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Shares, funds and investment trusts: how to generate £10,000 of income · On The Money

• 0:03
  Kyle Caldwell: Hello, and welcome to our latest on the money podcast episodes. Today's episode is focused on three hypothetical portfolios that aim to deliver an annual income of £10,000. So there are three portfolios. One is focused on shares, one is focused on investment trusts, and one is focused on funds. Joining me to discuss the shares portfolio is Lee Wilde, head of equity strategy at Interactive Investor.
• 0:34
  Lee, welcome to the podcast.
• 0:36
  Lee Wild: Thanks, Kyle.
• 0:37
  Kyle Caldwell: So, Lee, before we delve into it, I want to kick off by saying, so these portfolios are purely for educational purposes. And the reason why we do them is to get across to investors how they can build their own diversified income portfolios alongside wider research. The portfolios are very much designed to provide food for thought. Although I do think they also present the challenges that DIY investors face when building such a portfolio. And all the investments that are chosen, they're picked on the basis that on a medium to long term view, we would hope and expect that the returns would both grow in terms of capital growth and income growth.
• 1:23
  However, of course, there are no guarantees. And each year, we review our choices, and we consider making changes in order to ensure that the exercise remains relevant whether you're an existing investor that's been following the portfolios for many years or whether you're coming to the portfolios for the first time.
• 1:44
  Lee Wild: Yeah. Yeah. Well, I mean, we've I mean, we've been pretty successful over the years. They've been yep. They have proved incredibly popular with with readers.
• 1:54
  Yeah. We've been running the equity portfolio for for at least a a decade, and I I think the funds and trusts in previous situation for even longer. So I'd say one one thing that has cropped up recently, and it was something we discussed following some reader communication about the about inflation. Now we've we've said £10,000. That's our target income for the year.
• 2:22
  But obviously, haven't really factored in inflation over all that time. So it's something that myself and the team are gonna be talking about before the launch of the 2027 portfolios.
• 2:35
  Kyle Caldwell: Yeah. It's a very good point. You said portfolio has been around for around a decade. So, yeah, if you factor in inflation then, yeah, to to generate £10,000 of income ten years ago compared to today, you'd need a quite quite much higher. Someone wouldn't know what the exact figure is, but I'd probably guess it's around or close to 15,000 rather than 10,000.
• 2:57
  We
• 2:57
  Lee Wild: will find out next year.
• 2:59
  Kyle Caldwell: So, Lee, let's go into the shares portfolio. Let's start off with how the 2025 portfolio fared.
• 3:08
  Lee Wild: It was it was the best year we've had so far. I mean, for most years, we've got the 10,000 there or thereabouts. Some years have been slightly below, other years slightly above, and obviously the, yeah, the capital side of things has has been slightly more volatile. But certainly in in 2025, it's I expected to generate around 10 just over £10,300 of income, which would be have given us a yield of about 6.8%. So I ended up with just under 10,700 for a 7% yield.
• 3:46
  Now a chunk of that came from Sainsbury's. That was an unexpected special dividend, so that was welcome. And most of the constituents, otherwise, were were delivered pretty much what I expected. Sainsbury's gave us £1,400, the portfolio bank nearly 1,500 from M and G. I mean, and G has been a favorite of mine for for a very long while.
• 4:08
  Biggest income generated was LNG. I locked in a 9.2% yield a year ago that generated about £1,600 of income, but it's the capital gain I think that really stood out this time. So a £152,000 it costs to put the portfolio together to get that £10,000 of income, and that was worth about 190,000 twelve months later. So, again, HSBC, M and G, they were up almost 50% GSK, Rio, Tinzo, and British American Tobacco all up 30% or more, didn't expect to see that. So combined the income and the 25% capital gain, the total return was about 32%.
• 4:56
  If we could do that every year, happy days. So but look. So, Carl, you put together the £10,000 fund and investment trust portfolios. How did they do last year?
• 5:09
  Kyle Caldwell: Well, the overall total returns generated by both portfolios were lower than the very high returns that you produce, Lee. However, I was pleased with that aspect. Less pleasing was the fact that the income generated from both the funds and the investment trust's portfolio, it did fall short of the £10,000 income target. However, there were some very specific reasons why that was the case, and I'll go into them in a minute. So for the fund portfolio in 2025, it had an overall yield of 4.26%.
• 5:45
  So you needed a pot size of 235,000 to try and generate £10,000 of income. I would have liked the overall yield for the fund portfolio to be higher than that when I put it together last year. However, I do think, you know, given the fact that for a global ex income funds, most of them have yields of 3%. So if that's gonna be a core allocation in your income producing portfolio, then that's gonna drag down the overall yield of a portfolio. And unlike investment trusts where you can get gain exposure to, like, all terms of assets, like, renewable energy infrastructure or have some property exposure, I just don't think there's the same scope as there is with funds to generate a high level of income from a from a diversified portfolio of funds.
• 6:35
  So the overall return for the funds funds portfolio was 17.2%. But the income generated, it came up short. So £9,595 of income was produced. So there was a shortfall of £400, but given the overall total return was just over £40,000, I think you could have dipped into some of that to funds that £400 shortfall. The main reason why the fund portfolio had that £400 shortfall is because when the portfolio was put together at the end of last January, it was based on what the funds were yielding at that time.
• 7:15
  Of course, we know that fund yields, they're not static, and they I was using the current yield figures at the time. What we've seen within 2025, fund yields have declined, particularly for UK equity income funds. And this is due to the fact that a lot of the 41 hundreds companies, they they've had really strong share price returns in 2025, and that's resulted in the yields falling. So for UK income funds, if they have a larger company focus, the yields on those funds has now reduced. And due to the fact that those yields reduced, that led to this £400 shortfall.
• 7:56
  For the investment trust portfolio in 2025, it has a higher overall yield of 5.26%. So you needed a sum of a £190,000 to try and obtain £10,000 of annual income. The overall total returns came in at 13.1%. So that's a bit lower than what the funds portfolio produced in which the return was 70.2%. What didn't help matters in terms of the total returns was that one of the holdings, Greencoat UK wins, it has a year to forget.
• 8:32
  It produced a a loss of over 10%. The income generated also fell short by a thousand pounds. That was also a function of some of the investment trust yields falling within 2025. But the main factor why there was that big shortfall was the fact that one of the holdings that I picked last year, Henderson International Income, it merged into another investment trust. There's actually also in the portfolio, JPMorgan Global Growth and Income.
• 9:03
  The merger was announced very shortly after the article was published early last February. And what it meant was the merge went ahead in May. And for the portfolio, it meant that only one third of the income that was expected from Henderson International Income was produced. Just one of those things completely outside my control. It was an unforeseen event.
• 9:28
  But but but as as mentioned, given the overall total returns, you could have quite comfortably used some of those overall total returns dipped into them to pay that £1,000 shortfall to get up to £10,000. So let's now move on to the portfolios for 2026. So Lee, you're gonna kick off with the shares you've picked for the 2026 lineup. We will be in the episode description for the podcast, we'll put links to each article. So there's three separate links for the shares, funds, and investment trust portfolio.
• 10:06
  And within those articles, there'll be tables. But we're also gonna show the tables visually for those that are tuning in on YouTube. So that table for the shares portfolio should now be on the screen. So, Lee, go ahead and explain your choices.
• 10:23
  Lee Wild: Right. Okay. Well, I mean, we both talked about share prices having, you know, risen so much over the past twelve months. That does make it more difficult when we're looking for for higher yields. I know in with certainly on the equity side, I do have perhaps the luxury of taking a little bit more risk, which can mean higher yields.
• 10:43
  So there I've had to spend a little bit more this year to get that hypothetical 10,000. So about £163,000 I've had to to to spend, which is an extra 11,000 from this time last year to get that that 10 k target. That that's for a yield of about 66% compared with 7% in in 2025. So I'm gonna stick with LNG and M and G in 2026. They are yielding eight point four percent and six point nine percent, or they were at the time of of writing the article, putting together the portfolio.
• 11:18
  So it'd be foolish to reject that level of consistency this time. M and G have been in the portfolio for quite a while. Those yields are down on the previous year, but that's still highly attractive. Sainsbury's sticking with that as well. Last year it was 9.7%.
• 11:33
  I think the yield, thanks to the special, it'll probably be about half that this year, but it's still I think the best income option in the grocery sector, and I want that diversification. So I'm keeping BP again. It's all about sort of diversification in this portfolio, trying to pick something from a number of the the main sectors. So it's BP yields around five and a half percent. That's about a 160 basis points more than Shell.
• 12:03
  So there seems little reason to switch out of BP this time. Yeah. I've I like utilities in the portfolio as well. A little bit, you know, slightly more defensive. National Grid, yields just under 4%, but I do like the defensive appeal.
• 12:21
  It's inflation linked dividend and the earnings growth forecasts are attractive too. The biggest headache really has been in the house builders. So Taylor Wimpey, I want a house builder in the portfolio. Sector's cheap. Mean, I we could argue with afternoon about the pros and cons of owning house builders and what they may or may not do in 2026.
• 12:45
  But Tony Wimpey is not the analyst's favorite, perhaps more exposed than others to to slower house price price growth, but that 8.3% dividend yield just I can't ignore it. And I could have looked at some of the other house builders, but it just didn't stack up enough to ditch Taylor Wimpey. So I am sticking with it, and I hope it has a better year and that this is a turning point. But even if it's flat and we get that 8.3% yield, that's a success, I think. So I've made four changes for 2026.
• 13:23
  Now NatWest is in. It's the cheapest UK bank and yields about 5%. It is a little more sensitive to to interest rates, but I do want that exposure to the banking sector and exposure to that and improving UK economy. Fingers crossed. Land securities, first time I've included property in the in the portfolios, I think.
• 13:49
  Sector steadier than it has been for for a number of years and land sector is it's got a unit of about 6.4% sector leading, so attractive valuation made it not a no brainer, but it was it it it wasn't a difficult decision, don't think. Pennant, water companies have come in for a lot of lot of stick recently, but Pennant's underperformed in in recent years. There has been a recovery, but the yield again of 6% is is is is the best in the sector. I I just I like the security of of income and the the five year dividend policy out to 2030. That's gonna see profit grow in line with the consumer price index, CPIH.
• 14:37
  So Pennon's in. And in the tobacco sector, really, there there isn't really much choice. What do you want? Imperial or or BAT? So I've switched out of of BATs, had had a great year in '25.
• 14:51
  Imperial brands gives a a five and a half percent perspective. Dividend yield, valuations undemanding, cheaper than BAT, and the city likes the earnings visibility and and and opportunity for for capital return. So I've I've mentioned a couple of these, but British American Tobacco, GSK, HSBC, and Rio Tinto are the companies that miss out this year. So, Kyle, what are you what are your 10 k fund and trust portfolios look like in 2026?
• 15:23
  Kyle Caldwell: So before I go through them, I just wanted to start off by firstly saying that some of the things I think about when deciding whether or not to make any changes at all is to examine how each constituent has performed over different time periods, so particularly three and five years. I'm also looking at, you know, ultimately, I wanna see each fund or investment trust pull its weight in terms of performance in the portfolio. And I wanna ensure that every single fund or investment trust picked, they are sufficiently different from one another. They're offering the portfolio some a different element to the portfolio to to give the portfolio diverse diversification. What I don't wanna be doing is investing in any funds that is quite similar to another fund in the portfolio because when you do that, chances are you might get quite similar return.
• 16:15
  There's also a risk of doubling up on the same types of companies, sectors, and industries that the fund is exposed to. I'm also looking at is the is the same for managers still in place compared to a year ago when I picked it? Is the style of the funds is, you know, is the full manager sticking to his or her knitting in terms of how they're managing money? And is the objective and of the funds the same as well? And I'm also thinking if the fund is underperforming, I'm thinking, is this because of the style or the country that the fund is investing in being out of favor, or is it down to poor stock picking?
• 16:56
  And if it's the latter, I'd be more inclined to potentially remove the fund from the portfolio. As mentioned earlier on in the podcast, for an investor building an income portfolio today, it is more challenging than a year ago because yields have become less generous across the board. So in order to address this with the funds portfolio for 2026, what I've done is I've added two specialist funds that aim to deliver an extra chunk of income. So overall, the 2026 portfolio has a yield of 4.67%. So to generate £10,000 of income, you'd need a portfolio size of 215,000.
• 17:41
  So those watching on YouTube will now see a graphic showing all 10 funds that have been chosen for the funds portfolio. So those two specialist income funds that I've picked are Schroeder Income Maximizer and Fidelity Global Enhanced Income. These specialist funds, they're not for everyone. They're not straightforward to explain. But in a nutshell, what you're getting essentially is an extra chunk of income, but you're sacrificing some upside.
• 18:10
  So in a rising market, these funds are not gonna be top of the table. They're probably gonna be below the sort of sector average performer due to that.
• 18:20
  Lee Wild: So I guess with the yields, you know, decent yields more difficult to come by, you're taking a little bit of extra risk this year to to get a good yield at a reasonable cost.
• 18:33
  Kyle Caldwell: Yeah. I think it it does mean that the fund portfolio has a bit more risk picking these two funds. But, you know, I've I've done it in order to have a higher portfolio yields compared to a year ago. Those two funds that are picked, they account for 22.5% of the portfolio. So I'm hoping all the funds in the portfolio will provide a bit more growth than those two funds, and, hopefully, the portfolio overall is well diversified enough to generate both income and capital.
• 19:04
  And the two funds I removed to make way for them have much lower yields. So Fidelity Global Dividend is yielding 2.4%, and Vanguard FTSE or Whales high dividend yield ETF is yielding 2.8%. So the Fidelity global dividend funds, it's obviously got dividend in its name, but it's also trying to give you capital growth. And it's trying to it's trying to in a in a falling market, you'd expect you'd expect this fund to hold up pretty well. It's quite defensively positioned.
• 19:37
  So that's more of a sort of, like, a total a total return approach, hence why the overall dividend yield's only 2.4%. But given the, you know, yields have become less generous across the board, I felt that to try and boost the overall yield of the fund portfolio and to lower the theoretical amount that you need to invest, I needed to I needed to go for these two specialist income funds. And we'll see in a year's time whether that impacts the overall total returns within 2026. I made another change, and that change is that I removed Royal London short term money market funds. So for the past couple of years, and indeed still today, money market funds being a great option for investors to park some cash into because the yields have been at very attractive levels.
• 20:29
  So the yields that money market funds produce, they're typically in line with the with UK interest rates. We've seen US in UK interest rates fall last year, and they've been falling ever since. They peaked at 5.25%. And now The UK interest rates are at 3.75%. Money market fund yields are typically around that level or a little bit higher at the moment.
• 20:54
  There's usually a bit of a lag between to get with the yields being completely the same as The UK interest rates. I think that given the expectation is there's gonna be a couple of more interest rate cuts in The UK this year. Well, that's the expectation anyway. What that will mean is for money market funds is that the the amounts of income they're producing, it'll fall. So the overall total returns for money market funds will become less generous.
• 21:22
  So I wanted to cast my nets wider and take a bit more risk and go for a bond funds that is offering a higher yields. And that bond fund is the LNG short dated sterling corporate bonds index. And the distribution yields on that index fund at the January was 4.7%. It's a little bit of a step up in terms of risk from a money market funds, but you're not going from very low risk to completely high risk. It's just another sort of notch in in terms of going up the risk scale.
• 22:00
  So and I think the gap between a money market fund and what that fund and other competitors are offering is sufficiently high enough to take on that risk for this portfolio. The other seven funds in the portfolio have been retained. I'll I'll very, very briefly go through them. But as mentioned, you can find much more information in the article that is published. So for UK equity income, that that comprises 32.5 of the portfolio.
• 22:31
  I've gone for Artemis income, man income, Schroe's income maximizer before we talk through. Vang and then the final one is Vanguard's Footy UK equity income index. So as mentioned, I want the funds to be completely different in terms of how they invest. Artemis income mainly focuses on Footy 100 and quite reliable dividend paying companies. It's focusing on man income as more of a value focus, so invest very differently from Artemis Income.
• 23:01
  And I really like this index funds from Vanguard. So what it does is it tracks the up and down fortunes of companies that are expected to pay dividends that are generally higher than average. And at the January, it was yielding 4.2%. If you look at its long term track records and indeed even even over short time periods, actively managed funds really struggle to beat this index tracker. I think it's a it's a great one to consider for even for for a growth portfolio as well as an income one.
• 23:33
  The next part of the portfolio, Global Seas overseas income, is 37 and a half percent. I've already talked through Fidelity, Global Enhanced Income. The other two funds in that section of the portfolio are Guinness Asian equity income, and Artemis monthly distribution. Very briefly, the Guinness fund has an equally weighted approach. It invests in an equal proportion in 36 stocks.
• 23:58
  The Artemis monthly distribution funds, so that has 60% in shares and 40% in bonds. It's a very solid performer over the long term. And the final 30% section of the portfolio is for bonds to give the portfolio exposure to a defensive asset. So I've already talked through LNG short dated, stale, and corporate bond index. The other two I've picked and retained are Royal London Global Bond Opportunities and Jupiter Strategic Bonds.
• 24:28
  They both invest very differently from one another. So the Royal London funds, that focuses on under researched areas of the bond market. It has a lot of exposure to high yield bonds and unrated bonds. The Jupiter strategic bond funds, this is what they call a a go anywhere bond funds, and it looks to invest in the best opportunities it can find, but it also has a focus on trying to carefully manage downside risk. Moving on to the investment trust portfolio.
• 25:00
  So the overall yields for the 2026 lineup is 5%. So nice round number. You'd need £200,000 to try and generate £10,000 of income. Hopefully, now those watching on YouTube can see a table of the lineup of the investment trust portfolio. So there've been two exits from the portfolio.
• 25:21
  The first one was a forced change. It was the funds which merged last year, which was Henderson International Income. The other change I've made is removing Greencoat UK Winds. The main reason why I removed it is because it's long standing for manager called Stephen Lilly. He stepped down last April from managing Greencoat UK Wins.
• 25:43
  Prior to that, there was another full manager who, along with Stephen Lilly, had managed Greencoat UK Wins since it launched in 2013. That other full manager also stepped down a year prior to Stephen Lilly stepping down last year. So as a result, the two full managers that are now in charge, they have not been responsible for Greencoat UK wins, track records since launch of increasing its dividend every single year in line with r p RPI inflation. So, you know, the two full managers at the helm, I'm sure they'll do a good job for investors. But given that the two people that were in place when it launched and have been responsible for that outstanding track records are no longer running the money, I just felt I wanted to make a change as a result of that.
• 26:34
  Lee Wild: Yeah. Though those two guys, also the new guys come in at a very difficult time for the sector, you know, difficult couple of years. So not only have you got two a new team essentially, you've the the sector's still in a, you know, a bit of trouble, difficult times.
• 26:51
  Kyle Caldwell: Yeah. I mean, obviously, it was it was it wasn't alone in sort of being negatively impacted by higher interest rates. Like, whatever type of renewable energy an investment trust was focusing on, they really were harmed by those interest rate rises from rock bottom levels to peak at 5.25%. Of course, we've seen interest rates fall, but we've not seen a recovery really start at all for the sector. Obviously, no one can really predict when it will start, but I I thought that maybe last year might have been the start of a potential recovery.
• 27:27
  But the I think the trouble is that you can get, you know, pretty decent level of income from bonds. So I think a lot of investors are thinking, well, if I can pick up, you know, four, four and a half, 5% from bonds, a low risk asset compared to, say, renewable energy infrastructure, I'd sooner take that rather than take on higher levels of risk even when those yields for renewable energy infrastructure investment trusts mean some of them are over 10%.
• 27:56
  Lee Wild: I guess that that's what investors are are tempted by though, isn't it? You see something with 10%, you think, you know, you see the the prices come off so significantly. You think, well, it's tempting to think, well, things are gonna get better. I'm getting in a low point with a a locking in a, you know, very attractive yield, but you're not tempted.
• 28:17
  Kyle Caldwell: I mean, we've we've seen in terms of our most bought articles that we write each month on the most bought investment trusts. Renewable engine infrastructure trusts, you know, some of them do appear. Greencoat UK wins has appeared in the top 10 for, I think, the past three or four years every single month. So, you know, some investors are clearly tempted, and they're hoping for a recovery. And but as I mentioned, that's for for the rationale for removing it, I do think some investors are buying it based on its historical records of increasing its dividends in line with RPI inflation and just purely down to the fact that the fund managers are no longer at the helm for for this portfolio.
• 29:00
  That that's why I've removed it. So I introduced two new holdings. So the first one was Shroda Japan Trust. So I was really keen to get some Japan exposure into this portfolio. I think there's a lot of tailwinds going on at the moment for Japan's economy.
• 29:21
  I think it's it's finally exited its sort of three decade periods of being in a deflationary spiral. But the thing that I find most interesting is that the a number of years ago, Japanese companies have become more and more shareholder friendly, and there've been these corporate governance reforms that have been introduced. And as a result of that, companies in Japan are more much more prone these days to be paying dividends compared to, say, ten years ago. But when I was looking for a Japan focused investment trust, the the problem I found was that a lot of them are more growth focused. And if they are paying an income, the yields are very low, typically around 2%.
• 30:09
  However, this show the Japan Trust. A couple of years ago, it moved to an enhanced dividend policy. And what's that that what that has resulted in is it used to have a yield of of 2%, and its current yield is now 3.5%. So you're getting a you're getting a pretty good start and yield for investing in Japan through that investment trust. The other investment trust I chose is TR Property.
• 30:33
  So, you know, we all know it's been it's been a really tough time over the past four or five years for for the property sector. Obviously, of course, COVID was a real headwind for the sector, and the rise in interest rates that we've seen as well have been another headwind as well. I do think I do think there's low I do think interest rates falling is a potential tailwind for the sector. And one thing that I picked up when I was at researching TR property, it mentioned that it is it's quite close to returning to full dividend cover. So that gave me a lot of comfort really to consider introducing it as a position for the investment trust lineup.
• 31:18
  It's been tapping into its revenue reserves in order to pay a rising dividend over the past couple of years. It's it's got a 4.8% dividend yield. It's got a fifteen year track record of growing its dividends each year, and it's got a very experienced full manager called Marcus Fairmudge, who's been at the helm for two decades. And very briefly to run through the rest of the portfolio. So UKX income comprises 40%, and I've opted for City of London, Dunedin Income Growth, Diverse Income, and Merchants Trust.
• 31:54
  Each of those UKFC income trusts, I do feel they invest sufficiently differently away from one another. So I think each of them does earn the right to be in the portfolio. City of London, managed by Job Curtis. We've interviewed him many times over the years. He's been in charge since 1991, mainly focuses on reliable, 4,100 dividend paying companies.
• 32:17
  Dunedin income growth. It's got sustainable investments approach. It moved to paying an enhanced dividend. That was announced, I think it was last September or last October. And what this means is its yield is now 6.2%.
• 32:32
  Diverse income. So this, again, another really experienced manager in Jervais Williams. This has a particular focus on UK smaller companies that gives that gives that in the portfolio. And then there's also Merchants Trust. So this typically has a higher yields than most of The UK equity income trusts.
• 32:51
  Yield at the January was 4.6%, and it does tend to focus on higher yields and companies. And when I was researching the investment trust I when I put the portfolios together, I found it really interesting. The full manager, Simon Gergle, he made the point that he's been looking for more opportunities within UK medium sized companies because the overall yield in that part of the market is now actually higher than the 4,100. So it'd be interesting to see how that performs and indeed the others over the next year. For global overseas income, I've already mentioned Schroder, Japan.
• 33:31
  The other two I've opted for are JPMorgan global growth and income and Utilico emerging markets. So global overseas income, that's 35% of the portfolio. And I've I like the JPMorgan global growth and income fund because it's a it's a best ideas portfolio. Its it's it's performance hasn't been as as good as it as it was previously over the past one and three years, but it's still ahead of competitors over five years. It gives the portfolio exposure to The US.
• 34:01
  It has 70% in The US. It has a lot of exposure to the so called magnificent seven. It owns all of them in its top 10 apart from Tesla. Utilico emerging markets. So this is a bit bit more of a defensive way to to gain exposure to a high risk area, to invest in infrastructure and utility companies across the emerging markets as both a growth and an income focus, but its yield is higher than most of the emerging market investment trusts at 3.3%.
• 34:34
  Then the final portion of this portfolio, 25%, is I've already mentioned TR properties that accounts for 10%, and the other 15% is to a bond investment trust called twenty four income. So twenty four asset management, all they do I say all these. I I do I don't mean it like that. They specialize in investing in bonds. They they're not a jack of all trades.
• 34:57
  They don't have they don't have equity funds, multi asset funds, etcetera. All they do is bonds, and they're very, very good at it. So this again, it's not a simple strategy. So just just to look at my notes to explain. So invest in high yielding UK and European asset backed securities.
• 35:18
  So and if you wanna do a bit of digging, there's there's a great sort of educational piece that 24 have written explaining, I think, a really good way what the types of companies they are and and how they invest. But, basically, these companies, they include pools of corporate loans or packages of loans linked to mortgages. And when I was reading up on it, was thinking, okay. That's all I feel like I need to know. And then I can sort of hand the exposure over to the experts.
• 35:45
  They're the experts. And this is a an investment trust has performed very well over the long term. All of the income that that it generates is handed back to shareholders, and the yield at the January is a eye catching 9.8%. So that concludes the investment trust portfolio. Lee, thank you very much for coming on to discuss the shares portfolio, And I'm sure this point next year, we'll have you back on again to see how it fares and to see what future changes you've made.
• 36:14
  Lee Wild: Yeah. I look forward to it, Carl. Thank you.
• 36:16
  Kyle Caldwell: And thank you for listening to this episode of On the Money. Hope you've enjoyed it. As ever, we love to hear from listeners, and the best way to get in touch is emailing otm@ii.co.uk. And in the meantime, you can find lots of interesting insights and practical pointers related to investments and pensions on the Interactive Investor website, which is ii.co.uk. And I'll see you again next week.