Latest / Mortgage Marketing Radio / Becoming a Second Opinion Mortgage Specialist with Scott Schang

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Becoming a Second Opinion Mortgage Specialist with Scott Schang · Mortgage Marketing Radio

• 0:00
  In today's highly competitive mortgage industry, building profitable relationships with
• 0:04
  the real estate agents is essential for success.
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  However, finding effective ways to secure agent relationships can be a challenge.
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• 0:15
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  Our new case study featuring loan officer Chris Cogill is a must-read.
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  Chris has closed a remarkable 36 million in funded loans from agent referrals.
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  And in this case study, he shares his proven strategies for building strong relationships
• 0:34
  with real estate agents and leveraging those relationships to drive more business.
• 0:39
  To get your hands on this resource, head over to LOKestudy.com and download your free copy
• 0:45
  of the case study today.
• 0:47
  You'll find actionable insights and practical tips that Chris used to close 36 million
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  in funded loans from agent referrals and how you can too.
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  Don't miss out.
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  Go check it out right now.
• 0:58
  Visit LOKestudy.com and download your free copy today.
• 1:04
  Most consumers are going to work with the first person that they talk to unless that person
• 1:08
  drops the ball, right?
• 1:11
  And that's pretty, that's a game that they're playing, by the way, quick and for example.
• 1:16
  Yeah.
• 1:17
  Actually, let me add a couple other things that the positive sides of the quickens and
• 1:26
  the lending trees and the bank rates is, first of all, they've made consumers comfortable
• 1:32
  with getting mortgage information online.
• 1:35
  So I'm going to give them that.
• 1:36
  And they've also really pushed everybody's tech game.
• 1:40
  And I do agree that there needs to be hurdles removed from in front of the consumer to get
• 1:48
  to qualifying for mortgage.
• 1:50
  They're always trying to commoditize mortgages and you can commoditize certain mortgages,
• 1:56
  but especially with like COVID and the gig economy, there's a lot of people out there that
• 2:03
  just need somebody that can figure out the guidelines and piece this stuff together.
• 2:11
  Hey there, it's Jeff Zimfer.
• 2:29
  But you already know who I am.
• 2:30
  I'm the host of this podcast, the mortgage marketing radio.
• 2:32
  And I'm so grateful you have tuned in great to be connecting with you.
• 2:37
  And I'll tell you what I love so much about hosting this podcast in its sixth year right
• 2:42
  now is just bringing ideas and content to you guys that helps make a difference in your
• 2:47
  rear trajectory.
• 2:48
  I appreciate the DMs letting me know the difference the content is made.
• 2:52
  And hey, if you want to leave me a review wherever you're listening to this right now, tap
• 2:55
  your mobile phone, go to leave review.
• 2:57
  That'd be great.
• 2:58
  It really helps us come up in the search rankings.
• 3:01
  I was recently had the honor of being featured among other industry colleagues who also host
• 3:05
  podcasts by housing wire featured us as one of the top podcasts in the industry.
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  So thanks housing wire shout out to you for doing that.
• 3:13
  Hey, by the way, so look at the market has shifted and I'm talking to agents and loan
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  officers every single week and the thing I hear more often recently is that agents are
• 3:21
  getting lots of calls from lenders yet their approach is lame and same, meaning hey, let
• 3:26
  me tell you about our company.
• 3:27
  Let me tell you about our great rates, our great service, how fast we closed.
• 3:30
  Let me like to learn more about your business and what happens when you hear the same message
• 3:35
  over and over again, you tend to tune it out, right?
• 3:39
  The reality is you want more quality agent relationships, you want more consistent referrals
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  because referrals are the quickest shortest path to your purchase pipeline in today's
• 3:51
  market.
• 3:52
  Have you struggled with how to get those agent conversations, have you struggled with how
• 3:55
  to get agent attention and conversations and ultimately to build profitable partnerships
• 4:00
  and referrals?
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  I'd like to share with you a better way.
• 4:04
  You've heard the success stories.
• 4:05
  I keep rolling them out to you.
• 4:07
  I've got my another success story from Carmella shout out to you again, right?
• 4:11
  She's just ongoing and rocking with classes.
• 4:13
  She recently hosted this class 10 ways to get new listings.
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  She had 24 registered 10 show up for new agents.
• 4:19
  She had never met before three appointments made after the class.
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  She scheduled her next class, which is called embracing the shift right then and there
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  and she had agents immediately signed up to attend that class.
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  Then we have Jeremy Martin, who's got his third class in two months.
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  Every agent there wants to follow up meeting.
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  He says, I don't know why it took me so long to get signed up.
• 4:37
  What's taking you so long?
• 4:39
  You've heard me now for the past several podcast intros, run a brief commercial about
• 4:43
  my agent classes in the mortgage marketing pro membership.
• 4:46
  Have you checked it out?
• 4:47
  There's a brief video that's put up and it'll share with you exactly what's involved
• 4:51
  in our platform.
• 4:52
  It's turn key.
• 4:54
  It's plug and play.
• 4:55
  You simply become a member.
• 4:57
  You join our small group community of VIP members where we meet every single week and
• 5:01
  we coach on everything from social media to sales skills and everything in between.
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  But even better than that, we equip you with a done for you platform of educational content
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  that you reach out to real estate agents and invite them to your classes.
• 5:14
  Virtually or in person, we give you the social media images to post.
• 5:17
  We give you the emails to send the text messages.
• 5:20
  Literally in five minutes, you set up a class and you automate the entire invite and
• 5:24
  follow up system for getting agents to attend your classes.
• 5:28
  And then if you follow our coaching program, you will get conversations and referrals just
• 5:32
  like you heard about from our testimonials every single week.
• 5:35
  What do you do next?
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  You'd be like Jeremy, you don't wait so long to sign up.
• 5:39
  You go to mortgage marketing.pro and learn more.
• 5:41
  All right, this week, my special guest is a long time friend.
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  When I say long time, I'm talking over 10 years.
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  My good friend Scott Shang is what I'll call a digital marketing maven.
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  What I mean is, so Scott has been in the trenches for years, leveraging content, digital content
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  to come up organically in Google search results to fund and funnel his mortgage pipeline
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  with clients.
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  And he's done it for years now.
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  It's the third time he's been on the podcast and that is a very rare honor to be back
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  in the third time on the podcast.
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  And what I love about the conversation every time I have a Scott is I'm enlightened.
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  I've learned something and I've become right more knowledgeable about something.
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  And today we're talking about right search today.
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  We're talking about not just search, but consumer direct.
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  We're talking about how to, if you will, compete against the big boys and girls, the
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  big boxes.
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  And Scott has this pretty cool approach, what he calls a second opinion specialist.
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  And he's got some stats that's relevant for you to hear about the tens of thousands
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  of people that fill out an online mortgage app every day.
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  What the conversion rates are on that and what the real opportunity is for you as a
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  mortgage professional.
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  If you're at all interested in diversifying your sources of business, not only just real
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  estate agents as a pillar.
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  And of course, we know that's an important one, but also going consumer direct, the
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  holy grail.
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  What does consumer direct mean?
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  Where do you get the business?
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  How do you compete?
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  What do you do?
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  That's what this episode is all about.
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  So let's get into this week's show.
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  Scott Shane, welcome back to the podcast.
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  Thank you.
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  What is it?
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  Second, third time?
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  I think it's the third time.
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  Yeah.
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  Yeah.
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  I just don't eat club, my friend.
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  I feel very special.
• 7:22
  I do.
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  We've been friends a long time.
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  Yes, for sure.
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  And for the listeners, yes, we've known each other gosh, at least 10 years.
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  And you know, it's funny.
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  I finally remember back in the day, you and me used to be at Starbucks at the Irvine
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  Spectrum.
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  Yeah.
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  We just go talk marketing, man.
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  And geek out and marketing.
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  And that's a long time.
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  It feels like a long time ago, 10 years, right?
• 7:42
  Yeah, yeah.
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  No, gosh, it must, it's at least that long.
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  And yeah, and we were still talking about CRMs and conversion and all of that stuff
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  like that.
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  Yeah.
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  Things of things, something that have changed and some things haven't.
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  That's right.
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  Maybe that's a good place to enter.
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  What do you think hasn't changed?
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  Then we'll take what has changed.
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  Oh, boy.
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  I don't know, that's a really good question.
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  I think the most important thing that I realized, and this is within the context of my experience,
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  but being mostly consumer direct for over a decade, and what hasn't changed is there
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  are still some of the companies that do the most marketing direct to consumers have the
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  least experienced loan officers on the other side of that, on the other side of that inquiry.
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  And yet when consumers, and this is what has happened, this is what has changed for
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  sure over the last 10 years.
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  And maybe even a little bit longer is these companies have convinced consumers that the
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  way to get your questions answered about qualifying for a mortgage is to fill out a form
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  on the internet, right?
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  Because I mean, when you think about it, well, at least us as consumers and my decade
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  plus experience working with mortgage consumers, they're not going online to fill out some
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  rando application, they're going online because they have questions about qualifying for
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  a mortgage, and they want to talk to somebody.
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  But the only thing they're presented with on the first couple of pages of Google searches
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  are fill out this form, fill out this form, somebody will get a hold of you.
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  So I think the lack of experience in our industry has been exaggerated over time as more and
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  more mortgage companies go online first, and they're trying to go tech first as opposed
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  to in person first.
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  I think that's a big, I think that's something that's definitely shifted.
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  So are you implying there that the consumer experience of that search example you gave,
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  right?
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  Search some terms and we could talk terms, whatever, but, but ultimately the destination
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  for most of those is fill out a form.
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  Are you implying that that's not a great experience for the consumer?
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  Well, yeah, I'm not implying it.
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  I'm overtly stating that overwhelmingly that consumer, well, here are the statistics,
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  here are the industry statistics from my lead generation insider friends.
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  If you are purchasing leads, if you're a major buyer of leads from these companies, if
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  you can convert 4% of those lead forms, you are absolutely knocking it out of the park.
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  On average, between 2 and 4% of those lead forms will result in a closed loan with the
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  company that bought the lead.
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  And so what that means to me is that 96 to 98% of those online consumers are going back
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  to Google, I think armed with a little bit more information, maybe a little bit more detailed
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  question because they probably had some interaction and they're going back online and they're
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  looking for a second opinion, they're looking for somebody else to help them.
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  And, you know, I don't know if you and I have ever had this story, but I've been on this path,
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  basically my entire career, I've been in the mortgage industry for over 20 years.
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  And when I got into the industry, first my boss wouldn't really, he didn't want me to
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  originate. So I did stuff in the back end, like I helped people prequel and run numbers and
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  we used Excel spreadsheets back then for doing things. But when I wanted to originate,
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  he basically told me I couldn't do it because I wasn't a great salesperson.
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  And so he made me process for the top loan officer in the company for a year before he would
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  let me originate. And so I did that. And when he started, when he let me originate, it turned out
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  he was 100% right and I was a horrible salesperson, like I'm not good at being on the other side of
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  a call center or title data or something like that. So what I did is we had this room in our office
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  that was stacked floor to ceiling with legal sized bankers boxes of turn downs from all the other
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  loan officers in the company. I spent the next two years in that room and I more than tripled
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  the loan production of every other loan officer in that company for two straight years only working
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  off of turn downs. Now there's a couple of reasons for that. One reason is that people didn't have
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  databases. So they weren't keeping in touch with people if something happened.
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  But like that was my very first experience and I didn't realize it at the time.
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  But then when the market crashed in 2008 and I built my website, my consumer direct website,
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  my website averages 20,000 unique visitors a month. And I would say in the high 90% of those
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  have been turned down by one, two, three loan officers from call centers or some of these
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  bigger bank companies that have most companies with big marketing budgets. They're not syncing
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  that money into professionals. They're not hiring people like me to answer those phones.
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  They're hands are in telemarketers and they usually have a lot of overlays. They're just looking
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  for the easy stuff. So guys like me end up getting stuck with all the stuff with hair on it.
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  Yeah, by the way, first of all, kudos and congrats to you that you sweat it out and that's how you
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  built your stripes and really probably hold your ability to connect and understand, you know,
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  and conversations. Baptism by fire, as I say. I want to go back to the stats you threw out though.
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  And the context of what you talked about, like, you know, these big box, big budget companies
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  aren't necessarily investing in, you know, professionalism or sales skills. So first of all,
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  let me say this. You said all those lead forms that fill out. And of course, we all know who we're
• 14:23
  talking about the big boys and gals, two to four percent conversion. Yeah. I want to highlight if
• 14:29
  you agree with this is you said if you're converting four percent, you're knocking it out of the
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  park. However, that four percent conversion though, that's an example, a snippet of data from
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  the best of the best for conversion. Would you agree? Yes. Yeah. And on average, another four
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  percent of that is going to convert over the next six months. A lot of these companies, a lot of
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  these companies will continue to follow up on that data. But most of the time, they're going someplace
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  else. Most of the time, most consumers are not, they're not taking no for an answer, right? They're
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  going back and they're doing their research and they're just dialing until somebody tells them yes.
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  Well, one of the reasons why I wanted to highlight that is because I don't want people to overlook
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  that statistic because a lot of people are attracted by the siren song of online leads and paid ads
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  and a consumer direct stuff, that holy grail. However, these are people converting at four percent,
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  these are people who have their game on in terms of the technology platform, the automated follow-up,
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  the long-term nurture, all that, the quickens of the world, etc. Like those guys correct me from
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  wrong, those guys have that down pretty darn well, don't they? Well, it depends on what you're saying
• 15:52
  that they have down. Well, the technology side is really the lead generation. It's the lead
• 15:59
  capture where it all goes wrong is where they get on the phone with the kid who worked at the
• 16:04
  vitamin store six months ago. Hold up, hold up right there because that's the next question I wanted
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  to ask is part two to that. And I don't have, I don't sit inside the boardrooms of quickening
• 16:14
  all these people. So I don't know the real answer. My assumption as knowing that they're a smart
• 16:19
  business is that they would be investing in training and resources for their people. So what do
• 16:24
  you say to that? Are they not investing in their people? They're, they, their system doesn't require
• 16:31
  them to have a high level of experience and expertise. That doesn't mean that there's not good
• 16:35
  people that work a quick in. I'm not saying that at all. I'm saying that that business model
• 16:40
  where you're spending a billion dollars a year in marketing, you're not putting that money into
• 16:48
  personnel. They've created a technology platform. And if the loan is easy enough, there are
• 16:54
  guardrails set up on that. They're not accepting any six, 19 credit score FHA loans,
• 17:01
  right? And there's, and we can, people can do those all day long, right? So that business model
• 17:10
  is really just, it helps a certain percentage of consumer. But they're not going to help,
• 17:19
  but there's a lot of consumers up there. And I think a lot of people are having the same
• 17:24
  experience as I am. Deals are getting harder and harder, the ones that we're able to get
• 17:29
  our hands on. If I'm correct, last time I looked, I may be slightly off on this number. But last
• 17:33
  time I looked, I think, quick and as a whole in terms of total market share capture rate was around
• 17:39
  10% of total originations in the US. And I could be off on that. But my point of bringing that up is
• 17:47
  whether it's 10, it's eight, whatever is there's to your point. Let's say it is 10%. Well, that leaves
• 17:54
  a hell of a lot of additional business that they're not getting. A ton of additional business. And so
• 18:01
  I actually, I like the fact that those companies are out there because it's easier for a consumer
• 18:09
  to engage with an inexperienced paper pusher. And so it makes people like you have on your
• 18:20
  podcast all the time, that makes us look like rock stars because we actually know what we're talking
• 18:26
  about. And now, imagine the experience from the consumer that fills out, oh, hopefully they didn't
• 18:33
  refill out a bank rate or a lending tree because their phone is still ringing, right? And the text
• 18:38
  messages are still rolling in. Not so much with like a quickener, something like that. But it gives
• 18:46
  us the ability and actual professional that I don't know what your rating is on this. But quite frankly,
• 18:54
  consumers just need somebody that gives a shit. That's really all it is. Somebody that cares,
• 18:59
  somebody that, you know, there's a lot of us, there's a lot of us guideline geeks out there
• 19:07
  that hate to say no. You know, I love the fact that you shared this, this kind of opposite mindset about
• 19:14
  these big box companies and the fact that you said you're glad they're out there because that
• 19:18
  makes professionals look that much better, right? When a consumer can experience the two differences,
• 19:24
  what are they going to choose if you know, if you put like a professional who's highly skilled and
• 19:28
  knows all the right stuff that you know, we've been talking about in the show for years. But if you
• 19:32
  if you're doing an excellent job, if you're the, you know, lack of a better Ritz Carlton of
• 19:37
  mortgages, right? Service, caring, quality, dialogue, you know, the whole soups and versus what they
• 19:42
  get at that quick on a rocket, that's an obvious difference. And I would say if prices are relatively
• 19:49
  the same, consumers going to go with the better experience. Most consumers are going to work with
• 19:55
  the first person that they talk to unless that person drops the ball, right? And that's pretty,
• 20:01
  that's that that's a game that they're playing, by the way, quick and for example. Yeah, yeah,
• 20:07
  and actually, let me let me add a couple other a couple other things that that you know,
• 20:12
  the positive sides of of the quickens and the lending trees and the bank rates is first of all,
• 20:19
  they've they've made consumers comfortable with getting mortgage information online. So I'm going
• 20:25
  to give them that. And they've also really pushed everybody's tech game. And I do agree that
• 20:32
  there needs to be hurdles removed from in front of the consumer to get to qualifying for mortgage.
• 20:40
  They're always trying to commoditize mortgages. And you can commoditize certain mortgages,
• 20:45
  but especially with like COVID and the gig economy, there's a lot of people out there that just
• 20:53
  need somebody that can figure out the guidelines and piece this stuff together. And and for me,
• 21:00
  what I call that community is second opinion specialists. I love that. Right. Right. And like,
• 21:07
  that's our angle. Mm-hmm. What does that mean, second opinion specialists? Like a lender's
• 21:11
  listening to that. And like, I know I used to pitch that to realtors. Like, I'll be, you need
• 21:16
  a second opinion. But go ahead. What does that really mean? Well, for me, for for me, it, it, it,
• 21:22
  it means that we're problem solvers. We're troubleshooters and we're problem solvers. And if you're
• 21:29
  going to go out there and you're going to tell people you're going to give them a second opinion,
• 21:32
  like you better have some sort of depth of experience and product knowledge. Not everybody out there
• 21:39
  is a guideline geek and wants to handle second opinions. But what I can tell you, Jeff,
• 21:45
  and and and I've heard this over and over again with other people that are kind of in the similar
• 21:51
  spaces. I am the the loyalty and the referrals and the repeat business from somebody who's been
• 21:59
  turned down by another loan officer are probably multiples higher than if you bought leads from
• 22:07
  somebody and you just happened to be the lowest price and you're just a commodity and nobody cares
• 22:13
  about you. So I believe it's also a stronger relationship and it's a stronger past client pipeline.
• 22:19
  Hmm. Of that. Where do you think then, you know, because this consumer direct thing has been
• 22:24
  talked about for years, as you know, and it's always been what seems to be for many out of reach
• 22:32
  until, for example, social media came in and that's a different version of consumer direct and it's
• 22:37
  not exactly, you know, how, how we mean it here, per se, although you do have because of social
• 22:44
  the ability to build a relationship directly with a consumer. You got stories on the podcast,
• 22:48
  but where do you think that fits in in the overall high, right, of a of a loan officer's successful
• 22:55
  business, you know, strategy sources, et cetera? Consumer consumer direct. Mm-hmm. Like if you're
• 23:02
  building a get percentages or a slice of the, you know what I mean, like when should a why should a
• 23:06
  loan officer say, you know what, I need to go consumer direct and we'll, you know, whatever that
• 23:10
  means to you as well, explain what you think that means. Yeah, I think it is, first of all,
• 23:18
  I think it's a long game play. Mm-hmm. So I think if you're building up your consumer direct presence,
• 23:24
  now there's a few ways to do consumer direct. You can buy leads. That's considered consumer direct.
• 23:29
  The challenge that you have if you're using that method of consumer direct is you don't know what
• 23:34
  the ads look like. You don't know what's being told to the consumer for them to fill out the form.
• 23:40
  So when you get it, it's completely cold. And then the other piece of that is it's probably
• 23:45
  sold to multiple people. You can run your own ads, right? So you can hire an agency and tell them
• 23:53
  what to say and how to do it. And then that's going to be a little higher converting. And then what
• 23:58
  I've kind of done and what I'm trying to help loan officers with is creating your own content.
• 24:03
  So mostly video, transcribing the video, posting it as blog posts. And then that can be
• 24:09
  repurposed for all your social and all of your other things. I think consumer direct is really,
• 24:17
  really important, especially as we run into like these really challenging markets.
• 24:24
  If you don't own your lead flow, if you don't own, if you're not going consumer direct,
• 24:30
  it's just going to be a lot more challenging. I mean, if you're working with real estate agents,
• 24:36
  depending on what market you're in, they only have access to a certain number of consumers.
• 24:43
  I think it's absolutely vital. I think a lot of us do what you could call consumer direct on social,
• 24:53
  but they don't make that jump to Google and YouTube. And Google and YouTube are the largest
• 25:00
  search engines in the world. And so I think it's close to the same. You know, I think it's close to
• 25:09
  the same. I think it's close to social. So you mentioned creating content. Yeah. And so I'm
• 25:16
  always trying to like, and this is difficult because I'm always trying to, you know, advocate for
• 25:21
  the different context or situations of people that I know are in my audience, either based on people
• 25:25
  have had or other people, you truly know. So take YouTube, for example, right? Kyle Seagraves,
• 25:30
  for example, or others like him. Well, clearly he's built a very successful machine on YouTube,
• 25:35
  air quotes, consumer direct, using the second largest search engine YouTube. And so one could,
• 25:41
  or he might argue, you know, dude, I don't need to go anywhere else. Like I'm doing great on YouTube.
• 25:46
  Well, I know Kyle and we've had this conversation. And YouTube audiences are very, very challenging.
• 25:59
  It's, it's, it is difficult because education is what works on YouTube. And there isn't a
• 26:08
  clear way to control the path from the consumer. You can put links in the, in the bio.
• 26:16
  But then they're not pretty, right? They have to be the whole HTTPS. And it has to be the whole
• 26:21
  link. And you're getting people to go in there and click. That's not a bad, that's, that's,
• 26:27
  that's not a bad way to go. I mean, it's, it's a really good water. It's one line. It's, it's
• 26:32
  a line in the water. And what I, what I like is if I'm going to create content once I want to,
• 26:38
  I want to use it for multiple ways. So if I'm creating that video that I'm going to post on YouTube,
• 26:44
  I'm also going to transcribe it and publish it on my blog post as a text thing. I'll, I'll embed
• 26:50
  the video on there, but I'm going to, I'm going to paste the text. So now you're, now you're
• 26:55
  tackling Google because all of the keywords, everything that you said, it's now a blog post.
• 27:00
  And I think if you can get them to your own property like that, you can control the,
• 27:05
  the user experience much better. Yeah, but man, I don't have time to do all that. Like, that, that,
• 27:14
  I get it, I get it. And I didn't have time to do it either until the market crashed. And all
• 27:24
  of our other business sources dried up. So it's one of those things that you either make that
• 27:31
  investment in your business or you're always going to be starting at some point like by the time
• 27:38
  you need it, it's going to be too late. And then you're going to, and then you're going to be stuck
• 27:43
  with either buying leads from aggregators or shared leads or things like that, but they're not
• 27:49
  going to have a connection to you. Yeah, and it was a little bit of sarcasm as well with the,
• 27:54
  I don't have time because the, I don't have time is the same excuse everyone says for anything,
• 27:59
  right? I don't have time to work out. I don't have time to post video. Yeah, well, if you never
• 28:03
  have time, you know, it's true. And yes, you don't have time. And you should probably make time
• 28:12
  if you think that it's important enough. But, but really what, what, you know, what I want people
• 28:18
  to, to really hear here in this conversation though, Jeff is that there is, there are
• 28:27
  tens of thousands, if not hundreds of thousands of consumers every month filling out forms online
• 28:34
  from lead aggregators and big box lenders. Hundreds of thousands of people a month.
• 28:40
  We don't need very many of those to, but, but, but, to ignore that addressable audience of
• 28:49
  mortgage consumers is crazy. All right. Well, let's play a quick little game then here if you don't
• 28:53
  mind. Let's do tell them what he's won. No way. Where's my? All right. So I'm going to go to Google
• 29:04
  and I'm going to play with some keyword search terms. So let's play, let's play a second opinion
• 29:10
  specialist. Nobody's Google on that. No, I know. I know. But if I'm going to search, if I'm going
• 29:16
  to play a second opinion, yeah, if I'm a consumer, I'm going to search what am I going to search how much
• 29:21
  to qualify? Like, give me an example of a search term. I just just go as high level as you can. How
• 29:27
  do I qualify for mortgage? Okay. Let's do this. How do I qualify for a mortgage? And then,
• 29:35
  of course, other options are FHA loan, service dog, if anybody's interested, but, um, if you would
• 29:42
  Google came up with, here, let me do a screen share. And this is why if you're listening and you
• 29:47
  haven't gotten to my YouTube channel yet, now you want to go to my YouTube channel and we'll see
• 29:49
  this. Okay. So I typed in, oh, I actually chose FHA. So you want me to get rid of that and just do
• 29:54
  mortgage. How do I qualify for a mortgage? Sure. Yeah. For a mortgage.
• 30:01
  Okay. So obviously at the top is a good old boys, Raga mortgage. That is your lending tray.
• 30:07
  So you skipped rate pass this, though. Right. Which, uh, these are,
• 30:13
  well, yeah, those, you can get content to rank in those. They're most likely going to be
• 30:19
  informational. They're not going to be ads. Right. So that, that, it is a really good
• 30:24
  place if you can, if you can show up in there. One of the three main items to qualify for mortgage.
• 30:29
  So along the lines of what you said earlier, is that got a video? I'm going to take content
• 30:33
  I'm going to repurpose it as a blog post on a website, whatever. This is an example of how that
• 30:37
  stuff might show up. Yeah. Yeah. Um, yeah. And when you scroll down, there should be the YouTube
• 30:43
  videos across the bottom. I know. Yeah. Here it is right here. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
• 30:47
  Oh, first she's a rock star. Oh, Lizzie. Yep. Yeah. She got it. So, so, so look at that. So,
• 30:55
  you know, we know Matt, um, Matt does a really good job with his YouTube channel. Lizzie does a
• 31:01
  really good job with her YouTube channel. Those are organic results. Right. So like, that's as good as
• 31:10
  paid. Yes. But their content creators. Right. Yes. Yes. Yeah. And I would argue as, or not
• 31:17
  argue, I would say, and I know you agree, they're getting business off of YouTube like
• 31:23
  a few moments ago. However, like we said, well, I mean, but I tend to go a little bit like,
• 31:29
  definitely advocate as well because I'm trying to, you know, meet Chief Truth Teller. So, I mean,
• 31:34
  are in a sense playing the consumer direct game because they're showing up on Google here.
• 31:39
  That if you're creating content, you are playing the consumer direct game. That's it. That's
• 31:44
  100%. If you're a content creator on platforms where you can be found. And, and, and I think social
• 31:52
  is, I consider social consumer direct, but it's only the consumers. Not on Facebook strictly to
• 32:01
  look at pictures of their grandkids and cats. Yes. Right. It's just it's a different environment.
• 32:07
  It's an interruption marketing. Whereas YouTube and, and, and Google tend to be more answers.
• 32:15
  Consumers are asking specific questions. Right. And they're getting specific answers.
• 32:19
  And as you know, as well, part of what Google is now trying to do is actually give the answers
• 32:24
  within the search without clicking over to that donation page. And so you're missing out a little
• 32:29
  bit there. And so, okay. You could be very interesting, very interesting. I'm going to stop
• 32:37
  sharing. So, yeah. So, chances are they're going to hit one of those top three. And the top three,
• 32:43
  I think, was Google was, was rocket lending tree. And I think bank rate, right?
• 32:51
  So it was lending tree and rocket for the top two. The lending tree is in there. So far is in
• 32:56
  there. Surprisingly, interestingly, so far. Wow. Anyway, but yeah, generally that's what comes up.
• 33:03
  Yeah. And, and, and quick and as by far the elephant in the room, you know, they're doing the
• 33:08
  sale. They're doing that, you know, super bowl commercials. They're spending probably the most
• 33:16
  money out there, at least for an individual lender. Well, my, my question is ultimately this is
• 33:25
  knowing that, you know, the big boys are going to show up at the top. The ones we just mentioned.
• 33:29
  How do we then win? How do we, if we're talking about our, your, your version of Google or
• 33:36
  consumer Google, how do we win? Well, on an individual basis, you can be a content creator,
• 33:44
  you can create content. And you can learn consumer direct. Even if you're not creating content,
• 33:52
  even if you're buying leads, it's a completely different conversion strategy for consumer direct.
• 33:57
  And if you're going out and getting referrals from real estate agents and things like that,
• 34:02
  what I have built over the years is I am trying to build the largest life raft I possibly can
• 34:11
  in this, what I call this fast moving current of consumers that are being swept away because
• 34:18
  they fill out a form on the internet. And it gets sucked into some black hole and they end up on
• 34:23
  some kids desk in a call center somewhere, but the consumer has no clue on where they're going.
• 34:29
  They don't know who's going to answer their phone or what their experience is. So what I'm trying
• 34:35
  to do with Find My Way home is we're building a, basically a huge life raft where I'm connecting
• 34:44
  second opinion or consumers looking for a second opinion with loan officers willing to give them
• 34:49
  a second opinion. And we're making our brand promise is a one to one, a one to one
• 34:55
  introduction. And the way that we're, the way that we're doing that is we're building a community
• 35:02
  around second opinion specialists around, around loan officers that love to help consumers in that
• 35:10
  way. And they can be a part of that. And so we, it's a monthly membership that we do. And we,
• 35:19
  we have a huge net. I mean, like I said, I have over 20,000 unique visitors a month. That's organic.
• 35:25
  That's not even with paid. And then what we do is when we take the membership, we take the
• 35:30
  membership fees and we reinvest that so that we can start competing with those first page,
• 35:36
  those first page search results. So that's what we're trying to do. If you're, if you're just
• 35:44
  an individual that like works in a really hyper local area, like your community lender,
• 35:51
  you don't need something like what we're doing. You, you, you just need to start creating video.
• 35:56
  And you'll be at the top of, you'll be at the top of your list, right? It's, this works better
• 36:02
  for people that are licensed in multiple states. Do business across the entire state. They don't
• 36:08
  have a real hyper local presence. Hyper local presence. Just do it. You're going to get results
• 36:15
  very, very quickly. This is a little bit more of a higher volume game. Okay. Cool. All right. I know
• 36:20
  you, you're big on education, like I am in as well. And I know, you know, you value having
• 36:26
  loan officers equipped, which is, you know, why you kind of opened up what you talked about with,
• 36:30
  like, you know, the, the end result of who they get at that big box company. Usually,
• 36:34
  they're not highly skilled or trained. So you're also helping people kind of make this shift for
• 36:38
  who it is right for. Tell me about, like, what do you want to do? You know, we got some listeners,
• 36:42
  we got some people who that's right for that are reluctant to or more states. What should they
• 36:47
  do next? If this is something that's interesting to you, I will, you know, you can just schedule
• 36:57
  a call with me. That's the easiest way I can give you my calendar link. So let's put a,
• 37:03
  if you're cool with it, we can put a link to your calendar in the show notes or if there's this
• 37:07
  specific page instead, whatever you prefer, just other listeners know what to do. Is that cool?
• 37:13
  Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. What I'd like to do is I can give you a link where you can,
• 37:17
  where it can send to people and they can reach out to me through calendar to have a conversation.
• 37:23
  We basically have two options on our platform. One option is you can just get introductions to people
• 37:31
  looking for a second opinion. There, there really isn't anything else. You're going to have a profile
• 37:36
  on the website on, find my way home so you can be found on, find my way home. It's connected all
• 37:42
  the follow up, the consumer collection and all the follow up is all done for you. And then we have
• 37:50
  sort of an upgrade where we have a remote video production company and we removed all of the
• 37:58
  hurdles for people creating their own content. So if you go to find my way home.com and you click
• 38:03
  on your state, you'll see the experts that are already on my network and you'll see their videos.
• 38:09
  All they are literally doing is getting on a Zoom call like this and answering questions and
• 38:15
  talking. I have professional directors that sit there and talk them through their story.
• 38:20
  And we do all the editing and the publishing and the promoting and all the retargeting and stuff
• 38:25
  for you. Okay. So all right. So go to find my way, find my way home.com. And if you want to check
• 38:33
  it out, you can see some of the other professionals. I just did it just now. Like I clicked on Nevada
• 38:37
  and I see somebody showed up there. If I go to California, what do we got over here? A couple of
• 38:42
  folks in California. All right. Cool. So that's what they can do. And that's as an example of what
• 38:48
  it would look like to have a presence on the website. Got it. And there can also there'll be a link
• 38:53
  in the shown us to your calendar if they want to schedule a chat with you to learn more. Yes.
• 38:57
  Okay. Yeah. Yeah. I have a ton of free content, a ton of free tutorials that I put together.
• 39:04
  My first and foremost goal is to keep consumers out of call centers. And I want to build awareness
• 39:10
  and give as much free training alone upstairs as they possibly can. The ones that know that they
• 39:15
  want to do it, but they don't have the time. That's where I'm trying to create some done for you
• 39:19
  solutions. But the bottom line is I need people like your listeners in the fight, right? So that
• 39:27
  so that so that we can keep consumers out of call centers and we can take care of them the way
• 39:31
  that they need to be taken care of. By the way, if you haven't already done it, that is the slogan.
• 39:38
  Keep consumers out of call centers. Yeah. Yeah. Well, the website is where your first choice
• 39:44
  for a second opinion. But that is absolutely my mantra. My mantra is keep consumers out of call
• 39:52
  centers. Yeah. T shirts with that, man. Yeah. Yeah. I'll work. I'll get to work it out that
• 39:58
  right away. That's awesome. That's cool. All right. Well, definitely put a link in the show
• 40:03
  on this to all that information, man. And I know, look, we could be keep talking for another hour
• 40:07
  and just geeking out on marketing, but we're both real busy. And I just appreciate you.
• 40:10
  Number one, advocating for our fellow loan officers, because that's one thing hopefully people
• 40:14
  get to me is that I care and people that come on here care. And I know you as well. So
• 40:19
  appreciate you being here, man. No, I appreciate you having me. You've you've been doing amazing
• 40:24
  stuff for so long. And it's as absolute pleasure. I appreciate the friendship. Same here, same
• 40:29
  here. So listeners, you know what to do. Check the links in the show notes. And I feel like
• 40:32
  leaving a review. Hey, we'd love that as well. And I appreciate you tuning in. We'll see you
• 40:36
  on the next one. Bye for now.
• 40:59
  Hey, guys, what's up? Real quick. You've heard about the mortgage marketing pro membership
• 41:23
  before. And I just want to quickly remind you if that you're in a place in your business,
• 41:27
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• 41:31
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• 41:37
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• 41:42
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• 42:07
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• 42:20
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• 42:26
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• 42:32
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• 42:38
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• 42:43
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• 42:48
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• 42:52
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• 42:56
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