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The #1 Sales Mistake Your Making That's Costing You $$$ · Mortgage Marketing Radio

• 0:00
  Hello, my friend. Welcome to this episode of the Mortgage Marketing Radio podcast. I'm really
• 0:15
  excited to bring my special guest to today's conversation. And if you just happen to be a real
• 0:21
  estate agent who is listening to this podcast because your mortgage partner shared this conversation
• 0:28
  with you, I want you to thank them after you listen to today's conversation. The reason why they
• 0:32
  shared this conversation with you is because they want to pour into you and help you succeed
• 0:38
  in today's market. And this is just one way that they're demonstrating their commitment to helping
• 0:43
  you succeed is by sharing this conversation with you today. So please let them know that you
• 0:48
  appreciate the sharing of this conversation and then get with them about some of the ideas that are
• 0:52
  shared with how you can partner up and execute on some of these ideas and strategies to help
• 0:56
  you both succeed collectively in the market in 2025. So this week my special guest is
• 1:03
  Sharan Sivatsa, president of Real Brokridge. He joined Real in December 2022 and since then the
• 1:10
  company has taken off like a rocket ship. Here's some key highlights since Sharan joined the brokerage.
• 1:15
  It's increased the number of agents by more than 200% going from around 7,000 agents to I think
• 1:22
  it's upwards of 25,000 agents now at this point. Real brokerage moved up from number 11 and number
• 1:27
  six in the 2024 Real Trans verified brokerage rankings by transaction sides. Real is now
• 1:32
  recognized as a top 20 brokerage with over 21 billion in sales and despite industry challenges
• 1:38
  in 2024, Real Brokridge saw an enviable growth in its share price, reflecting strong financial
• 1:44
  performance and investor confidence. What Sharan brings to the table is an emphasis on the importance
• 1:50
  of comprehensive training programs, revenue sharing models and innovative technology solutions.
• 1:55
  As you'll hear in today's conversation, Sharan believes that one of the key areas that agents
• 2:00
  need to get better is in skills, skills around dialogue, skills around marketing and technology,
• 2:05
  and today's session is a clinic on fast, fired, rapid pace ideas for you to start implementing
• 2:13
  in your business today to start to capture more market share and start to have more conversations
• 2:18
  so you can have more transactions. And so without further ado, and by the way, if you want to
• 2:23
  connect with Sharan, make sure you check the links in the show notes where you can follow him on
• 2:28
  Instagram, check out his YouTube channel. There's a ton of content that Sharan puts out there that's
• 2:33
  just free training for you to become a better agent or a mortgage professional and I encourage you
• 2:37
  to check out the links in the show notes to connect with Sharan and learn more. So without further ado,
• 2:42
  let's get into this week's show. Sharan, welcome to the show. Jeff, thank you so much for having me.
• 2:47
  I just want to say this before we get started is a lot of people don't realize how much effort this
• 2:52
  takes to get the gas on, to think about a show, to research them, and then package and deliver both
• 2:59
  in conversation and post-production to get it to folks so that they can consume like a good 30-minute
• 3:04
  worth of like package knowledge that they can use for their lives and their careers. So could
• 3:08
  us do you, man, for taking the effort to put all this together? I know a lot of people appreciate it
• 3:12
  and so do I. Appreciate that very, very much. It's a labor of love is what it is.
• 3:16
  Started eight years ago over 350 episodes now, so I must be enjoying it at some level.
• 3:23
  Okay, so let's just jump right into it. Here we are. It's basically February 3rd, 2025.
• 3:29
  You know, I've been using this term transaction recession. You obviously are very up close and
• 3:35
  personal with the general vibe from real estate agents in mortgage as well. How would you
• 3:41
  ascertain? Let's just take that term transaction recession. How would you respond to that? What would
• 3:45
  be your take of the current state of the housing or real estate market? Yeah, so I think whenever you
• 3:50
  analyze anything today, you want to give it some context, otherwise you don't really know what to
• 3:56
  compare it to, right? And so if we, what we know what happened recently and that would be kind of
• 4:02
  like during the pandemic timeframe was we were in a momentum-based market. The consumer was
• 4:07
  moving faster than the agent was and so we, the agent was reacting and responding to whatever was
• 4:13
  happening to the momentum that the consumer was generating. Made a bin, a chance to move away,
• 4:18
  made a bin, a chance to work remotely, made a bin a chance because they got some liquidity in
• 4:22
  their house or low rates or whatever. It created this momentum-based market. When that momentum-based
• 4:27
  market changed, the agents didn't know what to do, per se. And so it quickly turned to a skills-based
• 4:34
  market. And a lot of people are unwilling to accept that a skills-based market exists because
• 4:39
  the average everyday agent assumes that they have the skills to run a transaction. But the problem
• 4:45
  with having the skills to running a transaction is you have to be in constant practice of having
• 4:48
  the skills to run a transaction. And when you're in a momentum-based market, the skills of running
• 4:52
  the transaction dramatically reduces. You're just reacting to whatever the consumer is asking,
• 4:56
  the market's moving fast. You have like 70 closes. Everything is accelerated. And I think what
• 5:01
  happened in the, like the two years of the pandemic is an agent, the everyday agent forgot to be
• 5:06
  everyday agents. That's what happened. And then when the, when the slowdown in number of transactions
• 5:12
  hit, which is what you're calling a transaction recession in a lot of ways, you know, we have,
• 5:16
  today we have roughly 1.5 Asian million agents in the United States called licenses. We have less
• 5:20
  than that in active inventory. So you have less than the number of active homes for sale that the
• 5:25
  number of agents have. And what does that mean? That means that, oh yeah, we see agents saying, oh,
• 5:30
  70% of agents didn't do a deal in the last 12 months. Now, that is not a surprise. Like it's
• 5:35
  interesting that agents think that that's a surprise, but that is not a surprise. What is important
• 5:39
  here is the other 35% that actually did the deals. What made them better? And the everyday agent
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  is unwilling to accept that their skills made them better. And when I say skills, and here's
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  what I mean, is the, is the ability to talk to a client? Is the ability to actually have a
• 5:56
  conversation to get them from maybe to a yes? Is the ability to solve a transaction creatively?
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  Is the ability to actually work with a lender partner and not look at them like a vendor? Small
• 6:05
  things like that are big deals here. And I think our everyday agents have lost their skills. So
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  if we can just go, and here's the word that I hate, Jeff, like the whole back to basics,
• 6:15
  if anybody says back to basics, you just want to punch them. Because no, I'm dead serious,
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  because back to basics means going back 30 years and doing what they did then. That is terrible,
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  because 30 years ago, 20 years ago, 10 years ago, four years ago is not what we have today.
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  Right? The back to basics conversation is said by coaches and consultants who have never talked
• 6:35
  to a client in their lives. That is what back to basics is. It is a smart thing for them to say to
• 6:39
  make agents feel better about themselves, make loan officers be better about themselves.
• 6:42
  Back to basics is terrible. What we want is sharper skills. In today's environment, the average
• 6:48
  consumer knows more than the average agent. How do we have a better skill? And I'll give you an
• 6:52
  example, right? Because your audience likes this. The number one thing that agents will do is we'll
• 6:58
  say they borrowed the skill from run random script book from some random coach that says,
• 7:03
  oh, Jeff, have you ever had any thoughts of selling? Like, there cannot be a dumber thing to ask
• 7:09
  anybody. And the reason is this, right? I'll tell you, my next door neighbor is a life insurance
• 7:13
  agent, right? And he said to me, he's like, hey, Sharon, I had a bunch of agents come by a knock on
• 7:17
  our door and they asked me a question. I said, what? They said, well, they said, hey, knock knock,
• 7:21
  have you ever had any thoughts of selling? And I said, well, what's wrong with that? You know what he
• 7:24
  said? He goes, well, that's the dumbest question ever. I said, why? He goes, well, that would be like
• 7:28
  me, Sharon, walking up to your door and say, knock knock, have you ever had any thoughts of dying?
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  Right? And the reason is nobody says, have you ever had any thoughts of selling? Because some coach
• 7:38
  who's never actually talked to a client in their lives actually told a person, oh, I'm going to
• 7:41
  ask this, nobody wants to be asked the question, have you ever had any thoughts of selling?
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  Because it's two things, one, it's sleazy and two, it's leading the witness. Instead, what do you
• 7:49
  ask? That's what I mean by having bad skills. Instead, you ask this, you say, I call this the
• 7:54
  game plan frame. And you say, hey, Jeff, has anyone taken the time to sit down and walk you through
• 7:59
  what it takes to sell a home in today's market? Now, that is skill, right? So I'm asking,
• 8:05
  has anyone taken the time to sit down and walk you through what it takes to sell a home in today's
• 8:08
  market? Now, if you said, oh, yeah, my cousin is an agent right here in Orange County and he laid
• 8:14
  out a great plan for me. Now, that makes sense. That's cool. So now I know that I have no shot at this
• 8:18
  business at all. But instead, if I say, have you ever had any thoughts of selling, that's dumb.
• 8:22
  So while somebody thinks that that is skill, it's not. And that's the difference between the 35%
• 8:27
  of the agents that are winning and the 70% of the agents that don't have a deal right now.
• 8:31
  Wow, that's awesome. That's a lot in there. Do you think that technique of the door knocking
• 8:38
  and using that phrase is trying to play the numbers game of just catching the right person at the
• 8:43
  right time? Well, think about this for a second, right? When we are in JV sports, numbers make
• 8:51
  sense. You're like, hey, I tell my son, hey, dude, you're playing hockey. Take as many shots on
• 8:57
  goal as you want and one of them will go in. That's JV, right? If you place in the NHL and he has
• 9:02
  200 shots on goal and he makes one goal, he's going to get kicked off the team. So again,
• 9:07
  I actually think brokers, owners, managers, coaches and consultants are the entire reason why agents,
• 9:12
  like everyday agents don't get support. It is my fault. It is my fault. I am taking responsibility
• 9:17
  for this. And the reason is this, right? The fact that we think, the fact that we have been taught
• 9:22
  that sales is a numbers game is a lie. Because what it says is, hey, you just put in more effort
• 9:27
  without any skill and eventually, you know, even a, even a blind squirrel finds an acorn,
• 9:32
  right? Like, that's not the answer, right? The answer is, imagine this. Why does, why do you like
• 9:37
  Steph Curry? Why? Why? Because because his efficacy is efficiency ratio is so much higher.
• 9:41
  For every 10 shots he takes, he makes nine. That's why. So we don't, people don't realize this.
• 9:47
  We, as the world gets smaller and as more information, as the consumers have more information,
• 9:52
  you're going to get less at bats. When you get less at bats, you're going to start to
• 9:56
  paying higher cost for lead. A higher cost for leads means more cost for conversations.
• 10:00
  It means you have to talk to more people. So if your skill is not good enough, you're,
• 10:03
  guess you're going to say, well, I talked everybody in Facebook lead suck. Well, that's not it.
• 10:07
  You just don't have good skill. So I'm a big proponent of not saying, oh, you know, it's a numbers,
• 10:13
  it's not a numbers game. It's a skills game, right? If you and I went into the marketplace,
• 10:17
  I can don't knock four doors and get 12 deals. I say it again, I could don't knock four doors and
• 10:21
  get 12 deals, not four, right? That is the skill. And so if agents can switch their mindset and say,
• 10:26
  wait a minute, how can I turn one opportunity to? How can I turn the game plan from? So I'll give you
• 10:31
  a really great example. So a lot of people will say, I talked this game plan from yesterday to a
• 10:35
  bunch of agents. I said, hey, has anyone taken the time to sit down and walk you through what it
• 10:38
  takes to buy a home in today's market, right? And then they'll say, well, not really. Now, most
• 10:43
  agents don't have the skill on what to do next, right? So now what you've asked a nice soft question,
• 10:48
  what is the next question? The next question is called a when then frame. Or like you say this, hey,
• 10:52
  hey, Jeff, why don't we, right? It's called a why don't we so that? Hey, why don't we get together
• 10:57
  for a cup of coffee, right? And before your coffee gets cold, I will walk you through the seven or
• 11:03
  eight things that are actually are important in buying a home in today's market. Now, what have I
• 11:07
  done? Why don't we get together? Incidentally, you're like, man, I don't want to get together with you.
• 11:10
  It's going to take two hours, blah, blah. No, before your coffee gets cold, that means it less than seven
• 11:14
  minutes. I'm going to walk you through that. Now, what does it do? It dramatically takes away all
• 11:18
  objections, right? Small little things on skill changes the ability for you to get more appointments. So
• 11:23
  if I get to an open house and 20 people came into my open house, and I'm able to sell set 20
• 11:28
  or 20 appointments versus the everyday agent that's like, I need more open houses, I need more open
• 11:32
  houses. Like, yeah, dude, you got 12 open houses and you said one appointment. Like you suck.
• 11:37
  Right? But no one taught you the skill because he just told you that you need more ad bats and more
• 11:41
  effort and it's a numbers game. And so you con yourself into believing that your lack of skill and
• 11:46
  the market's changing is what's not getting your results. But you never want to focus on one, two,
• 11:50
  three things of skill that can get you better results. What I heard a lot of in there in terms of
• 11:54
  like there are different skills and the one you're kind of hitting on right now is language,
• 11:58
  right? The ability to use language in an effective way. How do you recommend, because it's funny,
• 12:04
  I would agree with you there that a lot of people are not skilled with language. But any recommendations
• 12:09
  for agents to get better at that? Yeah, totally, right? So here's an interesting thing. I actually think
• 12:16
  scripts are good, but you have to check the source of who wrote them, right? So most of our
• 12:22
  script books today that exist in our marketplace, most of them, especially the popular ones, Jeff,
• 12:28
  were written by somebody 49 years ago, who's crusty old right now, who's never talked to a client
• 12:33
  in their lives, right? Like no, no, it's the truth, though, right? That's what I know. That's why I'm laughing,
• 12:38
  because I'm getting a visual in my mind of some of these people. And I don't, I actually think they
• 12:43
  mean well, I think they have really good intentions. But I was in an 11.5 million dollars thing
• 12:48
  appointment yesterday with one of our agents, right? I'm handling the objections day to day,
• 12:51
  I'm not saying I'm amazing, but I'm just saying I had to learn very quickly because otherwise my
• 12:55
  agents, I have 25,000 agents, my agents lose trust in me as the ability for me not to have the
• 13:00
  modeling skill to help them, right? So here's how you get better on the skill. Number one is
• 13:07
  want to check the source of where you're getting this information from. If that person has not
• 13:12
  talked to a client in their lives, then I would, I would be a little wary of getting,
• 13:16
  I woke up in the morning and I wrote a skill on an expired, like that's dumb, like you
• 13:22
  shouldn't do that, right? The second thing is a lot of people don't realize this, but if
• 13:28
  if they, if you're an everyday agent listening to the show, you should go back and listen to my
• 13:32
  scripting. When I started scripting, I changed my tonality, right? So it's not what you say,
• 13:37
  it's how you say it. So I could say, hey, hey, Jeff, has anyone taken the time to actually walk
• 13:44
  no, right? I have to, it's an empathetic tone. Hey, Jeff, I don't, I don't start her by the way.
• 13:51
  Has anyone taken the time to sit down and walk you through what a truly takes to buy home in
• 13:57
  today's market? What am I doing? I'm, I'm manufacturing safety, right? Tonality is super
• 14:02
  important. You're performing a little bit actually. Of course, right? And so the second, the second
• 14:07
  thing is to kind of think about tonality, like if I'm saying something, it is not what I say,
• 14:14
  like I, it's not what I say, I have to figure out what is the core emotion that I have to deliver
• 14:19
  in this. Right. So I'm delivering empathy and safety. Hey, has anyone taken the time to actually
• 14:24
  do this for you? And then I'll say, hey, would that help you? Would you possibly be interested in
• 14:29
  like walking through what the plan may look like so that it could help your family? Yeah. And so,
• 14:35
  yeah, I want to jump in here for a second, because I'm curious. That's actually the word I was
• 14:40
  going to use. What I'm hearing in your tone is curiosity. Sure. And I'm wondering this gets
• 14:46
  maybe a little deep psychologically here, but the degree to which the agents who succeed with
• 14:52
  dialogue of actually having some natural curiosity and empathy versus, oh, I've got to use a
• 15:00
  script that makes it sound like I'm curious. You know what I mean? Like the best people, the best
• 15:04
  communicators are ones who are just coming at it right from the heart and being naturally curious.
• 15:08
  Would you agree? 100% and he's the interesting part, Jeff. You even did it right then. You said,
• 15:15
  would you agree? Right. You had the curiosity on whether I agreed or not. Right. But the crazy part
• 15:21
  here is as soon as somebody hears what may be written as a potential objection, they instantly go
• 15:27
  to an objection handler. Right. Right. Instead. So I'll give you an example. Yesterday, the client set
• 15:31
  to us in the appointment, $11.5 million. He said to us, he goes, so Sean, I heard that
• 15:37
  we don't have to pay commissions anymore. So I can instantly go to a commission handling objection
• 15:42
  in my head. But instead, what did I do? I said, how do you mean? That's it. Right. How do you
• 15:50
  have no idea how he heard or what he heard? No, no. So now he has to validate to me what he heard
• 15:57
  so that I can have enough information to actually solve the objection. Most people take the
• 16:02
  objection and they're like, hey, I need to solve the objection. This is an objection handler.
• 16:06
  They let them give you all the information so that you know what objection to solve. Most agents
• 16:11
  will approach things to solve objections without knowing what objection they're trying to solve.
• 16:15
  Most of the time, it's not even an objection. It's just an unanswered question. And so number one,
• 16:22
  figure out the source of who wrote the script. Number two, figure out what emotion needs to be
• 16:26
  delivered around that. And number three, when you read the script and it feels awkward,
• 16:33
  if it feels awkward, it is. That's it. Right. You're going to be awkward to deliver.
• 16:38
  I'll give you an example. If you feel like someone says, oh, this guy actually said this to me when
• 16:43
  I was in, he said, oh, I need to think about it. Well, why didn't we think about it together?
• 16:46
  Two, two heads are better than one. I'm like, are you an idiot? Who says that? You will tell your
• 16:51
  grandmother that? And that's the test, right? The test is, would you tell your grandmother that?
• 16:57
  If you will tell your grandmother that, then it's okay. Because then you know that you have enough
• 17:01
  softness and rapport in this entire conversation. So the third is, if the script feels awkward,
• 17:06
  it is. A lot of the time people will say me, oh, Sean, you know, I have imposter syndrome. I'm like,
• 17:10
  you have imposter syndrome because you are an imposter. You don't deserve it. Like what are you looking
• 17:15
  for? Like making you feel better? No. So I always ask them, like Jeff, so Jeff, for example,
• 17:19
  do you feel like you're an imposter being a podcast host? No. I'll tell you why. Because you have
• 17:25
  over 350 episodes. Then you've stacked the proof in your favor that you are who you say you are.
• 17:31
  Right. Right. That's why you don't feel like an imposter. But I will ask you this. Three episodes
• 17:35
  in. You're like, you felt awkward. You had no proof to stack evidence in your favor that you
• 17:43
  are who you say you are. Now, if an agent is soft kind and emotionally well scripted,
• 17:49
  they don't have to worry. They're not imposter because they just want to have a thoughtful
• 17:53
  conversation in service of the client. And so if they have that, they're not reading off of
• 17:57
  a script, but they know that it's not awkward and so super easy. And that's why all of this is easy.
• 18:01
  Like I was on the, so after the appointment yesterday, Jeff, this listing appointment,
• 18:05
  the agent said to me, he's like, bro, why do I, when I go on appointments with you, why don't we
• 18:10
  get any objections? I'm like, because I have a conversation. I don't try to solve an objection.
• 18:15
  I don't try to crush an objection like you're from stage. Like I'm just saying, how do you mean?
• 18:19
  Oh, you're curious about that. So like the guy said to me, he goes, well, the other agent said it
• 18:25
  was worth that he could get a, he could get a 13 million. And I said, huh, why not 14?
• 18:31
  But like, that's the truth though. That's the truth. Right. And I'll give you the zinger and
• 18:36
  all of this, right? So a lot of agents right now are worried that other agents are buying the listing,
• 18:44
  right? And, and, and, and, and, which is, which is okay because right now when you, when there's
• 18:48
  lower in, by the way, everyone needs to understand this. When there's lower listing inventory, agents
• 18:52
  would rather accumulate listing inventory. They were rather just call, by the listing, called the
• 18:57
  higher price and just take the listing. But we also know that it's not healthy for the homecoming
• 19:02
  on the market and the process, et cetera. So literally, I told him this yesterday, I said, hey,
• 19:06
  Mr. Mrs. Client, would it be okay if I shared something with you about the real estate industry?
• 19:10
  And they said, sure. I said, in the real estate industry, we have an inside baseball term that we call
• 19:15
  buying the listing. Let me explain how this works. The agent will tell you a higher price than they
• 19:20
  can, that can actually get to get you to sign the listing. We call that buying it. And then,
• 19:24
  when they're inside the process with you, they'll get you to negotiate down. Now, you may not know
• 19:29
  this, but since you're in a contract period, you can't really do anything. So you're in a stalemate.
• 19:33
  Either you reduce the listing and they do more marketing or you don't do anything and it just
• 19:36
  sits on the market and it leaves you in a tough situation. And they're like, huh. And I said,
• 19:40
  may I give you a way to protect yourself? What do you think they said? Of course. And I said,
• 19:45
  this is really simple. Did Jimmy tell you that he could get you 13 million? Yeah. Well, you should
• 19:49
  call Jimmy and tell him this. You should say, hey, Jimmy, we are open to going with you on the 13
• 19:54
  million. However, we have one condition. If during the term of the listing, you ask for a price
• 19:59
  adjustment, the listing is automatically canceled. This is what you call skill, right? Most agents
• 20:05
  don't know that because now they think that they have to get in the appointment and and and refute
• 20:10
  Jimmy the agent's credibility on why Jimmy doesn't know what he's doing or how he think you can't do
• 20:15
  that. If you know that they're buying the listing, now I'm giving the client a chance for me to
• 20:20
  protect them. Now, whatever happens in that transaction, I am the star. I either get the listing
• 20:26
  or I don't get the listing and they love me anyway. And if they don't get the listing, it's not
• 20:29
  going to sell. I'm going to get it anyway because I looked out for protecting them, right? Small
• 20:33
  little things like that. No one teaches because they've never talked to a client in their lives.
• 20:37
  Yeah. That's savvy is what that is. That's experience. Yeah. Exactly. Right? Yeah. I love that.
• 20:42
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• 21:58
  grow your agent referrals without chasing and have fun doing it, check out mortgagemarketing.pro
• 22:04
  today. Okay, so the first big takeaway is language. Get skilled at the ability to speak to other
• 22:11
  people. Be empathetic, be curious. It's kind of what I jotted down there. Obviously understand
• 22:16
  your industry so you can sound smart as well. And this whole turn back to the basics.
• 22:26
  Does that mean you're not implying? What pops on my head is this other kind of catchphrase,
• 22:30
  which is conversations leads to contracts. That's ultimately what we need to do. It's
• 22:34
  be having conversations with people. Let's talk about that. So all conversion happens in
• 22:41
  conversation. I'm a full believer that that's sales 101. However, here's the fundamental thing
• 22:47
  that's broken in our industry, which is people think branding drives conversations. People think
• 22:54
  me saying, hey, Jeff and Sharan are number one, that drives conversations. It doesn't. So they say
• 23:00
  the just listed postcard, for example, like just list is good. However, you've taken a what you've
• 23:05
  done for 100 days and you've combined that into two words just sold. And so it doesn't show proof
• 23:12
  on what you did. So my suggestion around all of this is there are two types of marketing. Marketing
• 23:18
  makes sales easier, 100% agree. But there are two types of marketing and we have to be very clear
• 23:22
  as to which type of marketing we're using. If we're using brand based marketing, we're trying to get
• 23:27
  our word out there. People get to know who we are. It's just awareness. But to get a response,
• 23:33
  we have to use what we call direct response marketing. We need to create a response from them in
• 23:38
  some way so that we can start a conversation. And all conversion happens in conversation, right?
• 23:42
  So is there something that we're saying? So putting your phone number on a bus bench does not
• 23:47
  start a conversation. Because as I'm driving, I'm not looking and picking down your phone number.
• 23:52
  Right. That makes no sense. So the bus bench is actually a branding tool not a direct response to.
• 23:56
  If everybody took away all their phone numbers from bus benches, they actually will get more phone
• 24:00
  calls. I'm dead serious, right? Because if I said, hey, if I said the resident agent, like the
• 24:10
  resident agent resident investor and resident dad in Orange County, California, and I put my face
• 24:14
  on the bus bench, now what did they remember? Resident agent resident dad resident investor.
• 24:18
  Now the next time I run a Facebook ad or I send them an email or they come to an open house,
• 24:22
  now they're like, wait a minute. You have already pre-framed who the brand is. Now I can run a
• 24:26
  direct response campaign. Most agents don't have the ability to run a direct response campaign.
• 24:30
  For example, every agent should send this. They should send an email to their database. So they
• 24:35
  should look at their past their old open house registries. By the way, lender, letter partners can
• 24:40
  totally help with this process. They should get their old open house registries called from 10 weeks,
• 24:44
  20 weeks, 30 weeks ago. And they should sit down at Starbucks and with a cup of coffee because they
• 24:49
  don't have to talk to anybody. And they can look at the name. It says Jeff and they have a phone number.
• 24:54
  And they should literally text you and saying, are you still interested in buying a home in
• 24:58
  Orange County? Question mark send. That is direct response. Because now that text forces a response
• 25:03
  to start a conversation. Now one of three things can happen in that text, right? Number one is
• 25:08
  you can get and everyone's and the reason people don't do direct response is because they're not
• 25:14
  skilled as to what may happen with that direct response. So if I send that text to you and I say,
• 25:18
  no name, nothing. If I just said, are you still interested in buying a home in Orange County?
• 25:21
  Question mark send. You can do one of three things. One, you respond with who is this? Because
• 25:26
  you have no idea who this is. And what agents do is they freak out, right? Instead, all you have to do
• 25:31
  is to say, hey, this is Sharon. We met at 123 Real Street. And by the way, consumers don't know
• 25:37
  addresses. Only agents and consumers know all these that. They don't, right? The one with the big red
• 25:41
  door. Now they remember, right? And then you put a picture of yourself as selfie. And then you
• 25:45
  ask the question again, are you still interested in buying a home in Orange County? If you don't do
• 25:49
  that, then you don't have the ability to start a conversation. So that's what, so now they know,
• 25:53
  hey, if they tell me who are you, I have a very clear response to that, to that framework, right?
• 25:59
  Here's the second thing that can happen, right? They can say, yes. Are you still interested in buying
• 26:05
  a home in Orange County? Yes. But who is this? There's a big difference that that's called variable
• 26:09
  change. They have said, yes, they're still interested. But they don't know who this is. Now you say
• 26:13
  the exact same thing. Hey, it's the Sharon. We met at 123 Real Street. The one with the big red
• 26:17
  door picture. By the way, since you're still looking to buy a home in Orange County, has your
• 26:21
  criteria changed? Because now I respond to the yes. Again, I generate the conversation. The third
• 26:27
  is they just ghost you, right? They don't say anything for two days. Then what do you do? Well,
• 26:31
  it's really simple. You take a picture of a expired cancel withdrawn, make me move pocket,
• 26:36
  whatever. And you send them a picture of the home, just the front picture. And you say, hey,
• 26:40
  this is one of the homes that recently that we're looking at for our clients. That is off-market
• 26:45
  parentheses, not on Zelo, right? Are you still interested in buying a home in Orange County?
• 26:49
  Now it shows proof that you have access to something that they don't have access to that generates
• 26:54
  a conversation. Small little thing that can generate a conversation. So people now can use
• 26:59
  this transaction famine as we're calling it, but drive more results by generating direct response
• 27:04
  conversations as opposed to saying, look at me. I'm number one. Look at me. I just so look at me
• 27:08
  all of that because all of that goes to the trash. Jeff, I actually talked to an agent. He said to
• 27:12
  me, he's like, Sean, I send out like a 2000 postcards on EDDM. And I'm like, good job, bro. He's
• 27:17
  like, my goal is to ensure that when the consumer holds it and they're walking with my postcard
• 27:23
  on the way to the recycle bin, they remember my name. I'm like, bro, you know that your postcard
• 27:27
  is so terrible that they're going to trash it, but you send it anyway to make yourself fail better.
• 27:31
  It's got no direct response to it at all. And you know, what he says to me, he's like, what would
• 27:34
  you do differently? I said, this is what I would do. I would set a blank postcard with a QR code
• 27:39
  and an arrow that says, this could change your life. They'll scan the QR code, it goes to your video.
• 27:43
  Now they're actually watching the video because they tactically engage with their postcard because
• 27:46
  that is direct response. They respond it to something that you send as opposed to walk to the
• 27:51
  trash can and you play EDDM for that. And you think that your coach said that's a good idea.
• 27:55
  Wow. Because they're playing the exposure game, right? Repetition over time and all that kind
• 28:00
  of stuff and yeah, top of mind awareness. So you just showcase a second skill. We talked about
• 28:06
  the ability to dialogue and converse and things like that. But the second skill, I put that
• 28:10
  under the category of like modern selling. The ability to leverage, you know, to grab this thing,
• 28:15
  the phone that I'm holding up, which I often say like learning to use this video, et cetera,
• 28:20
  you just demonstrated a texting example, but this is a new skill. Learning how to use this, right?
• 28:24
  And I think there's this gap, which you referred to earlier, that we haven't caught up with.
• 28:28
  Because that's a strategy, you know, that I would guess most agents adding the photo
• 28:35
  is the next level of that. Like most agents wouldn't think to do that at all.
• 28:40
  Yeah. Yeah. And the reason is because most agents are wired with a branding mindset, right?
• 28:47
  Because they, because, and by the way, I grew up in the luxury markets. I'm the first one to tell you
• 28:52
  that, you know, your stuff's got to look good. But, but the, but the everyday is like, oh, man,
• 28:57
  that, that, that postcard looks really good. That design is so elegant. Like the elegant design does
• 29:02
  not get you conversations. Like we got to generate a conversation. So you have to create something
• 29:06
  for a person to respond to get you a conversation because all conversion happens in conversation.
• 29:12
  Are you a fan then of like, you know, the ugly yellow signs and all that stuff?
• 29:15
  I, so I'm a little different about that. I am not of like, I don't like to make things ugly
• 29:20
  on purpose. Like I think that's dumb, right? But I want to, I'm, I'm very, I'm a big fan of doing
• 29:26
  things in native environments. So if, if it's text message, I want the text message to look like a
• 29:31
  text message. If it's email, it should not look like a newsletter. Like no one woke up in the
• 29:35
  morning saying, oh my gosh, I'm really excited for Sean to send me his flowery newsletter today.
• 29:39
  Like with a bunch of like pictures and just, no, I'm checking email while sitting on the throne.
• 29:43
  Like it needs to look like email, right? And so, so I want the email to look like email,
• 29:48
  read like email, all of that. So I'm a big fan of native, natively looking communication. So
• 29:54
  if you're, if you're doing a video, it needs to look like an Instagram video. If you're doing a
• 29:57
  Facebook post needs to look like a Facebook post, you don't want to like jar people and be like,
• 30:00
  okay, that's dumb. So I don't want to go out of my way to create an ugly piece unless it's a
• 30:06
  strategy. But because otherwise it makes it looks like you don't care, right? And so I think
• 30:10
  a lot of people don't realize I'm not saying do ugly things. I'm just saying do the best you can,
• 30:15
  but don't, don't sacrifice direct response for branding because you could brand all day and
• 30:20
  then assume that when something happens, someone will think of you, but Jeff and Sharon are doing
• 30:24
  direct response and eating your lunch. That's the big difference. Okay, so I think the big takeaway
• 30:29
  from part one of this conversation so far is skills. You've got to build up skills. You've got to
• 30:33
  become a modern agent, right? Get with the modern times. Use the tools of today's modern consumer,
• 30:39
  right? So my other question is this is then there's two primary things I'm thinking in my head,
• 30:46
  but I want to take this question first is, you know, I saw a report come out recently,
• 30:51
  might have been a NARA report about what do you, I can't remember if it's sellers or I think it
• 30:56
  was buyers. What does a buyer value most from a real estate agent? And I thought this was
• 31:01
  opposite of what it used to say, but if I remember correctly, the highest one on the chart was
• 31:06
  help them find the right home. Correct, right? And then like the second category that I've
• 31:10
  often seen over the years is help with the process, understand the process. So what do you say to
• 31:15
  that? Does the consumer, is that true? Because I noticed you, you know, in your example brackets,
• 31:20
  not on Zillow, like to talk to me, to walk me through that, is that really, like if I'm thinking
• 31:25
  right now, so here I am in Vegas, been here seven years, maybe we're looking at a second home,
• 31:28
  Idaho, whatever, like how does that play into the mix of the consumer's mindset of help me find
• 31:34
  the home? Is that really what they think of an agent for? No, so this is really interesting,
• 31:38
  right? So a consumer does not believe, my wife is the perfect consumer. She's on seven different
• 31:44
  drips, you know, and seven, she gets one of those are, is a Zillow elert and one of those is a
• 31:52
  redfin elert. By the way, she likes the redfin elerts more than anything else because she likes these,
• 31:56
  it's aesthetically pleasing for her. Right. And I've seen most people tell me that, right? And so
• 32:01
  even though an agent doesn't believe that, that is, that is true. I don't, I don't believe that
• 32:06
  the modern consumer is has the mindset that an agent is going to help them find a home. I do not
• 32:12
  believe that. I do believe that the modern, the consumer believes that they will find the home,
• 32:17
  they will narrow down the search, they will do most of it. And then maybe the agent helps them
• 32:21
  kind of dial in the process. Now, most agents will probably disagree with this because they want
• 32:24
  to have more of an active role in the process. But before a, I would say nine out of 10 consumers
• 32:30
  have already started their search before they've ever talked to an agent, you know, and so they
• 32:33
  are aware of the marketplace. The question then becomes, I actually think the, the modern consumer
• 32:38
  is unaware of the process and they realize that they, they realize the agent is just a, a natural
• 32:44
  part of the process that they can't get rid of. But they don't know why. That's the problem. They
• 32:48
  don't know why. And I think it's the job of the agent to explain to the client that why they do
• 32:56
  what they do. And, and I always, I use these words often. I say, hey, good process and good process
• 33:00
  alone drives good results. So I always say, you know, hey, you are not hiring the agent. So,
• 33:05
  so I'll give you an example. Yesterday, same, same, everything go back to the listening
• 33:08
  appointment. Yesterday, the client asked me, he said, I asked all my, I asked all my, I've asked
• 33:13
  all other two agents. I'm going to ask you guys this too. And he says, what should be higher you?
• 33:18
  Now, very interesting question if you, if you, if you think about it, right? And this goes to the
• 33:22
  heart of like what consumers want. And I said, I really don't think you should. The guy's like,
• 33:28
  he starts laughing. And I said, no, no, I didn't mean it that way. But you got, you got to
• 33:32
  create tension, right? What I meant to say was, you're not hiring us. You're hiring our process.
• 33:38
  You're hiring our process that we have implemented for the last 10 years. A process that is actually
• 33:42
  delivered, you know, two hundred and twelve homes in the last 12 year period across price points.
• 33:47
  A process that two hundred and twelve families have prepaid to get us this entire blueprint that
• 33:54
  we're going to deliver you a process that you don't have to pay for, that all of these other
• 33:59
  clients have to pay for. And in fact, I'll tell you, Mr. Mrs. Klein, you are going to do this and
• 34:02
  it's going to help the client after you, which is why it is our job to bring you off for that
• 34:08
  you want, at a price that you want, a terms that you want. And we do that with good process.
• 34:12
  How important do you think a pre listing package is?
• 34:15
  So think about it. It's interesting, right? So there's only two things that happen in a pre listing
• 34:19
  package. Again, most agents don't know this. They assume that their coach told them to drop a
• 34:23
  pre listing package out, but they don't know this. So two things happen in a pre listing package.
• 34:27
  Number one, you deliver a pre listing package and nine out of 10 pre listing packages are never
• 34:31
  opened, right? Never, never open. They think they are, but they're not. Never open. And the one person
• 34:36
  that opens it is the extreme analytical anal person who found the typo on page seven. So technically
• 34:44
  speaking, it is useless to do a pre listing package. But I'm actually a good fan of this. So let
• 34:48
  me tell you how to do the right pre listing package. What you want to do is you want to do this.
• 34:52
  You want to take a, you know, I don't know what they call it in California. They call it a
• 34:57
  property profile. Some kind of title public record report, right? You do want to take a title
• 35:01
  public record report, maybe a couple of testimonials, etc. And some and then put it in a in a brown
• 35:07
  envelope, like a vanilla envelope. And I do this and I do this to all listings that I go on with
• 35:12
  our agents. However, hide the price point is. And on the back of the envelope, I write,
• 35:16
  please do not open the stall or meeting tomorrow, right? And then I tell the agent to slide it
• 35:20
  under their door and then use that to reconfirm the appointment. So what you do is you say,
• 35:25
  hey, Jeff, just drop something off for our meeting tomorrow. Can you just let me know if you get it?
• 35:29
  We'll see you at four. So you text back that you got it. So now you have appointment confirmation.
• 35:32
  As opposed to, hey, Jeff, I'm just checking in. Are you good for tomorrow? Bad, right? Now,
• 35:36
  if I've dropped that off, now there's social accountability that you have to keep the meeting,
• 35:40
  right? So that's number one. When you get to the appointment, most people don't realize this,
• 35:44
  this is white coaches who have never talked to a client, don't understand this, right? So when
• 35:48
  you get to the appointment, it's very awkward. It's very awkward because you're like, oh, hold on.
• 35:52
  Let me take off my shoes. Where do I put this back? Like, it's a really terrible opportunity.
• 35:56
  Like, so when you sit down, you don't, you want to say, oh, you ski an aspirin? I ski an aspirin too
• 36:01
  because somebody from 40 years ago told you that where these skis important for you to have
• 36:04
  rapport. But that's actually not what you want is you want mechanical rapport, not emotional
• 36:09
  rapport, right? Because they know that you're trying to sell them something. Here's crazy part.
• 36:13
  So I always say, when I get into appointment, I sit down. I'm like, hey, uh, this is really simple.
• 36:17
  Two words, two phrases. One, hey. Hey, Mister, thank you so much for having us.
• 36:21
  Where can we sit down and strategize? I don't do the tour first because the tour first is the
• 36:25
  worst thing that you can do, because you're walking with their head behind your, in front of yours.
• 36:30
  And you have no context of anything that they're going to say. And you're like, oh,
• 36:33
  I need to see the home before I give you the pricing, no one's asking for the pricing in
• 36:35
  the first two minutes. So you see where can you sit down and strategize. But then when you sit down,
• 36:40
  here's what I ask. I'm like, he do you have the envelope that I dropped off yesterday?
• 36:44
  And then they bring it to you know what they say. And as soon as they hand it to me and what I say,
• 36:48
  Jeff, I say, did you open it? But here's the best part. When I say, did you open it? What am I trying to
• 36:53
  do? I'm trying to establish something. So one of two answers, right? First answer they say is,
• 36:58
  oh, of course not. We didn't open it. You told us not to. And here's how I respond. Oh my gosh,
• 37:01
  you're the most perfect clients ever. I want you to have full visibility in the process. I just
• 37:06
  wanted to make sure to not stress you out in this entire process, which is I told you not to open it.
• 37:10
  Let's open it. I'll tell you exactly what I mean by this, right? That's part two. Let's say they say,
• 37:14
  oh yeah, I opened it. I didn't read your message. You know what I say? Oh yeah, you're the perfect
• 37:18
  clients no matter what, right? Because I have nothing to hide from you and you should open everything
• 37:22
  that I give you. I just wanted to make this process easy for you. Let's actually break this down.
• 37:26
  And they both of them laugh. Now that pre-listing package has a very specific reason for me to actually
• 37:32
  start the meeting. Every other pre-listing package doesn't because then they start the meeting with
• 37:36
  questions and objections, which you are not ready for because you never framed it in the first place.
• 37:39
  This is what skill is, right? It's super interesting because, and I'll tell you, I've got over a
• 37:46
  billion dollars in listings taken. I haven't lost a listing appointment and I don't know, 15 years.
• 37:49
  It's the same process over and over. And the reason is, it's not that I'm any better or worse
• 37:54
  than anyone else. It's just, I know how to work the psychology because there's a skill associated
• 37:57
  with it. And instead, everyone else is like, oh, I'm just going to do the tour. I'm going to lose
• 38:01
  rapport. I'm going to try to reframe. Then they don't know where the conversation going. It's 20 minutes
• 38:04
  into the conversation. They tell me that their neighbor's kitchen is better and everything's done.
• 38:09
  That's every single listing appointment. In fact, if I just control the appointment,
• 38:13
  with just that one pre, now you can, you can add the pre-listing package to my
• 38:17
  mineral envelope and it works. But you and I can talk right now, but I don't have any notes.
• 38:22
  I do this from memory, right? Everything that we're talking about,
• 38:26
  you can, every single person in every year on a show cannot do what I do from memory because they
• 38:30
  don't do this day to day. And that's super important. And I'm saying I'm better. I'm just saying
• 38:34
  the more skilled you are, the more money you make. Yeah, no, that's absolutely. You've got to
• 38:38
  stacked up. You're very intentional with your processes, obviously, as well. All right, real quick
• 38:43
  before I run out of time. So we've got mortgage loan originators and some agents listening to
• 38:48
  this as well. I'm a big fan of integrating the mortgage professional into the process.
• 38:53
  What, how do you architect that or suggest that for your agents? Dude, I think the number one
• 38:59
  most underutilized unfair advantage for real estate agents is not working in tandem with their,
• 39:08
  with their loan officer. Now, the first thing I will tell you is, if you're a real estate agent
• 39:12
  listening to the show with Jeff, one, good job you're listening to the show. Number two, stop calling
• 39:17
  them a vendor. They are not your vendor. They are a partner. And let me tell you how they become a
• 39:21
  better partner. The better they can become a better partner if you integrate them into how you run
• 39:26
  your business. There's two ways to integrate them into how you're about on your business. Number one,
• 39:31
  whenever you are, if you're an agent, you're going on an appointment. By the way, loan officers
• 39:35
  that you're listening to this, you should tell your agencies when they're going on a listing
• 39:37
  appointment. Every single agent should know that when they're going on a listing appointment,
• 39:41
  they should call their lender first, especially if it's a lender driven or if it's a, if it's a mortgage
• 39:46
  driven purchase market, right? Like Vegas, for example, I think what's 80% of homes have a loan
• 39:51
  on them when they're on their own purchase, right? So you say, because what is the client going to
• 39:55
  ask me? The client's going to say, do you have any buyers? But I can say I have 3,000 buyers in my
• 40:00
  database with the client doesn't believe me. Instead, what I should say is, oh, yeah, actually,
• 40:04
  we have more than buyers. We have qualified buyers right now. I want to show you a voicemail that
• 40:10
  my lender, my lender partner, Jeff just left from me because I was briefing this with him.
• 40:14
  And they play this voicemail Kardashian style on in the appointment. So the appointment should,
• 40:19
  I hit play and the appointment should say something like, I think I shared this with you at
• 40:22
  forward, right? It's something that you should say. You should say, hey, Sharon, this is Jeff,
• 40:26
  super excited that you go on this appointment on, you know, in this area. In fact, we actually have
• 40:30
  32 pre-qualified buyers that are in the 1.2 to 1.3 million dollar price range. And I'm pre-qualifying
• 40:36
  a few more. As soon as your home is ready and your clients give you the okay, I'd love to share that
• 40:40
  with these 32 buyers, you know, as a heads up. And that'll, because they need to buy a home in the
• 40:45
  next 60 to 90 days. As soon as you're ready for pre-marketing, please let me know, because I'd like
• 40:48
  to get it out to them. You play that in the appointment. Now, now, you are showing the agent,
• 40:54
  you're giving them access to a buyer pool that they never had with a legitimate proof-based source
• 40:58
  that only you have. And the nice part is all the loan officers have all these pre-qualified buyers.
• 41:03
  So you're not even lying, which is the greatest part in this process, right? So that's kind of
• 41:07
  a number one. That's a no-brainer. Every single loan officer should integrate their listing process
• 41:11
  with their agent partners, because the agent should call and say, hey, Jeff, I'm going on this
• 41:15
  appointment. Can you leave me a sharon voicemail? You'll leave him a sharon voicemail, and they should
• 41:19
  play their voicemail in the appointment. It blows their mind when you play that voicemail in the
• 41:23
  appointment, because no one else does that, right? Right. Here's the second way, is after open houses.
• 41:29
  I don't think most agents take advantage of this, because most agents do the open houses,
• 41:32
  they at best they may do the one follow-up phone call saying, hey, thank you for coming to my
• 41:36
  open house. Most of them will just do a video and text it to all these people, but they don't do the
• 41:40
  follow-up, right? This is called the middleman frame. And I love it when there's an integration of
• 41:45
  the lender partner here, where the lender partner starts to call that list and says, you can say,
• 41:51
  hey, Mr. Mrs. Client, my name is Jeff, and I'm a mortgage lender with XYZ company. I'm calling
• 41:57
  on behalf of Sharon Trivaz at Real. Sharon asked me to give you a call because all his private
• 42:02
  clients are blah, blah, blah, and I wanted to see if I could help you just dial in XYZ to get
• 42:07
  now that's insanely powerful because the lender partner knows if they go through that list, those
• 42:12
  are hot buyers that came into an open house. The agent feels good because he called on behalf of
• 42:18
  the agent and the lender partner feels good because now they have something live to work on and
• 42:21
  is very integrated in the process. We need to find a way to integrate the lender partnerships
• 42:27
  into our real estate business. Otherwise, you'll always just treat them as a vendor and that's where
• 42:31
  the relationship breaks. Yeah, I love that. Yeah, because you're creating wind winds for each
• 42:34
  other. That's awesome. Those are two killer strategies right there. All right, you've been
• 42:38
  incredibly generous with your insight, knowledge, and experience. I want you to just go rapid-fire
• 42:44
  real quick on an answer to this question. Then we're going to close out with what are you excited
• 42:48
  about for 2025? I had to ask you this question just because of who you are in the industry, you're
• 42:51
  obviously very well experienced and have a great, I think, take on the industry as a whole.
• 42:57
  What is your quick take on the net net impact of the NAR settlement to the industry?
• 43:04
  It's said nothing burger. Okay. All right, cool enough said. Then let's close out on this.
• 43:11
  What are you excited about? What's got you amped up? Really looking forward to whether it's a project
• 43:16
  or something coming up for the rest of this year? I believe that we are going to see artificial
• 43:23
  intelligence be a very key part of our industry overall, both on the consumer side and looking at
• 43:31
  stuff as well as on the agent side and doing what they do. What most people don't realize? If you've
• 43:36
  ever done the job of an agent or a loan officer, you realize that almost 70% of what we do is very
• 43:41
  manual and mechanical. If we can take that away, we're not quite there yet from a piece of AI
• 43:51
  that can do all of Jeff's work. We're not quite there yet, but I don't think we're that far off.
• 43:56
  As soon as we get that, something amazing starts to happen. It forces the agents to have more
• 44:00
  creativity, more creativity on marketing, more creativity on skill. I don't think it takes away the
• 44:03
  agent skill. It dramatically takes away all the mundane busy work and the error prone work that
• 44:10
  agents have to do. I'll give you a really simple example. We built a species of technology at
• 44:15
  real and it's not commercial or anything. It's a function of AI where normally if there's a
• 44:22
  signed purchase contract, Jeff, I would upload it to the system and our brokers would review it.
• 44:26
  They would go through all the 96 pages of the contract and tell you that you're missing a
• 44:29
  signature on page two. Well, if there's 100 contracts admitted that day, our broker team's probably
• 44:34
  not going to get there for four days no matter how big the broker team is. Well, now what we've
• 44:37
  done is we have a piece of technology that as soon as you upload the contract, it knows wherever the
• 44:42
  initials and signatures have to be and all the key fields, it scans it all of it and said there are
• 44:45
  three errors instantly. That alone, you can instantly just download it back, go get the other's
• 44:50
  docuSign and come right back and you're done. Now that back and forth confusion is immediately solved
• 44:56
  and now you may think that's an insane piece of tech but it's foundational to how an agent runs
• 45:01
  their business. So what I see is going to happen is you're going to see more creativity and more skill
• 45:06
  have be in the agent world because all the admin work has taken away. When you take away all the
• 45:10
  admin work, when you take away all the mundane work, what stands creativity and skill and creativity
• 45:16
  for that with creativity. I mean as ideas, brand, content, marketing strategies, etc. Skill is when
• 45:21
  you're actually talking to a client, what do you do? How can you solve a problem? How can you say what
• 45:24
  you say? Those two can't be replaced. Those are very, very hard because in the middle, the AI can
• 45:28
  do the manual work but it can't come up with the creativity and it can't actually talk to the client
• 45:32
  yet. So I'm really excited to see agents live better lives, not being stressed out by the
• 45:39
  meant, the mundane stuff they need to do but with the extra time, maybe my offer to them would be,
• 45:45
  hey, spend more time on the creative stuff and spend more time on the skill stuff because that
• 45:49
  will get you paid. Yeah, love that. Yeah, it's going to create efficiencies all across the board
• 45:53
  and let's use that free time as you said to get more skills, right? Which is what we're talking about
• 45:57
  here today. So Saron, once again, thank you so much for the listeners who want to connect with you
• 46:01
  more. We're going to put the links to your Instagram and your YouTube channel in the show notes
• 46:06
  because you got amazing content out there on the internet and people need to click the link in
• 46:09
  the show notes right now, whether you're an agent or a loan officer. By the way, if you are an agent
• 46:12
  listening to this and you did get this from a loan officer, please thank them and let them know
• 46:17
  that they are now considered a partner, right? Not a vendor because they want to help you and that's
• 46:22
  why they share this episode with you. So Saron, once again, thank you. Appreciate it, Matt. Thanks, Jeff.
• 46:26
  All right, listeners, you know what to do? Leave a note in the show notes or leave us a review if you
• 46:30
  like this one and by the way, share this with somebody else. Pay it forward. Thanks for tuning in.
• 46:34
  See you on the next one. Bye for now. Okay, that's it for today's episode. Before we wrap up,
• 46:38
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• 46:43
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  and fun. So if you're ready to take control of your agent referrals and grow your income,
• 47:04
  visit mortgagemarketing.pro or check the link in the show notes. And while you're there,
• 47:08
  don't forget to check out the success stories from other mortgage pros who've already seen
• 47:12
  incredible results. Thanks for listening and I'll see you on the next episode.