Latest / Broken Record with Rick Rubin, Malcolm Gladwell, Bruce Headlam and Justin Richmond / Valerie June Shines Bright

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Valerie June Shines Bright · Broken Record with Rick Rubin, Malcolm Gladwell, Bruce Headlam and Justin Richmond

0:15
Speaker 1: Pushkin. Since the release of her twenty thirteen Dan Arbach
0:24
Speaker 1: produced album Pushing Against the Stone, Valori June has become
0:27
Speaker 1: a critics Darling Rolling Stone praised the Tennessee born soul
0:32
Speaker 1: singer's unique voice as vinegary and slightly oddball, writing that
0:36
Speaker 1: she's equal parts Diana Ross and Dolly Party on AKA.
0:56
Speaker 1: With every subsequent release, Valor June has helped widen the
1:00
Speaker 1: scope of contemporary Americana music. She's one of few African
1:04
Speaker 1: American women working in the genre today. Her unique combination
1:09
Speaker 1: of gospel with appellation folk is a shimmering example of
1:12
Speaker 1: what's possible in the roots music tradition. Broken Record producer
1:17
Speaker 1: Leah Rose caught up with Valerie to talk through her
1:20
Speaker 1: stunny new album. They also talk about Valerie's new collaboration
1:24
Speaker 1: with the legendary Stack singer Carla Thomas and the mystical
1:28
Speaker 1: muse who inspires the chorus of voices that Valerie hears
1:32
Speaker 1: in her head. This is Broken Record Liner notes for
1:39
Speaker 1: the digital age. I'm justin Richmond. Here's Leah Rose and
1:47
Speaker 1: Valerie June. Valerie starts off by singing a song off
1:50
Speaker 1: her brand new album, The Moon and Stars Prescriptions for dreamers.
2:05
Speaker 1: No very is a place for me. Help me to
2:12
Speaker 1: crowl that I'm a leaving See a stream that flows well.
2:18
Speaker 1: Knowing to find battles the key and steals my chattering man.
2:26
Speaker 1: I know there is a harm inside window too saw
2:33
Speaker 1: every dreamer bite each bread is goldey, pathway, lightay, guide,
2:40
Speaker 1: garden to crowl, keep on the sun easide some Collie
2:46
Speaker 1: prayers and sea. Should n see some sitting breathe, some
2:52
Speaker 1: fallen being dead knees. I'd be a food to let
2:57
Speaker 1: it have a name. Earth is a school to shine.
3:02
Speaker 1: Is why you came. Some Collie person Cey is shot nice.
3:09
Speaker 1: I must agree how I find my peace. I'd be
3:15
Speaker 1: food to let it have a name. Earth is a
3:19
Speaker 1: school to shine, is why you came. I know there
3:27
Speaker 1: is a place for me and me too grow that
3:31
Speaker 1: I'm a living See a stream that falls well, knowing
3:37
Speaker 1: too fine, that's a key. It steals my chattering mind.
3:48
Speaker 1: It's beautiful. Thank you. So what inspired that? Did that
3:52
Speaker 1: start with the idea of trying to calm the chattery mind? Well,
3:57
Speaker 1: it started like most of the songs, where like it
4:02
Speaker 1: just came. The first thing I heard was, I know
4:07
Speaker 1: there is a place or me, and then I waited
4:13
Speaker 1: and then the rest started coming and it said helped
4:17
Speaker 1: me to grow that I'm living see, and I was like, whoa, okay,
4:23
Speaker 1: what am I growing for? And then it said a
4:27
Speaker 1: strength to flow well, knowing to fine that holds the
4:33
Speaker 1: key and steals my chattering mom and I was like, oh, okay,
4:39
Speaker 1: I'm in now. So I wanted to know more after that,
4:42
Speaker 1: and that's when it said there's a home inside and
4:45
Speaker 1: it's a window to your soul where every dream abites
4:48
Speaker 1: and each breath is gold, a pathway alight in the God.
4:53
Speaker 1: And I was like, okay, well, I guess I needed
4:56
Speaker 1: to hear that. It's always like the song comes to
4:59
Speaker 1: me and it's medicine that I needed in that moment.
5:04
Speaker 1: It's like they're little gifts for me. And that's why
5:06
Speaker 1: I call it prescriptions for dreamers, because they're like little
5:11
Speaker 1: messages from I don't know, maybe it's my ancestors, or
5:14
Speaker 1: maybe it's God or the Goddess or Buddha or whoever
5:19
Speaker 1: else we wanted, the universe, whatever we want to call it,
5:22
Speaker 1: giving little seeds of messages that I need. You know.
5:27
Speaker 1: In twenty thirteen, I read that you labeled your style
5:30
Speaker 1: organic Moonshine roots music. Does that so hold true for you?
5:35
Speaker 1: I stopped using the name organic Moonshine Roots music because
5:40
Speaker 1: I'm overusing that name. I don't even need a name anymore.
5:44
Speaker 1: At the point that I needed a name, it was
5:47
Speaker 1: I was playing music a lot down in Helena, Arkansas,
5:51
Speaker 1: and Clarkstone, Mississippi, and busking and all around Memphis in
5:57
Speaker 1: that area in the region, and people would hear my
6:00
Speaker 1: music and they would say, what kind of music is that?
6:03
Speaker 1: And I'd say, what kind of music do you think
6:05
Speaker 1: it is? And some people will say blues, and some
6:07
Speaker 1: people would say gospel, some folk, and some he obili music.
6:11
Speaker 1: And I was just like, gosh, I'm just gonna think
6:15
Speaker 1: of a magical name for my music and and let
6:19
Speaker 1: that name be what I call it, because I want
6:24
Speaker 1: it to be able to just be made and not
6:27
Speaker 1: have all of those rules. And I still feel like that,
6:32
Speaker 1: like it's ethereal, it's magical, it's it's what do we
6:36
Speaker 1: call music. It's really really hard for musicians unless they're
6:40
Speaker 1: in a pure form and studying that. Yeah, And it
6:43
Speaker 1: seems like the only place those labels really matter are
6:47
Speaker 1: you know, when you're being classified on Spotify in a
6:49
Speaker 1: certain playlist or even in like an old school record
6:53
Speaker 1: store where you have to be within a certain genre.
6:56
Speaker 1: But besides that, it's like it's what you know, it
6:58
Speaker 1: doesn't even really matter. Yeah, And I find that many
7:02
Speaker 1: listeners they don't much need the label title for the
7:07
Speaker 1: genre or whatever. They like the song and it feels
7:10
Speaker 1: good tunes, they respond to it, and that's the whole
7:12
Speaker 1: area is two. And it's almost even better because if
7:16
Speaker 1: it's a song, if it's somebody who has like a
7:18
Speaker 1: clear parameter, like you know, you hear people say I
7:21
Speaker 1: like everything but country music. M And it's almost better
7:25
Speaker 1: because then if you don't know what it is, you
7:28
Speaker 1: can like it and then you find out, oh no,
7:30
Speaker 1: it's actually country music. Yeah, because I guarantee you that
7:34
Speaker 1: for people who do say that, because I used to
7:37
Speaker 1: say that, Like as a teenager, I would say, I
7:40
Speaker 1: like everything but country music. But I loved country music
7:44
Speaker 1: because I like old country music. What I didn't like
7:49
Speaker 1: was modern, polished country music. And I like the country
7:54
Speaker 1: music that came out of my grandmother's church, which was
7:56
Speaker 1: just a bunch of old black folks singing at Highway
7:59
Speaker 1: forty five bypassed Church of Christ and singing with their
8:04
Speaker 1: Southern accents as loud as they could with no instruments
8:08
Speaker 1: and had a twine. And that's what I was writing, son,
8:12
Speaker 1: So you're probably still drawn to that. Oh yeah, voices
8:15
Speaker 1: in the pure raw form, and especially voices that are imperfect.
8:20
Speaker 1: I love that. If a voice breaks or cracks or
8:23
Speaker 1: crib quivers, I love that. So who are some artists
8:27
Speaker 1: that you love who have that characteristic with their voice?
8:31
Speaker 1: Karen Dalton has it with her voice. It's such an
8:34
Speaker 1: imperfectly perfect voice. Billy Holliday's voices like that, they have
8:39
Speaker 1: these breaks, Eddie James or here points where her voice
8:42
Speaker 1: has this rust on it. It's just rusty, like a
8:47
Speaker 1: galvanized ten that's been out in the sun in front
8:50
Speaker 1: of a trailer all day and for years and years
8:53
Speaker 1: and years. So voices that have that to it, you know,
8:58
Speaker 1: on a ball she sang with her husband ec Ec
9:04
Speaker 1: and on a ball her voice is so imperfect. Memphis
9:07
Speaker 1: Manny Best c Smith and my Rainy, any of the
9:10
Speaker 1: old sounds. When you listen to that, it doesn't sound
9:16
Speaker 1: clear and perfect all the way through. You know, there
9:19
Speaker 1: are points where you just hear raw emotion. And then
9:24
Speaker 1: how did you settle on your sound? Was there a
9:27
Speaker 1: certain point when you were just starting to play music
9:31
Speaker 1: where you felt like you had to pick a lean
9:34
Speaker 1: in a way. Did you experiment a little bit at first? Well,
9:38
Speaker 1: this is a not a ending question, it's an ever
9:43
Speaker 1: present question. And basically what I did was I was
9:48
Speaker 1: in a band went after I moved to Memphis, and
9:52
Speaker 1: I sang only. I didn't play any instruments. But when
9:56
Speaker 1: the band broke up, I was just singing. And I
10:00
Speaker 1: worked really hard building a following for this band, and
10:04
Speaker 1: people would be like, where are you going to play?
10:06
Speaker 1: What's going on? When's the next show? And it was
10:09
Speaker 1: over and I was like, you know what, I never
10:12
Speaker 1: want to experience this again in my life. I want
10:15
Speaker 1: to be able to accompany myself and do shows just
10:19
Speaker 1: me with an instrument, no matter what. And so my grandfather,
10:24
Speaker 1: when I was fourteen, he'd given me a guitar and
10:26
Speaker 1: I told him I promised him that I'd learned to play,
10:30
Speaker 1: but I never did. So I was in my early
10:32
Speaker 1: twenties and when the band broke up and I said, well,
10:36
Speaker 1: I might have to sit down and learn how to
10:38
Speaker 1: play this guitar, and so I got a chord book.
10:41
Speaker 1: And when you get a chord book, they show folk
10:44
Speaker 1: songs in their crowdad song which I was raised don
10:48
Speaker 1: Tom Dooley and the songs like that. So you learn
10:52
Speaker 1: the root, you learn the basic chords, you learn the
10:57
Speaker 1: foundation of music. And everyone who's anybody had to do that,
11:04
Speaker 1: from you know, John Herd to Hendrix. It didn't matter
11:07
Speaker 1: what style you play. I had to learn that route.
11:10
Speaker 1: And so when I started to explore even further, because
11:15
Speaker 1: the books only have twenty or so pages, I was like,
11:18
Speaker 1: I want to learn more songs more. So that's when
11:23
Speaker 1: musicians that were around me, because as a singer, I
11:25
Speaker 1: had a bunch of musicians around me, they'd be like,
11:28
Speaker 1: listen to this, listen to the listening to these Memphis musicians,
11:31
Speaker 1: and I've gravitated towards things that reminded me of what
11:35
Speaker 1: I was raised on. And I was raised on like
11:38
Speaker 1: just southern gospel and country and folk and blues and
11:45
Speaker 1: R and B and stuff. And so when I heard
11:48
Speaker 1: the Carter family, those songs were accompanied by guitar, but
11:55
Speaker 1: they were the same songs that I was raised singing
11:57
Speaker 1: a cappella in the church. So it blew my mind
12:00
Speaker 1: to hear them play that way, because it was against
12:03
Speaker 1: the rules of the church to have instruments in the church.
12:05
Speaker 1: You'd go to hell for that. And so I was
12:08
Speaker 1: just kind to like, well, I want to learn how
12:11
Speaker 1: to play these songs with and with the instrument. I
12:15
Speaker 1: know how to sing them. I know a thousand songs.
12:18
Speaker 1: The books full of like songbooks at church, they're about
12:22
Speaker 1: nine hundred two a thousand songs in there. So I
12:25
Speaker 1: had all of these melodies and lyrics and things floating
12:29
Speaker 1: around my head, and I just took them and started
12:32
Speaker 1: putting them to basic chords and creating my versions of them.
12:36
Speaker 1: And so the songs have always just told me what
12:38
Speaker 1: to do. They're the boss. If they want to be
12:41
Speaker 1: a blue song, they're a blue song. If they want
12:43
Speaker 1: to be a country song, they're a country song. If
12:45
Speaker 1: they want to be a rock and roll song or
12:46
Speaker 1: something I want to be on your Mind or Astraplane,
12:49
Speaker 1: which is kind of dreamy stuff, then they'll be that.
12:53
Speaker 1: They're the boss. I get told what to do basically, Well,
12:57
Speaker 1: that's nice because then you don't have to wrestle with
12:59
Speaker 1: it in your head. It sort of takes some pressure
13:01
Speaker 1: off it does. The hardest part is when a song
13:05
Speaker 1: tells you what it wants, but you can't afford to
13:07
Speaker 1: do it. So you started playing guitar in your early twenties,
13:12
Speaker 1: you said, and then you switched over to banjo. Was
13:15
Speaker 1: that a hard transition to make? Well, like the guitar
13:19
Speaker 1: being given to me by my grandfather, my first banjo
13:22
Speaker 1: was given to me, and I was like, what the
13:24
Speaker 1: hell am I supposed to do with this? Isn't it
13:27
Speaker 1: way more difficult to play banjo than a guitar? I
13:30
Speaker 1: think it is. Yeah, it is if you want to
13:33
Speaker 1: play it in a traditional way. Otherwise, if you play
13:37
Speaker 1: it like I play it, which is whatever way you
13:39
Speaker 1: feel like it, then you just make it your own.
13:43
Speaker 1: But if I'm trying to like go by the book
13:45
Speaker 1: on the banjo, yeah, there's no comparison to the going
13:49
Speaker 1: by the book on the guitar versus banjo. But yeah,
13:54
Speaker 1: it was given to me, and like the guitar, I
13:57
Speaker 1: let us sit around and collect us for a few years,
14:01
Speaker 1: and then it started calling me. It said, I have
14:04
Speaker 1: a song. I have a song. And so the first
14:06
Speaker 1: time I sat with it was just writing a song.
14:10
Speaker 1: I think I could write a song on almost anything
14:12
Speaker 1: that makes sound, but actually knowing how to play that
14:17
Speaker 1: instrument up and down. That's the life's work for me,
14:20
Speaker 1: and I work on that every day now now that
14:22
Speaker 1: I have this life where I don't have to get
14:25
Speaker 1: up and go work three jobs. It's what I do.
14:28
Speaker 1: Do you take lessons or are you completely self taught?
14:31
Speaker 1: Self talk? Do you do like YouTube tutorials or do
14:34
Speaker 1: you just sit with the instrument and figure it out.
14:37
Speaker 1: When I want to learn a cover song, I'll watch
14:40
Speaker 1: videos on it on YouTube. And I think that's so
14:43
Speaker 1: amazing about this technology in our time that we can
14:48
Speaker 1: learn anything we want to learn. And I think that
14:51
Speaker 1: contributes to artists not having limited limits as far as
14:56
Speaker 1: what they create. It being inspiration from artists from India
15:01
Speaker 1: or Africa, Ireland, you know, you can just go all
15:06
Speaker 1: the way into Brazilian music or anything you want to learn,
15:09
Speaker 1: right at the click of a finger tip, you know,
15:12
Speaker 1: on a button. So I lean on the the internet
15:19
Speaker 1: quite a bit, and and I kind of trust my
15:22
Speaker 1: ear some now, but really I just trust my ear
15:27
Speaker 1: with singing. So sometimes I can pick out a part
15:30
Speaker 1: and I'm like, oh yeah, I'm proud of myself because
15:34
Speaker 1: when I first started in my early twenties, I could
15:39
Speaker 1: not tell you what a saxophone was or a berry
15:44
Speaker 1: sex compared to any of the other horns. The only
15:48
Speaker 1: one I really knew was blaring saxophone clearly and trumpet
15:53
Speaker 1: if trumpet is my favorite arm. But I couldn't distinguish
15:56
Speaker 1: which was what in music. I listened to music as
16:00
Speaker 1: a whole versus getting inside of it and being able
16:02
Speaker 1: to say that, right there is the base, and then
16:04
Speaker 1: underneath that came this, and under behind that came that.
16:07
Speaker 1: And so I had to learn how to hear like
16:10
Speaker 1: a musician, and I'm still learning that. Can you now
16:14
Speaker 1: write music or can you direct players to play certain
16:18
Speaker 1: parts that you hear in your head? Yes, that is
16:21
Speaker 1: how I do the songs. I can't write music, but
16:24
Speaker 1: I humm it, you know, And I'll just be like, Okay,
16:28
Speaker 1: what I hear in my head, I know is a
16:29
Speaker 1: horn and it goes like this Dada adopted data, do
16:35
Speaker 1: do do do, And I'll just be like, that's what
16:38
Speaker 1: the horn is supposed to do. And you're a horn players,
16:41
Speaker 1: so how can you translate that? Can do the drum
16:48
Speaker 1: part and the bass and guitar everything, the feel of it.
16:53
Speaker 1: But I'm not so good at drums. I'm getting better
16:56
Speaker 1: at that, but I'm not so good at that. But
16:58
Speaker 1: with my songs, there's all the layers of voices because
17:02
Speaker 1: I hear it in voices. So I'll just sing the
17:07
Speaker 1: home like the line and put that in there and
17:10
Speaker 1: be like, this is what I hear as a horn
17:12
Speaker 1: or whatever. And a lot of times, like say, working
17:15
Speaker 1: with Jack, I would say, I hear something that's going
17:21
Speaker 1: and it's a drum, and we will like get the
17:26
Speaker 1: drummer to play that, you know, just get them to
17:28
Speaker 1: play that part. And so that makes it easier because
17:32
Speaker 1: when I first started, I would hear it and I
17:34
Speaker 1: would know how to talk to the musicians because I
17:38
Speaker 1: was intimidated because they knew real coordinames like eat sharp
17:42
Speaker 1: flat blood ever right right right, I want to talk
17:47
Speaker 1: about it's so intimidating. Da da da da, And got
17:51
Speaker 1: got Google with the baby talks. So is it Does
17:56
Speaker 1: it usually happen that the melody comes first to you?
17:59
Speaker 1: Or do the voices? Do you hear the voices first
18:01
Speaker 1: and then you put a melody under the voices. It's
18:05
Speaker 1: melodies and then the words start to morph. And sometimes
18:10
Speaker 1: I don't even get words, Like it'll just stay like
18:14
Speaker 1: a chant almost, you know, so it'll just stay at
18:17
Speaker 1: home and a chant. And I really feel like sometimes
18:20
Speaker 1: I actually need a producer to be like, nope, don't
18:23
Speaker 1: put that voice down, Like you already put down five hundreds,
18:26
Speaker 1: so like that's enough voices. Like as soon as one
18:30
Speaker 1: comes in, another one comes in, another one comes It's
18:33
Speaker 1: like a symphony or something to where do you think
18:36
Speaker 1: that comes from hearing a chorus of voices in your head?
18:39
Speaker 1: I don't know, but it does. It's like such an
18:42
Speaker 1: iridescent thing to me. Like it's like I love it
18:46
Speaker 1: and I'm glad I get to go there, and I
18:48
Speaker 1: want to take my listeners there, Like it's a space
18:52
Speaker 1: where we can walk in there and we can sit
18:54
Speaker 1: there and we can be in it and let the
18:56
Speaker 1: voices swirl around it. How often does the final product
19:00
Speaker 1: reflect what you first heard in your head? Do you
19:02
Speaker 1: ever actually get there? I never do ever, And that
19:07
Speaker 1: can be a little bit fresh, But also at the
19:10
Speaker 1: same time, I'm marvel at whatever it is. It's bigger
19:14
Speaker 1: than us. We're like always just inspired by something bigger,
19:21
Speaker 1: and you know, it's more real in the dream in
19:25
Speaker 1: the voice that I heard on my head. If I
19:28
Speaker 1: can live there, then I don't get frustrated because it's
19:32
Speaker 1: never the same as what I heard in my head.
19:35
Speaker 1: It always comes out different, and sometimes it comes out better.
19:39
Speaker 1: That's good. Yeah, So at least there's that. Yeah, so
19:44
Speaker 1: he does. It happens all kinds of ways. It must
19:47
Speaker 1: be frustrating if you don't have the language to express
19:51
Speaker 1: what you're hearing. You're trying to put this thing together
19:54
Speaker 1: that only you're hearing. And if you're working with someone
19:56
Speaker 1: like Jack Splash, how do you communicate that to him?
19:59
Speaker 1: Do you play him samples of other music? Do you
20:02
Speaker 1: just sort of like sit and hum in front of him?
20:06
Speaker 1: Which does sound funny, didn't it. Yes, I have to
20:09
Speaker 1: be working with someone that I feel comfortable enough to
20:12
Speaker 1: sing the baby talk too. And Jack is certainly a
20:16
Speaker 1: person like that because he makes everyone feel so safe
20:22
Speaker 1: and comfortable with their form of creativity. And then also, yes,
20:27
Speaker 1: I would play him like samples of things, and he
20:31
Speaker 1: would play me samples of things, just to be sure
20:35
Speaker 1: that what I describe to him is the same as
20:37
Speaker 1: what he's receiving. Because when you're in the room with
20:41
Speaker 1: another person and y'are getting ready to make music. You
20:44
Speaker 1: could say, play a drum role that sounds cloudy like
20:48
Speaker 1: a thunder like the back rolls of thundery drums on
20:54
Speaker 1: some of the t Rex stuff that Tony Visconi produced,
20:58
Speaker 1: but they might hear that differently, So how you land
21:01
Speaker 1: at it, It's just like there's got to be something
21:04
Speaker 1: that's marvelously bigger than you. That God's that. Yes, I
21:09
Speaker 1: don't know what to call it, but maybe the music,
21:11
Speaker 1: mystical music music, there's something that's guiding the whole process,
21:15
Speaker 1: a little fairy coming and guiden it to make sure
21:19
Speaker 1: that everyone hears the song the right way. Do you
21:23
Speaker 1: ever worry that you're gonna get cut off from that source? No,
21:27
Speaker 1: I don't. I don't worry because it's been with me
21:31
Speaker 1: since I was a little kid, like since before I
21:35
Speaker 1: can remember, and I know that, you know, there are
21:40
Speaker 1: other forms of art that I love and I do
21:43
Speaker 1: like I draw, and I write poems, and I don't
21:47
Speaker 1: just hear the singing voice. Sometimes I hear speaking voice
21:50
Speaker 1: where it'll be like tips reading me a poem. So
21:55
Speaker 1: I try not to limit it. And one of the
21:57
Speaker 1: girls of my life is one of the people I
22:00
Speaker 1: worked with. Who I thought was such a brilliant person
22:02
Speaker 1: was Richard Swift. Because he was he would paint, he
22:06
Speaker 1: would produce, he would play every single instru man and
22:09
Speaker 1: on something. I mean, he just he loves photography. He
22:13
Speaker 1: didn't have like a limit to his creativity. And a
22:17
Speaker 1: lot of musicians are creative outside of music. Many of
22:21
Speaker 1: them paint like I think Amanda Shires does, and Margot Price,
22:25
Speaker 1: my Joan Baiaz, yeah, Joan Bayaz and Johnny Mitchell. As
22:30
Speaker 1: long as you're just staying in the flow and keeping
22:33
Speaker 1: that creativity, the voice will always come back around. It'll
22:36
Speaker 1: always come back. We'll be back with Valerie June and
22:39
Speaker 1: le A Rose. After the break, We're back with more
22:46
Speaker 1: from Valerie June. You took four years between the last
22:50
Speaker 1: album and this album. Was there some sort of pivotal
22:54
Speaker 1: moment where you thought, Okay, I'm ready to start this
22:57
Speaker 1: whole creative cycle over again. No, I don't really stop
23:02
Speaker 1: four years. That record came out in March twenty seventeen,
23:08
Speaker 1: and then I tour for three years and then we
23:11
Speaker 1: hit coronavirus last year, so that was me stopping. But
23:15
Speaker 1: I really don't stop. What I do is I just tour.
23:18
Speaker 1: I tour on a record for a long time, which
23:21
Speaker 1: in the if you can bless you're coming to shows,
23:24
Speaker 1: then you would think, yeah, what's thou doing? You know?
23:27
Speaker 1: But it was really something to be home actually, because
23:30
Speaker 1: that's been more days gone and I do it home.
23:33
Speaker 1: Is it harder for you to rate when you're on
23:35
Speaker 1: the road. No. I usually write no matter what. Songs
23:40
Speaker 1: come in dream so I write sometimes in my sleep,
23:43
Speaker 1: like on this record, Why the Bright Stars Glow came
23:47
Speaker 1: in a dream. So I just my biggest thing is
23:51
Speaker 1: just to be open to the song whenever the song
23:53
Speaker 1: wants to come, and ready to capture it in some
23:56
Speaker 1: form on my cell phone or rolling over and scribbling
24:00
Speaker 1: it down or whatever it is. While I'm cooking. Sometimes
24:04
Speaker 1: the songs will come. I'll have to be like I
24:07
Speaker 1: gotta kick. I'm getting a song that got to capture
24:10
Speaker 1: just to the little snippet and I can go back
24:13
Speaker 1: later and continue with it or whatever. So it sounds
24:18
Speaker 1: like it almost comes when you're focused on something else.
24:22
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, yeah. If I sit down and try to
24:24
Speaker 1: write a song, it's over. I cannot I mean I
24:28
Speaker 1: can do it. If I have a songwriting session with
24:30
Speaker 1: someone and we say we're going to write a song,
24:32
Speaker 1: but even then it's hard. I do not like it.
24:37
Speaker 1: I want to learn how to like it. I want
24:39
Speaker 1: to learn how to write songs about blue cars when
24:42
Speaker 1: someone asked me to write a song about a blue car.
24:45
Speaker 1: But yeah, Like, the hardest part about the writing and
24:49
Speaker 1: stuff is that it's just making a record, is getting
24:54
Speaker 1: in the studio with the musicians and having the time
24:57
Speaker 1: and knowing the right producer. Like with this producer search,
25:02
Speaker 1: I met so many amazing producers that I loved, And
25:05
Speaker 1: that alone took about six months to Nashville and different
25:10
Speaker 1: cities and heaving tea and trying a little demo with
25:13
Speaker 1: someone and seeing how it felt and if they were
25:16
Speaker 1: right for these particular songs and stuff. So all of
25:20
Speaker 1: that stuff takes time. But the writing of the actual song,
25:24
Speaker 1: that song where I'm able to play just acoustic guitar
25:28
Speaker 1: and sang it no matter what layer of production I
25:31
Speaker 1: put on it, that comes when it wants to. So
25:36
Speaker 1: you settled on Jack Splash for the new album. He's
25:39
Speaker 1: worked with Kendrick Lamarge on Legend Alicia Keys. What was
25:43
Speaker 1: it about his sensibility that you really liked? I loved
25:49
Speaker 1: working with Jack because he's like a kaleidoscope in the
25:54
Speaker 1: way he appreciates music and art, and I just wanted
25:59
Speaker 1: to be working with someone who saw the world magically
26:03
Speaker 1: and like, similar to what I described about Richard, had
26:07
Speaker 1: no limit to their appreciation of whatever it is that
26:10
Speaker 1: makes us creative, whatever the thing is, just loves and
26:15
Speaker 1: appreciates it, from fashion to art in his house, to
26:20
Speaker 1: books in the studio to everything. Just is filled with
26:26
Speaker 1: inspiring moments no matter where you look in his space.
26:30
Speaker 1: So I just wanted to work with him because of that.
26:34
Speaker 1: You want to work with people that you feel like
26:37
Speaker 1: you're going to ask him to your tribe and there
26:39
Speaker 1: yet to be a part of your family, because it's
26:42
Speaker 1: such a vulnerable process. It is thinking baby talked to
26:47
Speaker 1: just anybody. No, it doesn't work. Even around the house
26:52
Speaker 1: with my boyfriend, he's like, is it over again? You
26:55
Speaker 1: just thank the same thing like again and again for
26:58
Speaker 1: like freaking hour. You're like, thanks for the encouragement. Now,
27:03
Speaker 1: he's super sweet. He produced the last record. But I
27:06
Speaker 1: do know that living in a tiny New York apartment
27:08
Speaker 1: and the same thing I'm getting again can drive anybody crazy.
27:13
Speaker 1: But the person's doing it did you assemble some sort
27:18
Speaker 1: of audio moodboard for the new album. Did you go
27:22
Speaker 1: in there with a set of sounds that you played
27:23
Speaker 1: for Jack? I created a document and it had songs
27:30
Speaker 1: that inspired so he could get the vibe that I
27:33
Speaker 1: was trying to create with the song. And then it
27:36
Speaker 1: also had like quotes and poems so that he would
27:40
Speaker 1: be in the headspace for what I was trying to create.
27:43
Speaker 1: And it also had words. Do you remember what any
27:47
Speaker 1: of those words were? Yeah, let's see cinematic. That was
27:51
Speaker 1: a word that I wanted it to be. And Oh,
27:54
Speaker 1: I loved what he'd worked on with Tanking the Bangas,
27:57
Speaker 1: especially the song Colors Change and the vintage sounds and
28:02
Speaker 1: the reverb on Teenage Love Affair that he did with
28:05
Speaker 1: Delicia Keys, and the raspiness of the drum song Full
28:09
Speaker 1: for You that he did with Celo. So I went
28:12
Speaker 1: through everything he did and I extracted like things that
28:17
Speaker 1: I knew I was already hearing all my songs, and
28:21
Speaker 1: just so he could know in relation to stuff he's
28:24
Speaker 1: already done, like sounds that he's already captured that I
28:28
Speaker 1: love that I'm like, this is the one that has
28:32
Speaker 1: to be on that particular song. Too, that feel or
28:35
Speaker 1: that reverb or that tone or whatever. So that and
28:40
Speaker 1: then oddn't dreamy sounds? I said, I want some vibraphones,
28:45
Speaker 1: some xylophones, some birds, some chimes, some planes, harps. I
28:50
Speaker 1: was just like I was going name it, all of it.
28:53
Speaker 1: And then the words are ethereal, dreamy, magical, otherworldly, flowing,
28:59
Speaker 1: multi era, multi genre, soul, heart colors, consciousness, adventurous, stimmering, space, gozong.
29:09
Speaker 1: I mean, the man probably thought I was freaking nuts.
29:15
Speaker 1: Let's talk through some of the songs. Is there anything
29:17
Speaker 1: in particular, any song that you want to start with
29:20
Speaker 1: or you want to break down for us. We can
29:23
Speaker 1: start with calling me a fools with Carla Thomas. Yeah,
29:27
Speaker 1: oh my goodness, how did that happen? So? I lived
29:32
Speaker 1: in Memphis for ten years and I'd sing Carla all
29:36
Speaker 1: around and people would be like, she doesn't really play
29:40
Speaker 1: much anymore or go out, and I didn't feel like
29:43
Speaker 1: she was someone that I could just walk up to
29:45
Speaker 1: and approach. So I reached out to Boo Mitchell, who
29:50
Speaker 1: runs Royal Studios, which is Willie Mitchell's studio, and I said, Boo,
29:58
Speaker 1: do you know how we can get in touch with
29:59
Speaker 1: Carla because I got a song and I would love
30:02
Speaker 1: to have her to sing on it, and he was
30:04
Speaker 1: like yep, and he got me in touch with her sister,
30:07
Speaker 1: the niece, and Vanisim got me in touch with Carla
30:13
Speaker 1: because Carla doesn't have a phone, and so she lives
30:17
Speaker 1: in a different like her time, and everything is just
30:21
Speaker 1: so great. It's so different, and so Boo was able
30:24
Speaker 1: to organize that for me and I went into his
30:28
Speaker 1: studio and we had we met it about ten am
30:32
Speaker 1: and we did the song and then after that we
30:36
Speaker 1: hung out till about twelve am. We went to see
30:38
Speaker 1: a show in Memphis. So we didn't have any of
30:41
Speaker 1: this planned either. It was just like kids in college
30:44
Speaker 1: or something goring and like, let's do this now, let's
30:47
Speaker 1: do that now. Having one and talking and listening to
30:51
Speaker 1: stories about Rufus times, it was amazing. Oh she is,
30:58
Speaker 1: she's a star. So what did you ask her or
31:01
Speaker 1: do you remember anything specific that you wanted to know?
31:03
Speaker 1: Once you all were out and comfortable and talking, I
31:08
Speaker 1: really just listened because she has so many stories and
31:13
Speaker 1: I think that, I mean, I hope that people start
31:18
Speaker 1: to interview her to get some of these stories captured,
31:21
Speaker 1: because she was there, you know, she was with Otis.
31:25
Speaker 1: I did ask her about that. I was like, what
31:27
Speaker 1: was it like? Yeah, in the room with Otis. She
31:30
Speaker 1: just I mean, it was as powerful and magical as
31:33
Speaker 1: you could have thought it would be. And she has
31:35
Speaker 1: countless stories. Well, that's cool. That sounds like such an
31:39
Speaker 1: amazing experience it was. Is it important for you to
31:44
Speaker 1: record music in Memphis and using Memphis players and just
31:48
Speaker 1: sort of like carrying on a Tennessee tradition. I think
31:52
Speaker 1: unconsciously it is because with everything I've done, there's been
31:59
Speaker 1: some home in it. Like my last record, my father
32:03
Speaker 1: and my brothers were on it, and you know, just
32:07
Speaker 1: I feel like I've always got to have home in
32:11
Speaker 1: what I'm doing. Yeah, talk a little bit about your
32:15
Speaker 1: household growing up, what you learned about music as a
32:18
Speaker 1: young girl, and how your family sort of came together
32:21
Speaker 1: and how music was a part of the family. Well,
32:26
Speaker 1: I have two brothers and two sisters, and I'm the
32:30
Speaker 1: oldest girl. So we were always singing around the house,
32:38
Speaker 1: being that our church was a church where no instruments,
32:42
Speaker 1: only voices, and we all knew as many songs as
32:46
Speaker 1: I told you earlier, And so if somebody started a song,
32:51
Speaker 1: then everybody else would just jump in on it, you know,
32:55
Speaker 1: and harmonize and started doing that part while we were
33:00
Speaker 1: on our way to school or working in the yard,
33:03
Speaker 1: or cleaning up the dishes after making dinner. I mean,
33:07
Speaker 1: it was like the sound of music and a lot
33:09
Speaker 1: of ways, you know, because if somebody started a song,
33:13
Speaker 1: you won't gunning in until we sang the hell out him.
33:17
Speaker 1: And so my mom and dad they My father was
33:22
Speaker 1: a music promoter, and he also had a construction business,
33:26
Speaker 1: which helped him on the times when the music business
33:29
Speaker 1: wasn't as prosperous, and we all helped in his businesses.
33:36
Speaker 1: We worked in all his businesses. So I learned a
33:39
Speaker 1: lot about promoting music from being with him, and I
33:43
Speaker 1: think he was one of the greatest inspirations for me
33:48
Speaker 1: when I moved to Memphis, being able to share my
33:52
Speaker 1: music and promote it with people, like hanging flowers on
33:56
Speaker 1: poles and making up these flowers and handing them out
34:00
Speaker 1: and be like, come to my show, gum, fearlessly promoting myself.
34:05
Speaker 1: I was able to do that, and I think that
34:07
Speaker 1: all my brothers, insists, got a little bit of that
34:11
Speaker 1: hustle from being a part of my parents' businesses, and
34:16
Speaker 1: you know, it was a good, good time singing with them.
34:20
Speaker 1: Do you think being the oldest of five kids does
34:23
Speaker 1: that give you sort of like an inborn confidence? Do
34:26
Speaker 1: you think there's something to birth order and the way
34:29
Speaker 1: that people hold themselves in the world. My friend, one
34:33
Speaker 1: of my best friends, she says that theory is my
34:36
Speaker 1: brother is one brother older than me and then all
34:39
Speaker 1: the rest. But what I found is that it makes
34:43
Speaker 1: me bossy. I have to like tell myself sometimes like nope, nope,
34:50
Speaker 1: just stop, don't be bossy, because I'm really bossy. I
34:54
Speaker 1: get that though, because you have a little a little
34:57
Speaker 1: army of people under you and you need to order
35:00
Speaker 1: them around. Yeah. So that's the biggest thing, because confidence
35:04
Speaker 1: is something I totally have had to work on over
35:07
Speaker 1: years of my life. Steel dudes, do you remember the
35:12
Speaker 1: first time you got up and played in front of people?
35:15
Speaker 1: I do this. Usually what would happen is at the holidays,
35:20
Speaker 1: we'd all get together during the you know, say it
35:24
Speaker 1: was Christmas. During the day, I'd say to my siblings,
35:27
Speaker 1: let's have a show. Let's put on a show. And
35:30
Speaker 1: so after we'd opened the presents and everyone at eaton
35:34
Speaker 1: then we'd say, Grant and all my hunts and uncles
35:36
Speaker 1: and all the kids, we're gonna do a show. And
35:40
Speaker 1: we'd go to the living room and we would get
35:42
Speaker 1: in front of everybody and we singing like we were
35:44
Speaker 1: Jackson five, and of course everybody else felt the infectious
35:49
Speaker 1: nature of music and they join in. So the whole
35:52
Speaker 1: family would just be getting down at the holidays. So
35:55
Speaker 1: that was me and my brothers and sisters promoting little
35:58
Speaker 1: shows in the family. And then in the fourth grade,
36:02
Speaker 1: mister Wallace in Humboldt, where I went to elementary school,
36:08
Speaker 1: we were stud He had a witty Guthrie and I
36:11
Speaker 1: love the song this Land is Yerland. And I said,
36:14
Speaker 1: mister Wallace, when we come back after lunch, can I
36:17
Speaker 1: get in front of the class and sang this Land
36:19
Speaker 1: is yeer Land? And he was like can you sing?
36:23
Speaker 1: I was like yeah, and I said, yeah, I can
36:26
Speaker 1: do it. So he let me get up and sing it.
36:28
Speaker 1: And I don't think they much like my voice, but
36:31
Speaker 1: I did it. Anyway. You have to be confident to
36:34
Speaker 1: do that. Yeah, it didn't stop me. You know, they
36:38
Speaker 1: might have called me a fool, but I went and
36:40
Speaker 1: did it. And I always wanted to sing, like you know,
36:44
Speaker 1: in high school, they'll choose the best singer to sing
36:47
Speaker 1: the national anthem. Oh, I really wanted to do it,
36:50
Speaker 1: but I knew I didn't have the voice that was
36:52
Speaker 1: pleasing to everyone. So did you do theater and stuff
36:56
Speaker 1: like that in high school? Um? No, I was a
36:59
Speaker 1: cheerleader and then I became a captain of the cheerleading squads.
37:03
Speaker 1: So that was me being a bossy person. Bossiness just
37:08
Speaker 1: running the comment would you do like flips and everything?
37:12
Speaker 1: Like were people throwing you up in the air. I
37:14
Speaker 1: was too heavy for that. I was a base I
37:19
Speaker 1: would throw people up. It was fun. I really enjoyed it.
37:22
Speaker 1: And I think I'm kind of like a cheerleader now
37:25
Speaker 1: for other musicians in some ways, you know, Like I
37:30
Speaker 1: did a play list recently. It's young, gifted and black,
37:33
Speaker 1: and it's just all these musicians that we have around
37:37
Speaker 1: us that are multi genre, that are amazing that you know,
37:43
Speaker 1: we need to celebrate who they are and just like
37:47
Speaker 1: lift everyone up, just keep everyone inspired to dream. We'll
37:52
Speaker 1: have more Valerie Leo Rose. After a quick break, we're
37:59
Speaker 1: back with Valerie June singing an acoustic version of her
38:01
Speaker 1: song Astral playing. What is there a lie? You haven't shot,
38:09
Speaker 1: You can't touch a looking glass, You can't only shine
38:20
Speaker 1: you so much. If you follow the sun slowly the standy,
38:31
Speaker 1: don't rush, then the day will come when you ready,
38:42
Speaker 1: Just try. You'd be dancing on the astral plane and
38:49
Speaker 1: holy water cleansing rain flowing through the stratosphere. Blind, but
38:55
Speaker 1: yet to see so clear? Where is there a way
39:01
Speaker 1: for you to shine out? Fear you from other words,
39:11
Speaker 1: but you can't see He would keep shoot here dancing
39:19
Speaker 1: on the astral bline and only water cleansing, rain flooding
39:24
Speaker 1: through the stratosphere blind, be yet to see shawcliff dancing
39:30
Speaker 1: on the astral blind and only water cleansing, raining flowing
39:35
Speaker 1: through the stratosphere blind, be yet to see saw clear? Blind,
39:41
Speaker 1: yet to see blind, be yet to see blind, be
39:46
Speaker 1: yet to see blind, be yet to see side clear?
39:58
Speaker 1: Is there a way for you to give it? You're
40:04
Speaker 1: all you dreaming, and dream a street of things, things great,
40:14
Speaker 1: things small, dancing on the astral fly and all the
40:22
Speaker 1: water cleansing, rain and flooding through the stratosphere blinder, yet
40:28
Speaker 1: to see shark clear, dancing on the astra flind and
40:33
Speaker 1: know the water cleansing rain, floating through the stratosphere. Blind
40:38
Speaker 1: be at to see shark clear blind be at you
40:41
Speaker 1: see blind yet you see blind be yet you see
40:49
Speaker 1: blind me at you see shine clear? Well, there is
40:58
Speaker 1: a light that you haven't shot, you can't touch m
41:11
Speaker 1: It's so beautiful. It always reminds me that you know
41:16
Speaker 1: of the light that I came to be in the world.
41:19
Speaker 1: So hopefully it'll do that for other people too. And
41:22
Speaker 1: it almost feels like you're trying to protect that light
41:24
Speaker 1: in the song most definitely. That's why dreamers neat prescriptions
41:32
Speaker 1: for protection of the loving kindness and the sweetness of
41:36
Speaker 1: their hearts and the dreams that they want to share.
41:41
Speaker 1: A lot of the imagery is, you know, floating above
41:44
Speaker 1: the earth, blind but you can see. Do you feel
41:47
Speaker 1: like you need that to protect yourself from from the
41:49
Speaker 1: harsh reality of the world. Yeah, But I think at
41:53
Speaker 1: the same time what's happened is that I understand the
42:00
Speaker 1: blues and the happiness of it and the joy of it,
42:05
Speaker 1: and the processing of the harshness and like not running
42:10
Speaker 1: away from it but walking right through it and looking
42:13
Speaker 1: at the world and sending the astral world within this
42:16
Speaker 1: physical world and it's all here, and how wondrous and
42:20
Speaker 1: amazing all of that is just being here on earth
42:24
Speaker 1: and the magic of us being here. I mean we
42:27
Speaker 1: have like trees, for example, we can hug. This stuff
42:32
Speaker 1: is really a gift, you know, the full moon tonight,
42:37
Speaker 1: the stars, all of these things. I saw three shooting
42:40
Speaker 1: stars the night I finished working with Chat on this record.
42:45
Speaker 1: And just like those things, you don't have to go
42:48
Speaker 1: far to see what I would call something bigger than you.
42:51
Speaker 1: And some people might call it God or something else,
42:54
Speaker 1: but I call it just beautiful and so you don't
42:58
Speaker 1: have to go far for it. How have you because
43:01
Speaker 1: you faced a lot of adversity in your life. There's
43:04
Speaker 1: a period of time when you were very sick for
43:06
Speaker 1: a number of years, how have you been able to
43:09
Speaker 1: get through seriously trying times like just having a practice
43:15
Speaker 1: of light and that being danced, that being music, baths, poem,
43:22
Speaker 1: joga mantras. Like some days I just have to say
43:26
Speaker 1: again and again to myself all day from the moment
43:29
Speaker 1: I get up, thank you for this life, Thank you
43:31
Speaker 1: for this life, Thank you for this life. And like
43:35
Speaker 1: just I have to say that again and again and again,
43:38
Speaker 1: because you know, I mean there are days when I
43:42
Speaker 1: just don't feel good, like physically, like being dealing with
43:48
Speaker 1: the diabetes. It's like every day it's a different day.
43:51
Speaker 1: Like some days I feel like I have the energy
43:53
Speaker 1: for the world and other days I don't, And I
43:56
Speaker 1: just have to work on that, and I have to
43:57
Speaker 1: be in it and not fight it and just be like, Okay,
44:02
Speaker 1: I see the body doesn't want to do that much today,
44:05
Speaker 1: but I'm gonna gently tell it to dance to this
44:08
Speaker 1: swamp Talk song real quick, you know. So you just
44:14
Speaker 1: meet it where it is every day, just like with
44:16
Speaker 1: the voice. Sometimes the voice is able to hit super
44:19
Speaker 1: high notes and then sometimes it sounds like, oh, like
44:23
Speaker 1: it in the morning when you first wake up. You
44:25
Speaker 1: meet it where it is until it's ready to be
44:27
Speaker 1: beautiful and clear, like Allison Kraus at the end of
44:30
Speaker 1: the day in the morning and Salent Woof at the
44:33
Speaker 1: end of the day Allison Kraft. Do you look back
44:37
Speaker 1: at old songs, listen to lyrics and think, Wow, I've
44:42
Speaker 1: come a long way, or I completely don't agree with
44:46
Speaker 1: that whatever I was saying wherever I was back then,
44:50
Speaker 1: I've moved on. Usually don't look back much, but when
44:56
Speaker 1: I do, like when something makes me look back, Like,
44:59
Speaker 1: for example, with the song Shotguns, someone wanted me to
45:02
Speaker 1: be on a podcast dealing with murder ballots, and there
45:05
Speaker 1: was a time in my life where I did study
45:07
Speaker 1: murder ballots. But I felt like, after all the things
45:10
Speaker 1: that happened in our nation with you know, gun violence
45:14
Speaker 1: and things, and even in African American communities, how we
45:18
Speaker 1: struggle with that, that I didn't want to sing that
45:20
Speaker 1: song ever anymore. It can be on a record, but
45:24
Speaker 1: I just don't feel like, I feel like, you know,
45:26
Speaker 1: when a song is right for a time and when
45:28
Speaker 1: it needs to just like that came out and it's out,
45:31
Speaker 1: and that's that. It doesn't need to go. If people
45:35
Speaker 1: want to hear it, they could put the record on.
45:37
Speaker 1: You know. I was wondering how you felt about working
45:40
Speaker 1: women blues. I ain't fit to be no mother, ain't
45:43
Speaker 1: fit to be no wife. If that's something that still
45:46
Speaker 1: holds for you, or if that's just not even really
45:49
Speaker 1: a proclamation from yourself, that's just part of the song.
45:52
Speaker 1: It's part of the song, and it's really just dealing
45:56
Speaker 1: with like women feeling free enough to be what they
46:00
Speaker 1: want to be. And I have to find any kind
46:03
Speaker 1: of set way to be. But if I look at
46:06
Speaker 1: it personally, I tried to be a why twice they
46:10
Speaker 1: didn't work, So maybe I think maybe that's one of
46:14
Speaker 1: the imprimnation sounds. Wish you wouldn't because Lord knows I
46:20
Speaker 1: love a good love story. But yeah, Madden are not
46:25
Speaker 1: getting married. I think I missed it up a couple
46:27
Speaker 1: of times. Well, thank you so much for taking the
46:31
Speaker 1: time to talk with me. I wish you so much
46:33
Speaker 1: luck with the new album super exciting. I hope you're
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Speaker 1: able to get out and perform once everything hopefully writes
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Speaker 1: itself in the world. Thank you, I hope so thanks
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Speaker 1: to Valerie June for singing and sharing her journey with us.
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Speaker 1: Valerie put together a playlist for us of her favorite
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Speaker 1: imperfect voices. You can find a link to it an
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Speaker 1: episode description, and be sure to subscribe to our YouTube
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Speaker 1: channel at YouTube dot com slash Broken Record Podcast, where
47:03
Speaker 1: you can find extended cuts of new and old episodes.
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Speaker 1: You can follow us on Twitter at broken Record. Broken
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Speaker 1: Record is produced with help from Leah Rose, Jason Gambrel,
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Speaker 1: Martin Gonzalez, Eric Sandler, and Jennifer Sanchez, with engineering help
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Speaker 1: from Nick Chafe, Our executive producer is Mio. Label Broken
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Speaker 1: Record is a production of Pushkin Industries. And if you
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Speaker 1: liked the show, please remember to share, rate, and review
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Speaker 1: us on your podcastle our theme music Spectkenny Beats, I'm
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Speaker 1: justin Richmond Peace