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Elan Mosbacher - The Marketplace Playbook · Boardroom Blitz

• jerVID: Hey Gary, what's up, man? JEREMIE: Hey Gary, what's up, man? GARY: It's it's a day in the week. It's Friday. I was gonna say it's I was gonna say it's Friday. nothing's up. it well it's fall. It's fall. The Bears are having a good season. so you know, things are pretty good. How about yourself, Jerry? garVID: It's f it's a day in the week. It's Friday. I was gonna say it's I was gonna say it's Friday. nothing's up. it well it's fall. It's fall. The Bears are having a good season. so you know, things are pretty good. How about yourself, Jerry? jerVID: It's a day in the week. Yes. elanVID: Yeah. ELAN: Yeah. JEREMIE: It's a day in the week. Yes. jerVID: That's a lie. JEREMIE: That's a lie. jerVID: Let's hope. JEREMIE: Well, let's hope. jerVID: you know, just hanging out, having a good time, trying to stay out of trouble, as I always do. it is a wonderful time of the year. I love that all the leaves have been changing and it's great. And I'm getting a chance to get outside a little bit between the 17,000 hours a day at work. so I have to ask, I have say, well, yeah, and we'll we'll be burning all year, all winter long. It's always fun. I gotta say, last time you and I were hanging out together, you gave me this book of Boys and Men. I'm like halfway through it. Thank you for the recommendation last time. I appreciate it. JEREMIE: you know, just hanging out, having a good time, trying to set out of trouble, as I always do. it is a wonderful time of the year. I love that all the leaves have been changing and it's great. And I'm getting a chance to get outside a little bit between the 17,000 hours a day of work. so I have to ask, I have say, well, yeah, and we'll we'll be burning all year, all winter long. It's always fun. I gotta say, last time you and I were hanging out together, you gave me this book of boys and men. I'm like halfway through it. Thank you for the recommendation last time. I appreciate ELAN: Yeah, I'll try it on the garVID: You you you you burned all the brush, right? You burned all the brush. GARY: You you you you burned all the brush, right? You burned all the brush. Yes. Yes. garVID: Yes. Yes. How is it so far? GARY: How is it so far? JEREMIE: it. jerVID: It's good. It it's it's definitely worth a read. I I'm really enjoying the content and there's there's a lot to unpack in it. so it's one of those books that fair listener, I without spending our entire day today talking about it, I would just say it's worth a read. If nothing else, you should read the synopsis and then and dig in, especially if you're a parent or thinking about becoming a parent. It's it's quite good. Quite good. Correct. Yeah, for sure. For sure. Yeah. Well, funny enough, our guest today is a parent, which is pretty fun. JEREMIE: It's good. It it's it's definitely worth a read. I I'm really enjoying the content and there's there's a lot to unpack in it. so it's one of those books that fair listener, I without spending our entire day today talking about it, I would just say it's worth a read. If nothing else, you should read the synopsis and then and dig in, especially if you're a parent or thinking about becoming a parent. It's it's quite good. Quite good. Correct. Yeah, for sure. For sure. Yeah. Well, funny enough, our guest today is a parent, which is pretty fun. ELAN: Mm-hmm. garVID: Yes. GARY: Yes. Follow. garVID: All the GARY: Especially if a parent of a young boy, I I think. yeah, sure. Yeah. Well good. garVID: Especially if a parent of a young boy, I I'd think. yeah, sure. Yeah. Well good. Yeah. GARY: Yeah. jerVID: And outside of being a parent, he's also scaled, like see parking, insurance, and now healthcare companies, which is awesome. So it makes it makes him either an exceptionally versatile operator or a man who is con constitutionally incapable of choosing an easy industry because these are not easy spaces that he's played in. But Elon Mossbacher is our guest today and he's the co-founder and CEO of Pinch. JEREMIE: And outside of being a parent, he's also scaled, like see parking, insurance, and now healthcare companies, which is awesome. So it makes it makes him either an exceptionally versatile operator or a man who is con constitutionally incapable of choosing an easy industry, because these are not easy spaces that he's played in. But Elon Mossbacher is our guest today and he's the co-founder and CEO of Pinch. garVID: Ha ha ha GARY: Yeah. garVID: Yeah. jerVID: He was formerly with with a company that a lot of folks in Chicago and a lot of folks across the country know, Spot Hero. So we're gonna have a great time listening to his leadership journey and hearing some fabulous things from him. Elon, welcome to Border and Blitz. JEREMIE: He was formerly with with a company that a lot of folks in Chicago and a lot of folks across the country know, Spot Hero. So we're gonna have a great time listening to his leadership journey and hearing some fabulous things from him. Elon, welcome to Border and Blitz. garVID: Yes. GARY: Yes. ELAN: Thank you. It's an honor to be here. Thanks for having me. elanVID: Thank you, it's an honor to be here. Thanks for having me. garVID: What can we find out? GARY: Welcome, let's go. jerVID: We're so excited you could be with us. Super fun. All right. So we started. I mentioned you have you're a father, you have kids. This book is great. Let's talk first and foremost about your family. I want to hear about your kids because it is such a difficult thing to juggle a startup and your prior career choices as well with a young family. So maybe we just jump right into it. Tell us, tell us what that journey has been. JEREMIE: We're so excited you could be with us. Super fun. All right. So we started. I mentioned you have you're a father. You have kids. This book is great. Let's talk first and foremost about your family. I want to hear about your kids because it is such a difficult thing to juggle a startup and your prior career choices as well with a young family. So maybe we'll just jump right into it. Tell us, tell us what that journey has been. ELAN: Sure, I'd I'd love to talk about my kids, but I I don't think I can start talking about my kids without first talking about like my grandparents and where I came from and their whole journey. So if we can step back, I think it's a good it's a good Chicago story, it's a good entrepreneurial story. But it it started like this. once on one side, my father's side of family, my grandparents were Jewish German Holocaust refugees. They lived in Germany. My family lived in Germany for hundreds of years in one small town. elanVID: Sure, I'd I'd love to talk about my kids, but I I don't think I can start talking about my kids without first talking about like my grandparents and where I came from and their whole journey. So if we can step back, I think it's a good it's a good Chicago story, it's a good entrepreneurial story. But it it started like this. once on one side, my father's side of family, my grandparents were Jewish German Holocaust refugees. They lived in Germany. My family lived in Germany for hundreds of years in one small town. GARY: Mm. garVID: Mm. jerVID: Let's do that, it's fine. JEREMIE: Let's do that, it's fine. GARY: Mm-hmm. garVID: Mm. ELAN: My great grandfather fought for the German army in World War One, died from complications from the war. And before World War Two, when my grandfather was in high school age, he actually had to drop out of high school. he started to learn a trade knowing he might have to leave. elanVID: My great grandfather fought for the German army in World War One, died from complications from the war. And before World War Two, when my grandfather was in high school age, he actually had to drop out of high school. he started to learn a trade knowing he might have to leave. ELAN: along the way he met my grandmother, who was also high school age. And around the age of eighteen, they both escaped elanVID: along the way he met my grandmother, who was also high school age. And around the age of eighteen, they both escaped ELAN: Nazi Germany just in the nick time, elanVID: Nazi Germany just in the nick of time, ELAN: through their own path. My grandfather landed in New York, my grandmother in elanVID: through their own path. My grandfather landed in New York, my grandmother in Chicago, ELAN: Chicago, those entire those three years, they wrote letters to each other. elanVID: those entire those three years, they wrote letters to each other. and we still have those letters. So it's literally like imagine kids today texting each other, like college-age kids, we have those letters that they wrote each other, ELAN: and we still have those letters. So it's literally like imagine kids today texting each other, like college-age kids, we have those letters that they wrote each other, jerVID: That's awesome. JEREMIE: Awesome. ELAN: really recounting that entire journey. elanVID: really recounting that entire journey. ELAN: and so literally, elanVID: and so literally, ELAN: the way I ended up in Chicago was because elanVID: the way I ended up in Chicago was because they made their way from Europe and were welcome to this country. my grandfather ended in New York, my grandmother here, and the last letter they wrote. ELAN: they made their way from Europe and were welcome to this country. my grandfather ended in New York, my grandmother here, and the last letter they wrote. elanVID: My grandmother or my grandfather, sorry, I wrote to my grandmother, Dear Alice, I just bought a Greyhound ticket after saving up for a year. I'm coming to Chicago on August fifteenth, ELAN: My grandmother or my grandfather, sorry, I wrote to my grandmother, Dear Alice, I just bought a Greyhound ticket after saving up for a year. I'm coming to Chicago on August fifteenth, elanVID: nineteen forty one, for anyone counting. ELAN: nineteen forty one, for anyone counting. can elanVID: can ELAN: you please pick me up elanVID: you please pick me up at the Greyhound station or the bus station? And four generations later, my children are now still in Chicago. ELAN: at the Greyhound station or the bus station? And four generations later, my children are now still in Chicago. garVID: Cool. jerVID: Basically. ELAN: so that's power of of of that side story. On the other side, elanVID: so that's the power of of of that side story. On the other side, GARY: Yeah. garVID: Yeah, yeah. Yeah, you're not. elanVID: my ELAN: my elanVID: my my mom's parents ELAN: my my mom's parents elanVID: who are in their 90s now living in Florida. ELAN: who are in their nineties now living in Florida. elanVID: but they they were born in this country. They also met in high school. My grandfather proposed to my grandmother at her high school graduation because he didn't want her to leave town. ELAN: but they they were born in this country. They also met in high school. My grandfather proposed to my grandmother at her high school graduation because he didn't want her to leave town. elanVID: they got married, had three kids very young, ELAN: they got married, had three kids very young, garVID: You mean? GARY: Yeah. ELAN: and they were business partners elanVID: and they were business partners for 70 plus years ELAN: for 70 plus years and married together. So when I talk about my kids, elanVID: and married together. So when I talk about my kids, GARY: Yeah. garVID: Yeah. ELAN: my story growing up was one of these like refugee elanVID: my story growing up was one of these like refugee ELAN: Grandparents who were doing all the things that people do to kind of live their life. And on the other side, elanVID: Grandparents who were doing all the things that people do to kind of live their life. And on the other side, garVID: Mm-hmm. GARY: Mm-hmm. jerVID: Yeah. elanVID: grandparents who were very entrepreneurial through all the ups and downs, ELAN: grandparents who were very entrepreneurial through all the ups and downs. elanVID: and both built awesome families. So now come to me and my kids, right? ELAN: and both built awesome families. So now come to me and my kids, right? GARY: Yeah. elanVID: my wife and I, believe it or not, met in Chicago in high school. ELAN: my wife and I, believe it or not, met in Chicago in high school. elanVID: During the college years, I got into, know, fine all the businessy things. ELAN: During the college years, I got into, you know, fine all the businessy things. garVID: goodness. GARY: goodness. elanVID: And when we were wrapping up college, my wife's like ELAN: And when we were wrapping up college, my wife's like, elanVID: my wife was like, ELAN: Well, everyone's getting married. We have to get married too. So I was like, okay, sure. So so so so we two ended up getting married right after college, moved back to Chicago, and I kind of looked around like it's like in second, and really I got an attack because elanVID: Everyone's getting married. We have to get married too. So I was like, Okay, sure. So so so so we two ended up getting married right after college, moved back to Chicago, and I kind of looked around like it's my goodness and second and really I got an attack because jerVID: Like sweet. JEREMIE: Like, sweet. garVID: Yep. elanVID: I came back to Chicago and I like, I wanna do venture capital. By the time I moved back to Chicago, there wasn't much venture capital. I had not much experience. I had not much money and there weren't many firms that would ELAN: I came back to Chicago and I like, I don't want to do venture capital. By the time I moved back to Chicago, there wasn't much venture capital. I had not much experience. I had not much money and there weren't many firms that would GARY: Mm-hmm. garVID: Right. JEREMIE: Mm-hmm. GARY: Mm-hmm. elanVID: take me. And so I that that ELAN: take me and so I th that elanVID: started my journey into stars. But getting to my kids. So we have three kids, one's in high school, one's in middle school, one's in elementary school. ELAN: Started my journey into stars. But getting to my kids. So we have three kids, one's in high school, one's in middle school, one's in elementary school. GARY: Yeah. garVID: Yeah. ELAN: they're all awesome. elanVID: they're all awesome. garVID: Yeah. GARY: Yeah. ELAN: they all have the unique strengths and unique challenges. And I would certainly say elanVID: they all the unique strengths and unique challenges. And I would certainly say as we were building spot here when they were younger, it was hard. It was really, really hard to do a startup full time, to have kids full time. ELAN: as we were building spot here when they were younger, it was hard. It was really, really hard to do a startup full time, to have kids full time. GARY: Okay. But then garVID: Okay. But then elanVID: and then also ELAN: and then also elanVID: I was actually working on a part time MBA. ELAN: I was actually working on a part time MBA. on top of both of those too. and so that was yeah. I so I did I did a Northwestern. So I basically I had elanVID: on top of both of those too. and so that was yeah. I so I did I did a Northwestern. So I basically I had jerVID: I was gonna ask if that was happening at that time. So you did Northwestern, right? Yeah. Mm-hmm. JEREMIE: I was gonna ask if that was happening at that time. So you did Northwestern, right? Yeah. Mhm. ELAN: one kid elanVID: one kid ELAN: pre Spot Hero elanVID: pre Spot Hero and then as I joined Spot Hero a couple months after my son, my second child was was born, and literally I was like ELAN: and then as I joined Spot Hero a couple months after my son, my second child was was born, and literally I was like GARY: Mm-hmm. boy. garVID: boy. ELAN: late twenties, probably the second oldest person at the company, only person s second person to have a kid. elanVID: late twenties, probably the second oldest person at the company, only person s second person to have a kid. ELAN: first person who a kid during the company. There was no plan for that. elanVID: first person who had a kid during the company. There was no plan for that. ELAN: while finished Ban BA. No no policies, no nothing. elanVID: while finished Ban BA. No no policies, no nothing. garVID: Probably no policies either. GARY: Probably no policies either. ELAN: third kid, no policies, no nothing. And you know, it's fought here in subsequent con companies I've been involved in building that and making much better. But for me personally, yeah, I had like no break, barely a break, and too too little of a break, unfortunately. elanVID: third kid, no policies, no nothing. And you know, it's fought here in subsequent con companies I've been involved in building that and making much better. But for me personally, yeah, I had like no break, barely a break, and too too little of a break, unfortunately. garVID: Mm, mhm, mhm, mm-hmm. GARY: Mm-hmm, mm-hmm, mm-hmm. elanVID: but jerVID: Well, I I've not ELAN: but JEREMIE: Well, I I've jerVID: met your wife, but I I I would imag I I can already picture in her a kindred spirit with with JEREMIE: not met your wife, but I I I would imag I I can already picture in her a kindred spirit with jerVID: wife that the JEREMIE: my wife. The jerVID: the difficulties associated with building a business while raising very young children as a couple is I mean that that was my path as well. And so I'm already like, man, I I must meet your wife. My wife and her must exchange conversations and stories, horror stories and and happy stories about how how tough that journey is. JEREMIE: the difficulties associated with building a business while raising very young children, as a couple is I mean, that that was my path as well. And so I'm already like, man, I I must meet your wife. My wife and her must exchange conversations and stories, horror stories and and happy stories about how how tough that journey ELAN: Sure. elanVID: Sure. garVID: Just just so GARY: Just just so JEREMIE: is. garVID: so GARY: so garVID: the audience know potentially how crazy you are, when did you start that MBA part-time program? Was it post-starting the company? GARY: the audience know potentially how crazy you are, when did you start that MBA part-time program? Was it post starting the company? ELAN: so this so I started okay, imagine roughly I'm like in my late twenties, I've done like two startups in Chicago that like were were good journeys for me learning. elanVID: so this so I started okay, imagine roughly I'm like in my late twenties. I've done like two startups in Chicago that like were were good journeys for me learning. ELAN: I was starting to get a little bored, this like pre spot hero. I was like, Do I do accelerate labs? Do I start a venture fund? Do I get an MBA? Do I I was kind of like, do I go run a company, elanVID: I was starting to get a little bored, this like pre spot hero. I was like, do I do accelerate labs? Do I start a venture fund? Do I get an MBA? Do I I was kinda like, do I go run a company, garVID: Mm-hmm. yeah. GARY: Mm-hmm. yeah. Yeah, yeah. garVID: Yeah, yeah. elanVID: be ahead of marketing, go do a VC thing? ELAN: be ahead of marketing, go do a VC thing? elanVID: And the way it kind of came about is like, maybe I should maybe I should do an MBA. ELAN: And the way it kinda came about is like, maybe I should maybe I should do an MBA. and really two things happened. One is elanVID: and really two things happened. One is my friend ELAN: my friend Stella Garber elanVID: Stella Garber ELAN: who elanVID: who GARY: Mm, garVID: Mm-hmm. elanVID: was in University of Chicago doing the the kind of the new venture challenge class at Booth. ELAN: was in University of Chicago doing the the kind of the new venture challenge class at Booth. jerVID: Yeah, yeah. garVID: Yep. GARY: Yep, JEREMIE: Yeah. ELAN: she was basically, Elon, you wanna do an MBA? Why don't you join me and j join our new venture challenge team? elanVID: she was basically, Elon, you wanna do an MBA? Why don't you join me and j join our new venture challenge team? ELAN: and long story short, we won the competition that year. We got first place. A whole bunch of folks in town, you know, wanted to write us checks. We're like, wait, this was a class project. We don't actually want to build this business. elanVID: and long story short, we won the competition that year. We got first place. A whole bunch of folks in town, you know, wanted to write us checks. We're like, wait, this was a class project, we don't actually want to build this business. GARY: Yeah. garVID: Yeah. elanVID: And and and we said no. I was like, right, MBA doesn't seem so bad. Maybe I'll apply and I won't get in, maybe I'll get in and I won't start, maybe I'll start and I won't finish. ELAN: And and and we said no. I was like, all right, MBA doesn't seem so bad. Maybe I'll apply and I won't get in. Maybe I'll get in and I won't start. Maybe I'll start and I won't finish. elanVID: and I think one class in, ELAN: and I think one class in, I s a drin spot here. And then two months after that had a second kid. And so we're literally talking, my life was like wake up, get kids out of the house, go to work, leave work, go to class, get home, see wife, not kids, and do it all over again. elanVID: I s I joined spot here. And then two months after that had a second kid. And so we're literally talking, my life was like wake up, get kids out of the house, go to work, leave work, go to class, get home, see wife, not kids, and do it all over again. jerVID: Yeah. You're like, here we go. Yeah. JEREMIE: Yeah. You're like, here we go. jerVID: Got JEREMIE: And go to bed, yeah. jerVID: a bet, yeah. ELAN: yeah, elanVID: yeah, ELAN: and that that that was life for well. Now I live a much more sustainable life. I don't think I could do that at this stage. But elanVID: and that that that was life for well. Now I live a much more sustainable life. I don't think I could do that at this stage. But GARY: I I I'm I'm pretty sure that garVID: I I I'm I'm pretty sure that GARY: entrepreneurs are like this where it's just everything is now. You know, like let's just maybe try to do it now. garVID: entrepreneurs are like this where it's just everything is now. You know, like let's just maybe try to do it now. elanVID: Exactly. You got it, you ELAN: Exactly. You got it, you jerVID: Well, and the thing JEREMIE: Well, and the ELAN: got it. Yeah. elanVID: got it. Yeah. jerVID: is too, like JEREMIE: thing is too, like that's super relevant for what we're trying to help our audience to think about and listen in on and and understand, like that what's the sacrifice required sometimes and then and how do you learn how to navigate that, right? So here you are, you're a young executive you're a young professional, sorry, looking at routes to achieve the sort of executive and entrepreneurial goals that you've got in your head. And so you have to make these very difficult choices, like what will that path take? And then what is the sacrifice you and your wife will have to make to enable jerVID: that's super relevant for what we're trying to help our audience to think about and listen in on and and understand, like that what's the sacrifice required sometimes and then and how do you learn how to navigate that, right? So here you are, you're a young executive you're a young professional, sorry, looking at routes to achieve the sort of executive and entrepreneurial goals that you've got in your head. And so you have to make these very difficult choices, like what will that path take? And then what is the sacrifice you and your wife will have to make to enable? garVID: Mm-hmm. GARY: Yeah, okay. garVID: Yeah, okay. JEREMIE: that? jerVID: Right. JEREMIE: Right. and it's real. It's very meaningful. jerVID: and it's real. It's very meaningful. elanVID: Absolutely. ELAN: Absolutely. Absolutely. And she and she definitely made more sacrifice than me. Like she she she enabled it. It was only possible because of her. elanVID: Absolutely. And she and she definitely made more sacrifice than me. Like she she she enabled it. It was only possible because of her. garVID: Mm-hmm. GARY: Yeah. ELAN: also I often say like I feel like I can only do two elanVID: also I often say like I feel like I can only do two ELAN: things well and maybe a little bit of a third. elanVID: things well and maybe a little bit of a third. ELAN: And so for me, I was doing family as well as I could. elanVID: And so for me, I was doing family as well as I could. jerVID: Mm-hmm. JEREMIE: Mm-hmm. ELAN: I elanVID: I ELAN: was doing spot here as well as I could. And then I was doing the MBA, but my goal was never like elanVID: was doing spot here as well as I could. And then I was doing the MBA, but my goal was never like ELAN: get the perfect grade. Like I I was I was not elanVID: get the perfect grade. Like I I was I was not jerVID: Right, right. ELAN: I was a very good college student and I was elanVID: I was a very good college student and I was ELAN: you know, I did as elanVID: you know, I did as ELAN: little as possible, but as much as elanVID: little as possible, but as much as ELAN: necessary I did elanVID: I did know, ELAN: know, elanVID: I showed up and I did I did what I had to do. I did the work, yeah. ELAN: I showed up and I did I did what I had to do. I did the work, yeah. jerVID: You did it. Yeah, you showed up, you did the work. Well, and I would argue too, and JEREMIE: You did it. Yeah, you showed up, you did the work. Well, and I would argue too, and this is funny too. So a lot of the the elite MBA programs, jerVID: this is funny too. So a lot of the the elite MBA programs, so Northwestern's fabulous, University of Chicago's fabulous, Harvard, all the the top five and ten programs, even 15, they're amazing schools. And what the deans of most of these schools will tell you as a student when you walk in, and I think some of the professors will tell you this too it's like, look, you're here to learn a ton and to develop and grow skills, but like the reality is, especially at that tier, JEREMIE: so Northwestern's fabulous, University of Chicago's fabulous, Harvard Fab all the the top five and ten programs, even 15, they're amazing schools. And what the deans of most of these schools will tell you as a student when you walk in, and I think some of the professors will tell you this too it's like, look, you're here to learn a ton and to develop and grow skills, but like the reality is, especially at that tier, jerVID: building a network of people that you can work with and rely on to help you get where you're trying to go and vice versa for the next 15 years. It's the principles that matter and the networks that you build that matter, just like in business, right? That's one of the that's one of the really cool things about the MBA that connects directly to the real world work, right? So JEREMIE: you're building a network of people that you can work with and rely on to help you get where you're trying to go and vice versa for the next 15 years. It's the principles that matter and the networks that you build that matter, just like in business, right? That's one of the that's one of the really cool things about the MBA that connects directly to to the real world work. Right. So garVID: Yeah. GARY: Okay. jerVID: know, you don't you don't have to go get an A on every on every assignment in business school. What you have to do is get an A on all the relationships JEREMIE: know, you don't you don't have to go get an A on every on every assignment in business school. What you have to do is get an A on all the relationships and the relationship building portion of it. So you can leverage those relationships and help each other out as you grow your careers. jerVID: relationship building portion of it so you can leverage those relationships and help each other out as you grow your careers. ELAN: Absolutely. elanVID: Absolutely. jerVID: like you did a great job. Well, funny enough, so I remember reading Speeder Northwestern. There was, I might get this slightly wrong, so please correct me if I if I missed it, but JEREMIE: Sounds like you did a great job. Well, funny enough, so I remember reading Speeder Northwestern. There was, I might get this slightly wrong, so please correct me if I if I missed it, but garVID: Cats. JEREMIE: some of the research you did or read at Kellogg, as I recall, helps you to identify like the most valuable customer segment for a spot hero, right? jerVID: of the research you did or read at Kellogg, as I recall, helps you to identify like the most valuable customer segment for Spot Hero, right? garVID: Mm. GARY: Mm. Interesting. jerVID: cheapest customer acquired wasn't necessarily the customer you wanted. I believe as I re I I read that you wrote that or said it somewhere. JEREMIE: the cheapest customer acquired wasn't necessarily the customer you wanted. I believe as I re I I read that you wrote that or said it somewhere. elanVID: Yeah, that's r that's roughly it. ELAN: Yeah, that's r that's roughly it. garVID: interesting. GARY: interesting. jerVID: Yeah, and so this came out of your work at Northwestern and one of the insights. So they're a perfect example of how, hey, you might not have gotten the A in the class, but you picked up the right insight, right? And created a fabulously helps create a fabulously valuable business as a result. JEREMIE: Yeah, and so this came out of your work at Northwestern and one of the insights. So they're a perfect example of how, hey, you might not have gotten the A in the class, but you picked up the right insight, right? And created a fabulously helps create a fabulously valuable business as a result. elanVID: Totally. In fact, I I'll kind of maybe share a little bit of the Spot Hero journey really quick for anyone who's not familiar, and then I can kind of share how Kellogg on the front ELAN: Totally. In fact, I I'll kind of maybe share a little bit of the Spot Hero journey really quick for anyone who's not familiar, and then I can kind of share how Kellogg on the front jerVID: Yeah, let's do that, please. JEREMIE: Yeah, let's do that, please. ELAN: end and back end influenced that a bit. But the long story short, if if anyone's listening to doesn't know, Spot Hero built elanVID: end and back end influenced that a bit. But the long story short, if if anyone's listening does doesn't know, Spot Hero built ELAN: a marketplace that helped drivers find elanVID: a marketplace that helped drivers find ELAN: convenient and, you know, affordable parking. elanVID: convenient and, you know, affordable parking. ELAN: and when the business started, elanVID: and when the business started, it was based in Chicago, ELAN: it was based in Chicago, a website and the I think the the elanVID: website and I think the the ELAN: hero kind of tagline the H1 on the the homepage of the website was like never get a parking ticket again. Right. So that was that was like a far cry from from what it ended up becoming. elanVID: hero kind of tagline the H1 on the the homepage of the website was like never get a parking ticket again. Right. So that was that was like a far cry from from what it ended up becoming. GARY: Yeah, yeah, yeah. ELAN: And over a journey, I joined kind of the first senior hire right hand of the founders, elanVID: And over a journey, I joined kind of the first senior hire right hand of the founders, and I had a few stints. The first stint was leaving marketing, so figuring out how do we acquire, retain, build brand analytics. That was kind of project one. ELAN: and I had a few stints. The first stint was leaving marketing, so figuring out how do we acquire, retain, build brand analytics. That was kind of project one. project two became how to like running product strategy and building a product that ended up becoming spot here for business, which we can talk about later if it's relevant. elanVID: project two became how to like running product strategy and building a product that ended up becoming spot here for business, which we can talk about later if it's relevant. ELAN: Then that led me to building partnerships with all the big build big mobility companies. So it's literally everywhere from Apple's headquarters, whiteboarding what the Apple card play category for parking could look like to floating in the Dead Sea elanVID: Then that led me to building partnerships with all the big bu big mobility companies. So it's literally everywhere from Apple's headquarters, whiteboarding what the Apple CarPlay category for parking could look like to floating the Dead Sea garVID: Mm-hmm. GARY: Mm-hmm. elanVID: with people at Waze and Tel Aviv, ELAN: with people at Waze and Tel Aviv, elanVID: designing integrations there and everywhere in between. And then the last handful of years of kind of more in a right right hand capacity, ELAN: designing integrations there and everywhere in between. And then the last handful of years of kind of more in a right right hand capacity, elanVID: leading executive team meetings, leading all hands, preparing company strategy. But if I go back quickly to catalog in the early days, ELAN: leading executive team meetings, leading all hands, preparing company strategy. But if I go back quickly to catalog in the early days, elanVID: one my first classes at Kellogg, the first class that I was both at Spot Here and Kellogg for, ELAN: one my first classes at Kellogg, the first class that I was both at Spot Here and Kellogg for, elanVID: was ELAN: was elanVID: a class around marketing insights. ELAN: a class around marketing insights. elanVID: And I remember that night very, very vividly because I remember the professor saying, Hey everyone, we're all gonna do a kind of market research project. in past years I let students pick their own project, but then I heard that was too much work, so this year I'm gonna assign you all a project. And I kinda raised my hand, I'm like, Hey, I lead marketing to this company called Spot Here, any chance I could do it on my own stuff? ELAN: And I remember that night very, very vividly because I remember the professor saying, Hey everyone, we're all gonna do a kind of market research project. in past years I let students pick their own project, but then I heard that was too much work, so this year I'm gonna assign you all a project. And I kinda raised my hand, I'm like, Hey, I lead marketing to this company called Spot Here, any chance I could do it on my own stuff? elanVID: And the professor said, if you figure it out ELAN: And the professor said, if you figure it out elanVID: by the end of the night, ELAN: by the end of the night, you're welcome to. Otherwise, I'm gonna sign you a project. So during the break, you know, like there's like a little bit of class, break, a little bit of class. I went to every single student in the class and I'm like, hey, I'm Milan, what's spot here? Would you do my project? And I got told no by every single person. Everyone. They're like, But the professor said it was easier if she assigned one. So who are you? Why would I work with you? At the end of class, four guys came up to me. elanVID: you're welcome to. Otherwise, I'm gonna sign you a project. So during the break, you know, like there's like a little bit of class, break, a little bit class. I went to every single student in the class, and I'm like, hey, I'm Elon, what spot here, would you do my project? And I got told no by every single person. Everyone. But the professor said it was easier if she assigned one. So who are you? Why would I work with you? At the end of class, four guys came up to me GARY: Mm-hmm. garVID: Mm-hmm. jerVID: That's awesome. JEREMIE: It's awesome. garVID: Yeah. JEREMIE: Right. Right. elanVID: and they were like, ELAN: And they were like, hey, we might be interested. And we ended up working on this project. The insight we found through that project was that exactly like you said, Jeremy, was that we had many competitors. We were not the first to get funding. We were not the most national. We weren't the biggest, right? We were we were kind of underdog. Was that everyone else was going after the cheapest to acquire customers? But the only customers were profitable were it seems obvious in highlands. elanVID: Hey, we might be interested. And we ended up working on this project. The insight we found through that project was that exactly like like you said, Jeremy, was that we had many competitors. We were not the first to get funding. We were not the most national. We weren't the biggest, right? We were we were kind of underdog. Was that everyone else was going after the cheapest to acquire customers? But the only customers were profitable were, it seems obvious in hind hindsight, like the commuter customer, I think the accountant, the venture capitalists, the consultants. ELAN: Hindsight, like the commuter customer, I think the accountant, the venture capitalist, the consultants, who's like going to the office a couple days a week, but not every day. So infrequently enough, they're willing to pay for parking and not take the train, but not frequently enough, they wanted like a monthly spot next to their office. Those are the only customers they're making money off of. And so that one insight totally changed the trajectory of the history of Spa Hero. Because instead of going after the person going to Wrigley Field for an event once a year. elanVID: It was like going to the office a couple days a week, but not every day. So infrequently enough, they're willing to pay for parking and not take the train, but not frequently enough, they wanted like a monthly spot next to their office. Those were the only customers they're making money off of. And so that one insight totally changed the trajectory of the history of Spot Hero. Because instead of going after the person going to Wrigley Field for an event once a year, GARY: Mm. Right. garVID: Mm. Right. elanVID: or going on Google and typing, hey, where's parking near Millennium Park? It was that commuter. And we we basically set the strategy of the entire business around that. garVID: Right. GARY: Right. ELAN: or going on Google and typing, hey, where's parking near Millennium Park? It was that commuter and we we basically set the strategy of the entire business around that. And then fast forward really quickly, Jeremy, many years later, elanVID: And then fast forward really quickly, Jeremy, many years later, garVID: Right. GARY: Right. elanVID: I partnered with a professor at Kellogg who wanted to write a case study about this. And so we together co-author a case study around this research project and my experience at ELAN: I partnered with Professor Kellogg, who wanted to write a case study about this. And so we together co-author a case study around this research project and my experience at elanVID: Spot Hero. And the crazy and he teaches it to this day. And the crazy thing is we actually had an intern this spring, ELAN: Spa Hero. And the crazy and he teaches it this day. And the crazy thing is we actually had an intern this spring. garVID: Mm-hmm. GARY: Mm-hmm. ELAN: And elanVID: and ELAN: she came up to me one day and she was like, Hey Lana, I have this crazy thing. I'm in this class at Kellogg elanVID: she came up to me one day and she was like, Hey Lana, I have this crazy thing. I'm in this class at Kellogg. ELAN: and the professor just gives a case and it's about you. I'm like, wait, no way, no way. I didn't know they actually use that thing. So yeah, so that's that's that's kinda the story that elanVID: And the professor just gives a piece and it's about you. I'm like, wait, no way, no way. I didn't know they actually used that thing. So yeah, so that's that's that's kind of the story then. jerVID: It's about you, my gosh. Yeah. Yeah. JEREMIE: It's about you, my gosh. Yeah. Yeah, garVID: Yeah. jerVID: Super cool. I was your ICP. I still am the ICP for Spot Hero. I use Spot Hero every week and a half since it started for this very reason. Yeah. As Gary knows, exactly. He's like, we meet up, he's like, Where'd you park? I'm like, I Spot Hero, dude, of course. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. JEREMIE: Super cool. I was your ICP. I still am the ICP for Spot Hero. I use Spot Hero every week and a half since it started for this very reason. Yep. As Gary knows, exactly. He's like, We meet up, he's like, Where'd you park? I'm like, I Spot Hero, dude, of course. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. GARY: He does. He does. I know that he does. I know that he does. garVID: He does. He does. I know that he does. I know that he does. elanVID: Awesome. Awesome. Awesome. Thank you. Thank you. ELAN: Awesome. Awesome. Awesome. Thank you. Thank you. elanVID: I'm amazed amazing. ELAN: I'm amazed amaz amazing. garVID: I'm GARY: I'm I'm curious, garVID: I'm curious, JEREMIE: Yeah. GARY: Elon, even on that story, garVID: Elon, even on that story, you were and you were still in the company, GARY: you were and you were still in the company, and things were going, presumably they came with, you know, a persona of users and customers that they were targeting. garVID: and things were going, presumably they came with, you know, a persona of users and customers that they were targeting. GARY: Can you talk about like, you know, I think some of our listeners garVID: Can you talk about like, you know, I think some of our listeners might be founders but also might be hired guns that are coming in. GARY: might be founders, but also might be hired guns that are coming in. garVID: They might see a different world that maybe the founders have seen or a different segment that we should tar target. Can you talk about, okay, I did this project in Kellogg, I've uncovered some insight, GARY: they might see a different world than maybe the founders have seen or a different segment that we should tar target. Can you talk about, okay, I did this project in Kellogg, I've uncovered some insight, but like how did it actually get done? Like how did you try to operationalize that initial insight to kind of, you know, cause a business outcome? garVID: but like how did it actually get done? Like how did you try to operationalize that initial insight to kind of, you know, cause a business outcome? ELAN: Totally. So I'll say I'll say a few things that are gonna elanVID: Totally. So I'll say I'll say a few things that are gonna come back to answering your question. ELAN: come back to answering your question. garVID: Yeah. elanVID: in my life, I in my education, I was always brought up to like question and jump in, and that's just kinda like the mode I operate in. So some people might be like, Elon, you're rude because you like interrupted or asked me a hard question. But that's just like how I was brought up, speaking to the you know, book you mentioned earlier. ELAN: in my life, I in my education, I was always brought up to like question and jump in, and that's just kind of like the mode I operate in. So some people might be like, Elon, you're rude because you like interrupted or asked me a hard question. But that's just like how I was brought up, speaking to the you know, book you mentioned earlier. garVID: Yep. GARY: Mm-hmm. garVID: Mm-hmm. elanVID: and in my career, I basically ELAN: and in my career, I basically Got the chance to work for a founder turn VC, a VC turn founder, a first time founder, a serial founder, a founder who hired a CEO, and I'm a co I'm a co-founder and CEO. And so I've I've seen the full elanVID: Got the chance to work for a founder turn VC, a VC turn founder, a first time founder, a serial founder, a founder who hired a CEO, and I'm a co I'm a co-founder and CEO. And so I've I've seen the full GARY: Yeah. garVID: Yeah. ELAN: full range and just kind of learned elanVID: full range and just kind of learned ELAN: how those folks think. But if you're if you're brand new at this or trying to figure out, I'll tell you my story where where this is you know challenging and and go from there. elanVID: how those folks think. But if you're if you're brand new at this or trying to figure out, I'll tell you my story where where this is you know challenging and and go up now. garVID: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. GARY: Mm-hmm. ELAN: I knew the spot here founder is like very early on through the Chicago tech scene. Actually elanVID: I knew the spot here founders like very early on through the Chicago tech scene. Actually Fun story for this podcast presented by 1871 is ELAN: fun story for this podcast presented by 1871 is think the first time we ever met was at a Technori pitch event in the basement of the Bank of America building where where Kevin got on stage and introduced elanVID: think the first time we ever met was at a Technori pitch event in the basement of the Bank of America building where where Kevin got on stage and introduced ELAN: 1871 to everyone. That's actually where we met. elanVID: 1871 to everyone. That's actually where we met. ELAN: kind of crazy. Just thought about that now. garVID: Wow. Deep cut. elanVID: kind of crazy. Just thought about that now. GARY: Wow. Deep cut. ELAN: and elanVID: and ELAN: we started to get to know each other. We both actually applied to Accelerate Labs. I mean with a different company, they got in, I didn't and a handful of months later I joined. elanVID: we started to get to know each other. We both actually applied to Accelerate Labs. I meet with a different company, they got in, I didn't, and a handful of months later I joined. ELAN: and my kind elanVID: and my kind ELAN: of interview so to speak elanVID: of interview, so to speak. ELAN: was actually elanVID: was actually ELAN: part of the interview elanVID: part of the interview ELAN: conversation was settling the debate between elanVID: conversation was settling the debate between two main business founders ELAN: two main business founders over what the strategy should be to go launch New York. And so like from day one, I was kind of put in this position of like, how do we navigate these relationships? And did a good enough job that I was there, have great relationships with all all the founders. but yeah it's it it's a tricky thing. elanVID: over what the strategy should be to go launch New York. And so like from day one, I was kind of put in this position of like how do we navigate these relationships? And did a good enough job that I was there, have great relationships with all all the founders. but yeah it's it it's a tricky thing. garVID: Mm. interesting. That's interesting. GARY: interesting. That's interesting. ELAN: that's story one. Two and then I'll answer your question directly. Two is elanVID: that's story one. Two, and then I'll answer your question directly. Two is funny enough, when I brought this idea to Mark ELAN: Funny enough, when I brought this idea to Mark, who's a found co-founder and CEO and very close as we talk all the time, elanVID: Found co-founder and CEO and very close as we talk all the time. he was like a little mad at me. He was like, Yvonne why why are we doing like school projects? Why are we doing school projects of work? He was like very skeptical of like, why would this even matter? And it ended up actually ELAN: he was like a little mad at me. He was like, Yvonne, why why are we doing like school projects? Why are we doing school projects of work? But it he was he was like very skeptical of like, why would this even matter? And it ended up actually garVID: Ha ha ha. GARY: Ha ha ha. garVID: Right. GARY: Right. elanVID: trolling tri change of director. And he here's here's how I here's advice I'd give is ELAN: totally changing the director. And he here's here's how I here's advice I'd give is you need to think about like the North Star or the mutual goal. elanVID: you need to think about like the North Star or the mutual goal you and the founder, or you and the other the investor, or you and the other people working towards. ELAN: you and the founder or you and the other the investor or you and the other people working towards and figure out how you get to yes on that elanVID: And figure out how you get to yes on that GARY: Hey. ELAN: mutual goal. And so it isn't elanVID: mutual goal. And so it isn't jerVID: Sure. elanVID: about ELAN: about what the founder says versus what you say or what your boss says versus what you say or what you say versus investor says. It's like, hey, elanVID: what the founder says versus what you say, or what your boss says versus what you say, or what you say versus investor says. It's like, hey, ELAN: we're on this journey together. Where are we trying to go? And let's argue about the guest path to get there. and that's how I think about it. elanVID: we're on this journey together. Where are we trying to go? And let's argue about the guest best path to get there. and that's how I think about it. garVID: Right. GARY: Right. garVID: Right. GARY: Right. elanVID: and that's usually how I get it done. But curious to hear how you you both have done that in the past. ELAN: And that's usually how I get it done. But curious to hear how you you both have done that in the past. jerVID: Turning it right back around on you, Gary. Isn't that amazing? Look at that. JEREMIE: Right back around on you, Gary. Ain't that amazing? Look at that. ELAN: Yeah, Gary. elanVID: Yeah, Gary. GARY: the story that most comes to my mind is when I was actually in corporate America and I was working at Ernst Young, the partner who I worked for, his name was also Gary. And garVID: the story that most comes to my mind is when I was actually in corporate America and I was working at Ernst Young, the partner who I work for, his name was also Gary. And let's just say we had a pitch coming up for a customer, a potential customer, and I thought the way that we were pitching, it was a biotechnology customer. And and I and I had actually been in that world and and he kind of is just a business person in that world, but he had never GARY: let's just say we had a pitch coming up for a customer, a potential customer, and I thought the way that we were pitching, it was a biotechnology customer. And and I and I had actually been in that world and and he kind of is just a business person in that world, but he had never garVID: Been in a lab in his life. I was like, I just don't think this is the right pitch for the right audience. GARY: Been in a lab in his life. I was like, I just don't think this is the right pitch for the right audience. And he was a senior partner at garVID: And he was a senior partner at GARY: UI. And, you know, and I wanted to grow up. I was a manager and I wanted to go to senior manager. garVID: EY. And, you know, and I wanted to grow up. I was a manager and I wanted to go to senior manager. so I just created two decks. GARY: I just created two decks. garVID: And what I did was I made the deck that the direction that he wanted a little less pretty and a little less thorough. GARY: And what I did was I made the deck that the direction that he wanted a little less pretty and a little less thorough. garVID: the deck that I thought we should be using. And let's just say he used the deck GARY: the deck that I thought we should be using. And let's just say he used the deck garVID: that I thought we should use and we won the the deal. So it wasn't as elegant as I would want to say is like try to but I you know, I did learn a lesson and and it sounds a little bit in your story too that GARY: that I thought we should use and we won the the deal. So it wasn't as elegant as I would want to say is like try to but I you know, I did learn a lesson and and it sounds a little bit in your story too, Leon, that garVID: you have to manage up. GARY: you have to manage up. garVID: and really I call we call him our principle, you know, I've always wanted Gary to look great. GARY: and really I c we call him our principle, you know, I've always wanted Gary to look great. garVID: And so it wasn't just from a place of I think I'm right. It was as a place like I don't want you to go to Gen and Tech and embarrass yourself, basically. So that's one story that comes to to mind. But yeah, I let's just say I it didn't look as pretty as the other deck is was one of the ways I accomplished that. GARY: And so it wasn't just from a place of I think I'm right. It was as a place of I don't want you to go to Gen and Tech and embarrass yourself, basically. So that's one story that comes to to mind. But yeah, I let's just say I it didn't look as pretty as the other deck is was one of the ways I accomplished that. jerVID: Subtle subterfuge. Nice. JEREMIE: Subtle subterfuge. Nice, jerVID: Nice. Well, JEREMIE: nice. jerVID: can I can I so I'm JEREMIE: Well, can I can I so I'm gonna take us into a slightly different direction if that's okay, Elon. So, jerVID: gonna take us into a slightly different direction if that's okay. Elon. So Spot Hero, again, for those who don't know it, they can learn all about it on the internet. Fabulous success that wasn't an overnight success, like no great business is. JEREMIE: Spot Hero, again, for those who don't know it, they can learn all about it on the internet. Fabulous success. That wasn't an overnight success, like no great business is. jerVID: slow and steady, hard and heavy, like fighting every day for years and years and years, built a fabulous business. JEREMIE: slow and steady, hard and heavy, like fighting every day for years and years and years, built a fabulous business. jerVID: ultimately, JEREMIE: and ultimately, jerVID: Now is a business that's owned by Uber, which is which is really cool. So that business had a successful exit, which is great. JEREMIE: Now is a business that's owned by Uber, which is which is really cool. So that business had a successful exit, which is great. Along the way, you decided, okay, you've been supporting the CEO, you've been supporting the C-suite, you've been like right there, side by side in the trenches, working and jerVID: the way, you decided, okay, you've been supporting the CEO, you've been supporting the C suite, you've been like right there, side by side in the trenches working and and going hard. JEREMIE: and going hard. jerVID: then you decided, JEREMIE: And then you decided, not too long ago, a couple of years back, now to start a company at Pinch, which I want to talk about a lot here in the next couple of minutes. jerVID: too long ago, a couple of years back now, to start a company at Pinch, which I want to talk about a lot here in the next couple of minutes. I would love, maybe if we can segue into the conversation for how the JEREMIE: I would love, maybe if we can segue into the conversation for how. jerVID: experiences you gained at Spot Hero. JEREMIE: The experiences you gained at Spot Hero jerVID: Working through the muck with the team in a support and executive capacity JEREMIE: working through the muck with the team in a support and executive capacity garVID: Yeah. GARY: Mm. jerVID: prepared you to then flip the switch and say, Nope, for this next business, I'm taking all my lessons. I will walk in as the CEO, which we all know is the worst job on the planet, and go crazy and try to build this business and do it away. JEREMIE: prepared you to then flip the switch and say, Nope, for this next business, I'm taking all my lessons. I will walk in as the CEO, which we all know is the worst job on the planet, and go crazy and try to build this business and do it away. jerVID: you walk us through that and your mindset and then and how some of those lessons you got at Spot Hero have helped you to jump into the world of pinch over the last what, three and a half years, almost four years? JEREMIE: Can you walk us through that and your mindset and then and how some of those lessons you got at Spot Hero have helped you to jump into the world of pinch over the last what, three and a half years, almost four years? garVID: Yeah. GARY: Yeah. ELAN: For sure. elanVID: For sure. ELAN: first of all I'd say I could probably write at least one book. If we wrote the case study catalog on one little like week of my life at Spire, there's probably a book or a series of books that could be written on the things that I learned thanks to we had again, we had incredible investors, an incredible team, an incredible journey. and I learned an unreal amount. Way more there than MBA or undergrad or anything else, frankly. so I I learned a ton. elanVID: first of all I'd say I could probably write at least one book. If we wrote the case study catalog on one little like week of my life at Spire, probably a book or a series of books that could be written on the things that I learned thanks to we had again, we had incredible investors, an incredible team, an incredible journey. and I learned an unreal amount. Way more there than MBA or undergrad or anything else, frankly. so I I learned a ton. GARY: Mm-hmm. garVID: Mm-hmm. jerVID: Mm. JEREMIE: Mm-hmm. jerVID: Fabulous team, yeah. JEREMIE: Fabulous team, yeah. ELAN: I think one of the most important things that I learned elanVID: I think one of the most important things that I learned ELAN: is I learned about myself elanVID: is I learned about myself and ELAN: and elanVID: know how to talk about earlier how to how to be a parent, how to run a family, how to all all the things. but professionally I l I knew a few things. I learned that I was ELAN: know how to talk about earlier how to how to be a parent, how to run a family, how to all all the things. but professionally I l I knew a few things. I learned that I was GARY: Yeah. garVID: Yeah. elanVID: pretty good, relatively speaking, at geo local marketplace businesses. ELAN: pretty good, relatively speaking, at geo local marketplace businesses. elanVID: meaning a a business that you launch city by city or state by state across the country with supply and demand. so Chicago, New York, San Francisco for park right, parking garages, drivers. ELAN: meaning a a business that you launch city by city or state by state across the country with supply and demand. so Chicago, New York, San Francisco for park right, parking garages, drivers. garVID: Yeah. jerVID: Mm-hmm. elanVID: I ELAN: I elanVID: also knew during spot here out, ELAN: also knew during spot here out elanVID: that I really loved helping people in their careers. Like whenever someone wanted a mentoring conversation or a job or like I you know, even today I get a couple of calls a week of like, hey, I'm thinking about doing this thing, or I need to make this change, or how do I know and I I just I get a lot of energy from that. I think it's one of those things I'm both good at and and and enjoy doing. And third is that I really like to work with people I like, right? Like how do I work with people I like on interesting problems that kind of make the world a better place. And those those were things I learned about myself. And I always kinda knew I wanted to start a company ELAN: that I really loved helping people in their careers. Like whenever someone wanted a mentoring conversation or a job or like I you know, even today I get a couple of calls a week of like, hey, I'm thinking about doing this thing, or I need to make this change, or how do I know and I I just I get a lot of energy from that. I think it's one of those things I'm both good at and and and enjoy doing. And third is I I really like to work with people I like, right? Like how do I work with people I like on interesting problems that kinda make the world a better place. And those those were things I learned about myself. And I always kinda knew I wanted to start a company GARY: Yeah yeah. garVID: Yeah. ELAN: BCO. So that that was that was less so. And so when the time came, Spider's incredible journey, elanVID: BCO. So that that was that was less so. And so when the time came, Spot here was an incredible journey. ELAN: the time f came for me to elanVID: time f came for me to ELAN: to kind of move on. I actually stayed on an advisory capacity, advising on rideshare specifically, which kind of you know a little bit of a little bit of how that story ends, which you mentioned earlier. elanVID: to kind of move on. I actually stayed on an advisory capacity, advising on rideshare specifically, which kind of you know a little bit of a little bit of how that story ends, which you mentioned earlier. and one day ELAN: and one day I got a call from a childhood schoolmate. He was a year ahead me in school, way smarter than me, so he did not come to tech, he became a trauma surgeon, elanVID: I got a call from a child at schoolmate, he was a year ahead of me in school, way smarter than me, so he did not come to tech, he became a trauma surgeon, so he's a tumbleboard ELAN: so he's a double board elanVID: certified physician and and and and surgeon. ELAN: certified physician and and and and surgeon. elanVID: And he's like, Hey Lan, I have this idea. You know how COVID was bad for you? I'm like, I know it was real bad. Our our revenue went down ninety-nine percent. ELAN: And he's Hey Lan, I have this idea. You know how COVID was bad for you? I'm like, I know it was real bad. Our our revenue went down ninety nine percent. elanVID: my I had three kids home on Zoom school, like every single thing fell apart in like two weeks. And, you know, I got a PhD in crisis management. I I I know how hard it was. Well, tell me more. So he's like, Well, it wasn't so good to work in the hospital either during COVID, if you could imagine. it wasn't just that revenue went down, it was that like, you know, people went down. So ELAN: my I had three kids home on Zoom school. Like every single thing fell apart in like two weeks. And, you know, I got a PhD in crisis management. I I I know how hard it was. Well tell me more. So he's like, Well, it wasn't so good to work in the hospital either during COVID, if you can imagine. it wasn't just that revenue went down, it was that like, you know, people went down. So garVID: Definitely. GARY: Definitely definitely. jerVID: Yeah. elanVID: So we started talking about this idea had to kind of empower more healthcare entrepreneurs is the way I would put it. And his kind of wording would be like give more autonomy and mastery and purpose and earning potential ELAN: So we started talking about this idea had to kind of empower more healthcare entrepreneurs is the way I would put it. And his kind of wording would be like give more autonomy and mastery and purpose and earning potential to some of the medical professionals who kind of leaving the field because it was no fun to work in a clinic or hospital anymore. elanVID: to some of the medical professionals who were kind of leaving the field because it was no fun to work in a clinic or hospital anymore. GARY: yeah. garVID: Yeah. elanVID: so we started chatting, I was advising him, just helping out as a friend. And then basically what happens is I get a message from him one day saying, Hey, who's who are Haley and Ezra at starting line? ELAN: so we started chatting, I was advising him, just helping out as a friend. And then basically what happens is I get a message from him one day saying, Hey, who's who are Haley and Ezra at the starting line? elanVID: And then Ezra and Haley are like, Who's this Jacob guy at Pinch? and we did this three way dating process whereby I came on as co-founder, CEO, he's co-founder chief medical officer, and basically Starting Line, Ezra's one of the partners of Starting Line was ELAN: And then Ezra and Haley are like, Who's this Jacob guy at Pinch? and we did this three way dating process whereby I came on as co founder CEO, he's co founder chief medical officer, and basically Starting Line, Ezra's one of the partners of Starting Line was investor in Spot Hero through his his prior firm. elanVID: investor in Spot Hero through his his prior firm. and we basically in a couple of weeks put together a round of investors who were almost exclusively ELAN: and we basically in a couple of weeks put together a round of investors who were almost exclusively elanVID: knew me from Spot Hero or ELAN: knew me from Spot Hero or jerVID: Mm-hmm. elanVID: in the case of a partner knew me from childhood. and that's how we got started. ELAN: in the case of a partner knew me from childhood. and that's how I got started. garVID: Okay. Very GARY: Okay. jerVID: Which is fabulous. So pinch is a two sided marketplace, right? but unlike parking, one side of the marketplace is kind of sticking needles into the other side of the of the marketplace, right? so as you think about scaling JEREMIE: Which is fabulous. So pinch is a two-sided marketplace, right? but unlike parking, one side of the marketplace is kind of sticking needles into the other side of the of the marketplace, right? so as you think about scaling garVID: Okay, thank you GARY: Okay. jerVID: marketplace efficiently and really scale efficiency without compromising the friction that probably needs to exist in the healthcare space, like how how do you how do how have you had to reimagine marketplace economics and the marketplace opportunity here? Because it's a similar but different thing. JEREMIE: marketplace efficiently and really scale efficiency without compromising the friction that probably needs to exist in the healthcare space, like how how do you how do how have you had to reimagine marketplace economics and the marketplace opportunity here? Because it's a similar but different thing. elanVID: Yes. ELAN: Yes. elanVID: Totally. Very similar similar in some ways, different others. And you I've done I've done five startups now here all in Chicago. Every single one was a d in different industry. but I've kind of brought lessons from prior ones to this one. So in my mind, I'm like, this is a geolocal marketplace business with a friend and investors I worked with before in a category I know nothing about. I know nothing about health, I know nothing about beauty, I know nothing about syringes, nothing. ELAN: Totally. Very simil similar in some ways, different others. And you I've done I've done five startups now here all in Chicago. Every single one was a d in different industry. but I've kind of brought lessons from prior ones to this one. So in my mind, I'm like, this is a geo local marketplace business with a friend and investors I worked with before in a category I know nothing about. I know nothing about health, I know nothing about beauty, I know nothing about syringes, nothing. but my partner is super smart and like elanVID: but my partner is super smart and like knows a lot of that stuff and we'll figure it out. And so ELAN: knows a lot of that stuff and we'll figure it out. And so jerVID: It does. JEREMIE: It does. elanVID: the way kind of I'll I'll talk about like kind of how we envision the business today and then maybe we can work backwards a little bit to to where we started in some of the marketplace mechanics. But the way I really think about this business is I am ELAN: the way kind of I'll I'll talk about like kind of how we envision the business today and then maybe we can work backwards a little bit to to where we started in some of the marketplace mechanics. But the way I really think about this business is I am elanVID: one side of the marketplace empowering more healthcare entrepreneurs and more autonomy for heels careers. On the other side, I'm helping people ELAN: one side of the marketplace empowering more healthcare entrepreneurs and more autonomy for Heels Careers. On the other side, I'm helping people elanVID: look, feel, and live their best life. And ultimately the business that we're building is I'm building a national healthcare workforce ELAN: look, feel, and live their best life. And ultimately the business that we're building is I'm building a national healthcare workforce garVID: Mm-hmm. GARY: Mm-hmm. elanVID: of ELAN: of nurse practitioners today elanVID: nurse practitioners today ELAN: who want to deliver elanVID: who want to deliver ELAN: super convenient, frictionless care elanVID: super convenient, frictionless care to ELAN: to clients or patients today in the comfort of their own home. Specifically focused on like private pay, cash pay, medical wellness. So we're not elanVID: clients or patients today in the comfort of their own home. Specifically focused on like private pay, cash pay, medical wellness. So we're not garVID: Mm-hmm. GARY: Mm-hmm. Yeah. ELAN: If you have some disease we're not curing you per se, but kind of more think longevity, functional, beauty, kind of proactive, prevent preventative health. elanVID: If you some disease, we're not curing you per se, but kind of more think longevity, functional, beauty, kind of proactive, prevent preventative health. garVID: Yeah. jerVID: Prevention and yeah, proactive health, yeah. JEREMIE: Prevention and yeah, proactive health, yeah. ELAN: and we're doing all of that elanVID: we're doing all of that ELAN: enabled by technology elanVID: enabled by technology ELAN: in using the kind of business principles that I learned from from my dated spot here. And so that's called ultimately what we're elanVID: in using the kind of business principles that I learned from my data spot here. And so that's called ultimately what we're garVID: Mm-hmm. GARY: Yeah. elanVID: I can speak to a lot of the marketplace ELAN: I can speak to a lot of the marketplace mechanics, but the way the the mainframing I can I elanVID: mechanics, but the way that the mainframing, I can garVID: Mm. GARY: Mm-hmm. elanVID: I I can speak to that, but maybe I can just talk about like how I think about a marketplace business for maybe listeners who aren't as familiar, and then kinda talk about our journey a bit. ELAN: I I can speak to that, but maybe I can just talk about like how I think about a marketplace business for maybe listeners who aren't as familiar, and then kind of talk about our journey a bit. jerVID: Yeah, I was gonna ask JEREMIE: Yeah, I was gonna ask jerVID: I was gonna ask what people mis frequently misunderstand about a marketplace business. And maybe maybe that's a mit seems to seem to be where your head was going anyway. Sorry to cut you off. I should have just shut my mouth. JEREMIE: I was gonna ask what people mis frequently misunderstand about a marketplace business and maybe maybe that's a seems to seem to be where your head was going anyway. Sorry to cut you off. I should have just shut my mouth. ELAN: Yeah. elanVID: Yeah. So here's how I think about the stages of a marketplace business. ELAN: So here's how I think about the stages of a marketplace business. And I'm not gonna go with a lot of people ask questions, chicken or egg or the you know, elanVID: And I'm not gonna go with a lot of people ask questions, chicken or egg, or you know, GARY: Mm-hmm. garVID: Mm. elanVID: disintermediation. You can like chat GPT ELAN: Disintermediation, you can like chat GPT all those and get good answers. But I'm not gonna talk about that. I'm gonna talk about like my unique framing that I've learned from other others over the years. There's basically four stages to any marketplace business. and if you get these four things wrong, like in the wrong order, you will likely fail. elanVID: all those and get good answers. But I'm not gonna talk about that. I'm gonna talk about like my unique framing that I've learned from other others over the years. There's basically four stages to any marketplace business. and if you get these four things wrong, like in the wrong order, you will likely fail. and then there's a whole bunch of principles and other stuff. But the four stage of those laws, the first is essentially the wedge. You have to find a unique ELAN: and then there's a whole bunch of principles and other stuff. But the four stages flaw. The first is essentially the wedge. You have to find a unique elanVID: way into a market that ELAN: way into a market that kind of is un untapped, underutilized. So in the case of elanVID: kind of is un untapped, underutilized. So in the case of Airbnb, that was like air mattresses and people's size bedrooms. In the case of Ubers, it was black car sitting idly. In the case of Spot Hero, it was ELAN: Airbnb, that was like air mattresses and people's size bedrooms. In the case of Ubers, it was Black Car C Idley. In the case of Spot Hero, it was elanVID: parking spots behind people's apartment buildings near Wrigley Field. ELAN: parking spots behind people's apartment buildings near Wrigley Field. and in the case of Pinch, our business, it was nurse practitioners who had shifts at a hospital elanVID: in the case of Pinch, our business, it was nurse practitioners who had shifts at a hospital and wanted to kind of ELAN: and wanted to kind of maybe three days a week in the hospital, and wanted to earn a little bit more money and had an extra some extra time. elanVID: maybe three days a week in the hospital and wanted to earn a little bit more money and had an extra some extra time. and they didn't quite ELAN: and they didn't quite elanVID: they wanted a flexible way to earn without ELAN: They wanted a flexible way to earn without elanVID: locking themselves in. That's it. The the second stage after that wedge is you need to build a flywheel, right? And so you need to figure out the supply and demand, and the more supply you get, the more demand you get, and so on and so forth. ELAN: locking themselves in. Cool. That's all. The the second stage after that wedge is you need to build a flywheel, right? And so you need to figure out the supply and demand, and the more supply you get, the more demand you get, and so on and so forth. GARY: No. garVID: No, no, no. GARY: Yeah. garVID: Yeah. elanVID: the third stage becomes the moat, which is like, hey, how do you win a specific vertical or specific territory or specific category? like, you know, maybe Amazon won in books and then done a bunch of other stuff. ELAN: the third stage becomes the moat, which is like, Hey, how do you win a specific vertical or specific territory or specific category? like, you know, maybe Amazon won in books and then did a bunch of other stuff. You know, Uber did elanVID: you know, Uber did transportation kind of rideshare and then did Eats you know parking and other things. and then the last phase is how do you expand? How do you go into ELAN: transportation, kind of ride share and then to beats and you know parking and other things. and then the last phase is how do you expand? How do you go into elanVID: do you go into new categories once you kind of build your core mode? And so the way I'm thinking about this business is very much ELAN: do you go into new categories once you kind of build your core mode. And so the way I'm thinking about this business is very much based on those principles that I learned at Spot Hero. elanVID: based on those principles that I learned at Spot Hero. ELAN: and the reason is one of the critiques of Spot Hero over the years was like everyone would write us off. They would just be like, you're just in Chicago. You're just elanVID: and the reason is one of the critiques of Spot Hero over the years was like everyone would write us off. They would just be like, you're just in Chicago. garVID: Yeah. Mm-hmm. GARY: Yeah. Mm-hmm. elanVID: You're just you don't even have a mobile app. You're just this. You're just that it was always like you're just this niche thing and why don't you go do all these other things? And the reason is because all the companies who try to go do all the other things before they got the first thing right ELAN: You don't even have a mobile app. You're just this. You're just that it was always like you're just this niche thing and why don't you go do all these other things? And the reason is because all the companies who try to go do all the other things before they got the first thing right GARY: Mm-hmm. garVID: Mm-hmm. GARY: Mm-hmm. ELAN: ended up spreading their chips too thin and failing. Right. jerVID: Failed. Mm-hmm. JEREMIE: Failed. elanVID: up spreading their chips too thin and failing. Right. garVID: Yeah. GARY: Yeah. Yeah. That's been my that's actually sorry, sorry, Elena. I was gonna say, you know, part of Replay, part of my my one of the businesses I founded, a big part of is the marketplace. And you know, we have a our our initial wedge was my finding, like, I'm a scientist, I'm in the laboratory, there's lots of stuff in our laboratory we're not using. garVID: Yeah. That's been my that's actually sorry, sorry, Elena. I was gonna say, you know, part of Replay, part of my my one of the businesses I founded, a big part of is the marketplace. And, you know, we have a our our initial wedge was my finding, like, I'm a scientist, I'm in the laboratory, there's lots of stuff in our laboratory we're not using. jerVID: Yeah. elanVID: yeah, yeah. No, go ahead, go ahead, go. ELAN: yeah. Yeah. No, go ahead, go ahead, go. GARY: Why is it that? You know, garVID: Why is it that? You know, and then we had this really interesting GARY: and then we had this really interesting garVID: problem. Like as we started to get out there and start inviting investors, they thought our market was too small. They thought it was too niche. GARY: problem. Like as we started to get out there and start inv pitching investors, they thought our market was too small. They thought it was too niche. garVID: And I remember reading this blog from well, one there there was a seminal lecture from Peter Thiel GARY: And I remember reading this blog from well one there there was a seminal lecture from Peter Thiel about, yeah, you know, garVID: about yeah, you know, monopolies are good. GARY: monopolies are good. garVID: I remember reading this blog by Paul Graham at Y Combinator. GARY: but I remember reading this blog by Paul Graham at Y Combinator garVID: about like picking niche things, GARY: about like picking niche things winning them and then scaling beyond that. And one of the the things that I think we so we did that. So we started, we tried to really own scientific labs stuff. garVID: winning them, and then scaling beyond that. And one of the the things that I think we so we did that. So we started, we tried to really own scientific labs stuff. jerVID: Mm-hmm. GARY: Now Reapy's doing things in real estate, building materials, you know, very beyond the lab. But one of the things that we had a trouble with was garVID: Now Reapy's doing things in real estate, building materials, you know, very beyond the lab. But one of the things that we had a trouble with was evolving our brand alongside that. So as we evolve from the lab to other things, GARY: evolving our brand alongside that. So as we evolve from the lab to other things, Making sure people didn't keep thinking of us like eBay of science when we were pitching real estate folks was a challenge. It's like, I wonder whether it's Reapley's story or whether it's Pinch's story or whether it's from garVID: making sure people didn't keep thinking of us like eBay of science when we were pitching real estate folks was a challenge. It's like I wonder whether it's Reapy's story or whether it's Pinch's story or whether it's from GARY: your previous companies. How do you think about garVID: your previous companies, how do you think about GARY: winning small niche but then a making sure that the marketing message garVID: winning small niche, but then a making sure that the marketing message and the brand kind of keeps up with where the business goes. GARY: and the brand kind of keeps up with where the business goes? ELAN: well, I I think there's probably three segments of where people sit on this. Either you're elanVID: I I think there's probably three segments of where people sit on this. Either you're GARY: Mm-hmm. garVID: Mm-hmm. ELAN: so early on elanVID: so early on ELAN: that you're still winning that first niche, and you should you should just focus on winning that niche, right? Like just do that and don't worry about it. Or on the other side, you're on the other side of that, elanVID: that you're still winning that first niche, and you should you should just focus on winning the niche, right? Like just do that and don't worry about it. Or on the other side, you're on the other side of that, garVID: Right. GARY: Right. garVID: Yep, right. Right. GARY: Yep, right. Right. elanVID: And so you already figured out. And so I don't think I have to answer it for either of those. ELAN: And so you already figured out. And so I don't think I have to answer it for either of those. GARY: mm-hmm, mm-hmm. garVID: mhm. elanVID: And and ELAN: And and then there's the middle one, which is like, hey, I'm actually going through that thing right now. elanVID: then there's the middle one which is like, hey, I'm actually going through that thing right now. garVID: Kinda sort of. Yeah. GARY: Kind of sort of. Yeah. elanVID: And I don't think on this podcast I could give a specific answer that applies to everyone. I think it a it actually it depends. It depends on the your reputation, the trust, the industry, the category. For some ELAN: And I don't think on this podcast I could give a specific answer that applies to everyone. I think it a it actually it depends. It depends on the your reputation, the trust, the industry, the category. For some GARY: Yeah. garVID: Yeah. elanVID: people you get pulled into it and for others you have to go and so I'd say if you're small, just win your niche and worry about it later. If you're big, you're past it. And if you're in the middle, like ELAN: people you get pulled into it, and for others you have to go. And so I'd say if you're small, just win your niche and worry about it later. If you're big, you're past it. And if you're in the middle of like GARY: Right. garVID: Right. Right. GARY: Right. elanVID: email one of us and ask later. 'Cause I th I I think it's more of a nuanced answer is is is ELAN: email one of us and ask later 'cause I th I I think it's more of a nuanced answer is is is is garVID: Right. Yeah yeah. GARY: Right. Yeah. jerVID: Well the the JEREMIE: Well the the garVID: Yeah GARY: Yeah, ELAN: my guy. garVID: yeah. GARY: yeah. jerVID: Yeah, I mean just just to add one or two quick thoughts there too. I mean, I I totally agree with everything you both just said. And like you the the whole point of a startup is to figure out one thing that you can do really, really well, and you do it, right? And that's pre-seed seed going into your series A. Like that's you can only do one thing well, and that's how you're gonna develop something that's that's worthwhile. Getting super spread, getting spread super thin too early, obviously, as you said, Elon, is what kills you. it's also what series B, C, and D are for, right? So like JEREMIE: Yeah, I mean just just to add one or two quick thoughts there too. I mean, I I totally agree with everything you both just said. And like you the the whole point of a startup is to figure out one thing that you can do really, really well, and you do it, right? And that's pre-seed seed going into your series A. Like that's you can only do one thing well, and that's how you're going to develop something that's that's worthwhile. Getting super spread, getting spread super thin too early, obviously, as you said, Elon, is what kills you. it's also what series B, C, and D are for, right? So like GARY: Yeah. garVID: Yeah. Yeah. GARY: Let me jerVID: When you've crushed it with your ideal client and you've got a product that works and the market's pulling it toward them, they want it so badly because you're doing so good, then you'll have no choice but to expand the offerings because there's they're more they're gonna want, right? But like I you see this all the time with founders, and I've made this mistake myself. I'm sure Gary, you probably got either well done that path or you got pulled in at Elon U too. Like you have to resist going too far too fast and spreading out too being spread too thin too quickly, or you will die. JEREMIE: When you've crushed it with your ideal client and you've got a product that works and the market's pulling it toward them, they want it so badly because you're doing so good, then you'll have no choice but to expand the offerings because there's they're more they're gonna want, right? But like I you see this all the time with founders, and I've made this mistake myself. I'm sure Gary, you probably got either well down that path or you got pulled in an Elon U too. Like you have to resist going too far too fast and spreading out too being spread too thin too quickly, or you will die. garVID: Yeah. Right. GARY: Mm-hmm. yes. Yes. garVID: Mm-hmm. yes. Yes. JEREMIE: but jerVID: what JEREMIE: What I've always found difficult, and I'd love to hear your guys' opinion on this, is there's this gray zone, right? It's not like it's black and white. we shouldn't do that. Like, no, it's very gray. And that margin is like really wide. It's like very, very gray. And so I've always personally struggled with okay, where do I say no? Where do I say yes? What are those breakpoints? And at what point do I need to then to hit them, address them? And does that take more capital, more talent, more time, more network, more people? What is it? So jerVID: I've always found difficult, and I'd love to your your guys' opinion on this, is there's this gray zone, right? It's not like it's black and white. we shouldn't do that. Like, no, it's very gray. And that margin is like really wide. It's like very, very gray. And so I've always personally struggled with okay, where do I say no? Where do I say yes? What are those breakpoints? And at what point do I need then to hit them, address them? And does that take more capital, more talent, more time, more network, more people? What is it? So GARY: But you're excited. Yeah. garVID: But you're a fact. Yeah. GARY: Yes. garVID: Yes. GARY: Yeah, yeah. garVID: Mm-hmm. Jeremy, ELAN: Well, elanVID: Well. GARY: Jeremy, especially as as you're like looking at run rate, cash, you have a board meeting, you have these projections you show to an investor, you're like, shouldn't we pivot to what this people are saying? Or should we just stay the course and you know, anyway, Elon, how how how do you yeah. ELAN: totally. garVID: especially as as you're like looking at run rate, cash, you have a board meeting, you have these projections you show to an investor, you're like, should we pivot to what this people are saying? Or should we just stay in the course and you know, anyway, Elon how how how you jerVID: All of it. JEREMIE: All of that. elanVID: Totally and Gary, that's a that's exactly it. Is is like ELAN: Totally. And Gary, that's like that's exactly it. Is is like elanVID: it's it's too nuanced. Like how much runway do you have? How much conviction do you have? What's a trust? Are you getting pulled? And so I think I think I I don't maybe one of us should write like a a thing about it, but I'm not sure that there's like a definitively right answer there. I do think that's one that's like the you're asking the question 'cause it's a hard one 'cause it's it's it's it's pretty new. It's probably more art it's like judgment. ELAN: it's it's too nuanced. Like how much runway do you have? How much conviction do you have? What's a trust? Are you getting pull and so I think I think I I don't maybe one of us should write like a a thing about it, but I'm not sure that there's like a definitively right answer there. I do think that's one that's like that you're asking the question 'cause it's a hard one because it's it's it's it's pretty new. It's probably more art it's like judgment. GARY: Yes. Yes. garVID: Yes. Yes. Mm-hmm. GARY: Mm-hmm. jerVID: Yes, it's like the question at at what time does at what point does JEREMIE: Yes. It's like the question at at what time does at what point jerVID: what point does speed become dangerous, right? Like you get yourselves killed by running too fast in the wrong direction. So at what point do you yeah, how do you how do you develop the JEREMIE: at what point does speed become dangerous, right? Like you get yourselves killed by running too fast in the wrong direction. So at what point to yeah, how do you how do you develop ELAN: Yeah. elanVID: Yeah. garVID: Mm-hmm. GARY: Mm-hmm. elanVID: Exactly. Especially in healthcare, ELAN: Exactly. GARY: And garVID: And ELAN: Especially in healthcare, elanVID: by the way. That's like w my biggest challenge if we kinda talk about my challenges. I I run run business today where ELAN: by the way. That's like w my biggest challenge if we kinda talk about my challenges. I I run run business today where JEREMIE: the ELAN: have good business, it's scaling nicely. I have very happy supply side, very happy demand side, I'm basically the best reviewed elanVID: a good business, it's scaling nicely. I have very happy supply side, very happy demand side, I'm basically the best reviewed on the internet for what we do. ELAN: on the internet for what we do. but I'm not an AI company. So every VC is not like, you're not growing from zero to a hundred million in two days. Cool. elanVID: but I'm not an AI company. So every VC is not like, you're not growing from zero to a hundred million in two days. Cool. GARY: Right. garVID: Right. GARY: Right. garVID: Right. jerVID: Four days, yeah. JEREMIE: Four days, yeah. ELAN: And because I'm a startup, I'm not like yet a profitable healthcare business. And so I'm in the gray area on you know, how do you think about funding a business that's fundamentally a very, very good business, but it doesn't fit on either end of the extremes at this moment in time. And so those questions become kind of like you know, judgment calls that that are probably hard to answer on a podcast. elanVID: And because I'm a startup, I'm not like yet a profitable healthcare business. And so I'm in the gray area on, you know, how do you think about funding a business that's fundamentally a very, very good business, but it doesn't fit on either end of the extremes at this moment in time. And so those questions become kind of like you know, judgment calls that that are probably hard to answer on a podcast. garVID: Right. GARY: Right. garVID: Right. jerVID: So to JEREMIE: So two garVID: Right. Mm-hmm. GARY: Right. Mm-hmm. jerVID: Yeah. JEREMIE: Yeah. jerVID: So two questions, right? So you describe the company on the internet as an AI enabled consumer health marketplace. JEREMIE: So two questions, right? So you describe the company on the internet as an AI enabled consumer health marketplace. so certainly there is some AI there. So for you to maybe go a little bit deeper on that notion, like so what where does AI fit into your business strategy given the fact that what you're doing is so human-centric and so non-traditional artificial intelligence based? jerVID: certainly there's some AI there. So for you to maybe go a little bit deeper on that notion, like so what where does AI fit into your business strategy given the fact that what you're doing is so human-centric and so non-traditional artificial intelligence based? ELAN: Yeah. Yeah. elanVID: Yeah. Yeah. ELAN: Totally. When I said not AI, I meant like I'm not like a frontier lab, you know, not like sci yeah, yeah, tot totally. elanVID: Totally. When I said not AI, I meant like I'm not like a frontier lab, you know, not like sci yeah, yeah, totally totally. jerVID: I know what you mean. Yeah, you're in a Frontier lab doing some crazy stuff, JEREMIE: I know what you mean. Yeah, you're not a Frontier lab doing some crazy stuff, jerVID: yeah. JEREMIE: yeah. elanVID: So so okay, so let's talk about where we started the business we're at and I talked little bit about where we're going. So where we started the business is we launched in Illinois, ELAN: So so okay, so let's talk about where we started the business we're at and I'll talk little bit about where we're going. So where started the business is we launched in Illinois, elanVID: enabling nurse practitioners ELAN: enabling nurse practitioners elanVID: to offer in-home medical spot treatments, think Botox, chemical peels, micronina, all face beauty related things that only a medical professional can deliver. ELAN: to offer in home medical spot treatments, think Botox, chemical peels, micronia, all face beauty related things that only a medical professional can deliver. garVID: Yeah. GARY: Mm-hmm. ELAN: But I always knew that wasn't like I wasn't born to go jump into that industry. That was that that wasn't the reason for our being. That was just the wedge, right? elanVID: But I always knew that wasn't like I wasn't born to go jump into that industry. That was that that wasn't the reason for our being. That was just the wedge, right? fast forward to today, as of this recording, we're in ten states, we have hundreds of providers, we have ELAN: fast forward to today, as of this recording, we're in ten states, we have hundreds of providers, we have elanVID: or now tens of thousands of treatments in, ELAN: or no tens of thousands of treatments in, and we are like the best rated elanVID: and we are like the best rated medical spa in the state of Illinois by far. ELAN: medical spa in the state of Illinois by far. GARY: it? garVID: it? ELAN: And elanVID: And ELAN: so elanVID: so ELAN: what makes us unique than the ten thousand elanVID: what makes us unique than the ten thousand brick and mortar medical spas, about eighty percent of whom are mom and pop, about twenty percent are backed by private equity. ELAN: brick and mortar medical spas, about eighty percent of whom are mom and pop, about twenty percent are backed by private equity. elanVID: And ultimately it's we we don't have a clinic. Like we everything we do, we don't have we don't have to I can launch a new state for less than it costs to build out a waiting room in a medical office. ELAN: And ultimately it's we we don't have a clinic. Like we everything we do, we don't have we don't have to I can launch a new state for less than it costs to build out a waiting room in a medical office. garVID: Maybe GARY: Yeah, you may ELAN: And so elanVID: And so ELAN: the thing that we do elanVID: the thing that we do ELAN: uniquely are as follows. One is elanVID: uniquely are as follows. One is for providers, we pay them really well because we pass some of our kind ELAN: for providers, we pay them really well because we pass some of our kind elanVID: overhead costs that would otherwise have to them. ELAN: overhead costs that we would otherwise have to them. Two is we educate them really well. We invest aggressively in their education. And three is we're we found ways to build community, even if you're like a solo person in wherever's Illinois, we still have this like community aspect. So that that's what pulls them in. elanVID: two is we educate them really well. We invest aggressively in their education. And three is we're we found ways to build community, even if you're like a solo person in wherever's Illinois, we still have this like community aspect. So that that's what pulls them in. garVID: Yeah. GARY: Mm. elanVID: On the client side, ELAN: On the client side, what we have is we deliver really high quality service, really convenient service at a very fair price point. And also do a lot of like work to build brand and community and trust. elanVID: what we have is we deliver really high quality service, really convenient service at a very fair price point. And also do a lot of like work to build brand and community and trust. GARY: Mm. garVID: Mm. ELAN: And elanVID: And ELAN: so why is that possible? It's possible because we've built technology elanVID: so why is that possible? It's possible because we've built technology ELAN: that enables like every single step in that process, elanVID: that enables like every single step in that process, some of which is more traditional software and some of which is AI, more and more and more of it's becoming AI. ELAN: some of which is more traditional software and some of which is AI, more and more and more of it's becoming AI. elanVID: But basically, I can go ELAN: But basically I can go compete. elanVID: compete. I can go launch for, as I said before, less than the cost of a line away room, but I can go like scale a whole ELAN: I can go launch for, as I said before, less than the cost of in a weight room, but I can go like scale a whole elanVID: state for less than the cost of a P for and like building out a couple new offices. ELAN: state for less than the cost of a P for like building out a couple new offices. elanVID: And so so where that plays in is obviously it's in coding and obviously in writing and obviously it's in data analysis, everyone does that. ELAN: And so so where that plays in is obviously it's in coding and obviously in writing and obviously it's in data analysis, everyone does that. but it's in the way elanVID: but it's in the way ELAN: we manage customer service, it's in the way that we elanVID: we manage customer service, it's in the way that we ELAN: prepare decks, it's in the way that we elanVID: prepare decks, it's in the way that we GARY: Mm-hmm. garVID: Mm. elanVID: do like there's like almost it touches almost everywhere of the business from clinical to operations to sales to marketing to running. And so ELAN: do like there's like almost it touches almost everywhere of the business from clinical to operations to sales to marketing to running. And so GARY: Yeah. garVID: Yeah. elanVID: What that means is I have an example, we have an engineer based in Col Columbia, Cargena, and said to me, I was talking to him like ELAN: What that means is I have an example, we have an engineer based in Col Columbia, Cargena, and said to me, I was talking to him like elanVID: this summer, and he's like, Elon, I think I'm three to four X faster than I was at the start of this year. ELAN: the summer, and he's like, Elon, I think I'm three to four X faster than I was at the start of this year. elanVID: And I talked to one of our investors this week who was like, you know, Elon, you know what's crazy, Elon? Just talk with your tech team and your bottleneck is product and design. Like, wait, we just added an amazing product design leader who was with me at spot here like a few months ago. ELAN: And I talked to one of our investors this week who was like, You know, Elon, you know what's crazy, Elon? Just talk with your tech team and your bottleneck is product and design. Like, wait, we just added an amazing product and design leader who was with me at Spa here like a few months ago. elanVID: How is it when you add a new resource? ELAN: How is it when you add a new resource? elanVID: That's the bottleneck. ELAN: That's the bottleneck. And he's like, because that actually takes the most manual human thinking work now. You have to go like, you know, what what are we going to take? So so we're using it across the business, elanVID: And he's like, because that actually takes the most manual human thinking and work out. You have to go like, you know, what what are they gonna do? So so we're using it across the business, garVID: Yeah. GARY: Yeah. jerVID: Right, yeah, for sure. JEREMIE: Yeah. garVID: Your penny. GARY: Your penny. elanVID: and we're using it well. It's not like slop, like we're using it really well, and that's just enabling us to scale really, really efficiently. We have a handful of people at HQ and we have hundreds of providers out across the country and pretty much ELAN: and we're using it well. It's not like slop, like we're using it really well, and that's just enabling us to scale up really, really efficiently. We have a handful of people at HQ and we have hundreds of providers out across the country and pretty much garVID: Basically. GARY: Basically. ELAN: everything is elanVID: everything is digitized, which is awesome. ELAN: digitized, which is awesome. garVID: Amazing. Amazing. GARY: Amazing. Amazing. jerVID: Which is nice. Yeah. Super certainly a great JEREMIE: Yeah. Super certainly a great wedge. jerVID: wedge. I have a question for you, Gary. Should we should we subject Elon to the boardroom blitz? JEREMIE: I have a question for you, Gary. Should we should we subject Elon to the border and blitz? garVID: Yeah. GARY: Yeah. garVID: Yeah. We gotta do the blitz. GARY: Yeah. We gotta do the blitz. jerVID: Can we do that? See se seems like a fun a fun time to to to jump into that. JEREMIE: Should we do that? See seems like a fun a fun time to to to jump into that. ELAN: boy. elanVID: boy. I I ELAN: I I'd rather I'd rather do like NFL blitz, but we could do the boardroom blitz, you know. Yeah. Yeah. jerVID: Why not, right? JEREMIE: Why not, right? elanVID: I'd rather I'd rather do like NFL blitz, but we could do the boardroom blitz, you know. Yeah. Yeah. jerVID: Yeah. Well we could try that. I could we could pull up some some some trivia really JEREMIE: Yeah. Well we could try that. I could we could pull up some some trivia jerVID: fast and see. all right. Well the Yeah. The boardroom blitz is it's pretty straightforward. Gary's gonna initiate a blitz and again, Gary, I still I realize again I should have like sent you the link to initiate JEREMIE: really fast and see. all right. Well the Yeah. The boardroom blitz is it's pretty straightforward. Gary's gonna initiate a blitz and again, Gary, I still I realize again I should have like sent you the link to initiate garVID: This is my fav one of my favorite parts. What are you talking about, Cherry B? GARY: This is my fave one of my favorite parts. What are you talking about, Cherry P? garVID: That's fine. GARY: That's fine. garVID: I should have it bookmarked, but you know, it's we're we're we're we're putting it together piece by piece right now. Click. Initiate the blitz. GARY: I should have it bookmarked, but you know, it's we're we're we're we're putting it together piece by piece right now. Click. Initiate the blitz. jerVID: Exactly, exactly. Well you s you say click and I'll click, how's that sound? JEREMIE: Exactly, exactly. Well you s you say click and I'll click, how's that sound? elanVID: Corre. Y you need some music. ELAN: Y you need some music. This this requires some music. elanVID: This this requires some music. jerVID: Yeah, I know. But dum bum JEREMIE: Yeah, I know. But jerVID: bum All right. First one. GARY: If Corp garVID: If Corp GARY: Elon, if corporate life were a reality show, what would yours be called? garVID: Elon, if corporate life were a reality show, what would yours be called? elanVID: corporate life were a reality show, what would mine be called? did you ever have you ever watched the show Nathan for You? No. Okay. Nathan for You. Nathan for you, there's there's a guy named Nathan Fielder and he's kind of like an actor producer and he has a satirical comedy show ELAN: corporate life were a reality show, what would mine be called? do you ever have you ever watched the show Nathan for You? No. Okay. Nathan for You Nathan for you, there's there's a guy named Nathan Fielder and he's kind of like an actor producer and he has a satirical comedy show garVID: No. GARY: No. jerVID: What's it called? No. Interesting. Nope. JEREMIE: What's it called? No. Interesting. Nope. elanVID: where he gives small business owners advice, but it's kind of like it's good advice, but it's also like funny. So for example, he like goes to like a an auto mechanic and he says, Hey, what's your biggest business problem? Like what's your bottleneck? And the auto mechanics like, No one trusts my quotes. So he's like, business idea. Let's do lie detector verified auto mechanic quotes. And like every episode is like another thing like that. So like I I make mine like Elon for you. ELAN: Where he gives small business owners advice, but it's kind of like it's good advice, but it's also like funny. So for example, he like goes to like a an auto mechanic and he says, Hey, what's your biggest business problem? Like what's your bottleneck? And auto mechanics like, No one trusts my quotes. So he's like, Business idea. Let's do lie detector verified auto mechanic quotes. And like every episode is like another thing like that. So like I I make mine like Elon for You. jerVID: Funny. interesting. JEREMIE: Funny. interesting. jerVID: Army kind of coin's nice. JEREMIE: Army Caticoids, nice. GARY: Yeah. jerVID: Yeah, yeah, yeah. JEREMIE: Yeah, yeah, yeah. elanVID: Which would be like giving people good but like entertaining advice. Yeah, yeah. That'd be that that that'd be my ELAN: Which would be like giving people good but like entertaining advice. Yeah, yeah. That'd be that that that'd be my GARY: I love jerVID: I like that. I like that. JEREMIE: I like that. I like that. GARY: That's good answer. garVID: Good answer. jerVID: That'd be super cool. We should actually just make that happen. That'd be super fun. JEREMIE: That'd be super cool. We should actually just make that happen. That'd be super elanVID: But ELAN: But JEREMIE: fun. ELAN: yeah, elanVID: yeah, ELAN: cool. But check it out, Nathan for you, it's good good job. elanVID: cool. But check it out, Nathan for you, it's good good show. jerVID: Yeah, for sure. JEREMIE: Yeah, for jerVID: It's a good plug for Nathan. All right. Well then the next question says, What's the worst advice an older or younger colleague ever gave you? And did you take it anyway? Terrible advice you took anyway. JEREMIE: sure. It's a good plug for Nathan. All right, well then the next question says, What's the worst advice an older or younger colleague ever gave you? And did you take it anyway? Terrible advice you took anyway. garVID: Mm. So many I'm thinking of. GARY: Mm. So many I'm taking up. elanVID: You know, I think the ELAN: You know, I think the Yeah, I you know elanVID: Yeah, I know jerVID: Okay. JEREMIE: Okay. ELAN: what was elanVID: it was I'm about a colleague. But like, you know you know you know the saying like hire slow and fire fast. There's been like I've worked with incredible people. There's a lot of people I've worked with across two or three companies. There's a lot of people I've like helped at every step of their career. But like sometimes you just like know someone has to go. Like it's just not working. And there's been a few times in my career where like ELAN: But a colleague, but like, you know, you know, you know the saying like hire slow and fire fast. There's been like I've worked with incredible people. There's a lot of people I've worked with across two or three companies. There's a lot of people I've like helped at every step of their career. But like sometimes you just like know someone has to go. Like it's just not working. And there's been a few times in my career where like jerVID: Yeah. garVID: Yes. GARY: Yes. JEREMIE: Yeah. jerVID: Yeah. elanVID: the you know, but those those guys, like the person in charge, HR, whoever it was, was like just ELAN: the you know, but those those guys, like the person in charge, HR, whoever it was, was like just Give him one more chance, just this, just that, just like whatever the excuse was to delay. elanVID: Give him one more chance, just this, just that, just like whatever the excuse was to delay. and they always end up not working out. Like every single time. And so I think a lot of the ELAN: and they always end up not working out. Like every single time. And so I think a lot of the GARY: Yeah. elanVID: advice that was bad was like ELAN: advice that was bad was like elanVID: just ELAN: just elanVID: give him more chances. And it never works out. And whenever I whenever I listen Yeah, exactly yeah. I mean, you know, that would be at least at least maybe their performance would be good, even if they shouldn't be doing that. But ELAN: give him more chances. And it never works out. And whenever I whenever I listen Yeah, exactly yeah. I mean, you know, that would be at least at least maybe their performance would be good, even if they shouldn't be doing that, but jerVID: I know right. I know he was smoking crack in the bathroom. Give him one more chance. JEREMIE: I know right. I know he was smoking crack in the bathroom. Give him one more chance. GARY: Mm-hmm. garVID: Mm-hmm. ELAN: you know elanVID: You know, those ELAN: Though tha that's that's kinda one where like elanVID: that's that's kind of one where like ELAN: I never really liked when people were like slow down on this thing you knew it was true just to wait and see if it gets better. So that was that's probably the worst guy. That's all I did. And again, that that sounds like you know elanVID: I never really liked when people were like slowed down on this thing you knew it was true, just to wait and see if it gets better. So that was that's probably the worst guy. That's all good. And again, that that sounds like a you know GARY: Mm-hmm. garVID: Mm-hmm. ELAN: pretty good at keeping people around and elanVID: pretty good at keeping people around and GARY: It it fits it fits the comment bullet garVID: It it fits it fits the comment bullet of if if if we play it safe, nothing goes wrong, which is also really GARY: of if if if we play it safe nothing goes wrong, which is also garVID: funny. Okay, maybe the last one I'm not sure. What's one business book you actually finished and think everyone else should too? JEREMIE: Right. elanVID: Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. ELAN: Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. GARY: Okay, maybe the last one I'm not sure. What's one business book you actually finished and think everyone else should too? elanVID: So you guys like can't see like this behind me is like all like minimalist, but like the the sides of this camera are like lots and lots and lots of books. ELAN: So you guys like can't see like this behind me is like all like minimalist, but like the the sides of this camera are like lots and lots and lots of books. jerVID: Mm-hmm. JEREMIE: Mm-hmm. elanVID: there's a ton of good ones. ELAN: there's a ton of good ones. elanVID: would say like ELAN: would say like elanVID: one of ELAN: one of elanVID: I'll tell you my favorite line and then I'll tell you my favorite book. So I'm gonna do two. ELAN: I'll tell you my favorite line and then I'll tell you my favorite book. So I'm gonna do two. garVID: Mm-hmm. GARY: Mm-hmm. elanVID: My favorite line from a business book is ELAN: My favorite line from a business book is in the hard thing about hard things. yeah, where where there's like a line which is like when I was a founder, elanVID: in the hard thing about hard things. yeah, where where there's like a line which is like when I was a founder garVID: huh. GARY: huh. ELAN: I slept like a baby. elanVID: I slept like a baby. I woke up every hour and cried. That's a nice ELAN: I woke up every hour and cried. That's like my th jerVID: Mm-hmm. garVID: Yeah. GARY: Yeah. JEREMIE: Mm-hmm. elanVID: Yeah. We talked about kids, we talked about sleep earlier. Like that that's that's like my favorite line from from any business book, because I think that really captures, and I don't, you know, fortunately these days I don't do that, but but you know, you can you can definitely lost sleep at times. I think my favorite biggest book that I like to recommend is called Pred especially for startup founders, is called Predictable Success. ELAN: Yeah. We talk about kids, we talked about sleep earlier. Like that that's that's like my favorite line from from any business book, because I think that really captures and I don't you know, fortunately these days I don't do that, but but you know, you can you can definitely lost sleep at times. I think my favorite biggest book that I like to recommend is called Produc especially for startup founders, is called Predictable Success. garVID: Mm-hmm. GARY: Wait. elanVID: and Predictable Success, ELAN: and predictable success, in a nutshell for this podcast, elanVID: in a nutshell for this podcast, is a book about the arc of a business lifecycle. ELAN: is a book about the arc of a business lifecycle. You start in early survival mode, elanVID: You start in early survival mode, ELAN: then you get into fun mode, where like, hey, mom, I raised money. And then you get into whitewater where no matter what, you hit rapids, people, process, technology. And then at the top of that arc, you get to predictable success. And that's kind of where you set a goal and you hit it, and you set a goal and you hit it. And then the other side of that arc is like the downfall. Like one stage is called treadmill, no matter how fast or slow you go. The business keeps going at the same pace. And I love that book as a startup person because it gives you really good perspective elanVID: then you get into fun mode, where like, hey, mom, I raised money. And then you get into whitewater where no matter what, you hit rapids, people, process, technology. And then at the top of that arc, you get to predictable success. And that's kind of where you set a goal and you hit it, and you set a goal and you hit it. And then the other side of that arc is like the downfall. Like one stage is called treadmill, no matter how fast or slow you go. The business keeps going at the same pace. And I love that book as a startup person because it gives you really good perspective. GARY: Yeah. garVID: And ELAN: on where you are at in your journey. And just like a human life, you have to be a baby and then a toddler and then a kid and then a teenager and then an adult, you can't like skip one of those phases. You can't skip being a teenager, right? You just can't. And in startups, I think there's some founders I find will get like self conscious because they'll be like, man, I brought in this person and not everything's perfect. Well if it was elanVID: on where you are at in your journey. And just like a human life, you have to be a baby and then a toddler and then a kid and then a teenager and then an adult, you can't like skip one of those phases. You can't skip being a teenager, right? You just can't. And in startups, I think there's some founders I find will get like self conscious because they'll be like, man, I brought in this person and not everything's perfect. Well if it was GARY: Mm-hmm. garVID: Mm-hmm. Yes. Yes. GARY: Yes. Yes. Yeah. ELAN: perfect, then you wouldn't have even earned the right to be here because you'd be optimizing the wrong thing. elanVID: perfect, then you wouldn't have even earned the right to be here because you'd be optimizing the wrong thing. jerVID: Exactly right. garVID: Right. GARY: Right. ELAN: And so elanVID: And so JEREMIE: Exactly elanVID: I really like that book 'cause it it it just yeah, it g it gives you it helps you understand where you are in your in your journey. It helps articulate that perspective to your team and it kinda helps you understand that like craziness in a startup is is is a feature, not a bug. JEREMIE: right. ELAN: I really like that book 'cause it it it just yeah, it g it gives you it helps you understand where you are in your in your journey. It helps articulate that perspective to your team and it kinda helps you understand that like craziness in a startup is is is a feature, not a bug. GARY: And garVID: With a word. GARY: Yeah. How do I? garVID: All the way. Absolutely. I actually remember I'm just as you said that book, you know, I'm thinking about the first time that I learned about this term of the valley of death. and GARY: Absolutely. I actually remember I'm just as you said that book, you know, I'm thinking about the first time that I learned about this term of the valley of death. and ELAN: Yeah, sure. elanVID: Yeah, sir. GARY: I was like we raised our seed round or maybe a pre seed round garVID: I was like, we raised our seed round or maybe a pre seed round, and things aren't really going the way that I think they should be going. And I remember an investor at a VC here in Chicago. He drew he drew time course, he drew these lumps. He's like, you're here. GARY: and things aren't really going the way that I think they should be going. And I remember an investor at a VC here in Chicago, he drew he drew time course, he drew these lumps. He's like, you're here. And it actually was so validating that like like there's a this is a known place to be. So yeah. garVID: And it actually was so validating that like like there is a this is a known place to be. So yeah, I agree. jerVID: Right. JEREMIE: Right. elanVID: Totally. Totally. Th there's nothing new under ELAN: Totally. Totally. Th there's nothing new under the sun and that that's the advantage of having done it before is you've seen it enough times and when it's your first time you're like, This is crazy and you're like, No, this everyone goes everyone goes through puberty or whatever the awkward you know, whatever the thing is, yeah. elanVID: the sun and that that's the advantage of having done it before is you've seen it enough times and when it's your first time you're like, This is crazy and you're like, No, this everyone goes everyone goes through puberty or whatever the awkward you whatever the thing is yet. garVID: It GARY: Uh-huh. Yeah. Yeah. garVID: Yeah. Yeah. jerVID: This is just it. Yeah. Well, JEREMIE: This is just it. Yeah. Well, this is the process. And the good news, bad news there is that it's also an indicator that you're on the right path, right? So as a founder, as a first-time founder, it's absolutely terrifying, right? Just like the first time you're in Whitewater Rapids is absolutely terrifying, but it's also exhilarating, exciting, and cool, right? But like when you've seen it a few times, then you learn, at least I think, jerVID: this is the process. And the good news, bad news there is that it's also an indicator that you're on the right path, right? So as a founder, as a first-time founder, it's absolutely terrifying, right? Just like the first time you're in Whitewater Rapids is absolutely terrifying, but it's also exhilarating, exciting, and cool, right? But like when you've seen it a few times, then you learn, at least I think garVID: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. GARY: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. JEREMIE: you learn to embrace it and you learn to appreciate it. jerVID: learn to embrace it and you learn to appreciate it. And I think it's also why it makes it easier to not. JEREMIE: And I think it's also why it makes it easier to not jerVID: Wake up every hour at night crying because you're like, this is just normal. Like, we're actually doing the right thing. That's why it's so hard. That's why it's so choppy. That's why, like, my visibility is where it is. As long as we keep our heads down, surround ourselves with the right people, continue to like work the heck out of the problem, right? Like, we're gonna get through it. yeah. JEREMIE: wake up every hour at night crying because you're like, this is just normal. Like we're actually doing the right thing. That's why it's so hard. That's why it's so choppy. That's why like my visibility is where it is. As long as we keep our heads down, surround ourselves with the right people, continue to like work the heck out of the problem, right? Like we're gonna get through it. yeah. garVID: Mm. Mm-hmm. GARY: Mm. Mm-hmm. garVID: Yeah. Right. GARY: Right. garVID: Mm-hmm. GARY: Mm-hmm. ELAN: Exactly. The the you know, we we mentioned NFL Blitz at the start. I'm not a big gamer, but just to go back on that theme of NFL Blitz is like part of the video games that are easy, aren't fun, right? And so part of, you know, I view startups is like you're c collecting gems or like beating the bad boss at the end of each level. And if it was easy, it no one would do it. And elanVID: Exactly. The the you know, we we mentioned NFL Blitz at the start. I'm not a big gamer, but just to go back on that theme of NFL Blitz is like part of the video games that are easy, aren't fun, right? And so part of, you know, I view startups is like you're c collecting gems or like beating the bad boss at the end of each level. And if it was easy, it no one would do it. And GARY: Yeah. garVID: Yeah. You can GARY: Mm-hmm. elanVID: you're doing something that's hard and that's what's rewarding, right? And and you know, and the journey's the destination, you know, you got you have to enjoy the process even if ELAN: you're doing something that's hard and that's what's rewarding, right? And and you know, and the journey's the destination. You know, you got you have to enjoy the process even if garVID: Mm-hmm. GARY: Mm-hmm. garVID: yeah. elanVID: then ELAN: then elanVID: the hard times come to the territory, you know. ELAN: the hard times come to the territory, you know. jerVID: Yeah, it's part of it. Only hard stuff is worth doing, right? So it's awesome. It's awesome. JEREMIE: Yeah, it's part of it. Only hard stuff is worth doing, right? So it's awesome. It's awesome. GARY: Absolutely. garVID: Absolutely. jerVID: NFL Blitz. That was sorry, now my brain just went off on this tangent about the NFL Blitz arcade game. And I think I've played it maybe three times and I was terrible. so I I didn't play a lot of that game. JEREMIE: NFL Blitz. That was it's sorry, now my brain just went off on this tangent about the NFL Blitz arcade game. And I think I've hit it maybe three times and I was terrible. so I I didn't play a lot of that game. GARY: Yeah. ELAN: Well, you elanVID: Well, you GARY: Looks like we're not gonna get NFL sponsorship for this show. elanVID: you can you can stick to boardroom blitz. Yeah, yeah. ELAN: you can you can stick to boardroom blitz Yeah, yeah. garVID: Looks like we're not gonna get NFL sponsorship for this show. jerVID: We'll sit the board or I'll stick to Ms. Pac Man. That's that JEREMIE: We'll sit the board or I'll stick to Ms. Pac Man. That's ELAN: Yeah, yeah. Yeah. You gotta get Caleb W Caleb Williams on the show here, you know? Yeah, exactly. elanVID: Yeah, yeah. Yeah. You gotta get Caleb Will Caleb Williams on the show here, you know? Yeah. JEREMIE: that is that is much easier for me. Yeah, that's funny. Yeah. jerVID: is that is much easier for me. Yeah, that's funny. Yeah. GARY: Yeah. jerVID: Yeah, we'll get him in. We'll bring him on. We'll talk about what it's GARY: That was garVID: Well JEREMIE: Yeah, we'll get him in. We'll bring him on. We'll talk about what it's like to be a professional quarterback. and like rewrite the rewrite the path of your team for sure. Super cool. Yeah. Come on in, buddy. We'll have you. We'll talk. We'll talk. We'll have some coffee. We'll talk about it. well Elon, this has been super jerVID: like to be a professional quarterback. and like rewrite the rewrite the path of your team for sure. Super cool. Yeah. Come on in, buddy. We'll have you. We'll talk. We'll talk. We'll have some coffee. We'll talk about it. well Elon, this has been super GARY: Cal Cum. garVID: Cal Cum. Yeah. GARY: Yeah. elanVID: Yes. You could put that in the you could ELAN: Yes. You can put that in the you can put that in the subject line for the subset. It could be like Boardroom Blitz with Elon Musk or and maybe Caleb Williams and maybe a little elanVID: put that in the subject line for the subset. It could be like Boardroom Litz with Elon Mossmacher and maybe Caleb Williams and maybe a little jerVID: Invicate. JEREMIE: Invice. jerVID: Exactly, JEREMIE: Exactly, jerVID: exactly. And a little little invitation to Caleb. Yeah, we're calling you out, Caleb Brader. JEREMIE: exactly. And a little little invitation to Caleb. Yeah, we're calling you out, Caleb Brader. ELAN: Yeah. So elanVID: Yeah. So GARY: Although the parlay garVID: I love the parlay GARY: from Elon to Kelly, this is amazing. garVID: from Elon Takelo, this is amazing. jerVID: Yeah. Let's do it. Let's do it. Awesome. JEREMIE: Yeah. Let's do it. Let's do it. Awesome. ELAN: Yes. Yes. elanVID: Yes. Yes. jerVID: So I have one last thing I gotta tell you. So Elon, you JEREMIE: So I have one last thing I gotta tell you. So Elon, thinking about your education and your path. So you did we didn't talk about this before, jerVID: about your education and your path. So you did we didn't talk about before, you went to JEREMIE: but you went to jerVID: Maryland, right? You're a terp. So I got one of my master's degrees at Maryland, so super fun. I I JEREMIE: Maryland, right? You're a terp. So I got one of my master's degrees at Maryland, so super fun. I elanVID: Yes. ELAN: Yes. JEREMIE: I'd never brought that up before and I'm so happy that jerVID: never brought that up before and I'm so happy that that it's always fun to find terps in Illinois. JEREMIE: it's always fun to find terps in Illinois. jerVID: and in Chicago. And funny enough, I know like four Elons that GARY: Mm-hmm. JEREMIE: And in Chicago. And funny enough, I know like four Elons garVID: Mm-hmm. jerVID: went to Date for undergrad and then came back and either went to Booth or Kellogg. So there's something about the name Elon and University of Maryland in Chicago. JEREMIE: that went to Date for undergrad and then came back and either went to Booth or Kellogg. So there's something about the name Elon and University of Maryland in Chicago. elanVID: Whoa. That's crazy. That's ELAN: Whoa. That's crazy. That's GARY: Well. ELAN: that's crazy. Well I also thank you. Well, yes, I I I also hide that I went to Maryland until I have to disclose it. I'm just kidding. But I will say on on Elon front, I'm also, you know, in in recent years because of Elon one thing that's happened to me is I I spell my name El A N, not El O N. But as a child, again, I have like a Hebrew name Elon, elanVID: that's crazy. Well I also thank you. Well, yes, I I I also hide that I went to Maryland until I have to disclose it. I'm kidding. But I will say on on Elon front, I'm also, you know, in in recent years because of Elon one thing that's happened to me is I I spell my name El A N, not El O N. But as a child, again I have like a Hebrew name Elon, right? garVID: you're the best one. GARY: But you're the best one. jerVID: Ha ha ha. GARY: sure. garVID: Well sure. ELAN: right? elanVID: And most people would mispronounce it. So I'd go to the ELAN: And most people would mispronounce it. So I'd go to the doctor's office and inevitably the nurse would be like Ellen or whatever. elanVID: doctor's office and inevitably the nurse would be like, Ellen, right, or whatever. jerVID: Right. ELAN: and now what's cool is more people pronounce my name right, elanVID: and now what's cool is more people pronounce my name right, ELAN: but everyone auto corrects it wrong. And so if people write E L A N just like because of Elon Musk, it's a switch to E L O N for everyone. So people now say my name right, but they they write it wrong, you know. I'm just u used to it at this point. You know. I'm sure Gary gets an occasional one R instead of two or you know. elanVID: but everyone auto corrects it wrong. And so if people write E L A N just like because of Elon Musk, is it switches to the E L O N for everyone? So people now say my name right, but they they write wrong, you know. I'm just u used to it at this point. You know. I'm sure Gary gets an occasional one R instead of two or you know. garVID: Yeah. jerVID: sure. JEREMIE: sure. garVID: Mm-hmm. jerVID: Yeah, yeah. I Yeah, Gary gets the one R. I get the JEREMIE: Yeah, yeah. I Yeah, Gary gets the one R. I get GARY: I'm there. I'm there with you, brother. I'm garVID: there I'm there with you, brother. I'm jerVID: I E I'm a Y I'm a I E, not a Y. So yeah, we're we're just a mess. We're a mess. JEREMIE: the I E I'm a Y I'm a I E, not a Y, so yeah, we're we're just a mess. Yeah, we're a mess. GARY: there with you. garVID: there with you. ELAN: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Totally. Bacon and Cooper are a little easier though, but you elanVID: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Totally. Bacon and Cooper are a little easier though, but you GARY: Well garVID: Well ELAN: know, you know. elanVID: know, you know. GARY: well garVID: well, I am a manic about getting people's first name correct because of the trauma. My high school diploma had one R on it. And and since then I'm like, nope, let's let's let's get the first names right. So yeah, yeah, yeah. But I I just Elon just like hearing that p it sets you up. GARY: I am a manic about getting people's first name correct because of the trauma. My high school diploma had one R on it. And I since then I'm like, nope, let's let's let's get the first names right. So yeah, yeah, yeah. But I I just Elon just like hearing that p it sets you up JEREMIE: Mm-hmm. elanVID: Awesome. ELAN: Awesome. Totally. Totally. I'll tell you one elanVID: Totally. Totally. I'll tell you one JEREMIE: Yeah. ELAN: other I'll tell you one other crazy story as or as this we wrap up the blitzer, which is elanVID: other I'll tell you one other crazy story as or as this we wrap up the blitz here, which is ELAN: I was actually for Spot Hero. I was one time in elanVID: I was actually for Spot Hero. I was one time in ELAN: of the big elanVID: of the big ELAN: notable mobility tech companies in elanVID: notable mobility tech companies in in Silicon Valley. I won't say which one. ELAN: in Silicon Valley. I won't say which one. And you know, like when you go to those offices you have to like sign the NDA thing and get to the stick around that says like your name. So mine was like elanVID: And you know, like when you go to those offices you have to like sign the NDA thing and you get to put the stick around that says like your name. So mine was like garVID: huh. GARY: huh. elanVID: for whatever reason this one was like Elon. right. And then Spira. ELAN: for whatever reason this one was like Elon. right. And then Spire. And I'm sitting in this meeting with this like VP level level guy. And he keeps like looking at like where my name tag was. And I'm like, Everything okay? He's like, elanVID: And I'm sitting in this meeting with this like VP level level guy. And he keeps like looking at like where my name tag was. And I'm like, everything okay? He's like, Hey, I'm sorry, could ELAN: Hey, I'm sorry, could elanVID: any chance you could remove your name tag? ELAN: any chance you could remove your name tag? elanVID: like, Yeah, yeah, sure. So I took it from and I put it on my like down to my jeans. I'm like, everything okay? He's ELAN: like, Yeah, yeah, sure. So I took it from and I put it on my like down to my jeans. I'm like, Everything okay? He's elanVID: Yeah, I just I just spent five years at Tesla ELAN: Yeah, I just I just spent five years at Tesla and like looking your name's giving me PTSD, I can't focus. Yeah. elanVID: and like looking your names giving me PTSD, I can't focus. Yeah, yeah. garVID: Ha ha. GARY: Yeah. jerVID: That is awesome. JEREMIE: That is awesome. jerVID: That is awesome. And that that's the perfect way to end our conversation. Elon with an A. Before we start talking about Elon with an O, we will thank you for joining us on Board Room Blades. Yeah. We totally will. Yeah, totally. Yes, yes. I love it. Well JEREMIE: That is awesome and that that's the perfect way to end our conversation. Elon with an A. Before we start talking about Elon with an O, we will thank you for joining us on Board Room Blades. Yeah. We totally will. Yeah, totally. Yes, yes. I love it. GARY: Thank you. ELAN: Yeah. elanVID: Yeah. boy, well ELAN: boy, well garVID: Hmm. Thank you. elanVID: You could put his name in the title too, Elon Musbacher, Caleb Williams and Elon Musk on boardroom plates. Awesome. Thank you, gentlemen. ELAN: You could put his name in the title too, Elon Musbacher, Caleb Williams, and Elon Musk on boardroom plants. Awesome. Thank you, gentlemen. GARY: A lot of parlays here. garVID: Lot of parlays here. This JEREMIE: Well elanVID: This ELAN: This elanVID: was great. Thanks everyone for who's still listening, you know? ELAN: was great. Thanks everyone for who's still listening, you jerVID: Yeah, thanks for hanging out with us. I really appreciate it. JEREMIE: Yeah, thanks for hanging out with us, we really appreciate it. GARY: This is awesome. garVID: is awesome.