Latest / The Soap Box Podcast / How I stopped nodding and smiling, with Siobhan Strode

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How I stopped nodding and smiling, with Siobhan Strode · The Soap Box Podcast

• 1:17
  Peta: How comfortable are you telling your story?
• 1:21
  Peta: I talked with a lot of creatives, a lot of.
• 1:24
  Peta: Copywriters messaging strategists.
• 1:27
  Peta: A lot of coaches a lot of people who are really comfortable.
• 1:31
  Peta: Telling.
• 1:32
  Peta: Stories about other people.
• 1:34
  Peta: As part of their work.
• 1:36
  Peta: They're really comfortable helping others tell their own story.
• 1:40
  Peta: As part of their work.
• 1:43
  Peta: They're really happy being advocates for other people.
• 1:46
  Peta: In my circles, there are a lot of individuals fame.
• 1:51
  Peta: Advocacy and being other people's voices is a huge part of their personality and their passion.
• 1:58
  Peta: But how comfortable are you telling your own story?
• 2:03
  Peta: Today, I'm speaking to Siobhan Strode, an incredibly wonderful, fabulous human being who is a friend of mine.
• 2:12
  Peta: She's also a word, witch, a copy coach and a mentor, and she helps you raise your voice and lead the change that you want to see in the world.
• 2:23
  Peta: We talk about her background in politics.
• 2:26
  Peta: Just far more impressive than mine.
• 2:28
  Peta: We talk about.
• 2:30
  Peta: The hidden stories of women throughout history.
• 2:33
  Peta: And how important it is that we tell them.
• 2:36
  Peta: Um, and we talk about how CIS het white women like us have a responsibility to step up and talk about the issues from our place of relative privilege.
• 2:45
  Peta: And she winds up by giving us three tips to get started.
• 2:47
  Peta: If you're nervous about telling your own story.
• 2:51
  Peta: I thoroughly enjoy talking to Siobhan.
• 2:53
  Peta: I always do.
• 2:54
  Peta: Um, but it was great to, to get some of that on the record and on the podcast so that you can hear her brilliance as well.
• 3:02
  Peta: So you sit back.
• 3:03
  Peta: Grab a cup of coffee and listen to Siobhan get on her soapbox.
• 3:08
  Peta: Siobhan, thank you for coming on the Soapbox podcast.
• 3:10
  Peta: I'm really excited to get to chat to you.
• 3:13
  Peta: Although obviously like, yeah, we do chat quite a lot all the time anyway.
• 3:17
  Siobhan: Yeah, I'm very excited to be here.
• 3:19
  Siobhan: Thank you for having me on, and I'm so glad I finally booked in to come on your podcast after what, like two years?
• 3:26
  Peta: Yeah.
• 3:26
  Peta: We have been trying to make this happen for quite a long time.
• 3:27
  Peta: Um, and we did so yay.
• 3:29
  Peta: So for people who haven't found you on Instagram haven't been checking out your content as you're slowly coming back onto LinkedIn, which has been very exciting.
• 3:38
  Peta: Can you tell them a little bit about who you are, where you come from, what you do, all the juicy, interesting stuff.
• 3:47
  Siobhan: Okay.
• 3:47
  Siobhan: So, I'm Siobhan, I'm a word witch.
• 3:49
  Siobhan: I help you raise your voice and lead the change.
• 3:54
  Siobhan: And I work as both a copywriter and copy coach, but also I've kind of segwayed, I suppose, into mentoring activists and campaigners and people who want to start shouting a little bit more about things they care about.
• 4:10
  Siobhan: So I, yeah, I, I used to be a teacher.
• 4:14
  Siobhan: I was a teacher till 2015.
• 4:16
  Siobhan: I used to teach little people how to read and write.
• 4:18
  Siobhan: So very, very different to what I do now.
• 4:22
  Siobhan: And yeah, I left after a breakdown basically.
• 4:25
  Siobhan: And tried to make it as a proofreader and copy editor.
• 4:29
  Siobhan: And that was all very stressful because I had a baby at the time.
• 4:32
  Siobhan: And thought I could do all these things and couldn't.
• 4:34
  Siobhan: But leaving teaching kind of gave me this, um, confidence to start speaking up on stuff because you, when you're teaching, you have to be really wary of kind of campaigning and activism and that kind of thing, because you're not supposed to be seen as political.
• 4:49
  Siobhan: But when I left, I kind of threw myself into joining lots of activist groups.
• 4:55
  Siobhan: And I suppose I was trying to find friends down here in Devon because we from London.
• 5:00
  Siobhan: Yeah, and, uh, got very involved in politics stood for parliament in 2019, was a town councillor for four years but all the while, kind of alongside that, kind of next to each other, I'm running parallel, was my business and that has kind of changed so much over the years where I've realised I can't keep all my hats separate, so I kind of, at one point was trying to run my business, be a mum in all these different ways, like being an activist, like getting very political.
• 5:34
  Siobhan: Um, and I kind of kept all the hats separate.
• 5:37
  Siobhan: And then I was burnt out in kind of 20, late 2017, early 2018, and just thought, bugger it.
• 5:44
  Siobhan: I'm just going to put all of them.
• 5:45
  Siobhan: I'm just going to stop wearing all these different hats, wear the same hat and just show up as I am, whole Siobhan, loud, ranty, social justice obsessed.
• 5:55
  Siobhan: Um, full ADHD, like, um, yeah, and it's been, it's been transformative just unless exhausting being, being me and I love helping other women kind of do the same thing with their businesses.
• 6:09
  Siobhan: And we are so, I think the reason that I get on so well with you is because we are so similar in like the way we grew up, our backgrounds, our careers, and then, yeah, just what we do.
• 6:22
  Siobhan: And it's just really, yeah, it's really, I'm so glad I'm finally here talking to you.
• 6:26
  Peta: I love the full Siobhan in all her glory.
• 6:29
  Peta: It's been, yeah, it's exciting.
• 6:32
  Peta: Cool.
• 6:32
  Peta: Um, and, um, So we got to know each other.
• 6:35
  Peta: Oh, the small business huddle during lockdown.
• 6:40
  Peta: Yes.
• 6:41
  Peta: So a whole bunch of people who were mostly in London, which was slightly annoying because I couldn't go and like hang out with them.
• 6:47
  Peta: Who were running small businesses and like online networking and I'd not really done networking before And I met these fabulous people like Pippa Parfait who runs Disobedient Business Co and Sadie Tichelaar From this curious life and then and then you and Oh yeah.
• 7:05
  Peta: There's like loads and loads of people who loads and loads of women who were who were running businesses that made sense with their lives, which was yeah, kind of like, just like you've been saying, not trying to separate everything.
• 7:17
  Peta: Um, and that was really refreshing.
• 7:20
  Siobhan: Yeah, and that was such a lovely little group and it's such a shame Shannon's stop that now, but her life has changed and that sort yeah, I met some brilliant humans in, in, well, 2020 and 2021 were just brilliant for meeting people, even though we were at home and couldn't meet people in real life.
• 7:38
  Siobhan: It was just kind of, yeah, a very different, um, Yeah, and 2020 was huge for my business in terms of networking, like I loved, I loved meeting new people.
• 7:48
  Siobhan: Yeah, and Shannon, Shannon Maid, you won't be able to see this because it's a podcast, but on my shelf behind me is a little, it's a little witch crocheted, and I, um, I feel like I grew Shannon's confidence because she, she, I think she, she sent me an invoice for like 30 pounds for this custom made crocheted witch.
• 8:08
  Siobhan: And I was like, dude, that is ridiculous.
• 8:10
  Siobhan: Like, like I was like, I can't.
• 8:12
  Siobhan: Like, no, what do you want to be paid?
• 8:15
  Siobhan: Like, not, what do you think I want to pay you?
• 8:17
  Siobhan: What do you want to be paid?
• 8:18
  Siobhan: And I sent her a check for that, for what she wanted, and I remember being like, that it made her start charging more in her Etsy shop, and I was so proud, I was so proud of like, of that, but also the fact that I have a custom made word witch on my shelf, which is kind of like, unusual, and with pink dungarees and everything, and but yeah, sorry, I've gone off on a tangent, haven't I?
• 8:40
  Siobhan: But, um, Yeah, I love that group.
• 8:42
  Siobhan: I love that group.
• 8:43
  Peta: that's cool.
• 8:43
  Peta: And that kind of does lead on to what I think is going to be your soapbox.
• 8:46
  Peta: So every every episode I kind of grab my guest and get them to tell me what their soapbox is.
• 8:54
  Peta: What is the thing that they always find themselves in the kitchen at parties at 11 PM talking about or holding court?
• 9:00
  Peta: What is the thing that they rant about on a regular basis?
• 9:04
  Peta: So Siobhan, what is your soapbox?
• 9:08
  Siobhan: My soapbox is that women don't tell their stories.
• 9:12
  Siobhan: And that might be a big general sweeping statement, but I feel like the majority of us don't speak up about that.
• 9:22
  Siobhan: the things we've been through or you know, where we came from or whatever it is, we let other people tell our stories for us.
• 9:31
  Siobhan: And I am a really, as a copywriter and a mentor or whatever, whatever hat I'm wearing, like I, I feel really passionate about women.
• 9:39
  Siobhan: Telling their stories.
• 9:40
  Siobhan: That is something that really grinds my gears is when people hold themselves back and that's on like the political stage Or whether that's like at their work Or even when they're like, you know at a party for example
• 9:55
  Peta: Why do you think it's so important for women to tell their stories, to show up and then kind of tell people about themselves?
• 10:03
  Peta: Yeah.
• 10:06
  Siobhan: women's stories have been kind of erased so whether that's like scientists not being, women scientists not being put on papers because obviously the men are much more important, or whether that's products that have been designed and patented by men.
• 10:23
  Siobhan: Who basically stole those ideas of women similar kind of track or, you know, there's, the history has re written, been re written by men, and women's stories have been taken away and there's loads of examples you could look through, and I talk about this on This Sister Speaks it's one of the modules, uh, This Sister Tells Stories, and For me, I just, I've seen it happen so many times when I did the Dreadcourts Women in Leadership programme, people kind of, just kind of rushing off the stuff they've been through the stuff that led them to where they are, as if it doesn't matter.
• 10:58
  Siobhan: Oh, because someone's told them not to speak about, you know, oh no, people don't want to hear about that, or you're too much, or you're too sensitive, and I'll stop bringing that up.
• 11:06
  Siobhan: You've like, bring it up with your therapist instead.
• 11:09
  Siobhan: People worried about trauma dumping, or you know, there's lots of different, and obviously that is an issue, but like, I just, I, our stories are so important, and if we don't tell our stories, someone else will, or they'll be erased completely.
• 11:23
  Siobhan: And you see, you know, there's like, there's so many examples, my head is like bubbling now, like, you could go off on a tangent about this, or like, but yeah, I mean, if you, all you have to do is like, Google, or whatever platform you use women, women's stories that have been erased, and there'll be hundreds of them.
• 11:42
  Siobhan: Um, you know, if you Googled who was the first woman in Parliament.
• 11:47
  Siobhan: Like, the actual first woman in Parliament, that story's been erased.
• 11:51
  Siobhan: Like, people poo poo it because she was an Irish woman.
• 11:54
  Siobhan: And because she never set foot in Parliament, her story was kind of, and her, it's a fucking powerful story.
• 12:01
  Siobhan: But she's not in there.
• 12:03
  Siobhan: Um, yeah.
• 12:04
  Peta: a recent Instagram post about, um, that popped up on my feed about how Einstein's wife did a lot of the maths for him.
• 12:10
  Siobhan: I read this this morning!
• 12:12
  Peta: yeah, yeah.
• 12:13
  Peta: And so they they made a deal that, that she'd get the money from the Nobel Prize if she gave him the, when they divorced, like if she gave him the credit and he went back on it and said that he was going to give the money to his son and so she threatened to out him to everybody.
• 12:28
  Peta: But yeah, all that kind of stuff is crazy.
• 12:32
  Siobhan: Yeah, but we just, it's really odd, isn't it?
• 12:34
  Siobhan: Like, um, The way that it's just kind of, there's been deals made, or they've just been shut down, like, Yeah, I just, I find it really mind blowing, and I know it's probably less so now because we have social media and people can kind of tell their stories, but I know lots of us self censor.
• 12:52
  Siobhan: And we edit the way we kind of show up and the way we tell our story.
• 12:59
  Siobhan: And so many of us don't, but like, for example, when I left teaching and set up bulletproof reading, Western themed website and all yeah, so cringe.
• 13:09
  Siobhan: Um, I didn't tell my story on my website, for example.
• 13:14
  Siobhan: I I look back now and I'm like, it's so embarrassing.
• 13:17
  Siobhan: But like, I just thought people want to see a professional proofreader and copy editor.
• 13:22
  Siobhan: So I didn't talk about the fact that I've been a teacher, quite an important part of my career.
• 13:27
  Siobhan: didn't talk about my degree in creative writing and media, didn't talk about the fact that I was a mum, which obviously can, can help you get clients sometimes I feel I didn't talk about my politics or, you know, any, I, anything, I literally was just this like must prevent, present as like professional and Try and align myself with all these other people don't want to stand out.
• 13:53
  Siobhan: Hi so, um, yeah, I Tell you story is so important because it helps you it helps you find your people doesn't it?
• 14:03
  Siobhan: like, you know telling to tell my story about Being a teacher and being a mom and telling story about you know Politics and my obsession with my you know, my lifelong obsession with social justice has helped me figure out who my people are.
• 14:19
  Siobhan: It's changed my it's changed the way clients come to me.
• 14:23
  Siobhan: It's changed the way people are more aligned with my work.
• 14:27
  Siobhan: It's grown my following massively.
• 14:30
  Peta: So, so you mentioned that telling your story has kind of helped you find your people.
• 14:36
  Peta: Can you, can, yeah, tell us a little bit more about the impact that that made on like on you, your business, your confidence, all that kind of stuff.
• 14:45
  Siobhan: Yeah, so, when I kind of obviously left teaching, I set up this other business that wasn't going well.
• 14:51
  Siobhan: And then somebody found my blog.
• 14:54
  Siobhan: I was writing at the time for like mental, mental health purposes, I suppose, for myself, like a release about town mummy to country mummy.
• 15:01
  Siobhan: And cause he moved from London to Devon and I wrote this kind of like, pithy, kind of scathing, um, weird blog.
• 15:11
  Siobhan: Anyway, don't go and Google it.
• 15:13
  Siobhan: Um, so, uh, anyway, someone found my
• 15:17
  Peta: totally going to Google it now.
• 15:19
  Siobhan: Hopefully it's deleted.
• 15:20
  Siobhan: I don't even know.
• 15:21
  Siobhan: But yeah, somebody found my writing and said like, Oh, you're a really good writer.
• 15:25
  Siobhan: Do you want to come and work for us?
• 15:26
  Siobhan: And I was like, Oh, cool.
• 15:28
  Siobhan: So I was doing content writing for a wedding company.
• 15:31
  Siobhan: And then that kind of spiraled into like other people being referred to me, wedding planners.
• 15:35
  Siobhan: I did a lot of work in the wedding industry for florists and all sorts.
• 15:39
  Siobhan: And then yeah, I had this kind of epiphany, I feel like, you know, counsellor, activist stuff, mum stuff, like I was running lots of, I ran three marathons at the same time.
• 15:51
  Siobhan: Like it was like, yeah, it was a very busy, And looking back, I'm like, oh, clearly I was just keeping myself going so I didn't like collapse in a heap mentally masking heavily.
• 16:01
  Siobhan: But anyway so, um, and at the same time, I was just taking any work that I could get, like I, because I had this very, very bland presence online a bit girl bossy, because that's all the groups were telling us in 2017, you know, Female Entrepreneur Association, et al very pink, very rose gold And I was just getting, I had some lovely wedding industry clients but at the same time I was taking on like SEO work for like bro marketers and I had this crappy retainer client who paid paid me very well but wow he was an arsehole.
• 16:41
  Siobhan: He, I was doing his social media, I was editing his books.
• 16:45
  Siobhan: I was proofreading all the books and his work.
• 16:48
  Siobhan: I was writing blogs for him.
• 16:49
  Siobhan: I was doing a lot of work for him and he would message me at like 4am and be like, why hasn't this been done?
• 16:58
  Siobhan: And of course, most people are asleep at 4am.
• 17:02
  Siobhan: So when I messaged him back at 7, when I was kind of like, you know, the children are sat at the breakfast table and I think, right, I'll text him back now.
• 17:09
  Siobhan: Like, why is it taking you three hours to reply?
• 17:12
  Siobhan: And he, I probably worked for him for like seven or eight months before I just had had enough.
• 17:18
  Siobhan: I was exhausted.
• 17:19
  Siobhan: I was like being paid for kind of maybe 15 hours a week, but probably working 25 hours, maybe, maybe more.
• 17:27
  Siobhan: And it was just really stressful and I felt like I was employed and I was like I left teaching because I didn't want to be employed.
• 17:35
  Siobhan: Yeah, and so the experience with him and realizing that, you know, I had to bite my tongue all the time.
• 17:41
  Siobhan: That was the other thing is he was quite politically.
• 17:45
  Siobhan: misaligned with me.
• 17:46
  Siobhan: So he would make little snide comments about immigrants or he would talk about Brexit and I'd have to be like, oh my god, rein yourself in Siobhan.
• 17:55
  Siobhan: Like, don't, don't antagonize, like, middle, middle aged, middle class white man.
• 18:02
  Siobhan: Um, so I basically like decided that I needed to change my messaging to be like, I don't work with knobheads.
• 18:11
  Siobhan: And that's explicitly stated on my website.
• 18:14
  Siobhan: Since that experience.
• 18:15
  Siobhan: I don't really, it's not stated on my website because obviously it would be like misandry to say I don't work with men.
• 18:21
  Siobhan: Cause I do occasionally, nice ones.
• 18:23
  Siobhan: And, um, Yeah, I told my story because I just felt like if I didn't explain this, people would come to me thinking I was just like a bro markety copywriter who works with any fucker and I don't, and I've learned that lesson.
• 18:38
  Siobhan: So that was in 20, that was at the end of 2017 beginning of 2018, and it was just such a, A lift for me.
• 18:46
  Siobhan: It's like the weight kind of fell off and I suddenly had all these like wonderful people being Being like, oh, I love how you've written no knobheads on your website I love how sweary you are.
• 18:56
  Siobhan: Like I love how you say fuck the tories.
• 18:58
  Siobhan: I love like, you know There was all this kind of like, um What's the word?
• 19:03
  Siobhan: Like synchronicity.
• 19:04
  Siobhan: And it was just, um, yeah, I don't know.
• 19:08
  Siobhan: Everything changed for me at that point.
• 19:09
  Siobhan: And don't get me wrong, like, I'm not like, Oh, I make six figures now and blah, blah, blah.
• 19:13
  Siobhan: Like, it's still a fucking rollercoaster, but I don't work with knobheads now.
• 19:18
  Siobhan: And it's such a huge difference.
• 19:19
  Siobhan: And that's because I told my story and it's because I show up as who I am fully.
• 19:24
  Siobhan: And that there come, there is a lot of privilege with that.
• 19:27
  Siobhan: Like, you know, I am a Cishet.
• 19:31
  Siobhan: white woman who is in a heteronormative relationship.
• 19:34
  Siobhan: I have a very supportive partner.
• 19:37
  Siobhan: You know, I'm housed, I'm able bodied.
• 19:40
  Siobhan: There's so much privilege that comes with this.
• 19:41
  Siobhan: But because of all that, like, that almost gives me more impetus to speak up about issues, to be more ballsy, to lead the conversation.
• 19:50
  Siobhan: That way to role model because I, I think there's quite a lot of cis het white women who aren't aren't willing or able to step up because if, and we need more of us to step up and otherwise collective liberation is not going to happen.
• 20:08
  Siobhan: Yeah, that's, that's my soapbox.
• 20:10
  Peta: I love it.
• 20:11
  Peta: The great soapbox, it's one I vibe very strongly with.
• 20:16
  Peta: Okay, so I mean, I have so much to unpack.
• 20:20
  Peta: The first is I cannot imagine you sitting there and biting your tongue when some middle aged white man is talking like that.
• 20:30
  Peta: It's, yeah, that's not the Siobhan that I have come to know and love.
• 20:36
  Siobhan: Yeah, she's a very different person and very un, I was very insecure, I suppose, financially worried about getting work in.
• 20:44
  Siobhan: It's yeah, I, there's a, yeah, I don't know, like I, I am very different now and I think there's a lot of hangover, hangover from teaching.
• 20:53
  Siobhan: Um, when I left, I had a bit of a reputation, I suppose, as being like a no person because I got, you know, I was involved in my union and that we had lots of stuff coming into my final school where I was working and I kind of kept going, well, no, I don't want to do that.
• 21:08
  Siobhan: Nope.
• 21:09
  Siobhan: I don't have to do that.
• 21:10
  Siobhan: And because I'd had a breakdown, I was very much told by occupational health, it's a job.
• 21:16
  Siobhan: You turn up, you do the job, you leave.
• 21:19
  Siobhan: Stop.
• 21:20
  Siobhan: being a control freak, essentially, was the messaging.
• 21:23
  Siobhan: No one picked up my ADHD, a whole other story.
• 21:26
  Siobhan: Um, but yeah, the, like, I think there was a lot of hangover of, like, you don't rock the boat.
• 21:32
  Siobhan: And that's something I've been talking about a lot recently.
• 21:33
  Siobhan: It's like, we need to rock the boat.
• 21:37
  Siobhan: But obviously, back then, it was, like, felt unsafe for me to do that.
• 21:41
  Siobhan: And now I think my experiences in the council being like the youngest person in the room or second youngest person in the room and realizing that I needed to speak up because the policies that we were bringing in didn't work for the local community and all that kind of stuff.
• 21:56
  Siobhan: And then obviously like the Joe Cox Women in Leadership program and lots of other labor and union trainings I was doing at the time made me realize, like, I've got all this privilege and I need to fucking use it.
• 22:08
  Siobhan: Um.
• 22:09
  Siobhan: Yeah, I don't know, like, yeah, Siobhan back in 2017 2018 was very, um, in juxtaposed, there were lots of things, there was lots of things going on that were very misaligned.
• 22:22
  Siobhan: Like, I'd be shouting about Palestine, but then not talking about it on social media.
• 22:27
  Siobhan: I'd be like at a rally, but not talk about it.
• 22:30
  Siobhan: And then be like, not speak up about someone, I don't know, talking about all, I don't know, all those bloody Muslims, that's the kind of thing he would say.
• 22:40
  Siobhan: Or they're taking over.
• 22:42
  Siobhan: Like, I'd be like, Hmm.
• 22:46
  Peta: Type, type, type.
• 22:47
  Peta: La, la,
• 22:47
  Siobhan: Yeah, which is very different to me now because now I would be like.
• 22:50
  Siobhan: Sorry, can you just explain that a bit more to me?
• 22:53
  Siobhan: Like, um, sorry, where, where is, where are they taking over?
• 22:56
  Siobhan: Like, can you just, can you just, can I have an, an, a postcode?
• 22:59
  Peta: Yeah.
• 23:00
  Siobhan: um, I'll go and look.
• 23:02
  Siobhan: Um, I'd be quite antagonistic now, whereas, like, Yeah, back then I didn't, wouldn't have said a word because I just didn't want to lose the work.
• 23:11
  Siobhan: Um, which I see, that is a lot, the way a lot of people are still.
• 23:16
  Siobhan: Um,
• 23:17
  Peta: So, so you've been helping some people, you've been having lots of people to step into that same kind of confidence, I guess, that ability to, one, care less about what other people think and to voice, like, tell your story and, and kind of speak your mind.
• 23:35
  Peta: How have you been helping women in your circle do that?
• 23:39
  Siobhan: So I've been doing that kind of the last couple of years I've been running a group program for copywriting called Shine.
• 23:44
  Siobhan: And that's kind of been doing it through kind of getting people to tell their stories on their websites and just kind of reiterating the idea.
• 23:51
  Siobhan: Yeah.
• 23:52
  Siobhan: that it helps you stand out from the crowd, like it calls in the right people and, you know, telling my story and being like, look, this is what happens when you, when you do that.
• 24:02
  Siobhan: But then I also got my, another group program, my group experience.
• 24:08
  Siobhan: Cause I hate the word program.
• 24:09
  Siobhan: Which is This Sister Speaks, and I've been kind of working with women to, and non binary folk, to yeah, learn what it means to be a changemaker and, lead, essentially.
• 24:21
  Siobhan: Essentially, it's a feminist leadership program, but if I call it that, then no one wants to do it.
• 24:27
  Siobhan: essentially like looking at, looking at the world leaders, looking at the people around us in our local communities and more online and going like, well, who, who do I want to aspire to be like, or who, who's making change happen that I want to kind of do in my own way.
• 24:43
  Siobhan: And given the confidence and the strategy to do that.
• 24:48
  Siobhan: And I think one of the things that people always go like, Oh, you know, but I'm just a, or are no, but it's just mean, or I can't, I can't do things like that or it's embarrassing to rock the boat, or what will people think?
• 25:03
  Siobhan: So I'm kind of like trying to combat all of that by showing them like imposter syndrome isn't really a thing showing them like how other people have done it introducing them to like speakers and people that they are leaders who they maybe haven't really thought of as leaders before introducing them to kind of books and readings that they can kind of take on board.
• 25:27
  Siobhan: As well as kind of getting them to practice speaking about something they care about in a safe space where they're allowed to be vulnerable and they can speak up on issues that maybe they haven't felt confident or comfortable doing before.
• 25:40
  Siobhan: So it's been and I love, I've absolutely loved, I did the first round, it's been in the making since 2021, and I tried to try to launch it.
• 25:50
  Siobhan: in the six weeks before I had a baby.
• 25:53
  Siobhan: Um, yeah, don't Peter.
• 25:56
  Siobhan: I was like, yeah, I'm superwoman, I can do everything.
• 25:59
  Siobhan: And yeah, absolute flop because obviously I didn't have the energy to launch properly.
• 26:05
  Siobhan: But also like they knew I was going to have a baby, so they were all like, why would you do this?
• 26:09
  Siobhan: Yeah, and I launched it properly this year, and it was super, like, I don't want to like, I don't want to brag, but it was awesome.
• 26:17
  Siobhan: We had the most juicy, wonderful, deep, vulnerable, conversations every single week where they were showing up and talking about, so we did the train, I send out the trainings on a Monday and then they've got a few days to kind of do the homework or kind of reflect.
• 26:35
  Siobhan: And then we come together on a Friday and have these collective reflection sessions, and which is quite hard to say with the list.
• 26:40
  Siobhan: But yeah, we, we dive into it for 90 minutes, and anything that's come up, you know, for them in terms of leadership, or things that have been going on in their communities, they haven't known how to discuss it, or or approach it, or like, how do I share about this without, you know, Seeming performative or that kind of thing.
• 27:00
  Siobhan: So we loads of different conversations and I'm thinking about doing this thing.
• 27:04
  Siobhan: Do you think it's a good idea or oh, it's just been, it's been absolutely glorious.
• 27:09
  Siobhan: And that finished in June, end of June, I think.
• 27:12
  Siobhan: And the next round starts next week and, or mid, mid-September.
• 27:16
  Siobhan: And it's just been, it's been exciting kind of talking about what, what we, what we could achieve collectively.
• 27:24
  Siobhan: Um.
• 27:25
  Siobhan: Yeah, I'm getting myself all riled up and excited now in anticipation.
• 27:30
  Peta: Brilliant.
• 27:30
  Peta: And yeah, it's, it sounds epic.
• 27:32
  Peta: Everything that you've been putting out about it sounds fabulous.
• 27:35
  Peta: Very amused by the fact that, yeah, you're like, if I called it a feminist leadership training, then nobody would take it because positioning is everything.
• 27:43
  Peta: It's interesting how that chimes with this idea that women don't.
• 27:48
  Peta: tell their stories.
• 27:49
  Peta: And women are often reticent to put themselves in positions of leadership.
• 27:56
  Peta: I mean, less so now, but you, you, you would, you will find an awful lot more female leaders in positions of power around the world now, and that's brilliant obviously, but there's still an awful lot of women who are going, well, nobody wants to hear about that, or I don't have anything to add.
• 28:16
  Peta: Or you know, that kind of old stat that men will apply for a position if they're like 50 percent qualified or whatever and women will, will apply if they're like 97 percent qualified.
• 28:28
  Peta: So we miss out on, on so much.
• 28:31
  Peta: So yeah, the fact that you'll help giving people a space to, to learn those kind of skills is really important.
• 28:36
  Siobhan: Yeah, and it's, and I think it's, and it's not aimed at one specific kind of person, which from a marketing perspective makes it quite challenging, but Yeah, I really like, I love the fact that everybody who came to it last time was from kind of different industries and different worlds.
• 28:54
  Siobhan: and had their own perspective to bring.
• 28:56
  Siobhan: So, and they, they all had very different aims for the program.
• 29:00
  Siobhan: And you know, when we did our one to one sessions, some of them wanted to like, talk about the campaign they want to run.
• 29:07
  Siobhan: Not political campaign necessarily, like in their local, local communities, like, you know, not, not a library closing, but that kind of thing.
• 29:14
  Siobhan: And then others just wanted to kind of talk about like, well, how, you know, stuff that you do in the soapbox, like, well, how do I talk about these issues and on social media without pontificating, or I don't, do I know enough, is it okay that I'm talking about that and kind of almost coming up with like a content strategy.
• 29:30
  Siobhan: So they're very different kind of aims.
• 29:32
  Siobhan: And it's, yeah, it's just, it's really nice for me as well to flex the different muscles that I have like using my kind of political campaign strategy stuff, but also.
• 29:42
  Siobhan: Being like, oh, I know, I know how to do that as well, like it's kind of, yeah, it's been really, it's been really nice to do, as opposed to like, I love writing copy, but also does get a bit tiresome sometimes, so this has been really nice for my ADHD brain to be like, I really love this and I'm in my, zone of genius.
• 30:01
  Siobhan: And you know, when things are like so easy and the conversations flow and the work kind of just brings so much joy.
• 30:09
  Siobhan: Yeah, it feels a bit naughty.
• 30:11
  Siobhan: Like I'm doing something forbidden and I suppose it is by the patriarchy.
• 30:15
  Peta: The patriarchy would not be happy with This Sister Speaks.
• 30:20
  Siobhan: but it is glorious and like the transformations that some of the women have, have had And the light bulb moment has been really brilliant to watch and kind of brings me back to like those moments when I used to have with teaching.
• 30:33
  Siobhan: It's been really good.
• 30:34
  Siobhan: I'm really looking forward to the next round.
• 30:36
  Siobhan: So,
• 30:37
  Peta: Cool.
• 30:38
  Peta: Okay, so for people who are listening and are thinking I, I would love to tell my story a little bit more but it's really, really difficult.
• 30:49
  Peta: What kind of two, three pieces of advice would you give them to kind of get started?
• 30:54
  Peta: If they've, if they're very much in their head, nobody wants to hear about that.
• 30:58
  Peta: How do you get them to, to take that first step?
• 31:02
  Siobhan: So I, I would say do a bit of journaling.
• 31:07
  Siobhan: I know it's cringe.
• 31:08
  Siobhan: but also it works.
• 31:11
  Siobhan: So, this is so sad, but I did a workshop on this years ago called Awaken Your Magic, which again, cringe, but whatever.
• 31:19
  Siobhan: So there, think about a time when you're at a party and you come across your younger self.
• 31:27
  Siobhan: What would you tell them about yourself?
• 31:29
  Siobhan: How would you describe where you are now?
• 31:32
  Siobhan: So kind of, you know, This is the, the way that I get people to realise that they've got a story to tell, effectively, is kind of like, tell your younger self, your childhood self, and it's quite emotional, I remember when I was running the workshop, like, 90 percent of people were crying on the, on the Zoom call, which, um,
• 31:52
  Peta: tissues.
• 31:53
  Siobhan: yeah, but it's, yeah, it's that It's really emotive thinking, like thinking about where, how you got to where you are today.
• 31:59
  Siobhan: So telling your younger self when we're writing it all down, and you're not necessarily going to put this on your website, but you might find some nuggets of thing of like stories to tell or anecdotes or even just kind of moments that are pivotal moments in your story where you're like, Oh my God, that was what changed everything.
• 32:22
  Siobhan: Yeah, so that's my tip for kind of finding your story almost is, is to go journal as if you're writing or talking to your your childhood self, which I'm sure there's some sort of therapy technique in there somewhere, but I'm not a trained therapist.
• 32:39
  Siobhan: Yeah, but I, it will be emotive.
• 32:41
  Siobhan: Um, yeah, box of tissues, as Peter said.
• 32:45
  Siobhan: So, yeah.
• 32:46
  Siobhan: And then the other, the other thing you could do is if writing isn't your thing, you could voice note and then listen back to it.
• 32:53
  Siobhan: I'm sure you use that as a copywriting technique and you've got like those kind of blank page phobia clients as well where you're like, it's fine, you don't have to write down, send me a voice note.
• 33:02
  Siobhan: It's cool.
• 33:03
  Peta: talk at me.
• 33:05
  Siobhan: Yeah, and that's,
• 33:06
  Peta: yeah, that's so helpful.
• 33:07
  Peta: And I, and sometimes I think that we, when, if we're not used to writing things down like that, we feel like we have to kind of start forming like an essay or like, it's all really
• 33:19
  Siobhan: grammar, please.
• 33:21
  Peta: like article that we're writing for something.
• 33:23
  Peta: And that means that we do definitely communicate in a different way than if we're just sat next to a friend on a garden bench, like having a chat.
• 33:30
  Siobhan: Yeah, that's self editing, like, and as women, that's kind of how we're trained, almost, to, like, edit ourselves, to censor ourselves, and it's, you know, it's self protection, I mean, we, we know what's been going on in the world of, like, femicide is rife, like, we are protecting ourselves by minimalizing what we say and how we say it and all of that kind of stuff, but I think there's, we're coming to a point now where, you know, And we need to stop doing that.
• 34:01
  Siobhan: We're like, we're being nice, not kind.
• 34:06
  Siobhan: That whole Rene Brown vibe.
• 34:08
  Siobhan: I know she's done lots of, she's talked about that a lot, but also, um, uh, somebody I follow called Yusama was talking about it this morning.
• 34:15
  Siobhan: And I, Yeah, I wholeheartedly wish that more women would tell their stories because A, they resonate with people and it calls the right clients in if you're a business person.
• 34:30
  Siobhan: But if you're a leader within corporate, telling your story is really important to set you up as a human being so that people see you as approachable that they can come to you when, you know, for example, if your kid's sick, your kid's sick, you're not going to go to a leader who is only ever been like corporate, corporate, corporate, corporate, bottom line, corporate, corporate, you're going to go openly to a leader.
• 34:56
  Siobhan: You're not going to pull a sticky.
• 34:57
  Siobhan: You're going to go openly to read and go, look, my kid's sick.
• 35:00
  Siobhan: I can work from home, but I really need to work from home.
• 35:03
  Siobhan: And they are going to show empathy.
• 35:05
  Siobhan: Then what they're more likely to show empathy if they've kind of shown you that a little bit of the, no, I'm not saying like, I'm not saying like tell you everything, and I know I'm a tell you everything kind of person, um, thanks ADHD, but like the, just a snippet of your home life, leading by example, role modeling, leaving early to go and pick your kids up from school, all that kind of stuff as a leader is really valuable.
• 35:31
  Siobhan: I don't know.
• 35:32
  Siobhan: I, it isn't just about the business.
• 35:35
  Siobhan: our online business space.
• 35:37
  Siobhan: I think it, it's, um, telling your story matters everywhere.
• 35:41
  Peta: yeah
• 35:42
  Siobhan: Yeah.
• 35:43
  Peta: Cool.
• 35:44
  Peta: Thank you very much.
• 35:46
  Peta: So if people are looking to tap into feminist leadership vibe, like they have something that they care about and or a campaign that they want to start or they want to get involved in those kind of things.
• 36:00
  Peta: And.
• 36:00
  Peta: They're intrigued by this Sister Speaks.
• 36:03
  Peta: What can they do?
• 36:05
  Siobhan: So the next round, um, is kicking, kicking off in September.
• 36:09
  Siobhan: So, it will be getting on the wait list to find out when I'm running the next round.
• 36:14
  Siobhan: Um, so, uh, we'll pop.
• 36:17
  Siobhan: Pop a waitlist link in there and then you can be, you get on my newsletter and you'll be the first to hear when the next round starts.
• 36:27
  Siobhan: Um, so you'll get a discount on all that jazz.
• 36:30
  Siobhan: But yeah, really excited to help more women raise their voices and lead the change.
• 36:36
  Peta: Hurrah! And if people want to get in touch with you generally, if they want to come and find out what you're up to have a chat about something that you might have in common or something that you can rant about together, where is the best place to come and find you?
• 36:48
  Siobhan: Instagram, I'm at this sister speaks come and hang out, leave me a several voice notes, that is absolutely fine.
• 36:56
  Siobhan: Or if you're feeling grown up, go on LinkedIn.
• 36:58
  Siobhan: I'm trying to hang out there a little bit more.
• 37:01
  Siobhan: Yeah, it feels a bit weird, but I'm, I'm trying.
• 37:04
  Peta: You're doing very well.
• 37:05
  Peta: LinkedIn's cool.
• 37:06
  Peta: It takes some getting used to, but I'm, I am positive that you are going to find your people there.
• 37:12
  Siobhan: I am trying.
• 37:12
  Siobhan: I just need, I need to be more confident speaking up, ironically.
• 37:17
  Siobhan: Um, yeah, I'm really comfortable on Instagram but I, I think it's because of the people that I've got in my thing.
• 37:23
  Siobhan: They're all like ex teachers, or labor people, or people I went to school with, like bankawanker types, like, just, yeah, there's a lot of A lot of people I probably should unfollow, but also I'm quite nosy, so probably not going to.
• 37:38
  Siobhan: But then I need to stop caring what they think.
• 37:41
  Siobhan: So yeah, it's
• 37:42
  Peta: Ah, the irony.
• 37:45
  Peta: Cool.
• 37:46
  Peta: Thank you so much for coming and chatting with me.
• 37:48
  Peta: As always, it has been a pleasure.
• 37:51
  Peta: So yeah, people need to go find you, find out about this as describes and yeah, find out how fabulous you are.
• 37:58
  Siobhan: Thank you for having me.
• 37:59
  Siobhan: It's been a joy.
• 38:01
  Siobhan: Thank you.