Latest / TWRS-Leadership Straight, No Chaser / Why Your Business Isn’t Getting Clients (Marketing Mistakes to Fix)
Transcript
- Scott Brandt: of built trusted and chosen what comes to mind welcome back to together we are stronger leadership straight no chaser and tonight we have west towers on with us as our guest And Wes, I was looking at the one sheet and I know you highlight you have your own podcast, but the interesting thing is with those words that you chose with title of the podcast, the big one is really the built piece. When we look at individuals, they like try to shortcut their stuff. They don't want to go through the building process and the time it takes to build. And so for yourself with what you do within the world of construction, helping leaders within that world, what was it for you that was that pinpoint piece that you're like, man, this is a struggle that I have and then now I'm looking at everybody else ⁓ we've got to figure out a way to help them out to really stand out and really get seen by others ⁓ Wes Towers: Yeah, I mean, there's lots of ⁓ little learnings over the journey, man. I just struggled with business so much in the early days. So like a lot of founder led businesses, you start with a skill set, you want to take that to market, but you've got no idea how to run business. so building out something that's viable firstly, first little goal was to build something that at least was to my ⁓ income, which the first little hurdle and Just so many things that I've figured out over the journey, know, learning from others, getting great mentors into my world, joining some networking groups where they were hanging out, because you've got to go where people are and the people that you want to learn from ⁓ so on. you ⁓ want to reach out to your ideal but you also want to learn from mentors. So I think that build process, it feels like it's a never ending journey, isn't it? It's like... ⁓ Scott Brandt: Hmm. Wes Towers: You learn as you go and as things evolve and you grow as a business and you get new challenges. It feels like brought one challenge to the next. But yeah, it's over 20 years been running digital agency, looking after trades construction businesses, making websites, looking after their online marketing. So it's been fun. Scott Brandt: Hmm. George Dovolis: That sounds like a lot of fun. Scott Brandt: Yeah, it's a very interesting thing because like We used, you talked to lot of people in the construction industry leaders, and I think it goes for anything. Really. There's times that leaders are really scared to do things differently. Trades and construction because it's hands on. It's like, okay, I don't have extra time to do all this extra stuff with marketing. So I'm not going to really tap into it, but the issue is a lot of people miss out on the opportunity to showcase who they are really to connect with their ideal client at a different. level, an individual, Amaral Takori, that has highlighted that it's not the best, but it's the best known. And so as a construction worker, you have a skill set that everybody needs. But the thing is, if people don't know who you are, you miss out. And ⁓ when comes to working with leaders and being in that construction world, what really that holding point that you see with individuals that they struggle with? And you're like, we Wes Towers: Mm. Yeah. Scott Brandt: got to figure out a way to help others in the spot to overcome that. But what's the biggest sticking point that you see for lot of individuals that you work with? Wes Towers: Yeah, well we tend to avoid what we don't understand and that can only make matters worse realistically and so every business probably appreciates they need to think about their marketing to grow as a business. I you can rely on word of mouth to a degree and that's good in the boom times because there's an abundance of work out there but when things turn a little bit, gets a little bit more scarce the work out there, you've really got to fight a little harder to attract in the right people into your world. and customers and clients. So just like I didn't know a whole bunch of stuff in business when I started out, starting trades in construction oftentimes. George Dovolis: Mm-hmm. Wes Towers: marketing pieces and something they're familiar with. And so that tendency to avoid what we don't know is a real risk. But the beauty of it for me is there's so many, ⁓ the is so great. ⁓ You bump into so many construction company that are really ⁓ not quite to what they need to be. And so where there's a great need, there's a great opportunity. And that's why we exist. why our business is flourishing because there's just so many, there's an abundance of companies that need to grow and need to attract more business. you know, it's always interesting. People say, ⁓ did you end up with the construction niche? And make the assumption that I had some sort of or construction background and I don't, I'm kind of useless at picking up a hammer and all that kind of stuff. But for whatever reason, I relate really well to those types of people. They're pragmatic, practical. hands on down to earth, they'll understand their limitations and delegate. So they're ideal for me because once we get an understanding what they're up to and what makes them unique and sets them apart in the marketplace, we can really expand upon their message and make sure all the right people are seeing it at the right times. George Dovolis: Mm-hmm. what you the most valuable part of business and yourself? Wes Towers: Yeah, there's so many struggles in business and in life. just the nature of life. But ⁓ way to look at any of those things is to take the learnings and see the opportunity for growth. ⁓ And so certainly a few years back, I had ⁓ a horrible time, separation, divorce, all that kind of stuff. then off the back of that, we needed to get the business valuation done and it came in. George Dovolis: yes Wes Towers: Pretty low to be honest, a whole lot lower than I anticipated. And that was largely due to the value of saying that the rise of AI was a massive threat to our entire industry. And so I already knew there was the potential for it to disrupt ⁓ industry and our business. But it was really a wake up call to say, you start hustling and figuring this stuff out. So was the very first time really leaned upon the team that I have because they're technical people, right? They're studying this stuff just out of fun. They're looking at AI and what it might mean and what it can do for fun because they're technical people. So leaning upon them to ⁓ about how we might adapt and grow and expand and change the way we do things was really a powerful move off back of that. George Dovolis: Now. Wes Towers: most profitable financial year just last one reported and hope to beat that again, this one. yeah, it's those painful, whilst it was a horrible painful time of life, it a reset in a whole lot of ways and ⁓ flourished as a consequence of getting some of this stuff right. George Dovolis: Amazing. Scott Brandt: Yeah, so right now as a business owner. You got into business to do some different things. It wasn't payroll, wasn't HR, it wasn't compliance. so like Wes has highlighted, if you're struggling with like the digital presence, if you're struggling with that back end stuff, ADP is a power partner of ours that they really specialize in that to make sure you focus on your zone of genius. So you can go grow your business and really focus on what your strength is and not take on this unnecessary extra stuff that you weren't even planning on. So if you have questions, there'll be a link in the show notes, reach out to ADP. That's what they're here for to help you say. then also want to give a shout out to Dr. Joey. ⁓ is one that works with business owners that really are struggling to ⁓ over to that next level. If you're between a half a million revenue to ⁓ million, he works with you, your uniqueness really to overcome and get to that next level. so ⁓ what Wes is sharing here, really it's that collaboration piece that if you're stuck, ⁓ do it on your own. Find help, reach out. And so if you'd like to talk to Dr. Joey, have him help you with that that'll be in the show notes hit the link there and they'll take that time to sit down and talk to you Wes it's a very ⁓ thing when we see the world of AI like everybody and their mothers is on the the warpath of AI ⁓ a new system here's a new ⁓ to work with AI it's it's crazy just how ⁓ ⁓ wide that we've got. ⁓ talk about the aspect of that human the human connection, that you really work to help ⁓ the within the construction industry, ⁓ leaders general, really, when I look at this. But when it comes to kind of the uprise of AI, people freaking out about it, when you look at that, what is the biggest thing that ⁓ we be mindful about when comes to that can do for you but also not going so far left that you end up ⁓ having disappear and you not show up because everybody's like I'm gonna kill myself Wes Towers: Mmm. Scott Brandt: And it's like, oh my God, like you're gone. Like you're scared about it, but now you're pushing yourself that way. like when you look at AI and what people can do, like what's the power on that? And then what are the things that we want to be mindful about not to dissipate ourself and then we don't ever show up. Wes Towers: Mmm. Yeah, yeah, there's massive risks and massive rewards that we can all work towards, those rewards. The risk is that we lean upon the tools so much that we lose, as you say, we lose ourselves in that and lose ourselves in terms of the marketing message. Just like the people that you mentioned that help you find your which sounds like a fantastic service. That's ⁓ what you wanna amplify throughout all your marketing material and certainly your website and social media everywhere. The risk with AI being... pretty dramatic because we're all bumped into things that just don't seem authentic. We read things we don't necessarily believe them. We've seen photographs we don't believe. ⁓ seen videos that we know are not true. And so that just erodes trust tremendously with everything that we... Scott Brandt: Hmm. Wes Towers: with these days. We just don't know what's real and what's true and there's a hunger for the authentic. So ⁓ think for businesses of any description and certainly ⁓ businesses where it's not an impulse buy, know, there's people are going to want to talk to a real human to make sure the end product or service is a quality. thing and it fits their precise needs. for and our clients, what we're trying to achieve is create human connections. ⁓ So media, the goal for our social media strategies are to get people off social media, ⁓ which strange, but when you think about it, we're trying to get people off social into the website because the website, control the messaging. ⁓ Social media incredibly noisy and it's just a place where people are wasting time and just so many distractions. If you can people onto your website, Scott Brandt: Mm. Wes Towers: you control the message and therefore you can control ideally their next logical step that you want them to take. So that call to action of how they're going to engage. The goal of the website is that call to action to create a human connection. So a real live discussion with somebody in the business because as I said, we're not selling a $10 widget. You can just buy impulsively online. We're selling something of higher value. So a human relationship is important. So everything we're gearing our marketing around creating creating a human connection in some way and creating that conversation. So those that can use the tools, AI, to help amplify their own voice and message, they to be the thought leader of the tool. ⁓ And one of the key ways of doing that is to think less about typing into your keyboard. you know, because we think in a certain way and we're limited in how much we will type. But if you start speaking to your device, your AI platform, you will cover so much more. These are large language models, so they understand of volumes of ⁓ So speaking, will naturally speak a whole lot more. ⁓ even if it feels clumsy, what you're saying, it'll be smart enough to ⁓ the thread of what you're trying to communicate. And you can even converse with the tool to distill down precisely what you want to do to something. Scott Brandt: Hmm. Wes Towers: meaningful and logical that's for other people to consume. So that's the real goal. You are the thought leader. You're using the tools to amplify what you truly want to say and you might be using it to refine your message in a way that's more for the end user. I think the biggest play. When I started talking to my AI rather than typing, that's when things started to shift gears because it could give some tips and insights. we've built our entire processes and systems around it now. But think that was the learning to think less about engaging because we're just so driven to type into our keyboards because we've been doing it for years now. But to start speaking, it really does get you at higher level ⁓ in terms of and getting your true message out there. Scott Brandt: never thought of that George. know you use the AI so we use it just to kind of be Thought partner with us. ⁓ I've talked into it. I know you have the capability and whatnot So it's something I have to look into just on that one. That's a great nugget there that was shared George Dovolis: ⁓ I do it all the time. And what I mean by that, I talk into AI, create content, talk to a then I come back, fix it, do it again. So when I go into the AI, it ⁓ personally knows who you are, and how you put for me, I can see. Yes, I say that or in create ways of doing things. And what we're talking about that. You know, I see so many hardworking businesses stay invisible. But you take an average business, it seems to dominate online. And why is that? Because you talked about it. see a business that's just out there doing it. And then you get the average business that's exploding online. And why is that? Wes Towers: Yeah, well you've got to because there's so much AI slop, there's a real, you've got to lift your game in terms of your message to a higher level, you're adding something of true value. Because if you rely upon the tool, all it can do is collate a bunch of thoughts that someone, that are someone else's thoughts. So there's nothing new, there's no information gain. always think about whatever you're producing. George Dovolis: Yeah. Yes. Wes Towers: what's the information gained in the world so that's why things ⁓ simple wins are to think about things that only you can speak about so that might be a project ⁓ you're delivering ⁓ projects, ⁓ studies, examples that only you can speak on that's going to be easier to surface to all the right people so I think the easy wins I mean we had a client that came on board George Dovolis: Now. Wes Towers: When they came on board I didn't, I wasn't aware of the and the scale and size of ⁓ they were working on, ⁓ Recognized around Australia, everyone would know a lot of them and even internationally some of the buildings probably people would recognize. But that never showcased it, so as they're sitting on a goldmine, all we needed to do is introduce the projects to their website and a whole lot of them and they've got a bit of a write up. And to get that write up, that was super simple. I just interviewed the marketing to say, hey, tell me about this one. We spoke it out over Zoom. I got the recording. put it in ChatGPT and that ⁓ and the story the case studies were all put together super, super fast. so it only worked because they were unique and genuinely theirs and no one else can say those things so if anyone searches for that particular building they're going to show up you know. And so ⁓ the platforms will learn these are the types of things they do. ⁓ you publish on your website, you're not only writing for the human reader, of course that's the priority, ⁓ you're educating AI, you're educating Google ⁓ about business at a deeper level. So ⁓ you've to think about it in multiple ways what you're Scott Brandt: Right now if you're getting nuggets from this episode hit the like button. If you're looking for these types of videos hit the subscribe button. And the biggest thing is if you're struggling with tools that are coming up, AI is a tool. If you are struggling with it and you really don't have a good idea about how to really make it a tool that works for you. Wes has shared quite a few nuggets here in regards to things to think of, consider, and really enhance it. I know some people are opposed to it because we hear everything under the sun, but you have to understand that it's here. It's either you're to fight it or you embrace it and have it work with you. So if you're struggling, listen to the nuggets that Wes just shared there and really turn it into a powerful tool and machine for yourself. with... a very interesting thing because we see a lot of individuals don't ⁓ understanding that by not showing up, they're missing out on building trust. And one of those aspects that assume that like ⁓ billboards, the sign, radio commercials, all like the old school way that a lot of people would go with and still people will buy into it. think that that's gonna help them really get in front of their ideal client, but with what you shared, Wes, that digital space really emphasizing landscape there for you to own, when it comes to really working to scale trust as an individual, what gonna help scale that trust for the business with their clients? And ⁓ do overlook when it comes to trying to scale the trust that they're building? with others. Wes Towers: Yeah so that because that trust is being eroded so greatly and we don't necessarily believe what a company says about themselves. Of course we don't because we know people will say only positive things about themselves. So anything third party the real gold. And so getting reviews from platforms that can't easily be manipulated, that's ⁓ important. But what you wanna do is make sure you leverage that to the greatest capability you have. So if you get a good Google review ⁓ example, you want those Google reviews embedded in your website. But also you can take that and make some social posts to repurpose it. people can verify if they want to go to Google themselves and see that it's legitimate. Because these things can't easily be manipulated or controlled, that high level of trust, you ⁓ want to make sure you attract as much of that as you can. So just with a little few habits of... prompting people who you've provided a service or product to, prompting them to leave a review is really because ⁓ are generally ⁓ and they like to help others ⁓ they forget, they forget to leave the review. They won't forget if it was a horrible experience by the way. That emotion of a bad experience, they'll jump in and leave a Google review even if it's not really warranted. ⁓ just human nature, that emotion of the negative is just so much more powerful. So really need to give a little bit of a nudge to get those positive reviews and generally people will do that for you, a of them will. And just to repurpose that as many times as you can so everybody it. ⁓ So that it's kind of like word of mouth. ⁓ Every business getting word of mouth. It's just that we don't necessarily know what people are saying. There's nowhere to anymore in terms of being a business. If ⁓ you're not providing great service or product, people are talking about that Scott Brandt: you Wes Towers: going to be very difficult. But if you've got positive things that people are sharing, it's about amplifying that as far and as wide as you possibly can. ⁓ depends to a degree which strategies you use to people, ⁓ know, your brand front of mind. I mean if you're in a small community, let's say, and you're ⁓ one three electricians, ⁓ Realistically, you only need to be better than the other two. the game and you just need to be in front of mind. So you need to be seen in the community and need to be a step above the others. So ⁓ in those ⁓ things like sponsoring the football team might be helpful. might get a ⁓ mention in promotional, ⁓ maybe there's a on ⁓ the side of ⁓ field or whatever is. But for the most part those things really don't produce a massive outcome. So you've got to really think about what's going to bring in the best return on investment. What's the nature of my business? What's the geographic region I can serve? How do I target that geographic region? how do I get in front of as many people as possible at the lowest price point that I possibly can. And when you can measure the results, it's helpful, but not everything is measurable. You don't necessarily ⁓ to measure the outcomes of every single marketing piece you do because sometimes it's just building upon itself. you're ⁓ on social media, you might have a post, no one sort of takes action necessarily, ⁓ they've become more aware of your brand and when they're ready to take action. they'll do so. yeah, every business is slightly different, but I think we need to evolve and adapt and think about what sets us apart in the marketplace and amplify those trust signals far as we can. George Dovolis: crazy, you answer one of my questions. And it was really how can a smaller local business a bigger company, you know, a competitor that has a larger marketing fund spend and you really kind of answer because the small business has to go locally to do different advertising, sponsoring the football team and getting out there. ⁓ It's it's incredible. You just really I was looking Wes Towers: Yeah. George Dovolis: I'm like you just answer one of my questions I was gonna ask you because that's it's something a lot of people want to know I was being a small business How do you beat a competitor and you're in the same business and you don't have the marketing funds they do and that's really just get out in front the reviews doing everything you talked about as a small business owner. I'm telling you I mean our listeners got to get some nuggets out of this because it really truly is the way to beat someone who's Wes Towers: Yeah George Dovolis: you know, is a little bit larger than you. Wes Towers: Yeah, well to that point so with the sponsorship that there was I was coaching basketball through the local club the YMCA club my boys were in that team for basketball but the guy who managed all the teams he ran a small business he didn't do any promotion necessarily ⁓ the YMCA or anything but he always coached in his branded so he wasn't overtly ⁓ you trying to hand out his business card and pushing anything or pushing an agenda, but he was just gently reminding, hey, I'm that guy who works in this company, you know, and like the tremendous value of that because... George Dovolis: Yeah. Wes Towers: He was doing the coaching anyway and the management of the coaching out of the generosity of his heart and his love for his kids and wanting to support community. But thinking about little things you can do just to make people aware what you do without being super pushy. If you're already doing things in your community, we'll figure out a way that people can remember what you actually do in business. It can be really a big step up. Scott Brandt: Mm-hmm. George Dovolis: Huge, very huge. Scott Brandt: I don't, so the funny thing was, I don't know how much of like the FTC, you know, when it comes to the U.S. the FTC also kind of extends out to the world and whatnot. funny thing is, is like with the testimonies. How many businesses realize that, have you asked for permission from the people that are giving you a testimony to be able to use it for social media proof? If they put it on your web page and you don't do anything with it, that's a little bit different. But the FTC, if you don't have the approval of the customer to say, yes, you can go ahead and use my testimony, If something happens and like you really explode and the customers like, you didn't have permission to use my testimony. They can come back and see you and then FTC. it's a very unique thing, but a lot of business owners really don't realize, ⁓ let me make sure I've got something in my document, something that they signed that says, yes, you can use my testimony. But if I ask you to take it down, please take it down. but it is one of those small things that ⁓ owners overlook. ⁓ it's one that if you overlook that, that could be. Wes Towers: Yeah. George Dovolis: Yes. Scott Brandt: very damaging to you because of how in depth the FTC wants to go with you sometimes. Wes Towers: Yeah, yeah, I can understand. Yeah, there's certain parameters. I mean, I can't give any legal advice on any of that sort of stuff. That certainly, yeah, you want to make sure that you're not offending or upsetting anybody. And when someone stops being a client, probably the ethical thing is ⁓ remove them from your client your list of clients or whatnot. Yeah, there's all those sorts of things. It's interesting in Australia, we've got really, it's kind of a side note, but we've got strict... legal requirements for anyone in sort of medicine or medical things as well. So even if they are, know a chiropractor who got some Google reviews and the authorities reached out and say, Hey, you got to remove those Google reviews. And he said, well, I didn't ask for them and I don't even control them. What do you want me to talk about it? So that it's kind of, it's kind of weird, isn't it? They, they're just super careful with anything medical here in Australia. But yeah, so different, different rules apply around the world for different things and you just got to work. Scott Brandt: Thank Wes Towers: within the parameters of what's ethical and reasonable. the spam rules as well, a ⁓ of people break those spam rules, but the associated with doing things ⁓ around edges of what's ethical or legal, ⁓ it's worth taking those risks in my view. Scott Brandt: It's a very interesting thing when you see marketing companies that don't realize the rules So that's another thing when I watch marketing companies advertise different things and I'm like, oh my goodness like and people are like, oh, yeah I'll do it. I'll sign up. I'm like, oh, please no like Not good, but I'm like, oh, this is that this is gonna be dangerous for somebody here. So George, I know you're you're bringing something up George Dovolis: What No. Wes Towers: Yeah. George Dovolis: Well, no, what I'm saying, you know, I want to bring this up. Scott would tell me, uh, let's look at the FTC. Why are you bringing them up? I mean, you know, you're talking about doing things and he was always that. that thorn in me say, Hey, we got the FTC. I'm like, who are you? And he would, he would just talk about it. But after understanding what it can do to your business, even on the success, it's a it's something that everyone needs to not worry about just make sure you you know, you cross t's dot the i's. did the hardest of business teach you that success never could? Wes Towers: Yeah, the painful truth of growth and learning is nearly all the best growth opportunities came off the back of horrific, painful times in life. Because that's the human nature that we don't change unless we have to. I think, and we can get lazy, but when things get bad enough, we're forced to make changes and to review and refine what we're up to. So I think there's a concept of being in the refiners fire so that all the dross or the waste material can be removed so that the gold can be showcased. been so many learnings, I mean around niching as well, sticking to our lane, not taking on projects outside of our expertise. I took on a project years ago which nearly killed me and ⁓ destroyed the business just because I took it on for all the wrong reasons. ⁓ had a lead developer who I could sense was getting bored with the work because he was really smart guy. George Dovolis: Yeah. Wes Towers: and I took on this job that I thought he would like to do. He did the proposal because I had no idea we wanted, and then he quit a couple of weeks into the project which was meant to take months. So I mean that was a painful lesson learned and a costly financial, costly mistake, but also the biggest lesson to stick to what we do best, being niched. Be specific, go after what we truly do really well. The word of mouth can build off the back of that. Marketing becomes easy. becomes easy when we know what we're trying to achieve and what we're working towards. George Dovolis: huge because I think a lot of times people quit. And they, you know, the white flag, and they're not learning from what they've gone through and not taking it in, and truly understanding what could I done better and learning from that, you know, you're supposed to celebrate the wins and then learn from the losses. And we all gone through certain things. And it's just so true what you're saying about, you know, what you've gone through and what you have learned, and then you get to share that to help others so they don't make the same mistake, you get to guide them. think that's amazing. Wes Towers: Hmm. Yeah, thanks. ⁓ it's kind of like when you have kids and you try to encourage them to not make the same mistakes made. But ⁓ know it kind of only goes to a certain level. There's sometimes, like you can express these things as best you can, but you've got to sometimes make your own mistakes, haven't you? ⁓ I didn't listen a lot when I was a young fella, ⁓ ⁓ think that's just the way it is. George Dovolis: Yes. Yeah. Yes. Yeah, it's it's something. So what grabs your attention today without selling your soul? And I know that's something that you know, everyone talks about in business, you know, to stay in your game and, you know, to stay stick what you're doing. Wes Towers: what's ⁓ sorry go again with that question George Dovolis: I mean, say what grabs attention today without selling your soul to it. Wes Towers: Yeah, well, an interesting world we in because the tools in which we use to market businesses ⁓ the very tools that can ⁓ all consuming and ⁓ I think we're seeing all of that play out. The difference of ⁓ even opinion, you might say, ⁓ globally the... George Dovolis: Yes. Mm-hmm. Wes Towers: And the solace we can live in through social media, we use social media as a massive tool to grow businesses because that's where our audiences are hanging out. And that's what you got to do. horror, and so it's a massive plus for a business to grow. The danger, the horrible thing with social media is that polarization and that healthy. George Dovolis: Yes. Wes Towers: bias that only gets reinforced because learns what your preferences are and it gives you more of that same stuff. ⁓ it only enforces and enhances ⁓ idea which isn't maybe not necessarily true ⁓ not maybe as important or as amplified as what the tools start to make us feel they are. So that ⁓ a massive problem in my view. If you meet people with differences of opinions in a social context at a bar, let's say, having a few beers, might have a completely different worldview as to you, but you know the person, you get to speak to them and you ⁓ they're just a person with different ideas. But they're on the other, through a screen on a ⁓ different device and people say some horrendous things. you know, I do wonder. Yeah, I do. We don't want to lose our soul to social media, but we want to make sure we use it as a mechanism to get our message out there. So there's pros and cons in that. George Dovolis: Mm-mm. Scott Brandt: Hmm. George Dovolis: That's huge. And I'm going to ask you, I'm going to just probably be the last to let Scott finish up. I always ask, what, when your time comes, what do you want people to remember you on your legacy? Wes Towers: Yeah, well a ⁓ great question because it helps you set your path to get there. want to be ⁓ as a, well you think about the people that you leave behind, so I want to be remembered as a really great father and a good example of ⁓ that means. To care for my kids, to help them through, to provide a legacy in all sorts of ways. I mean we've got a, challenge in Australia and I think it's probably a challenge everywhere where can't really get ahead unless you're born with a level wealth, let's say. People really can't buy their own home anymore. In Australia, ⁓ pretty much could work their way towards buying their own home. My kids and future generations aren't going to be born into a world like that. So in my view, part of it is to build a legacy where I can give them a leg up financially. But also more than that is to be an example so they can figure out how to ⁓ their lives in a ⁓ way, build a career, because I think that's important ⁓ all of us. But ⁓ be humans, I think, is the main priority. George Dovolis: Amazing. Scott Brandt: No, I love hearing that. Wes, as people are listening, if they're inclined and they're like, I really love what Wes does, ⁓ personality, really his perspective, ⁓ they wanted to learn more, get to know you a little bit better, where would that be for them to go and kind of do that deep dive with you? Wes Towers: Yeah, uplift360.com.au the AU because it's an Australian website, but don't let that deter you. If you do jump on the homepage, you'll see a whole bunch of brands we work with, global brands, some of them you might recognize. On homepage, you can also book a strategy call with me as well, ⁓ call, no I love talking to people. So hopefully they walk away with a few insights and tips that they might be able to apply. Scott Brandt: Awesome. Yeah, we'll put that in the show notes so that way it's easier for individuals to find out what they're looking for. Ultimately, if you're looking for these types of videos hit the subscribe button and as you're kind of sitting and if things are popping up and you're like I'm really struggling like if you're trying to grow your business and your hesitation about digital and not embracing it You're you're missing out on a huge swath. You're really doing a disservice to yourself and Having people miss out on the service that you offer because of your fear not showing up But we appreciate everyone allowing us to come on the journey with you you guys coming on the journey with us George Dovolis: Yes. Scott Brandt: and we'll catch you on the next episode. George Dovolis: Thank you. Wes Towers: Thanks.