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Ep 4: Shelby Saville (Shelby109) · Frap Rap with GDogggggggg

• Rob McEvily: Welcome to Frap Rap. I'm your host, Aaron Goldman, aka G, and the artist formerly known on AOL Instant Messenger as G Dog with 8Gs. Yes, one through seven were taken. Twenty-five years ago, I was an AE at an ad network called L90, and my biggest client was StarCom IP. Every Thursday, I'd invite everyone at Chicago at 35 West Wacker to meet me at the Cozy across the street for coffee. And for each person that came, I'd do a freestyle rap about them. Hence the name Frap Rap. The Mediaocean Podcast Network: You're listening to the Media Ocean Podcast Network. For more of our shows, visit www.mediaocean.com/slash podcasts. Rob McEvily: Each episode I track down another OGI peer to reminisce about the good old days and see what they're up to now. And my guest today is Shelby Seville. Shelby, welcome to FrapRap. Hello, great to be here. How exciting is this? So here we are in beautiful can. I don't know how much the backdrop comes through, but the podcast is on YouTube. So hopefully people can see that. ⁓ if you're just listening through your ears, picture ⁓ the Mediterranean Sea, the media ocean yacht. ⁓ we're not quite at Rose o'clock yet here. ⁓ we're kicking it old school with agua, but we are staying hydrated, which is super important. We are sweaty though. We're sweaty. It we it's been it's been a day. ⁓ but here we are, we're frap wrapping, and ⁓ so excited to catch up with you. So Shelby, let's transport back to the IP days. ⁓ when did you start and what was your first role? So I started in ninety nine, before Y2K. in the mid part of ⁓ ninety nine and I was really interested in this thing called digital and I worked on the Hallmark account and my job was to build a print plan for Star Wars ornament enthusiasts. And I said they're probably on the internet and not reading magazines and I sold it through to my client. It was like a very small budget. And Rashad Tabakowala heard about it and he came to me and said, I think you need to join this group and I was like, That sounds great and I just took the leap right from there. Amazing. How many people were part of the group at that time? ⁓ I think I was maybe the eleventh person because I was always sad that I could never say I was part of the original ten. Well, you I think at this point you can claim it and you're certainly one of the last people standing. Do you has there been anyone who's as tenured as you if we start back from IP? Any of those ten still with the group? I don't know if they're still with the group. We have a few though that have kind of gone in and out on our back. So Chandra Panley ⁓ works for us on the ⁓ ops and strategy team for Starcom. Aaron Vogel also works with us at Starcom and Content. So ⁓ there's quite a few of us that still kind of circle around and come in and out of the agency. Love it. So we'll we'll catch up all the way to present day and and you you'll catch us up on current role with Starcom and such, but let's stay back in that those early modes. ⁓ So Hallmark was the first account you worked on? Is that right? Okay. You mentioned the Star Wars enthusiasts. So of course L ninety represented Star Wars dot com. And so for ⁓ that was one of the big ⁓ sites where we would do these like crazy integrations. And this was right when the next set of the trilogy was coming out. So there like a lot of attention on it. But we were basically making it up as we went along. There were no like standardized units. ⁓ you know, how did you think about like s you you You said, you know, in that example, a print plan and translating it to digital. Like how did you go about like creating some of these new ⁓ formats when we really nothing existed? Well, I think it for me, it started with who we were trying to talk to. So it started with what the audience was and and what the person was and the easiest thing was to talk to the client about what people were actually doing and what was this target segment we were looking for and how they might be different than we thought and selling them in on that. But it was really interesting that nothing was defined yet. Like I remember getting the final okay on the budget and getting the authorization sign and standing up in my cubicle and being like, Well now what? Like what do I do? Like how do I try back a campaign and what exactly did am I buying? ⁓ because it was really like you could do a banner ad, but like integrations were even then more important and you could do a lot more then because everyone was looking to kind of figure out what it was. So it just became a I think a real symbiotic relationship between a seller and a buyer because we were all trying to figure it out together because there wasn't a set sense of you're selling this and I'm buying this. It was I am trying to reach these people. Help me figure out the best way to do that and get the message in front of them in a way that's not defined yet. And then we gotta figure out how to make it go live. Yeah. measure it. Yeah, well and for the publishers that we represented, ⁓ they were super hungry to, you get get brands on board and prove out that like their websites were actually like ⁓ a a medium that had ⁓ some staying power. So I remember like with Star Wars, we would do everything from like complete site takeovers to just standard four sixty eight by sixties? Ninety by ninety sixty eight by ninety. Okay. Maybe that sounds right. Se there was seven twenty eight by ninety was the leaderboard. Right. I can't remember. I don't know. And then there were the buttons. What was the skyscraper? That was like a one sixty by six hundred maybe? ⁓ that sounds right. That's why these old relics. And speaking of relics, I actually brought a few with me here today. So ⁓ I didn't bring the whole Rolidex from Chicago, ⁓ but I did pull out ⁓ two cards that I had for you. and this was you know before we had like Salesforce and things like that. So I would write on the card ⁓ how I met you. And so this was I don't have the year, but January sixteenth meeting with KJK. ⁓ Keith John Kaplan. ⁓ So apparently ⁓ and your title was director. Mm-hmm. ⁓ and y I have your fax on here because that was important. Right, we faxed over. And then I have another card from Media Vest. at what point did you transition or take us through like your your progression from IP and and what came next. Yeah, so what was interesting is, you know, I went from StarCom to StarCom IP because it just went from like total buying and planning on all mediums to focusing on digital. ⁓ that was great. ⁓ but then I also then helped a lot of the other brands inside of what was S ⁓ G at the time pitch business that was digital. So I ended up with a lot of business cards. So I had ⁓ Media Vest, although I was never technically transferred to Media Vest. I would just help them. ⁓ I was Starlink before I actually there. I would help them. ⁓ and it just depended on whatever entity was pitching. They would get me that business card. So in the room, I could be the digital lead for that. ⁓ eventually I did move over to what was ⁓ named Starlink, ⁓ because we want a very big financial client that was competitive to StarCon, and so I had to move out of the building to another entity, ⁓ which was you know sad at the time because I didn't want to leave StarCom AP but Starlink was amazing and it eventually became Spark and so people now know it as Spark and then Spark ⁓ merged with Media Vest. So this little tiny Starlink Spark then merged with Media Vest and became the big media agency that it is today. That's wild. So yes I also have the old org chart here. This one is circa 2005 and this must have been ⁓ the point at which You had moved ⁓ actually here. So Starlink has its own line here. Correct. So one thing is not like the other. I love it. So we had you, Mike Horwitz, Davis Brewer. You didn't even have any associates or ICs. You were really just having to do it all yourselves, huh? It was interesting. Starlink at the time. They were the media arm for independent creative agencies. And if you think about digital at that time, independent creative agencies were really the first movers on a lot of digital. And they needed a media partner that could think very agile and like being like, ⁓ yeah, we totally want to do that. Let's figure out how to make it happen. ⁓ so we needed more of a senior creative media crew. And then eventually we got budgets and and executed, and then we needed, you know, the ICEs and everything else. ⁓ but yeah, we started with a pretty small group and we just worked with every creative. creative creative agency in every account that they had. And it's so it s certainly seems to be a recurring theme of just, you know, figure it out as you go, keep the sort of customer and and the cut your your client's customer as the North Star. Yeah. ⁓ now take us all the way to present day. ⁓ talk about your current role and ⁓ if it you know, is the the through line ⁓ with you know, you've been in the group now How many years do we say 28? Unbelievable. So ⁓ tell us about your current role, and then I'm also just curious, like what's kept you there all this time? Mm-hmm. So my current role is I'm CEO of StarCom. So it really feels like I've come full circle to be, you know, at ⁓ what was the overnet media that turned into StarCom and then went from StarCom to StarCom IP, and then over to this small startup y thing called Starlink that turned into Spark and went around the group and now I'm back at StarCom as the CEO, which is really, really exciting. ⁓ I think what's kept me there is I've had a different Every number of few years, probably every three to five years. And it's always been with this theme of we need to figure something out, and we need someone who can ⁓ live in the gray for a moment and then crystallize it and figure it out. Like someone said to me once, you know, you're always seemingly on the forefront, like you must be a visionary. And I said, Absolutely not. I'm actually not at all. Like I don't really see the future, but I'm not afraid of change. And so being able to say, ⁓ that's interesting, well, everyone else is afraid of it. I'm like, ⁓ that's interesting. I'm really curious. And I'll lean in and figure it out. And so I've had roles everything from the different agencies to recently. I was at the publicist level, ⁓ running investment for the group while we were figuring out really the ⁓ merging of channels and how to think about AI and all of that. ⁓ and now I'm back at the agency just to really think about how we lead an agency through the AI future and what our clients look like as we bring more ⁓ data and audience and creative all together, like That's really been my like secret sauce through the years and why I've stayed because I've actually gotten to have the opportunity to really stretch into that curiosity whenever I start to feel that way. Totally. Yeah. It's it's ⁓ and such a good ⁓ lesson to people who are, you know, thinking through their careers and progression. Like you don't have to have the vision for where things are gonna go. If you're adaptable, you stay, you know, customer centric, ⁓ you embrace change and ⁓ and importantly, you have to be a good leader of people and in process. And so I'll I'll put those words, you know, I'll I'll be the one to say that for you. You're too humble to say it yourself. But ⁓ obviously you've you've always ⁓ been able to surround yourself with with great people and and grow talent ⁓ to be able to to deliver. ⁓ in thinking about now like what what made Starcom IP such a unique ⁓ place and time. ⁓ like w what what was it about that group at that time that you think now created like if we you know and my goal in the podcast is to track everybody down from the org chart. But people have gone on to do such incredible things. What do you think did ⁓ you know, what what was the genesis there? Yeah, I mean I think it was one, everything wasn't figured out. So if you had to have a defined process or you had to have everything figured like I need to know that A plus B equals C, it was not a place where you would thrive necessarily. But also when you think about growing talent ⁓ Rashad, Jeff Marshall, Chandra, that leadership did such a good job of really bolstering all of us up at whatever age we were in our career to give us the accountability and the leeway to figure it out and to really work and move forward in like an entrepreneurial way that you oftentimes don't get very early in your career. So the expectations were super high because this was a new area that nobody understood, but the runway to go as far as you could go inside those expectations. ⁓ Was there and then the safety from a management level to say this isn't figured out, so go try it. And then if it's not right, pivot. And if it is right, go forward and we're gonna protect you each way. I think grew a group of leaders into real confident people in making decisions and knowing that if you're making the right decision at the right time with the data you have, and then you just need to know what your pivot is or what your acceleration is. And that is hard to teach, but having that at such an early part of my career, and everyone had that, I feel like is. has really driven a lot of people into higher leadership positions. Yeah, right on. Well something was also very unique about the IP crew ⁓ was ⁓ how close the bonds were outside of work. And so that's our ⁓ segue into the ⁓ apartment crawl which is our lightning round. Now Shelby one thing I remember about you ⁓ was you were always very ⁓ strategic about your participation in the apartment crawl. And I remember and this was actually great like management advice that I I took on as I started to grow teams was ⁓ at some point you just need to leave and let the kids do their things so that You know, you're not you you're not complicit in the game. Yeah, and they might be laughing at your jokes, but they don't want you there all night. Like they really want you to come, like toast, maybe buy the rounds and like, you know, funds part of it, but they don't want you there all night. Totally. Yeah. So so maybe you'd hit like the first or second apartment crawl, then you'd sort of like exit stage left and let everyone carry on. Yes. ⁓ so yes, ⁓ very very wise. But at any rate, so I do I brought all the way from Chicago for us ⁓ an authentic solo cup. ⁓ and then I have my Grimace FIFA ⁓ happy meal cup. Amazing. ⁓ they're empty for now. ⁓ we still have our waters, but ⁓ well let's just pretend. ⁓ and cheers to the apart apartment crawl round. So this is just lightning round. Perfect. First thing ⁓ that comes to mind. ⁓ this question is ⁓ one that I've asked everybody, and this will ultimately be the name of the episode. ⁓ what was your AOL and messenger handle? ⁓ Shelby 109. Shelby 109. 109 was my first apartment number. Okay. There you go. ⁓ and now you can also probably get in ⁓ all of ⁓ Shelby's accounts. ⁓ you probably could because I do use it more often than I should ⁓ for various reasons. ⁓ I think you mentioned this, but I'm asking everybody, your first boss at IP. Was it actually Rashad? Did you report all the way out? No, ⁓ Jeff Marshall. ⁓ who was your favorite client during your time at IP? It's interesting. So I would say I have two, ⁓ and they were all stayed at McDonald's. Because they were early clients that I worked on. ⁓ and I got to do some really interesting things. And what's funny now is coming full circle, they're my clients today. And so I really like thinking about like what were the first things that we did with Allstate to help agents understand what digital was and why we were doing this. And then on the McDonald's side, like how to think about how to present what we were doing to franchisees and all of that, and then come back around and see the powerhouses that those brands still are today is really cool. I love it. Yeah, quick ⁓ sidebar. My ⁓ first, well, my first job in advertising was For the Daily Line Eye newspaper in college. but that summer I interned at Kelly Scott Madison and I worked on the Allstate account. They had the local business. And my job all summer was taking print calendars for each agent that showed like where where their ads were gonna show up. And I would ⁓ print it, bind it. We had a little like coil thing that, you know, you'd h punch the holes and and then I would ship it to each agent, and then they could hang it up in their office and show like, I'm gonna be on TV this day, I'm gonna be in the Sun Times this day. ⁓ so yeah, shout out to Allstate. ⁓ okay if you could have worked on any well, this question in your in your case, you probably touched all the clients to some degree, but was there one client that you didn't work on that you wish you could have? It's interesting because I did touch on most of them to be honest. So I don't know if I could think about that as much as like it took me a while to get to work on entertainment. ⁓ and that is such a fun ⁓ category and think about like the takeovers and the real integrations and pushing a lot of really innovative formats. Like I always thought that that was cool and it took me a while. I did eventually work on some entertainment brands, but that took me a long time and I for a long time I kept saying like I just want entertainment. I just want to work on one where we're trying to figure out how to make the entire site turn it like ooze or something, you know? Can we can't I just beheld to some nice fluffy brand metrics? Exactly. All this performance stuff is for the birds. Network solutions tracking me down to the last cent. Come on. ⁓ okay. ⁓ present company excluded, who was your favorite vendor? Ooh, I mean you were way up there. For sure. For sure. ⁓ I'm still very close to ⁓ Carrie King. She's ⁓ was ⁓ Glam, Mode Media, and then Teeds and now she's consulting and I would say, you know, as you were talking about, there are people you make are friends for life. And there are many people that are now I would wherever they're at, they're just we're friends first. And she's one of those people that I met very early. She was like cool savings. I met her very early in the industry. And then ⁓ We're still friends today. That's awesome. ⁓ all right, last one. You have a hot take on AI and advertising. Ooh, hot take. I'm very excited by AI and advertising. ⁓ I think that it reminds me very much of early ⁓ IP days when Everyone thought digital would do everything and be everything. And then when programmatic happened, everyone thought no one would need buyers anymore because it was all platform. And the thing is, I really feel like the merge of people and technology is always powerful. And I feel like we're getting even better tools and and things to make agile marketing real. Because agile marketing is real, but it's very hard. And it takes a lot of people. And I think being able to do that in a way that's using AI and being able to do that in a way that's getting closer to the consumer and all of that. Is great. And I think putting that in the hands of people is going to be really amazing. And so therefore I'm much more bullish on the role of people with technology and AI than I am afraid of what AI may do to the workforce. Amen. Well, let's pretend we have ⁓ some old Miller beer or maybe some rose in here. ⁓ cheers to that, to the people. ⁓ and before we close, ⁓ we have to do our frap wrap. So at Cozy back in the day, for every person that came, I would do a freestyle of About them, would incorporate what they were wearing or what accounts they were working on, etcetera. ⁓ but for the podcast, we've just been having people write down keywords. Or in the case of Aaron Vogel pulling out old relics out of the box that she's kept for twenty years. You didn't bring your box to can, ⁓ but we have some note cards for you. So give me three keywords that I'm gonna incorporate into my wrap. Okay, I have to write and then ⁓ we'll get it going. Okay. Okay. These are n much nicer mics than I have in my home office too. So I'm hoping it's gonna pick it up. I might spit on it a little bit with the beatbox here. You'll have to we'll have to do a wipe down in between ⁓ episodes, but ⁓ we're gonna let it rip. Okay. ⁓ so you wanna hold ⁓ let's just do one at a time. Don't let me see ⁓ yet. and ⁓ I'm gonna slip into my flow, let everybody know A G in the place to be Wishell B First keyword on the card, let's hold it up, let's raise our cup and we'll do it all up. We gonna take it down, we're gonna eat a little too. We got a dessert for me. I'm not a fool. They didn't sell this at Cozy back in the day, but we could go down to the bakery and look my way. I would hold it up. I would take a big bite. I would jump into the lake with my piece of cup cake. I'd take the frosting and I would lick it off too and I would spit it on the mic because I am such a fool. Next card, hey, what's it gonna be today? IP, don't you know you gotta look my way? I'm with Shelby. She's a dog lover. She knows that she's a sister from another mother. She's got one thing that that in her mug. She's got a thing and it's called a little pug, and it's snort a little like that. And it's snort because I am the bet. And I'm going to see the third card next. And we're gonna see if I can do it the best. So everybody put your hands in the air, wave ⁓ around like you just don't care. I do it like this and I do it like that. I do it on my yacht and I'm baseball bat. I'm with Shelby. It's been real. Star Come IP. Let's do it. You're the real deal. Thank you. This was awesome, Shelby. Thank you. Appreciate you. This was fun. That's it for Frap Rap. ⁓ thank you all for tuning in and see you on the next episode.