Latest / Bye Bye Panic / Why You Keep Spiraling Even When You “Know Better”

Transcript

Why You Keep Spiraling Even When You “Know Better” · Bye Bye Panic

• 0:00
  [SPEAKER_00]: Hi there, Listener.
• 0:01
  [SPEAKER_00]: Before we dive in, I want you to know that this podcast is AI-generated.
• 0:06
  [SPEAKER_00]: It's crafted from the topics and principles shared in the BiBi panic anxiety recovery program, and while AI helps bring this content to life, the recovery tools and insights remain rooted in the principles that have helped so many people overcome their symptoms for good.
• 0:23
  [SPEAKER_00]: Enjoy the episode.
• 0:27
  [SPEAKER_03]: Today, we're really getting into something, I think, well, a lot of us know firsthand.
• 0:31
  [SPEAKER_03]: That feeling when you're trying to recover from anxiety.
• 0:34
  [SPEAKER_03]: It's often this, this real roller coaster, isn't it?
• 0:37
  [SPEAKER_03]: You have good days, then bam, a bad day hits, and suddenly it feels like you're sliding all the way back down.
• 0:42
  [SPEAKER_03]: Maybe you're dealing with those, you know, baffling physical symptoms or sudden panic, or thoughts you just can't shake, or that weird feeling of being disconnected, like, de-personalization, where you feel unreal, or de-realization, where the world feels off.
• 0:57
  [SPEAKER_03]: It can make you feel so lost.
• 0:58
  [SPEAKER_02]: Oh absolutely, that sense of being lost.
• 1:01
  [SPEAKER_02]: Feeling like maybe you're the only one, even if you've seen doctors, it's incredibly common.
• 1:06
  [SPEAKER_02]: So our goal here, our mission for this deep dive, is really to help you see how you can avoid that downward spiral, how you can stay on track, and really understand the little nuances of managing anxiety day to day.
• 1:19
  [SPEAKER_02]: Because even though it feels overwhelming, there are clear principles, practical tools,
• 1:23
  [SPEAKER_02]: things that actually work to reverse that cycle.
• 1:25
  [SPEAKER_02]: We want to focus on those practical tips today, and importantly, the mindset that helps really aiming for hope and a path that feels, you know, understandable.
• 1:34
  [SPEAKER_03]: Okay, let's talk about that immediate reaction, anxiety spikes, or you have a setback, and there's this powerful urge, almost automatic, right, to jump into fix it mode.
• 1:44
  [SPEAKER_03]: You feel like you have to do something about it now.
• 1:46
  [SPEAKER_03]: but if the goal is long-term recovery, finding that calm.
• 1:50
  [SPEAKER_03]: Why is that reaction often?
• 1:51
  [SPEAKER_03]: Well, maybe not the best one, even when we know better.
• 1:53
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it feels like we should fix it, doesn't it?
• 1:55
  [SPEAKER_02]: But you've hit on such a crucial point there that fix it mode while totally natural can be a real trap.
• 2:01
  [SPEAKER_02]: It often works against us.
• 2:03
  [SPEAKER_02]: We sometimes break it down into the five F's.
• 2:06
  [SPEAKER_02]: You start fearing the symptoms.
• 2:07
  [SPEAKER_01]: Right.
• 2:07
  [SPEAKER_02]: Then you start fighting them, trying to push them away.
• 2:10
  [SPEAKER_02]: Then comes fixing that intense need to make them stop immediately.
• 2:13
  [SPEAKER_02]: And then you're focusing totally on them, magnifying them.
• 2:16
  [SPEAKER_02]: And finally, you end up just frustrated.
• 2:19
  [SPEAKER_03]: Oh, I recognize that cycle.
• 2:20
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 2:21
  [SPEAKER_03]: Fear, fight, fix, focus, frustrate.
• 2:23
  [SPEAKER_02]: Exactly.
• 2:24
  [SPEAKER_02]: And that whole sequence while understandable, it actually fuels the anxiety spiral.
• 2:29
  [SPEAKER_02]: It keeps it going.
• 2:31
  [SPEAKER_02]: So the very first step, the foundation, really, is just recognizing that automatic reaction when it happens.
• 2:36
  [SPEAKER_02]: Seeing it for what it is, that's how you start to change it.
• 2:39
  [SPEAKER_03]: That makes sense recognizing it is key.
• 2:41
  [SPEAKER_03]: But then there's that nagging question, especially during the ups and downs, am I really getting better?
• 2:45
  [SPEAKER_03]: How do people usually measure progress?
• 2:48
  [SPEAKER_03]: And what are the pitfalls there?
• 2:50
  [SPEAKER_03]: Like is it just about having fewer symptoms?
• 2:53
  [SPEAKER_02]: That's such a common way to think about it, isn't it?
• 2:55
  [SPEAKER_02]: If my symptoms are gone, I'm better.
• 2:58
  [SPEAKER_02]: But it can be misleading.
• 2:59
  [SPEAKER_02]: Recovery isn't usually this straight upward line.
• 3:02
  [SPEAKER_02]: It has bumps, dips, plateau is even.
• 3:05
  [SPEAKER_02]: Right.
• 3:06
  [SPEAKER_02]: So the crucial insight the thing to really hold on to is that true progress isn't just the absence of symptoms.
• 3:12
  [SPEAKER_02]: It's more about how you respond when the symptoms are there.
• 3:15
  [SPEAKER_02]: That's the real metric.
• 3:16
  [SPEAKER_03]: Okay, so how you respond when they're present.
• 3:18
  [SPEAKER_02]: Exactly.
• 3:19
  [SPEAKER_02]: And here's something else.
• 3:20
  [SPEAKER_02]: The amount of effort it takes to respond well.
• 3:23
  [SPEAKER_02]: That's going to change.
• 3:24
  [SPEAKER_02]: It just will.
• 3:25
  [SPEAKER_02]: Some days when symptoms are high, responding calmly is going to feel incredibly hard, much harder than on good days.
• 3:32
  [SPEAKER_02]: And that difficulty, that's not a sign you're failing.
• 3:35
  [SPEAKER_02]: It's normal.
• 3:36
  [SPEAKER_02]: It's just part of the process.
• 3:37
  [SPEAKER_03]: So harder effort doesn't mean backwards steps.
• 3:40
  [SPEAKER_02]: Not at all.
• 3:40
  [SPEAKER_02]: If you zoom out, look at the bigger picture of the macro view.
• 3:42
  [SPEAKER_02]: The overall trend is still usually upward.
• 3:45
  [SPEAKER_02]: Those tougher days are just temporary spikes within that larger upward journey.
• 3:49
  [SPEAKER_02]: They don't negate the progress you've already made.
• 3:51
  [SPEAKER_03]: Okay, that reframes things quite a bit.
• 3:53
  [SPEAKER_03]: So if these tough moments, these high anxiety days aren't failures, how can we use them?
• 4:00
  [SPEAKER_03]: Could they actually be opportunities a chance to get stronger instead of feeling derailed?
• 4:06
  [SPEAKER_02]: Precisely.
• 4:07
  [SPEAKER_02]: And that leads us right into a really key tip for navigating those moments.
• 4:12
  [SPEAKER_02]: When symptoms are high and responding feels really difficult, that's not assigned to throw in the towel.
• 4:17
  [SPEAKER_02]: It's actually a signal that you need more practice with your response.
• 4:20
  [SPEAKER_03]: Oh, we're practice, okay.
• 4:21
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 4:21
  [SPEAKER_02]: Think of recovery, less like reaching a destination, like symptom-free island and more like developing a skill set.
• 4:28
  [SPEAKER_02]: It's like building muscle memory.
• 4:30
  [SPEAKER_02]: The more you practice responding differently, the more ingrained that new response becomes.
• 4:35
  [SPEAKER_02]: So those intense moments, they are, believe or not, the best opportunities you get to practice and really refine that skill.
• 4:41
  [SPEAKER_02]: They might also show you where maybe there's a gap in understanding, you know, the mechanics of anxiety or the steps you need to take.
• 4:46
  [SPEAKER_03]: like identifying where the weak spots are in your technique.
• 4:49
  [SPEAKER_02]: Exactly.
• 4:50
  [SPEAKER_02]: It's valuable feedback.
• 4:51
  [SPEAKER_03]: But then there's this other thing, right?
• 4:52
  [SPEAKER_03]: Have it.
• 4:53
  [SPEAKER_03]: It feels so powerful.
• 4:55
  [SPEAKER_03]: Sometimes you know logically what you should do.
• 4:57
  [SPEAKER_03]: You've learned the techniques.
• 4:58
  [SPEAKER_03]: But then in the moment your body or your mind just reacts that old panicky way, it feels like you're not in control.
• 5:05
  [SPEAKER_03]: What's happening?
• 5:05
  [SPEAKER_02]: Or that disconnect is so real and
• 5:07
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, incredibly frustrating.
• 5:08
  [SPEAKER_02]: It really underscores the power of habit.
• 5:10
  [SPEAKER_02]: You see years of reacting with panic or fear create these deep neural pathways.
• 5:15
  [SPEAKER_02]: It becomes automatic.
• 5:16
  [SPEAKER_02]: So breaking that habit of spiraling and choosing instead to respond calmly.
• 5:21
  [SPEAKER_02]: It isn't like flipping an automatic switch.
• 5:22
  [SPEAKER_02]: It doesn't happen overnight.
• 5:24
  [SPEAKER_03]: Right.
• 5:24
  [SPEAKER_03]: It's not instant.
• 5:25
  [SPEAKER_02]: No.
• 5:25
  [SPEAKER_02]: Think of it more like
• 5:27
  [SPEAKER_02]: like chipping away at a block of stone.
• 5:30
  [SPEAKER_02]: You're gradually reshaping something in grain.
• 5:32
  [SPEAKER_02]: It's not about bulldozing the old habit in one go.
• 5:35
  [SPEAKER_02]: It takes real patience and a lot of self-awareness to catch yourself.
• 5:39
  [SPEAKER_02]: And this is crucial.
• 5:40
  [SPEAKER_02]: You have to give yourself grace.
• 5:42
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 5:42
  [SPEAKER_02]: When that old habit pops up and it will, don't beat yourself up over it.
• 5:46
  [SPEAKER_02]: That just adds another layer of stress, recognize it, acknowledge it.
• 5:50
  [SPEAKER_02]: Ah, there's that old pattern and see it as part of the unlearning process.
• 5:54
  [SPEAKER_02]: It's okay.
• 5:55
  [SPEAKER_02]: It takes time.
• 5:56
  [SPEAKER_03]: That's a much kind of approach than frustration, chipping away, giving grace.
• 6:01
  [SPEAKER_03]: Okay, let's shift gears slightly.
• 6:03
  [SPEAKER_03]: Let's talk about chaos.
• 6:05
  [SPEAKER_03]: That feeling.
• 6:07
  [SPEAKER_03]: Often comes up during healing, doesn't it?
• 6:08
  [SPEAKER_03]: When things feel turbulent, unpredictable, our gut reaction is often, this is bad, this is the end, everything's falling apart.
• 6:16
  [SPEAKER_03]: But is there another way to view that chaos?
• 6:18
  [SPEAKER_03]: Could it actually be something useful?
• 6:20
  [SPEAKER_02]: Absolutely, it's a huge perspective shift, but yes.
• 6:23
  [SPEAKER_02]: Chaos often feels like the end, but it's very rarely the end.
• 6:26
  [SPEAKER_02]: More often, it's a necessary transition, and it's within those messy, chaotic transitions that the most profound growth can actually happen.
• 6:33
  [SPEAKER_03]: It's transition not an end.
• 6:34
  [SPEAKER_02]: Exactly.
• 6:35
  [SPEAKER_02]: Think about nature.
• 6:36
  [SPEAKER_02]: Like, uh, forest fires.
• 6:38
  [SPEAKER_02]: We instinctively think.
• 6:40
  [SPEAKER_02]: destruction.
• 6:41
  [SPEAKER_02]: But historically, some indigenous cultures use controlled burns.
• 6:44
  [SPEAKER_02]: Why?
• 6:45
  [SPEAKER_02]: To clear out the old underbrush, make space and actually facilitate new, healthy growth.
• 6:50
  [SPEAKER_02]: Some trees, like certain pines, actually need the heat of a fire for their seeds to even open and sprout.
• 6:56
  [SPEAKER_03]: I didn't know that.
• 6:57
  [SPEAKER_03]: They need the fire.
• 6:58
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 6:58
  [SPEAKER_02]: So the chaos of the fire is essential for renewal.
• 7:02
  [SPEAKER_02]: If we constantly resist the smaller natural fires or changes in our lives, try to suppress everything, we might end up creating conditions for much larger, more destructive flash fire down the line because nothing got cleared out.
• 7:14
  [SPEAKER_02]: So embracing chaos seeing it as a transition allows for evolution, for growth.
• 7:19
  [SPEAKER_03]: That's a really powerful analogy.
• 7:20
  [SPEAKER_03]: I can kind of see that in my own life.
• 7:21
  [SPEAKER_03]: Like during the start of COVID, everything felt utterly chaotic for total of people, resisting it just led to more stress.
• 7:28
  [SPEAKER_03]: It was only when I started to like accept, okay, this is the reality now.
• 7:32
  [SPEAKER_03]: But I could adapt, find new routines, even new opportunities.
• 7:35
  [SPEAKER_03]: And even more personally, like you mentioned, losing my dog Leila, that was my absolute biggest fear, the ultimate chaos I dreaded.
• 7:43
  [SPEAKER_03]: And when it happened, the grief was immense.
• 7:46
  [SPEAKER_03]: but being forced into that transition, having to navigate that chaos.
• 7:51
  [SPEAKER_03]: It wasn't about liking it.
• 7:52
  [SPEAKER_03]: It was about accepting it.
• 7:54
  [SPEAKER_02]: That acceptance is so key.
• 7:56
  [SPEAKER_02]: And notice you said it was the first step.
• 7:58
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 7:58
  [SPEAKER_02]: Acceptance isn't the whole solution, right?
• 8:00
  [SPEAKER_02]: It's not like you just accepted it and everything is magically fixed.
• 8:03
  [SPEAKER_02]: It's about that initial step of realizing, okay, fighting this isn't working, resisting this feeling or situation isn't helping.
• 8:11
  [SPEAKER_02]: It's allowing that wave of emotion or the difficult circumstance to just flow through you without getting caught in the struggle again.
• 8:18
  [SPEAKER_03]: You're getting it passed through.
• 8:19
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yes.
• 8:19
  [SPEAKER_02]: And what happens then?
• 8:21
  [SPEAKER_02]: That acceptance creates mental space.
• 8:22
  [SPEAKER_02]: It creates clarity.
• 8:24
  [SPEAKER_02]: Once you're not actively fighting reality, you free up energy to think, OK, so what's next?
• 8:28
  [SPEAKER_02]: What can I do now?
• 8:29
  [SPEAKER_02]: It allows for purposeful action moving forward instead of just being spuck spinning your wheels in resistance.
• 8:35
  [SPEAKER_03]: That makes so much sense.
• 8:37
  [SPEAKER_03]: Acceptance creates this space to figure out the next step.
• 8:40
  [SPEAKER_03]: Reminds me too of how I ended up moving to Austin.
• 8:44
  [SPEAKER_03]: It was directly because of a really rough patch with anxiety, leaving Montreal, my whole life there felt like this huge chaotic failure at the time, a massive setback.
• 8:53
  [SPEAKER_03]: But I had to kind of lean into it, accept the change was happening.
• 8:57
  [SPEAKER_03]: And eventually, I built a really thriving life here, something I never would have planned.
• 9:01
  [SPEAKER_02]: What a perfect example.
• 9:03
  [SPEAKER_02]: It felt like chaos, like an ending.
• 9:05
  [SPEAKER_02]: But it was actually a transition that led to something positive, something unexpected.
• 9:09
  [SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, exactly.
• 9:10
  [SPEAKER_03]: Life just keeps throwing these curve balls, these moments of seeming chaos.
• 9:13
  [SPEAKER_03]: But looking back, they're rarely the absolute end we fear they are.
• 9:17
  [SPEAKER_03]: They're transitions.
• 9:19
  [SPEAKER_03]: And often, the biggest growth spurts happen right there in that uncomfortable unknown.
• 9:24
  [SPEAKER_02]: That's it, exactly.
• 9:25
  [SPEAKER_02]: And all these things we've talked about, understanding that your effort will fluctuate, the patients needed for breaking habits and bracing chaos as transition, they all take time.
• 9:33
  [SPEAKER_02]: Be patient with yourself, but just being aware of these dynamics, understanding these forces are a play.
• 9:38
  [SPEAKER_02]: That awareness is what helps you stay consistent, keeps you moving forward even when it's tough.
• 9:43
  [SPEAKER_02]: So maybe a thought to leave you with is this.
• 9:46
  [SPEAKER_02]: what hitting growth, what potential might be waiting for you just on the other side of your current resistance.
• 9:52
  [SPEAKER_02]: Your resistance to that feeling of chaos or difficulty.
• 9:56
  [SPEAKER_03]: What's waiting beyond the resistance?
• 9:57
  [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.
• 9:58
  [SPEAKER_02]: And honestly, the fastest way to navigate all this to uncover those blind spots we all have is often through guidance.
• 10:03
  [SPEAKER_02]: We really encourage you.
• 10:05
  [SPEAKER_02]: Find someone you trust, someone who gets what you're going through, someone you're willing to be open with, willing to follow their guidance and take that next crucial step.
• 10:14
  [SPEAKER_02]: Support makes a huge difference.
• 10:16
  [SPEAKER_01]: That's such an important point.
• 10:18
  [SPEAKER_01]: Guidance can really accelerate things.
• 10:21
  [SPEAKER_01]: Wow, this has been a really insightful deep dive today.
• 10:23
  [SPEAKER_01]: It feels empowering.
• 10:24
  [SPEAKER_01]: Just remembering that facing anxiety and navigating these ups and downs, it's not weakness.
• 10:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: Not at all.
• 10:30
  [SPEAKER_01]: It's actually this incredible opportunity to build serious resilience.
• 10:34
  [SPEAKER_01]: To develop a really powerful skillset for life.
• 10:36
  [SPEAKER_01]: Those setbacks, they're not failures.
• 10:38
  [SPEAKER_01]: They're your training ground.
• 10:39
  [SPEAKER_01]: You're literally training for mastery with every challenge.
• 10:42
  [SPEAKER_02]: beautifully put and that's where the hope really solidifies doesn't it.
• 10:45
  [SPEAKER_02]: Having the courage to lean into that discomfort just a little bit, the courage to practice new responses even when it feels awkward or hard and the courage to ask for help to seek guidance that's what truly unlocks your capacity for growth it's huge that unknown space you might be fearing.
• 11:01
  [SPEAKER_02]: It could genuinely hold the very best things for you.
• 11:04
  [SPEAKER_02]: So maybe just reflect on one small thing, one actionable step you could take today.
• 11:07
  [SPEAKER_02]: Maybe it's just
• 11:08
  [SPEAKER_02]: noticing your reaction without judgment, maybe it's reaching out.
• 11:11
  [SPEAKER_02]: Just one small step to embrace a tricky moment, or to seek out the support you might need, you really are stronger than you think.
• 11:17
  [SPEAKER_02]: Your next step is right there.