Latest / The Other 22 Hours / Hunter Hayes on identity beyond music, high-efficiency routines, and radical vulnerability.

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Hunter Hayes on identity beyond music, high-efficiency routines, and radical vulnerability. · The Other 22 Hours

0:01
[SPEAKER_01]: I was so scared down to be dizzy.
0:03
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that's because I knew that on the other side of that was a life that I just hadn't even started building.
0:07
[SPEAKER_01]: And also a person that I didn't even know where to start to understand.
0:09
[SPEAKER_01]: When I showed up from music, I'm showing up.
0:11
[SPEAKER_01]: But it was the rest of that that I was like, OK, I don't know what to do with this human in those faces.
0:15
[SPEAKER_01]: So there was a fear of not working for a long time.
0:18
[SPEAKER_01]: And as things started to evolve in my career, there are times when you're not working as much in a single wrong with that.
0:24
[SPEAKER_01]: But I thought it was.
0:29
[SPEAKER_02]: We often define artists by their output, their records, books, movies, and the times they're on stage.
0:35
[SPEAKER_00]: But the art is made in the quiet, the struggle, and the mundane, the hours that no one sees.
0:41
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm McKayla Ann.
0:42
[SPEAKER_02]: And I'm Aaron Kramer-Hase.
0:44
[SPEAKER_02]: This is the other 22 hours.
0:46
[SPEAKER_02]: An exploration of the creative life lived in between.
1:03
[SPEAKER_02]: Today we're featuring our conversation with multi-platinum five-time Grammy-nominated singer, songwriter, and multi-instrumentalist, Hunter Hayes.
1:11
[SPEAKER_02]: Hunter got started at the age of four and by seven he was playing at the White House.
1:14
[SPEAKER_02]: He's gone on from there to share the stage with legends ranging from Stevie Wonder to Taylor Swift.
1:21
[SPEAKER_00]: And we were really lucky to have a beautiful, vulnerable conversation with Hunter where we talk about building everything from your creative business to your daily schedule from the inside out, leading with love and knowing when to grow up.
1:33
[SPEAKER_00]: Here's our conversation with Hunter Hayes.
1:38
[SPEAKER_00]: So we like to always just start with how are you today?
1:43
[SPEAKER_00]: And where are you physically and creatively?
1:46
[SPEAKER_00]: But that's a how are you really question?
1:48
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, honestly, by the grace of God, I am today's the day of just absolute, extra joy.
1:54
[SPEAKER_01]: this year's kicked off in a good way and putting some new practices in place and get a small habits doing kind of some new habits, hit reset and a lot of things getting away from a lot of things that we'll talk about obviously, but yeah, I was going through today.
2:09
[SPEAKER_01]: I had a couple of interviews before this.
2:11
[SPEAKER_01]: obviously release and music and very specifically about music and about releases.
2:16
[SPEAKER_01]: And so I was like, I don't know, I think I gave myself the morning to like, re-list into the album that I just made from a non-critical standpoint, but more from a like, okay, this is my therapy right now.
2:27
[SPEAKER_01]: Let me listen to this and see what I hear.
2:28
[SPEAKER_01]: See who I see.
2:29
[SPEAKER_01]: And there's like three moments where I just like burst into tears.
2:33
[SPEAKER_01]: What's it for fair for that?
2:34
[SPEAKER_01]: Because I'm so as you know, like I'm so close to this project that I've been doing it for a minute and working on it.
2:39
[SPEAKER_01]: And all these songs have just kind of like, I thought they'd kind of gotten them for me.
2:43
[SPEAKER_01]: And this morning was a beautiful sort of like, oh my god, they're not.
2:47
[SPEAKER_01]: And to be fair, there were a lot of technical things that went well for me.
2:51
[SPEAKER_01]: And that alone is the big win and a big celebration.
2:54
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm really happy.
2:56
[SPEAKER_01]: And also, I think there's a huge joy that comes with finally getting to talk about, you know, the music, obviously, today's been really fun to like share, because so much of my work I do by myself.
3:07
[SPEAKER_01]: And today's been just really fun to like get to talk about it for the first time all on time, but also the really looking for this conversation.
3:13
[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm very grateful to be here with you guys.
3:15
[SPEAKER_01]: because I think these are important conversations.
3:18
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think these bring a lot of light for me listening.
3:20
[SPEAKER_01]: So I'm very excited to be here.
3:22
[SPEAKER_01]: Physically, I am in a new studio.
3:24
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not a studio, it's just an extra bedroom house.
3:26
[SPEAKER_01]: But I fell in love with it because this was my flight sim room for a couple of years.
3:30
[SPEAKER_01]: And you can see like airplanes landing and taking off from B&A.
3:34
[SPEAKER_01]: And then I just went through the project at the beginning of the year.
3:37
[SPEAKER_01]: My living room used to be in my studio.
3:39
[SPEAKER_01]: Cause it was a great experience.
3:39
[SPEAKER_01]: just me and my dogs and I wanted the studio to be the house.
3:43
[SPEAKER_01]: I wanted to live in a studio so they creativity just happened whatever.
3:46
[SPEAKER_01]: And then I think I've really enjoyed having a place, you know, having my little safe zone and this has become my studio and there's no sound treatment, there's nothing fancy, there's just a collection of a bunch of stuff that makes me happy.
3:59
[SPEAKER_01]: So I'm in Nashville, I'm watching airplanes land at National International Airport and I am in my new favorite room.
4:06
[SPEAKER_00]: you're watching them like out your window or you have like a screen.
4:09
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.
4:10
[SPEAKER_01]: No, that's a great question because that would be that guy.
4:14
[SPEAKER_01]: But I do have a window and I literally can see planes on a final approach.
4:18
[SPEAKER_01]: So my nerd self is very excited.
4:20
[SPEAKER_00]: I love that you said because you know your background is that you've been doing this.
4:25
[SPEAKER_00]: since you are very, very young, like on a national stage from the time you were at four, is that correct that you were on a national television by the time you were four by seven, you'd played for President Bill Clinton at the White House.
4:37
[SPEAKER_00]: So I'm always curious, especially when you are a child, star, virtuosic musician, where it's just like a part of your entire essence from a very young age.
4:55
[SPEAKER_00]: outside of it.
4:56
[SPEAKER_00]: And I kind of from observation feel like it doesn't really feel necessary to build a life outside of it for a long time until you get to a point maybe in adulthood that it's like, oh wait, maybe I do want some other stuff.
5:09
[SPEAKER_00]: And I actually don't know because I was not a virtuosic national child star.
5:13
[SPEAKER_00]: So I'm curious what what's happening here that sentence too.
5:18
[UNKNOWN]: You don't need that.
5:18
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I just, not the best sentence.
5:21
[SPEAKER_00]: I just made it up right now.
5:23
[SPEAKER_03]: Oh, I love it.
5:25
[SPEAKER_00]: But I'm curious if you can talk to that a little bit about your process of forming your personality and self outside of not just your deep passion for making music, but also then the relationship to a public persona and achievement and accolades and career success at such a young age as well.
5:48
[SPEAKER_01]: The first thing that comes up is there was a tie-out when I did, I wouldn't call it an intensive, but it was sort of modeled after a group intensive and run by people who do intensive.
5:59
[SPEAKER_01]: But it was kind of like this unintentional intensive, it was like a group of artist creatives et cetera.
6:04
[SPEAKER_01]: And I was so scared of the season of life that I was going into because this was I guess 2018 where the eclipse was last like in Nashville because it was on the daily clips and you know the group goes and then it gets to me and I'm like scared because at that time for at least eight years I'd had the same band at a lot of the same crew and most of the band were going through.
6:31
[SPEAKER_01]: their version of, okay, I found a partner.
6:34
[SPEAKER_01]: They're having kids.
6:35
[SPEAKER_01]: They're starting a life outside of just 300 shows we do every year and I didn't have one and I was really scared and I realized that man so many, I have exceptions, there are very few exceptions and they're basically like four people.
6:49
[SPEAKER_01]: who, well, the only one that was watching right now, I'm dead, there were four people who were outside of my business that I could call a friend.
6:55
[SPEAKER_01]: But outside of those four people, and to be fair, there were more, I have to give credit to so many people, but people I felt like I could be myself around.
7:05
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm not qualified friends by people who showed up, because there are a lot of people who showed up for me on the ways that I couldn't appreciate for a long time.
7:10
[SPEAKER_01]: But I think that people that I self-safe to amassed around.
7:14
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, we're very soon far between and most of the people that I considered my friends were people that I worked with and I think that was the biggest wake up call because then you start to negotiate and this is a weird thing to say and I don't know that I've said this as much publicly and maybe I have, but it's weird to share you realize there's so many of the people that you
7:32
[SPEAKER_01]: don't know how to live your life without or part of the business, right?
7:35
[SPEAKER_01]: Like on paper, they're collecting a check and it's like, man, what is my relationship with this and how do I define and shout out so many of those people that I was afraid to lose have stayed consistent in my life.
7:47
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think that's a testament to the roots.
7:49
[SPEAKER_01]: But that was one of the wake-up calls for me.
7:52
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't think I had the ability to understand how to build a community because I think so much of everything that I thought about and did
8:02
[SPEAKER_01]: career, my entire life was career.
8:04
[SPEAKER_01]: And then obviously the pandemic changed a lot.
8:08
[SPEAKER_01]: And, you know, ended up doing my first solo intensive therapy at that time, it's several.
8:13
[SPEAKER_01]: And we're starting to renegotiate that I had moved to Los Angeles.
8:17
[SPEAKER_01]: And I feel like I moved to Los Angeles during the pandemic because I really needed to grow up.
8:22
[SPEAKER_01]: I didn't know the business, but I think some cautiously I needed to grow up because I had grown up in the industry.
8:26
[SPEAKER_01]: And so
8:28
[SPEAKER_01]: me was what I had built to survive and be good in the chaos at all.
8:35
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think that moving away was as much need like becoming adult growing up figuring out what that meant as it was me craving whatever.
8:45
[SPEAKER_01]: all the other reasons were, which were ballot and legit.
8:48
[SPEAKER_01]: I wanted to be close to the water.
8:49
[SPEAKER_01]: I wanted to experience a new place.
8:51
[SPEAKER_01]: I wanted to shock my system in so many ways that I do think that the heart of it was I wanted to grow up.
8:56
[SPEAKER_01]: I needed to grow up as a human.
8:58
[SPEAKER_01]: All the growing up that I had done, which just has the professional.
9:00
[SPEAKER_01]: So that was a big moment.
9:02
[SPEAKER_01]: And then sing a lot of time in LA, but also resetting in 2023 with being in Nashville more.
9:08
[SPEAKER_01]: I did that because I was like, oh man, like so much with my community was here and my favorite people were here and I wanted to be around them because I was single, you know, I had two dogs and I wanted to invest, I wanted to be in my coach less the hook they one day and I was talking about community craving people and craving friends and also craving a meeting of partner or at least meeting people
9:28
[SPEAKER_01]: that I could date or whatever, and she was like, imagine if you could pass the amount of energy that you could put into your career into meeting people into your person.
9:36
[SPEAKER_01]: And I was like, you know, one side was like, it would really that supplement on the other side.
9:40
[SPEAKER_01]: I was like, what if I just tried it and lowered the hold within a month of setting that intention of like, I'm going to make space for my person.
9:47
[SPEAKER_01]: I took a month off, which is the longest I've ever taken any time off at a cell weird.
9:52
[SPEAKER_01]: But that's a month where I met some really important people in my life now, because I had made space for them.
9:56
[SPEAKER_01]: and I'm still learning how to make assisted space for them.
10:00
[SPEAKER_01]: So I'd feel like that's me understanding how to piece together the rest of it because from 15, you know, it was only child, lyrdy kid in school, I had friends that tended to recluse most of the time because music may be happier, vehicles easier, there was less to think about.
10:16
[SPEAKER_01]: And when you bring up specifically like the public persona part of it, they still kind of try to understand that.
10:22
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that's part of my complication with my religious and social media.
10:26
[SPEAKER_01]: Like, I can't gling that whole thing because it's one thing when you put out a record and their labels like, we want you to do a radio tour.
10:33
[SPEAKER_01]: And it's like, okay, this is something dry.
10:35
[SPEAKER_01]: I know what's expected of me.
10:37
[SPEAKER_01]: I could show up, I could talk about my music.
10:39
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm building relationships and that's great, but I think when social media gets involved, you're kind of all there or you're not there at all.
10:45
[SPEAKER_01]: And you're either showing up fully or you're kind of just showing up and that doesn't click is what I'm noticed.
10:54
[SPEAKER_01]: So we can unpack any part of us, but I'm still kind of understanding that I'd say, yeah.
11:00
[SPEAKER_02]: Hey, just a quick pause from this conversation.
11:02
[SPEAKER_02]: The other 22 hours is an independent production built entirely on the idea that he's quiet on his conversation's matter.
11:08
[SPEAKER_02]: The best way to support our work is simply to share it, so if you can think of one person who would appreciate this show, please pass it along.
11:14
[SPEAKER_02]: And if you haven't yet, please follow our show in your listening platform of choice, or subscribe to our channel on YouTube.
11:20
[SPEAKER_02]: It's a small action that makes a massive difference for us.
11:23
[SPEAKER_02]: Thanks for being here.
11:24
[SPEAKER_02]: Let's get back to our conversation.
11:28
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I love that idea of unpacking pulling back layers and I can definitely relate to the excitement and inspiration in that.
11:36
[SPEAKER_02]: I had a very similar situation where I was like, oh, I can put effort into like myself.
11:42
[SPEAKER_02]: I don't have to just turn to blind eye to that at a pure 100% like jet fuel ambition.
11:49
[SPEAKER_02]: I can slow down and they can feed each other and it can become this symbiotic relationship.
11:54
[SPEAKER_02]: Like, same kind of, I had somebody basically, like you said like a verbal right hook where I was like, all of a sudden it was like, in the Truman show where his boat runs into the edge of the world, quote unquote, you know, you're like, wait a second.
12:05
[SPEAKER_02]: There's more here and it can be like a kind of a little bit of like a life trust fall in a way.
12:11
[SPEAKER_02]: You're like, here we go.
12:12
[SPEAKER_02]: Let's try this.
12:13
[SPEAKER_02]: You have to say part.
12:14
[SPEAKER_01]: I was so scared not to be dizzy and I think that's because I knew that on the other side of that was a lie that I just hadn't even started building and also a person that I didn't even order to start to understand.
12:24
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank God, like there's a book that I've listened to where people that I've heard talk and it's not as cut and dry as like I had a performance like now when I show up from music I'm showing up but it was the rest of it that I was like okay I don't know what to do with this human in those faces.
12:36
[SPEAKER_01]: So there was a fear of not working for a long time.
12:39
[SPEAKER_01]: And as things started to evolve in my career, there are times when you're not working as much and as you think wrong with that, that I thought it was.
12:46
[SPEAKER_00]: I think we all think that.
12:49
[SPEAKER_00]: Anytime it's slow, I think that the training that the messaging we've received in kind of ambition and I don't know how old you are currently, but
13:01
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel the millennial age group is like, you know, we grew up kind of just being told like, work hard.
13:07
[SPEAKER_00]: You can be anything you want to be dream big.
13:10
[SPEAKER_00]: And the emphasis that I always really received was on career and not this kind of big picture of
13:18
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes, we're cutting your career, but also focus on that you can have intentional energy and time put towards your development of yourself and your social life and your relationships and it just in my mind was like those things just kind of happen or their sacrifice.
13:37
[SPEAKER_00]: at least for a long time when you're early in your career and you just got to keep going and if you miss things like in people's lives like that's just how it is and I think what happens for a lot of people and at least what happened for me I'll just speak for myself and let Aaron speak for yourself but you start to just feel this kind of emptiness in it.
13:56
[SPEAKER_00]: that like the drive isn't as fulfilling as it once was.
14:00
[SPEAKER_00]: Or even like the moments of achievement, don't feel as great as you thought they were going to.
14:07
[SPEAKER_00]: And all of a sudden like you're like, maybe I need to search for more meaning, more purpose, deeper meaning around my whole life.
14:16
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think for us, we have two children and that kind of like really shifted, but I remember early on pandemic and we had our first child in the midst of the pandemic and I was really grappling with all this stuff and my therapist was like Michaela, what are your non career goals in life?
14:33
[SPEAKER_00]: And I was like, what are those?
14:36
[SPEAKER_02]: I thought girl, I thought goals were only professional.
14:40
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I literally was like, I thought, you know, like it wasn't like, I didn't think of, you know, find a partner, build a family.
14:48
[SPEAKER_00]: Like, I never thought of that as like a goal.
14:51
[SPEAKER_00]: I thought of like that was something that would probably happen.
14:54
[SPEAKER_00]: It's so interesting to shift that perspective of, okay, and if you recycle of building that or building friendships or use the word community, which I think is really interesting because also when you're the front person of a career when you're a solo artist or the leader of a band, your quote unquote community is your touring business, but everything is very focused.
15:18
[SPEAKER_00]: on you.
15:18
[SPEAKER_00]: And even when you're really trying to be conscientious of it, it can be hard to really feel like what it really is to be in a community where there's a lot of times, I feel like it's necessary, where life is not about me.
15:32
[SPEAKER_00]: And I have to make sacrifices to put other people first.
15:36
[SPEAKER_00]: and miss out on things that I wanna do because I need to show up for other people in my life.
15:41
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think that is one of the ways that sometimes a music career can like create some arrested development for a lot of us.
15:49
[SPEAKER_00]: Do you have feelings about that?
15:50
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, the word community, I think you are surrounded by somebody to, I mean, to me the challenges.
15:55
[SPEAKER_01]: This sort of, as you put a front man leader in the band as it were, the beauty of that first fall in so many ways get to pick who I'm surrounded by.
16:04
[SPEAKER_01]: I feel lucky that I did have good examples.
16:08
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not like I'm starting from a scratch.
16:09
[SPEAKER_01]: I have had good examples of great people who has built beautiful careers.
16:13
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, one of the earliest examples of that was Dan Haas, Dan and I worked together for seven months straight five days a week, no breaks.
16:20
[SPEAKER_01]: I think he took somewhere in snow for Christmas and then we were right back at it, but he stopped at five pm every day.
16:27
[SPEAKER_01]: And there was one night where I wanted to work on something and him and his wife had there.
16:31
[SPEAKER_01]: They were out at the house and, you know, we don't need to have it for a while.
16:35
[SPEAKER_01]: And I was like, would you be comfortable with me like staying in your house and your studio and working?
16:39
[SPEAKER_01]: And he was like, let me check in on this and see how this feels and he was like, okay.
16:42
[SPEAKER_01]: We're going to go to dinner, if you want to work late, here's a piece, you know, lock up when you leave.
16:47
[SPEAKER_01]: But talk about a rest of the development.
16:49
[SPEAKER_01]: I so relate to the like, that just happens when it happens, right?
16:53
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, if I say focus like career, that'll happen.
16:55
[SPEAKER_01]: And you know, I'm looking back at times.
16:57
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm like studying a lot of music through this, like touring, going back and rebuilding relationships with older songs.
17:03
[SPEAKER_01]: And there's a period of music that's really interesting because it's not like I wasn't there to make it.
17:07
[SPEAKER_01]: And now it's not like I wasn't present to make it.
17:09
[SPEAKER_01]: but there is a little bit of missing life from it and it's not the fault of the song.
17:14
[SPEAKER_01]: I just think it's the lack of life lived and a week has gone off on vacation in between Torve doesn't really count and for me that realization happened recently honestly because even still after the pandemic and
17:29
[SPEAKER_01]: switching to a, in my view, the way that I look at it is kind of a second career almost because my first one started when I was four getting to the label doing the big releases and then becoming independent and building my own team one person one team member one collaborator at a time whether be agency or piece of the time starting to realize oh music human can only really handle certain things a certain way.
17:53
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm curious in this second career and building your team and really seeing independently how and I'd love to hear a little more about your process of use that you've done therapy and you really felt like okay now I've had to grow up like how that is.
18:09
[SPEAKER_00]: changing your approach going into an album release now, knowing all that comes with an album campaign, going back on tour.
18:16
[SPEAKER_00]: Are you kind of like mentally trying to approach it in a different way as well as building in practices or boundaries or different things that maybe you hadn't in the past?
18:28
[SPEAKER_01]: I started this year with like an eight hour a day.
18:32
[SPEAKER_01]: I hope my manager doesn't mind me saying this if so.
18:35
[SPEAKER_01]: She can text me and I can stop.
18:38
[SPEAKER_01]: But we started this year with like a, I'm not answering any emails.
18:43
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm not answering any text until you and I sit down and we talk about the year from this point now to this point next year.
18:51
[SPEAKER_01]: And a lot of my goals are changed and like I love making out memes in like a thematic.
18:57
[SPEAKER_01]: world.
18:58
[SPEAKER_01]: But I don't work.
19:00
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, the getting excited about five songs and then having to finish the other five because you're in the time period that you've set us.
19:06
[SPEAKER_01]: I did make an album part doesn't excite me anymore.
19:09
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't think it ever did.
19:11
[SPEAKER_01]: There was an excitement to like, we have to race in a sandwich line, but there's always like a little bit of a man I wish I could have
19:18
[SPEAKER_01]: taking them trip outside of the studio and then come back after six months.
19:22
[SPEAKER_01]: And so like two years ago and I started they ever bring past.
19:27
[SPEAKER_01]: I expressed that I really wanted it to feel like a growing garden.
19:32
[SPEAKER_01]: I didn't want to just like present.
19:34
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, here's the box, here's the thing, and I tried to work that way still, and I loved like large batch of time where I didn't have nothing to do with work on music, but also that's very unrealistic.
19:44
[SPEAKER_01]: What I knew that I wanted was a schedule and a strategy that worked the way that I do.
19:50
[SPEAKER_01]: I wanted to do singles because I knew that that's how I get excited.
19:55
[SPEAKER_01]: That's how my natural course ends to be.
19:59
[SPEAKER_01]: And so as we make the calendar for like this year, we're taking a lot of parts from last year and going, I felt good about that.
20:05
[SPEAKER_01]: And we're noticing the parts where it's dealt a little, like an aviation is determined, like you're behind the airplane, where it's like you're technically flying there plane, but there's like a whole checklist of things that you haven't even looked at and if something goes wrong, you don't really know where to start because you don't know where you are.
20:19
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think that's kind of where I found myself in times recently,
20:22
[SPEAKER_01]: So, learning a lot from that, and also just learning how my brain works.
20:26
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that's a big part of it.
20:27
[SPEAKER_01]: And rather than citing my brain to stick to, yes, I know I need to do.
20:32
[SPEAKER_01]: I got to list this stuff so I want to do.
20:33
[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm like, all right, how's my brain going to do this best?
20:36
[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm starting to sort of like,
20:38
[SPEAKER_01]: Approach it from the other side of the court, you know, so we sat and we looked at the calendar and we looked at everything from the way that the week's go for me, you know, a writing day is a writing day.
20:48
[SPEAKER_01]: I can't answer any text.
20:50
[SPEAKER_01]: I wish I could, but I can't answer any text.
20:52
[SPEAKER_01]: I can't answer any questions.
20:54
[SPEAKER_01]: I have like basically like seven kinds of days that I put in the calendar.
20:58
[SPEAKER_01]: And like three of them, I communicate with my team like it's not that I'm like pretending to be on vacation, but like it's you need something like make sure we put it on a day where and it's obviously exceptions and obviously days move, but you know, like a writing day I'm probably not likely to text back because it takes so much for me to show a bonerbly in that room and then it takes me a solid like three hours to decompress from it.
21:23
[SPEAKER_01]: And if I'm excited about it, I'm probably going to want to work on the song and so probably get I'd protect this face a little bit longer and extend that window so that I can stay safe and keep creating.
21:33
[SPEAKER_01]: Studio days are a little bit different.
21:35
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm looking for outside influence.
21:37
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm looking for side of the last, you know, I'm wanting more just as to kind of shake me up.
21:43
[SPEAKER_01]: Stotes are very by the book calendar schedule.
21:47
[SPEAKER_01]: I need everything I have.
21:49
[SPEAKER_01]: access to available at 9 PM.
21:52
[SPEAKER_01]: There's no exception like I want to see what my voice is there when I get on stage.
21:57
[SPEAKER_01]: I want to feel like I'm present, etc.
21:59
[SPEAKER_01]: So that's how we've approached this schedule for, I mean, to be fair, we've done that for like four or five years, but I'm just learning so many different pieces of it.
22:07
[SPEAKER_01]: Being an independent artist is especially challenging because you can get a call from somebody and they can talk about a big number of money
22:17
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know if you call them triggers, but I have a lot of things that come up when that happens.
22:21
[SPEAKER_01]: So it's like, I have to almost step out of this studio because I can't even be close to.
22:24
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm scared that I'll hurt the energy in the room for myself.
22:28
[SPEAKER_01]: So like, those are very different days.
22:29
[SPEAKER_01]: I even have a separate desk in the house now that I use for those conversations.
22:34
[SPEAKER_01]: And so it's because it's so sensitive because it's like, I can't be the bank in the artists at the same time.
22:39
[SPEAKER_01]: That's the big one that I wish there was a class for artists getting into the industry that helped people understand that because I think
22:47
[SPEAKER_01]: That kind of stuff, you know, that was a big lesson for me.
22:50
[SPEAKER_01]: I recently got to work through a lot of that, but that's hard, right?
22:53
[SPEAKER_01]: That's that.
22:54
[SPEAKER_01]: And it would be wrong to pretend that I was supposed to just kind of be okay with it.
22:58
[SPEAKER_01]: I need to acknowledge that it is hard to think that like, I have to be both the business and the creator.
23:03
[SPEAKER_01]: And for me, those things don't happen on the same day, you know, so making a settled that kind of works with that and having a team that, you know, I've communicated that to and they understand it and they're cool with it and they slow with me has helped and there's like so much more room to grow up to.
23:25
[SPEAKER_02]: you know like having like a set schedule or a system but way to approach things that is effective and inefficient and it's melding both sides of the brain where you're using your analytical brain to plan and optimize but it's all coming from your creative left side brain or your heart unlike
23:42
[SPEAKER_02]: This is what's best.
23:44
[SPEAKER_02]: This is when it's going to work in the two of those together.
23:46
[SPEAKER_02]: I think it's such a powerful combination, but what I really want to highlight is you were talking about like holding the space and staying safe.
23:53
[SPEAKER_02]: And I think there's so much, you know, that the, oh, I'm just going to take a peek at this email real quick.
23:58
[SPEAKER_02]: You can't see it.
24:02
[SPEAKER_02]: You know, my brain, like, even if it's just a peak, I am not going to be able to get back to where I was because it's like a tennis ball still bouncing around in my head somewhere.
24:10
[SPEAKER_02]: That's so important, but to do that self analysis of what works for you and what you need takes such a softness and a vulnerability and like a compassion towards yourself that at least for me and my experience talking about that like jet fuel the ambition of like, no, I have to do this and like white knuckle it is the exact opposite end.
24:27
[SPEAKER_02]: I really had to learn how to have compassion for myself and understand that saying like, oh, I can't look at this right now.
24:33
[SPEAKER_02]: It's not a weakness.
24:35
[SPEAKER_02]: It's actually finding strength in my vulnerability to this influence that I can then use here.
24:40
[SPEAKER_02]: So I just wanted to draw that connection that like I can tell it takes some work to be able to carve out a schedule like that and hold it strongly.
24:46
[SPEAKER_02]: It's bouncing both hands of the spectrum.
24:48
[SPEAKER_01]: For sure, like right now, I'm trying to, you know, before tour or thought, I never knew how to do a weekend for a long time.
24:54
[SPEAKER_01]: I credit my friend, Christina, for teaching me how to actually do it like a Sunday, because like living in Asheville does it a word day than like Monday's in Tuesday's year and a home, you can do laundry and, you know, you can't go.
25:05
[SPEAKER_01]: They antique stores because they're not open on Monday but they're open on Tuesday's.
25:08
[SPEAKER_01]: So for so long, it was just like survival.
25:10
[SPEAKER_01]: But right now I'm working with a five day week, six days.
25:14
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm gonna be productive, but I'm gonna be productive from my future.
25:18
[SPEAKER_01]: rewiring this studio was a Saturday.
25:21
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to give myself the future gifts thing because it's been so much fun to walk back into this and this is a setup from like four years ago that I kind of had put to the side if it was awesome but like I didn't have the space for it so I've made this space for it and then Sundays are just like I call them either potato days or sweet potato days but day to day they're just like I would couch potato
25:39
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm not going to accomplish anything.
25:41
[SPEAKER_01]: No one's expecting anything of me and my partner even knows that like asking me a question about either or is probably not going to yield any kind of successful results like I'll give you an answer, but I might change my mind tomorrow.
25:55
[SPEAKER_01]: sweet potato days are like kind of productive.
25:57
[SPEAKER_01]: I like those dream days, you know, digitalizing, putting a bunch of stuff in a bunch of random cards online and saying, okay, I'll think about this for a week.
26:05
[SPEAKER_01]: And if I need it, at that point, I'll reconsider all those things.
26:08
[SPEAKER_01]: But yeah, like I'm playing with are the like technical conversations better to have on Monday at the beginning of the week.
26:14
[SPEAKER_01]: And so you can kind of like ramp back out of it.
26:16
[SPEAKER_01]: And then I have like two days a week that I do like social media specifically because I've really
26:25
[SPEAKER_01]: and giving myself space to create, space to fail and space to try, rather than we need five pieces, so like, yeah, you know, but like, those are kind of in the middle of the week.
26:35
[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm playing with are the business conversations better at the beginning of the week, because I've had the weekend to sort of like, flush old energy and set up myself.
26:45
[SPEAKER_01]: Or is it better in the middle of the week when I hit the swamp?
26:47
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, I just become the business guy on Wednesday.
26:50
[SPEAKER_01]: You know what I mean?
26:51
[SPEAKER_01]: I am playing with that a lot right now.
26:53
[SPEAKER_00]: This is the kind of stuff that we nerd out on all the time.
26:56
[SPEAKER_00]: Erin went hard on it years ago and now has pulled me in and I'm like, I see the value in routine and systems and now it makes me really excited.
27:05
[SPEAKER_00]: Because then there's so much space to play within it.
27:09
[SPEAKER_00]: which was hard to realize before, especially when you're younger and you're just like, oh, I have this romanticized idea of what it is to be an artist.
27:17
[SPEAKER_00]: And I just want to be able to do what I want when I want.
27:20
[SPEAKER_00]: And that's just not sustainable.
27:23
[SPEAKER_00]: But one thing I want to point out of what you said, which I think is really cool is that you said that you and your team were looking at what makes you excited and how you work.
27:33
[SPEAKER_00]: And then wanting to shape your business around that.
27:36
[SPEAKER_00]: versus what I think is so typical in the music industry of looking out and seeing what's everyone doing right now.
27:43
[SPEAKER_00]: What's the trend?
27:45
[SPEAKER_00]: What's successful?
27:46
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, that's what we got to do.
27:47
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, oh, everybody is doing acoustic records.
27:50
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's do acoustic records.
27:51
[SPEAKER_00]: So let's do acoustic versions of everything or everyone's doing this or TikTok is where we got to do like the outside informing us of how we should spend our creative time is the dominant ethos.
28:04
[SPEAKER_00]: It's really cool to hear you say and hear that you've also built a team that's on board with that of wait, what is naturally exciting and therefore vibrant and engaging and more creatively productive for Hunter and therefore we're all going to be excited to work this more and let's build from there.
28:24
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I wish more people were yelling from the rooftop because I didn't also need to believe it for a while, right?
28:30
[SPEAKER_01]: Like my goals can start here versus okay, I see what that person's doing.
28:35
[SPEAKER_01]: I want to do that.
28:35
[SPEAKER_01]: There was a podcast that I was listening to and he was just saying, you know, I know that my clients are going to be more successful.
28:41
[SPEAKER_01]: at the financial planning, if they tell me what's seat on the airplane, they want to sit on what day of the year, what flight, and then what hotel room they want when they get there, you know, or like, sitting with the specifics of, and I think I'm grateful for this lesson because I've now seen evidence of like,
28:59
[SPEAKER_01]: It's seemingly obvious, and to those who are listening, if it seems obvious to you, in congratulations.
29:03
[SPEAKER_01]: You're mild ahead of you.
29:05
[SPEAKER_01]: Where I was for so long.
29:07
[SPEAKER_01]: But starting with what then you exactly do I want to play in every city?
29:10
[SPEAKER_01]: And it can be as simple as what is my version of success, and it can be as beautifully come, like,
29:18
[SPEAKER_01]: As I know, I want to play the rhyme again, you know, that's kind of obvious just I've always loved that room and the build is that room and the way that it's designed is the way that it feels on stage times in my life, it's been incredibly intimidating to stand on that stage and I hated it so that I know I love it for that.
29:34
[SPEAKER_01]: I know the kind of albums that I want to make and again it's like I'm saying all this and as I'm here myself say it's like well, duh, but also that's not how I was taught or not the things that I think I picked up on in my like building of my own school right finding mentors or like people that I looked up to I didn't know you could start from here and go like no I want to do like five just six months of touring specifically every year.
29:56
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't want to have five to six months where I know I'm in a studio that way I can put on both hats and show fully.
30:01
[SPEAKER_01]: It's anyone's listening or needs the confirmation that that's a viable way to build a career.
30:07
[SPEAKER_01]: I would almost argue that it's the only way to actually build a career.
30:10
[SPEAKER_01]: I've seen the success in an external goal being something we work towards.
30:15
[SPEAKER_01]: Seeing the difference between that and the success of something I really wanted and I was so excited about and I never lost excited about it and even though other people aren't because there's also the challenge that you have a vision for something there's a huge likelihood that no one you talk to is going to appreciate understand value or see in any kind of way that they're in the way that you have it but that's the reason that you're in the position you're in that's the reason why you have to take it and say excited about it that was the hardest lesson one of the hardest lessons for me to learn professionally.
30:42
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's something that still fires me up because there are weird things that I get excited about.
30:46
[SPEAKER_01]: We're projects I want to do and I've learned that I just need a carve time to do them and show people what they look like and be specific.
30:54
[SPEAKER_01]: I love YouTube because I love creating visual things.
30:57
[SPEAKER_01]: So it's like yeah, I love making music videos but also like how do we make more time in the ear for me to do more fun and dust with that platform or like long-form visual music content?
31:07
[SPEAKER_01]: And also to your point about the structure, I mean, it is wild how much the structure I'm on a very consistent daily schedule.
31:14
[SPEAKER_01]: It's almost the same time every day.
31:15
[SPEAKER_01]: And I did not think I would enjoy it as much as I'm enjoying it.
31:18
[SPEAKER_01]: But everything down to like, I've now got it in the calendar, you know, the floor is in March, but I'm already rehearsing the album twice through every day from this time to this time.
31:28
[SPEAKER_01]: And the consistency of that is like life getting in fun.
31:31
[SPEAKER_02]: Like with that structure, it's a lot of hard tedious work at first to, you know, really carve out like what you need, the time commitment for that will like what resonates with you how to do that, but once you kind of make a modular schedule like that, you don't have to think about it and it just freeze your brain up to be creative and freeze your brain up to just explore, you know, the equivalent of like I now understand why people eat like the same breakfast every day.
31:55
[SPEAKER_02]: They wake up.
31:56
[SPEAKER_02]: They eat it.
31:56
[SPEAKER_02]: It's done their full.
31:57
[SPEAKER_02]: They don't have to think about it.
31:58
[SPEAKER_02]: That's all this brain power that you could put into like, what am I going to use this?
32:03
[SPEAKER_02]: How am I going to create?
32:04
[SPEAKER_00]: We had Shelley right on here and she talked about how she eats.
32:08
[SPEAKER_00]: I think oatmeal every single day.
32:10
[SPEAKER_00]: And we were like, oh, is that because it frees up your brain and she was like, maybe.
32:15
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, well that one less choice that we have to make you know there's a thousand choices We make whether we're conscious or not.
32:22
[SPEAKER_02]: There's a thousand choices every day that we have to make and so if we can Eleviate some of those we can make the more fun choices like does this song really need a bridge?
32:30
[SPEAKER_02]: What about a post course?
32:32
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know you know leave room for us to pop up There's also the reality of knowing how to show up.
32:37
[SPEAKER_01]: That's my biggest thing Cuz then that tell me directly what I'm showing up for
32:41
[SPEAKER_01]: for rehearsals.
32:42
[SPEAKER_01]: I know no one's watching.
32:43
[SPEAKER_01]: Once it's sitting, I get to practice and I get to learn for studio time.
32:48
[SPEAKER_01]: I know that I'm showing up as kind of producer, me, or for writing.
32:52
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm showing up as the lyricist and for stuff like this.
32:56
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm showing up as I'm open to talking about any part of the process that we get to talk about.
33:00
[SPEAKER_01]: And I hope I do get to talk about parts of the process.
33:02
[SPEAKER_01]: I certainly wouldn't talk about this on a business set.
33:05
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, well, we talk a lot on here about the changing of goals and also in the path of being an artist, how differentiating between what are the goals that are dictated, whether we're conscious of it or not, and that we just automatically think, of course I want to try and win a Grammy, or of course I want to play this festival.
33:25
[SPEAKER_00]: And as you live it, I think for a lot of people, those kind of things shift.
33:29
[SPEAKER_00]: You've mentioned that I'm curious about a little more specifics because you are someone who has accomplished a lot and been nominated for awards and performed with massive artists like Taylor Swift and Stevie Wonder.
33:43
[SPEAKER_00]: So like when you've, for a lack of a better term, seen the mountain top, seemingly,
33:48
[SPEAKER_00]: How do you then recalibrate your brain of what's next and is it creative fulfillment or kind of like sometimes I think we can have like the video game achievement of when we're on an ambitious path?
34:03
[SPEAKER_00]: We had Edwin McCain on here and he talked about how, you know, yeah, this huge hits in the 90s and early 2000s.
34:11
[SPEAKER_00]: And then he really shifted down intentionally and was like, I wanted to just coast so that I could be with my family.
34:17
[SPEAKER_00]: He was like, I just spent a long time just playing 500 caprooms and playing the hits that everyone wanted to hear because that sustained my life and allowed me to have ample time with my family.
34:32
[SPEAKER_00]: someone else would maybe not find that fulfilling or successful feeling.
34:38
[SPEAKER_00]: So I'm curious for you how your goals specifically have shifted, especially achieving so many high-tiered things.
34:46
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, the first thing I came to mind was how the team and I look at specifically show opportunities.
34:52
[SPEAKER_01]: There's shows that you even break a lot of this in the subcategories, but there's shows that seal good, there's shows that pay good, and there's shows that can do a lot of good.
35:02
[SPEAKER_01]: I think becoming independent, I've become a little bit more comfortable with the conversations around the money of it all, because at the end of the day I don't make music.
35:11
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I do technically make music to make money, but I heard someone say, really, it's a hearted that I'm making money so that I can continue to make music.
35:18
[SPEAKER_01]: That's why I can't live without.
35:20
[SPEAKER_01]: And so I'd enjoy, I think, the portions of the game of it all, and that, okay, I've got some financial goals.
35:28
[SPEAKER_01]: And I love tearing that from everyone because there are parts of that that are just like, I feel like in six years.
35:35
[SPEAKER_01]: based on my current age, I'm probably going to want the opportunity to stay home with my kids when I have kids, like I do want to make a lot of shifts, and I want to be in a position where I can continue to make music, but I can shift some more things back to being on my terms.
35:52
[SPEAKER_01]: And so a lot of the goals that I have, I think of everything in three.
35:57
[SPEAKER_01]: They're sort of the financial side of everything, but also I know the kind of show that I want to put on and I know that they're certain things that work really well for that show and those are the things that I want to keep working towards.
36:08
[SPEAKER_01]: I also know like the size of the crew that I want to have like I've seen the parts that are really fun and there's this certain size of the crew.
36:16
[SPEAKER_01]: that is both fun and connected.
36:19
[SPEAKER_01]: And to me, that also sees into the show as better because we get to all in New York.
36:25
[SPEAKER_01]: And we're also in the specific room that is capable of holding that show and building that show while reducing the stress on the crew.
36:32
[SPEAKER_01]: And also the side of the audience, there's a certain side of the room that I see like I can connect with everybody in and be human and vulnerable.
36:39
[SPEAKER_01]: And I've seen a couple shows in certain venues that I used to think I wanted to be in, and that's played them.
36:44
[SPEAKER_01]: I think Grace of God can't believe that I get to say that.
36:47
[SPEAKER_01]: And I've experienced on both sides on from the audience and from the stage.
36:52
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, you've kind of got to create something bigger than human in a way that I don't, isn't aligned with how I want to show up on stage.
36:59
[SPEAKER_01]: So I've been able to kind of rule some of that out.
37:02
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, listen, I played tomorrow if I could anyway, but because it still would be fun, but I think when we're talking about sustainability, I'm not saying I'm ruling everything out, but I am saying what we're talking about sustainability.
37:15
[SPEAKER_01]: There are specific things there, and I want my audience to understand, what are the first things that said will be started working on ever green two years ago, it's like, I really want my audience to have the relationship with me that I have with certain YouTubers that I watch for.
37:27
[SPEAKER_01]: I can set my watch to them.
37:29
[SPEAKER_01]: Like every other week, they put out a video, right?
37:32
[SPEAKER_01]: For me, I want my fans to know, like, oh, yeah, that's Hunter.
37:34
[SPEAKER_01]: He puts out music all the time.
37:36
[SPEAKER_01]: That's just what he does.
37:37
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, sometimes he tours it, sometimes he doesn't, sometimes it's about this.
37:40
[SPEAKER_01]: Every project has a message, has a meaning, has a theme, et cetera.
37:43
[SPEAKER_01]: Not just, okay, I'm putting out an album because I want this to this.
37:46
[SPEAKER_01]: So we're putting out music right now when the evergreen era because I want evergreen to sort of be this, not escape, but sort of the series of letters from your future.
37:54
[SPEAKER_01]: I want it to be a place for prayer and manifestation.
37:57
[SPEAKER_01]: this sort of safe place to dream, imagine your future, imagine your future self, and I want the shows to feel like that too, this sort of medicinal quality to it.
38:05
[SPEAKER_01]: So everything is geared towards, I feel good about doing this amount of shows every year in this format, because I also know that that allows me to build the best team, and I want to be surrounded by people who love what they do too.
38:16
[SPEAKER_01]: And I guess I'm attracted obviously to the people that are valuing things at the same time that I am.
38:20
[SPEAKER_01]: So that's part of it.
38:21
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't want to get into specifics because I, you know, those are very personal, but those are the kind of things that I've learned how to put into words and like gift those to my team, my collaborators, my partner, so that we're all kind of on the same page of what I'm building towards and why I'm building it.
38:37
[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know if that answer your question.
38:39
[SPEAKER_00]: It definitely does.
38:40
[SPEAKER_00]: And again, it was really cool listening to you share that because your goals of your ambitions of the rooms you want to be in, or, you know, and even financially what you want to work towards, the way that you shared it was clear that it's, again, starting from the inside out.
38:54
[SPEAKER_00]: So it's starting from this is these songs that I make have specific meaning that I want to connect for people in this way and therefore to communicate those songs I want to make this type of show and then the ripple effect of these are the things that we would need to make the art that I really want to make.
39:14
[SPEAKER_00]: Rather than, oh yeah, my dream is to be able to play Bridgestone every year because that's the way my brain works.
39:21
[SPEAKER_00]: There's nothing wrong with that, but I think it's really beautiful when you witness an artist who seems like you've come to really continually try and learn and know yourself.
39:31
[SPEAKER_00]: Where you're at right now, and then that's communicated through your songs.
39:35
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you for saying that I know that I'm going to lose sleep over this because when I talk about my goals, I want to be very careful and I want to give context that I'm not speaking against anyone else's goals or speaking against any other formats.
39:48
[SPEAKER_01]: I just know what I'm good at also to something that I thought about as those kind of preparedness conversation is that sort of like argument or the polarizing conversation around what you want to do and I think the misconception is I want to do it itself fish it'll make me feel good.
40:02
[SPEAKER_01]: First of all, I think there are a lot of things that we need to do that are selfish, that might seem selfish, because we do deserve to feel good, but when I say feel good, I mean it's low, I am live and purpose.
40:13
[SPEAKER_01]: I am doing it, that's what I was put on this earth to do.
40:15
[SPEAKER_01]: I know it because I'm lit up, I'm on fire and I am so aligned with every part of what's happening today.
40:21
[SPEAKER_01]: It's happening easy and I don't mean that it's like easy and a lazy way.
40:26
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean that I am specifically geared to do exactly this, something that I've had to negotiate is like,
40:32
[SPEAKER_01]: I really want to do this and I've tried to reward that for myself and just I feel led to do this.
40:38
[SPEAKER_01]: I feel like I'm supposed to do this and that is, you know, I've started saying conviction a lot in 2016.
40:44
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think that's because of that, I was trying to say, you know, I'm not moving with confidence and I'm not moving from selfishness.
40:51
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm moving from I feel like I'm supposed to do this.
40:54
[SPEAKER_01]: So I'm really in love with sharing that because I really wish more artists would also think about that.
41:00
[SPEAKER_01]: And the abundance of knowing that you're doing what you're meant to be doing where your place on the start, we should provide to do what you're built to do with no one else can do.
41:07
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and I think when you are very in touch with that, it resonates.
41:13
[SPEAKER_00]: It's not selfish because it's so connective then.
41:16
[SPEAKER_00]: It's
41:17
[SPEAKER_00]: an invitation for others.
41:18
[SPEAKER_00]: When I see someone who is so, you know, strongly in their conviction and their messaging and then their, you know, whether it connects with me or not, I feel that energy and it gives me permission to carry myself in the same way.
41:32
[SPEAKER_00]: I think that's what's so beautiful about art.
41:35
[SPEAKER_00]: a lot of us with self awareness have to grapple with this, like, are we narcissists?
41:39
[SPEAKER_00]: Are we selfish?
41:41
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, I'm also in grad school right now studying depth psychology of creativity because I'm so interested in how creativity, how our mind works, and honestly how creativity benefits us as humans not just professional artists, just any human that it's not designated just for the talented ones, but that creativity is essential to being a human and
42:00
[SPEAKER_00]: I think that's the biggest thing is like sharing is intuitive.
42:04
[SPEAKER_00]: It's not because we're self-obsessed.
42:07
[SPEAKER_00]: It's an invitation to connect.
42:09
[SPEAKER_00]: And it sounds like you've been on a journey really standing strong in that, which sounds really beautiful.
42:13
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I appreciate you saying that.
42:15
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's what I crave the most out of music is connecting.
42:18
[SPEAKER_01]: the ceiling of being a human and being with other humans is my relationship with music.
42:25
[SPEAKER_01]: Which has changed because I think originally it was the love and adoration as a kid, you know what I mean?
42:30
[SPEAKER_01]: But that's what I want the most.
42:31
[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm not good at compartmentalizing things.
42:33
[SPEAKER_01]: So I'm so jealous that people who can perform in these ways that are bigger than life and then just hang the costume to hat, whatever, and just like treat it.
42:42
[SPEAKER_01]: So
42:42
[SPEAKER_01]: Professionally it then so cleanly because for me it's all connected but I think again that's where my list of calls comes from so that's the case and how do I keep doing that?
42:52
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
42:52
[SPEAKER_01]: Beautiful.
42:53
[SPEAKER_02]: We know that you have a very strict schedule that you just take to.
42:55
[SPEAKER_02]: But we also like to be aware of the time that our guests give to us.
43:00
[SPEAKER_02]: So we like to end our conversations with the same kind of question and it's kind of a choose your own adventure.
43:06
[SPEAKER_02]: Either it'd be something that somebody has said to you or something that you've heard along your journey that continues to resonate and fill your tank.
43:13
[SPEAKER_02]: Or conversely, we usually say something that you would tell younger you as you were entering the business.
43:17
[SPEAKER_02]: But
43:21
[SPEAKER_02]: 14-year-old hunter for 17-year-old.
43:25
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
43:26
[SPEAKER_01]: There's so many things I would tell younger versions of me.
43:28
[SPEAKER_01]: So many versions of me that I would talk to and want to slap sense into.
43:33
[SPEAKER_01]: Slow down, chill out, breathe, enjoy it, take it in.
43:37
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, maybe just cliche as hell, and that's totally fine.
43:41
[SPEAKER_01]: Mungle saying is for the love of music.
43:43
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think that I'm so committed to that because I would say, let love be the starting place for everything.
43:48
[SPEAKER_01]: Love what you do, but also love yourself.
43:50
[SPEAKER_01]: love the world that you give it to, because I think that gives you more grace in the getting of it all, you know, loving people who hate it, loving people who love it, loving what you do enough to step away and take a break from it, loving the people who love you, and knowing that loving them sometimes requires stepping away from this thing you love to do as well.
44:11
[SPEAKER_01]: To me, like if I were to make more decisions based on that, it's not salsa,
44:19
[SPEAKER_01]: And I'm grateful, because my dad and my mom, even with my obsession with being on stage to be loved, they always kept it that way.
44:27
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, they were not stage parents.
44:29
[SPEAKER_01]: My dad sat me down on a 15 and he was like, listen, we're playing a lot of shows.
44:32
[SPEAKER_01]: And I just want to make sure that's what you want to do.
44:34
[SPEAKER_01]: So like, I'm not taking the gigs for you this year.
44:36
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm the most miserable year of my life.
44:38
[SPEAKER_01]: But I saw a love with the studio.
44:39
[SPEAKER_01]: And so I don't know.
44:40
[SPEAKER_01]: That's cliche.
44:41
[SPEAKER_01]: But I also kind of love it.
44:43
[SPEAKER_01]: No pun intended.
44:44
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, for the love, Charleston loves.
44:45
[SPEAKER_01]: I love the people I work with.
44:47
[SPEAKER_01]: I love the people that I make music for, whether they like it, or they hate it, I love them anyway, and I love doing it.
44:53
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think that there's so many parts of this career that we would probably, it would be so much easier to say.
44:59
[SPEAKER_01]: I'll pick something a little easier to do if we didn't love it so much.
45:03
[SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely.
45:04
[SPEAKER_01]: But that's also the thing that gets you up in the morning and keeps you going.
45:07
[SPEAKER_01]: So ask AI to coupleify that and make it sound better.
45:10
[SPEAKER_00]: I think you know a great job, and we haven't had one like that before, and that feels like something I want to write down of all of the bullet points you said of like let love be where you begin right love the world that you give it to Please, Shays are rooted in deep truths.
45:26
[SPEAKER_00]: So I'm going to write that down.
45:28
[SPEAKER_02]: And I could use that for Mike.
45:30
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, and I will say that having spent this last hour with you, that feels like the nucleus of everything you've shared with us.
45:37
[SPEAKER_02]: I can really feel that in your responses in your approach and your vulnerability and openness in showing up for this conversation with us, so thank you so much.
45:45
[SPEAKER_02]: Thanks for saying that.
45:45
[SPEAKER_02]: Appreciate it.
45:47
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
45:47
[SPEAKER_01]: Thanks for a safe space, too, guys.
45:49
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it's so great to have these conversation.
45:51
[SPEAKER_01]: Imagine that's the origin of creating what you've created, but this is such a beautiful safe place to talk about things.
45:57
[SPEAKER_01]: We don't have to talk about, so thank you.
45:58
[SPEAKER_02]: Thank you.
45:59
[SPEAKER_02]: We can only go as deep as I guess, so.
46:01
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
46:01
[SPEAKER_02]: Thank you for being the other half of this.
46:03
[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you so much and excited for your album release and going back on tour and congratulations on everything.
46:10
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you.
46:11
[SPEAKER_01]: All right, Hunter.
46:11
[SPEAKER_00]: So nice to meet you.
46:13
[SPEAKER_01]: Great to meet you all.
46:14
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you so much.
46:15
[SPEAKER_00]: All right.
46:15
[SPEAKER_01]: Take care, I have a great rest of your day.
46:20
[SPEAKER_02]: We know your time is valuable and we're grateful you chose to spend this hour with us.
46:23
[SPEAKER_00]: If this conversation resonated with you, know that it is just one of many.
46:27
[SPEAKER_00]: We have an archive of over 140 conversations.
46:30
[SPEAKER_00]: So if you're looking for a way to go to next, you can find curated playlists by topic on our YouTube channel or simply scroll back in the speed to find our conversations with Rose and Cash, New York Times by selling author Maggie Smith, Lucius, JD McPherson, and many others.
46:45
[SPEAKER_02]: This shows produced by me and Aaron Shave of Ace with help from the Kayla and all the music he hears written, performed and produced by me as well.
46:52
[SPEAKER_00]: Our show is edited and mixed by Leland Holden at Pod Punch and we are proud members of the Bluegrass situation podcast network.
46:59
[SPEAKER_02]: Thanks for being here.
47:00
[SPEAKER_02]: We'll see you next time.