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Say Goodbye to Awkward Dirty Talks – Tips from a Sex Expert, Dr. Evelin Dacker · Libido Lounge

• 0:00
  Welcome to the libido lounge.
• 0:02
  We focus on all things love, lust, and libido.
• 0:05
  We believe that fabulous sex is important to health as exercise and good food.
• 0:19
  Hey, everybody.
• 0:20
  Welcome back to another episode on the lounge.
• 0:23
  I'm your libido expert, Doctor.
• 0:25
  Diane Mueller, and I'm so excited to invite Doctor.
• 0:28
  Eveline Dacker to our show today.
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  We're gonna have a great conversation.
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  I was really inspired to get doctor Dacker on the phone with me today because of so many
• 0:38
  areas of her work, but in particular, her work around communication and how we talk about sex.
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  She has a really great acronym and process for what she teaches about.
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  We're gonna get into that today.
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  And a lot of the episode, we're gonna see where this goes as always, but a lot of the
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  orientation today is going to be on communication, on sex, on how do we talk to our
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  partners, on how do we talk to each other about this very important topic.
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  So thank you so much for being here with me today.
• 1:06
  Yeah.
• 1:06
  Thank you.
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  I'm excited to be here as well.
• 1:09
  I'd love before we jump into the the juiciness of the story.
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  I'd love to hear a little bit of the nuts and bolts of you from a standpoint of you've gone
• 1:17
  such an interesting direction as a doc in your career to really bring so much communication
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  and so much of the conversation around healthy sexuality and not just to focus on, say, the
• 1:31
  physical components of human sexuality.
• 1:34
  So I'm curious about your story, if we can lead with that around, like, what what really
• 1:39
  happened or what transpired to help you understand that this is such an important thing
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  to talk about and then to, you know, take it pretty big and get on, you know, TEDx and
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  really be getting your word out.
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  What was what was the initial, say, the process of that?
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  Oh, okay.
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  It was roller derby.
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  For real or figurative?
• 2:00
  No, honey.
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  We really like I joined the roller derby team when I was like 44.
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  And all of a sudden, like being in a group of women who were in this like place in their life
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  of wanting to express themselves and like with avatars and dressing up and just like being in
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  a community of women really made me realize how little we know about sex, how little we know
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  about our own sexuality, and how little it's talked about.
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  So I was not a good roller derby player, but I was kind of like the team doc.
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  And people just were asking me questions.
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  And at the same time, I was in the process of getting a certification in functional medicine,
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  which I kind of called natural empathy for MDs.
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  And, I realized, darn, I'm learning about all this root cause of illness and disease, but
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  we're not talking about what something that's so important and that's pleasure.
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  Yeah.
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  That's your connection.
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  What makes our life yummy.
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  Right.
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  And, and that's kind of where I started going into sexuality, but not sexuality.
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  It's like something is wrong, but like, how can we actually make things great for ourselves?
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  I was also 44.
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  So I know as being a doctor, you know, I work, I've been working with menopause and
• 3:17
  periadipause for the last twenty, thirty years.
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  And I had this story in my head that, oh my God, I'm going to hit 50 and I'm going to be
• 3:25
  dead sexually.
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  Right.
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  Because that's kind of the story that we're given.
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  And I decided that that didn't have to be true.
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  And I went deep into like studying sexuality, but not from the lens of medicine and
• 3:39
  dysfunction, but from the lens of like, what are people actually doing?
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  And, so, you know, I like to laugh, like I took up my first people ask me, so how'd you get
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  into this?
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  Like, what, what, like, what continuing education did you do?
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  And I'm like, oh, I took some classes at a, at a sex store and there's an adult store.
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  There's a late store in Portland, Oregon called she bop and they used to teach classes.
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  So I went and I started learning from people who were sex educators.
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  And, I realized that there's some really important things out there that is not known in
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  the mainstream.
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  Stream.
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  And I just felt like the worlds could be so different to the way we navigate sexuality
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  could be so different if we take these lessons from, you know, these sex positive subcultures
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  and actually bring them to the mainstream, which is kind of where my work is.
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  I love it.
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  And definitely similar soul missions.
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  I I often say pleasure is not just about desire.
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  It's something we require.
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  And it's for exactly what you said.
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  It's like so much I think of motivation in medicine and society is like away from pain,
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  which is important.
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  But I really appreciate what you're doing because, like, there's it's like changing the
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  orientation from moving away from pain to actually, like you said, like, making life more
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  yummy.
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  Right?
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  Bringing in more of that pleasure.
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  So it's such a great orientation to health of, like, towards pleasure versus, like, chasing
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  away the bad thing, even though we wanna get away with that bad thing too.
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  So in these years of study, what have you found to be some of the core things that are
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  important for healthy sexuality and sexual expression?
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  Well, of course, communication.
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  Yay.
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  We got Yay.
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  And then and we had to talk about like, oh, we gotta talk about sex.
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  But one of the things that I realized is that we don't have a framework to talk about it.
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  So so I came up with one.
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  I came up with a framework and it's called the SARS talk.
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  And I'll get into this in a minute.
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  Please.
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  But the other thing that really I noticed is that we need to understand ourselves,
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  especially people who are raised as women.
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  Like we're not taught how to own our own sexuality and our own, like, pleasure and our
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  own for us.
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  Right?
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  Yeah.
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  And so much of what we're taught about sexuality is like reproductive sex, penetrative
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  sex, heterosexual sex.
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  And if we could step a little bit away from that and relearn what sexuality means, then
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  we're able to talk about it.
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  We're able to ask for it.
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  We're able to keep it alive for us.
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  And so that's what the STARS talk is.
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  It it actually is not only a framework to have conversations, but it's a framework for us to
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  understand our to create our sexual self awareness.
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  Yeah.
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  It's so important because I think that's one of the the biggest things is, like, where to get
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  started, how to get started.
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  And you're right.
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  Like, so many times, it's, like, such a taboo thing to talk about sex.
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  And another thing I hear in so many of my female population, so much of my female
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  population is, like, this sense of, like, I'm doing it wrong.
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  Right?
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  There's almost this feeling of, like, because we're not taught that women and men, our
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  processes are different.
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  Right?
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  That that oftentimes there's this this sense of, like, doing it wrong that I see in in my
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  female population.
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  And it's really just, like, this lack of communication and this lack of understanding
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  and this lack of awareness of, like, there there's really no right and wrong in this.
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  It's it's about consent and exploration and communication.
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  And so let's get into Yeah.
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  Your STARS framework.
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  I wanna make sure we get, you know, thoroughly into that city.
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  No.
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  Let's talk
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  in.
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  Okay.
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  So the very so it's an acronym and each one stands for something.
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  I'll just say what the acronym is really first.
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  I will go into each other.
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  So it stands for safety needs, turn ons, avoids relationship values or retentions and
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  expectations, and then our sexual health STI disclosure.
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  So it starts out with safety needs because, you know, I've been working on this framework for
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  many years, and I realized, like, the fundamental thing that we need to know is how
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  to stay safe because we cannot open our heart, our mind, or our body if we're not really safe.
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  So then what if safe, what does that even mean?
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  Right.
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  And so I'd like to take that even a step back into like, what does our body tell us?
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  What is the somatic safety?
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  Could we tune into like, oh, when I feel safe, this is how my body is acting.
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  And when I don't feel safe, this is how I'm acting.
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  And like, then you could decide to realize like, oh, I need like, for me personally, I
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  don't feel safe if I'm with somebody and they're drinking a lot of alcohol.
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  Like, I don't feel like I could really have consent in that situation.
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  So one of my safety needs that I tell people is like, I count drinks.
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  If you're gonna have more than two alcoholic drinks, then, you know, it's gonna change our,
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  our encounter.
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  Some other things that could be safety is like, where do I feel?
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  What location do I feel safe?
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  Is do I feel safe getting into a car with somebody that I haven't met yet?
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  No.
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  So, you know, like, let me just tell that to somebody upfront so that we could make plans in
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  a way that we could come together so that we're both safe?
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  Like, what do we both need?
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  And it's not something we talk about.
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  It's not even something we think about, but it's so important.
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  So I like to start with safety needs.
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  Safety needs also like sometimes the whole sex talk is about safer sex.
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  So we think it's about like condoms and reproductive.
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  But I like to put that to the end and really start with, like, what does our body, our mind,
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  our sex, like, what do we need to feel safe with a person?
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  So that's the first one.
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  The second one is turn ons or things we like.
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  Like, what do I like?
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  One of my turn ons is I love good conversations.
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  Like, that helps me feel safe as well.
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  Like, having a good conversation with somebody before I would even consider getting address.
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  I know there's people that are really into hookups, and that's good.
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  That's what their turn ons are.
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  That's what they like.
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  So let's bring it out.
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  Like, how we'd like to be touched.
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  I like to be touched really slowly and softly.
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  So I let my partners know that.
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  So if they're not touching me, you know, softly, I could always say just now a little
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  softer, a little slower, and they don't feel bad about it.
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  I'm just telling them the way that I like.
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  I also love to know what my partner's like.
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  How do they like to be held and touched and, and what turns them on?
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  The, the counter of that is our avoid what we don't want.
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  And, you know, these two could go back and forth and they're, they're very mad.
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  They go together, turn on to the void, but our avoid our boundaries, the things that we don't
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  want, the things that may cause us to be going to trauma response.
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  If we're going really deep into that, like how do I, what is my trauma response?
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  How do I look?
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  How do I show up?
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  And can I tell a partner that beforehand?
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  So if it happens, they're aware of it.
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  That's a little deeper into the conversation, but I like to bring that up because I think,
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  consent has to happen from a trauma aware embodied attuned space.
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  And the stars talk is a talk, it is a conversation, but it really involves being
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  trauma aware, embodied, and leaning into learning attunement with one another.
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  So our turn ons and avoids are really, they could be very powerful for us to actually
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  explain them.
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  And I know, when I teach this to a lot of people who are raised as girls and raised as
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  women, a lot of them don't even know what they like.
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  I didn't even know what I liked.
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  It's like, what do I like?
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  I don't know.
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  I'd like to like turn my partner on.
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  I like to like orgasm proof this or that.
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  I don't know what I like.
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  I like to make him happy.
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  You know?
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  But, really, it's about owning ourselves and, like, knowing what do we want and not censoring
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  them, not censoring their orgasm.
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  But, you know, this is how we're gonna close the orgasm gap.
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  So those are my turn ons and avoids.
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  And then, there's our relationship expectations and intentions.
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  This is kind of like summed up in like, what does sex mean to me?
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  What do I want in a relationship?
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  What am I looking for with this person?
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  Am I looking for someone distracting?
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  Am I looking for fun?
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  Am I looking for sex?
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  Or am I looking for partnership and love?
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  And knowing that and being clear within ourselves, help us navigate this whole dating
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  world or put in a relationship with somebody to be like, oh, you know what?
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  I'm feeling like we're doing the domestic thing really good, but I am missing a little bit of
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  that, that spontaneity and juice.
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  So like bringing that to our conversation with our partners.
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  And, you know, when I say expectations, people are like, oh, we shouldn't have expectations,
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  but it's human to have expectations.
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  So that's all that we have them and let's say them and let's just be clear with one another.
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  And then the, you know, so that, that, and with part of our expectations, I got this from the
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  sex positive communities, because one of the things that really like made such an impact
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  from with me is when I kind of learned a little bit about kink and BDSM and how people go into
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  this as a scene.
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  So they, they create a scene, they actually communicate what they want, what they don't
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  want.
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  And then after they're done, they have aftercare.
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  Yeah.
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  And I loved that concept.
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  I'm like, why doesn't why don't we all have aftercare?
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  Yeah.
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  Yeah.
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  That's cool.
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  I love pee.
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  Like, you know, being in a sexual, dynamic with somebody or intimate dynamic, it takes energy
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  and and and I want aftercare.
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  So, like, I'm gonna ask what I need, and I'm gonna figure out what it is I need, and I wanna
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  know what my partner needs.
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  So expectations is kind of that.
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  It's kind of like the aftercare.
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  Do I I wanna be texted.
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  I don't like it when I text somebody and they don't respond to me, you know, in a day.
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  I don't like ghosting.
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  And if you're, I, I look out for that.
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  Like, are you somebody that ghosts?
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  Because that's going to be something like that's on my no list.
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  That's on my avoid list.
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  Yes.
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  So, so that's the relationship.
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  And then the last death, like, oh, you know, I also want to mention that most of the time we
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  start with the, our, we don't start, you know, we start with the safety needs in our body.
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  Then we start with the R of what our intentions and expectations and our values are.
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  Then if we're fairly comfortable, we'll go to more turn ons and the blades, but you know, the
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  acronym doesn't work in that direction.
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  Yeah.
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  We're gonna start and we're done.
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  And so then at the very, very end is when we talk about our sexuality and our sexual health
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  and our STI.