Latest / The Driven Athlete / Hands on Pediatric Medicine w/ Dr. Celina Moore | Ep 86

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Hands on Pediatric Medicine w/ Dr. Celina Moore | Ep 86 · The Driven Athlete

• 0:00
  Speaker 1: If you're a driven, active person who wants to reach and pursue a higher quality life with some ambition, then guess what this podcast is for you.
• 0:07
  Speaker 1: This is the Driven Athlete Podcast.
• 0:10
  Speaker 1: What's up?
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: Y'all?
• 0:12
  Speaker 1: It's your man, dr Kyle.
• 0:13
  Speaker 1: Welcome back to the Driven Athlete Podcast.
• 0:15
  Speaker 1: We got a cool guest with us.
• 0:16
  Speaker 1: Very busy individual.
• 0:19
  Speaker 1: I appreciate your time.
• 0:20
  Speaker 1: This is Dr Selena Moore.
• 0:21
  Speaker 1: She's a pediatrician locally in West Palm.
• 0:23
  Speaker 1: Thanks your time.
• 0:23
  Speaker 1: This is Dr Selena Moore.
• 0:24
  Speaker 1: She's a pediatrician locally in West Palm.
• 0:25
  Speaker 2: Thanks for coming in, absolutely.
• 0:25
  Speaker 2: Thanks for inviting me.
• 0:27
  Speaker 1: So tell us more about where you're at your practice and what you do.
• 0:38
  Speaker 2: So the short story is I have a concierge pediatric practice here in West Palm and I service the entire county for concierge pediatric needs.
• 0:42
  Speaker 2: But that came from almost like a disgruntledness, maybe, or I had to really step away from traditional pediatric medicine.
• 0:55
  Speaker 1: The dissatisfaction.
• 0:56
  Speaker 2: Yes, that's the word I was looking for.
• 0:58
  Speaker 2: Because you have a baby and you make an appointment and you have to, like, dial the pediatric number and go down the phone tree and wait on hold and get an appointment and then sit in the big waiting room and then go to the little waiting room and it's coughing everywhere and and then you get a whole seven point five minutes with a pediatrician.
• 1:22
  Speaker 2: If you don't have a list, then you lose your chance and it's very dissatisfying both from the parent point of view, but it's also really frustrating from the practitioner point of view, because there's so much more that we can, you know, give to these families to help their kids thrive and we are constrained by the limitations of what the insurance company tells us we can do with the time that we have, right.
• 1:51
  Speaker 2: So I stepped away from that the beginning of 2025 and I started my own practice, where, you know, I am released from those limitations and I can do house calls and I can spend as much time as I want with my patients.
• 2:06
  Speaker 2: The patients have a lot more access to me.
• 2:08
  Speaker 2: They can call and text me if, like you know, something pops in your brain and say hey, wait a minute.
• 2:12
  Speaker 2: I just read this article.
• 2:13
  Speaker 2: Is this true?
• 2:14
  Speaker 2: Is this not true?
• 2:15
  Speaker 2: Or my kid just did this?
• 2:16
  Speaker 2: Should I worry?
• 2:17
  Speaker 2: And having the more of like a high touch, hands-on approach really decreases all the barriers to care, so it's very fulfilling both as a pediatrician and also on the parent side.
• 2:30
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, totally.
• 2:31
  Speaker 1: That makes total sense.
• 2:32
  Speaker 1: We have.
• 2:33
  Speaker 1: We got three kids.
• 2:34
  Speaker 1: Yeah, my daughter will be five in a month, or like a little less than a month.
• 2:38
  Speaker 1: My son is three and then my youngest son is six months.
• 2:40
  Speaker 1: So we're grinding right now.
• 2:42
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah but yeah, so like I forget so something.
• 2:45
  Speaker 1: His son is six months, so we're grinding right now.
• 2:47
  Speaker 1: But yeah, so like I forget something happened recently.
• 2:49
  Speaker 1: We called in and like it just takes a little time, you know, like it's just a bummer.
• 2:55
  Speaker 1: And the waiting room, yeah, of course you know there's like the sick side and then there's like the healthier side, so it's like if you're but like what toddler you know is going to follow directions.
• 3:01
  Speaker 1: There's a lot of blending over there.
• 3:02
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 3:02
  Speaker 2: Well, like when I was a kid, you would walk into the restaurant.
• 3:04
  Speaker 2: They say smoking or non-smoking and you're just like it's the same air.
• 3:12
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I can smell it over here guys.
• 3:13
  Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly.
• 3:14
  Speaker 1: And also, too, I would agree as well, like the dissatisfaction just not feeling as fulfilled as you can and frustrated from a practitioner standpoint of like trying to help people.
• 3:23
  Speaker 1: Would have plenty of people in previous life when I was doing my thing in the clinic, just like you said you were doing, where people would be like, can you do more like the manual therapy.
• 3:31
  Speaker 1: And then I want you to teach me some stuff.
• 3:33
  Speaker 1: I'm like I wish I could, I can't, I don't have the time.
• 3:35
  Speaker 1: I'm managing five other fires.
• 3:37
  Speaker 1: You know what I mean?
• 3:38
  Speaker 1: It was just a bummer, you know.
• 3:39
  Speaker 1: And then I mean you know pediatric and I mean you know pediatricians like yourself, docs, like usually they get into the field because they're philanthropic, they want to help people, they're warm and fuzzy, they want to like, get a relationship and help people, and then you're strangled which sucks, yeah, and the burnout rate right now in medicine is atrocious.
• 3:58
  Speaker 2: It's atrocious and it's really sad.
• 4:01
  Speaker 2: It's really sad and and I really you know feel for my physician colleagues who are kind of stuck in this right now because this is not the ideal model for everybody, but it's working well for me and for my patient population.
• 4:16
  Speaker 1: So I'm really happy.
• 4:17
  Speaker 1: Yeah, where are you from originally?
• 4:19
  Speaker 2: So I grew up in Baltimore.
• 4:20
  Speaker 1: Okay.
• 4:21
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm a Baltimore on.
• 4:22
  Speaker 1: Okay, that's awesome.
• 4:24
  Speaker 1: I've never heard that before.
• 4:26
  Speaker 2: I may or may not have made that up.
• 4:27
  Speaker 1: That's funny.
• 4:28
  Speaker 2: And I moved to South Florida.
• 4:29
  Speaker 2: Well, actually I did my residency at what's now known as Nicholas Children's, but it was Miami Children's, okay, so I was there from 2001 to 2004 and then moved back up to the Northeast for a year and then bounced right back down in 2005, just in time for a bunch of hurricanes.
• 4:46
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I remember that specifically.
• 4:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah, it was.
• 4:49
  Speaker 2: Katrina, it was Wilma.
• 4:51
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I was like what is this place?
• 4:53
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 4:53
  Speaker 2: And yeah, and I've been here ever since.
• 4:55
  Speaker 2: So I practiced pediatrics in the Boca Raton area for about 20 years before I shimmied up a little bit farther north.
• 5:01
  Speaker 1: And did you start doing that thing?
• 5:02
  Speaker 1: Yeah, where'd you go to med school?
• 5:04
  Speaker 2: So that is, that's a story.
• 5:07
  Speaker 2: Yes, so I was.
• 5:09
  Speaker 2: I was a French literature major in college because-.
• 5:14
  Speaker 1: French lit wow French lit.
• 5:17
  Speaker 2: I decided when I was quite young that I wanted to be a pediatrician in Francophone Africa.
• 5:24
  Speaker 2: I'm talking about like kindergarten.
• 5:26
  Speaker 2: I'm like I want to be a pediatrician in Francophone Africa or a waitress.
• 5:30
  Speaker 2: Those were my two, those were my two career paths in kindergarten and I followed that through.
• 5:36
  Speaker 2: I mean, I did wait tables and that was also frustrating, but I I ended up saying to myself well, I want to join the San San Francio Doctors Without Borders and I want to go to this part of the world.
• 5:49
  Speaker 2: And in order for me to do this and I must learn French.
• 5:51
  Speaker 2: And so I did my medical, my pre-med in French literature and pre-med, and then spoiler alert that's really hard to get into medical school with a French lit major.
• 6:05
  Speaker 2: So I ended up moving to Spain, where my family's from, and I started medical school in Spain and then from there there was medical school in the rest of the world is different than the United States.
• 6:19
  Speaker 2: You go straight from high school to medical school and then there it's a six-year program where you do your prerequisite that we would do in pre-med and then you would do straight medical school.
• 6:30
  Speaker 2: Then you do what's called an internship, where you are doing a lot more clinical work and then you do a social service year where you give back to the community in what you've learned in medicine and you have an exit exam at that time and, depending on how you do it, that exit exam is kind of placing you in what residency program that you want.
• 6:49
  Speaker 2: And I've only wanted to go into pediatrics, like GI doesn't do it for me, feet don't do it for me, you know, eyes don't do it for me.
• 6:59
  Speaker 2: I want to do the whole kid.
• 7:00
  Speaker 2: So the way it was going in Spain I'm not going to get into all of it at that moment but led me to pause and think maybe I need to go somewhere else.
• 7:09
  Speaker 2: So I ended up moving to Mexico and I did a few years of medical school there and my last year, like my diploma, says New York Medical College, but I did the bulk of it overseas Cool.
• 7:23
  Speaker 2: And then I did my residency in Miami.
• 7:26
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, country number four, yeah, yeah, exactly, yeah, yeah, wow.
• 7:31
  Speaker 2: So yeah, and that's what I did and I think it made me into a very well-rounded, both culturally and academically person and I can really, especially when dealing with different cultures around the world, gives me that perspective that, okay, just because this is the way things are taught in the United States, it doesn't necessarily mean that that's how you have to practice medicine completely True.
• 7:59
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, it's something that I love.
• 8:01
  Speaker 1: Exposure like a lot of cool experiences and stuff.
• 8:03
  Speaker 1: Saw a lot of things.
• 8:04
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 8:06
  Speaker 1: So you've always pediatrics, was always your thing.
• 8:07
  Speaker 2: Always, always how come.
• 8:09
  Speaker 2: I don't really know.
• 8:12
  Speaker 2: I mean, the classic thing was like I love my pediatrician.
• 8:14
  Speaker 2: I'm like I don't really have any warm and fuzzy feelings about my pediatrician.
• 8:18
  Speaker 2: I thought he was kind of dry and I didn't really.
• 8:20
  Speaker 2: He never smiled at me and I thought I was funny because I would say why are you named Dr Cat?
• 8:24
  Speaker 2: So you don't look like a cat right.
• 8:26
  Speaker 2: And he did not like that.
• 8:29
  Speaker 2: So moving on, but I love children, I love their role in the family.
• 8:36
  Speaker 2: I love thinking, I love figuring things out, I love puzzles, I love trying to come to a conclusion right.
• 8:44
  Speaker 2: So I really like that idea of medicine, of this is what is presented to you in this way, and everything that I learned up until now is going to help me get to the answer of this question.
• 8:57
  Speaker 2: Whether it's a diagnosis or if it's, you know, helping somebody with something, and.
• 9:02
  Speaker 2: I'm also a very.
• 9:03
  Speaker 2: I was voted most helpful of my eighth grade class, so I like to help.
• 9:07
  Speaker 1: Okay, that makes sense.
• 9:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, yeah, that's awesome.
• 9:10
  Speaker 1: Um, so with recently your practice, um you see a wide range of kids from infancy through 18 years old through university.
• 9:24
  Speaker 2: I take them through college, oh wow.
• 9:25
  Speaker 1: Okay, awesome.
• 9:26
  Speaker 2: Yeah, they're big kids.
• 9:27
  Speaker 2: Then, yeah, big kids.
• 9:29
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's a journey, that's awesome.
• 9:30
  Speaker 2: It is.
• 9:31
  Speaker 1: When the patients, like the people that reach out to you and say, hey, what do they usually ask you when they want to work with you, like, what do they usually ask?
• 9:48
  Speaker 2: I get a lot of like where did you go to medical school ends up becoming a big answer.
• 9:52
  Speaker 1: Well, let me explain.
• 9:53
  Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, so that usually starts the rapport right.
• 9:57
  Speaker 2: They ask me a question where they think it's going to be a one-word answer and I just vomit all this information onto them.
• 10:05
  Speaker 1: Yeah, which I mean?
• 10:06
  Speaker 1: I'm sure they would appreciate the enthusiasm and, like the knowledge you know, like this the information you know, thanks for going the extra mile and explaining things.
• 10:13
  Speaker 1: Yeah, what do they usually ask?
• 10:15
  Speaker 1: Like, what's your philosophies on?
• 10:17
  Speaker 2: On antibiotics?
• 10:18
  Speaker 2: What's your philosophy on parenting?
• 10:20
  Speaker 2: What's your philosophy on immunizations?
• 10:22
  Speaker 2: What's your philosophy on illnesses?
• 10:24
  Speaker 2: You know, I think, as more people in the wellness industry start getting more of a attraction on social media and you know the just health at large, it's very, very important to, as a physician, to be able to fill in the role of truth seeker and making sure that there's how to discern information that's coming at you, you know, towards you, and it's a very exciting place to be in because there's so much out there that I did learned information in medical school, like how to see if this data is true or not right, if there's any spin to it, and then applying it to what's coming out right now.
• 11:13
  Speaker 2: Right Whether it's having to do with food safety or food health or nutrition or gut microbiome or developmental issues or immunizations like all of that.
• 11:24
  Speaker 2: Yeah, or developmental issues or immunizations, like all of that.
• 11:25
  Speaker 2: So I think I'm poised to be able to show light on what is true.
• 11:32
  Speaker 1: Yeah, for sure.
• 11:32
  Speaker 1: What do you feel like?
• 11:34
  Speaker 1: You learned a lot that you weren't exposed in medical school.
• 11:38
  Speaker 2: Definitely nutrition, absolutely nutrition.
• 11:41
  Speaker 2: We got, I think, six weeks maybe, and most of it was on feeding or refeeding different pathologies.
• 11:53
  Speaker 2: So if you are in cardiac failure, this is what you should eat and if you're in renal failure, this is what you should eat.
• 11:59
  Speaker 2: But there wasn't really that much on micronutrients and health from just an every person point of view.
• 12:07
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean I totally.
• 12:08
  Speaker 1: I mean I would always suggest to patients like the most influential thing for someone's longevity and trajectory is just like what they consume consistently.
• 12:16
  Speaker 1: And I mean it took a little bit in undergrad.
• 12:19
  Speaker 1: You know nutrition, but definitely I mean I'm a hobbyist when it comes to nutrition, like like an educated hobbyist.
• 12:26
  Speaker 1: On that, I think it's fun and cool.
• 12:27
  Speaker 1: Not a nutritionist though, right, but anyway I totally agree Like it's super influential with somebody's health and wellness longevity trajectory.
• 12:35
  Speaker 1: What do you find yourself recommending to patients now with nutrition?
• 12:40
  Speaker 2: Well-.
• 12:40
  Speaker 1: Have you said like micronutrients, Like what do you?
• 12:42
  Speaker 2: mean.
• 12:43
  Speaker 2: Well, what I mean by micronutrients are more like your vitamins and the minerals that are found in foods, and how to make sure you have a good balance.
• 12:50
  Speaker 2: And looking at what the American diet is and looking at what the American dietary recommendations are.
• 12:57
  Speaker 2: Both fall short of what we really should be consuming, and this should start in infancy.
• 13:03
  Speaker 2: This should start before infancy.
• 13:06
  Speaker 2: This should start before conception and you know, making sure that you know this is something that we're able to control.
• 13:11
  Speaker 2: We can't control genetics, we can't control the diseases that are passed down generation by generation, but we can control what we put into our bodies and we can control the exercise that we do and our lifestyle and how to avoid things that are going to hurt us.
• 13:28
  Speaker 2: And if you're able to do that in infancy and toddlerhood and early childhood, then we can take what we've learned and continue throughout childhood and adolescence, because in adolescence that's when everyone's going to go.
• 13:42
  Speaker 2: I don't want to do this anymore, but hopefully it will be ingrained enough you know the good habits that you can then carry that into adulthood.
• 13:49
  Speaker 1: And what do you find yourself recommending to toddlers as an example?
• 13:53
  Speaker 1: Like, the parents of toddlers are like hey, incorporate this.
• 13:57
  Speaker 2: So there you know I the easy way to do it is I.
• 14:01
  Speaker 2: I tell parents, especially parents of children a little bit older than toddlers, and I always speak to the children.
• 14:08
  Speaker 2: I speak much more easily to children than I do to grownups, but I tell the children do you know where this comes from?
• 14:16
  Speaker 2: If this comes from, you can trace it back really easily.
• 14:20
  Speaker 2: Then you can eat it.
• 14:21
  Speaker 2: But if it comes out of a crinkly package or if it comes out of you know, a piece of foil, then it's probably not good for you.
• 14:30
  Speaker 2: So if you can look at that hamburger, for example, and you can say, oh, I know that b that came from a cow, right, and I know that lettuce came from the ground and I know that slice of tomato came from a tomato plant, and then I'm like, okay, I can eat that because I know exactly where that comes from.
• 14:45
  Speaker 2: But when I open up a Pop-Tart I'm like I don't know where that comes from.
• 14:51
  Speaker 2: There are so many steps to make that Pop-Tart and then you can even break it down even more healthily, like I don't know where the cow came from, but I know where the eggs came from because it came from my neighbor's yard.
• 15:01
  Speaker 2: So I know came from, because it came from my neighbor's yard so I know I can eat that right and and then just teach them like little little things at a time.
• 15:07
  Speaker 2: You can't give a dissertation on nutrition to the parents of a person who's just making sure their kid's not gonna yeah stick a fork in a in an outlet, or yeah, exactly, exactly.
• 15:18
  Speaker 1: Or yeah, man, it's rough like five is a handful it's, it's, it's, don't yeah nice, nice, that's awesome.
• 15:28
  Speaker 1: Um, it's a hit or miss.
• 15:29
  Speaker 1: You know, like every day, like some days they're like sure I'll eat and then some days they're like I don't want that.
• 15:34
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I want milk.
• 15:36
  Speaker 1: Right now I'm like bro, you already had like five glasses of milk like we need to have some sustenance, you know, okay, okay, you can have a treat if you have this I bought the parenting part is the bargaining?
• 15:45
  Speaker 1: Yeah then, there's a whole bunch of philosophy on that that we're not gonna like a whole other podcast, yeah exactly.
• 15:51
  Speaker 1: No, it's like, well, you shouldn't do that, you, and I'm like, oh my gosh yeah, we also need to go to bed and, like you know, sometimes publics runs out of milk yeah, yeah, there you go they just run out of milk.
• 16:01
  Speaker 2: That's a good way to put it.
• 16:01
  Speaker 2: Yeah, hey, we ran out.
• 16:03
  Speaker 2: I'm so sorry, done left.
• 16:05
  Speaker 1: We have done that for sure.
• 16:06
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's so funny and there's a meltdown, but then they get over it.
• 16:10
  Speaker 1: Yeah, you know.
• 16:11
  Speaker 1: Yeah, totally fine, all right, so mentioned.
• 16:15
  Speaker 1: There's a lot of hot topics right now, right, yeah, what have you found, immunizations being one of them, right?
• 16:20
  Speaker 2: Vaccines.
• 16:22
  Speaker 1: What are your thoughts on those Like of the recent things coming to light?
• 16:25
  Speaker 1: I know COVID was a huge exposure moment for a lot of people because the COVID vaccine, the disease in general, the media's role in all this stuff.
• 16:35
  Speaker 2: But anyway, what are your thoughts?
• 16:37
  Speaker 2: Three words vaccines save lives.
• 16:40
  Speaker 2: They absolutely do, and we have not seen a lot of these diseases and so we're not afraid of them anymore.
• 16:48
  Speaker 2: And what's going to happen and what has been happening, is when you're not stopping the vaccine I mean stopping the illness, stopping the bug that's causing the disease then there's going to be, you know, kind of like a global amnesia of like, oh, this is not so bad.
• 17:05
  Speaker 2: And then there's going to be a resurgence, and that's happening.
• 17:11
  Speaker 1: And anything in particular, oh measles.
• 17:14
  Speaker 2: Whooping cough is back.
• 17:14
  Speaker 2: We just had a colleague of mine just had a four-day-old that tested positive for whooping cough and whooping cough can kill that age right.
• 17:23
  Speaker 2: So there's a reason why we want to protect our children.
• 17:26
  Speaker 2: Having said that, I completely understand and empathize with parents today who are looking at a vaccine schedule and saying what the hell Like?
• 17:38
  Speaker 2: What is this madness right?
• 17:40
  Speaker 2: And I love history and I love medical history and I love vaccine history and I love being able to explain why we do the things we do and why we know these things are safe.
• 17:51
  Speaker 2: Lot of noise out there that is not giving complete accuracy in what they're presenting in terms of harm from immunizations, and I do have families who say you know what I am like really, really nervous about this and I'm like, okay, you know I'm not going to stick needles in your kid behind your back.
• 18:21
  Speaker 2: This is a conversation and this is, you know it's not just a one-time conversation.
• 18:26
  Speaker 2: This is a conversation over a childhood and I am more than willing to address your fears and I'm more than willing to show you the data and why we do the things that we do, and I also respect you for making the choice that you believe is the right choice for your child because, we both have the same end goal, and the same end goal is protecting the child.
• 18:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 18:48
  Speaker 2: Right and so I completely understand it.
• 18:51
  Speaker 2: But I come from a land of science and I come from a land of wanting to help and protect and having seen children die of whooping cough, having seen children die of varicella of chickenpox, seen children die of whooping cough, having seen children die of varicella of chickenpox I mean even in the early 2000s, kids who were immunosuppressed because they were undergoing bone marrow transplants or chemotherapy or whatever.
• 19:14
  Speaker 2: We try to protect those who cannot protect themselves.
• 19:17
  Speaker 2: And that's the idea of immunizing a population, because there's going to be a certain threshold where we lose our herd immunity.
• 19:26
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, herd immunity.
• 19:27
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah.
• 19:28
  Speaker 2: And we all know all these terms now because of COVID.
• 19:30
  Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly yeah, I was reading somewhere recently.
• 19:34
  Speaker 1: There's, I mean, over 80, in some states 90 vaccines on the schedule.
• 19:39
  Speaker 1: For what number is that, you know?
• 19:43
  Speaker 2: what it's the same over all it's federal, it's, yeah, it's worldwide.
• 19:47
  Speaker 2: I mean, these are the vaccines are available to everybody in the world, and these are the ones I.
• 19:52
  Speaker 2: I haven't counted it if I, if I were to count each antigen over the of the course of a childhood, probably in the 60s, but don't hold me to that because I haven't gone through that yet, but what I do know, and I am so I had my first immunization in 1973.
• 20:12
  Speaker 2: So it's 51 years ago Now.
• 20:15
  Speaker 2: I just told everybody my age.
• 20:16
  Speaker 2: All right, anyway, all you out there, it's experience yes, there we go?
• 20:23
  Speaker 2: Yes, it is.
• 20:25
  Speaker 2: So I had my first immunizations at the age of two months in 1973, and I had a diphtheria, tetanus, whooping, cough, dtp and I had an oral polio vaccine, which was the drops in the mouth, and I had that at two, four, six months and then, when I was one, I had my MMR, because the MMR came out in 1963.
• 20:45
  Speaker 2: So I was 11 years old when I got my MMR and then I got all my boosters before kindergarten.
• 20:50
  Speaker 2: That first tetanus shot that I got in December of 1973, had more antigen in it, more vaccine, more particles, more protein than all vaccines over a child's entire childhood, from birth to 18 years of age, put together.
• 21:11
  Speaker 2: So the amount of vaccine per syringe, per shot, has drastically come down and the number of diseases that we could prevent has drastically gone up.
• 21:24
  Speaker 2: But when you're looking at the schedule and you're looking at how many Band-Aids are on the tray and how many needles there are, it seems overwhelming and scary.
• 21:32
  Speaker 2: But the science just gets better and we stand on the shoulders of giants and we see that I can decrease the dose of this vaccine and make it safer and better and more efficient than what I got 51 years ago.
• 21:47
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, interesting, and what else.
• 21:51
  Speaker 1: So what?
• 21:51
  Speaker 1: I'll to clarify what I was asking.
• 21:53
  Speaker 1: Like people wouldn't understand what I was saying, but like cause I didn't say it, but the immunization requirements for school.
• 21:59
  Speaker 1: Oh yes, that was like there's, I don't know.
• 22:01
  Speaker 1: It's a plethora of vaccines and stuff and the big question right now is like the relation of autism to all the vaccines.
• 22:09
  Speaker 1: What have you seen with that?
• 22:12
  Speaker 2: Well, those are two questions, right?
• 22:13
  Speaker 2: So the first one is you're, you have a certain amount of of immunizations you need in order to enter school, and that's you know.
• 22:24
  Speaker 2: When you go to the pediatrician, you get a form, and those are not all the vaccines that are recommended by the American Academy of Pediatrics or the ACIP now defunct RIP, or even just to stay healthy, but those are the ones that are probably the most communicable from child to child, right?
• 22:38
  Speaker 2: So that I don't think varies too much state to state.
• 22:42
  Speaker 2: Like, for example, we recommend babies get a hepatitis A vaccine when they're a year old and that's not on the form, and the flu shot's not on the form, and COVID obviously is not on the form, or the Gardasil, but most of the other ones are, and we do that in order to protect kids that wouldn't be able to get the immunizations themselves.
• 23:06
  Speaker 2: So you might have a five-year-old who's completely up to date on their vaccines and then they develop some horrible disease that wipes out their immune system, and now the person sitting next to them can give them one of those diseases, right?
• 23:16
  Speaker 2: Right, the person sitting next to them can give them one of those diseases right, right.
• 23:18
  Speaker 2: And the schools are not allowed to disclose.
• 23:21
  Speaker 2: If everybody has all their immunizations because of privacy, yeah, but everyone needs to have the form.
• 23:28
  Speaker 2: And there are people who can get what's called a religious exemption, which I think should be renamed like a philosophical exemption.
• 23:33
  Speaker 2: But you can go to the Department of Health and say I'm not going to immunize my children and I want this exemption, and they're going to say here you go and with that paper you can go to school and you can still get in.
• 23:44
  Speaker 2: So it allows a little bit of freedom of parenting for parents who say I really don't want to do this, but it comes at the expense of me, of perhaps harming somebody else.
• 23:55
  Speaker 2: So there's that harming somebody else.
• 23:58
  Speaker 2: So there's that To the autism question.
• 24:00
  Speaker 2: So this all started in.
• 24:03
  Speaker 2: Well, there's always been vaccine hesitancy, even since the smallpox, right.
• 24:13
  Speaker 2: But the big jump happened in 1998 when Andrew Wakefield, who is a gastroenterologist, published a study in the Lancet, which is one of the periodicals of medicine, stating that he thinks he knows what causes autism.
• 24:25
  Speaker 2: He thinks it might be the measles, mumps, rubella vaccine, the MMR vaccine.
• 24:28
  Speaker 2: And this is why and basically what he did was called a retrospective study, where he took children already diagnosed and looked backwards and did colonoscopies on them and said that there's this leaky gut idea and that these toxins from this vaccine traveled through the gut into the brain and then caused the autistic symptoms in these children.
• 24:51
  Speaker 2: And it was the huge sensation, right.
• 24:54
  Speaker 2: So we're like, oh my gosh, we got it, we now know what was causing autism.
• 24:58
  Speaker 2: Great.
• 24:59
  Speaker 2: But as we learn in fourth grade biology class, there's a scientific method where you know you have to have this hypothesis and then you have your the way that the methods, like how you're going to be, you know, doing this experiment, the data that's collected and then the last part of it after the conclusion, is the reproducibility of it.
• 25:20
  Speaker 2: Can somebody else do this?
• 25:21
  Speaker 2: If they read my paper, do the exact same thing that I did and get the same results.
• 25:25
  Speaker 2: And that's where it fell through, that it was not able to be reproducible and then after that he lots of other stuff happened.
• 25:32
  Speaker 2: There's, you know they most people retracted their names of the authors, retracted their names, and then they realized, well, andrew Wakefield ended up losing his license because he was trying to for ethical reasons.
• 25:46
  Speaker 2: He was trying to produce another vaccine to compete with the MMR and that was unethical.
• 25:52
  Speaker 2: He's trying to scrut the MMR through the paper and then make his own vaccine, so he lost his medical license over that.
• 26:00
  Speaker 2: but the damage is already done because we're still talking about it.
• 26:04
  Speaker 2: 27 years later, we're still talking about it.
• 26:07
  Speaker 2: I am not saying that all vaccines for all people, at all instances are safe.
• 26:13
  Speaker 2: I can't even say that about our drinking water.
• 26:15
  Speaker 2: I cannot say that about Tylenol or Benadryl or anything that?
• 26:18
  Speaker 2: we regularly put into our bodies.
• 26:20
  Speaker 2: Nor am I saying that we should all make up our own vaccine schedules because of just vibes, right.
• 26:28
  Speaker 2: But I do pay attention to risk factors.
• 26:33
  Speaker 2: If there's been a family history of a vaccine injury, if there's any history with a family member with immune issues either hyperimmunity or disimmunity, like immune dysregulation I pay attention to that and we have a discussion about it.
• 26:53
  Speaker 2: But I am still encouraging children not to die from preventable deaths.
• 27:00
  Speaker 1: Right, yeah, yeah, we have a friend recently that—it's so hard.
• 27:05
  Speaker 1: We get so much information, don't know what to believe.
• 27:09
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 27:10
  Speaker 1: But we have a friend recently that was sharing that their child, I think, was at the time like five and was getting another schedule of vaccines and was doing well, progressing, talking, all that stuff, Got a vaccine Week later, wasn't talking, having speech, issues, whatever, Thinking like anyway they were trying to.
• 27:30
  Speaker 1: They were saying like I don't know Right, but this vaccine thing just happened A couple of days later, boom.
• 27:36
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 27:36
  Speaker 1: But nothing else.
• 27:37
  Speaker 1: It seems like was intervened to have caused this delay, but anyway, it's just.
• 27:43
  Speaker 1: I hear stories like that.
• 27:46
  Speaker 2: And they?
• 27:46
  Speaker 2: I mean I'm not going to give medical advice over a podcast but, this is something that happens and it's not necessarily I mean yes, it's due to be very careful with how I say this.
• 27:59
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 28:00
  Speaker 2: It's.
• 28:00
  Speaker 2: There are other things that can trigger this, right?
• 28:03
  Speaker 2: So there are underlying genetic abnormalities that need a trigger, and the trigger can come in the form of a virus.
• 28:09
  Speaker 2: It can come in form of an exposure to like a toxin, like a pesticide or something like that or a trigger like an immunization, and so when those things happen, you look at what the trigger was and then you say, oh my gosh, we need to get rid of this trigger.
• 28:26
  Speaker 2: But the real problem is this underlying genetic abnormality that got triggered.
• 28:32
  Speaker 1: Yeah, and that was expressed.
• 28:34
  Speaker 2: The best way I can explain that is.
• 28:36
  Speaker 2: Type 1 diabetes is like this right, you're born with this genetic predisposition and then there is a circulating virus that triggers it.
• 28:48
  Speaker 2: And then we see this in pediatrics, that the first time diagnosis of type 1 diabetes comes in waves, like we see it in the hospital, like you see five kids come in in one week with first onset because the circling strain of viruses that are going through is hitting the people who are predisposed to this and then causing that autoimmunity.
• 29:12
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so that's what's happening.
• 29:14
  Speaker 2: I want to go back to that question that you said originally about autism and immunizations.
• 29:20
  Speaker 2: And there was, you know, with that landmark paper that started everybody talking about.
• 29:26
  Speaker 2: That was in 98.
• 29:27
  Speaker 2: In 2000 and then I want to say 2012, but I'm not 100% sure.
• 29:33
  Speaker 2: There were two huge studies that were published.
• 29:35
  Speaker 2: There were two huge studies that were published.
• 29:37
  Speaker 2: One of them was a Danish study and one was a Finnish study, where they took huge populations of 600,000 and 1.2 million and the other of children and they followed them prospectively.
• 29:47
  Speaker 2: The children were born and then they followed them for seven years in one study I can't remember the other one and then they divided them into the ones who were fully immunized and the ones who weren't, and they saw the exact same rates of autism in both Exact same.
• 30:01
  Speaker 2: So that was in 2001,.
• 30:04
  Speaker 2: That first study came out.
• 30:05
  Speaker 2: All the pediatricians who, since 98, were like what are we going to do?
• 30:08
  Speaker 2: What do you think?
• 30:09
  Speaker 2: Whatever we're like, okay, now we know it's not vaccines.
• 30:13
  Speaker 2: Now do vaccines or anything in their environment play a role in it?
• 30:17
  Speaker 2: Absolutely, we know that autism is genetic and we know that there is this multifactorial, as we call it.
• 30:23
  Speaker 2: There are other things that come into play, but because all kinds of autism are different like you see one autistic child, you just tell me I see one autistic child you can't define autism by that one child, right?
• 30:37
  Speaker 2: So it expresses in different ways and is being caused by different things.
• 30:41
  Speaker 2: And when science catches up and says, aha, this is what it is, then we will, all you know, as new parents, breathe a little easier.
• 30:48
  Speaker 2: But until then, we just have to really make sure that we are not causing more harm by withholding immunizations that are life-saving to children just out of fear of autism.
• 31:00
  Speaker 1: Right, I mean I would totally.
• 31:01
  Speaker 1: I mean I'm a person of science as well.
• 31:03
  Speaker 1: By no means the same education as you are in that realm.
• 31:07
  Speaker 1: You know what I mean.
• 31:07
  Speaker 1: Different, yeah, but I remember in school and undergrad I was a biology major I was debating med school for a minute.
• 31:14
  Speaker 2: That's what I should have done, yeah exactly, I was a French literature major decided to swing away and go into medicine.
• 31:22
  Speaker 1: May we?
• 31:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah, like what is it?
• 31:25
  Speaker 1: But I remember one class in particular.
• 31:27
  Speaker 1: Like they were like you know, every time you get a vaccine I get sick.
• 31:30
  Speaker 1: I think vaccines are making me sick and I was like that's like impossible.
• 31:34
  Speaker 1: They're dead viruses, that's not causing you to be sick, and maybe it's a placebo thing, you know.
• 31:39
  Speaker 1: Anyway, people are like, oh my gosh, this is, like you know, 15 years ago.
• 31:44
  Speaker 1: But anyway, I've always agreed, like I mean, vaccines are made to save lives, they're vaccines to help express immunity and antigens and stuff.
• 31:54
  Speaker 1: So we become better equipped to handle viruses when they come about right, Right to genes and stuff.
• 32:00
  Speaker 1: So we become better equipped to handle viruses when they come about right, right.
• 32:02
  Speaker 1: And so antibiotics right from a bacterial standpoint, just to fight off the bacteria and be good.
• 32:06
  Speaker 1: There's a lot of skepticism of like, what else is included in these syringes when they're injecting, whether it's been ammonia or aluminum and mercury found in them.
• 32:17
  Speaker 1: What have you heard?
• 32:17
  Speaker 1: What are your thoughts on that, or like?
• 32:18
  Speaker 1: What have you heard on that?
• 32:20
  Speaker 2: Well, back about feeling sick after getting an immunization.
• 32:23
  Speaker 2: It depends on the health of your immune system, right?
• 32:25
  Speaker 2: So the immunization is priming your immune system to recognize this bug so that when the actual bug comes into view, then you've got your defenses already done so some people are a little bit more sensitive to that and they feel like a little bit more run down after getting an immunization because their immune system's working right Kind of how you feel sometimes a little crummy, like the day after a really strenuous workout and you're like, oh, I shouldn't have done that.
• 32:51
  Speaker 2: And you're like, no, I really should have.
• 32:52
  Speaker 2: I just have to, like recover from this Right.
• 32:54
  Speaker 2: Exactly so.
• 32:56
  Speaker 2: You know, immunizations are like that.
• 32:58
  Speaker 1: That makes sense.
• 33:00
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and some people have everyone's different right, so I'm the type of person that I can get a bunch of immunizations and I just keep powering through it.
• 33:08
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 33:09
  Speaker 2: But I can tell you that second or third COVID shot I got, I was like, oh, this is what people talk about.
• 33:14
  Speaker 1: Interesting.
• 33:15
  Speaker 2: Because I felt it with that one.
• 33:17
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah.
• 33:18
  Speaker 2: And now I forgot your question.
• 33:20
  Speaker 1: It was the other things, oh, the adjuvants and the things that are added to the vaccines?
• 33:24
  Speaker 2: Yes, so when I was in medical school, it was when the hepatitis B vaccine was pulled off the shelves because of a worry about the preservative in it called thimerosal, which is mercury.
• 33:42
  Speaker 2: Right, so there's two types of mercury there's ethylmercury and methylmercury.
• 33:47
  Speaker 2: One of them is the one that was in the thermometers like the old thermometers that when I was a kid and the thermometer would break.
• 33:56
  Speaker 2: We're like oh look, we can play with this right.
• 33:59
  Speaker 1: I wonder what it tastes like 70s right?
• 34:00
  Speaker 1: Oh boy yeah.
• 34:04
  Speaker 2: And that type of mercury can cross through the blood-brain barrier and that type of mercury can cause problems in the brain and we know that not only from individual people who have mercury toxicity from drinking mercury or playing with it, because it can be absorbed through fine motor development, speech development, cognitive development.
• 34:25
  Speaker 2: So these fetuses and babies and young children ended up having toxicity from the mercury that they were ingesting.
• 34:58
  Speaker 2: This is the same reason why we tell pregnant women not to eat a lot of big fish.
• 35:03
  Speaker 1: Right.
• 35:03
  Speaker 2: Because there's mercury in our water supply and the big fish eat the little fish, that eat the plants that have the mercury right.
• 35:10
  Speaker 2: So it's a cumulative effect.
• 35:12
  Speaker 1: Yeah, is that the same mercury that crosses the blood-brain barrier?
• 35:14
  Speaker 1: Yes, that's the one, okay, right, that's that one mercury Crosses the blood-brain barrier.
• 35:16
  Speaker 1: Yes, that's the one, okay.
• 35:16
  Speaker 2: Right, that's that one mercury.
• 35:18
  Speaker 2: The other mercury is the one that's found in thimerosal right, and that mercury is a bigger molecule and it does not cross a blood-brain barrier and it's processed really efficiently by the liver and we pee it out.
• 35:30
  Speaker 2: So at that time science wasn't 100% sure if thimerosal was the bad mercury or the not bad mercury, and so they took the hepatitis B off the shelf and were like we're going to study this.
• 35:46
  Speaker 2: Then, when they deemed it like, oh, it's the not bad mercury.
• 35:49
  Speaker 2: And then they took the thimerosal out of the vaccines.
• 35:52
  Speaker 2: Anyway, what it was used for it was a stabilizer so that when the vials of 10 doses were out, that the seventh or eighth dose would be as effective as the first dose, right?
• 36:04
  Speaker 2: So it was there to stabilize and preserve it.
• 36:06
  Speaker 2: They took the thimerosal out and since 90 something, 99, 2000, there has been no thimerosal in vaccines except for multi-dose vials, and so the multi-dose vials, which usually is one of the forms of flu vaccine, all the other ones have been thimerosal free.
• 36:28
  Speaker 2: So when speaking with people who may be leaning a little bit more towards conspiracy theory, there's like, well, if it wasn't bad, why did they take it out?
• 36:36
  Speaker 2: Again, there are many reasons why they removed it, one of them being it really decreases human error to have immunizations come in pre-filled syringes.
• 36:46
  Speaker 2: You get the dose exactly the same every time the name of the vaccine's written on the syringe.
• 36:52
  Speaker 2: There's just less room for error.
• 36:54
  Speaker 2: And because they're single dose, you know single use vaccines, you don't need the thimerosal.
• 36:59
  Speaker 2: But when you're looking at it from a more suspicious point of view, I can understand why people will say well, if it wasn't that bad, why did they remove it?
• 37:06
  Speaker 2: And now we don't have it in our vaccine.
• 37:08
  Speaker 2: So no, that we don't have thimerosal in practically any of the vaccines, except for the multi-dose ones which most pediatricians don't carry, just because it's so much easier just to give a single dose vaccine?
• 37:21
  Speaker 1: Oh, yeah, for sure.
• 37:21
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I also read and this was just top of mind because I had my baby boy six months ago, right, so we're like talking about vaccines and stuff and then we're getting flooded with all kinds of information yeah, but anyway, I also was reading about SIDS and the highest likelihood of SIDS happening, I think, is within seven to 14 days after an immunization event.
• 37:41
  Speaker 2: Okay, I have not read that.
• 37:43
  Speaker 1: The reason why I was reading.
• 37:44
  Speaker 1: I just was like what about SIDS, you know, and I was investigating that.
• 37:51
  Speaker 1: Then again, I don't remember or recall like the in-depth sources that I was reading this from of the legitimacy, the in-depth sources that I was reading this from of the legitimacy but I remember a couple sources that I was reading through similarly came up where it was like SIDS.
• 38:04
  Speaker 1: If a SIDS happens, it's like 80% likelihood that it had happened within 7 or 14 days, higher likely 7 days after a vaccine immunization period and then after that it decreases 60%, 50%, 40% After 14 days.
• 38:16
  Speaker 1: It's like cuts off, like drastically, like not having SIDS.
• 38:20
  Speaker 2: I'm wondering if that same data I mean it's going to be harder to find than you know finding immunization dates but if that same pattern happens after being exposed to an illness.
• 38:33
  Speaker 2: So if they so, if they have anything that revs up the immune system.
• 38:36
  Speaker 2: I'm not aware of that.
• 38:39
  Speaker 2: We do know what causes SIDS.
• 38:41
  Speaker 2: Unfortunately, we don't know who is predisposed to that, because there's no way to find out.
• 38:50
  Speaker 1: What is the cause?
• 38:52
  Speaker 2: It's an inability for the brain to increase respiratory drive when taking bigger gulps of air in, because there's a relative decrease of oxygen at the top of a mountain versus at a lower level right.
• 39:24
  Speaker 2: So if there is a decrease, or say like we're breathing into a pillow or into a paper bag, we breathe harder and harder as the oxygenation goes down.
• 39:35
  Speaker 2: It's a drive, like a physiological drive that we have, and these babies lack that drive and we don't know why.
• 39:42
  Speaker 2: We don't know how.
• 39:42
  Speaker 2: We know something genetic, but we don't know anything else about it.
• 39:45
  Speaker 2: And so the back to sleep campaign, which is basically putting the baby on their back so that they have all of this air around them that they can draw from, has decreased the risk of SIDS.
• 39:58
  Speaker 2: And we've seen other things that also predispose somebody to SIDS.
• 40:03
  Speaker 2: So belly breathing, belly sleeping we know, will predispose.
• 40:07
  Speaker 2: If the air is too stagnant, if it's really really hot and stagnant in the room, then it can also be a risk factor Smoking around the baby, because it also decreases the oxygen around and then the other one is co-sleeping and it's not co-sleeping because you roll over the baby.
• 40:27
  Speaker 2: That's death by suffocation.
• 40:30
  Speaker 2: It's because you have two adults with big lungs who are exhaling carbon dioxide in the breathing space of a baby who's got tiny little lungs and trying to draw the oxygen in.
• 40:42
  Speaker 2: And so when you are looking at all these different risk factors.
• 40:48
  Speaker 2: I like to tell my parents all these things because I believe that knowledge is power, and I would really love to decrease postpartum anxiety and all these things that come up when all of a sudden you have this live baby with no instruction manual coming home with you from the hospital and explaining.
• 41:06
  Speaker 2: This is why the back to sleep campaign works and this is why I say don't co-sleep with your baby.
• 41:13
  Speaker 2: And if you're still worried about SIDS, then run a ceiling fan or make sure that there's nothing in the breathing area of a baby, and then you should be okay, because then they grow out of that, their lungs become bigger, they have more residual volume and the brains are more developed, and then you lose that risk of SIDS.
• 41:29
  Speaker 2: The problem is that we can't tell which babies are predisposed to this and then we can't ease everyone else's anxiety.
• 41:36
  Speaker 1: Right, of course.
• 41:36
  Speaker 1: Yeah, interesting.
• 41:37
  Speaker 1: I had a professor back in the day that they had a baby years prior that had passed away from SIDS.
• 41:43
  Speaker 1: Horrible, horrible.
• 41:44
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I wasn't there, I wasn't present when it was happening.
• 41:48
  Speaker 1: I had met them years after that, but they still.
• 41:52
  Speaker 1: They would talk about it.
• 41:53
  Speaker 1: They would hold like a memorial every year for his birthday.
• 41:56
  Speaker 2: It was very you know I'm like man I couldn't imagine I could not imagine, Terrible, my son.
• 42:01
  Speaker 1: When he was born.
• 42:02
  Speaker 1: He I'm blanking on like the diagnosis, but he was a hemoglobin incompatibility with the mom and he was in the ICU, the NICU, for five days.
• 42:12
  Speaker 2: With the lights.
• 42:12
  Speaker 1: With the blue lights.
• 42:13
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, what am I?
• 42:15
  Speaker 1: Hyperbilirubinemia.
• 42:16
  Speaker 2: Yes, yeah, yeah, you said that very well.
• 42:17
  Speaker 1: Hyperbilirubinemia.
• 42:18
  Speaker 1: I was researching all about it, you know.
• 42:21
  Speaker 1: So he was born six hours.
• 42:23
  Speaker 1: We're in the normal hospital room.
• 42:25
  Speaker 1: Six hours later the nurses come in.
• 42:27
  Speaker 1: It's early.
• 42:28
  Speaker 1: It was like 6 a was like.
• 42:35
  Speaker 1: We're like okay, you know, and that was tough had to draw blood like through his heel and like it wasn't coming out well and I'm like, oh man, I've seen this little baby like in a blue light.
• 42:44
  Speaker 1: I know Can't hold him.
• 42:46
  Speaker 1: We were holding him a little bit like to nurse.
• 42:48
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 42:50
  Speaker 1: And then his regulating so like we need to like not pick them up and like just crush these blue lights.
• 42:55
  Speaker 1: So it was hard.
• 42:55
  Speaker 1: You know it's very hard, but bless my wife, you know heart.
• 42:58
  Speaker 1: She was there all, all day and all night and I went home with the other kids managing them at home and we go visit every day and this was over thanksgiving but fortunately everything was fine.
• 43:07
  Speaker 1: You know they're like it was tough um, but everything worked out um after that.
• 43:12
  Speaker 1: Do you have any like with infants that you see after birth their home?
• 43:17
  Speaker 1: Um hyperbilirubinemia is that a common?
• 43:20
  Speaker 1: After like a couple of days it's like you know, you're confident it's not going to happen.
• 43:25
  Speaker 2: Correct, okay.
• 43:26
  Speaker 1: And then after that any complications with babies afterwards.
• 43:30
  Speaker 2: Nope, that's what I've heard too.
• 43:30
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so it's in the time that you're dealing with it.
• 43:34
  Speaker 2: You want to make sure that that bilirubin is low enough that doesn't cross into the brain.
• 43:38
  Speaker 2: Yeah, and that's really why people get very excited about it, yeah, and then after the bilirubin levels start coming down and then it's never an issue ever again for the regular ABO incompatibility or that kind of stuff.
• 43:53
  Speaker 2: There are some syndromes that lead to hyperbilirubinemia that can be diagnosed and can be confused in the very beginning, but that's why we have so many visits in the very beginning of life.
• 44:05
  Speaker 2: We're always like eyes on the child, just to make sure that it's not one of these weird things out there.
• 44:10
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, for sure.
• 44:11
  Speaker 2: But it's sad because you miss out on the maternal bonding with the baby and the stress of being in the NICU.
• 44:20
  Speaker 1: Oh for sure, but there's nothing else to worry about.
• 44:22
  Speaker 1: That's good, and so you mentioned preventative health with kiddos.
• 44:29
  Speaker 1: What do you recommend with that besides?
• 44:32
  Speaker 2: eating well.
• 44:32
  Speaker 2: Wow, there's so much.
• 44:33
  Speaker 2: Is that eating well?
• 44:33
  Speaker 2: Yeah, can you trace?
• 44:34
  Speaker 1: back where this thing is from, where's the Pop-Tart tree, right, exactly, I don't know.
• 44:42
  Speaker 1: If there is one, then maybe let's pass.
• 44:43
  Speaker 1: You know, let's limit this a little bit.
• 44:44
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so, preventative health.
• 44:46
  Speaker 1: What are your recommendations?
• 44:48
  Speaker 2: well, it depends on the ages and the stages.
• 44:49
  Speaker 2: Okay, so in um, the tenets are probably all the very similar pillars that adults are used to, right.
• 44:55
  Speaker 2: So nutrition is being one of them that we have touched on.
• 44:58
  Speaker 2: Sleep is huge.
• 45:00
  Speaker 2: Sleep is probably one of the most important things out there.
• 45:03
  Speaker 2: You have so much stuff happening during sleep that you know getting knowing what a normal sleep looks like at different ages, and then making sure that you're hitting those not only just the length of time that you're sleeping, but the the the right sleep patterns.
• 45:19
  Speaker 2: So babies spend a lot of time in REM sleep.
• 45:21
  Speaker 2: That's why they're so they're.
• 45:23
  Speaker 2: They're like these little goblins at night that you're like what is this noise coming from the bassinet next to my bed?
• 45:28
  Speaker 2: They're snorting and they're moving and they're grunting and they're.
• 45:30
  Speaker 2: But all that's like normal sleep.
• 45:32
  Speaker 2: So knowing what what sleep looks like at different ages and different stages, and trying to maximize the amount of sleep Movement Movement's very big and you know I'm a big proponent of play.
• 45:44
  Speaker 2: I think us grownups should be playing more too.
• 45:46
  Speaker 2: I mean, play is so important, not just for the physical body but for the brain and social development and everything.
• 45:53
  Speaker 2: So you know.
• 45:55
  Speaker 2: And then prevention of accidents, disease.
• 45:58
  Speaker 2: You know harm prevention.
• 46:00
  Speaker 2: You know you don't want to be encouraging different high-risk behaviors and they look different at different ages, right?
• 46:08
  Speaker 2: So usually when there's a spurt of psychomotor development, there is a peak in accidents.
• 46:18
  Speaker 2: So you see that in toddlerhood, where they're all of a sudden they're learning how to run and climb and do all this stuff, then we have accidental deaths.
• 46:25
  Speaker 2: When we have adolescents who have this big spurt in, like their psychosocial development, they have these accidents that adults wouldn't be having in terms of like motor vehicle accidents or boating accidents, drowning, you know things from.
• 46:39
  Speaker 2: You know getting access to something all of a sudden and then not having the tools to do it safely.
• 46:45
  Speaker 1: Yeah, of course.
• 46:46
  Speaker 1: Yeah, with the nutrition thing.
• 46:49
  Speaker 1: You know you're familiar with the Huberman Lab, right?
• 46:52
  Speaker 1: That cool podcast, andrew Huberman?
• 46:54
  Speaker 1: You should check it out, it's really interesting.
• 46:55
  Speaker 1: You're familiar with the Huberman Lab, right?
• 46:56
  Speaker 1: That cool podcast, andrew Huberman?
• 46:57
  Speaker 1: You should check it out, it's really interesting.
• 46:58
  Speaker 1: But anyway, there was a couple of podcasts.
• 47:00
  Speaker 1: I'd listened to him and he was talking about alcohol, like there's no benefit to alcohol.
• 47:04
  Speaker 1: I would argue that oh you would, oh yeah, Tell me.
• 47:06
  Speaker 2: Oh no, I just enjoy my wine.
• 47:08
  Speaker 1: Oh, yeah, I enjoy it, it's good, um, and yeah, for sure I feel really good when I'm drinking.
• 47:14
  Speaker 1: That helps.
• 47:16
  Speaker 1: But anyway, I guess what I was saying was is like like, oh, it's good for your blood, like a little bit of red wine, like whatever it's like, that's been disproven, it's just, it's all toxic.
• 47:24
  Speaker 1: I haven't kicked it myself yet.
• 47:25
  Speaker 1: Like, I enjoy a couple of drinks on the weekend, you know, of course, um, when the kids get to bed and it's like, okay, finally, good, rest with candy, and like treats and stuff with the kiddos, are you like, hey, moderation is totally fine.
• 47:38
  Speaker 1: Or you like to try to avoid any candy and sugar?
• 47:42
  Speaker 2: So now we're talking a little bit more, not so much of what the body requires, you know, but what socially and developmentally, a child would gravitate towards.
• 47:57
  Speaker 2: So any type of extremism, absolutely don't do this, don't do this, don't do this and a child who is developing their brain and being curious and adventurous, they're going to probably end up overdoing it.
• 48:11
  Speaker 2: And this can apply to anything, whether it's candy or anything.
• 48:18
  Speaker 2: They say absolutely not to a child and be very strict on that, but in moderation, I mean.
• 48:27
  Speaker 2: You should not.
• 48:28
  Speaker 2: These things are called treats and you don't have treats every day right.
• 48:32
  Speaker 2: A treat is a special occasion thing.
• 48:34
  Speaker 2: So for birthday parties and maybe Christmas or Halloween or something like that, then you can have a treat.
• 48:40
  Speaker 2: But if you have a treat every day then you kind of take away that being a treat.
• 48:46
  Speaker 1: It's normalized almost.
• 48:48
  Speaker 2: Right and say this is one of the food groups.
• 48:50
  Speaker 2: Today I heard somebody say Um you know, today I I heard somebody say um, there should not be the term junk food.
• 48:57
  Speaker 2: Either it's food or it's junk.
• 48:59
  Speaker 2: But junk food should not be its own thing.
• 49:02
  Speaker 2: So when you start looking at it through that lens and going, this is junk.
• 49:06
  Speaker 2: And so every once in a while you go to the thrift store and you buy a piece of junk right.
• 49:11
  Speaker 2: Every once in a while you have, you know, some Smarties.
• 49:14
  Speaker 2: Those are my favorite junk, oh, smarties.
• 49:16
  Speaker 1: Yeah, every once in a while you have some Smarties.
• 49:17
  Speaker 2: Those are my favorite junk.
• 49:18
  Speaker 2: Oh, smarties, yeah, those are good.
• 49:19
  Speaker 2: Yeah, those are good.
• 49:21
  Speaker 2: Then, without demonizing it, but also not being super, you know, allow you to experiment with meth.
• 49:42
  Speaker 1: No, absolutely not.
• 49:43
  Speaker 1: Or like lighter fluid and like just light stuff on fire.
• 49:45
  Speaker 1: No, not going to do that.
• 49:47
  Speaker 2: But you know, if I demonize something that is at your cafeteria table, you're going to be really curious about it.
• 49:55
  Speaker 1: Why, and?
• 49:56
  Speaker 2: why does everybody else get to do this and not me?
• 49:58
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 49:59
  Speaker 2: The other kids are not playing with lighter fluid or meth at the cafeteria table, but they might have a Pop-Tart.
• 50:04
  Speaker 1: Yeah right.
• 50:04
  Speaker 2: So you know, just saying we don't eat that here.
• 50:07
  Speaker 2: You can have a bite if you want.
• 50:09
  Speaker 2: It's not good for you, it's junk.
• 50:12
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but it's junk.
• 50:18
  Speaker 1: Yeah, but you know, and then you parent that way, yeah, yeah, do you give suggestions on alcohol with?
• 50:20
  Speaker 2: teenagers and stuff.
• 50:20
  Speaker 2: What do you mean by suggestions?
• 50:22
  Speaker 1: as in like I guess the same thought of like don't want to demonize alcohol because it turns out like oh, why is it so?
• 50:29
  Speaker 1: you know yeah I want to try that right.
• 50:31
  Speaker 1: Um, I've heard different schools of thought.
• 50:33
  Speaker 1: You know, I mean I don't see us doing this, but I know of parents and people that I had previous experiences with, like their parents were like, yeah, just you know you can have a couple drinks, you know you're graduating high school or you're a junior now and everyone's driving.
• 50:49
  Speaker 1: At least we know that I'm taking your keys, so no one's driving, but at least I know everything's controlled.
• 50:56
  Speaker 2: Right, right Right.
• 50:57
  Speaker 1: Versus like no, don't drink until you're 21.
• 50:59
  Speaker 1: There's a reason Frontal lobe development and brain development, whatever.
• 51:01
  Speaker 1: What are your thoughts on that?
• 51:03
  Speaker 2: Well, I like to nerd out on the science of it and explaining to kids.
• 51:09
  Speaker 2: You know, the drinking is one thing.
• 51:10
  Speaker 2: I think one of the bigger threats comes at a little bit of an earlier age, and it's with the vaping that we're seeing a lot in the middle schools and it's horrible.
• 51:20
  Speaker 2: It's horrible and being able to explain you know whether the child has thought about it or not.
• 51:26
  Speaker 2: I just go into it when you know, when they're 10, 11 years old, and I just talk to them about this is what it does to your brain, this is what it does to your body.
• 51:33
  Speaker 2: This is why we say no and I just keep reiterating it.
• 51:37
  Speaker 2: I think a lot of these things like the vaccine talk and the drugs and alcohol talk and the sex talk, is something that you start at a relatively early age, at age appropriate language, and then you just build on it as it goes on and then give the kids the tools to say this is why we don't do this at this age.
• 51:55
  Speaker 1: All right, yeah, I gotcha.
• 51:56
  Speaker 1: So you're like staunch like don't drink any like.
• 52:00
  Speaker 2: No, I can't say that because I grew up in a Spanish household and we had wine at dinner from a very early age, but it was not glasses, it was a sip here, a sip there.
• 52:10
  Speaker 2: And when I came to the age in high school where people were having parties and I'm like, why is everybody drinking?
• 52:17
  Speaker 2: Like the world is going to end like 30 seconds from now, you know like you haven't drank before.
• 52:22
  Speaker 1: Like relax, what's?
• 52:23
  Speaker 2: up with that, and then I would go spend my summers in Spain and it was a social thing.
• 52:27
  Speaker 2: You know, you just go out and you have a drink Maybe, maybe not and then you know it wasn't to the point of, with the end result, getting drunk.
• 52:38
  Speaker 1: Yeah, right, yeah for sure.
• 52:39
  Speaker 1: I've heard a couple of Europeans say that, like, why do Americans just like crush and drink so much?
• 52:47
  Speaker 2: What's with the Red Solo cups?
• 52:48
  Speaker 2: Yeah, come with that.
• 52:51
  Speaker 1: That's funny I've also with the sleep thing.
• 52:54
  Speaker 1: I've heard that from multiple sources.
• 52:56
  Speaker 1: Where it's like the benefits and like the necessity to get quality sleep, where it's like all right, I want to really get in a health kick and like really change my life and trajectory.
• 53:06
  Speaker 1: First things, first, what do you do?
• 53:08
  Speaker 1: And it's like focus on your sleep.
• 53:10
  Speaker 1: Yeah, that's what I've heard from a lot of people.
• 53:12
  Speaker 1: Sleep is so important.
• 53:13
  Speaker 1: It's interesting oh, microbiome.
• 53:16
  Speaker 2: Oh, I love that, love the microbiome.
• 53:22
  Speaker 2: Yes, we have a whole world inside of us and you know there's all these different bacteria, right, and everything's like in this homeostasis, in this balance and by eating different foods, right?
• 53:37
  Speaker 2: So if we eat a different variety of foods, we are introducing different advantages by either the bacteria or the yeast or whatever that we're consuming, and we have to be able to sustain that.
• 53:52
  Speaker 2: And when it goes off, kilter, right.
• 53:56
  Speaker 2: So you have a stomach bug and you kind of wash everything out, or you're taking antibiotics and you kill off a whole bunch of things.
• 54:01
  Speaker 2: Or if you have just a really ultra processed, um, narrow diet, you're going to throw everything off on the inside of the gut and, um, you know, the gut is where most of our neurotransmitters are made.
• 54:15
  Speaker 1: Huh.
• 54:16
  Speaker 2: And so, if you want your serotonin hit, eat well, right, make sure you're sustaining your microbiome so you can produce the right balance of neurotransmitters.
• 54:30
  Speaker 1: Interesting.
• 54:31
  Speaker 2: So there's a very strong gut-brain connection and a lot of people don't listen to the gut.
• 54:37
  Speaker 2: So you know making sure that there's, you know it becomes a loop.
• 54:43
  Speaker 2: So people who have chronic constipation or chronic diarrhea, you, you're not, you're not able to stop that cycle because you know you're not restoring that bacteria.
• 54:56
  Speaker 2: That's either causing it or not allowing it to heal.
• 55:01
  Speaker 1: Yeah, interesting.
• 55:01
  Speaker 1: Are there different foods associated with different neurotransmitters?
• 55:04
  Speaker 2: Yes, and I don't know them off the top of my head, but yes, there are.
• 55:07
  Speaker 1: If you want like dopamine, eat this yes.
• 55:09
  Speaker 2: Yeah, so not necessarily the foods, but the bacteria that thrive off of that food.
• 55:16
  Speaker 2: I see Okay, interesting.
• 55:18
  Speaker 1: We'll be in a conversation another time then.
• 55:20
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I've got to read up on it.
• 55:21
  Speaker 2: That's awesome.
• 55:21
  Speaker 1: That's really cool, all right.
• 55:23
  Speaker 1: The risk factor avoidance you mentioned screen time.
• 55:27
  Speaker 1: Oh, I hate screen time.
• 55:29
  Speaker 1: Yeah, so screen time and vaping, you would say, on your top two lists of like don't do that.
• 55:34
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I think so yeah.
• 55:36
  Speaker 2: I'm sure I can find other lists, but-.
• 55:39
  Speaker 1: Screen time.
• 55:40
  Speaker 1: Describe screen time.
• 55:42
  Speaker 2: Screen time is.
• 55:48
  Speaker 2: I think screens cause a lot of harm inherently because of what they are right, and then they also cause a lot of harm from what they take away.
• 55:57
  Speaker 2: So things that they can take away they can take away from interpersonal development, right, they take away from play.
• 56:03
  Speaker 2: They take away from knowing conflict resolution and how to speak with other people, and we have this whole generation of kids who really don't know how to engage in small talk, because if we're all sitting in waiting at the bus stop together, everybody is going to be in their own little world and they're not going to talk Right.
• 56:32
  Speaker 2: So we're losing all of that as a society and totally agree.
• 56:35
  Speaker 2: And it's really, really sad.
• 56:38
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 56:39
  Speaker 2: And, and then what it?
• 56:40
  Speaker 2: What then?
• 56:41
  Speaker 2: What it does, you know?
• 56:42
  Speaker 2: So those are things that it takes away.
• 56:43
  Speaker 2: And then what?
• 56:45
  Speaker 2: I'm sure I'm missing some, but things that it causes.
• 56:48
  Speaker 2: It causes sleep disruption.
• 56:49
  Speaker 2: It causes it's been linked to the mental health crisis that we're dealing with right now with children and adolescents.
• 56:56
  Speaker 2: We have the social media component, that, speaking of dopamine, you know that these algorithms are written by these psychologists that know how to keep us addicted and how to scroll and how to do all these things.
• 57:15
  Speaker 2: And we're like you can't just stop by looking at your phone for 30 seconds.
• 57:19
  Speaker 2: You have to keep going, and keep going, and keep going.
• 57:22
  Speaker 2: And then time is lost and you're not talking to anybody.
• 57:25
  Speaker 2: And now you're feeling bad about yourself because everybody on the screen have happier, healthier lives than you are, and you suck, and so you can go down this rabbit hole.
• 57:34
  Speaker 2: And then there's the discernment of information Like how do we know what we're seeing is real?
• 57:39
  Speaker 2: And so now we're in the state that we're in right now, both socially and geopolitically and everything, and I blame screens for all of that?
• 57:50
  Speaker 1: Yeah, 100%.
• 57:51
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 57:51
  Speaker 1: I think it's crazy that like there's hired professionals Like you know how we can really manipulate people.
• 57:57
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I think it's crazy that like you know there's hired professionals like you know how we can really manipulate people Like do these things and these algorithms and that's how you get people addicted.
• 58:02
  Speaker 2: And increase like the intensity of light here and say this word here and it's it reminds me a lot of you know, the food chemists that try to make chips like you have to eat the whole bag and not just one.
• 58:16
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 58:17
  Speaker 2: It's like that same type of you know I went to.
• 58:20
  Speaker 1: Braving addiction.
• 58:21
  Speaker 2: I got a master's in psychology for this, yeah.
• 58:25
  Speaker 1: That's cool.
• 58:27
  Speaker 2: But yeah, I really I'm very sad about the screens.
• 58:31
  Speaker 2: The American Academy of Pediatrics recommends zero hours of screen time a day for children under the age of two, and then, during the time of COVID, they kind of backtracked a little bit and said well, if you're FaceTiming, you know, then that is the social connection that we need right now, you know in the height of COVID, and then they never took that back out.
• 58:51
  Speaker 2: So now we are allowing FaceTime, as you know, as permissiveness of screen time in babies.
• 58:57
  Speaker 2: But there are studies and there is data out there with linking the amount of screen time with problems with the developing brain, and one of the ones that I recently read about was the increase of eye pathology in children because of screen times, and it's linked to how many hours per day.
• 59:19
  Speaker 2: So if you're an infant and you spend more than one hour in front of a screen a day, then you have like 21% more chance of needing glasses because your eyesight is going to have problems with myopia or astigmatism or something like that.
• 59:35
  Speaker 2: So it depends on the age, because your brain know, your brain is there right.
• 59:39
  Speaker 2: The eyes are part of your brain and it depends on the age, it depends on the intensity and there's no reason why an infant or toddler needs to be on a screen.
• 59:48
  Speaker 1: Absolutely none.
• 59:48
  Speaker 1: Television same thing.
• 59:51
  Speaker 2: Television's a screen.
• 59:53
  Speaker 1: Yeah, interesting.
• 59:54
  Speaker 1: I remember watching a lot of television when I was a kid yeah it's just you know, but then again we also didn't have phones.
• 1:00:00
  Speaker 1: So the same way we did now, you know where I totally agree, like um then the social development and um the ability, like just the social intelligence conversations, um emotional intelligence.
• 1:00:16
  Speaker 1: It's just man, it's a bummer.
• 1:00:19
  Speaker 2: And even as a family unit.
• 1:00:20
  Speaker 2: You know you go to a restaurant and you see, you know two adults on a screen.
• 1:00:24
  Speaker 2: You see the kid with the iPad, the other kid with the iPad, and nobody's talking to each other.
• 1:00:28
  Speaker 2: And you know your kids are only going to be this age one time.
• 1:00:32
  Speaker 1: Yeah, for sure.
• 1:00:33
  Speaker 2: And you're going to miss out.
• 1:00:34
  Speaker 2: And so what if they have a meltdown?
• 1:00:35
  Speaker 2: Everyone One time, one time, yeah, for sure.
• 1:00:37
  Speaker 2: And you're going to miss out.
• 1:00:37
  Speaker 2: And so what if they have a meltdown?
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 2: Everyone has a meltdown.
• 1:00:39
  Speaker 2: I had a meltdown yesterday.
• 1:00:40
  Speaker 2: We can all have meltdowns, yeah, but being able to work through that and it just makes the whole unit so much stronger.
• 1:00:45
  Speaker 1: Yeah, totally, I totally agree with that.
• 1:00:47
  Speaker 2: I really did not have a meltdown yesterday, I was just part of the fun.
• 1:00:51
  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I'm having a mud don right now.
• 1:00:52
  Speaker 1: No, I uh, yeah, I totally there's.
• 1:00:55
  Speaker 1: I mean, man it's, yeah, it's a bummer.
• 1:00:59
  Speaker 1: I just think, like the kicks, considering some of the young, young kids right now, that in 20 years or 30 years from now they're going to be the main drivers of the economy and stuff.
• 1:01:12
  Speaker 1: Where what's that going to look like?
• 1:01:13
  Speaker 1: Probably a lot more manipulatable, not great socially intelligence.
• 1:01:17
  Speaker 1: They just never had that.
• 1:01:18
  Speaker 1: You know what I mean.
• 1:01:19
  Speaker 1: A conflict resolution, like you said, emotional intelligence, navigating challenging waters.
• 1:01:24
  Speaker 2: Right.
• 1:01:24
  Speaker 1: I don't know, it's tough.
• 1:01:25
  Speaker 2: I know and you know part of me.
• 1:01:27
  Speaker 2: I'm like am I now like my grandparents, like back in my day?
• 1:01:32
  Speaker 2: Right Exactly Is that what I'm trying to say is like, back in my day, right, exactly, am I?
• 1:01:35
  Speaker 2: Is that what I'm trying to say?
• 1:01:36
  Speaker 2: I'm like no, I mean it's a sadness, it's a yearning for, like simpler things.
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 2: It's the.
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 2: You know it's a tool, the screens are a tool and it should be used as a tool, like, just like you would use a drill as a drill, but you're not going to use a drill as a hammer and you're not going to apply that tool to everything right.
• 1:01:57
  Speaker 2: So knowing the useful part of it you know and applying it that, and then using play as play.
• 1:02:04
  Speaker 2: I'm not going to play here by myself.
• 1:02:08
  Speaker 2: You know, I'm going to go outside and play or I'm going to play a board game or I'm going to make up a story and tell people or whatever, and using your creative mind to be able to make life sweeter than looking at a screen.
• 1:02:26
  Speaker 1: Yeah for sure, Totally agree with all that.
• 1:02:28
  Speaker 1: Awesome.
• 1:02:30
  Speaker 1: Well, I appreciate it.
• 1:02:31
  Speaker 1: Let's land the plane there.
• 1:02:32
  Speaker 1: We'll open for other conversations next time.
• 1:02:35
  Speaker 1: We have plenty we could talk about, but no thanks for coming in, Cause I know you're busy and stuff.
• 1:02:40
  Speaker 1: What's the best way people can reach out to you?
• 1:02:43
  Speaker 2: So you can find me my speaking of.
• 1:02:47
  Speaker 2: So, speaking of screens, you can find me on a screen my website.
• 1:02:51
  Speaker 2: My practice name is more healthy kids.
• 1:02:53
  Speaker 2: My last name is Dr.
• 1:02:54
  Speaker 2: Website.
• 1:02:54
  Speaker 2: My practice name is More Healthy Kids.
• 1:02:55
  Speaker 2: My last name is Dr Moore, so it's M-O-O-R-E.
• 1:02:57
  Speaker 2: My phone number is 561-834-5528.
• 1:03:00
  Speaker 2: My office is right here on Olive, right down the street here, and my Instagram handle is at More Healthy Kids.
• 1:03:07
  Speaker 1: Cool.
• 1:03:07
  Speaker 1: Yeah, I love the name.
• 1:03:08
  Speaker 1: More Healthy Kids yeah, it's fun.
• 1:03:17
  Speaker 1: Perfect, I love it.
• 1:03:17
  Speaker 1: I love it.
• 1:03:18
  Speaker 1: That's my goal.
• 1:03:18
  Speaker 1: Well, thanks again for coming in.
• 1:03:19
  Speaker 1: We'll have to get round two in there and talk more about some other stuff like systemic disease down the road.
• 1:03:21
  Speaker 1: Your nonprofit in.
• 1:03:21
  Speaker 2: Ghana.
• 1:03:21
  Speaker 2: Yeah, what's all that?
• 1:03:22
  Speaker 2: Yeah, I'd love to talk about that too.
• 1:03:23
  Speaker 2: Yeah, for sure.
• 1:03:23
  Speaker 1: So thanks again for coming in and if y'all have any questions, we're always open to answering questions, comments, concerns, conflicting opinions, whatever If you, if it's like shoulder pain, back pain, neck pain, we'd love to help.
• 1:03:33
  Speaker 1: You can at least talk on the phone and get some opinions and some insights, and the best way to reach us is probably our phone number too 561-899-8725.
• 1:03:42
  Speaker 1: So don't hesitate to reach out to any questions and reach out to Dr Moore for any pediatric questions.
• 1:03:46
  Speaker 2: Absolutely.
• 1:03:46
  Speaker 2: I'm here to help.
• 1:03:49
  Speaker 1: We'll catch you all next time.