Latest / To All the Men I've Tolerated Before / Practical Magic 2

Transcript

Practical Magic 2 · To All the Men I've Tolerated Before

• 0:21
  Speaker 1: Hey tolerators this is to all the men i've tolerated
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: before with natalie katona your weekly look at everyday misogyny
• 0:28
  Speaker 1: today julia washington makes a return to the podcast because
• 0:32
  Speaker 1: we need to talk about practical magic too and possibly
• 0:36
  Speaker 1: the state of women in movies in general it's been
• 0:39
  Speaker 1: too long Since you've been on the show.
• 0:42
  Speaker 2: I was just thinking, when was the last time I
• 0:45
  Speaker 2: was on here? Was it Anora?
• 0:47
  Speaker 1: Was it Anora?
• 0:48
  Speaker 2: That was so long ago.
• 0:49
  Speaker 1: Yikes, that's too long.
• 0:52
  Speaker 2: Hello, tolerators, I've missed you. Aww.
• 0:57
  Speaker 1: If you're wondering why we skipped Practical Magic and went
• 1:00
  Speaker 1: straight to Practical Magic 2 is because I've posted our
• 1:04
  Speaker 1: Practical Magic Still Comfy on the feed for about every
• 1:07
  Speaker 1: break that we've ever taken because it's one of my
• 1:09
  Speaker 1: favorite collabs that we've ever done together.
• 1:11
  Speaker 2: That's a great episode. That's a great episode. Yeah. So
• 1:14
  Speaker 2: find it. I don't think I have any differing opinions.
• 1:17
  Speaker 2: I should re-listen to it to confirm that, actually.
• 1:20
  Speaker 1: So then I also want everyone to know right up
• 1:23
  Speaker 1: on the top that it's the first week of October.
• 1:28
  Speaker 1: The movie's been out for two or three weeks. What
• 1:30
  Speaker 1: is time? I'm spoiling this movie for you.
• 1:33
  Speaker 2: Okay? Have we ever been able to have a conversation
• 1:36
  Speaker 2: about a movie without spoiling it?
• 1:38
  Speaker 1: No, and I don't even warn people anymore because I
• 1:40
  Speaker 1: assume that if they're listening to an episode about a movie,
• 1:43
  Speaker 1: they either don't care about the movie or they already
• 1:47
  Speaker 1: watched it.
• 1:49
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, fair, fair, fair, fair. And the way that
• 1:52
  Speaker 2: the internet works and moves now, avoiding spoilers is so hard.
• 1:56
  Speaker 1: One of my script, like in-depth script podcast, I won't
• 2:00
  Speaker 1: name because I'm not throwing him shade, but he does
• 2:04
  Speaker 1: keep it spoiler free. And every once in a while,
• 2:06
  Speaker 1: I'm like, what would the conversation be like if you
• 2:09
  Speaker 1: just spoiled this goddamn movie?
• 2:12
  Speaker 2: It's a real skill, honestly, because at the bookstore, we
• 2:15
  Speaker 2: do a podcast where we discuss books through the lens
• 2:18
  Speaker 2: of writing, like writing style, all that stuff. And we
• 2:21
  Speaker 2: do it spoil free. And every time I'm like, this
• 2:23
  Speaker 2: is so hard for me. Because the thing I want
• 2:27
  Speaker 2: to talk about is a really cool writing technique, but
• 2:30
  Speaker 2: I can't because it spoils the book.
• 2:31
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, and that's the thing, too. I get hung
• 2:34
  Speaker 1: up on what is a spoiler.
• 2:36
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 2:37
  Speaker 1: A man told me one time that having the science
• 2:40
  Speaker 1: be kooky in the Jurassic Park new movie that I
• 2:43
  Speaker 1: didn't see was a spoiler. He's like, don't say anything
• 2:46
  Speaker 1: about the science. I haven't seen it yet. And I
• 2:49
  Speaker 1: was like, huh? We all have different definitions of spoilers.
• 2:53
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's interesting. That's wild.
• 2:57
  Speaker 1: All right. Julia, what was your overall impression of Practical
• 3:03
  Speaker 1: Magic 2?
• 3:05
  Speaker 2: Firstly, let me apologize for my dog in the backyard.
• 3:07
  Speaker 2: She hates the neighbors and is barking. So I apologize
• 3:11
  Speaker 2: for you hearing her in the background. Secondly, I went
• 3:15
  Speaker 2: into this movie with very low to no expectations because
• 3:19
  Speaker 2: the trailers, because... The recasting for Joey King and Maisie Williams,
• 3:26
  Speaker 2: question mark is her last name? Yes. And I was like, okay,
• 3:30
  Speaker 2: what are we doing? I don't know what's happening. It
• 3:33
  Speaker 2: looks bad. So I'm just going to go in with
• 3:36
  Speaker 2: zero expectations whatsoever, which proved to be the right way
• 3:40
  Speaker 2: to do it because I walked out with, oh, I
• 3:43
  Speaker 2: love this movie. Was the dialogue terrible? Uh-huh. Were there
• 3:47
  Speaker 2: some significant issues with the story structure?
• 3:50
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 3:51
  Speaker 2: Absolutely there were. Do I think that the whole sisterhood
• 4:00
  Speaker 2: of it all wasn't present in the next generation? A
• 4:03
  Speaker 2: thousand percent. Did I still walk out of there deeply
• 4:07
  Speaker 2: emotional and touched and moved and sad and irritated and
• 4:10
  Speaker 2: loved it? Yes, I did. Yes. Yes, I did. Yes.
• 4:13
  Speaker 1: Yes, we did. I had a hard time recognizing that
• 4:18
  Speaker 1: this movie was fundamentally is a flawed movie.
• 4:21
  Speaker 2: I think oh well i need you.
• 4:24
  Speaker 1: To unpack that well remember when they announced practical magic
• 4:30
  Speaker 1: 2 and my anger and frustration came swiftly yeah and
• 4:35
  Speaker 1: loudly yeah and i went they're gonna fuck up the
• 4:40
  Speaker 1: one movie i've ever said now that is my favorite
• 4:44
  Speaker 1: movie they're gonna fuck.
• 4:45
  Speaker 2: It up but Practical Magic is a great film. Perfect
• 4:49
  Speaker 2: in every way. I was like, why?
• 4:51
  Speaker 1: Why would we ever tarnish my legacy? I don't even
• 4:54
  Speaker 1: know where that cop guy from the first movie. What
• 4:57
  Speaker 1: did he do after Practical Magic? Where is he?
• 5:00
  Speaker 2: Isn't it Aiden Quinn? Wasn't he in early, late 80s,
• 5:03
  Speaker 2: early 90s heartthrobs?
• 5:05
  Speaker 1: I don't know. He was hot. I don't know.
• 5:07
  Speaker 2: Like he did a movie with, he did like Legends
• 5:09
  Speaker 2: of the Fall or something like that with Brad Pitt.
• 5:12
  Speaker 1: My mom loves Legends of the Fall.
• 5:14
  Speaker 2: I remember loving that movie too. I don't know if
• 5:16
  Speaker 2: I was still. I'll come back for you.
• 5:19
  Speaker 1: In a waterfall. She loves to talk to me about
• 5:21
  Speaker 1: that waterfall. Um, I don't know if I've ever sat
• 5:25
  Speaker 1: down and watched Legends of the Fall. I don't know.
• 5:27
  Speaker 1: I don't know what he was in. They could have
• 5:30
  Speaker 1: told me that Lee Pace was just taking over that
• 5:33
  Speaker 1: role and I would have gone, okay.
• 5:36
  Speaker 2: I mean, in deference to Lee Pace, that man is...
• 5:40
  Speaker 2: I could not hold it together. Every time they cut
• 5:43
  Speaker 2: to Lee Pace and he did the... When he touched
• 5:46
  Speaker 2: her chest to help her find her magic again, I
• 5:50
  Speaker 2: leaned over to my friend and I said, I would also, too,
• 5:54
  Speaker 2: be healed if Lee Pace put his hand on my sternum.
• 5:58
  Speaker 1: He even asked. I'm pretty sure.
• 6:03
  Speaker 2: I'm pretty confident he was like a consent king the
• 6:06
  Speaker 2: whole movie. I've only seen it once since it released
• 6:09
  Speaker 2: at the time of this recording.
• 6:10
  Speaker 1: I don't understand why he has perfect hair. He has
• 6:17
  Speaker 1: perfect hair and it's graying perfectly.
• 6:19
  Speaker 2: Yep.
• 6:21
  Speaker 1: And he's perfect.
• 6:23
  Speaker 2: He's gorgeous. Did you think his English accent was bad?
• 6:27
  Speaker 1: Is he not English?
• 6:29
  Speaker 2: No!
• 6:30
  Speaker 1: You know I can't tell. You know that part of
• 6:32
  Speaker 1: my auditory processing bullshit is that I don't know what
• 6:36
  Speaker 1: accents sound like.
• 6:37
  Speaker 2: Which is so funny because I'm the exact opposite. My
• 6:40
  Speaker 2: auditory processing issues is I can clock it so fast.
• 6:46
  Speaker 1: Well... that's not why we're here we're not.
• 6:50
  Speaker 2: This is not a lee pace fan episode.
• 6:53
  Speaker 1: So i think because i popped my anger cherry the
• 6:58
  Speaker 1: moment it was announced by the time i saw the
• 7:00
  Speaker 1: first preview i was like at least it's pretty yeah
• 7:06
  Speaker 1: and i did miss my girls and then the second
• 7:10
  Speaker 1: preview came and i was like you know what at
• 7:13
  Speaker 1: least it's pretty and i did miss my girls And
• 7:18
  Speaker 1: then I sat down on Tuesday and I they opened
• 7:23
  Speaker 1: it up on that overview shot of the town. And
• 7:27
  Speaker 1: I went, holy fuck, if this doesn't feel like coming home. Oh,
• 7:31
  Speaker 1: holy fuck. And then I started to cry. And then
• 7:36
  Speaker 1: Diane Wiest was there and I was like, holy fuck,
• 7:38
  Speaker 1: she looks great. And I'm just crying. I just love
• 7:42
  Speaker 1: women so much. Yeah.
• 7:45
  Speaker 2: Especially like diane weiss like she's an incredible actress.
• 7:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah i just love women so much that the idea
• 7:53
  Speaker 1: that i was going to get to spend multiple hours
• 7:56
  Speaker 1: with some of my favorite women of all time the
• 7:59
  Speaker 1: owens women.
• 8:00
  Speaker 2: Yeah move you you've read all the books right i've read.
• 8:06
  Speaker 1: All of them but practical magic you haven't.
• 8:09
  Speaker 2: Read the first one no I don't even when we
• 8:12
  Speaker 2: book Natalie, we book clubbed it last year and you
• 8:15
  Speaker 2: didn't read it.
• 8:16
  Speaker 1: And I believe that I was upfront about I've only
• 8:19
  Speaker 1: seen the movie and because I've only seen the movie
• 8:21
  Speaker 1: and the movie is perfect. I've never read this book.
• 8:25
  Speaker 1: They make movies of the other books until right now.
• 8:27
  Speaker 2: I feel like I vaguely remember that. I feel like
• 8:32
  Speaker 2: I vaguely remember that. Man, did our book club hate
• 8:34
  Speaker 2: the book?
• 8:35
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I know.
• 8:37
  Speaker 2: We were like, wow, Alice Hoffman hates women.
• 8:39
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and then I got mad because I've read all
• 8:41
  Speaker 1: of her books. And I was like, I really do
• 8:44
  Speaker 1: think she is making a point about how men are
• 8:48
  Speaker 1: a curse. And you can't hate women if you think
• 8:52
  Speaker 1: men are a curse.
• 8:54
  Speaker 2: I mean, you can if you're a boomer.
• 8:56
  Speaker 1: I guess. Yeah, sure.
• 9:00
  Speaker 2: Okay.
• 9:01
  Speaker 1: And I will say this.
• 9:03
  Speaker 2: We have to stay on track.
• 9:05
  Speaker 1: We have to stay on track. I am a supporter
• 9:08
  Speaker 1: of and a proponent of the cash grab nostalgia sequels.
• 9:16
  Speaker 1: When people are like, this is cheap. They're just trying
• 9:19
  Speaker 1: to get my $ 15. They're just trying to make the
• 9:22
  Speaker 1: good chemicals fill my body for no reason.
• 9:26
  Speaker 2: Oh, okay.
• 9:26
  Speaker 1: Sorry. Oh, sorry that you felt adrenaline today. Sorry that
• 9:31
  Speaker 1: you sat in a movie theater and it felt like
• 9:33
  Speaker 1: coming home because as you know, Right underneath Practical Magic,
• 9:38
  Speaker 1: one of my favorite movies is Grease 2. And I
• 9:41
  Speaker 1: fight people about it. I go, Grease 2 is a
• 9:43
  Speaker 1: great movie. I go, they have Frenchie. They have the
• 9:48
  Speaker 1: pink lady outfits. What do you want? Michelle Pfeiffer's there
• 9:52
  Speaker 1: and she's hot as fuck. I call it the Grease
• 9:54
  Speaker 1: 2 effect that I actually love a cash grab sequel
• 9:58
  Speaker 1: because I am its target audience. audience because I do
• 10:01
  Speaker 1: like to feel happy easily because it never happens you.
• 10:04
  Speaker 2: Have argued that Grease 2 is better because of the
• 10:09
  Speaker 2: empowering message that it has some sequels you watch and
• 10:13
  Speaker 2: you're like what are we doing did we forget what
• 10:18
  Speaker 2: we were doing But.
• 10:20
  Speaker 1: Here's what I've also learned about me. And I'm going
• 10:22
  Speaker 1: to be very vulnerable about this. I think if I'm
• 10:25
  Speaker 1: having a good time.
• 10:26
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 10:27
  Speaker 1: It's actually easier for me to be empowered by it.
• 10:30
  Speaker 1: So like I'm empowered by Greece, too, because I'm having
• 10:33
  Speaker 1: a good time.
• 10:34
  Speaker 2: Yeah. But didn't you say something about the messaging being like, hey,
• 10:37
  Speaker 2: like feminism versus like the first one, which is like, hey,
• 10:41
  Speaker 2: sexual assault.
• 10:42
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, the pink ladies have more agency and more
• 10:46
  Speaker 1: more of a personality in the second one. And they
• 10:49
  Speaker 1: don't give a fuck about the T-Birds, which I love. However,
• 10:52
  Speaker 1: someone has disproved my love of Grease 2 by being like, yeah, Namlee,
• 10:57
  Speaker 1: it's a whole other decade.
• 10:58
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's true.
• 10:59
  Speaker 1: They've moved forward in time so women felt differently. Yeah.
• 11:03
  Speaker 1: And I was like, God damn it.
• 11:06
  Speaker 2: But still.
• 11:07
  Speaker 1: But still. So I love a cash grab sequel. I
• 11:12
  Speaker 1: loved that Jurassic Park movie where the original three came
• 11:16
  Speaker 1: back because Laura Dern's hot. Jeff Goldblum's hot and Sam
• 11:21
  Speaker 1: Neill is hot. And then they kept playing all the
• 11:23
  Speaker 1: songs that gave me the feel goods from the first movie.
• 11:26
  Speaker 1: And I was like, this is beautiful. Is it a
• 11:27
  Speaker 1: bad movie? Yeah. Was Chris Pratt there? Of course. But
• 11:30
  Speaker 1: I was like, thank God for this movie. I loved it.
• 11:33
  Speaker 1: I love this movie. And now Sam Neill is dead.
• 11:37
  Speaker 1: So imagine if we didn't have that movie. I know
• 11:43
  Speaker 1: now Sam Neill is dead, everyone. So that's also my point, too.
• 11:47
  Speaker 1: Nostalgic grab bag movies. Allow me to revisit my favorite actresses.
• 11:54
  Speaker 1: How many acting roles are Stockard Channing and Diane? Stockard
• 11:59
  Speaker 1: Channing came out of hiding.
• 12:01
  Speaker 2: Well, she yeah, because after her partner died, she was like,
• 12:03
  Speaker 2: I'm good. I've got done. I'm done. Bye.
• 12:07
  Speaker 1: We were never going to see her again until it
• 12:09
  Speaker 1: was an in memoriam.
• 12:11
  Speaker 2: I do feel like. because it is a several book
• 12:15
  Speaker 2: series that it is a little bit of a missed
• 12:17
  Speaker 2: opportunity to carry on in that way. And I, and
• 12:23
  Speaker 2: I never, I never thought I would come to the
• 12:25
  Speaker 2: defense of a man, but Griffin Dunn did a beautiful
• 12:28
  Speaker 2: job directing a movie about female friendship and sisterhood and empowerment.
• 12:33
  Speaker 2: Like what? You're a man. How do you get it?
• 12:38
  Speaker 2: But I do feel like, because there is so much
• 12:41
  Speaker 2: source material, that there could have been the opportunity for
• 12:47
  Speaker 2: there to be a multiple movie cash grab is there
• 12:53
  Speaker 2: and is it kind of fumbled a little.
• 12:54
  Speaker 1: Bit probably yeah I think I think they should have
• 13:00
  Speaker 1: done a mini series about the Owens women that came
• 13:04
  Speaker 1: before Sally and there's.
• 13:07
  Speaker 2: A prequel right about Maria Owens in the books right.
• 13:10
  Speaker 1: A couple of the books are about Owen's sisters that
• 13:13
  Speaker 1: have never interacted with. Yeah. Yeah. This is my last
• 13:18
  Speaker 1: argument for cash grab sequel movies.
• 13:20
  Speaker 2: Okay. Okay.
• 13:24
  Speaker 1: I need people to go to the movie theater. I
• 13:26
  Speaker 1: go on cheap Tuesday when the popcorn is free. This
• 13:30
  Speaker 1: was the most full I've seen a cheap Tuesday afternoon
• 13:33
  Speaker 1: because I go in the afternoon because I'm like, you
• 13:35
  Speaker 1: know who, what I want a solo movie theater experience.
• 13:40
  Speaker 1: I like to be by myself in the movie theater.
• 13:43
  Speaker 1: But I need people to go to the movie theater
• 13:45
  Speaker 1: and movies like this get people into the movie theater,
• 13:48
  Speaker 1: as we saw with Coyote versus Acme. And I need
• 13:53
  Speaker 1: people to go to the movie theater because when I
• 13:56
  Speaker 1: think of a world without movie theater popcorn, I could
• 14:02
  Speaker 1: end it right then and there. What do you mean?
• 14:05
  Speaker 1: The good popcorn? We're going to get rid of the
• 14:07
  Speaker 1: good popcorn. It's never the same when you make it
• 14:10
  Speaker 1: at home. Don't send me your recipes. I want the
• 14:13
  Speaker 1: toxic movie theater popcorn.
• 14:17
  Speaker 2: With that synthetic butter.
• 14:18
  Speaker 1: With that synthetic poison butter. Yeah.
• 14:23
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 14:24
  Speaker 1: Don't send me your recipes because that's what I want.
• 14:29
  Speaker 1: I am a girl of simple taste. So I do
• 14:33
  Speaker 1: feel like In the age of TikTok and podcasts and
• 14:37
  Speaker 1: people having an opinion about fucking everything, it's so easy
• 14:41
  Speaker 1: for us to turn our backs on cheap movie sequels,
• 14:47
  Speaker 1: like gotcha movie sequels. But I'm sorry, none of us
• 14:51
  Speaker 1: like a Very Brady sequel, because I did.
• 14:55
  Speaker 2: I can't remember a Very Brady sequel. That was so
• 14:57
  Speaker 2: long ago. Come on now. It's a whole different century.
• 15:04
  Speaker 2: I do I don't know if this is on your
• 15:07
  Speaker 2: list of our topics I do think that because you
• 15:11
  Speaker 2: know the conversation around like oh the women are it's
• 15:14
  Speaker 2: like 28 years later and like people like they've recast
• 15:18
  Speaker 2: Evan Rachel Wood and the other gal whose name I'm
• 15:20
  Speaker 2: forgetting and I'm so sorry it is not a fairy
• 15:25
  Speaker 2: tale in my backyard right now even though there are
• 15:28
  Speaker 2: birds and dogs and butterflies it's more chaotic than I'd
• 15:32
  Speaker 2: like it to be um this is what happens when
• 15:37
  Speaker 2: you build a backyard to have to attract butterflies and
• 15:41
  Speaker 2: bees and birds it's chaos okay and you know everyone
• 15:45
  Speaker 2: was like struggling right like what do you mean Nicole
• 15:47
  Speaker 2: Kidman in in Sandra Bullock or like in their 60s
• 15:50
  Speaker 2: and technically Nicole Kidman it's not in her 60s yet
• 15:53
  Speaker 2: but Sandra Bullock is and like what do you mean
• 15:55
  Speaker 2: you've recast people who were born to be in this
• 15:58
  Speaker 2: century instead of the women that should have been there
• 16:00
  Speaker 2: who are, like, arguably late 30s, early 40s. Like, that
• 16:03
  Speaker 2: doesn't make sense. The whole time I'm watching the movie,
• 16:06
  Speaker 2: I'm like, oh, they're not giving us a clear, blatant
• 16:11
  Speaker 2: it's 2026. There's hints of, like, all the cars are older.
• 16:15
  Speaker 2: The FaceTime keeps dropping because 2014, I think, is when
• 16:18
  Speaker 2: they started introducing FaceTime. And if you remember... it wasn't
• 16:23
  Speaker 2: super stable. No, we couldn't track each other's devices. So
• 16:27
  Speaker 2: then when Antonia or excuse me, Kylie runs off to
• 16:31
  Speaker 2: England and she, and everyone's like, we don't know where
• 16:32
  Speaker 2: she is. It's like, yeah, cause we couldn't track each
• 16:34
  Speaker 2: other like that in 2014 in the ways that we
• 16:36
  Speaker 2: can now. And if we could, it wasn't, again, it
• 16:39
  Speaker 2: wasn't an accurate reading. So like they had hints of, Oh,
• 16:44
  Speaker 2: this is like 15 ish years later. Cause the girls
• 16:47
  Speaker 2: are like, you know, 22 and, 25 because you know
• 16:51
  Speaker 2: Antonia is like a meds medical whatever and like Antonia
• 16:57
  Speaker 2: is still in college but the problem is is they
• 16:59
  Speaker 2: didn't lean into it's 2014 or even potentially 2010 because
• 17:05
  Speaker 2: 1998 to 2010 is what like 13 years yeah question
• 17:11
  Speaker 2: mark so like had that been leaned into better because
• 17:16
  Speaker 2: then Joey King's character does the fucking Gen Z heart
• 17:19
  Speaker 2: at the end. And I was like, okay, well that
• 17:21
  Speaker 2: just took me out of it. It's now 2026 again.
• 17:23
  Speaker 2: And there's like little things, right? Like, like Nicole Kidman
• 17:26
  Speaker 2: talking about Tinder, which is funny joke, but again, more 2019, 2020, 2026. Um,
• 17:33
  Speaker 2: because I, you know, I'm so sorry, you guys, um,
• 17:36
  Speaker 2: dating apps are in fact dying. Um, and so like,
• 17:40
  Speaker 2: like there's that element for me where I'm like, there
• 17:42
  Speaker 2: were moments where I could arguably believe that we're in
• 17:46
  Speaker 2: 2014 and And then one tiny little thing would happen.
• 17:50
  Speaker 2: Then I was like, oh, yeah, no, they made this
• 17:52
  Speaker 2: movie in 2025 and released it in 2026. Got it.
• 17:55
  Speaker 2: You know what I mean? And I feel like that
• 17:58
  Speaker 2: could have been leaned into more. I won't call it
• 18:00
  Speaker 2: a failing. But I will say, like, you could have
• 18:05
  Speaker 2: gotten stronger with that.
• 18:07
  Speaker 1: Yes. I will say that that is a flaw of
• 18:11
  Speaker 1: the movie. Yeah. It's either you take me back in
• 18:14
  Speaker 1: time to the 2010s.
• 18:15
  Speaker 2: Yeah, because what was that old car, Kyle? Girl, my
• 18:19
  Speaker 2: aunt drove that car in 1987.
• 18:22
  Speaker 1: Or you keep it timeless, because a lot of movies
• 18:25
  Speaker 1: go for the timeless route, where no matter when you're
• 18:29
  Speaker 1: watching this movie, you're probably going to feel... Like it's
• 18:33
  Speaker 1: a movie that you could relate to.
• 18:36
  Speaker 2: Well, Practical Magic, the original has a timeless feel to it.
• 18:39
  Speaker 2: Like sure, the cars are dated and like there's little things.
• 18:43
  Speaker 2: But at the end of the day, those things don't matter.
• 18:45
  Speaker 2: You still feel like you're watching. Like we had somebody
• 18:48
  Speaker 2: watch it for the first time at my Practical Magic
• 18:50
  Speaker 2: watch party last year. And like when we told her
• 18:53
  Speaker 2: what year it was released, she's like, there's no way.
• 18:55
  Speaker 2: And we're like, yeah, that's so sweet, babe. Like this
• 18:58
  Speaker 2: movie is not 10 years old. This movie is. 20
• 19:00
  Speaker 2: years old.
• 19:01
  Speaker 1: Look at all the lace camisoles. Yeah. I, and I
• 19:07
  Speaker 1: will say that one thing that I was disappointed in
• 19:12
  Speaker 1: was part of the reason I love the original practical
• 19:14
  Speaker 1: magic is because it did set the basis of my
• 19:18
  Speaker 1: woo woo witch practice. And it was all really subtle.
• 19:22
  Speaker 1: And it was all like the magic was very present,
• 19:25
  Speaker 1: but it was present in very everyday ways which is
• 19:29
  Speaker 1: how i practice my witchcraft and they went for flashy
• 19:34
  Speaker 1: big time bainy magic where it's like oh it's flashing
• 19:38
  Speaker 1: and there's smoke and explosions and bangs and i was
• 19:42
  Speaker 1: like oh that's a very different that's a very different
• 19:45
  Speaker 1: atmosphere than my first yeah it's not practical yeah they
• 19:51
  Speaker 1: were like smoke demons and there's like smoke demons in
• 19:54
  Speaker 1: the first movie or whatever but I feel like they
• 19:57
  Speaker 1: saved all that in the first movie for the big
• 20:00
  Speaker 1: shebang the finale the finale and in this one it's
• 20:05
  Speaker 1: like why are we trying to impress ourselves with the magic.
• 20:09
  Speaker 2: And the next generation really doesn't give bonded sister. It's like, oh,
• 20:14
  Speaker 2: Gideon was hit by a car. Antonia, you stay in
• 20:18
  Speaker 2: the hospital. I will go fix it. And you're just like, what?
• 20:22
  Speaker 2: So now Antonia or Kylie is now bonded strongly with
• 20:27
  Speaker 2: her mother and her aunt because of what, you know,
• 20:29
  Speaker 2: that final scene when they all like, you know, the gold,
• 20:32
  Speaker 2: the lime, whatever. But where was Antonia in all of that?
• 20:35
  Speaker 2: She's not included.
• 20:36
  Speaker 1: Yeah. I will say that when I was driving home,
• 20:40
  Speaker 1: I was like, it's very weird that they didn't have
• 20:42
  Speaker 1: the sisters....
• 20:44
  Speaker 2: Go together.
• 20:45
  Speaker 1: Go together. It's also such a waste of Macy Williams.
• 20:51
  Speaker 1: And I recently saw an interview, which will lead into
• 20:54
  Speaker 1: my other ding on the movie, where they asked Macy Williams...
• 21:00
  Speaker 1: about Antonia being canonically queer. Yeah, she's a sapphic queen.
• 21:07
  Speaker 1: And Macy Williams said, well, that's how I played her.
• 21:10
  Speaker 1: And there were a bunch of different iterations of the script.
• 21:13
  Speaker 1: And there were a bunch of different things that were
• 21:15
  Speaker 1: edited out or put back in. And, you know, the
• 21:19
  Speaker 1: movie is the final product that the movie is. But throughout,
• 21:25
  Speaker 1: I knew Antonia was queer, no matter what version of
• 21:28
  Speaker 1: the movie we were going to get. And I have
• 21:33
  Speaker 1: to believe that there's some sort of version of this
• 21:37
  Speaker 1: movie where the sisters do it all together or else. Why?
• 21:41
  Speaker 2: Why? Yeah, because that was a huge part of the
• 21:46
  Speaker 2: first one and why it felt so moving. It brought
• 21:49
  Speaker 2: these two women back together after whatever their lives, what
• 21:53
  Speaker 2: have you. And here's Antonia and Kylie. They're really close.
• 21:56
  Speaker 2: They're really bonded. We see that. They're disconnected from their
• 22:00
  Speaker 2: powers because of their mom's trauma. So it didn't feel
• 22:03
  Speaker 2: like their story. It still felt like it was a
• 22:06
  Speaker 2: Sally Owen story. Yes.
• 22:08
  Speaker 1: And I will say that it's a big letdown to
• 22:12
  Speaker 1: not have Macy Williams in more of the movie. She's
• 22:16
  Speaker 1: so present on the press tour. Also, she's a stronger
• 22:19
  Speaker 1: actress out of the two. So there's also that. And
• 22:26
  Speaker 1: so it was like kind of disappointing to me that,
• 22:31
  Speaker 1: like you said, the sisterhood didn't seem to translate into
• 22:36
  Speaker 1: the next generation.
• 22:40
  Speaker 2: Especially since the whole other undertone of the film was
• 22:45
  Speaker 2: that Nicole Kidman, that's Jilly and Sally become the aunts.
• 22:50
  Speaker 2: So then the journey should be for the younger generation
• 22:54
  Speaker 2: to become the next generation. And you know what I mean?
• 22:58
  Speaker 2: You can do that. I don't know. It just didn't
• 23:00
  Speaker 2: feel strong. It just felt like if you're going to
• 23:04
  Speaker 2: get the buy-in of the next generation, then give us
• 23:07
  Speaker 2: a story that the next generation has to conquer whatever
• 23:09
  Speaker 2: their version of evil is, which is breaking the curse. Yeah.
• 23:13
  Speaker 1: I also... There was also such a focus on... The
• 23:20
  Speaker 1: little way Sally had started to fracture her sisterhood bond
• 23:24
  Speaker 1: with Jilly and how frustrated Jilly was during that. And
• 23:29
  Speaker 1: I like wrote down in my phone while I was
• 23:31
  Speaker 1: watching it. I was like, hey, give it up for
• 23:33
  Speaker 1: the aunts that actually love kids with their own with
• 23:36
  Speaker 1: their whole body and their whole being. And they don't
• 23:40
  Speaker 1: actually get to make choices. Yeah, that would that they
• 23:44
  Speaker 1: think would serve these kids that they love.
• 23:46
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 23:47
  Speaker 1: I am sure that that is a balance that I
• 23:49
  Speaker 1: will fuck up. a million times as my nephews get older.
• 23:53
  Speaker 1: But to watch Jilly like, no. And I agree with Jilly. Hey, Sally,
• 23:58
  Speaker 1: we need to give these girls a heads up. We
• 24:01
  Speaker 1: got to stop hiding it from them. And to be
• 24:04
  Speaker 1: so hurt by that and for there to be like
• 24:09
  Speaker 1: no acknowledgement as to why that that that would hurt Jilly, too,
• 24:15
  Speaker 1: because it was my understanding that before the girls left,
• 24:19
  Speaker 1: were off living grownup lives that all six of them
• 24:24
  Speaker 1: were still living in that goddamn house.
• 24:25
  Speaker 2: You know? Right. That's the impression that I got too.
• 24:30
  Speaker 1: Yeah. So, which honestly is my dream is to just
• 24:36
  Speaker 1: live with two old ladies, two middle-aged ladies and me.
• 24:40
  Speaker 2: And then also, did I miss something at the end
• 24:43
  Speaker 2: of the first one? Cause didn't, Sally have an apothecary?
• 24:47
  Speaker 2: When did she become a librarian?
• 24:48
  Speaker 1: So I thought that that was her giving up because
• 24:51
  Speaker 1: the apothecary was magic lotions and potions that were supposed
• 24:55
  Speaker 1: to still have intentions behind them. So I did file
• 24:59
  Speaker 1: that away as a way that she dissonanced herself from
• 25:02
  Speaker 1: her magic again.
• 25:03
  Speaker 2: Okay, that makes sense.
• 25:05
  Speaker 1: I did love that the library was dedicated to women
• 25:07
  Speaker 1: who burned because I was like, yeah, they burned us
• 25:10
  Speaker 1: because we were knowledgeable and we started educating ourselves outside
• 25:14
  Speaker 1: of their abusive system.
• 25:15
  Speaker 2: A friend of mine was like, I could believe that
• 25:20
  Speaker 2: this movie took place before Me Too because she told
• 25:23
  Speaker 2: that man everything and went with him to a second location.
• 25:27
  Speaker 2: I was like, what the fuck?
• 25:31
  Speaker 1: It's not funny, but also it's funny. I was like,
• 25:34
  Speaker 1: you can't trust a white boy just because he has
• 25:36
  Speaker 1: an accent and a cottage. What are we doing?
• 25:39
  Speaker 2: Like, when he popped up, when they're like, oh, yeah,
• 25:42
  Speaker 2: this boy, blah, blah, blah. He popped up. It was like,
• 25:44
  Speaker 2: that is the man that stole everything from Lee Pace.
• 25:47
  Speaker 2: That is the man who is trying to do whatever.
• 25:49
  Speaker 2: I said, that man is a bad, bad man.
• 25:51
  Speaker 1: Bad man.
• 25:51
  Speaker 2: And somebody else in the group was like, oh, yeah, maybe.
• 25:55
  Speaker 2: And then they were like, no, I, you know, I
• 25:57
  Speaker 2: feel like maybe he's the red herring. And I was like, no,
• 25:59
  Speaker 2: Lee Pace is the red herring.
• 26:00
  Speaker 1: Lee Pace is the red herring. If he's the red herring,
• 26:03
  Speaker 1: who's Lee Pace?
• 26:05
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 26:06
  Speaker 1: Also, they were trying really hard to make me believe that, oh,
• 26:09
  Speaker 1: maybe Lee Pace is in it together. I was like,
• 26:11
  Speaker 1: him and his soft eyes?
• 26:13
  Speaker 2: No.
• 26:14
  Speaker 1: Okay, so I actually don't feel like they.
• 26:18
  Speaker 2: did enough work to make Lee Pace feel like such
• 26:22
  Speaker 2: a red herring. Yeah, that's what I'm saying. Because of
• 26:24
  Speaker 2: how much he was, like, so into Sally.
• 26:28
  Speaker 1: That's what I'm saying.
• 26:30
  Speaker 2: Oh, okay, okay. Because I was like, sir, you're coming
• 26:34
  Speaker 2: out of... I mean, I do think that scene when they're, like,
• 26:37
  Speaker 2: helping him come out of whatever the thing is on
• 26:39
  Speaker 2: him that the guy did.
• 26:42
  Speaker 2: I do think that was a really great way to
• 26:45
  Speaker 2: show that Sally still is the more powerful out of
• 26:48
  Speaker 2: the two sisters. It's, I just still felt like, I
• 26:52
  Speaker 2: don't know, man, I just don't feel connected to this movie.
• 26:59
  Speaker 2: The sisterhood wasn't strong for me. I don't think.
• 27:03
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 27:03
  Speaker 2: Do I need to watch it a second time? I
• 27:05
  Speaker 2: don't know.
• 27:05
  Speaker 1: I don't know. Maybe I was just crying. You know,
• 27:07
  Speaker 1: when I go to the movie theater and the popcorn
• 27:09
  Speaker 1: is free and I'm crying, I'm like, this movie deserves
• 27:12
  Speaker 1: an Oscar. You know?
• 27:14
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I just love to feel. And then when the
• 27:19
  Speaker 2: death beetle sound happens and you're like, no, no, no, no, no.
• 27:22
  Speaker 2: Nobody warned me. Nobody told me. I was not prepared.
• 27:27
  Speaker 2: You did not give.
• 27:29
  Speaker 1: Any indication in the trailer.
• 27:31
  Speaker 2: Nothing. thing that we would be losing like because you
• 27:36
  Speaker 2: know me i'm actively staying away from death stuff like
• 27:39
  Speaker 2: intentional death stuff right like if we know someone's dying
• 27:42
  Speaker 2: i'm not taking i'm not doing it um so i'm
• 27:47
  Speaker 2: in the theater weeping because i'm just like well i
• 27:52
  Speaker 2: wasn't ready for.
• 27:53
  Speaker 1: That when diane we passed and she was just at
• 27:58
  Speaker 1: peace with it the death beetles started chirping And she's like,
• 28:02
  Speaker 1: it's my last day. I was like, why are you
• 28:04
  Speaker 1: saying that? Why are you saying that, Franny? That all
• 28:08
  Speaker 1: makes sense.
• 28:10
  Speaker 2: And like, like, I do feel like the use of like,
• 28:14
  Speaker 2: you know, Jilly being like, you haven't heard this to Sally.
• 28:17
  Speaker 2: And she's like, heard what? Because they're like, you know,
• 28:19
  Speaker 2: and then, um, um. jetty's like well it's been around
• 28:25
  Speaker 2: and you know i've been hearing it for about a
• 28:27
  Speaker 2: week or whatever and you're just and like that wasn't
• 28:29
  Speaker 2: you know i just feel like there was a lot
• 28:31
  Speaker 2: of good pieces that but it just it just the
• 28:35
  Speaker 2: execution wasn't working for me.
• 28:38
  Speaker 1: We have the ants mixed up i just looked it
• 28:40
  Speaker 1: up because when i said franny i was like i'm
• 28:42
  Speaker 1: pretty sure that's stalker channing but they're interchangeable because they
• 28:45
  Speaker 1: live their entire lives together okay and that's what happens
• 28:48
  Speaker 1: to old women they just become interchangeable Because they lived
• 28:52
  Speaker 1: their entire lives together.
• 28:53
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah.
• 28:54
  Speaker 1: Jet dies first. Mm-hmm.
• 28:57
  Speaker 2: And I feel like.
• 29:00
  Speaker 2: And then with the girls being like, oh, what's that sound?
• 29:02
  Speaker 2: What's that sound? Giving us the hint of, like, they
• 29:03
  Speaker 2: have the touch of the magic, too. I don't know.
• 29:06
  Speaker 2: I just... It would have felt more impactful.
• 29:12
  Speaker 1: If.
• 29:15
  Speaker 2: I'm trying to think of, like... because everybody can criticize
• 29:19
  Speaker 2: everything but who has a solution.
• 29:21
  Speaker 1: Well and my whole thing is too that i am
• 29:27
  Speaker 1: a woman who ruminates on the mortality of my matriarchs
• 29:32
  Speaker 1: all the time all the time i'm just like tomorrow
• 29:37
  Speaker 1: tomorrow i'm prepping for a wedding and what am i
• 29:39
  Speaker 1: focused on Are all my older matriarchs going to be
• 29:43
  Speaker 1: fine being outside? It's hot out. And like, I'm just always,
• 29:48
  Speaker 1: and I feel like, I feel like that was such,
• 29:53
  Speaker 1: it was a natural move to make because you and
• 29:58
  Speaker 1: I are the age now that we would be preparing
• 30:03
  Speaker 1: to take over our matriarchs. I feel like that is
• 30:07
  Speaker 1: such a deep feminine theme that women are born to
• 30:14
  Speaker 1: eventually replace other women and continue to lead families and
• 30:21
  Speaker 1: lead community. And I ruminate on it a lot. So
• 30:25
  Speaker 1: when Jet passes, I'm devastated because But I'm also like, God,
• 30:31
  Speaker 1: I've lived this like five times where it's like at
• 30:34
  Speaker 1: some point, like I started just referring to myself as
• 30:37
  Speaker 1: the matriarch. I was like, one day I'll be the
• 30:40
  Speaker 1: matriarch of the family. And it's funny, but I and
• 30:47
  Speaker 1: Sally and. Jilly also just being like, we're the aunts now,
• 30:52
  Speaker 1: you know, I live every day of my life being like,
• 30:55
  Speaker 1: I can't wait to be a crone. I can't be
• 30:57
  Speaker 1: wait to just be one of the aunts. sitting at
• 31:00
  Speaker 1: a wedding. No one cares what I'm wearing.
• 31:03
  Speaker 2: Yeah. And I wonder, so like, I wonder though, because
• 31:07
  Speaker 2: it's like them having, is it like, I think, okay.
• 31:11
  Speaker 2: As you were talking, I was thinking about it too.
• 31:13
  Speaker 2: I think for me, it would have been more impactful
• 31:16
  Speaker 2: for them to become the ants. And it was hard
• 31:18
  Speaker 2: losing Franny and Jetty. Like that was hard to watch
• 31:20
  Speaker 2: on screen. If Maisie had been there, if Antonia had
• 31:26
  Speaker 2: been there, Because now you've sent these two six-year-old women
• 31:31
  Speaker 2: on a journey across the pond to fight evil magic.
• 31:38
  Speaker 2: And only one of the girls is there. So these
• 31:41
  Speaker 2: three women have some sort of rite of passage, but
• 31:43
  Speaker 2: Antonia's not involved. So that doesn't feel like a rite
• 31:46
  Speaker 2: of passage. You're leaving one out. So what is the
• 31:50
  Speaker 2: way that we could have included Antonia in this so
• 31:52
  Speaker 2: it did actually feel like the batons were being handed off? Also.
• 31:57
  Speaker 1: It is magically incorrect and bloodline incorrect because Antonia would
• 32:05
  Speaker 1: be the more powerful one as the next matriarch because
• 32:08
  Speaker 1: she's the eldest daughter.
• 32:11
  Speaker 2: And she's gay.
• 32:14
  Speaker 1: And she's gay.
• 32:15
  Speaker 2: So I love the juxtaposition of how the curse doesn't
• 32:19
  Speaker 2: actually impact her. Right.
• 32:23
  Speaker 1: Because as you know, I looked at the ally flag recently.
• 32:26
  Speaker 1: And it has black and white bars on it. And
• 32:29
  Speaker 1: I went because heteronormativity is a prison. It's a prison.
• 32:34
  Speaker 1: It's a prison. Someone in this poor reporter, she just
• 32:39
  Speaker 1: made it to Stocker Channing and Diane Wiest and they
• 32:42
  Speaker 1: don't want to answer fucking questions like that.
• 32:44
  Speaker 2: She was like.
• 32:45
  Speaker 1: Did Jet and Franny ever decide to be gay at
• 32:48
  Speaker 1: some point since men are a curse and heterosexuality is
• 32:51
  Speaker 1: a curse? And those women just deadpan that poor girl.
• 32:54
  Speaker 1: And I was like, that's a question. That was a
• 32:56
  Speaker 1: question for Nicole and Sandra. Yep. They would have been
• 33:01
  Speaker 1: the ones that would have knocked that out of the park. Yep.
• 33:07
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I just feel like that's, I feel like that's
• 33:11
  Speaker 2: the answer is to have wrapped Antonia into, because franny's
• 33:16
  Speaker 2: not going across the water no she's not going to
• 33:19
  Speaker 2: england she's not doing that she they needed to uncover
• 33:24
  Speaker 2: the answer for the curse i also think and they
• 33:29
  Speaker 2: needed it to be it should have been the four
• 33:31
  Speaker 2: of them uncovering that together in the movie i don't
• 33:33
  Speaker 2: know how it plays out in the book.
• 33:35
  Speaker 1: Well and i can't remember because it's been a decade
• 33:38
  Speaker 1: since i've read the book if not more And I
• 33:42
  Speaker 1: I also will say that before we move on from
• 33:45
  Speaker 1: losing the ants and this whole idea of women replacing
• 33:49
  Speaker 1: other women in the magical matriarchy that lives within all women.
• 33:53
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 33:57
  Speaker 1: I did really appreciate that Franny didn't even open it
• 34:01
  Speaker 1: up to discussion that she would be the sacrifice that
• 34:03
  Speaker 1: breaks the curse.
• 34:05
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 34:06
  Speaker 1: I'm old.
• 34:07
  Speaker 2: It's time.
• 34:08
  Speaker 1: It's time. I've lived a life.
• 34:10
  Speaker 2: Living without my sister sounds like shit.
• 34:12
  Speaker 1: My better half is gone. A.K.A. Jet, her sister.
• 34:17
  Speaker 2: It's time.
• 34:18
  Speaker 1: They're ready. I'm ready. I'll just drown myself in this lake. Because... Oh.
• 34:24
  Speaker 2: My god, Natalie.
• 34:25
  Speaker 1: Well, that's what happened.
• 34:26
  Speaker 2: I know, but the way you said it was so jarring.
• 34:30
  Speaker 1: Well, you know, if I talk about it....
• 34:36
  Speaker 2: I understand. We'll cry. I'll cry. Yeah.
• 34:39
  Speaker 1: I'll just drown myself in this lake. A dream. And
• 34:45
  Speaker 1: I often am like, I'm just going to go drown
• 34:47
  Speaker 1: myself in Lake Michigan. Take myself back to the waters.
• 34:52
  Speaker 1: But I felt like that was so powerful. Mostly because
• 34:59
  Speaker 1: I feel like that is also a huge symbol of
• 35:03
  Speaker 1: sacrifices that women make every day. And they just do
• 35:07
  Speaker 1: it silently and wordlessly and our entire lives are just
• 35:10
  Speaker 1: like giving up tiny little parts of ourselves silently for
• 35:14
  Speaker 1: the good of all and the good of the next generation.
• 35:17
  Speaker 1: A huge theme in this movie is that line that
• 35:23
  Speaker 1: Sandra Bullock says when she looks at the main villain,
• 35:25
  Speaker 1: a man. who is just so jealous that he is
• 35:30
  Speaker 1: also an Owens, but he's not a magical Owens because
• 35:34
  Speaker 1: he's not part of the magical bloodline. He's part of
• 35:37
  Speaker 1: the legitimate bloodline.
• 35:38
  Speaker 2: Illegitimate.
• 35:40
  Speaker 1: No, I thought he said he was illegitimate. Maria's the
• 35:43
  Speaker 1: illegitimate one.
• 35:44
  Speaker 2: Okay, go ahead. I don't remember.
• 35:49
  Speaker 1: The Owens line is the... Because that's why they burn
• 35:52
  Speaker 1: Maria and Maria's mom, because they were... having sex with
• 35:57
  Speaker 1: that rich man in England.
• 35:59
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah.
• 36:00
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 36:00
  Speaker 2: Yeah. I thought, I guess I thought he was a
• 36:03
  Speaker 2: different illegitimate line.
• 36:05
  Speaker 1: No, I think he's the legitimate line. Okay.
• 36:07
  Speaker 2: Continue. Sorry. I, we, there's no way for me to know.
• 36:10
  Speaker 2: Cause it's been a while. It's been a minute since
• 36:12
  Speaker 2: I watched the movie. I should have watched it again before.
• 36:14
  Speaker 1: So anyways, So here's a man jealous of women's power
• 36:18
  Speaker 1: and his only solution is, and I will conquer it
• 36:21
  Speaker 1: and I will colonize it and it will be mine.
• 36:25
  Speaker 1: And I will just steal it from the women, which
• 36:28
  Speaker 1: if you haven't heard me say it a hundred times,
• 36:30
  Speaker 1: you'll hear me say a hundred times more is what
• 36:32
  Speaker 1: actually happened in our history. We had all these ancient
• 36:36
  Speaker 1: religions that women were in charge of. Men got mad
• 36:40
  Speaker 1: and took them from us. And Sandra Bullock, Sally looks
• 36:45
  Speaker 1: at this man and she goes, oh, you think power
• 36:49
  Speaker 1: is for making others suffer. And I went, and that's it.
• 36:53
  Speaker 1: That's the exact difference between patriarchy and matriarchy. That's the line.
• 36:57
  Speaker 1: Patriarchy believes that power is used for suffering and for
• 37:02
  Speaker 1: the punishment of others. And matriarchy understands that power is
• 37:07
  Speaker 1: supposed to be for the good of us all.
• 37:09
  Speaker 2: Well, yeah, because his whole life has been suffering. Everything
• 37:13
  Speaker 2: about him and his life has been an element of suffering.
• 37:18
  Speaker 2: He's never known kindness. He's never known generosity. Those things
• 37:25
  Speaker 2: don't exist unless people are subverting patriarchy.
• 37:28
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. So I did write, I was like, yeah,
• 37:33
  Speaker 1: these movies have always been the line between like patriarchy
• 37:38
  Speaker 1: and matriarchy. And I go, and that's the most succinct
• 37:40
  Speaker 1: way I've ever, what's the difference between patriarchy and matriarchy?
• 37:44
  Speaker 1: It's that patriarchy believes that if you have power, you
• 37:47
  Speaker 1: should use it to the detriment of other people to
• 37:49
  Speaker 1: continue to hoard power, Bezos, Musk, a million other billionaires,
• 37:58
  Speaker 1: and matriarchy, believes that once you have power, you should
• 38:02
  Speaker 1: spread it to everyone so that the community thrives and
• 38:06
  Speaker 1: we build a better future and we have the future
• 38:09
  Speaker 1: in mind instead of our own experience. Bill Gates's ex-wife.
• 38:14
  Speaker 2: I mean, Jeff, Mackenzie Scott's a better example because she's
• 38:17
  Speaker 2: given away so much of her wealth and still has,
• 38:20
  Speaker 2: her wealth is still growing.
• 38:21
  Speaker 1: Thank you for correcting me because I'm pretty sure that
• 38:24
  Speaker 1: I thought that that was Bill Gates's ex-wife.
• 38:26
  Speaker 2: Oh, okay.
• 38:27
  Speaker 1: You know.
• 38:29
  Speaker 2: And all of this conversation is reminding me of the book,
• 38:32
  Speaker 2: The Power by Naomi Adler. You know, there's one of
• 38:40
  Speaker 2: the main characters is a very powerful girl and somebody,
• 38:44
  Speaker 2: you know, the men steal it from her and implant
• 38:46
  Speaker 2: it into other men.
• 38:47
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but that's the we can make electricity with our fingertips, right?
• 38:52
  Speaker 1: They should have never canceled that show.
• 38:55
  Speaker 2: I haven't. I've yet to watch it.
• 38:57
  Speaker 1: It was a good adaptation.
• 38:58
  Speaker 2: OK, good, because I feel like when we read the book,
• 39:01
  Speaker 2: I was like, I don't know if I'll be able
• 39:02
  Speaker 2: to sit through the show because I am.
• 39:04
  Speaker 1: Oh, yeah, that's right. There's torture. Don't do it. Just
• 39:08
  Speaker 1: like the Widows Bay. Yeah, I like and I I
• 39:13
  Speaker 1: understand how that feels like feminism 101 that like, oh,
• 39:17
  Speaker 1: matriarchy is kind and patriarchy is angry. And it's the
• 39:22
  Speaker 1: same critique we had of the Barbie movie. But how
• 39:26
  Speaker 1: often do we hear female leaders say out loud, it's
• 39:30
  Speaker 1: because I'm trying to make us a community that will
• 39:32
  Speaker 1: care for all of us and not some of us.
• 39:35
  Speaker 1: I feel like we still don't have the language of
• 39:39
  Speaker 1: why we're trying so hard to get more women elected
• 39:42
  Speaker 1: and in positions of power. And I think that if
• 39:46
  Speaker 1: we don't start talking about the actual goddamn difference, this
• 39:50
  Speaker 1: narrative will continue to spread also to other women, mostly
• 39:54
  Speaker 1: white women, who refuse to believe that matriarchy would be better, that, well,
• 39:58
  Speaker 1: women are just out to punish men. No, we're out
• 40:02
  Speaker 1: to feed babies.
• 40:04
  Speaker 2: And there's definitely, like, you know, to tie it back
• 40:08
  Speaker 2: to the Barbie movie, it got a lot of criticism
• 40:11
  Speaker 2: because it was like, you know, new feminist idea, like, oh,
• 40:14
  Speaker 2: this is like feminism 101, like, and beyond that. But
• 40:18
  Speaker 2: I think also the other part of that, that we forget,
• 40:22
  Speaker 2: especially in like bigger cities, more metropolitan areas is that
• 40:27
  Speaker 2: smaller communities like mine, like yours still have people who
• 40:30
  Speaker 2: have never heard the messaging that was coming out of Barbie.
• 40:33
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 40:34
  Speaker 2: And it's like, as long as that's still happening, we still,
• 40:38
  Speaker 2: we're always going to have a ton of work to
• 40:39
  Speaker 2: do because like, just like with Black history, you have
• 40:44
  Speaker 2: to actively seek these things out because they're not readily
• 40:47
  Speaker 2: available on purpose. And so if I'm not a curious
• 40:51
  Speaker 2: person or if I'm like, hey, I don't think there's
• 40:54
  Speaker 2: anything wrong with the way that we're living. Everything's fine.
• 40:56
  Speaker 2: Even though I don't realize I'm suffering, I'm not going
• 40:59
  Speaker 2: to seek it out and learn.
• 41:01
  Speaker 1: Well, and you and I talk about all the time
• 41:03
  Speaker 1: that the easiest way for people to comprehend new ideas
• 41:07
  Speaker 1: and to learn new ways of empathy and new ways
• 41:10
  Speaker 1: of thinking about the world is through fiction and Barbie
• 41:14
  Speaker 1: and practical magic too. And who knows, who knows what
• 41:18
  Speaker 1: the Romeo and Michelle two movie will be. Maybe we'll
• 41:22
  Speaker 1: talk about it too. And I'll be like, and this
• 41:24
  Speaker 1: is a feminist manifesto.
• 41:27
  Speaker 2: Romeo and Michelle's 40th high school reunion.
• 41:29
  Speaker 1: Yes, it could be. We don't know. I didn't write
• 41:32
  Speaker 1: that script. It has yet to be produced. Um, And
• 41:37
  Speaker 1: I think, like, that's it, too. Like, we live in
• 41:39
  Speaker 1: small communities where women aren't hearing on the front lines
• 41:43
  Speaker 1: every day, you should care about yourselves more than none,
• 41:45
  Speaker 1: because if we were in power, we'd have it all.
• 41:47
  Speaker 2: Well, and then there's not a lot of opportunity. Like,
• 41:50
  Speaker 2: when I think about my role, like, my trajectory here
• 41:55
  Speaker 2: in the town that I grew up in, my only
• 41:58
  Speaker 2: options to be able to afford to be able to, quote,
• 42:00
  Speaker 2: take care of myself without, you know, a benefactor, i.e.
• 42:03
  Speaker 2: a husband, is.
• 42:06
  Speaker 2: You know, working for the county or becoming a teacher
• 42:11
  Speaker 2: because those are the only jobs that pay enough. And
• 42:14
  Speaker 2: not every community has high paying teacher positions. Where I live,
• 42:19
  Speaker 2: that's one of the highest paying city district, city school
• 42:23
  Speaker 2: districts in the state. but also it's like, or nursing too.
• 42:27
  Speaker 2: Like I could have become a nurse, but these are
• 42:29
  Speaker 2: also skills that I'm just like, I am working for
• 42:32
  Speaker 2: the County. It depends on the role, because if I
• 42:34
  Speaker 2: become an admin assistant, I'm making just a smidge above
• 42:37
  Speaker 2: minimum wage and that's not a little wage. So it's like, so, so,
• 42:41
  Speaker 2: but if I'm living in like San Francisco or even less,
• 42:44
  Speaker 2: let's throw Los Angeles in there, Seattle, New York city,
• 42:47
  Speaker 2: a bigger city, Atlanta that has way more professional opportunity to,
• 42:54
  Speaker 2: then that's, you know, an option. But if my only
• 42:57
  Speaker 2: opportunity is to become a teacher, become a nurse or
• 43:01
  Speaker 2: be an admin assistant at, you know, the County, what,
• 43:07
  Speaker 2: what am I, what am I thinking beyond, you know
• 43:09
  Speaker 2: what I mean? Like, there's not a lot to drive
• 43:12
  Speaker 2: me to be more than that other than like, okay,
• 43:15
  Speaker 2: well it's time for me to find a husband who
• 43:16
  Speaker 2: makes enough money so we can be comfortable.
• 43:19
  Speaker 1: Yeah. I think one thing we should have taken away
• 43:21
  Speaker 1: when Dolly Parton passed, like all of us, and I'm
• 43:24
  Speaker 1: not talking about Julia and I who talk about it
• 43:26
  Speaker 1: in voice message every day. I'm talking about like 12
• 43:30
  Speaker 1: year old girls, 20 year old women who have just
• 43:35
  Speaker 1: left their conservative home. I hope that when Dolly Parton died,
• 43:39
  Speaker 1: it ran through every person's mind. My God, I still
• 43:44
  Speaker 1: live in a country that hoards all the wealth in
• 43:47
  Speaker 1: the world. And I, still have kids that only get
• 43:51
  Speaker 1: one book a month because of Dolly Parton. One book
• 43:55
  Speaker 1: a month. One. And she started it because they were
• 44:01
  Speaker 1: like communities that weren't guaranteed a library.
• 44:04
  Speaker 2: Like I think people don't understand. And to honor her
• 44:07
  Speaker 2: dad because he had low to no literacy skills. And
• 44:10
  Speaker 2: she's like, that cannot happen under my watch for anybody else.
• 44:13
  Speaker 1: For anybody else. I think people like, I think it's
• 44:16
  Speaker 1: always so easy to be like, well, people just aren't
• 44:18
  Speaker 1: doing enough and think about the individual. It's like, get
• 44:21
  Speaker 1: your kid to a library. What if the library is
• 44:23
  Speaker 1: 40 miles away? And that's the nearest one. What if
• 44:27
  Speaker 1: gas is $ 5 a gallon? I can't be going to
• 44:31
  Speaker 1: story time now, can I?
• 44:32
  Speaker 2: Yep. And that's like the lack of community of it
• 44:35
  Speaker 2: all to not understanding what it actually takes. The black
• 44:41
  Speaker 2: and whiteness of that kind of thinking is really harmful.
• 44:45
  Speaker 1: And I'm going to make another argument that that makes
• 44:47
  Speaker 1: Grease 2 a feminist manifesto. Because in Grease 1, the
• 44:50
  Speaker 1: whole thing was, what if you changed yourself to make
• 44:53
  Speaker 1: yourself sexier for a man and smoke cigarettes? But in
• 44:56
  Speaker 1: Grease 2, the message was, What if men actually learned
• 45:01
  Speaker 1: one skill that made them impressive enough for me to
• 45:03
  Speaker 1: date them?
• 45:04
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 45:05
  Speaker 1: Just one. She asked him to ride a motorcycle. Like
• 45:10
  Speaker 1: she kept asking the ex guy, like, why are you
• 45:13
  Speaker 1: impressive and why should I date you? Why? Why would
• 45:16
  Speaker 1: I ever go back to that, Johnny? You're not impressive.
• 45:20
  Speaker 1: Which feels very feminist 101. But Natalie in her 20s
• 45:24
  Speaker 1: dated a whole hell of a lot of untalented women.
• 45:28
  Speaker 1: men and thought that that was as good as it
• 45:32
  Speaker 1: was going to get. And thank God a man looked
• 45:34
  Speaker 1: at me. He even says the town gossiped about me.
• 45:39
  Speaker 1: And I was like, oh, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding.
• 45:42
  Speaker 1: Maybe they were warning their daughters that you're a creep
• 45:45
  Speaker 1: because you don't seem like a catch. Gotta say it.
• 45:50
  Speaker 2: Gotta say it. You don't seem like you're a catch.
• 45:55
  Speaker 1: I do fully believe that we should be warning other
• 45:57
  Speaker 1: women about When men seem angry, like, hey, his main
• 46:01
  Speaker 1: baseline behavior seems to be one out of anger. You
• 46:04
  Speaker 1: might not want that second date.
• 46:06
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 46:07
  Speaker 1: Like.
• 46:08
  Speaker 2: And also, why did that old guy who works with
• 46:10
  Speaker 2: him was like, yeah, this guy knows all the answers.
• 46:13
  Speaker 1: Because men love other men.
• 46:16
  Speaker 2: But, like, if you know he's a bad, bad man,
• 46:18
  Speaker 2: why are you sending a young 20-something woman off with him? Like,
• 46:21
  Speaker 2: that's just bad. Like, do you not have daughters?
• 46:24
  Speaker 1: No, that old man didn't realize. I'm talking that women
• 46:27
  Speaker 1: knew that that man was a man that was born
• 46:30
  Speaker 1: out of anger and strife and had a bad personality.
• 46:33
  Speaker 1: Other men just saw him as another white man. And
• 46:35
  Speaker 1: they were like, oh, it's our pal. The angry guy
• 46:39
  Speaker 1: that punches holes into the pub. Yeah. No.
• 46:45
  Speaker 2: Why wouldn't you... This is what we mean when men
• 46:47
  Speaker 2: need to, like, stand up.
• 46:49
  Speaker 1: Stand up. Pay attention.
• 46:51
  Speaker 2: Pay attention. Don't let her run off with some man
• 46:54
  Speaker 2: that has been gossiped about his whole life of being
• 46:56
  Speaker 2: a weirdo.
• 46:57
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Believe me when I say, hey, that guy shouldn't
• 46:59
  Speaker 1: be near the kids. And don't ask me why I
• 47:03
  Speaker 1: feel that way. I am a person of authority. I
• 47:06
  Speaker 1: am a grown-up adult woman going, hey, I don't like
• 47:10
  Speaker 1: that guy near the kids. So that guy doesn't get
• 47:12
  Speaker 1: to be near the kids. We don't have to debate it.
• 47:16
  Speaker 1: You won't have to stand up for every man in
• 47:20
  Speaker 1: town just because God forbid men hurt other men's feelings.
• 47:29
  Speaker 1: I will say that something else that I thought was
• 47:35
  Speaker 1: a flaw to the entire plot in general, and it
• 47:39
  Speaker 1: could have been an entire... I fixed the problem of
• 47:42
  Speaker 1: how we get all four of them involved. And how
• 47:45
  Speaker 1: Antonia gets to actually be a bigger part in the movie.
• 47:49
  Speaker 1: Bragging about being a sapphic queen who doesn't have to
• 47:51
  Speaker 1: worry about curses. I would have loved that. I would
• 47:53
  Speaker 1: have loved her entire character just being like, and I
• 47:56
  Speaker 1: don't have to worry about this. I think it did
• 48:02
  Speaker 1: us all a really big disservice to watch Sally Owens
• 48:06
  Speaker 1: just backtrack to where she was at the beginning of
• 48:09
  Speaker 1: the first movie. And I think. that the reason why
• 48:13
  Speaker 1: it does a disservice, and I think this is how
• 48:17
  Speaker 1: we feel about Gen X and boomer women as millennial women,
• 48:22
  Speaker 1: is at some point, older women have to take the
• 48:25
  Speaker 1: responsibility of giving information to younger women about the fate
• 48:31
  Speaker 1: of the world. It does younger women no good to
• 48:38
  Speaker 1: not tell them that they're witches, but unfortunately, there's a curse.
• 48:42
  Speaker 1: That doesn't protect them in any way, shape or form.
• 48:46
  Speaker 1: It doesn't do you any good to backslide. And I
• 48:48
  Speaker 1: understood the grief of it, but I would have loved
• 48:52
  Speaker 1: the movie to be. They've grown up. They still don't
• 48:58
  Speaker 1: know how to deal with the curse. They find this
• 49:00
  Speaker 1: weird book. The book is the catalyst to make them
• 49:05
  Speaker 1: re up there. Maybe Jillian, Sally have been working on
• 49:08
  Speaker 1: it all along and they just don't have it. And
• 49:13
  Speaker 1: then Kylie and Antonia come into their own, come into
• 49:19
  Speaker 1: their powers. And the four of them are going to
• 49:22
  Speaker 1: set off on this weird book journey together. And Kylie,
• 49:27
  Speaker 1: because she was very male-centric, can still end up mistrusting
• 49:33
  Speaker 1: the wrong man and ending in a big tornado situation.
• 49:39
  Speaker 1: dark magic, almost being burned on a pyre confrontation. There
• 49:45
  Speaker 1: is still conflict in Julia and I are educated, informed women,
• 49:51
  Speaker 1: and we still have conflict in our lives. I think
• 49:54
  Speaker 1: that like, it's very easy to just go and the
• 49:57
  Speaker 1: women know nothing. And that's why they've ended up in
• 50:00
  Speaker 1: this scenario when it could be, well, what about the
• 50:03
  Speaker 1: women who know everything and still ended up cursed?
• 50:11
  Speaker 2: Yeah, because that was a big question for a lot
• 50:13
  Speaker 2: of people too, was like, that I'm seeing the discourse
• 50:16
  Speaker 2: on the internet where it's like, well, they, you know,
• 50:19
  Speaker 2: they fixed the curse at the end of the first movie,
• 50:22
  Speaker 2: and then the other side is like, no, they thought
• 50:25
  Speaker 2: they ended the curse at the end of the first movie.
• 50:29
  Speaker 2: That is why the second movie can exist, because they
• 50:32
  Speaker 2: thought they did. They thought they did. And that's an
• 50:35
  Speaker 2: interesting thread to follow too, because of this idea of like, oh,
• 50:39
  Speaker 2: we thought we Because we all thought they did. Because
• 50:42
  Speaker 2: the guy that she wrote about when she was a
• 50:44
  Speaker 2: child who could not realistically happen, happened. And then he
• 50:49
  Speaker 2: also dies. That's the thread we need to follow. And
• 50:54
  Speaker 2: I think they tried to follow that thread. I think
• 50:58
  Speaker 2: that it is a misstep, to your point, to restate
• 51:02
  Speaker 2: everything we've talked about today. to not make it a
• 51:06
  Speaker 2: four situation and leaving Antonia behind, because even though Antonia
• 51:12
  Speaker 2: is gay, she's still impacted by the curse in the
• 51:14
  Speaker 2: sense of like, she still is going to have to
• 51:16
  Speaker 2: nurse her sister through this because when Gideon got hit
• 51:19
  Speaker 2: by the car and, you know, and he's in the hospital,
• 51:23
  Speaker 2: like instead of being by Gideon side, she, she needed
• 51:26
  Speaker 2: to be by in Kylie side, because even if they
• 51:30
  Speaker 2: break the curse, like, They still are sisters and will
• 51:34
  Speaker 2: have a life together regardless of all the men. Because
• 51:37
  Speaker 2: even though the curse takes the men out of their
• 51:39
  Speaker 2: lives all together, all the Owens women, the sisterhood is
• 51:44
  Speaker 2: the bond. The sisterhood is the strength. That conquers everything
• 51:48
  Speaker 2: over love. Sorry.
• 51:50
  Speaker 1: Sorry.
• 51:52
  Speaker 2: Also, a.
• 51:55
  Speaker 1: Huge theme in all of the Alice Hoffman books.
• 51:59
  Speaker 2: Oh, is anti-women?
• 52:02
  Speaker 1: No, is men are purely there to have sex with
• 52:07
  Speaker 1: you enough times that they impregnate you, continue the female
• 52:12
  Speaker 1: line of magic.
• 52:13
  Speaker 2: Right. And then no one's having sons.
• 52:15
  Speaker 1: Because no one's having sons. And then the and then
• 52:17
  Speaker 1: the magic curse goes. And now your purpose has been
• 52:21
  Speaker 1: done and they kill you. Right.
• 52:24
  Speaker 2: And which is why we didn't hear the beetle for Gideon. Yeah.
• 52:30
  Speaker 2: He hasn't served his purpose.
• 52:32
  Speaker 1: He hasn't served his purpose. He hasn't knocked up Kylie.
• 52:35
  Speaker 2: And also, why did you make him an orphan?
• 52:37
  Speaker 1: Yeah. I have to imagine it's so they didn't have
• 52:40
  Speaker 1: to cast two more people.
• 52:42
  Speaker 2: Yeah, probably.
• 52:45
  Speaker 1: It's like they just didn't want to cast two more
• 52:47
  Speaker 1: people and have to explain to two people we've never
• 52:50
  Speaker 1: met before. Hey, we're cursed.
• 52:53
  Speaker 2: Because the whole time it's like, wait a minute, we
• 52:55
  Speaker 2: didn't hear the beetle for Gideon. Okay, fair. But also
• 52:58
  Speaker 2: the one that's going to break the curse, probably like
• 53:00
  Speaker 2: the death beetle's not coming. Right? So then I also
• 53:04
  Speaker 2: felt clumsy the way that they did the death beetle
• 53:06
  Speaker 2: sound for Franny when she's in the hospital. Because it
• 53:09
  Speaker 2: was like, well, I shouldn't. They probably thought that that
• 53:15
  Speaker 2: was a red hairy. Yeah, because I was like, okay,
• 53:18
  Speaker 2: so we're meant to assume. what about this? Because you,
• 53:22
  Speaker 2: we didn't hear the death beetle before the accident. So
• 53:24
  Speaker 2: I'm assuming the death beetle is for Franny. And so,
• 53:28
  Speaker 2: but also a little confusing to me because it's like, well,
• 53:33
  Speaker 2: if I don't know that you're supposed to, like, if
• 53:35
  Speaker 2: I never saw the first one, because we only heard
• 53:39
  Speaker 2: the death beetle for jet. So if I've never seen
• 53:42
  Speaker 2: the first one, I don't know. I, I just got
• 53:46
  Speaker 2: stuck on so many things.
• 53:48
  Speaker 1: Well, because that is clumsy. And I do think it
• 53:51
  Speaker 1: is a stronger movie if you just have them. They
• 53:55
  Speaker 1: should have had that beautiful man, the second husband, die. Yeah,
• 54:01
  Speaker 1: the guy from Legends of the Fall, maybe, in a waterfall. Yeah. Julia,
• 54:08
  Speaker 1: the Legends of the Fall scene that I'm thinking of
• 54:12
  Speaker 1: is actually the last of the Mohicans.
• 54:15
  Speaker 2: Oh, my God, Natalie. Yes.
• 54:17
  Speaker 1: Two movies that my mom loves and I've never sat through.
• 54:22
  Speaker 2: Well, I'm probably not going to sit through The Last
• 54:24
  Speaker 2: of the Mohicans because, you know, Mel Gibson's a monster.
• 54:28
  Speaker 2: But I do regularly think, oh, I want to watch
• 54:31
  Speaker 2: Legends of the Fall. And then I never turn it
• 54:33
  Speaker 2: on because I'm like, do I really want to be devastated?
• 54:35
  Speaker 1: One.
• 54:35
  Speaker 2: And two, do I really think that it's going to
• 54:37
  Speaker 2: hold up after all these years? I don't know.
• 54:39
  Speaker 1: We shouldn't be watching Brad Pitt.
• 54:41
  Speaker 2: Plus Brad Pitt. The Brad Pitt of it all.
• 54:44
  Speaker 1: Anyways. That just clicked for me. I'm like, actually, that's
• 54:47
  Speaker 1: Last of the Mohicans. So anyways, Aiden Quinn. They should
• 54:54
  Speaker 1: have had him die while the girls were teenagers. And
• 54:57
  Speaker 1: then you could have ushered in to the, oh, no.
• 55:01
  Speaker 2: Because it would have walloped it. Because they kind of
• 55:04
  Speaker 2: implied that it was like months after they got married, right?
• 55:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah.
• 55:08
  Speaker 2: Which feels... fucked.
• 55:10
  Speaker 1: Up so now you've known for years that the curse
• 55:12
  Speaker 1: is back and you've just been inactive about it right
• 55:17
  Speaker 1: and i'm sorry women don't actually go into inactivity when
• 55:23
  Speaker 1: they're grieving i've never seen a woman be succumbed by
• 55:29
  Speaker 1: grief and then go and i'm just never gonna do
• 55:33
  Speaker 1: anything again no we still have kids to.
• 55:38
  Speaker 2: Feed yeah, I do think you're right. I think it
• 55:41
  Speaker 2: would be stronger if the girls were a little bit older,
• 55:43
  Speaker 2: if they had a couple of years together, because the
• 55:46
  Speaker 2: inactivity for 15 years of the, like the implication is
• 55:49
  Speaker 2: that it's like maybe 15 years later. Right. Um, so to,
• 55:54
  Speaker 2: to not because, but then it lends itself to the
• 55:57
  Speaker 2: conversation of like, well, there's still so little, so they
• 56:00
  Speaker 2: can't like, how do you have that conversation? But if
• 56:02
  Speaker 2: they had it when they were older and Because Sally
• 56:07
  Speaker 2: in the first movie, when she moves back in with
• 56:09
  Speaker 2: the aunts after her husband dies, she's like, no magic.
• 56:11
  Speaker 2: We're not doing this. But it still seeps in anyway.
• 56:14
  Speaker 2: And I feel like it is kind of, I agree
• 56:20
  Speaker 2: with you. The girls should have been teenagers when it happened.
• 56:23
  Speaker 2: Because then it could be like, they have a base
• 56:27
  Speaker 2: understanding of the fact that they come from a magical
• 56:31
  Speaker 2: family line. But then because mom is like, what? they
• 56:36
  Speaker 2: now have to do everything in secret. So they're not
• 56:39
  Speaker 2: actually learning properly because they're just like doing what they
• 56:42
  Speaker 2: can when they can, because mom's like.
• 56:44
  Speaker 1: Oh yeah.
• 56:46
  Speaker 2: Sorry for that.
• 56:47
  Speaker 1: She robbed them of a spiritual childhood.
• 56:49
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Twice. Twice.
• 56:54
  Speaker 1: Because I'm sorry.
• 56:55
  Speaker 2: I would have loved, I would have loved to see
• 56:57
  Speaker 2: that more. I would have loved to see a 16
• 56:58
  Speaker 2: year old and a 15 year old Antonio and Kylie
• 57:01
  Speaker 2: and being forced to be like, okay, we're done. We
• 57:05
  Speaker 2: aren't doing this anymore. But the teenager-ness of it all
• 57:09
  Speaker 2: combined with the grief, oh, that would have been so interesting,
• 57:12
  Speaker 2: I think.
• 57:13
  Speaker 1: It opens on the funeral, like this movie does. It
• 57:17
  Speaker 1: opens on the funeral. And then the very next scene
• 57:21
  Speaker 1: is Sandra Bullock and Nicole Kidman sitting those girls down
• 57:26
  Speaker 1: and be like, 10 years ago, we thought that we
• 57:29
  Speaker 1: got it. And we didn't get it. And this is
• 57:34
  Speaker 1: our reality. And those girls have grown up in a
• 57:37
  Speaker 1: household where you put lavender next to the door and
• 57:40
  Speaker 1: salt over your left shoulder. And they might even be like, oh,
• 57:44
  Speaker 1: our aunts and our moms are so eccentric or whatever.
• 57:48
  Speaker 1: And then you have to have the realization. And then
• 57:52
  Speaker 1: Sally could still say, and I'm never doing it again.
• 57:56
  Speaker 1: Or it's the call to action to actually deal with
• 57:59
  Speaker 1: the curse.
• 58:01
  Speaker 2: Because then you have Kylie falling in love with Gideon.
• 58:05
  Speaker 2: She has hesitation reservation because she's like, Mom, we have
• 58:08
  Speaker 2: to do something. I found this man. I like this man.
• 58:12
  Speaker 2: You talked about this curse when stepdaddy died. I don't
• 58:16
  Speaker 2: want that. How do we fix it? And then now
• 58:19
  Speaker 2: the four of them go on this journey of fixing it. Oh,
• 58:22
  Speaker 2: that's the movie I want. I would have loved to
• 58:25
  Speaker 2: have seen that.
• 58:26
  Speaker 1: I don't know why no one will. pay me to
• 58:29
  Speaker 1: write movies. Everyone should be paying me to consult on
• 58:32
  Speaker 1: these movies. Sandra Bullock should have called me. That's a
• 58:38
  Speaker 1: better movie.
• 58:38
  Speaker 2: I also do agree with the person on TikTok. I'm
• 58:40
  Speaker 2: so sorry I can't remember who it was because I
• 58:42
  Speaker 2: consume so much TikTok that I can never find anything
• 58:46
  Speaker 2: to go back in my watch history. About not bringing
• 58:50
  Speaker 2: back her sort of like that strawberry reddish hair, like
• 58:53
  Speaker 2: the more red to it. Because it really was such
• 58:56
  Speaker 2: a signifier in the first one. The physical contrast in
• 59:01
  Speaker 2: that way between the two of them in the first
• 59:03
  Speaker 2: one would have been really nice to see.
• 59:06
  Speaker 1: I also agree with Chelsea. Devantez, who put in her
• 59:11
  Speaker 1: free newsletter on Patreon today, that all cameras from the
• 59:17
  Speaker 1: 90s were better at filming movies than the cameras of
• 59:19
  Speaker 1: today because everything looked softer and prettier.
• 59:21
  Speaker 2: Oh, and you can see the transition. Like, I'm rewatching,
• 59:25
  Speaker 2: I'm doing my Gilmore Girls rewatch right now, and the
• 59:28
  Speaker 2: transition from season... Three to season four. No, season four
• 59:33
  Speaker 2: to season five. Because it's a big difference in terms
• 59:38
  Speaker 2: of tone, the rate of speed of each frame. Like, whoa.
• 59:43
  Speaker 1: One of my favorite horror movies, The Love Witch, I
• 59:47
  Speaker 1: was convinced was an old 70s horror movie. Because it
• 59:52
  Speaker 1: takes place in the 70s. And the camera... is so
• 59:57
  Speaker 1: unlike anything that we've got going on now in a
• 1:00:00
  Speaker 1: Marvel movie that I was like, oh, that was a
• 1:00:01
  Speaker 1: really solid, good movie. And I swear it's like from 2018. Like, yeah,
• 1:00:08
  Speaker 1: I do. I just miss old. I just like, do
• 1:00:12
  Speaker 1: you think that this is how they felt when like,
• 1:00:14
  Speaker 1: I love Lucy went in color and they're like, I
• 1:00:17
  Speaker 1: liked it in black and white.
• 1:00:18
  Speaker 2: Did I love Lucy ever go in color?
• 1:00:21
  Speaker 1: I don't know. Eventually she had to be on color television.
• 1:00:24
  Speaker 2: Yeah, but that was after I Love Lucy. That's not
• 1:00:27
  Speaker 2: the point. That's not the point. That's not the point.
• 1:00:28
  Speaker 1: Some of the shows did go from black and white
• 1:00:31
  Speaker 1: to color, though. Didn't Bewitched? Yeah.
• 1:00:34
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:00:35
  Speaker 1: I wonder if this is how they felt about Bewitched.
• 1:00:38
  Speaker 2: There you go. I do think, man, I would have
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 2: loved to see.
• 1:00:43
  Speaker 1: I just love watching women come together.
• 1:00:47
  Speaker 2: Yeah. So like leaning into it's 15 years later. Well,
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 2: that would have put them at 30. So if it happens,
• 1:00:53
  Speaker 2: if stepdaddy number if stepdaddy number one dies at when
• 1:00:58
  Speaker 2: the girls are like 15 16 then it's eight years
• 1:01:01
  Speaker 2: later so you're still leaning into it's 2010 I wish
• 1:01:05
  Speaker 2: that they had leaned into the period piece of it
• 1:01:09
  Speaker 2: all I understand we didn't have FaceTime in 2010 but
• 1:01:14
  Speaker 2: you could have blurred that line of this is the
• 1:01:16
  Speaker 2: 20 teens in a way where it was like okay
• 1:01:20
  Speaker 2: FaceTime's dropping we don't have locations.
• 1:01:22
  Speaker 1: Also why do we need FaceTime You could have done
• 1:01:26
  Speaker 1: a split scene of him talking if you really needed
• 1:01:29
  Speaker 1: his face on the screen.
• 1:01:30
  Speaker 2: That's true. And also the leap pace of it all
• 1:01:35
  Speaker 2: because he and Sandra have such a connection or he
• 1:01:38
  Speaker 2: and Sally have such a connection. Sally and whatever doctor, professor,
• 1:01:41
  Speaker 2: whatever his name is.
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 1: Dr. Pretty.
• 1:01:43
  Speaker 2: So hot.
• 1:01:45
  Speaker 1: So pretty.
• 1:01:47
  Speaker 2: Because then that means she gets her final and then
• 1:01:51
  Speaker 2: what an interesting exploration for Jilly who basically was just
• 1:01:54
  Speaker 2: like this curse I'm cool don't need to date I'm
• 1:01:58
  Speaker 2: good I'll just fuck around I don't need to find
• 1:02:00
  Speaker 2: out like that would have been an interesting exploration too
• 1:02:04
  Speaker 2: for future films because then it's like does Jilly dial
• 1:02:07
  Speaker 2: back that and decide okay maybe I do look for
• 1:02:10
  Speaker 2: love now that the curse is officially broken because part
• 1:02:12
  Speaker 2: of me feels like the fact that Jilly doesn't ever
• 1:02:16
  Speaker 2: attempt even like like the the curse isn't broken so
• 1:02:20
  Speaker 2: she's like i'm good i'm cool i don't need it
• 1:02:24
  Speaker 2: so like the curse is broken for reals now what
• 1:02:28
  Speaker 2: does jilly feel does she feel like she wants to
• 1:02:30
  Speaker 2: have a partner or is she good like what kind
• 1:02:33
  Speaker 2: of internal conflict does that create for her well.
• 1:02:37
  Speaker 1: And also they kept creating conflict between jilly and sally
• 1:02:40
  Speaker 1: and i was like i actually don't need that to
• 1:02:43
  Speaker 1: be entertained I.
• 1:02:44
  Speaker 2: Don't the way I don't even remember the conflict between
• 1:02:46
  Speaker 2: any of them in the movie well it's.
• 1:02:48
  Speaker 1: Jilly is just like walking behind Sandra Bullock the entire
• 1:02:51
  Speaker 1: movie going now Sally do you want to be powerful
• 1:02:53
  Speaker 1: and Sally just screams back oh yeah I don't and
• 1:02:57
  Speaker 1: like I did really enjoy the conflict of like being
• 1:03:00
  Speaker 1: an aunt but not but I don't.
• 1:03:03
  Speaker 2: Need there was yeah there was a lot of like
• 1:03:05
  Speaker 2: nitpicky kind of shit where you're just like we don't
• 1:03:07
  Speaker 2: need this space filler yeah it's all coming back to
• 1:03:10
  Speaker 2: me now you're right yeah.
• 1:03:11
  Speaker 1: I don't need them to be in conflict. I would
• 1:03:14
  Speaker 1: rather watch a group of women come together and take
• 1:03:17
  Speaker 1: down a curse.
• 1:03:18
  Speaker 2: Because even in the first one, when they were, quote unquote,
• 1:03:22
  Speaker 2: in conflict with each other, they still really weren't.
• 1:03:24
  Speaker 1: No.
• 1:03:25
  Speaker 2: So, like, we don't need the nitpicky, the mm-mm-mm of
• 1:03:29
  Speaker 2: it all. Like, that didn't need to be there.
• 1:03:33
  Speaker 1: Also the first movie does end with a group of
• 1:03:36
  Speaker 1: women coming to everyone's aid because then all of the
• 1:03:39
  Speaker 1: neighborhood women come to the Owens house. Yeah.
• 1:03:41
  Speaker 2: If you need, you got a broom, bring it.
• 1:03:43
  Speaker 1: If you got a broom, bring it. Yeah. And they
• 1:03:47
  Speaker 1: use the school phone tree and all of the women
• 1:03:49
  Speaker 1: show up and what's his name?
• 1:03:53
  Speaker 2: Billy? Bad, bad man.
• 1:03:54
  Speaker 1: Is his name Billy?
• 1:03:56
  Speaker 2: Sure. I don't know.
• 1:03:58
  Speaker 1: Billy is also a name in Hocus Pocus. So I
• 1:04:00
  Speaker 1: feel like it can't be both. Um, But that feels right.
• 1:04:05
  Speaker 2: Yeah, let me look. Also, I would like to point
• 1:04:10
  Speaker 2: out Aiden Quinn is still working.
• 1:04:12
  Speaker 1: Good for him.
• 1:04:13
  Speaker 2: Per his IMDB.
• 1:04:15
  Speaker 1: Maybe I don't recognize him because they probably don't put Jimmy.
• 1:04:19
  Speaker 2: They don't put Jimmy.
• 1:04:21
  Speaker 1: They don't put colored contacts in one eye. So I
• 1:04:24
  Speaker 1: don't recognize him. You know all men look the same.
• 1:04:27
  Speaker 1: Unless they're Lee Pace or Pedro Pascal. This is so beautiful.
• 1:04:32
  Speaker 2: It's ridiculous.
• 1:04:33
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a better movie. I don't actually need to
• 1:04:36
  Speaker 1: watch conflict be sown between women and then to have
• 1:04:40
  Speaker 1: one young woman just be like, and I trust all men,
• 1:04:43
  Speaker 1: any man I talk to. And it's like, ah, Kylie.
• 1:04:47
  Speaker 2: And especially because, see, now that you've reminded me that
• 1:04:50
  Speaker 2: there was conflict, I'm remembering all the scenes that irritated
• 1:04:53
  Speaker 2: the shit out of me. Because when she's telling Kylie
• 1:04:58
  Speaker 2: all the things and Sally's like, Jilly, Jilly, Jilly, Jilly.
• 1:05:05
  Speaker 1: Then you should have done it.
• 1:05:07
  Speaker 2: Um, which I understand. I understand Sally's position. Like I'm
• 1:05:10
  Speaker 2: having a hard time saying these things out loud, but
• 1:05:12
  Speaker 2: I don't believe that Jillian would have been so. Pushy
• 1:05:16
  Speaker 2: about it. I feel like she would have been more
• 1:05:17
  Speaker 2: supportive and they would have done it together, but that's just,
• 1:05:20
  Speaker 2: you know, based on my perceptions of the film. I
• 1:05:23
  Speaker 2: also find it really frustrating how they did sort of make, uh, Sally,
• 1:05:28
  Speaker 2: this less confident, more like kind of character, uh, Where
• 1:05:32
  Speaker 2: she's just like, oh, oh, oh, oh, the whole movie.
• 1:05:38
  Speaker 2: Which only works when you're in the presence of Lee Pace.
• 1:05:40
  Speaker 2: Because I, too, would be like, oh, if he was
• 1:05:45
  Speaker 2: in presence of me.
• 1:05:47
  Speaker 1: Rack your brain. Decide if you've got more points to make.
• 1:05:50
  Speaker 1: Because I've got one last question before we move into
• 1:05:53
  Speaker 1: the closing ceremony.
• 1:05:56
  Speaker 2: Okay. I'm good. Okay.
• 1:05:59
  Speaker 1: Julia? Julia? how many husbands would you sacrifice to kiss
• 1:06:04
  Speaker 1: Lee Pace? Because Sally technically sacrificed two.
• 1:06:12
  Speaker 2: I've never had a husband, so I'm not going off
• 1:06:15
  Speaker 2: of lived experience, but I would sacrifice every single husband
• 1:06:21
  Speaker 2: I ever had so I could kiss Lee Pace. Yeah.
• 1:06:23
  Speaker 2: Even though I'm not his type.
• 1:06:25
  Speaker 1: Even though I'm not his type. If all of a
• 1:06:26
  Speaker 1: sudden Lee Pace was like, Maybe heteronormativity is a prison
• 1:06:31
  Speaker 1: after all, and Natalie, I want to live my life
• 1:06:33
  Speaker 1: behind bars with you. I'd probably sacrifice.
• 1:06:37
  Speaker 2: I'd be like, bet. Let's do this.
• 1:06:39
  Speaker 1: The man could be living and breathing right next to me.
• 1:06:42
  Speaker 2: Yeah, like, do you also maybe want to try and
• 1:06:43
  Speaker 2: have kids? Because I think we'd have beautiful children.
• 1:06:45
  Speaker 1: Beautiful babies. Now, how many aunts would you sacrifice to
• 1:06:51
  Speaker 1: get sleep-based? None. I would sacrifice no women to get sleep-based.
• 1:06:56
  Speaker 2: Well, if.
• 1:06:58
  Speaker 2: If my aunt was like a Caroline Lovett situation, maybe.
• 1:07:01
  Speaker 2: I would absolutely.
• 1:07:02
  Speaker 1: I would sacrifice no women to kiss Lee Pace. That
• 1:07:05
  Speaker 1: is my point. Feminism reigns.
• 1:07:07
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Even the women who voted against our rights, I'd
• 1:07:10
  Speaker 2: probably still be like, no, we're not going to do that, actually.
• 1:07:13
  Speaker 1: Or one kissy kiss smooch. But any man I know.
• 1:07:17
  Speaker 1: No man is safe.
• 1:07:18
  Speaker 2: No man is safe.
• 1:07:20
  Speaker 1: All right, Julia. At the end of the day. Dissecting it,
• 1:07:25
  Speaker 1: seeing it, crying about it. What do you think our
• 1:07:30
  Speaker 1: takeaway from Practical Magic 2 is? What's our lasting lesson?
• 1:07:36
  Speaker 2: I honestly don't know if there is one.
• 1:07:44
  Speaker 1: Out of our whole discussion, you can't synthesize it down
• 1:07:47
  Speaker 1: to one point?
• 1:07:49
  Speaker 2: It should have been better. Yeah. Don't sacrifice the aunts
• 1:07:55
  Speaker 2: for love. Like, there's so many things, I think, in
• 1:07:58
  Speaker 2: the version that we created today.
• 1:08:01
  Speaker 1: So maybe the lesson is people should be hiring us
• 1:08:03
  Speaker 1: to write movies.
• 1:08:05
  Speaker 2: Yes. Or script doctoring. Because the thing of it is,
• 1:08:09
  Speaker 2: you know, the character development of Sally and Jilly in
• 1:08:16
  Speaker 2: the first one is so strong. Clear visual images. You
• 1:08:20
  Speaker 2: put me... And I did. I did this for Halloween
• 1:08:22
  Speaker 2: one year. You put me in a white shirt and
• 1:08:25
  Speaker 2: a pair of shorts and my hair naturally wavy. And
• 1:08:30
  Speaker 2: I say I'm going, you know, no one's going to question.
• 1:08:34
  Speaker 2: Are you Sally Owens? Yes. You put me in scrubs
• 1:08:39
  Speaker 2: with my hair up and some makeup on. People aren't
• 1:08:42
  Speaker 2: going to get it. They're not going to know I'm Antonia.
• 1:08:44
  Speaker 1: When did you start watching Grey's Anatomy?
• 1:08:48
  Speaker 2: Exactly.
• 1:08:48
  Speaker 1: Exactly.
• 1:08:48
  Speaker 2: Exactly. And that was a point that was made the
• 1:08:51
  Speaker 2: other night in the Behind the Binks character development class,
• 1:08:55
  Speaker 2: because it was like, there is nothing. about these two
• 1:09:01
  Speaker 2: younger characters that make you immediately, if you were to
• 1:09:04
  Speaker 2: dress like them for Halloween, make you immediately go, oh yeah,
• 1:09:07
  Speaker 2: that's that character. So it's hard with this movie because
• 1:09:12
  Speaker 2: I literally walked out and I was like, well, I
• 1:09:13
  Speaker 2: had a good time. Couldn't tell you shit. I.
• 1:09:17
  Speaker 1: think that I'll live the rest of my life on
• 1:09:20
  Speaker 1: that line of, oh, you think power is for suffering,
• 1:09:24
  Speaker 1: the suffering of others.
• 1:09:25
  Speaker 2: Oh, that's a good one. Yeah.
• 1:09:27
  Speaker 1: And for that being like, oh, they might not have
• 1:09:31
  Speaker 1: written an entire movie of great lines, because at one
• 1:09:35
  Speaker 1: point Lee Pace does, Natalie.
• 1:09:39
  Speaker 2: My molecules want to be next to your molecules.
• 1:09:42
  Speaker 1: I literally said out loud, weirdo. I was like, why
• 1:09:44
  Speaker 1: are you... I go, why are you making me have
• 1:09:47
  Speaker 1: the ick for Lee Pace?
• 1:09:49
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:09:49
  Speaker 1: No one wants to have the ick for Lee Pace.
• 1:09:52
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:09:55
  Speaker 1: God.
• 1:09:55
  Speaker 2: The dialogue fail.
• 1:09:58
  Speaker 1: Even like Jilly's whining about Sally. Can we just remember
• 1:10:03
  Speaker 1: that you're a witch, Sally? It wasn't ever like impactful.
• 1:10:08
  Speaker 1: Because if we had had a couple of one-liners that
• 1:10:10
  Speaker 1: really did just like punch Sally in the gut.
• 1:10:13
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:10:13
  Speaker 1: And she still fought against it. OK.
• 1:10:16
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:10:18
  Speaker 1: But just this like little natty nitpicking. Yeah.
• 1:10:22
  Speaker 2: And I don't like that.
• 1:10:23
  Speaker 1: I don't like that. So I will ride on the
• 1:10:28
  Speaker 1: the clear, distinct line between patriarchy and matriarchy is how
• 1:10:32
  Speaker 1: you define power and what's it what you use it for.
• 1:10:35
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that's good. I support that. I agree.
• 1:10:39
  Speaker 2: I'm piggybacking on that.
• 1:10:43
  Speaker 1: You know I've always got one in case the guest doesn't.
• 1:10:46
  Speaker 2: It's reverse colonization because I'm a person of color.
• 1:10:50
  Speaker 1: If you had to manifest something inspired by Practical Magic
• 1:10:55
  Speaker 1: 2 or our conversation today for the general collective, the
• 1:11:01
  Speaker 1: energy source that rules us all, our matriarchs, our magical lines,
• 1:11:06
  Speaker 1: what would you manifest?
• 1:11:09
  Speaker 2: I would manifest a community of women who isn't competitive
• 1:11:15
  Speaker 2: and is loving and supporting of each other like we
• 1:11:18
  Speaker 2: saw at the end of Practical Magic the first because
• 1:11:23
  Speaker 2: again that wasn't clear in the second one.
• 1:11:27
  Speaker 1: It is really too easy in 2026 to still keep
• 1:11:34
  Speaker 1: women fractured yeah away from one another yep even within
• 1:11:38
  Speaker 1: our own matriarchal lines yep Do I find it way
• 1:11:43
  Speaker 1: too easy for women to throw away my thoughts and
• 1:11:47
  Speaker 1: my feelings about something to like toe the easy narrative?
• 1:11:52
  Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah.
• 1:11:54
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:11:54
  Speaker 2: I mean, you know, there's a lot of things.
• 1:11:57
  Speaker 1: Yeah. I just find it too. Well, and as you know,
• 1:12:02
  Speaker 1: this is a white woman problem. Like, God forbid we
• 1:12:05
  Speaker 1: wake up uncomfortable about something that's going on.
• 1:12:09
  Speaker 2: Right. Right. Yeah, no one cares unless it's actually impacting you.
• 1:12:13
  Speaker 2: That's why Miss Rachel is a fucking badass because she
• 1:12:16
  Speaker 2: has no problem saying you should be you should actually
• 1:12:23
  Speaker 2: be caring about this.
• 1:12:24
  Speaker 1: Hey guys, what if we cared? Hey guys.
• 1:12:30
  Speaker 2: What if we gave a shit? Or like, you know,
• 1:12:32
  Speaker 2: my current frustration is people who come into the store
• 1:12:35
  Speaker 2: and are upset that we don't carry Harry Potter when
• 1:12:38
  Speaker 2: that person has clearly stated that any money she makes
• 1:12:42
  Speaker 2: off of harry potter is going to fund her whatever
• 1:12:46
  Speaker 2: weird advocacy that she's doing that's very clearly anti-trans it's
• 1:12:52
  Speaker 2: like you think it's not impacting you but the problem
• 1:12:57
  Speaker 2: is is that any anti-trans legislation will eventually impact all
• 1:13:02
  Speaker 2: women trans or cis it doesn't actually matter.
• 1:13:08
  Speaker 1: And technically, this is giving everyone the easy way out.
• 1:13:12
  Speaker 1: But if I could I Dream of Jeannie one thing,
• 1:13:16
  Speaker 1: if I could click my hand on my other arm
• 1:13:19
  Speaker 1: and my head down, I would blink out of existence
• 1:13:23
  Speaker 1: every IP connected to Harry Potter. I'd be like, and
• 1:13:27
  Speaker 1: it never existed.
• 1:13:28
  Speaker 2: It never existed. She fully has created this new show
• 1:13:31
  Speaker 2: because she's mad at the original cast for thinking she's
• 1:13:35
  Speaker 2: a bad, bad person.
• 1:13:36
  Speaker 1: And it's like, babe, you are. If I never had
• 1:13:40
  Speaker 1: to look at her, say her name again, be disappointed.
• 1:13:44
  Speaker 1: I went to the movie theater yesterday and I guess
• 1:13:46
  Speaker 1: it's one of the movie's fucking anniversaries. I don't know.
• 1:13:49
  Speaker 1: But why was the Hogwarts Express the popcorn bucket? I
• 1:13:54
  Speaker 1: was like, and you should have seen my face. I
• 1:13:57
  Speaker 1: was like, ew. I just kept saying ew as I
• 1:14:00
  Speaker 1: walked by merch.
• 1:14:02
  Speaker 2: You're like, I don't want to be seen with that. Thanks.
• 1:14:04
  Speaker 1: Yeah. I was like, this is bad for my brand.
• 1:14:06
  Speaker 2: I don't understand why people don't understand like if it's
• 1:14:08
  Speaker 2: how you know, it's like first they came for the
• 1:14:11
  Speaker 2: insert marginalized group here. Yeah, I did nothing. Then they
• 1:14:14
  Speaker 2: came for the insert marginalized group here and I did nothing.
• 1:14:18
  Speaker 2: And then they came for me. And it's like, yeah,
• 1:14:19
  Speaker 2: that's real.
• 1:14:21
  Speaker 1: Ellen Moore and I talk about it on her episode.
• 1:14:24
  Speaker 1: That was our first episode back from the break about
• 1:14:27
  Speaker 1: how like, hey, do you know how in a blink
• 1:14:29
  Speaker 1: of an eye you can go from being an able
• 1:14:31
  Speaker 1: bodied person to a disabled person?
• 1:14:34
  Speaker 2: So fast.
• 1:14:35
  Speaker 1: So fast. So you think you'd care about disabled people's rights, right?
• 1:14:39
  Speaker 1: Because any one of us could be disabled. It's not
• 1:14:42
  Speaker 1: like it's a shot of lightning in the dark.
• 1:14:45
  Speaker 2: Yep, exactly. And, you know, COVID really proved that a
• 1:14:49
  Speaker 2: lot of the regulations or the expectations in a work
• 1:14:52
  Speaker 2: environment are bullshit and just ways to keep people who
• 1:14:56
  Speaker 2: are disabled out of the market.
• 1:14:59
  Speaker 1: Out of the market.
• 1:15:00
  Speaker 2: Because now that everyone's working from home, you don't have
• 1:15:03
  Speaker 2: to ask if you can lift 25 pounds. Because I
• 1:15:06
  Speaker 2: work from home now.
• 1:15:09
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:15:09
  Speaker 2: It's bullshit. I tell people all the time, and I
• 1:15:12
  Speaker 2: say this on my Instagram whenever the opportunity presents itself.
• 1:15:16
  Speaker 2: If you are not safe for trans people, you are
• 1:15:19
  Speaker 2: not safe for black people. And if you can't see
• 1:15:21
  Speaker 2: the correlation between how trans people are being discriminated against
• 1:15:25
  Speaker 2: is very similar to how black people are discriminated against, then...
• 1:15:30
  Speaker 2: I don't, you're not safe. Sorry. Bye.
• 1:15:32
  Speaker 1: Specifically black women, the language that people use to discriminate
• 1:15:36
  Speaker 1: against trans people is always an echo of language. I've
• 1:15:43
  Speaker 1: heard about female black athletes. Yep.
• 1:15:47
  Speaker 2: Like the T and the LGBTQ is, you know, a
• 1:15:52
  Speaker 2: little bit more of a soft spot for me because
• 1:15:54
  Speaker 2: I am a light skinned black woman and, I am
• 1:16:01
  Speaker 2: not unscathed by racist language just because I could, you know,
• 1:16:11
  Speaker 2: pass if I wanted to. And so when I hear it,
• 1:16:15
  Speaker 2: I'm like, oh, you actually, I have relatives that have
• 1:16:21
  Speaker 2: heard that language, that exact language their whole lives. And
• 1:16:25
  Speaker 2: I've heard it myself sometimes depending on the level of racism. Yeah.
• 1:16:30
  Speaker 2: I mean, it's not funny, but it's just really sad
• 1:16:32
  Speaker 2: how people don't understand how we're all connected and that
• 1:16:37
  Speaker 2: if we just sort of like, I'm not saying apathy
• 1:16:40
  Speaker 2: is good, but if we had a little more, I
• 1:16:45
  Speaker 2: don't really actually give a shit if that's what you're doing,
• 1:16:49
  Speaker 2: but I'm going to vote in a way that's good
• 1:16:51
  Speaker 2: for everybody.
• 1:16:51
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah. Because we're all paying the same price for eggs.
• 1:16:58
  Speaker 1: I don't know if you noticed.
• 1:16:59
  Speaker 2: Yeah, that's the thing that kills me. It's like you
• 1:17:03
  Speaker 2: are voting against everyone's best interests and now our lives
• 1:17:06
  Speaker 2: are harder. And now you're mad because we run out
• 1:17:08
  Speaker 2: of diesel. And you're like, look at that.
• 1:17:12
  Speaker 1: They're not going to check your voter registration card to
• 1:17:16
  Speaker 1: decide whether or not you get horse meat, mad cow
• 1:17:19
  Speaker 1: disease meat or meat that went through some sort of
• 1:17:22
  Speaker 1: safety protocol. Yeah. They will just all give you poison meat.
• 1:17:26
  Speaker 2: Right. which is why you should shop at your local
• 1:17:29
  Speaker 2: farmer's market.
• 1:17:30
  Speaker 1: Correct.
• 1:17:31
  Speaker 2: That's likely to have the problems because of big ag.
• 1:17:37
  Speaker 1: Julia, thank you so much.
• 1:17:40
  Speaker 2: I'm so sorry. We had, I pushed us on that tangent.
• 1:17:44
  Speaker 2: I'm not actually, cause you know, trans rights means that
• 1:17:48
  Speaker 2: we all get to live safe.
• 1:17:50
  Speaker 1: Well, isn't that a concept? Um, uh, what do you
• 1:17:55
  Speaker 1: have to plug?
• 1:17:56
  Speaker 2: Okay. Everybody, if you, Are curious about my conversation with
• 1:18:00
  Speaker 2: Natalie about how why I think Alice Hoffman hates women.
• 1:18:03
  Speaker 2: It's because we read Practical Magic in book club last year.
• 1:18:06
  Speaker 2: And you're thinking, Julia, you run a book club? Yes,
• 1:18:09
  Speaker 2: I run what we call the book club candle. So
• 1:18:13
  Speaker 2: every month I send you at the beginning of a
• 1:18:15
  Speaker 2: month a candle that is inspired by a book. And
• 1:18:18
  Speaker 2: if you want to read the book, you may. You
• 1:18:21
  Speaker 2: light the candle while you read the book. And then
• 1:18:23
  Speaker 2: at the end of the month, we meet and gather
• 1:18:25
  Speaker 2: to discuss said book. It's usually a book-to-screen adaptation, so
• 1:18:30
  Speaker 2: you can read the book, watch the screen adaptation, or
• 1:18:34
  Speaker 2: just show up for the vibes. And it's a lot
• 1:18:36
  Speaker 2: of fun. Natalie's a member, even though we haven't seen
• 1:18:38
  Speaker 2: her in a while, which is totally fine. No shade.
• 1:18:43
  Speaker 2: Not trying to call you out on your own show.
• 1:18:47
  Speaker 2: But it's a lot of fun. Every candle is handcrafted
• 1:18:49
  Speaker 2: by me. The scent is something that sort of captures
• 1:18:53
  Speaker 2: the essence of the book. So I'm helping you create
• 1:18:57
  Speaker 2: a very curated, multi-sensory reading experience.
• 1:19:03
  Speaker 1: I skipped the last book club because I was fully
• 1:19:05
  Speaker 1: reading and I forgot to set an alarm to alert me.
• 1:19:10
  Speaker 2: To stop reading. All right. I will stop calling you
• 1:19:13
  Speaker 2: in a show. You can find the book club candle
• 1:19:19
  Speaker 2: on Instagram at the book club candle. You can find
• 1:19:22
  Speaker 2: me on Instagram at the Julia Washington. Same handle on TikTok.
• 1:19:26
  Speaker 2: And yeah, I'd love to see you in the I
• 1:19:29
  Speaker 2: would love to see you in the club.
• 1:19:31
  Speaker 1: And there's also a tier where you can get the
• 1:19:34
  Speaker 1: book and the candle, right? Yes.
• 1:19:36
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 1:19:37
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 1:19:37
  Speaker 2: There's a tier.
• 1:19:38
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:19:39
  Speaker 2: It makes it.
• 1:19:40
  Speaker 1: So easy for you to just have it already.
• 1:19:42
  Speaker 2: Yeah, because, you know, I also suffer from, oh, I
• 1:19:45
  Speaker 2: bought this thing. I'll buy the pairing thing later. And
• 1:19:47
  Speaker 2: the next thing I know, it's the day before and
• 1:19:49
  Speaker 2: I need it. And I'm like, shit. So, yeah, yeah.
• 1:19:53
  Speaker 1: And tolerators, you know the deal with us. It's Men
• 1:19:55
  Speaker 1: I've Tolerated Pod on Instagram, NatalieK124 on Instagram and TikTok.
• 1:20:01
  Speaker 1: To all the men I've tolerated before, it can be
• 1:20:02
  Speaker 1: found on YouTube and Patreon, where you can pay for
• 1:20:08
  Speaker 1: ad-free products. episodes and bonus episodes, or you can hang
• 1:20:12
  Speaker 1: out for free and read our humor pieces, our think pieces.
• 1:20:18
  Speaker 1: And if you're trying to escape, uh, social media, I'm
• 1:20:23
  Speaker 1: repurposing all of my social media onto Patreon because they've
• 1:20:26
  Speaker 1: created a feed. And remember tolerators, you don't have to
• 1:20:31
  Speaker 1: smile through anything you're tolerating, including a movie. that clicked
• 1:20:37
  Speaker 1: all of your nostalgia buttons and filled your body with
• 1:20:40
  Speaker 1: the good chemicals, but then you came home and you
• 1:20:42
  Speaker 1: rewrote it in your head. Smiles are for joy.