Latest / Talk Copy to Me | Content + Copywriting Podcast / Breaking Up with Bad Marketing: 7 Tactics to Leave in 2024

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Breaking Up with Bad Marketing: 7 Tactics to Leave in 2024 · Talk Copy to Me | Content + Copywriting Podcast

• 0:00
  Hey friend, and welcome back to Talk Copy to Me.
• 0:04
  I can't tell you how good it feels to be back here in the host seat, having conversations with you for the, fourth year now.
• 0:15
  I'm doing something a little bit different this week.
• 0:18
  You see, January itself has felt like a decade and I know we're all feeling a bit.
• 0:25
  exhausted, overwhelmed, and our energy is just kind of shifted, which is why it actually took me so long to get this first episode of the season out today.
• 0:36
  I had fully expected to be back in your ears a couple of weeks ago after my short holiday break, but I just couldn't get it together.
• 0:45
  And from what I hear, A lot of you are feeling that same way.
• 0:49
  Content creation is difficult, regular business processes are difficult, because there's a lot of things happening in our world that are demanding our attention, and it can feel hard to create during these times.
• 1:04
  Which is why today we're talking about marketing trends that really need to stay in 2024.
• 1:11
  I know we're, we're a little bit into 2025 right now.
• 1:14
  I'm not, I'm really just resetting.
• 1:16
  I feel like February 1st is totally my new years.
• 1:20
  I've taken this month to get back on track after the holidays, after a family vacation, , and I'm really just starting to develop my goals.
• 1:29
  , review my year and you'll hear about that this week.
• 1:33
  Why?
• 1:34
  Because instead of just having one podcast episode this week, I am going to celebrate this fourth season by doing four mini podcast episodes this last week of January.
• 1:47
  So yes, today is Tuesday, January 28th, 2025, and I will be back in your podcast player tomorrow, Thursday.
• 1:56
  And Friday for , a total of four short episodes that I really hope you enjoy so today we're talking about something that's really been on my mind a lot.
• 2:05
  The marketing trends, the marketing plans, tips, tricks that somehow made it into 2024 still, but need to stay there.
• 2:14
  Like, they're not welcome into this year.
• 2:17
  . Because here's the thing.
• 2:18
  Some of these marketing trends may have even started with good intentions but they've lost their effectiveness or honestly, they've become manipulative and we don't have time for that in 2025.
• 2:30
  In 2025, we are going to stand firmly with our marketing messages and sell for our businesses.
• 2:38
  But we're not going to do it in a way that feels gross or weird or uncomfortable for us or our clients.
• 2:45
  So, these things may have worked in the past, but now they're just either creating noise or they're eroding the trust that we have with our audience.
• 2:53
  And you'll hear this from a few of the experts that I've invited on tomorrow.
• 2:57
  Trust is very important this year.
• 3:00
  It's, it's not just important, it's vital.
• 3:02
  This year we need to connect.
• 3:05
  Authentically with our audiences and we need to deliver real value.
• 3:10
  And these 2024 and earlier trends, they're not serving that purpose.
• 3:16
  Before we jump in, I do want to take a quick moment to say thank you to you, to everyone who has been here with me since the beginning in season one, who has joined even after that season two, season three, if today's your first episode, thank you.
• 3:33
  I have seen the messages come in my inbox and my social media accounts.
• 3:38
  I have read the reviews.
• 3:40
  I have.
• 3:42
  Really just listened to the feedback, whether it's positive or negative.
• 3:46
  And it's helped me really develop this show into something that I'm really proud of, proud of myself, , that I have created, but also proud to share with you to have you be a part of, thank you for being part of it with me.
• 4:01
  Thank you for continuing to come on the journey.
• 4:04
  And again, if it's your first time here, welcome to the conversation.
• 4:08
  This podcast is not a monologue.
• 4:12
  I hope can be a conversation my goal is to keep it real, to dig deep, to invite on some of the best minds that can help grow your emotional intelligence, your business expertise, and help you feel motivated and set goals to achieve.
• 4:30
  And do it in a way that feels right for you.
• 4:33
  , so today I am so grateful to welcome on Williamson, Samantha Burmeister, Stacy Braga, Brianna Owen, and Hannah Plourde to share their thoughts on the things we need to stop doing and we need to make sure we have some clear boundaries about leaving.
• 4:58
  in the past.
• 4:58
  All right, so I'm going to try to not talk too much.
• 5:02
  , consider me your narrator.
• 5:04
  We are going to jump right in with Amy Williamson of Damn Write Copy to hear A potentially polarizing opinion when I first actually read the text before I listened to this, , audio message, what I thought was, huh, it is that something that needs to stay back in 2024, but I was actually really intrigued so I'm going to jump right in and I'm going to let them talk for themselves.
• 5:30
  Oh, hey, I'm Amy Williamson, the AI obsessed copywriter from Damn Right.
• 5:35
  Now, writing good copy comes down to what you say and how you say it.
• 5:41
  So with that in mind, here's what I think would be best to leave behind in 2024.
• 5:46
  Starting with a maybe polarizing opinion, but I think that highly aspirational marketing is going to fall on its face next year.
• 5:54
  I know we've seen a lot of this type of messaging and marketing lately, and a lot of it seems to have performed really well.
• 6:01
  And that's because it is that like natural pushback against pain point marketing.
• 6:07
  But the problem is that aspirational messaging really only works when it feels possible and relevant, which I just don't think will be the case in 2025.
• 6:18
  So, cool.
• 6:19
  Amy is saying that aspirational marketing has the potential to crash and burn this year.
• 6:25
  And you know, I mentioned that I was a little wary at first when I heard this and that's because I, there's a lot of aspirational writing that I will do with clients, especially those in the coaching field.
• 6:36
  So, In some ways, I like aspirational marketing, but here is where Amy is completely right.
• 6:43
  There's no, balance here.
• 6:45
  Like, it's not like a scale where aspirational marketing is on one side and pain point is on another and you have to choose a side.
• 6:52
  So when people hear, you know, either of the two and feel as if they do need to take a side, they go all in.
• 6:59
  In the wrong way on aspirational, which you'll hear shortly from a few other marketers about why, , having a fabricated lifestyle or fabricated message can be so wrong for your marketing.
• 7:12
  So if you're promising these big results and what could be and how everything can change and you can transform, you know what someone's experiencing with your aspirational marketing, but you don't have.
• 7:27
  the skills, the expertise, the actual proof, the ability to, to follow up on that, it's not good.
• 7:37
  Also, we're entering a very difficult time in history and people have a lot of feelings.
• 7:43
  They're going to continue to experience a lot of changes.
• 7:48
  So Writing without acknowledging pain points or writing where everything is aspirational and pretty and possible is going to feel disingenuous.
• 7:56
  So, I don't think Amy means that we should just say sayonara to aspirational marketing, but I do think We need to be very careful about how we position our copy, our content, our sales efforts in, in 2025, specifically that we are just cautious with the way that we present things and make sure that we don't present everything to be like sunshine and roses.
• 8:23
  All right, we're going to move on slightly.
• 8:25
  I did mention that Some people have a lot to say about this, like lifestyle that content creators have created and how that affects marketing and how we're actually sold a message that we do really need to have this, , persona of self if we're going to market our business.
• 8:43
  So I am going to invite Hannah Plourde on the podcast to talk about that right now.
• 8:49
  And let's see what she has to say.
• 8:51
  Hello, my name is Hannah Plourd.
• 8:53
  I'm a storytelling marketing mentor, and a trend that I see staying in 2024 is flashing your wealth, flashing your success, using marketing materials like showing your jewelry, going on fancy trips, flying first class, without backing it up with real life proof that you own the world.
• 9:13
  Worked hard to get this.
• 9:15
  I see a lot of people talking about, Oh, I only worked five hours a week and I have this type of lifestyle.
• 9:20
  And I see a lot of people seeing through this marketing gimmick and understanding the work that goes into creating a lifestyle like this.
• 9:29
  And it's really not work at all if you're passionate about it.
• 9:32
  So I see a trend in 2025 of more people sharing behind the scenes.
• 9:38
  Real truth of what it takes to build a business and to have the level of success that people desire.
• 9:45
  And Hannah's not the only person that feels like that.
• 9:48
  You know, there were actually a few people who mentioned this same thing lightly, either in the other messages that they shared with me, or just truly echoing the same feelings.
• 9:59
  One of those people is Becca Tracy, who's been on the podcast before, and she's also the founder of The Uncaged Life.
• 10:07
  And here's what she has to say about selling lifestyle instead of True marketing.
• 10:14
  Hey, I'm Becca Tracy from The Uncaged Life, and the trend that I see, or at least that I hope stays behind in 2024, is this emphasis on selling a lifestyle.
• 10:26
  This should have stayed behind in 2015, let's be honest, but , it's still happening and I'm hoping it's done.
• 10:31
  I just feel like Buyers are being more discerning now, especially after the last couple of years of inflation and prices going up on literally everything.
• 10:41
  I think that this idea of selling the lifestyle of something, especially when we're looking at the business and marketing space is just so overdone and people are a lot more specific now and a lot pickier about what they pay for.
• 10:54
  And I think that being vague about how you help someone and just, you know, acting as if your business course is going to give them this, fancy lifestyle is bullshit and no one is buying it anymore.
• 11:07
  Or at least I hope people are cluing in that if somebody isn't able to clearly tell you how they're going to help you specifically what they're going to be working on in your business or in your marketing or in your copy,, and they're just trying to sell you the nice outcome of that lifestyle.
• 11:27
  you should run the other way.
• 11:28
  And I'm hoping that we're moving away from that.
• 11:30
  I've seen us moving away from that over the years, and I'm hoping that we continue to move away from it so that it is done in 2025 and people who are doing marketing and copywriting and selling are really being clear and specific about what they're going to help you with beyond just achieving some kind of luxury lifestyle.
• 11:49
  okay.
• 11:49
  Thank you, Becca.
• 11:50
  Thank you, Hannah.
• 11:51
  Great points.
• 11:52
  But.
• 11:52
  What do you do, right?
• 11:54
  Because it's been so ingrained in people in the online business world, specifically, you might not see this so much if you are a local business, , or if you are just kind of entering the digital landscape with your business, but if you've been in the online business world, It's been so ingrained to create this persona of self, to create this vision of success and use that to sell yourself and your business to your audience.
• 12:23
  So it feels tricky, I think, to say, like, what's the next step?
• 12:26
  What do we take to change?
• 12:28
  How can we move into this new sense of self in marketing, this new persona where we're not being disingenuous, where we're being authentic?
• 12:38
  Especially if you are the face of your business or brand, you know.
• 12:42
  Hello, everyone.
• 12:43
  I'm a service provider and a content creator, but I am the name of my business.
• 12:48
  I am the consultant.
• 12:49
  I am the strategist.
• 12:51
  I am the writer.
• 12:52
  So I have a personal brand and you see that when you come to the podcast and you listen to these episodes, you're seeing a persona that I have created for myself.
• 13:04
  You are seeing something that is shaped.
• 13:07
  The full version of Erin Olilla is complicated and messy.
• 13:11
  You know, there's one second that I am the perfect mom and the next second where I'm yelling at my kids, there's one second where I am.
• 13:19
  Killing it with my SEO content that I'm creating for my business.
• 13:23
  And then there's years where I did not write a thing for my own business because I was too busy in my clients.
• 13:29
  You know, there's wins and losses I've had.
• 13:31
  I've had extremely high,, financial months of, of income and extremely low ones.
• 13:37
  I have been consistent with the podcast and I've been inconsistent, right?
• 13:42
  So that's real.
• 13:45
  , but what I'm presenting to you is the best version of myself as a podcaster for me, specifically, transparency and authenticity are Transcribed actual business values.
• 13:56
  So I try as hard as I can to build connection with you, my audience, from being honest, right, from showing you the pitfalls and the mistakes that I've made and, you know, sharing ways to, I've tried to improve or that I can suggest for you, but it's still a persona.
• 14:13
  So before I go so deeply off topic, I think the best way to approach this next step is to figure out what What your persona is, and I think for everyone, all businesses in 2025, your persona needs to be as true to your brand values as possible.
• 14:36
  You know, we've got a couple of great episodes on this, which I will link to in the show notes.
• 14:41
  , But if you haven't figured out what those brand values are, I really suggest , that you spend some time doing that this year, that you prioritize your brand values and your brand voice.
• 14:51
  Because I think when you feel very confident in who you are in business.
• 14:55
  And how you choose to present yourself, it's natural for your audience to relate to that.
• 15:00
  And it's natural for them to like, you know, it's going to be some corny marketing language right here, but feel that magnet to you because they trust you because that connection has been built.
• 15:11
  But speaking of brand voice, let's talk about one type of voice.
• 15:17
  I guess I'd say that needs to stay behind.
• 15:21
  And again, I'm going to welcome Amy Williamson back on the podcast to share her thoughts on that.
• 15:25
  Oh, hey, I'm Amy Williamson, the AI obsessed copywriter from Damn Right.
• 15:30
  I also think we're going to see the casual but vague brand voices really struggle to be heard.
• 15:37
  These voices might sound more conversational, but when you scratch a little deeper, they're often still just filled with cliche, meaningless words.
• 15:45
  It's still missing that personality and that pulse that makes people actually want to read it.
• 15:51
  And while AI is great for helping combat this and helping figure out brand voice, it's also led to a lot more of this type of voice being out there in the world.
• 16:00
  Now, while I'd love to say that the villainization of particular words or punctuation as supposed proof that something was absolutely written by AI will be left behind, it does make for pretty effective clickbait, so I doubt that's going to simmer down.
• 16:16
  All right.
• 16:16
  I had actually meant to lecture you a little bit after I shared Amy's clip.
• 16:22
  And what I wanted to say was something that needs to stay behind in 2024 and not tip its toe into 2025 is marketing without values.
• 16:31
  But I kind of already mentioned that.
• 16:33
  So Just want to reiterate that.
• 16:36
  You want to be effective in 2025?
• 16:38
  Know your values and let them lead your marketing efforts.
• 16:42
  Being vague in this time in history is not going to attract people to you, and it is not going to make people confident in buying from you.
• 16:52
  People want to really align their,, business spending with their own values.
• 16:59
  So when you lead with your values, you're more likely to make conversions and develop a stronger sense of trust with your audience.
• 17:07
  Don't know what your values are.
• 17:08
  It's impossible to do that.
• 17:10
  So if you are again, kind of adding to what Amy's saying, if you are, you know, having this voice that is maybe quirky and fun and, and shows some personality.
• 17:20
  But doesn't actually say anything, you're not going to be as effective.
• 17:25
  So leave that, self created brand of personality in the past, unless you can tie it in with some of those brand values that you have, unless you can actually, you know, take a stand, , set your feet firmly on the ground when, and be clear with what you believe in and.
• 17:42
  You know, invite your audience in on that fact.
• 17:45
  So we've gone over some kind of like big things, but there were a few specific suggestions that were marketing related, I'm going to let Brianna, Sam and Andrea on the podcast now to talk about very, specific copy or marketing things that we need to stop doing.
• 18:03
  First person is Brianna Owen, and she's going to talk to us about.
• 18:06
  Keyword stuffing, , as it relates to SEO.
• 18:09
  Now, in this decade that has been January 2025, I have heard 8 billion things on social media about how SEO is either dead or it is alive.
• 18:21
  It is either going to completely like vanish into the ethers because of AI, or it's going to transform into something new and beautiful and marketing.
• 18:31
  But no matter what, we want to make sure that we follow SEO best practices that are Not manipulative and keyword stuffing is just one of those things that really belongs back in 2011 like we need, we need to stop adding so many keywords in because I mean, it's just such a thing of the past.
• 18:52
  So Brianne is here.
• 18:54
  I'll let her take this one and talk to you about why keyword stuffing is just silly these days.
• 19:00
  Hi, I'm Brianna.
• 19:01
  I'm an email, copywriter and strategist for service based businesses.
• 19:05
  And I definitely have some pet peeves when it comes to marketing and copywriting.
• 19:09
  And one that I hope does not step a single toe into 2025 is keyword stuffing.
• 19:16
  Because here's the deal, like, if we talk like a human, and even more, if we talk like our ideal clients do about our thing, like, we use their words to describe the problem that they're having or the solution that our services and offers provide and the future desire that.
• 19:35
  It can create and bring to life if we use their words to talk about our stuff, the relevant keywords will naturally and organically be there, and it will be just the right amount.
• 19:52
  And so we don't need to just, like, stuff our content with keywords.
• 19:58
  Like, we just need to talk like our people talk and our keywords will be there.
• 20:03
  And speaking of talking like our people talk, let me introduce Sam Burmeister, , who you may know as Nomad Copy on social media.
• 20:12
  She's actually the person that was the inspiration behind today's episode and tomorrow's.
• 20:17
  Because on threads, at some point, she was asking this very question.
• 20:22
  What needs to stay?
• 20:24
  behind in 2024?
• 20:25
  Like what has no place in 2025?
• 20:28
  And you know, what were some copywriters predictions for what 2025 will bring for the world of marketing and messaging?
• 20:35
  And at some point during the comments, the thread, she had tagged me and and said, Hey, like, this needs to be a podcast episode, and I thought to myself, like, heck, yeah, like, this is a really smart conversation.
• 20:46
  You've seen it in the past.
• 20:47
  I have a lot of prediction episodes and I actually think they're really fun.
• 20:52
  There's something I'd love to continue to do every year.
• 20:55
  But Sam has a really specific suggestion for what goes on sales pages.
• 21:01
  And I think this is actually really, really smart.
• 21:04
  So listen in, take note, especially if you have any sales or launches coming back up in the future.
• 21:09
  Hi, my name is Samantha with Nomad Copy Agency.
• 21:11
  And the term that I see staying behind in 2024 is the introducing section.
• 21:16
  We've heard this thing that says clear over clever for so many years and what this ended up turning into is kind of this like clear and clever matrix of things that ended up sounding a little bit templated.
• 21:27
  And one of those things is the introducing section.
• 21:31
  The introducing section tends to appear as a header and it's the part of a sales page where you introduce your program.
• 21:36
  Typically we see it ending up about halfway down the page and it is the part of a sales page that tells people the most important thing that they're looking for on that page, which is what the program is and why they should want it.
• 21:47
  So the introducing section should stay, but the title of it, I think, is going to go by the wayside.
• 21:53
  When we say introducing, there are so many more ways to be even more clear while still maintaining that bit of cleverness that goes with it.
• 22:02
  So some language changes that we might see with this in 2025 are saying something like Becoming.
• 22:09
  For example, become the best marketing VA in your industry.
• 22:13
  Or telling them what the outcome of the program is in a different way.
• 22:17
  Two examples here are, create the coaching practice of your dreams, or one that we see all too often, especially around resolution season, go from couch to 5k in 90 days.
• 22:28
  Ultimately, the introduce and introduction section Is staining, but the exact wording of introducing, I think is going by the wayside where we get to see that header space used for more potent, powerful language.
• 22:47
  And to sum up this episode, something that Absolutely, 100 million percent, because that is of course, you know, a way to measure things, 100 million percent.
• 22:58
  Moving on, something that is vitally important, and this is also a hill that I will die on, is gatekeeping prices.
• 23:07
  I get that it can feel overwhelming to try to put a price on things, but it is so important for your audience to have a general idea of what it costs to work with you, you know, before I start, you know, renting on this, I'm just going to let Andrea take it over.
• 23:25
  Hi, I'm Andrea Shaw and I'm a website copywriter for wedding creatives and educators in the wedding industry.
• 23:31
  And if there's one trend I want to stay in 2024, it is websites that gatekeep pricing, especially for service providers.
• 23:39
  I know that everyone thinks that their pricing is custom and therefore they can't put a price on their website.
• 23:45
  But the reality is that is turning potential clients off.
• 23:49
  They are You're opening up 10 tabs in their browser, and if 7 of those people don't list prices, the first people they're going to reach out to are going to be the 3 who did, where they can see confidently that this might be within their budget.
• 24:04
  You need to get creative with how you share your pricing.
• 24:06
  I know that most of us don't have fixed prices for our services, that things are flexible, they change, but people are looking for some evidence that you're aligned on price with them.
• 24:18
  I spend a lot of time researching what buyers are thinking in today's environment, specifically for my industry.
• 24:23
  And over and over, this is one of the biggest complaints, including at a very high level, even people who are spending 500, 000 or a million dollars on their wedding, for example, still have.
• 24:35
  a price point at which they might not be able to pay for a florist or a photographer or some other vendor and they want to know before they reach out to people.
• 24:44
  They are busy people, they don't want to waste their time inquiring with someone who's going to cost far beyond their allocated budget.
• 24:51
  So they are not only looking for that information on their site, but also they are exchanging that information behind the scenes.
• 24:59
  And when they do that, it causes service providers to lose control of the narrative around the pricing.
• 25:04
  Because when you present an example of your pricing, you can explain that it's your current pricing, you can explain what it's for and what it includes exactly.
• 25:13
  If someone else shares that pricing with your ideal client, it might lose all context.
• 25:17
  It might not include everything.
• 25:19
  that was offered for that price.
• 25:20
  It might be outdated.
• 25:22
  It might be inaccurate.
• 25:23
  So sharing your pricing is a way to control the narrative around your pricing and people want that information up front before they have to fill out an inquiry form and definitely before they have to get on a live sales call with you.
• 25:37
  All right, friends.
• 25:38
  That is it.
• 25:39
  Again, welcome to season four of Talk, Copy to Me.
• 25:42
  I hope this first episode gave you something to think about, made you question whether you were doing things in 2025 that you actually really don't want to be doing anymore, or you want to make efforts to change, or made you just think about What you have personally left behind in your marketing efforts over the time that you've been in business, now in case you tuned me out before I invite you to come back tomorrow because we'll, I'll be here all week.
• 26:08
  Yes.
• 26:08
  In your ears all week, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, and tomorrow, some of these voices that join me today will be back with a couple new people to talk about the predictions that we have for 2025.
• 26:20
  . I wanted to make sure I did the like, see you later 2024 episode first, so we could kind of get that out, clear the air, and start fresh.
• 26:30
  Tomorrow's episode I think is going to be really helpful, so tune back in, it will be short, and I hope to see you there.
• 26:37
  See you next time where we keep talking copy.