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#506: Leaders in Customer Loyalty: Brand Stories | How Simon Is Redefining Loyalty in Shopping Centers · Leaders in Customer Loyalty, Powered by Loyalty360

0:03
SPEAKER_01: It's a Thursday, so welcome back to the Leaders in Customer Loyalty series.
0:08
SPEAKER_01: This is the Brand Stories Edition.
0:09
SPEAKER_01: It's great having you with us every Thursday.
0:12
SPEAKER_01: The customer loyalty game in real estate is changing, and the Simon Property Group is leading the charge.
0:20
SPEAKER_01: Customer loyalty programs for malls have historically been rare.
0:24
SPEAKER_01: But Simon Plus is rewriting the rules by creating a unified experience that delivers value across every touch point for the customer, for merchants, and partners alike.
0:36
SPEAKER_01: In this episode, we're going to hear from Ina Allen.
0:39
SPEAKER_01: She is a senior vice president of marketing at Simon.
0:43
SPEAKER_01: Welcome Ina.
0:44
SPEAKER_01: First off, congratulations on the launch of Simon Plus.
0:48
SPEAKER_01: You've taken some incredibly challenging tasks in an environment that has challenges, such as a lack of a consistent point of sale.
0:57
SPEAKER_01: Yet you realized an opportunity between real estate, retail, the merchants, and the customers and turned it into a program that feels fresh, relevant, and actionable.
1:08
SPEAKER_01: Today we're going to dive into that story.
1:10
SPEAKER_01: So thank you very much for taking the time to join us today.
1:13
SPEAKER_01: How are you?
1:14
SPEAKER_00: I'm great, Mark.
1:15
SPEAKER_00: How are you?
1:16
SPEAKER_01: Great.
1:17
SPEAKER_01: Today we're going to be diving into your new customer loyalty program, Simon Plus.
1:22
SPEAKER_01: I know that customer loyalty has been a priority to Simon for many years.
1:26
SPEAKER_01: Can you tell us a little bit about this program, why it's a priority, and kind of the kind of the overall benefits of the program?
1:35
SPEAKER_00: Sure.
1:36
SPEAKER_00: Simon Plus is a loyalty program designed for today's modern shopper.
1:44
SPEAKER_00: As the largest owner and developer of shopping centers across the country, we have always been very interested in developing a loyalty program that would be something that consumers could rally against and that retailers could support.
2:01
SPEAKER_00: But it's a difficult proposition to create something that makes sense in our space and in our world.
2:09
SPEAKER_00: But we understood that customers love a good deal.
2:13
SPEAKER_00: Customers need and want reasons to return.
2:16
SPEAKER_00: And we had been watching all of these different loyalty programs spring up around us, not in our space necessarily, but all the programs that we all know and love: Delta, American Airlines, Sephora.
2:28
SPEAKER_00: And we wanted to try and create something that would build that same passion and brand love with our consumers and our retailers.
2:37
SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
2:37
SPEAKER_01: And I think you mentioned it that it's unique.
2:41
SPEAKER_01: A loyalty program is a unique initiative for a real estate company, development company.
2:45
SPEAKER_01: Because at the end of the day, you want to drive loyalty to the brands in the store, and they may or may not even know who Simon is, correct?
2:52
SPEAKER_01: So, you know, why has it been such a priority?
2:55
SPEAKER_01: And can you tell us a little bit about the journey?
2:57
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
2:58
SPEAKER_00: It's been a journey.
3:00
SPEAKER_00: We have been working on the launch of Simon Plus for the last two years, but obviously it was a conversation that was happening internally well before that.
3:11
SPEAKER_00: Ultimately, loyalty has always been a huge priority.
3:18
SPEAKER_00: But as you know, a real estate company.
3:21
SPEAKER_00: So a couple of key things.
3:22
SPEAKER_00: We don't own the POS, right?
3:24
SPEAKER_00: Like every single brand has their own POS.
3:26
SPEAKER_00: So it's not like I can just walk in and develop a program that will measure impact across the entire portfolio.
3:33
SPEAKER_00: But we also have a variety of different types of retailers, whether that's fashion, electronics, food, experiences.
3:44
SPEAKER_00: There are a number of ways that customers interact with Simon Shopping Centers.
3:49
SPEAKER_00: And so to develop a program that works across all of those different types of retailers, that works within all of these different types of markets, 400 centers across the country.
4:00
SPEAKER_00: What it works in New York doesn't necessarily work in Ohio.
4:04
SPEAKER_00: And so you really need to try and make sure that you're developing a program that resonates with customers and with retailers.
4:13
SPEAKER_00: So we had been back and forth trying to figure that out and trying to develop something that would make meaningful sense for our diverse partfolio.
4:23
SPEAKER_00: And we know that customers are going to shop when and how and where they want to, right?
4:31
SPEAKER_00: I think there was a time in our industry where we were all so focused on saying, no, it's only about brick and mortar, it's only like we need to drive them into physical retail.
4:40
SPEAKER_00: We now recognize that customers are going to do what customers want to do.
4:45
SPEAKER_00: And if we can play a part in driving that loyalty engine in a 360-degree view, which includes what they're going to do in store, what they're going to do online, what they're going to do in our digital marketplace, we could find a winning solution.
5:00
SPEAKER_00: But it took an entire team and an entire data stack and a lot of conversations and a lot of, you know, hitting our heads up against a wall to try and figure out how to make it happen.
5:14
SPEAKER_00: But we did.
5:14
SPEAKER_00: We made it happen.
5:16
SPEAKER_00: And we're super proud of what the program has ultimately resulted in.
5:20
SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
5:20
SPEAKER_01: And I think you mentioned as well that there's challenges, not having the access to the point of sale because a real-time loyalty or loyalty in general is predicated on having that integration, right?
5:31
SPEAKER_01: To get the data, not only the transactional data, potentially the skew level data that you can action as well.
5:36
SPEAKER_01: And you mentioned uh things can be different in New York, as they may be in Ohio, but they can be different in, you know, we were talking about a little bit as we prepared for this call.
5:45
SPEAKER_01: Where I live in the east side of Cincinnati and up north, where there's kind of a couple bustling malls, right?
5:50
SPEAKER_01: New, uh, and but then there's a mall that's five, ten minutes away from me.
5:54
SPEAKER_01: Uh it it it's it's being torn down.
5:56
SPEAKER_01: So there's obviously unique challenges and opportunities of the industry.
6:00
SPEAKER_01: Uh, and I would assume even competitors, right?
6:02
SPEAKER_01: If you have a couple anchor tenants, maybe at Bloomingdales and a Nordstrom, you know, you how do you get those guys to work together?
6:09
SPEAKER_01: So you had a pretty complex matrix you had to navigate, correct?
6:14
SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
6:15
SPEAKER_00: And part of that complex matrix also included many conversations with retailers who were asking us, well, why do I want to participate in your loyalty program when I have my own loyalty program?
6:30
SPEAKER_00: Um, so that was, you know, an ongoing conversation to try and help them understand that being part of Simon Plus was not taking away from their own loyalty programs.
6:43
SPEAKER_00: It was actually additive.
6:45
SPEAKER_00: And the examples I always gave to them was, you know, customers, especially those who play the loyalty game, want to double dip wherever they can.
6:54
SPEAKER_00: I'm gonna use myself as an example.
6:57
SPEAKER_00: When I walk into Sephora, you know I'm gonna give them my phone number to collect my Sephora points, but I'm simultaneously going to use my American Airlines credit card at Sephora.
7:09
SPEAKER_00: So I'm also getting points for American Airlines.
7:13
SPEAKER_00: But now I'm going to also upload my receipts into Simon Plus so I can get Simon Plus points, Sephora points, and American Airlines points.
7:22
SPEAKER_00: Now I'm like really making best use case of all of what's available to me.
7:28
SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
7:29
SPEAKER_01: But but that that that conversation that you had with merchants is a pretty unique conversation.
7:34
SPEAKER_01: It's much like hoteliers who uh buy a new brand potentially and bring them on board, right?
7:40
SPEAKER_01: They have to talk about the marketing.
7:42
SPEAKER_01: People may or may not know that uh you know organizations, uh franchisees or people that uh have the retail properties, they have marketing uh budgets they have to assign them, right?
7:51
SPEAKER_01: They have marketing clause, and that can vary in percentages, right?
7:53
SPEAKER_01: But when you add a loyalty program, that value discussion, at the end of the day, you know what's good for you, more people in the store, right?
8:00
SPEAKER_01: But they may not see that as a benefit to the program.
8:03
SPEAKER_01: And but you're absolutely right.
8:05
SPEAKER_01: People do want to double dip.
8:06
SPEAKER_01: They want to maximize their utility, right?
8:08
SPEAKER_01: That's a human functionality and mass of those hierarchy needs, right?
8:12
SPEAKER_01: You want to maximize that.
8:13
SPEAKER_01: But when you had those discussions, how did those discussions go?
8:17
SPEAKER_01: Obviously, you rolled out a very successful program and you've seen success, but you you talked about some of the pushback.
8:22
SPEAKER_01: How do you navigate that to get them involved, to make them see the benefits of joining this program?
8:28
SPEAKER_00: Well, it helps when their competitors have joined the program, right?
8:32
SPEAKER_00: Like when you start showing them that over 500 retailers are currently signed up for the program and participating in it, it makes the conversation go a little bit easier because you're you can point directly to other folks who are doing it.
8:47
SPEAKER_00: But in addition to that, what we like to point out is that consumers who shop in shopping centers are doing a lot of cross shopping, right?
8:56
SPEAKER_00: Like you're shopping at Sephora, and then you're maybe even going to Mac, and then you're going to like get a handbag, and then you're going to get shoes.
9:04
SPEAKER_00: And so, in order for them to effectively take advantage of that cross shopping opportunity, Simon Plus allows them to highlight that, right?
9:13
SPEAKER_00: So if you're a retailer that has an offer within the program, and maybe we can talk specifically about what Simon Plus is, just so I can explain to you the different things.
9:22
SPEAKER_01: That'd be great.
9:22
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
9:23
SPEAKER_00: But, you know, as a retailer who's got an offer in the program, as a consumer, I'm looking at all of the offers that are available to me before I'm out there shopping.
9:36
SPEAKER_00: And so I can pre-select, I can determine how I'm going to plan my visit based on what's in the program.
9:44
SPEAKER_00: So cross-shopping, huge opportunity, right?
9:47
SPEAKER_00: And that's what we like to share with retailers is that it does encourage that.
9:51
SPEAKER_00: It encourages repeat visits.
9:54
SPEAKER_00: It encourages them to make purchases.
9:57
SPEAKER_00: And again, once we talk a little bit more about the program, you'll understand why there's incrementality built in for retailers.
10:03
SPEAKER_00: It's not just them giving away free stuff.
10:06
SPEAKER_00: It really is tied to a sales portion.
10:09
SPEAKER_01: Well, let's do that.
10:10
SPEAKER_01: Let's talk a little bit about kind of the program, uh, how it's evolved, how you designed it, kind of the benefits for not only the merchants, but also for the customers as well.
10:18
SPEAKER_01: I think you've talked about that, but be nice to know kind of holistically a little bit more about the program and how it was designed.
10:24
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
10:25
SPEAKER_00: So the program is super unique to the real estate industry.
10:30
SPEAKER_00: There's really nothing else that exists out there right now that ties these four components together.
10:36
SPEAKER_00: So the first element of the program is what we call offers and discounts.
10:41
SPEAKER_00: That is, you know, holistically what we historically did with our mall insider program, with our VIP shopper club.
10:50
SPEAKER_00: Those were designed to provide offers and discounts to consumers in order to draw them into the store.
10:57
SPEAKER_00: And that is like the base level of the program.
11:01
SPEAKER_00: So if you log into your favorite center, I happen to be in New York today, and Woodbury Commons is, you know, um just outside of the city here.
11:10
SPEAKER_00: If I log into my Simon Plus experience for Woodbury Commons, I'm gonna see like over a hundred different offers and discounts.
11:17
SPEAKER_00: And it's everything from 10% off at Ann Taylor to 20% off at Aero Postel to a buy one, get one free, and everything in between.
11:26
SPEAKER_00: But these are offers and discounts.
11:29
SPEAKER_00: So think like old school coupon books, but old school coupon books don't really exist anymore.
11:33
SPEAKER_00: They've now transitioned into these digital experiences.
11:36
SPEAKER_00: So that's like level one of the program: coupons and discounts at participating retailers.
11:43
SPEAKER_00: And we have well over, you know, 6,000 different offers that are out there across the portfolio.
11:50
SPEAKER_00: Level two of the program is what we call rewards.
11:54
SPEAKER_00: So I'm now a customer and I'm out there shopping.
11:57
SPEAKER_00: And I'm shopping at Woodbury Commons for a holiday, and I've gone to four or five different stores, and I've like got all these receipts.
12:06
SPEAKER_00: I can upload my receipts into Simon Plus in order to get points for the purchase.
12:13
SPEAKER_00: We are giving consumers one point per dollar spent in points.
12:20
SPEAKER_00: Some customers will always be the type of customer that wants to upload a receipt, and that's fine.
12:28
SPEAKER_00: But in addition to that, we are partnering with retailers to provide card-linked transactions.
12:35
SPEAKER_00: So if a retailer has agreed to allow us to do that, and the customer has linked a credit card into the program, when you walk into a retailer like J.
12:46
SPEAKER_00: Crew, as an example, your points will automatically appear in your account.
12:50
SPEAKER_00: You don't even need to upload the receipts.
12:52
SPEAKER_00: So now as a consumer, I've got all these points.
12:56
SPEAKER_00: I can then redeem my points for rewards.
13:00
SPEAKER_00: And the rewards are at various levels.
13:03
SPEAKER_00: So we have rewards that start at 500 points and go all the way to 2,500 points.
13:09
SPEAKER_00: And the rewards range, right?
13:11
SPEAKER_00: So at 500 points, your reward could be a free pretzel at Auntie Ann's, a free Cinnabon, a free coffee.
13:19
SPEAKER_00: In some instances, they are also discounts and additional discounts for retailers.
13:24
SPEAKER_00: So there could be for a thousand points, you could get a$20 um credit at a particular retailer, but there's always like a spend component tied into it.
13:37
SPEAKER_00: So at the$20 threshold, and these are determined by the retailer.
13:42
SPEAKER_00: So the retailer can say, okay, I will give the customer, you know, a$20 discount if they spend$100 or$150, whatever the number is.
13:50
SPEAKER_00: So retailers are able to determine what the threshold is on the rewards.
13:55
SPEAKER_00: But again, using WoodBerry Common as an example, there's like, you know, probably 40 rewards that are in the program right now.
14:04
SPEAKER_00: In addition to all of that, we also have a cashback opportunity.
14:09
SPEAKER_00: So there are programs out there that consumers are very familiar with, whether it's Rakutan or Chase Card offers or MX offers, where if you activate an offer at a particular retailer, you get cash back when it's directly tied to your credit card.
14:32
SPEAKER_00: So those offers change on a regular basis, but retailers can turn them on and off based on their business needs.
14:39
SPEAKER_00: So it's not live right now, it was before holiday.
14:43
SPEAKER_00: Sephora had a 2% cash back.
14:45
SPEAKER_00: So if I walked into assignment center, activated the Sephora offer, had a link to my credit card, I could get cash back on that purchase that sits within my Simon Plus account.
14:59
SPEAKER_00: And then finally, there's online shopping.
15:02
SPEAKER_00: So we also, you know, recognize that customers are going to shop in person, they're going to shop online, but we have links with cashback in the Simon Plus platform.
15:13
SPEAKER_00: So if you are a Simon Plus member, you could um, you know, a few weeks ago we had an Allo program promotion where if you logged in via the Simon Plus program to the Allo website, you were getting 10% cash back.
15:29
SPEAKER_00: So those four layers together create a very holistic program that is meaningful to consumers.
15:37
SPEAKER_00: And from a retailer perspective, they have the opportunity to show up in all four of those experiences.
15:45
SPEAKER_00: So if I'm a retailer at a particular center, you know, I could be in the discount, I can provide a reward, I could provide a card link to offer, I could provide an affiliate link.
15:56
SPEAKER_00: I mean, all of these things add up to enhance visibility in an omnichannel.
16:02
SPEAKER_00: And so the opportunity for retailers is more cross-shopping, more exposure, more um access to customers who are visiting our centers and planning their visits in advance.
16:16
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, absolutely.
16:16
SPEAKER_01: And I think uh we can talk about that a little bit uh more, but let's step back a little bit.
16:21
SPEAKER_01: When you look at the concept of a shopping mall, it definitely changed, right?
16:24
SPEAKER_01: And it's evolving, customers evolving.
16:26
SPEAKER_01: You talked about that a little bit before.
16:28
SPEAKER_01: Being in the channel, they you know they are you obviously want to be in that channel.
16:33
SPEAKER_01: So when you look at the shopping mall concept, uh how is it changing?
16:37
SPEAKER_01: Uh, and how do you see it changing going forward?
16:40
SPEAKER_01: And you know, how are you adapting that change?
16:43
SPEAKER_00: So, I mean, shopping malls are changing, right?
16:47
SPEAKER_00: Like I like to use a couple of examples in our own portfolio to demonstrate how malls today are not the malls of our youth.
16:56
SPEAKER_00: So um, let's use Phipps Plaza as an example.
17:00
SPEAKER_00: This is a property in Lennox that has a collection of, you know, mid-price retail, luxury retail.
17:08
SPEAKER_00: They have a nobu hotel, they have a lifetime fitness, they have a Lego experience.
17:14
SPEAKER_00: I mean, it is a full-blown experience.
17:16
SPEAKER_00: It's not the traditional shopping mall that you would normally associate with traditional malls, um, or even um King of Prussia outside of Philadelphia.
17:29
SPEAKER_00: I mean, if you look to see what's happening in that kind of center, just even in the last few weeks, we opened Netflix House.
17:37
SPEAKER_00: Netflix House has never done a branded Netflix experience, and their first location was in a shopping center environment.
17:47
SPEAKER_00: So here's like a brand that A, you would never really imagine doing physical retail.
17:52
SPEAKER_00: And for their first shop, for their first physical environment, they're at KOP.
17:57
SPEAKER_00: So that coupled with addicted.
18:01
SPEAKER_00: So addicted is a an online, direct-to-consumer brand, popular with Gen Z, you know, they were very much online.
18:10
SPEAKER_00: They are now opening retail stores.
18:13
SPEAKER_00: And again, like we opened one at KOP.
18:16
SPEAKER_00: So if you start to take those things into consideration, like new retail, new to market, Eatily is also at KOP.
18:25
SPEAKER_00: I mean, it's just like a different experience that is now more holistic.
18:29
SPEAKER_00: It's shopping, it's dining, it's entertainment.
18:31
SPEAKER_00: It is the place where families and friends want to come together to have shared community experiences.
18:40
SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
18:41
SPEAKER_01: And uh when you look at that change, that can be obviously disruptive because some brands are gonna come in, like you mentioned, uh, Netflix and addicted.
18:50
SPEAKER_01: Some brands are going to leave too.
18:51
SPEAKER_01: But that whole the focus on experience and more holistic uh push towards experience drives emotional connection and therefore customer loyalty, correct?
19:01
SPEAKER_00: 100%.
19:03
SPEAKER_00: And so even in our own loyalty program, we are trying to also create those experiences.
19:09
SPEAKER_00: So this past weekend, we had activations that were happening at 150 of our properties where Simon plus existing members and those members that signed up on that day received a complimentary gift.
19:25
SPEAKER_00: It was not something that we promoted in advance.
19:27
SPEAKER_00: It was not something that we like went out there and mentioned in the press.
19:32
SPEAKER_00: We really created the surprise and delight experience that happened in our centers that rewarded people for being members or for signing up for the program.
19:42
SPEAKER_00: Um, and so it was like really cool to watch customers engaging with us, talking about how fun it was to like get surprised and delighted in our shopping center to get a free goodie just for being a member when they were already going to be saving money on this shopping trip.
19:59
SPEAKER_00: Like that's the other thing.
20:00
SPEAKER_00: The program like goes live day one.
20:03
SPEAKER_00: You sign up, you immediately have access to the benefits and the rewards of the program.
20:09
SPEAKER_01: That's awesome.
20:10
SPEAKER_01: Well, when you look at, you kind of talked about how malls are evolving.
20:14
SPEAKER_01: You know, when you look at what makes a mall successful, you know, is there a correlation to newness or location, or is it an experience push, or is it a combination of both that you can kind of make it so unique that people will drive to it and build that they will come kind of idea?
20:31
SPEAKER_01: What's the key to success with malls these days?
20:34
SPEAKER_00: Honestly, it's a combination of all of those things.
20:38
SPEAKER_00: It is ultimately about the mix of retail, the dining, the experiences, the entertainment, the access to unique retail that you can't get in other places, but it's absolutely a combination of all of it.
20:54
SPEAKER_00: Um, and when you put all of those things together in a compelling way, that is going to drive success and meaningful experiences for consumers and for retailers.
21:06
SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
21:07
SPEAKER_01: So you touched on it a little bit.
21:09
SPEAKER_01: You know, how the digital online piece, but you're you're known as a brick and mortar location, right?
21:16
SPEAKER_01: Obviously, you have the online components.
21:19
SPEAKER_01: When you look at that holistic engagement, how are you improving the customer journey across both the in-person and digital channels to benefit both the merchant tenants and also the customers in the program?
21:31
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think we have a lot of digital innovation and digital experiences above and beyond just what we're doing with Simon Plus.
21:40
SPEAKER_00: So one initiative that we launched several years ago and it's up and running is called Simon Search.
21:46
SPEAKER_00: And so if you think about that physical experience, you're walking into a center, and I'm gonna use myself as an example.
21:52
SPEAKER_00: I'm the mom of two teenage girls.
21:55
SPEAKER_00: And of course, like on a Friday night, they are telling you that they need this item.
22:00
SPEAKER_00: For Saturday.
22:01
SPEAKER_00: And so you're not going to be able to order it online.
22:04
SPEAKER_00: You're going to have to go physically buy it.
22:06
SPEAKER_00: And in my case, it was the search for the perfect white dress.
22:09
SPEAKER_00: It had to be a white dress, it had to be short.
22:12
SPEAKER_00: It had to be in a certain size.
22:14
SPEAKER_00: And they gave me their parameters.
22:16
SPEAKER_00: So I walk into Woodfield, just outside of Chicago, where I live.
22:20
SPEAKER_00: And rather than walking from store to store to store looking for this white dress, I was able to use a tool that Simon has in place called Simon Search that allows me to put the parameters of what I'm looking for into the website.
22:36
SPEAKER_00: And it will tell me which stores have an item in stock and available right this second so that I could walk directly to altered state or to J.
22:49
SPEAKER_00: Crew or to JCPenney and pick up the item.
22:53
SPEAKER_00: So this was like a very new innovation that we launched two years ago, but it's still active.
22:58
SPEAKER_00: And we are working directly with retailers to secure their local product inventory feeds that feed into Simon Search that allow a customer to be able to do that immediately on the spot.
23:13
SPEAKER_00: So, you know, in my case, I was able to find a dress for my daughter very quickly without having to walk to 1,800 different locations in order to find something that was in her size.
23:25
SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
23:25
SPEAKER_01: So you you you uh it's uh it's a whole nother level, right?
23:28
SPEAKER_01: Being able to actuate on that, having the different feeds, right?
23:32
SPEAKER_01: So the retailing systems, the procurement systems, you know, the inventory and management systems are gonna be different across the board.
23:38
SPEAKER_01: So that's gonna require that's an onerous integration uh with little Retalics or an IBM or whomever you're integrating with or in an Oracle.
23:45
SPEAKER_01: That's a pretty onerous task.
23:47
SPEAKER_01: But that data though uh creates that convenience that they're looking for.
23:51
SPEAKER_01: Because at the end of the day, you want to be the the that that a brand of choice, and they may know uh and and that helps tie that brand, Simon, back to the customer, correct?
24:02
SPEAKER_01: Because at the end of the day, you go into your normal mall, no one's looking at is this uh Jones, JL, or is this Simon?
24:09
SPEAKER_01: But then you start to really build that brand value that wasn't there before, correct?
24:14
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, customers are definitely connected emotionally to their local shopping center, right?
24:22
SPEAKER_00: Like if I shop at Woodfield or if I shop at Westchester, like this is my mall, that's where I go.
24:28
SPEAKER_00: They may or may not know that Simon is the owner.
24:31
SPEAKER_00: And that was very intentional for us for many, many years.
24:35
SPEAKER_00: Like there are other developers who have different brand strategies where they lead with their brand.
24:40
SPEAKER_00: We have not done that.
24:42
SPEAKER_00: Um, however, we're taking steps in that direction with the launch of Simon Plus, Simon Search, um, and even Shop Simon, which is our digital online marketplace, those elements are tagged to a broader Simon story.
25:00
SPEAKER_00: Um, and yes, like we are going to be helping customers understand what Simon means.
25:06
SPEAKER_00: And you know, and it was funny, like during these activations that were happening last weekend, um, one of my favorite stories is hearing from our center teams how when they were explaining Simon Plus to a customer, and the customer in the experience can pick their favorite center, like when they're selecting um, you know, their their personalized view of Simon Plus.
25:27
SPEAKER_00: And people were like, Oh, I didn't even know that this other center was a Simon Center and like I'm here in Vegas on vacation, but you know, Denver Premium Outlets is my home center.
25:38
SPEAKER_00: So it was like cool to hear the stories when customers were starting to connect the dots about all of the great places that they can utilize Simon Plus in, right?
25:47
SPEAKER_00: Um, that they had no idea was even a Simon Center.
25:50
SPEAKER_00: So that's on us to try and help customers understand that.
25:53
SPEAKER_01: Well, and it's interesting too.
25:54
SPEAKER_01: You talked about that wasn't your story, right?
25:56
SPEAKER_01: And everyone wants to be the hero of a story.
25:58
SPEAKER_01: Uh, there's a great book I'm a big fan of called Brand Story, just how you position yourself.
26:02
SPEAKER_01: Uh, but when you look at customer loyalty, very important, Simon, because you want to differentiate yourself too to keep the merchants loyal because you're actually working for them, because uh it's a B2B program in some essence, right?
26:14
SPEAKER_01: And most successful B2B programs actually take the pieces of uh operations that the individual brand may not want.
26:23
SPEAKER_01: The the pizza place uh doesn't want to uh run the program.
26:27
SPEAKER_01: He wants to know that someone's there that can do that for them, that can create huge value.
26:31
SPEAKER_01: So that becomes a uh a driver of emotional loyalty for that brand to you because you're providing this great marketing channel, marketing opportunity, data set, and packaging it up in a way that they can action on, correct?
26:41
SPEAKER_01: So you're providing value in that way.
26:43
SPEAKER_00: A hundred percent.
26:44
SPEAKER_00: Um, you're you're absolutely right.
26:46
SPEAKER_00: For the local, smaller players, this can be their loyalty program, absolutely.
26:52
SPEAKER_00: And for the bigger players, this can complement their existing loyalty programs.
26:58
SPEAKER_00: Um, but but yes, you're you're right.
27:01
SPEAKER_00: It is a B2B to C play.
27:04
SPEAKER_00: Like this program would not exist without the retailers who are involved.
27:10
SPEAKER_00: But absolutely, I mean, it's designed to position Simon as an innovator, as a developer of choice, and to showcase to retailers how we're adding value when they choose to do business with us.
27:25
SPEAKER_01: Yeah, absolutely.
27:26
SPEAKER_01: And value is just the big discussion right now with some of the economic headwinds we have.
27:30
SPEAKER_01: You know, we have a hundred and some brands that are members, we meet weekly on different topics and values, value to the program, value of the program to the organization internally.
27:39
SPEAKER_01: Uh it's I think how you're looking at value is very unique.
27:43
SPEAKER_01: So uh, and and and being able to bring that forth.
27:46
SPEAKER_01: And even from a uh a local store, right?
27:48
SPEAKER_01: The local American Eagle, uh, they're a member of multi 360, you're providing value to them, right?
27:52
SPEAKER_01: Because you're trying to drive that you know, cheers mentality, right?
27:56
SPEAKER_01: Because I may go into American Eagle a hundred times and they'll start to know me, right?
27:59
SPEAKER_01: But then they'll say, Oh, you talked about that cross-promotion.
28:02
SPEAKER_01: That's where it becomes very powerful because American Eagle can maybe uh partner with Sabaro or with Auntie Anne's, right?
28:08
SPEAKER_01: And you can have a joint promotion knowing that I'm more likely, if I had my daughters with me, we're gonna hit both of those, right?
28:14
SPEAKER_01: So that's the power in data where it's not creepy, right?
28:18
SPEAKER_01: It becomes that you know me moment.
28:23
SPEAKER_00: Yes.
28:24
SPEAKER_00: Um, and it will take us um, you know, it'll take us some time to get there and to get to know our consumers and to start understanding what personalization might be relevant for them and where the synergies are, right?
28:39
SPEAKER_00: Like an American Eagle shopper, are they more likely to want to go to Starbucks or Chick-fil-A, right?
28:46
SPEAKER_00: Like, and then we can start serving up messaging that's tied specifically to what we know about that customer.
28:54
SPEAKER_00: But yes, absolutely.
28:56
SPEAKER_00: I mean, there is definitely value to the retailers in order to help them um make that successful.
29:04
SPEAKER_01: So why did you uh what was the impetus to kind of redo the program?
29:09
SPEAKER_01: I know you consolidated some uh earlier programs, Mall Insider, the VIP Shopper Club, Shop Simon.
29:15
SPEAKER_01: You know, what was the impetus to redo the program?
29:19
SPEAKER_00: It was really based on looking for an omni-channel integrated solution.
29:26
SPEAKER_00: Like Shop Simon lived over here, Mall Insider lived over here, Shop PO VIP program lived over here, and there was not like this consolidated approach.
29:36
SPEAKER_00: And each had different rewards and different benefits, and it was like painful to try and put it together.
29:43
SPEAKER_00: And there weren't necessarily as many meaningful consumer tactical rewards, right?
29:52
SPEAKER_00: Like, and that's what we were looking to do.
29:55
SPEAKER_00: And so when we started to really dig into what would make a successful loyalty program, it made no sense to not do something that would consolidate everything into one cohesive element and program.
30:09
SPEAKER_01: That makes perfect sense.
30:11
SPEAKER_01: So when you look at the program, marketing, promotional planning, that's been a big discussion we've had with brands recently, right?
30:18
SPEAKER_01: And being pliable, because you may think that a marketing is gonna go like this and go very well, and you have co-marketing agreements, and and man, maybe we don't want to market that, right?
30:26
SPEAKER_01: We we've seen existence, we we have a partnership program, we help brands facilitate partnerships and they go smoothly, they swingly until they don't, right?
30:33
SPEAKER_01: And then we don't want to market anymore, it's not working.
30:35
SPEAKER_01: So, how do you market the program?
30:36
SPEAKER_01: How do you start off?
30:37
SPEAKER_01: How does the marketing uh Taylor strategy both to benefit Simon as a brand, but also the individual merchants?
30:43
SPEAKER_01: How do you balance that?
30:45
SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
30:46
SPEAKER_00: So it is a bit of a work in progress.
30:48
SPEAKER_00: Um, we you know only launched this program in August.
30:51
SPEAKER_00: And so we are testing and learning and adapting as we go.
30:57
SPEAKER_00: But right now, when you walk into any Simon Center, you would be hard pressed to miss the messaging about Simon Plus.
31:06
SPEAKER_00: We are in pure acquisition mode right now, and so we are utilizing all of our channels: on-mall digital, on-mall printed collateral, email, texting, paid media, boosted social, on-mall activation.
31:22
SPEAKER_00: We have turned on every opportunity to ensure that customers are aware of this program.
31:31
SPEAKER_00: So that's from a marketing perspective.
31:34
SPEAKER_00: It is by far our biggest push and focus in Q4.
31:40
SPEAKER_01: That's awesome.
31:41
SPEAKER_00: From a retailer perspective, right?
31:43
SPEAKER_00: Like the retailers that are part of the program are benefiting by being involved in the program.
31:49
SPEAKER_00: So as customers are signing up, they're immediately seeing which which retailers are offering rewards, which are offering discounts, which are part of our cart-linked offers.
31:59
SPEAKER_00: Like they immediately see who's there.
32:01
SPEAKER_00: Part of our email strategy is also to highlight the specific offers at a particular center.
32:09
SPEAKER_00: So rather than just sending out an email to Westchester shoppers saying, like, hey, this is what's happening at Simon Plus, we're sending out emails that specifically talk to and highlight offers that are available from existing retailers.
32:24
SPEAKER_00: So a retailer at Westchester is now getting access to a database of millions of customers across the Simon ecosystem, promoting their offer and their initiative within their Simon centers.
32:37
SPEAKER_00: Um, so I like to call it kind of like, you know, that it's the it's it's the shopping cart in real life.
32:44
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, like, you know, normally when you're putting things into your cart and you're in online, you're getting reminders to go back to your cart and make the purchase.
32:52
SPEAKER_00: Well, here we know customers are shopping in person during Q4, particularly like we're about to hit that shipping window where no more online orders are going to be able to get delivered.
33:02
SPEAKER_00: And we get like the huge influx of people shopping in person.
33:06
SPEAKER_00: And so when we're tailoring our communication during that time, knowing that they're physically going to be in center, um, it does you know ultimately benefit the retailer.
33:17
SPEAKER_01: Okay.
33:18
SPEAKER_01: Um, when you look at customer choice, customer choice is another topic that's been very uh kind of front and center in the brand community.
33:25
SPEAKER_01: Uh customers have tons of choices.
33:26
SPEAKER_01: You mentioned online, everything's changing, and different uh ways to shop.
33:31
SPEAKER_01: So getting uh someone to you know consider the Simon program and then to choose it going forward and truly engage with it can be a challenge.
33:38
SPEAKER_01: But you guys just seem to do a very holistic job.
33:41
SPEAKER_01: Uh you know, you said you're not necessarily right there on personalization, but just being able to get these brands together and to get the card-linked offer pieces together, right?
33:51
SPEAKER_01: Just uh the linking the card so you can because all that again is going to provide that value to the individual customers to want them to completely engage with it.
33:59
SPEAKER_01: So, you know, how are you manage a conversion?
34:02
SPEAKER_01: Because it seems to me like you've got them to choose, right?
34:04
SPEAKER_01: You doing seem to be doing a great job that how are you getting to convert, convert that behavior to to you know, to the brand?
34:11
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I mean, so we know that they're already shopping the brand, right?
34:15
SPEAKER_00: Like we know that they're shopping at Simon because they've signed up for Simon Plus.
34:19
SPEAKER_00: They you know they've signed up for the loyalty program.
34:21
SPEAKER_00: So, how do we continuously keep them engaged within Simon Plus?
34:25
SPEAKER_00: I think will be a key focus area for us.
34:27
SPEAKER_00: But our plan um is is has got a variety of different holistic components to it, but we will continue to provide engagement level opportunity.
34:39
SPEAKER_00: So, gamification is one example of something that is on our roadmap for 26.
34:46
SPEAKER_00: So I look at something like the Starbucks example, right?
34:49
SPEAKER_00: And we who hasn't played like the Starbucks games, the Starbucks for life or the holiday games, um, or even like the McDonald's Monopoly that just came out as a digital format.
35:01
SPEAKER_00: So we are going to reimagine what that could look like for us and in our industry to make the value prop more compelling for our customers.
35:11
SPEAKER_00: So that's one thing.
35:13
SPEAKER_00: We are going to continuously add additional rewards into the program.
35:18
SPEAKER_00: So right now, the rewards are primarily focused on retailers in our centers.
35:24
SPEAKER_00: But we've had a lot of interest from other brands and other partners who aren't necessarily retailers who would like to participate by providing a reward in the program.
35:37
SPEAKER_00: So, as an example, um I I won't speak to specifics, but like a hotel brand that is trying to promote an all-inclusive collection that they have and are eager to provide a discount or an offer or some kind of incentive for Simon Plus members.
35:56
SPEAKER_00: So it's an opportunity for them to get access to a new customer base.
35:59
SPEAKER_00: And it's an opportunity for us to provide a reward that goes above and beyond just what's happening in the shopping center environment.
36:06
SPEAKER_00: So we are going to continuously provide and look at, you know, new rewards, better rewards, rewards from new partners, gamification, engagement, double points days.
36:17
SPEAKER_00: We're looking at the full suite of opportunities to keep Simon Plus members engaged.
36:23
SPEAKER_00: We're also going to be doing on-mall activations on a regular basis to surprise and delight and reward our members for being in center.
36:32
SPEAKER_01: That's awesome.
36:33
SPEAKER_01: And I think you mentioned uh you're doing a number of things at the love brands, right?
36:37
SPEAKER_01: Like Lowe's, our member, they did some great things around Thanksgiving, got a lot of press that activation, that surprise and delight, getting a bucket, but that activation drives that emotional connection.
36:45
SPEAKER_01: And it's aspirational as well.
36:47
SPEAKER_01: So you talked about, you know, looking at the tiers, gamification, uh, very important.
36:51
SPEAKER_01: But partnerships are a big one, right?
36:53
SPEAKER_01: Getting them right, but uh the data and insight you have could be great for a hotel chain like a Hilton, right?
36:59
SPEAKER_01: Do a cross promotion.
37:00
SPEAKER_01: That could be your redemption options because if I know if I can get some points for my Hilton stay that next day I want to do, and and maybe maybe, or even some swag catalog, because you know, that's a big discussion right now.
37:10
SPEAKER_01: What reward types are actually driving the incremental behavior the brand is looking for?
37:15
SPEAKER_01: And what is that, what is that, you know, value?
37:17
SPEAKER_01: Does it have more value to the customer than the cost, right?
37:20
SPEAKER_01: So you want to maximize that.
37:21
SPEAKER_01: So it but partnerships, how how are you looking at partnerships and and how will those be managed going forward?
37:29
SPEAKER_00: Yeah, well, you know, we're in early stages.
37:31
SPEAKER_00: Obviously, our first priority is getting all of our retailers on board and making sure that we're driving success for them, but also for consumers.
37:39
SPEAKER_00: So we're looking at options.
37:40
SPEAKER_00: We've had lots of interest from brands that are outside of the shopping center industry.
37:45
SPEAKER_00: Um, and we're we're having those conversations where we're collecting examples of things that we really like.
37:52
SPEAKER_00: So, you know, if you know, I keep a board of like all these great programs that do some really interesting things.
37:58
SPEAKER_00: And one of my favorite ones right now is the collab between Uber and Bonvoy.
38:06
SPEAKER_00: And so, like when you are staying at a Bonvoy property, you're able to connect your accounts.
38:12
SPEAKER_00: So you're getting extra Uber points, you're getting extra points and Marriott, you're getting, you know, connections to Starbucks.
38:20
SPEAKER_00: So, like if you look at Uber, Starbucks, and um Bonvoy, like that is a natural thing because when you're traveling, you're using Uber, you're probably visiting a Starbucks.
38:32
SPEAKER_00: In my case, like I also do Uber Eats when I'm traveling on business.
38:35
SPEAKER_00: So like you can really connect all the dots.
38:37
SPEAKER_00: And so we also know that when people are shopping, particularly when they're traveling, they're doing those things too, whether that's staying at a hotel or using an Uber and going shopping.
38:50
SPEAKER_00: So we're looking at those holistic types of partnerships as examples of things that we would like to do with our program.
38:57
SPEAKER_01: Excellent.
38:58
SPEAKER_01: You know, when you look at the program, uh, you know, what are you most proud of?
39:02
SPEAKER_01: What are two or three things you're most proud of as you've evolved and kind of built the program?
39:07
SPEAKER_00: The one thing I am so proud of is the level of engagement and work that it took from our cross-functional team to make this happen.
39:18
SPEAKER_00: Um, we do not currently have a loyalty department, right?
39:23
SPEAKER_00: Like it was done by um everyone in the organization.
39:28
SPEAKER_00: It was the brand team, the creative team, the digital team, the innovation team, the retailer marketing team.
39:36
SPEAKER_00: It was hundreds of people coming together in a cross-functional format to bring this program to life.
39:44
SPEAKER_00: Um, and so to get to that point with the number of retailers we have participating, the number of offers and rewards that are out there, um, that is what I am super proud of.
39:58
SPEAKER_00: Um, and the fact that we were really able to come together to do that and make it happen.
40:02
SPEAKER_01: That's awesome.
40:02
SPEAKER_01: And a last question, somewhat self-serving.
40:04
SPEAKER_01: You know, what can Loyalty 360 do to help you and your team, don't have a customer loyalty team, but kind of a larger team in your customer loyalty efforts?
40:12
SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, uh help us spread the word.
40:15
SPEAKER_00: Um, make sure that retailers and brands know that we exist.
40:19
SPEAKER_00: We're relatively new on the loyalty, um, on the loyalty stage.
40:23
SPEAKER_00: Um, help us identify potential partners that could be good add-ons based on the things we've talked about.
40:30
SPEAKER_00: Um, and keep us updated on what's new and trending in the world of loyalty.
40:34
SPEAKER_00: I mean, things are happening all the time, and it's hard to keep track of like what's really news and what's just fluff.
40:40
SPEAKER_00: And um, you know, I really hope to learn from you and your organization on what is is is really moving the needle for other brands.
40:48
SPEAKER_01: What a powerful conversation.
40:49
SPEAKER_01: We covered everything from why Simon decided to reinvent customer loyalty to how Simon Plus is driving value for customers, merchants, and partners.
40:59
SPEAKER_01: We explored the evolution of the program, the role of data and experience in creating emotional connections, and even what the future of malls may look like.
41:07
SPEAKER_01: So, Ina, thank you very much for sharing your insights and giving us a behind-the-scenes look at Simon Plus.
41:13
SPEAKER_01: It's clear that it's not just a customer loyalty program, it's a strategic shift that's redefining engagement in the real estate industry.
41:23
SPEAKER_01: Uh, it was an excellent interview, and thank you very much for taking the charge.
41:26
SPEAKER_00: Awesome.
41:27
SPEAKER_00: Very nice to meet you, Mark.
41:28
SPEAKER_00: Appreciate it, and thanks for um taking the time to learn more about our program.
41:32
SPEAKER_01: Also, I want to thank everyone else for taking the time to tune in today.
41:35
SPEAKER_01: Make sure you join us every Thursday for our Leaders in Customer Loyalty series.
41:39
SPEAKER_01: Be sure to follow us on LinkedIn and Twitter as well as YouTube so you don't miss what's next in the world of customer loyalty.
41:46
SPEAKER_01: Until then, have a wonderful day.
41:48
SPEAKER_01: Thank you very much.