah.
• 44:48
  Alex Alexander: So you know if you are breaking your own patterns, talk about it with your teens. I think
• 44:56
  Sheri Gazitt: yes, they're watching us. We role model things for them, and so if you are, I'm actually very shy and very introverted, so I talk about that when I'm going to go to a conference. My kids are in their 20s now, but I've always talked about and still do with them. I prep for it, right? I'm like, okay, I know I'm gonna be a little bit nervous, so let me think about what are the things I can talk about, and I'll very purposely, you know, decide where I'm gonna sit so that I'm not in the back where I'm like, that's where I really feel compelled to sit because I know I have some control over those skills, so you have
• 45:40
  Alex Alexander: because I think there are so many beliefs or just like patterns we can have, and I've done episodes on people pleasing. I think that's another one that a lot of people struggle with. I've done episodes on kind of that belief that I'm bad at friendship and I'm awkward. Whatever. One of my personal ones was I really grew up believing that in order for somebody to want to be my friend. I had to be like, what's the best word for this? Useful to them, and so I always joke that I'm like the recovering mom of the friend group. When I was younger, I was like the person where if everybody was getting together, I'd be like, "Well, I'll cook capacity. Like I just ignored my personal capacity for so long, and exhausted myself honestly, and sometimes felt like really resentful in friendships
• 46:56
  Sheri Gazitt: you're not enjoying yourself as you're cooking for 35 people. That joy is gone. It's like I got to do this for them to like me, and you know I'm always the one. And those are all limiting beliefs, right? Too is how we see ourselves and show up, but yeah, there's so many patterns.
• 47:12
  Sheri Gazitt: There's the people pleasing is a big one, which you're as you were talking about, feel like you needed to be needed or the helper. There's also the people pleasing, which kind of falls in that same arena. And what happens when you take on a role like that is you also stop sharing yourself with people, and so I'll talk to girls who are so nice and so accommodating for all their friends, but they lose friend after friend.
• 47:35
  Sheri Gazitt: Especially, it'll be like they are good friends with someone, and then a third person comes in and they break off, and they're not friends with her anymore.
• 47:42
  Sheri Gazitt: And that pattern is not sharing when it feels like you have to do it versus you get and being vulnerable. People pleasers are great on the periphery, but you don't have a deep friendship generally with to do it.
• 47:52
  Sheri Gazitt: people who are people pleasers.
• 47:53
  Alex Alexander: Yes, I mean, I can think of friends I have now who I know are people pleasers, but honestly, it's really hard to be their friend. And I've had mutual friends say, like, I actually don't even feel like I really know that friend
• 48:08
  Sheri Gazitt: exactly. I do
• 48:10
  Alex Alexander: all sorts of things with them, and I could tell you, you know, like their favorite coffee order, their favorite tea, their favorite this, their favorite that. But honestly, I could never tell you how they actually feel and if they're happy and if they enjoyed that activity that we did because they never share any of their own opinions. They're just trying to make themselves so malleable to the group, right?
• 48:35
  Sheri Gazitt: Yeah, and for teen girls, they would say you know they feel like they're two faced or fake or you know something like that. When they're not, they just are you know struggling to reveal themselves.
• 48:45
  Alex Alexander: Yeah. Are there any other like really common teen struggles that you feel like carry on into adulthood.
• 48:53
  Sheri Gazitt: Oh, there's so many, Alex. I'm trying to think.
• 48:56
  Sheri Gazitt: Like, what have we not covered?
• 48:56
  Sheri Gazitt: Right. I think that a big one is being part of a friend group and feeling a safety in that, but yet not creating the deepness in that, and so you'll have like 20 friends, but who are you really connecting with, like one-to-one? Who are you telling your imperfections? You know, sharing imperfections. Who are you telling about your struggles with your kids that you know is not going to go far and wide.
• 49:29
  Sheri Gazitt: Who are you telling about your fight you had with your spouse or your best friend or you know your other best friend? You know who can you really talk to and open up with? And when you are in a group of 20 people, you don't get to do that a lot. So you've got to have those one-to-ones as well.
• 49:47
  Alex Alexander: I mean, when I talk about friend groups, I have a really big friend group. I have a few, but I have one that is like very large at this point because significant others have been added to it. So it's probably about 30 people, and I talk about this friend group regularly. And I think one of the biggest misconceptions is that everybody thinks everybody is equally close.
• 50:05
  Sheri Gazitt: Yeah,
• 50:07
  Alex Alexander: and they're not.
• 50:07
  Alex Alexander: There are people in this group who are more of like acquaintance, or if you use my Wheel of Connection model, right? They're like defined friends. They are on the same fantasy football team, and they really can talk about that. Or they're all the moms, so they maybe aren't talking all the time, but they have like a group thread where they talk about mom stuff, and then you also have like really close individual friendships. You have some like little close, maybe like trios.
• 50:41
  Sheri Gazitt: Yeah,
• 50:42
  Alex Alexander: and it's not equal, and so you really have to live in this kind of ambiguous situation where you're okay with the fact that some people are closer than you are, and take personal responsibility for if you want to be closer to somebody, that's on you. The group will not facilitate that.
• 51:03
  Alex Alexander: You have to reach out and try and find ways to deepen that friendship, even if you see that person all the time or talk to them regularly in the group context.
• 51:15
  Sheri Gazitt: Yes, it's so true, and teens have to learn that.
• 51:18
  Sheri Gazitt: But we're not often talking about that. Though I hear a lot of girls say, "Well, nobody talked to me, or when they're in the group, they never talk," and then they don't understand why they don't get invited places, and it's not in a shame and blame way, right? It's just a recognition. Oh well, because you never talk when you're in the group, or you never invite anybody to do something, or they may even, if they do get invited, say no because they're nervous about it. So they have to step back and say, okay, this is how I want to show up now so that I can create those connections,
• 51:48
  Alex Alexander: yeah, and yeah.
• 51:48
  Alex Alexander: Groups are so hard because I just think people-it's kind of like joining a club, like when somebody says, "like just go join a club." Yes, I think you can find some sort of community version of belonging. Right, these people will invite you to the bigger group functions, and you're a part of that, and it is normal for you to be there. And you make some like, "How was your week?" "It was good." "How was your week?" "It was good." But you're not getting normally super deep, maybe, but probably not. And trying to get people to understand that like it is your own personal responsibility to try and develop one-on-one connections within that group, and that's how you're going to get yourself out of feeling like you're the floater friend.
• 52:36
  Sheri Gazitt: Yes, absolutely.
• 52:36
  Sheri Gazitt: Yeah, because nobody's going to think I'm going to invite her to go have lunch or to go get coffee because they never had that connection in the big group setting.
• 52:47
  Alex Alexander: Yep,
• 52:47
  Sheri Gazitt: to say hi
• 52:48
  Alex Alexander: and being okay with the fact that other people are doing the same thing. I mean, even yesterday I had a friend over here hanging out, and she was like, "Oh, I had our other friend Dani came over to her house." I was like, "Oh, nice, love that, right? But I wasn't invited,
• 53:04
  Sheri Gazitt: Right.
• 53:05
  Alex Alexander: Just like I didn't invite Danny to come over when she was here yesterday. So, and that probably comes with some of the emotional resilience and the identity and things like that that you're talking about.
• 53:16
  Sheri Gazitt: Yeah, for sure.
• 53:16
  Sheri Gazitt: Yeah, when you hear that, it's like, oh, well, she doesn't like me as much anymore. She likes them better than me, and that is a rampant thing in the teen years for sure. That comparison and friendships.
• 53:29
  Alex Alexander: Yeah, something I try and talk about with people is like, well, why do they like each other? Like, why are they friends?
• 53:35
  Sheri Gazitt: Yeah,
• 53:36
  Alex Alexander: Do they have an interest you don't have? Do they like normally there's a reason, and if I think you can start thinking about like what they actually have in common, then you're like, oh, well, I get why they would want to be friends.
• 53:50
  Alex Alexander: Yeah, it actually has nothing to do with me.
• 53:52
  Sheri Gazitt: Yes, and that one's hard to swallow, right?
• 53:54
  Sheri Gazitt: That it's not you. That's why there's a huge shift in friendship groups going from elementary to middle school because people change their interests, change how they're dressing. Everything about them changes, so it makes sense friendship groups are going to change, and it's very sad because I'll hear often they were friends since kindergarten, and then she ditched her in sixth grade, and it's because of those differences. Why does she like that other person now?
• 54:20
  Sheri Gazitt: Because they love a certain type of art, or they love a certain activity, and it's that level of friendship. It doesn't have to be all or nothing. It's just a different type of friendship now you have with that person. But yeah, as we change too, we might have a friend for 10 years, and then something big changes in our lives, and that friendship changes, and they get new friends. And when we're secure in ourselves and knowing we will find connections, then we don't take it quite so hard. We still need to kind of grieve the closeness we had, appreciate the friendship we had, and be okay with moving through it in a different way.
• 54:56
  Alex Alexander: Yeah, I mean, example for anybody listening of exactly what you just talked about is I have a friend. We were college roommates. We've been friends for a very long time. Like we consider each other like chosen family, but we don't live near each other anymore. And she's a mom to a medically complex kiddo, so we had been talking about her maybe flying up to visit me. Well, us like a group of us in Seattle, and she had brought it up, and it sounded good. And then she got invited to like a medical mom's retreat. I think she felt bad, and she was like, "Oh, like if I'm gonna go away, I actually think I want to go to that." She's kind of nervous, I think, to tell us, and all of us were like, "Girl, go! Like you need those people. We are so excited for you,"
• 55:43
  Sheri Gazitt: yeah,
• 55:44
  Alex Alexander: that you have other people who understand exactly where you are right now, and that doesn't make us love you any less. We're so excited for you to go build those friendships, but that takes time and security, and like yeah, yeah.
• 56:01
  Sheri Gazitt: That's a true secure friendship. Definitely love it.
• 56:04
  Alex Alexander: Well, I'm not just talking about this stuff because I really do try and live it and believe it. Like this is really how I want my friendships to be. Is like this, you know. A
• 56:17
  question I did have for you is: you work with people up to the age of 23.
• 56:23
  Sheri Gazitt: Yes. Why
• 56:23
  Alex Alexander: 23?
• 56:25
  Sheri Gazitt: Well, it came out of necessity, right? Moms would say, "Hey, my daughter's always had friendship issues. We thought it was going to change in high school. We thought it was going to change in college, and now she's out past college, and we-they don't have that hope anymore that college is a place she's going to find her friends." So I'll work with them after college, basically, to really look through all the friendships they've had. Look through all the limiting beliefs. Same thing I would do with a teen girl. Honestly, look through all of the things that are going on, how she's thinking about her future friendships, and even like at that age, they're usually getting to know some new people, whether it's at work or some place they're going, you know, locally around where they live, and they have to step into it, being ready to create those connections. And so that's why that age I've kind of added that on because it's the same stuff that we would talk to an 11-year-old about, but it's at a different point in their life, and they just need to see life differently, see friendships differently, see themselves differently, so they can find those friends that they have been trying to get all of those years.
• 57:38
  Alex Alexander: I think that is such a necessary. I mean, it's kind of like we're going to set you right.
• 57:43
  Sheri Gazitt: Yes, yes.
• 57:44
  Alex Alexander: At this final last juncture, we're going to really just dig in, so that you don't have to, you know, get 10, 20, 30 years down the road and feel these same beliefs that you're feeling before. Do you feel like there is any difference between coaching a teen who wants to be there versus a teen whose mom maybe thinks they need to be there?
• 58:05
  Alex Alexander: Does it matter if somebody reaches out to you,
• 58:09
  Sheri Gazitt: this is how we handle that. So I talk to the parents first, figure out what's going on, see if their daughter is a good fit for coaching. The next thing is a discovery session for the teen. That's the one I tell the parents you can be a little pushy to get them there, bribe them to get them there if you need to. There is no commitment past that point, so that the daughter is empowered in that moment. Maybe mom or dad found me, but they get to meet me or my associate coaches, and then they get to say yes. Very rarely will I say that I'll coach a girl if the girl doesn't say yes. I've done it probably two times, and I was like, "Why do I do this? Because it does make a difference. But getting them into the discovery session-that one is okay most of the time. I'll say 98% of the time they'll say yes to it once they see it's not about shaming and blaming, and you know they don't just sit there and talk about everything all the whole time because it's a structured session. It's skill based, so they can see how it's going to help them.
• 59:08
  Alex Alexander: Yeah, it sounds a lot like when I tell someone that my work is in community and friendship. I'm sure you feel this way too. People kind of get this deer in the headlights look, like they're panicked. I'm just going to tell them they're a bad person.
• 59:21
  Sheri Gazitt: Yes, exactly.
• 59:22
  Alex Alexander: And then as soon as I would say, you know, give me like 90 seconds because I start with a lot of things. Like you know, this is a skill. A lot of people haven't learned this.
• 59:33
  Alex Alexander: It's trial and error. Like it's hard, but it is worthwhile to develop. And then people, you like watch their shoulders drop when they realize it's not just going to be the whole time being like, "Well, you're a failure,"
• 59:47
  Sheri Gazitt: right? Oh my gosh, yes! And for girls whose parents have tried to coach them through it themselves, they feel like they're just disappointing their parents over and over again.
• 59:57
  Sheri Gazitt: When their parents are like,"Did you talk to her? Did you?
• 59:59
  Sheri Gazitt: What did she say? You know, did you ask invite her?" And the girls really start to feel like there is something wrong with them. And so when we can normalize it, when I say this is the only thing that I work on, basically, and I see you know hundreds of girls, they're like,"Oh, I'm not the only one. Okay, I can do this." It's a great feeling, like you said, when you see them soften up and be like,"Oh, okay, this isn't about there's anything wrong with me, then that's great."
• 1:00:27
  Alex Alexander: I mean, let's just say this so that we can both confirm it. Most people aren't talking outwardly about how they feel like they are bad at friendship, but when they meet someone like you or I, and then we tell them how many people are listening to my podcast, are sending me DMs, are emailing me, are reaching out to you or booking discovery calls, like so many people feel this way, and there is nothing wrong with you.
• 1:00:53
  Sheri Gazitt: Yep,
• 1:00:53
  Alex Alexander: it's just something people aren't talking about. I hope in my lifetime people do admit if they feel this way, so we can help them faster. But most people are just living in their own like shame spiral.
• 1:01:07
  Sheri Gazitt: Have you read the book "Together"?
• 1:01:10
  Alex Alexander: Yes.
• 1:01:11
  Sheri Gazitt: Oh my gosh! I mean, if anybody's listening and you're looking for a book, read that, and that really highlights how lonely so many people are.
• 1:01:17
  Sheri Gazitt: And for teens, I was just I'm doing a webinar the other day looking at the graph of how kids feel lonely, and it's just continuing to tick up and up and up, and right now it's at about 43% of teens will say that they feel pretty alone and not isolated. So we got work to do.
• 1:01:36
  Alex Alexander: Well, and especially the teens, the kids, right? I mean, I mentioned this earlier in the episode. This is a skill set that really I believe is going to kind of seep into every area of your life, like you want to go get a job, you have to network. You need to have interpersonal skills to be in a corporate setting or to be an entrepreneur and put yourself out there and make connections.
• 1:02:00
  Alex Alexander: Having neighbors, having a support system, having people as a new parent to call-it really is truly wild that this is not a lesson or a continued like year by year in school type of thing that we're all working on because it is so integral to all parts of our life.
• 1:02:25
  Sheri Gazitt: It really is, and we had our kids go through COVID, right? And so that was a huge disruption in connection.
• 1:02:32
  Sheri Gazitt: And in fact, it was a moment where saying, "Don't connect." So they're still kind of coming out of that and feeling the repercussions of that, and us as adults too.
• 1:02:43
  Alex Alexander [Narration]: Yeah, everybody. Well, Sheri, to close it out, if there is a parent who is listening right now, and their daughter is in the middle of a friendship crisis. What's the first thing they should do tonight?
• 1:02:53
  Sheri Gazitt: Well, they should first go to teen-wise.com to see what the support is, right? And they can get support for their daughter through private coaching, or they can get support for themselves through the Mom Wise Collective. Because sometimes the girls are not going to agree to do a discovery session. In addition to that, I would say one of the first things to do is to sit back and think about what are your limiting beliefs that you're bringing to the table. Journal about it, think about it, meditate about it, whatever you need to do. Go back to those years, those informative years, and think about what did you learn from your friendships?
• 1:03:28
  Sheri Gazitt: What limiting beliefs did you pull from those, and really dissect those, analyze them, work them out, right? See what you can release, and then you can parent your daughter in a different way when she's going through this stuff.
• 1:03:44
  Alex Alexander: Sheri, thank you so much for being here. This is just such an amazing episode and such a gift to so many parents who I know are struggling with this day in and day out.
• 1:03:55
  Sheri Gazitt: Yes, there's many, many parents struggling with this. Their kids are struggling, and there is help, as you said, Alex. It's a skill. It's not something innate. We can help them.
• 1:04:05
  Alex Alexander: Before I let you go, I want to leave you with one final thing, because we covered a lot of ground today, I want to remind you that friendship and connection is a skill. We talked about that in the episode. I say it in pretty much all my work everywhere, but part of what that actually means is that you practice this skill in small increments. So if you feel a lot of pressure after this episode to go out there and make all these changes and have all these conversations with your kid.
• 1:04:33
  Alex Alexander: Take a deep breath. You can just do little things and allow them to compound and build up. You can check in with yourself regularly. You can start practicing having these conversations with your kid, you can encourage your kid to have a small conversation instead of waiting for a big fight. You can do this all for yourself if you're reparenting. You are trying to help your teen or yourself make small shifts one at a time. That is how skills get built. It's not going to happen overnight, so just take that pressure off yourself if you left this episode feeling a little anxious about needing to make some sort of big shift. I also want to mention that I am so grateful to Sheri for doing this work because teen girls need it, moms and parents need it. So many parents message me telling me how they're trying to figure out how to navigate this.
• 1:05:30
  Alex Alexander: This is such an important space, and I'm so glad someone like her is tackling it. All of Sheri's information is in the show notes, so go check out Teen Wise, learn more about the Mom Wise Collective, and see what support looks like for you and your daughter. And with that, I'll see you next week.
• 1:05:51
  Alex Alexander: Thank you for listening to this episode of Friendship IRL. I am so honored to have these conversations with you. But don't let the chat die here.
• 1:05:58
  Alex Alexander: Send me a voice message. I created a special website just to chat with you. You can find it at alexalex.chat. You can also find me on Instagram. My handle, @itsalexalexander. Or go ahead and leave a review wherever you prefer to listen to podcasts. Now if you want to take this conversation a step further, send this episode to a friend. Tell them you found it interesting. And use what we just talked about as a conversation starter the next time you and your friend hang out. No need for a teary goodbye. I'll be back with a new episode next week.