Latest / The Expert's Journey: Helping Speakers & Authors Succeed! / The Hidden Cost of Over-Explaining

Transcript

The Hidden Cost of Over-Explaining · The Expert's Journey: Helping Speakers & Authors Succeed!

• 0:14
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome to The Experts Journey.
• 0:16
  SPEAKER_00: Some experts simplify their message so people can follow it, and others simplify it so much that there's barely an idea left.
• 0:23
  SPEAKER_00: In this episode, we're asking some sharp questions, such as, are you making your thinking clearer or are you quietly lowering the bar?
• 0:32
  SPEAKER_00: Because your audience does not just need easy answers.
• 0:36
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes they need stronger thinking, better questions, and a higher standard.
• 0:40
  SPEAKER_00: Should you simplify your thinking or raise your audience?
• 0:44
  SPEAKER_00: So let's get into it.
• 0:45
  SPEAKER_00: Good morning, Dixie.
• 0:46
  SPEAKER_01: Good morning, Brad.
• 0:47
  SPEAKER_01: What an interesting way to start the day.
• 0:49
  SPEAKER_01: Fascinating conversation ahead, I'm sure.
• 0:53
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
• 0:54
  SPEAKER_00: So we talk about breaking things down and keeping it easy so everyone in the room can understand.
• 0:59
  SPEAKER_00: And as it applies to any sort of expert content that we create.
• 1:03
  SPEAKER_00: Where do we set the line that we're speaking to, talking to, writing to?
• 1:09
  SPEAKER_00: And one of the things I was looking at was does simple mean shallow?
• 1:15
  SPEAKER_01: Oh.
• 1:16
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, what a great question.
• 1:18
  SPEAKER_01: One of the things that comes to mind as soon as we start into this topic is the fact that we get bored with maybe is not maybe the right line, but we get so familiar with our own topic that sometimes we lose objectivity around this whole perspective.
• 1:35
  SPEAKER_01: So is it that we worry that we're not coming across this smart enough and cutting edge enough and therefore we simplify it too much?
• 1:44
  SPEAKER_01: So or do we complicate it so much that we are trying to just really appease our own ego rather than actually think about what the audience needs to hear?
• 1:54
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, absolutely.
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_00: I think there's a huge difference between making an idea clear and making it thin.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_00: You really want to get through, but that doesn't mean you've got to peel back everything off it.
• 2:05
  SPEAKER_00: Good communication actually ref removes confusion without taking away the meaning of things.
• 2:11
  SPEAKER_00: So we need to look at how we're communicating something to make it clear.
• 2:16
  SPEAKER_00: We don't have to stay shallow.
• 2:17
  SPEAKER_00: We can go deep, but we have to be clear.
• 2:20
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 2:21
  SPEAKER_01: And where do you draw the line and how do you know if in fact your own topic is becoming too shallow or if you're thinning it down too much?
• 2:33
  SPEAKER_01: How do we measure what it is that our audiences are getting out of us if we haven't taken a really big step back and assessed it from their perspective?
• 2:43
  SPEAKER_01: And of course, the only real way to get that is feedback.
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, feedback certainly helps.
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_00: One of the things I think of is you want to bring in new topics and get people thinking, but it doesn't mean that you've actually got to go deep into the topic.
• 2:56
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes it's about exposing people to the topic, making sure that they understand that this thing is happening or that they need to be looking at this thing, but you don't have to delve into the depths of it, which I know some of us like to go down deep on things.
• 3:11
  SPEAKER_00: And maybe that's the mistake.
• 3:13
  SPEAKER_00: Just keep the content clear and bring new ideas, but don't drown people in.
• 3:22
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I keep going back to my framework that I use when I'm developing either a book or a presentation or a workshop, where you've got three main points you want to make, and then you break those three main points down into chapters or subheadings and then subheadings or sub-subheadings.
• 3:40
  SPEAKER_01: And I think if you're going to consider your main keynote or your main topic set and start bringing in new things and implementing additional parts and seeing how they land, rather than thinking, I'm going to recreate the whole half of this and experiment with it.
• 4:00
  SPEAKER_01: I don't think you should be experimenting with your audience at that level.
• 4:03
  SPEAKER_01: I think if you're going to experiment with new topic or new content, that you need to bring it in gradually, which gets hard if you're not speaking on a regular basis, by the way.
• 4:14
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, exactly.
• 4:15
  SPEAKER_00: You've got to bring it in.
• 4:16
  SPEAKER_00: And I think that probably brings me to my second point, which is that some audience actually need a bridge, not a lower bar.
• 4:21
  SPEAKER_00: So it's a case of stepping our audience, building those steps to bring them to that new level of understanding.
• 4:29
  SPEAKER_00: They might come in here, you want them to leave there.
• 4:32
  SPEAKER_00: You don't just throw them in here because it's too much.
• 4:35
  SPEAKER_00: You step them up to there.
• 4:37
  SPEAKER_00: And you're talking about using your three points.
• 4:39
  SPEAKER_00: That's one way we can do that.
• 4:41
  SPEAKER_00: The real skill is knowing how to meet people where they are, but don't leave them there.
• 4:47
  SPEAKER_00: Bring them up.
• 4:49
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 4:49
  SPEAKER_01: So how do you approach doing this from the perspective of someone who obviously you deal a lot with tech and complex content?
• 4:58
  SPEAKER_01: How do you work your way through these issues?
• 5:03
  SPEAKER_00: I think the biggest thing I've learned to do is use real-world examples.
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_00: So stories, in other words.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_00: So the stories of how this is applied in a real-world situation, normally for me, actually clarify it for somebody.
• 5:18
  SPEAKER_00: So I can say, we've got this great tool and it does this and this, but this is how I use it to do this thing.
• 5:26
  SPEAKER_00: And then people can bridge their way across and go, oh, I see how that fits in with what I do because I could use it like this.
• 5:33
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 5:34
  SPEAKER_01: And I think you're right.
• 5:35
  SPEAKER_01: The value of stories cannot be underestimated.
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_01: As I always say, stories make the facts sticky.
• 5:41
  SPEAKER_01: And then if you could also use looping within the story framework of your presentation, so you start out with one part and then you loop it into where you finish and bring it back, or even thread that story so that it goes from A to B to C to D to E rather than thinking I'm going to go from A to H to P to G back to B, whatever.
• 6:06
  SPEAKER_01: Using a really comprehensive but simple way of meandering your story through what you're trying to demonstrate means you bring the audience with you on a journey rather than thinking that you're just giving them a bunch of information.
• 6:21
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and that format, as you said, A, B, C, D, you were talking about stepping there, which is what you're trying to do.
• 6:27
  SPEAKER_00: And the looping part for me is always hard because I forget where I was.
• 6:31
  SPEAKER_00: But like it's a common thing.
• 6:32
  SPEAKER_00: In comedy, it's one of the biggest parts of doing comedy is the loop back.
• 6:36
  SPEAKER_00: You'll often see it on TV where they start telling a story and then it goes off for a while, and then suddenly they throw it back to the start, and you get this random comment, and you realize it's related to the earlier story.
• 6:47
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, they looped that back.
• 6:48
  SPEAKER_00: That was very clever.
• 6:50
  SPEAKER_00: I think that it's certainly a skill that can be learned, but yeah, for me, I often forget where I started, so it's not always helpful.
• 6:59
  SPEAKER_01: But hey, you just brought up a great point and never underestimate the value of comedy and good comedy to help bring the really interesting parts of what you're trying to convey forward as well.
• 7:12
  SPEAKER_01: And if you have the ability to do a bit of like comedy or make people laugh or bring them at an NLP level connection back to the points you're trying to make as well, then you get a lot better shot at helping those points to really stick fast.
• 7:29
  SPEAKER_00: No, absolutely.
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_00: Look, so we're starting to step people through, but the next problem that I see people have is oversimplifying.
• 7:37
  SPEAKER_00: And this is something that I've been known to do myself, where I take a complex topic and break it down to make it easier, but sometimes you can break it down too much and actually damages your authority.
• 7:47
  SPEAKER_00: So if everything you say sounds too basic, people understand you, but they don't get your level of expertise.
• 7:54
  SPEAKER_00: You need to be clear, but also show the weight behind your thinking.
• 7:58
  SPEAKER_00: So making sure that you keep it simple in language, maybe, but not simple in concept.
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_00: And bringing people into that higher level thinking.
• 8:10
  SPEAKER_00: Because, in the end, as we discussed last week, it's about taking people from where they are to make a change in their life to where they want to be.
• 8:18
  SPEAKER_00: And you're there to help them do that.
• 8:20
  SPEAKER_00: So if people come into the room and you're talking at too low a level for the room, then you're going to lose your audience, which is the worst thing you can possibly do.
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_01: Well, one of the ways you can help yourself with that too, and this is just basic stagecraft, right?
• 8:37
  SPEAKER_01: Where you can get the audience involvement, get them doing things, nodding their heads, or nod if you did this or hands up if you did that.
• 8:44
  SPEAKER_01: And I did something the other day where I made everyone sit down or stand up and then sit down in in s in groups so that we got to a point and bring a little bit of humor into that.
• 8:54
  SPEAKER_01: And so you get them physically participating in what you do, even if you you're trying to make a really complex point or a simple point, regardless of which end of the spectrum you're at, if you get them physically doing something, it helps the complexity to land or can bring the simplicity up.
• 9:13
  SPEAKER_01: The other thing you can do is using things like whiteboards or flip charts.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_01: And yes, you may have your PowerPoint, but maybe you need to occasionally break out with the big fat pen on a s on a white surface and say, well, let's write this, let's loop this back, shall we?
• 9:29
  SPEAKER_01: Let's show how this works.
• 9:31
  SPEAKER_01: Let's bring you through in the way that your PowerPoint can't, you bring your audience from point A to point B to point C and tie that into what you're doing with your PowerPoint.
• 9:44
  SPEAKER_01: And so it's often it comes down to stagecraft.
• 9:49
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think there's always going to be an element of stagecraft involved in everything like that.
• 9:53
  SPEAKER_00: Whenever you're in front of people, it's not just a case of being in front of them.
• 9:57
  SPEAKER_00: There needs to be more than that.
• 9:59
  SPEAKER_00: It some people will stand there and they naturally are able to tell stories and do things.
• 10:04
  SPEAKER_00: And other people will get up there and it'll be the most terrifying thing in the world because they're doing something out of the comfort zone.
• 10:09
  SPEAKER_00: They might be an author, they're not a speaker.
• 10:11
  SPEAKER_00: They're standing in front of a group of people and they have to read a page.
• 10:14
  SPEAKER_00: But if at least if you've got a plan, you've got some steps in place of how you're going to present your book or how you're going to present this topic, you've got some sort of framework to fall back on.
• 10:25
  SPEAKER_00: And you can have it on a piece of paper in front of you, or you can write it on a flip chart or whatever.
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_00: But certainly having some sort of plan in place before you start is always important because that allows you to have time to think as well, depending on how your audience is reacting to what you're doing.
• 10:44
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, you're right.
• 10:45
  SPEAKER_01: And sometimes you can also revert back to the audience and get their feedback as you're going by asking for questions.
• 10:53
  SPEAKER_01: Like, is this landing?
• 10:54
  SPEAKER_01: Are you with me?
• 10:55
  SPEAKER_01: Do you have any questions about what I've just said?
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_01: If you get no questions, then there's a chance that you are giving yourself feedback immediately on how simple you've got.
• 11:06
  SPEAKER_01: So then maybe that's a good time to have in reserve, obviously, something that's more complex that you can pull in to just again take the audience's temperature in in the real time.
• 11:18
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 11:19
  SPEAKER_00: And look, when you're looking at the content you're presenting, you also got to think about what you're trying to achieve with your audience.
• 11:26
  SPEAKER_00: So if you give bite-sized pieces of information, easy answers and things like that, you're probably going to attract those people that just want quick answers.
• 11:34
  SPEAKER_00: On the other hand, if you want to teach people to think deeper, maybe you need to start building in more insights and not just shortcuts.
• 11:42
  SPEAKER_00: So while we're taking people through, we don't we don't want to be shallow, we want to be a certain amount of depth, but also we want to make sure that people are getting actual insights, they are getting learning and they are growing.
• 11:59
  SPEAKER_01: I think you bring up an interesting perspective regarding that keynote versus workshop.
• 12:07
  SPEAKER_01: A lot of what we've just been talking about is different between doing a keynote versus a workshop.
• 12:14
  SPEAKER_01: If you're in a workshop situation, it's a lot easier to take the temperature of the room to then also bring in the extra heavy armory if you need it while you're in the workshop zone.
• 12:26
  SPEAKER_01: If you're doing a keynote isn't about teaching people, it's about moving them from the space where they are to the space that they'd like to be.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_01: So inspiring them to consider what space they're currently inhabiting.
• 12:40
  SPEAKER_01: And to think when you're talking about a keynote, you have a different set of criteria for assessing whether or not the complexity is too high.
• 12:54
  SPEAKER_01: And I think also when you're doing a keynote, if you've done a really great job of checking in with the people beforehand.
• 13:03
  SPEAKER_01: For example, one of the guys in a presentation series the other day said he does a minimum of four interviews one-on-one with people before he turns up for the keynote.
• 13:14
  SPEAKER_01: I thought, well, four, that's quite a lot.
• 13:15
  SPEAKER_01: And we all talked about that in in the day.
• 13:18
  SPEAKER_01: And he said, Yeah, four.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_01: He said, I want to know from the CEO, and the CEO has to be part of that four.
• 13:24
  SPEAKER_01: The CEO, the financial controller, the II, and then the marketing guy.
• 13:29
  SPEAKER_01: And he said, because that will give me real perspective on where they're at and what they really need.
• 13:34
  SPEAKER_01: And so I think if you're someone who tailors your presentations as a keynote deliverer to exactly whatever audience needs and you do the right homework, then you're not going to have the problem of is it too simple or is it too complex?
• 13:51
  SPEAKER_01: But if you are going in and doing something that's more public or that you don't have the ability for whatever reason to do that level of homework first, then you are more likely to fly blind on that.
• 14:06
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, absolutely.
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_00: The best experts make the people in the room feel smarter, not smaller.
• 14:12
  SPEAKER_00: And it's one of those things where you really want to raise your audience, you want to bring them up, but you don't want to make them feel like they're behind.
• 14:20
  SPEAKER_00: Now, that's really difficult because if you're like me and you're talking about AI, most people feel behind, but you got to put it in a way that the room feels like, okay, I didn't realize this was happening, but I see the opportunity for me to move forward now because I know that.
• 14:36
  SPEAKER_00: And so you invite them into the better thinking.
• 14:39
  SPEAKER_00: It's not about proving that you're smart because you're up there as the expert.
• 14:44
  SPEAKER_00: That's not the goal at all.
• 14:45
  SPEAKER_00: The goal is to show them that they can move to this point if they listen to you, if they take these next steps.
• 14:54
  SPEAKER_00: And so you're trying to show them that they're actually capable of embracing this change or whatever it is.
• 15:01
  SPEAKER_00: But they're not being left feeling like, oh, I'm in trouble.
• 15:06
  SPEAKER_00: I'm never going to be able to move forward or my business is going to fail or whatever.
• 15:10
  SPEAKER_00: That's the worst.
• 15:11
  SPEAKER_00: If you do that, you're definitely doing something wrong, I reckon.
• 15:14
  SPEAKER_01: Well, you have to inspire hope.
• 15:16
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 15:16
  SPEAKER_00: Always.
• 15:17
  SPEAKER_00: And that's the key thing, isn't it?
• 15:19
  SPEAKER_00: You don't want to leave the room desperate.
• 15:21
  SPEAKER_00: You want to leave them uncomfortable.
• 15:22
  SPEAKER_00: There's no doubt about that.
• 15:24
  SPEAKER_00: You want people to be uncomfortable because only uncomfortable people change.
• 15:29
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 15:30
  SPEAKER_00: But you don't want them to walk out of there and go, yeah, I'm going to go home and sit in the corner and cry.
• 15:38
  SPEAKER_01: So there's a common line of thought that of the whole audience, there will be five or ten percent who will completely not love you, and there'll be five or ten percent who will become raving fans, and then there's the other, let's say, 80% who will be somewhere in the middle.
• 15:55
  SPEAKER_01: So do you pitch for the people who are going to be somewhere in the middle, or do you pitch to really please that top 10% who are going to become raving fans?
• 16:04
  SPEAKER_01: And do you consciously make a decision about that?
• 16:08
  SPEAKER_00: I think it comes back to what you said before, where you were talking about the person who interviews four people before they do the speech.
• 16:14
  SPEAKER_00: More often than not, when you're brought in to do something, it's for a reason.
• 16:20
  SPEAKER_00: The company, the group, the whoever is in the room has brought you in to present a certain message to get people to take a certain action.
• 16:29
  SPEAKER_00: And so you need to understand that.
• 16:31
  SPEAKER_00: Other times you get no direction at all.
• 16:33
  SPEAKER_00: And so it's up to you to set the direction.
• 16:36
  SPEAKER_00: But more often than not, you if you're speaking for corporate or whatever, there's a reason you're there.
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_00: So I think it really comes down to understanding that more so than anything else.
• 16:48
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 16:49
  SPEAKER_01: You know, you're right.
• 16:50
  SPEAKER_01: So do you please the CEO or do you please the person who books you?
• 16:54
  SPEAKER_01: The person who pays the check?
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 16:58
  SPEAKER_01: Who do you want to be focusing on as your avatar in the room to please the best?
• 17:04
  SPEAKER_00: I think that's a good question.
• 17:05
  SPEAKER_00: I was always told that you're there to please the speaker booker, but I don't think that's the answer truly, because the speaker booker should be there trying to please the person who got them to do the job.
• 17:16
  SPEAKER_00: So if the CEO's come in and said, we need a speaker that does this and this, or we want to bring in an author who talks about this, then that speaker booker should be trying to hit that goal.
• 17:27
  SPEAKER_00: And so, yes, your goal is to make the speaker booker look good, but the speaker booker is supposed to be making the sure the CEO's messaging or mission is covered by the person that they bring in.
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_00: So that's why I look at it anyway.
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_01: So top tips for thinking how do you make this yeah, happen for following through on this conversation that we've just had.
• 17:53
  SPEAKER_01: What are your top tips on fitting it right?
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_00: I think the first is understand who you're speaking to and what they're after.
• 18:00
  SPEAKER_00: That's essential if you're going to go up and speak about a topic, get an understanding of who's in the room and what they're after.
• 18:06
  SPEAKER_00: That's probably the key thing first.
• 18:09
  SPEAKER_00: Second is then trying to establish a level that they're already at.
• 18:13
  SPEAKER_00: What are they already doing?
• 18:14
  SPEAKER_00: What are they succeeding and where they're having troubles?
• 18:16
  SPEAKER_00: So that's an interview process, like anything.
• 18:19
  SPEAKER_00: And then it's a case of going, okay, they're here, they want to be there.
• 18:24
  SPEAKER_00: What are the steps?
• 18:25
  SPEAKER_00: You're the expert.
• 18:26
  SPEAKER_00: You should be able to see the steps.
• 18:27
  SPEAKER_00: You should know what the steps are.
• 18:29
  SPEAKER_00: And then breaking them down into a way that relates to the audience that they can understand in their language, that succeeds in hitting the goal of the conference.
• 18:41
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 18:42
  SPEAKER_01: And I would add to that, do the feedback loop, make sure that you are checking visually with the audience while you're presenting as best you can, in whatever way you can, either by doing the either any questions, raise your hands if there's none, then you know you're possibly going in a little too sh too thin.
• 19:00
  SPEAKER_01: And also to uh drip feed the new stuff, the things that you're a little bit unsure of, but you're ready with if you need to have it as part of your toolkit.
• 19:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I think this it applies to all of the content you create, whether it's a speech, a book, uh, an article, whatever.
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_00: There should be some underlying message you're trying to get across.
• 19:20
  SPEAKER_00: For example, when I talk about AI, I say the embers are already in your business.
• 19:24
  SPEAKER_00: There's AI appearing everywhere.
• 19:25
  SPEAKER_00: And even if you're trying to ignore it, it's in every piece of software.
• 19:29
  SPEAKER_00: So you need to do this, and that's the underlying message, is that you have to do something.
• 19:35
  SPEAKER_00: And so that try I try to bring that through in all my content, whether it's an article or whatever.
• 19:40
  SPEAKER_00: Now, whether the article's about communication or software or whatever, it doesn't matter.
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_00: That theme's coming through.
• 19:47
  SPEAKER_00: So you should always be looking at how you can keep it simple, keep people moving forward while bringing through the goal message overall.
• 19:56
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, brilliant.
• 19:58
  SPEAKER_01: Well, I think we've given everyone a lot to think about this morning for sure.
• 20:02
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, absolutely.
• 20:03
  SPEAKER_00: So if this episode has you thinking about writing a book, but you're not sure how to shape your ideas, reach out to Dixie at indiexpertspublishing.com.
• 20:11
  SPEAKER_00: She can help turn what's in your head into a clear, compelling book that builds real authority.
• 20:15
  SPEAKER_00: And if you want to get more out of AI automation, join my authority multiplier coaching community at bradhouk.com.
• 20:22
  SPEAKER_00: You'll learn how to use AI to grow your business and save time and money.
• 20:25
  SPEAKER_00: Don't leave your best thinking sitting in your head.
• 20:28
  SPEAKER_00: Take action and turn it into something.
• 20:31
  SPEAKER_01: Love it.
• 20:32
  SPEAKER_01: Well, once again, another week of fascinating conversation.
• 20:35
  SPEAKER_01: And of course, if you've really enjoyed this, remember to leave us a review because they always matter and count well for us too.
• 20:40
  SPEAKER_01: So thanks everyone.
• 20:42
  SPEAKER_01: And uh we'll catch you next time, Wraith.
• 20:44
  SPEAKER_00: See you next time.