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Will Fulton — Confidence Comes After Action, Not Before · The Sharon Francisco Show

• 0:02
  SPEAKER_01: Today, we are joined by the amazing Will Fulton, who brings more than 20 years of experience in business advisory.
• 0:10
  SPEAKER_01: 12 years ago, he founded the Trusted Advisor Network.
• 0:14
  SPEAKER_01: Before that, Will had two business partners and built an incredible franchise network of 120 franchisees.
• 0:20
  SPEAKER_01: Over many years, Will has trained hundreds, I reckon it's got to be thousands, Will, hundreds of consultants and coaches and created programs that have helped thousands of clients grow stronger, more successful, profitable businesses.
• 0:34
  SPEAKER_01: At the heart of Will's work is a belief we can absolutely share.
• 0:39
  SPEAKER_01: Business advice should be simple, practical, and accessible, even when it comes to financials.
• 0:46
  SPEAKER_01: Will, welcome to the Sharon Francisco Show.
• 0:49
  SPEAKER_01: I'm so excited to have this conversation with you.
• 0:51
  SPEAKER_01: How are you?
• 0:52
  SPEAKER_01: Thanks, Sharon.
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_00: It's great to finally catch up.
• 0:55
  SPEAKER_00: I think we've been talking about probably doing this for a couple of years.
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_01: It's been a while.
• 0:59
  SPEAKER_01: I've had to really put your arm behind your back to go, well, let's do that.
• 1:03
  SPEAKER_00: I'm a bit of a backstage guy, but then you bring you bring out the front stage and if you want to say that.
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you, Will.
• 1:09
  SPEAKER_01: And I also should add, you know, Will and I have known each other for many, many weeks, probably nearly 30 years.
• 1:14
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, Will, we were back together with Action Coach.
• 1:17
  SPEAKER_01: You were an action coach back in the day.
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_01: And of course, you know, I was an accountability coach and I had you come in and speak to my coaches.
• 1:24
  SPEAKER_01: And I was forever grateful because you were a very high banking coach back then.
• 1:28
  SPEAKER_01: And obviously you've turned that career into some amazing stuff.
• 1:32
  SPEAKER_01: And I really want to get into your head around the conversations that you have with business owners and the kind of more of the subconscious stuff that you see go on in businesses that really stop us from growing and stop us from seeing our full potential.
• 1:46
  SPEAKER_01: So let's kick off.
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_01: After more than 20 to they have to be nearly 30 years in doing this, right?
• 1:52
  SPEAKER_00: No, I reckon it's not.
• 1:53
  SPEAKER_00: I reckon it's more like sort of early 20s.
• 1:56
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm gonna stick to that because that's some terminal.
• 1:59
  SPEAKER_00: It's worse.
• 2:00
  SPEAKER_01: That's gonna stay for the next 20 years.
• 2:02
  SPEAKER_01: We'll just keep it at early 20s.
• 2:04
  SPEAKER_00: Early 20s go to early 20s is good.
• 2:06
  SPEAKER_01: Sounds good.
• 2:06
  SPEAKER_01: Sounds good.
• 2:07
  SPEAKER_01: So after more than 20 years around business owners, what's the most uncomfortable thing or truth about business growth that most people don't want to hear?
• 2:16
  SPEAKER_01: So the stuff that they probably know that needs to happen, but they don't really want to face.
• 2:20
  SPEAKER_01: What have you found that to be, Will?
• 2:23
  SPEAKER_00: I think I think when you try to grow anything, uh a lot of a lot of demons come up.
• 2:31
  SPEAKER_00: Um and I think as much as anything, people sort of confronting those things presents all sorts of challenges in the way of what would be very simple sort of strategies to do.
• 2:44
  SPEAKER_00: I'll give you a really simple example.
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_00: I think pricing is probably the most psychological thing a business owner is ever going to confront.
• 2:52
  SPEAKER_00: So when we talk about things like, you know, do you have prices that reflect your value, or are you trying to give people a good deal?
• 3:01
  SPEAKER_00: Then that sort of brings up like what am I worth?
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_00: And the minute it brings up sort of worth situations, it becomes a reflection of how people feel about themselves.
• 3:10
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, from a logical point of view, we can sort of run costings and have a look at prices compared to costs and have a look at margins and even do, you know, research in the marketplace to find what other people are charging.
• 3:25
  SPEAKER_00: But when it comes to actually getting the business owner to make the decision, man, that can be so super confronting.
• 3:30
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that really comes down to the what am I worth question when it comes to pricing.
• 3:36
  SPEAKER_00: So that's that's an example.
• 3:38
  SPEAKER_00: But I also think that when people decide they want to grow, there's all sorts of other things that hang around with that.
• 3:46
  SPEAKER_00: Like, can I actually, am I capable of it?
• 3:49
  SPEAKER_00: And if I haven't had an experience of business growth in my business, what allows me to think that this is actually even possible for me?
• 3:56
  SPEAKER_00: I see other people on success stories, but I don't sort of relate to their stories because that's what happens to other people.
• 4:04
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, there's a lot of belief sort of things that I think come up.
• 4:07
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and that's probably the hardest thing to deal with is people's sort of negativity towards themselves or their own restrictions that they put on themselves.
• 4:15
  SPEAKER_00: And they're all very unexpected things and weird kind of relationships that they have with things like money and uh self-worth and those sorts of things.
• 4:24
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, we can get all the advice right, um, but when the head's kind of moving around a bit, it it makes it a bit of a challenge sometimes.
• 4:32
  SPEAKER_01: So it's interesting, yeah.
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_01: And I know a lot of the times, in especially in our industry with the bookkeeping and accounting world, that it's like if I just get the script on how to increase the prices, or I just know if I can just work out how to do value pricing, then that will be the answer, or if there's some special program or uh thing to do that's kind of like that's the answer, I'll get that.
• 4:54
  SPEAKER_01: But when we've got all this other subconscious stuff going on, I know there's uh I saw a post on LinkedIn recently that you know this lady was really sort of going to town on the belief thing.
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_01: She says, you know, it's it's the practical stuff, it's the this whole mindset stuff is just a whole bunch of crap.
• 5:11
  SPEAKER_01: It's just you when you identify what you need to do, you just do it.
• 5:15
  SPEAKER_01: And and that's so far from from my perspective, that's so far from the truth.
• 5:20
  SPEAKER_01: Because if it was practical, wouldn't we all be millionaires?
• 5:24
  SPEAKER_00: Well, yeah, I mean, it is, I don't know, mindset stuff can get very naval gazy.
• 5:30
  SPEAKER_00: And and the the challenge, I think, in working with other people on their success is that I feel like you always walk a tight rope.
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_00: And the tightrope is do I just give the advice and say, for the love of God, can you just do that?
• 5:43
  SPEAKER_00: Versus the we got to get you in the right my right mindset to be able to do that.
• 5:48
  SPEAKER_00: And I think it changes in terms of what works.
• 5:51
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes you can just boss someone into an instruction and just say, case you're done.
• 5:56
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and they get the belief after they do it and say, hey, that wasn't so bad.
• 6:00
  SPEAKER_00: But other times there's all sorts of stuff that's in the way.
• 6:03
  SPEAKER_00: The other thing I want to say about mindset is I reckon there's a lot of people that would be kind of anti-the-mindset brigade of, you know, like who you spoke about.
• 6:11
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 6:12
  SPEAKER_00: But the minute you sort of start dealing with things like procrastination and I didn't get it done because I was too busy, or I don't know how, all of those sort of unresourceful kind of things that people say, that's mindset.
• 6:24
  SPEAKER_00: Now, whether they actually resonate with the concept that it is their own mindset getting in the way or not, is entirely their business.
• 6:33
  SPEAKER_00: But the minute somebody says I didn't have time or I or I couldn't get it done because, or any of those that excuse kind of stuff, that's mindset.
• 6:41
  SPEAKER_00: So I don't know, sometimes you've got to dress mindset up in a different kind of uniform for it to be relatable as something that people recognize as needing to change, you know?
• 6:51
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, definitely.
• 6:52
  SPEAKER_01: So I know back in the day when you were a coach, you were banking very high dollars per month.
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_01: And to have that level of belief, that's why I wanted you to come in and speak with the coaches that I was coaching.
• 7:05
  SPEAKER_01: And because you did have that belief you were able to create that sort of business, where does that belief come from and how could we foster it and learn from you to build that belief?
• 7:15
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I think I'd answer that in two ways.
• 7:18
  SPEAKER_00: I came off a pretty reasonably successful corporate kind of wicket.
• 7:23
  SPEAKER_00: So I always had a belief that I I had a uh a word sort of built into what I expected to be able to make.
• 7:30
  SPEAKER_00: So I think that helped a lot because I compared against what I was getting in corporate.
• 7:35
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 7:35
  SPEAKER_00: But the other thing, the other thing is when you know that you've got a formula for what you do to create success for other people and you can just do that and you can quantify it, I feel like that changes things a lot as well.
• 7:50
  SPEAKER_00: So I think for the the people that you talk to a lot, there is a formula there that you could probably come up with that if you do these 10 things with clients, you know that they're going to be effective in the way that they operate, uh, whether that's bookkeeping or accounting or whatever that is.
• 8:09
  SPEAKER_00: And if you can back yourself to get them to do those 10 things, and you know that outcome for them is going to be like really, really good, then I would suggest that you should be rather bulletproof in your pricing and with any prospect that comes along or opportunity that comes along that you'd be able to get that.
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_00: And I guess what I found is I got really, really bulletproof with my client results.
• 8:35
  SPEAKER_00: I knew that I could do this and do that and do these other things.
• 8:38
  SPEAKER_00: And I had my checklist of stuff that I would just go in and do.
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_00: And my my other thing that I found was like the first 30 to 90 days with a client, that's like it's like golden hour in the evening, you know, when everything glows, you know?
• 8:53
  SPEAKER_00: So you you glow when you start with a client.
• 8:56
  SPEAKER_00: That's when your value is at its highest because they just started paying you.
• 9:00
  SPEAKER_00: And that means that they will listen to absolutely everything possible and want to get as much out of that relationship at the start, more so than when you've been with them for sort of three, six months and that sort of a thing.
• 9:12
  SPEAKER_00: So if you see that first 30 days, that first 90 days as like golden time with your client, then every instruction that you give them, you can have a high expectation that they should be able to get that done.
• 9:25
  SPEAKER_00: And if you know exactly what they need to do in those first 30 to 60, 90 days, and you just charge and get that done, and you quantify it, you can very quickly say, hey, I've found my fee.
• 9:36
  SPEAKER_00: I've done a whole bunch of work with you, and we can see the outcome for it, that means for the next two, three, five years, I'm already paid for.
• 9:45
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that's a really strong position to get, and I think it's a very unique position at the start of a relationship.
• 9:51
  SPEAKER_00: And I would say that that goes for pretty much any service business.
• 9:54
  SPEAKER_00: If you can be a rock star within 30 to 90 days with your clients, not only do you get clients for life, but you also get a level of bulletproof around what you can earn and what you can charge and the kind of people that you can decide to have as clients.
• 10:08
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that's really powerful.
• 10:10
  SPEAKER_01: So is it fair to say that you had a time in your life where you did second guess yourself and and you grew with the confidence as you as you worked?
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_00: I think I was pretty lucky to get into this quite early.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah.
• 10:25
  SPEAKER_00: But I was I was in my what early 30s when I got into this.
• 10:28
  SPEAKER_00: And coming out of corporate, I was I don't know, I was I was pretty arrogant.
• 10:34
  SPEAKER_01: I was very honest of you.
• 10:35
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I couldn't imagine that.
• 10:37
  SPEAKER_00: No, no, I I would I would I would go so far as to say I was probably a bit of an asshole.
• 10:43
  SPEAKER_00: I know that's awful to say that, but but I I really thought, you know, I I could pretty much do anything.
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_00: And I I guess you know, that that's a comes with a bit of youth and all the rest of it.
• 10:52
  SPEAKER_00: And I think you know, to maintain that level uh I found quite challenging because you know, when you get into your own business, you know, it is a bit of a roller coaster.
• 11:02
  SPEAKER_00: There are times when you feel amazing, and there's times when you frankly feel like a sack of shit.
• 11:08
  SPEAKER_00: So yeah.
• 11:08
  SPEAKER_00: So uh, you know, I I think part of what going through the good times gives you is enough momentum to know that that time can come again.
• 11:20
  SPEAKER_00: And I think part of getting through the tough times for me has been sort of figuring out like how I make sense of when things aren't going well.
• 11:29
  SPEAKER_00: Where where I'm at right now, like I still have times where I feel like completely bulletproof and other times when I feel awful.
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_00: And the awful times, and I don't think this is I didn't expect to be talking about this right now, Shaw, but there you go.
• 11:43
  SPEAKER_00: Um I I think I think that's a bit of a reality of just dealing with the fact that you're in business.
• 11:49
  SPEAKER_00: And the way I view the the tough times is I view it like like you've got a susceptibility to getting the flu once in a while over winter.
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_01: Interesting, yeah.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_00: And and and the thing is with the flu, like you feel like dog.
• 12:03
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I mean, man, I was I was out a few weeks ago with the flu, so this is kind of where a bit of this realization came from.
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_00: And I thought, my God, I am so low, like I'm used to really high energy levels, and part of my exercise routine is so I can maintain those high energy levels because I never want to have any excuse for feeling flat ever.
• 12:18
  SPEAKER_00: So, but going for the flu is like I was horizontal for like 10 days, and I think part of understanding the highs and lows of being in business is understanding that the lows are like having the flu.
• 12:31
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it passes.
• 12:33
  SPEAKER_00: And there's stuff that you can do to prevent that, intensive stuff that you can take and stuff that you can do to keep as healthy as possible.
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_00: And I think the highs and lows of business when you feel like not so good, if you view it like it's a flu or like a cold, you know it's gonna pass.
• 12:49
  SPEAKER_00: And all you can ever do with that is is ride it out and know that there's some preventatives that you can take going into it because it is gonna come again because you can't avoid it.
• 12:59
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but if you know that it passes, I think there's some comfort in that.
• 13:03
  SPEAKER_00: So that's a bit of, I don't know, how I sort of ride the highs and know that I can nail it.
• 13:08
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but also if I know that I can sort of get through the fail it parts as well, then whether I'm sort of nailing or failing it, uh it's all just part of you know doing the do, you know.
• 13:18
  SPEAKER_01: I love the analogy and I think it's so true because I think when you feel when you're down there, you think, oh, this is it forever.
• 13:24
  SPEAKER_01: It's like this, like all the time.
• 13:26
  SPEAKER_01: And it's it and it's not, it does pass.
• 13:28
  SPEAKER_01: And I think a lot of the things that when you're down there and you're naval gazing and you think, gosh, why am I here?
• 13:34
  SPEAKER_01: That's where the true lessons are.
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_01: And that's where you come out of that and you go, right, I'm gonna figure out a way to get through this or whatever it might be.
• 13:41
  SPEAKER_01: But that's the tricky times, unfortunately, seem to be the the lessons, don't they?
• 13:47
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 13:48
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I mean, there's there's a a million quotes around that, you know.
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_00: You know, there's there's safety in a port, but boats weren't made to stay in port, they're made to go out in the ocean where all the danger is.
• 14:00
  SPEAKER_00: So, and that, I mean, I don't know.
• 14:02
  SPEAKER_00: There's there's lots of sort of different maxims to live by, I guess.
• 14:05
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but yeah, and I do I do think the tough times are there to remind us of of our capability and our resilience to sort of pop out of those sorts of things.
• 14:15
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I also think there's a lot of innovation that comes with dealing with crap, basically.
• 14:22
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I I think from a creative standpoint, it forces us to reflect on what's going well and what's not going well.
• 14:30
  SPEAKER_00: And I think oftentimes the adversity uh forces a lot of confrontation about stuff that's kind of been swept under the carpet when things are going well.
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that's a really healthy sort of place to be.
• 14:41
  SPEAKER_00: So in that way, I mean, I mean, it's kind of cliche to talk about seasons, but essentially that's kind of what it I feel like that's kind of how it works.
• 14:50
  SPEAKER_00: And it works for the good times as well.
• 14:52
  SPEAKER_00: Because like I know that I've, you know, been in a situation where, you know, bankings have been fantastic and things are just going rockingly well.
• 15:01
  SPEAKER_00: And the the the weird thing is the expectation for that to succeed is just as strong and the disappointment is just as strong when they don't last as what it is when you're down in the dips and you think, oh, this is gonna last forever, but but the reverse is so when you start pulling out, it's like, oh thank God, I don't think it would last forever, but certainly felt like it was going to, you know.
• 15:25
  SPEAKER_00: So I mean, if you sort of see things as as as kind of cycles and uh and you know that every cycle is is there for a reason to to help you know craft the kind of business and lifestyle that you sort of want to have.
• 15:40
  SPEAKER_00: Um personally I found that sort of helpful um in my sort of journey because I don't know, I'm sure your bookkeepers and accounts will be the same way in terms of like once you know how to do something, you tend to sort of stay in that thing for a long time.
• 15:54
  SPEAKER_00: So the opportunity for like massive change of career doesn't really sort of come up.
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_00: Like I think I'm kind of useless for anything else apart from what I do right now.
• 16:02
  SPEAKER_00: Um, so it means you've got to kind of constant come to grips with the idea that you're gonna be doing the this for the next like decade, 15 years.
• 16:10
  SPEAKER_00: That seems like a really, really long time.
• 16:13
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, coming to terms with the the ebbs and flows of it, I think is a big part of being able to be content, not necessarily happy, but content with the way things work.
• 16:24
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know, that's how I seem to look at it.
• 16:27
  SPEAKER_01: And that's a big thing with business with owning your own business, isn't it?
• 16:30
  SPEAKER_01: Because it's the battle a lot of the times, is the battle in our head around how to manage all the ups and downs and sometimes the feedback you get and the good and the bad and the ugly with all of that, it's managing that and and almost getting yourself to be a little bit more, I guess, structured around making sure you're having the fun, making sure that you're doing the things that perhaps feel like nice things to have, but they're actually essential, like holidays and like start times and stop times and the sort of clients you want to work with and all of that.
• 17:04
  SPEAKER_01: That's all in our hands as business owners.
• 17:06
  SPEAKER_01: But we actually have to make and it's weird to say this, but it's like the tricky thing of, yeah, I'm gonna have four weeks' holiday here or or six, and I'm not gonna work in that time.
• 17:17
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm gonna knock off at five o'clock every afternoon, and I'm gonna have every weekend off, and I'm gonna enjoy this whole process rather than allow it to just totally consume you.
• 17:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think that's really, really true.
• 17:30
  SPEAKER_00: Like what are we we're like what mid-50s now, right?
• 17:34
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, if we're not gonna enjoy the time that we've got now we're like when, not now and when kind of stuff.
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_00: And I also think like booking, booking things like holidays and that sort of a thing, it can feel like really for me anyway.
• 17:48
  SPEAKER_00: I'm one of those sort of gen X kind of people that feels guilty but don't work.
• 17:52
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know if you're the same.
• 17:53
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I think we're all the same.
• 17:54
  SPEAKER_01: It's weird.
• 17:55
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and I think I think you've you've you've got to make the effort to actually put something in a calendar and then go for it.
• 18:00
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, what I was talking about before with the sort of highs and lows, I know that I, and I know you have too, had holidays that you've come back from and you've come back to an absolute frickin' disaster.
• 18:10
  SPEAKER_00: And it's like, why did I go?
• 18:12
  SPEAKER_00: Why did I go on?
• 18:13
  SPEAKER_00: This this is but see that's part of it as well, because it's like, well, if I want to take a break of that sort of length or of that type, then whatever I'm coming back to, that's that's the job to fix that.
• 18:23
  SPEAKER_00: Because like we're not just wired to work for the rest of our lives, there has to be a degree of balance, and I actually think that one of the most depressing things ever in business is not having brightness of future towards something.
• 18:36
  SPEAKER_00: Like we all as humans need brightness of future.
• 18:39
  SPEAKER_00: And whether that's a an escape weekend or you know, a buckerless holiday, that we have to have something out there to work towards.
• 18:47
  SPEAKER_00: If it's just the same stuff on a different day for for you know, week in, week out, month and month, year in, year out, that's the that's the burnout.
• 18:57
  SPEAKER_00: That's the stuff that has people think, you know, questioning what am I doing with my life and that kind of stuff?
• 19:01
  SPEAKER_01: It's all about, yeah.
• 19:02
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, definitely, definitely.
• 19:04
  SPEAKER_01: Well, you've got an incredible ability to understand what makes people tick.
• 19:09
  SPEAKER_01: When a business owner says, I just need more clients, or you know, one sort of I just need more clients, or I just need to increase my price, or whatever it is, what do you immediately start looking for that's underneath that statement?
• 19:23
  SPEAKER_00: Um well, I guess what the big picture is.
• 19:27
  SPEAKER_00: Because a lot of people will say something that they need that's immediate.
• 19:32
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, money is a uh an obvious one.
• 19:34
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, you don't need more clients, you need more money.
• 19:37
  SPEAKER_00: So what for?
• 19:39
  SPEAKER_00: Like, what's the big idea?
• 19:40
  SPEAKER_00: Like, what do you need the money for?
• 19:41
  SPEAKER_00: Like, what would that later do that you can't write now?
• 19:44
  SPEAKER_00: Those are the sorts of things that I'm interested in finding out because ultimately people aren't motivated by more work and more clients is more work.
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_00: Well, not all the time, but a lot of the time.
• 19:56
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, it's it's it's like what are we actually aiming for here?
• 20:01
  SPEAKER_00: So I think a lot of business people I find lose sight of why they went into the thing to start with.
• 20:09
  SPEAKER_00: They lose sight of what they've already got and focus on what they don't have.
• 20:13
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, and I I think getting relativity back into the thought process for business owners is is a big part of working on basically how to have this something bigger than the past in terms of working together with the people.
• 20:27
  SPEAKER_00: People generally want to work with people like you and me because they know in their hearts that they've got more to give.
• 20:32
  SPEAKER_00: And left to their own devices, they know that there's some sabotage stuff that is happening that's causing them not to have that.
• 20:38
  SPEAKER_00: And whether they recognize that in sabotage or not really makes no difference.
• 20:42
  SPEAKER_00: All I got to do is look in the bank account and say, not enough.
• 20:45
  SPEAKER_00: All I got to do is see lack and think, God, I thought I'd be doing better than this to recognize that there's a gap.
• 20:51
  SPEAKER_00: Now, the minute that there's a gap, there's the well, what should I do about closing it?
• 20:55
  SPEAKER_00: Well, how I've been in this business for however many years and I've only got as far as I've got.
• 20:59
  SPEAKER_00: Maybe I need to look externally at what I can do to support me on that journey.
• 21:04
  SPEAKER_00: So I think for working with people and hearing people sort of wanting more or wanting better or whatever, I think that's really healthy.
• 21:12
  SPEAKER_00: But I still think it needs to come back to what is the bigger picture here?
• 21:16
  SPEAKER_00: What actually is the the brightness of future that you want?
• 21:19
  SPEAKER_00: If we got another 10 clients, what would break?
• 21:22
  SPEAKER_00: But on the um on the flip side of that, what would that allow you to do?
• 21:25
  SPEAKER_00: What kind of income would that give you?
• 21:27
  SPEAKER_00: What would you do with it?
• 21:28
  SPEAKER_00: You know, how does that align with what you thought you wanted or where you thought you wanted to be with your business when you started?
• 21:34
  SPEAKER_00: You know, take a bigger picture, change the context, and and oftentimes there's there's much more motivation in in a bigger context than there is in just one more client or a better client or a better income from a client or whatever.
• 21:49
  SPEAKER_00: So switching up the the context of what they're after, I find, and making it into something that's much, much bigger is oftentimes quite helpful, I find.
• 21:58
  SPEAKER_01: So for people out.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_01: There, listening, if if you feel like you want more clients to get more money, the the the process should be what for, and then work backwards from there and say, right, what is this for?
• 22:10
  SPEAKER_01: And then go all the things that's going to make your life easier or your business to run it easier or whatever.
• 22:15
  SPEAKER_01: You to be kind of motivated by the carrot rather than just, I just need more clients.
• 22:21
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and and yeah, I mean talk about carrot.
• 22:23
  SPEAKER_00: So I don't think you can talk about carrot without talking about stick as well.
• 22:26
  SPEAKER_00: Because I think there's there's there's plenty of like the alternative is mediocrity.
• 22:31
  SPEAKER_00: The alternative is more of the same.
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_00: The alternative is feeling like you've got so much more to give, and trying to sort of shake hands with the disappointment that you couldn't make it happen.
• 22:44
  SPEAKER_00: And and I think that as a stick is you need both.
• 22:48
  SPEAKER_00: And I I think that's I think that that that's true for a lot of people when they make decisions on wanting more.
• 22:55
  SPEAKER_00: They they definitely have to focus on the what am I moving towards, but they also need to focus on what am I moving uh against, what am I moving away from.
• 23:04
  SPEAKER_00: So it needs it needs both of those, and that's part of creating context.
• 23:07
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I love it.
• 23:08
  SPEAKER_01: I um I I'm gonna butcher this, but there's some sort of saying that says when you get on your deathbed, and the most disappointing thing of all is when you meet the person that you were meant to become in this lifetime and you haven't done it, and it's like, oh it's like because we all know that what's in us, we we have to somehow satisfy whatever that burning desire is inside us to be the most fully expressed that we can be in this lifetime, whatever that might be.
• 23:38
  SPEAKER_01: And I know for me that that burn has just getting stronger and stronger for me.
• 23:42
  SPEAKER_01: I I've just got so much I want to do in this lifetime.
• 23:46
  SPEAKER_01: And I feel like I'm even if I lived over a hundred, it's like I'm never gonna stop.
• 23:50
  SPEAKER_01: I just feel like there's so many cool things to experience in this world and and to kind of figure out what am I made of?
• 23:57
  SPEAKER_01: What can I what can I kind of see I can do and and play with that?
• 24:01
  SPEAKER_01: It's scary though, sometimes, Will.
• 24:04
  SPEAKER_01: Do you ever feel like that?
• 24:06
  SPEAKER_00: Um sometimes for sure.
• 24:08
  SPEAKER_00: I actually think it's it's it's different for different personalities.
• 24:12
  SPEAKER_00: I think some people like us, like we're both reasonably high-energy people, I'd say.
• 24:16
  SPEAKER_00: And for us, it's easy to get excited about stuff, which is awesome.
• 24:20
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and I know that we're not always like this.
• 24:22
  SPEAKER_00: No.
• 24:23
  SPEAKER_01: But but I think we've seen each other at our best and our worst, Will.
• 24:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, we have.
• 24:29
  SPEAKER_00: That's true.
• 24:30
  SPEAKER_00: But I I think for for everyone, there there's something that burns inside them that says, I know I'm capable of more.
• 24:36
  SPEAKER_00: More.
• 24:36
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I think there's a lot of us that will say, Oh God, I feel like the best kept secret kind of stuff.
• 24:41
  SPEAKER_00: Because I know I walk over coals for people.
• 24:43
  SPEAKER_00: I know I've got a lot to give, and I really love it when I see other people succeed.
• 24:47
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that not just people like us, I think actually that's a human trait that a lot of people have.
• 24:53
  SPEAKER_00: The the difference for people, I think, is like we we we get in such different weird circumstances life-wise that that have us say from time to time, how the frickin' heck did we get here?
• 25:07
  SPEAKER_01: Get here.
• 25:08
  SPEAKER_00: How did I get here?
• 25:09
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I've got all this mess happening in my life, and it's like, you know, what happened?
• 25:14
  SPEAKER_00: This this kind of wasn't in the rosy sort of magazine that I had looking in my early 20s and thought, ah, life's gonna be awesome.
• 25:20
  SPEAKER_00: Look at this.
• 25:24
  SPEAKER_00: There's a big pile of shit over here, and and unfortunately, you own it.
• 25:28
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 25:28
  SPEAKER_00: So I I think I I think for for all of us, that battle where it's not like rosy all the time, where yes, we know that we've got capability, there's also the idea that we actually can change things.
• 25:47
  SPEAKER_00: We can do something about things, we can prioritize things differently.
• 25:51
  SPEAKER_00: Like I know for a lot of the businesses that I've personally helped, and I know for a lot of the businesses that guys in our network have helped, the the difference between their businesses from month to month is always going to be the non-urgent things that they've actually managed to get around to doing.
• 26:13
  SPEAKER_00: So we give people well, all the stuff like like for instance, planning a holiday.
• 26:19
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, okay.
• 26:20
  SPEAKER_00: Like that is that is not urgent because I got 50 things on my to-do list that I'm never gonna get done if I start veering off and booking a holiday and having a look at what I want.
• 26:28
  SPEAKER_00: And and I use that as an extreme.
• 26:31
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but that isn't that's non-urgent.
• 26:34
  SPEAKER_00: Reviewing prices in the same way is non-urgent.
• 26:37
  SPEAKER_00: I know I keep on sort of coming back to price just because it's an easy one.
• 26:40
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 26:40
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but but any of those things that are non-urgent, like addressing a really negative team situation or staff situation, or actually sitting somebody down and saying, oh man, don't know about you, but I want to really enjoy coming to work every day, and it feels like there's work to do in that area.
• 26:56
  SPEAKER_00: Like confronting a problem like that, that can go for months, years without being confronted.
• 27:02
  SPEAKER_00: So once again, that's a non-urgent thing.
• 27:04
  SPEAKER_00: And generally speaking, the most progress that that I've observed is when people do non-urgent things.
• 27:12
  SPEAKER_00: Do what?
• 27:13
  SPEAKER_00: Non-urgent things.
• 27:14
  SPEAKER_00: Non-urgent things, yeah.
• 27:15
  SPEAKER_00: Non-urgent things.
• 27:16
  SPEAKER_00: And and the the more we can get people doing non-urgent things, the the more the shift happens in in the business.
• 27:25
  SPEAKER_00: And and it's almost the difference between strategic and operational.
• 27:28
  SPEAKER_00: Because like we're so tied up in operational so much of the time that doing anything strategic, let alone beyond strategic, into personal, in terms of like what do I actually have this business for?
• 27:38
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I have this business because I've got skills that I want to use and I've got uh a lifestyle that I want to bankroll.
• 27:44
  SPEAKER_00: And both of those things require of me an amount of work.
• 27:48
  SPEAKER_00: So the way that kind of plays out is I can do anything.
• 27:54
  SPEAKER_00: I've got all the urgent stuff that I need to do, all the deadlines that I've got ahead.
• 27:58
  SPEAKER_00: I think, you know, bookkeepers more than anyone have got the urgency stuff as an occupational hazard.
• 28:03
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, you've got so many dates to keep in your head, and you've got so many things that if that if it doesn't happen at a particular time, bad stuff happens for yourself, for the client.
• 28:11
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, repercussions are really quite catastrophic sometimes when you stuff dates up and and time is such a a big commodity, I think, particularly for bookkeepers and accountants.
• 28:22
  SPEAKER_00: So, so much is sort of geared around that sort of date-driven kind of urgency.
• 28:27
  SPEAKER_00: And to pull yourself out from that and say, actually, why I'm running this business?
• 28:31
  SPEAKER_00: What do I want out of this business?
• 28:32
  SPEAKER_00: What are the things that I absolutely have to put in my in my calendar that must get done, even though they're non-urgent, even though they don't have a date that's going to come and I'm going to get a massive catastrophic outcome if I if I miss the date?
• 28:45
  SPEAKER_00: It's turning the non-urgent into urgent and getting it on the to-do list and actually going through with it.
• 28:52
  SPEAKER_00: That is the difference between people that actually get anywhere and people that just spin the same year.
• 29:00
  SPEAKER_01: That's what I've seen.
• 29:01
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, it's kind of like the elephant in the room, isn't it?
• 29:03
  SPEAKER_01: Anything that we sort of like the non-urgent stuff or the things that we kind of try to push away and go, yeah, yeah, I know that's there, but it is like the elephant in the room.
• 29:11
  SPEAKER_01: And I know addressing that is one of the things, like, you know, if you've got a tricky team member that you need to sit down and talk with, and I know these are the sort of things that I work with clients about, which trying to understand how to have those sort of conversations in a way that, you know, they feel good about afterwards and things like that.
• 29:28
  SPEAKER_01: I came up with years ago when I was in corporate, actually, when I was given a lot, a lot of the jobs that I used to get when I was a franchise relationship manager and the different companies was the first one was generally to chase the debtors.
• 29:40
  SPEAKER_01: And quite often I was asked to let people go.
• 29:45
  SPEAKER_01: And and I know once they got to know me and they kind of knew that I had the ability to have a conversation with somebody that was tricky, but they got the outcome and it still felt okay.
• 29:56
  SPEAKER_01: I I thought, you know what, I'm I'm getting all these, I'm getting all these crappy jobs that people are giving me.
• 30:03
  SPEAKER_01: So then I made a decision back in when I was with Corporate years ago.
• 30:08
  SPEAKER_01: I I made a mental decision that I'm the tricky person to come to.
• 30:12
  SPEAKER_01: Like come to me with all the tricky problems because I'll solve them.
• 30:15
  SPEAKER_01: And I did it because I was getting them anyway.
• 30:17
  SPEAKER_01: And I thought, if I make a decision that I'm the person that solves tricky problems, at least I'll feel better about it.
• 30:24
  SPEAKER_01: Which I that's really helped me.
• 30:26
  SPEAKER_01: Like just that little brain thing has helped me with that.
• 30:30
  SPEAKER_01: How what how do you do tricky things?
• 30:32
  SPEAKER_01: What's your trick to do that?
• 30:35
  SPEAKER_00: Um, well, going back a step, I I do think one of the things that holds most of us back to our capability is just the fear of confrontation.
• 30:47
  SPEAKER_00: And and I think confrontation is what you're talking about.
• 30:50
  SPEAKER_00: You're talking about having a low level of fear around confrontation for people that owe money, for people that need to make decisions, uh, for people that are difficult to work with.
• 31:04
  SPEAKER_00: All of those require a level of confrontation.
• 31:07
  SPEAKER_00: And I think for most people, they just like it kind of nice and calm.
• 31:11
  SPEAKER_01: Calm.
• 31:12
  SPEAKER_00: But so to go against the nice and calm is is to decide on confrontation.
• 31:19
  SPEAKER_00: I guess my recipe for that is like how much do I want to be in denial that there's a whole lot of percolating stuff that's been kind of swept under the carpet that is gonna just faster and get worse and is gonna end up way more ugly unless I just do it.
• 31:38
  SPEAKER_00: And I think confrontation for most people is like we talked at the start of this conversation about mindset.
• 31:44
  SPEAKER_00: Um, fear of confrontation, that is a mindset issue.
• 31:49
  SPEAKER_00: So a decision to confront and a decision to be fearless around confrontation is a decision to address once again the non-urgent things because if you can sweep it under the carpet, it is by definition non-urgent.
• 32:03
  SPEAKER_01: Non-urgent, yes, yes, yes.
• 32:05
  SPEAKER_00: So interesting.
• 32:06
  SPEAKER_00: So with that comes uh a decision to confront.
• 32:11
  SPEAKER_00: And I think of uh to uh answer your question, I think back when we had like a lot of franchises, uh franchisees, when I had the franchise with two business partners.
• 32:23
  SPEAKER_01: That's your previous business for the audience.
• 32:25
  SPEAKER_01: So that was the previous Yes, yeah.
• 32:27
  SPEAKER_00: That that was like when you read my little intro, that was the when I had a franchise as a franchise, or um, I don't have that any longer.
• 32:35
  SPEAKER_00: Um, but the what I was gonna say about that was one of the things that caused that business to break apart was the culture was just extremely challenging.
• 32:45
  SPEAKER_00: And it was a misalignment with one of the business partners, essentially around values.
• 32:51
  SPEAKER_00: And I just remember being absolutely ripped apart with the the values that I had versus the values that they had that were just so incompatible, it was really crushing for for me.
• 33:04
  SPEAKER_00: And this was a very successful franchise.
• 33:06
  SPEAKER_00: I remember looking in the um in the bank one time, there's like a million dollars cash just sitting in the bank.
• 33:11
  SPEAKER_00: We were making a lot of money, yeah, but it it was so toxic that it didn't matter.
• 33:18
  SPEAKER_00: I it for all of I couldn't care less.
• 33:20
  SPEAKER_00: I just I just didn't feel like I was in the right spot.
• 33:24
  SPEAKER_00: Um I I tried to buy the thing, but that didn't work out.
• 33:28
  SPEAKER_00: So essentially I ended up selling the thing to get out and then starting what I've done now.
• 33:32
  SPEAKER_00: The reason I talk about that is because to get through that mismatch of of values was the hardest thing I think I've ever done.
• 33:42
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, and to deal with the what life was like on the other side of making a really hard decision to to walk away from all of that.
• 33:49
  SPEAKER_00: Because I'm not just walking away from a toxic relationship with a business partner, I'm walking away from all the relationships that I had with the franchisees, which were amazing.
• 33:57
  SPEAKER_00: So, so I think when you go through something, I don't necessarily think like that, because I think we all go through difficult times in our life.
• 34:06
  SPEAKER_00: I think that is probably the most reassuring thing for me personally to say if I can get through that, I can get through anything.
• 34:13
  SPEAKER_00: And I'd guarantee that everyone who's listening to this, because we're all human, all of us have been through some really shitty times in our life.
• 34:22
  SPEAKER_00: And I think part of confrontation is realizing life goes on.
• 34:26
  SPEAKER_00: We can get on the other side of it.
• 34:28
  SPEAKER_00: Life has gone on.
• 34:30
  SPEAKER_00: So, as bad as it's ever been, you know that you've gotten and risen above all of that.
• 34:36
  SPEAKER_00: So, whatever you're gonna do with this little confrontation thing, whether it's with a client or a team member, um, or with anything that sort of amounts to confrontation, it's not going to be as bad as what you've already done and survive.
• 34:49
  SPEAKER_00: So, like get stuck in, you're stronger than you think you are, you know?
• 34:53
  SPEAKER_01: It's so true.
• 34:53
  SPEAKER_01: And how often do you do something like that?
• 34:55
  SPEAKER_01: And you think, gosh, that it wasn't as hard as I thought.
• 34:58
  SPEAKER_01: I built it up bigger in my head because you think about it and you think about it and you play it over in your mind, you play different scenarios and things.
• 35:03
  SPEAKER_01: And then when you actually do it, it's like a monkey off your back, you go, thank goodness.
• 35:07
  SPEAKER_01: And then you're able to then get on with things.
• 35:09
  SPEAKER_01: But it's like a pressure cooker building when you're thinking about doing it and taking the step to do it as like the release.
• 35:16
  SPEAKER_01: Whatever the outcome is, you can just grow from that and learn.
• 35:19
  SPEAKER_00: And that's I really do think that that's where momentum comes from.
• 35:23
  SPEAKER_00: Momentum.
• 35:25
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I read a book once by a guy called Daniel Flynn, um, who runs the company, he's a young entrepreneur, uh, Aussie guy, Melbourne-based, um, called Thank You.
• 35:33
  SPEAKER_00: Um the thank you story.
• 35:35
  SPEAKER_00: You guys have the thank you brand.
• 35:36
  SPEAKER_00: I think I have a lot of things.
• 35:37
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, I do know.
• 35:38
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 35:38
  SPEAKER_00: That's Daniel, Daniel Flynn.
• 35:39
  SPEAKER_00: So he needed to raise some money because he needed a lot of money to launch a new product.
• 35:44
  SPEAKER_00: So he's like, what am I gonna do?
• 35:46
  SPEAKER_00: He's like, I I'm so young, I can barely write a book now because like I've only just started.
• 35:50
  SPEAKER_00: So he called his book chapter one, which I thought was really cool.
• 35:54
  SPEAKER_01: That's cool.
• 35:54
  SPEAKER_01: I love that.
• 35:55
  SPEAKER_01: That is really cool.
• 35:56
  SPEAKER_00: And then he had this weird business model where he actually gave away the book in exchange for whatever you want to pay for it, and he had to have that across a retail system.
• 36:03
  SPEAKER_01: Wow.
• 36:04
  SPEAKER_00: The guy's awesome.
• 36:05
  SPEAKER_00: The guy's awesome.
• 36:06
  SPEAKER_00: Anyway, he talks about momentum in his book, and he reckons that momentum is one of the hardest things to get and the easiest things to lose.
• 36:14
  SPEAKER_00: And I reckon when you start doing things like confrontation and when you start actually addressing your fear of what might happen if this goes bad or what might happen, um, and so therefore I'll avoid it, whether it be a client situation, team member situation, or even you know what you need to do.
• 36:32
  SPEAKER_00: Increasing prices, systemizing, whatever.
• 36:35
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, all of those amounts of confrontation.
• 36:37
  SPEAKER_00: But if you can actually figure, look, in life, I've been through worse than this, and it's not going to be as bad as that.
• 36:42
  SPEAKER_00: And I survived that, so it'll survive this.
• 36:44
  SPEAKER_00: If you can do that and and get some momentum with that, there's a level of of bulletproof that that we get to feel.
• 36:52
  SPEAKER_00: I I remember doing that when I when we started this business, um the Trusted Visor Network.
• 36:57
  SPEAKER_00: Um, we didn't have a single member, but we were we start from zero.
• 37:02
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 37:02
  SPEAKER_00: And and we we were spending, you know,$10,000,$12,000,$15,000 a month on advertising.
• 37:08
  SPEAKER_00: And I remember just getting this massive cash burn when we started, it's like, how many how many months do you have to do this before we realize like, I ain't gonna get a job, this is just too much.
• 37:20
  SPEAKER_02: That's scary.
• 37:21
  SPEAKER_02: I did not know that at the beginning.
• 37:23
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, but but the thing is, I think it took about three or four months for us to get our first guy, you know, in in into the whole thing.
• 37:30
  SPEAKER_00: And we had our first train with four people there, and you know, it barely paid for the month, and and we were we were still you know quite down because it was now a few months to get there.
• 37:39
  SPEAKER_00: But you know, I've had so many people now say, Oh, you're so lucky to have a work in a team of people, just like, yeah, it's not not really that much luck.
• 37:48
  SPEAKER_00: It was really a case of just doing something that not many people are prepared to do, which is like deal with a cash burn longer than any sensible person would put up with and get on the other side of it, knowing that if you trust your yourself in terms of being able to provide value, and you trust this idea that if you expose people, enough people to your value, they someone's gonna see it and they're gonna say, sure, that sounds cool.
• 38:15
  SPEAKER_00: Let's do something together.
• 38:16
  SPEAKER_02: And it's like, yeah, yeah.
• 38:18
  SPEAKER_00: So but but that that's momentum, like like that's confronting fear around loss of money.
• 38:25
  SPEAKER_00: I remember what the the first piece of software I built, uh, had a client and he was a software engineer.
• 38:31
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, and I and I remember going out to lunch with him, his name is Ross, and Ross said, How do you approach this?
• 38:37
  SPEAKER_00: Like you've got so many different clients.
• 38:39
  SPEAKER_00: And it's like, well, I've actually figured out my little formula.
• 38:43
  SPEAKER_00: I've got 24 different things that I do with clients, and I've got seven different business types.
• 38:48
  SPEAKER_00: And of those 24, I just filter the 24 by the business type and come up with that's my formula for that particular business type.
• 38:56
  SPEAKER_00: Then I know that there's like 16 different numbers that I need from the business to be able to calculate what that's worth.
• 39:01
  SPEAKER_00: And that means at the back of an envelope, I can kind of figure out if I worked with you, here's how much money I think I could make for you based on business type and based on those 24 different strategies.
• 39:11
  SPEAKER_00: And he was just like, that's awesome.
• 39:14
  SPEAKER_00: I got to build some software for you.
• 39:15
  SPEAKER_00: If you put that together in a software program, that would be amazing.
• 39:19
  SPEAKER_00: It would mean that you could quantify out how much money you could make every business owner before you started working with him.
• 39:24
  SPEAKER_00: I was just like, damn, this sounds amazing.
• 39:26
  SPEAKER_00: I love that.
• 39:28
  SPEAKER_00: When do you reckon you can build it?
• 39:29
  SPEAKER_00: He's like, I reckon it'll take me three months.
• 39:31
  SPEAKER_00: It's like, cool, okay, you got a budget for me?
• 39:33
  SPEAKER_00: He was like, Well, I was gonna ask you the same question.
• 39:35
  SPEAKER_00: I'm like, well, just just throw me three months of build.
• 39:38
  SPEAKER_00: Just just throw me three months.
• 39:40
  SPEAKER_00: He goes, I get 20 grand.
• 39:41
  SPEAKER_00: I'll do it for 20 grand.
• 39:43
  SPEAKER_00: I'm in, man.
• 39:44
  SPEAKER_00: I'm all in on this.
• 39:45
  SPEAKER_00: This sounds freaking amazing.
• 39:47
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, you know where this is going, right?
• 39:50
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, 12 months and over a hundred thousand dollars later, I'd remortgage the frickin' house for this, and I was just like, but see, the confrontation there for me was I know that I've got good ideas, but are they just ideas, or when you put can you put your money where your mouth is and go all in on your idea?
• 40:13
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, I was talking before about momentum.
• 40:17
  SPEAKER_00: It's like we had to make sales of that thing because it had this massive 12-month build with like 100k 100k build, like and and the first month I launched it, it was 68,000 bucks.
• 40:34
  SPEAKER_00: No, and I was like, Why that was my first time I'd I'd banked at that level, and and it was because I sweated blood to do it, and and like doing stuff that people are not prepared to do is kind of the hallmark of the difference between like kind of mediocrity and obviously sort of getting above.
• 41:00
  SPEAKER_00: And you don't have to do it that much, you just have to do it once to tell you that you can do it again.
• 41:08
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, yeah, and when when you know you can do it again, then I think that's a really powerful kind of a way to feel a level of momentum that gets you places that you never thought you could get.
• 41:19
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and and of course, you know, once you get there, the next thing comes along and it never stops, kind of as when Paul knows.
• 41:27
  SPEAKER_00: But I think that was probably the first time that I really had to back myself all the way.
• 41:31
  SPEAKER_00: And I think all of us get opportunities to back ourselves all the way because opportunities do come along a lot, uh, but they're all dressed up like you know, stuff that I'm and it's hard.
• 41:44
  SPEAKER_00: I want to do that.
• 41:46
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 41:47
  SPEAKER_00: That's I th I think you do that once or twice in your life and you figure you can do it again and again.
• 41:53
  SPEAKER_00: I think as as time goes by and we get older, um, I think the degree of risk that we can take on uh drops off.
• 42:01
  SPEAKER_00: Goes down, yeah.
• 42:02
  SPEAKER_00: And then what once once in a while we have to remind ourselves that we are still that person, we can still do crazy stuff.
• 42:08
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and when that happens, I think that's quite quite good for the soul.
• 42:13
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, definitely, definitely.
• 42:14
  SPEAKER_01: Wow, what a story.
• 42:16
  SPEAKER_01: How courageous are you, my goodness me.
• 42:19
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, see, I wouldn't call that courageous.
• 42:21
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, there's just a little bit of stupid in there, I reckon.
• 42:24
  SPEAKER_01: Oh I don't know.
• 42:26
  SPEAKER_01: I think it's courage, and I think that's the thing for the audience listening.
• 42:30
  SPEAKER_01: Like you sort of you always I do, you sort of look at people when they've arrived with to wherever they're at, and you sort of put I do put them up on pedestals and say, look at look at what they did.
• 42:40
  SPEAKER_01: Of course, they've got the confidence to do that.
• 42:42
  SPEAKER_01: And I know a lot of people say that to me.
• 42:43
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, Sharon, you've got the confidence.
• 42:45
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, if you knew, if you only knew how I had to push through some of the fear to do some of the things that I'm doing, like, and then that builds on, as you say, it doesn't go away.
• 42:55
  SPEAKER_01: Once you push through that, it doesn't go away.
• 42:57
  SPEAKER_01: You might get knocked again, but you still got that the lesson from pushing through the fear, right?
• 43:04
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and I think that it's it's funny the whole you you mentioned confidence, and confidence is such a weird thing, it's such a difficult thing to sort of articulate or work on or whatever.
• 43:16
  SPEAKER_00: Because a lot of people say, Oh, if I had the confidence, then I would or could that sort of a thing.
• 43:22
  SPEAKER_00: To me, I felt at my least confident when I was going through that some of those decisions.
• 43:30
  SPEAKER_00: Interesting.
• 43:32
  SPEAKER_00: And confidence was at the lowest ebb where the spend was the highest and the result was the lowest.
• 43:39
  SPEAKER_00: But at the other end of it, it's like, oh, I feel really bulletproof about that.
• 43:45
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm really proud of myself, kind of stuff.
• 43:47
  SPEAKER_00: So the question is where does the confidence come?
• 43:49
  SPEAKER_00: Does it come before the thing, before you do the thing, or does it come after?
• 43:54
  SPEAKER_00: It's the exact same thing.
• 43:55
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, simple analogy anyway, I think anyway, is like I run four time.
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_00: A week, right?
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, and very speedy for the audience if you uh want to share your average hizo machine, my goodness.
• 44:08
  SPEAKER_01: I'm not gonna do that.
• 44:08
  SPEAKER_00: But what I'd say, what I'd say is like before you go on a run, I reckon that's when you feel like at your windows, you're like, I can't I don't know.
• 44:21
  SPEAKER_00: Sponsor New Zealand winter, and it's it's like blowing a gale out there, it's freaking freezing cold.
• 44:26
  SPEAKER_00: There's there's sleep on the windows for God's sake.
• 44:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 44:29
  SPEAKER_00: I I don't want to go, I just do not feel like going.
• 44:33
  SPEAKER_00: But then once you get back from it, you feel amazing, right?
• 44:36
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, absolutely.
• 44:37
  SPEAKER_00: And and see that's confidence.
• 44:39
  SPEAKER_00: Before you don't want to do it.
• 44:40
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, once you've done it.
• 44:42
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, you know that it will be good, but you do know that it's gonna be good at the end of a run.
• 44:46
  SPEAKER_01: Some of the things that we do in business, though, you're not you're not as sure, right?
• 44:52
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, sure.
• 44:53
  SPEAKER_00: But I think you know, the analogy with fitness is is fear.
• 44:57
  SPEAKER_00: Um, because you don't know if you're gonna have a good run or a bad run.
• 45:00
  SPEAKER_01: True, that's a good point, actually.
• 45:02
  SPEAKER_01: But even a bad run's a good run, right?
• 45:04
  SPEAKER_00: Well, it's a it's a good run because you did it, but it's not a good one if you look at your strawberry and you feel like you're a chill.
• 45:10
  SPEAKER_01: And and and if it just didn't feel like a good run, because sometimes you do, like sometimes at the end of the run, you go, huh, that was Well, like I mean, same analogy going to the gym.
• 45:18
  SPEAKER_00: Like, I am no Hercules, like I'll never get a job as a bouncer.
• 45:23
  SPEAKER_00: So So going to the gym.
• 45:25
  SPEAKER_00: I go to the gym twice a week, right?
• 45:26
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 45:27
  SPEAKER_00: But there's like there's I I never feel great coming back from that.
• 45:30
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, okay.
• 45:31
  SPEAKER_00: But I know I've got to do it.
• 45:32
  SPEAKER_01: And you know it's good for you.
• 45:33
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm and I'm proud of myself when I do it.
• 45:36
  SPEAKER_00: So so this is all under the context of where does confidence come from?
• 45:40
  SPEAKER_00: Confidence comes after you do stuff, not before you do it.
• 45:44
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 45:44
  SPEAKER_00: You don't you don't need it to do it, you get it when you've done it.
• 45:47
  SPEAKER_00: That's what I've found to be true.
• 45:49
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and I I completely agree with you.
• 45:51
  SPEAKER_01: And that's going to be really cool for the audience to be hearing too, because you kind of you do.
• 45:56
  SPEAKER_01: I know for me, sometimes you feel like you're just waiting for it to happen.
• 46:00
  SPEAKER_01: Like when that's and even if like if we've got anyone in the audience that's um, you know, working as a bookkeeper or an accountant for a firm and making that big career to step to start your own business, like that that takes some courage.
• 46:13
  SPEAKER_01: But we know once you start doing it and you start making money for yourself, it's like, why didn't I do this years ago?
• 46:19
  SPEAKER_01: I know for me, certainly starting this business, it's like, oh, if I started this business back when we first knew each other, and I had coaches, when I was coaching them, they were like, Why don't you become a coach, as I'm like, oh no, not me.
• 46:32
  SPEAKER_01: Uh yeah, that's for you, not me.
• 46:34
  SPEAKER_01: If I would have started way back then.
• 46:36
  SPEAKER_01: So the key is really, whatever it is, do it sooner rather than later, right?
• 46:42
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 46:42
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, there's there's so much in that, isn't there?
• 46:45
  SPEAKER_00: That you know, that the the time is now, it just always is.
• 46:48
  SPEAKER_00: Um, you know, I get daunted from time to time about how much longer I still have to work, kind of stuff with it, how's it genetics, workaholism kind of stuff.
• 46:57
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, at my worst, I'll look at like I'm 55 now, another 10 years, like it just feels so far away and so daunting and overwhelming.
• 47:09
  SPEAKER_00: And I think the one thing that's helped me handle that, and it's not like all the time, right?
• 47:15
  SPEAKER_00: This is I I talked about pixels, yeah, it's like negative or down on it or whatever, but you know, if if we can put together a solid hour's work, that's good.
• 47:27
  SPEAKER_00: We can put together a solid day's work, that's good.
• 47:29
  SPEAKER_00: If we can put together a solid week's work, that's good.
• 47:33
  SPEAKER_00: So, how do you do the next 10 years?
• 47:34
  SPEAKER_00: Will you do it an hour at a time?
• 47:36
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 47:37
  SPEAKER_00: And I think for me, that's been like super helpful.
• 47:40
  SPEAKER_00: I had a good mate, Phil Richards, he's a he's a top man.
• 47:43
  SPEAKER_00: And he used to own it.
• 47:44
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, I know Phil.
• 47:45
  SPEAKER_01: He's lovely, yes.
• 47:47
  SPEAKER_01: I've talked to him.
• 47:49
  SPEAKER_01: I have a lovely guy.
• 47:51
  SPEAKER_01: Well, if it's the same one, it might not be the same one.
• 47:53
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, he's a New Zealand guy and he bought a um company.
• 47:57
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 47:58
  SPEAKER_01: Oh no.
• 48:00
  SPEAKER_00: How long have we known each other?
• 48:01
  SPEAKER_00: I've known Phil for years.
• 48:03
  SPEAKER_00: And one of the things he said when because he's man, he's done some real big transactions.
• 48:08
  SPEAKER_00: He he's bought and built and sold businesses like crazy.
• 48:11
  SPEAKER_01: He's and and he's quite the um non-assuming, like he's just the most down-to-earth bloke.
• 48:19
  SPEAKER_00: Uh yeah, no, Phil's gun.
• 48:21
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, definitely.
• 48:22
  SPEAKER_00: And I mean, I remember talking to him one, he had a um uh a business that he imported uh the the number one Indian brand of food from India into New Zealand, and it was through the time when all the currency stuff got messed up.
• 48:37
  SPEAKER_00: And I remember talking to him then, and Toro 4 was just so low.
• 48:41
  SPEAKER_00: My God, he was so low because he just could not do anything.
• 48:43
  SPEAKER_00: He's a super smart guy, but you you just can't outsmart a market that tanks on currency, and you've got set rates to supermarkets that you cannot change, and you've got a massive change in your importing rates because your your forex is stuffed.
• 49:00
  SPEAKER_00: So Phil Phil's definitely gone through it.
• 49:02
  SPEAKER_00: And I remember talking to him at the time when he was sort of climbing out of that one, and he and he sold the thing, you know, for a matter and yet another Phil Richard's success three.
• 49:11
  SPEAKER_00: He's got but but you know, when he was down, he said, like, you know, all I can do is just try to work between now and lunchtime.
• 49:20
  SPEAKER_00: And and if I can get to lunchtime and I've managed to get some stuff done, it's a good thing.
• 49:25
  SPEAKER_00: And then like all I gotta do is try to get to closing time and just put one foot in front of the other and I can get to closing time.
• 49:33
  SPEAKER_00: Good thing.
• 49:33
  SPEAKER_00: Because he just felt so crap about where things were.
• 49:37
  SPEAKER_00: And he just put one foot in front of the other and he got out of it.
• 49:39
  SPEAKER_00: And I remember him telling me that story, like in the depths of of when he was dealing with it.
• 49:44
  SPEAKER_00: And and I thought that is a real maxim to live by.
• 49:47
  SPEAKER_00: Just if you if you're overwhelmed by anything, if you're worried about the fact that you've still got to work another 10 years, whatever it is, the time is now.
• 49:55
  SPEAKER_00: Just work the next hour and try to get some stuff done.
• 49:59
  SPEAKER_00: Work the next morning and just try to get some stuff done.
• 50:02
  SPEAKER_00: Put one foot in front of the other, and you will find that life goes on and you get out of it.
• 50:06
  SPEAKER_01: It's it's the best thing.
• 50:08
  SPEAKER_01: And I certainly adopted that without even knowing it was a strategy when I was going through my divorce.
• 50:13
  SPEAKER_01: I used to look at myself and talk to myself in the mirror every morning and go, today, if you just get through today's, that's all you have to do.
• 50:22
  SPEAKER_01: Because I couldn't, I literally couldn't think further than that day.
• 50:26
  SPEAKER_01: Because every time I did, I'd freak out.
• 50:29
  SPEAKER_01: So I I made myself go, you know what, just today.
• 50:32
  SPEAKER_01: And then at night, I'd write down all the good things that I did.
• 50:35
  SPEAKER_01: Like I and you did this and you did this, and then I all the reasons why it was better that I was single.
• 50:41
  SPEAKER_01: So I'd write out all the good things of this is what's good, and that's what's good.
• 50:44
  SPEAKER_01: And and I got through today, and then I'd do it all over again the next day.
• 50:48
  SPEAKER_01: And then I did that, you string it together and you get through it.
• 50:51
  SPEAKER_01: It's incredible.
• 50:52
  SPEAKER_00: That's it.
• 50:53
  SPEAKER_00: That's that's the momentum thing.
• 50:55
  SPEAKER_00: As Daniel Flynn was saying, you know, hardest thing to get, easiest thing to lose.
• 51:00
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 51:01
  SPEAKER_00: So could because there's so much discipline that goes on with what you're describing there, as well as what Phil was talking about, in terms of just like sit down, get some stuff done, confront the stuff that you are freaking out about, and just keep on doing it.
• 51:15
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 51:15
  SPEAKER_00: And I think as much as anything, that momentum, that ability to get confidence on the other side of doing stuff rather than needing it before you do anything, um, getting some of those sorts of things straight with the way that we operate is really quite I think, I think that's the recipe for success.
• 51:35
  SPEAKER_00: If anyone wanted a recipe, to my way of thinking that would be that would be a figure out what you're you're avoiding, uh, decide on confrontation is the best strategy, uh, get something in a diary, come up with a way to address it that has you feel more prepared and and get it done and do it again and again and again.
• 51:57
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 51:58
  SPEAKER_00: And you won't get the confidence to do it, but you'll get the confidence after it.
• 52:02
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, and and that'll give you the momentum to actually get anywhere.
• 52:06
  SPEAKER_00: To keep going.
• 52:07
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and you'll end up doing, I'm just sort of linking together a couple of our conversations here.
• 52:11
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, you know, you'll you'll end up doing more of the non-urgent things.
• 52:14
  SPEAKER_00: You'll do stuff that is is not required of you, like it's not required to go to the gym, it's not required to go for a run, it's not required to do to to you know, hunt down a holiday.
• 52:25
  SPEAKER_00: It's not none of those requirements, but to do them is a reminder of the discipline that we all have a capability for that when we string it together produces outcomes like we've never had before.
• 52:39
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I love it.
• 52:40
  SPEAKER_01: Wow.
• 52:41
  SPEAKER_01: I've got so many more questions and we're running out of time.
• 52:44
  SPEAKER_01: So I'm gonna ask you this question.
• 52:45
  SPEAKER_01: Actually, I will ask you the one before.
• 52:47
  SPEAKER_01: Let's talk money.
• 52:48
  SPEAKER_01: I I've got two more questions.
• 52:50
  SPEAKER_01: So, where do you most often see profit leaking out of companies and or businesses?
• 52:56
  SPEAKER_01: And what should a business owner look at first if they're losing, oh, they're not making money and it's leaking out of the business?
• 53:02
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, well, there's always gonna be four levels of business, it's always gonna be sales, marketing, margins, and productivity.
• 53:06
  SPEAKER_00: It's just always gonna be those four things.
• 53:09
  SPEAKER_00: So I kind of liken it to putting a tint on your glasses.
• 53:15
  SPEAKER_00: And if you can look at your business through a set of tinted glasses that only shows up the productivity opportunities, the pricing and cost opportunities, the sales conversion and retention opportunities, then it it changes how you look at a business because you're always hunting.
• 53:36
  SPEAKER_00: So sales, market, margins, and productivity are it.
• 53:38
  SPEAKER_00: I think the the where to start is always on the business model.
• 53:43
  SPEAKER_00: The business model is everything.
• 53:44
  SPEAKER_00: And by the business model, I mean the margin you make needs to be high enough to cover the overheads that you've got.
• 53:50
  SPEAKER_00: And the overheads include a decent salary to get to it.
• 53:54
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 53:54
  SPEAKER_00: So it has to include like owner benefit.
• 53:57
  SPEAKER_00: It can't just be, you know, rantom whatever else.
• 54:00
  SPEAKER_00: It has to include a decent worker for the business owner.
• 54:02
  SPEAKER_00: And I'd say a decent worker for the business owner, like I don't mean to be judgmental here, no, that's not my intention at all.
• 54:10
  SPEAKER_00: But but I I think everybody in business should earn a minimum of$100,000.
• 54:14
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 54:14
  SPEAKER_00: Like that's that's just it with the amount of work that if you put the amount of work into your business into somebody else's company, they would have to pay you that amount because you are so committed, because you always go the extra mile, because you you know, you just that sort of a person that's that's worth that level if you worked for an organization that had decent clients, that paid decent money, to do a decent range of services, and they got you to help with that, you would freaking walk over hot coals for them.
• 54:46
  SPEAKER_00: That's worth it.
• 54:47
  SPEAKER_00: So my thoughts are like where to start in terms of you know, you talk about profit leakage and that sort of thing.
• 54:53
  SPEAKER_00: Where to start is like you have to figure out on paper how your business can make 100K.
• 54:59
  SPEAKER_00: So work out a margin and work out the sounds needed to have 100k dropping at the bottom.
• 55:05
  SPEAKER_00: And once you've got that, that gives you your the model that you need to go after.
• 55:10
  SPEAKER_00: It might mean that you've got like a couple of clients that are decent that you can make some decent money on, and a whole bunch of ones that you just sort of break even on.
• 55:17
  SPEAKER_00: And there's probably a few that you just open soon as a crap out of, and you're too scared to put sort of prices in order, and therefore you're probably losing money on those.
• 55:24
  SPEAKER_00: So you you you've got to be able to look at your business model from a spreadsheet point of view and say, for the amount of work that I'm doing, I need this type of client to make this kind of money for me with this kind of overhead so that there's 100 for me at the bottom.
• 55:41
  SPEAKER_00: Then orchestrate that.
• 55:42
  SPEAKER_00: Then there'll be the sales, marketing margins, productivity that you need to orchestrate with that model to make the 100kp down the bottom.
• 55:51
  SPEAKER_00: So, how much can I afford to pay people?
• 55:53
  SPEAKER_00: What sort of output do I need from those people to see there's those types of clients?
• 55:57
  SPEAKER_00: What sort of prices do I need from those clients in order to do it?
• 56:00
  SPEAKER_00: So I think the where to start is start from a white sheet of paper, start from a blank spreadsheet, put 100 grand down the bottom and build the thing up to the top in terms of what does my turnover need to look like?
• 56:12
  SPEAKER_00: What does that mean for the number of clients, etc.?
• 56:14
  SPEAKER_00: Am I gonna have some big whale clients who are all big guys that pay me heaps?
• 56:18
  SPEAKER_00: And I'm gonna have some sharks around there and some snackers as well.
• 56:20
  SPEAKER_00: Like what's gonna be my mix of clients to give me the sort of income I need with my processing sort of power in the middle in terms of my team to give me my outcome down the bottom so that I'm I actually know that this is going somewhere.
• 56:33
  SPEAKER_00: And it's not just me forever dealing with scope creep and um and you know worried about sort of prices and and and blowouts on productivity and all those sorts of things that that can happen.
• 56:45
  SPEAKER_00: So make it work on paper and then with that template, um, make it work with your with your private legagerias there to fix those up so you can get your 100k bottom line.
• 56:56
  SPEAKER_01: So that's kind of abstract sort of stuff, isn't it?
• 56:59
  SPEAKER_01: Like when you're sitting down, you're sort of figuring out, like, okay, I need those sort of clients and those sort of clients.
• 57:04
  SPEAKER_01: How can we, because I know a lot of our audience are very much left-brain thinkers, critical, like detailed thinkers.
• 57:10
  SPEAKER_01: So looking at those sort of things is sometimes tricky.
• 57:15
  SPEAKER_01: What's some advice you can give to help start that process?
• 57:23
  SPEAKER_01: Um so if you were to say like 100k, like I know a lot of my clients go No, no, no, okay.
• 57:31
  SPEAKER_00: Well wipe the 100k for argument's sake, okay?
• 57:34
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 57:34
  SPEAKER_00: Because I know that plenty of bookkeepers don't make 100k.
• 57:36
  SPEAKER_00: I get that.
• 57:38
  SPEAKER_00: I would say like what's an amount that's better than what it is now?
• 57:42
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah.
• 57:43
  SPEAKER_00: And let's have that conversation.
• 57:45
  SPEAKER_00: So if you're on 50 at the moment or something like that, like what does 75 look like?
• 57:49
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 57:49
  SPEAKER_00: What is what is 10k extra per annum on the understanding that you know what you're gonna do with your 10k or your 20k?
• 57:55
  SPEAKER_00: Like, that's the trip.
• 57:56
  SPEAKER_00: That's the Italy thing, that's the whatever that is, that's the the kitchen renovation, whatever it is.
• 58:03
  SPEAKER_00: Like, figure it backwards and say, like, I'm gone after this thing because that's what I want this time, 12 months from now, you know.
• 58:11
  SPEAKER_00: So I don't it scrub the 100k.
• 58:14
  SPEAKER_00: I kind of think that's a minimum benchmark, and I I really hate that, but that feels like a distance away for people because I I know how hard people work, and it it disappoints me to think that people can work as hard as what they do and be as diligent and committed and kind as what they are to to clients to do less than that.
• 58:38
  SPEAKER_00: That said, whatever is your reality right now, I'd say just add 20 for it.
• 58:42
  SPEAKER_00: And the reason I'd say 20 is because if it's less than 20k extra per annum for what you're doing, it's not really gonna move the needle.
• 58:51
  SPEAKER_00: Like that gets gobbled up on bloody mortgage stuff.
• 58:56
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, that that you've already got that.
• 58:58
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, you don't see that.
• 58:59
  SPEAKER_00: So I feel like you know, it needs to be a bump of money that would say, oh, that's there.
• 59:05
  SPEAKER_00: Cool, that means I can blah.
• 59:06
  SPEAKER_00: Like whatever your filling the gaps is on that, that's your that's your end game.
• 59:10
  SPEAKER_00: So that that was what I was talking about before about about changing the context of what we're doing.
• 59:14
  SPEAKER_00: It's not just one extra client or make me a little bit more or um having a bit more time or anything like that.
• 59:20
  SPEAKER_00: But we've got to go big on it to say, like, what's the bump that would make a difference and what would I do with that bump?
• 59:25
  SPEAKER_00: Then work backwards from that and have the same exercise.
• 59:28
  SPEAKER_00: Like your guys are I say your guys, all of us have a degree of left brain thinking to us.
• 59:34
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, not to start with a very little.
• 59:39
  SPEAKER_01: I'm gonna make myself.
• 59:40
  SPEAKER_00: But that's why you plus them is is American demon.
• 59:44
  SPEAKER_00: So so so like build it up from the number that you want that what that's like 20k better than what it is now, and then then go backwards on in terms of like what am I starting to pop out?
• 59:55
  SPEAKER_00: What are my prices need to be?
• 59:56
  SPEAKER_00: What sort of clients do I need to be?
• 59:58
  SPEAKER_00: What sort of you know, scope of works do I need for them?
• 1:00:01
  SPEAKER_00: Um, what are the sorts of things that I'm doing that are valuable that I don't charge for?
• 1:00:05
  SPEAKER_00: How can I repackage those?
• 1:00:07
  SPEAKER_00: How can I do reviews of clients where I sort of go through what I'm doing with them so that they can sort of see what is basic versus what is extra?
• 1:00:15
  SPEAKER_00: Um, how do I get a sense of putting a value on what is extra?
• 1:00:19
  SPEAKER_00: How do I find a charging mechanism for that?
• 1:00:22
  SPEAKER_00: Like oftentimes people look at what they've got and say, oh, I need so many more clients before I can get there.
• 1:00:28
  SPEAKER_00: That is, I think, the biggest mistake that a lot of people make.
• 1:00:32
  SPEAKER_00: You've got enough clients probably already.
• 1:00:36
  SPEAKER_00: You you probably got enough people that you've spoken to as prospects already to not have to do some big marketing drive or big sales drive or big whatever.
• 1:00:46
  SPEAKER_00: You probably, I would say for 90 plus percent of people, you've already got the contacts ready to actually give you the outcomes that we're talking about with a 20k bump or 100k minimum or whatever that is.
• 1:01:00
  SPEAKER_00: You already know the people that you could JV with and do an alliance with.
• 1:01:04
  SPEAKER_00: You already know the people that you'd like to work with, but don't.
• 1:01:07
  SPEAKER_00: You've already got the clients that are already clients of yours, but don't pay you enough.
• 1:01:12
  SPEAKER_00: And would if you did a review on dismantry services and got them clear in terms of what the benefits to them of those things would be.
• 1:01:19
  SPEAKER_00: So the thing is, most of the time, 90 plus percent of the time, the ingredients are already there.
• 1:01:24
  SPEAKER_00: People already have the what they need to actually give them the outcome that they want.
• 1:01:30
  SPEAKER_00: It just needs to be orchestrated and built in a better way.
• 1:01:33
  SPEAKER_00: Um and I think that is a sort of a top-down look at the whole thing and a decision that, hey, I already know enough, I already know enough people, I've already got the skills to be able to transact for for sort of the amount that I need uh to give me the brightness of future that I'm after.
• 1:01:47
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I just got to put it together in a way that allows me to sort of believe that this is an outcome that I'm gonna shoot for because it's worth it.
• 1:01:57
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I love it.
• 1:01:58
  SPEAKER_01: I love it.
• 1:01:59
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I've got one more question.
• 1:02:01
  SPEAKER_01: It's a big one.
• 1:02:02
  SPEAKER_01: Um, it's a bit of a combination question.
• 1:02:04
  SPEAKER_01: I know I've got listeners out there that have absolutely built incredible businesses, very successful, and they're kind of navel gazing now, going, now what?
• 1:02:13
  SPEAKER_01: Now what?
• 1:02:14
  SPEAKER_01: Now what, Will?
• 1:02:15
  SPEAKER_01: What what what advice can you give them where they've you know they've built the business, they've got the team, everything's humming along, and and they're they're looking at that next step now.
• 1:02:27
  SPEAKER_00: Well, I'd just say who's the most successful person that you know who would look at what you created and say, really?
• 1:02:34
  SPEAKER_01: Nice, no, and then do what?
• 1:02:37
  SPEAKER_01: Little then decide how far you can take it.
• 1:02:41
  SPEAKER_00: Because like like no one knows their capability.
• 1:02:44
  SPEAKER_00: No one.
• 1:02:45
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I know, isn't that exciting?
• 1:02:47
  SPEAKER_00: Well, it's it is, but this see the thing is I don't know.
• 1:02:53
  SPEAKER_00: This whole thing about comparison is weird because it's often said that comparison like sucks the joy out of life, but I think it can do that, but I think it can also challenge us to be you know more than we think that we're capable of.
• 1:03:09
  SPEAKER_00: And I think comparison is helpful to hang out with people that are more successful, to to kind of get a sense of what our own capabilities are.
• 1:03:21
  SPEAKER_00: And I mean, I I've taken the position to just never be impressed with anyone and always be inspired by what they could get to if they really decided to pin their ears back and go for it.
• 1:03:35
  SPEAKER_00: And so many people would say that they've already done that, but it's always compared to what?
• 1:03:41
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, like really I mean what if what if somebody looked at your business and said, that is a solid six out of ten.
• 1:03:50
  SPEAKER_00: Good job, you love it, that's awesome.
• 1:03:56
  SPEAKER_00: So I and and it is like you you know that you could get like something that you bolted on to the thing, you would find some rock star that you'd recruit or hire, you'd find some relationship with somebody that ended up giving you another 10 big guys, just like the big guys that you've already got.
• 1:04:15
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's always there.
• 1:04:17
  SPEAKER_00: But the the thing that changes it is like, but what would that change for you?
• 1:04:22
  SPEAKER_00: And if it doesn't change anything, because I've already ditched my mortgage or I've already got the house in the dreams or the holiday happening or whatever.
• 1:04:29
  SPEAKER_00: If there's none of that kind of stuff, then you're just not thinking big enough.
• 1:04:33
  SPEAKER_00: Like, like ultimately, what could you do?
• 1:04:37
  SPEAKER_00: Like, really, there's people in need.
• 1:04:40
  SPEAKER_00: There might be family members that you know could do with a head start.
• 1:04:45
  SPEAKER_00: There could be people that need to start a business that needs some seed capital to get started.
• 1:04:51
  SPEAKER_00: There might be some cause that you've got that you know that if you if you gave something to them, there would be an amount of altruism that would flow from you that you'd never kind of imagined that you'd be capable of.
• 1:05:06
  SPEAKER_00: So I I think successful people have their work cut out for them because they compare with where they've come from, not where they could go.
• 1:05:17
  SPEAKER_00: And I I think I mean I I would say that that's the that's the litmus test of personal growth, actually.
• 1:05:26
  SPEAKER_00: The the reason I talk about personal growth is because I think that business is the number one canvas for painting a personal growth journey.
• 1:05:34
  SPEAKER_00: Because it puts you in such weird situations and such confrontational situations.
• 1:05:38
  SPEAKER_00: I don't know any other kind of form of life that that does as good a job as business does of trying to answer the question, what am I actually capable of?
• 1:05:47
  SPEAKER_00: And I think from a life perspective, it's super valuable to be in business to be able to do that.
• 1:05:52
  SPEAKER_00: But I I would say to successful people, go back and have a look at where you started and and figure out like where you've got to and what that looks like from a growth perspective.
• 1:06:02
  SPEAKER_00: And understand that growth from a success point of view looks like a hockey stick.
• 1:06:10
  SPEAKER_00: It's an exponential growth curve.
• 1:06:12
  SPEAKER_00: It means what it took to get you here is less effort.
• 1:06:16
  SPEAKER_00: So one more unit of effort gets you like two or three more units of success.
• 1:06:22
  SPEAKER_00: Whereas back when you started, or even like a few years ago before you got something magic that happened, it was like three solid levels of effort for only one unit of success.
• 1:06:33
  SPEAKER_00: It it gets better the further along you go.
• 1:06:37
  SPEAKER_00: And I think a lot of people sort of, you know, it's often said 90% of people give up only 90% of the way there.
• 1:06:43
  SPEAKER_00: And when people think that they're 100% of the way there and they they're cruising, that that's when weird stuff happens that falls off.
• 1:06:51
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, doesn't it?
• 1:06:51
  SPEAKER_01: That's so true, huh?
• 1:06:53
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so so I think you know you you've done what you need to satisfy your own kind of goals personally, but how do you include other people in that?
• 1:07:05
  SPEAKER_00: How do you get other people along for a success journey as well?
• 1:07:10
  SPEAKER_00: Who do you see that's that's got capability that if you did some work with them and helped them out, that they could be along for that journey as as well.
• 1:07:20
  SPEAKER_00: And I think when you look beyond yourself, you'll see that there's lots of other opportunity to do more.
• 1:07:26
  SPEAKER_00: Um, sure you've done really well for yourself, and super congrats on that.
• 1:07:30
  SPEAKER_00: And I know people need people to notice, and I think we should do more of that for sure.
• 1:07:36
  SPEAKER_00: But I think spotting other people uh who could see a success story beyond where they are right now, you'll be reverone who's successful can be really good at that because you know what you're looking at.
• 1:07:47
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, um, so my challenge to successful people is find more people that have capability and and find a way to help them as well.
• 1:07:54
  SPEAKER_00: That would be my 10 cents worth.
• 1:07:56
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I love it.
• 1:07:57
  SPEAKER_01: I love it, I love it.
• 1:07:59
  SPEAKER_01: Will Fulton, you are an absolute inspiration.
• 1:08:02
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, you paint a picture that creates so much excitement for me.
• 1:08:06
  SPEAKER_01: Every time I talk to you, I just get so excited about the future because you're able to articulate business and business success in such a way that I can do it.
• 1:08:15
  SPEAKER_01: Like that's how I feel.
• 1:08:16
  SPEAKER_01: And I'm sure the audience is feeling exactly the same thing.
• 1:08:19
  SPEAKER_01: You you paint a vision and a future that is whatever we can dream up, we can achieve.
• 1:08:26
  SPEAKER_01: And and all we need to do is figure out that little formula to get through that.
• 1:08:30
  SPEAKER_01: And whatever your unique little formula is, is work workouttable.
• 1:08:34
  SPEAKER_01: You can do it, you can get to the other side of that.
• 1:08:36
  SPEAKER_01: And honestly, I'm I'm so grateful to be in your world and to to call you a friend, Will.
• 1:08:43
  SPEAKER_01: And thank you so much for being on the Show and Francisco show.
• 1:08:45
  SPEAKER_01: It means so much to me.
• 1:08:47
  SPEAKER_01: So thank you.
• 1:08:48
  SPEAKER_00: You are welcome.
• 1:08:49
  SPEAKER_00: That's been fun.
• 1:08:50
  SPEAKER_00: So great.
• 1:08:50
  SPEAKER_00: I'm sure we'll talk again soon.
• 1:08:52
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, definitely.
• 1:08:53
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you so much, Will.
• 1:08:54
  SPEAKER_01: And uh hopefully, yes, we can get you back on the Show Francisco show soon.
• 1:08:59
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you, Will.
• 1:09:00
  SPEAKER_01: See you.