Latest / The On Purpose Podcast / Ep. 367 – Mary Catherine Liscinski: Breaking Free From Screen Addiction

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Ep. 367 – Mary Catherine Liscinski: Breaking Free From Screen Addiction · The On Purpose Podcast

• speaker-0: You are listening to the On Purpose Podcast. What's up, everybody? Welcome to this week's edition of the On Purpose Podcast, where you know it's our goal to keep you thinking, to keep you wondering, to keep challenging you to maybe how can we better and this be better in our lives. And this week I'm super excited to be talking with Mary Katherine Lesinski, a licensed mental health counselor, digital addiction coach, and founder of LifeWalk Coaching. She's specializing in helping families break free from the grip of screen overuse. And her new book, A Guide for Getting Your Kids Off of Screens, offers six practical solutions that work for kids. And I'm intrigued for how they work for adults as well. What I love about her is she's blending not just the science, but insight and where I think she can really make a huge difference, and that is real world coaching. to help people reclaim focus, connection, and well being in a world overwhelmed by devices. So Mary Catherine, my newest friend, welcome to the show. speaker-1: Thank you so much ⁓ so much, Jared. I am so excited to be here to talk with you and share with your audience. This is gonna be great. speaker-0: And what I love researching you is I I love the amount of references you had to coaching, because that is something we firmly believe in, is coaching people, not just giving them more information, not telling them where they're making mistakes or where they need to improve, but really investing in the process of helping them make the changes, helping them make the improvements. And and I want to applaud you for that because I I think that is. an area that so many people need more of is just somebody in their corner that's gonna believe in them, gonna hold them accountable and challenge them to become who they know they can become. So thank you for for blending all that together and showing up in this manner. speaker-1: Yes, I am so passionate about helping people. You know, we all know that screen overuse, screen addiction is a problem for people of all ages. And I began to see how frequently family conflict was based around screen time, screen use, and trying to get your kids and teenagers to get off those devices. And I was like, okay, if I can hone in on this one issue, I can help a lot of families, a lot of people. And so I don't want people to give up hope. I hear, you know, the stories of, you know, great parents saying, I tried to reduce screen time in my home and it was just so much fighting, I gave up just to keep the peace. Yeah. And that's sad, you know, ⁓ because too much screen time is so ⁓ damaging for children and for all of us that it's like, no, don't give up. Let me help you along the way. So that's my aim. speaker-0: I love it. Yeah. Giving up's generally not the right answer for most things in life. All right, Mate Catherine, before we dive into this, I gotta warm you up. I like to think of this as like a mental workout for us. So you I got some questions for you. Are you ready for these? All right, my first one, Mary Katherine. What is a favorite quote or mantra that you go back to throughout your life? speaker-1: You know, that's an interesting one. I think what I go back to is my grandmother. And this quote or this phrase did not originate with her, but she frequently would say, Stop and smell the roses. And she did that literally and figuratively in her life. And I think there's so much to learn from that. Again, it's a overused, you know, little quip, whatever, but what it really means is slow down. appreciate the little things in life. And to me, I mean, you know as well as I do, we are a hurried society. We're not really humans anymore, we're hurriers. Yeah. And that comes to my mind so frequently. speaker-0: ⁓ I love it. I love it. Good job for grandma for reinforcing that with you. As far as I know, she created it. speaker-1: Sure, why not? She was born in nineteen fourteen, so maybe she did. speaker-0: Yeah, I love it. All right, Mary Catherine, what's something you've learned about yourself lately? speaker-1: I think, you know, that I just need to keep focused on putting healthy priorities first. And we all know that can be hard, but I think that we actually need physical reminders in front of ourselves. I have a few different ways that I do that for myself. ⁓ I put a sticky note on my bathroom mirror to say, here's my priority, or I put it, I write it out. on a piece of paper, take a picture of it, and then make that picture my ⁓ home page, you know, home screen on my phone, so that I see that phrase every time I open my phone. And so again, I think we are so distracted and going in so many directions, I have to have visual, actual reminders. And so that has really helped me recently. speaker-0: Can give me a sample of what one of your reminders has been as a home screen? speaker-1: ⁓ let's see. no. ⁓ I think, you know, well, not on my home screen. This is on my bathroom mirror. Yeah. ⁓ and that is, you know, does this action align with what I want to be? And so just to have that in my mind each day of okay, are my actions aligned with who I want to be? speaker-0: I love that. Yeah, that's so good. And I I love that you tie into who you want to be, not what do you need to get done. speaker-1: Right, that that that's a mental shift. speaker-0: Right, like who is my person? Yeah, so good. So good. All right. Third one. What is a favorite book or a book you consistently go back to? speaker-1: See here. You know, I think of a book that I read as a teenager that I've read a couple of times since then. and it is the autobiography of George Mueller. I'm, you know, especially when I was a teenager, I read a lot of biographies and autobiographies. And George Mueller was the founder of an orphanage over in England, and it was his story, and it's just just incredible. ⁓ so I I really liked that book a lot. speaker-0: What what keeps you coming back to it? What do you take away from it? speaker-1: He had a very strong faith in God and he would pray about everything. You know, every little tiny need that he had, he would go to God about it and talk to God. And I think, you know, that's what we all need to do. So speaker-0: All right, one last warm up question, Mary Catherine. When you think about the season you're in for life right now, what's a word or phrase that best describes it? speaker-1: As far as what it is or what it should be. speaker-0: Now you got me curious. speaker-1: Well, let's see, said I think my season is kind of a readjustment season. I have been involved in, you know, various things with my work. I'm self-employed, and so that, you know, involves constant shifting, usually. And then in my family, ⁓ I am blessed to live nearby my parents and also my sister who's married with two precious little nieces that I have. And so juggling life between all of us, which I love. takes adjustments and how you know, how are we going to stay close as a family? How are we going to support each other? And we all have our different roles and different seasons of life, of course, with that age span. And so I think that's what I would say. speaker-0: I love that. Yeah. ⁓ wow. I I'm just picturing that and I what I really enjoyed about hearing that is how do we support each other. Right. And being conscious and and intentional and providing support for one another, not just hoping that I find it at the right time. speaker-1: think that family when you have parents, children, eventually grandchildren, like that's meant to be some type of unit. And I am so blessed to live in the same town ⁓ with all of those people. I know that's not the case for some people. And when it's not the case, you you do the best you can when you live across the country. But I think that your family is so important. You know, they're gonna be there for you. And so I think investing in family first is what we need to do. And we need friends too. Good friends are a great part of life, but your family is gonna be there, so speaker-0: ⁓ I'm excited for this conversation, Mary Catherine. Are you ready? All right. Help me understand what first opened your eyes to the scale of digital addiction. speaker-1: I'm ready, let's go. I think it was my own realization of how frequently, you know, family conflicts were centered around screen use. As I in my practice, as I decided to pivot more towards family therapy and working, you know, with the family unit as a whole to begin with. As I started thinking that through and, you know, planning that and I was like, you know what? Screens are such a problem to all of this. And as you know, so then. I said, you know, how do I become more educated in this specifically? And I found a certification that I got. And then I ended up doing a lot of ⁓ self education after that to dive even deeper. So I have read a lot of books, I've read a lot of research online, and that's where it all started. speaker-0: What was it? I guess let's go to to the brain because that's what I like about you. So I ⁓ I read in some of your stuff that you talk about technology can hijack the brain. What does that look like? Like what does that actually mean and how's it impacting our thinking? speaker-1: Right. Well, I think there are two broad ways. Number one, it hijacks, you know, anyone of any age and you know has negative effects on them, but especially with young children and teenagers, it's actually hijacking and stunting their brain growth, which is very scary ⁓ for individuals, for families, and for society as a whole. And so we have these, of course, addictive properties that the social media companies and gaming companies have admitted, hey, you know, we built those in on purpose. ⁓ and so we we know that as a foundation. And then once we're hooked, again, we have these damages to the brain and and especially the developing brain, but it's damaging to a brain of any age. And so for example, you know, when we are on screens, we're almost always sedentary. You know, occasionally, you know, we'll have, you know, somebody walking and listening to a podcast or whatever, but almost all screen time is sedentary. And so especially for a developing child, that can result in metabolic syndrome symptoms. Okay. So blood sugar dysregulation, weight gain, prediabetes, all of those things that we used to never see in children. It was only adults. Okay. But now pediatricians' offices are just full of children. Who are having metabolic syndrome ⁓ issues. And so, and also with the brain with attention. Something that parents do not realize in regards to video games specifically is that video games are creating what's now being called acquired ADHD. So when you are gaming. You're actually paying attention to many things at once. You're not just staring at one screen. You are scanning that screen for any change, any movement, any noise. And so you're training your brain to be hyper-vigilant, just like a soldier is hyper-vigilant on their environment, watching out for the enemy, all of those things. And so then when you put that brain in a classroom or you go to work with that brain, you're gonna be, you know. distracted by this noise over here and that movement over there and how in the world are you going to pay attention to a teacher and how how in the world is you're going are you going to compete with that as a teacher when these kids' brains are trained to be hypervigilant. speaker-0: Yeah. I I'm I'm just pondering that 'cause that's such a big question, right? Is how do we deprogram some of that programming? speaker-1: Well, one of my solutions, and I'll go ahead and say this, the solutions that I present seem very simple and simplistic, even though they're not always easy. They seem like, how does that work? But again, you know, I explained scientifically how they work. For example, being outside in nature, the energy level outside in nature, the atmosphere is very calm, you know, borrowing a thunderstorm or whatever. It's very calming outside. And so that is going to put your nervous system in a calm state. It's going to activate your parasympathetic nervous system, which is your calm side. Okay. And so spending more time in nature, you're going to retrain your brain to stay in that parasympathetic, calm state, instead of the fight or flight state that is put on by video games and even social media. you are, you know, constantly looking for that newsfeed scroll, what's the next thing? And you're just in that tense anticipation, right? And we should not be in that state of being for long periods of time at all. And so for instance, so to reverse that, spending more time in nature is going to reset your nervous system and your brain to be in that calm, natural state. speaker-0: Yeah, that seems so simplistic, right? Like I think if you asked anybody, they'd be they know they need to be in nature more for the ⁓ vast majority of our lifestyle. But it's hard to get get them to take action on that. It's hard to to make that a priority. So let me ask you this. How does somebody know if their kids or their family's spending too much time on the screen, right? What are the symptoms they can look for? 'Cause I I I think like with most addictions And I'm no expert, but just a layman here. It's easy to compare and go, Well, I'm not on my screen as much as that guy, so I don't have a problem. Right. Just like drinking, like I don't drink as much as Fred, so I'm not an alcoholic. So what symptoms and behaviors do you see this that should be red raising red flags to say, wait a second, maybe we are on here too much? speaker-1: Well, I'll give you a simple test, especially for adults, but then I'll tell you the symptoms too. I think giving yourself a simple test by saying, okay, let me, you know, not play my video games for a week and see what happens, or put down my phone and only answer it if the phone rings for a phone call. And just, you know, try to cut yourself off from that and see how it goes. If you get antsy and upset and jittery. And just like feel that pull. I gotta check it, I gotta see. Like if that's hard for you, that shows that you or your child was too attached. Okay. And this whole thing is about being too attached to the screen, which again, those addictive properties make it that way. And so if you give it up and it's hard, guess what? You were some level of addicted. So here are some symptoms to watch out for. Okay, so withdrawal from other people. Wanting, you know, teenagers wanting to be in their rooms by themselves on their devices. Okay. Anger when you tell your kids to get off your screens, if they come up with some giant meltdown, again, that signals they're too attached. If they weren't attached to it, they'd be like, here, sure, whatever. Right? But if they're, ⁓ you know, too much attachment, right? So again, lower grades due to a lack of ability to focus. This acquired ADHD, one thing to specifically watch out for. is if you have a child in you know fourth, fifth or sixth grade that kind of all of a sudden develops these ADHD symptoms and teachers in the lower grades did not see it, you know, in first, second, third grade, teachers didn't say little Johnny was distracted, whatever. ⁓ that shows, you know, something started that up at that time, right? And so watching a child's grades, poor communication skills, right? ⁓ less eye contact, we're really seeing that big time in young adults, teenagers, and kids. They're not literally practicing it and they're not knowing how to do it. And when you're not in that practice, it's actually uncomfortable some to start looking people in the eye when you talk to them. So less eye contact, you know, they're not as happy as they used to be. They have fewer interests, they just want a game or they just want to be on social media. Feeling exhausted but can't sleep. How about that? I think we as adults could feel that. And lacking motivation, here's something ⁓ that is really important to know. Okay, so one reason why screens are so addictive is that they play on your dopamine pathway in your brain. Okay, that that feel-good hormone that we have. And so I'll sidestep here and say when you're addicted to a substance. Okay, you take that substance, you get that dopamine spike, and then it goes back down and you're craving for another hit, right? But especially with video games, you start playing, you get that dopamine rise, and as long as you're on the video game, it plateaus and stays at that high level until you know for however many hours, and then you know, cuts off and crashes when you're done. So again, multiple hours of being on social media or video games with that high level of dopamine. It will eventually lead to dopamine depletion. Now, the important thing about that is that some level of dopamine is needed for everyday normal tasks and motivation for that. And so, again, that's one actual reason for what we would call, you know, being a couch potato in the basement and these young people don't have the motivation. Well, their dopamine is more than likely very low, and they've got to do some of these things to re-regulate their dopamine and build it back up the healthy way so that they can like literally get off the couch and go do things. They may cognitively know that they should go out and get a job, but they just can't. And the dopamine depletion I think is one big factor there. speaker-0: What do you think about this? And and this is what I see more often than I would like to see is parents that are using screens to occupy their child's time so they can do something else. Like we went out for dinner, ⁓ it was a bit a bit ago, but literally a family of four sat down next to us and both kids immediately pulled out an iPad and both parents pulled out their phones. So here they are at a family dinner, not one person's interacting with another human near them. speaker-1: I see that too when, you know, both parents and all the kids are each on their separate device. That is alarming. I will say I know screens are a very convenient babysitter and they're very good because they're addictive. That child is glued. It's like it's glued to their hand or glued to their face. Right. So I get that. And we just need to spread the message of here are all these damages that this is causing. And that, hey, It's okay to reverse. It's okay to back up. Just because we invented these things doesn't necessarily mean that they're good. Look at, for example, back in the early days, 100 years ago or whatever, doctors said that cocaine was a panacea for all your ailments. And now we know, you know what? Cocaine's not that great, right? Same thing with opioids. You know, doctors at first said they're not addictive. Go ahead, take them. Now we have all of these people in the throes of addiction of these opioid pills. And so just because something comes along and it's new and great doesn't mean that we're correct. And so, you know, again, I want to spread the message of, hey, it's okay to reverse, it's okay to back up, it's okay to be the way we used to be. One thing that I like to emphasize is that, you know, for those of us who are 35 years old and older, you know, the way we grew up. Mostly without screens, you know, there was television and whatnot, but we definitely didn't have smartphones. That way of growing up, being a lot more active, spending time with family and friends, all of those things, having various hobbies and interests, and what we would call normal, is actually critical for healthy child development. And we're seeing all these deficits now in the entire population of children, just about. And this is what's doing it. speaker-0: Is that just in the Western world or would you say that's worldwide? speaker-1: Think it's worldwide anywhere that children have access to screens like here. And so that varies country by country. I know that, you know, for instance, Finland and Sweden, they have really backed up on their allowance of screens in schools. They'll be getting those out. I know that the country of Australia has now banned social media if you're under 16 years of age. Yeah. And here in the United States, I don't know the exact number, but it's well over 20 states have now banned cell phones in schools. And so if you're out there and you're living in a state that has not banned cell phones in the school, I want you to get on that. ⁓ because ⁓ for instance, I'm here in Arkansas and we banned it starting last year. We offered it, you know, the year before to in highly encouraged schools. But anyway, teachers and everybody is saying we're seeing an immediate difference in week one. Yeah, at school with these kids when they no longer have their phones. So it's a big deal. speaker-0: Yeah, that's interesting. So how that's you mentioned something and it was kind of what I wanted to talk about next. What does reversing the effects of screen use actually look like in our real life? speaker-1: Well, the solutions that I have come up with as I have done all of this heavy research, again, they seem simple. They kind of just seem normal life, you know, if ⁓ and they do seem like, you know, how do they work or whatever. And so some of it is going to seem like lifestyle change, which I almost hate to use that phrase because people are like, ⁓ lifestyle change, that seems too insurmountable. Like I'm not gonna change my whole life. But Again, I just encourage people to investigate it. You know, for instance, going, you know, spending more time outside in nature. That also is going to help with one of the other keys, which is to get appropriate sleep, right? If you're outside and getting sunshine, you're going to sleep better at night, which again, screens really ⁓ negatively impact your ability to get a good night's sleep. speaker-0: So let me ask this 'cause here as as you're saying that I'm like, okay. Like I parenting sometimes one of the hardest things in parenting is how do I say that? Comparing yourself to the other parents. Right. And not, you know, being feeling guilty or overwhelmed that like you're putting these rules on your kids. But all you hear about is Johnny's family's not doing that and Susie's family's not doing why do these kids get to be on their phone so much more and and and not feeling like you're just alone or or or guilty that maybe you're holding your kids back one way or the other by in institute. And what would you say to parents that are are struggling with those emotions if they are trying to follow your steps? speaker-1: Well, I realize that's definitely a thing where your child can say, I'm the you know I'm gonna be the only one not on Roblox or whatever, and as other other parents allow this and that. But I think and I hope and I do think that the tide is turning. And I want to say to you parents out there, have conversations with like all the parents you know. And I bet you could find another family who says, you know what, we wanna do that too. We, you know, so let's band together. Let's support each other as parents. Let's have our kids get together to play and to do activities and to go out and all these kinds of things. And so I think it again, even though, yes, there are going to be those parents who just let their kids have free reign on social media and all of those kinds of things, I think now the tide is beginning to turn and you can find at least one more family who says, Yeah, we want to do it too. And that's going to help you. It's going to help your kid. But yes, I I agree that's hard to be the one going against the tide. But it's worth it. It really is. speaker-0: You know what's funny is as I said that I listed you to answer it, I'm like, okay, maybe in this generation that's an argument, right? Like the kids come home and say, Well, so and so's doing it so so. So go back to my generation, it would be like, you know, so and so is allowed to stay out till two in the morning. So and so is allowed to do this, right? Like we all parents always faced the I'm the only one that has my kids home by midnight. Now it's just digital, right? Or at least one in a another avenue is digital. So let me ask you this, Mary Catherine, right? 'Cause I as I'm listening to this, I I think back 'cause I worked in public education for a few years and a big change was when the schools embraced everything happening on laptops and tablets. And I remember we were very fortunate, a very affluent community in Colorado, that all the kids got issued a laptop or a tablet. So what roles do schools need to play? And getting the kids back off of technology and back to engaging the other humans around. speaker-1: Again, I think that not allowing kids to have their personal phones at school is a big step. If you're not familiar with this, ⁓ a lot of schools are doing it so that the child can bring the phone to school, but then they put it in a, you know, locked pouch that's just for them. And then they can pick it up at the end of school because a lot of times at the end of school they may go to a friend's house or they may go to a sporting event, something like that. And so they need their phone for safety outside of school so they can take it with them. But again, it's in the pouch during school the school. hours. Now, ⁓ also I think the next step after that is to say, hey schools, you know what? It's not great to issue all these laptops and to be doing homework only online. Parents need to realize this that most of the CEOs of the technology companies in Silicon Valley, so all of these social media companies, gaming companies, they send their kids to schools that do not use screens for any purpose. There are not Screens at the school, they don't issue ⁓ tablets, anything like that. It is totally screen free until some of them you know have a little bit in like 11th or 12th grade or something. But again, those CEOs they know, you know, and you know, Steve Jobs kids did not have ⁓ iPads. So if we want to look at what's the best education and you know, what are these technology CEOs who know, they know. the very most about what screens do to people. And if they say their kids can't have it, well then what about mine? I don't think so. And so I think there just needs to be a lot more talk. You need to go to parent-teacher meetings and talk about this. Go to your school counselor, your school principal and say, hey, let's make a plan to reverse this. It wasn't that many years ago that we didn't have these. So we just have to go back to what we were doing before. It's not like we have to change change again and do something totally new we haven't done. We're just gonna go back to what we were doing. So yes, I do, you know, really want that to happen in schools to be no screens. speaker-0: Is there a balance, you think? Is there a balance to using technology? So like like the kids are gonna have to be computer literate. Like everything all business is done on computers for the most part. Is there a place we can balance and find that sweet spot of being literate and knowing how to use them but not being consumed by them or obsessed with them? speaker-1: Yes, you know, screens and the internet are here to stay. And so I I can agree with that in the sense, but I think it really doesn't take that long to learn. You know, when you're seventeen, eighteen, you can pick up stuff really fast still. Your brain is young, your brain is still growing until your mid twenties. And so I don't that's that's my stance that you delay it as long as possible. And because you can still learn. Think think about, you know, people who were 50 years old when all of a sudden, you know, companies started using computers for everybody. Well, they it was kind of tough, but they managed, right? Yeah. And so it's like, we can do it. You don't, you know, especially you don't need to think of, you know, young children, ⁓ they've gotta, you know, learn all this stuff when they're young. No, they don't. That's my stance. speaker-0: Yeah. No, I agree with that. speaker-1: But using using the internet and the computer as a tool, you know, if we can do that as adults, you know, that's what we need to try to do. speaker-0: All right. Yeah, no, I wouldn't disagree at all with that. I think that's well said. What Catherine, what breakthroughs have you seen with families when they commit to reducing their screen time? speaker-1: Well, Jared, I think that, you know, families, it's it's hard at the beginning, I'll admit that. Okay. But I think very quickly and you know, quicker than they anticipated, they see a lot more peace and calm in their home. They discover that their child or their teenager, you know, is interested in what they were interested in before, right? And they're more wanting to be out of their room because again, if they don't have technology in their room. You know, you're gonna sleep in your room, and maybe your room is where you do your homework, but then like you wanna be out of there. You wanna be with your family or with your friends or doing something. And again, going back to what you said about seeing families at a restaurant and all four of them have their own individual device, family time, especially meal time, but any family time, that's when you pass down stories, not only of when you as a parent were a kid or when you as a grandparent were a kid. But just, you know, teaching kids about life and giving examples and talking about things on the news, you know, that's how you want your teenager to learn the news is kind of, you know, through you. Now they're seeing it all over their news feed, and it's just that is a whole other level of stress that teenagers don't need to have world news just popping out at them, you know, all the time. It's not for them to handle, right? And so ⁓ having that time to share. So it's not just about the news of the day, but it's about stories and passing down values. And you know, it's so shocking and terrible, not only for the individual, individual or family, but for society that we are seeing a big decrease in empathy amongst people. And again, you know, teaching empathy starts at home to say this is how actions and words affect other people. And Hurting other people is not okay. Again, that sounds so basic, but it's taught in so many ways from grandparents and parents to children. And I think when we all live our separate lives in our rooms on our own devices, who's teaching that? Nobody. speaker-0: Yeah, or somebody, but you don't know who it is. It's a random stranger whose content just popped up in their algorithm. speaker-1: Right, that's right. Online, all worldviews are online. And so you don't know what's going to pop up for your kid. I like to use this illustration with parents who, you know, some parents originally thought, ⁓ if I keep my kid at home, they're not gonna be out on the streets in danger. Da-da-da. And like, yes, if they are at home, they are protected from certain dangers. But when your teenager is in their room by themselves online. You need to consider that to be a virtual sleepover. Okay. Just like you wouldn't allow your teenager to go spend the night at a stranger's house, that's a no, right? But online, you have no idea what kind of online environment they're in. You have no idea who they're communicating with, and you know have no idea what kind of pressures they're facing. Okay. So it's like a virtual sleepover with The entire world open to your child. speaker-0: Yeah, that that's so important, right? And I and I've seen that a lot, right? Where where young people talk about a hopelessness and just a doomsday and like there's just not much right. And then I ask them, I'm like, okay, well, well, show me that in your world. Right. Like let's let's step out of your house and like show me this despair in your neighborhood. Show me this this despair in your workplace. Like I see happy people, I see people going about their lives, I see people creating. And a lot of times like we forget the actual real world we're in and we're basing all these emotions and ideas off stuff happening across the world that maybe we were never meant to consume, right? That we can't possibly burden everything and we're missing the joy, the happiness, the human potential right in front of us, because we're we're consumed with so much. speaker-1: Yes, I totally agree. Especially children and teenagers, but even us as adults, like, yes, we need to be semi aware of what's going on, but so much we have zero control over. You know, and it's that's just, you know, for that negativity and that burden to be on us, that's going to again reduce our ability to be fully present and energized in our family and in our neighborhood. People don't even know their neighbors anymore. And I'm like, what is that? Right. ⁓ You need to know your family, know your neighbors, have and your friends, you know, who have a lot of things in common with you. That's who you need to be connected with. And too much information, you know, our brains were not designed to hold that many individual pieces of information. We come across as much information in one day as a person in the 15th century came across in their entire lifetime. That's blew me away. Right. ⁓ but you think about how many pieces of information come at us. It's unbelievable. speaker-0: Well, and the trickery behind it, right? Like the people feeding you the information aren't fools. They know what sells. They know what gets the like you said, an emotional response from you. So they're not sending you good stuff. They're sending you information that triggers the fear, that triggers the anxiety, that triggers the ⁓ maybe a dopamine release. So you stay and then you go to the next video. Mm-hmm. And yeah, I think I you had a great analogy earlier, like that sleepover stuff. If these people were calling your house, so like let's go back pre internet. Okay. People actually had to call you. If somebody would call you and say, Hey Jared, I want to tell you about all the bad news around the world right now, you'd hang up on speaker-1: Yeah, I would too. speaker-0: You would never take that call, right? Or you got, hey, some stranger calls and wants to pitch you on their whatever crazy idea, you'd be like, No, that's really not for me. You'd hang up. But now you find yourself watching their video of some crazy idea across the world. You're like, ⁓ that could happen here. I should be afraid of this as well. speaker-1: Right. I I like to think about it that way because the phone you would certainly, you know, put down that phone that has the wire attached to the wall. You you'd put that thing down so fast. But yes. ⁓ you know, one more thing that's very important to mention, I think, in talking about the dangers is that now we have something called sex dorsi on the rise. And many people don't even know what that is, and they need to because it is happening out there. What's happening is again, when your child is on social media or even video games now that are open, you know, to the internet to talk to anyone in the world, ⁓ someone gets in contact with your your child, they can make their profile appear to have many mutual friends with their child. So your child thinks, ⁓ they're friends with all of my friends, so they must be all right. You know, and so that has them, you know Let down any kind of guard that they did have a child as a child, which is small anyway, ⁓ it's gone when they see all these mutual friends. And they become friends with your child, etc. And if it comes to the point to where you know they are sending inappropriate pictures back and forth with your child, ⁓ nude pictures, once they get a nude picture of your child or teenager, then they say, Hey, you know what? Actually, if you don't you know, send me $5,000 through Cash App. I'm gonna send this picture to all your friends, all your youth group friends, your sports team, I'm gonna send it out if you don't send me $5,000. And children and teenagers don't know what to do with that. Sure. And of course the embarrassment and the shame are so huge. Even we as adults, you know, have trouble with embarrassment and shame over things, but children and teenagers, they really don't know how to handle that. As an extreme, right? And we have, you know, very sadly, you know, children and teenagers who have committed suicide when they have gotten sex dorcian threats. And so again, that whole virtual sleepover, you have no idea. And you can't possibly, you can't possibly try to control that. speaker-0: Yeah. Let me ask you this, Mary Catherine, what inspired you to decide to go ahead and write the book about this? speaker-1: Well, as I self-educated and read a lot of other books and read a lot of scholarly articles online from research journals, medical universities, things like that, I was like, okay, I've learned a lot about the problems. I've seen a lot about here's, you know, 10 tips to get yourself off screens, or here's 10 rules for your family. And those are great, but I found them to be very incomplete. And so what I dove into is okay, like we know scientifically the problems that screen time is causing to the brain, to the body, to relationships. You know, scientifically we we see those now. Now, how do we reverse those? And so that's what I again dove into and researched and put together to say, okay, people need to know this. I need to put this in a book because we need to not just get off screens, but we need to help to reverse and heal the damages that have been done. Now, even if you're not young, there's hope for you because we have in our brains neuroplasticity, which means the brain can change, it can rewire. ⁓ when your brain has been going down this pathway and is used to this, we can train it to go down this pathway instead. Okay. Yeah. So even an old dog can learn new tricks. Yeah. And so I think that my book is very unique in this aspect when it comes to stopping screen addiction is that again, it's not just here are these ten tips ⁓ to to reduce screen time, but here's how you change things so that you begin to heal and restore the damages. speaker-0: ⁓ I love it. What was one of the things I love asking authors is what was your biggest fear or obstacle that you had to overcome in creating your book? speaker-1: The biggest obstacle I think was just learning all that I need to need needed to learn to be self-published. I self-published, my book is on Amazon, and so I was very naive in the beginning because I had never written a book before. I thought I would, you know, write the book and I know that would take time and effort because it's basically like a giant college research paper ⁓ as far as the time and effort put into it, multiple college research papers put all into one. ⁓ but then I thought, okay, then I'll I'll have it and then I'll just upload it on Amazon and sell it, you know, but there were so many steps. You know, I knew I would hire an editor, which I did, of course, and then I realized I needed a formatter and a cover designer, and then ⁓ you have to apply for your U US copyright, and I wanted my book to be in the Library of Congress so that libraries can carry it, and just so many things that I had no idea. I would even have to learn about and then make decisions about. There were a lot of decisions I had to make as a self published author, but I am so glad to have the book now. speaker-0: Yeah, I love it. Congratulations on doing it. And and thank you for I always like to t throw out the term the courage to putting it down on paper, right? There are so many great book ideas that float around in the universe and in people's heads that just never actually make it to paper. So thank you for doing that. speaker-1: I hope that it blesses many families and like we've said it is geared to parents to help, you know, their children, but these solutions can be used by anyone of any age. It's very easily translatable for anyone. So speaker-0: All right, Catherine, as we get close to wrapping up, what's a message you'd want every listener, a parent or not, to take away from our conversation today? speaker-1: I think it's that just to not give up hope. I know this is hard on us as adults. I know it's hard on children, and it's hard being a parent trying to guide your child through this digital world. But don't give up hope because I firmly believe that you can, you know, put the boundaries that you need to put and protect your children and give your children the best life that they can have. You know, y I want Parents and teenagers and children to be excited about brain health. I know that brain health is typically something that neuroscientists, that's what they do, right? ⁓ but I think we all need to learn brain health to say, how do I get the healthiest brain that I can so that I can do what I want to do in life? I want to have the ability to just go after life. And we need a sharp brain for that. And so I want that to spread and say, you know, don't give up hope. You know, you can do it. speaker-0: ⁓ I love it. I was just thinking about this listening to that to your comment there, Mary Catherine. And I think maybe I would throw out that if you're a parent, before you try to change your kid's screen time, analyze yours. Right. Cause if I'm telling my kids, get off your phones, don't be on technology, but every time I have a down moment, instead of playing catch or going on a walk or just listening to their my team's crazy ideas on how their day was, I'm on technology. They're gonna watch what you're doing more than they're gonna hear what you're saying. speaker-1: Right. That is so true. That is so true. We learn so much by observing and by interacting. Yes, I would say parents, you definitely need to look at your own screen time, how you handle that and say, you know, this is gonna be tough for my child, so let me do my tough part first and do this along with them. And that way you can sympathize with them and say, you know what, I kinda miss my social media too, but here we are. You know, we're going to change this. speaker-0: Yeah. Yeah. That's that that's a fascinating concept there, right? And I I just think ⁓ Yeah, I think we've all gotten swept up by it, right? Because it's it's just ⁓ it was a huge technology development in our lifetime and we didn't know the parameters that needed to be in place as it it blew up. And now I think like you said, we're kind of reversing back, okay, it's good to a degree, but now I need to put some some barriers here, some some ⁓ limits, if you will. speaker-1: Right. Yes, yes. It developed too fast for the medical community and mental health community to put out at the beginning, like, hey, here's the warnings about this, you know, ⁓ it happened too fast. And now people like me are trying to put out the warnings, not only put out the warnings, but say, hey, you know, there's help for this. It it is a struggle. It is addictive, but you know, there's help for it. speaker-0: Yeah, and I loved what you said earlier. It's not unprecedented in our history as humans to go, wait a second, that thing that's supposed to be good for everybody isn't really good. Let me r you know, I'm thinking of like alcohol. When alcohol first came out, it was legal for all kinds of people. And then we slowly said, Okay, you gotta be eighteen. Well, maybe eighteen's not old enough. Now you gotta be twenty one, right? So we we r retroactively created rules around something and it had an established practice. Which is all you're saying, right? Like we're not saying get rid of all technology. We're not saying live in a cave and cook by fire every night. Mm-hmm. But we can put some limits on things. speaker-1: Yes, we've discovered, hey, you know what? Fifteen year olds drinking alcohol, not a good idea. So that's right. speaker-0: Yeah, I love it. Mary Catherine, where can our audience follow along, get the book and become part of your community as as we look to, like you said, take a proactive approach to our brain health and go, you know, create the moments we really want to have, right? Cause I'm pretty sure I'm just gonna throw this out. Maybe I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure at the end of our lives, none of our kids are gonna wish look at us and go, Mom, Dad, I wish you'd have made one more Facebook post. speaker-1: Yeah, that's true. No, that's a good one. It's so true, right? Yeah, why why didn't she send me more TikTok if I speaker-0: ⁓ I don't think so. speaker-1: Yeah, I I don't think that's what we're gonna be saying. speaker-0: No, where can we follow along on your your journey and be part of your community? speaker-1: So here is my book that I'm so proud of. You know, I really hope that it helps a lot of people. So it is on Amazon as paperback ebook and audiobook, and it's on Spotify as an audiobook as well. So I would encourage people to check this out. Parents, grandparents, anybody and everybody, it's great for yourself, for your kids. ⁓ educators and teachers, I'd encourage you to check this out. ⁓ doctors, you know, they are seeing the effects of screen time. So there's that. ⁓ and I invite all of you to not follow me on social media. I am I am regrettably on Facebook. I come this close to shutting down my account all the time. I want to get off so bad. But unfortunately, like for business purposes, I need to be on there. And then I have to watch myself to not get sucked in, right? Because I'm, you know, I'm a human too. And just because I am certified in this doesn't mean that I can't. feel the addictive pulls. Okay. But if you see me on Snapchat or TikTok or Instagram, guess what? It's not really me because I'm not on there. So there is no way to follow me. ⁓ I do have a website, lifewalkcoaching.com. You can find out more about my coaching services, my speaking, my book there. I can coach nationwide. So give me a call ⁓ and I'll see how I can help you. But That's my little spiel about that. speaker-0: I love it. Mary Catherine, thank you so much for joining us today. It's been an honor to share your story with our community and thank you for the work you're doing. And please keep it up. speaker-1: Thank you so much, Jared. This has been great to be able to talk about this with you. ⁓ you are just right there on that page. So I really appreciate that opportunity. speaker-0: Hey friends, Jared Hardy here. If you've been inspired by what we talk about on the On-Purpose Podcast, it's time to take it to the next step. My Excellence and Leadership course is built for individuals, teams, and organizations ready to lead with clarity, accountability, and purpose. Whether you're running a business, leading a squad, or just leveling up personally, let's work together. You can book me for custom classes or speaking engagements and we'll build something that lasts. Visit teamhardy.net to learn more and take action today. And remember, team, life is far too short to live any other way than on purpose. We'll see you all again next week.