Latest / What is Business Development? / Episode 73: Part 2 "How To Implement a Referral Management System" with Andrew Z. Brown

Transcript

Episode 73: Part 2 "How To Implement a Referral Management System" with Andrew Z. Brown · What is Business Development?

• 0:03
  Speaker 1: Welcome to the Business Development podcast, brought to you by
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: the Global Business Development Association, delivering the strategies and tactics
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: to boost your career and corporate growth.
• 0:21
  Speaker 2: Hello BD pros, and welcome to the Global Business Development
• 0:26
  Speaker 2: Association podcast called what is Business Development?
• 0:33
  Speaker 3: Now?
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  Speaker 2: Wouldn't you like a business development tactic that converts at
• 0:38
  Speaker 2: over fifty percent? Over half the time when you execute
• 0:42
  Speaker 2: on this business development tactic, you will have a conversion?
• 0:47
  Speaker 4: Does that sound crazy?
• 0:48
  Speaker 2: Especially in a world that's so congested with competitors and noise,
• 0:52
  Speaker 2: where cold calls, cold out bounds social media engagement, those
• 0:58
  Speaker 2: only have conversions that are usually lower than ten percent.
• 1:02
  Speaker 2: Doesn't fifty percent conversion rate sounds so much better to you? Well,
• 1:05
  Speaker 2: it sounds a lot better to me. And we're today
• 1:08
  Speaker 2: we're going to talk about that business development tactic and
• 1:11
  Speaker 2: we're going to talk to the father of b to
• 1:14
  Speaker 2: be managed referral programs. There's a little bit of a hint,
• 1:17
  Speaker 2: but hey, before we start there, we have the business
• 1:21
  Speaker 2: development body of knowledge that covers this tactic and all
• 1:24
  Speaker 2: the other tactics, operations and strategy of business development. In
• 1:29
  Speaker 2: the Business Development body of Knowledge that is the core
• 1:33
  Speaker 2: base of knowledge universally worked upon by business developers, and
• 1:38
  Speaker 2: it's the core knowledge you need to pass the Global
• 1:41
  Speaker 2: Business Development Association Business Development Professional certification. So go to
• 1:47
  Speaker 2: Amazon grab your copy of the Business Development Body of
• 1:50
  Speaker 2: Knowledge we affectionately call the BD BOCH. Get your copy,
• 1:54
  Speaker 2: get started in the profession, or boost your career success
• 1:58
  Speaker 2: in BD. And we're going to be boosting your conversion
• 2:02
  Speaker 2: rates today by continuing a discussion that we started in
• 2:06
  Speaker 2: the first part of a three part series episode series
• 2:10
  Speaker 2: with the father of B to B referral programs, and
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  Speaker 2: that's Andrew Z.
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  Speaker 4: Brown.
• 2:17
  Speaker 2: Andrew helps organizations increase revenues, enhance reputations, shortened sales cycles,
• 2:23
  Speaker 2: and improved trust felt by key stakeholders. With his proven
• 2:29
  Speaker 2: track record in B to B product marketing, corporate marketing,
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  Speaker 2: branding communications, channel marketing, alliance management, business development and change,
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  Speaker 2: employee communications, Andrew has launched and promoted over two hundred
• 2:44
  Speaker 2: products and services spanning fifteen industries around the globe, and
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  Speaker 2: one of the products he's promoting today is his most
• 2:51
  Speaker 2: recent book, called Get Referred. How to Increase Sales, Velocity,
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  Speaker 2: volume and Value, came out in August of twenty twenty four.
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  Speaker 2: In paperback edition. It's available on Amazon, very accessible prices. Folks.
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  Speaker 2: It's a wonderful book, just very nicely presented. The book
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  Speaker 2: is so easy to read. I love the presentation style,
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  Speaker 2: very very professional and exceptional for the business busy business
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  Speaker 2: developers like you to open the book, follow along and
• 3:22
  Speaker 2: start implementing these tactics yourself. So Andrew Z. Brown, welcome
• 3:28
  Speaker 2: back to the show.
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  Speaker 3: Well tony as always, thank you very much for having
• 3:32
  Speaker 3: me and allowing me to speak to your very talented
• 3:34
  Speaker 3: and impassioned group of BD followers and listeners and professionals
• 3:40
  Speaker 3: who want, as you said earlier, want to convert their business,
• 3:46
  Speaker 3: and they want that reliability, that predictability, and they want
• 3:49
  Speaker 3: speed because when you convert quickly, that amount of money
• 3:55
  Speaker 3: turns into get your commissions. The money comes in, it
• 4:01
  Speaker 3: increases cash flow, that money can be used throughout the organization.
• 4:04
  Speaker 3: So speed by focusing on conversions and fast conversions is
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  Speaker 3: obviously critical to the BD folks as well as to
• 4:16
  Speaker 3: people throughout the organization on the executive level. So thank
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  Speaker 3: you very much for having me. And I'm just a
• 4:23
  Speaker 3: quick shout out. I've taken I've read The Bad Body
• 4:29
  Speaker 3: of Knowledge, great book, so I strongly, I strongly support
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  Speaker 3: everything that you do to help the b D community
• 4:37
  Speaker 3: become stronger, more refined, very quipped. So thank you.
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  Speaker 2: Tony, well, thank you Andrew for those kind words, and folks,
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  Speaker 2: I'm showing on the screen for those that are listening,
• 4:49
  Speaker 2: this is the visual of Andrew's books, so you can
• 4:53
  Speaker 2: easily recognize it on Amazon, but you'll also see it's
• 4:56
  Speaker 2: a number one best seller on Amazon. Again, it's get
• 4:59
  Speaker 2: refre comes in paperback. I have my copy dog eared
• 5:02
  Speaker 2: and highlighted and in so many different directions. But you
• 5:05
  Speaker 2: know what, Today we're going to jump into part two
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  Speaker 2: of our multi part episodes to go through the managed
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  Speaker 2: referral program concept that's in the book.
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  Speaker 4: Of course, we're not going to cover all the details, don't.
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  Speaker 2: Want to spoil all those pleasant adizes you'll read in
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  Speaker 2: the book, but we've been making our way slowly through
• 5:28
  Speaker 2: the process. We started in the previous episode, and we'll
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  Speaker 2: have a link to that in the show notes for
• 5:34
  Speaker 2: this episode, So you go back and listen to the
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  Speaker 2: first episode that we discuss this program and Andrew. Just
• 5:42
  Speaker 2: to get everybody caught up if they happen to miss
• 5:45
  Speaker 2: the first episode, can we walk through what.
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  Speaker 4: They may have missed.
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  Speaker 2: Just in a broad level I have for folks that
• 5:51
  Speaker 2: are listening, I have the graphic up and let's start
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  Speaker 2: with step one. Just a quick summary of what do
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  Speaker 2: you mean step one?
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  Speaker 3: Yeah, so step one one is and if I take
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  Speaker 3: a look at the graphics, selecting initial goals. And so
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  Speaker 3: when you are setting about doing a referral strategy, is
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  Speaker 3: critical for you to set specific goals. And those goals
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  Speaker 3: could be selling specific products or services, target certain targets,
• 6:19
  Speaker 3: certain geographic regions for each referral source. We want to
• 6:24
  Speaker 3: set up a target for themselves. But all of that
• 6:27
  Speaker 3: is dictated by your organization's revenue targets. Otherwise the referral
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  Speaker 3: program isn't going to be if you will successful, I
• 6:35
  Speaker 3: won't meet up your expectations. So there's a whole bunch
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  Speaker 3: of detail in the book, but it really is to
• 6:41
  Speaker 3: ask you to set goals, revenue generating goals that make
• 6:47
  Speaker 3: sense for your organization, or your department or yourself. Yeah.
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  Speaker 2: I think the key takeaway there, Andrew, was, you know
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  Speaker 2: so many people automatically think, oh, well, I just need
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  Speaker 2: to set a revenue goal, right, That's the whole point
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  Speaker 2: of this referral program my increasing conversions generate more revenue.
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  Speaker 2: But the subtle thing that we discussed last time is
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  Speaker 2: there are other goals for the organization and so you know,
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  Speaker 2: you should have a holistic perspective on all of the
• 7:10
  Speaker 2: different goals you want to accomplish. Okay, so let's jump
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  Speaker 2: into the second step.
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  Speaker 3: Sure. Oh and just a close loop on that. Thank
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  Speaker 3: you for saying that, Tony, Because when you have a
• 7:21
  Speaker 3: number of different stakeholders and you identify their goals as
• 7:25
  Speaker 3: well within the firm, you increase the likelihood of a
• 7:28
  Speaker 3: referral program being embraced and being successful. So step two
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  Speaker 3: is getting referral ready. We talked last time about you know,
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  Speaker 3: everyone wants to be to get referrals. We know the
• 7:41
  Speaker 3: power of power of referrals in terms of speed and
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  Speaker 3: conversion and ROI, but not if your organization is ready
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  Speaker 3: to receive referrals. So last time we touched upon the
• 7:54
  Speaker 3: first issue, which is to get referral ready. You want
• 7:57
  Speaker 3: to quantify your reputation. You owe it to referral sources
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  Speaker 3: that you choose to put in their hands or in
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  Speaker 3: their minds some very tangible measures as to what your
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  Speaker 3: reputation is and there are a number of different ways
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  Speaker 3: that you can do it, but that you owe to
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  Speaker 3: your referral sources because they're putting their reputation on the line.
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  Speaker 2: Okay, great, so quantify that reputation. All right, So let
• 8:26
  Speaker 2: me bring the graphic back up with your overall Okay,
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  Speaker 2: where do you want to start now in this episode?
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  Speaker 3: So I'm just going to add a little bit more
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  Speaker 3: meat on the bones for to get referral ready, and
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  Speaker 3: so I'm going to talk briefly about two areas, one
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  Speaker 3: addressing capacity and one reinforcing value of referrals. So what
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  Speaker 3: I mean by addressing capacity When you have a referral
• 8:53
  Speaker 3: source and they are bringing referred business to you, you
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  Speaker 3: have to actually be able to take that influx of business.
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  Speaker 3: And it's going to come in with a different set
• 9:06
  Speaker 3: of expectations, and it's going to come in, if you will,
• 9:09
  Speaker 3: through a different channel, a different person, or a different organization.
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  Speaker 3: So you have to you should review your client on
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  Speaker 3: boarding making sure that that's a smooth process, and you
• 9:21
  Speaker 3: also need to define how that referred business will be
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  Speaker 3: treated differently than business that's coming through other sources and.
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  Speaker 4: It doesn't What do you mean by that?
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  Speaker 2: I mean, are you saying, like, Okay, you're getting the
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  Speaker 2: referral it comes in.
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  Speaker 4: I mean.
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  Speaker 2: You have other leads come into you're pursuing other leads.
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  Speaker 2: Give me an example, like how you would treat it differently.
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  Speaker 4: Do you do you send your.
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  Speaker 2: Referral partner a note or something and say, hey, I
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  Speaker 2: got the lead and thank.
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  Speaker 4: You very much? Or do you treat the lead differently?
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  Speaker 4: I mean, what do you mean?
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  Speaker 3: So the answer to that speaking is yes, you want
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  Speaker 3: to define what that difference is. It may very well
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  Speaker 3: be sending a note to the referral source thanking them.
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  Speaker 3: It may be for the client responding to them faster.
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  Speaker 3: And you may put an SLA a service level agreement
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  Speaker 3: saying you know, when something comes in from a referral,
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  Speaker 3: that client we're going to recognize within twenty four hours
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  Speaker 3: or forty eight hours, or they might get a note
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  Speaker 3: from the president or the CEO will It can be
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  Speaker 3: very It can be a small token, but you want
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  Speaker 3: to make it different and you want the referral source
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  Speaker 3: to know that these folks are going to be treated differently.
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  Speaker 4: Yeah, I like that.
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  Speaker 3: You know.
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  Speaker 2: Obviously, if referrals typically have a higher conversion rate, you
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  Speaker 2: should be on it. Because there are statistics I think
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  Speaker 2: I have them in the bad box that talks about
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  Speaker 2: how it's I opening, how how many leads are just
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  Speaker 2: ignored by you know, business developers and folks that need
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  Speaker 2: to respond to them. And the statistic statistical data shows
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  Speaker 2: and it's obvious the longer that lead sits unattended, the
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  Speaker 2: lower and lower the conversion rate gets. So if you
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  Speaker 2: have a lead that comes in from a referral source,
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  Speaker 2: we know referrals converted, you know can convert up the
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  Speaker 2: fifty percent or more, well then you should be Johnny
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  Speaker 2: on the spot as we say all over that that
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  Speaker 2: lead opportunity, that referral and very quickly respond and because
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  Speaker 2: it has a high conversion rate and you owe it,
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  Speaker 2: you owe it to your partner right precisely.
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  Speaker 3: And again it doesn't have to be a monumental headache
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  Speaker 3: to have a piece of referred business betred. Differently, you
• 12:01
  Speaker 3: may add them to your holiday list for example, right so,
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  Speaker 3: and that's okay. Again, let the referral source know how
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  Speaker 3: a referred business is going to be treated in a
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  Speaker 3: special way that makes the referral source feel as if
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  Speaker 3: you actually value them, and that you value the referred
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  Speaker 3: business they're bringing in. So that's the first thing. It's
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  Speaker 3: a capacity issue and when it comes to onboarding. The
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  Speaker 3: second point is reinforcing value of referrals in the organization.
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  Speaker 3: So identify events or activities in your organization that could
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  Speaker 3: be a weekly or bi weekly sales meetings and highlight Hey, look,
• 12:47
  Speaker 3: Tony brought in a referral. Wait a second, So once
• 12:51
  Speaker 3: when a company sees when a group of BD and
• 12:54
  Speaker 3: sales folks see that referrals are being called out, that
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  Speaker 3: they're being you know, these are important, then it reinforces
• 13:02
  Speaker 3: there's a value placed on referrals and by extension, referral sources.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, and I think to go one step further too,
• 13:10
  Speaker 2: if you could show the performance of your referral sources. Hey,
• 13:14
  Speaker 2: this referral source gave me ten great leads last month
• 13:18
  Speaker 2: and I already converted two of them. Well, everybody else
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  Speaker 2: starts to see that and say, wow, okay, I'm jumping
• 13:25
  Speaker 2: all over that opportunity to engage with that referral source.
• 13:29
  Speaker 2: So you know, if you could show the prove those
• 13:31
  Speaker 2: conversion rates are higher, I think that also, you know,
• 13:35
  Speaker 2: is a pretty powerful medicine.
• 13:37
  Speaker 3: Okay. So and a couple of other practical things that
• 13:42
  Speaker 3: people can do. Identify if there any practices that actually
• 13:47
  Speaker 3: hinder referrals. And i'll give you just speaking to a
• 13:49
  Speaker 3: client yesterday and we were talking about their intake process
• 13:54
  Speaker 3: and we were talking about how to demonstrate value or referrals. Well,
• 14:00
  Speaker 3: we identified that there were some things that were stopping
• 14:04
  Speaker 3: or hindering referrals, and one was simply about tracking referrals.
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  Speaker 3: All they had to do was add one additional field
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  Speaker 3: in their intake about a referral source. They've never done
• 14:19
  Speaker 3: that before. So it's it's identifying to reinforce the value
• 14:23
  Speaker 3: of referral. Sometimes it's taking a look at internal process
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  Speaker 3: and saying, are we actually doing something that's preventing referrals
• 14:30
  Speaker 3: from coming in? So that was a very simple one.
• 14:32
  Speaker 3: And ideally you also to really demonstrate that you value referrals,
• 14:38
  Speaker 3: allocate responsibility for someone to manage referral sources. We all
• 14:43
  Speaker 3: know that unless something is managed, unless resources are put
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  Speaker 3: to it, it's not going to happen.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, and I think that's that's what you're really trying
• 14:53
  Speaker 2: to get at in step number two is be referral
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  Speaker 2: ready and a big part of that is Okay, in
• 14:59
  Speaker 2: an ideal world, this is how we would love to
• 15:01
  Speaker 2: be able to respond to our referral sources and be
• 15:04
  Speaker 2: able to track them move them through pipeline. But there's
• 15:09
  Speaker 2: also reality. We have limited resources, so we'll only be
• 15:13
  Speaker 2: able to do these parts of our ideal referral plan right,
• 15:18
  Speaker 2: Because you need to set realistic expectations within your organization
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  Speaker 2: and with your referral partners.
• 15:24
  Speaker 3: Don't you very much on that ware We actually we
• 15:28
  Speaker 3: step in because we will help. The wonderful thing about
• 15:31
  Speaker 3: referral programs is that they can run parallel to b
• 15:35
  Speaker 3: D sales and marketing. They don't have to get in
• 15:37
  Speaker 3: the way. They can be a real compliment, and that's
• 15:40
  Speaker 3: where we come in and we help manage because managing
• 15:44
  Speaker 3: a series of referral sources, once you've evaluated them, that
• 15:48
  Speaker 3: takes time. I mean, it's it's worthwhile time because, as
• 15:52
  Speaker 3: you said Tony earlier, having a referral harnessing referrals turns
• 15:59
  Speaker 3: into conversions and actually referral programs. Most recent that I
• 16:04
  Speaker 3: saw was that the ROI on a managed referral programs
• 16:08
  Speaker 3: is in excess of forty times. So putting the effort
• 16:15
  Speaker 3: into it makes sense. And I would argue that once
• 16:20
  Speaker 3: you do that, you might act. It might actually cause
• 16:22
  Speaker 3: you to take a look at some of the other
• 16:24
  Speaker 3: initiatives and saying, well, wait, what's what's our ROI on that?
• 16:28
  Speaker 3: We know the ROI on a referral program is monumental,
• 16:32
  Speaker 3: So why don't we start to reallocate anyway, You don't
• 16:37
  Speaker 3: have to do that. You can start a pilot program
• 16:39
  Speaker 3: of a managed referral program. You can take a look
• 16:42
  Speaker 3: at it again. It doesn't get in the way of
• 16:43
  Speaker 3: everything else. You can keep on plugging away with all
• 16:46
  Speaker 3: the other programs and this will run smoothly and nice
• 16:50
  Speaker 3: profitable engine of qualified leads and converted leads just runs
• 16:57
  Speaker 3: in the background.
• 16:58
  Speaker 2: Yeah, if I can to unpack up one thing you
• 17:01
  Speaker 2: said there, I thought that was it was really interesting.
• 17:03
  Speaker 2: Is obviously in get Referral ready we talked about in
• 17:06
  Speaker 2: the previous episode as having those KPIs to be able
• 17:10
  Speaker 2: to measure the success of your program, which conversion rate
• 17:15
  Speaker 2: should be a big one and return on investment should
• 17:19
  Speaker 2: be another. And I think having also those benchmarks, those
• 17:22
  Speaker 2: industry benchmarks of okay, we know we can get up
• 17:25
  Speaker 2: to maybe over fifty percent, because that's an industry benchmark
• 17:30
  Speaker 2: and we should be able to get forty times.
• 17:34
  Speaker 4: ROI as well.
• 17:35
  Speaker 2: So are we actually achieving those And if you're not,
• 17:38
  Speaker 2: then those KP failure to hit those KPI triggers could
• 17:43
  Speaker 2: be then something that causes you to think about, Okay,
• 17:47
  Speaker 2: what is preventing us from hitting those benchmarks? Because if
• 17:51
  Speaker 2: others an industry can do it, then why aren't we?
• 17:55
  Speaker 2: And then the second thing is why aren't we doing
• 17:56
  Speaker 2: them at scale? You know that's kind of where the
• 17:59
  Speaker 2: ir the ROI metric comes in. Yes, let's say, okay, yeah,
• 18:03
  Speaker 2: you're hitting over fifty percent referral, but are you hitting
• 18:06
  Speaker 2: the ROI? Do you have the right kind of scale?
• 18:09
  Speaker 2: And if you're not able to scale it, then you're
• 18:11
  Speaker 2: not going to have ROI numbers. Okay, so we have
• 18:16
  Speaker 2: about ten more minutes here, Andrew, let's jump into the
• 18:18
  Speaker 2: next parties.
• 18:20
  Speaker 3: And then you've led the perfect path to it as well,
• 18:24
  Speaker 3: because we talk about scale and the one thing that's
• 18:28
  Speaker 3: really fascinating and wonderful about referral programs is you can
• 18:33
  Speaker 3: achieve growth without scale. Now take that in for a moment,
• 18:37
  Speaker 3: because that is sometimes a scary thing because we all
• 18:40
  Speaker 3: hear that we've got a scale scale scale. Well, imagine
• 18:44
  Speaker 3: having the growth without having to build the infrastructure, without
• 18:47
  Speaker 3: having to do the expense.
• 18:49
  Speaker 2: You know.
• 18:49
  Speaker 3: One of the other key metrics of the a referral
• 18:53
  Speaker 3: program is customer acquisition costs, which plummets when you use
• 18:58
  Speaker 3: referral sources. And when it comes to scaling again, we
• 19:06
  Speaker 3: need to step back and say, it's really growth that
• 19:08
  Speaker 3: we're looking for. That's why you scale. You're not scaling
• 19:11
  Speaker 3: for scale sake, You're scaling for growth sake. And the
• 19:15
  Speaker 3: next phase in the referral program process is finding the
• 19:22
  Speaker 3: right referral sources. Because if you find the right for
• 19:26
  Speaker 3: referral sources, you can blow your numbers out of the
• 19:30
  Speaker 3: water with usually under a half a dozen people. So
• 19:35
  Speaker 3: it's really important to find those half dozen people. And
• 19:39
  Speaker 3: so we want to spend time on evaluating referral sources.
• 19:44
  Speaker 3: How do we do that is probably the next question. Well,
• 19:48
  Speaker 3: I would say start first by looking at the data
• 19:53
  Speaker 3: you probably already have in your organization, and I would
• 19:57
  Speaker 3: say think of grouping referral sources in four discret groups.
• 20:03
  Speaker 3: And in get referred there's a simple grid called the
• 20:06
  Speaker 3: referral Champion grid, and along one dimensions on along one dimension,
• 20:11
  Speaker 3: rather you have the amount of revenue that's brought in
• 20:18
  Speaker 3: by referrals and on the bottom on the x ax
• 20:21
  Speaker 3: as it's frequency. So frequency and value. And you want
• 20:25
  Speaker 3: to take your potential referral source candidates as you take
• 20:30
  Speaker 3: a look at the people in your orbit and you
• 20:33
  Speaker 3: start want to mapping them against that grid. And I
• 20:37
  Speaker 3: can say, you can do individuals or you can say,
• 20:40
  Speaker 3: you know what these organizations are bringing us referrals. Okay,
• 20:45
  Speaker 3: so you might want to plan place the different organizations
• 20:48
  Speaker 3: on that grid, or you might want to say industry,
• 20:51
  Speaker 3: you might be you might find that financial services brings
• 20:54
  Speaker 3: you a lot of referrals, high value referrals, so they
• 20:58
  Speaker 3: go on the grid. So you start to use the
• 21:01
  Speaker 3: data that you have to start to evaluate potential referral sources.
• 21:06
  Speaker 3: And the nice thing about this framework is you you
• 21:11
  Speaker 3: get to dictate that frequency and the revenue thresholds that
• 21:15
  Speaker 3: are relevant to your organization. For some organization, it's going
• 21:18
  Speaker 3: to be smaller buckets or smaller prices, but you get
• 21:21
  Speaker 3: to dictate it. Yeah.
• 21:23
  Speaker 2: So I mean, but you said, you know, look at
• 21:26
  Speaker 2: the data.
• 21:26
  Speaker 4: What if you don't have data right?
• 21:28
  Speaker 2: And then what if you're just starting off and you
• 21:30
  Speaker 2: haven't engaged with these referral sources consistently. You know, we
• 21:36
  Speaker 2: always have folks in our network that randomly will send
• 21:39
  Speaker 2: us an opportunity every now and then. Not a referral
• 21:42
  Speaker 2: management program, folks, that's you know, that's just happenstance, that's
• 21:47
  Speaker 2: just waiting for magic to happen. Not a good business
• 21:51
  Speaker 2: development strategy. By the way, We're talking about a deliberate,
• 21:55
  Speaker 2: proactive program where you are regularly engaging and sharing referrals
• 22:00
  Speaker 2: with your partners. So I guess my question, and Andrew,
• 22:04
  Speaker 2: and let me just play it out here. If some
• 22:07
  Speaker 2: if you don't have an existing relationship, or you just
• 22:09
  Speaker 2: kind of had a few referrals here and there from partners,
• 22:14
  Speaker 2: what I think is you would probably look at are
• 22:17
  Speaker 2: they engaging with the same ICP that I am, you know,
• 22:20
  Speaker 2: the are they engaging with the same ideal customer profile
• 22:23
  Speaker 2: that I have? Do they have the same type of
• 22:25
  Speaker 2: customers that I want, that I need? Okay, that's great,
• 22:28
  Speaker 2: that's kind of your leading indicator as far as the
• 22:31
  Speaker 2: value curve is, you know concerned. I think another thing
• 22:34
  Speaker 2: too would be how close are they to being a competitor,
• 22:38
  Speaker 2: you know, if they are, you know, there's kind of
• 22:40
  Speaker 2: that continuum of competitor to complementary partner, you know range. Obviously,
• 22:48
  Speaker 2: competitors would be less inclined unless they are maybe pruning
• 22:52
  Speaker 2: some of their old clients that they don't want anymore
• 22:55
  Speaker 2: because it just doesn't map to their product set or
• 22:57
  Speaker 2: services or whatever the case might be. And then on
• 23:01
  Speaker 2: the other end of the spectrum, you have solid compliments.
• 23:04
  Speaker 2: There's just no competitive overlap at all. Ideally, I think
• 23:08
  Speaker 2: that's probably where you want to start off, because you
• 23:13
  Speaker 2: know it's a solid ICP fit and they're not a
• 23:17
  Speaker 2: direct competitor. And then you know, the other thing too
• 23:21
  Speaker 2: is just frequency. How many have they brought to us
• 23:24
  Speaker 2: in the past, That should be a leading indicator of
• 23:26
  Speaker 2: how many they'll probably bring to you in the future, Right,
• 23:29
  Speaker 2: it can it.
• 23:30
  Speaker 3: Can be Actually the you talk about some things which
• 23:35
  Speaker 3: I put in slightly different buckets, right, Hopefully they'll they're relatable.
• 23:39
  Speaker 3: And it's something that we call basic referral math, that is,
• 23:46
  Speaker 3: a referral source is only going to bring you business
• 23:49
  Speaker 3: that you want if they have three key qualities, the
• 23:52
  Speaker 3: skills to refer, the willingness to refer and the opportunities
• 23:58
  Speaker 3: to refer. And when you talk about in connection with
• 24:02
  Speaker 3: the relevant ICP, that we're talking about the opportunities that
• 24:06
  Speaker 3: people have to refer the business that you want. But
• 24:09
  Speaker 3: they have to have all those qualities, willingness, and you
• 24:14
  Speaker 3: talk about competitors. Are competitors going to bring you business?
• 24:17
  Speaker 3: Probably not, So we want to evaluate potential referral source
• 24:22
  Speaker 3: candidates among the dimensions of scale, willingness, and opportunity. Now
• 24:28
  Speaker 3: there is a very detailed question guide in get referred
• 24:32
  Speaker 3: to get started, and the process that you do that
• 24:36
  Speaker 3: is that first you take a look at people within
• 24:41
  Speaker 3: your orbit, and it's probably not going to be existing clients,
• 24:45
  Speaker 3: although existing clients can be great sources of referrals, but
• 24:49
  Speaker 3: actually within a lot of research and it's professional colleagues
• 24:54
  Speaker 3: that are more likely to can we talk about research
• 24:57
  Speaker 3: in the book as to who's likely to refer, But
• 25:00
  Speaker 3: those three qualities are our key. So you start with
• 25:04
  Speaker 3: taking a look at your orbit and you feel them
• 25:07
  Speaker 3: out about their past experience in referring, and you can
• 25:12
  Speaker 3: ask them a simple question, do you refer business? When
• 25:17
  Speaker 3: do you refer business? You are looking for a pattern
• 25:23
  Speaker 3: of referral behavior doesn't mean that they're going to bring
• 25:26
  Speaker 3: you everything right away or that they're awesome at doing it,
• 25:31
  Speaker 3: but having that habit of looking for opportunities to refer
• 25:38
  Speaker 3: is a predominant characteristic of a successful referral candidate. So
• 25:45
  Speaker 3: you've spoken maybe to half a dozen people, maybe you
• 25:48
  Speaker 3: start with an orbit of ten, you speak to to
• 25:52
  Speaker 3: all of them, and you're down to six people who
• 25:54
  Speaker 3: have demonstrated that they have a history of referring, and
• 25:59
  Speaker 3: you just go have a coffee with them and find out, Hey,
• 26:02
  Speaker 3: what does it take for people for you to refer?
• 26:05
  Speaker 3: So understand a bit of them. Then then it's a
• 26:10
  Speaker 3: bit of a drill down. Then it makes sense to
• 26:12
  Speaker 3: have with those people that you've narrowed in. I have
• 26:15
  Speaker 3: one on one interviews to dig deeper into questions like
• 26:22
  Speaker 3: why don't you refer us, why do you refer competitors?
• 26:28
  Speaker 3: What would it take to get you to refer us?
• 26:32
  Speaker 3: And I strongly advocate using a third party to have
• 26:37
  Speaker 3: those conversations. And here's the reason, because if these are
• 26:40
  Speaker 3: people within your orbit who you've done business with, or
• 26:44
  Speaker 3: who you know professionally or personally, they will be reluctant
• 26:50
  Speaker 3: to tell you the full story as to why they
• 26:53
  Speaker 3: may not refer you. But if you bring a third party,
• 26:57
  Speaker 3: and that's again something that we often do with our clients.
• 27:00
  Speaker 3: We sit down with their potential referral source candidates, so
• 27:04
  Speaker 3: we have real open discussions about what it takes for
• 27:09
  Speaker 3: them to refer and we evaluate them on again, I'm
• 27:12
  Speaker 3: going to say it again, skills, willingness, and opportunities to refer. Well.
• 27:18
  Speaker 4: I like that.
• 27:19
  Speaker 2: I've never really considered bringing a third party into that discussion,
• 27:24
  Speaker 2: but I can see the tremendous value in doing that
• 27:26
  Speaker 2: where you can get more candid feedback far from your
• 27:31
  Speaker 2: referral sources because they don't want to offend you exactly
• 27:35
  Speaker 2: for whatever reason, and maybe just a misperception on their
• 27:38
  Speaker 2: part that they think they would offend you, I guess.
• 27:40
  Speaker 2: So this is very powerful information. And Andrew, we're already
• 27:45
  Speaker 2: at the top of the show, so we will have
• 27:48
  Speaker 2: to pick up this discussion again in the next episode. Again,
• 27:52
  Speaker 2: we thank you so much for your generosity, folks. I'm
• 27:55
  Speaker 2: showing just where we've come so far. We talked about
• 27:58
  Speaker 2: step one setting the goals, step to get referral ready,
• 28:03
  Speaker 2: Step three, evaluate the referral sources. We're taking time to
• 28:06
  Speaker 2: really painstakingly talk about these first few steps because it's
• 28:10
  Speaker 2: so critical for establishing that solid foundation first. You don't
• 28:15
  Speaker 2: want to build your referral house on shaky ground. And so, Andrew,
• 28:21
  Speaker 2: thank you so much for sharing your time and insights
• 28:24
  Speaker 2: with us. I am just so fascinated by the depth
• 28:26
  Speaker 2: of the knowledge that you have and how folks can
• 28:29
  Speaker 2: really contribute and implement these tactical tools in a referral
• 28:35
  Speaker 2: program to be referral ready and folks again. All of
• 28:41
  Speaker 2: this is packed into Andrew's five star rated book on Amazon.
• 28:47
  Speaker 2: The book is called Get Referred. It's a number one
• 28:50
  Speaker 2: best seller on Amazon. You can grab it in paperback,
• 28:54
  Speaker 2: you can grab it in the kindle version, of course,
• 28:57
  Speaker 2: and you can join us here again in the next
• 29:01
  Speaker 2: episode to continue the path as we walk through a
• 29:06
  Speaker 2: implementation methodology for managed referral programs. Andrew, before we end
• 29:13
  Speaker 2: the show, how can folks follow your work? How can
• 29:16
  Speaker 2: they get in touch with you?
• 29:18
  Speaker 3: As always? Feel free to reach out to me via LinkedIn.
• 29:22
  Speaker 3: You can reach out to me at Andrew b at
• 29:25
  Speaker 3: get Referred dot biz. You can I'll say, contact Tony,
• 29:33
  Speaker 3: contact Tony badger him and.
• 29:36
  Speaker 2: I will be a referral source for you. That's true,
• 29:41
  Speaker 2: all right, great, Andrew, thank you so much for joining
• 29:45
  Speaker 2: us in this second episode in our multi part series
• 29:48
  Speaker 2: talking about implementation of referral management programs, and folks who
• 29:53
  Speaker 2: are listening, we'll look forward to seeing you in the
• 29:56
  Speaker 2: next episode as well. Thank you, Andrew, thank you.
• 29:59
  Speaker 3: Tony, thank you all.
• 30:03
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• 30:07
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• 30:11
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• 30:16
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