Latest / Mortgage Marketing Radio / Ep #88: How to Break Into the Financial Planner Market and Diversify Your Business

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Ep #88: How to Break Into the Financial Planner Market and Diversify Your Business · Mortgage Marketing Radio

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In today's highly competitive mortgage industry, building profitable relationships with
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the real estate agents is essential for success.
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However, finding effective ways to secure agent relationships can be a challenge.
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With so many mortgage loan originators vying for the attention of real estate agents, it
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can be difficult to stand out and establish meaningful connections.
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Our new case study featuring loan officer Chris Cogill is a must-read.
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Chris has closed a remarkable 36 million in funded loans from agent referrals.
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And in this case study, he shares his proven strategies for building strong relationships
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with real estate agents and leveraging those relationships to drive more business.
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To get your hands on this resource, head over to LOKestudy.com and download your free copy
0:45
of the case study today.
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You'll find actionable insights and practical tips that Chris used to close 36 million
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in funded loans from agent referrals and how you can too.
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Don't miss out.
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Go check it out right now, visit LOKestudy.com and download your free copy today.
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Hey listeners, Jeff Zimper, welcome once again to this week's episode of mortgage marketing
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radio.
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Hope you are doing well, hope you are preparing for Q4 closing out 2018 strong.
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If there's any one single message, I'm going to give a shout out to Bill Hart, my mentor
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from afar, my brother from another mother, one of the most esteemed coaches out there in
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the world today.
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Bill posted a video recently that talked about attacking the market, attacking the market.
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And I couldn't agree more in the top producers that I talked to, the loan officers that
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I'm working with on a daily basis.
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That's the one thing that the one key to success.
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It's that magic silver bullet, it's the fundamentals, it's the blocking and tackling
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and it's doubling down on the outbound activities, I'm stepping that game up because the tide
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is washing out.
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And as you've heard me say before, a rising tide races all boats.
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Well, in this market that we've entered into and the coming market, the tide is going
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out.
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And the question is, is what's going to be left behind?
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Will you be washed up on the shore or will you be one that survives and thrives?
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It is a land grab right now moving forward in its current market, meaning those who freeze,
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those who get stuck and wonder what's my next move are going to be left behind.
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They're going to lose important momentum.
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Don't be that person, be the person who sees the opportunity now, like Warren Buffett
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I said before, when there's blood in the streets, that's the time to invest.
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Well, there may not be blood in the streets yet, but there definitely is a shift and a pivot.
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Realtors are going to be looking for that professional mortgage relationship that adds value,
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that they can can on, that delivers value for them and their clients.
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And now's the time to double down on your outbound activities to get those relationships,
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not only with real estate agents, but other referral partners, such as financial advisors,
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which brings us to my special guest here today, Mr. Craig Strant CEO of Apex Home Loans
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out of Rockville, Maryland.
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We dive deep into how Craig has largely built his business as one of his biggest pillars
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is financial advisors, Realtors is another one, but we're going to unpack this conversation
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about a couple of different things.
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One is how do you demonstrate your visible value and how are you engaging with buyers
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during the first conversation and consultation so that you are demonstrating yourself as
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somebody much more valuable than just rate and quote, how do you do that?
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What are the questions you ask?
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How do you use that 1003 to open up a conversation?
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How do you take somebody right off, right, to take it out of that silo as my Fred N. Conorkey
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talks about, take it out of the silo of price and talk about advice, right?
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How do you leverage your past database, which Craig talks about?
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But most of the time on this particular conversation, we're talking about financial advisors.
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It had to find them, how to approach them, how to be more successful in presenting yourself
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to financial advisors, what to say, right, because that's the biggest reason why most
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loan officers you listening don't pursue financial advisors.
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Oh, I want to do it, I want to do it, but I don't know what to say, both on the phone
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and in the meeting.
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Well, Craig's going to help you with that as well.
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And Craig's just a rock star, man, he is among the top 1% of mortgage bankers nationwide.
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He has received a 40 under 40 award.
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His company has been recognized throughout greater Maryland area as one of the best companies
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to work for.
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Craig's consistently in the top 100 mortgage originators and companies in the country.
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So the guys just rock star and over 20 years of experience.
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So this is a deep dive, right, crash course in how to be a truly highly successful productive
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efficient mortgage loan officer.
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So I hope you enjoy that.
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And if you haven't yet checked out our latest announcement at mortgagemarketing.pro.
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If you're looking for more training, if you're looking for that, you know, finally the
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single place where you can learn how to better partner with real estate agents, get some
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scripting, become a modern mortgage originator, and have a better, more professional presence
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online.
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Go check out mortgagemarketingpro.com.
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And with that said, let's get into my conversation with Craig Strent, my special guest for this
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week's episode of Mortgage Marketing Radio.
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Hey, Craig, welcome to the show.
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Thank you.
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Hey, man, glad you could be here at Know Your Extremely Busy, running a company and right
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probably dealing with the daily market issues and changes and fluctuations we've got in
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this mortgage market right now.
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So I did a formal intro for the listeners, but I always like to get, you know, your personal
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take on the Craig Strent story, right?
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How and why did you get in the mortgage business, why do you love this business?
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Well, I got in the mortgage business in 1994 when I graduated from college and that was
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not a good year for the job market in general.
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And I had teen other people being successful and I knew from school in the mortgage business
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and felt that it touched on a lot of different skill sets.
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I had learned up to that point and I thought I would give it a try.
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I got started doing sub-prime consumer direct way back when that was a good thing and
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worked out well.
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And it was a great way to learn because I learned on telemarketing leads, which required
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a tremendous amount of persistence and follow-up back then.
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It wasn't a whole lot of technology, so I also learned to do all my calculations back
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then by hand and meet with people in person.
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So learning in that environment in that market has served me well and was a good way to
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get into the mortgage business.
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Over the years, people who I've met who have been successful in the mortgage business
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not always, but a lot of times are people that have entered the mortgage business in difficult
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markets rather than those that entered in really strong markets.
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What advice would you give to those that are entering the market right now?
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There's a fair amount of people I talk to that have come in in the last one to three years.
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They haven't seen the market shifts and the changes in what it takes to succeed.
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Any suggestions or coaching you might be doing for those people?
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Certainly taking a long view.
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I think there's still tremendous opportunity in the mortgage business.
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I'm really proud to have been it for so long.
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I think that there's great opportunities for young people in the business and it's not
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really looked at by the current generation very significantly and the income potential,
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the freedom, the opportunity to build your own business and manage your own time are wonderful.
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So I would advise you and doing the business now to take a long view to make investments in
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themselves at least somewhere between 10 and 20% a year back into their own marketing and technology
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to take an ownership standpoint, not to count on their company to do everything for them,
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but instead to make investments now in the right database, presentation software,
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mobile tools, all the things they need to create sort of an independent entity amongst themselves
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so they could be successful for the long term.
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Is there anything looking back that you would do differently or wish you had done differently
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in preparing, you know, you've used the word long view a couple of times.
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But if you could go back to, you know, coach yourself 20 years ago, whatever,
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is there any advice you would give yourself?
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Yeah, while I really believe in database and client retention, I would have done it even earlier
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and even deeper than I already did and I already do it pretty deep to begin with, but I would have
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gone even deeper with it. I would have spent even more time nurturing existing relationships
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rather than being out trying to build new ones. So I would have changed the proportion of time
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management a little bit if I could go back and do that again.
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So by nurturing existing relationships, you mean referral partners?
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I mean referral partners and past customers, there's, you know, it's certainly
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appreciated there's so much gold in the database and the relationships, but there is.
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And it's also true going back many years people in the industry have always told us that there's
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multiple opportunities in every single loan. And I think we miss that on those opportunities.
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Most people do not see that there's four or five opportunities in every single loan application.
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And for me personally, I would have done a better job focusing on all of those opportunities
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within the application rather than rushing to find the new buyer.
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All right, so that's an interesting topic. Yeah, and I've definitely heard that before.
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How do you extract more than one opportunity out of a loan app?
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Well, certainly, I think it's important to plant the seed early on these days with a potential client
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setting out expectations as to what you are going to do and the experience you plant to deliver.
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And slowly sort of, you know, plant the idea that if they're happy,
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you would be very appreciative at the end of the process of a review of them passing your name
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along to friends and family and others. So certainly making sure that you get within the network,
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it has to do, you know, in terms of somebody's particular activator, right?
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So many refinancing, and you know, other people refinancing, so many buying homes,
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and you know, other people that are buying homes, so making sure that you are aware of that,
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and that the client is aware that you're looking for those introduction.
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If you don't tell them, particularly if they're first-timers, they just may not know.
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So I'm not talking about asking for a four or five times note at the process.
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I don't believe in that, but I am letting them know in a subtle and gentle way,
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particularly at times in which they express gratitude to me and taking advantage of the law of reciprocity,
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then letting them know, hey, by the way, I am really appreciative of anybody else you know.
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And the way I say it is, who do you know now?
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Rather than saying, hey, please keep me in mind, I'll say, hey, who do you know now?
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It's also buying a home we're looking to buy.
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So certainly that opportunity for more business there.
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I also set up the next transaction with the client at the time of closing, so
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I will set an auto lock target, meaning a specific targeted rate in which a no-cost
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we finance makes sense, and then I will track that for them for the life of the loan.
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So I'm setting up the next transactions for them as well.
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In terms of business within the individual loan application,
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I am asking questions with regard to their happiness level or existence working with
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a CPA and a financial planner.
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I'm making those introductions if they don't have them already and if they do have them and they're
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happy. I'm asking for those introductions. I'm also looking at where they work.
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In some cases, if it's a local company where I know decision is made here,
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I'm considering sending information on what we call our workplace rewards program,
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and trying to get it some information in front of the HR folks over there as well.
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So multiple opportunities within every single loan.
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There's really more than that if you dig even deeper.
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Yeah, exactly. There's a lot of stuff in there.
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Two things I want to unpack a little bit there. I'm curious about when you come to that section
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about the CPA. Tell me, do you have a current CPA? Are you happy or not?
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I'd be curious. I don't know if you measure this, but how often that leads to an opportunity
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one way or the other, whether it's you're introducing them to a CPA because they're open to it or
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you're going to get introduced to theirs. How often would you say that happens?
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Yeah, what I'm typically doing is if I have the tax returns, I'm taking the CPA's info right
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off of there. If I don't, I'm asking for it at some point in the process.
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I'm asking if it's okay to provide the closing disclosure to their CPA.
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The answer is yes, then post-closing, I'm sending a letter to the CPA indicating I've just handled
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the transaction. They'll need the CD for tax prep next year, and here's a copy, and here's my info,
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and then I'm doing a follow-up call based on that. Unlike some other people out there that suggest
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going to the CPA at the point of sale and getting their buy-in. I don't do that, just for a
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little bit of a concern over, could they potentially sell away from me at that point?
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So I don't do it then, but I do do it in a little hospital, isn't it?
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Not particularly. If you call up and you say our mutual client, Bob and Jane Jones are in the
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process of refinancing, and they suggested that I provide you with this detailed analysis of the
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numbers, including the tax benefit I wanted to show this to you ahead of time, generally it's okay,
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but the CPAs are sort of a finicky group, they're very technical and they're not salesy, so
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it's better to just, I find, to follow up with the closing disclosure and pepper them with numbers
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and analyses. They don't really want to be sold too. Then take me through the end of that. It's
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a transaction's closed, do you send them the disclosures? You're following up, what does that sound like?
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Yeah, I mean, sometimes they'll give you a meeting, sometimes they won't, but hey,
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it's Craig's rent today, text home loans, just wanted to let you know.
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So I want to make sure you receive the letter I sent over for Bob and Jane Jones.
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I included a copy of their closing disclosure and I recently handled their
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transaction. Did you receive that? Yes, I think I saw that. Okay, well, I just want to let you know,
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you know, they were able to save 300 hours a month or purchase a new home,
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where a local experienced mortgage lender here in Rockville, Maryland, and I welcome the
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opportunity to chat with you a little bit more about how we might coordinate on some clients in
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the future. I'm regularly asked as well on my end for CPA recommendations when I ask my clients
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if they have them and they don't always do. So I'd like to get together and maybe learn a little
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more about what a good referral for you is and keep it to right. It's a very basic, very basic
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networking script. And what's the take rate on that in terms of that offer? I'd say every now and
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then. I wouldn't say constant. You do find yourself leaving voicemails. You do get a call back
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every now and then. I take you don't get that many one-on-one meetings, but what you do get is
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you sort of get permission to continue to stay in touch with them, connect with them on LinkedIn.
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And if you're doing a lot of good social media and posting and you have a good monthly newsletter,
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other items you're mailing, what will happen inevitably over time is that GPA will call you with
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a referral. That's what my experience has been. So you don't necessarily want to run out to lunch
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together, but they will use you as a resource down the road if you stay in touch well.
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Interesting. So are you then like, friending them on Facebook once you do have that conversation?
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I don't friend them on Facebook unless I know them and I've met them personally, but I do connect
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with them on LinkedIn and they'll see the right-door social media updates and so on.
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Yeah, that's probably a good point with the CPA LinkedIn.
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Yeah, and if I can't get to a CPA to meet with them that I really want to meet with,
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I do start inviting them to cool events and a good sort of off successful story have as I do
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also believe in sort of targeted ways of staying in touch and showing them that I'm aware of what's
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going on. So I'll go online and read about their hobbies or interest and then I'll send them an
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article or a book related to something they're interested in, try to get the conversation going.
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I recently had a CPA where I tried multiple times to get lunch with. I couldn't, I started,
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it was really insufficient. I sent them a book called The Greatest Fishing Stories Ever Told
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and he immediately called me back and did this book is amazing. So I appreciate you thinking
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of me clearly, you know, consider it and it makes sense that maybe we should talk about some
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clients. So, you know, no rest for violations. You can't send a gift for somebody sending you
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referral, but you can sort of look at somebody's interest and sent them an interest through them ahead
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of time, get the conversation going. Absolutely. That's that personal touch and you know,
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demonstrates that you've, you know, like you said, you're considerate. You've spent some time
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and thinking about how to make an impact with that person. That's great. Any particular reason
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why you pursued that CPA that much? Did you know he was a like- Yeah, he was, he was recommended
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via financial advice that he already worked with who said that he was very good and he sends a
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lot of his clients to him and I was looking for a new CPA in a particular part of town where client
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had said to me a few times we need a new CPA and I didn't have a good contact.
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So what would you say roughly percentage of business you get from CPAs to for your total
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overall volume? It's small. I mean, financial advisors are much, much, much larger group,
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much, much larger segments for me. I would take EPAs as a minor pillar. I would call it
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5%. Okay. Great. So then nice transition. Let's talk about how you get financial advisor business.
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That's like, you know, the holy grail people want to know, how do I get in front of those people?
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Yeah. Financial advisor has been my number one source of business for a very long time
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as well as the repeat referral business that comes with it. I just decided a long time ago,
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this goes back to almost 2000 that I read an article in mortgage originator magazine way back when
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by a great guy named Bill Early who's still in the mortgage business down in Carolina now and
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Bill in one page in that old magazine outlines why it made sense for mortgage people and financial
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advisors to work together. And I decided to pursue that niche at that time. And it worked
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out really well. And to this day, it still makes up a huge piece of my business. I think that
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people miss out on the mortgage piece of financial advisory. They don't understand that the
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mortgage is the number one liability typically. And that financial advisors, particularly,
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you know, those who say they're holistic and they manage everything, well, they really don't.
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They're really only managing the asset side of the balance sheet. And financial advisors,
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they partner with CPAs and they partner with a state planning attorney, but they haven't thought
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to partner with mortgage people. And it just makes natural sense to look at the largest liability
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if you're doing financial planning for someone. So I sort of go with them with that approach
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that I can handle that aspect of their practice and that we should partner up. And I sort of give
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them case studies and other materials as to demonstrate how they can properly use the mortgage
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to create and preserve assets for their clients. All right. How do you do that? I'm curious.
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How do I create and preserve assets? Yeah. Well, if it's a refinance environment, it's very simple.
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Obviously, if their clients are saving up money and freeing up cash flow,
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that cash flow can then automatically be redirected to take advantage of the employer's sponsored
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retirement plan that they're not maxing out to take advantage of life or disability insurance.
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They don't have yet to start a 5.29 that they may not have done to save up for the next down payment
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to pay up high interest debt, all that stuff. So that's natural on a refinance. On a home purchase,
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a little different, particularly for move up buyers, it's particularly effective. Most mortgage
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people listening to this call will probably agree that when you talk to the average move up buyer
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and you say, how much you're going to put down on the next house, they generally say,
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I'm just going to roll my proceeds over. So I show them specific strategies for not doing that,
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for rolling over a portion of the proceeds and investing the difference. We get into detail
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about the actual after-tax cost of a mortgage versus the long-term ROI on investing in a well-diversified
20:06
portfolio elsewhere. So I show them sort of that, you know, that partial arbitrage they could take
20:11
advantage of. I talk to their clients and provide third-party validation on why a 30-year fixed
20:18
and investing the difference typically makes a whole lot more sense than taking a lower rate,
20:23
associated with 15 years. I illustrate why paying extra money to your mortgage principle is
20:28
generally not a good idea and why you're better off keeping that money separated with your advisor
20:33
or investing it into your plan with the advisor. I show them ways to free up cash flow that they
20:38
buy, you know, if they want to buy permanent insurance versus term life, I show them different
20:43
ways and to free up that cash flow to do that and the impact's over the long term. So all types
20:48
of things that are related to how can the mortgage be used to help accelerate the attainment of
20:55
financial planning goals. And I'm not talking about stupid stuff like, hey, let's refinance and
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pull cash out of your house and invest it all in the market and use a nag I'm loan. I'm not talking
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about that kind of stuff. I'm talking about suitable and prudent things that meet that meet TFP
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types of standards. How do you illustrate that to people represent that in a way they understand
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are using, you know, software tool or something to, you know, I use presentation software that
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allows me to take into account all those other things tax benefits are a why I'm separating money
21:24
from the house and so on. So when you say presentation software, what do you mean? I use mortgage
21:30
coach for that, which I think most of the people on the call will probably have heard of. I should
21:35
hope at least and I've been in that for a very long time. That's what I thought. Yeah, when I get Dave
21:40
a shout out Dave's average mortgage coach. For those who don't know what it is, we'll put only
21:44
in the show notes, but Dave's been on the podcast before. All right, so that's interesting. I want to
21:48
clarify something here that conversation around, you know, being a financial advisor for somebody
21:55
purchasing a home. If I'm understanding this correctly, you clarified that that's typically a
22:00
move up buyer who's rolling proceeds from the sale of a house and, you know, may have way more than
22:05
20% or whatever that they need. Is that correct? Number one, not always. I mean, sometimes it's a first
22:11
time buyer and sometimes it's just helping a first time buyer understand because a lot of times
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first time buyers do have money invested and are often in a position where they're going to sell
22:21
something and pay a capital gain to get to a certain point and they may often do that to get
22:26
to a really brief, they should put 20% down. So maybe 20% down makes sense, but maybe they've done
22:32
really well and they want to stay invested and they don't have, for example, enough cash in liquid
22:36
reserves and living expenses and buying a new place in furniture is expensive. So I may show them
22:41
an option where, you know, they take advantage of single premium MI or some other type of mechanism
22:46
that allows them to stay more diversified within their total financial plan, inclusive of the
22:52
mortgage and the home equity. So it works really well on move up buyers that have proceeds,
22:56
but it certainly worked well for first time buyers as well. On financial advisors, you don't always
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get, you know, the real first time home buyer would very minimal down because those people often
23:05
don't have advisors. The way that you get those referrals from advisors is often from the parents.
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So very often in this market as well as we know people are buying later and often putting more down.
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Financial advisors are managing the parent's money and the parents are helping the kids with a
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gift for down payment. And as a result of it, they'll often say, hey, call this mortgage person.
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Interesting. I'm curious like in the first time home buyer situation because that's the bulk of
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a lot of buyers right now. Is there ever a time when you determine that type of a conversation
23:40
isn't right for that particular client? Well, you know, first time home buyers, they know how to
23:45
ask two questions. What's the rate and what are the closing calls? And so, you know, and that's not
23:51
their fault. That's what they're programmed to ask. So I don't fault them for that, but oftentimes
23:56
they're not looking at other considerations. For example, I recently had a couple two government
24:01
workers down here in DC. They both worked for the government. They had strong salaries. They were
24:05
in their early 30s. And they wanted to put 50% down and take a 15 year from straight mortgage.
24:11
And it just didn't make sense. They weren't maxing out their TSP's, their government retirement
24:16
accounts. They hadn't started saving for college, but they were so debt of verse that this is the
24:22
way they wanted to go. So it allowed me to start a conversation that moved them to, hey, what about
24:29
these other things? Hey, if you still want to pay off your mortgage in 15 years, you could. But what
24:33
if we did it in such a way where at year 15, you could pay it up in a lump sum and still have
24:39
money left over and still have a better tax advantage between now and then. So not everybody says yes
24:45
to that, but it's a completely different conversation that you're having. And it definitely separates
24:51
you from from other people out there. I think the key thing I'm hearing here is a couple of things,
24:57
you know, you're presenting them options. Number one, and you're having your conversation that's
25:01
larger than rate and fees. And you're kind of controlling that. You're not letting the client.
25:09
It's been a fact, let's be curious, you know, when somebody comes out swinging, right? Hey,
25:12
what's your rate? How do you pivot? How do you adjust with that? I just used the same script
25:17
I've used for years and I learned this many years ago and just modified it from a gentleman that
25:21
a lot of listeners probably heard of and his name is Dale Vermillion, he's a great coach.
25:26
And, you know, I would say, I would say Jeff, I appreciate you asking me that question.
25:31
What I'd like to do is build you out a detailed spreadsheet of rates, loan options,
25:38
payments, and closing costs broken down to the dollar for you to view. I'd like to send that to
25:42
you in writing so that you can see it all broken down for you. Is that okay? And then the kind of
25:48
the prospect will of course say absolutely I'd love to have that and I'd say great. In order to
25:53
do that accurately and to make sure all the information I present to you, I can actually deliver on.
25:57
Is it okay with you if we take a few minutes just right now, just for me to get the information
26:01
I need to build that out for you. Of course it is. Great. We go ahead and do that and I say okay.
26:06
Can I send that to you around 230 today? Can we jump on the phone? You know, pick a time,
26:10
we jump on the phone. So I'll pick a time for us to jump on the phone. I'll send the spreadsheet
26:15
to them about 10 minutes before because I don't want to get too confused looking it on their own.
26:20
I send it over back to Dave and the shout out. I use mortgage coach and the edge for that.
26:26
So I'll do an edge live call with them for that. We'll jump on the phone. This is assuming we
26:32
don't get together in person. I'll take over their screen and I'll walk them through each option
26:37
in detail. I often follow up with a video after the call as well to summarize the discussion for
26:44
the person we just spoke to and or for any other decision makers or people that are going to be
26:49
sharing the options with we're not on the phone. Wow, that's cool. How much do you try and meet
26:55
people in person? I live in the DC area so it is it is hard with with you know we're a multi-state
27:02
area with lots of commute times and traffic so it's not easy to do that. I offer it to most clients,
27:08
most clients do not take me up on it. I do use video quite a bit. All right so what I'm hearing
27:15
there is you're using video because you understand the importance of building that trust in connection,
27:22
can't do it in persons of videos the next best thing. Yes but to be super clear to the people on
27:26
the phone, particularly the newer folks in the business, I'm 20 plus years now. I really feel
27:30
strongly and I coach my loan office on this. I do feel very strong about trying to meet people
27:36
in person and I believe that my personal you know rate of conversion would likely be better
27:41
if I was able to do more in-person meetings. It hasn't been as possible for me because
27:45
as one of the owners of the company, I'm also holding a bunch of director. So I would highly advise
27:51
those people on the call particularly new newer L.O.s to meet with people in person whenever they
27:56
can even if that means going to them. Now in terms of meetings where you go to them, I would really
28:02
just say on a side note I would try to avoid going to the house because there's always distractions
28:07
when you go to someone's home and maybe going to their office conference room or to a Starbucks
28:12
something like that but trying to avoid the house had become. Yeah I can relate. I've done that a
28:17
few times in the past man. There's babies, there's dogs, there's whatever, right? That's really
28:23
cool man. So you've really thought out this process for engaging. I was curious though real quick
28:28
back to the financial side of things. You've done a lot of self-education then on helping you become
28:33
more of yourself a financial advisor, right? Yeah so if you ask L.O. officers and I've coach
28:40
L.O. officers you know around the country over the years about how to go after financial advisors
28:45
in a deeper manner and you know when you talk to L.O. officers almost every single L.O. officer
28:50
to a person that you talked to said yes I really want to pursue that market and when you ask them
28:54
well why haven't you up to now you know they also I'm sick of realtors I want to go after
28:58
advisors I always hear about that why haven't you done they generally say that they don't know where
29:04
to start and B they don't know what to say to the advisor is B and then C if they got the meeting
29:11
they don't know this yet but if they got the meeting they wouldn't know what to do at the meeting
29:15
so for all of these reasons they don't pursue advisors most law officers got into the business
29:20
and their sales manager said here go go get realtors that's where the business is and you should
29:25
go after realtors that is a huge portion of where the business is but I believe in having multiple
29:30
pillars of business some major some minor and so I think it makes sense to diversify just like
29:36
in financial planning diversify your book of business and the sources in which where it comes
29:41
from so that you're not sitting with all your eggs in one basket that's all so that's why I believe
29:46
the advisor market is really great and as if people have heard me speak before on advisors they'll
29:52
know that you know I also like to point out that there's a couple major major pluses with advisors
29:59
and they are that they don't work on weekends they don't give out multiple names and people pay
30:07
for their financial advisors advice so they tend to follow it. All right I'm gonna hold you to it
30:14
give me the you don't have to rip you know open the whole box here but coach me real quick what
30:19
should I say when calling on a financial level how do I prepare to make that call man. Well if
30:24
you're calling a financial advisor for the first time first I would start with how I got to them
30:28
but if I just getting to them cold is that what you're asking me somebody gets in my neighborhood?
30:33
Well I guess yeah there's one of two ways right either you're introduced on behalf of your clients
30:37
you just take a loan app for or there's cold so I'm sure it's two different approaches. Yeah I mean
30:42
if it's cold I would say I would teach you know my name is Craig I'm a local mortgage lender and I
30:48
have a unique niche in which I support financial advisors by managing the liability side of the
30:53
balance sheet. One of the ways I do that is to structure the mortgage to help accelerate the
30:57
financial planning goals and this helps to create and preserve assets that you manage for your
31:02
clients. I'd love to take a few minutes with you to show you a little bit more how I do that how I
31:07
think it could benefit your practice and increase your business and how we might work together and
31:12
usually that's enough. Really and that works. Yeah I mean if you want to if you want to
31:18
dangle referrals you can I don't love doing that you could take me on lines and this is true
31:23
for me by the way at the end of I you know I would say I didn't done this many mortgages in last
31:28
year the end of every process I asked my client if they have a financial advisor many of them say
31:34
they don't I explain that this is a great time since we just did the mortgage for you to have a
31:38
complimentary planning consultation with a local financial advisor I know a few good ones which
31:43
you like me to introduce you and I'm always looking for new advisors to introduce my clients too
31:48
can we get together and you're sort of talking about interviewing them can we get together
31:52
so I can understand more about what you're doing whether or not we work together and if you're a good
31:56
fit for my client and now you're sort of calling to interview them for your client. Yeah I like that
32:01
and to get together is it's not coffee launched per se it's just meat at their office.
32:06
I prefer to meet at the office of the financial advisor or at my office if we meet at their office
32:12
I'm going to see their operation I'm going to look around their office I'm going to see their hobbies
32:16
and interests start some conversation maybe think about ways we can connect later with an article
32:21
or something of interest that I can send them and I'm also going to get an opportunity if I do a
32:25
great job they're probably going to introduce me to other advisors that are in the office if not
32:30
I like them to come to my office so I can give them a tour of my office and show them how I'm set up
32:35
meet my team and sort of blow them away with the culture and the customer service that we have here
32:40
in the office so I like one of those two things over meaning for lunch or coffee or whatever
32:44
everything doesn't have to be a meal you can have a business meeting with advisors it's different
32:48
it's not like realtors where a lot of them not all of them but a lot of them looking for a free lunch
32:52
it's not like that they can buy their own lunch they they're happy to do a professional meeting
32:56
in and out. Yeah and what happens after that meeting let's say it goes well you know some good
33:02
report and stuff what do you do I'm assuming you do something you can different like the book
33:07
you know what I mean yeah well I think the most effective thing you could do after any meeting
33:11
whether it's a networking group a realtor meeting a financialite any meeting the most effective
33:16
thing you could do is immediately try to provide some value remember that you know in networking
33:21
a giver get so super important to meet a rack my brain after the meeting it's a who can I introduce
33:27
this person to number one if I can't think of anyone who can I that's not a client who can I
33:32
connect them to that's potentially a good referral partner for that if not what can I do for them
33:37
personally what did I hear them say maybe they're having a problem with their their home and their
33:41
landscaping and their problem who knows what what can I do to help this person what book can I
33:45
send them so I'll often listen to what challenges they'll have in their business and then I'll send
33:50
them a specific book with a handwritten note what are their hobbies again this guy about this guy
33:55
loves fishing I send them the fishing book maybe it's something else and I'll send them you know
33:58
to sleep a golf balls whatever so I'll always do something immediately to create an impact after
34:04
the meeting then I will follow up in regular intervals with little blogs or articles I write or
34:11
pieces of interest related to mortgages and financial planning touch base with them regularly
34:17
and then try to get together I might invite them to hear a local speaker or to a networking
34:21
event or something like that as well so I can continue to build the work keep point there man add
34:26
value right consistently immediately afterwards I mean they're they're now's the time for you to
34:31
to really shine right they're expecting to see something they're like what's next all right this
34:35
guy came in right had a good good talk and good you know let's see if he actually delivers
34:41
the other thing I do is I'll send him a sample of what I'm going to do with their clients they
34:45
can experience it so I'll send him a sample of a mortgage coach video with a case study that I
34:50
put together and say hey here's an example of if you gave me a client with we talked about hey
34:54
30 versus 15 there's my 30 versus 15 case studies the next time a client asks you about it you
35:00
could show them this video I'm curious you know do you ever get into those discussions with
35:04
financial advisors about you know the strategy of having a 30 year fix versus a 15 and
35:10
do you do kind of butt heads ever on that we constantly have this discussion yeah we don't
35:15
butt heads because agenda you know a cardinal rule if you're going to go into this niche is never
35:20
contradict the advisor's advice to the client if you disagree with what the advisor is telling the
35:27
client call the advisor and explain your position and why and say have you considered this and
35:33
provide data show an example of a specific case study even the client's case study if you have
35:39
the information thing hey I know you're recommended this but if they do this it might actually look
35:44
look how much better it can be and a lot of times the advisor be tremendously open to that
35:48
and everything we thought about Craig that's great or they'll say you know what this client has
35:52
a very depressionary mentality they're very diverse they're probably going to inherit money a
35:56
couple years we're fully aware of why they shouldn't do the 15 year but they want it and that's
36:00
what we're going to go okay great no problem so we don't butt heads to you to answer your questions
36:07
but I may sometimes enlighten them on another way of structuring the mortgage sure again keep
36:13
here keep your advisor cap on right you're not a salesperson you're an advisor so your job is to
36:18
do your fiduciary responsibility to the client and then you know maintain that relationship with
36:23
the advisor now the keep mind the mortgage person me does not have legally a fiduciary
36:30
responsibility and I think it's important that you brought that word up because for the people
36:33
listening they should understand that advisors do generally not all kinds but almost all advisors
36:38
have fiduciary responsibilities to the client and I think that's an important word because I take
36:43
that approach with the client and I think it's important when you're talking the advisor that
36:48
while we are not fiduciaries we structure our practice if you're working with advisors
36:52
to be that way and I think something that's really gotten me points with advisors over the years
36:58
is that it's not it's not infrequent that advisor will send me something to analyze for a client
37:04
and I say there's nothing to be done here there's no these guys are in great shape there's nothing
37:08
to be done here and by the way I'm going to set a target for them anyway and let them know when
37:12
it's time to refine it so I think that's super important advisors want to have the outlet of getting
37:18
some person to third party validate their suggestion whether it's telling look if advisor says you
37:24
shouldn't put 50% down you split 20% down and give me the rest to invest the homeowner sort of
37:30
has their antenna up going oh he just wants to get his hands on my money so he can invest it
37:33
but if that's coming from the mortgage person with detailed analyses on the mortgage options
37:40
showing that it's better to separate the money that's huge for the advisor to have that third
37:44
party validation so they want us in that transaction we make them look good on top of that
37:51
we're not cross-selling away so if most advisors just say oh call your bank or call your current
37:56
mortgage company well a lot of banks have loan officers on staff who are incentive to take a
38:03
look at the full 1003 and try to grab the 401k or the retirement plan or whatever else and
38:08
bring it in house so it's just another small benefit to the advisor that we're not doing that
38:13
that's a great point great point indeed and I really thank you for by the way highlighting the
38:19
the word fiduciary because I think that in this market where like you said earlier people are
38:25
conditioned to ask for rate well you know I use this term visible value and you've got a
38:29
a tool like mortgage coach that helps you illustrate right your visible value through providing
38:35
data at the back up right you know the deal everybody listening people buy for emotional reasons
38:39
they back it up with logic that helps just I think demonstrate clearly to an advisor and to your
38:45
clients that you are taking a fiduciary responsibility because you're showing them options you're
38:50
showing the impact of their choices based on their unique situation yes and most of all are not
38:55
doing it look the truth is most mortgage people are just quoting rate and cost and they're not
39:00
showing the long-term impact of the mortgage and or they're not taking the mortgage and putting
39:07
in a scope of the total financial plan and looking at the impact on the other side of the balance
39:13
and on the assets on the cash flow and everything else they're just quoting the rate in the term
39:17
yeah and I've been talking about this for quite a while it really goes into kind of your from that
39:23
first conversation from the first point of engagement with your clients of having that discussion
39:27
which you shared so eloquently earlier and how you take the the conversation away from price
39:33
to advice so for those listening go back right down the script adjust it make it yours and start
39:39
uses them third party tools to you know position yourself as a valuable resource rather than just a
39:46
rate and quote machine and don't don't get me wrong this is still an incredibly price sensitive
39:51
environment and you can do all of these things and still lose the deal for an eight because there
39:56
is that population of people right that it's just going to take your advice and go run and use it
40:00
elsewhere so that's going to happen but as Steven Marshall would take it's really just about
40:05
increasing your batting average and giving yourself all the tools you need to do that and this is
40:09
just another one of those tools yeah so so what I'm hearing you say is just know that you're not
40:14
about a thousand percent you're going to you know some of those people are going to go that other
40:17
route okay well they're just not going to care about your advice because they're going to think they
40:22
they know better or whatever and that's fine and they're going to just they're just lowest rate
40:26
and that's that's okay that's okay it's about understanding who your target client is yes I know
40:31
somebody in my life who when they acquire home and all that stuff they they they don't just jump
40:37
right online and go for that lowest cost right lowest rate because they know they got the 800
40:42
FICO the 20 you know all that kind of they know they're vanilla straight up a paper so they're like
40:46
I don't I don't care about your advice man I just want the lowest rate right and those are the kind
40:51
of people that are often paying an extra two or three hundred dollars a month to their mortgage
40:56
at even though they have a three and a half percent rate without realizing that they could
40:59
pay their mortgage off even sooner if they separated that money from now hmm interesting all right very
41:04
good conversation on financial advisors curious um is there any kind of source you you know online or
41:10
otherwise that you might have used in the past to locate financial advisors if you're going to
41:16
maybe do some outbound calling um you know the the way to gather advisors I mean the best way
41:21
of course to gather financial advisor names is to ask your existing referral network um
41:27
and keep your existing clients your friends your family all those types of things who they use
41:32
are they happy and then ask for introductions that's the best way to go um beyond that you can
41:37
obviously Google financial advisor in your area you're going to get a massive number there
41:41
you can also look at associations where they join the FBA which is the financial planning association
41:46
very common yeah have you ever attended any of those meetings by the way you know I've looked at
41:51
the FBA many times and I haven't attended them just because I I'm spending a lot of time nurturing
41:56
the existing advisors I have and I'm at the point where I'm actually diversifying as well trying
42:00
to do better into other areas just because I feel good about my advisor niche so I'm trying to
42:05
make sure that I don't put all my eggs in that basket right right exactly yeah you've got those
42:10
other baskets you've got a nurture as well right yep that's right uh but for those listening uh and
42:15
I've done a little bit of that in the past as well uh you know Google the various financial planning
42:19
associations like you said there's the FBA there's the NAPFA and a lot of these organizations um
42:25
they have meetings local chapters in your town your city and oftentimes they're open to having
42:31
guest speakers who want to come in and present on a relevant topic so that's another way for you
42:35
to get exposed to them and network um all right very cool we are um just about out of time but I
42:41
want to wrap up with um you know you've got a lot of uh you've got a breadth a wide breadth of
42:47
experience and advice uh and as you said you're right you've got too many loan officers throughout
42:51
the year so I want to close out by you know getting some wisdom here from Mr. Craig Strand uh what do
42:58
you've got a roomful of loan officers let's say right um various levels of experience but
43:03
yeah you know let's just say um well let me just put it this way how are you preparing
43:09
for the shift that's happened happening in the market what are you doing differently if anything
43:15
or just doing more of what you're already doing um I think in this environment there's a lot of
43:19
blocking and tackling that has to go on I think you have to and you have to cast a really wide net
43:24
there's two books on my desk right now uh both of them are a little dated but they're really
43:28
relevant but I pull them off my bookshelf one is Spencer Johnson's who moved my cheese which a lot of
43:33
people have heard of and the other one is by gentleman named Marshall Goldsmith also a well-known
43:38
book which is what got you here won't get you there so I think that the landscape in the
43:43
mortgage business has shifted tremendously a lot of digital people starting online like they're
43:48
wanting uh you know everything at their fingertips and only getting ready to call more of these
43:52
people right at the point of sale when they want that final piece of advice so I think we have to
43:56
look at what got us here and how are we going to shift now and find the new cheese because I think
44:03
there is a lot of new cheese out there but it's not in the same place the old cheese was and there's
44:08
more you know we've seen a significant drop up over the last couple of years in origination volume
44:13
but we have not seen that big of a drop off and people exiting the business just yet so you've
44:18
gotten more people going after you've got the same number of people going after less business
44:24
which drives you into a price sensitive transaction and you've got multiple going online for price
44:29
only so I do think there's going to be a lot of consolidation among loan officers in the business
44:34
and those that survive are going to be the ones that create significant value at the point of sale
44:40
so if you're not doing that and you're just you know not going on wheel to doors and drop
44:45
off rate sheets and quote rate in terms all day long that's probably going to wane on your business
44:50
over time if you don't have some kind of niche that helps separate you out from the pack whether it's
44:54
product niche whether it's a customer service niche whether it's a referral source niche such as
45:00
advisors or the voice lawyers there's got to be something that makes you different to help you
45:04
capture business long term. Very good very good stuff thank you for for sharing those those
45:11
two books I definitely know who moved my cheese and I wrote down the what got you here what was
45:17
that title again what got you here what got you here won't get you there right I'm going to put
45:25
links to both of those in the show notes for those listening if you want to grab those books
45:29
you are definitely a student who's always sharpening the axe man even after 20 years so
45:34
thanks a lot for sharing your wisdom here if anybody wants to reach out to you directly connect
45:38
where should they find you they could just email me it's my first name Craig and my company is
45:42
apex home loan so Craig at apexhomeloans.com awesome man I appreciate you being here my pleasure thanks
45:48
for having me you bet and listeners once again I appreciate you being here if you enjoyed this
45:52
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