Latest / Sukany4: The Walk and Talk Podcast / Penny Millar - River Brathay.- on career changes, finding Her Calling as a Virtual Assistant and Franchise Owner

Transcript

Penny Millar - River Brathay.- on career changes, finding Her Calling as a Virtual Assistant and Franchise Owner · Sukany4: The Walk and Talk Podcast

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_02: And it went from that.
• 0:01
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 0:01
  SPEAKER_02: So I hadn't been looking to join a franchise.
• 0:03
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 0:04
  SPEAKER_02: And had I not found Pink Spaghetti, would I have done this?
• 0:07
  SPEAKER_02: And maybe it wouldn't have done.
• 0:08
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 0:09
  SPEAKER_02: It was interesting.
• 0:10
  SPEAKER_02: For want of a better way of putting it, it gave me the safety net that I may not have needed, but it was nice to have.
• 0:16
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 0:22
  SPEAKER_01: Hello and welcome back to Sakania, the Walk and Talk Podcast.
• 0:27
  SPEAKER_01: I'm Sakania and this is the show where we walk, we talk, and somewhere along the way, in between the muddy boots and the magnificent views, we find the stories that flow that day and perhaps exactly what you need to hear today.
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_01: Today's episode is a little bit special to me.
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_01: We're walking the Skellet Bridge to Elterwater Route in the Lake District along the River Brazy.
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_01: On a typically autumnal Cumbrian day where the sky is dull, grey, cloudy, but not cold enough for jacket, and the rain is misly, so definitely not wet enough to cancel.
• 1:10
  SPEAKER_01: And the colours that the leaves are turning are just stunning.
• 1:14
  SPEAKER_01: It's so special because it's with Penny Miller.
• 1:19
  SPEAKER_01: Penny has been instrumental in helping with the background tasks of the early days of setting up this podcast.
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_01: Always on hand to pick up the endless voice notes, emails, and always with gentle reassurance that everything is achievable.
• 1:38
  SPEAKER_01: Penny, you are definitely my fourth emergency service.
• 1:43
  SPEAKER_01: I thank you for everything you do for me.
• 1:46
  SPEAKER_01: So who is Penny Miller?
• 1:49
  SPEAKER_01: Penny is the franchisee of Pink Spaghetti Kendall, virtual assistant, extraordinaire, and just the most wonderful, hardworking, puts everyone first kind of a person who has never once taken the obvious path and yet somehow always ended up exactly where she needed to be.
• 2:10
  SPEAKER_01: From managing a bar in Kendall to a switch gear manufacturer, which then grew into a corporate machine that started to feel fullpenny, less and less like home, until the day came when she missed her stepdaughter's school Christmas play.
• 2:28
  SPEAKER_01: And then something quietly and permanently shifted for her.
• 2:34
  SPEAKER_01: In this episode, we talk about what it means to finally back yourself, about why Franchisee gave Penny a foundation she might never have built alone, about the clients who've stayed with her for six years, and why, for her, that's the only trophy she really needs.
• 2:53
  SPEAKER_01: So grab your headphones or get cozy, or get outside if you can, and let's walk.
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_02: Hi Panny! Hi Zekania, how are you?
• 3:06
  SPEAKER_02: I'm very good, Bailey.
• 3:07
  SPEAKER_02: How are you?
• 3:08
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, good thing.
• 3:08
  SPEAKER_02: Here, I've been horning.
• 3:10
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, uh half term, so sorting out small, well, lots of small 12-year-old.
• 3:17
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 3:18
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, she's quite tall, isn't she?
• 3:19
  SPEAKER_02: She's very tall.
• 3:20
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 3:21
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, she's very tall.
• 3:22
  SPEAKER_02: Going to get into my clothes and my shoes.
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_02: Stop here.
• 3:24
  SPEAKER_02: Yep.
• 3:25
  SPEAKER_02: So we're doing the Elterwater walk, which is just a really nice little stroll.
• 3:30
  SPEAKER_02: It's nothing hard or heavy.
• 3:32
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 3:32
  SPEAKER_02: She says as we go up a small hill.
• 3:34
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 3:35
  SPEAKER_02: It is beautiful.
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_02: But also because it's right next to the river, it's just it's just a really beautiful setting.
• 3:40
  SPEAKER_02: I believe this walking hall.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_02: It's beautiful.
• 3:43
  SPEAKER_02: So the river um Brayday.
• 3:45
  SPEAKER_02: And then we come out next to Elterwater if we go all the way to the ends.
• 3:49
  SPEAKER_02: And it's just a really nice walk.
• 3:50
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's nice and beautiful.
• 3:52
  SPEAKER_02: And it's early as well, so fair place at the moment.
• 3:54
  SPEAKER_02: It is.
• 3:55
  SPEAKER_02: But do you do this walk a lot?
• 3:57
  SPEAKER_02: We used to do it quite a bit with Willow, but it's a nice, easy one to do.
• 4:00
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 4:01
  SPEAKER_02: But actually I haven't been out for a bit.
• 4:02
  SPEAKER_02: So when you said make suggestions of walks, I thought, ah, this is uh water.
• 4:09
  SPEAKER_02: That's exciting.
• 4:09
  SPEAKER_02: Isn't it smell?
• 4:10
  SPEAKER_02: So to come through here, you're gonna see all of the mountains.
• 4:13
  SPEAKER_02: Honestly, old man will be up to your left.
• 4:15
  SPEAKER_02: Oh.
• 4:16
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, you've got the Langdells.
• 4:18
  SPEAKER_02: I can't believe even I found this walk bits.
• 4:20
  SPEAKER_02: I have one back, but I'll be swalking from there.
• 4:22
  SPEAKER_02: Did you walk back the other way?
• 4:23
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 4:24
  SPEAKER_02: Because you walk you walk all the way through to the pub at the other end and then come back.
• 4:27
  SPEAKER_02: So you're doing oh, you start with chesters for pay streets and you stop in the middle for chips.
• 4:32
  SPEAKER_02: Oh boy.
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_02: But then you come back again.
• 4:35
  SPEAKER_02: Well honey, how does it fall to be on this side?
• 4:39
  SPEAKER_02: The process.
• 4:39
  SPEAKER_02: It's really weird.
• 4:40
  SPEAKER_02: And I think this is why I've overthought it because I I know the process and I've listened to all the pods.
• 4:48
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 4:48
  SPEAKER_02: You know how much I love them.
• 4:50
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 4:50
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, thank you.
• 4:51
  SPEAKER_02: And thank you for all your help.
• 4:53
  SPEAKER_02: But of course, we'll get into what you do business later.
• 4:57
  SPEAKER_02: Can you get through?
• 4:58
  SPEAKER_02: Can I get through it?
• 4:59
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, it's a bit tight.
• 5:01
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's not backpack friendly, is it?
• 5:03
  SPEAKER_02: No, hang on.
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, this is the way we did the Cumbria Way.
• 5:06
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, okay.
• 5:06
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, from Skelet's Bridge.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_02: So we walked from Skelet's Bridge.
• 5:09
  SPEAKER_02: Which is where we just were.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_02: You must have come that way.
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_02: Did you just walk with your eyes shut?
• 5:13
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, basically.
• 5:14
  SPEAKER_02: So Penny, who are you?
• 5:16
  SPEAKER_02: Who is I'm kidding?
• 5:18
  SPEAKER_02: That's too much.
• 5:20
  SPEAKER_02: When you're one.
• 5:22
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, when I was one, I had nothing much interesting to say.
• 5:27
  SPEAKER_02: Did you grow up in Cumbria?
• 5:29
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_02: So I was born in North London.
• 5:32
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 5:33
  SPEAKER_02: Well not North London.
• 5:35
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, where where about Oxbridge.
• 5:37
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 5:37
  SPEAKER_02: How about you?
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_02: Enfield.
• 5:39
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, Enfield.
• 5:40
  SPEAKER_02: But it is considered one of the boroughs.
• 5:43
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 5:43
  SPEAKER_02: And then when we were five, we moved to Hampshire.
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, okay.
• 5:46
  SPEAKER_02: And then 10 to Kendall.
• 5:48
  SPEAKER_02: So I've been here a really long time.
• 5:50
  SPEAKER_02: Stayed here.
• 5:51
  SPEAKER_02: I'll stay here.
• 5:53
  SPEAKER_02: Oh wow.
• 5:53
  SPEAKER_02: So from from the age of ten.
• 5:55
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, so I've been here 41 years now.
• 5:57
  SPEAKER_02: Wow.
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 5:58
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 5:59
  SPEAKER_02: So I consider myself complete.
• 6:01
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, 41 years.
• 6:02
  SPEAKER_02: Which makes me 51.
• 6:04
  SPEAKER_02: That's what I mean.
• 6:04
  SPEAKER_02: You're lying.
• 6:05
  SPEAKER_02: There's no way.
• 6:06
  SPEAKER_02: You know I am.
• 6:08
  SPEAKER_02: There is no way.
• 6:09
  SPEAKER_02: So what triggered the move to the countryside?
• 6:12
  SPEAKER_02: Dad's job, he was offered a job in Bristol with a company he was working with, which they took.
• 6:17
  SPEAKER_02: They had schools lined up for us and they put an offering at the house.
• 6:22
  SPEAKER_02: And then the company said, Or there's Cumbria, Kendall.
• 6:28
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 6:29
  SPEAKER_02: And mum and dad didn't know this area at all.
• 6:32
  SPEAKER_02: It was that typical never been north of Birmingham type.
• 6:36
  SPEAKER_02: Mid 80s.
• 6:37
  SPEAKER_02: Well, they came up on the train.
• 6:38
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_02: And they got off the train at Oxno, and it was March, and everything was covered in snow.
• 6:43
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_02: Wow, that's phenomenal.
• 6:46
  SPEAKER_02: Everything was covered in snow.
• 6:48
  SPEAKER_02: And mum said they more or less made the decision on the on the station.
• 6:52
  SPEAKER_01: That was their first visit.
• 6:54
  SPEAKER_01: They hadn't stepped out of the station and they were sold on it.
• 6:57
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 6:57
  SPEAKER_02: That's amazing.
• 6:58
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_02: The magic.
• 7:00
  SPEAKER_02: So Bristol was sort of discarded quite quickly.
• 7:05
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 7:05
  SPEAKER_02: And we moved up here instead.
• 7:07
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, to be fair to Bristol, I really like it.
• 7:09
  SPEAKER_02: Bristol's an awesome city.
• 7:10
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 7:11
  SPEAKER_02: Just putting it out there.
• 7:13
  SPEAKER_02: We well, we'd have been happy there as well, but I think this w was very different.
• 7:17
  SPEAKER_02: So we came from a little town called Petersfield, uh-huh.
• 7:22
  SPEAKER_02: Which is gorgeous.
• 7:23
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 7:23
  SPEAKER_02: And small and dinky and very community-based.
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 7:27
  SPEAKER_02: So Kendall was different, but it felt huge.
• 7:30
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_02: Cosmopolitan.
• 7:32
  SPEAKER_02: Oh my goodness.
• 7:33
  SPEAKER_02: How funny.
• 7:33
  SPEAKER_02: Well, because me at 10, I didn't really have any memory of London.
• 7:36
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that's a good point.
• 7:38
  SPEAKER_02: As a kid, you don't get any choice, it's just where we're going.
• 7:41
  SPEAKER_02: So up we came.
• 7:42
  SPEAKER_02: Well, what a brave move.
• 7:43
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, for mum and dad, yeah, it was big.
• 7:45
  SPEAKER_02: And also so far away from their families.
• 7:47
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, friends.
• 7:48
  SPEAKER_02: Friendship circle.
• 7:50
  SPEAKER_02: But you know, for my grandparents, it's like a four, four and a half hour drive.
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_02: It's a long way.
• 7:55
  SPEAKER_02: That is a long way.
• 7:56
  SPEAKER_02: Have to say though, part of my heart still does.
• 7:57
  SPEAKER_02: I feel it belongs in London.
• 7:59
  SPEAKER_02: Really?
• 7:59
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 8:00
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, your accent, you look very strongly for one.
• 8:03
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 8:04
  SPEAKER_02: No, my um because my mum and dad obviously had southern accents.
• 8:08
  SPEAKER_02: What's funny is Toby, the middle brother, yeah, is very northern.
• 8:13
  SPEAKER_02: Oh really.
• 8:14
  SPEAKER_02: Daniel the youngest is like me.
• 8:16
  SPEAKER_02: Oh really?
• 8:16
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, I'm southern.
• 8:17
  SPEAKER_02: Um if I go south though, everyone says to me, God, you're so northern.
• 8:23
  SPEAKER_02: And yeah, I can't hear any.
• 8:25
  SPEAKER_02: I can't get northern as well.
• 8:27
  SPEAKER_02: Well that's good because you're a southerner, so you get it.
• 8:29
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah, for sure.
• 8:31
  SPEAKER_02: Because we live here.
• 8:32
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 8:33
  SPEAKER_02: Do you take it for granted?
• 8:34
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, I don't know.
• 8:35
  SPEAKER_02: I th I think because I moved up.
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_02: Later, yeah.
• 8:39
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 8:40
  SPEAKER_01: I totally appreciate it.
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_01: I just kind of every time I come to these walks, and even if I've done it a hundred times, just like wow.
• 8:48
  SPEAKER_01: But it's interesting because my friends walk off with who sorry, who I didn't grow up with, who grew up in the lake.
• 8:55
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah.
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_02: When they see it through my eyes, they uh see it differently.
• 9:00
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 9:00
  SPEAKER_02: Well, that's the thing.
• 9:01
  SPEAKER_02: It's only when I'm going to it tends to be when I'm picking people up front station.
• 9:05
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 9:05
  SPEAKER_02: Pendle station.
• 9:06
  SPEAKER_02: Absolutely.
• 9:07
  SPEAKER_02: When we're driving back down that hill, yeah, and you've got the view.
• 9:11
  SPEAKER_02: People are just like, oh my god.
• 9:13
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm like, oh yeah, no, that's quite amazing.
• 9:15
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah, exactly.
• 9:16
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 9:17
  SPEAKER_02: Look, this is where my merry people wellies come into their own.
• 9:20
  SPEAKER_02: I'm I'm looking at those.
• 9:21
  SPEAKER_02: They look great.
• 9:22
  SPEAKER_02: You can get them loads of different colours.
• 9:24
  SPEAKER_02: Can they?
• 9:24
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 9:25
  SPEAKER_02: You can get a bright pink, I resisted.
• 9:26
  SPEAKER_02: Shoot and which square did you go to?
• 9:30
  SPEAKER_02: We went to Queen Catherine.
• 9:31
  SPEAKER_02: I did you.
• 9:31
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, which is where Willow is now.
• 9:33
  SPEAKER_02: Oh wow.
• 9:35
  SPEAKER_02: You're lovely and really weird.
• 9:37
  unknown: Yeah.
• 9:38
  SPEAKER_02: Is it weird?
• 9:39
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, because it's a school event.
• 9:41
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 9:41
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 9:42
  SPEAKER_02: When we went to have a look around.
• 9:43
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 9:43
  SPEAKER_02: Because I thought she'd go to Kirby, but she um she chose Queen Catherine because that's where most of her friends were going.
• 9:50
  SPEAKER_02: It is really strange.
• 9:51
  SPEAKER_02: Everything's really small, isn't it?
• 9:53
  SPEAKER_02: But at the time you'd also think like oh garland, so it's special.
• 9:57
  SPEAKER_02: Big school.
• 9:58
  SPEAKER_02: I'm a I'm growing up.
• 10:00
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's small.
• 10:01
  SPEAKER_02: See, when I was younger, God you know, I really envy or really envied those people who grew up with a plan.
• 10:08
  SPEAKER_02: Did you know what you wanted to do?
• 10:10
  SPEAKER_02: Obviously not.
• 10:11
  SPEAKER_02: Me neither.
• 10:12
  SPEAKER_01: No, I had no idea.
• 10:13
  SPEAKER_02: But I did know in terms of having a plan that the sort mostly the sort of things I wanted to achieve.
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_02: I had I had none of that.
• 10:22
  SPEAKER_02: I had a quite plan for money.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_02: Did you?
• 10:25
  SPEAKER_02: See, you'd be the sort of person I would envy.
• 10:28
  SPEAKER_02: But I don't know if I knew that that's what I was doing at the time, but I just knew.
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_02: I mean I guess it's both tea.
• 10:35
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 10:36
  SPEAKER_02: I well see, I didn't even do that.
• 10:38
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 10:38
  SPEAKER_02: I kind of thought that I don't know, maybe I thought life would always pan out the way it should.
• 10:43
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 10:43
  SPEAKER_02: We're kind of given a blueprint, aren't we, of what's supposed to be, and that's kind of put in our minds from all the media we consume children.
• 10:52
  SPEAKER_02: And there's all also now with social media, but there's almost an element of whimsy there as well, though, in there romanticising the whole thing and thinking that it'll all just work out.
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 11:02
  SPEAKER_02: Life isn't like that.
• 11:03
  SPEAKER_02: Now we're talking.
• 11:05
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 11:05
  SPEAKER_02: So what was your first hot head thing that you did by choice in terms of work?
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_02: Well, I worked from 12 at the local post office.
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_02: Yep.
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_02: Doing what?
• 11:15
  SPEAKER_02: I was behind the counter in the shop.
• 11:17
  SPEAKER_02: What?
• 11:18
  SPEAKER_02: Yep.
• 11:18
  SPEAKER_02: And I I earned£1.40 an hour.
• 11:23
  SPEAKER_02: I mean I really enjoyed that job.
• 11:25
  SPEAKER_02: Um yeah.
• 11:25
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 11:26
  SPEAKER_02: So from 12 till 17 I did that.
• 11:29
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 11:30
  SPEAKER_02: And just I loved it.
• 11:32
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 11:32
  SPEAKER_02: Knew all the community that would come in.
• 11:35
  SPEAKER_02: Because of where the post office was situated, you had the same people coming in all the time.
• 11:40
  SPEAKER_02: Weird now thinking about it, I sold a lot of cigarettes.
• 11:43
  SPEAKER_02: Did you at 12?
• 11:44
  SPEAKER_02: At 12.
• 11:46
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, how funny.
• 11:47
  SPEAKER_02: Used to be able to buy them in singles.
• 11:50
  SPEAKER_02: No, really.
• 11:51
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 11:51
  SPEAKER_02: Wow.
• 11:52
  SPEAKER_02: Used to be able to come in and buy one cigarette.
• 11:54
  SPEAKER_02: So if if you had kids come in, like you're not going to challenge your child.
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_02: Oh no, I was pretty good at that.
• 12:02
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 12:02
  SPEAKER_02: You didn't really.
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_02: I don't think we ever really got anyone to try.
• 12:06
  SPEAKER_02: I don't think anyone came in to be honest.
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_02: I was there on a Tuesday evening and a Saturday morning.
• 12:11
  SPEAKER_02: And the odd additional shift.
• 12:13
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_02: It was great for giving me a sense of ownership, responsibility.
• 12:19
  SPEAKER_02: And this was before so they did have a like a they sound like they didn't have anything high tech.
• 12:24
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 12:25
  SPEAKER_02: But I was taught how to count without using the till, a skill I still think is really valuable.
• 12:30
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, absolutely.
• 12:31
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, so as in count backwards.
• 12:33
  SPEAKER_02: So someone gave me a 20 and something with 350.
• 12:36
  SPEAKER_02: I wouldn't use the till to work it out.
• 12:37
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 12:38
  SPEAKER_02: I'd use my brain.
• 12:39
  SPEAKER_02: And it is true.
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_02: Like we we have so de-skilled these days because of technology.
• 12:44
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 12:45
  SPEAKER_02: We've outsourced our brains.
• 12:47
  SPEAKER_02: But even that, yeah, we don't have money anymore.
• 12:49
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 12:50
  SPEAKER_02: How do you pay with anything with cash?
• 12:51
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, with cash.
• 12:52
  SPEAKER_02: That's true.
• 12:52
  SPEAKER_02: You don't need calculating.
• 12:54
  SPEAKER_02: No, it's all done with cards.
• 12:56
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 12:56
  SPEAKER_02: Or phones.
• 12:57
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 12:57
  SPEAKER_02: But what if you lost your phone?
• 12:58
  SPEAKER_02: Oh no, we'd only bug it.
• 13:00
  SPEAKER_02: Well, I don't yeah, I don't have it on my watch either, so that's almost beyond stack for me, Admiral.
• 13:05
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, because that, you know, I like my smartwatch to just be about attracting stuff.
• 13:10
  SPEAKER_02: I don't want my phone to ring on my fits.
• 13:12
  SPEAKER_02: So after so I I was there for four years or so.
• 13:16
  SPEAKER_02: And then I started working at Killington Lake, which is the service station on the M6.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_02: Again, really see, this is my thing.
• 13:22
  SPEAKER_02: Once I'm working for somebody, I'm all in.
• 13:24
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 13:25
  SPEAKER_02: So I'm motorway service station and I worked in every different department.
• 13:28
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 13:30
  SPEAKER_02: And what is there we at?
• 13:32
  SPEAKER_02: Uh 16 to 20?
• 13:34
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 13:34
  SPEAKER_02: So when I was doing my degree as well.
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_02: My favourite bit was working in a winky and making burgers.
• 13:40
  SPEAKER_02: As a vegetarian, that's quite a thing.
• 13:42
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, obviously I don't hunt out fast food places because my body is a temple thing.
• 13:49
  SPEAKER_02: I'm not laughing because I don't think it is.
• 13:51
  SPEAKER_02: That was a bit of a hard laugh.
• 13:52
  SPEAKER_02: That was a bit No, I think you've you've also witnessed the binging.
• 13:58
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, but you know there's room for all of it.
• 14:01
  SPEAKER_02: Well it's a balance.
• 14:02
  SPEAKER_02: Of course it is.
• 14:03
  SPEAKER_02: But you know, as vegetarian, but I still really enjoy making the burgers.
• 14:07
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 14:07
  SPEAKER_02: Again, it's about a process.
• 14:09
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 14:09
  SPEAKER_02: I think I'm clearly process-driven.
• 14:11
  SPEAKER_02: I think one of the things that stands out to me about you is how you don't really sing your own phrases.
• 14:17
  SPEAKER_02: Not that people do.
• 14:18
  SPEAKER_02: Um but I think one of the things that really attracts me to you is that you're exceptionally poor at everything you turn your hand to.
• 14:29
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 14:29
  SPEAKER_02: You're not the sort of person who will walk in a room and go, I should do that.
• 14:33
  SPEAKER_02: No, I know, because like most people, my voice is going, You can't do that.
• 14:39
  SPEAKER_02: And I know it can.
• 14:40
  SPEAKER_02: And that's really good to know.
• 14:42
  SPEAKER_02: And now I and now I can.
• 14:43
  SPEAKER_02: The thing is, there's a you you can we can figure everything out, can't we?
• 14:47
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 14:47
  SPEAKER_02: And if I can't, then I'll find someone who can.
• 14:49
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 14:50
  SPEAKER_02: I think it's knowing what you are capable of and knowing when to call somebody else in.
• 14:54
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, when to ask for help.
• 14:56
  SPEAKER_02: And there are lots of different reasons to ask for help.
• 14:58
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 14:58
  SPEAKER_02: I suppose it just comes to work.
• 15:00
  SPEAKER_02: You know what I do.
• 15:02
  SPEAKER_02: That's gonna be really irritating people.
• 15:04
  SPEAKER_02: Maybe I need to.
• 15:06
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that's the thing, it's just pacing it.
• 15:07
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 15:08
  SPEAKER_02: Um, we're not going quite fast.
• 15:09
  SPEAKER_02: I'm just this is just what slows me down.
• 15:11
  SPEAKER_02: No, but for talking walking.
• 15:13
  SPEAKER_02: Well, when I walk when I'm walking normally, and I'm going at because I walk at speed.
• 15:17
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 15:17
  SPEAKER_02: I must walk past people and people must think, my gosh, he's gonna die.
• 15:20
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I think don't we don't we all have imposter syndrome?
• 15:25
  SPEAKER_02: Isn't that something most of us there are very few people who don't.
• 15:28
  SPEAKER_02: And it's that in my experience.
• 15:33
  SPEAKER_01: If you let that inner voice dominate, you have to push through that thing out.
• 15:37
  SPEAKER_02: And I think it's knowing that if it goes wrong, everything can be fixed.
• 15:42
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 15:43
  SPEAKER_02: And also knowing when to put your hand up and go, I don't know how to do this.
• 15:47
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 15:47
  SPEAKER_02: Or I've got this wrong.
• 15:49
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 15:49
  SPEAKER_02: There's power in that.
• 15:50
  SPEAKER_02: There is power in that, and it yeah, it is the thought of taking something back, isn't it?
• 15:56
  SPEAKER_01: And claiming something in terms of moving forward.
• 16:00
  SPEAKER_02: So you can't move forward if you're trying to be all things to all people.
• 16:04
  SPEAKER_02: Absolutely.
• 16:06
  SPEAKER_02: But there's always room to learn as well.
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_02: We don't know everything.
• 16:10
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 16:10
  SPEAKER_02: No, every day is a school day.
• 16:13
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_02: Do you think that's something that comes with age?
• 16:16
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 16:17
  SPEAKER_02: It's true.
• 16:17
  SPEAKER_02: And it's also, you know, we spend a lot of time, I think, in our 30s and forties on picking and unlearning things.
• 16:24
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 16:25
  SPEAKER_02: Because I think your twenties are really the first decade where you're seeing the world through your eyes.
• 16:31
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, yeah, completely.
• 16:33
  SPEAKER_02: But also in your twenties, you do tend to think you know everything.
• 16:36
  SPEAKER_02: You do, yeah.
• 16:37
  SPEAKER_02: But there's sort of to get you through it, it starts to crumble.
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_02: There's an attitude of yeah, this is I'm a grown-up and I can do everything and anything.
• 16:46
  SPEAKER_02: It's great, it's great for people who do that and it works out.
• 16:50
  SPEAKER_02: But equally it's completely understand.
• 16:54
  SPEAKER_02: But I think that's what comes when you're in your 30s and forties.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_02: Who's acknowledging that there's still so much to learn?
• 17:01
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 17:02
  SPEAKER_02: I'm always looking forward to being in my 80s and still not knowing everything.
• 17:05
  SPEAKER_02: Thinking, you know, every day's a school day.
• 17:07
  SPEAKER_02: I'm really excited about achieving AT and BP.
• 17:15
  SPEAKER_02: I think I What do you think you'll be like as an eight-year-old?
• 17:18
  SPEAKER_02: Outrageous.
• 17:19
  SPEAKER_02: I think I will give zero.
• 17:23
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 17:23
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, I kind of do at the moment anyway.
• 17:26
  SPEAKER_02: But I think as each year passes, I get more and more like that.
• 17:30
  SPEAKER_02: Uh yeah, and again, this comes back to that.
• 17:32
  SPEAKER_02: The older we get.
• 17:33
  SPEAKER_02: We also know that there's no point caring about the small stuff.
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, absolutely.
• 17:37
  SPEAKER_02: It doesn't gain any there's such a tac on our day.
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_02: You pick your battles as well.
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_02: You do pick your battles.
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_02: You you need to know where to just walk away.
• 17:50
  SPEAKER_02: It's just such a lovely walk.
• 17:52
  SPEAKER_02: These little screens.
• 17:53
  SPEAKER_02: And they're all full of water at the moment because the weather's been so bad.
• 17:55
  SPEAKER_02: I feel like we place your paper sticks.
• 17:57
  SPEAKER_02: So what was your degree in public?
• 17:59
  SPEAKER_02: My degree was in health studies, which is a kind of catch-all for sociology, psychology, biology, economics.
• 18:08
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, and economics, okay.
• 18:10
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 18:11
  SPEAKER_02: Although the economics part I dropped at year two.
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_02: To focus on.
• 18:15
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, so so we started broad and narrowed down.
• 18:18
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 18:19
  SPEAKER_02: And what made you choose that?
• 18:20
  SPEAKER_02: Clearing.
• 18:21
  SPEAKER_02: Clearing.
• 18:22
  SPEAKER_02: Same as me.
• 18:23
  SPEAKER_02: Well we've had this conversation because my other clearing choice was IT.
• 18:26
  unknown: Yeah.
• 18:28
  SPEAKER_02: So I I I could have gone into IT as and actually with hindsight, I kind of think should I have done IT because of the way the world's gone.
• 18:34
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, you and also the way your brain works.
• 18:36
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I think I'm process driven.
• 18:38
  SPEAKER_02: I think I'm far more I would have actually done far better with the far better.
• 18:42
  SPEAKER_02: But I think my life would have been very different had I gone that IT route.
• 18:45
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 18:45
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, isn't that funny?
• 18:46
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I got into IT compute science as well.
• 18:50
  SPEAKER_02: You just don't know which direction life's gonna take you.
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_02: No, you don't.
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, to an extent, I do I'm a big believer in what's meant to happen, happens.
• 18:59
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 19:00
  SPEAKER_02: And to an extent you have to facilitate that.
• 19:02
  SPEAKER_02: You can't just sit on your sofa and expect things to happen.
• 19:04
  SPEAKER_02: 100% not, Max, but you have to listen to those things that come up in your mind and the way those things are gonna come up is when you'd make space for that time.
• 19:14
  SPEAKER_02: 100%.
• 19:16
  SPEAKER_02: I was wanting But I think I I mean I don't know if you agree with this, but when we were that age, I think there was an expectation to go to university.
• 19:28
  SPEAKER_02: If I was talking to my 18-year-old self now, I would probably say do it do something different.
• 19:35
  SPEAKER_02: Don't feel the need to go to university.
• 19:37
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 19:38
  SPEAKER_02: The world is both huge and small.
• 19:42
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 19:43
  SPEAKER_02: And you don't have to conform.
• 19:44
  SPEAKER_02: It was more about going to union, enjoying three years of being with your mates and dossing about.
• 19:51
  SPEAKER_02: It w at that point, it was less about the study.
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_02: I agree.
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_02: I think and also I think you know, we were lucky in that we had the grant system.
• 19:59
  SPEAKER_02: 100% to go.
• 20:02
  SPEAKER_02: We didn't we didn't think we were gonna come out with loads of loans.
• 20:06
  SPEAKER_02: But do you not think that that's as much as I agree that the grant system should still be in place?
• 20:11
  SPEAKER_02: It's prohibitive to have you know for people to be expected to pay for it.
• 20:14
  SPEAKER_02: There are people that will never be able to afford it.
• 20:16
  SPEAKER_02: But actually it's making those that do go to university study for what they're they're aiming for.
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_02: Whereas when we were there, we a lot of us went.
• 20:25
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 20:25
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 20:26
  SPEAKER_02: I agree.
• 20:27
  SPEAKER_02: And but I think also going to university is about more than the subject.
• 20:32
  SPEAKER_02: It's about life skills.
• 20:33
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I agree, I agree.
• 20:35
  SPEAKER_02: To form friendships and have fallouts, understand who you are.
• 20:41
  SPEAKER_02: And I think you can do that without having to go to university, but you do need to move out and get a job and yeah, which given everything at the minute, moving out itself is too expensive.
• 20:51
  SPEAKER_02: It is, yeah.
• 20:51
  SPEAKER_02: And also when I look back on it, I think the whole university fit was so enriching.
• 20:59
  SPEAKER_02: Go on, I dare you to jump in that puddle.
• 21:04
  SPEAKER_02: A bright, bright pink waterproof onesie.
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I I kind of feel like everything clicked into place when I started lifting, because I was like, this is why I need to know this.
• 21:15
  SPEAKER_02: This is how it's applied when I see it straight.
• 21:18
  SPEAKER_02: Whereas at university's very theoretical, although I smashed it at university.
• 21:23
  SPEAKER_02: I think also understanding your own algorithms apply for it.
• 21:27
  SPEAKER_02: But it's like they they say, Daniel, that you don't really start learning how to drive until after you pass your test.
• 21:33
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, exactly.
• 21:34
  SPEAKER_02: Same thing for university.
• 21:36
  SPEAKER_02: You don't really get to know about life, learning, progressing until you're out of university or any type of education.
• 21:44
  SPEAKER_02: That's cute.
• 21:46
  SPEAKER_02: But yeah, for um real quick I would say well for according to do an apprenticeship for the opposite of my time.
• 21:56
  SPEAKER_02: Mike, I I would have been the same.
• 21:58
  SPEAKER_02: As soon as I entered the course.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_02: corporate world.
• 22:01
  SPEAKER_01: I just got it.
• 22:03
  SPEAKER_01: But ironically, now at this stage of my career, like 25 years on, I've recognised that actually to push ahead in my corporate world, I had to play a part.
• 22:15
  SPEAKER_01: And I had to assume more character.
• 22:17
  SPEAKER_01: Yep.
• 22:18
  SPEAKER_01: And actually what they should really teach you at school is lessons in car and how to get to know yourself.
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 22:29
  SPEAKER_01: And all of that mindfulness because once you start that journey, your choices are different again and your your attitude towards yourself is different and how you present yourself to the world is different.
• 22:43
  SPEAKER_02: But and how you show up at work is different.
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_02: Again, which is where an apprenticeship would work.
• 22:47
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 22:47
  SPEAKER_02: Because you're you're immediately thrust into that learning the the corporate and business side of things.
• 22:52
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 22:52
  SPEAKER_02: But also you you learn far more about yourself when you're out there doing the doing.
• 22:56
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 22:56
  SPEAKER_02: Did you do up to degree then?
• 22:58
  SPEAKER_02: So I came home and it's you know decision time what we what was I going to do.
• 23:03
  SPEAKER_02: Because my degree was so broad and I wouldn't say it was necessarily vocational.
• 23:06
  SPEAKER_02: So although I had the degree, what was I going to do with it?
• 23:09
  SPEAKER_02: Plans were to move down to London.
• 23:11
  SPEAKER_02: But instead I met someone and stayed oh thank you.
• 23:14
  SPEAKER_02: And although that relationship is long since over Thanks I never left.
• 23:19
  SPEAKER_02: Uh oh.
• 23:19
  SPEAKER_02: It's just weird isn't it how these things happen and you don't know what life would have been.
• 23:23
  SPEAKER_02: And do you ever think about that?
• 23:25
  SPEAKER_02: I i I don't know.
• 23:26
  SPEAKER_02: What's the point in worrying about it didn't happen.
• 23:29
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 23:29
  SPEAKER_02: This wasn't your part.
• 23:31
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 23:31
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 23:32
  SPEAKER_02: So I stayed and did a number of different jobs.
• 23:36
  SPEAKER_02: But what I ended up doing for seven years was running a bar.
• 23:40
  SPEAKER_02: Did you?
• 23:41
  SPEAKER_02: Did you run a bar yeah bootleggers in Kendall.
• 23:43
  SPEAKER_02: Oh wow so what manager so my my degree was in health and I did peddling legal drugs for a living.
• 23:52
  SPEAKER_02: That's what I did for seven years.
• 23:54
  SPEAKER_02: God when you said peddling illegal drugs peddling legal oh I was gonna stash yeah we did we didn't have a stash underneath the counter like who are you isn't because it's come on this walk and I've learned that she's someone I didn't know no terrifying no le legal drugs.
• 24:13
  SPEAKER_02: Yes confess confessions on the thoughts no I wasn't doing something I shouldn't have been doing.
• 24:17
  SPEAKER_02: Oh okay yeah see what you but but again I threw myself into it yeah and and thoroughly enjoyed the job for seven years.
• 24:26
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah we had a really brilliant team it was hard work I don't know if it's a I don't know if I could do it now.
• 24:34
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah yeah about the late hours long yeah and I did 40 hours a week yeah and but the weekends that sort of four five hour rush yeah you got such a high afterwards yeah because we all came together yeah and worked as a team yeah 100% great turnovers really busy yeah I bad I mean it's such a good location isn't it well we were the busiest bar in town for quite a stretch then then everything changed with regards to smoking ban, uh late licensing yeah the the playing field became a bit more level between bars.
• 25:13
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah but it was definitely a moment in time that I was glad I was there for it.
• 25:17
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah um but again you can't you can't do that's not a life plan is it?
• 25:24
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 25:25
  SPEAKER_02: It wasn't if you've asked me as a kid what was I gonna do that wouldn't have been a list.
• 25:29
  SPEAKER_02: No it's true and it just goes to show what we were saying before it's not laid out there isn't a step by step no you you go to university you get a job aligned to what you've done at university I mean not a lot of people are doing what they did at university but the skills that you get from your courses do play though they do they lend themselves to keep with the you know whatever whatever discipline you go into you they're all transferable skills.
• 26:01
  SPEAKER_02: Absolutely and but this is it comes back to the same thing that we spoke about earlier in the walk.
• 26:06
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah I really envy those people who knew what they wanted to do.
• 26:10
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 26:11
  SPEAKER_02: I've got friends who wanted to be nurses they're now nurses.
• 26:15
  SPEAKER_02: A friend wanted to be a police officer she's a police officer.
• 26:19
  SPEAKER_02: I do wonder though when you have such a I'm gonna say reachy but I don't such a clear plan that's probably what we there's room for the bubble bursting when you get in there.
• 26:29
  SPEAKER_02: Exactly that's exactly what I was gonna say like how would that feel when we finally achieve it and you think oh this wasn't what I thought it was going to be I don't want this for my life and of course you have that choice to change it.
• 26:43
  SPEAKER_02: You do but actually what you almost need to do is grieve the bit that you you thought it was going to be yeah although they're all still in their jobs.
• 26:51
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah in you in your example in my example yeah yeah shall we take a moment shall I just give to the people who find themselves in that situation because it must be so devastating to get there and put all that of yourself into it and think oh actually I don't like it.
• 27:10
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah because then you for the first time ever you have to think beyond that as to well what can I do then?
• 27:17
  SPEAKER_02: Because actually your whole world and your personality has been aiming about you is is crafted around this vision.
• 27:25
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 27:26
  SPEAKER_02: And if you've been talking about it since you were a kid I mean most of this as children had about 75 different things we were going to be.
• 27:32
  SPEAKER_02: Did you?
• 27:32
  SPEAKER_02: What were you archaeologist watch too much Indiana Jones?
• 27:36
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 27:37
  SPEAKER_02: Well when I was much younger I was gonna be Princess Leia.
• 27:40
  SPEAKER_02: How were you?
• 27:40
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah when I was about five feeling vicious wrong yeah but again bubble birth when I realised that wasn't an actual job.
• 27:46
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah um I'm so sad for you little different dreams shattered you mean I can't go and fight intergalactic enemies that's not a thing I can do you could just ease back on that training program.
• 28:03
  SPEAKER_02: Got visions of was it star shi starship troopers that's that one I was gonna be an actor oh weren't you yeah it was a drama teacher that squashed that dream not because it wasn't any good unfortunately just because he was a I'll stop talking there.
• 28:17
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah he was a the little flag yeah oh what well and of course it all happened when I was about 15.
• 28:24
  SPEAKER_02: Oh okay quite for no I'm not gonna say that I would have been on the telly but I really enjoyed acting I really enjoyed it.
• 28:30
  SPEAKER_02: You never know though you might have been you might have been if you hadn't have crushed those teenage ambitions.
• 28:38
  SPEAKER_02: Well only two pieces layer buttons yeah well there you go investigations and big trial theories that's like being a detective but in space yeah exactly yeah exactly that so clearly I did know what I wanted to do well I all thought I wanted to be an lawyer oh you'd have been a good lawyer aren't you thinking you'd have been a really human lawyer.
• 29:02
  SPEAKER_02: It was a lot of reading I was like I've not and anyway I didn't pick any aligned subjects so I wasn't that invested in it.
• 29:10
  SPEAKER_02: I think it was just something to say to sort of say I've put some thought into this but I just quite choose another advent the way it was meant to and it's all been great.
• 29:24
  SPEAKER_02: Because Janet obviously was yes a lawyer or solicitor.
• 29:28
  SPEAKER_02: She was yeah and also a podcast guest.
• 29:31
  SPEAKER_02: So she is I'm looking forward to hers.
• 29:34
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah but I um tell you I'd want her on my side because I think she'd be awesome at that almost feel like the laws dipped out by her not doing it anymore.
• 29:42
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah yeah totally but it's a passion that's not they have yeah formidable ally yeah what was the turning point when you thought I'm done with work working bar or from bootleggers I went to Anold Modix was Mardix one of those.
• 29:59
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah see no one does oh that's okay then they're based right in the middle of Kendall been based in Kendall since uh they started in 66 yeah but it's a conversation stopper yeah people used to say where do you work and I'd say Mardic's and they'd say what do they do?
• 30:17
  SPEAKER_02: And I'd say well they make like giant giant fuse boxes and people go oh right and that'd be the end of that conversation because you can't dress that up in any kind of That's the closed question.
• 30:30
  SPEAKER_02: However from uh I mean I went there after working at the bar.
• 30:34
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 30:34
  SPEAKER_02: How did you learn that?
• 30:36
  SPEAKER_02: Like that's quite a curious shift.
• 30:38
  SPEAKER_02: Well it just shows how so when I was at it's gonna show my age when I started my degree we didn't have the internet wasn't a thing.
• 30:47
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah he wanted a book to learn he went to the library got the book out went home read it and went back yeah and I then left and went to the bar yeah and of course we didn't use anything tech wise there really.
• 31:02
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah so when I went to Mardix it was literally like starting completely green and fresh and wow didn't feel anxiety in those first moments I don't remember feeling anxious about it.
• 31:19
  SPEAKER_02: But I think it was more a case of what's something I had to do.
• 31:22
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah not because it was a career path I've been made redundant from a bootlegged.
• 31:27
  SPEAKER_02: Oh I see okay so it was like well I just want a job.
• 31:30
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah and a friend worked there yeah and I and although she sat in on the interview because it was her department was interviewed by another chap who I then worked under.
• 31:39
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah and I learned from the beginning.
• 31:42
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah and as quirky as he was and he was quirky yeah he was a good teacher okay so I learned a lot in that first couple of months just about the basics.
• 31:53
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah and then I was at MADIX for nine months and I had a number of different I worked in the helpless safety department just as administrator.
• 32:05
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 32:06
  SPEAKER_02: You mean I believe he's good just yeah no I God you know that that's terrible of me.
• 32:13
  SPEAKER_02: I suppose I'm downplayed just in any career.
• 32:15
  SPEAKER_02: Well I think I'm downplaying the fact that what these other guys were doing seemed so much bigger than that.
• 32:21
  SPEAKER_02: They had the knowledge and the technical than what they created without no 100% they absolutely couldn't look at that yes I should know this myself.
• 32:31
  SPEAKER_02: We are and then I ended up as office manager.
• 32:34
  SPEAKER_02: Okay uh and from there went to the service department uh as a manager.
• 32:40
  SPEAKER_02: So 10 of us working together insanely busy we were it felt like we were flyfighting the whole time.
• 32:47
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah that department uh was responsible for all the kit that be put in yeah and and if you look at London the the city yeah most of that or lot of that has some of uh Mardit's switch gear in it.
• 33:01
  SPEAKER_02: Oh wow we would then service it.
• 33:04
  SPEAKER_02: So amazing what gets done in Cumbria.
• 33:06
  SPEAKER_02: It is well it started in Cumbria and it's never moved out of Cumbria.
• 33:09
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah so it was a really busy department uh we had a really great team yeah but it was almost frenetic in its busyness.
• 33:17
  SPEAKER_02: Uh didn't feel very productive.
• 33:18
  SPEAKER_02: Oh okay we were always fighting to get stuff done.
• 33:21
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 33:21
  SPEAKER_02: Just because it was so busy.
• 33:23
  SPEAKER_02: Just you were never ahead.
• 33:24
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 33:25
  SPEAKER_02: But again for me the learning that came from that job because all those skills that I took yeah then lent itself to me doing the job I do now.
• 33:34
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 33:35
  SPEAKER_02: It led to me loved it.
• 33:38
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 33:38
  SPEAKER_02: So it felt like a natural transition probably to what you see now.
• 33:42
  SPEAKER_02: In some ways yes I think it was more the fact that the company was becoming bigger it was growing and growing growing which is amazing.
• 33:48
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah when I started because I worked in health and safety I know the exact number yeah the uh there was 119 of us oh wow within the company and when I left I think it was something just shy of 800.
• 34:01
  SPEAKER_02: Wow yeah oh my so the company in that in nine years had really expanded yeah which in itself is phenomenal and so yes it was the company was growing and growing yeah but what comes with that is that it feels like you're you're just a cog in a massive wheel yeah and I'm not diminishing what anyone was doing or the drive of the directors of the company but for me we've gone from this what was a family business and still corporate yeah but into something that was huge in corporate and I just started wondering whether it was what I really wanted to do for the next 20 years.
• 34:42
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah eventually 20 years.
• 34:44
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah so over the course of probably 12 months I was thinking about what do I want to do what could I do and again it came back to that same thing of what skills do I have?
• 34:59
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah and and again it was a really hard question to answer.
• 35:03
  SPEAKER_02: And actually what I'm really good at is working with people.
• 35:06
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah I can testify to that yeah but and so one of the the jokes of the team that I was working with used to call me the problem manager.
• 35:17
  SPEAKER_02: Oh okay yeah so if a client had an issue or even if one of the team had an issue yeah I'd be the person that they'd give it to to figure out and sort out and invariably that meant talking to the end client.
• 35:29
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah because sometimes they were tricky yeah because of what we were doing.
• 35:35
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah definitely but building those relationships knowing how to manage people yeah that's what I'm good at.
• 35:41
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah yeah and I guess these are things that you're not going to recognize off the bat like no it takes years it takes practice.
• 35:49
  SPEAKER_02: And again that's a skill to learn that's a skill to learn absolutely and also I think it's really important for all of us to just pause once in a while and just write down everything we've done.
• 36:02
  SPEAKER_02: Yep whatever it is whether it's related private life whatever it is and just list it out you'll be so surprised by how much you achieve and it's a really good thing to do one of those you know during those periods when you're questioning yeah will you possibly am I am I living my life right now or something smaller than that.
• 36:25
  SPEAKER_02: Or is it just that I'm doing this job because I need to pay the mortgage and in some cases that's enough.
• 36:30
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah I I have absolutely if people are doing a job just to be able to to live great but actually I felt at that point I needed a bit more.
• 36:41
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 36:42
  SPEAKER_02: So yeah and and that's a really important point to draw out.
• 36:46
  SPEAKER_02: It's okay to not want to do chase something.
• 36:50
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah it's really really enviable to be in a position yes and just to get up and go to work and come back.
• 36:57
  SPEAKER_02: And you love it.
• 36:58
  SPEAKER_02: You love your life and you're happy doing it and that's great too.
• 37:02
  SPEAKER_02: And I I think for me that the and I and that may have been the situation I was in don't get me wrong I did really enjoy the job.
• 37:09
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah and I learnt an awful lot yeah but it was fast paced it was long hours and by this point Rob and Willow were in my life and she was three she I was of all of her four parents I was the closest to her school but because of the nature of the work we did I didn't get to go to the Christmas plays.
• 37:36
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah I didn't get to go down and watch the Harvest Festival I didn't go to Sports Day and it was at that point I thought is this giving me a life outside of work and it really wasn't like so that was the reason for the thinking yeah is this what I want?
• 37:53
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah the company's changing it's becoming more fast paced in the long run is this the best thing for my family and I decided it wasn't.
• 38:04
  SPEAKER_01: Okay so making that transition then making that decision and making that transition to what you do now how did that feel and how did that do well again it wasn't an overnight thing it was me looking at what I do what I'm good at doing a lot of research yeah and I knew that I could be a virtual assistant but how did I want to be become a virtual assistant?
• 38:34
  SPEAKER_02: And actually just the ball there is that the whole research bit is quite a big part of your life as well isn't it?
• 38:41
  SPEAKER_02: What's the connection there?
• 38:43
  SPEAKER_02: With the research well I suppose with lots of our clients a lot of a lot of what we do from starts at research.
• 38:49
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah so full circle.
• 38:51
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah so actually you're doing it anyway.
• 38:53
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah yeah yeah so you did a lot of research into how what how to be a virtual assistant and how did you land a virtual assistant in the first place just purely because of the skills that I have and the fact that I could be my own boss yeah so I could work for myself and that that ultimately was what I wanted but what would be the right career to do that.
• 39:18
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah so being a virtual assistant allows me to be my own boss yeah but also I help others yeah I'm working with much smaller companies for the most part and it's those smaller companies and solo entrepreneurs I really really value working with.
• 39:37
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah that's it and look at that smile well again it is that full circle isn't it that I I've always worked in smaller companies yeah that's just where I get my joy from yeah and so there's this whole decision around do you take up a franchise?
• 39:57
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah you go on your own yeah how how is that decision in your mind and reality yeah so that's you've l that's literally it I had to make the decision as to whether to just start out or to go buy a franchise and lots of people don't get the franchise choice.
• 40:16
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah but for me doing the research finding Pink Spaghetti and then researching Pink Spaghetti and meeting with them if I'd have started out my own it would have been a much slower process.
• 40:32
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 40:32
  SPEAKER_02: Pink spaghetti is a business in a box.
• 40:35
  SPEAKER_02: Right business in a box business in a box yeah and they provide yeah I do love a flat pack again that's my organizing process driven I feel what's up I love I actually love a flat pack.
• 40:51
  SPEAKER_02: If you have anything you want building call me and I'll do it.
• 40:53
  SPEAKER_02: No I'd absolutely love it.
• 40:55
  SPEAKER_02: It's like Lego.
• 40:56
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah give me a Lego set but it's it's true though like the franchise is uh sold your own isn't it but have the building blocks to do that.
• 41:04
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah so you can hit the ground running.
• 41:06
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah and they provided training uh huh so we had I think it was two four day windows I think okay they provided some marketing uh but not all of it it was more more of a guidance thing so to get you going basically uh but the support that they provide and continue to provide I think is second to none.
• 41:33
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah and I wouldn't change it.
• 41:34
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah I wouldn't go another way.
• 41:36
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah it doesn't work for everyone no but for me having the support of effectively a back office and a team behind you gives you the confidence gave me the confidence to do it.
• 41:50
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah that's fun and how long ago was this?
• 41:54
  SPEAKER_02: Oh seven years in January?
• 41:56
  SPEAKER_02: Wow yeah that's amazing did you think seven years ago that you'd still be doing it uh do you know I I don't know think no.
• 42:08
  SPEAKER_02: Good I think that's the right answer.
• 42:10
  SPEAKER_02: I don't think I did think that it was yeah just went on.
• 42:14
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 42:15
  SPEAKER_02: And this is what this is your life now.
• 42:17
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah and I you know Pink spaghetti has been nothing but good for me.
• 42:21
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah and it's giving you a new community as well hasn't it well we as the as the franchise yeah think there are now fifteen two wow in the country yeah fifty two franchises yeah wow HQ is in the northwest oh it's just south of Manchester yeah yeah um in Northwich and everyone's spread out yeah I'm on my own in the north northwest yeah um but it's really great to have that community because one of the beauty beauties of it is if I don't know how to do something one of those 52 does yeah exactly so you have a network to tap onto yeah and actually I am someone that's quite happy working on their own yeah but having that that that core team sat behind you yeah that you can tap into any anytime you want with so much knowledge in that team.
• 43:13
  SPEAKER_02: So much knowledge in that franchise.
• 43:14
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah what what would you say to someone who's thinking about taking up the franchise in any caucus T like as in there is no boundary to this offer.
• 43:26
  SPEAKER_02: I think do your research because I know there are franchises out there that maybe aren't quite as financially viable workers ethically so do your research.
• 43:41
  SPEAKER_02: But and people do people have an opinion of franchises and I must admit I did.
• 43:46
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 43:47
  SPEAKER_02: In what sense?
• 43:48
  SPEAKER_02: It seems a negative Okay.
• 43:51
  SPEAKER_02: But for me i i there are no negatives to working with me ethics what kind of negatives I think people think you've got it easy.
• 43:58
  SPEAKER_02: Oh I see okay So a real entrepreneur because you've been handed a template.
• 44:03
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 44:04
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 44:04
  SPEAKER_02: So I think people think and actually people thought we were given clients, which we're not at all.
• 44:10
  SPEAKER_02: Right.
• 44:10
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, because you've moved to prospect.
• 44:13
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 44:13
  SPEAKER_02: And I think I think there are I think is it time, etc.
• 44:17
  SPEAKER_02: I think is one.
• 44:18
  SPEAKER_02: Uh-huh.
• 44:18
  SPEAKER_02: Where you're given a client.
• 44:20
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, that's like I think they work from the Far East.
• 44:23
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 44:24
  unknown: Yeah.
• 44:24
  SPEAKER_02: And it's not it's nothing like that.
• 44:26
  SPEAKER_02: We weren't given any clients.
• 44:27
  SPEAKER_02: We were supported in how we marketed ourselves.
• 44:30
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 44:31
  SPEAKER_02: But that was where it ended.
• 44:32
  SPEAKER_02: So it's the same hustle.
• 44:34
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 44:34
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 44:35
  SPEAKER_02: Exactly the same.
• 44:36
  SPEAKER_02: But I had a bit more of a running start.
• 44:38
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 44:38
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 44:39
  SPEAKER_02: And it worked for me.
• 44:40
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 44:40
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and that's the key, isn't it?
• 44:42
  SPEAKER_01: What is it that you want?
• 44:43
  SPEAKER_01: And again, it's about being honest with yourself about who you are, what do you want from your lifestyle?
• 44:49
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 44:50
  SPEAKER_01: And you have to be dishonest.
• 44:51
  SPEAKER_02: You can't it's this whole thing that we were kind of discussing um on a previous chat about how saying this kind of oh, I don't want to be seen as not being grounded or not humble.
• 45:06
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 45:06
  SPEAKER_02: And it's it's okay to follow what life prisons or I want a good life because everyone wants a good life.
• 45:13
  SPEAKER_02: Absolutely.
• 45:13
  SPEAKER_02: You don't want to be struggling.
• 45:14
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 45:15
  SPEAKER_02: Because what does that good life look like for you?
• 45:18
  SPEAKER_02: And the other thing for for us as well, um, Rob and I weren't living together at that point.
• 45:22
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 45:22
  SPEAKER_02: Together, I was the one earning the money.
• 45:24
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 45:24
  SPEAKER_02: I had a you know, my salary at Mardix was very good.
• 45:27
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 45:27
  SPEAKER_02: And I knew that there was a certain monthly figure I needed to get to.
• 45:30
  SPEAKER_02: So it it just made more sense for me to join a franchise.
• 45:34
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 45:34
  SPEAKER_02: Because there's so many elements that I possibly wouldn't have thought about or have thought about after starting, things like insurance.
• 45:40
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 45:40
  SPEAKER_02: Being a member of the ICO.
• 45:42
  SPEAKER_02: What's the ICO?
• 45:43
  SPEAKER_02: Oh god, now you got me.
• 45:44
  SPEAKER_02: Something commissioners.
• 45:45
  SPEAKER_02: It's all information.
• 45:47
  SPEAKER_02: Yes, information commissioners office.
• 45:49
  SPEAKER_02: There's so and GDPR rules and all the learning a lot as well.
• 45:54
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 45:54
  SPEAKER_02: And they're they're giving you all that information to start with.
• 45:58
  SPEAKER_02: So the franchise.
• 45:59
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 45:59
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 46:00
  SPEAKER_02: So for me, it just made more sense.
• 46:01
  SPEAKER_02: It just meant I was getting where I needed to go quicker.
• 46:04
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 46:05
  SPEAKER_02: So in terms of your entrepreneurial journey, what has been the highlights?
• 46:10
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, that's a really hard one to answer.
• 46:12
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 46:13
  SPEAKER_02: I'm work working with individuals.
• 46:15
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 46:16
  SPEAKER_02: When you work with a client that you really connect with and you really feel like you're supporting them and you're doing the job that they need you to do, really aiding their growth, that's there's no feeling like it.
• 46:26
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 46:27
  SPEAKER_02: But also knowing how far I've come, all my learnings.
• 46:31
  SPEAKER_02: And I look back to where I started in 2019.
• 46:34
  SPEAKER_02: Of course I'm proud.
• 46:35
  SPEAKER_02: You know, the business is growing.
• 46:36
  SPEAKER_02: I've got an employee.
• 46:37
  SPEAKER_02: That's amazing.
• 46:38
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 46:39
  SPEAKER_02: Being someone in a position to give someone else work.
• 46:42
  SPEAKER_02: Well, that in itself is quite terrifying.
• 46:45
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 46:45
  SPEAKER_02: Being an employer comes with all of it.
• 46:47
  SPEAKER_02: You know, there's all what's the word I'm looking for?
• 46:49
  SPEAKER_02: The legitimacies and the legalities and even the emotional side of it of employing somebody.
• 46:54
  SPEAKER_02: I could go with freelancers, but actually that wouldn't work for me.
• 46:57
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 46:57
  SPEAKER_02: I wanted to be able to have someone that works as part of my team.
• 46:59
  SPEAKER_02: And she's ace and she works independently.
• 47:02
  SPEAKER_02: I try to give her as much autonomy as I can, and we work well as a team.
• 47:05
  SPEAKER_03: Oh, that's good.
• 47:06
  SPEAKER_02: But she's really good at sticking her hands up and saying, not sure about that.
• 47:09
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 47:10
  SPEAKER_02: So we can chat through together.
• 47:11
  SPEAKER_02: But yeah, having a we're only a team of two, but ultimately they'd like to grow that, the longer term plan.
• 47:15
  SPEAKER_02: That's exciting.
• 47:17
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and sc and scary.
• 47:18
  SPEAKER_02: If you know Pink Spaghetti is growing, Pink Spaghetti Kendall's growing, yeah.
• 47:22
  SPEAKER_02: Then then ultimately the team has to grow.
• 47:24
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 47:24
  SPEAKER_02: And um, I guess you're as your client-based was you've got no choice.
• 47:27
  SPEAKER_02: Because I work full-time, so lots of the franchisees, not actually that's not true.
• 47:30
  SPEAKER_02: Some of the franchisees might not work as many hours as I do.
• 47:34
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 47:34
  SPEAKER_02: Lots do.
• 47:35
  SPEAKER_02: Lots have families and lots work evenings and weekends.
• 47:38
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, but if you then have employees, it makes it easier to spread that load.
• 47:41
  SPEAKER_02: So what was it about being spaghetti that attracted you?
• 47:44
  SPEAKER_02: There are very few actually.
• 47:45
  SPEAKER_02: Well, there wasn't at that point, yeah.
• 47:47
  SPEAKER_02: VA franchises.
• 47:48
  SPEAKER_02: And like I say, I wasn't looking to be in a franchise.
• 47:50
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 47:50
  SPEAKER_02: It wasn't something I thought I was yeah.
• 47:52
  SPEAKER_02: That wasn't my goal.
• 47:53
  SPEAKER_02: I just found them through the research.
• 47:55
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 47:55
  SPEAKER_02: And then I met Carlo and Vicky.
• 47:56
  SPEAKER_02: Where do we meet?
• 47:57
  SPEAKER_02: We met Crew Station, I think it's that.
• 47:59
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 48:00
  SPEAKER_02: Or a hotel opposite.
• 48:01
  SPEAKER_02: And they're the founders, are they of Pink Spaghetti?
• 48:04
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 48:04
  SPEAKER_02: And we chatted for maybe an hour, an hour and a half.
• 48:07
  SPEAKER_02: And then they sent me a message saying we think we'd make an excellent franchisee.
• 48:11
  SPEAKER_02: And it went from there.
• 48:12
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 48:13
  SPEAKER_02: So I hadn't been looking to join a franchise.
• 48:15
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 48:15
  SPEAKER_02: And had I not found Pink Spaghetti, I would I've done this and maybe it wouldn't have done.
• 48:19
  SPEAKER_02: It was interesting.
• 48:21
  SPEAKER_02: For want of a better way of putting it.
• 48:22
  SPEAKER_02: He gave me the safety net that I may not have needed, but it was nice to have.
• 48:27
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, totally.
• 48:28
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I get that.
• 48:29
  SPEAKER_02: And also the the people behind the business is so important.
• 48:34
  SPEAKER_02: It's not just about the brand.
• 48:35
  SPEAKER_02: 100%.
• 48:36
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 48:37
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 48:38
  SPEAKER_02: And they are so supportive.
• 48:39
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 48:40
  SPEAKER_02: There's a whole load, as you know, there's a whole load of stuff going on in the background with us at the minute, as a family.
• 48:46
  SPEAKER_02: And they've been absolutely awesome.
• 48:48
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 48:48
  SPEAKER_02: Really good.
• 48:49
  SPEAKER_02: That's good.
• 48:50
  SPEAKER_02: That's me to sniff.
• 48:51
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 48:52
  SPEAKER_02: You need to.
• 48:52
  SPEAKER_02: And actually, in that I have a crawly thing on my neck.
• 48:57
  SPEAKER_02: It's not that gone.
• 48:59
  SPEAKER_02: See?
• 49:00
  SPEAKER_02: This is this is the danger of coming outside.
• 49:04
  SPEAKER_02: You don't know what you don't know what bugs are going to be attracted to.
• 49:07
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, so actually in New York current with the current extra pressures you have going on, that's Lola.
• 49:14
  SPEAKER_02: It's actually quite nice to know that your clients aren't going to be let down.
• 49:17
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that you have that support network that's so important as an entrepreneur.
• 49:22
  SPEAKER_02: And at the moment, we're still working as we would do normally, but no, to know that I can reach out to any of the other franchisees to say, can someone pick this up?
• 49:29
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 49:30
  SPEAKER_02: And the client wouldn't be affected in any way.
• 49:31
  SPEAKER_02: Exactly.
• 49:32
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that's a real strength line doing it.
• 49:35
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 49:35
  SPEAKER_02: Provide that seamless service.
• 49:37
  SPEAKER_02: Switching gear a little bit and you're listening to it, and then you lose it at the moment.
• 49:41
  SPEAKER_02: You know, music is no passion.
• 49:42
  SPEAKER_02: Well you've introduced me to when China means toast when I toast.
• 49:46
  SPEAKER_02: Which is just the best name.
• 49:48
  SPEAKER_02: Isn't it?
• 49:48
  SPEAKER_02: And isn't the music amazing?
• 49:50
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it is.
• 49:50
  SPEAKER_02: It's really good.
• 49:51
  SPEAKER_02: At the moment for me, for the last couple of years, it's not been music, it's been podcasts.
• 49:56
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, has it?
• 49:57
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 49:57
  SPEAKER_02: It's your top.
• 49:58
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, I know what your top one is.
• 50:00
  SPEAKER_02: Obviously.
• 50:01
  SPEAKER_02: Obviously, Sakanya 4.
• 50:03
  SPEAKER_02: Um, yeah, that's really funny.
• 50:06
  SPEAKER_02: So the name is Sakanya for the podcast.
• 50:09
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 50:10
  SPEAKER_02: But it's with a four on the end.
• 50:11
  SPEAKER_02: So it all goes back to when I set an Instagram page and someone else had grabbed the handle of Sakanya with an A.
• 50:20
  SPEAKER_02: And then there's the whole debate about how to pronounce my name as well.
• 50:24
  SPEAKER_02: Because if you um so my name is traditionally well, my family knows it just um Tamil Sri Lankan.
• 50:33
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 50:34
  SPEAKER_02: And there are different variations of my name.
• 50:36
  SPEAKER_02: So it's really interesting that my name is on a spectrum.
• 50:41
  SPEAKER_02: And so if you're like traditional Tamil Sri Lankan, you would say Sudanya.
• 50:47
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 50:48
  SPEAKER_02: I didn't know that.
• 50:49
  SPEAKER_02: Sukhanya with a H.
• 50:51
  SPEAKER_02: Nice.
• 50:52
  SPEAKER_02: And I'm a Sukhanya.
• 50:54
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 50:55
  SPEAKER_01: Which is based on the science script version.
• 50:57
  SPEAKER_01: Okay.
• 50:58
  SPEAKER_01: And then obviously I anglicise it because my accent is very British.
• 51:03
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 51:03
  SPEAKER_01: And so that faces some critiquing, which is fair enough.
• 51:06
  SPEAKER_01: So when I was naming the podcast and I felt titled it, I won't be the four.
• 51:12
  SPEAKER_02: It's a good conversation.
• 51:14
  SPEAKER_02: It is.
• 51:14
  SPEAKER_02: So can you with the podcast?
• 51:16
  SPEAKER_02: It's obviously your top one.
• 51:17
  SPEAKER_02: It is.
• 51:18
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 51:18
  SPEAKER_02: Well, this at the moment, for divide people here, it is uncanny because it's Halloween season.
• 51:24
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, okay.
• 51:25
  SPEAKER_02: And that's all about it's just good stories.
• 51:27
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, is it?
• 51:28
  SPEAKER_02: Really?
• 51:28
  SPEAKER_02: I was gonna say I don't know what that is.
• 51:30
  SPEAKER_02: It's more it's more of a comedy eleven adds, but I do thoroughly enjoy it.
• 51:32
  SPEAKER_02: Oh cows.
• 51:33
  SPEAKER_02: I'm normally terrified cows, but they all sat down, so it's okay.
• 51:35
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 51:35
  SPEAKER_02: We saw these cows before.
• 51:37
  SPEAKER_02: Did we?
• 51:38
  SPEAKER_02: I took a photo.
• 51:39
  SPEAKER_02: It must have been so so engrossed in our conversation.
• 51:41
  SPEAKER_02: That's a scallow if you're interested.
• 51:44
  SPEAKER_02: My brothers and I got chased by about 20 cows.
• 51:48
  SPEAKER_02: Oh god.
• 51:49
  SPEAKER_02: It was terrifying.
• 51:50
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 51:51
  SPEAKER_02: I think I don't think there's gonna pop past yet where we haven't discussed cows.
• 51:55
  SPEAKER_02: Does anyone like them?
• 51:57
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 51:58
  SPEAKER_02: It's because they're huge and run quite quick.
• 52:00
  SPEAKER_02: They run quite, yeah, they're scary.
• 52:02
  SPEAKER_02: The three of us did outrun them, but holy crap.
• 52:04
  SPEAKER_02: We'll still talk about it now.
• 52:05
  SPEAKER_02: I was like gonna say, oh, podcast, yeah, so I'm coming.
• 52:08
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, now you've got me because I'm trying to think what else am I listening to.
• 52:11
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, the rest is entertainment.
• 52:12
  SPEAKER_02: What's fucking about?
• 52:13
  SPEAKER_02: Entertainment.
• 52:17
  SPEAKER_02: It's part of the goal hanger group.
• 52:19
  SPEAKER_02: They also do the rest is politics, which I was listening to, but everything's got so heavy that I'm like, Do you know what?
• 52:24
  SPEAKER_02: I'm just gonna stop listening for a bit.
• 52:26
  SPEAKER_02: And they do various others.
• 52:27
  SPEAKER_02: The rest is history as well.
• 52:28
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that is something Imagine living there.
• 52:31
  SPEAKER_02: No, I would never live there.
• 52:32
  SPEAKER_02: As beautiful as too many people walking past pointing at the house.
• 52:35
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 52:36
  SPEAKER_02: And also I need to be able to do this store to buy not.
• 52:40
  SPEAKER_02: I can't live somewhere.
• 52:41
  SPEAKER_02: I have to get to car'd buy provisions.
• 52:44
  SPEAKER_02: I need staff.
• 52:45
  SPEAKER_02: You need to get people to come to you.
• 52:46
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I need staff.
• 52:48
  SPEAKER_02: I keep saying this.
• 52:49
  SPEAKER_02: I meant like Aster delivery.
• 52:53
  SPEAKER_02: Although staff is staff is better.
• 52:55
  SPEAKER_02: That is my rich life.
• 52:57
  SPEAKER_02: That's your rich life.
• 52:58
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 52:58
  SPEAKER_02: To where we all want to be.
• 53:01
  SPEAKER_02: But Aster Delivery won't work until then.
• 53:04
  SPEAKER_02: Other supermarkets are available.
• 53:05
  SPEAKER_02: That doesn't work when you don't have like delivery, like what's it called?
• 53:10
  SPEAKER_02: Uber Eats.
• 53:10
  SPEAKER_02: Uber Eats.
• 53:11
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 53:12
  SPEAKER_02: To give you that line.
• 53:12
  SPEAKER_02: Well we we use that small town thing.
• 53:14
  SPEAKER_02: We don't have Uber Eats.
• 53:16
  SPEAKER_02: Do we?
• 53:17
  SPEAKER_02: I don't know if we do.
• 53:18
  SPEAKER_02: I don't think so.
• 53:18
  SPEAKER_02: I think hands all does.
• 53:19
  SPEAKER_02: I don't think we can never use it.
• 53:20
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 53:20
  SPEAKER_02: Or use it report back.
• 53:22
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I think they go to license the people and stuff like that.
• 53:25
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 53:26
  SPEAKER_02: How weird.
• 53:27
  SPEAKER_02: Things you learn on your walks with can you?
• 53:29
  SPEAKER_02: Some podcasts, yes.
• 53:31
  SPEAKER_02: Oh god.
• 53:31
  SPEAKER_02: See what was it?
• 53:32
  SPEAKER_02: Entertainment, that's where we were.
• 53:34
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that's entertainment.
• 53:35
  SPEAKER_02: So this week they're talking about the traitors, which you watch the traitors?
• 53:38
  SPEAKER_02: I can't let myself do it.
• 53:40
  SPEAKER_02: Why?
• 53:41
  SPEAKER_02: I'd get I'd lose my life.
• 53:43
  SPEAKER_02: See, I goodbye life.
• 53:44
  SPEAKER_02: It's only this one's only, I think, nine nine episodes.
• 53:47
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 53:47
  SPEAKER_02: So it's good.
• 53:48
  SPEAKER_02: I don't watch a lot, Telly.
• 53:49
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, you don't?
• 53:49
  SPEAKER_02: I do.
• 53:50
  SPEAKER_02: I have to spot this now.
• 53:51
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 53:51
  SPEAKER_02: No, I don't tend to watch a lot.
• 53:53
  SPEAKER_02: Walk you do for fun.
• 53:56
  SPEAKER_02: I like walking.
• 53:58
  SPEAKER_02: I do like walking.
• 53:58
  SPEAKER_02: I walk every day.
• 53:59
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 53:59
  SPEAKER_02: And I walk from the door as well, so it doesn't mean I have to go somewhere, park up and hike up a mountain.
• 54:04
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 54:04
  SPEAKER_02: I'm quite happy just to put my headphones in and go from the door.
• 54:08
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, that's great.
• 54:09
  SPEAKER_02: I love walking, obviously.
• 54:11
  SPEAKER_02: That's kind of a lot of my creative thinking comes from walking or problem solving.
• 54:16
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 54:16
  SPEAKER_02: And that's why I should be listening to music as opposed to podcasts, because I can do a walk and then realise I've not listened to anything that someone's been saying in my ears.
• 54:23
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I do know I never listen to podcasts when I'm walking.
• 54:26
  SPEAKER_02: For that reason.
• 54:27
  SPEAKER_02: Listen.
• 54:28
  SPEAKER_02: So if I listen to an audiobook or listen to it on a long car journey.
• 54:33
  SPEAKER_02: Do you not make you sleepy?
• 54:34
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 54:35
  SPEAKER_02: Makes me sleepy.
• 54:36
  SPEAKER_02: No, and I only listen to it when I don't have that nav on because I like to miss a second.
• 54:41
  SPEAKER_02: So I need that focus time.
• 54:43
  SPEAKER_02: Or I listen to it when I'm thinking how for some dreadful job like that to convince myself I'm doing something really fasting.
• 54:51
  SPEAKER_02: Because I read before I go to sleep, I find that if I listen to audiobooks, I get sleepy.
• 54:57
  SPEAKER_02: Oh James, well I can't listen to them in the car.
• 54:58
  SPEAKER_02: Oh how funny.
• 54:59
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, because he trains yourself to this Padlovian.
• 55:03
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 55:03
  SPEAKER_02: Makes me sleep.
• 55:05
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 55:05
  SPEAKER_02: So the last thing you want is me driving down the motorway.
• 55:08
  unknown: Yeah.
• 55:08
  SPEAKER_02: Getting sleepy.
• 55:09
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 55:10
  SPEAKER_02: No, I need that focus on walking it's always.
• 55:14
  SPEAKER_02: Because it's weird, isn't it?
• 55:15
  SPEAKER_02: Because when I'm working, I can focus like that.
• 55:18
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 55:18
  SPEAKER_02: Because you switch your brain.
• 55:19
  SPEAKER_02: But if I'm doing something else, I can find myself quite easily distracted.
• 55:22
  SPEAKER_02: That's the thing with work, is you know, it's not easy for people to hand over.
• 55:25
  SPEAKER_02: It's not easy for people to outsource and making that decision to do it and bring someone else into your business.
• 55:30
  SPEAKER_02: It's not a small thing.
• 55:31
  SPEAKER_02: It's not.
• 55:31
  SPEAKER_02: But you're baby.
• 55:34
  SPEAKER_02: Well, not just that, but you're handing over something which is precious to you.
• 55:37
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 55:38
  SPEAKER_02: And I think I'd never take that lightly.
• 55:39
  SPEAKER_02: I never take it lightly.
• 55:41
  SPEAKER_02: Sort of the the privilege and the responsibility.
• 55:44
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 55:44
  SPEAKER_02: And you know, we tried to say to people, as as important as it is to you, it's that important to us as well.
• 55:50
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 55:50
  SPEAKER_02: It has to be.
• 55:51
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 55:52
  SPEAKER_02: Absolutely.
• 55:53
  SPEAKER_02: For us to be able to do it well, we have to really care about it.
• 55:56
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 55:57
  SPEAKER_02: When we think about your business, do you kind of we're talking about goal setting before we have like a three-year five-being plant business?
• 56:05
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 56:06
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 56:06
  SPEAKER_02: Change it changes as I go through, but yes.
• 56:08
  SPEAKER_02: So what does the next 12 months look like?
• 56:10
  SPEAKER_02: The next 12 months, so because of everything that's been going on outside of work, this past 12 months has just been about sort of keeping the bow steady.
• 56:19
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 56:20
  SPEAKER_02: And and keeping going, which we've achieved.
• 56:22
  SPEAKER_02: The next 12 months is about growth and pushing the business forward, which means more networking for me, which in itself, when you start a business, it's necessary and scary.
• 56:31
  SPEAKER_02: And part of networking, I think, is finding your group, finding your people.
• 56:35
  SPEAKER_02: So I'm fortunate in that I think I'm in a really good networking group.
• 56:38
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 56:39
  SPEAKER_02: But it's about going and joining others and putting yourself out there.
• 56:42
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 56:43
  SPEAKER_02: And meeting new people meeting new people.
• 56:45
  SPEAKER_02: We've got capacity to take more people on.
• 56:47
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 56:48
  SPEAKER_02: But I do need to think about employing at some point.
• 56:51
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 56:52
  SPEAKER_02: And I think it's important, isn't it?
• 56:53
  SPEAKER_02: To you know, whilst you're trying to, you know, you want your business to flourish, there are periods where you do need to just acknowledge that steadying the boat is cracked, and that's okay because life happens.
• 57:04
  SPEAKER_02: And and that's, you know, we had four years of steady business growth.
• 57:08
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 57:09
  SPEAKER_02: To the point where obviously Ellie's with me, but we've been very busy.
• 57:13
  SPEAKER_02: And then with various things happening, it was it was we haven't slowed.
• 57:17
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 57:18
  SPEAKER_02: No, that's what we did.
• 57:19
  SPEAKER_02: We c we just kept the boat steady.
• 57:20
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 57:21
  SPEAKER_02: We didn't grow.
• 57:22
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 57:23
  SPEAKER_02: But that was the right decision at the right time.
• 57:25
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 57:25
  SPEAKER_02: And actually, because of what I do, I've got the freedom to make that choice.
• 57:29
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 57:29
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 57:30
  SPEAKER_02: Which has been a good thing for us.
• 57:31
  SPEAKER_02: And also, there's there were so many good VAs out there.
• 57:34
  SPEAKER_02: Do you what do you mean for your awards?
• 57:36
  SPEAKER_02: Networks just get involved in this.
• 57:38
  SPEAKER_02: No, not really.
• 57:39
  SPEAKER_02: Again, this is me being not shining a light myself.
• 57:42
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 57:42
  SPEAKER_02: I know they're there.
• 57:43
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 57:44
  SPEAKER_02: And I remember Pink Spaghetti, sort of 12 months in, would have a really brilliant first year.
• 57:48
  SPEAKER_02: And they encouraged me to apply for one.
• 57:50
  SPEAKER_02: And it's that self-doubt creeps in, doesn't it?
• 57:52
  SPEAKER_02: And whether or not I I stick myself out there.
• 57:55
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, I don't suppose you're saying you're any better than anybody else.
• 57:58
  SPEAKER_02: You're just sticking your hands up and saying I'm here and I deserve to be recognized.
• 58:01
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, exactly.
• 58:02
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 58:02
  SPEAKER_02: Fantastic.
• 58:03
  SPEAKER_02: It's something that you can club anyway.
• 58:06
  SPEAKER_02: You know me.
• 58:08
  SPEAKER_02: We have to advocate for ourselves.
• 58:10
  SPEAKER_02: We absolutely do.
• 58:11
  SPEAKER_02: I can't wait for someone else to see your brilliance.
• 58:14
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 58:15
  SPEAKER_02: But I think the other thing as well is we are busy.
• 58:18
  SPEAKER_02: We've we've got hustling.
• 58:19
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, we've got plenty of work coming in.
• 58:22
  SPEAKER_02: This month has been insane.
• 58:23
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, that's good.
• 58:24
  SPEAKER_02: And next month will be as well.
• 58:26
  SPEAKER_02: And so do I feel like I need to do it?
• 58:29
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 58:29
  SPEAKER_02: I there are different ways of thinking about it, and I don't think there's a right or wrong.
• 58:33
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 58:33
  SPEAKER_02: But for me, I know what I'm good at.
• 58:36
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 58:36
  SPEAKER_02: I know what my clients expect and I know we're able to achieve it for them.
• 58:40
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 58:40
  SPEAKER_02: And I love working with my clients.
• 58:42
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 58:43
  SPEAKER_02: Do I need an award on the shelf to say that I'm good at it?
• 58:45
  SPEAKER_02: That's a personal thing for me.
• 58:46
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 58:47
  SPEAKER_02: I don't think on it.
• 58:49
  SPEAKER_02: Who actually needs that acknowledgement or recognition because it's happening every day through your clients.
• 58:55
  SPEAKER_02: And the fact that we've got clients that have worked with us, I mean I've got clients that have worked for me for six years.
• 59:00
  SPEAKER_02: Wow.
• 59:00
  SPEAKER_02: So that in itself is validation that we know what we're doing and that we're good at what we do.
• 59:05
  SPEAKER_02: But I mean, don't I mean I'm not knocking anyone that goes for these awards.
• 59:09
  SPEAKER_02: It's a personal choice to do it.
• 59:11
  SPEAKER_02: And also I'm terrible at getting dressed up and going to events.
• 59:15
  SPEAKER_02: I'm a jeans and jumper girl.
• 59:17
  SPEAKER_02: So yeah, it I I personal choice.
• 59:20
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 59:20
  SPEAKER_02: It's maybe not for me.
• 59:21
  SPEAKER_02: I'm not I'm not saying I wouldn't do it, but it's not for me at the moment.
• 59:24
  SPEAKER_02: Let's talk about purchases.
• 59:26
  SPEAKER_02: What do they actually have?
• 59:29
  SPEAKER_02: Well see, that's a question we get asked a lot.
• 59:32
  SPEAKER_02: And actually it's probably the most difficult question in the world to answer.
• 59:36
  SPEAKER_02: So the easy and quick answer is that we support businesses of all sizes with their back office admin.
• 59:44
  SPEAKER_02: But what does back office admin look like?
• 59:46
  SPEAKER_02: It's different for absolutely everybody.
• 59:50
  SPEAKER_02: Absolutely.
• 59:52
  SPEAKER_02: And everybody's needs are different.
• 59:55
  SPEAKER_02: So the way we start that question is to or to try and answer that question is to ask the business owner where are the bits of sticking points for you?
• 1:00:06
  SPEAKER_02: It tends to fall into three things.
• 1:00:09
  SPEAKER_02: So the things that they don't know how to do things that they don't want to do, the things they don't have time to do.
• 1:00:18
  SPEAKER_02: And from the we use that as a jump-off point.
• 1:00:21
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 1:00:22
  SPEAKER_02: And we can then isolate the pain points.
• 1:00:25
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:00:25
  SPEAKER_02: But it looks so different to every single client.
• 1:00:29
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:00:30
  SPEAKER_02: And I have had people that have wanted a discovery call and were beyond that discovery call and they know they need support.
• 1:00:37
  SPEAKER_02: They don't they have no clue what they want help with.
• 1:00:39
  SPEAKER_02: And overall was that, wasn't it?
• 1:00:41
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:00:42
  SPEAKER_02: When you're helping overwhelm, you make the discovery call.
• 1:00:45
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:00:49
  SPEAKER_02: But it works both.
• 1:00:50
  SPEAKER_02: You do need to come with something.
• 1:00:52
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:00:53
  SPEAKER_02: Because actually I've sat on discovery calls with people that then they've had to go away and consider where they because they have to be comfortable handing elements over.
• 1:01:02
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:01:03
  SPEAKER_02: It doesn't matter what it is, they're handing over a bit of their business and they have to be comfortable doing that.
• 1:01:09
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 1:01:10
  SPEAKER_02: So it's not a case of them just saying, here's access to all of my bookkeeping software on your crack.
• 1:01:17
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:01:17
  SPEAKER_02: There are processes we have to put in place.
• 1:01:20
  SPEAKER_02: They have to trust us.
• 1:01:21
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 1:01:21
  SPEAKER_02: But they have to know where they want to start.
• 1:01:23
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 1:01:24
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:01:25
  SPEAKER_02: And and sometimes knowing where you want to start comes through that discovery call.
• 1:01:30
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:01:30
  SPEAKER_02: And that we're able to dig into it a little bit.
• 1:01:32
  SPEAKER_02: And how do people come up in various ways?
• 1:01:36
  SPEAKER_02: Email, phone call, you can find me on all the socials.
• 1:01:39
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:01:39
  SPEAKER_02: Some people contact us via something like Instagram.
• 1:01:41
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:01:42
  SPEAKER_02: And we get the discovery call.
• 1:01:43
  SPEAKER_02: And we may uninterest call.
• 1:01:45
  SPEAKER_02: And what would you say to people who don't know what they're looking for?
• 1:01:49
  SPEAKER_02: Like how do you reach those people?
• 1:01:51
  SPEAKER_02: From a VA point of view, I think it's acknowledging the fact that if you want to grow your business, if you want your business to move forwards, there comes a point where you cannot do it all yourself.
• 1:02:03
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:02:05
  SPEAKER_02: And admin is not your job to do.
• 1:02:09
  SPEAKER_02: If you're not going to employ someone, then outsourcing it is the quickest and easiest way to get it off your plate.
• 1:02:15
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:02:16
  SPEAKER_02: And most small businesses don't have enough admin hours to employ someone, it's not worthwhile doing that.
• 1:02:21
  SPEAKER_02: Some people look at our hourly rate, which I don't think is that inexpensive, but think, oh, that's that's a lot of money.
• 1:02:27
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:02:28
  SPEAKER_02: But actually, if you just need someone for four or five hours a week, it's not a lot of cash at all to make sure that all of those tasks are done.
• 1:02:35
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:02:35
  SPEAKER_02: And not something you're doing on a weekend of an evening.
• 1:02:39
  SPEAKER_02: Because what will take you maybe twice as long.
• 1:02:44
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:02:44
  SPEAKER_02: Maybe maybe even more than that.
• 1:02:46
  SPEAKER_02: What might take you 12, 13 hours to do, we might we might have it done it for.
• 1:02:50
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, exactly.
• 1:02:50
  SPEAKER_02: So it's always worth having that conversation to see how a virtual assistant can help you.
• 1:02:54
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:02:54
  SPEAKER_02: If you talk and there are brilliant VAs out there.
• 1:02:57
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:02:58
  SPEAKER_02: And where I may not be the right support, someone I know someone else that might be.
• 1:03:04
  SPEAKER_02: Or if it's a service that we can't provide, again I know someone that might.
• 1:03:08
  SPEAKER_02: So it's always worth just having that conversation.
• 1:03:10
  SPEAKER_02: Absolutely.
• 1:03:10
  SPEAKER_02: But I would say we're good at what we do.
• 1:03:12
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:03:13
  SPEAKER_02: And I agree.
• 1:03:15
  SPEAKER_02: I thoroughly enjoy my job.
• 1:03:17
  SPEAKER_02: So I feel really, really lucky to have made that decision to do it and to be able to help small business owners every single day.
• 1:03:23
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, yeah.
• 1:03:24
  SPEAKER_02: Thanks.
• 1:03:25
  SPEAKER_02: And what I should say as well is there's no client which is too small.
• 1:03:29
  SPEAKER_02: We can help someone who wants a couple of hours a month right the way through to a bigger company that needs 20.
• 1:03:34
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:03:34
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, I love that.
• 1:03:35
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:03:36
  SPEAKER_02: We just slot in in the background.
• 1:03:37
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:03:38
  SPEAKER_02: We're doing our job well, you don't know we're there.
• 1:03:40
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:03:40
  SPEAKER_02: I love that.
• 1:03:41
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:03:41
  SPEAKER_02: And what's the whole point?
• 1:03:42
  SPEAKER_02: Isn't that you slot in as part of the team?
• 1:03:44
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 1:03:45
  SPEAKER_01: But you're not um not imposing, you're not sort of saying, telling the business owner what they do or how they do it, you're helping them with what their vision is.
• 1:03:56
  SPEAKER_02: We've we've actually we've got both.
• 1:03:57
  SPEAKER_02: So we've got clients that's but they just need us to do the doing.
• 1:04:00
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:04:01
  SPEAKER_02: And we have got some clients that need more of a business manager support.
• 1:04:05
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 1:04:06
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:04:06
  SPEAKER_02: Uh and we may be far more active.
• 1:04:08
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 1:04:09
  SPEAKER_02: So you do offer that service as well then?
• 1:04:11
  SPEAKER_02: We do that with a couple of clients, yes.
• 1:04:13
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:04:13
  SPEAKER_02: But there's no easy answer to the question of what's BA does our two businesses look the same.
• 1:04:20
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:04:20
  SPEAKER_02: I've worked with clients that are just starting out with their business.
• 1:04:24
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:04:24
  SPEAKER_02: And we've worked so Annold Martyx hired me back.
• 1:04:28
  SPEAKER_02: Did they?
• 1:04:29
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:04:29
  SPEAKER_02: As a virtual assistant.
• 1:04:30
  SPEAKER_02: As a virtual assistant.
• 1:04:31
  SPEAKER_02: So I worked back in the department I left to help them when a member of their team uh had to go off sick very suddenly.
• 1:04:39
  SPEAKER_02: Um so I was with them, I think, for about three months.
• 1:04:41
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, good seemed us.
• 1:04:43
  SPEAKER_02: I dropped straight back into it.
• 1:04:44
  SPEAKER_02: I mean it helped, but I knew I knew it.
• 1:04:46
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:04:46
  SPEAKER_02: But um, yeah, I just dropped straight back into it.
• 1:04:48
  SPEAKER_02: And it's picked up.
• 1:04:49
  SPEAKER_02: It's also a testament to your skill that you can pick up any business.
• 1:04:54
  SPEAKER_02: Like there is no business lots of limits, is there?
• 1:04:57
  SPEAKER_02: A good virtual assistant has a brain that switches between because that's an uh people always say, How do you work with that business and then turn that off to go over and work with that business doing something completely different?
• 1:05:06
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:05:06
  SPEAKER_02: That's just part and parcel of what we do.
• 1:05:08
  SPEAKER_02: And I think maybe that's why I ended up in this role because that's when I worked at MARDIX.
• 1:05:13
  SPEAKER_02: There was a lot of jumping from one project to another.
• 1:05:16
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, this is exactly the same as that.
• 1:05:17
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:05:18
  SPEAKER_02: So my brain, and actually I thoroughly enjoy it for that reason because no two days are the same.
• 1:05:21
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 1:05:23
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, we're nearly at the beginning.
• 1:05:25
  SPEAKER_02: We are.
• 1:05:25
  SPEAKER_02: Well, thank you, telling that.
• 1:05:28
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, thank you.
• 1:05:29
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you for being amazing.
• 1:05:33
  SPEAKER_01: That was the wonderful, warm, wonderfully honest Penny Miller.
• 1:05:39
  SPEAKER_01: And if this episode has stood something in you, I hope you'll sit with it for a moment before you scroll.
• 1:05:46
  SPEAKER_01: Penny, thank you so much for taking me on that beautiful, gentle stroll from Chester's in Ambleside to Elderwater along the river Bravey.
• 1:05:56
  SPEAKER_01: I love that this has now become our go to meeting.
• 1:06:00
  SPEAKER_01: Up spot for a coffee, a cheeky snack, and a catch-up walk where we both offload our woes and brainstorm our dreams.
• 1:06:09
  SPEAKER_01: I love that Penny didn't plan her way to where she is now.
• 1:06:13
  SPEAKER_01: She paid attention and followed what lit her up and let go of what didn't.
• 1:06:20
  SPEAKER_01: And she did it with no drama, just quietly, steadily, and courageously.
• 1:06:27
  SPEAKER_01: So here are some reflections for you today.
• 1:06:30
  SPEAKER_01: A few questions just to carry with you on your next walk.
• 1:06:35
  SPEAKER_01: What are you doing right now that's keeping you from the things that matter the most?
• 1:06:42
  SPEAKER_01: Where is the real validation in your work and are you actually seeing it?
• 1:06:49
  SPEAKER_01: And when was the last time you asked yourself, is this still right for me?
• 1:06:55
  SPEAKER_01: Or is there something else wanting to be built?
• 1:07:01
  SPEAKER_01: As always, you don't have to have all the answers today, but sometimes just asking the question is enough.
• 1:07:08
  SPEAKER_01: If Penny's story resonated with you, please do give her a follow.
• 1:07:13
  SPEAKER_01: All details are on my website at www.sacania.com.
• 1:07:20
  SPEAKER_01: That's www.sukany4.com.
• 1:07:28
  SPEAKER_01: And if you're a small business owner wondering whether you need support, honestly just reach out to Penny.
• 1:07:36
  SPEAKER_01: Now I know I always say this, but it really does make a difference to my independent walk and talk podcast.
• 1:07:44
  SPEAKER_01: If you enjoyed this episode, please leave a review wherever you listen.
• 1:07:49
  SPEAKER_01: Share it with someone who needs to hear it today.
• 1:07:52
  SPEAKER_01: And tag me if you can.
• 1:07:54
  SPEAKER_01: I read all the messages and it makes me really happy.
• 1:08:00
  SPEAKER_01: A huge heartfelt thanks to Persimmon, our incredible music partner for season three.
• 1:08:06
  SPEAKER_01: The soundtrack you've been walking to today is theirs, and I couldn't love it anymore.
• 1:08:13
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you for believing in the show.
• 1:08:16
  SPEAKER_01: And thank you, our glorious listeners, always endlessly, for being here for walking with us.
• 1:08:26
  SPEAKER_01: Until next time, keep moving forward even when you don't know where you're going yet.
• 1:08:32
  SPEAKER_01: Keep connecting, and the right people change everything.
• 1:08:37
  SPEAKER_01: And of course, keep listening.
• 1:09:32
  SPEAKER_00: Full and empty, keep it steady.
• 1:09:36
  SPEAKER_00: Wondering when are we gonna be there already?
• 1:09:42
  SPEAKER_00: Thinking, waiting and pacing lately.
• 1:09:47
  SPEAKER_00: I'm acting out in memories easily.
• 1:09:57
  SPEAKER_00: Made me think I really missed a beautiful