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Hormone Replacement Therapy Myths That Still Hurt Women | Dr. Erika Schwartz · hol+ with Dr. Taz MD | The Future of Medicine is Holistic

• [00:00:00] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Healthcare is broken. I did conventional medicine for 15 years [00:00:05] of my life. [00:00:05] Dr. Taz: Mm-hmm. [00:00:06] Dr. Erika Schwartz: And then I walked away and I said, I'm not helping anybody [00:00:10] in the your er. I was helping, I know people life and death, but you are [00:00:15] never gonna see a life in death situation in your [00:00:20] life that can be handled in reality. So why are we acting like [00:00:25] everything's life and death? [00:00:25] Dr. Taz: Millions of women are struggling with hormone imbalances, [00:00:30] burnout, and exhaustion. Yet most are told their labs are normal. What if the [00:00:35] real problem isn't just hormones, but how the entire medical system [00:00:40] misunderstands women's biology? [00:00:42] Dr. Erika Schwartz: The moment the hormones are not in balance. You [00:00:45] start having problems. [00:00:46] Dr. Erika Schwartz: The American College of Obstetrics and Gynecology and the North American [00:00:50] Menopause Society came out and said, hormones are bad for you. They're gonna kill you. They're [00:00:55] gonna increase your risk of cancer, so we're gonna stop them. [00:00:58] Dr. Taz: Mm. [00:00:58] Dr. Erika Schwartz: And they stopped [00:01:00] giving women hormones [00:01:01] Dr. Taz: At all ages. [00:01:03] Dr. Erika Schwartz: At all ages. Well, birth control pills, [00:01:05] for some obscure reason, did not go into this. [00:01:07] Dr. Taz: Mm. [00:01:08] Dr. Erika Schwartz: The study did [00:01:10] not look at bioidentical hormones. They looked at conjugated, equine, [00:01:15] estrogen, Premarin, prempro. And they had nothing to do with that. Right. And the [00:01:20] study was on women who are more than 10 years post menopause. They [00:01:25] had preexisting conditions. That study was flawed from the beginning. It had [00:01:30] nothing to do with the people that you were trying to help. [00:01:33] Dr. Erika Schwartz: The fallout was [00:01:35] tremendous. Instantly, 7 million women stopped taking [00:01:40] hormones. Women lost their minds. What happened was you sent them faster [00:01:45] into chronic illnesses and they become roadkill, [00:01:47] Dr. Taz: right? [00:01:48] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Literally, and it's [00:01:50] been a horrible, horrible situation. [00:01:52] Dr. Taz: My guest today, Dr. Erica Schwartz, is one [00:01:55] of the most trusted voices in integrative and preventive medicine. [00:01:58] Dr. Taz: For more than three [00:02:00] decades, she's been helping women take charge of their health through personalized evidence-based hormone [00:02:05] care that connects the dots between metabolism, aging, [00:02:10] stress, and emotional wellbeing. She is also the author of several bestselling [00:02:15] books, including the Newly revised 2025 edition of Don't Let Your Doctor Kill You. [00:02:19] Dr. Taz: [00:02:20] A Powerful Guide to Navigating Modern Healthcare and advocating for yourself in a [00:02:25] system that often overlooks women's needs Today, while unpack what's [00:02:30] really driving the hormone crisis, why women's symptoms are so often dismissed, and [00:02:35] what the preventive medicine looks like in midlife and beyond. This [00:02:40] episode is sponsored by Whole Plus, a holistic health platform built around education, [00:02:45] personalization, and integrative care. [00:02:47] Dr. Taz: Whole plus blends holistic, integrative [00:02:50] and functional medicine clinics with learning resources like blogs, YouTube videos, and [00:02:55] of course, this podcast. So you're not just treated, you're informed. The [00:03:00] platform also includes holistic health quizzes and a curated wellness shop helping you make choices [00:03:05] that support your body at the root level. [00:03:07] Dr. Taz: Whole Plus is holistic [00:03:10] healthcare designed for real life. Visit [00:03:12] Dr. Erika Schwartz: us@wholeplus.co to learn [00:03:15] more about the platform. Again, that's HOL ps.co. [00:03:19] Dr. Taz: [00:03:20] All right, we're starting out. We've already been deep in conversation. And Dr. Schwartz, you [00:03:25] guys, I think you were the first hormone book I read. I do. I think I used to carry that thing around [00:03:30] when I was in the throes of my own personal hormone crisis when I was going through med [00:03:35] school and residency and then started working the er. [00:03:37] Dr. Taz: And people were telling me I was anxious and I was depressed, and [00:03:40] I was stressed, and here's a medication for this and a medication for that. And I think in [00:03:45] that journey of trying to get answers, I found your book. [00:03:48] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Thank you. I'm so [00:03:50] happy you did [00:03:50] Dr. Taz: them. How long ago that was? [00:03:52] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Well, that was the first version of it. [00:03:53] Dr. Erika Schwartz: So it was 2002. [00:03:55] [00:03:55] Dr. Taz: Yes. It [00:03:55] Dr. Erika Schwartz: came out right before the Women's Health Initiative [00:03:58] Dr. Taz: thousand and two. And I was [00:04:00] freshly out. Where was I? I was in residency. Yeah. Yeah, that's where I was. So [00:04:05] anyhow, so that book. Set me on a course of discovery. Thank you. And trying to get answers. [00:04:10] I'm so happy. And for the first time in my life I understood bioidentical progesterone and what [00:04:15] that was. [00:04:15] Dr. Taz: I think I started it and it was a big piece of the overall right puzzle for me. Amazing. [00:04:20] Trying to, trying to turn things around. Mm-hmm. And then I know we met later in New York. Yes. Much, much [00:04:25] later in New York when I was trying to figure out kind of like, [00:04:27] Dr. Erika Schwartz: and I tried to convert you [00:04:30] to work with me. [00:04:30] Dr. Taz: Well then COVID happened. [00:04:31] Dr. Taz: Right? Right. And so I think I put a stop on any kind of scaling or growth [00:04:35] or expansion or anything like that. But I love New York and I've admired your work for so [00:04:40] long and I'm so thrilled to have you on the show such, oh my [00:04:44] Dr. Erika Schwartz: God. [00:04:44] Dr. Taz: I [00:04:45] like, I was telling people, and this is not a lie, like if you need inspiration, look that [00:04:50] way, you know, you are, you've been ahead of us, you've been running this race alone for a long [00:04:55] time. [00:04:55] Dr. Taz: I need [00:04:55] Dr. Erika Schwartz: you. [00:04:56] Dr. Taz: And we were just talking about that we need each other. We were just talking about the importance of [00:05:00] collaboration. Yes. Because if we're really gonna start a movement or. Put a, you know, poke some holes in those [00:05:05] things. [00:05:05] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Yes. [00:05:05] Dr. Taz: It can't be a lone ranger, no situation. Right. [00:05:08] Dr. Erika Schwartz: And we're trained, [00:05:10] actually, we're trained to isolate ourselves. [00:05:12] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Yeah. And to just focus on the patient, on whatever we're doing [00:05:15] so that we don't collaborate. So we don't really become unified in [00:05:20] our messages. We're trained to compete against each other. We're trained to do a lot of competitive things. So Competitive. [00:05:25] Yeah. That's not good. For the outcome. [00:05:28] Dr. Taz: How long have you been in medicine?[00:05:30] [00:05:30] Dr. Erika Schwartz: 40. Well, I graduated medical school in 1975. Oh, my, before you [00:05:35] were born? My, [00:05:35] Dr. Taz: I was three. I was born, I was three years old. [00:05:38] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Well, I'm 75. [00:05:40] Wow. Of course. So, [00:05:41] Dr. Taz: I mean, look at this. I, I mean, I know those of you who are listening may not be [00:05:45] able to see her, but for everybody else who's on YouTube or socials, like, she's amazing. [00:05:49] Dr. Taz: When you [00:05:50] talk about like health and vitality and energy, you are who I'd like to be at 75. I [00:05:55] hope I can be there. Yeah. [00:05:55] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Well, I hope I give you everything I have so you can carry the [00:06:00] torch. Because unless you know, I, I mean we have so much we acquire as we get older. [00:06:05] [00:06:05] Dr. Taz: Yeah. [00:06:05] Dr. Erika Schwartz: And unless we share it, you know, if we're sitting in a [00:06:10] corner and just doing it on our own, you're not. [00:06:13] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Growing. Right. You're not [00:06:15] helping anybody grow. [00:06:15] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:06:16] Dr. Erika Schwartz: So everything I have, I share. [00:06:18] Dr. Taz: Well, I am fascinated by [00:06:20] both your medical journey and the impact you've had on medicine. So we need to talk about that. I'm [00:06:25] also, uh, you know, so impressed with your personal journey and just the basics of staying healthy and alive and [00:06:30] vibrant as you move into, you know, like your post 40 era. [00:06:34] Dr. Taz: Right. Which [00:06:35] is where many people get confronted with different [00:06:37] Dr. Erika Schwartz: mm-hmm. [00:06:37] Dr. Taz: Different issues and different diseases. But let's go [00:06:40] back, let's go back to medicine and what your journey has been like. You've been at the forefront [00:06:45] of the hormone revolution. You were the original pioneer. I don't care what anybody [00:06:50] else says out there. It's [00:06:51] Dr. Erika Schwartz: true. True. I don't think anybody [00:06:51] Dr. Taz: would, and [00:06:52] Dr. Erika Schwartz: they'll [00:06:53] Dr. Taz: say no. Yeah. Well, [00:06:55] I was looking for information and I know your space and you know, I know you're rolling in that space. So [00:07:00] what, what have you been screaming from the rooftops for 40 [00:07:05] years? That people finally get. [00:07:08] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Yeah. [00:07:08] Dr. Taz: And I'm gonna flip the [00:07:10] question. [00:07:10] Dr. Taz: What have you also been screaming from the rooftops for 40 years? [00:07:15] That we still are not getting right? [00:07:16] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Well, you getting it? So we have to like kind of [00:07:20] go back. I mean, yeah, because this is home. You are home, [00:07:25] you are like part of the next, you know, the next level movement [00:07:30] [00:07:30] Dr. Taz: grow. I [00:07:30] Dr. Erika Schwartz: feel that responsibility. [00:07:31] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Well, I will give you everything I have. I feel it. [00:07:34] Dr. Taz: You know, [00:07:34] Dr. Erika Schwartz: because [00:07:35] what I've been screaming, you know, the hormone thing was just like kind of a [00:07:40] sidebar. I, I mean it was the timing of the hormone solution. [00:07:42] Dr. Taz: Mm-hmm. [00:07:43] Dr. Erika Schwartz: That made it like number two on [00:07:45] Amazon. It was like a big, big seller because of the women's health initiative. [00:07:49] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:07:49] Dr. Erika Schwartz: But it [00:07:50] wasn't intentional. So I feel like I'm a messenger, you know, like the universe used [00:07:55] me as a vehicle because I was doing that and what I was talking about and the [00:08:00] hormone solution was about. How hormones impact us from [00:08:05] puberty until the end. Oh, wow. And so, and I took area like, you know, [00:08:10] 20, you know, teens, twenties, thirties, forties, fifties, et cetera. [00:08:13] Dr. Erika Schwartz: And it was like I [00:08:15] was talking Chinese, I don't know. Mm-hmm. Maybe Chinese would've helped me. They might've helped. They [00:08:19] Dr. Taz: would've [00:08:20] helped you. They believe in that too. Chinese, [00:08:21] Dr. Erika Schwartz: they believe in [00:08:22] Dr. Taz: Chinese [00:08:22] Dr. Erika Schwartz: medicine. Believes in Chinese medicine. Oh yes. Yeah. [00:08:25] The point was that healthcare is broken. [00:08:30] And I am a conventional doctor, as you know. [00:08:33] Dr. Erika Schwartz: I ran a trauma center. [00:08:35] I'm a board certified internist, critical care. I did [00:08:40] conventional medicine for 15 years of my life. [00:08:42] Dr. Taz: Wow. Mm-hmm. [00:08:43] Dr. Erika Schwartz: And then I walked away and I [00:08:45] said, I'm not helping anybody in the your er. I was helping. I know [00:08:50] people life and death, but you're never gonna see a life in death [00:08:55] situation in your life. [00:08:57] Dr. Erika Schwartz: That can be handled in [00:09:00] reality. So why are we acting like everything's life and death? [00:09:02] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:09:03] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Crazy. Right. [00:09:04] Dr. Taz: [00:09:05] Totally. [00:09:05] Dr. Erika Schwartz: And then I realized that medical school, medical [00:09:10] education, and sadly it's the same now as 50 years ago. [00:09:14] Dr. Taz: That's [00:09:15] what makes me so mad. [00:09:16] Dr. Erika Schwartz: I know, but you know what? No. A rm, and I'm [00:09:20] not trying to plug [00:09:21] Dr. Taz: right [00:09:21] Dr. Erika Schwartz: for the plug for it, but a RM is actually [00:09:25] changing that. [00:09:25] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Mm-hmm. So they're more and more like we were at this, um, than Scottsdale [00:09:30] at this. Uh, [00:09:30] Dr. Taz: a RM by the way, is a, how would you describe A four M was this [00:09:33] Dr. Erika Schwartz: American Academy of [00:09:35] Anti-Aging Medicine, which is like the leaders in longevity and training. They provide a [00:09:40] lot of training for the providers, [00:09:42] Dr. Taz: right? [00:09:42] Dr. Erika Schwartz: They, they, you know, doctors, [00:09:45] um, nurses, nurse practitioners, PAs, um, [00:09:50] naturopath, anything who's in the health professions. [00:09:54] Dr. Erika Schwartz: [00:09:55] Gets support from them and they're really cutting edge and they actually [00:10:00] saw the hormone situation on day one. They endorsed, you know [00:10:05] what we call bioidentical hormones. They were called natural hormones, [00:10:07] Dr. Taz: and they were kind of the first organized. [00:10:10] Is that correct? Yeah. That's kind of the first organized institution. [00:10:12] Dr. Taz: I [00:10:12] Dr. Erika Schwartz: think so. I think so. [00:10:13] Dr. Taz: To really embrace this idea around [00:10:15] hormones. Mm-hmm. We've had a lot of terms since we've had integrative medicine, which again, I did the fellowship in, [00:10:19] Dr. Erika Schwartz: [00:10:20] right. [00:10:20] Dr. Taz: We have functional medicine, we have what else is out there? Lifestyle medicine. [00:10:25] Yeah. We have all these other, like subcategory, antiaging, longevity. [00:10:29] Dr. Taz: Longevity, [00:10:30] you know, [00:10:30] Dr. Erika Schwartz: but that's all the same. And I think it's only serving to confuse people. Totally. Yeah. [00:10:35] And I think the way I say it, and you know what I call it prevention. [00:10:38] Dr. Taz: Yeah. [00:10:38] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Because prevention [00:10:40] fits perfectly between conventional medicine, like when you're [00:10:45] really sick and you're in the hospital and you need medical, acute medical care, which the [00:10:50] conventional system's still good at, [00:10:51] Dr. Taz: right. [00:10:52] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Or fairly good, not as good as it used to be. [00:10:55] And the alternative, which is really focusing on [00:11:00] Chinese medicine, [00:11:01] Dr. Taz: Ayurveda, [00:11:02] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Ayurveda, nutrition, all these other things. Exactly. So [00:11:05] between them sits, prevent. And I've been a firm [00:11:10] believer that prevention's the way to go. So hormones turned out to be an important [00:11:15] part of it. [00:11:15] Dr. Taz: Absolutely. [00:11:16] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Like the foundation of it. [00:11:17] Dr. Taz: How did you stumble on hormones as being such a [00:11:20] critical piece of this puzzle? [00:11:21] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Well, [00:11:21] Dr. Taz: and by the way, I, I say prevention, but I call it [00:11:25] holistic so that people know where [00:11:26] Dr. Erika Schwartz: anything you wanted [00:11:26] Dr. Taz: recall bringing it all together essentially. I think. [00:11:30] I [00:11:30] Dr. Erika Schwartz: think so, [00:11:30] Dr. Taz: but, but to me, when we think holistically about hormones or preventively about [00:11:35] hormones. [00:11:36] Dr. Taz: They impact every system of the body. It is not about reproduction. It is not [00:11:40] about menopause. Correct. And those are the only two conversations you maybe puberty every now and then you [00:11:45] might hear a blip about, but still not an in-depth conversation by any means. So how [00:11:50] did you stumble into this conversation? [00:11:52] Dr. Erika Schwartz: You know, there was no conversation when I stumbled. That's [00:11:54] Dr. Taz: the first [00:11:55] point. She's like, this is a party of one. A party [00:11:58] Dr. Erika Schwartz: of [00:11:58] Dr. Taz: one. So it [00:11:59] Dr. Erika Schwartz: was easy to [00:12:00] like. Debated. [00:12:01] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:12:01] Dr. Erika Schwartz: But the thing is, you know, patient came in and she was in [00:12:05] menopause and I was treating everybody with Prempro because we had Prempro already. [00:12:09] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Right. [00:12:10] Premarin and Provera, right? Yep. And she was doing fine, but she wasn't doing as well as she should have [00:12:15] been doing. And she came in and she said, oh, you know, she had been [00:12:20] seeing a doctor who was trained somewhere else in California, and this [00:12:25] doctor had written a prescription for her to go to a compounding pharmacy in California. [00:12:29] Dr. Taz: Mm-hmm. [00:12:29] Dr. Erika Schwartz: [00:12:30] And this is what the script was. And she gave me her prescription. So I looked at it [00:12:35] and I'm like, I've never seen anything like this. Yeah. Estradiol, progesterone, [00:12:40] testosterone, DHEA. I was like, what is this? [00:12:45] So she said, I feel great. [00:12:46] Dr. Taz: Wow. [00:12:47] Dr. Erika Schwartz: So I was like, okay. So like everything [00:12:50] has to be personal, right. [00:12:51] Dr. Erika Schwartz: So. I wrote the prescription, I send it [00:12:55] to God only knows where. 'cause in those days you had paper prescription. So I gave her the prescription. She [00:13:00] went And then two years later, three years later, [00:13:05] um, I wake up and I'm in menopause. [00:13:07] Dr. Taz: Mm. [00:13:08] Dr. Erika Schwartz: And I have [00:13:10] hot flashes, I have night sweats. I have like my mood swings. [00:13:13] Dr. Erika Schwartz: I never had a mood swing [00:13:15] in my life until then. Or maybe about boys. Yeah. But that's it. [00:13:19] Dr. Taz: Always mood swing [00:13:20] about boys is anyhow, [00:13:21] Dr. Erika Schwartz: nothing else. Nothing really serious. Right, right. So I'm like, what [00:13:25] is wrong with me? So I start taking Prempro, 'cause I'm giving Prempro, right. [00:13:30] And I start bleeding like a stock pig, literally.[00:13:35] [00:13:35] Dr. Erika Schwartz: So I'm like, this is not right. So I remember the patient [00:13:40] and I called the pharmacy. So I'm now going through her chart and I called [00:13:45] the pharmacy and I say to him, can you send to me what I ordered for her? [00:13:49] Dr. Taz: Mm mm-hmm. [00:13:50] [00:13:50] Dr. Erika Schwartz: So he sends it to me. And there was like. [00:13:55] Powders, creams drops, some things have to be [00:14:00] refrigerated. [00:14:00] Dr. Erika Schwartz: You need literally a PhD in biochemistry to be able to do [00:14:05] this. Understand that. Oh [00:14:05] Dr. Taz: boy. [00:14:05] Dr. Erika Schwartz: So I take out a notebook 'cause I was scientist. Yeah. Supposedly. [00:14:09] Dr. Taz: Yeah. [00:14:10] [00:14:10] Dr. Erika Schwartz: And I start writing and I start doing. Within a week I feel [00:14:15] like myself. So I'm like, okay. I also, so I said to, so I called [00:14:20] the guy and I said to him, listen, can you send me all the scientific documentation behind [00:14:25] this? [00:14:25] Dr. Erika Schwartz: 'cause estradiol, we know we make it progesterone, we know we make it [00:14:30] testosterone, we know we make it DHA, we know we make it. So it's not like it's drugs. Right. This is like what [00:14:35] our body makes. [00:14:35] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:14:36] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Clearly not. In my case, it wasn't making it 'cause I was menopausal. [00:14:40] So, and I was early menopause too. [00:14:43] Dr. Taz: Right, [00:14:43] Dr. Erika Schwartz: right. [00:14:43] Dr. Taz: How old were you? Do you remember? [00:14:44] Dr. Erika Schwartz: [00:14:45] 46. [00:14:45] Dr. Taz: 46. So you kind of young. [00:14:46] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Yeah. Well it was after breakup. [00:14:50] How funny is always Yeah. Them in in [00:14:52] Dr. Taz: emotional, the emotional [00:14:54] Dr. Erika Schwartz: [00:14:55] heads. Exactly. [00:14:55] Dr. Taz: Hit the pituitary. I've been talking about [00:14:57] Dr. Erika Schwartz: those. Yeah, exactly. So I, [00:15:00] um. Call him up. And I said, okay, well I feel great. I had gone to the library. [00:15:04] Dr. Erika Schwartz: 'cause [00:15:05] remember we didn't have internet. We didn't have anything in 1996 and [00:15:10] 95, 96 at this point. Yeah. We didn't have any of that. So I go to the library, I do the [00:15:15] research. I'm, you know, doing what I've been taught to do and looks great. [00:15:20] And I say to him, listen, is there any, I have a lot of patients who would benefit from this. [00:15:24] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Can [00:15:25] you do this for me? And, um, but it's like [00:15:30] $300 a month. [00:15:30] Dr. Taz: Mm-hmm. [00:15:31] Dr. Erika Schwartz: And he doesn't take any insurance. Mm-hmm. And that's a lot of money in, in those [00:15:35] days. Right. So, uh, he says, well, I don't need you or your patients. And he [00:15:40] did me the biggest favor because I had to figure it out on my own. [00:15:45] [00:15:45] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:15:45] Dr. Erika Schwartz: So I didn't even know what a compounding pharmacy was. [00:15:48] Dr. Erika Schwartz: I had never heard of it. [00:15:49] Dr. Taz: Wow. [00:15:49] Dr. Erika Schwartz: I mean, they [00:15:50] don't teach you that in medical school. No. Yeah. No, they tell you they're bad. As a matter of fact, [00:15:53] Dr. Taz: we're trained to believe that they're [00:15:55] bad. [00:15:55] Dr. Erika Schwartz: That's right. [00:15:55] Dr. Taz: And what you get is not. What we order is not necessarily what the patient [00:15:59] Dr. Erika Schwartz: gets. Right. It's not [00:16:00] the quality. [00:16:00] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:16:01] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Which is totally wrong and erroneous and [00:16:05] bad for us. [00:16:05] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:16:06] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Really. So anyway, [00:16:07] Dr. Taz: I mean, hang on. Not to interrupt, but like old [00:16:10] medicine used to go in and everything was custom formulated. [00:16:13] Dr. Erika Schwartz: No kidding, [00:16:14] Dr. Taz: right? Yeah. [00:16:15] Remember like you go in Chinese medicines the same way you get a totally custom formulation [00:16:19] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Exactly. [00:16:19] Dr. Taz: Of herbs and [00:16:20] things like that. Yeah. You don't get just these like standard doses [00:16:23] Dr. Erika Schwartz: and all that other stuff. No. It's offensive [00:16:25] that you are saying that. [00:16:26] Dr. Taz: Right? [00:16:26] Dr. Erika Schwartz: The way medicine was practiced for [00:16:30] hundreds, if not thousands of years is wrong. [00:16:32] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:16:32] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Because you have a [00:16:35] standardized, pseudo standardized, let's say pharmaceutical that's [00:16:40] going to be given to you regardless of what your size is, what your age [00:16:45] is. [00:16:45] Dr. Erika Schwartz: If you're a man, a woman, a child, right. It doesn't matter. Right? You just take it Anyway. So back to that. [00:16:50] So I, uh. The guy gets rid of me. So I have to find a [00:16:55] compounding pharmacy where my practice is in New York and I find one and [00:17:00] I spent three years in the guy's lab putting [00:17:05] together ways to do it. Hmm. [00:17:07] Dr. Erika Schwartz: That would actually [00:17:10] be user friendly. And you wouldn't have to like [00:17:13] Dr. Taz: mix all this stuff up. Yeah. [00:17:14] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Right. If [00:17:15] you didn't need the, you know, the biochemistry part, [00:17:17] Dr. Taz: mixing the house is blowing up 'cause you're mixing up hormones here, [00:17:20] you know, so. [00:17:20] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Right. Exactly. And it's like crazy. So anyway, so I do it and the [00:17:25] rest is history. [00:17:25] Dr. Taz: Amazing. [00:17:26] Dr. Erika Schwartz: We start, I started the first compounding pharmacy in New York [00:17:30] State, like in Western state. So you [00:17:31] Dr. Taz: started a compounding pharmacy? [00:17:33] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Yes. I didn't know [00:17:33] Dr. Taz: that. [00:17:34] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Well, it was [00:17:35] called the Natural Hormone Pharmacy that was be before bioidentical hormones. Oh. In [00:17:40] 2002. [00:17:40] Dr. Taz: Okay. [00:17:42] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Then I wrote the, the hormone solution. [00:17:44] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:17:44] Dr. Erika Schwartz: And [00:17:45] then we were teaching doctors in the city. Like from Cornell and [00:17:50] from N nyu. Mm-hmm. And from Presbyterian. And we were teaching them how to use [00:17:55] the hormones. Mm-hmm. And showing them how the molecular structure [00:17:58] Dr. Taz: mm-hmm. [00:17:59] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Of [00:18:00] bioidentical hormones. Natural hormones. Identical, human identical hormones [00:18:05] is was different from [00:18:06] Dr. Taz: a Prempro [00:18:07] Dr. Erika Schwartz: or the Prempro. [00:18:08] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Right? And we were saying, [00:18:10] I was saying, listen, they can't be acting the same in your body if [00:18:15] they look differently. [00:18:15] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:18:16] Dr. Erika Schwartz: As in class effect, right? [00:18:18] Dr. Taz: Mm-hmm. [00:18:18] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Well, [00:18:20] unfortunately, the conventional medical establishment decided because they got so scared after the Women's [00:18:25] Health Initiative, which is another story, they got so scared and they didn't want [00:18:30] anybody to know anything about it, about the truth about it. [00:18:33] Dr. Erika Schwartz: So what they did [00:18:35] is they decided that there was class effect, that all estrogens behaved the same, [00:18:40] all progestogen behave the same. So what they did is they tortured women. [00:18:44] Dr. Taz: [00:18:45] Mm. [00:18:45] Dr. Erika Schwartz: They started the torture of women and they told doctors that they shouldn't be giving women [00:18:50] hormones. [00:18:50] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:18:50] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Which is the worst thing. [00:18:52] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Whole, well, at least today it's, you know, the bill. [00:18:54] Dr. Taz: It's different [00:18:55] today, but like a whole generation of women. Yeah. Basically. [00:18:58] Dr. Erika Schwartz: And still [00:18:58] Dr. Taz: suffered and [00:19:00] kind of bear the burden of chronic disease. [00:19:01] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Yep. [00:19:02] Dr. Taz: Due to the lack of hormones. Right. Right. [00:19:04] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Exactly. [00:19:04] Dr. Taz: And so [00:19:05] that's something that I know you've been so passionate and an advocate about trying to change that [00:19:10] conversation and that discourse. [00:19:11] Dr. Taz: Let's go to the Women's Health Initiative. 'cause a lot of our conversation is framed around [00:19:15] hormones. What to use, when to use what's safe, what's not safe. Right. But let's go back to the [00:19:20] Women's health initiative. 'cause it's still within sort of the DNA of our, of our culture in [00:19:25] terms of like hormones. [00:19:26] Dr. Taz: You know, like what's happening here? [00:19:28] Dr. Erika Schwartz: You still hear it? [00:19:29] Dr. Taz: Yep. [00:19:29] Dr. Erika Schwartz: All the [00:19:30] time are still saying, [00:19:31] Dr. Taz: yeah. [00:19:31] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Oh, hormones cause cancer. I don't want breast cancer. I'm afraid of [00:19:35] hormones. [00:19:35] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:19:35] Dr. Erika Schwartz: But that's all because the education is lacking. Like I said, a [00:19:40] medical education in medical school is the same as 50 years ago. [00:19:44] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Right. So, but [00:19:45] 50 years ago. They were giving hormones. [00:19:47] Dr. Taz: Yeah. [00:19:48] Dr. Erika Schwartz: You know, they were giving bioidentical [00:19:50] hormones. [00:19:50] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:19:50] Dr. Erika Schwartz: But it took, in 2011, I was at the International Menopause Society in [00:19:55] Rome, and the data that was presented there from all over the world [00:20:00] said there was no class effect. Meaning the birth control [00:20:05] pills and estradiol are not the same. Mm-hmm. [00:20:08] Dr. Erika Schwartz: They don't behave the same. [00:20:09] Dr. Taz: Mm-hmm. [00:20:10] [00:20:10] Dr. Erika Schwartz: We've been screaming it for, like I said, from the, from the roofs. They're not the [00:20:15] same. They behave differently. So why would you give them the burden [00:20:20] of the negativity of the non-human identical hormones? [00:20:24] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:20:25] [00:20:25] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Good question. [00:20:26] Dr. Taz: So let's go. So birth control. [00:20:28] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Mm-hmm. [00:20:28] Dr. Taz: The estradiol and birth control [00:20:30] pills. [00:20:30] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Right. [00:20:30] Dr. Taz: Bioidentical or not bioidentical. [00:20:32] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Birth control pill? No, of course not. It's [00:20:35] not bioidentical. And I've been saying it's another thing screaming, right? [00:20:40] Birth control pills put women in menopausal hormonal states. So if you measure [00:20:44] Dr. Taz: [00:20:45] right, [00:20:45] Dr. Erika Schwartz: the hormones, a 16-year-old who is on birth control pills, they have [00:20:50] the same estradiol level as a menopausal woman, think of what that's doing to their [00:20:55] body. [00:20:55] Dr. Taz: Absolutely. So why, why do we not [00:21:00] see that? And why do we not practice differently when it [00:21:05] comes to hormone in our teenagers and young women in their twenties, maybe even early [00:21:10] thirties? Mm-hmm. And then when we get to women in their forties and fifties, why are we so parked [00:21:15] in, you know, birth control for hormone regulation? [00:21:17] Dr. Taz: You've got PCOS, you've got endometriosis, you've got [00:21:20] whatever, here's your birth control. Right? No conversation around what that means. Mm-hmm. [00:21:25] Hit late forties, mid forties, early forties, I should say, whatever, early forties [00:21:30] through your fifties hormone replacement therapy. Here are your two options.[00:21:35] [00:21:35] Dr. Taz: Bioidentical hormones don't need to be a part of this. Custom compounding does not need to be a part of this. [00:21:40] What's the fallout for these two groups of people? [00:21:42] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Horrible. Horrible. It's [00:21:45] really bad because hormones, like you said, are the fabric [00:21:50] of who we are and when our hormones are. I balance, we're young.[00:21:55] [00:21:55] Dr. Erika Schwartz: We don't have wrinkles. We are fertile. Our hair looks [00:22:00] great. [00:22:00] Dr. Taz: Mm-hmm. [00:22:00] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Our body does well. We recover from staying up all [00:22:05] night very easily. Mm-hmm. We can eat garbage and feel better. It's [00:22:10] very easy because our hormones help us. [00:22:12] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:22:13] Dr. Erika Schwartz: The moment that hormones [00:22:15] start going outta balance, whether it is when after pregnancy, [00:22:20] you know, like you said, PCOS. [00:22:22] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Puberty, then [00:22:25] perimenopause, menopause. The moment the hormones are not in balance, you start having [00:22:30] problems and you're going towards diseases of aging. [00:22:33] Dr. Taz: Hmm. [00:22:34] Dr. Erika Schwartz: [00:22:35] Osteoporosis, Alzheimer's, cancers, cardiovascular disease, [00:22:40] all of these things occur when your hormones are leaving you. [00:22:45] So why would you ever not put the hormones back in? [00:22:49] Dr. Erika Schwartz: [00:22:50] But what hormones you're putting back in is crucial. And that's where my screaming started. It [00:22:54] Dr. Taz: [00:22:55] started the Women's Health Initiative, 2001. [00:22:58] Dr. Erika Schwartz: 2002. [00:22:59] Dr. Taz: 2002. [00:23:00] [00:23:00] Dr. Erika Schwartz: And it was ended in 2002 abruptly. [00:23:04] Dr. Taz: And what did that [00:23:05] tell us about hormones and what did it do to our practice when it comes to [00:23:10] women's and teen and girls' health? [00:23:12] Dr. Erika Schwartz: It didn't touch women's, I mean [00:23:15] young girls. [00:23:15] Dr. Taz: Mm-hmm. [00:23:16] Dr. Erika Schwartz: That study. So let's tell the truth about the study. [00:23:20] So that study was sponsored by Wyeth Pharmaceuticals and Upjohn. [00:23:25] They gave a hundred million dollars or whatever to the academic [00:23:30] institutions that were the enters were the study. The study [00:23:32] Dr. Taz: was being done. [00:23:33] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Was done. [00:23:34] Dr. Taz: Okay. A hundred [00:23:35] million dollars [00:23:35] Dr. Erika Schwartz: at least, if not more. And they also gave them the free hormones, right. [00:23:40] Whatever those are the hormone, imposters, whatever we call them anyway. [00:23:45] And five years into the study turns out that the [00:23:50] interim, like the interim data, showed that there might be an [00:23:55] increase risk of cancer and of thrombotic episode like blood clots.[00:24:00] [00:24:00] Dr. Erika Schwartz: And because the government, 'cause it was supposed to be a government [00:24:05] study, the government didn't want to know who sponsored the study. [00:24:10] Government, you think it's kind of our tax money. [00:24:12] Dr. Taz: Right? Right. [00:24:13] Dr. Erika Schwartz: But it wasn't our tax money [00:24:15] or maybe part of it. It was, but definitely not the, uh, major part. [00:24:20] So the government got really scared and they got together [00:24:25] with every, you know, the principal investigators and they stopped the study.[00:24:30] [00:24:30] Dr. Erika Schwartz: And the American College of Obstetrics and Gynecology and the North American Menopause [00:24:35] Society, which were the only like, I guess, ways to [00:24:40] get any information out. [00:24:41] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:24:42] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Came out and said, hormones are bad for you. They're gonna [00:24:45] kill you. They're gonna increase your risk of cancer, so we're gonna stop them. [00:24:49] Dr. Taz: [00:24:50] Mm. [00:24:50] Dr. Erika Schwartz: And they stopped giving women hormones. [00:24:52] Dr. Taz: At all ages. [00:24:54] Dr. Erika Schwartz: At all ages. Yeah. [00:24:55] Well, birth control pills for some obscure reason did not go into this. [00:24:59] Dr. Taz: Mm. [00:25:00] [00:25:00] Dr. Erika Schwartz: The study did not look at bioidentical hormones. They looked at [00:25:05] conjugated, equine, estrogen, Premarin, prempro. And they had nothing to [00:25:10] do with that, right? And the study was on women who are more than 10 years post [00:25:15] menopause. [00:25:16] Dr. Erika Schwartz: They had pre-existing conditions. That study was [00:25:20] flawed from the beginning. It had nothing to do with the people that you were trying to study, [00:25:25] that you were trying to help, [00:25:26] Dr. Taz: right? [00:25:26] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Because you're trying to help really, [00:25:28] Dr. Taz: right? [00:25:28] Dr. Erika Schwartz: These studies should help. [00:25:30] So the fallout was tremendous. Instantly 7 [00:25:35] million women stopped taking hormones. [00:25:37] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Now think about what happens when you [00:25:40] stop suddenly hormones. You go into ffl, you know? [00:25:43] Dr. Taz: Full fledged. Yeah, [00:25:43] Dr. Erika Schwartz: full fledged, [00:25:44] Dr. Taz: yeah. [00:25:44] Dr. Erika Schwartz: [00:25:45] Hot flashes, night sweats. Women lost their minds. And you know, when women get [00:25:50] older, if they don't take hormones, if they're not well balanced, [00:25:55] everything falls apart. Chronic illnesses. [00:25:57] Dr. Erika Schwartz: So. What happened was you [00:26:00] sent them faster into chronic illnesses and they become roadkill. [00:26:04] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:26:05] [00:26:05] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Literally. [00:26:05] Dr. Taz: Oh. [00:26:06] Dr. Erika Schwartz: And it's been a horrible, horrible situation, but [00:26:10] nobody wanted to talk about it. And whenever like there was [00:26:15] any opportunity to talk about it, [00:26:17] Dr. Taz: you were shut down. [00:26:18] Dr. Erika Schwartz: You were shut down. Yep. And you were [00:26:20] considered a pariah because you are risking women's lives. [00:26:24] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Mm-hmm. I [00:26:25] can't tell you how many women came into my office over the years because the hormone solution did well, [00:26:29] Dr. Taz: [00:26:30] right? [00:26:30] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Because women were looking for answers. [00:26:32] Dr. Taz: They were looking for a solution. [00:26:33] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Right. There was a solution. [00:26:34] Dr. Taz: I was, I was [00:26:35] in the mix. [00:26:35] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Right? [00:26:36] Dr. Taz: Yeah. [00:26:36] Dr. Erika Schwartz: So they came and. They, [00:26:40] everybody did well, and I could tell you now, 30, almost 30 years later, it's like [00:26:45] 25. [00:26:45] Dr. Erika Schwartz: 20, yeah. 23 years. Yeah. 23 years later. I have patients who have [00:26:50] been with me for 30 years. [00:26:51] Dr. Taz: Yeah. [00:26:51] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Nobody gets cancer. Nobody has Alzheimer's in [00:26:55] my practice, nobody has osteo. I mean, they may get osteopenia, but the thing [00:27:00] is, why are my patients doing so much better? 'cause [00:27:05] they're on hormones the whole time. [00:27:06] Dr. Taz: Mm. [00:27:06] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Of course, we added exercise, stress [00:27:10] management, life, lifestyle medicine, which became so important to me because they were doing [00:27:15] well. [00:27:15] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:27:15] Dr. Erika Schwartz: But there was always room for better. [00:27:17] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:27:17] Dr. Erika Schwartz: And then we brought in better, but now [00:27:20] we're [00:27:20] Dr. Taz: seeing, okay. So now, so okay. You're, you're out there. You're talking about [00:27:25] hormones, you're trying to, in the context of the Women's Health Initiative, trying to educate people [00:27:30] on hormones, do you get a lot of backlash? [00:27:31] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Nope. Because you know what's good, [00:27:34] Dr. Taz: [00:27:35] what [00:27:35] Dr. Erika Schwartz: you try to ignore. So I was among the ones who was ignored. [00:27:39] Dr. Taz: [00:27:40] Mm. [00:27:40] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Except for when I came out and started talking. [00:27:43] Dr. Taz: So you were under the radar basically. [00:27:45] [00:27:45] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Mm-hmm. [00:27:45] Dr. Taz: Right. Which is a space that I tried to embrace for a period of time. All of, but you don't like all of us to be [00:27:50] in that space for very [00:27:50] Dr. Erika Schwartz: long? [00:27:51] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Well, not anymore because I have the knowledge. Right. I have the experience, I [00:27:55] have the proof, I know the data. [00:27:57] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:27:58] Dr. Erika Schwartz: As far as I'm concerned. So in [00:28:00] 2008, I wrote an article for the Medical Clinics of North America, which is a medical journal. [00:28:04] Dr. Taz: Mm-hmm. [00:28:05] [00:28:05] Dr. Erika Schwartz: And it was a white paper on hormones. Mm-hmm. But it just barely touched [00:28:10] on natural human identical hormones. [00:28:13] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Mm-hmm. Because that's all they let me [00:28:15] do. And then we had a webinar that had 900 OBGYNs on [00:28:20] it because OB GYN was women's health. [00:28:22] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:28:22] Dr. Erika Schwartz: And I spoke to, I spoke at Harvard. I [00:28:25] mean, they were welcoming to a certain degree, but they always tried to [00:28:30] block anything coming out. So. The guy who was [00:28:35] the head of the O-B-G-Y-N department at Harvard, who now is retired, but is [00:28:40] the, um, editor in chief of the journal menopause. [00:28:44] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Mm-hmm. [00:28:45] Was very supportive and very nice to me, and said, you have to write for [00:28:50] menopause. I never got to write for menopause, but he was very supportive. [00:28:55] Trying to keep me, like you said, [00:28:58] Dr. Taz: in Yeah, [00:28:58] Dr. Erika Schwartz: in, in, in [00:29:00] line. In, in, you know. Mm-hmm. They invited me to speak at the North America Menopause [00:29:05] Society, but it was like all [00:29:06] Dr. Taz: mm-hmm. [00:29:07] Dr. Erika Schwartz: You know, like, well, kind of, not really. [00:29:09] Dr. Taz: Right, [00:29:10] [00:29:10] Dr. Erika Schwartz: because they didn't hear what I was talking about. [00:29:13] Dr. Taz: Mm. [00:29:13] Dr. Erika Schwartz: They didn't wanna hear what I was talking [00:29:15] about. [00:29:15] Dr. Taz: What's the block? Why, why is I have ex So the sa here's the sad [00:29:20] part of the story, and I'm gonna be truthful and honest here, you know. 30 [00:29:25] years later, I write the 25, whatever that math is, I write the hormone shift, which came out in [00:29:30] 2023. [00:29:30] Dr. Taz: It was all about a holistic approach to hormone balancing, which you're very much [00:29:35] in line with, right? Yes, sure. Um, it was [00:29:40] categorically side bared [00:29:41] Dr. Erika Schwartz: of course [00:29:43] Dr. Taz: by, and I have some [00:29:45] OBGYNs I love. So I hope I don't offend anybody, but by Yeah, you do. It doesn't matter anymore by some of the [00:29:50] major voices in the OBGYN community. [00:29:51] Dr. Taz: Mm-hmm. To the point that I was not included in different [00:29:55] events around menopause and perimenopause of course, and launches and things like that. Of course [00:30:00] feelings aren't heard. It is what it is. I'm used to this, I've been called everything since the beginning, so nothing new. [00:30:05] Right. But what is the fear or the walk with you [00:30:10] now? [00:30:10] Dr. Taz: With me, we have a gap between us. It's the same. What's going on? [00:30:14] Dr. Erika Schwartz: I'll tell you what I [00:30:15] think is going on. Okay. And I don't know what's really going on, but I tell you what I think. I [00:30:20] think that we're going against. The [00:30:25] conventional way of thinking. The conventional [00:30:30] education. Right. We're talking about compounding and I know there was an article that was [00:30:35] written in menopause by this boothy in [00:30:40] early two thousands that actually tried to trash [00:30:45] compounding. [00:30:45] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Yeah. And me Yeah. And, and some, and other doctors, [00:30:48] Dr. Taz: well, you'll see a spike. Right. Right. You'll [00:30:50] see like nothing, nothing, nothing. And all of a sudden you'll see like a barrage of compounding iss not safe. Right. [00:30:55] FDI coming down on compounding, this is happening with compounding [00:30:58] Dr. Erika Schwartz: and Right. So what it [00:31:00] came from was that there was this, uh, outbreak of, [00:31:05] um, fungal meningitis [00:31:08] Dr. Taz: mm-hmm. [00:31:09] Dr. Erika Schwartz: In [00:31:10] Massachusetts from a co, from a compounding mar [00:31:15] pharmacy. [00:31:15] Dr. Taz: Mm-hmm. [00:31:15] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Product from a compounding Margaret pharmacy that was injected in the spinal. [00:31:19] Dr. Taz: Hmm. [00:31:20] [00:31:20] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Cord, which has nothing to do with what we're talking about. Right. Which is creams that [00:31:25] you put on your skin. [00:31:25] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:31:26] Dr. Erika Schwartz: That I mean, anyway, and that was a one thing [00:31:30] that was blown so outta proportion and made like the big thing. [00:31:34] Dr. Erika Schwartz: [00:31:35] Compounding does not pay for medical school education. [00:31:38] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:31:39] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Does not [00:31:40] pay for consulting. Jobs for academics. Does not [00:31:45] pay for the studies because they don't have the money [00:31:50] because they're actually working with something your body makes. Ironically, the [00:31:55] part I still don't understand is how did we get FDA approval for estradiol?[00:32:00] [00:32:00] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Mm. Esra divigel, ami, you know, the patch? [00:32:05] How did that come about? Mm-hmm. That came about around 2020. Right? [00:32:09] Dr. Taz: [00:32:10] Mm-hmm. [00:32:10] Dr. Erika Schwartz: How did that happen? All of a sudden there is, and now the [00:32:15] GLP ones, right, which are peptides, which our body makes. How [00:32:20] did they get FDA approval? Mm-hmm. So it's very interesting when you see how this [00:32:25] unfolds. [00:32:25] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Mm. And I think that unfortunately we are speakers of the [00:32:30] truth. [00:32:30] Dr. Taz: Mm. [00:32:30] Dr. Erika Schwartz: And speakers of the truth are not welcome when money is [00:32:35] the root desire, outcome. [00:32:40] And when patients are not cared for. [00:32:42] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:32:42] Dr. Erika Schwartz: When the patient gets lost. And you [00:32:45] know, we've talked about patient-centric medicine for decades. We don't [00:32:50] practice, we do no. [00:32:51] Dr. Erika Schwartz: But conventional medicine, no. Does not practice [00:32:55] patient-centered medicine. [00:32:55] Dr. Taz: No. [00:32:56] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Nobody cares about the patient. And add to that [00:33:00] being a woman. Forget it. You're never gonna get anything. [00:33:03] Dr. Taz: Add color to that now. [00:33:04] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Oh my God. [00:33:05] Add anything. [00:33:05] Dr. Taz: Just add a few layers of color. Yeah. And it just goes down and down and down, down, [00:33:08] Dr. Erika Schwartz: completely [00:33:09] Dr. Taz: down, you know? [00:33:09] Dr. Erika Schwartz: So, [00:33:10] and to say that there is improvement. It's to totally understate. [00:33:14] Dr. Taz: Yeah. [00:33:15] I used to get, you know, I've been invited to sit in different meetings and rooms. I'm sure you have [00:33:20] too. And when they talk about patient-centric care, you know where the conversation usually is, how [00:33:25] do we make it more efficient? How do we make things faster? [00:33:28] Dr. Taz: How do we make [00:33:30] things quicker? You know, or more technologically savvy. Now with the conversation with [00:33:35] ai, I did an episode in which I was like, AI is great as a helper. Companion [00:33:40] AI cannot replace. The personalization of medicine, it can't, no. You know, [00:33:45] you need to have that interaction to decide what that personalization needs to look [00:33:50] like, no matter how many robots you're gonna program in the future, you know? [00:33:53] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Right. [00:33:53] Dr. Taz: So it's just like [00:33:55] the idea of patient-centric care. You know, even from a business strategy, when you talk [00:34:00] to like people in the, you know, business space, like the whole idea of [00:34:05] sitting and spending time with a patient and learning their story and pulling out the [00:34:10] details, formulating a plan that's customized and personalized to them is like too hard.[00:34:15] [00:34:15] Dr. Taz: It's not worth the savvy. You're not gonna money not worth the energy. How you gonna money? You make money. Mm-hmm. Not [00:34:20] scalable. These are all the terms. Mm-hmm. I have heard over time, and you know what it did, I can [00:34:24] Dr. Erika Schwartz: vouch [00:34:25] for that one. [00:34:25] Dr. Taz: It made me super stubborn. [00:34:26] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Of course, of course. [00:34:28] Dr. Taz: Did you say no to me right [00:34:30] now because I'm about to show you something totally d different Exactly know so, [00:34:35] absolutely. [00:34:35] Dr. Taz: But [00:34:35] Dr. Erika Schwartz: anyhow, that's why wrote the released Don't let Your Doctor Kill you. Yes. 'cause after [00:34:40] COVID, right? [00:34:41] Dr. Taz: Yeah. [00:34:41] Dr. Erika Schwartz: After COVID, which was a [00:34:45] fiasco and the proof of how the conventional medical system doesn't work. [00:34:50] Not even going to politics. Right. I'm just saying that right. [00:34:53] Dr. Taz: Yeah. [00:34:54] Dr. Erika Schwartz: So that [00:34:55] was horrible. So I brought in, um, COVID and I also talked about AI [00:35:00] and how, to me, AI is the glimmer of hope because [00:35:05] AI can do all protocol based, algorithm based. [00:35:09] Dr. Erika Schwartz: [00:35:10] Procedures, anything. Right? So, which gives the doctor [00:35:14] Dr. Taz: more [00:35:14] Dr. Erika Schwartz: [00:35:15] bandwidth. More bandwidth to know the patient. [00:35:17] Dr. Taz: Mm. What a great way to look at it. [00:35:19] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Right. So [00:35:20] I don't like always try to see the positives. Right. [00:35:22] Dr. Taz: No, that's amazing because, and then [00:35:25] going back to sort of the isolation from the conventional communities, whether it's OB, GYN, or [00:35:30] academia or whoever it is, you know, if they could breathe for a [00:35:35] second and think creatively and more, have more flexibility when it [00:35:40] comes to how you approach a patient. [00:35:42] Dr. Taz: They'd be on our, on our side, of course they would be in [00:35:45] our camp, but they have no time or energy for that either. [00:35:50] Right? No, no. You know, so that's the empathy part that I have, you know, towards the profession and [00:35:55] towards our colleagues in these different disciplines. [00:35:57] Dr. Erika Schwartz: I think it's kind of you, but I have to [00:36:00] tell you that there's research since the [00:36:05] eighties from Johns Hopkins, so not. [00:36:08] Dr. Erika Schwartz: A [00:36:10] non-academic, non-conventional, but totally conventional. Yeah. That shows [00:36:15] that medical mistakes are caused by physician. Arrogance. [00:36:19] Dr. Taz: [00:36:20] Arrogance. [00:36:20] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Arrogance. So when you are giving your sympathy, which I totally am [00:36:25] sympathetic, she's [00:36:25] Dr. Taz: like, stop. [00:36:27] Dr. Erika Schwartz: We need to put it into perspective. Right. And tell [00:36:30] the truth. Even at Johns Hopkins, they know [00:36:35] they came with the research. [00:36:37] Dr. Taz: If you're listening to this and thinking, [00:36:40] I know something is often my body, but I don't know where to start. [00:36:45] This is for you. That's why I created the circle. The circle is my [00:36:50] private community where I and my team focus on understanding your body from hormones [00:36:55] and stress to metabolic health and longevity with real life guidance that you can [00:37:00] actually use. [00:37:01] Dr. Taz: This is about clarity and consistency and support [00:37:05] beyond the exam room and maybe outside of all the different appointments and experts that [00:37:10] you've been running around to. You can try the circle with a one month trial using the [00:37:15] promo code podcast@wholeplus.co back slash circle. Again, [00:37:20] that's whole plus to ho lpls.co/circle.[00:37:25] [00:37:25] Dr. Taz: All right, let's jump back into the episode. [00:37:28] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Medical errors are still the [00:37:30] number three cause of death. Mm-hmm. In the United States. [00:37:33] Dr. Taz: Mm-hmm. [00:37:33] Dr. Erika Schwartz: COVID moved that a [00:37:35] little bit, but then now back to that. [00:37:37] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:37:37] Dr. Erika Schwartz: So. We're not training our [00:37:40] doctors. Right. We are at A four M. We are in our world, but in [00:37:45] the conventional world, there's no training. [00:37:47] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Well, it's the same. [00:37:50] Nobody tells you not to be arrogant. Nobody tells you to be grateful. Nobody [00:37:55] tells you to be humble. You think you get that MD after your name, [00:37:59] Dr. Taz: you're [00:37:59] Dr. Erika Schwartz: the shit. [00:38:00] You're the, you're hot. Right? Right. Exactly. And you're not. Mm-hmm. You have the same body functions as [00:38:05] anybody else, and everybody has the same body function, so why can't we learn [00:38:10] to respect each other? [00:38:11] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Mm-hmm. And to treat people with respect. Because if you are gonna be [00:38:15] a doctor, and I think of myself as a healer. [00:38:18] Dr. Taz: Mm-hmm. [00:38:18] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Because otherwise I wouldn't be [00:38:20] doing it. [00:38:20] Dr. Taz: Mm-hmm. [00:38:21] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Then you wanna be kind. [00:38:23] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:38:24] Dr. Erika Schwartz: And the [00:38:25] information you have from all the studies and all the data that's constantly coming out [00:38:30] should be used to move from relative risk, which is what we're [00:38:35] talking about. [00:38:35] Dr. Erika Schwartz: To absolute risk, which nobody talks about, which [00:38:38] Dr. Taz: is you. Okay. Define those. [00:38:40] Define both of those for people listening today. Sure. 'cause they're probably like, [00:38:45] how do I sift through the tons of information coming at me? There's so much noise in the [00:38:50] wellness space. Yep. There's so much noise in the hormone space [00:38:52] Dr. Erika Schwartz: and longevity now [00:38:53] Dr. Taz: E every [00:38:55] space. [00:38:55] Dr. Taz: Mm-hmm. Right. It's like clunky. Yeah. It's just, it's too much. Mm-hmm. You know? So how [00:39:00] can we help somebody watching or listening to us today understand the difference between relative [00:39:05] risk and absolute risk so that they can have these terms deeply imprinted in their brain as they're [00:39:10] taking in information from many different sources. [00:39:13] Dr. Erika Schwartz: So relative risk is [00:39:15] the only way scientific data can be provided. Right? [00:39:20] Studies, all the studies that we come up with that are [00:39:25] published, they're about relative risk because. Absolute risk is the risk [00:39:30] that you have or I have for that particular whatever it is that we're [00:39:35] looking at. And we're only looking at one variable. [00:39:38] Dr. Taz: Mm-hmm. [00:39:38] Dr. Erika Schwartz: We're not looking at the [00:39:40] multitude of variables involved. So unless you [00:39:45] know the patient and you know the person sitting in front of you, you will [00:39:50] never be able to take care of them properly because you're thinking relative risk. [00:39:54] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:39:55] [00:39:55] Dr. Erika Schwartz: And I'll give you an example. This woman who came to [00:40:00] see me, a highly educated, brilliant woman and had an [00:40:05] ovarian cyst, went to a gynecologist who was specialized in [00:40:10] oncology. [00:40:10] Dr. Erika Schwartz: She was in her fifties and he looked in at the [00:40:15] cyst and he said to her, oh, you have a 6% chance of getting [00:40:20] ovarian can of that being cancer. She went flying out of her, his [00:40:25] office called me up and said, I'm having the surgery tomorrow. [00:40:28] Dr. Taz: Mm-hmm. [00:40:29] Dr. Erika Schwartz: So I said, wait, [00:40:30] and this is a smart woman who knew math too. [00:40:32] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Mm-hmm. So I said to her, wait, [00:40:35] let's slow down here. 6% risk [00:40:40] of getting cancer means 94% risk of not getting, not getting [00:40:45] cancer. Cancer. Getting cancer. Getting cancer. So your doctor has just scared you. [00:40:50] And the other thing is he's not talking about 6% absolute [00:40:55] risk. [00:40:55] Dr. Taz: Mm. [00:40:55] Dr. Erika Schwartz: He's talking about the data from the studies that is [00:41:00] 6% relative risk. [00:41:01] Dr. Erika Schwartz: So what's your risk? I [00:41:05] was not able to talk her down. She [00:41:07] Dr. Taz: got the surgery. [00:41:07] Dr. Erika Schwartz: She got the surgery. Yeah. She went into [00:41:10] flaming menopause and then. I had to take care of it. [00:41:13] Dr. Taz: Yeah, absolutely. [00:41:14] Dr. Erika Schwartz: [00:41:15] But there was no reason. And by the way, of course you didn't have cancer. [00:41:17] Dr. Taz: Right? Such a long way [00:41:20] to go. But let's get back to bioidentical hormones because that is one that is, like [00:41:25] you said, part of why I got sidelined more than likely, maybe why you've been sidelined for all these [00:41:30] years, right? [00:41:31] Dr. Taz: But it is a viable solution for the patient that is safe and [00:41:35] effective through any age and is metabolized by the body in such a better way and [00:41:40] fashion, right, than some of our conventional preparations, even straight estradiol to a certain [00:41:45] extent. So what is the right role or place for bioidentical hormones? [00:41:49] Dr. Taz: What [00:41:50] is the right age? You know, when can you start 'em? Creams [00:41:55] versus pills versus trophies versus vaginal. Like, give us your overall sense and then [00:42:00] how do you know that what you're getting? 'cause I get this question all the time and we have, you know, compounders that we love [00:42:05] and trust, but how do we know that what we're prescribing and what they're picking up is [00:42:10] really what it is? [00:42:11] Dr. Erika Schwartz: That's a big question. [00:42:12] Dr. Taz: Yeah, figured. [00:42:13] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Alright, so let's see. I'm gonna let you [00:42:14] Dr. Taz: run [00:42:15] with [00:42:15] Dr. Erika Schwartz: that one. So let's see. Well, I'll run with you. Um, [00:42:20] first of all, hormones, bioidentical hormones, human identical [00:42:25] hormone, natural hormones, you need them. You must have them, you [00:42:30] need to take them. They'll save your life. They will keep you from getting [00:42:35] sick. [00:42:35] Dr. Erika Schwartz: They'll keep you from getting old and sick. Look at me. I'm [00:42:40] 75. Amazing. [00:42:40] Dr. Taz: She looks amazing. [00:42:41] Dr. Erika Schwartz: I've been on bioidentical hormones for [00:42:45] 26 years, right? And of course [00:42:50] I take hormones, I take supplements, I eat right, I exercise, I sleep, [00:42:55] I walk the walk. [00:42:56] Dr. Taz: Mm-hmm. [00:42:57] Dr. Erika Schwartz: And you could do it. It's not hard. It's [00:43:00] really not hard. [00:43:00] Dr. Erika Schwartz: But the number one thing is you need hormones without hormones [00:43:05] when you lose your hormones. You're not gonna be able to move off the couch. [00:43:08] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:43:08] Dr. Erika Schwartz: So without [00:43:10] hormones, you can tell anybody you want. Go exercise. They can't, they don't [00:43:12] Dr. Taz: have the energy. [00:43:13] Dr. Erika Schwartz: They can't. Right. [00:43:14] Dr. Taz: Yeah. [00:43:14] Dr. Erika Schwartz: So we [00:43:15] have to give you back the energy. [00:43:16] Dr. Taz: Mm-hmm. [00:43:17] Dr. Erika Schwartz: I mean, there are a lot of women who try really hard [00:43:20] and that's difficult. So while it's difficult, it's not [00:43:25] impossible. And you can find a doctor who cares. They're two here. [00:43:30] But if it's not us, there are a lot of them who are learning and a lot [00:43:35] of them who will care if you make sure that they treat you with [00:43:40] respect. [00:43:41] Dr. Taz: So. [00:43:42] Dr. Erika Schwartz: So [00:43:42] Dr. Taz: I'm gonna ask you a few pointed questions. So [00:43:45] we have an epidemic of what I'm calling progesterone deficiency. Mm-hmm. In women [00:43:50] today, due to the stress levels, many young women carry trauma, we know is connected to [00:43:55] elevated cortisol, declining progesterone, elevated androgens. Should a young [00:44:00] woman in her twenties. [00:44:01] Dr. Taz: Which I did by the way, and once I learned things around 28 or [00:44:05] so, should a young woman start bioidentical hormones? [00:44:08] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Sure. [00:44:09] Dr. Taz: [00:44:10] Should a woman in her perimenopause years as she's going into mid [00:44:15] perimenopause and late perimenopause, should she do a hormone cream or should she [00:44:20] do a patch? [00:44:21] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Depends on the patient. [00:44:22] Dr. Erika Schwartz: I'm not so pro [00:44:25] patch. [00:44:25] Dr. Taz: I'm not [00:44:25] Dr. Erika Schwartz: either as like now. I mean, you know, there are various people on Instagram [00:44:30] that are promoting things, but unfortunately they don't, you know, they say the patch is the only way, but [00:44:35] unfortunately they don't have the experience we're talking about here. [00:44:37] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:44:37] Dr. Erika Schwartz: So we're, I'm talking about, you know, [00:44:40] 40 years of experience, 35 years of experience, so, yeah. [00:44:43] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Patch [00:44:43] Dr. Taz: when? When the patch, when [00:44:45] the cream Right. I have some clinical stories that I don't want to take too much time on, but there are times [00:44:50] where I use the cream. [00:44:51] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Mm-hmm. [00:44:51] Dr. Taz: And we can't get levels to a certain place. Right. So we end up switching [00:44:55] over to the patch. Of course. Totally. And there are also times where we put a patch on and the patient has no ability to [00:45:00] detox the hormones. [00:45:00] Dr. Taz: Exactly. Break the hormones down so we switch back over to the cream. Right. [00:45:04] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Right. [00:45:04] Dr. Taz: So just curious [00:45:05] what your perspective is. [00:45:05] Dr. Erika Schwartz: You just said it. [00:45:07] Dr. Taz: All right. That's it. We're the [00:45:08] Dr. Erika Schwartz: same person, but, [00:45:10] which is a beautiful thing because you know, everybody should be on the same page. Right. Because then it'll make it [00:45:15] easier for us. [00:45:15] Dr. Erika Schwartz: True. To change, right. The way things are. So yes. I [00:45:20] think that the creams are great, they're easy. And I think that [00:45:25] when you say, you know, how do we know? Because that's one of the conventional [00:45:30] like [00:45:30] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:45:30] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Anti compounding. First of all, you don't have to go to compounding. You have [00:45:35] FDA approved. So use F FDA approved if you feel more comfortable. [00:45:38] Dr. Taz: Right, [00:45:38] Dr. Erika Schwartz: right. You know, as much. [00:45:40] About FDA approved, where it's coming from, as you know about compounding, or maybe [00:45:45] less because compounding, you know who they are. You've worked with them, [00:45:50] they, I trust them. But I do work with a lot of FDA approved products. [00:45:55] I don't have a problem with it. I think the creams work a lot better. [00:45:59] Dr. Erika Schwartz: [00:46:00] Gels work a lot better. I think the patches give you [00:46:05] consistent delivery. Your body doesn't make hormones consistently. Makes 'em [00:46:10] impulses. Mm-hmm. So if you do it in the morning and at night with creams, you're probably closer to what your body [00:46:15] would make then if you have a patch. Mm. What I would say is pellets don't, [00:46:19] Dr. Taz: ah, [00:46:20] thank you. [00:46:21] Dr. Taz: Thank you. [00:46:21] Dr. Erika Schwartz: I, but I said that from the beginning, the get go, I have never been so [00:46:24] Dr. Taz: [00:46:25] anti pellet. [00:46:25] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Mm-hmm. I have never been propelled and it's a marketing thing. [00:46:29] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:46:29] Dr. Erika Schwartz: And [00:46:30] unfortunately it delivers. Hormones consistently, [00:46:35] constantly, continuously into your system. And that's not how your system [00:46:40] works. And 10 years down the line, what happens is that your, you know, your [00:46:45] cells have receptors on them, right? [00:46:47] Dr. Erika Schwartz: And the cells, they're [00:46:50] the receptors die and they dull out. 'cause they're constantly being flooded with hormones. [00:46:55] So when you have somebody my age, you're not gonna be able to continue the hormones [00:47:00] because they're not responding to them anymore. So you have to think long term. It's a [00:47:05] long game. [00:47:05] Dr. Taz: So as we do get older, I'm curious, do you think we should be doing more pulsed [00:47:10] based hormone theory therapy? [00:47:12] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Mm-hmm. [00:47:12] Dr. Taz: Where it's, you know, morning, night? [00:47:15] You know, broken up that way. Maybe estrogen in the morning, progesterone at night. I mean, I don't know how you like to do [00:47:20] it. Yeah, totally. But is that pulsed way better than the patch and the pill, which is sort of the mantra [00:47:25] now, right? It went from no hormones to now patches and pills for everybody. [00:47:28] Dr. Taz: Yeah. Kind of where we trouble, [00:47:30] that's kind of where we've landed, [00:47:30] Dr. Erika Schwartz: right? Yeah. So I agree with you a hundred percent. [00:47:33] Dr. Taz: Yeah. [00:47:33] Dr. Erika Schwartz: I think that patch and [00:47:35] pill is not, I mean the progesterone at night by all means, because it helps you sleep. [00:47:40] I think progesterone slow release compound, it is a wonderful way to figure out [00:47:45] what time of the evening you should take it so you could sleep better. [00:47:48] Dr. Erika Schwartz: 'cause everybody has insomnia. [00:47:50] So progesterone by all means and a pill. I don't have a problem with [00:47:55] that. I think a cream estrogen estradiol should be in a cream. [00:48:00] And I think that doing it in the morning, estro gel. If you want FDA approved [00:48:05] estradiol, if you want compounded. By the way, estrogen is estradiol. [00:48:09] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:48:09] Dr. Erika Schwartz: [00:48:10] And, um, that works beautifully. I think you want to [00:48:15] really pay attention to how you need to give the body a [00:48:20] break. [00:48:20] Dr. Taz: Mm. [00:48:21] Dr. Erika Schwartz: The body can't be on everything forever. Um, [00:48:25] because then it won't react. Right. Eventually it just washes through. [00:48:28] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:48:28] Dr. Erika Schwartz: And I think that, [00:48:30] I don't know where this'll end, but I'll be taking hormones forever. [00:48:33] Dr. Erika Schwartz: You could tell. Be sure. They'll, I'll [00:48:35] go down with last with hormones. My life with [00:48:37] Dr. Taz: my hormones got prescriptions in hand going [00:48:40] down. That's right. Alright, well, one more question. What do we do about the pill and our [00:48:45] girls? What, what's your advice? I mean, if they need birth control, they need birth control. [00:48:49] Dr. Taz: Right? [00:48:50] But, but [00:48:50] Dr. Erika Schwartz: not the pill. [00:48:50] Dr. Taz: But what do we do? Okay, let's see. Let's go, let's go there. [00:48:55] What do, what do we do? I have a 17-year-old. What do I do about birth control? What do I [00:49:00] do about teenagers and young women who need hormone regulation may [00:49:05] or may not need. Birth control. How would you answer that question? [00:49:08] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Well, first of all, [00:49:10] it's not just birth control. We're looking for, we're looking STD prevention too. [00:49:14] Dr. Taz: Good [00:49:15] point. Yes. [00:49:15] Dr. Erika Schwartz: So birth control pills will never prevent STDs. They actually will increase [00:49:20] the rate of STDs because you have a false sense of security. You're not gonna get pregnant, but you [00:49:25] get STDs. So I think that that's something I would think first.[00:49:30] [00:49:30] Dr. Erika Schwartz: So I, my kids, I have two girls. Mm-hmm. Too. But [00:49:35] they're your age. So, um, [00:49:40] I never put my kids on birth control. Mm-hmm. And it was really tough because obviously [00:49:45] everyone of their friends were me through [00:49:46] Dr. Taz: that one. [00:49:47] Dr. Erika Schwartz: I, yeah. Right. How do I do that? [00:49:49] Dr. Taz: [00:49:50] Right. [00:49:50] Dr. Erika Schwartz: But I sat down and I explained. I said, you have to use condoms if you're gonna have [00:49:55] sex. [00:49:55] Dr. Taz: Mm-hmm. [00:49:55] Dr. Erika Schwartz: And I think they got it. They understood. It's hard. [00:50:00] It's really hard because in the heat of the moment, you're not gonna think about [00:50:03] Dr. Taz: condoms. [00:50:04] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Yeah. But I think if [00:50:05] you think of yourself and we teach our women, our young women to take care of [00:50:10] themselves, to love themselves, to know how important their bodies are [00:50:15] and how they have to keep them. [00:50:17] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Well, forever, [00:50:20] literally. Then maybe you take better care of yourself and you don't put in [00:50:25] stuff that's toxic to you. Hmm. Then there are those, you know, injectable, [00:50:30] long-term birth control, which is really a bad thing for your body. [00:50:35] And then we see the, you know, this huge outbreak of IVF and [00:50:40] infertility because we have them on my, on birth control pills suppressing [00:50:45] their hormone production for decades. [00:50:46] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Decades from the get go. [00:50:46] Dr. Taz: Yeah. [00:50:47] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Right. So if we care about our girls. [00:50:50] I think we try to teach them they don't need birth control pills, they need [00:50:55] condoms. And there's a lot of stuff about men having, [00:51:00] um, this birth control thing for the men. And you know, [00:51:05] there's mother nature that helps a lot mm-hmm. Along the way. [00:51:07] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Like, you know, the more testosterone [00:51:10] they take, the less there sperm count this. So there are things that help, but [00:51:15] to me, birth control pills are not good. [00:51:18] Dr. Taz: Yeah. What would [00:51:20] you use to regulate hormones? Can we use bioidentical hormones in those, those scenarios? Of course. Like, I feel like [00:51:25] so many young girls, they need progesterone. [00:51:27] Dr. Erika Schwartz: They do. [00:51:27] Dr. Taz: You know, [00:51:28] Dr. Erika Schwartz: and we do, we actually, [00:51:30] um, I created a progesterone, it's called pro cream. [00:51:32] Dr. Taz: Mm-hmm. [00:51:33] Dr. Erika Schwartz: And it's a [00:51:35] progesterone 50 milligrams, a very low dose and. Teenagers love it because before [00:51:40] your period, you know, and how as a mother of a teen girl mm-hmm. You know what happens? [00:51:43] Dr. Taz: Oh yeah. [00:51:44] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Mm-hmm. [00:51:45] And the door slamming, maybe you wanted less slam. [00:51:48] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Mm-hmm. So if they [00:51:50] take it once or twice a day before their periods, they don't have PMS anymore. [00:51:55] And instead of like suffering through it, 'cause they suffer [00:51:59] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:51:59] Dr. Erika Schwartz: As much [00:52:00] as you as a parent suffer. Right. And I as a parent suffer. 'cause I didn't have that [00:52:05] in those days. Um, it's a very easy way to help without [00:52:10] any damage. [00:52:10] Dr. Taz: Right. I think that's, so really the IUD how do you feel about [00:52:15] the IUD? [00:52:15] Dr. Erika Schwartz: I think the IUD is a great method of contraception [00:52:20] and I think, I don't care if they're 16 actually. I'm not like 20 ones [00:52:25] not a right. [00:52:25] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:52:26] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Do or die. [00:52:27] Dr. Taz: Right. [00:52:27] Dr. Erika Schwartz: But. IUD has to have [00:52:30] no hormones in it. Like as in para guard, copper seven, whatever you wanna call it. [00:52:34] Dr. Erika Schwartz: [00:52:35] You don't want morena, you don't want anything that has synthetic hormones in it, [00:52:40] because it does. So you wanna make sure that IUDs a great thing. I mean, I use [00:52:45] IUD, uh, my girls use IUDs and it works great. You [00:52:50] have a local, you know, they, you get discouraged. I don't know why the OBGYNs discouraged [00:52:55] them. [00:52:55] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Mm-hmm. Or they only want Morena Right about, which makes no sense to me. Mm-hmm. Right. [00:53:00] Because yeah, you have side effects from it. The side effects you cramps are [00:53:05] worse and you get more bleeding at the beginning, a few months. [00:53:10] But if you think about it in the balance, right, [00:53:15] you have a local discomfort and you're [00:53:20] protecting the whole body at the same time. [00:53:21] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Yeah. So why take something that will destroy your [00:53:25] whole body when you don't have to? [00:53:29] Dr. Taz: How you brought [00:53:30] something up that I think is really important, and especially as we're winding down here. You talked [00:53:35] about, I'm assuming, do your girls have children? [00:53:39] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Yeah, of [00:53:39] Dr. Taz: course. So [00:53:40] you're have [00:53:40] Dr. Erika Schwartz: five grandchildren. [00:53:40] Dr. Taz: You have, you have five grandchildren, one [00:53:42] Dr. Erika Schwartz: boy and four girls. [00:53:43] Dr. Taz: And then you have two [00:53:45] daughter Have two daughters. Yeah. And countless patience. You know, and you, you [00:53:50] made a comment about teaching our girls to love themselves and love their bodies. Right. Which I [00:53:55] think that many women don't even do going into their fifties. No. You know, I, and even [00:54:00] going into their sixties, honestly. [00:54:01] Dr. Taz: Mm-hmm. So how do we do that? [00:54:05] How do we teach ourselves to love our own bodies and how do we teach [00:54:10] a young girl a teenager to love their bodies? You know, when I look at my [00:54:15] daughter's generation and her. You know, her group or her cohort, you know, just the [00:54:20] rise of everything from eating disorders to, you know, [00:54:25] PMS and PCOS and endometriosis. [00:54:27] Dr. Taz: I mean, I could go on forever, you know, they seem sicker [00:54:30] to me or they seem not. Well, you know, and again, I don't know if it's the old person in the room saying, oh, those, [00:54:35] those youngsters aren't well, but like, how do you, you're not the old person, [00:54:38] Dr. Taz: so [00:54:38] Dr. Erika Schwartz: not, you're not. [00:54:39] Dr. Taz: [00:54:40] So how do we, how do we help them and help ourselves?[00:54:45] [00:54:45] Dr. Erika Schwartz: We practice, um, individualized medicine, we [00:54:50] become the ones who teach them by example. [00:54:55] So if you love your body, if they see you taking care of yourself, [00:55:00] they'll do it. If you show them, eventually, they'll [00:55:05] hear it. I think that women have been suppressed and repressed for so [00:55:10] long that all we could do is try to do better for them than we [00:55:15] did for ourselves. [00:55:16] Dr. Erika Schwartz: So we missed the most important piece, which is doing [00:55:20] well for yourself. And it's not just getting our hair done and our nails [00:55:25] done. It's about the way we take care of our bodies, the way [00:55:30] we build muscle strength, the way we do it for ourselves, the way we [00:55:35] sleep, the way we eat. And it's for us, not for the man or [00:55:40] the partner or whatever, right? [00:55:41] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Not to attract another human being, but just for [00:55:45] ourselves. Because if we do it that way, the next generation will hear it. [00:55:50] They'll do it too. [00:55:51] Dr. Taz: They'll copy us. Oh wow. So [00:55:55] powerful. All right. You have a book that, mm-hmm. Is this book Newly Out? Don't Let Your Doctor Kill You. [00:55:59] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Yes. It just came [00:56:00] out last week. [00:56:01] Dr. Taz: I love it. [00:56:01] Dr. Taz: We [00:56:01] Dr. Erika Schwartz: just had the book [00:56:02] Dr. Taz: last week. [00:56:03] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Yeah, the book launched. This is brand new. [00:56:04] Dr. Taz: Oh [00:56:04] Dr. Erika Schwartz: my gosh. [00:56:05] Well, it's a release of a book I wrote in nine, in [00:56:10] 2015, I think, or 16. [00:56:11] Dr. Taz: Okay. Excellent. What are you hoping to accomplish in this book? [00:56:14] Dr. Erika Schwartz: I [00:56:15] want to empower people, uh, to not allow [00:56:20] the doctor to intimidate them. [00:56:22] Dr. Taz: Mm-hmm. [00:56:23] Dr. Erika Schwartz: To scare them. [00:56:23] Dr. Erika Schwartz: The 6% [00:56:25] story. [00:56:25] Dr. Taz: Yeah. [00:56:26] Dr. Erika Schwartz: To feel that they can make [00:56:30] their own decisions. We have Google making decisions for us. We have the medical [00:56:35] profession making decisions for us, the pharmaceuticals. Everybody's making decisions for us. [00:56:39] Dr. Taz: [00:56:40] Mm-hmm. [00:56:41] Dr. Erika Schwartz: We need to take a breath, stop [00:56:45] and not react and fear. Is [00:56:50] the most pervasive of emotions that [00:56:55] the medical profession has created and literally pedals [00:57:00] their goods through. [00:57:01] Dr. Erika Schwartz: And I think that the way you want to do it is [00:57:05] by making people less fearful. Helping people know that the [00:57:10] doctor doesn't know best because the doctor doesn't live in your body back to the body. [00:57:15] The doctor doesn't live in your body, that you live in your body. [00:57:20] And so the doctor can give you advice and you have to leave [00:57:25] and think. [00:57:26] Dr. Erika Schwartz: And then you don't have to be afraid. Be, and you [00:57:30] don't have to go from doctor to doctor to doctor. And you have to realize that unless the [00:57:35] doctor treats you with respect and pays attention to you as an individual that [00:57:40] you are, you just move on. It's like any other relationship. [00:57:43] Dr. Taz: Mm. [00:57:43] Dr. Erika Schwartz: I mean, you wouldn't stay in a [00:57:45] bad marriage, would you? [00:57:45] Dr. Taz: No, and I think I would. Add to that and just [00:57:50] remind everybody that the body actually has an inner wisdom. [00:57:53] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Yes. [00:57:54] Dr. Taz: And [00:57:55] if I think that you and I and others in the field, our [00:58:00] responsibility is to help you tap into that inner wisdom. So at the end of the day, you're [00:58:05] actually making the decisions. We're just kind of like, I forgot the character that says, oh, I was just trying to [00:58:10] show you yourself, you know? [00:58:11] Dr. Taz: Mm-hmm. And like we're just sort of that mirror player that's like [00:58:15] pulling it out of you, you know? Mm-hmm. Just like a coach would, or a mentor would, or some of these other figures in your [00:58:20] life, you know? Yeah. So, quarterback them. Quarterback. I love that word. That's the [00:58:25] word. Like quarterback a whole lot. [00:58:26] Dr. Taz: We need to quarterback care. [00:58:27] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Yeah. [00:58:29] Dr. Taz: You are [00:58:30] incredible. [00:58:30] Dr. Erika Schwartz: So are you. [00:58:31] Dr. Taz: 40 something years. You, I mean, again, I'm gonna [00:58:35] come back to where we started. Like when I look for my inspiration, you're one of [00:58:40] the places that I look. Thank. Thank you. Because I'm just so odd, you're proud, impressed by all that you've [00:58:45] done and probably all that you've had to kind of like barrel and fight your way through. [00:58:49] Dr. Taz: I don't think I [00:58:49] Dr. Erika Schwartz: [00:58:50] noticed it [00:58:50] Dr. Taz: because you were just so passionate about what you do. Right? So I think that's incredible. So I'm gonna [00:58:55] end our time today asking you a question. What makes you whole [00:59:00] [00:59:01] Dr. Erika Schwartz: doing this? [00:59:02] Dr. Taz: Your work? [00:59:03] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Helping patients. [00:59:05] Helping, helping open people's eyes. Giving [00:59:10] love to them, which you don't really get very much in the medical profession. [00:59:14] Dr. Taz: [00:59:15] No. It's a whole different take on healing. Mm-hmm. It's a whole different take. [00:59:18] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Right. [00:59:18] Dr. Taz: Well thank you so much for your [00:59:20] time today. The book is Don't Let Your Doctor Kill You Available now everywhere the books are [00:59:25] sold. [00:59:25] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Mm-hmm. [00:59:26] Dr. Taz: Dr. Schwarz is heavily involved in A four M, which is the organization that [00:59:30] helps to train and really set doctors up in a different path, different from the way [00:59:35] that we were conventionally trained. [00:59:36] Dr. Taz: I've spoken there as well. It's a powerful organization. [00:59:39] Dr. Erika Schwartz: You are. Great. [00:59:39] Dr. Taz: [00:59:40] And what else are you involved in? Is, are there any other, my [00:59:42] Dr. Erika Schwartz: practice. [00:59:44] Dr. Taz: Tell us [00:59:44] Dr. Erika Schwartz: a little bit about [00:59:45] that. You know? Yeah. I do some consulting, but not for pharmaceuticals. I do help [00:59:50] in the area of wellness prevention, [00:59:55] longevity, um, help. [00:59:57] Dr. Erika Schwartz: People put together practices and try to [01:00:00] grow our way of thinking to set up [01:00:01] Dr. Taz: the next generation. Right. That's right. Our healers and [01:00:04] Dr. Erika Schwartz: that's right. I [01:00:05] won't be here forever. [01:00:06] Dr. Taz: Aw, well you're doing a great job in the time that you are, so thank you so much. Thank for [01:00:10] taking time out today. Thank you for your busy schedule to join us. [01:00:13] Dr. Taz: The book is everywhere. Books are sold. She's on [01:00:15] Instagram too, by the way. She didn't mention that, but I've seen her on there. So. But anyhow, thank you again and [01:00:20] for everybody else watching or listening to this episode of Whole Plus, we post new [01:00:25] episodes every week. We're gonna change medicine. We're on a mission. [01:00:27] Dr. Erika Schwartz: We are. [01:00:28] Dr. Taz: So stay tuned in. [01:00:30] We'll see you next time. [01:00:31] Dr. Erika Schwartz: Thank you. [01:00:31] Dr. Taz: Before you go take a second to reflect on what [01:00:35] stood out for you today. Then if you can leave a quick review wherever you're [01:00:40] listening, it really helps other people discover Whole Plus and start their own healing [01:00:45] journey. And don't forget to follow me on Instagram at Dr. [01:00:47] Dr. Taz: Taz md. I love hearing [01:00:50] how these episodes are supporting you.