Latest / Free Therapy with Ben & Kevin / A therapist answers your questions on dating, self-doubt & feeling stuck #27

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A therapist answers your questions on dating, self-doubt & feeling stuck #27 · Free Therapy with Ben & Kevin

• 0:01
  Speaker 1: Hey, I'm Ben. Welcome to Free Therapy. And I'm Kevin. No,
• 0:06
  Speaker 1: I'm just kidding. Kevin actually isn't here right now, but
• 0:08
  Speaker 1: he was on the episode. Don't worry. Each week, we
• 0:11
  Speaker 1: sit down with a different therapist to unpack the stuff
• 0:13
  Speaker 1: that everyone is struggling with but not saying out loud.
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: And this week, we're doing something we've never done before.
• 0:19
  Speaker 1: In a couple of days, it's Movember, and it's really
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: a time to bring awareness to men's mental health. So
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: we decided to host our first ever Therapy in Sessions.
• 0:28
  Speaker 1: where we had guys submit anonymous questions to a therapist
• 0:31
  Speaker 1: on things they needed advice on. So we brought in
• 0:34
  Speaker 1: someone we've had before, therapist and friend Seth Menachem, to
• 0:37
  Speaker 1: answer these. And to be honest, I cannot believe a
• 0:41
  Speaker 1: couple of the questions we received. They're very real, vulnerable,
• 0:45
  Speaker 1: and actually really, really funny. But at the end of
• 0:48
  Speaker 1: hearing these in all seriousness, it made me realize that
• 0:51
  Speaker 1: everyone is going through the same stuff. And I think
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: doing an episode like this is really, really helpful because
• 0:56
  Speaker 1: because it shows that we're all human. We're definitely going
• 0:59
  Speaker 1: to do it again. So if you want to submit
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: your question, go to freetherapypod.com slash questions, and we'll get
• 1:06
  Speaker 1: it on the next one. Enjoy the show.
• 1:28
  Speaker 2: All right, everybody, please welcome back to Free Therapy, Seth Menachem.
• 1:32
  Speaker 1: Seth!
• 1:33
  Speaker 3: Hello, guys. Thanks for having me back.
• 1:34
  Speaker 1: I'm honored. Welcome back.
• 1:36
  Speaker 3: To have me back a second time.
• 1:37
  Speaker 4: I know.
• 1:37
  Speaker 2: We loved the first episode so much. It was pretty
• 1:40
  Speaker 2: much just 45 minutes of fun and joy ripping about therapy.
• 1:44
  Speaker 2: And today, for the first time, we are going to
• 1:47
  Speaker 2: have therapy in session, where we had listeners record voice
• 1:53
  Speaker 2: notes of questions they had for a therapist, things they
• 1:56
  Speaker 2: were struggling with, and- Seth, our mighty therapist, is going
• 2:01
  Speaker 2: to answer their questions. But Ben and I are also
• 2:03
  Speaker 2: going to take a couple stabs.
• 2:05
  Speaker 3: I haven't heard these yet.
• 2:06
  Speaker 1: And look, the reason we're doing it right now is
• 2:07
  Speaker 1: next week is Men's Mental Health Awareness Month. And I
• 2:11
  Speaker 1: think obviously like we're two guys who are in therapy
• 2:13
  Speaker 1: and it's also important for other guys to know that
• 2:16
  Speaker 1: what you're going through is probably not unique to you.
• 2:19
  Speaker 1: Everyone has been through what you're going through. So this
• 2:21
  Speaker 1: episode is all guys, all guys together. who are sharing
• 2:24
  Speaker 1: things that they need advice on that they're struggling with.
• 2:26
  Speaker 1: And we hope that you, I don't know, just feel
• 2:29
  Speaker 1: a little bit more comfortable in knowing that it's okay
• 2:32
  Speaker 1: if it's not okay. Yeah.
• 2:33
  Speaker 2: I also feel like so often therapy is amazing. And
• 2:37
  Speaker 2: I think in a lot of ways, friendships can be
• 2:39
  Speaker 2: like therapy, not therapy, but they can be like therapy
• 2:42
  Speaker 2: because so much of therapy is actually sharing and being
• 2:46
  Speaker 2: open and vulnerable. Part of the healing, part of it
• 2:48
  Speaker 2: happens when you stop holding all the shit that you're
• 2:52
  Speaker 2: going through inside and And you start to actually let
• 2:55
  Speaker 2: it out.
• 2:55
  Speaker 3: Absolutely.
• 2:55
  Speaker 5: There's something to be said for just being able to
• 2:58
  Speaker 5: share your story out loud.
• 3:00
  Speaker 6: Yeah.
• 3:00
  Speaker 5: Even without a solution. Yeah, just saying it. Yeah, I
• 3:03
  Speaker 5: totally agree.
• 3:04
  Speaker 1: So we have memos and all of them are anonymous.
• 3:08
  Speaker 1: Everyone submitted and we don't know who is who. We also,
• 3:13
  Speaker 1: by request and because we thought it better, we changed
• 3:15
  Speaker 1: the voices of all of them. So we don't know
• 3:17
  Speaker 1: who it is. You'll never know who it is. So
• 3:19
  Speaker 1: if you want to submit your question. Go to freetherapypod.com
• 3:23
  Speaker 1: slash questions. And then we will get it on the
• 3:27
  Speaker 1: next episode when we do this.
• 3:29
  Speaker 5: Yalla.
• 3:30
  Speaker 3: All right.
• 3:30
  Speaker 2: Here we go.
• 3:31
  Speaker 6: Okay.
• 3:32
  Speaker 2: We got a 33-year-old in Los Angeles.
• 3:34
  Speaker 6: Okay.
• 3:36
  Speaker 1: What's up, guys?
• 3:37
  Speaker 7: So I'm currently in bed with my ex. We dated
• 3:41
  Speaker 7: for about six months. And a year later, I reached
• 3:46
  Speaker 7: back out to her to grab coffee and catch up.
• 3:51
  Speaker 7: things led one thing led to another and we started
• 3:56
  Speaker 7: hooking up again. And I am not sure if this
• 4:01
  Speaker 7: is a good idea for us because my heart still
• 4:05
  Speaker 7: misses being with her, but both of us know that
• 4:12
  Speaker 7: we're not compatible because we got in a lot of
• 4:17
  Speaker 7: long arguments over little things. And we just couldn't resolve
• 4:25
  Speaker 7: the conflicts. We were on just such different pages. So
• 4:31
  Speaker 7: is this a bad idea? Should we be doing this
• 4:34
  Speaker 7: or not?
• 4:34
  Speaker 1: Thanks, guys.
• 4:37
  Speaker 3: He just called from bed with his ex.
• 4:40
  Speaker 2: I imagine him in bed with the ex talking about
• 4:43
  Speaker 2: this thing.
• 4:43
  Speaker 1: But that means they both probably want to work it out. Absolutely.
• 4:47
  Speaker 2: Or they both know it's not going to work out.
• 4:49
  Speaker 1: No, I fucking think That if two, I'm just going
• 4:51
  Speaker 1: to speak, but I'm not a therapist. I think if
• 4:54
  Speaker 1: two people want it enough and you can figure out
• 4:58
  Speaker 1: how to do conflict resolution and you can actually sit
• 5:02
  Speaker 1: and listen and be with someone else's discomfort without trying
• 5:08
  Speaker 1: to fix it. And you recognize that compatibility is not everything. Man, like,
• 5:14
  Speaker 1: I don't know. Therapy is magic, isn't it?
• 5:17
  Speaker 5: Therapy is magic if two people are able and willing
• 5:21
  Speaker 5: to be able to do the work that it takes
• 5:22
  Speaker 5: and to accept certain differences in relationships. Therapy is not
• 5:26
  Speaker 5: magic in the sense that it's going to change who
• 5:28
  Speaker 5: a person is who doesn't want to be changed or
• 5:31
  Speaker 5: it's going to offer them something magical when they have.
• 5:34
  Speaker 5: hard nose about certain things that they don't like, but
• 5:36
  Speaker 5: accept differences.
• 5:37
  Speaker 2: So there might be, if they're small, he said small things,
• 5:41
  Speaker 2: but if they just have challenges with how they communicate
• 5:43
  Speaker 2: and relate.
• 5:44
  Speaker 5: They are, they are perfect candidates for couples therapy. The
• 5:47
  Speaker 5: idea that the two of them didn't do it in
• 5:49
  Speaker 5: the first place is such a shame. So the two
• 5:52
  Speaker 5: of them are together. They're laying in bed together. He
• 5:54
  Speaker 5: saw this thing and wanted to ask a question with
• 5:56
  Speaker 5: her next to him. So he's also communicating to her.
• 5:59
  Speaker 5: I want this to work.
• 5:59
  Speaker 3: I'm scared.
• 6:00
  Speaker 2: It's amazing.
• 6:01
  Speaker 5: And I don't know if we're making a mistake. So
• 6:03
  Speaker 5: they are perfect candidates for couples there.
• 6:06
  Speaker 1: If you, you might as well just try.
• 6:07
  Speaker 3: Of course. Why wouldn't you try?
• 6:09
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 6:09
  Speaker 2: You know, when is it the right time to say
• 6:12
  Speaker 2: we should do couples therapy?
• 6:15
  Speaker 5: I think early on in a relationship before things get complicated,
• 6:19
  Speaker 5: before things get so heavy, before the crisis, you start
• 6:22
  Speaker 5: to do some work because there's so much you can
• 6:24
  Speaker 5: learn in communication that people don't really do until there's
• 6:27
  Speaker 5: a bad crisis. We tend to ignore those things. We
• 6:30
  Speaker 5: put them to the side. We get irritated. We never
• 6:32
  Speaker 5: learn how to manage it. And so we keep having
• 6:34
  Speaker 5: the same kinds of arguments, even if they're not about
• 6:36
  Speaker 5: the same thing. There's a communication style maybe that keeps
• 6:39
  Speaker 5: repeating itself. And so therapy can be very healthy early on.
• 6:42
  Speaker 2: How do you bring up doing couples therapy without making
• 6:45
  Speaker 2: it feel like some, I don't like this relationship and
• 6:49
  Speaker 2: something's wrong and that we need to fix?
• 6:51
  Speaker 5: Well, when couples therapy is only used in a crisis,
• 6:54
  Speaker 5: then the way it's viewed is we're going to couples
• 6:56
  Speaker 5: therapy because we're a mess and this is a problem
• 6:58
  Speaker 5: and we're on the verge of divorce or on the verge.
• 7:00
  Speaker 3: Of breaking up.
• 7:01
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 7:02
  Speaker 5: And the truth is, if you look at couples therapy
• 7:04
  Speaker 5: the way you look at anything in bettering yourself, you're saying,
• 7:07
  Speaker 5: I love this relationship. I really appreciate being with you.
• 7:10
  Speaker 5: And I want to make this as strong as possible.
• 7:12
  Speaker 5: I want to make this work. I want to really
• 7:14
  Speaker 5: hone this time with an N. I want to hone
• 7:17
  Speaker 5: certain things in us so we can get better at communicating.
• 7:21
  Speaker 5: I want to be able to figure out how to
• 7:23
  Speaker 5: fix our communication issues. I want to be able to
• 7:25
  Speaker 5: talk about some things I think we're not doing a
• 7:26
  Speaker 5: great job at, but that we could do better. And
• 7:29
  Speaker 5: so I want to work with someone else to help
• 7:30
  Speaker 5: us make us better because I want this long-term.
• 7:33
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Amazing. Amazing. Yeah. I think, man, I have like
• 7:36
  Speaker 1: crazy hope for this couple. Like I have a weird
• 7:39
  Speaker 1: feeling because how he described it did not feel like
• 7:43
  Speaker 1: it wasn't going to work out. Oh, we would argue
• 7:45
  Speaker 1: about small things. He would say, oh, six months later,
• 7:48
  Speaker 1: I reached out and now we're in bed. Oh, she's listening.
• 7:51
  Speaker 1: Like there's so much desire. And I was, I don't know,
• 7:54
  Speaker 1: like Esther Perel and Gottman all say that not being
• 7:58
  Speaker 1: compatible is actually not a problem in a relationship.
• 8:02
  Speaker 5: No, compatibility isn't the only factor in what makes a
• 8:05
  Speaker 5: relationship work.
• 8:06
  Speaker 4: Yeah.
• 8:06
  Speaker 5: People are, I think, deluded in this belief that there
• 8:09
  Speaker 5: is some one person for them who is perfect. and
• 8:13
  Speaker 5: fills all their needs, and it's a ridiculous concept. It's
• 8:18
  Speaker 5: just not possible. There is not one person who fills
• 8:20
  Speaker 5: every need. There's not one person who's perfect. There's not
• 8:22
  Speaker 5: one person who's exactly like you, and even that person
• 8:25
  Speaker 5: probably wouldn't be a great fit for you regardless. The
• 8:27
  Speaker 5: question is, are you two willing to be able to
• 8:29
  Speaker 5: do the work, to accept each other for who they are,
• 8:33
  Speaker 5: even appreciate the differences between the two of you and
• 8:36
  Speaker 5: that there's care and there's respect and there's wanting to
• 8:38
  Speaker 5: make this work, like a real effort to want to
• 8:40
  Speaker 5: make this work. So yes, as funny as it is,
• 8:42
  Speaker 5: is that he called her from the bed, right? I mean,
• 8:45
  Speaker 5: he called us to say, hey, I'm laying in bed
• 8:47
  Speaker 5: with my ex.
• 8:48
  Speaker 1: I bet you that sex was really good right after
• 8:49
  Speaker 1: he called.
• 8:50
  Speaker 3: There's no way. He's like, oh, see, I assumed it
• 8:53
  Speaker 3: was a post-coital call. That's what I'm saying.
• 8:56
  Speaker 1: No, it's post-coital for sure. Yeah, yeah. 100% at sex.
• 8:59
  Speaker 1: He's like, baby. We've got to figure this out.
• 9:01
  Speaker 5: Yes.
• 9:02
  Speaker 3: Yes.
• 9:02
  Speaker 2: I just agree with you though.
• 9:04
  Speaker 1: Great. Go.
• 9:04
  Speaker 2: I don't think I, what it sounded like to me
• 9:08
  Speaker 2: is that he's actually saying we had this great fling
• 9:14
  Speaker 2: relationship and it was not working. I was clear on
• 9:18
  Speaker 2: that and we ended it. And then a year later
• 9:21
  Speaker 2: I was alone and I needed some connection and I
• 9:24
  Speaker 2: reached out to get coffee with her and now we're
• 9:27
  Speaker 2: hooking up again and the sex is great. I get
• 9:29
  Speaker 2: that you want the connection. Like it feels really good
• 9:33
  Speaker 2: when you're alone to have a connection that feels like home,
• 9:37
  Speaker 2: that feels familiar, that gives you a bit of that self-worth,
• 9:41
  Speaker 2: that gives you a bit of that affirmation, validation. But
• 9:45
  Speaker 2: if he's done it and he's done the work to
• 9:48
  Speaker 2: see if, is this the right person or not?
• 9:50
  Speaker 5: We have no way of knowing if he's done the work.
• 9:52
  Speaker 5: So you're right in terms of there's a familiarity where
• 9:55
  Speaker 5: we go back to a thing that makes us comfortable
• 9:58
  Speaker 5: The sex was good.
• 9:58
  Speaker 3: There's some connection they had. but it's short-lived.
• 10:01
  Speaker 5: And there's a realization that as soon as they start
• 10:03
  Speaker 5: hanging out, they're fighting all the time again, that they
• 10:05
  Speaker 5: don't like aspects of each other and they're not even
• 10:06
  Speaker 5: willing to change those things or to be able to
• 10:09
  Speaker 5: try to accept those things in each other.
• 10:11
  Speaker 3: Quite possible. We have no way of knowing. There's just
• 10:13
  Speaker 3: not enough.
• 10:13
  Speaker 2: But if he was saying, this is a new person
• 10:18
  Speaker 2: I'm with. She's incredible. I used to have these problems.
• 10:22
  Speaker 2: We used to argue all the time, but now it's
• 10:24
  Speaker 2: just amazing.
• 10:24
  Speaker 3: I'd be like, okay, cool.
• 10:25
  Speaker 2: That's great. He's changed. She's changed. There's something new. He's
• 10:29
  Speaker 2: just saying we have problems, but we're having a great time.
• 10:34
  Speaker 5: But he's saying we have problems and we're not sure
• 10:36
  Speaker 5: what to do. And he's saying we had small arguments
• 10:38
  Speaker 5: over and over. It sounds like he has a lot
• 10:40
  Speaker 5: of work to do.
• 10:41
  Speaker 1: All right.
• 10:41
  Speaker 2: Give us an update in six months.
• 10:43
  Speaker 1: Please.
• 10:44
  Speaker 3: We'll see if they're both willing to do it.
• 10:46
  Speaker 1: Thanks for that vulnerability, though. That was great. I'd love
• 10:48
  Speaker 1: to hear her.
• 10:49
  Speaker 5: I was hoping she was going to chime in.
• 10:53
  Speaker 2: All right. We have a 35-year-old male from the Midwest.
• 10:57
  Speaker 6: Currently figuring out a career pivot, figuring out, okay, I
• 11:03
  Speaker 6: subscribe to the school thought of keep hustling, work hard,
• 11:07
  Speaker 6: don't give up. The next best thing is your achievements
• 11:10
  Speaker 6: are right on the other side of that horrible, sad,
• 11:13
  Speaker 6: stressful night. And there's going to be light at the
• 11:16
  Speaker 6: end of the tunnel. If you just keep pushing through,
• 11:17
  Speaker 6: don't give up. But on the other side, it's like, hey,
• 11:20
  Speaker 6: you know, maybe you've tried something long enough. You want
• 11:22
  Speaker 6: to quit while you're ahead and pivot to something new,
• 11:24
  Speaker 6: a new career, new role. And that's what I'm facing
• 11:27
  Speaker 6: right now, where I am hoping to find more income
• 11:33
  Speaker 6: and happiness and freedom in a new entire industry and career.
• 11:39
  Speaker 6: But it's starting over and it's scary. And I would
• 11:42
  Speaker 6: love any any guidance on how to get.
• 11:45
  Speaker 1: Over those feelings.
• 11:47
  Speaker 6: Thank you for listening.
• 11:50
  Speaker 2: So real, huh?
• 11:51
  Speaker 1: Right. I relate. It's funny. Cause like, you know, living
• 11:55
  Speaker 1: in this culture as a man, there is a sense
• 11:57
  Speaker 1: of like having to provide and work really hard and
• 11:59
  Speaker 1: make a lot of money and be like, I need
• 12:01
  Speaker 1: to have it. And if I do it, then I'll
• 12:03
  Speaker 1: feel better. Cause you know, you need so much. And
• 12:06
  Speaker 1: I think what I'm hearing is like, it's like pressure.
• 12:09
  Speaker 1: And he's like, maybe he's not enjoying what he's doing.
• 12:12
  Speaker 1: And he wants to try something else. But giving up
• 12:14
  Speaker 1: on something you've been working so hard for and knowing
• 12:16
  Speaker 1: if it's the right move to switch is like really hard.
• 12:19
  Speaker 7: Totally.
• 12:20
  Speaker 2: How do you relate?
• 12:20
  Speaker 5: He mentioned hustle culture. I mean, I think that's also
• 12:23
  Speaker 5: been so influential probably in terms of the way he
• 12:24
  Speaker 5: looks at work and feelings of guilt that he's not
• 12:27
  Speaker 5: working hard enough or seeing people online do things that
• 12:31
  Speaker 5: he thinks he's incapable of doing. In terms of shifting careers,
• 12:35
  Speaker 5: I actually think that ultimately if it comes from the
• 12:37
  Speaker 5: healthiest place, which is Not about how others see you,
• 12:40
  Speaker 5: but about what you're actually getting joy out of, which
• 12:42
  Speaker 5: maybe is where he is right now, which is a
• 12:44
  Speaker 5: realization that he's just not happy with what he's doing.
• 12:47
  Speaker 5: And there's a huge fear in making a leap like that.
• 12:50
  Speaker 5: And I relate in the sense that I did something similar.
• 12:53
  Speaker 5: My psychology degree was an undergrad degree that I didn't
• 12:56
  Speaker 5: use for over 15 years.
• 12:58
  Speaker 3: I was out here. I was acting.
• 12:59
  Speaker 1: I was writing.
• 13:00
  Speaker 5: I was in a whole other industry. There was a
• 13:02
  Speaker 5: point when I had my own show at Starz when
• 13:04
  Speaker 5: I was thinking, I wonder if I could be a
• 13:05
  Speaker 5: therapist at night. And I realized, oh, I really miss
• 13:09
  Speaker 5: this thing that I really want to do.
• 13:11
  Speaker 1: And I was scared.
• 13:11
  Speaker 3: I was really scared to do it.
• 13:13
  Speaker 5: And the way I handled that was I went and
• 13:16
  Speaker 5: found a grad.
• 13:17
  Speaker 1: School that was closest to my house.
• 13:19
  Speaker 3: That's how I chose the school. And they asked why
• 13:20
  Speaker 3: I chose.
• 13:21
  Speaker 1: I said proximity.
• 13:23
  Speaker 5: And I jumped into another career by just sticking one
• 13:25
  Speaker 5: foot in front of the other. I could not think
• 13:27
  Speaker 5: about how much of a heavy lift this was, that
• 13:31
  Speaker 5: how many years of work it was going to be,
• 13:33
  Speaker 5: what grad school would be like.
• 13:34
  Speaker 1: I had two kids.
• 13:35
  Speaker 5: Little kids in diapers at the time when I was
• 13:37
  Speaker 5: doing it. But as a result of me doing it,
• 13:39
  Speaker 5: I ended up realizing I love what I'm doing. I
• 13:41
  Speaker 5: was so happy. I went into grad school. I booked
• 13:44
  Speaker 5: a movie that I turned down. I never turned down
• 13:46
  Speaker 5: work in my life. I was begging to work as
• 13:49
  Speaker 5: any actor is, right? Especially when you're struggling and you're
• 13:52
  Speaker 5: barely making a living. I realized that I was so
• 13:55
  Speaker 5: happy with what I was doing that I was putting
• 13:56
  Speaker 5: my head down. I was going to work as hard
• 13:58
  Speaker 5: as I could to become a therapist as soon as possible.
• 14:01
  Speaker 5: And so I ended up building an entire other career
• 14:03
  Speaker 5: and I could not be happier. I feel so lucky
• 14:06
  Speaker 5: to have done what I did.
• 14:07
  Speaker 1: You know, in today's culture, like just work harder. It'll happen.
• 14:10
  Speaker 1: Work harder. It'll happen.
• 14:11
  Speaker 7: Right.
• 14:12
  Speaker 1: But at what point do you say, you know what?
• 14:14
  Speaker 1: I think I've worked hard enough or I'm, this isn't
• 14:17
  Speaker 1: really serving me anymore. Do I just stick it out
• 14:20
  Speaker 1: a little bit longer or do I make the change?
• 14:22
  Speaker 1: And I can hear in the voice of like, how
• 14:24
  Speaker 1: am I going to make this change? I put my
• 14:26
  Speaker 1: whole entire life into one thing and I haven't gotten
• 14:30
  Speaker 1: what I want out of it yet. Is it keep going?
• 14:34
  Speaker 1: Or is it, man, just try something else? Maybe he'll
• 14:36
  Speaker 1: feel like a failure. You can tell yourself that. And
• 14:39
  Speaker 1: I don't know. I mean, what would you say to that?
• 14:43
  Speaker 5: I would say you're speaking to a sunk cost fallacy,
• 14:45
  Speaker 5: which is this idea that we've put in so much
• 14:47
  Speaker 5: time and effort into a thing, therefore I need to
• 14:49
  Speaker 5: keep doing it without being honest about how it's not
• 14:53
  Speaker 5: paying the dividends that it should be paying. You're not
• 14:55
  Speaker 5: feeling good about the work you're doing. You're not making
• 14:57
  Speaker 5: the money you want to be making. And clearly this
• 14:59
  Speaker 5: guy isn't feeling just good about himself and his purpose.
• 15:01
  Speaker 5: And he's thinking about something else. I'm sure some is
• 15:03
  Speaker 5: financial and some is just the feeling that like his
• 15:06
  Speaker 5: life isn't going the way he expected it to. But
• 15:08
  Speaker 5: you're so frightened to do it because you believe that
• 15:10
  Speaker 5: because you put in so much effort, therefore you should
• 15:12
  Speaker 5: keep doing it. It's why I think he speaks of
• 15:14
  Speaker 5: drive and hustle culture. And that keeps getting reinforced to
• 15:17
  Speaker 5: you in a way where you think, I guess I
• 15:19
  Speaker 5: can't give up. Giving up is a failure of some kind.
• 15:21
  Speaker 5: When it's not, it's a pivot, a healthy pivot.
• 15:23
  Speaker 1: And I think my gut tells me, and I relate
• 15:26
  Speaker 1: to this, is if you're good at one thing and
• 15:27
  Speaker 1: you work your ass off and it doesn't work out
• 15:28
  Speaker 1: the way you want to, the next thing you'll be
• 15:30
  Speaker 1: as good at because it's not what you're doing, it's
• 15:32
  Speaker 1: who you are while you're doing it. And I think
• 15:34
  Speaker 1: if you're somebody like me, I've had so many jobs
• 15:37
  Speaker 1: for a year or two years or three years at
• 15:38
  Speaker 1: a time. And I'm like, I quit or got fired
• 15:42
  Speaker 1: or something happened. And the next thing I was like
• 15:44
  Speaker 1: worried it wasn't gonna be as good. And it was
• 15:45
  Speaker 1: great because I just busted my balls like I've always done.
• 15:48
  Speaker 1: And I think if you're the kind of person that
• 15:49
  Speaker 1: trusts yourself then who cares what it is, right?
• 15:53
  Speaker 7: Yeah.
• 15:54
  Speaker 1: All right, next one.
• 15:55
  Speaker 2: Here's a 40-year-old from England.
• 15:58
  Speaker 4: So my question is about the world of romance. I
• 16:01
  Speaker 4: do a lot of personal development. I feel like I've
• 16:03
  Speaker 4: come a long way over the years and I have
• 16:05
  Speaker 4: much more self-love for myself and my boundaries are a
• 16:07
  Speaker 4: lot better and I'm realizing my self-worth, et cetera, et cetera. However,
• 16:11
  Speaker 4: whenever there is a romantic pursuit in my life, I
• 16:15
  Speaker 4: tend to fall quite quickly into And all these other
• 16:19
  Speaker 4: aspects of my life, which I feel very strongly in,
• 16:21
  Speaker 4: they sort of go away. And I fall into this
• 16:24
  Speaker 4: space of desperation and chasing and needing validation externally. So
• 16:31
  Speaker 4: it's like all the work I do suddenly just disappears
• 16:33
  Speaker 4: whenever romance shows its face.
• 16:36
  Speaker 2: So real.
• 16:37
  Speaker 1: Literally the most relatable thing I think I've ever heard.
• 16:40
  Speaker 5: All right.
• 16:40
  Speaker 1: That's just like real. It's very real.
• 16:42
  Speaker 5: So what he's discovering is that we are not the
• 16:46
  Speaker 5: same in every scenario. That the way we behave or
• 16:49
  Speaker 5: the things that trigger us or even you've probably heard
• 16:51
  Speaker 5: people discuss attachment styles. This assumption that that attachment style
• 16:55
  Speaker 5: is fixed and you are only that way in all situations.
• 16:58
  Speaker 5: And the truth is he's functioning well in other areas.
• 17:00
  Speaker 5: But there's something that happens in a relationship that triggers
• 17:04
  Speaker 5: some very early stuff for him that makes him feel
• 17:06
  Speaker 5: anxious in that relationship.
• 17:08
  Speaker 3: It's the early stuff. That's right.
• 17:10
  Speaker 5: And so for him, the anxious attachment is just playing
• 17:12
  Speaker 5: out in these romantic relationships where he suddenly feels like
• 17:15
  Speaker 5: a kid again.
• 17:16
  Speaker 7: Yeah.
• 17:16
  Speaker 5: Where he's not functioning the way he does in other
• 17:18
  Speaker 5: areas and it's throwing him.
• 17:19
  Speaker 7: Yeah.
• 17:20
  Speaker 2: So many people experience this where they just, they're like,
• 17:22
  Speaker 2: I'm good. I'm going to the gym every day. I'm meditating.
• 17:26
  Speaker 2: Like I'm living my life. I'm happy. I feel good.
• 17:28
  Speaker 2: You get into a relationship and you start to just
• 17:30
  Speaker 2: spiral down this hole. The neediness is something that I
• 17:33
  Speaker 2: really found.
• 17:34
  Speaker 1: But I think it's even early. It's right when you
• 17:36
  Speaker 1: meet that girl, everything drops to the wayside and her
• 17:39
  Speaker 1: validation is the thing you need the most. Because in
• 17:42
  Speaker 1: that moment you say, if I just get her, Everything
• 17:45
  Speaker 1: will work out.
• 17:46
  Speaker 2: I'll be enough.
• 17:46
  Speaker 1: I'll be enough. And you completely shift everything you've learned
• 17:50
  Speaker 1: because of that anxious attachment. And I remember feeling that
• 17:55
  Speaker 1: all the time and going absolutely stir crazy.
• 17:58
  Speaker 4: Yeah, you would.
• 17:59
  Speaker 1: I would.
• 17:59
  Speaker 3: Absolutely.
• 18:00
  Speaker 1: You'd go fucking nuts. Because I felt like the relationship,
• 18:07
  Speaker 1: getting that relationship would mean I was good enough. I
• 18:10
  Speaker 1: was complete. People would look at me a certain way.
• 18:12
  Speaker 5: So think about this idea that someone else is going
• 18:14
  Speaker 5: to fill that need for you, that you are going
• 18:17
  Speaker 5: to be good enough because someone else sees you, because
• 18:19
  Speaker 5: someone else wants you.
• 18:20
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 18:21
  Speaker 2: This is the biggest thing I think for so many
• 18:23
  Speaker 2: people is the feeling they're not enough. And so they
• 18:25
  Speaker 2: receive the validation externally in this situation in relationship.
• 18:29
  Speaker 5: Right. So if I feel I'm not enough and I
• 18:31
  Speaker 5: only look for that externally, the only way that I
• 18:33
  Speaker 5: can feel like enough is someone shines their light on
• 18:35
  Speaker 5: me and then I'm enough.
• 18:37
  Speaker 1: How do you maintain equanimity and calmness when you're trying
• 18:41
  Speaker 1: to be with that girl early on instead of letting
• 18:44
  Speaker 1: it consume you? Like, does he, is it an awareness?
• 18:47
  Speaker 1: Is it a slowing down? Like, how do you, you
• 18:49
  Speaker 1: have to work through it with in a relationship. You
• 18:51
  Speaker 1: can't do it on your own.
• 18:52
  Speaker 3: You cannot.
• 18:52
  Speaker 5: And so awareness and slowing down are two great things.
• 18:55
  Speaker 5: And anyone that I see in my office when they
• 18:57
  Speaker 5: are dating. And for example, if, if you were struggling
• 19:00
  Speaker 5: and you notice that every time you go on dates,
• 19:02
  Speaker 5: you start to look for this thing right away and
• 19:04
  Speaker 5: everything else goes by the wayside. I say, bring your
• 19:06
  Speaker 5: dates in here, right? I'm going to date this person
• 19:08
  Speaker 5: with you, Ben. We're going to date her together. And
• 19:11
  Speaker 5: we're going to pay attention each week to how you're
• 19:12
  Speaker 5: feeling and what's going on and what's happening. And you'll
• 19:15
  Speaker 5: discover certain things. One is you might discover that the
• 19:18
  Speaker 5: kind of person you date tends to be avoidant. And
• 19:21
  Speaker 5: so that's actually flaring up your anxious attachment in a
• 19:24
  Speaker 5: way that feels familiar to you, even if it doesn't
• 19:26
  Speaker 5: feel good. And maybe you'll realize, oh, I keep dating
• 19:28
  Speaker 5: a person like this. The kind of person I'm attracted to,
• 19:31
  Speaker 5: the thing I'm looking for is someone that actually creates
• 19:33
  Speaker 5: that in me. Or you're dating someone who has secure
• 19:36
  Speaker 5: attachment and they are healthy, but you're not. You're feeling insecure,
• 19:40
  Speaker 5: you're feeling anxious, even when she's not doing anything that
• 19:42
  Speaker 5: should make you feel that way, it's disproportionate to what's happening.
• 19:45
  Speaker 5: And so therefore then in therapy, you can start to
• 19:48
  Speaker 5: make sense of what you're feeling, learn how to slow
• 19:50
  Speaker 5: it down and make sense of it. If I'm having
• 19:52
  Speaker 5: a feeling that's so big, disproportionate to what's going on,
• 19:55
  Speaker 5: I need to make sense of what that is. And
• 19:57
  Speaker 5: then in therapy, you would start to learn about why
• 19:59
  Speaker 5: you feel that way, what in your childhood may have
• 20:01
  Speaker 5: even caused these kinds of feelings, why you would feel anxious,
• 20:04
  Speaker 5: where your needs weren't met as a kid and how
• 20:06
  Speaker 5: you're still looking for them now and how that's playing
• 20:08
  Speaker 5: out in relationships. And then how you are damaging other
• 20:12
  Speaker 5: parts of your life because that relationship then, as you said,
• 20:16
  Speaker 5: takes precedence over everything. That for you, the relationship then
• 20:19
  Speaker 5: had you not working hard or maybe not nurturing friendships anymore,
• 20:23
  Speaker 5: that it becomes your everything. It becomes your guiding star.
• 20:25
  Speaker 5: That this thing will fix me. And that thing is
• 20:28
  Speaker 5: not going to fix you. You're going to fix you.
• 20:30
  Speaker 1: It never does.
• 20:32
  Speaker 2: It's good.
• 20:32
  Speaker 1: It's really good.
• 20:33
  Speaker 2: So important. We got a 36 year old from the
• 20:51
  Speaker 2: Bay area here.
• 20:52
  Speaker 8: Oh, wise therapist. I am struggling with the fact that
• 21:00
  Speaker 8: finance can sometimes get in my head or in the
• 21:03
  Speaker 8: way of, uh, relationships. I date women. I love taking
• 21:09
  Speaker 8: care of a woman, treating her well, paying for the dates.
• 21:13
  Speaker 8: And then at some point I'm like, okay, great. Does
• 21:16
  Speaker 8: this woman want to show me her care and affection?
• 21:19
  Speaker 8: And her investment in this relationship with her dollar. Is
• 21:23
  Speaker 8: that rude of me to think? Is that unmanly of
• 21:26
  Speaker 8: me to ask for? Is that going to make her
• 21:29
  Speaker 8: feel like she is masculine in this role and I'm
• 21:32
  Speaker 8: emasculated and that turns off the attention and affection? That
• 21:37
  Speaker 8: has happened to me in the past. So it's become
• 21:40
  Speaker 8: a trigger for me when a woman is not offering
• 21:44
  Speaker 8: up to pay for anything at all. And I'm continually...
• 21:49
  Speaker 8: paying for everything and essentially becoming a sponsor for this woman, which,
• 21:52
  Speaker 8: you know, didn't really sign up for. So struggling with that,
• 21:56
  Speaker 8: how to be a man in court and lead the
• 21:59
  Speaker 8: way and pay for things without going too overboard and
• 22:06
  Speaker 8: spending all the money in a relationship.
• 22:10
  Speaker 1: I mean, I have, I think I get that. That's
• 22:13
  Speaker 1: like every guy struggles with that.
• 22:14
  Speaker 2: It's such a common conversation with guy friends.
• 22:16
  Speaker 1: How much do you pay? Have you spent on a date?
• 22:18
  Speaker 1: When does she... Here's my thing. Here's my thing. I
• 22:20
  Speaker 1: get it like it's hard. I think, girls, you might
• 22:23
  Speaker 1: fucking hate me for this. I know we live in
• 22:25
  Speaker 1: Los Angeles and yada, yada, yada, and you want to dream.
• 22:28
  Speaker 1: If you don't offer to pay for anything by the
• 22:31
  Speaker 1: third or fourth date, you're not it. Pay for fucking dessert.
• 22:36
  Speaker 1: Pay for bringing the guy something. If he's going to
• 22:39
  Speaker 1: spend $ 500, $ 600, $ 700 in the first two or three dates...
• 22:44
  Speaker 1: Offer a movie ticket. Just 20 bucks. We're not going
• 22:49
  Speaker 1: to ask you to pay a lot in the first
• 22:51
  Speaker 1: couple months.
• 22:52
  Speaker 3: Just offer.
• 22:55
  Speaker 1: Do something.
• 22:56
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I think what he's really talking about is more
• 22:58
  Speaker 2: of an energetic thing. It sounds like. He's not saying
• 23:00
  Speaker 2: I don't have money and she needs to pay for
• 23:04
  Speaker 2: half of the dates we go on in life. He's
• 23:07
  Speaker 2: saying I want to feel like she's energetically offering something.
• 23:14
  Speaker 2: that she's energetically wanting to contribute. And I can relate
• 23:18
  Speaker 2: to that in the sense that sometimes like, I like
• 23:20
  Speaker 2: it when a girl goes, takes out her wallet at
• 23:21
  Speaker 2: dinner and I go, no, no, no.
• 23:22
  Speaker 1: That's what I'm saying.
• 23:23
  Speaker 2: I got it.
• 23:24
  Speaker 4: Just offer it.
• 23:24
  Speaker 2: That feels good. So that's what you're saying.
• 23:26
  Speaker 1: That's what I'm saying. Just like show that you give
• 23:28
  Speaker 1: a shit that you're not going to expect it all
• 23:30
  Speaker 1: the time.
• 23:30
  Speaker 7: Yes.
• 23:31
  Speaker 2: But there's also an interesting question of this conversation as
• 23:33
  Speaker 2: a whole. It's like when you go on, when you
• 23:36
  Speaker 2: start actually dating and you're in a relationship, it's like, well,
• 23:39
  Speaker 2: where does that go? And what is the line there? Really,
• 23:41
  Speaker 2: what are the conversations you should have, could have, With
• 23:44
  Speaker 2: your partner.
• 23:44
  Speaker 5: So what is the dynamic that you want in the relationship?
• 23:46
  Speaker 5: So he's discovering that it may not be financial in
• 23:49
  Speaker 5: terms of his inability to be able to afford paying
• 23:52
  Speaker 5: for someone else on dates. But there is a feeling
• 23:54
  Speaker 5: he's getting where he's now taking care of someone else
• 23:58
  Speaker 5: in a way that feels yucky. He doesn't want that
• 24:00
  Speaker 5: kind of hierarchy in a relationship. And he needs to
• 24:02
  Speaker 5: say something. Or discover that this just isn't the kind
• 24:05
  Speaker 5: of relationship for him. That he's dating the kind of
• 24:07
  Speaker 5: women who want to be taken care of that way.
• 24:09
  Speaker 5: And if that's the dynamic they both want, great. But
• 24:12
  Speaker 5: if it's not and it's clearly not what he wants,
• 24:14
  Speaker 5: then there's a conversation not being had that should be had.
• 24:16
  Speaker 2: How do you have that conversation without losing the masculine
• 24:21
  Speaker 2: energy that comes with supporting, taking care and providing for?
• 24:25
  Speaker 1: When do you have it?
• 24:26
  Speaker 3: Well, it's interesting.
• 24:26
  Speaker 5: Why is there a lack of masculine energy in having
• 24:30
  Speaker 5: an expectation that? someone should also think about you and
• 24:34
  Speaker 5: the way in which you move through the world and
• 24:35
  Speaker 5: your own finances or them being thoughtful enough to say,
• 24:39
  Speaker 5: let me get the concert tickets this time, or let
• 24:41
  Speaker 5: me pay for dinner.
• 24:41
  Speaker 3: You've been paying for every date for the last month.
• 24:44
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Why? Why? Yeah.
• 24:45
  Speaker 2: There is something about that. I think that men think
• 24:48
  Speaker 2: their worth and value comes from providing.
• 24:51
  Speaker 1: Well, you, you do too.
• 24:52
  Speaker 2: I can relate to that to me that I relate
• 24:54
  Speaker 2: to that. I say that for myself. I'm using the
• 24:55
  Speaker 2: men as me, like that. I think that, subconsciously, unconsciously,
• 25:01
  Speaker 2: somewhere in there that my worth and value in the relationship,
• 25:04
  Speaker 2: part of it comes from me providing, me supporting in
• 25:07
  Speaker 2: these ways. I agree with you. It'd be great if
• 25:10
  Speaker 2: I could have those conversations and even accept, sometimes my
• 25:14
  Speaker 2: girlfriend will offer and I'll go, no, no, no, I
• 25:16
  Speaker 2: got it. But it would be kind of nice for
• 25:19
  Speaker 2: her to contribute in those little ways, again, energetically more
• 25:22
  Speaker 2: than it is financially.
• 25:23
  Speaker 5: Well, then understand what you want, right? You're saying that
• 25:26
  Speaker 5: You have a feeling that men should be providers and
• 25:30
  Speaker 5: that you don't want to lose that and you know
• 25:31
  Speaker 5: that it's important for women or you think it's important
• 25:33
  Speaker 5: for women and important for you. And also you would
• 25:37
  Speaker 5: like a woman to offer to pay.
• 25:39
  Speaker 4: Why?
• 25:39
  Speaker 1: I think the issue is that guys think that if
• 25:45
  Speaker 1: you provide, you'll feel better about yourself because you can
• 25:49
  Speaker 1: compare yourself to other guys in society. I have enough.
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: It is a dick measuring competition, right? Mm-hmm. And I
• 25:54
  Speaker 1: think the second thing is that we think providing is
• 25:56
  Speaker 1: only financial, which is bullshit. You can pick her up.
• 25:59
  Speaker 1: You can buy her flowers. You can run, do an
• 26:02
  Speaker 1: errand for her. You can open the door for her, right?
• 26:04
  Speaker 1: Like we're putting the provider and the masculinity in one
• 26:07
  Speaker 1: area that society deems as like, I'm the man, but like,
• 26:10
  Speaker 1: I get it. It's definitely the main thing, but I
• 26:13
  Speaker 1: believe you can be a provider in 10 other ways,
• 26:17
  Speaker 1: have a conversation with your partner and she will feel,
• 26:20
  Speaker 1: you will feel completely manly For lack of better terms.
• 26:25
  Speaker 5: If you are dating someone, and I don't mean in
• 26:27
  Speaker 5: the first few dates, you each make, I don't know,
• 26:30
  Speaker 5: $ 80, 000 a year.
• 26:30
  Speaker 3: You're both single.
• 26:32
  Speaker 5: And now you've been going out for a certain amount
• 26:34
  Speaker 5: of time and you're continually paying for everything. Do you
• 26:36
  Speaker 5: feel okay in that?
• 26:39
  Speaker 1: I think you're stressed.
• 26:41
  Speaker 2: With that amount?
• 26:42
  Speaker 1: I think you're overwhelmed. I think it inhibits the relationship
• 26:45
  Speaker 1: a little bit because now you're like in your head.
• 26:47
  Speaker 1: You're maybe feeling. Don't you think? Yeah. Yeah. I do
• 26:50
  Speaker 1: think maybe you're not performing.
• 26:52
  Speaker 5: I think I'm wondering, I'm wondering, so knowing that accepting
• 26:55
  Speaker 5: that that is a truth and not confronting that is
• 26:58
  Speaker 5: going to cause some issues and resentments.
• 27:00
  Speaker 2: So how do you, but how do you confront it?
• 27:03
  Speaker 2: If a guy's in that situation, how does he confront
• 27:06
  Speaker 2: it in a way that I know you're saying it
• 27:10
  Speaker 2: shouldn't emasculate him. I know that, that it's not inherently
• 27:12
  Speaker 2: a part of masculinity to be the one that always pays,
• 27:15
  Speaker 2: but I think implicit in this conversation is that there
• 27:18
  Speaker 2: is an expectation. Not all the time. Some women are like, no,
• 27:20
  Speaker 2: I want to pay 50-50. Some women are conscious of this.
• 27:23
  Speaker 1: Of course.
• 27:23
  Speaker 2: I don't want to create a dynamic or a hierarchy.
• 27:26
  Speaker 6: Totally.
• 27:26
  Speaker 2: And some women, not even in a bad way, are
• 27:28
  Speaker 2: just like, I love when a man takes care of me.
• 27:30
  Speaker 2: I'm going to take care of my man in different ways.
• 27:32
  Speaker 2: I love that as well.
• 27:33
  Speaker 5: Forget any judgment on what should be. What I'm saying
• 27:36
  Speaker 5: is that a relationship is a partnership. And if within
• 27:38
  Speaker 5: this partnership, you're unable to have a conversation about what
• 27:41
  Speaker 5: kind of partnership you want and what kind of relationship
• 27:44
  Speaker 5: you build.
• 27:45
  Speaker 1: Here's the thing though.
• 27:45
  Speaker 2: That's good.
• 27:46
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's great.
• 27:47
  Speaker 2: I just want you to expand on that.
• 27:49
  Speaker 1: Jump in. Well, I just think at the end of
• 27:50
  Speaker 1: the day, like that conversation shouldn't happen super early. I
• 27:53
  Speaker 1: think it should happen a little bit later. I think
• 27:54
  Speaker 1: on the first couple of days.
• 27:55
  Speaker 2: What is later to you?
• 27:55
  Speaker 1: I think if you're having it on the first three
• 27:56
  Speaker 1: or four days, it's inappropriate. I agree. I think you
• 27:58
  Speaker 1: wait two and a half months, three months. And I
• 28:00
  Speaker 1: think you, hopefully she offers to pay at some point.
• 28:03
  Speaker 1: And at three or four months, you're like, hey, I'm like,
• 28:04
  Speaker 1: I'm having a great time. I just want you to
• 28:06
  Speaker 1: know that like, Whatever that conversation is. Okay.
• 28:08
  Speaker 2: How would you have that conversation?
• 28:09
  Speaker 3: This is great.
• 28:10
  Speaker 2: Imaginary, not in your relationship. Imaginary conversation. How would you
• 28:13
  Speaker 2: have it?
• 28:13
  Speaker 1: So let's just like set the, set the framework. We're
• 28:15
  Speaker 1: four months in. We're official. We're boyfriend, girlfriend. Yeah. We're like, damn,
• 28:20
  Speaker 1: I fucking feel good. I trust you. I'm walking around
• 28:22
  Speaker 1: naked in the house. We're like it, right? We're just like,
• 28:24
  Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying? Like you're it. She's like
• 28:26
  Speaker 1: talking to your mom on speaker, whatever it is.
• 28:28
  Speaker 4: Right.
• 28:28
  Speaker 1: I'd be like, Hey babe, honestly, like I love going
• 28:33
  Speaker 1: to nice dinners and I love doing cool shit. And honestly,
• 28:37
  Speaker 1: like sometimes if we do it a lot, it gets
• 28:39
  Speaker 1: kind of expensive. Would love if you can contribute where
• 28:41
  Speaker 1: you feel good doing that.
• 28:43
  Speaker 2: I feel like a woman would pull, would have some
• 28:46
  Speaker 2: kind of response, whether she wants to or not to
• 28:50
  Speaker 2: that kind of conversation. How would you have a different?
• 28:52
  Speaker 4: Why?
• 28:53
  Speaker 2: I just think so.
• 28:54
  Speaker 1: Four months in, I love you. You're in a relationship.
• 28:57
  Speaker 1: You're naked. She knows your family. You're doing it. You're
• 29:00
  Speaker 1: paying for 85.
• 29:00
  Speaker 2: I love the situation you're creating.
• 29:02
  Speaker 1: You're paying 85, 90%.
• 29:02
  Speaker 3: I like the naked.
• 29:04
  Speaker 2: Naked is so important.
• 29:06
  Speaker 3: That is the moment when you know you're in a relationship.
• 29:08
  Speaker 2: You're comfortable being naked in the house.
• 29:09
  Speaker 5: Let me respond to this idea because I think.
• 29:11
  Speaker 1: I think you're wrong, dude. Well, hold on, hold on.
• 29:13
  Speaker 5: Before you even have this conversation, I think that there's
• 29:16
  Speaker 5: something building in you that's not being said, which means
• 29:19
  Speaker 5: that before you've said, hey, it's four months in and
• 29:21
  Speaker 5: we've been going to dinners. You've had moments where you've
• 29:23
  Speaker 5: been irritated by it. And I think those little irritations
• 29:26
  Speaker 5: haven't been brought up there. I don't think that. You know,
• 29:29
  Speaker 5: it suddenly just occurred to you in that moment that
• 29:31
  Speaker 5: you've been paying for everything that money's a bit tight. Okay.
• 29:34
  Speaker 5: And so I think there's a problem even before that
• 29:36
  Speaker 5: and you being able to talk about a feeling you have,
• 29:38
  Speaker 5: which is. I, we make, you know, whether you make
• 29:41
  Speaker 5: the same amount of money or not, I guess it's irrelevant,
• 29:43
  Speaker 5: but it makes me feel as if you are not
• 29:47
  Speaker 5: as invested or don't care when I'm paying for everything.
• 29:50
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you're feeling underappreciated maybe.
• 29:52
  Speaker 2: This is what I'm trying to hit on. It's a
• 29:53
  Speaker 2: different conversation. I feel like I'm spending all the money.
• 29:55
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 29:55
  Speaker 5: Well, I want to speak to what this guy's saying
• 29:57
  Speaker 5: because it's not a financial piece in terms of him
• 30:00
  Speaker 5: being in trouble and he's going to be underwater because
• 30:02
  Speaker 5: he's paying.
• 30:03
  Speaker 1: Well, I still think he's stressed and overwhelmed by spending
• 30:05
  Speaker 1: too much money. Maybe like job. I still think he's
• 30:09
  Speaker 1: worried about how much he's spending.
• 30:10
  Speaker 3: He might be.
• 30:10
  Speaker 5: I'm saying regardless, it's making you uncomfortable. So whether or
• 30:13
  Speaker 5: not money's an issue, it's just telling something. And so
• 30:17
  Speaker 5: if what you're feeling is uncomfortable by it, then you
• 30:19
  Speaker 5: need to say something. It doesn't matter whether you can
• 30:21
  Speaker 5: afford it or not. If you can afford it and
• 30:24
  Speaker 5: it doesn't bother you, great. If you can afford it
• 30:26
  Speaker 5: and it's starting to bother you, well, then you're not
• 30:28
  Speaker 5: bringing something up in this partnership that you're building. If
• 30:31
  Speaker 5: you can't afford it and it's bothering you, you're not
• 30:33
  Speaker 5: bringing up something in this partnership that's bothering you. It
• 30:36
  Speaker 5: is your responsibility to bring up these feelings. You are
• 30:38
  Speaker 5: now building resentment and she's unaware of it.
• 30:41
  Speaker 1: How fair is that? Yeah, not fair.
• 30:44
  Speaker 2: How I would do it differently? is instead of saying
• 30:48
  Speaker 2: like thing, I don't like when I pay, when I'm
• 30:52
  Speaker 2: always paying, it's a little too much. The nice dinners
• 30:55
  Speaker 2: are nice, but it's always too much. It's too much.
• 30:58
  Speaker 2: Like actually pointing positive and going, babe, I love when
• 31:02
  Speaker 2: you offer sometimes to pay because it makes me feel
• 31:06
  Speaker 2: like you want to treat me sometimes as much as
• 31:09
  Speaker 2: I want to treat you. I love taking care of you.
• 31:11
  Speaker 2: Like reinforcing that I love taking care of you and
• 31:13
  Speaker 2: just actually telling them what you like That to me
• 31:16
  Speaker 2: feels like a different way to do.
• 31:18
  Speaker 3: It that feels better.
• 31:19
  Speaker 5: It is a great way to reinforce things that you
• 31:22
  Speaker 5: want to have repeated. The problem is if she's someone
• 31:25
  Speaker 5: who's not doing it. So we were talking about someone
• 31:26
  Speaker 5: who's not offering. No, but I'm- Occasionally she does. You
• 31:29
  Speaker 5: have the opportunity.
• 31:30
  Speaker 2: But let's say she never does. You could say, I
• 31:33
  Speaker 2: would love if sometimes you offered. It's not a money
• 31:36
  Speaker 2: thing for me even, but it's an energetic thing. Because
• 31:40
  Speaker 2: then she has an opportunity to go, wait, why? Like
• 31:43
  Speaker 2: I thought you pay for everything. And then it opens
• 31:45
  Speaker 2: up the conversation of expectation.
• 31:48
  Speaker 1: I think it's a great idea.
• 31:48
  Speaker 2: Very differently than like, I don't like paying for you
• 31:51
  Speaker 2: all the time.
• 31:52
  Speaker 1: I think what I'm saying is I don't like it.
• 31:54
  Speaker 1: I love our dinners. I love going out. It's expensive
• 31:56
  Speaker 1: when we do it all the time. Would love for
• 31:58
  Speaker 1: you to contribute where you feel like you want to. Right.
• 32:01
  Speaker 2: But if it's not about money, that conversation feels like
• 32:05
  Speaker 2: it's about money. So I think about the guy who
• 32:07
  Speaker 2: it's not about like, this is getting really expensive or.
• 32:10
  Speaker 1: Right, I see what you're saying.
• 32:11
  Speaker 5: But it is making you feel a certain way about her.
• 32:13
  Speaker 5: That needs to be addressed. You are wondering about a
• 32:16
  Speaker 5: part of her, a part of her character. Right.
• 32:18
  Speaker 2: I think the way saying, I would love if you
• 32:21
  Speaker 2: sometimes did, addresses the need that you have instead of
• 32:26
  Speaker 2: attacking that she doesn't.
• 32:27
  Speaker 5: And you're using that as an in to sort of
• 32:28
  Speaker 5: figure out who her character might be. Her response might
• 32:31
  Speaker 5: be very telling.
• 32:31
  Speaker 2: Yeah, she might be like, I don't think so. Whoa, whoa, really?
• 32:35
  Speaker 2: To me, it's really important. And you could say, this
• 32:39
  Speaker 2: is a money, you know, we make the same amount
• 32:40
  Speaker 2: of money. And like, I see this going, I see us,
• 32:44
  Speaker 2: you know, I see this relationship really working out and
• 32:46
  Speaker 2: this is an important conversation. We should have the conversation,
• 32:49
  Speaker 2: you know, or I know we don't make us, you
• 32:51
  Speaker 2: don't make as much as I do, but it's more
• 32:53
  Speaker 2: of an energetic thing. Even if it's little things, it
• 32:55
  Speaker 2: means so much to me when you buy a coffee
• 32:58
  Speaker 2: for me, that kind of thing would feel amazing for her.
• 33:01
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 33:02
  Speaker 5: It's why you should have the conversation earlier, meaning What
• 33:04
  Speaker 5: I want you to do is to be able to
• 33:06
  Speaker 5: figure out in your relationship if you guys even have
• 33:07
  Speaker 5: the same values and wants. And yes, she might have
• 33:10
  Speaker 5: very unhealthy expectations of what she wants in a guy or–
• 33:14
  Speaker 5: I mean it's possible she finds that. But that what
• 33:16
  Speaker 5: she wants is a very wealthy guy who just takes
• 33:18
  Speaker 5: care of her. And to be fair, Ellie is very
• 33:20
  Speaker 5: expensive and it's difficult and the tiny percentage of people
• 33:23
  Speaker 5: who make so much starts to feel like our reality.
• 33:26
  Speaker 5: Everyone can afford a house. Everyone can afford these things.
• 33:28
  Speaker 5: Everyone can afford vacations. While I'm struggling, what is happening, right?
• 33:31
  Speaker 5: Your own self-worth is so affected by it. And so
• 33:34
  Speaker 5: you're not saying anything, I think just builds resentment and
• 33:36
  Speaker 5: also doesn't allow you the opportunity to see what kind
• 33:38
  Speaker 5: of person you're in a relationship with.
• 33:39
  Speaker 1: Yeah, totally. Great. All right, let's see the next one.
• 33:42
  Speaker 7: This is a 32-year-old from the UK. Okay.
• 33:53
  Speaker 1: Okay.
• 34:01
  Speaker 9: I feel like I've always been quite goal-oriented and future-oriented.
• 34:07
  Speaker 9: I'm always kind of drifting off into future scenarios, possibilities,
• 34:12
  Speaker 9: usually in a very positive way. I get excited and
• 34:15
  Speaker 9: I love thinking of and working towards goals. But I
• 34:19
  Speaker 9: find it really hard to balance that with a desire
• 34:22
  Speaker 9: to be more, I think a need to be more present.
• 34:25
  Speaker 9: I know it's cliche, but I do feel like I
• 34:28
  Speaker 9: sometimes miss out on the present moment and like getting
• 34:32
  Speaker 9: the most from it. So yeah, I'm just wondering if
• 34:36
  Speaker 9: you have any thoughts or advice on how to balance
• 34:39
  Speaker 9: that kind of future bias towards the future and bias
• 34:42
  Speaker 9: towards being goal oriented, but with a, yeah, with being
• 34:48
  Speaker 9: more present.
• 34:49
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I relate to that. Being present is so hard
• 34:51
  Speaker 1: because you're today, right?
• 34:53
  Speaker 4: Totally.
• 34:54
  Speaker 2: Also, you have the aspiration.
• 34:55
  Speaker 3: For sure.
• 34:56
  Speaker 1: You want, you want a lot.
• 34:57
  Speaker 2: Self, self-imposed expectation, societal expectation. relationship expectation.
• 35:02
  Speaker 5: Well, think about the opportunities you've made to be present
• 35:06
  Speaker 5: in your life that has worked. For example, we started
• 35:08
  Speaker 5: today and right before we started, you said, let's sit
• 35:10
  Speaker 5: for 30 seconds.
• 35:11
  Speaker 1: Let's meditate.
• 35:12
  Speaker 5: Let's pay attention to what we're doing, who we're doing
• 35:15
  Speaker 5: this for and why it's important. And that dropped us
• 35:17
  Speaker 5: all into the present immediately. You can still have goals.
• 35:20
  Speaker 5: You can still have wants. You can still be driven.
• 35:22
  Speaker 5: But what you did was you put us in the present.
• 35:24
  Speaker 5: I do similar things at work. Sometimes I'll come in
• 35:26
  Speaker 5: in the morning and I have a full day. I
• 35:28
  Speaker 5: ran in, I drove my kids to school, whatever was
• 35:30
  Speaker 5: going on in my life. And I sit for a
• 35:32
  Speaker 5: moment and I remember what I'm doing and what the
• 35:34
  Speaker 5: work is and how important it is and how, how
• 35:36
  Speaker 5: honored I am that people are coming in to sit
• 35:39
  Speaker 5: with me in their pain or whatever they're going through.
• 35:42
  Speaker 5: And I get myself really present before I do work
• 35:45
  Speaker 5: for the day because I think it's important. It doesn't
• 35:47
  Speaker 5: take away from any goals or drives or anything else
• 35:49
  Speaker 5: I have, but I want to be in the moment
• 35:51
  Speaker 5: when I'm in the moment. When I sit here with
• 35:53
  Speaker 5: you guys, I want to be in here. I don't
• 35:54
  Speaker 5: want my head anywhere else. I want to be in
• 35:55
  Speaker 5: this moment with you guys listening and riffing and it,
• 35:58
  Speaker 5: It doesn't matter in terms of like what I'm thinking
• 36:01
  Speaker 5: of for my future or what's going on in the
• 36:03
  Speaker 5: outside world. It's unfair to all of us if we're
• 36:05
  Speaker 5: somewhere else. I want to fully have this experience with you.
• 36:08
  Speaker 5: And so I think what you did in the beginning,
• 36:09
  Speaker 5: which was hold on a second, let's take 30 seconds
• 36:12
  Speaker 5: and let's just drop into this.
• 36:13
  Speaker 3: And so if you have difficulty in.
• 36:14
  Speaker 5: Getting present in certain times, at certain times, you can
• 36:17
  Speaker 5: practice those ways of getting present. So I think people
• 36:20
  Speaker 5: who have difficulty getting present use little tricks to get
• 36:23
  Speaker 5: present by their simple things of like just taking in
• 36:26
  Speaker 5: your surroundings, right? What does this rug feel like? What
• 36:29
  Speaker 5: does this chair feel like? Ways that people ground themselves
• 36:32
  Speaker 5: when they're anxious, but also just paying attention to the
• 36:34
  Speaker 5: here and now. And so I think any opportunity you
• 36:37
  Speaker 5: have to be present, to put yourself in the present,
• 36:39
  Speaker 5: gives you the opportunity. Any opportunity you have to teach
• 36:42
  Speaker 5: yourself how to be present gives you the ability to
• 36:45
  Speaker 5: be able to sit in the space and not future
• 36:47
  Speaker 5: trip or whatever his fears were.
• 36:48
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I think if you're future tripping a lot, the
• 36:51
  Speaker 2: first way to get into the present is actually through action.
• 36:54
  Speaker 2: not through expectation that you're just gonna start to be present.
• 36:57
  Speaker 2: I love, gratitude is an easy one, but there's also
• 37:01
  Speaker 2: a couple emotions I think you can tap into that
• 37:03
  Speaker 2: are action-oriented. So gratitude, 100%, curiosity, awe, any time, those
• 37:09
  Speaker 2: three things are really easy to tap into at any time. Well,
• 37:11
  Speaker 2: I'm curious about Seth's day, life, about his mood today,
• 37:17
  Speaker 2: what's going on, it's like, that's presence. Curiosity is 100% presence.
• 37:20
  Speaker 2: Awe is presence. Man, whoever designed this fucking room did
• 37:27
  Speaker 2: a great job.
• 37:28
  Speaker 1: Yes. Nice.
• 37:29
  Speaker 2: Man, I love the fact that someone wrote this book,
• 37:32
  Speaker 2: The Alchemist, is crazy.
• 37:35
  Speaker 3: You know, awe.
• 37:36
  Speaker 2: And then gratitude, of course. Physical gratitude is the easiest
• 37:39
  Speaker 2: because how could you not be grateful for the fact
• 37:42
  Speaker 2: that if you have two feet, that these two feet
• 37:44
  Speaker 2: have been with you your entire life, that they've taken
• 37:47
  Speaker 2: you everywhere you've ever needed to go without fail, and
• 37:50
  Speaker 2: that you've never had to think about it. That your
• 37:52
  Speaker 2: hands have written everything they've ever needed to write, that
• 37:55
  Speaker 2: they've picked up and held and eaten, used to eat
• 37:58
  Speaker 2: everything that you wanted to eat. Like easy gratitude. I
• 38:01
  Speaker 2: think those are great ones.
• 38:03
  Speaker 3: I think you have a beautiful way of being appreciative
• 38:05
  Speaker 3: in life.
• 38:05
  Speaker 1: I love it.
• 38:06
  Speaker 7: I really.
• 38:06
  Speaker 1: But it's a practice.
• 38:08
  Speaker 2: It doesn't come naturally to me. I'm not always thinking, oh,
• 38:11
  Speaker 2: I'm so grateful for my hands. No one fucking thinks that.
• 38:14
  Speaker 2: But I think you practice it.
• 38:17
  Speaker 5: You teach yourself how. I mean, I once pulled my
• 38:20
  Speaker 5: hamstring so painfully. I couldn't walk. I was trying to
• 38:24
  Speaker 5: learn how to skateboard because my kids were. And I
• 38:26
  Speaker 5: was so depressed because for me to not be able
• 38:28
  Speaker 5: to move, I just realized like I was really struggling.
• 38:31
  Speaker 5: And I decided to take in how lucky I was
• 38:35
  Speaker 5: that I'll heal in a month or two. And it
• 38:37
  Speaker 5: was painful and it was hard to get around. But
• 38:39
  Speaker 5: oh my God, I just have this for a month
• 38:40
  Speaker 5: or two. Like how lucky I am that I'm able
• 38:42
  Speaker 5: to go hiking and walk and go uphill. And all
• 38:45
  Speaker 5: of a sudden I like take this in. And then
• 38:47
  Speaker 5: we get better and we forget.
• 38:48
  Speaker 3: We all forget.
• 38:49
  Speaker 5: And so it does take active work to keep remembering,
• 38:51
  Speaker 5: to keep doing that work, to be able to appreciate
• 38:53
  Speaker 5: the things we.
• 38:53
  Speaker 1: Have in our lives. Yeah.
• 38:55
  Speaker 6: I agree.
• 38:55
  Speaker 1: It's great.
• 38:56
  Speaker 2: Amazing.
• 38:57
  Speaker 1: Seth. Seth, this has been amazing.
• 38:58
  Speaker 4: Nice.
• 38:58
  Speaker 1: Thank you for having me.
• 38:59
  Speaker 2: Such a great episode.
• 39:01
  Speaker 1: We're doing this again.
• 39:01
  Speaker 2: The inaugural therapy in session. This was so much fun.
• 39:04
  Speaker 1: I love it. Tell people how they can submit. Okay.
• 39:06
  Speaker 2: So go to freetherapypod.com slash questions and you'll be able
• 39:11
  Speaker 2: to submit a voice note. of any question, anything you're
• 39:14
  Speaker 2: struggling with, men and women. This episode is for Men's
• 39:17
  Speaker 2: Mental Health Awareness Month, so we just focus on men,
• 39:19
  Speaker 2: but we want everyone to submit. You can choose anonymous
• 39:23
  Speaker 2: and we'll change your voice so no one knows that
• 39:24
  Speaker 2: it's you. And we're very excited to hear all of
• 39:27
  Speaker 2: your questions on the next episode. of Free Therapy, Therapy
• 39:31
  Speaker 2: in Session. Thank you, Seth Menachem, for coming on the show.
• 39:34
  Speaker 3: Thank you, guys.
• 39:35
  Speaker 1: Thanks, Seth.
• 39:36
  Speaker 2: Thanks for listening to the episode. We hope you loved it.
• 39:38
  Speaker 2: So our goal is to get a million guys into
• 39:41
  Speaker 2: therapy with this show. And the biggest thing you could
• 39:43
  Speaker 2: do to support is leave us a five-star review on
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  Speaker 2: Apple or Spotify.
• 39:47
  Speaker 1: Yeah, Kev and I are so passionate about these conversations.
• 39:50
  Speaker 1: It makes such a big impact on the show and
• 39:52
  Speaker 1: it really helps us reach more people who need to
• 39:55
  Speaker 1: hear conversations like this.
• 39:57
  Speaker 2: You can also watch the full show on YouTube with
• 39:59
  Speaker 2: videos so you can actually feel like you're in the
• 40:02
  Speaker 2: room with us getting therapy.
• 40:04
  Speaker 1: Because therapy is expensive.
• 40:05
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• 40:09
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• 40:12
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• 40:18
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