Latest / The Dr. Psych Mom Show with clinical psychologist Dr. Samantha Rodman Whiten / What Predicts Success In Couples Counseling?

Transcript

What Predicts Success In Couples Counseling? · The Dr. Psych Mom Show with clinical psychologist Dr. Samantha Rodman Whiten

• 0:05
  Hi everybody, and welcome to the doctor psych mom show in this
• 0:09
  episode. We're going to talk about what
• 0:11
  predicts successful couples counseling.
• 0:14
  So which couples do the best in couples counseling.
• 0:17
  This was a request from somebody in my Facebook group so you
• 0:20
  should join that. If you haven't, that is separate
• 0:22
  from subscribing to the podcast and the Facebook group, you get
• 0:26
  to interact with me more, and with like-minded Doctor, psych
• 0:29
  mom readers. And if you subscribe via anchor
• 0:33
  to the podcast and you got all the Caption episodes the most
• 0:36
  recent of which was when men try to say that.
• 0:39
  The only reason they have a job is for their wives and to use
• 0:41
  that as like some kind of blackmail when it's not true.
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  So then that is an interesting episode and you get that one and
• 0:48
  loads more. So what factors predict
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  successful couples counseling. So, there's certain areas of
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  work that you can do in couples counseling, that are going to be
• 1:02
  pretty fruitful. So obviously, Ubiquitous
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  communication skills, people can learn to fight more.
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  Fairly they can learn what constitutes a normal amount.
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  And type of fighting, they can learn to say what their feelings
• 1:17
  are better. They can learn to express
• 1:19
  themselves, verbally even if that is not there, want wo NT.
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  Not wa NT. May not be your want either, but
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  but, you know, you got to compromise on shit and you can
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  certainly learn to empathize. Thighs with one another, you can
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  learn what one another's. Love languages are and how not
• 1:39
  to condescend To Each Other's Love language.
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  This is a big one with women who think that the man's need for
• 1:45
  sex is just completely off the wall and animalistic learning
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  that, that is not the case. And for men who think that a
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  woman's need for emotional, closeness is stupid and overly
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  romantic, and he can learn not to be a dick about that as well.
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  But what do you need as like a prerequisite for all of this?
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  People need to be motivated. So I get sometimes couples in
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  that a aren't married and be don't have kids.
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  Like if you're not getting along and you don't have kids, you're
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  not married break up like this was dating, is for dating is to
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  figure out who you're compatible with.
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  So if you have to go to couples counseling, I don't talk about
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  premarital counseling, that's nice.
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  You know, that's like kind of an extended version of some sort of
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  personality testing, you know, that can help you learn about
• 2:33
  each other. That's great.
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  But if you have active massive conflictual issues, as a couple
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  before you get married and have kids and, or have kids get out.
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  So like if you're in a sexless marriage and you don't have
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  children, I did a podcast about this like why are you in it?
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  You what do you thinks gonna get better after children you know?
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  And or if you don't want children to begin with, nobody
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  is going to suffer from your breakup except the two of you
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  who suffer from being together. So if you are not held together,
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  I buy something very strong such as having a family, commingled
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  finances. I mean, a family is just the
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  number one, but other ones are, of course, commingled finances,
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  property businesses, you know, you're in each other's lives.
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  But really the big one is kids, you know, I mean, so so if y'all
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  don't have kids and you're fighting over shit, you're going
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  to keep fighting a couples counseling because nobody is
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  that motivated to change because you don't have to there's no
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  superordinate goal. There's no There's no people who
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  are going to deeply suffer, if you break up, so, if you don't
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  have a motivator of family, then you know, it usually doesn't go
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  as well. People kind of Trail off
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  because, you know, they kind of see that, you know, what?
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  They ought to break up if things keep going so badly.
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  And if they are locked in this dysfunctional pattern which they
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  likely are, if you're the sort of person who's in couples
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  counseling, before marriage, you likely saw a bad marriage
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  growing up your ambivalence. And about commitment you're
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  ambivalent about the relationship as a whole and you
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  don't have good skills at communicating and so forth.
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  You know, you're likely drawn to somebody who exacerbates these
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  issues. And if there are not larger
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  overarching reasons to stay together, then couples
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  counseling can seem like an exercise in futility and
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  certainly time and money wasting.
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  So, so my number one thing to say would be, if you are having
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  issues before you are even married.
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  And don't get married, you know, that's that's what people, very
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  much regret. When they end up divorcing, is
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  that they knew that there were issues before they even got
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  married. Then why the hell did they still
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  get married? That's what they say to
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  themselves, right? So if you are a couple of kids
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  and have that big motivator to stay together, then that helps
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  what else helps being verbal in couples counseling is a very
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  verbal modality. So if one or both of you hate
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  talking, you're not going to do as well in couples counseling
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  and that's just how it is. I mean that's what there.
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  Therapy is it's basically a very words based modality and if one
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  of you hate talking then couples counseling is going to become
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  extremely painful, no matter what.
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  And your best bet is a couple's counselor who doesn't you know
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  focus on the communication as much or focuses on that as well
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  because it's always big but also focuses on what you guys should
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  be actively doing outside of the room in order to connect.
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  In terms of your sex, life activities to do together,
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  quality time spent together and other things that may be more in
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  your wheelhouse if you're not very verbal.
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  So, in that case, you're mostly suffering through the couple's
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  session but it's a means to an end of creating more intimacy.
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  That may be in your way of doing things, you know, more of a
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  nonverbal way. That that could be what you end
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  up with even though the couples therapy itself is a verbal
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  modality. But again it if you are Both to
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  highly verbal people that love to communicate, then couples
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  counseling is probably going to go better for you.
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  So, so far we have kids and we have that.
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  Now, what's next? There has to be a traction.
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  Still, especially the man toward the woman, as I've said, many to
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  think, their wife is hot for things to work it, you know, men
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  can tolerate a lot of shit, although not infinite shit,
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  because as I discussed in a prior podcast and are people
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  too, and when their wife acts like, she hates them all the
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  time, they don't want to have sex even if they have a high sex
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  drive. But in that Case they can still
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  probably and still do say to me and express.
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  Yes, I'm still physically attracted to her, but it's the
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  personality and it's like how we communicate, that's a turn-off,
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  but let me tell you if there's no physical attraction and
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  you're fighting, there's not going to be much to work on
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  there. And another thing that we can do
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  because we're not magic, is we cannot create attraction when
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  there was no attraction ever. So when people get married in
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  the absence of any physical chemistry That is usually not a
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  repairable situation. Unless in the, in the specific
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  case where a woman has had sexual trauma.
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  She does not really think of herself as a sexual entity at
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  all though, she has no chemistry with anybody.
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  And the husband was just a, you know, a nice guy that she
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  married, she can potentially learn to become more of a sexual
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  entity if she was not, but in a situation where she was
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  attracted to other men but she was not attracted to him.
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  Well, you know, she does. She's never going to be couples.
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  Counseling is not going to create that, although she could
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  still, and I've discussed this. Another podcast of what to do
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  when your partner's never attracted to you, but generally
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  if she really does want to stay together for the kids and she
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  loves the man, she can learn to be more sexual, but I cannot
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  create attraction. When there was not attraction,
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  you know, except in as much as the personality level attraction
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  will likely increase as the emotional Intimacy in.
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  Creases and then you can get so far with that that it could be
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  potentially in a best-case scenario, indistinguishable to
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  the man, from genuine attraction or at least monogamous
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  attraction, which is not going to be poor level variety anyway.
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  Okay. So if there's some sort of
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  Attraction still between the partners kids and if you're both
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  verbal and another one, of course is if you have the time
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  and money to engage, if you don't, you know, I have couples
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  that they really could benefit from couples counseling, but
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  it's like nearly impossible to schedule with them.
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  So, in these cases, I urge people to think, you know, you
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  know, it's going to be a real shit show of scheduling your
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  divorce, you know, that that stuff schedule and gets very
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  difficult. So you know, you gotta be very
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  very flexible with scheduling at that point.
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  So probably more so than trying to get in 45 minutes via video
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  once a week or every other week that's going to look like a
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  dance through the meadow compared to the scheduling
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  Fiasco's. That will happen when you are
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  divorced and you need to be with the kids 50% of the time.
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  But then you still have your job but then you still have this.
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  But then you have to be flexible about this because then it's
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  parent-teacher night and she went last time and you got to go
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  this time whatever. So if you are generally feel
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  like you're motivated. Couple that wants to remain
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  together but you just can't get your shit together to schedule.
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  I urge you to reframe that and think about how it's going to be
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  down. Line in terms of scheduling, if
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  you don't get in. Now, another area where it's now
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  this one is like either can go well or not.
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  When there are so many empathic ruptures have built up, that one
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  person is basically completely out of the marriage emotionally
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  than couples counseling, cannot break.
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  It cannot resuscitate the dead but there are cases when
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  somebody thinks that there's so many empathic ruptures that
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  there can't possibly be any sort of Reconnection.
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  But they're wrong because the partner has never actually
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  apologized in a meaningful way. And once they do all of a sudden
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  there become the, some new blossoming, small feelings of
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  closeness and tenderness. So if you're in the, you think
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  that there's too many empathic ruptures that this can survive
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  Camp, then that is a situation. When I would encourage you to
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  try couples counseling and I would think it might go well,
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  especially if you hit the other variables that I told you about
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  because you never know, you know, like maybe finally.
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  Hopefully, the therapist is useful in the regard of what we
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  are trained to do, which is to help people communicate and
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  understand one another better, and perhaps the empathic
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  ruptures could be repaired with the benefit of a third party.
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  Another, and this is specific to the type of couples counselor.
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  But another thing that is not going to work.
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  So if you have sexual issues, and you think they're just
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  working on the emotional part is going to help.
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  It's not. So you got to be talking about
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  the sexual part, To and if you're in therapy, where the
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  therapist says basically well, you know, the sexual issues
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  usually get better. Or once people communicate
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  better? No, they don't.
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  I've people I'm not going to say throughout money cuz yeah, maybe
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  they learn to communicate better, okay, but they learn to
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  communicate better for years and years of weekly sessions during
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  which they were celibate or close to it.
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  And, or having a sex life that is garbage.
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  At least in the view of one person, which if it's in the If
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  one person is usually in the view of both people so it just
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  doesn't like miraculously help itself.
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  You know somehow which is what people who do not like to talk
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  about sex or not trained to talk about sex or whatever like to
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  think is that if you fix the emotional closeness and the
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  sexual closeness follows, why? Like if you think about it it's
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  a logical. It's like saying if you become
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  happier then you will be able to run three miles.
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  Without stopping how those things can't be linked, you
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  know, like it like it, they're just completely orthogonal
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  constructs, you know? But like they have nothing to do
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  with each other, but it seems at first glance, like, I guess.
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  Yeah, sure. We're both happier.
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  So then we have better sex, wait, how do we get to that one?
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  So like, if you break it down, it doesn't really work but, you
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  know, people like to tell themselves that.
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  So if you're in a relationship that had sexual issues and
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  you're not talking about them In Session 1, maybe wait till
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  Listen to bring it up, asked about it.
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  And if it is not going to ever happen, if you get the sense, I
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  mean, you'll get the sense that the therapist is much like your
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  partner that doesn't like to talk about sex in that case.
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  Get the hell out of Dodge before you throw your money out.
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  You know, you might as well. Donate it to a good cause you
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  know, the ASPCA can benefit from your money more than you will in
• 12:57
  a week of week after week after week of couples counseling, that
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  does not focus on the sexual issues that you know, are there?
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  All right, so hopefully this helped you gain perspective on
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  who does well in couples counseling, and who doesn't in
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  terms of individual level variables, the more open-minded
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  people are the better they do in both individual and couples
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  counseling. And by which, I mean people that
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  can have their world view, challenged people that are not
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  incredibly close minded and defensive.
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  Now, if you are incredibly close minded and defensive or you've
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  been accused of such by your partner, individual therapy may
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  be what you need to supplement. Couples.
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  Because if you cannot handle being challenged, what's likely
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  going to happen in couples? Is that the couple's counselor
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  gets scared of you? Because as I talked about in the
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  previous in the podcast, about therapist therapists are people
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  too. So if you're like a tremendous
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  asshole, they're going to back away from you usually and assume
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  that over time. Hopefully you come to the table
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  willing to play ball more, but you're going to end up kind of
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  making it this very closed kind of loop where The therapist is
• 14:05
  not allowed to say certain things to you.
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  Otherwise, you get loud, you get sulky, you skip the next
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  session, whatever the case may be.
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  So you kind of create the situation where you can get no
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  feedback. If you're going to do that or if
• 14:19
  you recognize that your partner would do that individual therapy
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  may be the way to go at first. If you're you, or your partner
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  are not clicking with the therapist by like a few sessions
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  in, then, you also ought to get out because it's Going to help
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  you. If you do not feel like this
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  person understands what's going on and if one of you like the
• 14:39
  therapist, the other one doesn't then you can work with it
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  potentially because if the partner who likes the therapist,
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  you know is encouraged by the therapist to change and to grow
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  and whatever then that can lead to positive change in the unit,
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  right? And the couple but if both of
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  you hate the therapist well then don't be stupid.
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  Get out, you know don't stay in despite one another punishing
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  one. Other with the terrible
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  therapist, like, get out if wanting loves therapist, then,
• 15:09
  at least see. Okay.
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  Maybe the therapist will have a lot of, you know, ability to
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  shape how that person listens and responds and and understands
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  the situation differently. Even if I don't like the
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  therapist on much, you know, let me think about, why probably
• 15:24
  this. It's because the therapist
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  challenges you and Subway. I also have a podcast on why we
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  hate. People is because it's a
• 15:30
  disavowed part of ourselves, you know, but again if both you hate
• 15:34
  the Don't like just this this is not it's not supposed to be
• 15:37
  torture you know where you can check another therapist out.
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  See if one of you likes new therapist, at least one of you.
• 15:45
  So those are the overarching points on who's going to benefit
• 15:50
  from couples counseling and in what situations.
• 15:52
  So please take that to heart. As always, you could reach out
• 15:56
  to me for therapy or coaching and you can reach out to me for
• 16:02
  my group, practice were I have counselors and couples
• 16:07
  counselors in various States particularly around the DC area,
• 16:10
  but there are others as well. That's best reliable health.
• 16:13
  And I linked to that every time and every one of my description.
• 16:16
  So if you do feel like you need couples counseling another, I
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  mean an implied an implied other variable here, that I ought to
• 16:26
  stay directly is do not wait until you are on the precipice
• 16:29
  of divorce. Because again, we're not
• 16:31
  Houdini, we cannot resuscitate the Dead.
• 16:34
  And the Miracles not going to happen if y'all are basically
• 16:38
  divorced already, so don't do it.
• 16:41
  When already things have jumped the shark try to do it when you
• 16:46
  are feeling frustrated and upset for a few years versus 20 years,
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  you know, like, you know, like right out a couple months, you
• 16:57
  know, that you should be able to get back on track from
• 16:59
  potentially, but if it's been at least a couple years that y'all
• 17:03
  have not been getting along or have Add these hot button issues
• 17:06
  that caused conflict. Well, you know, what are you
• 17:09
  waiting for things? Generally do not get better
• 17:12
  after a few years, they tend to get worse, not better.
• 17:18
  All right, so hopefully, y'all got something out of this and I
• 17:21
  will talk to everybody soon. Please do subscribe.
• 17:23
  Also follow me on Tick, Tock and YouTube.
• 17:26
  Those are my newest platforms, because I am just so on top of
• 17:29
  shit. And so trendy, and E way or
• 17:35
  Facebook and Instagram for us old people and I will talk to
• 17:38
  everybody soon. Bye, bye.