Latest / DPC Life: Direct Primary Care Podcast / Finding Calm in the Chaos: Dr. Crystal Vernon on ADHD, Parenting, and Physician Life

Transcript

Finding Calm in the Chaos: Dr. Crystal Vernon on ADHD, Parenting, and Physician Life · DPC Life: Direct Primary Care Podcast

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  I just wanted to be that resource for physicians so that
• 0:04
  they would have somebody else to bounce things off as though I
• 0:07
  really enjoy just the fact of kind of being your own
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  scientist. Pediatric system stole my my
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  first blood. A lot of times you think about
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  these like, oh, the problem is so big it needs a big solution
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  for really if you can just make the first little step, you're on
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  your way to change anything. There's a lot of talk about
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  motivational interviewing and coaching is really in that
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  motivate motivational interviewing space.
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  It is just kind of giving props that people can do, set their
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  own self reflection and find out what is their best or their next
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  step in reaching whatever that long term goal is that they
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  have. Welcome to DPC Life, the podcast
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  where independent doctors share real stories, bold ideas, and
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  the freedom of doing medicine on your own terms.
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  I'm your host, Doctor Anne Gonzalez, and together we'll
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  explore the winds, the struggles, and everything in
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  between. Let's dive in.
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  Hi and welcome back to DPC Life. This is the podcast where we
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  talk with different DPC docs who have opened their practices and
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  built their practices to fit around their lives.
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  I opened up my DPC four years ago with a partner, Doctor
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  Rachel Kelly. We have a couple of episodes
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  previous to this where we talked about different topics related
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  to DPC. But one thing that is it's
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  really interesting. It's kind of, it's really sad
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  actually. And we were very fortunate to be
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  able to do because we have ADPC practice a year ago, actually
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  almost to the day, Hurricane Helene hit North Carolina, South
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  Carolina, Georgia, Tennessee. It just came up from the Gulf of
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  Mexico, hit several states, Western North Carolina.
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  It had several days, I think 2-3 days of just heavy, heavy rains
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  prior to Helene coming. And so that combined with Helene
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  and the way that Helene just stalled out over the area and
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  dumped so much water because massive flooding, many people
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  lost their lives, lost their homes, lost everything, their
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  businesses, their properties, their cars, all of their
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  belongings. It was horrible.
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  It was horrible. And even though we live in
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  Morganton, which is about an hour east of Asheville, where a
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  lot of a lot of people just lost everything, we were still
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  affected because we had all of that kind of downstream run off
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  of water from the Catawba River. It actually flooded in my town.
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  We couldn't get out from our house for a couple of days
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  because the river flooded, our Rd. couldn't get across, needed
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  a needed a kayak or something to get out.
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  And even still places were closed because they've been
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  flooded. So Rachel, my partner and I, we
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  were trying to figure out how can we help?
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  And we heard about this group at the Hickory Airport that was
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  delivering supplies and medicines to people who were cut
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  off by the hurricane because of the floodwaters.
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  The roads and bridges were washed out.
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  A lot of these people lived in remote areas and they weren't
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  able to get out. So there's a group called
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  Operation Hilo that had started, I think they started in Texas,
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  but they go around to different places where hurricanes have
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  affected, and they basically do the same thing.
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  They deliver supplies using helicopters to areas where you
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  can't get a car or truck or convoys.
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  And so we were able to go and help these efforts at the
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  airport. And because we are direct
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  primary care doctors, we were able to tell our patients, hey,
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  we've got to go and do this to help people.
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  And they were fine. No one complained that we
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  rescheduled their appointments. No one said, what about me?
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  They all knew that this was to help the community and to help
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  people who are in need. So they didn't mind and in fact
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  they were super generous and giving donations of money and
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  supplies that we then brought to the airport and the helicopter
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  pilots, they took these out. The military was involved,
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  National Guard, so it was a great community effort.
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  People in Hickory and Morganton, all around surrounding areas
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  were delivering supplies to be donated to people in need.
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  And they would come to the airport.
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  They brought their medicines and blankets, clothing, you know,
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  cleaning supplies, you name it, they were bringing it all.
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  So when we were at the airport, we were stationed in the medical
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  section. There were a couple of nurses,
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  few nurse practitioners, some pharmacists.
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  There was one other physician, he's a semi retired
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  pediatrician. And then there was us, because
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  no one else could get off from their fee for service jobs,
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  their hospital employed jobs, their insurance based jobs to
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  come out and help. And we had the flexibility to
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  get out there and we spent days helping out, organizing
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  medicines. We were able to order
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  medications from our suppliers. People donated medicines.
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  People in the DPC community were wonderful and they sent us
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  medicine, they sent nebulizers, they sent supplies.
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  With those we are able to make care packages to give to other
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  clinics in the area that had lost everything because of the
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  floods. So being ADPC Dr. has put us in
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  a very unique situation where we can help our community so much
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  easier than other doctors in fee for service could.
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  So we are both very grateful that we are DPC doctors and we
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  could help in this way. So that's one way that DPC has
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  changed our lives and made things better for us because we
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  knew that we could reschedule our patients, go and do these
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  things that needed to be done and there's no red tape.
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  We could just, we could just do it.
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  So very grateful again that we are doing DPC, very grateful for
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  all of the DPC doctors that helped, that donated supplies
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  and medicines from all over the country.
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  That was really truly incredible.
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  So anyway, all that rambling to say that I am extremely grateful
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  that I am a direct primary care doctor and glad that I can help
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  my community in ways that other doctors unfortunately can't
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  because of the way that their employment is structured.
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  And, you know, I think it's a, it's a wonderful way to
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  practice. And I hope that more people are
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  able to get out of the fee for service system and into DPC
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  because of the flexibility. There's so many reasons why, but
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  this is just one of those. So let's go on to our episode
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  today with Doctor Crystal Vernon.
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  She's a pediatrician in Tennessee and she's a partner at
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  her practice, but she also has another business which is
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  catering to physicians with children with ADHD.
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  And I felt she would be a wonderful guest for the show
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  just because it's something that I know a lot of my physician
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  friends deal with and having children with ADHD.
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  And I thought she would be a really great resource for our
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  listeners in case they have a child with ADHD, that they feel
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  like they need help and guidance in learning how to help their
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  child thrive. So thanks for being here.
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  And here we go with Doctor Crystal Vernon.
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  Today. I have Doctor Crystal Vernon
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  with me. She's a pediatrician graduate
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  from University of Tennessee Health Science Center and then
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  did Pede's presidency at University of Kentucky and she
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  practices at Premier Medical Group in Clarksville, TN.
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  She is also a physician coach, which is fascinating.
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  And she coaches mainly physicians, correct?
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  That is correct. Yep, with and how to parent
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  complex children and her business, her side gig, It's
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  called Doctor Anonymous Coaching.
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  That's a great name. Thank you.
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  Yeah, a little bit about the name.
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  Like when I was younger in my practice and had small kids at
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  home, I remember there were a lot of times that the
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  pediatrician, I was just like, oh, my goodness.
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  Like there were things that, you know, I had questions about and
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  I didn't know, like from the parenting side of the versus the
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  pediatrician side. And that made me feel a little
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  bit shameful. And I noticed that a lot of
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  people in physician groups and I thought there's some a really
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  big niche for that. Yeah, that's great.
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  Well, I'm glad you found it because I think it's fantastic.
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  I I remember my daughter was, and she was my oldest, so it was
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  my first child. I think she was 6.
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  And she had a cough for a couple weeks and she was fine.
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  Like she was acting fine. And so I brought her to the
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  pediatrician finally because I was like, it's getting kind of
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  long. And he's sitting there listening
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  to her and his face goes. And I was like, what?
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  He said, have you listened to her?
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  I said no. Why?
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  And she sounded awful. It's like, Oh my God, what kind
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  of parent? I always had the frame of mind
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  that I was my kids parent not their doctor and I never
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  listened to my kids unless I was the lol.
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  Right. Yeah.
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  So that's why I didn't listen to her.
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  I was trying to do the same thing.
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  So OK, well, let's talk about how you got into, you know,
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  really how you got into the coaching and then you know,
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  which came first, the coaching or the the doctor anonymous.
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  And and then I'll just let you free reign talk about what you
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  want to talk about because any little bit I think will be very
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  helpful. So I'll talk about the coaching
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  side of stuff first because I did get into coaching when I
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  started using coaching for my own self as part of weight loss
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  initially clear. And so I really enjoyed that
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  kind of future focus mindset. Really just how do you effect
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  change going forward? So not looking back, not trying
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  to solve path problems, just looking forward and making your
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  life better in whatever meaningful way that is for you.
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  And so I, I really did enjoy that piece of coaching.
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  And then Fast forward just a little bit, during COVID, I had
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  started in my pediatric practice realizing that I was using
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  examples from my own childhood when I would do ADHD evaluations
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  and that sort of thing. And then it started to click for
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  me that I probably had ADHD. And so life started making a
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  whole lot more sense in there. And I recognized that, you know,
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  a lot of the struggles that I have in or I've encountered with
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  parents that they bring up to me are, you know, the vast majority
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  are kind of behavioral things that fall into categories of
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  either neurodivergence or with some visual health stuff.
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  So in all of that with my own diagnosis and then really
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  enjoying coaching, I have done a big deep dive into mainly ADHD
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  behavioral side of coaching but also I have a fairly decent
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  sized medically complex practice.
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  Local pediatrician had retired and I hear that a lot of his
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  patients. And so I also know that there's
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  a lot of parents struggling with the medically complex patient
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  population too. So I just wanted to be that
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  resource for physicians so that they would have somebody else to
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  bounce things off as. So I do individual coaching in
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  any of those domains, and then I have some horse work that I have
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  done on one on ADHD and then another one on kind of calming
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  chaos, just like the chaotic life of parenting.
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  So yeah. Sound fantastic.
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  That's how I found you. And I honestly, I don't remember
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  exactly how I found you, but I, I remember the the doctor
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  anonymous and then parenting for children with ADHD.
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  And so when, when you talk to these parents, are you ever
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  like, wait a second, I think you have ADHD?
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  Well, I think that that happens both in the coaching room but
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  also in the medical practice realm because we do know that
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  there is a high hereditability, irritability of ADHD.
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  So sometimes we will, we will dive into that sometimes.
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  Yeah, yeah. And do parents, when they hear
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  that, they start to get kind of the light bulb moment as well
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  like you were? Sometimes, yeah, sometimes.
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  Now, what I will often do, and it's not necessarily by design
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  of trying to get the parent to buy in to recognizing
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  themselves, but sometimes that if we talk about how the skill
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  developed over a lifetime and how ADHD effects adults
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  differently than it affects children, then parents will
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  sometimes see a little bit more of those light bulbs too.
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  Fascinating. So the coaching you actually you
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  took, you got coached on coaching.
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  Tell me about that. How did you get into that?
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  So when I after I had been doing my own coaching as a client and
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  I decided that I wanted to do so coaching probably for
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  physicians, but I wasn't quite sure and I didn't know exactly
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  what domain I wanted to be in. So I didn't find Surgeon
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  Masters, which has a physician coaching program.
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  And so they coach position or they teach positions as well as
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  some other healthcare extenders how to bring coaching.
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  And the vast majority of that training was, I would say most
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  of our practice pitching was around practice management and
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  lifestyle, how kind of work like balance things like that.
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  But with the pediatrician side of things, the parenting thing
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  just got FELLA and and seemed to be a good fit.
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  So that coaching program is it, I guess it's not just for surge.
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  It's called surgeon masters. I just.
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  Assumed. Yes, OK, fascinating because
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  some of the other people who are listening may be interested in
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  doing that. Yeah.
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  So the founder is an orthopedic surgeon, Doctor Jeffrey Smith,
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  and he really has brought coaching into not only the
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  medicine side of things, but then he really enjoyed coaching
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  and thought it was such a useful benefit that he created this
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  program to help others coach. And there are quite a few who
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  are either business owners or in administrative positions with
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  their businesses, and also some that are in the education side
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  of medicine. So residency directors and
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  things like that will come through and learn coaching
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  skills that they can use. And when you went into the
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  coaching, how many years of practice like were you in
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  already or? Were you failing at that point?
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  Probably 17 ish. Oh, OK.
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  So yeah, yes, in a while, yeah. So how did that change the way
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  you treated your patients? Did it kind of make you more
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  aware of how you were trying to educate and, you know, motivate
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  them? Yeah.
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  So I think you're coaching, you know, when we talk about
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  effecting change for our patients and I think about like
• 16:06
  around obesity, for example, there's a lot I've talked about
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  motivational interviewing and coaching is really in that
• 16:12
  motivate motivational interviewing space.
• 16:14
  It is just kind of giving props that people can do, set their
• 16:18
  own self reflection and find out what is their best or their next
• 16:23
  step in reaching whatever that long term goal is that they
• 16:26
  have. Yes, actually it's really
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  interesting. I was thinking about it the
• 16:31
  other day that, you know, as a, as ADPC Dr. you have to know how
• 16:35
  to sell yourself essentially, right?
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  You have to sell the idea of DPC and sales is kind of like
• 16:44
  motivational interviewing, right?
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  You know, you have to find what that you know, what you know
• 16:51
  that that person needs and kind of get them to that point where
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  they realize, oh, this really is what I need to do.
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  Yeah. And I think that, you know, as I
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  have brought more coaching tactics into my medical
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  practice, what people recognize, that's kind of part of the way
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  that I see my patients too. That's a practice style that a
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  lot of people do appreciate. Yeah, definitely.
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  Yeah. So let's see how about, if you
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  don't mind, if, if there's a couple things that you can share
• 17:25
  with physician parents that you know, as far as how to not even
• 17:31
  necessarily medically complex kids, but things that would help
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  parents that are super busy. A lot of physicians are married
• 17:38
  to other physicians, and you know what, What kind of tips can
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  you give that would be helpful. I have really started using
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  this, what I consider the CPR approach, your approach with
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  parenting, but it can really work with any kind of
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  relationship. So the first thing is connecting
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  and really putting the relationship ahead of the other
• 17:59
  stuff. Second thing is helping each
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  other solve problems. And particularly for kids, you
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  know, when the lifetime goal is for them to be productive
• 18:09
  members of their own households and that they can really lead
• 18:12
  their own lives going through adulthood, I found that a lot of
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  times when we get through adolescents, we're still in that
• 18:19
  younger parenting stage where we're still telling kids a lot
• 18:22
  of the things that they need to do, where they need to be really
• 18:24
  learning how to do things for themselves.
• 18:27
  And so asking them those questions, using some of this
• 18:31
  same coaching skills for them. So, you know, how do you think
• 18:34
  that we can meet this goal together?
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  That time is a struggle and it's really hard every single night.
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  What do you think is the biggest problem?
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  I'm trying to engage them and helping with those solutions.
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  And then the third thing is response.
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  So connection, problem solving, your response, your response is
• 18:52
  giving other people back what you would want to see from them.
• 18:55
  So if you want to see an explosive kid, exploit it, your
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  kid, you know? Yeah, they marry.
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  You want to say some calm and irrational thinking.
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  You're like some deep breathing and reflection.
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  Then model those things for. Your kids, yeah, yeah, 'cause
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  they learn how to mirror what what they see.
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  Absolutely. Yeah, yes.
• 19:21
  So you started Doctor Anonymous? How long ago?
• 19:24
  What year? Is it after COVID and just this
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  year? I'm 25.
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  Oh, OK, OK. I was thinking, OK, so COVID was
• 19:33
  more like the start of it, right?
• 19:36
  So COVID time was when I was starting coaching for myself for
• 19:41
  other reasons. And then a couple years and
• 19:44
  later I started doing the coach training and, and then I kind of
• 19:49
  dallied with it a little bit, but wasn't like committed to
• 19:52
  like starting and focusing on building the business until
• 19:56
  this, this calendar year. This year, what prompted you
• 20:00
  like to get in there and really start this year?
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  Well, so I am certainly not an empty nester, but what if my
• 20:11
  kids explained to keep into adult land?
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  And so. I had a little bit more time on
• 20:17
  my hand for I could really dedicate a little bit more to
• 20:19
  that and that would would be part of this.
• 20:23
  Another part of it was really I want to be able to focus on
• 20:32
  medicine and this is kind of, you know, I, I am not PPC, I
• 20:36
  actually am a practice in a product practice that takes
• 20:39
  insurance. Are you a partner at your
• 20:41
  practice? I am.
• 20:43
  OK. Yeah, absolutely.
• 20:44
  Yeah, that is stressful and. I and I love Pediatrics and I, I
• 20:49
  love our business, but you know, a little bit of something that I
• 20:54
  knew that to bring in a little bit of mental recruit too, you
• 20:57
  know, like it brings happiness to me to be able to help other
• 21:00
  people and we don't have the trying that of time that we
• 21:05
  need. I think with patients, which is
• 21:07
  really a benefit and a service. I think with DPC practices that
• 21:12
  you have a lot more flexibility with that too.
• 21:15
  It is. It is great.
• 21:17
  So because you started the doctor Anonymous, did you have
• 21:20
  to cut back on time seeing your patients in the clinic or you
• 21:24
  just kind of worked it in? I just pretty much work it in.
• 21:29
  Yeah. Well, because if you think about
• 21:32
  it, most of us have very similar work schedules.
• 21:35
  Not everyone. There are some other people who
• 21:37
  have other work schedules. But because most people have a
• 21:40
  hard time taking off work to do, you know, things for themselves,
• 21:45
  I have been done to touch people at 5:00 in the morning so that
• 21:51
  that that work can set up schedule.
• 21:53
  So. Yeah.
• 21:54
  Well, that's great. I found it.
• 21:56
  Yeah. You're meeting them where they
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  are. That's awesome.
• 21:59
  I am I, I try. I try very hard and recently
• 22:03
  with this most recent enrollment started with some group coaching
• 22:07
  sessions so that the times were work fixed and people could come
• 22:11
  and go and join and not feel that pressure of the commitment.
• 22:15
  Although I do still offer individual coaching too.
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  So how big are your group sessions?
• 22:23
  Right now they're really small in the single digits.
• 22:26
  OK, you know. That's fine, that's pretty good
• 22:29
  'cause then you can can get a good conversation going And
• 22:33
  yeah, people don't feel quite so not I guess, shy 'cause it's
• 22:38
  just not that many people. Yes, I, I wanted and, and when I
• 22:44
  started there and I did put a cap on it, I think it was a
• 22:47
  little generous to put a cap at like 15 or 20, but I was like,
• 22:51
  you know, it's probably a little bit bigger.
• 22:52
  So it didn't end up feeling quite that full.
• 22:54
  So I was, you know, thankful that we've got that smaller
• 22:58
  number gram, you know. So you started this year.
• 23:02
  How has the response been? It's been pretty good.
• 23:06
  We, you know, I've had some people who have found me through
• 23:09
  some physician online groups, but I really did want to also
• 23:12
  kind of do a slow up start just because I want to make sure that
• 23:16
  I can, you know, Pediatrics stole my, my first blood.
• 23:20
  So wanted to be able to, to offer my best self there and
• 23:24
  then, but also my best self to client.
• 23:26
  So I didn't want those to grow too terribly fast.
• 23:29
  So I, I basically, I've just done some grassroots organic
• 23:33
  social media marketing and nothing much bigger than that
• 23:36
  yet so. Thank you.
• 23:37
  Maybe you say. Yeah, that's great.
• 23:40
  Yeah. But then you know when you start
• 23:41
  that it is kind of that balance of you want to show up for, for
• 23:46
  your patients come on both sides.
• 23:48
  Yeah, Yeah, definitely. Well, with the new business with
• 23:54
  Doctor Anonymous, is there anything in particular that you
• 23:58
  think this is working really well?
• 24:00
  Like you thought, OK, that worked.
• 24:03
  And then is there something we thought, wow, I wouldn't have
• 24:07
  done business wise? I mean like maybe I should have
• 24:09
  done it that way or I would have done it differently.
• 24:13
  Yeah, I, while I say that I want it slow, I probably didn't
• 24:17
  intend for it to be 3 years before I started taking
• 24:19
  patients, not patient, client, client because we do no medical
• 24:23
  care in the coaching realm, right, none.
• 24:26
  So I always try to make that very clear in front.
• 24:29
  I'm not going to talk about medicine.
• 24:30
  I am. We're not going to talk about
• 24:31
  like we haven't talked about like disease processors, like
• 24:36
  from an educational, academic standpoint, but not like your
• 24:40
  specific kids disease process. This was more just functional.
• 24:43
  Like, how are we going to get through day-to-day life and just
• 24:47
  happening to know that we have this in the background.
• 24:49
  But yeah, it was a little bit slower.
• 24:52
  But I had, you know, when I first started doing the
• 24:55
  certification and the training programs, I still have both my
• 25:00
  kids at home. And so I had a lot more running
• 25:03
  around to do, as you know, with teenagers.
• 25:05
  So yeah. Right.
• 25:07
  Yeah, yeah. You know, it's been nice to take
• 25:10
  it at my own pace, but. Yeah, you're ready to go, sounds
• 25:16
  like. I'm I might get to grow soon,
• 25:18
  yeah. When you did the coaching, what
• 25:21
  part of the coaching did you enjoy the most?
• 25:25
  So I really enjoyed just the fact of kind of being your own
• 25:28
  scientist, figuring out what your records were so that you
• 25:32
  could then make the small changes.
• 25:35
  And sometimes I didn't realize that the changes could be so
• 25:39
  small and make a big difference. A lot of times you think about
• 25:44
  these like, oh, the problem is so big it needs a big solution.
• 25:49
  But really, if you can just make the first little step, you're on
• 25:53
  your way to changing things. Right, right.
• 25:57
  Yeah. So, OK, well let me, is there
• 26:01
  something else that you wanted to discuss?
• 26:03
  Say, first of all, you know you're not alone.
• 26:07
  There are a lot of other doctors who are thinking a lot of the
• 26:10
  exact same things that you are, whatever that is.
• 26:13
  And I think that if you Google in any position online group,
• 26:16
  you will see that you are not alone.
• 26:18
  It's just everybody thinks that they are because we're not
• 26:20
  always real open sharing about ourselves in our fashion, I
• 26:26
  think, and we should be. And we should take care of
• 26:28
  ourselves so that we can keep taking care of others, both
• 26:33
  within our nuclear families but also in the medical realm.
• 26:37
  So yeah, yeah, it's kind of that airplane analogy.
• 26:42
  Parents, put on your oxygen mask first before you assist your
• 26:46
  children. Right, Yes, that's so true.
• 26:48
  Yeah. Well, thank you.
• 26:50
  Yes, the the whole point of this podcast is kind of to that point
• 26:56
  as well. You know, that you're not alone.
• 26:58
  And just for people who are trying to or they're considering
• 27:02
  going into DPC, that, yeah, there is a huge community now.
• 27:06
  It's just growing every day. And so that it's, it's been, I
• 27:11
  mean, the community has been great.
• 27:12
  Everyone is always really willing to help.
• 27:14
  So that makes it hopefully easier for people to make that
• 27:18
  decision and decide to do that. Yeah, yeah.
• 27:22
  As we love it and I would be happy and open to talking with
• 27:26
  any of your listeners about what we what we have to offer.
• 27:31
  Yeah, I know. Yes, I I went to your website
• 27:34
  and I thought this is fantastic and that yes, I know.
• 27:38
  I mean, I know other doctor parents with children with ADHD.
• 27:43
  And so, yeah, I think you'll be very, very busy.
• 27:47
  I think now that you actually have gotten it off the ground.
• 27:50
  Yes, yeah. I don't think you're going to
• 27:53
  have to do a whole lot of advertising.
• 27:55
  I think that word of mouth is really going to, you know, send
• 27:58
  a lot of people towards you. I.
• 27:59
  Love it. I'm excited.
• 28:01
  Yeah, I'm too. I hope to do your course soon.
• 28:05
  Wow, there it is. There we will probably the next
• 28:09
  big enrollment after this podcast airs would be around the
• 28:13
  first of the year. OK.
• 28:14
  Because I do usually open around that time, or at least that was
• 28:17
  when I did my first opening, and I know that a lot of people are
• 28:21
  looking to make a lot of good changes the first of the year.
• 28:23
  So that makes sense. Good time to.
• 28:25
  Get started. Yes.
• 28:27
  And explain is it cohorts you're doing, is it 12 weeks or how,
• 28:31
  how does it work? It's a 12 week course and so we
• 28:34
  do the 12 weeks worth of coaching is a weekly e-mail and
• 28:37
  that comes with some worksheets and a video that's usually about
• 28:42
  10 to 15 minutes. So I try to make it really small
• 28:44
  because I know that a lot of people don't have a lot of time
• 28:47
  or they both feel too overwhelmed to open it.
• 28:49
  So we want to make it in manageable bite size pieces.
• 28:53
  Right. And then the group session or is
• 28:56
  that all for all of the coaching that you do in the one and one
• 28:59
  one-on-one and the group? Or.
• 29:02
  They get the. E-mail so if you wanted to focus
• 29:07
  on something that I've got a force for.
• 29:09
  So either the CALM, the KF, which was the other course that
• 29:14
  I've done, or the parenting ADHD, then we can set that up to
• 29:18
  continue to be through a weekly e-mail even if you didn't join
• 29:21
  at the first part of a cohort if you're doing individual.
• 29:23
  Coaching. OK, I see.
• 29:25
  All right. So you have a January cohort and
• 29:29
  then a second one during the year.
• 29:32
  Or so I try to do something quarterly.
• 29:35
  OK. And this year 80, the parenting
• 29:39
  81 was there was more interest in that one, so I've offered it
• 29:43
  twice this year. All right.
• 29:46
  Wonderful. So if they don't catch you in
• 29:47
  January, they can catch you sometime else during the year?
• 29:51
  Absolutely. And I'm envisioning that maybe
• 29:53
  at some point down the road I will release the courses as
• 29:56
  standalone, but I want to make sure that all the kinks are
• 29:59
  worked out. And you know, as we do some
• 30:02
  coaching with each of these cohorts, if they see anything
• 30:04
  that needs to be tweaked a little bit, we'll get that
• 30:06
  tweaked before we leave it as a standalone course for people to.
• 30:10
  And you can always, you know, update and just keep drinking,
• 30:15
  tweaking it, right? Yes.
• 30:18
  Well, how do people find you? What's the best way to get in
• 30:21
  touch with you or find you? Unless so, I am in the social
• 30:25
  media realm. I am most active on Facebook and
• 30:29
  you can search for my name. I've got my personal profile and
• 30:32
  then I've got the business page. The business page is Doctor
• 30:36
  Ramanas Coaching, Hyphen, Crystal Vernon and then my
• 30:41
  personal profile is just all garnered there and then the
• 30:45
  e-mail is dr.anonymous.coaching@gmail.com
• 30:50
  and then the website is Doctor Anonymous coaching.com.
• 30:54
  I think people can remember this.
• 30:56
  I think we just Google Doctor Anonymous.
• 30:58
  I can't imagine there's more than you.
• 31:00
  Is there? Well, there there is a little
• 31:03
  bit. So apparently there was the
• 31:05
  psychiatrist mini minutes ago who was called by the name
• 31:08
  Doctor Anonymous. I believe it was a psychiatrist.
• 31:11
  But yeah, it's really interesting because when you try
• 31:14
  to Google anything that's like physician related, it tries to
• 31:16
  send you to a specific like person or disease state.
• 31:20
  And it's really hard to find stuff that's labeled Dr.
• 31:23
  Something I found when I was trying to come up with a name.
• 31:28
  Because when you try to like look for physician ADHD coach or
• 31:32
  even a parent coach for physicians, it's often times
• 31:35
  just going to send you to like an ADHD page or a like a disease
• 31:41
  process page rather than. A now.
• 31:45
  Than a service for physician. Right, I think it just doesn't
• 31:48
  understand. Right.
• 31:50
  I think it thinks you're looking for a physician and not that you
• 31:53
  are a physician looking for a service that was typically
• 31:55
  drafted for physicians, so. Well, that is.
• 31:58
  That has been a challenging piece though.
• 32:02
  I'm trying to get into search it.
• 32:05
  Sounds like an SEO thing. OK, well thank you so much.
• 32:10
  I appreciate your time. I do want to get into your
• 32:13
  course later this year if everything works well with this
• 32:17
  sounds. Great.
• 32:18
  Step by step, feet. Happy.
• 32:20
  Thank you. Thank you for listening to DPC
• 32:24
  Life. If today's conversation inspired
• 32:27
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• 32:31
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• 32:35
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• 32:40
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• 32:44
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