Latest / Partnerships Unraveled / Elise Carbone, Deltek

Transcript

Elise Carbone, Deltek · Partnerships Unraveled

• 0:04
  SPEAKER_02: Welcome back to Partnerships Unraveled, the podcast where we dive deep into the mysteries and the secrets of partnerships and the channel.
• 0:11
  SPEAKER_02: My name is Michelle.
• 0:12
  SPEAKER_02: I'm head of marketing at Chanex, and I'll be your host for today.
• 0:15
  SPEAKER_02: Now, today is a special one.
• 0:16
  SPEAKER_02: I have got the pleasure of speaking with Elise Carbon, head of Global Partners and Alliances at Dell Tech.
• 0:22
  SPEAKER_02: Elise, how are you?
• 0:23
  SPEAKER_00: I'm feeling well today, and you?
• 0:24
  SPEAKER_02: I'm feeling great.
• 0:25
  SPEAKER_02: Absolutely great.
• 0:26
  SPEAKER_02: I'm really looking forward to this one.
• 0:28
  SPEAKER_02: Um, to kick it off, let's ask an easy question.
• 0:31
  SPEAKER_02: Every guest I bring on has a completely different path into this space, right?
• 0:35
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and I love hearing how that shapes the way that they actually lead.
• 0:40
  SPEAKER_02: Could you tell us a little bit about yourself and your background and what you do at Dell Tech?
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_00: Fantastic.
• 0:44
  SPEAKER_00: So, yeah, that's an interesting one, right?
• 0:46
  SPEAKER_00: Because I don't think I choose partnership.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_00: I would say partnership choose me, uh, which is a typical path of a partnership leader.
• 0:53
  SPEAKER_00: So, um, in terms of background, I've been in software since 17 years or so.
• 0:57
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, but I started in HR initially.
• 0:59
  SPEAKER_00: So my first job was in HR, in a standard office doing recruitment and you know, supporting an HR director.
• 1:06
  SPEAKER_00: And then I moved into HRS.
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_00: That's when I started to um work with software, right?
• 1:11
  SPEAKER_00: And I worked for a consulting firm for a couple of years, and after that, I was quite bored, to be honest.
• 1:17
  SPEAKER_00: So a startup contacted me and said, hey, we are like five people in Europe.
• 1:20
  SPEAKER_00: Do you want to join us and do something?
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_00: And I was like, okay, I'm young, I don't have kids, I don't have anything to worry about, let's do it.
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_00: And I joined a small startup called EdgeR Smart, and that's where I started.
• 1:32
  SPEAKER_00: And my role with them was being a subject aspect matter.
• 1:35
  SPEAKER_00: So bringing the edge expertise and like consulting expertise in order to sell software.
• 1:39
  SPEAKER_00: And that's how I ended up in sales, you know, without knowing.
• 1:42
  SPEAKER_00: I was like, now I'm on the dark side, I'm selling software, right?
• 1:46
  SPEAKER_00: And uh step by step I kind of grew within that startup and started to really build from scratch the um sales team and the marketing team, and then starting to work with partners and partnership.
• 1:58
  SPEAKER_00: And um, five years later, after that, we got acquired by a large business called Dell Tech.
• 2:04
  SPEAKER_00: So that's how I joined Dell Tech.
• 2:05
  SPEAKER_00: And I've been with Dell Tech since 11 years, really enjoying my pastor, uh growing within the business, doing multiple roles within the channel team.
• 2:14
  SPEAKER_00: And today I'm lead uh I'm leading the partner team, the Coser Globe.
• 2:18
  SPEAKER_02: That's so cool.
• 2:19
  SPEAKER_02: It actually, you know, you you said it at the beginning, right?
• 2:21
  SPEAKER_02: But you didn't choose partnerships, partnerships chose you.
• 2:24
  SPEAKER_02: I I actually I'm thinking in the let's say 50 episodes I've done of this podcast so far, I don't think I've found anyone that was like, oh, I'm straight out of college, let's do partnerships, right?
• 2:36
  SPEAKER_02: So I think it's a really organic path.
• 2:38
  SPEAKER_00: But you know what?
• 2:39
  SPEAKER_00: Thinking about um influencers, right?
• 2:42
  SPEAKER_00: And content creators, they are choosing partnership for day one because they need to live out of partnership.
• 2:47
  SPEAKER_00: So maybe at one point you will get a content creator joining the podcast, which can explain how they manage their partnerships.
• 2:54
  SPEAKER_02: That is such a good point.
• 2:55
  SPEAKER_02: That that shows my blind spot, right?
• 2:57
  SPEAKER_02: That I'm so stuck in enterprise SaaS software that I don't think that there's like a world outside of it.
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_02: But uh no, I I think that's a really good point.
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_02: And and I think you raised um another interesting one.
• 3:06
  SPEAKER_02: Um obviously you worked in worked in HR and consulting.
• 3:09
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and and you mentioned that you were basically a subject matter expert.
• 3:12
  SPEAKER_02: And and I have to laugh because I used to work in like really complicated uh SaaS technology, and we would bring subject matter experts everywhere.
• 3:19
  SPEAKER_02: And at one point I thought, why is SILS even here?
• 3:22
  SPEAKER_02: Like just let the subject matter expert do the job.
• 3:28
  SPEAKER_02: But um, no, I'm curious because obviously you sat with customers while they implemented new software, so you were able to get kind of a front row seat to the customer strategy uh when it comes to implementing the software.
• 3:39
  SPEAKER_02: And how does that understanding shape how you build partner relationships today?
• 3:43
  SPEAKER_00: I'm going to say something very bad, but I'm I'm going to say it anyway, right?
• 3:47
  SPEAKER_00: So uh do not lie during the sales process.
• 3:50
  unknown: Right.
• 3:51
  SPEAKER_00: Because when I was in consulting, we were picking up any bad sales process that happened before.
• 3:56
  SPEAKER_00: So maybe, you know, inconsistencies, something that was not said or not asked.
• 4:00
  SPEAKER_00: So I would say what is helping me today is really putting the customer in the center.
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_00: We are servicing a customer.
• 4:07
  SPEAKER_00: We are a software business providing a software to the customer.
• 4:11
  SPEAKER_00: We are partnering with additional um companies that provide a service to the customer.
• 4:16
  SPEAKER_00: So when I look into partnership and what my consulting days brought me, is really thinking about how we are going to build the best ecosystem around the customer.
• 4:26
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I think that makes a lot of sense.
• 4:27
  SPEAKER_02: And I'd be interested to hear what you think about this because when you look at SaaS, right?
• 4:32
  SPEAKER_02: We had that transition where at the beginning of SaaS, let's say 2014-ish, everybody was promising everything.
• 4:38
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, every solution was multi-tenant SaaS, even though someone just had a server running in their basement.
• 4:43
  SPEAKER_02: Like every feature was possible.
• 4:45
  SPEAKER_02: And I think at one moment we kind of flipped that script and we started being more honest, right?
• 4:51
  SPEAKER_02: We started actually selling what we have.
• 4:53
  SPEAKER_02: Now with AI, I wonder where we stand.
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_02: What do you think about that?
• 4:57
  SPEAKER_02: Are we back to like promising people the world or have we found an equilibrium there?
• 5:02
  SPEAKER_00: I don't think we are promising the world to people, right?
• 5:04
  SPEAKER_00: Because AI, AI is in a very, very interesting place today.
• 5:09
  SPEAKER_00: Um, it's where you think, okay, let's use AI.
• 5:12
  SPEAKER_00: Everybody's saying we need to use AI, we need to have the AI fluency, your people need to know about AI, right?
• 5:18
  SPEAKER_00: But um it's great.
• 5:20
  SPEAKER_00: But the basis is really back to basis.
• 5:22
  SPEAKER_00: What do you want to deliver with AI?
• 5:24
  SPEAKER_00: Which business challenges are you going to solve?
• 5:26
  SPEAKER_00: Which uh processes do you want to automate with AI?
• 5:29
  SPEAKER_00: And so you need to look at in the reverse way.
• 5:32
  SPEAKER_00: Is the basis is going to be, instead of being AI first, it's like, okay, what are my challenges as a business?
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_00: Which processes I'm going to look at very deeply because it's super manual.
• 5:43
  SPEAKER_00: And I want to leverage technology, which could be AI or something else, in order to solve the process.
• 5:49
  SPEAKER_00: So I don't think it depends.
• 5:51
  SPEAKER_00: I'm not saying like those AI startups, you've got one popping up every 10 seconds, right?
• 5:55
  SPEAKER_00: They could promise the word, but if you are an established like ERP company or software business, I do think you've got um the intelligence of looking at AI in a different way and thinking about what are my processes, what are the processes that I'm um helping my customer with within my software and how I'm going to implement AI within these processes, right?
• 6:16
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 6:17
  SPEAKER_02: That's a really reasonable approach.
• 6:19
  SPEAKER_02: And I think it's the best approach, right?
• 6:20
  SPEAKER_02: That you always keep the customer challenge first instead of slapping solutions onto things that might not even need fixing or that we might not even understand.
• 6:29
  SPEAKER_02: Um that that actually uh segues nicely into another question I have for you.
• 6:33
  SPEAKER_02: You mentioned that you basically built the direct sales team from scratch at HR Smart before Dell Tech acquired the company.
• 6:39
  SPEAKER_02: I'm curious how much of that experience travels with you.
• 6:42
  SPEAKER_02: Like what carries over when you move from building a direct motion to building an indirect and partner-led motion?
• 6:47
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I would say you do need salespeople within your partner team, right?
• 6:52
  SPEAKER_00: Managing partnership is very important to have a good background in networking and building relationships and in knowing the software and knowing how to interact with like the dozen of stakeholders you've got internally and externally, right?
• 7:07
  SPEAKER_00: But at the end of the day, you need to be able to sell to your partners what you want, right?
• 7:12
  SPEAKER_00: Um, obviously, with partners, that's a win-win relationship and you are building value together.
• 7:17
  SPEAKER_00: But at the end of the day, you need to convince them that it can work.
• 7:20
  SPEAKER_00: So finding very good sellers that are also interesting in working with additional parties is what um I brought on from my direct days.
• 7:30
  SPEAKER_02: Do you think that complicates the balance with the fact that obviously Dell Tech needs to also be interesting to end customers?
• 7:36
  SPEAKER_02: So you need to sell to end customers, so to speak, but also to those partners to create that kind of sticky value proposition?
• 7:43
  SPEAKER_00: I don't think so, because so if we if we look at Dell Tech, right, as we are a very expert business.
• 7:50
  SPEAKER_00: We focus on very focused industries.
• 7:52
  SPEAKER_00: So when we go and recruit partners or work with our partners, they are very specialized.
• 7:57
  SPEAKER_00: They do something very, very well.
• 7:59
  SPEAKER_00: It could be in a territory, it could be an industry, it could be an additional software that is really work very well with ours.
• 8:06
  SPEAKER_00: So um we go and find the gaps and leveraging partners to close these gaps.
• 8:12
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 8:12
  SPEAKER_02: I I think that raises a good point.
• 8:14
  SPEAKER_02: I remember when I was in like heavy industry tech um that the partners we had were very different than generic partners.
• 8:22
  SPEAKER_02: They were often also subject matter experts in a certain field, whether that's governance or or regulations or or another type of software.
• 8:29
  SPEAKER_02: And what I noticed is that you could always find what partners were a good fit if you didn't have to explain your solution to them 10 times.
• 8:36
  SPEAKER_02: I'll never I'll never forget working with um certain analyst firms and just being in these analyst briefings, just explaining the basics over and over because it was so niche.
• 8:46
  SPEAKER_02: Um and if you look at Deltec, Deltech's world is government contractors, engineering firms, professional services, obviously pretty specialized customer base.
• 8:54
  SPEAKER_02: I keep thinking about how differently partner ecosystems need to be built depending on how specific the vertical is.
• 9:01
  SPEAKER_02: So, in your specific space, what does a strong partner ecosystem look like compared to like a more horizontal uh software category?
• 9:09
  SPEAKER_02: What partners do you focus on and why?
• 9:11
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's back to basics, right?
• 9:13
  SPEAKER_00: So I think we we could do we do two things.
• 9:15
  SPEAKER_00: The first one is adding an ideal partner profile.
• 9:18
  SPEAKER_00: And it seems very basic, like you need one, but you need one that match your industry.
• 9:22
  SPEAKER_00: It cannot be the same for government contracting versus architecture engineering versus consulting, right?
• 9:27
  SPEAKER_00: So what's your ideal partner profile for this?
• 9:30
  SPEAKER_00: I'm picking three industries.
• 9:32
  SPEAKER_00: And then, as I mentioned before, is like which gap I'm trying to cover with with my partners.
• 9:37
  SPEAKER_00: So it could be a jails.
• 9:39
  SPEAKER_00: We don't have any, we are not on the ground in South Africa, for example.
• 9:42
  SPEAKER_00: So we will go and look to the market and say, okay, which company I could partner with in that territory to make sure they are very well positioned and recognized to sell my software because I'm trusting them to do it.
• 9:54
  SPEAKER_00: Or in the government contracting space, we are going to look for companies that have an expertise and recognize in regulation and compliance and this type of areas.
• 10:05
  SPEAKER_00: So filling the gaps, looking at your ideal partner profile, looking at your ideal customer profile, and matching the threes.
• 10:13
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 10:14
  SPEAKER_02: That makes sense.
• 10:15
  SPEAKER_02: Do you think that's that makes it easier because you have that focus, or more difficult because you have less partners to choose from?
• 10:21
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, that's a very good question.
• 10:24
  SPEAKER_00: I would say both, right?
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_00: Because we are very clear about what we want.
• 10:28
  SPEAKER_00: And then is the question is where where do you find them sometimes?
• 10:32
  SPEAKER_00: Where do you compromise within the three areas, right?
• 10:35
  SPEAKER_00: Um, something that is very, very clear to me, you know, as a partner leader, is we are never going to build a channel with like thousands and thousands of partners, right?
• 10:45
  SPEAKER_00: We are very large, they're focused on building very, very strong relationship with the right one and making sure they stay with us.
• 10:52
  SPEAKER_00: And we find this common interest and this common joint value proposition to support customers.
• 10:58
  SPEAKER_00: We are a small channel in comparison to other companies.
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and I I think that allows, and I think you you hit the nail on the head when you said like it's easier and it's more difficult, right?
• 11:06
  SPEAKER_02: It's more focused, so you have less less kind of noise in the channel.
• 11:10
  SPEAKER_02: But then again, you do indeed need to keep those relationships strong.
• 11:13
  SPEAKER_02: You have to keep those relationships kind of on point and focused to make sure that you can actually do the sales you need, because if one of those partners drops, you have a bigger problem than if you have like 20 channel partners that could pick up the Slack at any time, right?
• 11:25
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 11:26
  SPEAKER_02: Um, so let's talk a little bit about your role at Dell Tech.
• 11:30
  SPEAKER_02: You took over Dell Tech's global channel and marketplace uh only a couple months ago, but you spent years in that team.
• 11:37
  SPEAKER_02: So I can imagine that stepping into the top seat of something you already knew well tends to change your view of it.
• 11:43
  SPEAKER_02: So, what looks different now that you own the whole picture and and what are you focusing on at the moment?
• 11:49
  SPEAKER_00: Great question.
• 11:50
  SPEAKER_00: So, as you mentioned, I was within that team since a long time.
• 11:53
  SPEAKER_00: So when I took the whole, I really took the time to slow down.
• 11:58
  SPEAKER_00: And not doing the I know everything, I've been there, I've been doing it since a long time, I know the company, so I know where to go.
• 12:05
  SPEAKER_00: But listening, listening to um my direct report, personal to the team, listening to the surrounding business unit and also the partners to see what do we do well, what needs to be improved, and where we can go based on where the market is going to, right?
• 12:20
  SPEAKER_00: And then something very new to me was taking on the marketplace.
• 12:24
  SPEAKER_00: That's something I've never done.
• 12:25
  SPEAKER_00: I was really focused on, you know, selling areas, of the co-seller or your reseller.
• 12:30
  SPEAKER_00: So that's that's been a very interesting part, I would say, of my whole, because I always felt that we needed to bring, um, as I mentioned before, like the right ecosystem of partner for our customers.
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_00: And I see huge value into marketplace.
• 12:43
  SPEAKER_00: Um, this is this is strengthening us, right?
• 12:46
  SPEAKER_00: Because our software cannot do everything and anything.
• 12:49
  SPEAKER_00: So we definitely need to partner with additional companies to cover our gaps.
• 12:54
  SPEAKER_00: Once again, you know, repeating myself here, but uh to cover the gaps that we have.
• 12:58
  SPEAKER_00: And so looking at the marketplace on how we could really leverage additional software and build a trusted relationship with them, which is not competitive, is an interesting area.
• 13:09
  SPEAKER_00: So that's something that's very a big part of what I've been doing in the last few months, and thinking on how can can really the marketplace integrate into the partner strategy within Dell Tech?
• 13:19
  SPEAKER_00: So that's um that's an area.
• 13:21
  SPEAKER_02: That's fascinating.
• 13:22
  SPEAKER_02: So I I always get interested when I hear specialized and kind of complexed software houses do marketplaces.
• 13:28
  SPEAKER_02: Can you maybe talk a little bit more about how that works in practice?
• 13:31
  SPEAKER_02: Obviously, when you have certain very highly focused partners, how a marketplace structure then works.
• 13:36
  SPEAKER_02: When I I can imagine that the implementation process of a solution like Dell Techs with the ecosystem around it is not just click and it turns on and I put in my credit card.
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_02: You know what I mean?
• 13:48
  SPEAKER_00: I would say it's involving the partners early, right?
• 13:51
  SPEAKER_00: We are speaking about the marketplace, but we can speak about any partners.
• 13:55
  SPEAKER_00: The worst thing you can do is like going through the entire sales process and thinking now my prospect or my customer is telling me there is a gap, so I need to go and find the right partners, right?
• 14:04
  SPEAKER_00: Is really doing well your discovery stage as a seller, right?
• 14:09
  SPEAKER_00: And during the discovery schedule stage, being able to say, okay, I see that there is some areas that we are not covering.
• 14:16
  SPEAKER_00: So where I could find the right people to cover these areas, right?
• 14:21
  SPEAKER_00: Um, and involve your partner early, I would say.
• 14:25
  SPEAKER_00: They are not going to slow you down.
• 14:26
  SPEAKER_00: So a misconception is like if I'm involving partners, it's going to slow my sales process.
• 14:31
  SPEAKER_00: So if you are direct sellers and listening to the podcast, don't think that partners are going to slow down your process.
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_00: Just make sure to involve them and very clear, being very clear about your RACI, you know, what the roles and responsibilities, how they are going to work with you, how they are going to influence your deal.
• 14:48
  SPEAKER_00: And maybe most of the time, we see that the deal value is higher when you involve the partners.
• 14:54
  SPEAKER_00: And sometimes the sales process is also faster.
• 14:56
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 14:57
  SPEAKER_02: It's actually really funny that you mentioned that, right?
• 15:00
  SPEAKER_02: Because it seems intuitive if you think about it, oh yeah, partners are going to slow down my deal because there's another variable.
• 15:05
  SPEAKER_02: But if you if you make it very simple and think about yourself personally, like if if I find someone on LinkedIn that I want to speak to, yeah, and I don't know that person and I go direct, I'm going to have to take a bunch of extra steps to lay that connection.
• 15:19
  SPEAKER_01: For sure.
• 15:19
  SPEAKER_02: But if I find out that one of my friends knows this person, worked with them, and I call my friend and say, hey, can you introduce me?
• 15:25
  SPEAKER_02: I skip the entire kind of first stage of that process.
• 15:29
  SPEAKER_02: So actually, it's far more intuitive to think that partners speed up the sales process as opposed to slow it down.
• 15:36
  SPEAKER_00: And there is a bit of ego things also, is when you are selling, there is an aspect of being very proud.
• 15:44
  SPEAKER_00: This is a deal.
• 15:45
  SPEAKER_00: I lead the sales cycle.
• 15:46
  SPEAKER_00: I brought this deal.
• 15:47
  SPEAKER_00: I signed my customer.
• 15:49
  SPEAKER_00: It's mine, which is very natural, right?
• 15:51
  SPEAKER_00: So when you have a lot of people involved within your sales cycle, sometimes there is a feeling, oh, it's less, it's going to be less mine, which is a misconception, right?
• 16:00
  SPEAKER_00: It's because you are still leading and you are building the team.
• 16:03
  SPEAKER_00: It's like, you know, professional athletes.
• 16:05
  SPEAKER_00: Um, if um a soccer player or footballer on the field, they are going to have an entire team that is supporting them to go and play the game.
• 16:13
  SPEAKER_00: So partnership is exactly the same.
• 16:15
  SPEAKER_00: It's like we are the team surrounding the seller to help them sell faster, sell more, and service better our customers.
• 16:23
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's almost like a perspective change that's needed, right?
• 16:26
  SPEAKER_02: Indeed.
• 16:26
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 16:27
  SPEAKER_02: Uh you you can still have those almost those dopamine hits, right?
• 16:31
  SPEAKER_02: When you close the deal, what difference does it make if you close it with a partner, you close it yourself, you're still closing it, right?
• 16:37
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and more partner to celebrate with, right?
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
• 16:41
  SPEAKER_02: You're gonna get more confetti.
• 16:43
  SPEAKER_02: Uh I think it's such a good point because I I think it's also very easy to forget that regardless if you're going direct or indirect, you always have a support structure around you.
• 16:52
  SPEAKER_02: You're never doing enterprise deals alone.
• 16:54
  SPEAKER_02: Uh, you mentioned the subject matter experts that that come along.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_02: You've got the solutions engineers, you've got the legal finance team, etc.
• 17:01
  SPEAKER_02: You're always doing this together.
• 17:02
  SPEAKER_02: So I think that mindset shift um um can can really help sellers understand and embrace the partnership model.
• 17:09
  SPEAKER_02: And I think it also aligns with something you actually said that when you came into this new role, that you didn't come in and say, I understand everything, I've been in this team, I know what to do.
• 17:18
  SPEAKER_02: No, you take a step back, and I think it's uh there's a philosopher that said something very similar to this.
• 17:23
  SPEAKER_02: And he said something like, Um, sometimes it's good to take a step back and take a look at the assumptions you hold most dear.
• 17:29
  SPEAKER_02: I allow it.
• 17:29
  SPEAKER_02: I love it.
• 17:30
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's it's uh it's David Hume, I think.
• 17:32
  SPEAKER_02: Um I'm I'm I'm super well learned, you know.
• 17:35
  SPEAKER_02: I have to say that on the podcast.
• 17:36
  SPEAKER_01: Uh but no, I think it's a really good- Did you prepare that?
• 17:39
  SPEAKER_01: No, I'm joking.
• 17:40
  SPEAKER_02: I did, yeah, it's in my notes right here.
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_00: No, I that's AI.
• 17:43
  SPEAKER_00: That's AI, Michelle.
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_02: It is, yeah.
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_02: This this philosopher doesn't even exist.
• 17:47
  SPEAKER_02: It was a hallucination.
• 17:48
  SPEAKER_02: Um, but I think that's a good thing.
• 17:49
  SPEAKER_01: I mean that's a great one.
• 17:51
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 17:51
  SPEAKER_02: It really is, right?
• 17:52
  SPEAKER_02: To just take a step back and say the way that I do things, is that actually the right way I to do things right now, as opposed to how I learned it 10 years ago or what I've become used to, and it really helps change that perspective.
• 18:04
  SPEAKER_02: And I think it also um aligns with with my next question a little bit.
• 18:08
  SPEAKER_02: So um we kind of talked about this, like people that treat partner-led sales as a completely different discipline from direct sales with its own playbook and rules.
• 18:17
  SPEAKER_02: I wonder where do you land?
• 18:18
  SPEAKER_02: Is it a different game or is it just the same game with more players?
• 18:21
  SPEAKER_00: Uh definitely the same game with more players, right?
• 18:24
  SPEAKER_00: So um it's something we started to do um a couple of years ago is making sure our partners know our sales process.
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_00: By that I mean if you are we are if we are using a framework, making sure that our partners know are aware of our framework.
• 18:41
  SPEAKER_00: So then they know how we sell and they can understand our processes and making sure they are sometimes replicating the same process with their sellers.
• 18:49
  SPEAKER_00: So it's making us more sticky, um, I would say.
• 18:52
  SPEAKER_00: But yeah, it's it's definitely something where um you cannot avoid partners.
• 18:58
  SPEAKER_00: That's impossible, right?
• 18:59
  SPEAKER_00: And um maybe that's my because I'm in partnership, but uh I don't see any software company today that is going to say we are going to only sell direct, direct, direct and have no partnership in place, right?
• 19:10
  SPEAKER_00: It's it's a fundamental.
• 19:11
  SPEAKER_00: So when you are a seller, you need really need to think about how I'm going to arm myself with all these people that can support my um my sales site.
• 19:19
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I I think that that comes back to that ego side of things, right?
• 19:23
  SPEAKER_02: Like, oh, we can do it ourselves.
• 19:24
  SPEAKER_02: And I as a someone who's in marketing, I've seen that with startups and scale-ups that are like really well funded and say everything, all our deals are inbound, we don't need any marketing, and at one moment you just hit a wall.
• 19:36
  SPEAKER_02: Uh yeah, and the inbound dries up, and then it's almost too late, right?
• 19:40
  SPEAKER_02: Because you've not set up the uh the marketing org to actually be useful, and then you have to scramble to get things right.
• 19:46
  SPEAKER_02: And I think it's with with partnerships, it's the same thing.
• 19:48
  SPEAKER_02: Like involve them early, build those relationships, and they will drive change in the industries you're you're looking to uh to hit, right?
• 19:55
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 19:56
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 19:56
  SPEAKER_02: Um talking about ego, uh, I I want to talk a little bit about representation in the channel because you were nominated um for this podcast by uh Danielle Simon at Action.
• 20:08
  SPEAKER_02: Um and I had a fantastic conversation with her and also about um um gender representation in the channel.
• 20:14
  SPEAKER_02: I personally see um more women in the channel these days, but it's still heavily male at the leadership level.
• 20:21
  SPEAKER_02: And I would like to hear from you, because I think it's important to highlight this.
• 20:25
  SPEAKER_02: What's one thing that would do the most to get more women into these leadership roles?
• 20:30
  SPEAKER_00: So I'm very involved, and you probably know it because when we chatted before the podcast, I'm part of Woman in Alliances, which is a volunteer organization across the globe that supports women, um, young professionals, but also people later in the in their careers.
• 20:45
  SPEAKER_00: I'm also a very active member, part of the leadership team of women at Dell Tech.
• 20:49
  SPEAKER_00: So for me, it's really very important to involve being involved in promoting women in tech.
• 20:56
  SPEAKER_00: And the reason why is because when I started, I was probably, you know, part of the what 10% that were in tech.
• 21:02
  SPEAKER_00: So I often uh spend my time in a room filled with male colleagues, which wasn't easy at the time.
• 21:09
  SPEAKER_00: I would say we made a lot of progress in the last 70 years, but 17 years ago, the picture was completely different from today.
• 21:17
  SPEAKER_00: What I've learned is in you know, being involved in this movement at Dell Tech and women in alliances, is initially I thought we need to provide mentors to young professionals.
• 21:28
  SPEAKER_00: So these young ladies starting and entering the market need to have some mentor to know how to navigate, to know how to promote themselves, to, you know, we all have an imposter syndrome, so how do we deal with it also as a woman?
• 21:41
  SPEAKER_00: Or what I call the good girl syndrome, which is I'm going to do my job well and people will see it, which is not the truth, right?
• 21:48
  SPEAKER_01: No.
• 21:48
  SPEAKER_00: And then I took a step back recently and I think we don't need mentor, we need sponsor within the organization.
• 21:54
  SPEAKER_00: So my recommendation if you are in a manager role or in a leadership role within The business, if you see young, talented female, instead of being the mentor, be their sponsor, promote themselves, put them in in project where they could have the visibility that need to evolve, and how we are going to change.
• 22:13
  SPEAKER_00: Um, I think the perspective, but it will take time.
• 22:16
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I I really love that approach because it moves away from the indeed like like the male-female dichotomy, and it really moves into lifting lifting people up and empowering people.
• 22:25
  SPEAKER_00: And anyone, you know, young talents.
• 22:26
  SPEAKER_00: We are speaking about women, but uh young talent could be, you know, anyone.
• 22:31
  SPEAKER_00: Just make sure you you are smart enough to sponsor them within your organization.
• 22:36
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and there again comes that like lack of ego, like lifting other people up requires you to not focus on yourself, right?
• 22:42
  SPEAKER_02: It requires you to focus on other people, and I think that's so important in uh in business.
• 22:46
  SPEAKER_02: Absolutely.
• 22:47
  SPEAKER_02: Um and uh uh in a previous role, I actually recorded a podcast uh with someone who was very uh kind of at the forefront of um uh inclusion in kind of more complex workspaces, and she came up with this term called inclusive innovation.
• 23:01
  SPEAKER_02: And I think that aligns with with what you're saying now.
• 23:03
  SPEAKER_02: I love it so much because it's really about shaping the systems to also empower uh different people to rise to the top.
• 23:11
  SPEAKER_02: And I I thought that was just such a great point, and I think every every company listening, you know, just just focus on what you're trying to achieve and and lift good people up to the roles they deserve, um, regardless of whether they shout the loudest.
• 23:24
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, absolutely.
• 23:25
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, that's a big yes, as you can say.
• 23:30
  SPEAKER_02: Um so I have a question to you, but but before we end with your final thoughts and tips and tricks and words of wisdom.
• 23:37
  SPEAKER_02: Um, obviously, you were nominated for this podcast.
• 23:40
  SPEAKER_02: Um, I'm going to ask you to also nominate someone for the next podcast and kind of keep this train going.
• 23:46
  SPEAKER_02: Um who do you think we should have next?
• 23:48
  SPEAKER_00: So I would love to see Tina Valent into uh this podcast.
• 23:52
  SPEAKER_00: Uh, she's part of Woman Aliencies, you know.
• 23:55
  SPEAKER_00: Um I've been I had the pleasure to organize so many events with Tina, and she is a fantastic advocate for young professional but also women in the channels.
• 24:06
  SPEAKER_00: She also has an AI spin to it where she wasn't, you know, close to AI and what it started to happen, she took on a role on AI, so she's got a very interesting perspective.
• 24:18
  SPEAKER_00: And last but not least, she is also she has so many businesses.
• 24:21
  SPEAKER_00: So fantastic woman to chat with uh about a lot of topics.
• 24:25
  SPEAKER_02: That's super cool.
• 24:26
  SPEAKER_02: I I can't wait to talk to her.
• 24:27
  SPEAKER_02: Um, so to wrap this up, do you have any final insights, tips, or tricks that you'd like to share with me or the audience or obviously both?
• 24:35
  SPEAKER_00: Any tips.
• 24:35
  SPEAKER_00: I've got so many, but if um I have to pick one would be based on my experience in the last few months in taking on this new role, is you have to slow down in order to go fast, right?
• 24:48
  SPEAKER_00: And maybe I said it before, but taking the time to really think about where you are going, how you want to go, and you know, what do you want people to feel about it is very important.
• 24:59
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, I love that.
• 24:59
  SPEAKER_02: And it's also um final words of wisdom that I haven't yet heard on this podcast.
• 25:04
  SPEAKER_02: I think it's such a good point that people always have the intuition to step into a new role and just go fast.
• 25:09
  SPEAKER_02: I need to prove myself, I need to do this, I need to understand.
• 25:11
  SPEAKER_02: No, no, no, just take a step back, take stock of what you have, what you can build, and then the process after that will be a breeze.
• 25:17
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 25:18
  SPEAKER_02: I love it.
• 25:19
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you so much for sharing your thoughts and taking the time to speak with me.
• 25:22
  SPEAKER_02: And uh, you, dear listeners, thanks for tuning in, and we'll see you in the next episode.
• 25:26
  SPEAKER_02: Thanks, Elise.
• 25:28
  SPEAKER_02: Bye.