Latest / Millennial Mental Health Channel / GIVE IT UP FOR SCHOOL COUNSELORS!!!!!!

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GIVE IT UP FOR SCHOOL COUNSELORS!!!!!! · Millennial Mental Health Channel

0:02
Speaker 1: Welcome to MMHC, your go to mental health podcast.
0:06
Speaker 2: I'm Eddie Coorello, a licensed professional counselor.
0:08
Speaker 1: And I'm Justin Romano, a Board certified child and adolescent psychiatrist.
0:12
Speaker 2: We created MMHC to give listeners evidence based information directly
0:16
Speaker 2: from professionals who work in mental health.
0:18
Speaker 1: We're not influencers, we're not trying to sell you anything.
0:21
Speaker 1: We just want to bring love, empathy, and understanding of
0:24
Speaker 1: mental health into this world.
0:26
Speaker 2: And we really think that learning about mental health should
0:28
Speaker 2: be fun, interesting, and most importantly honest.
0:31
Speaker 1: So thanks for tuning in. This is a show by
0:33
Speaker 1: two millennials, but it is intended to be for everyone.
0:36
Speaker 3: We hope you enjoy the show.
0:40
Speaker 1: MMHC is a production of Speaker from iHeartMedia Do I heartma.
0:47
Speaker 3: Hey, welcome back. This feels we were doing it first. Sorry,
0:52
Speaker 3: I don't know how you do this every week.
0:53
Speaker 1: Just I'm just used to it.
0:56
Speaker 2: Oh oh man, okay, okay, let's shake it off a
0:58
Speaker 2: little bit. No, we're good, we're good.
1:00
Speaker 3: Yeah.
1:00
Speaker 2: You know, Justin's given me, He's given me permission.
1:03
Speaker 3: Just kidding.
1:03
Speaker 2: I've always told Justin I want him to go first.
1:06
Speaker 2: He's offered the opportunity for me to open up this
1:08
Speaker 2: episode because there's something I want to talk about. The
1:11
Speaker 2: date is February second, twenty twenty six. We want to
1:14
Speaker 2: take a quick break from our regularly scheduled jovial banter
1:19
Speaker 2: that we usually have to just address something or bring
1:22
Speaker 2: something up that's been really impactful and important for us
1:25
Speaker 2: to say. Again, it's February twenty twenty six, and as
1:29
Speaker 2: of the date of this recording, there's a lot of
1:31
Speaker 2: really significant negative events just in the month of January alone,
1:36
Speaker 2: And again, no matter where you stand politically, because this
1:39
Speaker 2: is going to feel a little political, what's going on
1:41
Speaker 2: is extremely concerning. In the month of January twenty twenty six,
1:45
Speaker 2: we've already seen it. Multiple people have died and been
1:48
Speaker 2: killed by ice agents. This is something that just should
1:51
Speaker 2: not be happening in our country. To make matters worse,
1:54
Speaker 2: they're sremingly killed for no reason, not that there needs
1:56
Speaker 2: to be a reason for someone to be killed. They're
1:58
Speaker 2: just being murdered in cold blood, and we as a
2:01
Speaker 2: country have had to sit back and see it. Thankfully,
2:04
Speaker 2: there's people in Minneapolis and across the country who have
2:06
Speaker 2: been wanting to protest and really trying to stand up
2:08
Speaker 2: against these things, but it's one of those things that
2:10
Speaker 2: it just feels like it shouldn't be happening. Things feel bleak,
2:15
Speaker 2: doesn't feel really great to be turned on the news nowadays,
2:18
Speaker 2: and I know for me sometimes it is a privilege
2:21
Speaker 2: to just not listen to the news or to not
2:23
Speaker 2: pay attention to social media for a day. People feel scared.
2:26
Speaker 2: There really doesn't seem to be an end in sight.
2:29
Speaker 2: And I don't bring this up to just make it
2:32
Speaker 2: seem like we have a solution or that we'll fix
2:35
Speaker 2: this right now, but really just to be to offer
2:38
Speaker 2: up a reminder to our listeners that each of us
2:40
Speaker 2: is part of a different community and there's different ways
2:43
Speaker 2: we can support each other, whether it's connecting with your
2:45
Speaker 2: own community, finding ways that are available. I know, for me,
2:49
Speaker 2: in the state of Oregon, in the Portland metro area,
2:52
Speaker 2: the Oregon Counseling Association that I'm a part of, we're
2:54
Speaker 2: currently in the works to support and then to also
2:56
Speaker 2: get resources from the Portland Immigrant Rights Coalition, just so
3:00
Speaker 2: we can spread awareness and spread accurate and up to
3:04
Speaker 2: date information for people so they know what to do
3:06
Speaker 2: in case they encounter people that they hopefully don't have to.
3:09
Speaker 2: But again, I don't know where we go from this.
3:11
Speaker 2: I don't know what's going to happen next. I just
3:14
Speaker 2: know as a country, the world as a country, and
3:16
Speaker 2: the world is watching, and you know, we really can't
3:20
Speaker 2: have these things continue before we move on to the
3:22
Speaker 2: rest of the episode. I'll go ahead and say it directly,
3:24
Speaker 2: Fuck Ice. We don't need to be having any of
3:26
Speaker 2: that bullshit here. It sucks.
3:28
Speaker 3: It's really hard.
3:29
Speaker 2: I'll telling justin before we started recording, I feel like
3:31
Speaker 2: I've been watching my back since November of twenty sixteen,
3:34
Speaker 2: because you just don't know who's out there, what they're
3:37
Speaker 2: going to do to a Mexican male like myself, or
3:39
Speaker 2: to people who look like me, or people who are
3:41
Speaker 2: from different backgrounds and just look like they're from different
3:45
Speaker 2: parts of the.
3:45
Speaker 3: World that are here in the US.
3:47
Speaker 2: So, yeah, it's been hard to want to post on
3:50
Speaker 2: social media recently. It's been hard to want to come
3:52
Speaker 2: up with videos and you know, post content and stuff
3:54
Speaker 2: like that because there's so much bullshit and shit going
3:56
Speaker 2: on in the world. But we just wanted to go
3:59
Speaker 2: ahead and give a definitive stance. Shout out to Billie
4:01
Speaker 2: Eilish last night or the other night at the Grammy.
4:04
Speaker 2: She was pretty vocal, but I thought that was cool.
4:06
Speaker 2: My boy, bad Bunny, where do you win Best Album
4:09
Speaker 2: over the Year? And he, you know, had a great
4:11
Speaker 2: speech going, don't listen to Jelly roll speech.
4:13
Speaker 3: That shit was bullshit.
4:15
Speaker 2: But yeah, that's waiting with that.
4:17
Speaker 1: What did Jelly Roll say? I didn't see that, dude.
4:20
Speaker 2: It We've talked about religion here right, like we are
4:24
Speaker 2: not anti religion in any way, shape or form, but
4:27
Speaker 2: that man he said something of like Jesus is not
4:31
Speaker 2: Jesus does not belong to among other things, but said
4:34
Speaker 2: like Jesus does not belong to a political party, knowing
4:37
Speaker 2: full well this man is full on make America great again,
4:42
Speaker 2: and you know, you know all this bs and I
4:45
Speaker 2: think at some point took like a kind of like
4:47
Speaker 2: a side swipe at Bad Bunny, which watch yourself, Jelly Roll,
4:50
Speaker 2: You're not special, You're not that great. But yeah, it's
4:53
Speaker 2: just one of those things where it was like just
4:55
Speaker 2: pushing just the same message that a lot of extremely
4:59
Speaker 2: conservative right wing people say, and.
5:01
Speaker 3: It just it just was really off putting.
5:04
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, what also gets me too is that Jelly
5:07
Speaker 2: Roll and see now you got me going justin Jelly
5:10
Speaker 2: Roll is one of these people who started off his
5:12
Speaker 2: career like as a rapper or tried to be a rapper,
5:14
Speaker 2: And I mean shout out to him, but you know,
5:17
Speaker 2: he went to prison, he you know, became sober, all
5:20
Speaker 2: these things good for him, found a religion that has
5:22
Speaker 2: been helpful for him. But he started off trying to
5:24
Speaker 2: be a rapper, right and to incorporate black culture into
5:28
Speaker 2: his music. That didn't end up working out well or like,
5:31
Speaker 2: once he got a little bit of fame, then he
5:32
Speaker 2: quickly switched to country music. So after using black culture
5:36
Speaker 2: and black ideas to like help propel himself, then he
5:40
Speaker 2: quickly dropped off and hit the country music scene. And
5:44
Speaker 2: I don't know, it's just one of those things that
5:45
Speaker 2: it just doesn't doesn't sit right with me.
5:48
Speaker 1: Unfortunately, white musicians have a long history of appropriating other
5:52
Speaker 1: forms of.
5:53
Speaker 2: Me looking at you Post Malone, looking at.
5:58
Speaker 1: You Elvis Oh, deep cut, deep cut.
6:04
Speaker 2: But anyway, not because we want to move on or
6:07
Speaker 2: just forget or just this wasn't performative in any way,
6:09
Speaker 2: shape or form. Just we felt like it's important to
6:12
Speaker 2: take some time to talk about these things. On our platform,
6:14
Speaker 2: I think, which if you've been listening for a long time,
6:17
Speaker 2: we were pretty clear where we stand on a lot
6:19
Speaker 2: of things. I don't know a single person that's told
6:21
Speaker 2: Ted Cruz to go fuck himself, probably more than I
6:24
Speaker 2: have on Mike. So anyway, what we do want to
6:28
Speaker 2: talk about or what we really want to focus on
6:30
Speaker 2: for the episode justin do you know what today is?
6:32
Speaker 1: Today's Groundhog Day?
6:34
Speaker 3: I believe you're right.
6:36
Speaker 2: Okay, do you know what day it also is?
6:41
Speaker 1: It is the American School Counselor Association School Counselor Week.
6:47
Speaker 2: At a boy there. It is every year around every
6:50
Speaker 2: year or around the same time every year, at the
6:53
Speaker 2: first full week of February. The American School Counselor Association
6:56
Speaker 2: or ASKA acknowledges this week as National School Counselors Week.
7:00
Speaker 2: So we want to talk about it a little bit
7:02
Speaker 2: because we've talked about a bunch of mental health professions
7:04
Speaker 2: on the podcast. We've had psychologists. Justine's the psychiatrist, I'm
7:07
Speaker 2: a therapist. We've had social workers. We've had this dad
7:10
Speaker 2: and the other, We've had innurse practitioners. We've had about
7:14
Speaker 2: everything you could have on a podcast in terms of
7:17
Speaker 2: mental health professions. But we haven't talked about school counselors.
7:20
Speaker 2: And I work in a high school, so I get
7:21
Speaker 2: to work with an amazing group of school counselors every
7:23
Speaker 2: single day, So we wanted to highlight the profession, really
7:26
Speaker 2: talk about it. I know, for me, if I would
7:28
Speaker 2: have known school counseling was a job, job title, or
7:32
Speaker 2: what that looked like, I probably would have considered it
7:34
Speaker 2: very heavily in undergrad but.
7:36
Speaker 3: I just had no idea it was a thing.
7:37
Speaker 2: So all that to say, if you know a school counselor,
7:40
Speaker 2: if you have one in your life, please be sure
7:42
Speaker 2: to thank them, especially this week, because they go through
7:44
Speaker 2: a lot. They're kind of like the I don't want
7:46
Speaker 2: to say the backbone. We can say the backbone, but
7:48
Speaker 2: they're they're in the the They're doing a lot of
7:51
Speaker 2: the dirty work behind the scenes that a lot of
7:53
Speaker 2: people just don't know about. So we really want to
7:56
Speaker 2: highlight them. But for you, justin did you ever see
7:59
Speaker 2: your school counselor growing up?
8:02
Speaker 1: You know, I remember one very specific time in high school,
8:06
Speaker 1: my sophomore year, I saw the school counselor and I
8:11
Speaker 1: remember telling her that I was thinking about going into medicine,
8:13
Speaker 1: thinking about becoming a doctor, and she told me, you
8:16
Speaker 1: don't have the grades for it.
8:18
Speaker 3: Fuck.
8:19
Speaker 1: Remember No, that was exactly what I needed to hear
8:24
Speaker 1: because I was always a very competitive person, and in
8:29
Speaker 1: my mind I kind of did the Michael Jordan thing, right.
8:32
Speaker 1: I was like, Okay, you don't believe in me, watch me.
8:34
Speaker 1: I'm gonna do this. And so I really pushed myself
8:37
Speaker 1: from then on and then throughout high school because Wyoming
8:41
Speaker 1: was weird because technically ninth grade, your freshman year was
8:44
Speaker 1: still in junior high and I like had a I
8:47
Speaker 1: think I had two c's in junior high, so like
8:50
Speaker 1: I wasn't taking school super seriously. And then when I
8:53
Speaker 1: actually got to high school, so my sophomore year on,
8:55
Speaker 1: I got straight a's. I didn't get anything lower than
8:57
Speaker 1: an A. And I think part of that was just
8:59
Speaker 1: me trying to prove her wrong. So in a way,
9:02
Speaker 1: I'm very grateful that she was honest with me and said, hey,
9:05
Speaker 1: if you want to do this, you're going to have
9:06
Speaker 1: to prove that you can do this.
9:08
Speaker 3: I like it.
9:08
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, for me, I really didn't see the
9:11
Speaker 2: school counselor until I got to high school either. With
9:14
Speaker 2: help around like college related things, academic planning. Shout out
9:18
Speaker 2: miss Harkey. I actually took the time last school year
9:21
Speaker 2: to email her from my work email to just wish
9:24
Speaker 2: her a happy National school counselor this week cool, and
9:27
Speaker 2: we emailed back and forth for a little bit. She
9:29
Speaker 2: remembered me, she remembered my sister, and she actually told
9:31
Speaker 2: me that she's getting close to retirement, which is wild
9:34
Speaker 2: because it doesn't feel like I was in high school
9:36
Speaker 2: that long ago, but it's been long enough that she's getting.
9:38
Speaker 3: Ready to retire.
9:39
Speaker 2: But anyway, with school counseling and what I think is
9:42
Speaker 2: really important to pay attention to one, they're at every
9:44
Speaker 2: level most of the time in public education, elementary, middle
9:48
Speaker 2: and high school, school counselors are at every level for
9:50
Speaker 2: a lot of kids. For a lot of students, a
9:52
Speaker 2: school counselor is a child's first introduction to mental health support,
9:56
Speaker 2: whether it's an elementary school, middle school, or high school.
10:00
Speaker 2: I've talked about this a lot. Schools are being tasked
10:03
Speaker 2: with a lot. They're essentially now a one stop shop
10:06
Speaker 2: for kids, whether it's help with resources at home with
10:10
Speaker 2: like food vouchers or food gift cards. I know we
10:13
Speaker 2: do that a lot in our school district, whether it's
10:16
Speaker 2: clothing help, whether it's getting meals. For a lot of kids,
10:19
Speaker 2: the only time they eat breakfast and lunch consistently is
10:22
Speaker 2: at school, right So when schools shut down during COVID,
10:25
Speaker 2: thankfully a lot of schools were able to kind of
10:27
Speaker 2: come up with a backup plant to still be able
10:29
Speaker 2: to feed kids, you know, out in public and like
10:31
Speaker 2: parks and stuff. But they've become a one stop shop.
10:34
Speaker 2: It's not just academics anymore. It's again financial support, food support,
10:39
Speaker 2: and for a lot of kids, mental health support. It's
10:42
Speaker 2: the very first time that they've ever encountered a mental
10:44
Speaker 2: health professional and that could really help set them up
10:47
Speaker 2: for you know, how they feel about mental health support
10:49
Speaker 2: for the rest of their life.
10:51
Speaker 1: And even in a professional capacity, I work with a
10:54
Speaker 1: lot of school counselors. I get calls from school counselors
10:57
Speaker 1: all the time, especially if I have filled out the
11:00
Speaker 1: upper paperwork for a release of information and everything. But
11:03
Speaker 1: they give me updates on my patients and what they're
11:05
Speaker 1: seeing in school because I see a lot of families,
11:08
Speaker 1: and the families often give me their side of how
11:10
Speaker 1: things are going at home. But the school counselors and
11:13
Speaker 1: the guidance counselors are the ones in the school telling
11:16
Speaker 1: me how things are going, so it's really nice to
11:19
Speaker 1: have their input, and they're the ones that they care
11:22
Speaker 1: about these kids so much. I mean, like all the
11:24
Speaker 1: things that you mentioned. I've had kids who show up
11:28
Speaker 1: in kind of dirty, stinky clothes, and the school counselors
11:32
Speaker 1: are the ones that are trying to take care of
11:33
Speaker 1: these kids, like meet their basic needs on a lot
11:36
Speaker 1: of different levels, and that's such an admirable thing.
11:38
Speaker 2: Do you give a quick kind of rundown or history
11:41
Speaker 2: of what school counseling has kind of transformed to In
11:43
Speaker 2: the early nineteen hundreds of school counseling became to be
11:46
Speaker 2: a profession, it really was more like vocational or work guidance,
11:51
Speaker 2: so helping people find support with jobs or career support.
11:55
Speaker 2: It's really what the main kind of piece of it
11:57
Speaker 2: was when it first started off.
11:59
Speaker 1: In the mid twenty century, we started to see a
12:01
Speaker 1: shift towards more academic and personal development, and now in
12:05
Speaker 1: the modern era, the comprehensive school counseling model focuses on
12:09
Speaker 1: academic development, career development, and social emotional development too.
12:13
Speaker 2: They're looking at the whole kid. And I don't know
12:15
Speaker 2: why I'm feeling so fired up about this right now,
12:18
Speaker 2: but it is cool. I mean, it's super special well
12:21
Speaker 2: school counselors do because I get to see it every
12:23
Speaker 2: single day with my coworkers. And I'll be clear, I
12:26
Speaker 2: know I am. I have the title of Licensed Mental
12:29
Speaker 2: Health Specialists, and I work with a group of school counseors.
12:32
Speaker 2: I work with five of them. But I'm not a
12:34
Speaker 2: school counselor. I'm just in the school as a school therapist.
12:38
Speaker 2: So my training and my understanding of things is way
12:40
Speaker 2: different than theirs. Yes, we can both do mental health,
12:44
Speaker 2: personal social crisis intervention, all those things, but they do
12:47
Speaker 2: a lot more than I do. And I'm totally fine
12:49
Speaker 2: with saying that because they are so trained and skilled
12:52
Speaker 2: in other things, so they do take a holistic view
12:55
Speaker 2: of your kid. Any well trained school counselor is not
12:58
Speaker 2: just looking at your kids' grades, at every single thing
13:01
Speaker 2: that impacts them. And now take that and a lot
13:03
Speaker 2: of school counselors when they're not really in the ratio
13:06
Speaker 2: that they should be, which according to the American School
13:08
Speaker 2: Counselor Association, should be about two hundred and fifty students.
13:11
Speaker 3: To one school counselor. A lot of schools don't do that.
13:14
Speaker 3: Just throwing that out.
13:14
Speaker 2: There, but multiply what one school counselor is doing for
13:19
Speaker 2: one kid and multiply that by two hundred and fifty
13:22
Speaker 2: three hundred, four hundred kids. They're trying to take a
13:25
Speaker 2: holistic approach to everyone.
13:26
Speaker 3: So the work they do is special, and so I just,
13:28
Speaker 3: I don't know, I.
13:29
Speaker 2: Get fired up just thinking of how much they just
13:32
Speaker 2: look at a big picture all the time, and I
13:33
Speaker 2: think that's super helpful. We've talked about the American School
13:37
Speaker 2: Counselor Association, but just as a definition, they are the
13:41
Speaker 2: kind of licensing governing board. They really help to define
13:44
Speaker 2: what the standards of field of the field are across
13:46
Speaker 2: the country.
13:47
Speaker 3: So that's really helpful.
13:48
Speaker 2: School counseing didn't start as mental health work, like we've mentioned.
13:52
Speaker 2: It really started as job placement and job support. The
13:55
Speaker 2: role has expanded so much in schools as they've realized
13:58
Speaker 2: that you really can't separate learning from emotional well being.
14:01
Speaker 2: A kid that is emotionally emotionally well and has support
14:05
Speaker 2: is a student that can learn and that can pay
14:07
Speaker 2: attention in class. When that's off off and they can't
14:11
Speaker 2: and they're not doing well emotionally, a lot of learning
14:13
Speaker 2: just doesn't happen.
14:15
Speaker 3: You know.
14:16
Speaker 1: There's a really good podcast episode that came out about
14:18
Speaker 1: two weeks ago that talked about how stressful school can
14:21
Speaker 1: be and how much it impacts mental health on kids.
14:25
Speaker 1: Where can we find out on the MMHC website.
14:30
Speaker 2: You can find right belower above this episode.
14:32
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, it should be one away from this one,
14:36
Speaker 1: but it we're so right, Like, I mean, school has
14:38
Speaker 1: become so stressful for young people, and there's so much
14:41
Speaker 1: writing on school performance. I have so many young people
14:45
Speaker 1: telling me that they're so stressed out. They so want
14:48
Speaker 1: to get good grades and to perform well and to
14:51
Speaker 1: get into college, and they've got all these expectations and
14:54
Speaker 1: it's a lot for a counselor to help them through
14:57
Speaker 1: all that too, especially if you've got two hundred and
14:59
Speaker 1: fifty and that's like a good ratio too, lusty kids
15:03
Speaker 1: for one counselor, that's a lot.
15:05
Speaker 2: Yeah, man, it's it's wild. It's wild, how much you know,
15:08
Speaker 2: schools just unfortunately have a hard time with the funding
15:12
Speaker 2: of keeping the ratio correct, and even us a school district,
15:16
Speaker 2: that is, you know, in a pretty well off area.
15:18
Speaker 2: School counsing is one of those things that typically traditionally
15:22
Speaker 2: generally if there's school cuts, unfortunately, that's where some of
15:25
Speaker 2: the cuts come from first. So that's really hard. This
15:28
Speaker 2: next piece of information I'm gonna share, I wish I
15:30
Speaker 2: would have known when I was in school, because I
15:32
Speaker 2: honestly think I no bs. I may have taken this
15:34
Speaker 2: route because I think working in a school is super fun.
15:37
Speaker 3: I love it. I enjoyed it all the time.
15:39
Speaker 2: But what does it take to become a school counselor
15:42
Speaker 2: other than a desire to help and support children and
15:45
Speaker 2: teens during probably the most pivotal years of their life.
15:48
Speaker 2: There's other pieces to it. So most school counselors hold
15:50
Speaker 2: a master's degree in school counseing. They have a master's
15:53
Speaker 2: in education somewhere in there or related field, and then
15:57
Speaker 2: they have graduate level training and things like than adolescent development,
16:01
Speaker 2: mental health, crisis intervention, ethics, and colleging career readiness, among
16:07
Speaker 2: other things. Some requirements for being a school counselor include
16:11
Speaker 2: a state licensure or certification, and they have a ton
16:14
Speaker 2: of hours of a ton of supervised internship hours. My
16:18
Speaker 2: coworkers actually told me that not only did they have
16:21
Speaker 2: to do like counseling and internship hours, they had to
16:23
Speaker 2: do student teaching because they are licensed through like this,
16:27
Speaker 2: the Teaching Board of Oregon. I don't know if that's
16:30
Speaker 2: for every state. Every single one of them had to
16:33
Speaker 2: do student teaching. So that's the other thing is they're
16:35
Speaker 2: also trained to be teachers, and they do understand that
16:39
Speaker 2: portion of it. While a lot of them do stick
16:41
Speaker 2: as a school counselor probably for the majority of their career,
16:44
Speaker 2: they do have some experience and expertise in teaching. It's
16:47
Speaker 2: not the exact same as being a teacher every single day,
16:49
Speaker 2: but they have some experience with that. So I think
16:51
Speaker 2: that helps kind of with the wholeness of treating the
16:54
Speaker 2: student and the well roundedness of a school counselor. And
16:57
Speaker 2: a lot of them do have a lot of extensive
16:59
Speaker 2: training things like trauma and form care. Suicide risk assessment
17:03
Speaker 2: is a huge one group counseing, and then system levels,
17:06
Speaker 2: systems level interventions, so to nerd out a little bit
17:10
Speaker 2: on where schools are, and it just depends on what
17:12
Speaker 2: your school district does. A lot of schools would do
17:15
Speaker 2: tiered levels of support. So tier one ends up being,
17:18
Speaker 2: here's the support that every student gets. That could be
17:21
Speaker 2: a homeroom lesson that the whole school gets about consent, right,
17:26
Speaker 2: that's tier one. Tier two is maybe a more specific
17:29
Speaker 2: and like specialized group that could be a school counselor
17:33
Speaker 2: point in, every sophomore that has at least one f
17:37
Speaker 2: in their classes. That's a little more like Tier two.
17:39
Speaker 2: And then tier three is like the highest level of
17:41
Speaker 2: support where we're really specific intensive support for like maybe
17:45
Speaker 2: an individual or small group of students. So yeah, I
17:48
Speaker 2: mean their whole lives, their whole day at work is
17:51
Speaker 2: big picture, all of it.
17:53
Speaker 1: Yeah, how much do you think is actual one on
17:56
Speaker 1: one time with people helping them with some of that
17:59
Speaker 1: vocalal guidance and what they want to do.
18:03
Speaker 2: I would say it's it's definitely a big portion of
18:05
Speaker 2: the job still. I mean, like us, we have a
18:07
Speaker 2: college and Career center where the students can get support
18:10
Speaker 2: that way, but counselors talk about it all the time.
18:12
Speaker 2: I mean, right now we're in the middle of and
18:15
Speaker 2: I guess I should say I'm speaking from my experience
18:17
Speaker 2: at my school, but I think a lot of it
18:19
Speaker 2: ends up being pretty general. But right now we're in
18:21
Speaker 2: the middle of students choosing their classes already for next
18:24
Speaker 2: school year next August. Kids that are nine, tenth and
18:27
Speaker 2: eleventh graders are already looking at their classes. I sat
18:30
Speaker 2: with them at lunch while they were answering questions. There's
18:32
Speaker 2: a lot of time talking about like, well, what are
18:34
Speaker 2: you interested in? What do you want to you know,
18:36
Speaker 2: are you interested in sciences after high school? Okay, then
18:38
Speaker 2: maybe we should look at ap BIO. Maybe we should
18:40
Speaker 2: look at APKM. You want to do trades, okay, let's
18:44
Speaker 2: let's get you into the welding classes so that you
18:46
Speaker 2: can finish out the pathway while you're here and you
18:49
Speaker 2: have some experience and can get some certification by the
18:51
Speaker 2: time you graduate.
18:52
Speaker 3: You know, things like that.
18:53
Speaker 2: Oh, even if you want to do trades, that doesn't
18:55
Speaker 2: mean you should stop doing math. Math is in a
18:57
Speaker 2: lot of trades, so you want to still consider that.
18:59
Speaker 2: So I think is still definitely still definitely huge piece
19:02
Speaker 2: of the job. It's just now added to the list
19:06
Speaker 2: with all the other things that they do.
19:08
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think is the biggest thing.
19:09
Speaker 1: They seem like they're kind of the catch all, like
19:12
Speaker 1: they do so many different things. You know, some examples
19:15
Speaker 1: of what school counselors do in each of those domains.
19:19
Speaker 1: In terms of social emotional development, there's mental health support, teaching,
19:23
Speaker 1: coping skills, crisis response. Academic development wise, there's academic planning,
19:28
Speaker 1: advocacy for student accommodations and students are and study skills,
19:33
Speaker 1: and that advocacy for student accommodations is a huge one,
19:36
Speaker 1: the one that I know we've talked about in i
19:39
Speaker 1: EPs individualized education plans and fivele four's in the past.
19:43
Speaker 1: They do a lot of advocating for that, making sure
19:46
Speaker 1: that the kids get those plans and that they're implemented.
19:49
Speaker 1: And then from a career development standpoint, they do a
19:52
Speaker 1: lot of career exploration and post secondary planning. So yeah,
19:56
Speaker 1: just broad they just do a little bit of everything.
19:58
Speaker 2: A little bit of everything. They're the utility player. I
20:02
Speaker 2: think it's important a thing, especially as like you get
20:05
Speaker 2: into the higher levels, like high school. School counselors aren't
20:08
Speaker 2: just people that help you with the schedule, right. They
20:10
Speaker 2: don't just pick your schedule for you or like you know,
20:13
Speaker 2: do schedule changes. They are trained mental health professionals, and
20:16
Speaker 2: again they are the first line of mental health support
20:18
Speaker 2: that a lot.
20:19
Speaker 3: Of kids get.
20:20
Speaker 2: I always appreciate every year since I've been in a school,
20:23
Speaker 2: The American School Counsing Association, which is my kind of
20:26
Speaker 2: governing body, always does some posts for school counselors during
20:29
Speaker 2: school counseling a week. We're different licensure, we're different certification,
20:34
Speaker 2: but even the American Counseling Association understands the crucial part
20:37
Speaker 2: of the school counselors play into kids and teens' lives
20:42
Speaker 2: and something.
20:42
Speaker 3: To think about too.
20:43
Speaker 2: While school counselors are not long term therapists, you know,
20:46
Speaker 2: with everything they're responsible for, I don't think they want
20:48
Speaker 2: to be. They have a lot going on, they do
20:50
Speaker 2: serve a crucial role for short term counseling, crisis intervention,
20:54
Speaker 2: short term brief intervention seeking. They do a lot of
20:58
Speaker 2: that and they're a big part of that. They're a
21:00
Speaker 2: huge part of prevention and early intervention efforts because that's
21:04
Speaker 2: stuff too that helps kind of keep our mental health
21:07
Speaker 2: care system from not having too too many people in
21:10
Speaker 2: it is because they can get intervention and support pretty
21:13
Speaker 2: easily in a school setting. Right again, one stop shop.
21:16
Speaker 2: You can get a lot of support that way.
21:18
Speaker 1: So why are school counselors in school so important at
21:22
Speaker 1: all levels. So research actually consistently links school counseling programs
21:27
Speaker 1: to improved academic outcomes, better attendance, stronger school climate, increased
21:33
Speaker 1: graduation rates, improved post secondary planning, and early identification of
21:38
Speaker 1: mental health concerns. So the research is there. It shows that, yes,
21:44
Speaker 1: these are good for schools and good for students in
21:46
Speaker 1: a lot of different ways.
21:48
Speaker 2: Do you remember who was it the Surgeon General that
21:50
Speaker 2: had put out that study or findings that basically was
21:54
Speaker 2: like a student's connectedness to school like shows like better outcomes,
21:59
Speaker 2: like just mental mental health outcomes overall if they feel
22:02
Speaker 2: more connected to school.
22:04
Speaker 1: I can't remember if that was surge in general, but yeah,
22:06
Speaker 1: I remember you mentioned.
22:06
Speaker 2: With the somebody put it out there, but yeah, I
22:09
Speaker 2: mean that's I think that's a huge part that school
22:12
Speaker 2: counselors play a role in. And not to say that
22:14
Speaker 2: teachers don't, but I think school counselors have the opportunity
22:17
Speaker 2: to kind of be in and out all around the school,
22:20
Speaker 2: whereas teachers, you know, you're kind of in your classroom
22:22
Speaker 2: the whole time because you have to be I mean,
22:23
Speaker 2: that's your responsibility.
22:25
Speaker 3: But really, I.
22:25
Speaker 2: Think one of the best things and coolest things about
22:28
Speaker 2: being in the school and seeing the school counselor's work
22:30
Speaker 2: is sometimes the most powerful intervention for a student who's
22:33
Speaker 2: struggling is simply to have one consistent adult who notices
22:37
Speaker 2: when a kid is not okay, who knows that they're there.
22:39
Speaker 2: I tell kids all the time, if you have nobody
22:41
Speaker 2: else you can talk to, please come talk to one
22:43
Speaker 2: of us. I always I don't know, I never just
22:45
Speaker 2: say just talk to me, come talk to one of us.
22:47
Speaker 2: Because every student is a scientistic school counselor, they have
22:50
Speaker 2: them as a as a resource and a tool. But
22:53
Speaker 2: sometimes that makes all the difference. Sometimes kids can just
22:56
Speaker 2: not even need to get any additional mental health support
22:58
Speaker 2: because they have someone they can talk to a score
23:00
Speaker 2: because just because they know that somebody knows that they're
23:03
Speaker 2: not always okay. Huge plus for a lot of kids,
23:06
Speaker 2: Huge support for a lot of kids.
23:08
Speaker 1: One thing I wanted to ask you, since you are
23:10
Speaker 1: in the schools, you're working with all this stuff, how
23:13
Speaker 1: much do you feel like social anxiety gets in the
23:15
Speaker 1: way of young people seeking help from counselors?
23:18
Speaker 2: Huge part, huge part, And I think that's why you know,
23:21
Speaker 2: for us and if there's any school counselors listening.
23:23
Speaker 3: You know.
23:23
Speaker 2: Something that we've tried to do that I think has
23:25
Speaker 2: been really effective is we just try to be out
23:28
Speaker 2: in the school all the time. If it's not a
23:30
Speaker 2: class time and we're not meeting with students during class time,
23:34
Speaker 2: before school, after school, at the start of lunches, in
23:37
Speaker 2: between pretty much every class period, we go stand in
23:40
Speaker 2: front of the counting center and we're just out there
23:42
Speaker 2: saying how the kids, waving, smiling, just so kids know
23:45
Speaker 2: that this is what we look like. We are right here.
23:47
Speaker 2: And I think we have not tracked it. I mean,
23:50
Speaker 2: we track how many check ins we have all the
23:51
Speaker 2: time on a Google sheet and all that spreadsheet. We
23:54
Speaker 2: haven't tracked it. But I think it's helped a ton
23:56
Speaker 2: because there's times where a kid sometimes they have a
23:58
Speaker 2: simple question and they've wanted to ask, but they haven't
24:01
Speaker 2: wanted to walk through the counseling center door, signing on
24:05
Speaker 2: the check and sheet do all that just to get
24:07
Speaker 2: their question answered. Seeing us standing out there, they come
24:10
Speaker 2: in and ask a question. Boom, good to go. Connection
24:13
Speaker 2: made you talk to a kid one day, you say hi,
24:15
Speaker 2: one morning they come by a week later.
24:17
Speaker 3: And just say hey, I've been wanting to talk to
24:19
Speaker 3: you or I want to check in.
24:20
Speaker 2: We go to health class presentations where then that's why
24:23
Speaker 2: it's been great. The school counselors come with me every
24:26
Speaker 2: single time, and so now kids get FaceTime of their
24:28
Speaker 2: school counselor or a school counselor when they're in class,
24:31
Speaker 2: and then they know, like, this is what we look
24:33
Speaker 2: and we get kids every single time we give those presentations.
24:36
Speaker 2: We always get kids that come in to check in
24:37
Speaker 2: for the first time ever because they've seen us in there.
24:40
Speaker 2: So I think for sure the social anxiety part of it,
24:43
Speaker 2: it is hard. It's hard to raise your hand in
24:45
Speaker 2: class and say can I go down to the counseling center.
24:47
Speaker 2: It's hard to email your counselor and say, hey, we've
24:50
Speaker 2: never met before, can we talk. We try to be
24:52
Speaker 2: out there as soon as quick as possible, as much
24:55
Speaker 2: as possible to kind of get that out of the way.
24:57
Speaker 2: But it's definitely a part of it, and we try
24:59
Speaker 2: and work on it all time to make it even
25:01
Speaker 2: easier for kids to come ask for help because it
25:03
Speaker 2: can be hard.
25:04
Speaker 1: I think you do such a good job of that.
25:06
Speaker 1: Even hearing all the different steps that you're taking to
25:09
Speaker 1: get out there and meet people, meet kids where they are.
25:12
Speaker 1: I think that's so important. And you know you'll text
25:15
Speaker 1: me every once in a while and say, Hey, I
25:17
Speaker 1: can't record on this date. I'm going to go announce
25:19
Speaker 1: a basketball game. I've got to go to the school play.
25:23
Speaker 1: Like You're always doing stuff. And I think that's one
25:26
Speaker 1: thing that I admire about you is that this is
25:30
Speaker 1: this is your whole life, Like this is your whole personality.
25:33
Speaker 1: You'd love being there. You love these kids, And man,
25:37
Speaker 1: I think if I were a student in your high school,
25:40
Speaker 1: I'd be like, man, we have the coolest school therapist
25:44
Speaker 1: there is. Because it's cool to see how much you
25:47
Speaker 1: love it and how much you do you put yourself
25:49
Speaker 1: out there.
25:50
Speaker 3: Yeah, I appreciate it.
25:52
Speaker 2: I mean again, the school counselors, they come with me
25:54
Speaker 2: and a majority of those things. We go to these
25:57
Speaker 2: things together just because it is important for the kids
26:00
Speaker 2: to see. I mean, you would not I mean you
26:02
Speaker 2: can only imagine what it's like for a kid. You
26:05
Speaker 2: I see them in the hallway, I pull them, Hey,
26:07
Speaker 2: so and so come over here, and then they like
26:09
Speaker 2: walk over like, oh what happened?
26:10
Speaker 3: And'll be like, Hey, I went to the basketball game
26:11
Speaker 3: last night. Great job, that was awesome.
26:14
Speaker 2: Hey, great job at the musical yesterday or last week,
26:17
Speaker 2: like things like that. I think those connections that again,
26:20
Speaker 2: stronger school school climate, stronger connecting this to school. Those
26:24
Speaker 2: are things that are so important to us and feel small,
26:27
Speaker 2: but I think because you put an effort into it,
26:28
Speaker 2: I think really makes a big difference for a lot
26:30
Speaker 2: of kids.
26:31
Speaker 1: Do you guys feel anxious sometimes putting yourselves out there
26:34
Speaker 1: so much for the kids?
26:36
Speaker 2: Oh, I want to say no, but like, in what way?
26:40
Speaker 3: What way are you thinking?
26:41
Speaker 1: Like it's kind of nerve wracking to put yourself out
26:43
Speaker 1: there and be out there in front of kids, because
26:45
Speaker 1: sometimes high school kids can you know, they could be
26:47
Speaker 1: a little mean.
26:47
Speaker 2: They can be I thought you were That's what I
26:49
Speaker 2: thought you were thinking. I mean, honestly, like, I'm always
26:52
Speaker 2: in the mindset are like, fucking dude, I don't care.
26:53
Speaker 2: You're a teenager, man, I've heard the worst of the worst.
26:57
Speaker 2: We've all heard the worst of the worst growing up,
27:00
Speaker 2: and like they will soon learn things that happen in
27:03
Speaker 2: high school will only last so long, right, it is
27:05
Speaker 2: what it is, like, you know, I'm sure there's kids
27:08
Speaker 2: that think we're corny as fuck all the time when
27:10
Speaker 2: we go to classes and try to make jokes, and
27:12
Speaker 2: but that's fine because for every kid that thinks it's
27:15
Speaker 2: like weird or cheesy, there's kids that like that needed
27:18
Speaker 2: it and are are happy that someone came to say
27:21
Speaker 2: something there to connect so cool. Well, that's it. I
27:25
Speaker 2: just wanted to brag about school counselors for a little
27:27
Speaker 2: bit because again, I think if if anybody would have
27:29
Speaker 2: told me that school counseling was a job, even though
27:32
Speaker 2: I talked to my school counselor in high school, I did,
27:35
Speaker 2: I think I would have strongly considered it, you know,
27:36
Speaker 2: to get I have some coworkers that they went to
27:39
Speaker 2: like a dual like licensure track program where they could
27:44
Speaker 2: either be an LPC Licensed Professional counselor like me, or
27:47
Speaker 2: they could be a school counselor, or they could do both.
27:49
Speaker 2: Thing you have both licensure, So there's a lot of crossover.
27:51
Speaker 2: There's a lot of pieces that are the same, there's
27:53
Speaker 2: a lot of pieces that are different. But again, we
27:55
Speaker 2: wanted to talk to about school counselors for a little
27:57
Speaker 2: bit because I think they are unsung heroes. Of of
28:00
Speaker 2: schools a lot of the time, and you know sometimes
28:02
Speaker 2: they need a little little extra help, a little extra support.
28:05
Speaker 2: And yeah, I don't know if a lot of people
28:08
Speaker 2: know about school counselor National School Counselor Week. I know
28:10
Speaker 2: for our school this week is staff appreciation Week, which
28:13
Speaker 2: is great. I think all the staff should be appreciated,
28:16
Speaker 2: but I think school counselors need their their time to
28:18
Speaker 2: shine a little bit too.
28:19
Speaker 1: So if you if you know a school counselor, give
28:22
Speaker 1: him a big hug, give him a big kiss, tell
28:24
Speaker 1: them you love them, and appreciate them.
28:27
Speaker 3: With consent.
28:29
Speaker 2: Yes always, We'll wrap it with this. You know where
28:33
Speaker 2: to find this Apple podcast Spotify. Leave us a five
28:36
Speaker 2: star review on social media at Millennial MHC at our
28:40
Speaker 2: website MILLENNIALMHC dot com. We appreciate you all. We'll see
28:44
Speaker 2: you guys next time. Remember take care of all mentals.
28:48
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28:51
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28:56
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