Latest / Camp Classics / Charlie's Angels (2000)

Transcript

Charlie's Angels (2000) · Camp Classics

0:00
The vibe is like we've already solved feminism so now girls can
0:03
be hot again. Get away from her, you bitch.
0:08
Classic. He was in the Amazon of my mom
0:11
when she was researching spiders right before she died.
0:15
No. I thought you can't prostitute
0:21
your dog at it. I used to love doggy chow.
0:25
I used to love doggy chow too. Never, said a man to do a drag
0:30
Queen's job. I'm Crystal.
0:32
And I signed that release form so you can just feel free to
0:35
stick things in my slot. I'm baby lame.
0:38
And welcome to Camp Classics A. Thoughtful podcast about stupid
0:46
movies. Oh, I'm feeling a little stupid
0:48
today. I got to.
0:49
I got to say. Why are you feeling stupid?
0:52
What's up? What's going on, girl?
0:54
I'm just suffering I think, from a two day hangover.
0:57
Yeah, well, we've got to tell the listeners, haven't we?
1:00
Crystal through one of her infamous soirees.
1:04
Actually. Soiree, I think, is too classy.
1:08
I mean, the set up from an outsider's point of view, it is
1:12
a soiree. Crystal and her husband have a
1:15
lovely home. This catering is very gorgeous,
1:18
gorgeous cocktails. But it doesn't end up as a
1:21
soiree, does it it? Really ends full of trash bags,
1:24
mixing whatever booze they can find and probably whatever drugs
1:27
are lying around on the floor. Yeah, right.
1:30
Yeah, it's very that energy amongst the gorgeous wild
1:34
garden. Yeah.
1:36
But we had some special guests, didn't we?
1:41
Yes. Finally.
1:44
Can I just say just before you build it up, finally you pulled
1:47
through. Because we've been burned by the
1:49
world of celebrity in the past, haven't we?
1:51
When we've done our shows, we've had, you know, whispers that
1:55
Charlotte Church is going to be there.
1:58
There's been times when I might. I bet I can get Rylan to come.
2:01
Like we've been burned by the celebrity world, haven't we?
2:04
Yeah, Well. We had the usual array that
2:07
normally come. You've got some famous drag
2:09
Queens, Courtney hacked. Yeah, there were some porn
2:14
stars. There were some influencers.
2:17
There were some. Porn stars are always the
2:19
chattiest. As well.
2:20
That's the G, Yeah, right. 'Cause I always need a bit of
2:25
warming up in those kind of environments.
2:27
But yeah, like the porn stars are the ones with all the chat,
2:30
aren't they? But the real, the real moment
2:34
was our friend Darren, who's been on the podcast he directed
2:37
Jawbreaker. Darren Stein, he brought along
2:41
Rose McGowan, killed Liz, I killed the teen dream.
2:45
Deal with it. What the fuck?
2:48
What the fuck? What the actual fuck?
2:51
Like like you sent me a message like warn again whispers that
2:57
Rose McGowan might be coming. I was like fuck off.
3:00
Why is Rose McGowan coming to your party?
3:03
Oh, lo and behold, holding court in the kitchen.
3:06
And she brought half a papaya. And I did not know about that
3:11
element. And a chicken breast which we
3:13
cooked for her dog in the air fryer.
3:16
So how do you cook a chicken breast for her dog?
3:18
And what's her dog's name? It's Perlita and it was olive
3:22
oil. Oh, and what what was the half a
3:27
papaya for? She just, well, she lives in
3:30
Mexico and she was missing papaya.
3:34
Sure. I've and I'm naturally I live
3:38
next to the kind of shop that sells organic chicken breasts
3:41
and half papayas. Oh yeah, yeah, totally.
3:44
Well, it's like I've never seen Call My Name.
3:46
Is that the film where they it's it's something that has come.
3:48
No, he. Fucks that he fucks a Peach.
3:51
He does he fuck the Peach. He.
3:52
Fucks a Peach, yeah? Because there's also a film with
3:55
Tiffany Haddish called Girls Trip, which I don't know if
3:58
you've watched. Yeah, they do this.
3:59
Yeah. What is it?
4:01
Is it like a? A watermelon.
4:02
Yeah. Yeah, the watermelon trick.
4:05
It's like a blowjob. It was like a hand job but with
4:08
a juicy. Yes, well, let's just say we all
4:12
got our spoons in. PT fucking cane.
4:15
So that's exciting then? An actual camp classic icon.
4:19
Yeah, in our reach. That's very exciting.
4:21
First stop my kitchen. Next stop the podcast.
4:25
That's how it works. I think so.
4:27
Well, good work. You're doing the good work
4:28
there, aren't you? Looked amazing as well studying.
4:32
Did you ever watch Charmed? No, I I mean, I watched it, but
4:36
I wasn't. Now you're like, you're a big
4:38
old witch though, aren't you? Yeah, it was a very important TV
4:41
show to me. So yeah.
4:43
Anyway, in this case, do meet your heroes because yeah, she
4:46
was lovely. Anyway, that's our gossip, isn't
4:49
it? Yeah.
4:50
I think that's quite good gossip.
4:51
As well. Very juicy.
4:53
Yeah, this is what people as. Juicy as the papaya?
5:00
But on to, you know, the serious business of the show.
5:03
Show business, if you will. We of course, do have a Gatreon
5:08
where you can get a bonus episode every month.
5:10
And who knows what secret kitchen gossip you'll get over?
5:14
There. Oh, are you going to spill on
5:15
the Gatreon? Is that what you're saying?
5:19
Well, you'll have to subscribe to find out, and we'd like to
5:21
welcome our new member, Leanne Brown.
5:23
Hi Leanne. Leanne already got shouted out
5:26
on the Gate Trone as well, because that's what happens if
5:28
you become a Gate Trone member. One of the many benefits.
5:31
Our last episode was on Postcards from the Edge, which I
5:35
really enjoyed, and our next episode will be on Vamp, which
5:39
is Grace Jones as a vampire stripper in a low budget 80s
5:43
horror. What's not to love?
5:45
And as always, if you can't subscribe to the Gatron because
5:48
you're poor or homophobic or a secret third thing, you could
5:52
leave us a comment on Apple Podcasts and give us a five star
5:55
rating on Spotify. Yeah, just fucking do it now.
5:58
We've got a new review on Apple Podcasts.
6:00
Good. Let me read it to you.
6:03
Is it Rose McGowan? Yeah, I assume working under a
6:07
pseudonym, yeah. Classic Rose.
6:10
Classic Rose. Now this is Sophia who has said
6:13
how have I only just discovered this podcast combining my two
6:16
favorite things, movies and being one of them,
6:18
queerosexuals. Crystal and Baby Lame are
6:21
amazing as always. Perhaps Romeo and Michelle's
6:24
high school reunion as a camp classic.
6:26
I mean, that's a strong contender and it will get
6:29
covered at some point. I actually is it even on?
6:32
Is it on our list? It must be on the list.
6:35
The list is. So big now, though, it is.
6:37
It is. Well, hi, Sophia.
6:39
Yeah, thank you. Thanks, Gorge.
6:41
That's a lovely review. And we've also had a request
6:45
come in via the e-mail. I.
6:48
Didn't know we had an e-mail. Me neither.
6:50
I think it maybe came to me directly via my a forum on my
6:54
website, which anyway. Sure.
6:56
Well, e-mail us. E-mail us.
6:58
Send a pigeon. Who knows but Milo says hi
7:02
Crystal, I heard about your podcast from the Bechtel cast.
7:05
Would recommend you watching Jupiter Ascending.
7:08
It's a camp stupid space opera written and directed by the
7:11
Wachowski sisters. I have seen it, have you?
7:15
I haven't seen it and I I think it's always good for us to have
7:19
a film that we neither of us have any association with as
7:22
well. So yeah, we'll add that to the
7:24
list as well. Thank you, Milo.
7:26
Now I feel. Like you're, you're giving me
7:28
very like, oh, businesswoman with lots to do today.
7:31
Yeah. Very long.
7:32
Oh my God, I've I've been very productive today.
7:35
I've had a lot. I've ticked a lot of.
7:37
Jobs the energy is riding through into this podcast.
7:39
You just seem very efficient. Right.
7:41
Well, what's what's next? What's next?
7:42
OK. See lots of things to do on the
7:45
list. Well, actually, that's a great
7:47
segue because, baby, before we go any further, why don't you
7:51
let the people know what makes a camp classic?
7:53
I would love to do that. And now a camp classic is
7:55
something that needs to unlock queer joy.
7:58
In the words of Megan Fox, we want something that will give us
8:02
such a wetty. That is not what I thought a
8:09
wetty would sound like. Oh.
8:10
Really. Well, I guess, I guess it
8:13
depends on like the orifice and the amount of wetness coming out
8:17
of it, like, and if there's any air caught up as well.
8:20
Do you know what I? Mean yeah, it was definitely
8:22
giving quiz, yeah. Oh wow.
8:29
Basic. We're basic today, everybody.
8:32
Vagina jokes, that's what you can't say, I mean.
8:36
It feels appropriate for the film that we're going to be
8:38
talking about. True.
8:39
And that's not because women are in it.
8:41
The second thing that makes a camp classic is it needs to have
8:44
an ongoing legacy. We want something that'll make
8:46
you come back for more, and that feeds queer pop culture.
8:50
A camp classic needs to be so stupid, it's genius.
8:53
If it makes sense, it's probably not camp.
8:56
And finally, we are looking for flaccid energy.
9:00
That's right, a flop projected by the mainstream, resurrected
9:03
by the queers. And today we are solving
9:07
feminism with boobs. All the Mamas who rock the
9:12
dollar throw your hands off filming.
9:15
I like Independent Women Part 20, which is set to the circus
9:20
music. And it's like, oh jingly and
9:22
jangly Beyoncé's all that, but y'all never think a girl like
9:33
me. Only when you're silly.
9:35
When you're feeling lonely. Because we are covering, of
9:39
course, 2000s Charlie's Angels. What is your history with this
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movie? Well, I feel like I was the
9:50
generation, so you would have been as well.
9:52
This is like peak MTV, Britney Christina.
9:58
Like it just felt like a big music video that came out of
10:01
nowhere. And it was like, oh, I can watch
10:03
this. And also it felt like, oh, this
10:06
is a film I can like without being gay bashed because it's
10:10
kind of like it's sort of lads mad mag adjacent, do you know
10:14
what I mean? Yes.
10:16
So yeah, I really liked it, but like with all films, I prefer
10:19
the sequel personally. Spoiler alert, I realized this.
10:25
Every single film that has a sequel, I will prefer it,
10:28
genuinely. I think you're the first person
10:30
to say ever that they prefer Full Throttle to the.
10:33
Original. Really.
10:34
Demi Moore. I mean, I might be with you.
10:37
It's been a while since I've seen 4th throttle.
10:38
So yeah, I'm I'm ready to agree, but right now I can't.
10:43
OK, fair. Well, we're not talking about
10:45
full throttle. We're not.
10:47
It's very risk addiction coded, isn't it?
10:50
Basic Institute. But yeah, they're the same
10:53
title. They're the same movie.
10:56
A reason to check out the Gate drone because Crystal will not
10:59
allow us to talk about Basic Instinct 2 on the main podcast.
11:02
So please subscribe now. What about you Crystal?
11:05
Where do you sit with this one? Yeah, I think the same.
11:08
It was definitely came out at a time that was it felt targeted
11:12
directly at me. I would say, somewhat
11:16
embarrassingly, I found this movie quite aspirational when it
11:18
came. OK, let's break that down.
11:25
That's that's quite a big I feel that we need to go into a deep
11:29
dive on this subject. I think, you know how like, it's
11:33
in the same way that I think I probably found Sex in the City
11:35
kind of aspirational. I was like, I want my future to
11:38
be cosmopolitan, glamorous, sexy.
11:42
I want, I want to be using my sexuality to get what I want.
11:46
And you know what? It all came true, women.
11:50
And just like that. Rose McGowan is in my house and
11:57
etcetera. No, yeah, I think I made it my
11:59
personality when it came out in the same way I probably did with
12:02
like Moulin Rouge. I was like what is this?
12:04
Moulin Rouge, She made it your personality.
12:07
What were you doing? Like crazy mash ups of like old
12:11
pop songs. Probably I remember like trying
12:13
to learn Cameron Diaz's dance routines from these movies.
12:17
Oh my God, this is all. This is all obviously so far pre
12:21
drag, but obviously I was responding to the there was a
12:25
baby drag queen still within me that was very much responding to
12:30
the spectacle. And, and, and Cameron Diaz was
12:33
the one that you aspired to out of them.
12:37
No, but she had choreography that you could kind of copy.
12:41
OK. Yeah, I feel like I'm learning a
12:43
lot about you in a very short amount.
12:45
I did say I was embarrassed. No, no judgement here.
12:49
I feel like we need, this is part of the assessment.
12:51
We need to kind of we need to explore this, right.
12:54
OK, OK. Anyway, we'll get into maybe why
12:59
the the whys of why it was so cool, the choreography, Yeah.
13:04
But I watched it again last week.
13:07
I went to the Prince Charles Cinema for the 25th anniversary
13:10
screening and I got to say it, it did very well in a group
13:14
theatre setting. It was so fun.
13:16
People were really chuckling along.
13:18
There was some, you know, some dialogue in this movie that
13:21
people repeated in the theatre. It was it was fun.
13:24
I haven't seen it a long time so it was really fun to revisit.
13:27
And was there anyone else at was it like a screening with any
13:30
speakers or anything? A screenwriter gave a talk at
13:33
the top, but she didn't have a connection to the movie, so she
13:37
was just basically talking about why she loves it.
13:40
So what Someone talking about films that has no connection to
13:43
it? Like why would anyone want to
13:44
listen to that? Well, let's get into the
13:50
context. The context?
13:53
This movie came out in 2000, directed by Mick G.
13:56
Now Mick G at this point had only done music videos.
14:01
And I'd say as gay people, we understand that that is not
14:05
necessarily a bad thing. Some of the highest art in the
14:08
world is music videos. There's nothing wrong with being
14:10
a music video director. In fact, it's probably a tick.
14:13
Unfortunately, the music videos he's done are like for Corn and
14:17
Smash Mouth. Yeah, I saw that.
14:19
And so that is actually. That is actually, yeah.
14:22
But I, you know, I did a bit of research into this director too,
14:25
and, and there are lots of films that look really great actually
14:28
that I didn't know he was responsible for.
14:31
One is called Rim of the World. Is that like?
14:36
I just thought, what a what a captivating title, Rim of the
14:40
World. Is that is, is it like a
14:43
monster? Like a Godzilla kind of movie.
14:46
I didn't look into it, I just I just like the word rim.
14:50
Oh no, it's not. It's looks like it's about
14:52
children. OK.
14:55
OK, moving swiftly along. Yeah, so this was his first
15:00
movie. 1st movie yes. How do you get given like the
15:05
Charlie Angels franchise as a first movie?
15:09
Apparently he gave a really great pitch and Drew Barrymore
15:12
was incredibly impressed with him.
15:13
Oh, that's right. Speaking of boss Ladies, Drew
15:15
Barrymore produced this, didn't she?
15:17
She sure did. Wasn't she only like 24 as well
15:20
when she first? Got something like that.
15:22
That woman has lived. Whenever you can go out into the
15:26
rain, do not miss the opportunity.
15:30
But yeah, she did produce this. She was championing McGee.
15:33
This movie had a very troubled production with a script that
15:38
apparently had 14 different writers.
15:41
Wow. And it was apparently rewritten
15:44
30 times. The movie had a budget of
15:47
$90,000,000, which is just so much money.
15:51
It is so much money. And it made $264,000,000
15:54
worldwide. And it was the 12th highest
15:57
grossing movie of the year. So it was a big, big hit.
16:01
Reviews wise, it's a bit more mixed, 68% on Rotten Tomatoes.
16:05
And I've actually, there's a lot of like, pretty nasty review
16:09
sound bites, Roger Ebert said. It's a movie without a brain and
16:13
it's 3 Pretty Little heads, which isn't very nice, is it?
16:17
No, no, I don't like him though. I know it's not the actresses
16:21
fault that the movie doesn't have a brain.
16:22
I hate men. The New York Times said Sure,
16:26
it's easy on the eyes, but would a little brains be too much to
16:28
ask? I hate.
16:30
Men, Yeah. So there's a kind of running
16:32
theme of like, this is just silly trifle for girls.
16:36
I hate men, right? But Todd McCarthy in Variety
16:41
wrote of Cameron Diaz's performance.
16:43
Rarely has a performer conveyed the impression of being so happy
16:46
to be in a movie, and I think that's probably quite true.
16:50
Yeah, 'cause I think I read an article with Drew Barrymore and
16:54
I think Cameron Diaz was like one of her first choices.
16:57
And then they went through a three, a few different other
17:00
people before they got to Lucy Liu.
17:02
But I think she sort of summarized it that she was just
17:05
literally like, to Cameron, hey, do you want to be in this action
17:08
movies? It's Charlie's Angels.
17:10
We're going to learn Kung Fu. And we look really hot and wear
17:12
cool outfits. And like, Cameron Diaz was also
17:15
like, yeah, that sounds great. Because if you're in your 20s, I
17:17
mean, that does sound like a fun sell, really, doesn't it?
17:20
Yeah. And I'm going to give you $10
17:22
million. Yeah, well, unless you're Lucy
17:24
Liu. Didn't she get like one million,
17:25
$1 million? Wow.
17:27
Yeah. Yep, I'm going to quickly roll
17:29
you through some of the other people that were approached and
17:31
considered for this movie. Oh, go on.
17:33
And and the IT will get more unhinged as I go on.
17:36
Angelina Jolie. Tandy Newton.
17:38
OK, can I give a bit of commentary of some of the names?
17:41
Angelina Jolie, too dark for this.
17:44
She's she's a Lone Ranger, I think.
17:47
I can't see her doing the teamwork.
17:49
No, no. No, Tandy Newton.
17:51
She was very close to being cast, but she dropped out
17:54
because she didn't want to be racially stereotyped.
17:57
We'll get to that, won't we? Yeah.
17:58
Yeah, OK. Mila Jovovich, Alyssa Milano,
18:02
Julia Roberts, Salma Hayek. I feel like Julia.
18:04
Roberts is thrown in with every one of these things, so.
18:07
Sure. Yeah, for sure.
18:09
Ashley Judd, Halle Berry, Jennifer Jason Leigh, Gwyneth
18:12
Paltrow, Uma Thurman, Kate Winslet, Reese Witherspoon,
18:15
Robin Wright, Renee Zellweger, Jader Plinkett Smith, Helena
18:18
Bonham Carter. Wow, imagine So what?
18:26
She was like a crusty posh 1. I myself am strange and unusual.
18:31
Kristen Davis, Jodie Foster, OH. Hello, Clary.
18:36
Who would have been substantially older than the
18:38
other angels. Oh yeah.
18:40
Jerry Horner. As in Jerry Halliwell Horner.
18:44
Yes, Aaliyah, Lauren Hill, Michelle Yeoh, Jenny McCarthy,
18:49
Catherine Zeta Jones, Victoria Beckham.
18:55
What a list. Oh.
18:57
God, it could have gone anyway, couldn't it?
18:59
Literally just just throw. Just throw darts at every
19:03
celebrity of the time. What I will say is I actually
19:06
can see why the Spice Girls might have been in a discussion
19:09
because actually this film is quite similar to Spice World.
19:13
You're right actually, and I've never thought about that.
19:16
I think it's all. I think it's all of those kind
19:17
of like, you know, high production scenes that don't
19:20
really mean anything, but you've got them in lots of different
19:23
setups and costumes. Music video, Yeah.
19:26
Yeah. Anyway, I'm really glad that no
19:29
Spice Girls ended up in this movie.
19:30
Yes. Should we get into the plot?
19:34
Yeah, yeah. I mean, again, as as often the
19:39
case, this is a very yada, yada, yada, yada, yada, yada, yada,
19:43
Yeah. There's definitely scenes that
19:45
need to be discussed. Oh 100% yes, the.
19:48
Plot So Natalie, Dylan and Alex are the Angels, three women who
19:55
work as private investigators together for unseen millionaire
19:58
Charlie Townsend. They're played, of course, by
20:01
Cameron Diaz, Drew Barrymore and Lucy Liu.
20:04
We've got our opening scene, which involves a long shot of a
20:07
bomb on a plane that the girls diffuse.
20:10
And I think stylistically here, we know what we're getting
20:12
because it's like CGI has come in hard on that plane, hasn't
20:17
it? It's like we're watching like a
20:18
PlayStation game or something, yeah.
20:21
Yeah, but I thought it looks quite good.
20:23
Well, again, it's a it's a stylistic choice.
20:25
I would say I quite like the gay.
20:27
I quite like the gay flight attendant as well.
20:30
The fat shaming one, yeah. So the racist fat shame.
20:33
Yeah, yeah. Because he's definitely racist
20:34
as well. I said to her the seats aren't
20:36
smaller, your ass has gotten bigger.
20:40
And then they let someone fuck in the toilets.
20:42
And then he racially profiles LL Cool J and says this is the
20:47
first class section. Yeah.
20:50
Are you supposed to be here? It's all very Richard Branson
20:53
energy, this plane. Yes, it is.
20:56
But yeah, LL Cool J is there, and I don't feel qualified to
21:01
decide whether or not Drew Barrymore wearing an LL Cool J
21:04
mask counts as blackface. But let's just note it.
21:08
I think it's, I think it's a useful note to have with some of
21:12
the stuff that's about to follow on.
21:13
Yeah, yeah. But in this case alone, it's
21:16
it's probably OK, but again, probably not the best person to
21:19
talk about that. But yeah, I would say they,
21:23
they've done a good job of sort of giving us action thriller,
21:26
spy movie, paint by numbers as the opening, haven't they?
21:29
They've kind of set it up and it's a bit of a like, you know,
21:33
it's a bit of like, oh, we're just Mission Impossible here
21:36
before it twists and starts showing.
21:38
Yeah, yeah, it's very Mission Impossible.
21:41
The girls are tough. They're capable and they're hot.
21:44
It's very that energy. Also, I, I mean, I don't know if
21:47
you noticed this, but Drew Barrymore is dressed as LL Cool
21:50
J and she takes the guy with the bomb off the plane but leaves
21:53
that door open. I think.
21:54
I think that gay flight attendant got sucked into space.
21:56
But yeah, definitely, yeah. Like.
21:59
Yeah, I think that whole plane is full of dead people.
22:01
Death to all of them. Carnage.
22:06
Carnage. And McGee decided to not focus
22:09
on that. No, he just wanted.
22:11
We're focusing on Cameron Diaz and a gold bikini.
22:13
Yes, right, there we go. So then we meet Vivian Wood,
22:19
played by Kelly Lynch. You know, I'm going to say that
22:23
I love her. I didn't know who she was, but I
22:27
was like, oh wow, the budget has not gone on you has it?
22:30
Sweet. She's giving me like very like
22:34
TV drama D list celebrity moment.
22:37
Do you know what I mean? TV Movies.
22:40
Yes, and she's got the most early 2000s Halle Berry Catwoman
22:43
hair. In a tone.
22:45
Of red. Yeah.
22:46
Open. Yeah, that flippy little Pixie
22:49
cut and a leather trouser. Love her.
22:54
A movie that really has quite the extensive wardrobe and hair
23:00
budget. She really is the half to 4,
23:03
isn't she? It's, it's cruel.
23:04
It's it's cruel. It's like someone hates Kelly
23:08
Lynch, OK? They hate her because she's an
23:11
attractive woman. Right, yes, she is.
23:14
She's but. Someone hates her, they've gone.
23:17
Oh bitch, you're not getting any of this because has the montage
23:21
happened before this? Oh yeah, sorry, the montage has
23:24
just happened. We need to talk about the
23:25
montage. So yeah, it's literally like
23:27
they are Charlie's Angels. And it's like they've done like
23:30
a mock, like opening title sequence, like you would see in
23:34
the TV series where we see them all in different setups doing
23:37
like fighting, you know, saving. People an astronaut.
23:43
Cameron Diaz is a Jeopardy champion.
23:46
What like it's hard? That alone is the visual
23:49
overload of looks that they're pulling.
23:52
Is insane, isn't? It so fabulous.
23:55
It's so. Fabulous.
23:55
Well, I did some research about the the costume designer.
23:59
I don't know if you came across this at all.
24:01
I saw him talking a bit in the making of and he was really
24:04
going, you know, enjoying talking about the beadwork on
24:07
the gown in the party scene. Yeah.
24:10
Right. OK, so I was doing some research
24:12
about the costume designer who's called Joseph Elusi Sure.
24:17
And apparently he was called in three weeks before filming began
24:25
and he had to create 3000 outfits for the entire cast for
24:29
the film in record time. And this isn't one of those like
24:33
bottom of the pile IMDb trivia. He's been on record from
24:37
multiple publications saying this.
24:39
So apparently the angels each wear over 50 looks each in this
24:45
movie. My God.
24:46
But yeah, so. And like we were talking about
24:48
this, obviously Drew Barrymore was producing.
24:50
It might have been a bit of a vanity producer role though,
24:53
because a lot of men are involved in this role.
24:56
And if they're straight men, this does sound like something
24:59
straight man would would sort of leave last, isn't it?
25:02
So they've, they've created the script.
25:03
They've got it all signed up. Oh, we're going to need like
25:06
different looks. Well, I guess we better hire a a
25:08
costume guy three weeks before production and he literally just
25:13
had to scramble to kind of make it all happen.
25:17
Well, he really turned it out. Then there's some there's some
25:19
iconic looks in this movie. And they're all done really
25:22
well, aren't they? They're like, there's the wigs
25:25
are great and the makeup is really fab.
25:28
Like, you know, if they're doing like a throwback to a 70s look,
25:31
they've got the Farrah Fawcett hair.
25:33
Yeah, it's very playful. I'm trying to think of some of
25:36
the like the more iconic costumes in this, but like,
25:40
yeah, maybe when they're the yodeling maids, the the race
25:44
course scene. Race track, I will say, like the
25:47
yodeling maid, you think if you go to like an Oktoberfest style
25:51
and you get the awful like Smithies, there's no scale to
25:56
the costumes these have like wiring the hairs wired.
26:00
It's drag. It's top tier drag.
26:02
But yeah, old Kelly Lynch and poor old Kelly Lynch, even I'm
26:05
doing it. She's probably only 38 or
26:07
something, but yeah, old witchy Kelly Lynch got fuck.
26:13
All What was the name of the costume designer?
26:17
Oh, Josepha. Lucy.
26:19
Joseph. Well, well done, Joseph.
26:21
Yeah, well done, JoJo. We love you.
26:23
I'm just looking at Kelly Lynch's Instagram now just to
26:26
see if I can get any. Let's see if she follows Cameron
26:29
Diaz. That'll be telling, won't it?
26:33
She doesn't. Oh, let's see if she follows
26:36
Drew Barrymore. She doesn't.
26:39
Let's see if she follows Lucy Liu.
26:42
She doesn't. Oh.
26:44
Oh, so just saying. I wonder if they all follow each
26:48
other. We don't have time for this.
26:50
No, sorry. So we've met Kelly Lynch.
26:55
She hires Bosley, played by Bill Murray, and the Angels to find
27:00
her partner, Eric Knox, played by Sam Rockwell.
27:03
He's a software genius who created a revolutionary voice
27:06
recognition system and heads his own company, Knox Enterprises.
27:11
They think he's been kidnapped by Roger Corwin, played by Tim
27:15
Curry, who runs a satellite company.
27:18
Because if those two technologies get together, every
27:21
mobile device will become a homing beacon.
27:28
It was glorious how dated this this well, because even like
27:31
watching it, obviously it's like 25 years ago, but I was still
27:35
kind of like, oh, it's not that old.
27:37
But when it's like, you know, the evil superpowers, voice
27:40
recognition, you know you're fucked.
27:42
When it's like you can go on YouTube and type Madonna singing
27:45
padam padam and it's all AI done.
27:47
Yeah, and as a gay man living in the year 2025 with Grinder on my
27:51
phone, the idea that my phone could tell people where I am
27:55
does not feel like a big threat to me.
27:58
If anything, I'm sharing my location to everybody.
28:01
The door is open. Come and do what you need to do.
28:04
Yeah, right. Also, I'd like to shout out Tim
28:08
Curry. I feel like I've.
28:10
I've never seen Tim Curry in a film where he's not playing camp
28:14
version of Frankenfurter in some sort of way, and it was just
28:17
nice to see him being very hammy on the old villain side of
28:21
things. It's.
28:22
Fabulous got no notes for him, so the Angels are trying to
28:26
track down Knox. They infiltrate a party held by
28:28
Corwin. Natalie has a meet cute with
28:31
Pete, played by Luke Wilson, which is where we get the line
28:34
here. God damn here.
28:38
Which the entire theater shouted at the screen, which was quite.
28:40
Fun. Oh, did they?
28:41
Oh, OK. Yeah, yeah.
28:43
Then they spot a suspicious looking Thin man played by
28:46
Crispin Glover got a fight scene with the Angels chasing down the
28:50
Thin man and this is where we see what the fighting style is
28:54
going to be like in this movie. And this is also where we're
28:56
really reminded of the era, because the soundtrack is Smack
28:59
My Bitch Up by the Prodigy, isn't it?
29:01
And it's just like, Yep, we know where we are.
29:04
Yep. I enjoyed it.
29:06
I enjoyed hearing that song. I enjoyed the fight.
29:09
I enjoyed the silliness. It's Kung Fu.
29:12
It's matrix light. Yeah, well, it's the same.
29:14
Crouching Tiger. It's just after the Matrix,
29:16
isn't it? So it's got this sort of.
29:17
They've got the technology of the slow bullet vibe going.
29:21
I agree. I think all of the fight
29:23
sequences are super enjoyable in this.
29:27
Yeah, yeah, you you've suspend your disbelief pretty
29:29
immediately. And then as long as you've done
29:31
that, you're having a lovely time watching.
29:33
Yeah, and they're relentless. They're kick ass, aren't they as
29:35
well? And I read that it was really
29:37
important for Drew Barrymore that they didn't have guns in
29:39
the movie and that they all were hand to hand combat.
29:42
So. Yeah, I watched the making of
29:44
this today. It's it's on YouTube.
29:47
It's quite fun. But yeah, they did three months,
29:49
8 hours a day of fight training. It's pretty intense, you know,
29:52
and they did a lot of their own stunts that you see them flying
29:55
through the air. They're working really hard.
29:57
Drew Barrymore can like, really properly kick.
30:01
It's cool. Well, you'd hope so after all of
30:03
that training, yeah. Yeah.
30:05
I love I love this as well because this is still where we
30:08
haven't quite worked out harnesses and making like people
30:12
on a harness fly up look, you know when like someone's leaping
30:15
through the sky and it's just very a slightly too slow.
30:19
You can see the harness has been painted out, but I, I, it's kind
30:22
of enjoyable that. Totally.
30:24
Yeah, there's definitely a few times where you're like, are you
30:26
being dragged across the set by your foot?
30:31
But I don't mind it. And then angels find knocks.
30:35
He's been tied up. Then they have to find out
30:37
whether or not the Thin Man and Corwin have stolen the voice
30:40
recognition software. So they have to break into
30:42
Corwin's office and we get a series of scenes where they get
30:47
the stuff they need to break in. And all of these are sexy.
30:50
They're the German yodelers. There's the racecourse scene we
30:56
can talk about, and there's also the brown face belly dancers.
31:00
Yeah, what in the Gwen Stefani is going on in this movie?
31:05
It's like, as we mentioned earlier at the the start, we've
31:07
got LL Cool J and then the kind of a sort of a standard spy
31:11
effect where a mask is peeled off to reveal Drew Barrymore.
31:14
And you're kind of like, OK, But then they really heavily go into
31:19
cultural appropriation in this movie, don't they?
31:22
They sure do. Yeah, we've already also had
31:24
Drew and Cameron in. Yeah, and Lucy Liu.
31:30
Like being a masseuse. Playing a masseuse.
31:33
In kind of quite a sort of trophy Asian woman.
31:38
Yeah. Way and then yeah, then you've
31:40
got like 2 geishas then then you've got them belly dancing.
31:44
And Drew Barrymore is painted brown, yeah.
31:47
And it's like a weird, she just walks out.
31:49
It's a very quick shot of her. Yeah.
31:53
And Karen Diaz is blonde as a belly dancer, isn't she?
31:56
So they're just, they're kind of the other two are like, oh,
31:58
we're up. We're just belly dancers as
32:00
ourself. And then it's like, Nope, Drew
32:03
Barrymore is in brown face. Yeah, it's hard to.
32:05
It's hard to see. And we've also got the SEMO
32:08
wrestling, even the yodeling. And and Cameron Diaz on Soul
32:14
Train also does not feel great to me.
32:17
This kind of like white fantasy hostile black people who get won
32:23
over by her white girl charms. Yeah, it's so true.
32:27
It's so, it's so tasteless. That's it.
32:31
And it really I I my notes off. It's giving that woman who's
32:35
just occupies all of the space in the club and it's like me,
32:39
me, me. I'm getting married.
32:40
Everyone look at me, look at me. And it's just, yeah, it just, it
32:45
was just off, wasn't it? And then it's like, go white
32:47
girl, go white girl. And yeah, she's taking up all
32:50
the space, all the energy. Everyone's worshipping her with
32:53
her CGI blue Aryan eyes. Totally.
32:56
And of course she's this the main character in this club
32:59
because she's white and it's very yeah, 1 defence I've got.
33:04
It's not really a defence, but one thing.
33:06
I watched the first episode of the actual original series today
33:11
just to kind of compare and contrast.
33:12
And there is a scene of someone getting a massage by feet.
33:17
They're obviously they're, they're obviously kind of doing
33:21
a reference to it. It's, but you know that doesn't
33:25
make it any better. Yeah.
33:27
And then it's even like, it's even like when Lucy Liu is like
33:31
the mistress. It's very fetishy, isn't it?
33:35
It's, I think it's, that seems kind of cool, but it's again
33:38
sort of playing into kind of stereotypes of Asian women,
33:42
isn't it? Yeah, like dragon lady sort of
33:44
vibe. Dominatrix.
33:46
Yeah, yeah. But then I mean, but then I
33:49
mean, I guess the the only thing you could sort of say about that
33:52
is the kind of comedy that Lucy Liu and those types of
33:55
characters that she played were always those very deadpan, very.
34:00
I mean, I think Lucy Liu is hilarious in this film.
34:03
I think me too. I think I probably find her more
34:06
aspirational than the Drew Barrymore.
34:08
So, you know, you said that Drew Barrymore was.
34:10
I think I find Lucy Liu Moore aspirational.
34:13
I did not. I did not say that I was
34:15
aspiring to Drew her. Cameron.
34:16
It's definitely Lucy. No, but what did you say?
34:18
You said something about. I used I used to try and learn
34:21
Cameron Diaz. 'S damn, I think he said.
34:24
You felt inspired by Cameron Diaz and you wanted to be her.
34:28
No, I wanted to be them. Them specifically Lucy Liu in
34:33
the land. Rewind the tapes.
34:37
You're right, she has been. At this point, she's kind of
34:40
been a bit typecast, hasn't she? Because she basically plays the
34:42
exact same character in Ally Mcbeal.
34:44
And I guess as well, like we were, you know, this is still a
34:47
kind of a pre social media era. And if you look at pop culture,
34:52
there was a lot of cultural appropriation happening around
34:54
about this time. You know, I had Madonna being
34:56
her sort of ray of light era, Christina Aguilera, genie in a
35:00
bottle. I think Beyoncé sort of tapped
35:03
into that. It was kind of a Gwen Stefani
35:05
with the bindi. There is like a real like MTV
35:08
generation of of like fashion. It was kind of OK in a wider
35:13
sense to kind of do that. No, I'm not saying it is OK, but
35:16
I culturally it feels like we're in a a different place.
35:20
Yeah, yeah, it's a it. This movie is a product of it's
35:22
time. Although I don't I yeah, the
35:24
sort of blackface thing I don't think ever really was was OK,
35:28
but. No.
35:29
The girls then break into Red Star headquarters.
35:32
You've got Lucy Liu, Alex as a dominatrix efficiency expert.
35:37
Just I think one of the more iconic scenes and looks in the
35:40
movie, probably. She's really chewing it up.
35:44
I think this movie chomping. Yeah, yeah.
35:46
And it's, it's really, yeah. It's just a really strong
35:49
performance, like it's a comedy performance.
35:51
It's just bang on, isn't it? Yeah, it's great.
35:54
And then Natalie and Dylan are in drag as male directors, and
35:58
they also look fantastic. Yeah, it's great drag king
36:00
level, isn't it? Yeah.
36:02
It's really good. They fool the security system.
36:05
There's like a very Mission Impossible style heist situation
36:10
and that can hack into that computer.
36:13
They then give, they do we care, yadda yadda yadda.
36:18
Then they go. They all go on some dates.
36:25
Thank you for that. No, they do, because they've
36:28
really shoehorned in like the love affairs here, haven't they?
36:31
And they're all kind of we're getting to know the real then
36:33
they're not these kind of like kick ass, you know, crime
36:36
fighters. They've all got their flaws,
36:38
just like all women do. So, you know, Cameron Diaz is a
36:41
bit goofy and like, Oh my God, I'm so goofy.
36:44
I can't find a man because I'm just saying this so goofy.
36:47
And Lucy Liu is like, you know, desperately wants to be like a
36:51
housewife cook, kind of wants to please her man, the actor, but
36:55
like is kind of unsure about how she can be real with him.
36:58
And then true, well, she just loves chasing Dick and kind of
37:02
can't find a good boy 'cause she likes bad boys.
37:05
It's just relatable women stuff, right?
37:08
It's so annoying and apparently the original script didn't have
37:11
any love story and Drew Barrymore insisted it go in
37:14
because it was very the time of like women can have it all and
37:18
she wanted it to be a fantasy storyline for women and for
37:21
women to be able to see and relate to these characters.
37:24
Unfortunately, I think it actually makes them all look way
37:28
worse. Yeah, but again, it's an
37:30
interesting time because I heard an interview with Lucy Liu and
37:33
she was kind of saying like, you know, we're not GI jaining this,
37:36
we're not doing what Demi did, we're not shaving our heads off,
37:39
we're not being masculine. We're showing that we can kick
37:41
ass in a pair of 6 inch heels. And that's kind of how much
37:46
that's done by the PR team surrounding this movie.
37:48
But again, like you said, it's kind of like you can be hot, you
37:51
can be fam and you can also do all of this.
37:53
It's that's the the message they're trying to send, aren't
37:57
they? I.
37:57
Guess, but the the truth is that you can't actually kick ass and
38:00
chills of. Course.
38:03
And so there's like 2000 even if you could, even if you.
38:07
Could it probably would be better to be in a still cut
38:09
boot. Yeah.
38:11
Exactly. You're probably going to be more
38:13
efficient. And so, yeah, it's this 2000s
38:17
era maximalism, which is very, the vibe is like, we've already
38:21
solved feminism, so now girls can be hot again.
38:24
Yeah, it's like, oh God, thank God that bit is over with.
38:28
Yeah. But you know it.
38:30
I also appreciate why Drew wanted to do it this way.
38:34
And like, it's probably what I would have done in my 20s.
38:36
Also, but this is actually answering my question about the
38:39
unravelling of Drew Barrymore and me finding out when was she
38:42
uncalled. She fell in love with that Tom
38:45
Grennan during this as well and. Tom.
38:47
Tom Green. Tom Green or whatever his name
38:49
or Tom Grennan is that awful pop star, isn't it?
38:52
Tom Green. Yeah.
38:54
The Chad thing. I'm sorry, I hated that so much.
38:58
It was that Chad humor just represents early naughties men
39:02
humor. Yeah, just.
39:04
And the fact that he's saying repeatedly say the same
39:07
statement. Yeah, yeah, he's really, really
39:10
annoying. I I I mean, I found Bill Murray
39:12
really annoying in this too, but he and.
39:14
Apparently he was awful to Lucy Liu on set as well.
39:17
Yeah, there's quite a few like bits where you're like gross man
39:21
alert. It feels that.
39:23
Yeah, and yet you don't mind the gross man alert when it's Sam
39:27
Rockwell being that awful, you know, because that's that's the
39:30
role, isn't it? But it's just like other people
39:32
seem like. Yeah, what's?
39:34
Why are you taking time from our girls?
39:37
A girl, do you? Watch The Handmaid's Tale.
39:41
I have. You sound like Aunt Lydia, my
39:43
girls. Yeah, so we should talk.
39:49
We can talk about this now, but Bill Murray was apparently
39:50
really horrible. Lucy Liu screamed at her.
39:52
He apparently also head butted the director, I think.
39:55
Basically, it sounds like Bill Murray's a nasty, nasty piece of
39:58
work. And I guess if you are at the
40:00
level of what Bill Murray was in this film, I guess you can get
40:03
away with that kind of behaviour, can't you?
40:05
Yeah, yeah. I mean, he doesn't bring
40:07
anything to the movie for me. I liked there's that one bit at
40:12
the party scene at the beginning when he's got the the mic in his
40:15
mouth and he's just like opening his mouth and trying to get the
40:18
guy to speak into his mouth. I found that funny.
40:22
There's like, but you know it's not worth his presence.
40:26
I I also feel like it's these films are just like, it's almost
40:29
that they don't write these scenes.
40:30
They're just like, oh, right, you do your bit, you beat Bill
40:33
Murray now in this bit. That's what you need to do.
40:35
Apparently this is a fact I learned researching this, but
40:38
apparently Bill Murray has never had an agent.
40:40
He just has a 1800 number you can call and leave a message on
40:44
with an offer for a movie and if he's interested, he'll call you
40:47
back. But apparently he lost out on
40:49
like, like he was supposed to be in like Austin Powers and all
40:55
sorts of movies that people wanted him and no one could
40:57
reach him. So that also makes me find him
41:00
really annoying. Yeah, really annoying.
41:03
OK, but they're all on dates. This is where we get the Soul
41:06
Train scene, which we've already kind of discussed.
41:08
Matt LeBlanc is here. And it made me think of Red Shoe
41:12
Diaries. Do you remember Red Shoe
41:14
Diaries? Red Shoe Diaries was kind of
41:16
this like soft porn TV erotic drama.
41:21
And that was the first time I saw him.
41:22
He used to get it late night on cable.
41:24
And there'd be like these long salacious, like each EP would be
41:28
just like a different story. But it would, it would set it up
41:31
and it was all just very steamy and it would all end up with
41:34
like sex. And he in his scene, he was like
41:37
this, like paper boy or something.
41:39
And it was all just very like. Would you see butt?
41:43
No you a suggestion of tits, A six pack, maybe a a cheek.
41:51
You know he was in one of Alanis Morissette's first music videos.
41:54
I did not know that. There you go.
41:56
How you doing? So then Dylan has sex with Knox
42:01
and then he betrays her and we realized that he's the bad guy
42:06
and he also tries to get Natalie and Alex killed and Bosley gets
42:12
kidnapped but. Again, I, I like, in terms of
42:16
like it as an action movie, I found those scenes where the,
42:18
the, the angels were like struggling in their different
42:21
set ups and being caught. Like it felt like a bit more
42:24
dangerous and a bit more. That's the thing.
42:27
It's almost like a, a movie of 2 halves for me because you've got
42:29
all of this like over the top. I'm not going to use the word
42:33
campy humour, but like, sort of, you know, sort of
42:37
two-dimensional clowny behaviour.
42:40
But then when they get to the action scenes, they're like, way
42:42
more committed to it and stuff. Like the bit where Cameron Diaz
42:47
is like, she's got her felt on this guy's neck and she's like,
42:51
strangling it. She's got really powerful there.
42:53
And she's kind of like, tell me his name.
42:55
And you're like, fuck yeah. And there's no kind of like,
42:59
cheesy nudge, nudge, wink, wink tagline.
43:01
You're just like, she's fucking cool.
43:03
Yeah. So yeah, I liked those again.
43:05
Any kind, any times we've seen them actually fighting, I'm
43:08
like, oh, this is really good. Yeah, I totally agree.
43:11
And then it slips into like there's something about Mary or
43:15
some kind of ROM com sort of situation.
43:18
But yeah, you're right, it's really fun.
43:21
They all like, get away from this fight and then their office
43:25
building gets exploded and I might just yadda yadda yadda
43:29
here. It's a lot of gathering, isn't
43:31
it? They they rescue Bosley, they
43:35
get on a helicopter, they blow up the villain.
43:39
They don't blow up Kelly Lynch, though.
43:41
She's like chained up, isn't she?
43:44
Kelly Lynch I think gets blown up by.
43:47
Oh, is she blown up? Oh, I didn't know that she gets.
43:49
Blown up by Sam Rock Sam Rockwell.
43:51
Oh, OK. Then the girls head to the beach
43:53
for like some sexy giggle times with some coconuts.
43:59
Is that the top of the scene? Final scene The girls are at the
44:02
beach having some sexy time with some coconuts.
44:05
The end Yeah, you were just talking about this, but I think
44:09
we, we just like, need to talk about the feminism or not of
44:12
this movie. But yeah, I like, I definitely
44:14
don't think I did a deep dive on it.
44:16
So please open up this discussion.
44:18
Well, it's like, so as you say, during the action scenes or like
44:23
the heist moments, the Mission Impossible stuff, stuff, you're
44:25
like these women are so capable and it's really fun.
44:28
It's you're impressed by them. And then even when they're using
44:32
their sexuality to get what they want, you're also on board, I
44:36
think as a queer person, because I think it's quite cathartic to
44:39
watch. It certainly was cathartic for
44:41
me as a child to watch people use their sexuality to like and
44:44
be unashamed about it and like use it as a powerful thing and
44:47
use it as a weapon. I think that I found that really
44:49
exciting. And so you're like, you can find
44:52
joy in all of that. But then it swaps into like,
44:55
their personal lives and they've become Dum Dums.
44:58
They become weak, they become insecure.
45:01
Suddenly, you know, Cameron Diaz is really, she has no idea what
45:05
to do. She's scared.
45:06
She's in, she's nervous. Like you were just kicking so
45:09
much ass and you're so confident you can wrap any man around your
45:12
finger when you're at work. And then suddenly you can't.
45:15
Like it felt very inconsistent. Yeah.
45:18
And also this this whole thing about like, Lucy Liu's
45:21
character, like wanting to bake and cook all the time.
45:24
And again, like that scene where she shot her in the trailer and
45:29
she's gone up on the ceiling of the thing and she's holding it
45:31
there and it's like really fucking aggressive machine guns
45:34
everywhere that I'm like, that's an exciting scene.
45:37
And she looks kind of like traumatized.
45:39
So she would be like, Oh my God. But then she sees that her
45:42
souffle sort of drops. And that's the bit.
45:44
That's the bit that gets her moving.
45:47
And. Again, I'm just like this
45:50
character. I've also seen when they go to
45:51
the drive through, the drive through is not working and then
45:54
she gets out a bit of gun and she rewires it.
45:57
And again, I'm like, that's fucking cool that she's this
46:00
tech person and that's still a very entertaining, funny way to
46:04
do the scene. But it's subliminally going, Oh,
46:07
she's she's got the smarts about her, whereas as soon as she put
46:10
her in the kitchen, I'm not saying that people that bake
46:13
aren't smart, but it's it really, really is dumbs down any
46:17
of that good work they've done with the character developments
46:19
there, I think. Exactly, exactly.
46:22
And yeah, even though this movie is women LED, women produced, it
46:26
does feel very like a product of the time in this way where it's
46:30
like we can't let them be too tough.
46:33
They need to still have this like softer side.
46:38
The other thing I really hated, it's this trope of like bored
46:42
and sexy yesterday. Like Cameron Diaz is so
46:45
infantilized sometimes she's she's really bimbowed and and
46:50
again, it's not in keeping with with what her character's like
46:53
as soon as she's. Crime fighting, she could still
46:55
she could still be this very positive, happy, fun character.
47:02
The fact that they're all these kind of incredibly talented,
47:07
deeply trained experts in their field.
47:10
Yeah, I'm not buying that that that she is then that dumb in
47:14
every single situation. It's.
47:16
Just that she's then like banging her head on her own door
47:20
frame and like falling head over heels over a waiter.
47:23
And saying like the slit, the slit, the slot line about.
47:27
Oh yeah, exactly in my. Slot it's like but again, like
47:30
as we've seen, there are bits of the scene where they know how to
47:32
manipulate men with those kind of languages, but which again, I
47:35
think would have you would have got the entertaining trade off
47:39
just by sitting in that world rather than.
47:42
Yeah, I think it's a real kind of shame that they split it that
47:45
way. And also as well, why do you
47:47
think Lucy Liu is so terrified to tell Matt LeBlanc what her
47:51
job is? Why does she?
47:52
Why is she a bikini waxer? Why is that where she went to?
47:56
Well, I think she's in a really toxic relationship with a man
47:59
who will be incredibly threatened by a strong, smart
48:02
woman. And like, there's that bit where
48:04
she, like, tells him about how to defuse a bomb.
48:06
And then he's like, how did you know that?
48:07
I thought you were a bikini waxer?
48:08
And she has to be like, oops, sorry, I don't know anything
48:10
actually remember. And I mean, unless the Dick is
48:13
that good, what's the other reason why someone of her genius
48:16
would be willing to and also know like she's hot?
48:19
She's an she's an astronaut. We saw her as an astronaut.
48:23
Why is she pretending to be a bikini waxer?
48:26
And then also as well, like, obviously, you know, a lot of
48:30
people like a kind of more edgy bad boy.
48:33
But this idea that, I mean, actually is Drew Barrymore's
48:36
character the most believable in terms of her relationship with
48:39
men maybe. Yeah.
48:41
I'm just trying to think if there's anything outrageously
48:44
off. She's probably the most
48:46
humanised all round character I'd say right out of the three
48:49
of them. Yeah, she doesn't.
48:51
Like, she doesn't get weakened in the B plots.
48:54
She does get kind of punished for being a slut.
48:57
Oh, yeah, there's that, isn't there?
48:58
Yeah. And she really it.
49:00
Yeah, that actually is really nasty, the way he like.
49:02
Yeah. And again, it like, again, it
49:04
doesn't feel tonally the right kind of set up when he's like
49:07
revealing that he's actually shagging Kelly Lynch and.
49:11
Kelly Lynch turns out polyamorous icon.
49:13
Yeah, yeah. Mother, meanwhile, we're talking
49:18
about correct representation of a woman in a film.
49:21
It's Kelly Lynch. But yeah, she's like, yeah,
49:26
there's a real. This is almost where all of the
49:29
writings gone. Wow.
49:31
Let's go to town on this fucking slut.
49:33
So she gave me her pussy. Yeah.
49:35
We're going to demonise you now. Very more of that.
49:38
But but then it does paint him as like a really dirtbag man.
49:44
And she gets like a real revenge kind of storyline, which I
49:47
really like 'cause she like beats the crap out of him right
49:50
before he gets blown to pieces. And so there is like a, it's
49:54
clearly like cathartic for her. And you know, men are D bags and
50:00
it's fun to watch them get punished for it sometimes.
50:03
So now this is something else I'd like to point out.
50:04
Just the minor plot point that really, that is actually quite
50:07
camp actually in in the breakdown of it when she's tied
50:12
up by him and he's tracking down Charlie and all of that's
50:17
happening and he's like, ha ha, doing his evil spiel.
50:20
She's just sat there. Isn't she like powerless to him?
50:23
But then when he goes and then leaves like a group of eight men
50:27
to kind of fuck her up, that's when she then decides to, with
50:32
her hands tied up, break away from the chair and beat them all
50:35
up. And I'm just like, you could
50:37
have just done that to him and that wouldn't have put Charlie
50:40
in danger and you could have solved all of this a lot
50:42
earlier. You're right.
50:44
You're. Right.
50:45
So she's a bit of a masochist, I think.
50:47
And also she doesn't know what that moonwalk is.
50:50
No, that is not a moonwalk. That is not a moonwalk.
50:53
But again, a straight man has written that as a joke.
50:56
I'm just going to moonwalk. I just that's that was a big
51:00
warm, warm, warm. Still on the wave of feminism.
51:04
Yeah. About this.
51:05
I read an article in Vanity Fair.
51:08
Now I'm laughing as I say that because I don't really know what
51:12
level of journalism Vanity Fair is.
51:14
Is it quite trash bag or is it? No, no, it's not trash.
51:17
Bag. OK, good.
51:18
No, it's just, you know. I'd say it's high end Hollywood
51:22
Goss. Smart people writing about
51:25
stupid things, yeah. It's very that, isn't it?
51:27
Yeah. So I read this article in Vanity
51:30
Fair and they were kind of doing like a retrospective look on it.
51:33
And one of the arguments they have for this is actually it was
51:37
pretty revolutionary in ushering in a new era of Hollywood action
51:41
films. Because basically up until this
51:44
point, there hadn't really been any women LED content in this
51:48
realm. And in the wake of Charlie's
51:50
Angels, we had Angelina Jolie becoming Lara Croft, Uma Furman
51:55
being The Bride, and Kill Bill, Charlie's Angels Full throttle
51:59
with Demi. And then even further down the
52:02
line, we've obviously had Mad Max, we've had Proud Mary,
52:06
Atomic Bond, and then even your bigger superhero blockbusters,
52:10
Wonder Woman, Captain Marvel, etcetera, etcetera.
52:14
And I did think in the journey of Hollywood actually, maybe
52:16
that's a really interesting point, that how capable was this
52:21
at a point when it existed to go further than it did?
52:25
Yeah, yeah, yeah, I, I totally agree.
52:28
It this is like the best that the system could produce at the
52:30
time, the best like representation that the system
52:34
was capable of making at this time in history.
52:37
And I think it is important and I think it is cool to watch a
52:40
female fronted action movie. And I think what we're saying is
52:42
we love all of the action. It's just it got mixed around
52:46
with all of this other stuff. Have you seen the Elizabeth
52:49
Banks directed? I haven't because I think, well,
52:53
I don't know, I feel like a lot of people said that it, it kind
52:56
of was trying too hard to rectify a lot of the changes and
53:01
it kind of lost the essence of what it was about.
53:03
Which it's basically the problem of Hollywood is that everything
53:08
needs to be a known property. But then if you try and take
53:11
something that's got kind of problematic issues baked into
53:14
its core and then you try and modernize it, it's like, well,
53:19
you either lose the the entire essence of the original source
53:23
material, or you just continue to perpetuate the problematic
53:28
aspects of it again and again. And what we're seeing in this
53:31
movie, I think is all the problematic stuff rehashed.
53:34
The male gaze in this movie is crazy.
53:37
And so like we were talking, I was saying about how like it's
53:39
really cathartic to watch these women use their sexuality and
53:42
like treat men like Dum Dums. And like all of the men in this
53:46
movie are kind of stupid. And they're all just like idiots
53:50
around them and they can manipulate them and they're in
53:52
power, they're powerful, they're in control.
53:54
But then there's these shots which have nothing to do with
53:57
that, which are just pure titillation.
53:59
Like that bit where they're coming out of the sea in the
54:02
scuba suits and they're all like unzipping their scuba suits and
54:04
taking them off. You're like, well, who's this
54:06
for? And why would why are they doing
54:08
this? And like, why is the camera
54:09
lingering on them this time? Because it doesn't actually
54:12
serve that idea of them being strong and powerful.
54:14
It's just like to make sure that the men in the in the theatre
54:18
always have a boner. Yeah, totally.
54:20
And this actually links really interestingly to an interview I
54:23
read with the director right where he was saying this is this
54:27
is to quote what he was saying about the experience of working
54:29
on this movie. I'm like this knucklehead from
54:32
Kalamazoo, MI. And I never got any girls
54:35
growing up. So I find myself looking over my
54:37
shoulder and Cameron Diaz is there in a bikini and Drew
54:39
Barrymore is in this little Swiss Miss costume.
54:42
And Lucy Lewis got this leather dominatrix thing.
54:45
It was unbelievable. It's just like, that's a
54:49
director talking about his first feature film, a huge brand
54:55
that's been rebooted, a £90,000,000, a $90,000,000 movie
55:00
and that's and he's talking about his lead actors.
55:03
In that context, it's just fucking gross, isn't it?
55:06
Yeah, yeah. And that stuff is peppered
55:09
throughout the making of as well.
55:11
You've got Bill Murray being like, this movie is just about
55:13
girls having fun, having a blast.
55:15
Like, no it's not. But also because are we meant to
55:18
believe in the final scenes when they're they're in the on the
55:21
beach and they basically end up like frolicking in the waves
55:26
with Bill Murray, are we meant to believe that they're enjoying
55:30
that with him? Because again, I'm like, it's
55:32
just this gross man with them. I'm yeah, I'm not buying it.
55:37
No I'm not buying it either. Also in the making of you've got
55:41
Sam Rockwell being like really hubba hubba about them
55:45
throughout. Again this is your Co worker.
55:47
Like don't go on camera talking about how they're all hot.
55:51
Like G, you've got him asking a random crew member like which
55:54
one of their outfits is your fave?
55:57
Just like, yeah, it's it's gross.
55:58
It's very salacious. I'm, I love, you know, obviously
56:02
like kind of like overly sexual scenes.
56:04
I kind of, I'm into it as a thing, but it was like, and I
56:09
can't quite work out why I didn't enjoy it.
56:11
And I think it's because I know that that stuff was happening
56:14
behind the camera. It's when Drew Barrymore is in
56:18
the car with the police officer and she licks the handle, the
56:24
steering wheel, and there's just something about it that just
56:27
feels, I don't know. I feel like I'm not getting
56:30
power from her doing that. Even though she is like seducing
56:34
this guy. There's something about it that
56:35
just doesn't land for me. And it's weird because the
56:38
colour palette, the way everything is shot is giving me
56:41
David Le Chappelle. It's very like over the top
56:43
Berry camp. But it's also kind of very, a
56:46
lot of like lads mags were styled in that manner and you'd
56:51
get like women in like hyper sexualized police outfits and
56:54
stuff for that shoot. And it's just giving me lads
56:57
mag. I can see that it's very hard to
57:01
separate out, isn't it? And also like, you know, that
57:04
she's a producer and she's doing this because she wants to.
57:08
So, you know, you, you do want to be like, well, you know, she
57:12
found it empowering to do that. Yeah.
57:13
And so. Yeah, totally.
57:14
Yeah, there is that as well, I think.
57:16
I think it's just, it's that thing of like, 'cause you what
57:18
you really want to see behind the scenes in that video is Lucy
57:22
Liu going, God, Drew's so hot there.
57:25
You kind of want them, like, reinforcing it with each other.
57:29
But instead it's like the person behind the cameras are yeah,
57:33
it's just it's icky, isn't it? It's a confusing topic.
57:37
And that's the thing as well, like the three of them have
57:39
recently done reunion interviews and they have nothing but great
57:42
experience of working on this movie.
57:44
And they really loved it. And I think they were just like,
57:46
wow, we looked hot. Wasn't it great that we showed
57:48
off how hot we were? I couldn't, I couldn't do half
57:50
those things now, so you know. It the culture of all of the men
57:56
being leery, it's bad. But if they, you know, if the
58:01
girls actually did feel safe and empowered Despite that or
58:05
because of that, like, you know, I've enjoyed being admired in my
58:10
life. And if you still feel like
58:12
you've got the power, it feels safe.
58:14
So it's complicated. And we just basically, I think
58:18
probably need to take our lead from from them.
58:21
Yeah, and if they're still speaking positively about it.
58:25
But yeah, I think my take away after watching it this time was
58:29
like, this is a movie that should only be allowed to be
58:32
shown to women and gay men. Straight men shouldn't be
58:38
allowed to watch it. And then it's perfect.
58:40
I I like that that stance helps me a lot.
58:43
Whereas I think I was just watching it thinking a lot about
58:45
straight men. And I think that's, that's so
58:48
true because there's so many fun things.
58:51
But yeah, I like this sort of cloud of straight men.
58:55
Just dulled a lot of my viewing experience this last go round.
58:58
Yeah. That's a really interesting
59:00
point, actually. OK, Yeah.
59:03
They can't be trusted with it. I think the other the another
59:06
thing I was sort of thinking about with this film, I was
59:08
like, obviously there's a lot of like very inappropriate, badly
59:12
made films that do well on this podcast.
59:16
I think something that sort of stuck with me a bit was it was
59:19
kind of like a film with this much money, this much great
59:23
talent behind it should have been better than it is.
59:27
It's not like one of these sort of super girls that have no
59:30
budget. And also with those ones, it's
59:33
like, yes, there are these kind of tropes of women shown, but
59:38
you can't tell me that Faye Dunaway as a witch and Supergirl
59:41
is is a straight man's idea or dream or is going to be remotely
59:46
interested in that. Do you know what I mean?
59:48
It's like. I think you're right, but that
59:52
it's often the case with giant budget movies, isn't it?
59:55
When like they're, they just become too big to bail.
59:58
So they there's a lot of safe playing.
1:00:02
You know what I do think you can see in this movie though?
1:00:04
It's like the money being spent. So much of the effects were
1:00:08
practical. They were done, like, for real.
1:00:12
And it's just fun to see a big budget movie spend its budget.
1:00:17
It's like all of this maximalism, and it's all just
1:00:20
for the purpose of fun. And, you know, that the director
1:00:24
was gross and leery, but he was also very quite charming about
1:00:27
how much he was like, you know, just having fun playing with the
1:00:30
toys, which is what I would probably be like if if I was a
1:00:33
director. I'm like, how can we do these
1:00:35
big things? What what can we do?
1:00:36
What can we blow up? How can we make that bigger?
1:00:38
What can we do? Splashy or louder, blah, blah,
1:00:40
blah. They built a cannon on the back
1:00:43
of a flatbed truck to fire a car off that bridge.
1:00:46
OK, OK. Yeah.
1:00:50
That's. Fun, isn't it?
1:00:51
Yeah, it's fun. And that's a real car going off
1:00:53
a real bridge in in Long Beach in California.
1:00:56
Like it's crazy. They blew up those two
1:00:59
buildings. They built big buildings and
1:01:02
blew the fuck out of them. Even like we're going back to
1:01:04
that montage there are they're huge set pieces for like seconds
1:01:08
worth of footage. Yeah, it's cool.
1:01:11
One thing you can say about this movie is that you're never
1:01:13
bored. Yeah, it like you'd never suffer
1:01:16
for boredom because it's a visual feast and you're
1:01:17
constantly like, what's next? This is fun.
1:01:20
What's? Happening and we we spoke about
1:01:21
this as well when we spoke about like Batman Forever, etcetera.
1:01:24
Like, the design elements of the film are brilliant.
1:01:28
They're just gorgeous. Like, yeah, set pieces, the art
1:01:32
direction, all of it. Stella, it's, you know, yeah.
1:01:36
I even think the soundtrack is quite fun.
1:01:38
Oh, I loved the. Yeah, I love that Barracuda
1:01:40
song. I didn't actually know that
1:01:42
song. I thought that was really.
1:01:43
Oh, right, yeah. I think this movie is the reason
1:01:46
I'm, I know Heart. I think it introduced me to
1:01:48
Heart and then I became like a massive Heart fan.
1:01:52
Barracuda. But yeah, the the soundtrack and
1:01:58
the soundtrack for number two were like very formative again.
1:02:02
Yeah, it's just like, it's a bit weird.
1:02:04
It's fun, it's kooky. Although I didn't like the song
1:02:07
turning Japanese when they were dressed as geishas.
1:02:10
Oh, I didn't. I didn't clock that song.
1:02:12
I think I was so like, what am I watching here?
1:02:15
It feels reductive. I'd like to shout out Melissa
1:02:20
McCarthy features in the movie. Yes, important.
1:02:24
Really important. I think it's Melissa McCarthy's
1:02:27
first time on the podcast, so welcome Melissa McCarthy.
1:02:31
I think it might be her first film role too.
1:02:32
Was this her first film role? I think maybe.
1:02:35
I'm really she's really set the president for the rest of her
1:02:38
career by the role she's playing.
1:02:42
Yeah. There's nothing more to say
1:02:43
really. As though it's just Melissa.
1:02:44
You are a big Melissa McCarthy apologist.
1:02:47
I love Melissa McCarthy getting angry and swearing at people.
1:02:50
It it always makes me laugh. And she does it in lots of
1:02:52
films. So yeah.
1:02:54
But she's no Kelly Lynch. Justice for Kelly Lynch
1:02:58
Barracuda. OK, so it's the time has come to
1:03:02
rate this movie on our patented Campo meter.
1:03:04
We need to give it one to 10 Merrells for the quality of the
1:03:07
movie Bon Appetit and one to 10 Eliza's or the Camp Factor.
1:03:13
How many Merrells are we giving this one?
1:03:16
How good is this movie? Now my question here, do the
1:03:20
problematic elements such as cultural appropriation and the
1:03:24
male gaze, does that get subtracted from Merrells or the
1:03:28
Lizas? I can never decide.
1:03:31
It's a very good question and some might say a flaw in our
1:03:34
scoring system. It's a feeling.
1:03:38
Sometimes you have to go with the feeling, with what you would
1:03:40
take it from. Yeah, I think it mostly comes
1:03:42
off Merrill's, unless it ruins the queer joy for you, and then
1:03:44
it also might come off Eliza's. But I personally think this is a
1:03:49
very successful, fun blockbuster movie that is like pulling from
1:03:56
lots of sources and just delivering great, like popcorn
1:04:00
entertainment. And I think the things that I
1:04:02
hate about it are the cultural appropriation bits and I think
1:04:07
some of the ways they deal with women and feminism.
1:04:12
But I think overall it's like a fun, successful movie, and it's
1:04:15
the kind of movie I enjoy watching.
1:04:17
All of that said, I think I'm going to give it like 6
1:04:20
Merrells. Yeah, I think, I think I'm like
1:04:24
a six as well with this. There's a better film with a few
1:04:29
changes, small changes. This film could have been
1:04:31
amazing, like if you just sacked off the love interests for all
1:04:35
of them. Yeah, and we'd spent that time
1:04:37
developing their characters in ways that weren't about men.
1:04:40
Yep. And then maybe had a couple more
1:04:42
fight sequences. Yeah, I think I think we would
1:04:45
have been. And then also obviously dropped
1:04:47
the coach cultural appropriation.
1:04:49
And as we've seen, there were so many other fun setups they could
1:04:52
have been dressed up as. It's not like they ran out of
1:04:54
ideas, which I think is just one of the biggest shames about this
1:04:58
film because you're watching it and you're like, it was so
1:05:00
nearly right, and the stuff that's wrong isn't wrong enough
1:05:04
that it makes the film beneficial.
1:05:05
It just kind of feels like sloppy.
1:05:09
Yeah, I'm going to give it a six as well.
1:05:11
Groundbreaking. So how about Liza's for the camp
1:05:14
factor? No, I'm not going to lie.
1:05:17
It's it's really interesting to me because it again, like I
1:05:19
think sometimes we talk about movies on this and if it's a
1:05:21
communal viewing, it really can enhance the experience.
1:05:25
And I watch this movie by myself and I didn't get a lot of queer
1:05:29
joy from it. And I think that is just because
1:05:32
the male gaze is so prevalent throughout the movie for me.
1:05:37
So it was hard for me to kind of get the joy.
1:05:40
And it's interesting because as as we've spoken about, it's kind
1:05:43
of not necessarily our place to talk about like how empowered
1:05:48
the actors were in this movie or not.
1:05:49
And it's, it sounds like from their recollections, looking
1:05:52
back, they were. So maybe it's not my place to
1:05:55
get so down about that. It's not a classic to me.
1:05:57
It's, I mean, you look at the camper meter, Catwoman isn't a
1:06:01
classic. So I would give it, I think I'm
1:06:04
going to give it a six personally.
1:06:07
Yeah, it's, it's camp. It is camp, but it's not a
1:06:10
classic for me. I think you're right.
1:06:12
What you've just said, like watching it in a group, I think
1:06:15
real moments of queer joy that were really fun and the whole
1:06:18
audience was on board. And then you get kind of these
1:06:20
whiplash scenes. You're like, oh, this is taking
1:06:22
me out of it. This is annoying.
1:06:23
Oh, OK. Oh, yeah.
1:06:24
No, no, we're back. We're back And and you got kind
1:06:26
of get distracted by it. The fun again, But yeah, there
1:06:30
are there were those niggles for sure.
1:06:32
I think also like ultimately this does not have enough
1:06:35
underdog plot vibes to be a real camp classic.
1:06:37
It's too big budget, it's too mainstream, it's too studio.
1:06:40
It's it's it made too much money.
1:06:43
It was too successful. But it is stupid and I do think
1:06:47
it has a big legacy and I think for those reasons I'm probably
1:06:50
around there with you, but I might just nudge it up slightly
1:06:53
to like A7. I I can think that's completely
1:06:55
valid and as I said, I think if I watch this with a group of
1:06:58
people, I might feel differently about it.
1:07:00
A quick question for you though, because I was thinking about
1:07:02
this and I don't have the answer.
1:07:04
Obviously Barbed Wire got 10 Lizas from us and that's a film
1:07:11
that's made with male gaze in a very similar way.
1:07:16
Why do you think that's a camp classic and this isn't?
1:07:20
Oh gosh, I mean how much time have we got?
1:07:23
You're right though, they're actually like very similar.
1:07:26
The bones of the movies are the same.
1:07:28
It's like it's an espionage movie about API who uses her
1:07:33
sexuality to get what she wants. I guess Pammy is a terrible
1:07:37
actress. Yes, yes, and I guess there's
1:07:40
like, even though they were like bad, bad jokes in this that you
1:07:44
can still tell that like experienced people that are good
1:07:47
at their job have worked on this and it maybe the level of barbed
1:07:50
wire and films like that. They're just there's and it's
1:07:52
the same with like I Know Who Killed Me, which was another
1:07:55
perfect store for us is they're just terrible.
1:07:58
But I guess the leads, actors are just plowing on through with
1:08:01
with what they can do. Yeah.
1:08:03
And. Also barbed wire turned up the
1:08:05
sexy also like beyond. Yeah.
1:08:08
So it's like, yes, it's male gaze, but it's so far beyond
1:08:11
that because like, I'm not sure any man would find that hot
1:08:14
either. It's just like.
1:08:16
Yeah, you're right. Like ultimately.
1:08:18
It's drag. It's drag level.
1:08:19
Ultimately, you know Charlie's Angels, you're still going to
1:08:24
get douchebag straight guys probably jacking off to it.
1:08:31
Oh, sorry to sorry to that to be my closing line, but full
1:08:36
throttle, what a movie. Yeah, we'll, we will have to
1:08:40
come back to full Throttle. And you know, I wanted to say is
1:08:42
I looked at the campo meter also 'cause I was trying to figure
1:08:45
out like how I felt about my score before we started
1:08:47
recording. It's in like the same realm with
1:08:50
those scores as like the craft and to Wong Foo.
1:08:54
And that actually does feel kind of right, yeah.
1:08:57
I think that's that's the right kind of it.
1:08:59
I would be genuinely interested to find out what our viewers
1:09:02
think about this one because I feel like it's a really popular
1:09:04
film and it it has sort of lasted the test of time in terms
1:09:08
of people still talk about it and still watch it.
1:09:11
So I would be interested to see if people have like a much
1:09:15
closer affiliation with it and still think it's great and if
1:09:18
we're just being overly sensitive.
1:09:21
Yeah, let us know. And do you want to hear us talk
1:09:23
about Full Throttle? Well, let us know that too.
1:09:26
I in fact think we should just do a Demi Moore season GI Jane
1:09:31
striptease the substance and full.
1:09:33
I've never seen, I've never seen striptease.
1:09:35
I'm not sure I've ever seen GI Jane, so sign me up.
1:09:40
Isn't striptease like sort of a comedy?
1:09:42
No, it's more like a crime thriller.
1:09:46
Oh, OK. She's like an undercover cop
1:09:52
that's a stripper. Yeah, but isn't it like kind of
1:09:54
weirdly supposed to be sort of comic and that doesn't work and.
1:09:57
No, I don't think so. OK, cool.
1:10:01
Well, what do I know? Wagon Wheel Watusi.
1:10:03
Please do consider joining the Gay Tron.
1:10:05
Go give us a rating and we'll be back in two more weeks with
1:10:09
another Camp classic. Bye bye.
1:10:17
Get away from her, you bitch. Classic.
1:10:23
He was in the Amazon cry along when she was researching spiders
1:10:26
right before she died. No, I.
1:10:31
Thought you become a prostitute or go get it.
1:10:36
I used to love doggy chow. I used to love doggy chows too.
1:10:41
Shoes on my feet, I bought it.