Latest / Found in Interpretation Podcast / Ep. 43 - Judy Jenner (Twin Translations) - How to Manage a Successful Interpreting Agency?

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Ep. 43 - Judy Jenner (Twin Translations) - How to Manage a Successful Interpreting Agency? · Found in Interpretation Podcast

0:00
Hello, hello and welcome to another episode of found in
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Interpretation podcast. Once again, I'm one of your Co
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hosts Animoto when I'm here at Brian.
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Brian, how you doing? I'm doing fantastic.
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Thanks very much. And we're also here with Judy.
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Judy, how are you? I'm good.
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How are you? Good morning.
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Good morning. Good morning.
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It's a much earlier for you, I think, right?
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You're in Las Vegas if I'm not mistaken.
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I am in Washington state right now so they are still wasting
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time but much closer to Canada. Perfect.
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Alright, so don't forget everyone like share, subscribe.
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Very important. Now let's kick it.
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All right, so we're here with Judy, and Judy runs Twin
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Translations, A boutique translation and interpreting
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business with her twin sister Dagmar.
1:02
Is that right? That's correct.
1:04
You got it. OK, so how do I know which one
1:07
I'm talking to? Well, it's just Judy on the
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screen, so that's an easy giveaway.
1:12
Well, I Oh yeah, yeah, right. You wrote it, but.
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But for some people, it's hard. Some people cannot tell us
1:19
apart. Others know exactly who we are.
1:22
You go to into assignments and you dress the same.
1:25
You know, we, we share the booth quite a bit, which I love that
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she's obviously my favorite booth partner.
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We don't dress the same. Sometimes we'll wear like a
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similar top or sometimes, yeah, we don't.
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I think after certain age it's that it's cute, but not as cute
1:41
as it used to be when we're like 10, you know?
1:45
I guess everything is cuter when we're 10.
1:47
Aren't you right about that? Yeah.
1:51
So I guess you guys don't finish each other's sentences, you
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finish each other's interpretation.
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Actually, you know, she is the ideal booth partner.
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We just have so much life experience, so much connection.
2:02
And, you know, I feel like I work really well with many of my
2:05
lovely booth partners, including the one I'm working with here in
2:08
Washington now. But with Daggy, I call her
2:11
Daggy. It's a, it's obviously a
2:13
different level. It seems sort of uncanny
2:15
sometimes where we exchange terminology, we write down notes
2:19
in the booth, but we don't really have to because we sort
2:22
of know where we'll get stuck. It's pretty.
2:25
It's pretty unique to have a twin.
2:27
So how did you guys start in interpretation?
2:31
Who did you? Did one of you discovered it and
2:34
then the other one join? Or were both of you interested
2:37
in languages? What's the background story
2:39
here? Good question.
2:40
You know, we do have an origin story which dates back to our
2:45
childhood in Mexico City where we grew up.
2:47
And I remember just we're in the school bus going back from
2:51
school before summer vacation one year.
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And I think you must have been middle school and we said when
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we grew up, we're going to something with languages and
3:00
it's going to be called gender and gender cross cultural
3:03
consulting. Of course, at this point we're
3:06
like 11 or 12. And we had like absolutely no
3:08
idea what any of that meant. It's just.
3:11
It was actually quite cute. Actually cute.
3:13
We're very proud of it, and it's very personal.
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Yeah, yeah, we, we do excel at the languages and the
3:19
humanities, even though we went to a mathematical technical
3:23
school. But without all this is
3:24
something we should do. And lo and behold, we did start
3:28
the translation side of the business much, much earlier than
3:32
the interpreting side. And we, my sister studied
3:36
translation, I studied business. And we thought we'd need some of
3:39
those skills that we can combine.
3:41
And that worked super well. And at some point we thought,
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well, you know, interpreting seems sort of like a magical
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thing that we're both interested in.
3:49
So pretty much at the same time on different sides of the world,
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because I'm in Vegas, she's in Vietnam, Austria.
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We decided to get some training and some credentials and he went
3:59
back and then both the masters degree and undergrad and
4:03
interpreting and translation. I also went back and got a
4:06
masters degree in conference interpreting and became court
4:09
certified and did a a lot of exploration and a lot of
4:13
discovery process and interpreting.
4:16
It seems sort of impossible, the beginning to go from translation
4:20
to adding a very different skill set.
4:23
But just like my dear friend Corinne McKay, Well, I know has
4:26
been a guest on your podcast. It's it's doable and it was a
4:29
cool journey and now we're do both.
4:32
That's awesome. And so where is your company
4:35
based out of? Because you're in Vegas, She's
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in Austria, you said. Exactly.
4:40
She's in Vietnam, Austria. So OK, big companies called twin
4:44
translations. She takes care of the European
4:47
side of the business. I take care of the American side
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of the business. And on the on the back end, we
4:53
had to split it just for the next purposes, right.
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So we, we technically have two different companies, the two
5:00
different tax bases because many, many years ago our
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accountants and CPA said what having two subsidiaries of the
5:08
same company is going to be very difficult for, for tax purposes.
5:12
So for accounting purposes 2 separate companies, but the the
5:16
public facing companies twin translations to make sure
5:19
everybody remembers the twins. Yeah.
5:23
So you had to. So it's two companies just.
5:25
Right. Of course it's just for tax
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purposes, but it would have been too complicated to have like 1
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company and two different branches.
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That's what our CPA said, you know, this is not my area of
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expertise. So they said it's just much
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easier for another, some tax treaties of course between
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Australia and the US, but they said make it easier on yourself.
5:48
That's going to save you a lot of time and headache if you if
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you split it. And we've talked about that.
5:52
A lot of the interpreter circles were friends and colleagues have
5:56
businesses with others in different countries, and it's a
5:58
lot more difficult than it than it seems.
6:00
Transnational tax law apparently is a complicated issue.
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Not that I know much about it, but I think there was good
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advice from our CPA's back then. And how much how much travel are
6:11
you doing for conferences? And it depends, you know, and
6:16
sometimes I'd say more than I'd like and sometimes not enough.
6:19
But you know, it's, it's like that always and every
6:21
professional, right. Yeah.
6:22
Like I'm traveling too much. I'm not traveling enough.
6:25
So right now I'm in assignment in Washington and I'm going
6:29
straight from here to another assignment in Oregon.
6:32
But that's for court. So it's, it's a mix between
6:35
court and, and conference. And I, I, I love both, you know,
6:39
I think court is sort of the, the stomping grounds and the
6:43
sort of bread and butter for a lot of interpreters on the, on
6:47
the West Coast and here in the US.
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And the conference interpreting is something I really, really
6:52
enjoy, but obviously requires a lot more preparation.
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And it's sort of a different ball game in terms of how the
7:00
payments are structured, right? Because if you think about it or
7:04
court, oftentimes after you have a lot of experience, it requires
7:08
minimal preparation. Profit margins are actually
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quite a bit higher. So I'm, I'm very picky with some
7:16
of the conference work that I take because I want to make sure
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that at the end of the day, what I'm netting and what I'm
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averaging is comparable to to other assignments because this
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certainly is more glamorous than in court.
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But ultimately I'm running a business and I want to make sure
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that I'm getting the net that I want.
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And you have to just divide it differently if you look at how
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much time you're spending on conference prep.
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Well, I'm a bit surprised that if I understand you correctly,
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you're saying that even for court you can go from state to
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state because I imagine court interpretation, which I don't
7:50
do. I imagine it to be very local,
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for instance. So there's a courthouse here in
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Quebec City where I am. I thought I would get to, let's
7:59
say, if I had. If I wanted to, I could just
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work there rather than be sent in Montreal or other cities
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nearby. Yeah, super good question on
8:06
Yeah, it's here in the US we have something that's called a
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federal certification for court interpreters.
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So every state has their own certification.
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And then there's something that's the highest level of
8:17
court, which is federal, which currently only exists for the
8:20
Spanish language, which I'm lucky enough to have, though
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with that, that that certification, you are allowed
8:28
to work in the federal courts, which of course operate
8:30
nationwide. And the federal courts have a
8:33
very big need for federally certified interpreters, which
8:36
there are relatively few of us. So we can fly around and go
8:41
wherever they're calling us, you know, from New York to Texas to
8:45
Florida. Wow, that is so cool.
8:47
And when you're guests that your rates are higher when you're
8:52
federally certified and the cases you work with are not like
8:56
regular cases, there must be a bit more technical or something
9:01
like that or it is just about the certification.
9:03
It's just a different jurisdictional issue, right?
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The federal government has jurisdiction over certain cases
9:08
that the state courts do not. And I'm not, I'm not the lawyer,
9:12
I'm just married to one. But that the federal level,
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you'll see more cases that have to do with that trans state
9:20
issues, for example, drug smuggling, kidnapping of a lot
9:24
of the big drug cases can be indicted in both state and
9:27
federal courts. And then American legal system
9:30
is complicated. But usually the, the, the
9:33
federal, the, the feds will indict cases that they want to
9:37
take to sort of a higher, bigger, bigger stage, so to say.
9:41
We so we don't have those petty cases that you see at the state
9:44
level, which is like, you know, Jay walking and traffic tickets,
9:48
although we do have some traffic tickets inside of national
9:52
parks. So the national parks belong to
9:54
the federal government. So if the Germans, sorry,
9:57
sometimes the Germans come here this summer to Yellowstone and
10:00
they're speeding and they get a speeding ticket inside National
10:03
Park, you're going to federal courts.
10:05
Just a friendly reminder to everybody, you don't want to
10:09
mess in the around in the national parks.
10:12
Wow. But yeah, mostly it's higher
10:13
profile, bigger drug cases, but not always.
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So we'll never see you on like Judge Judy or?
10:18
Something no? How about I like their name.
10:22
Oh well, yes, Judge Judy and interpreter Judy.
10:25
Combining both worlds. There you go, right?
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So, so when you're crossing a national, so just to make sure,
10:32
just when you're crossing a National Park in the US, you're
10:35
in, in federal land. That's right.
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I can say that way. And if you get arrested, I mean,
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if you, you know, you speed, you're, you're like, you're
10:44
speeding or. Something.
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Then it's not a federal ticket, right?
10:48
It's a state ticket. Or no, it's, it's federal.
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You gonna you gonna be seeing me the federal court?
10:53
Well, you, not you personally, but yes.
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That's her translator that's interpreted.
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I'm sorry. I want my interpreter.
10:59
I want. The best vanish interpreter.
11:02
I would. Hire her for French.
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That's right. You don't want me for French.
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You'll be in big trouble. Yes.
11:08
So yeah, it sounds weird. A lot of people don't know that
11:11
that that these are that's federal land.
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So it's all goes directly to federal court.
11:16
So except, for example, if you are on Lake Mead outside of
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Vegas, which is all the water comes from, by the way, for
11:24
millions and millions of people. Yeah, We just rented a party
11:27
boat there a couple of weeks ago.
11:29
It's an incredible amount of fun.
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And if you got caught speeding with this boat or drinking with
11:35
this boat, you are going to be going to federal court.
11:38
Yeah. Because it's not, it's it's
11:40
inside the state of Nevada, but it's someone in a federal area.
11:44
There's federal lands called national parks and national
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conservation areas. That's all federal, right.
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But usually what we do, we do some of these funny cases they
11:53
called the petty calendar and federal courts.
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And oftentimes that involves things like illegal bonfire
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building and, yes, speeding on Lake Mead, things like that.
12:06
But most of the cases are drug related cases, immigration
12:12
cases, which is a complicated issue because immigration is
12:14
technically an administrative issue.
12:17
But it, these cases go to Federal Court for the criminal
12:20
portion because it is, it is a criminal offence to be in this
12:24
country. Well, they, they, they, they say
12:27
illegally, but I think undocumented is them the correct
12:30
term which should be using. So then there's a federal
12:32
proceeding that happens mostly in border states.
12:36
So there's some interesting work.
12:38
Also heartbreaking work, though some of the criminal work I
12:43
really have to balance with civil cases and also with
12:47
conference interpreting work. So yeah, you got everything
12:50
between like drug drug cases and like skinny dipping and Lake
12:54
Mead like. Anything you have never seen?
12:57
Skinny thief thing? I'm still waiting for that.
12:59
But yes, most of it is some sort of drug related cases, but
13:03
they're not all big trials. I think if you're not a court
13:06
interpreter, you oftentimes think that you do these big, big
13:09
trials all the time. But we do have a few trials a
13:13
year at the federal level that I self select into.
13:16
Most of them are initial appearances, quick hearing,
13:19
status checks, maybe a change of plea where people plead guilty
13:22
to certain charges. And they're, they're pretty
13:24
standard. They're very predictable, right?
13:27
They're they're technical, but they're, they're repetitive.
13:30
But most these days, it's a lot of drug cases, yes.
13:33
At the federal level, a few months ago, I think that the
13:38
Trump administration said that English is now the official
13:42
language in the US. Has that changed anything?
13:45
And not yet far, not yet. We're waiting for that to play
13:48
out. I have the pleasure of
13:50
volunteering my time as one of the spokespersons of the ATA.
13:54
And just for the for, for the sake of our listeners or
13:57
viewers, can you explain what it is first like for this official
14:02
language? And so there is a, there was an
14:05
executive order they came through that says that English
14:08
is now now going to be the official language of the US
14:11
because it turns out that the US did not formally have an actual
14:15
official language designation, which was neither here or there.
14:18
But the reality is that Spanish is very wide, very, very widely
14:22
spoken in the US. But as opposed to Canada, we
14:25
didn't have any sort of official designation of one language or
14:28
two languages, which I think would probably make more sense,
14:31
but they're not asking us. So we're just waiting for this
14:34
to play out. Like what does that actually
14:36
mean? This is executive order have any
14:39
sort of power over the judiciary and.
14:41
As I just. Show it has a non lawyer, I
14:43
would say no, that's a different branch of government, right?
14:45
But can it affect sort of things that the executive branch does
14:50
like deciding to have the the website for the White House only
14:54
in English as opposed to Spanish?
14:56
I suppose so, right? But this is a we are living in
14:59
very difficult times here in the US, and language access, I
15:03
suppose, will be affected one way or another.
15:07
I hope not. I really don't see how the
15:10
executive order can affect the judiciary.
15:13
So I think the courts are safe, I would say, without having your
15:17
crystal ball. So, OK, just just so I put it in
15:20
order in my mind. So there's the federal
15:22
government and there's the executive branch, but the
15:25
judiciary is another branch. So although it's a federal court
15:29
and a federal offence is not the executive level, that can change
15:34
what happens in the judiciary. As far as I understand that, you
15:38
know, this has never really been litigated before.
15:40
It hasn't really come up, you know, but technically that
15:43
that's we're supposed to have checks and balances, quite
15:46
different branches of government mean that we have certain
15:48
division that we can't all just throw it in 1 LB.
15:52
They get, I'm no expert on all these things and I think it's
15:55
also new to everybody, but technically the judiciary is an
15:59
independent branch of government, right?
16:01
That's the whole idea that the courts are independent and they
16:04
are not under the executive branch.
16:07
So it's a due process issue mostly, right?
16:09
I mean, they do have, as a defendant, a due process right
16:13
to participate in your own defence.
16:15
And if you don't speak the language, that is of course a
16:18
violation of your due process rights.
16:21
There's going to be some litigation on this for sure.
16:25
I haven't seen it affect any of our work yet.
16:30
And I certainly hope that it ever, you know, I wish I had a
16:33
crystal ball and I wish the answer to that were no.
16:36
But we, we don't know. I, if I live in Vegas, but I'm
16:43
not a betting lady. I don't, I don't gamble.
16:47
Let's just hope for the best, you know, and I've been asked in
16:50
my function as a spokesperson for the ATA, for the American
16:53
Translators Association where this is going.
16:56
And I, I wish I had an answer. But it certainly is
16:59
unprecedented to hear something like that.
17:01
Because whether we like it or not, the US is a highly, highly
17:06
multilingual country. And there's 10s of millions of
17:09
people who speak a language other than English as their
17:13
first language. And should those folks have
17:16
access to services, to the judiciary, to government, to
17:20
medical services? You know what my answer is on a
17:23
both a human level and an interpreter level, absolutely
17:27
they should. They're not asking us, but we
17:29
certainly are going to keep on pushing back on the
17:32
organizational level, ATA NAGET, which is the National
17:36
Association of Judiciary Interpreters and Translators,
17:39
and also on the on the personal level, right with these services
17:43
are important. Absolutely.
17:45
And I'm just wondering for the ATA, you said that you're a
17:48
spokesperson. Does that mean that you have to
17:50
go a lobby at the White House or what does that mean?
17:52
No, it doesn't mean lobbying. We don't have a we do have a
17:56
doctor, Phil Rivers, and I'm sure you're familiar with,
17:59
there's a lot of advocacy work for ATA and for other groups.
18:02
So basically, I respond to the media when I'm a group of
18:08
trained media, trained translators and interpreters at
18:12
the ATA who respond to media inquiries.
18:15
And, you know, oftentimes, as you know, interpreting and
18:17
translation is only in the media when something really bad
18:21
happens. So we also take it as some of
18:26
the educational opportunity to tell the public about
18:29
interpreting, about translation. I've done some interviews on
18:32
CNN, on national public radios and major newspapers.
18:36
So it's. Yeah.
18:39
It's ASL part of it or no? You know, we ASL unfortunately
18:43
is very separate from from spoken languages here in the US.
18:48
They have their own associations and I don't have much contact
18:51
with ASL, which is I think quite unfortunate, right?
18:54
But they have developed a little bit differently.
18:56
They're they're under the Americans with Disabilities Act.
18:59
So ASL is something that has to be provided.
19:02
So without any sort of question because of fall under ADA,
19:05
Americans with Disabilities. But I wish we had a little bit
19:08
more more contact with ASL. Actually, at this conference
19:12
last year when I was here, we had an ASL interpreter and it
19:15
was kind of nice to spend some time with somebody from sign
19:18
languages. Yeah, absolutely.
19:20
We, I think it's kind of similar in Canada to the sign language,
19:24
American Sign Language or Quebec sign Language.
19:26
It's it's separate from OTAC for Quebec or ATIO for Ontario or
19:31
they have their own association as well.
19:33
Now. I remember the first time I
19:34
tried to hire you, I thought you French was your combination.
19:40
I remember that, Brian. That was funny.
19:42
But yeah, yeah, sign me up. I'm like, OK, great.
19:44
It's French. It's like I don't speak French.
19:46
I'm. Like hold on, how so?
19:50
You wanted to hire here in the United States.
19:52
Yeah, and. What made you think that she her
19:56
French actually was her first language?
19:58
It was just an assumption I think, because Corinne had
20:00
introduced us and Corinne is English French, so um, yeah.
20:05
So I thought you were English, French as well.
20:07
How these rumors get started? There you go.
20:11
To work with you on that assignment sounded really
20:13
interesting, but I know twins sister does have French in her
20:17
combination, but unfortunately that's one of the differences
20:19
between the twins and that she has French and I don't.
20:23
Is she? Interested in in French too.
20:25
She does do French to to German and into the other languages,
20:28
not into French but from French. So passive.
20:31
So you've got German and Spanish as an English obviously as your
20:37
language combinations. Yeah, I do, because I have a
20:40
relatively, I don't know how unique my background is, but we
20:44
were born in Austria to Austrian and Austrian German parents, and
20:48
my dad took a job in Mexico City when we're in elementary school.
20:53
So we packed up and moved to Mexico City in the 80s and you
20:58
know, I, I give my mom also a lot of credit for making this
21:00
happen because this, I don't know if you're old enough to
21:03
remember this, but this is the before times, as in before the
21:07
Internet and. We're we're the last generation
21:11
to remember that. OK, good.
21:13
So we're in the same boat here. And it was it was quite an
21:16
adventure. And I consider myself incredibly
21:18
privileged who have had that opportunity to grow up in a
21:22
different country and to go to a German school in Mexico.
21:26
But to have this total Mexican immersion in a country that I
21:30
feel very, very close to and that that magical world that I
21:34
grew up in doesn't really exist anymore and is that Mexico is,
21:38
is not the reality now, but it's still a place I go to back to
21:44
frequently. And then and remember with much
21:47
nostalgia, it's, it was a, it was a great way to grow up and
21:50
I'm very grateful. Yeah, my my grandmother was born
21:53
in in Silao in Mexico and and they lived in Mexico City for
21:58
many years. My mom was raised there so.
22:01
That's amazing. Good for you.
22:04
Mexico City has a close place in my heart too, so.
22:07
Good. It's a very special place.
22:09
It's so big that you can't even process how big it is.
22:13
You know, when when I was a kid, there's of course a very small
22:17
part of the city that's really your stomping grounds.
22:19
That's the there's so many parts of the city that you haven't
22:22
even been to ever because it's even when I was a kid, it was in
22:25
the 20 million range. You know, there's very little
22:30
accurate data. I'm gonna go out in the limo
22:33
saying and the actual population, right?
22:35
I remember is there for the census of 1990 and I remember
22:39
they're giving us information at school about how they're going
22:42
to count people in it. It seems a big challenge
22:46
considering that some of these outlying areas and of course
22:49
more poor areas don't have addresses and it's it's a
22:53
challenge, right. So we we know that it's one of
22:56
the largest cities in the world, but I think the actual
22:59
population is a not exactly quite easy to to to nail down.
23:05
Point. So at home you spoke German and
23:09
outside, let's say at school, I mean outside with little like
23:12
other kids outside, you were speaking Spanish.
23:15
Well, how? How did that work?
23:16
Like, yeah, I was actually trying to think back at how that
23:19
exactly that went. And I I asked my dad a little
23:22
bit about it too, and my sister and I do.
23:24
Remember question for the podcast?
23:26
No, no, I just recently I was thinking how, how was it?
23:29
Because I know that my friends from the German school in Mexico
23:32
City, we all had these multilingual backgrounds.
23:35
Some of them had one German father, a German father, Mexican
23:39
mother or children of diplomats or their father was working for
23:42
Volkswagen. And you know, this is back when
23:45
not too many women expats really were traveling the world.
23:48
It was mostly from the father side.
23:50
And we did have these funny mixtures of German and Spanish
23:55
that we spoke in the German school.
23:57
But at home, I do remember that my parents seemed pretty keen on
24:01
keeping the German language alive.
24:04
But just like all children are either immigrants or expats, we
24:08
just thought that German was not very cool, that we were in
24:13
Mexico. And we adapted very quickly and
24:16
we just looked to Mexico with a whole, with whole heart.
24:21
Is that what I remember very frequently as my mom would say
24:24
something in German, it would answer in Spanish?
24:27
Oh, did she accept that or did she?
24:29
Did she say? I think she just went with it.
24:35
I remember she just sort of went with it.
24:37
But it it was good advice that they sent us to the German
24:41
school, which we had no interest in going to zero.
24:45
We wanted to go to the American school, which we heard was
24:48
significantly easier. And turns out that's certainly
24:51
true. The words are shorter.
24:54
Much shorter and there we heard there was more partying there
24:57
too. So that's what we heard in high
24:58
school. So we thought that sounds much
25:00
better, but our parents said no. At some point we will move back
25:03
to Austria, which is exactly what did happen.
25:05
Well, I said if you want to be able to have credit for all
25:08
these years of schooling, you need to attend this German
25:11
school. So it's much reluctance.
25:15
We attended the German school and you know, outside of school
25:19
and home, our lives are really completely Spanish dominated.
25:22
Really. We didn't hang out with too many
25:24
German speakers at the Tennis Club or and my circle of friends
25:29
there really wasn't anybody outside of school who spoke
25:32
German. So German sort of took, yeah, I
25:35
guess, second place in my life for a long time.
25:38
So I wasn't as close to the German language as I I was, of
25:42
course, when I was a young kid. And then you move back to
25:45
Austria and that's where or your German got a lot better
25:51
afterwards because you were using it in your daily life.
25:55
Right. I mean, you know, it was my
25:57
German was fine, but you're there.
25:59
It's funny how you terminology, you're just not on this on top
26:03
of it anymore, right, when you're kind of far away from it
26:05
for for a long time. So yeah, we moved back and I
26:08
think he was either it was junior year of high school,
26:10
which isn't a good time to move. If you ever have children in
26:14
your life, don't move women in the.
26:16
Around 15 years old. I think it was that 17 or
26:19
something. So it's not, not, not a good
26:21
time to, to move to different continent.
26:24
And, but I was there. I was only in Austria very
26:26
briefly for about a year because then I came to the college here
26:30
in the US, which is some kind of a brief transition.
26:34
Then the German is a language I didn't spend as much time with
26:38
as a, as a child and as a young adult, but now as an actual
26:42
older adult, I'm sort of rediscovering the, the pleasures
26:46
of, of German. And actually at this conference,
26:48
I'm actually doing, doing German, which is really nice.
26:51
I'm doing in English, German, German both.
26:54
Cool, so English is your third language I guess like if you
26:58
were to. In, in in order of acquisition.
27:01
Yeah. But, you know, if I do the math,
27:03
I have actually lived in the US longer than I've lived anywhere
27:07
else, which is kind of a scary statistic.
27:11
And also when you start adding the years, turns out the numbers
27:14
getting much bigger than I would expect, you know?
27:17
I know. Yeah.
27:18
Every. Year, every year, it turns out
27:20
it's a good thing, right? So yeah, I've been here since in
27:24
the US since 1995. This is my 30th year which seems
27:28
so crazy. Yeah, but your, your story about
27:33
languages are reminds me of a little bit of my own in one way.
27:38
My mother always spoke Spanish to me since since I'm a child,
27:41
because my mother's from Salvador.
27:43
I grew up here in Quebec City and I, I went to school here in
27:47
Quebec and my family on my mother's side all live in the
27:50
States and all my cousins, I've got roughly 20 cousins in, in
27:56
the United States are all around the New York, New Jersey, Long
27:59
Island area. And so when I was a kid, I, if I
28:04
had to go to my grandmother's place, I would speak Spanish at,
28:06
and my, my grandmother with other kids in English with my
28:10
cousins, sometimes in Spanish, some, some others in English.
28:12
And then in Quebec, I would speak French.
28:14
But my Spanish was sort of an everyday Spanish and I didn't
28:19
sound like I was having much of an accent or something.
28:22
I was pretty fluent. But then I went to Barcelona to
28:27
study conference interpretation and when I'm because it was an
28:31
exchange program with my university here in Quebec City.
28:34
And when I got to Barcelona, of course it's Catalan.
28:37
But my course I took, I picked up the courses in Spanish and
28:41
suddenly I was hearing some words for the first time that
28:45
are pretty common. But since these are not words
28:48
that I would use every day with my mother or other family
28:50
members, I had to learn them. For instance, I heard the word
28:54
that I still remember the first time I heard the word Sakia,
28:57
which is a drought. And I was like, I had never, you
29:00
know, I've never spoken with my mom about a drought about
29:02
anything, right. So it's not a word that I would
29:04
use So suddenly in the interpretation in the conference
29:08
I hear and they were talking about a traffic and I was like,
29:10
Sakia, Sakia. What, what is that?
29:11
Then I just typed and I saw it was a drought.
29:14
So OK, I do I, I do the interpretation.
29:16
So I figured that since my, my Spanish was not in, I would say
29:21
an educated Spanish. It was more like a colloquial
29:24
Spanish with family members and everything.
29:27
Although I may sound fluent, being educated in a language is
29:31
very different than just learning it naturally.
29:33
So did you have that barrier with German where you had to
29:37
relearn your own language in in a certain way?
29:40
Because you were not as of I would say you, you didn't have
29:45
all the terminology that a native speaker who grew up in a
29:48
country would have. Super interesting.
29:50
I love hearing about your story, Elon.
29:52
That's super interesting. Yeah, I mean that we talked
29:55
about that a lot, right, like for what we call heritage
29:57
speakers of a certain language, right, on how you're vocabulary
30:01
tends to be more limited because you just didn't have the formal
30:03
education. I think the Super interesting
30:06
topic, right? It really shows you sort of the
30:08
limits of the language that you speak in and on every day and
30:11
how much more limited your profitability is if you didn't
30:14
have formal education. So we moved to Mexico.
30:17
It was still elementary school under the Mexican system, but I
30:20
was either 9 or 10. So I did have a very, very solid
30:23
base of German as a child. And of course the German school
30:27
felt very strongly about holding back classes in both German and
30:31
in Spanish. So there was no, there was no
30:35
escaping the German there. But the interesting thing is I
30:39
there's, there are a few years early in my interpreting career
30:42
where I felt that of course I speak it at a native language,
30:45
but I felt like, should I really be going into German?
30:49
And this is something that I think we don't talking about
30:52
often enough in our in our profession because we're all
30:55
sort of strive for perfection and maybe we don't want to sort
30:58
of admit some of the shortcomings.
31:00
But I think these are important conversations to have, right.
31:03
I remember there's one event in Vegas that came up that was
31:05
English into German and is one of my, you know, the political
31:10
figures are really admire Bill Clinton was coming.
31:12
And I thought, oh, you have the chance to interpret Bill
31:14
Clinton. But I took it really hard.
31:16
Look at myself and I thought I, I don't know if I'm ready to
31:19
interpret Bill Clinton into German and I turned it down and
31:23
turns out I think it was a bad decision.
31:25
I think you probably would have been ready to do Bill Clinton in
31:29
German. But I think it's always good to
31:31
air on the side of caution. But as I've gotten older, I've
31:34
also understood that of course, I do have that capability.
31:38
Do I? Is my life more English
31:40
dominated now than German dominated?
31:42
Of course. But I also spend at least a
31:44
couple of months in a year in Vienna and I'm sort of
31:48
rediscovering some of those that higher level language, right,
31:52
when you're surrounded by more educated people.
31:54
And also in the booth when I have the chance to work in
31:56
Europe and to German, I'm always learning from the other German
32:01
interpreters, like, oh, this is a nice turn of phrase.
32:03
Like I wouldn't have thought about it that way.
32:05
And you're always adding to her your vocabulary.
32:08
So yeah, I didn't run into that issue of that I didn't have sort
32:11
of the higher level German because I did have formal
32:13
education and middle school, elementary school, high school
32:17
in German. Even I didn't didn't like it
32:20
that even I had eight years of chemistry in German, right.
32:23
So I had some which actually really helped me yesterday here
32:26
at this conference where I was interpreting in a laboratory for
32:30
a distillation process. And my interpreting partners,
32:33
like can you do this part because of your German chemistry
32:36
background? I said yeah, I got you.
32:40
That's pretty incredible. That's fun.
32:42
That's fun. Um, while back, just to change
32:46
the subject a a bit, we were, I was checking out LinkedIn and
32:50
Jonathan Downey, who's been on her podcast a couple of times.
32:53
He mentioned he gave like some props to a bunch of people,
32:56
including yourself. What was he?
32:58
I mean, he only said like, kudos to Judy Jenner and her research.
33:02
Like could you expand on on what he was talking about?
33:06
Oh, Jonathan is such a great guy.
33:07
This is a great nation to to our profession.
33:10
I love him. He was talking about the book
33:13
that my sister and I wrote many years ago about the
33:16
entrepreneurial side of translation.
33:19
Back then we focused on translation.
33:20
It's called The Entrepreneurial Linguist, the Business School
33:24
approach to freelance translation, which in hindsight,
33:27
was a bit too long of a title. From your German background you
33:34
like long words. Longer compound long.
33:37
And it was a book that came out in 2010, and we wrote it pretty
33:41
early on when we thought, well, a lot of translators are
33:45
incredible at the language side. They're excellent at the
33:48
humanities. But I had come out of Business
33:50
School and I approached our our translation business back then
33:55
really from an entrepreneurial sort of business perspective,
33:58
like how can we grow this? How can we make as much money as
34:01
possible? Because presumably that's what
34:03
we're all here for, to to make a good living and not just to play
34:06
with language without any sort of good living.
34:10
So we wrote this book just really as a call to action for
34:13
our colleagues and say, hey, look, we gotta stop it with this
34:16
poverty cult and stop it that, oh, I don't like to talk about
34:19
money and money is not comfortable.
34:21
Yeah, I hear you. No, but I, I I read another book
34:25
for you what the title was, but yeah, it gave the same example
34:28
with the plumber. Like, you could be the best
34:30
plumber in the world, but if you don't know anything about
34:32
business, once you go and try to start your own company, you may
34:35
fail and do worse than that, actually just doing the
34:38
plumbing. And I think that's a big trap
34:40
for a lot of entrepreneurs. Like, say, for example, famous
34:43
chefs who try to go out on their own and they're they're the best
34:47
chefs in the world, but they don't know anything about
34:49
business necessarily. So their business fails or
34:51
restaurant fails, They have to go back and become a chef
34:54
somewhere else. Yeah, it's, it's that's such an
34:56
important aspect for any freelancer in any profession.
34:59
I find it. So I think that that book does
35:01
resonate more than just our industry, but to all freelancers
35:05
and anyone wants to be an entrepreneur.
35:08
Absolutely, because working for yourself sounds really great
35:10
until you really get into the weeds and figure out that now
35:13
you're responsible for everything and you need to
35:15
charge accordingly. And I think we've theorized
35:18
about this for 20 years because we've been speaking at
35:21
conferences about entrepreneurship and about how
35:24
to run your own business for many, many years.
35:25
But the issues really haven't changed.
35:27
We're we're a female dominated industry and without getting
35:31
into too many stereotypes, it's funny.
35:33
I'm talking to two males here. You know, that's, that is funny,
35:36
but, you know, amazing interpreters, but, you know, not
35:39
representative of the overall sort of a gender breakdown.
35:43
So I think as women were just generally not as good
35:46
negotiating, we're not as good as standing up and asking for
35:49
what we want. And that, I think, has really
35:51
sort of trickled down to what oftentimes called the poverty
35:55
cold, right? That you're like, oh, I don't
35:57
wanna ask for this. I don't think I'm worth it.
35:59
And there's a lot of imposter syndrome, a lot of insecurity,
36:02
which, you know, we all have, right?
36:04
But you have to ask for what you want.
36:06
And you have to to run this business in a way that you can
36:09
make a profit because otherwise it's just a waste of your time,
36:13
right? Would you say that this is sort
36:16
of one of the biggest challenges for entrepreneurs because, well,
36:21
in my case, and that's interesting because actually I
36:23
never thought about that point specifically, maybe because in
36:26
Canada the market is different. We have the official language
36:29
act that means that and there's a shortage of interpreters at
36:32
many level, not all of them. And so we regularly get some
36:35
work. But as a, as a self-employed
36:39
interpreter, I feel that the biggest challenge is to manage
36:45
time and ambition. And what I mean by that is that
36:50
managing time, you, you need to put some time aside to do your
36:53
taxes, to do some of the paperwork to do this and to do
36:56
that. And sometimes we're like, well,
36:58
I'm not making money then. So when am I going to do it?
37:01
So that's one thing. And the other is the ambition
37:03
part. For instance, I'm saying, OK,
37:04
let's start a podcast with Brian.
37:06
And we got to take some time to do it, right?
37:09
But we want to take, we gotta take the time.
37:11
So I gotta make sure that I'm not working on that day.
37:14
I got to make sure that if it's a schedule, then I have to take
37:16
a few hours to edit it. What am I gonna do it?
37:18
I'm gonna do it when we conference, I'm going down over
37:20
the weekend, etcetera, etcetera. So I feel, and when you're an
37:22
entrepreneur, you always have some hopefully you always have
37:25
many ideas, many projects and many things.
37:28
And you got to learn to say no, no in order to manage your
37:31
sanity, to manage time, to manage the work life balance and
37:35
all of that. Yeah, and I don't think you're
37:37
ever going to be a business owner after this week because I
37:39
think I've been bitching to you all week long about how much
37:42
I've been work I've had, alas, because my soundboard for the
37:47
whole week, I'm like. Well, I get, I get only a few
37:51
emails with Brian and I'm like. And then I, I don't check my
37:54
inbox for like a few hours and then my, my inbox is like, and
37:56
I'm like Brian, I mean, because I get CC sometimes a lot.
38:01
And sometimes because of that, some people reply and I'm not
38:03
even in the conversation. And I'm like, how can he manage
38:06
so many emails? I'm like, Oh my God.
38:08
Does he have a twin? Maybe like a twin somewhere?
38:13
No, it's a secret. You're absolutely right.
38:16
We have limited. That is Ryan.
38:18
Ryan. Ryan, Ryan, Ryan and Brian.
38:20
Very creative. I like that.
38:22
Like Jenny and Jimmy or something.
38:24
Yeah. I mean, we all have time limits,
38:26
of course, that the resource, the only resource we have is
38:28
time, right? And I think it took me a long
38:31
time to convince my colleagues that non billable hours are part
38:34
of what you need to do as an entrepreneur.
38:37
They say I can't do marketing. I got to be interpreting.
38:39
I'm like, well, but no professional person does only
38:43
100% of their job, right? No, lawyer, little doctor,
38:46
that's just not the way professional people live their
38:50
lives, right? If you're living in a working in
38:52
a factory, then you're doing 100% billable hours, right?
38:54
But there has to be a portion of the time that's gonna be
38:58
dedicated to client acquisition, to marketing, to recording
39:01
amazing podcasts and them. And he has to say no to things
39:05
to saying, hey, there's an assignment that came up that
39:08
turns out I'm not that interested in.
39:10
It's not the fee schedule that I want.
39:13
I'm going to say no and go do something else, whether that is
39:16
working on my admin stuff or going for a walk, hitting the
39:19
gym, spending some time with my husband, reading a book,
39:22
whatever. I think saying no is something
39:24
we're also not very good at in our profession.
39:27
And then often again, I think it's also sort of a female thing
39:31
you like, without generalizing too much.
39:33
But I've seen that so often that people say, oh, I want better
39:36
clients, I want higher paying clients.
39:37
But I'm sort of stuck with this one client.
39:40
They gave me a lot of work. Like, yeah, but you're not
39:42
technically stuck with them. You choose to be stuck with
39:44
them. You work for your son, right?
39:45
You can say no thank you. I'm not going to take the
39:48
assignment. Is there a risk?
39:50
Of course there's a risk every time you say no to perfectly
39:53
good work, even if it's maybe not the fee schedule you want
39:56
and you don't have work, you'll have to be, you know, you have
40:00
to have some risk, some ability to handle a risk, right?
40:03
To say, OK, if I don't fill this time, what's the worst that can
40:06
happen, right? The worst that can happen is
40:08
that it didn't make money that day, right?
40:10
And maybe I used it to, to do something else.
40:13
But yeah, I wish I had more, more time, just like everybody.
40:15
And I think it's important to invest also our time and what.
40:19
What you guys are doing and helping the profession and
40:21
moving it forward, I do that by volunteering my time, by having
40:25
mentees, by teaching at the university, by volunteering at
40:29
associations. And I think we all need more of
40:32
that. So, and I think my contribution
40:34
to this podcast is switched to a public service announcement to
40:38
invite all our lovely colleagues and your guests and listeners
40:41
to, to give something back to this profession, right?
40:43
Because we all get so much from it and we need to move it
40:47
forward. And your podcast the perfect
40:50
example of how we can accomplish that.
40:51
And of course, it's a lot of work and I thank you for it.
40:54
But no, you're right, like this whole entrepreneur thing, it's
40:57
so important for for people in every profession.
41:00
Like I read an article a couple of years ago where apparently
41:04
freelance freelancers are outnumbering employees.
41:08
So there's 52% of the workforce in Canada and it's probably
41:13
similar in in the States that are freelancers as opposed to
41:17
being employed by a company. Does that include Uber Eats and
41:20
Uber drive? I would assume so because
41:22
they're not employees, right? Like you can, I could become an
41:25
Uber driver and go like do like take calls on the weekend,
41:30
right? They pick people up.
41:32
So good. Yeah.
41:33
Yeah. Uber's gone to great lengths to
41:35
make sure those folks are not classified as employees.
41:38
Indeed. Yeah, that's a fascinating
41:40
statistic. I didn't know that, but I know
41:42
that obviously small businesses are the backbone of of any
41:46
economy really, that they drive the economy.
41:49
They're very nimble, they're adaptable.
41:50
They are easy to start, right? But it's hard to do it well in
41:55
the long run. You have to really value your
41:59
time and not give your time away for free.
42:02
And I've been telling my students this for, for, for
42:05
decades where you gotta, there's a value to your time.
42:08
So if your client is like, hey, can you help me walk, walk me
42:11
through remote simultaneous interpreting on Zoom?
42:14
Yeah, I can help you. But there's a cost associated
42:16
with it. Here's my fee schedule.
42:18
It's not free. Why should it be free?
42:21
You can't go to your lawyer to say I want a free contract, but
42:24
I think we tend to be so giving with our time and to clients,
42:28
but we have to start billing for these things.
42:31
Yeah. Well, you, you just mentioned
42:33
something that I heard early in my career from someone here and
42:39
an owner of an agency here in Quebec City.
42:42
And she she told me that. Oh, yeah.
42:46
I've explained to the client that we, you, they should see us
42:50
as lawyers and that's how we should build it.
42:56
And I was like, oh, OK. And since I heard that very
43:01
early in my career, then it kind of changed the way I thought
43:05
about it. And it basically shaped the
43:09
rest. I mean even today's behavior and
43:12
how I see myself and how I see how we should see ourselves in
43:15
our profession. I love that.
43:17
I think we need to demand that and lawyers are good at many,
43:20
many things and billing for their time is one of them.
43:23
And I think as a profession of interpreting and even on the
43:26
conference interpreting level, we haven't really done a very
43:30
good job. I heard recently from a
43:32
colleague said, oh, these clients asking me to fly to a
43:34
different city and I got a friend in that different cities,
43:37
I'll just stay at her house. I said, why would you stay at
43:41
her house? The the client should pay for
43:42
you to stay at the hotel. She's like, no, but I'm trying
43:45
to save the money. I'm like, you shouldn't try to
43:47
save the money because this is a bad precedent for the rest of
43:50
the profession, right? Yeah, the hotel room.
43:52
And then if you want to stay at your friend's house, you don't
43:54
want to actually be in that room.
43:56
Go to your friend's house, but keep the client honest.
43:58
This is an expense they need to cover.
44:00
What one more, one more, one more thing about that.
44:02
It's it's to me it's even worse than that because it devalue
44:06
your your you think you're helping the client, but it
44:09
actually it's bad for your own reputation.
44:12
Because if I, OK, if I have anyone in any profession who's
44:19
really right up there at the very top, they're not gonna do
44:23
it for cheap. They're gonna ask me for this,
44:25
this, this and that and have a long list of demands in order to
44:30
accommodate them. And if I have someone who says,
44:33
yeah, yeah, yeah, I'll just hitchhike to, I don't know, to
44:36
come to your podcast. Let's say, although we don't
44:38
bring anyone anywhere, then I will not.
44:41
I will think this is a hitchhiker.
44:45
Yeah, maybe that person is not as worth as that person claims
44:49
to be. You know, there's also the
44:52
reputational side of it. And when you're a professional,
44:55
you should really act like it. You should dress like it.
44:57
You should talk like one. Hmm.
45:00
And I think that then hire clients and better paying
45:04
clients will be basically hire you because they'll want the
45:07
best. Well, there's a reason why why
45:09
people like when people have conferences that they book the
45:11
hotel, like you're going to different city, you're, you
45:14
don't know, like the public transportation there.
45:16
You don't know, like if you're going to get there on time, if
45:18
you're, if you're somewhere else, Like the, the whole goal
45:21
is that everyone's in one place so that the conference goes
45:24
well. So like as soon as you start
45:26
saying, Oh yeah, no, I'm gonna go find my own accommodations,
45:28
then that opens the door to maybe like, you know, is the
45:32
subway running that day or is, you know, is there Uber in this
45:35
little town like that kind of thing, right.
45:37
So. Absolutely.
45:39
That you bring up another great point about that Brian.
45:41
Yeah, here in this very fancy hotel, I just take the elevator
45:45
downstairs and then at my booth is waiting for me right there.
45:49
And I think those standards are important right as interpreting
45:53
is changing like all professions.
45:54
I don't know if those the glory days of us traveling around the
45:58
world to cool conferences are over.
46:01
I don't know. I just recently interpreted in
46:03
Sri Lanka, which is really cool. Is that gonna happen again in a
46:07
few years? I don't know.
46:08
I'm gonna enjoy it while it's happening.
46:10
But I think it's really important that we keep on
46:13
fighting for those standards. And of course, providing the,
46:15
the flip side of the coin, which is the professionalism, the, the
46:18
level of preparedness, the being on time, which is my absolute
46:23
pet peeve. Number one person born at a
46:26
German speaking country. You could imagine that, that for
46:29
me, being picture quality is a, is a big, big sticker sticking
46:33
point. And you know, I, I notice when
46:36
people even for different pools, like at this event, for example,
46:39
we've got 8 booths, 8 languages. I, I, I notice who's, who's
46:44
there early because I think that's something that, that some
46:48
interpreters forget, right? That many of us hire each other
46:51
for other events. And of course I have events too,
46:54
that I would need different languages.
46:55
And people are paying attention, right?
46:57
Who are the folks who are there on time?
46:59
Who are the folks who are there early?
47:01
And actually, I want to tell you a funny story about this travel
47:04
thing, which you may enjoy. I recently had a client who had
47:07
a conference in Vegas. And of course, I'm in Vegas and
47:10
I happened to be in town and they said we want to pay you
47:13
less than your fee schedule, but we'll put you up at a nice hotel
47:18
room in Vegas. So we could do which I said I
47:22
said it nicer than this, but I said I've got a perfectly
47:25
beautiful house in Vegas with a pool.
47:27
You're welcome anytime, gentleman.
47:29
By the way, it's a great party house.
47:32
I don't need it. A hotel room in Vegas.
47:35
I you know. I work in Vegas in February so I
47:38
should have next time I go to Vegas you.
47:42
Are not, you're not allowed to come to Vegas without checking
47:44
in with me? That's an interpreter rule.
47:47
Alright, Interpreters must check in with me and I'll need to take
47:50
them out for a drink anyway. So I said no, I don't, I don't
47:52
need. If you want to put me up in this
47:54
hotel room, fine. If you want me to stay here,
47:56
absolutely. But no, this is my fee schedule
48:00
and this is what it costs. And then they said, well, but
48:03
it's a $600.00 hotel room at Fountain Blue.
48:07
And I said, look, you're talking to a Vegas girl.
48:09
This room is not $600.00. It's 3:50.
48:12
And it's a nice room, but they're over decorated that to
48:16
put too much furniture in there. It's really not that great of a
48:18
room, but they have a nice gym. So if you want me to stay there,
48:21
I'm happy to stay there if it makes your conference easier,
48:24
not lowering my fee schedule. This is the fee schedule.
48:28
And they said, OK, I guess we're just, we're just wondering.
48:32
If we're just wondering. Like yeah, it worked out well.
48:37
That's good. One time, one time just to, just
48:39
to, just to finish this on the same thought one time, many,
48:43
many years ago when my one of my very first assignments, what the
48:49
owner of an agency calls me and says, can you lower your fee a
48:53
little, but there's gonna be great chicken at the buffet.
48:58
And there's a glass of water for you, too.
49:01
Very well with the. Great chicken.
49:03
Brian knows who I'm talking. About yes, I know you're, I
49:07
think just just to reassure you, Judy, I think that I don't think
49:12
we're gonna be unable to travel in the future.
49:14
I think you, like, keep enjoying it because they have had
49:18
colleagues like 20 years ago who had been in the profession for
49:21
30 years and they went on cruise ships doing interpretation,
49:25
whatnot, like, Oh yeah, those glory days are gone.
49:28
But then like, you know, 20 years later, you're going to Sri
49:31
Lanka. Alan and I are traveling like,
49:33
so you know what? In 20 years, we'll be fine.
49:35
I absolutely hope you're right because I'm loving is too much
49:39
for it to to change, right? But I'm always, yeah, I'm always
49:42
prepared mentally for things to change, right?
49:44
Which I think is a a healthy attitude, right?
49:47
Instead of just hoping and clinging on to the hope that
49:49
everything will continue the same.
49:51
I'm open to the possibility of change, but I would of course,
49:54
love to continue this because it while it's a lot of work, it's
49:57
also it's a lot of fun. And as you know, some
50:00
assignments are more fun than others.
50:02
Some are more meaningful than others, and some are really
50:06
something that fills you. You just fills your heart with
50:09
with happiness that you're able to make this interpreting happen
50:13
and others is very corporate and very far away from the language.
50:17
You know, I do some of these big events in Vegas for Amazon Web
50:20
Services and for Microsoft and it's it's meaningful work, but
50:25
you're not close enough to the people to really sort of feel
50:28
the effect right. So nobody's coming up to you and
50:32
saying, Hey, thank you for your great work because there is,
50:35
there are 10,000 people in this ballroom and the booths are
50:39
backstage and it doesn't feel as, as, as direct, right.
50:42
But here it's smaller conferences are like 2-3 hundred
50:45
people here. Folks will come up to us and
50:47
say, hey, thank you. I didn't, I was, I didn't even
50:50
know would have interpreting services and I was afraid that I
50:53
wouldn't understand what anybody was saying.
50:54
And, and now we do. And that's, that's meaningful.
50:57
Some of those things are incredibly meaningful.
51:00
And what I, what that happens when that is magical moments
51:03
happen in the booth or, or liaison interpreting.
51:06
It reminds you of how special this profession is.
51:10
Absolutely. Speaking of Vegas, I when I sent
51:13
Alan to Las Vegas, I think you're right.
51:15
It was in February ish. Yeah, I think it was in
51:17
February. I worked with a an AV company in
51:20
Vegas that supplied the interpretation equipment.
51:23
They were awesome. Like they were awesome to.
51:25
Deal with Yeah, they were. Think it's probably the same.
51:27
One that I'm working with right now is a global interpretation.
51:30
They're amazing. Yeah.
51:31
Is it Chris? Chris, Chris, I'm here with him
51:34
right now. Chris.
51:36
For us, yeah, yeah. Yeah, tell him the the the the
51:40
French Canadian guy from from Quebec City and he'll he'll
51:44
know. Yeah, that's so funny.
51:46
I just saw him at breakfast. I said, hey, I gotta run.
51:48
I have to go upstairs and through this podcast and this is
51:52
what I love about interpreting well, one of money many things
51:55
these these connections right how small it is.
51:57
I will go look for him and tell him that you 2 say hi.
52:01
He's so. Cool pre advertising for him, so
52:04
there he goes. Yeah, I was like, should I
52:06
mention his name? But yes, he's he's great.
52:08
So he deserves. Love reserved.
52:10
Yeah, well deserved. Kudos.
52:12
Alright, so Judy, thank you so much for joining us and to the
52:17
podcast. It was amazing.
52:19
Wow, We're almost at one hour, which is actually longer, but we
52:23
had some great stories. Yeah, good.
52:26
I'm so happy. It's such a pleasure and an
52:28
honor that you invited me. And I know how much work this is
52:31
just in scheduling, and I'm sorry my schedule has been so
52:35
tough. And I thank you for for keeping
52:38
at it and finding a slot that worked for all of us.
52:41
And I'm very grateful. I love the work you do, I love
52:43
the stories and I love your style.
52:45
So I'll keep on sharing and subscribing, of course, and
52:48
telling other people about it. Then I will not repeat everyone.
52:52
I will not repeat to everyone to like, share, subscribe.
52:56
I will not do that so. OK, I don't get it, but it
53:00
doesn't hurt to say it again. Awesome.
53:01
Well, yeah, thank you so much Judy.
53:03
That was amazing to have you and to finally get to talk to you
53:06
for like an extended period of time, not just over the phone.
53:09
And I think we may have all have something in common that we all
53:13
do the Glendon the. Masters yes, I was going to
53:16
bring that up. I'm so glad you found out you
53:18
couldn't. Ask you about the Masters, right
53:21
Glendon as. Well.
53:22
Yeah, yes. What?
53:23
Lyndon? I graduated in 2022.
53:27
Yeah, more recently than us. Like when did I graduate my
53:31
Thomas right? There I'm beginning to doubt
53:32
too. Is it 23 or 22?
53:34
I did it later in my career and I think it was 22.
53:36
Yes, 20. Man, it's just something else we
53:40
have in common. But maybe.
53:41
We'll have it. We'll have to bring you back and
53:43
then we'll talk about all the other things we have in common
53:45
as well. Oh, I'd love it.
53:47
I think that there's a lot to talk about.
53:49
Absolutely happy to come back anytime.
53:52
That's good podcast from the pool in Vegas.
53:54
There you go. I love that I have two barking
53:56
dogs. I'm not sure how well that will
53:58
work, but it's they're they're they're do it.
54:00
Yeah, they're they're invited. Perfect.
54:03
Alright, alright, Alright. See you next time.
54:06
Thanks. Bye.