Latest / Overwhelmed Working Woman: Boost Productivity, Master Time Management, Overcome Overwhelm & Stop People Pleasing / #162| Why Anxiety Is the Root of Low Confidence and Overwhelm—and How to Fix It

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#162| Why Anxiety Is the Root of Low Confidence and Overwhelm—and How to Fix It · Overwhelmed Working Woman: Boost Productivity, Master Time Management, Overcome Overwhelm & Stop People Pleasing

• 0:00
  Joanne Williams: What are you going to do about it?
• 0:01
  Joanne Williams: It's your responsibility now to go learn the skills.
• 0:04
  Joanne Williams: Woman and current life coach.
• 0:06
  Michelle Gauthier: On this show we unpack the stress and pressure that today's working woman experiences, and in each episode you'll get a strategy to bring more calm, ease and relaxation to your life.
• 0:33
  Michelle Gauthier: Hi friend, thanks for joining today.
• 0:38
  Michelle Gauthier: If you've ever struggled with self doubt, anxiety or just feeling like you don't have the confidence you need to go after what you want.
• 0:44
  Michelle Gauthier: Today's episode is for you.
• 0:46
  Michelle Gauthier: And also I don't have the confidence.
• 0:47
  Michelle Gauthier: You need to go after what you want.
• 0:48
  Michelle Gauthier: Today's episode is for you.
• 0:50
  Michelle Gauthier: And also I don't know anyone who hasn't occasionally struggled with self-doubt, anxiety or a lack of confidence, so this is a good one for just about any human.
• 0:56
  Michelle Gauthier: My guest today is Joanne Williams, and she is a licensed mental health professional with 30 years of experience specializing in anxiety and confidence building and PTSD.
• 1:05
  Michelle Gauthier: I really enjoyed the conversation with her because during the conversation, the tips and ideas that she provided were really simple and actionable.
• 1:12
  Michelle Gauthier: So when you listen today, you will hear how anxiety and confidence are directly connected and why overcoming anxiety is the key to building true self-confidence.
• 1:22
  Michelle Gauthier: And then she'll also teach you about a framework called the ACT framework for retraining your brain so that you can shift from negative self-talk to thoughts that actually serve you.
• 1:33
  Michelle Gauthier: The conversation is full of great and interesting information, so let's dive in.
• 1:38
  Michelle Gauthier: Joanne, welcome to the podcast and thanks for being here.
• 1:42
  Joanne Williams: Well, thank you for having me.
• 1:43
  Joanne Williams: I love your podcast.
• 1:45
  Joanne Williams: It's really informative.
• 1:46
  Michelle Gauthier: Oh good, Thank you, Same to yours.
• 1:48
  Michelle Gauthier: I'm going to put the link in the show notes so that everybody can listen to yours as well.
• 1:52
  Michelle Gauthier: So I recently read something it was a quote about.
• 1:57
  Michelle Gauthier: I'm going to butcher it a little bit, but it's something like we feel like we have to have confidence before we do something.
• 2:05
  Michelle Gauthier: But in actuality, we get the confidence from doing things, you know like taking the step, and when I read that over the weekend it made me think about you, because I knew we were going to talk about insecurity versus confidence today.
• 2:17
  Michelle Gauthier: So I'm excited to dig in all things insecurity and confidence and have you teach us how to feel more confident.
• 2:25
  Michelle Gauthier: I'm also really interested in the fact that you help certify people to have a psychiatric service dog, so I just want to hear all about that too.
• 2:33
  Michelle Gauthier: But before we jump into all that, will you please just tell the listeners who you are like, what you do in general, and I don't know maybe a little bit about your backstory, of how you got into talking about confidence and anxiety and all the things that you talk about.
• 2:49
  Joanne Williams: Oh, I'd love to.
• 2:50
  Joanne Williams: So I'll start kind of more at the beginning.
• 2:52
  Joanne Williams: I grew up in a family that was pervasive, lots of screwed up things, but pervasively anxious, and I didn't even know it that.
• 3:01
  Joanne Williams: You know my mother she obsessively organized and really rigid in her ways and I didn't know what that was.
• 3:08
  Joanne Williams: That was kind of normal.
• 3:10
  Joanne Williams: But I, you know, I really didn't understand the impact on me until later in life and that was anxiety.
• 3:16
  Joanne Williams: And then my dad was depressed and you know, and I, you know, he just came home and sat in a chair and put the paper up.
• 3:24
  Joanne Williams: You know I didn't know even what that was, but those kind of impacts really made me want to understand more.
• 3:31
  Joanne Williams: And then I married an alcoholic, you know, and so you know, I wanted to know more and I had two children.
• 3:37
  Joanne Williams: At that point I went to therapy and I had to learn more about what this really meant in my life what anxiety was, what depression, what alcoholism, the codependence, how, my part in taking responsibility.
• 3:52
  Joanne Williams: That's why I went back to school and I got my master's degree and now has been a counselor for 30 years counseling people, mainly with the specialty of anxiety and post-traumatic stress disorder.
• 4:06
  Michelle Gauthier: Okay, okay, and do you work with women, men, anyone?
• 4:10
  Joanne Williams: Yeah, anyone and everyone that really wants to work on their life skills is what I call it ways to get into what to do in situations, because generally that's what bothers people I'm good with my life but it's just going into crowds or I can't talk in social situations.
• 4:27
  Joanne Williams: You know, it's like specific kind of things like that.
• 4:30
  Joanne Williams: So I always go for where they want to go and specific life skills.
• 4:34
  Joanne Williams: I would call it.
• 4:35
  Joanne Williams: I kind of call it.
• 4:35
  Joanne Williams: You know, counseling to me is like going to emotional college classes that we never learned in a younger school or younger years.
• 4:46
  Michelle Gauthier: Yes, absolutely true, so that's really helpful.
• 4:49
  Michelle Gauthier: Thank you for sharing your personal story with us.
• 4:52
  Michelle Gauthier: I just recently had another therapist on who had a lot of anxiety and came by it honestly from her family as well, and I do think it's so neat when we take something that has been really hard for us and turn it into good by, you know, sharing our experience with other people and helping them.
• 5:09
  Michelle Gauthier: So what do you think is the relationship between anxiety and confidence?
• 5:17
  Joanne Williams: I really think that confidence, self-esteem, self-worth comes from outside first.
• 5:24
  Joanne Williams: Our families share oh you're the most wonderful, you can do anything kind of thing to support you.
• 5:30
  Joanne Williams: And if you don't get that from the outside first in family or school or wherever religions then you got to do it yourself.
• 5:39
  Michelle Gauthier: And.
• 5:39
  Joanne Williams: I think it leaves us, you know, to our own devices, so to speak, about what to do.
• 5:44
  Joanne Williams: I'm anxious, I'm afraid of going here and do it, but then you haven't learned the skills to do it, and then that creates more self-doubt, more, you know, maybe even self-abusing, like and I can't, I don't know how, I'm stupid, or, you know, negative self-talk.
• 6:00
  Joanne Williams: So I think there's just a relationship between the two, and I don't like self-blaming of anybody at any point parents or whatever because at some point we've all got something from our parents and we just have to figure it out.
• 6:15
  Joanne Williams: So it's like what are you going to do about it?
• 6:17
  Joanne Williams: It's your responsibility now to go learn the skills, and that's why we do the podcast that we do.
• 6:22
  Joanne Williams: Mine is Anxiety, simplified.
• 6:24
  Joanne Williams: There's books, there's so much out there right now about learning some ways to deal with this, whether it's self-worth or helping with confidence.
• 6:33
  Michelle Gauthier: Yeah, I just want to pull out one thing that you said there, because you mentioned this at the beginning too.
• 6:38
  Michelle Gauthier: When you first went to counseling, before you became a therapist, I had the same experience of thinking that I was going to go to a therapist and she was going to be like you're right, he's a jerk, everyone's wrong, you're doing everything right.
• 6:53
  Michelle Gauthier: And when it was like, hey, here's your part in this, sister, you're creating this for yourself in your life.
• 6:59
  Michelle Gauthier: I think that that is the first, most painful step to take is just really focusing on radical responsibility of what you're bringing into your own life.
• 7:11
  Michelle Gauthier: You said, for example, that you were married to an alcoholic.
• 7:14
  Michelle Gauthier: So that's a situation that you know you could put a lot of blame on that other person, but you won't be able to solve it until you look at your part in it and you know take responsibility.
• 7:26
  Michelle Gauthier: So the reason why I'm bringing this up is because you just said again I want to make sure all the listeners heard you loud and clear that no matter what happened when you were growing up or what situation you're in now, you don't have to blame anybody else or judge yourself.
• 7:41
  Michelle Gauthier: You're probably doing the best you could up to this point.
• 7:43
  Michelle Gauthier: But starting now, if you want to feel less anxious, less overwhelmed, more confident, start thinking about what you own, and the good news about that is that you own it, so you can change it, you can make yourself feel better.
• 7:57
  Michelle Gauthier: I just had to give that little aside because I just could not wait to hear how I was amazing and how everyone else was messing up.
• 8:04
  Michelle Gauthier: Therapist, which you need, you need that too.
• 8:08
  Michelle Gauthier: Well, I could get that from my mom, you know in my case, right?
• 8:12
  Joanne Williams: I don't have to go to a therapist for that.
• 8:15
  Michelle Gauthier: Yeah, yeah, it is very good, you know a couple of things on that.
• 8:18
  Joanne Williams: I feel like the other side of the coin to blaming is responsibility.
• 8:23
  Joanne Williams: There's always two sides and yet we can blame and complain, like you're saying, but it doesn't do any good.
• 8:27
  Joanne Williams: The only way is taking a hundred percent responsibility of your part and, you know, moving into it.
• 8:34
  Joanne Williams: But I'll tell you a skill that I also learned in therapy, that I use every day and everything that I do, as well as in therapy, because I don't think anybody ever taught this or really talked about it how, like you said, it's your responsibility and you can change it.
• 8:52
  Joanne Williams: But understanding that your thoughts are what starts that process, that create the emotion that's connected to it that then creates the behavior that you take.
• 9:03
  Joanne Williams: Because if you're talking about taking responsibility to maybe feel uncomfortable, calmer in your life, let's say, or more confident in your life, if that starts with the thought I'm nothing, I'm worthless and whatever, you're not going to go to a confident, calming thought, you know.
• 9:21
  Joanne Williams: And so, re-looking at becoming more aware of the thoughts that you're putting in your head, that you are responsible for now and be able to look at it in a different way that is much more supportive and much more kinder.
• 9:39
  Joanne Williams: I would say really to build whatever that strength or confidence that you want.
• 9:47
  Michelle Gauthier: And how do you do that?
• 9:49
  Michelle Gauthier: So if you realize that you're having a thought like I'm not good at this, I'm not good at anything or whatever would create that feeling of insecurity, then what?
• 9:59
  Joanne Williams: Well, and I came up with this ACT blueprint that I use a lot.
• 10:04
  Joanne Williams: First, the A is just become aware.
• 10:06
  Joanne Williams: You've got to notice, you've got to recognize and I think that's the hardest part to say the truth, start to recognize what you are actually saying to yourself, and you've probably said this a million times, so that's why it's out of your awareness.
• 10:20
  Joanne Williams: And that's really the first step.
• 10:22
  Joanne Williams: But then the second step, or the C, is connect what you're telling yourself to what you want to feel.
• 10:30
  Joanne Williams: And if you want to feel confident, what could you be saying to yourself?
• 10:33
  Joanne Williams: And a lot of times it's absolutely the opposite of what you've been telling yourself.
• 10:38
  Joanne Williams: So that's kind of a little trick.
• 10:40
  Joanne Williams: If you're already saying I can't, well then you got to.
• 10:42
  Joanne Williams: How can you come up with it?
• 10:43
  Joanne Williams: I can do this.
• 10:45
  Joanne Williams: I may need help, I may not know how, but I know for sure I will be able to.
• 10:51
  Joanne Williams: And you can just give yourself that feeling enough times to start, go like the little engine that could the chug, chug, chug.
• 10:59
  Joanne Williams: You can just continue that pattern.
• 11:01
  Joanne Williams: And that's the T of the ACT Train your brain.
• 11:05
  Joanne Williams: You got to retrain it to go to this new pattern, being aware, connect your thought with your feeling really to go to.
• 11:11
  Joanne Williams: I got this, I feel this, and I think that's always the missing piece.
• 11:16
  Joanne Williams: I think we're always in our head about things oh, this or that, that, no, get to your heart.
• 11:21
  Joanne Williams: See if you can get down to your heart and feel what you're saying.
• 11:26
  Joanne Williams: I got this, I know, I can, I will and feel it.
• 11:33
  Michelle Gauthier: And if at first they don't feel it, is it still worth it to practice that, or should they try something different?
• 11:40
  Joanne Williams: You have to.
• 11:41
  Joanne Williams: There's no way about same thing you know just about how do you build confidence.
• 11:47
  Joanne Williams: You don't have it in the beginning, but how do you get anything?
• 11:53
  Joanne Williams: How do we get out of the third grade?
• 11:54
  Joanne Williams: How do we go into multiplication?
• 11:57
  Joanne Williams: We didn't jump from addition to multiplication, we had to learn, you know, how to add, subtract and then do division, and then we went on and on.
• 12:06
  Joanne Williams: This is no different.
• 12:07
  Joanne Williams: But if you expect yourself to be able to jump, I got this.
• 12:12
  Joanne Williams: I'm going to fake this confidence, no matter what People see through it.
• 12:17
  Joanne Williams: And if you have to fake it for a minute, but you got to get to the feeling it, and there's only one way, and it is doing it, practicing it Like just the practice, practice, practice.
• 12:26
  Michelle Gauthier: Yes, practice, practice.
• 12:27
  Michelle Gauthier: I like to think about it.
• 12:28
  Michelle Gauthier: For me, I was like 40-something, I don't remember, when I started doing this kind of work, where I started having awareness of my thoughts and what my self-talk was and I thought, well, it took me 41, two years to get here with this pattern.
• 12:45
  Michelle Gauthier: So now it's luckily, it doesn't take that long to build a new one, but it takes some time.
• 12:50
  Michelle Gauthier: You can't just like flip a switch and, you know, get going.
• 12:53
  Michelle Gauthier: So I love that, I love the encouragement and like the grace or kindness to give yourself to say this might take a minute, we're going to have to keep practicing this, but it's so worth it when you can start getting your confidence from yourself and your own thoughts, instead of trying to get it from your job or someone else's approval, because those are not foolproof methods.
• 13:17
  Michelle Gauthier: In fact they're the opposite.
• 13:20
  Joanne Williams: Yeah, and you know, I feel like sometimes when you start a new practice like that, it's like trying to stop a locomotive on the tracks it just runs you down.
• 13:29
  Joanne Williams: You just miss it.
• 13:31
  Joanne Williams: Oh, I missed another.
• 13:32
  Joanne Williams: Oh, I missed it, oh, but I caught one.
• 13:34
  Joanne Williams: So one out of a hundred you catch and change that pattern, Then it'll be, you'll catch more and more of them and then you'll get caught off guard a lot less and won't get run over.
• 13:45
  Joanne Williams: You'll go.
• 13:45
  Joanne Williams: Oh yeah, because this one feels so good.
• 13:48
  Joanne Williams: I like this new feeling.
• 13:51
  Michelle Gauthier: Yeah, I love that.
• 13:52
  Michelle Gauthier: That's such a good way to think about it.
• 13:53
  Michelle Gauthier: Okay, so if somebody out there right now is thinking I know I have some negative self-talk that I need to change, be encouraged that it is totally possible and that you can start just by starting to notice your thoughts, connecting your thoughts and your feelings.
• 14:09
  Michelle Gauthier: And then is the last what Is the T taking action?
• 14:12
  Joanne Williams: Retrain your brain.
• 14:13
  Joanne Williams: You got to keep doing it.
• 14:14
  Joanne Williams: That's the practice.
• 14:15
  Joanne Williams: That's right.
• 14:16
  Joanne Williams: That's right.
• 14:17
  Michelle Gauthier: Retrain your brain.
• 14:18
  Michelle Gauthier: I like that.
• 14:18
  Michelle Gauthier: Act.
• 14:19
  Michelle Gauthier: That's good.
• 14:19
  Michelle Gauthier: I like it, Okay, great.
• 14:21
  Michelle Gauthier: So another area that I know you focus on and I noticed in the picture that we're going to be using for this podcast, you have a dog on your lap.
• 14:31
  Michelle Gauthier: I do.
• 14:33
  Joanne Williams: I'm surprised, I don't right now.
• 14:34
  Joanne Williams: Yeah, I don't.
• 14:36
  Michelle Gauthier: My dog's under there.
• 14:37
  Joanne Williams: I just looked yeah, she's under my desk.
• 14:38
  Michelle Gauthier: But she's big, she weighs 65.
• 14:40
  Michelle Gauthier: She can't sit on my lap.
• 14:42
  Michelle Gauthier: She'd like to?
• 14:43
  Michelle Gauthier: She can yeah.
• 14:44
  Joanne Williams: They still think they're lap
• 14:47
  Michelle Gauthier: Yes, yes, exactly.
• 14:48
  Michelle Gauthier: So tell me about your work with that and helping people get certified to have dogs and the effect you think that dogs can have on anxiety, confidence or any so huge?
• 15:01
  Joanne Williams: Well, about 13 years ago I was just on a plane and I had a little dog but I didn't know about any of this, that you could do that and he was a little crate and he was acting up and I was just panicked.
• 15:16
  Joanne Williams: And I had panicked and so that was the kind stewardess that came over and says you know, there's a program.
• 15:22
  Joanne Williams: If you wanted to get a letter from a mental health professional that states you need your dog, you could fly with him on your lap.
• 15:29
  Joanne Williams: I'm like what?
• 15:31
  Joanne Williams: And they have.
• 15:33
  Joanne Williams: There's a flying law.
• 15:33
  Joanne Williams: I'm like what?
• 15:34
  Joanne Williams: And they have.
• 15:34
  Joanne Williams: There's a flying law.
• 15:35
  Joanne Williams: It's called the Air Care Access Act, and so ever since then so I've been a therapist for probably 20 years.
• 15:41
  Joanne Williams: At that point I didn't even know about that law.
• 15:43
  Joanne Williams: And there's a law that you can Fair Housing Act, that you can have your dog in no pet housing, and so they did change the flying law four years ago that it has to be a psychiatric service dog and now it's only dogs to fly, and that is the third law that covers this, called the Americans with Disabilities Act.
• 16:04
  Joanne Williams: A lot of people hear it as the ADA and that states if your dog recognizes, responds and reduces psychological symptoms.
• 16:15
  Joanne Williams: They can be a psychiatric service dog.
• 16:18
  Joanne Williams: So I've been doing this now.
• 16:21
  Joanne Williams: Well, I started, like I said, with emotional support animals, but about 13 years, and so I and you have to have psychological symptoms right and the tasks are that they're trained to do connects the task with their diagnosis anxiety, panic, ptsd, depression and that's what I do.
• 16:41
  Joanne Williams: And then, once they get certified, they get a letter to be able to give for housing or they give it a little ID card that has a picture of their little doggy.
• 16:52
  Joanne Williams: I'm showing a little picture that you have your dog for an ID to go into stores to show or a public places or public transportation.
• 17:01
  Joanne Williams: So I find it for a lot of my clients again, my specialty is anxiety and PTSD.
• 17:07
  Joanne Williams: Now, using a dog is a game changer in their lives.
• 17:10
  Joanne Williams: They will go to the store, they will go to family gatherings because they can bring their dog, or social outings where they're like I'm too shy, I'm going to stand in the car, I'm not going to talk to everybody who sees the dog and that's all they want to talk about.
• 17:25
  Joanne Williams: Like, great, take the focus off of me and put it on the dog.
• 17:30
  Joanne Williams: Yeah, happy to go.
• 17:31
  Joanne Williams: So it can be really life changing.
• 17:33
  Michelle Gauthier: Yeah, oh my gosh, that's amazing.
• 17:35
  Michelle Gauthier: So what do you have to do?
• 17:37
  Michelle Gauthier: Do you have to do anything with the dog?
• 17:40
  Michelle Gauthier: Or do they get the dog trained somewhere?
• 17:42
  Michelle Gauthier: Or are a lot of these dogs?
• 17:43
  Michelle Gauthier: I'm thinking my dog's had no training.
• 17:46
  Michelle Gauthier: In fact, she could use some training on not eating off the counter as an example.
• 17:50
  Michelle Gauthier: But I promise you, when any of the three of us who live in this house are sick, upset, anything is wrong, she immediately knows it.
• 17:58
  Michelle Gauthier: She will come over, like if I'm crying, she licks the tears off my face, or even if I just feel upset, she'll just come and lay by me.
• 18:16
  Joanne Williams: I mean she knows, and I don't think she's special in that way.
• 18:19
  Joanne Williams: I think she's really special and I don't think she's special in that way.
• 18:22
  Joanne Williams: I feel like dogs just have a sixth sense.
• 18:23
  Joanne Williams: For that Our sun dogs do, and that's the key, and you know.
• 18:25
  Joanne Williams: But the training, the basic behavioral training sit, stay calm has to be there because again they're going with you in a crowded, you know, airport or sitting on a plane.
• 18:32
  Joanne Williams: So they're all even our emotional support animals had to have basic training, basic training, doggy training Like the army.
• 18:40
  Joanne Williams: You know the who can't, but you can get that almost anywhere.
• 18:44
  Joanne Williams: You know PetSmart or whatever.
• 18:45
  Joanne Williams: I did, the AKC, good Citizens, you know, and you can get some certifications for that.
• 18:52
  Joanne Williams: But truly, even for a service dog that for medical now, psychological and medical they kind of divide it up.
• 18:59
  Joanne Williams: They're all service dogs but psychiatric or medical, for blindness, hearing impaired no, none of these three laws have ever stated that you have to have professional trainers or, you know, be professionally trained with an organization, ever.
• 19:13
  Joanne Williams: They can train their own dog and, just like you're saying, your dog already is in tune with you.
• 19:21
  Joanne Williams: That's what all of these dogs kind of are first, and then this piece that they have to recognize.
• 19:28
  Joanne Williams: Though, like you said, you start crying, something's up, they come to you.
• 19:32
  Joanne Williams: It's not about you calling them over when you're anxious.
• 19:36
  Joanne Williams: They have to respond to that anxiety or panic attack or something and then do the task, what they do for you.
• 19:44
  Joanne Williams: Maybe they can take you through a crowd.
• 19:47
  Joanne Williams: They just kind of move you through a crowd, maybe it is.
• 19:51
  Joanne Williams: They just can get on your lap and find pressure therapy.
• 19:54
  Joanne Williams: But it's got to reduce your anxiety or panic so you don't have panic attacks.
• 20:00
  Joanne Williams: So they have to and you have to know how to say that.
• 20:04
  Joanne Williams: And then I do a training with people on what to say what you never have to say, because it's one thing to get a psych yet, but then what do I say to the store owner?
• 20:11
  Joanne Williams: It's one thing to get a psych kit, but then how do I?
• 20:12
  Joanne Williams: How, what do I say to the store owner?
• 20:14
  Joanne Williams: You know if they say things to you.
• 20:16
  Joanne Williams: And so that's a second part of this, that I train people to really know how to use their dog confidently, because most people with anxiety or PTSD, they're already shell-shocked in the center.
• 20:29
  Joanne Williams: If you ask me anything, they go into deer in the headlights, look but, but, but, but.
• 20:34
  Joanne Williams: They can't.
• 20:35
  Joanne Williams: Their mind freezes up, they go blank.
• 20:37
  Joanne Williams: And so the training is we actually role play this?
• 20:39
  Joanne Williams: What are you going to say?
• 20:41
  Joanne Williams: Do it again.
• 20:42
  Joanne Williams: Well, I'll get this so you can just flick this off.
• 20:45
  Joanne Williams: And so it really helps them to feel confident, to be able to use their dogs.
• 20:50
  Michelle Gauthier: I'm just shuddering, thinking about the questions that people probably ask dogs.
• 20:54
  Joanne Williams: I'm just shuddering, thinking about the questions that people probably ask.
• 20:57
  Joanne Williams: Oh, and there's only two that they have to respond to, which is really good.
• 21:05
  Joanne Williams: One is is your dog required because of a disability?
• 21:07
  Joanne Williams: So what I'm certifying is they have a psychological, psychiatric disability because of their symptoms, right?
• 21:13
  Joanne Williams: The other one is what is the task that your dog is trained to help you with?
• 21:20
  Joanne Williams: And that is what I was just saying.
• 21:22
  Joanne Williams: My service dog is trained to recognize that my anxiety is increasing, responds by coming over, leaning into me, getting my lap to apply pressure therapy to reduce my anxiety, or something like that, and you just get the recognize, respond and reduce in that statement and that's all that's required.
• 21:43
  Joanne Williams: But I got to tell you it's not really funny but that's why I train, because you do get these wacko kind of statements.
• 21:50
  Joanne Williams: One of the clients told me they said the person asked what's wrong with you.
• 21:54
  Michelle Gauthier: Mm-hmm, that's exactly what I was picturing.
• 21:57
  Michelle Gauthier: Someone say Yep, yep, and I swear.
• 22:01
  Michelle Gauthier: I like to think that people are not trying to be in there, just being curious, but they don't know how to say it.
• 22:07
  Michelle Gauthier: But how does one respond to that?
• 22:10
  Joanne Williams: Well, the way I train is again on the back of the little ID card.
• 22:14
  Joanne Williams: There is what you can only ask.
• 22:16
  Joanne Williams: What is the task my dog is trained to do?
• 22:18
  Joanne Williams: Or is my dog required because of a disability?
• 22:21
  Joanne Williams: Which one would you like me to answer?
• 22:24
  Joanne Williams: So I always come up with non-confrontative ways, and that's part of the training.
• 22:29
  Joanne Williams: So they know what to say, because I'm telling you, they're dying inside.
• 22:34
  Joanne Williams: They are so scared and so anxious, and the reason why they need their dog there with them.
• 22:39
  Joanne Williams: But people don't realize that this is so debilitating for so many people and that their dogs truly help them.
• 22:46
  Joanne Williams: And you know, I feel like we give lip service to more mental health services and da-da-da-da-da, but there's still just a lot of judgment.
• 22:57
  Joanne Williams: Oh, you don't look like you need a dog.
• 23:00
  Joanne Williams: You don't look like you have panic, you know, and it's like public.
• 23:04
  Joanne Williams: Please be kind Don't judge.
• 23:07
  Michelle Gauthier: Yeah, I wonder what a person looks like who has panic.
• 23:12
  Michelle Gauthier: I didn't know that there was a certain look to it or what you're supposed to look like.
• 23:18
  Joanne Williams: Yeah, and I'm telling you, when you ask them a question, watch their eyes.
• 23:22
  Joanne Williams: Yeah, you know they get big and you'll see that I don't care.
• 23:28
  Joanne Williams: I can't even speak, and that's that.
• 23:32
  Joanne Williams: You know there's fight, run or freeze and PTSD.
• 23:36
  Joanne Williams: They may get confrontative.
• 23:38
  Joanne Williams: No, what are you talking?
• 23:40
  Joanne Williams: That's funny, right, freeze up.
• 23:43
  Joanne Williams: I can't say anything.
• 23:44
  Joanne Williams: I'm getting out of here, I'm not dealing with this, and so that's what the response generally is, and people do not understand that that is a response to a trauma in their past that has made it so hard for them to live life.
• 23:57
  Michelle Gauthier: That's such a great way to think about it.
• 23:58
  Michelle Gauthier: Okay, well, I love that you do that too.
• 24:01
  Michelle Gauthier: That's so cool.
• 24:02
  Michelle Gauthier: So you're teaching the human how to manage through those and then teaching them how to manage with their dog, taking them in public places so that they can be out and about everywhere?
• 24:12
  Michelle Gauthier: Okay, tell us.
• 24:15
  Michelle Gauthier: These are the questions that I ask everyone on the show.
• 24:17
  Joanne Williams: So tell us what's something that you do when you're feeling overwhelmed or anxious and you want to feel better vagus nerve, not like Las Vegas, but V-A-G-U-S nerve, and it's our largest nerve that runs from our gut to our brain, that these medical researchers were looking for?
• 24:45
  Joanne Williams: What would stimulate that vagus nerve to calm you and, within a minute, to send a calming chemical into your system?
• 24:54
  Joanne Williams: Just breathing, four count in your nose, breathing out your mouth, and eight count, and even I find it even in like three to five rounds of this.
• 25:04
  Joanne Williams: They suggested doing about 10 rounds until you feel the shift or release.
• 25:10
  Joanne Williams: And when you do, you can.
• 25:12
  Joanne Williams: It's like a.
• 25:13
  Joanne Williams: I don't know if you've ever taken Xanax, but it's like that feeling like, oh, it's just an immediate Okay, like I'm going to be okay, yes, yeah, yeah.
• 25:22
  Michelle Gauthier: When I come out of overwhelm, my first thought is like okay, I can think now, yes.
• 25:27
  Joanne Williams: That's what this does, because that's what the thing it does.
• 25:30
  Joanne Williams: It stops overthinking, it gets you out of the overwhelm loop.
• 25:34
  Joanne Williams: I call it back to zero or reset, so you can think, because you can't think and feel the same time.
• 25:41
  Joanne Williams: If you're in an anxiety or overwhelm spiral, you're just in it.
• 25:44
  Joanne Williams: You can't do it.
• 25:46
  Joanne Williams: You can breathe to get back to zero.
• 25:48
  Joanne Williams: To go to those thoughts Again, a new thought what would help me right now?
• 25:53
  Joanne Williams: I got this.
• 25:53
  Joanne Williams: I've done this a million times.
• 25:55
  Joanne Williams: I'm good at so many things.
• 25:58
  Joanne Williams: I can do this.
• 25:58
  Joanne Williams: I don't have to feel it, but I use this all the time.
• 26:03
  Joanne Williams: I teach this to every single client.
• 26:06
  Michelle Gauthier: Okay, that's awesome, I love it.
• 26:07
  Michelle Gauthier: Good, okay, and then the second question is what is something you do consistently to save time?
• 26:16
  Joanne Williams: Save time, I'm going to turn it around a little bit.
• 26:21
  Joanne Williams: I feel like I do a daily kind of spiritual practice and meditation that takes me to a place where I feel like I can expand my energy field to be able to do more with less anxiety and less overwhelm.
• 26:36
  Joanne Williams: So I just have these spiritual practices.
• 26:38
  Joanne Williams: My daughter, seraphine Coates she's on my podcast too and she just really teaches these more esoteric kind of ways to build self-love in her soul work courses and I feel like that's what it is.
• 26:50
  Joanne Williams: It's like how can you give more to yourself to have more capacity as mothers, as women, as entrepreneurs, as we have to do this, that and all these other things that we do in our lives?
• 27:02
  Joanne Williams: It's almost like I like to just build my capacity to do more with less overwhelm.
• 27:07
  Michelle Gauthier: And that's what I feel like these do.
• 27:08
  Michelle Gauthier: Yeah, because I mean, even if you frame it in the way that I originally was asking the waste of time, the thing that you're doing is avoiding waste of time.
• 27:21
  Michelle Gauthier: The thing that you're doing is avoiding overwhelm and like, what a waste of time.
• 27:23
  Michelle Gauthier: That is because, at least for me, in overwhelm nothing good is happening.
• 27:26
  Joanne Williams: I'm just spinning.
• 27:28
  Michelle Gauthier: So if you can do something ahead of time so that you save yourself all that time of overwhelm, that's awesome.
• 27:33
  Michelle Gauthier: So what does your morning look like?
• 27:35
  Michelle Gauthier: What do you do?
• 27:37
  Joanne Williams: And I've done this for 30 years.
• 27:38
  Joanne Williams: That's the other key.
• 27:40
  Joanne Williams: You've got to do something that you really develop and love.
• 27:43
  Joanne Williams: You can't wait to do it, but I have.
• 27:45
  Joanne Williams: I live in Florida, so I have this beautiful lanai that I sit out and there's a little canal and nature's right in front of me, birds and all these beautiful feelings you know of.
• 27:55
  Joanne Williams: And then I have a candle.
• 27:57
  Joanne Williams: I like, I like smells.
• 27:58
  Joanne Williams: So, I add that to my practice.
• 28:00
  Joanne Williams: I have this comfy place in my cushion chair that I sit and I will listen to either you know some meditation that I've created, or that my daughter, or some kind of practice.
• 28:12
  Joanne Williams: That again brings me back to my center.
• 28:16
  Joanne Williams: It's really part of my self-care practice that when I'm done, I just go oh, I'm ready, I'm ready to take on more, I'm ready for the day.
• 28:25
  Joanne Williams: But it almost like draws me that I have to.
• 28:29
  Joanne Williams: It's like not brushing my teeth in the morning if I didn't do it.
• 28:32
  Michelle Gauthier: It's like okay, okay, that's a solid habit then.
• 28:35
  Joanne Williams: Yeah, I must, and it just cause it just feels so good.
• 28:40
  Michelle Gauthier: Yeah, yes, I will sometimes think I don't have time to do this morning routine today.
• 28:46
  Michelle Gauthier: And when I skip it, I am always sorry, and I more than make up for the time that that would have taken me in time, because I'm just not in the right mindset to get things done and you know to have my day, but that's so great, okay.
• 29:01
  Michelle Gauthier: So what's a new thought there?
• 29:03
  Michelle Gauthier: It's a great use of my time to do this right now.
• 29:08
  Michelle Gauthier: Yes, so tell us where people can find you if they want to learn more about you or follow some of the things that you're doing.
• 29:24
  Joanne Williams: Yes, oh, thank you for asking.
• 29:25
  Joanne Williams: Yeah, so, for psychiatric service dogs, I've got a website called ESA Pros.
• 29:26
  Joanne Williams: Esa is like emotional support animal but E-S-A-P-R-O-S.
• 29:29
  Joanne Williams: com, and there's information about whether you want an emotional support animal for housing or a psychiatric service dog to go all places with you, and there's a 30-second pre-qualification that you can just right then and there see, and it's a screening so you'll know if you qualify and then people move forward with that.
• 29:48
  Joanne Williams: I do have a podcast on all the major platforms Anxiety Simplified Podcast that people can do, and same for YouTube Anxiety Simplified Podcast.
• 30:01
  Joanne Williams: I'm on TikTok as well, so I'm and Facebook and I'm kind of everywhere.
• 30:06
  Joanne Williams: Joanne S S like, say, williams, so I'm kind of everywhere and I really intend to do more, with courses now on confidence building coming up in the fall.
• 30:16
  Joanne Williams: So there'll be more I'll be coming out with as well.
• 30:21
  Michelle Gauthier: Okay, so if people are following you on Instagram, for example, will they see that when it comes?
• 30:25
  Joanne Williams: out, it's available Okay.
• 30:27
  Michelle Gauthier: Okay, perfect, I will link all of that in the show notes.
• 30:30
  Michelle Gauthier: And then what about your new magazine article?
• 30:33
  Michelle Gauthier: I'll link that as well.
• 30:34
  Michelle Gauthier: How about that?
• 30:36
  Joanne Williams: Oh, I'm so proud of this.
• 30:38
  Joanne Williams: I'm telling you I really have never been a writer but I sent in an article on they were looking for articles on overcoming anxiety and I sent in five strategies and it got accepted at this magazine called Medium like in the middle, not small, but Medium and it's really this really nice magazine that really goes into human interest stories and kind of strategies.
• 31:02
  Joanne Williams: It's straightforward, kind of short ways, and I and I've loved it.
• 31:05
  Joanne Williams: So I got accepted for it and I've actually got an interview with she wants to add a video interview to it as well this week, so I'll be doing that.
• 31:15
  Joanne Williams: But you can find it on mediumcom.
• 31:19
  Michelle Gauthier: And I have the link because I saw the article, so I will put it in show notes as well, please.
• 31:26
  Joanne Williams: Great job.
• 31:26
  Michelle Gauthier: Great job getting the word out there about anxiety and opportunities like having a dog to help you with that and helping people of all kinds have more confidence.
• 31:37
  Michelle Gauthier: I just love what you're putting out into the world.
• 31:39
  Michelle Gauthier: Thanks for being with us today.
• 31:42
  Joanne Williams: Thank you very much.
• 31:50
  Michelle Gauthier: Thank you for listening to the Overwhelmed Working Woman podcast.
• 31:52
  Michelle Gauthier: If you want to learn more about my work, head over to my website at michellegauthier.
• 31:56
  Michelle Gauthier: com.
• 31:58
  Michelle Gauthier: See you next week.