Latest / Libido Lounge / What Does a Wife Need to Actually Want Sex? With Caroline Hood (Part 2)

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What Does a Wife Need to Actually Want Sex? With Caroline Hood (Part 2) · Libido Lounge

0:00
So spontaneity is overrated and and I think often like didn't exist at all.
0:04
We called it a date or we called it going out, but but it was scheduled sex.
0:09
If you have to try it all, you're not meant to be.
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That's again to like setting up couples to fail.
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It's play.
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We are animals.
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We're rolling around.
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It's super silly.
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It's super ridiculous.
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It should be fun.
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Flirting is not for the the first time you meet someone.
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Flirting is for the duration of a relationship.
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Actually, I really do have this desire and I want to sleep with my husband.
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I still am a sexual being.
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We get to be sexy throughout our lifespan and through a long term relationship.
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And so
0:46
Hey, everyone.
0:47
Welcome back to another episode of the Libido Lounge.
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I'm your host, doctor Diane, and I'm so excited to welcome back for another week Caroline Hood.
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If you missed our episode last week, I strongly recommend you go back.
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We'll put the link in the show notes for part one of this conversation.
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And we talked a lot in that episode around desire fading in long term relationships and
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what to do about that as well as if this is really even true.
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Right?
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We talked about how a lot of these things that happen are common, and so we accept them as
1:17
normal, but really broke down the myth of accepting that just because it's common and we
1:23
see our friends and family members going through it, it doesn't mean it has to be our
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story too.
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Now today, I wanted to bring Caroline back on so that we could talk more around solutions.
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So we're gonna talk today around solutions for getting your intimacy back, bringing back
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spontaneity, whether it's important to be spontaneous with sex or schedule sex, and
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really look at some of her work on how we solve the problem of this desire mismatch for many
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couples.
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So I did introduce her in the last episode, but just to remind you guys, Caroline Hood is a sex
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and relationship writer, speaker, and consultant.
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She is the author of Sex Begets Sex and writes the newsletter Desire in Real Life where she
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really helps to shape relationships and help people understand how to be more effective in
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their intimate relationships.
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Thank you again for being here with me today.
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Thank you.
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Excited to dig into this part.
2:18
Yeah.
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And let's go right to it.
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So let's start kinda big picture, and we're gonna talk solutions, as I said, but big
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picture.
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Talk to us about like spontaneity spontaneity versus scheduling sex.
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Yeah.
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What, you know, what are your opinions on each of these?
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What's important?
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What really matters?
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So I don't actually think any of the sex we really ever had was spontaneous.
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And I think that that's again this we talked about myths in the first in the first part.
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Right?
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I think that's another myth that we're falling into, which is like, we never have to schedule
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or put any intention towards sex.
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We should just line up, and we should wanna rip each other's clothes off and be done with it.
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But even if we go back to when we were dating or young or single, like, whatever your story
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was, you maybe you got together with girlfriends and had drinks at an apartment and
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went out to a bar and everybody was there at the same time and the music was bumping and the
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drink specials and the lighting.
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All of that was curated.
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Like, you weren't doing that probably on a Monday night.
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You were doing it on a Saturday night when everybody else was there.
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So there were all these rituals and and rhythms that went into your sex life when you were
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single that I think we all perceive in hindsight often as being very spontaneous.
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When in reality, it was very structured.
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You would shower.
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You would think about if you were masturbating before or after.
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You would schedule dates.
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All of that was scheduled.
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We called it a date or we called it going out, but but it was scheduled sex.
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So there's something that happens in long term relationships where couples go, oh gosh, you
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know, we can't schedule sex.
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That's not hot.
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Sex has to be spontaneous.
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And and our sex has really always been scheduled.
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It's always been intentional.
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It's always been curated.
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So there's nothing about doing it in a long term relationship that's worse than having done
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what you did when you were 20.
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It's just like the constraints are different.
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Right?
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The the structures of your life are different.
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So so that's fine.
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We have we get to embrace that, and we get to look at scheduling sex as it also builds
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anticipation.
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You know, I'm somebody and I think a lot of people are we it's fun to look forward to
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something.
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It's not quite as fun to go, oh god.
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Am I ever gonna have this thing happen again?
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I hope that it works out.
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That anticipation is really like, it's really important.
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So spontaneity is overrated and and I think often like didn't exist at all.
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Just tell you, it's it's really fun when I get guests on here that with different opinions
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just from a standpoint of debate, but I find it especially fun when I have people like like
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yourself that like that are using almost the same language that I do when I'm interviewing
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around like even the dating example.
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I've used that so many times and I I couldn't agree more that you know, I think oftentimes we
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are expecting this this whole thing to be different when when we were actually planning
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and anticipating and all of that, you know, the entire time.
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It just I I love when I hear people saying that, like, a similar thing is to me.
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It's like, wow.
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This is it almost validates it because Yes.
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You have come to your the same conclusions from your years of observation that I have, and and
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I just love that so much.
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Yeah.
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Well and I think there's there's really interesting I don't know how much work you do
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around this, but with particularly, like, with the kink community, there's so much planning
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and preparation and conversation and intention around, you know, depending on whatever the
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case may be or the scene or player, however you orchestrate your particular kink.
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And and no one is saying, oh, that's not sexy and hot.
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Usually, the the reverse, which is that it's the most the most pleasurable, the most
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freeing, the most exciting type of sex, and and it's highly curated.
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So so I think the quote, you know, more vanilla relationships and and not disparaging that at
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all.
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You know, you like what you like, but but more vanilla relationships can certainly benefit
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from looking at other other sexual communities and the way they sort of orchestrate and curate
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and build that excitement and anticipation and safety within that.
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Yeah.
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Exactly.
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I draw a lot of my work and I work on monogamous cup with monogamous couples, but I
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draw a lot of the the stuff I teach from polyamorous types of relationships.
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So similar type of stuff.
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It's like, okay, well, you look at what these other types of relationship styles are doing
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effectively.
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And even if like the core of the value system around, you know, say what is hot versus what
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is not is different, the the principles, you know, actually really apply well from Greek
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from group to group just like you're finding with kink.
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Yeah.
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And I think, you know, the heteronormative couples can learn a lot and you take, for
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instance, homosexual couples where penetration is is often not something that's strictly
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solely defined as sex, where in heteronormative structures, it really is.
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And so so, again, just sort of looking at different structures, I think, is such a good
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tool to take back to a monogamous heterosexual couple and say, hey.
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Like, let's learn from these other ways of doing things.
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It doesn't mean you have to have to behave in that way, but there's certainly sort of nuggets
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of wisdom and lessons to be learned.
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Exactly.
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Let's talk about the readiness fallacy.
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So what do you advise when couples are just kinda doing that thing around, we're gonna wait
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for the perfect perfect circumstance and before prioritizing intimacy.
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And, you know, anybody with kids, you know, particularly knows this, but whether or not you
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have kids, whether it's dogs, whether it's your career, whether it's visiting your grandma,
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like, whatever it is, it's so easy to just give at any given day 17,000 different reasons that
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are keeping us too busy to prioritize intimacy.
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So, you know, like like, have you looked into it's like, we'll talk about solutions in a
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second, but I'm also just curious as to have you looked into why this like, where this thing
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comes from, this readiness fallacy?
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Like, why are we programmed that we have to wait for all of these circumstances to just
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spontaneously come together before we start prioritizing this?
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Well, I think there I think it's connected back to that fallacy of spontaneity.
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Right?
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Like the readiness and the spontaneity go hand in hand.
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So if you've if you've bought into this messaging that that two people's individual
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libidos and sexual desires are supposed to just magically align and that if you have pure true
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love that your chemistries will just match.
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And so you don't need to put any effort toward it.
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And I would argue the messaging almost tells us that if you do have to put effort toward it,
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then then it means that your connection is not as good or not as solid.
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So so unlike, I think, other things in our life where we we value putting attention and time
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toward it and and we we think that that's a positive thing.
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I actually think that this sort of societal messaging tells us the reverse, which is that
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if you have to try it all, then you've then you're not, quote, meant to be.
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So that's, I think, that's again to like setting up couples to fail.
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Yeah.
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It's an awful fallacy.
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It's an awful fallacy that is just it is.
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It's setting couples up to fail and and nobody can live up to that ex you know, that
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expectation.
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I just wanna take a quick break to say one of the number one things that leads to a lack or
9:55
just a slowing of passion in the relationship is thinking that our partner's body and mind
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and spirit is going to be the same today as tomorrow.
10:06
So one of the things that happens for so many bodies especially for female bodies is that
10:13
with time, the pleasure needs change.
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And we get into those sexual scripts and those habits of doing the same thing over and over
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and over again, not always realizing that our pleasure body is wanting something else.
10:27
This creates a lack of passion, a desire, a lack of orgasm, and it's one of the reasons why
10:34
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10:37
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11:01
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11:05
Now, let's get back to our episode.
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And I want to talk about now solutions, like what can we do from a standpoint of how we
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prioritize intimacy and how we, you know, work with oftentimes her needing more time than him.
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Mhmm.
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You know, of course, it doesn't always work that way, but a lot of times it does.
11:25
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11:47
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11:51
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It can help men with size, but it also is just helping get that feedback loop going to the
12:25
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12:26
And so one of the things too with women in desire is we bring more blood to that area.
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Well, that's what takes so long to get her warmed up is she has slower acting
12:34
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12:35
It takes longer for blood to get to her juicy bits.
12:38
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12:50
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12:55
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13:02
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But anyways, now back to my original question.
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So what do we do about it?
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What do we do about it?
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Well, once we've taken this sort of moral judgment aside and we've said, okay, great.
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We're gonna focus on this.
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We're gonna pay attention to it.
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I think there's some easy things to do.
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And where couples get trapped is this like, okay.
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Well, we have to go on this ten day all inclusive vacation and we have to get the
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babysitter and we have to do all these things.
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And although that's great and I'm a fan of vacations, intimacy needs to be something
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that's a regular part of life.
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It can't be something that you save for the margins.
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I think that's really, really important.
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So how are you gonna just invest in it regularly?
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And there's some easy things that are free, cheap, ready to go.
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One is one is flirting.
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Like, flirting is not for the the first time you meet someone.
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Flirting is for the duration of a relationship.
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Flirting is for Monday morning, for Tuesday afternoon.
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It's not something that is just like, okay, the ten minutes before I wanna have sex, I'm gonna
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kinda put on the charm.
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Flirting is really easy and it's just I think continuing to show your partner that they are a
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sexual object of your desire and that you are also a sexual being.
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People lose that.
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They and it's understandable.
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Right?
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Like, they lose it in the day to day of all of the logistics as of being an adult.
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And and I understand that.
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But but these taking your own sexual identity and your partner's sexual identity and, like,
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putting it on a shelf until that half hour on Saturday night doesn't lend itself to having
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fun during that half hour on a Saturday night.
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You have to infuse it throughout.
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So I think keep flirting or start flirting.
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Talking about sex outside of the bedroom, talking about it over coffee, over dinner.
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However, in situations in which it's not fraught and and not in the, like, hey.
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We need to have a talk sort of setting.
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But, hey.
15:07
You know, I was I've been reading this romantic scene novel or, you know, have you been
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watching that show?
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Everybody's going wild over these sex scenes.
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Like, what are you thinking about lately?
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Man, we've been having sex for twenty years.
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Is there something you wanna try?
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You know, keeping it adding that levity back in.
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I think there's this piece that couples get to sex after a decade or two or longer where sex
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becomes this this this sort of pressure filled fraud thing.
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And I like to remind people that it's play.
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Like, at its at its base level, we are animals.
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We're rolling around.
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It's super silly.
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It's super ridiculous.
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It should be fun.
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It should be risk taking.
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And let's make sure that we maintain that levity in our dynamic.
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So so flirting, having rituals, prioritizing it, getting off our phones, guess what?
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We actually all have enough time to have sex.
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Like, we we do.
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We really, really do.
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And so if we're finding that we don't have time, that's where I think we have to dig in
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and going, okay.
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Is it that we don't have time or that or that we're putting other things above it?
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And and and if we are putting other things above it, like, why?
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And and is that how we want things to be?
16:21
What do you say, because I think these are great starting tips for people, what do you say
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to the couple that's like, and even if it's just one person in the couple, that says
16:29
something like, well, I don't even know how to flirt.
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Like how does somebody, do you have any advice for a couple around how to start that?
16:37
Yeah.
16:37
It can be really awkward.
16:38
So I'm often a big fan of like naming naming the thing that's going on and saying saying to
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your partner, okay, like we've I love you so much.
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We've built this beautiful life together and I also miss the sexual part of me, and I miss the
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sexual dynamic of us that we used to have.
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And so I'm feeling awkward.
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I wanna start bringing back in more flirting and more fun, and I'm I'm just letting you
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know, like, I'm gonna start trying.
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I don't need I don't know how it's gonna go.
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I've never been good at this, but I'm gonna try.
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And so so one, if you're comfortable enough to just kind of name the the awkward elephant in
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the room, that can lower some tension.
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But then there are things, you know, it's not you don't need to jump straight to like dirty
17:26
talk.
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I think there can be even nonverbal, little touching, grabs of the thigh, a three second
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kiss instead of the one second peck.
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Right?
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So there's there's the actual physical holding hands, anything that bridges some intimacy.
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And then you can say, you know, oh, hey, babe.
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You're looking pretty good today.
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You know, it can just be a compliment.
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It doesn't need to be it doesn't need to be a huge elaborate sort of scene.
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Baby steps.
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Baby steps.
17:59
Yeah.
17:59
It's I think it's really good advice.
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I think sometimes we over complicate simple things as humans in general, we do that and and
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I think it's really good advice to say, hey, it can start with just comp, you know,
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complimenting somebody or just naming what you see or naming what you desire.
18:14
I I wanna wrap up with a final question and then let everybody know how to get a hold of
18:19
you.
18:20
And my question is, in your book, Sex Begets Sex, when you were doing your research and
18:25
putting together everything for that book, what is one thing that you came across that was
18:30
actually surprising to
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you?
18:31
Gosh.
18:34
There's so many surprising things.
18:36
I think I think one of the surprising things that I found is there's a lot of women I've
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spoken with who are in this sort of, like, mid forties, like, children are kinda teenagers or
18:47
out of the out of the toddler diaper phase.
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Where at first conversation, many of them are like, I'm fine.
18:55
I I don't even care.
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I don't even want him to touch me.
18:58
Like, ugh.
18:59
I'm just I'm counting the minutes until he just falls asleep on the couch.
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The conversations can start there, and then it doesn't take more than five minutes or ten
19:10
minutes to go, oh, I thought I thought I was totally done with that part of my life and that
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I was fine, and actually, I'm not.
19:19
And actually, I really do have this desire, and I want to sleep with my husband, and I wanna
19:26
have good sex, or maybe I want maybe I wanna be more adventurous than that.
19:30
So I think there's what's surprising a little bit or or or almost it it confirmed my belief,
19:36
but it was nice to hear.
19:37
And I think surprising for the women I spoke with, which is that they felt like things were
19:41
fine.
19:42
They felt pretty numb.
19:43
They felt like, no big deal.
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And then just peeling back the layers, they went, oh, I still am a sexual being and I
19:51
actually still do care about this.
19:53
I think they were surprised by that.
19:55
Yeah.
19:55
That makes sense and I'm so curious to hear from from people.
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If people, you know, wanna comment on this podcast, I'd love to hear from you all around
20:04
who is thinking about this and thinking about the ideas you as you contemplate what was
20:08
discussed on these past two podcasts, who feels surprised by maybe having desire in a way that
20:14
you didn't even realize was still in there?
20:16
You know, I'd love to hear from you.
20:18
So thank you so much for all of your wisdom.
20:21
Thank you for making this so actionable for all of our listeners.
20:24
I think we have some real good steps that people take.
20:27
I wanna make sure everybody knows about your book.
20:29
Like we've mentioned, Sex Begets Sex, that'll be in the show notes.
20:33
And I know, like we mentioned in the intro, you write this regular newsletter where it's a
20:38
great way for people to continue to learn from you and stay stay in touch with you.
20:43
So just tell us a little bit about all of that, and we'll have all those links in in the show
20:46
notes for everybody.
20:47
Yeah.
20:47
That's great.
20:48
Thank you.
20:48
I'm really active on Substack, and all of that's linked to my website and Instagram and
20:55
that's all desire in real life as you mentioned.
20:57
So if you go at desire in real life, you'll find me, Caroline Hood.
21:02
And I think I'm just kind of constantly trying to pick at these myths, pick at these notions
21:09
that people bring into relationships and go, okay.
21:12
Is that really serving me?
21:13
Is that really serving us as a couple?
21:16
Like, we get to be sexy throughout our lifespan and throughout a long term relationship.
21:22
And so I'm you know, DMs are open, all of that.
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I'm really here just to support and to, know, affirm people and give some guidance.
21:32
So reach out, please.
21:33
And what a great takeaway to end on.
21:36
You get to be sexy.
21:38
So let's end on that everybody.
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Really take that in.
21:41
Really take some time to go and follow Caroline.
21:44
Please make sure you're subscribing so you get our latest content.
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21:59
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