Latest / The Inspired Stories Podcast / Eliza Keegan's Strategy for Growing Momentum Indoor Climbing from Utah to Bulgaria and Beyond

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Eliza Keegan's Strategy for Growing Momentum Indoor Climbing from Utah to Bulgaria and Beyond · The Inspired Stories Podcast

0:04
Welcome to another edition of the Inspired Stories podcast,
0:08
where leaders share their experiences so we can learn from
0:11
their successes and be inspired by how they've overcome
0:14
adversity. My name is Anthony Kotaspodi,
0:17
and today's guest is Eliza Keegan, chief executive officer
0:20
of Momentum Indoor Climbing. They offer rope climbing and
0:24
bouldering facilities across Utah, Texas, and Washington,
0:28
along with yoga classes, training sessions, and fun
0:31
monthly events. Founded in 2004, they are
0:34
renowned for their innovative approach to climbing, gym
0:37
design, and inclusive community environment.
0:41
Their mission is to inspire and empower climbers of all ages and
0:45
skills, and they've been at the forefront of creating welcoming
0:49
spaces for hobbyists and professionals alike.
0:52
Eliza has been instrumental in Momentum's growth since it
0:55
launched, serving as executive vice president and program
0:58
director before taking on her current role.
1:01
She also gained valuable experience with the Houston
1:03
Dynamo, a Major League Soccer team, where she managed youth
1:07
programs and marketing. Now before we get into all that
1:10
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AD back benefits.com. All right, back to our guest
1:54
today, the CEO, Momentum Indoor Climbing.
1:57
Eliza Keegan. Thanks for making the time to
1:59
Share your story today. Hey, Anthony, thanks so much for
2:02
having me. So, Eliza, you spent nearly two
2:05
years with the Major League Soccer team Houston Dynamo.
2:09
Was this your first job right out of college?
2:12
It wise it started as a really low paying internship part time
2:17
gig while I was still in college and after graduation evolved
2:22
into a full time role. And what?
2:25
What is it that you were doing there?
2:27
I started out in the marketing department and it was game day,
2:33
half time, you know, entertainment on the fields,
2:37
directing groups and then I get in, got involved in the youth
2:41
programming side and ended up in a management position pretty
2:45
quickly managing the youth programs for Houston Dynamo and.
2:49
What does that mean? What are the youth programs?
2:52
So most professional sports have a youth system and the Houston
2:58
Dynamo had an Academy with a bunch of recreational programs
3:02
as well as some competitive programs that really funnel kids
3:06
from introductory programming all the way up to highly
3:10
competitive, almost like farm league, farm team league like
3:16
programs with kids that are potential candidates for
3:21
professional teams down the line.
3:24
So is it seen both as a way to find new up and coming players
3:29
for the system as well as like a marketing piece?
3:33
Hey, get kids, fans of the game and the team early on.
3:37
Absolutely. There's a community outreach
3:39
piece to it. We at the time partnered with, I
3:43
think 13 local YMCAS to just introduce sports and soccer and
3:48
bring programming to fringe communities around the Houston
3:52
area. And we had pathways, you know,
3:55
climbing Soccer, rather, is an older, very established sport
4:01
with really clear pathways. And so there's this, you know,
4:05
grassroots boots on the ground funnel system, getting kids in
4:10
introduced to the sport, and then all of these different
4:13
levels they can pursue if they're interested, if they're
4:16
passionate, if they're talented and potentially be identified to
4:22
be on a competitive team or even a team that, you know, funnels
4:26
into the professional team. How did the work with the
4:30
Houston Dynamo set you up for success that you would later
4:33
have with momentum climbing? Professional sports are so
4:38
community driven, they're dynamic, they're fast-paced, and
4:44
it was a really intense but really exciting introduction to
4:49
my career basically. And I think I was really, really
4:57
set up to take on a role in the climbing industry because I had
5:02
this background from a really established sport that had
5:06
organization that had pathways that had really clear rules and
5:10
procedures. And the climbing industry is a
5:14
newer, younger sport and as such, you know, doesn't have a,
5:19
a ton of organization or established pathways for kids.
5:22
And so I heard momentum was coming to Texas.
5:26
It was, we're a Salt Lake City based company and we had at the
5:30
time 3 gyms in Salt Lake City and this was our first expansion
5:36
outside of Utah. And I was living in Houston at
5:39
the time. I was working for the Dynamo and
5:41
I heard momentum was coming to town and I was really excited at
5:45
the opportunity to kind of take my skills and apply it to a new
5:49
sport. Had you had any personal
5:52
experience in the climbing space before?
5:56
Yeah, that's a great question. You know, I, I, I climbed
5:59
growing up at camps and, you know, recreationally growing up,
6:04
but never seriously. And we moved around a lot and I
6:08
lived in a lot of cities that weren't mountain towns, mountain
6:12
cities. And so climbing wasn't really a
6:15
popular activity in the areas that I, I lived in Houston, you
6:22
know, falls into that bucket. There are no mountains in
6:24
Houston. And so I'm I'm, I'm outdoorsy,
6:29
I'm active, I play a lot of sports.
6:32
And I thought, how cool is this that, you know, we don't have
6:34
any mountains here, but this company is bringing the
6:36
mountains to Houston and I want to be a part of that.
6:41
And so you applied, they liked you, they invited you in.
6:44
And what role, what capacity to start with?
6:47
I started, we opened in July of 2017, our Katy, TX location.
6:53
It's a full service rope gym. It's 35,000 square feet, huge,
6:57
beautiful, state-of-the-art rope facility.
7:00
I came in as the youth program manager of that facility.
7:03
And then a few months later we opened our Siller St. location,
7:07
which is it a bouldering only facility in downtown Houston.
7:11
And at that time I took over managing programs at both
7:14
locations. OK.
7:16
So explain to me the difference between the two facilities, the
7:20
full service versus the bouldering only?
7:22
Yeah, that's a great question. So there's a couple different
7:25
disciplines in climbing. There's three main disciplines
7:28
that you see in the Olympics. It's sport climbing and sport
7:32
climbing, top rope climbing. That is climbing on ropes with
7:36
harnesses and really tall walls. It's what a lot of people think
7:40
of when they think of, you know, traditional rock climbing.
7:42
And there's also bouldering, Bouldering, shorter walls,
7:46
anywhere between 1318 feet tall walls.
7:49
You don't need any equipment, no ropes.
7:51
You climb up, you hop down and there are really big squishy
7:56
pads that you fall onto. And this has become incredibly
8:01
popular the last couple of years because it's lower barriers of
8:05
entry, you don't need a partner, you don't need this equipment
8:08
and rope management knowledge. And it's also easier in some
8:16
respects to build a bouldering facility because you don't need
8:19
60 foot tall ceilings. So we're seeing bouldering gyms
8:23
pop up all over the country and it's becoming a very social,
8:28
popular way to exercise. And so going forward, how do you
8:33
guys think about growth? Is it more bouldering facilities
8:36
because there's that, you know, lower startup cost?
8:40
Yeah, that's a great question. Anytime we go into a city, we
8:45
hope to bring all types of climbing to, you know, that
8:49
community. And so if we go in with a
8:52
bouldering gym, we will actively pursue opportunities to later
8:57
put a rope gym in. And then vice versa, when we
9:00
build a rope facility, we try and include bouldering in that
9:04
facility as well. When you guys think about
9:08
placing a location, how far out geographically does it typically
9:14
pull people in? Like, you know, I'm thinking,
9:17
oh, a movie theater, you know, they've got one maybe every, you
9:21
know, 15 minutes from each other.
9:24
But something like bouldering, I'm going to guess you're not
9:26
going to have that same sort of density of locations.
9:30
Yeah, that's a great question. So when we opened, I think this
9:33
is probably the best example, when we opened our Katie
9:36
facility in Texas, there at the time weren't a ton and still
9:42
aren't a ton of full service climbing gyms in South Texas.
9:46
And we had people driving 2 hours on the weekends, regularly
9:52
on the weekends to come to our facilities.
9:55
And I would say I'm at our Houston gyms right now.
10:00
We have people who regularly commute 45 minutes to an hour to
10:04
our facilities multiple times a week.
10:06
Wow. And so when somebody comes in,
10:09
especially somebody who's not, let's start it from this
10:12
viewpoint for somebody who's not familiar with what a climbing
10:16
facility is, paint a picture for the listeners.
10:19
What are they going to experience?
10:20
What options are going to be available to them?
10:23
Yeah, absolutely. So if you're walking into a full
10:27
service gym, a rope gym, you've never climbed before, you're
10:29
going to walk in, you're going to be greeted by our very
10:32
friendly front desk who are generally psyched climbers
10:36
themselves and can't wait to tell you all about the facility,
10:40
the sport, what our offerings are.
10:43
But in our facilities, you're going to walk in and you're
10:45
just, your jaw is going to drop because you're going to be
10:48
standing face to face with a 55 foot climbing wall.
10:53
And some of them feature arches, some of them feature prows and
10:57
monoliths. And it really is a breathtaking
11:00
experience to walk into a full service climbing gym and see
11:04
people of all ages up on the wall just absolutely sending.
11:10
What were the terms that you used?
11:11
Prows and monoliths. Yes.
11:13
Prows. What are those?
11:15
We use a lot of geological terms and climbing, you know, we're
11:19
all rock nerds and Momentum is in particular is a company
11:25
that's deeply rooted in American rock climbing history.
11:29
And so we really try and create angles and features in our
11:34
artificial climbing walls that resemble features of outdoor
11:39
rock and outdoor cracks. So those are just some terms we
11:44
used to describe features of our climbing walls.
11:47
OK. So you came in, started out
11:51
heading up the youth program. How did that youth program
11:56
compare to what you were doing at Houston Dynamo?
11:58
Or maybe I should say what What did you pull from your
12:02
experience at Houston Dynamo to apply to what you were doing at
12:05
Momentum? At the Houston Dynamo, I was
12:08
overseeing anywhere from 80 to 100 coaches at a time, very part
12:14
time coaches who were dispersed throughout the greater Houston
12:19
area and different tiers and levels of programming.
12:25
So some very introductory entry level programs and some
12:30
competition based programs. And when I started with
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Momentum, we had this great foundation of youth programs and
12:41
that is in large thanks to our former CEO Jeff Patterson who
12:46
was a founder of the company. But he also was a competitive
12:50
rock climbing coach for many years, and he really started our
12:54
our youth programs and our competitive program.
12:56
And something that you know we can get into later in the
13:00
podcast is there's been this balancing act in the industry
13:04
between adult members, adult climbers and kids.
13:08
And how do you balance those two in a gym space in the evenings,
13:15
during busy hours? And how do you dedicate terrain
13:18
to kids when you have adult members competing for the same
13:21
space? And we had a leader of this
13:25
company who really prioritized youth programs.
13:28
And so I came in with a great foundation and was able to just
13:34
immediately jump in and build upon that foundation and say,
13:38
hey, you know, we, we have this foundation, we have a framework
13:42
of these pathways, but let's fully develop these pathways so
13:45
that there is a pathway for a kid to walk in who maybe doesn't
13:49
have any interested interest in competing, but wants to be a
13:52
lifelong climber and they want to grow and develop their
13:55
skills. Let's create a pathway for them
13:57
and then let's create a pathway for kids who want to compete and
14:01
want to be on a a national level circuit or compete in the
14:06
Olympics one day. Let let's, you know flush out
14:09
what that looks like. And I'm curious because I think
14:13
about what you were doing at the Houston Dynamo.
14:15
And in my mind, it's like, well, there's soccer programs all over
14:19
the place, right, that you could tap into, whether it's through
14:22
the Y, somebody's school, you know, a different club that's
14:25
set up. But what do those pathways look
14:28
like in the climbing community? Because I didn't grow up with,
14:32
you know, any access to climbing.
14:35
I live in kind of like, Houston. Like, I lived in Ohio, which is
14:38
very flat. There were no mountains.
14:40
There were no climbing facilities.
14:41
Like how do you generate that interest?
14:44
That is such a great question. And it, it's so it's such a good
14:49
question because in so many popular sports in the US that's
14:53
really governed by the national governing body of that sport.
14:59
So US soccer or in climbing, it's USA climbing.
15:05
And USA climbing has done amazing work over the past
15:08
decade to, you know, create pathways and create competition
15:16
programs for kids. But at the time I came in, there
15:20
wasn't a framework, there wasn't a framework, there weren't
15:23
resources. And so I utilized the framework
15:27
and the resources I had from the soccer industry and from the
15:31
Houston Dynamo to build in house.
15:35
And still, still we're constantly developing and
15:40
changing what this USA climbing pathway looks like for kids with
15:45
competition pathway looks like for kids.
15:48
But at least for momentum, we for the last, I would say 8 to
15:53
10 years have had a pretty consistent program that does
15:59
provide opportunities to grow, to compete, to learn and to move
16:03
up in the system. And and how do you let kids know
16:07
that this is even an option? Are you tying into schools or
16:11
other sports programs? Or how are you getting in front
16:14
of them and their parents? We do a lot of outreach
16:17
programming and we just naturally have seen a lot of
16:21
kids come in through gymnastics, through cheerleading.
16:26
There's a lot of overlap, it seems, between some other
16:30
sports, and we've had a lot of kids who maybe lose interest in
16:35
one activity or they see climbing on YouTube or
16:39
Instagram, or they hear about it from their friend in school and
16:42
they want to come try it out. And that's been, you know, a
16:47
great way for kids to learn about climbing, come and get
16:49
involved. We have birthday parties and we
16:52
have really introductory programming that's once a week.
16:55
It's two hours, minimal commitment and the goal is to
16:58
just come teach some fundamental basic skills and to have fun.
17:03
And from there, if kids want to take it further, there's there's
17:06
pathways for them to do that. So, and tell me if I've got this
17:11
right here, you started with momentum back in middle of 2017,
17:17
Youth program manager worked your way up pretty quickly, a
17:19
regional program manager, then program director in 19,
17:24
executive VP in 2023 and then earlier this year 2025 CEO.
17:30
This is quite an accelerated growth path in the in the
17:36
company. Which of these transitions have
17:39
you found did you find to be most challenging?
17:43
Yeah, that's a great question. You know, Anthony, life is so
17:48
funny and you end up on these really unexpected trajectories.
17:52
And if you would have told me five years ago I'd I'd be in
17:55
this seat, I wouldn't have believed you.
17:59
But I'm really grateful to have had the opportunities I've had
18:03
and to be in this role now. And the transition from being a
18:08
department director to an executive leader was definitely
18:13
the most challenging. I think you're going from being
18:17
an expert in a field and having a specific lane and, you know,
18:23
an attention to detail and a dedicated team staff that you're
18:28
hands on managing to shifting to executive leadership where you
18:35
have to understand all of the lanes.
18:38
And you have to shift your leadership from day-to-day hands
18:44
on management to leading with vision and trust and delegation.
18:49
And it's it's a big shift. Did you have any formal coaching
18:58
or mentors that taught you how to become a leader?
19:02
So I think a lot of times what happens in business is we see
19:05
people performing really well in their role and think, OK, let's
19:10
just, you know, move them up into a manager, an executive
19:13
position, and they'll continue that success.
19:16
But it takes a different set of skills to be able to perform and
19:22
manage employees at that point. And if you don't have experience
19:27
in it, not not everybody you know moves into it very
19:31
elegantly. Absolutely, absolutely.
19:34
I've been so fortunate to have had incredible mentors over the
19:39
last, you know, 10-15 years in all of my roles and across, you
19:44
know, the different companies I've worked for.
19:46
And I've also had bosses who have had confidence in me and
19:55
that's been a huge support. And I think, you know, I've,
20:01
I've tried to have consistent, A consistent approach to
20:04
leadership throughout all of my roles.
20:07
And I think my leadership style and my approach has been really
20:12
applicable in every hat that I've worn for this company and
20:15
every hat that I wore for the Dynamo and.
20:20
I think that that approach is just you don't have to be the
20:24
smartest person in the room. You don't have to know it all.
20:27
You just have to show up. You have to show up and you have
20:31
to be there for your team. And I mean, maybe if you want to
20:36
get a little further into the weeds, I had some really great
20:40
advice from a mentor one time who said the, the core function
20:47
of your role as a leader of a team is to let your team know
20:51
it's going to be OK. It's going to be OK.
20:54
That is the core function of you as a leader to let people know
20:58
it's going to be OK. Whatever problem we face,
21:01
whatever circumstance, there's always a solution we can figure
21:05
out. And we're we're going to find a
21:08
solution and it's going to be OK.
21:12
That's great advice. And how do you communicate that?
21:17
Yeah, I think I have AI, have a lot of confidence in my team and
21:22
I have a lot of optimism that there is always a solution.
21:25
And so we approach difficult circumstances, we approach
21:30
problems with that mindset. You know, with a a company of
21:34
your size that continues to grow, I'm going to guess I hear
21:39
in most labor markets it it's tough to find good folks.
21:42
It's maybe sometimes even tougher to hold on to good
21:45
folks. What have you guys tried and
21:49
found success with when it comes to recruiting and retention?
21:53
We are very fortunate that we work for a climbing company and
21:59
most of the people who work for Momentum, from the folks at our
22:04
headquarters all the way down to our front desk staff, they are
22:09
lifelong climbers. Climbing is part of their
22:12
identity, it's part of their lifestyle and so we have this
22:17
huge luxury, I would say, as it pertains to staffing, that
22:21
people want to work for Momentum because it's something they're
22:24
excited about, it's something they're passionate about and
22:27
it's something they genuinely want to share with other people.
22:30
So, you know, it's a really easy sell to go and work for
22:36
something you're really passionate about.
22:39
But then we, you know, are faced with how do we create a culture
22:46
and a working environment where people can meaningfully
22:50
contribute, but also have that work life balance and also get
22:54
to prioritize the things that are important to them,
22:57
specifically to our industry. It's outdoor recreation, it's
23:01
climbing, It's, you know, making the time in your personal life
23:05
to be able to climb and train and go on climbing trips and go
23:07
camping and go mountain biking. And so we definitely have a
23:12
balancing act internally of just, you know, having a space
23:17
where people can produce but also find that work life
23:20
balance. What do you think is driving the
23:25
popularity in climbing right now?
23:28
It's incredibly social. And I think we're seeing this
23:36
bigger desire, bigger interest and health and Wellness kind of
23:41
across multiple generations. We're seeing that right now.
23:44
We're seeing people investing more money into their health,
23:49
their experience, their their experiences.
23:52
And I think climbing is a way to interact and be social, but also
24:01
be participating in this healthy lifestyle.
24:04
And, you know, there are a lot of people who get interested in
24:08
climbing, and it's their weekly gym session, it's their social
24:12
hour. It's where they go with their
24:14
friends to exercise, to be active.
24:16
And then there's this other, you know, category of climbers who
24:20
take the sport really seriously and are in the gym sometimes 345
24:25
times a week training because of their personal goals.
24:29
Is there a recent innovation or gym feature you guys have
24:33
introduced that you're particularly proud of?
24:37
We have we opened in December of 2024.
24:41
So just this past winter we opened a 47,000 square foot
24:45
state-of-the-art climbing gym in Salt Lake City.
24:48
And this gym is the first of its kind in the United States
24:53
because every single climbing T nut it's called AT nut.
24:57
I'm gonna have to get a little in the weed so I can explain.
25:00
What? Yeah.
25:00
What is that? Our climbing walls have if you
25:03
go into a climbing gym, you'll see there are all these little
25:06
holes on the wall and that's where we screw our climbing
25:09
holds into and we call those T nuts.
25:13
And our route setters can, you know, make any sort of
25:17
combination of holds to create a route to create a boulder and
25:22
they screw the holds into these T nuts.
25:25
We put LE DS into every single it's 10s of thousands of T nuts,
25:31
every single T nut in our newest gym.
25:33
Even the ones that aren't being utilized at that.
25:36
Moment the ones that aren't being used, and we have an app
25:40
that allows us to put translucent holds on the wall in
25:45
as high a density as we want, and it has the capability of
25:49
lighting up a multitude of routes, kind of an infinite
25:51
amount of routes in different colors.
25:55
Oh, that's fun. I thought you were going to say
25:57
that you like put people's names or faces and patterns with using
26:01
those lights. Any thoughts to do that or is
26:04
that just silly? But you know, you had a a much
26:06
more functional purpose in mind. We have a very climbing specific
26:11
intention behind this technology.
26:14
We did. We were laughing.
26:16
We opened this gym right around Christmas and we were laughing
26:19
that, you know, if you've ever gone through the drive through
26:22
Christmas light where you turn on the radio laughing that we
26:25
could have some dancing reindeers up on the wall with
26:27
some cute Christmas music. But this technology we hope will
26:33
revolutionize the the sport of climbing and how people
26:36
interact. Because it's app based, it's
26:39
more technology forward. And it also allows us you only
26:44
have so much space on a wall, any given wall, to set routes.
26:48
This allows us to set higher density, but create more routes
26:52
and problems out of the density. So is the idea that you can put
26:57
what, what do you call what you put into the T holes, the the
27:00
pegs, the the hole, What is it that you're screwing in?
27:04
What's that called? Climbing holds.
27:07
Climbing holds. OK, so is the idea that you put
27:10
like a climbing hold basically in every single T hole there or
27:16
or and then you can light up the path or or OK OK got it.
27:20
So every T hole is filled with a a climbing hold and am I getting
27:26
the lingo right now that. You're on the right track.
27:29
You're. You're getting, Yeah.
27:31
You're getting an anybody who is familiar with climbing will know
27:35
that training boards are really popular right now.
27:37
Training boards, they're normally 12 foot by 12 foot foot
27:40
boards that are at base that have holes that light up, great
27:44
training system, really, really popular right now.
27:47
This is a an A similar application to that, it's just
27:51
on a much larger scale. On a grand scale, OK, so I've
27:55
got two sons, one's 91's, 11, and they've never climbed
28:00
before. I do have my youngest boy
28:04
actually literally climbs the walls at home.
28:08
He tries to think that he's Spider man.
28:10
And if I want to introduce them to something like this that
28:13
they've never done before, what would it look like bringing them
28:16
in for the first time? That's a great question.
28:19
And I, Anthony, I've got to tell you, every single day we have
28:22
parents coming into our gym saying my kid is climbing the
28:25
refrigerator, my kid is climbing the bookshelf.
28:28
And so I figured they would like this every single day.
28:32
Yeah, generally you walk into a gym and depending on if it's
28:35
full service or if it's bouldering, most gyms, all of
28:37
our gyms have dedicated youth areas.
28:40
We give, we give an orientation. You have to sign a waiver.
28:44
Climbing is inherently dangerous.
28:46
So there's quite a few risk acknowledgments that you'll have
28:51
to do when you enter any climbing gym, whether it's ours
28:55
or somebody else's. And then there's an orientation
28:58
video that you'll be required to watch.
29:01
And then the front desk staff will give you a tour of the
29:03
facility and then they'll show you what you can do without any
29:09
formal instruction, which is generally bouldering or the
29:12
youth only areas, and provide you the shoes, the equipment you
29:18
need to do that. If you wanted to take them rope
29:20
climbing, there would have to be a learn to belay class or some
29:25
sort of formal orientation and training to give you the rope
29:30
management and belay skills you need to belay them on the wall.
29:34
And so as a parent, would it be my role to be the Blair?
29:39
Is that the right term? Yes, yes.
29:41
And that's what we would prefer because climbing is multi
29:45
generational. You know, one of the most
29:47
rewarding things for me to see when I walk in the gym is a
29:50
grandparent climbing with their grandchild.
29:53
We see it all the time. It's really cool.
29:56
But yeah, climbing is so unique. You can have a 5 year old
29:59
climbing next to a 25 year old climbing next to a 65 year old.
30:02
We see that all the time. So we want the parent to be
30:05
engaged, be involved. If you don't want to be engaged
30:09
and involved, if you're not interested in learning climbing,
30:11
or you know, you just need an after school activity for your
30:14
kid, most gyms have programs where you can drop them off and
30:18
they're in a class with classmates and a certified
30:22
instructor who's going to teach them and belay them.
30:26
OK, what does the future look like for momentum?
30:31
Indoor climbing? More locations?
30:35
Maybe redoing some of the existing locations?
30:38
New states? New cities?
30:40
What's on tap? We have big plans, we've got
30:44
huge plans. So we are on a huge growth
30:47
trajectory right now. It's very exciting and we went
30:51
about a seven-year period with no new facilities.
30:55
Last December we opened this new full service rope gym.
30:57
We're about to open our first ever micro gym concept which is
31:03
first of its kind for us. It's a really small compact
31:08
climbing and climbing specific training facility in downtown
31:12
Salt Lake and that's really exciting.
31:16
And we've got a couple more locations coming in Houston, TX
31:20
and we are looking all over the country as well as in Europe and
31:25
Asia for expansion opportunity. We have two gyms in Bulgaria
31:31
right now. Already, right now, today.
31:34
We have one location and we are about a month away from opening
31:37
our second location in Bulgaria. OK.
31:40
Now you know, I talked with a lot of restaurant groups that
31:46
you know, think about growth. Some of them use a franchise
31:48
system, some of them are corporate owned, but generally
31:50
speaking, they kind of have one or two or three hubs,
31:54
geographical hubs that they sort of build out from.
31:59
And it's a little bit different there because they've got, you
32:01
know, raw materials, you know, their food, their ingredients
32:05
that they want to be able to have the supply chain for.
32:08
Obviously that's not a restriction here, but I'm
32:10
curious the thought process behind your growth.
32:13
And, you know, it seems like, oh, maybe like we're going to
32:16
get the state of Texas down first before we go to another
32:19
state. But I'm not hearing that.
32:22
I'm hearing, yeah, we've got plants here.
32:24
We're already in Bulgaria. We're looking at Asia, other
32:26
places in Europe. You guys are are kind of all
32:29
over the place. Talk to me about the the thought
32:31
process here. There is so much opportunity and
32:34
there's so much opportunity still in major markets across
32:38
the world. And so I think our, our goal is
32:43
to definitely build in our existing hubs, if you will.
32:48
So Houston, we have two locations already and we have
32:51
plans for many more locations in Houston.
32:55
And there's a ton of opportunity in Houston being, you know, one
32:58
of the largest cities in the US. But there are really great
33:02
opportunities across the world because we're, we're seeing, I
33:06
think, I think that the industry, you know, at the at
33:12
its origin started by building gyms in mountain towns and
33:16
mountain communities where there's climbing, there's
33:18
knowledge of climbing, there's outdoor enthusiasts.
33:21
And what we've caught on to and what people are catching on to
33:26
is there's just as much opportunity in major cities that
33:30
are removed from the mountains as there are these mountain
33:33
towns. And there's maybe even an
33:36
elevated edge to bringing the mountains to people who can't
33:40
access them. And if your only option is to go
33:44
to the climbing gym, versus here in Salt Lake, you can go to the
33:48
climbing gym. But most of the year you can
33:49
also just go out to the mountains and go climbing.
33:52
I think. I think there's just so much
33:54
opportunity in major cities across the world to bring a
33:59
climbing gym in. The biggest challenge that has
34:01
prevented the growth and the saturation of the market has
34:06
been real estate for sure. And do you see these micro gyms
34:12
as being what you want to lead with in some of these other
34:16
markets or it's just it's not an either or it's an and?
34:20
The micro gyms are a solution a solution to the real estate
34:24
challenge. You need a generally a really
34:29
large footprint to have a climbing gym.
34:32
And because we're a membership model, you know, we can't pay a
34:36
ton of rent. It's just not our business
34:39
model. And so if you want to get into
34:42
these urban areas, these cities with high density where the real
34:46
estate is really competitive, there are not a lot of options
34:50
and it's really expensive. The micro gyms are great
34:53
solution to be able to get your foot into that city, that
34:58
community without undertaking, you know, sometimes a $10
35:02
million project. You said you're a membership
35:06
model, so this is not the kind of thing whereas A1 off I would
35:10
be able to come in and just try it out.
35:12
I need to sign up for a monthly recurring membership.
35:16
We you absolutely can just walk in by a day pass, use it one
35:20
time, absolutely can do that. You know, programs, birthday
35:24
parties, day passes, punch passes.
35:26
But the bulk, about 70 to 80% of our revenue does come from our
35:32
memberships, people who are paying a monthly, a monthly
35:36
amount to use our facilities on an unlimited basis.
35:40
Unlimited. Yes.
35:42
And and what are hours typically like?
35:46
6:00 AM to 11:00 PM of course that's.
35:49
A long day. It's a long day and our
35:52
facilities, all of our facilities currently have a gym
35:56
and a yoga studio. And so, you know, we see people
36:00
who, like I said, are replacing their weekly, you know, exercise
36:05
weekly activity with climbing, specifically climbing.
36:07
That is their fitness, that is their exercise.
36:10
But we also have these gym amenities that people use to
36:15
supplement their training or they just use our facilities to
36:18
come and work out. When you say gym amenities, so
36:22
like free weights or like equipment?
36:26
Weights, free weights. We have a dedicated cardio room
36:29
in most of our locations and then we have a pretty, pretty
36:35
robust set of like free weights and fitness equipment, but we
36:41
also have climbing specific training.
36:45
I want to shift gears now, Eliza, and I'd love to hear from
36:48
you about a serious challenge that you've overcome in your
36:51
life, something personal or professional.
36:55
What was that? How'd you get through it?
36:57
What'd you learn? I think I think for me, the
37:01
elephant in the room at all Times Now is stepping into this
37:06
role and my age, you know, I'm I'm quite young to be ACEO of a
37:14
company of this scale. And the transition was really
37:20
intimidating. And I find myself weekly, maybe
37:26
sometimes daily in conversations are faced with decisions that
37:33
are are new and something I haven't experienced before.
37:39
And that absolutely is the biggest challenge for me right
37:45
now. It's just drinking from a
37:48
firehose and getting up to speed and being confident in the
37:54
decisions I'm making for this company and the way that I'm
37:57
leading this company. I have an amazing team and I
38:01
have amazing mentors, but the amount of responsibility and the
38:06
amount of decisions that I face on a daily basis, it's a lot.
38:12
It's a lot. And it's balancing, you know,
38:18
being brave and taking chances with utilizing experts and
38:25
resources and leaning on your team.
38:27
And it's definitely, it's been a crazy year.
38:34
Still in your 20s, now in your early 30s.
38:37
I am in my 30s, I am in my 30s and I'm actually about to turn
38:42
33 in two weeks. And you know, definitely one of
38:47
the younger CE OS you've probably.
38:50
Talked to it's true, it's true. And so does that ever I want to
38:57
explore sort of the what I'll call the imposter syndrome
39:02
component that I've heard you touch on in, in a moment.
39:05
But if, well, first I I want to dive into does it ever, do you
39:11
ever get pushback from other people because of your age,
39:15
whether it's internally or working externally with partners
39:19
or vendors? And how do you and how do you
39:23
deal with that? All the time, all the time.
39:26
An interesting dynamic for me at Momentum is that, you know, I've
39:31
ascended to this role and now I'm managing people that have
39:35
been my peers for many years. And that dynamic is a
39:41
challenging one because you're, you know, you're stepping into
39:46
this role with people who used to be your peers that now report
39:51
to you and have to take direction for you.
39:53
And I think it's, it's been this huge truck trust exercise for
39:58
all of us and. As it applies internally and
40:03
externally when I show up for meetings and you know, I walk
40:06
into a room all the time and people aren't expecting me to be
40:09
what's walking through the door, you know and they.
40:12
Think you're the assistant for who's coming, right?
40:15
All the time, all the time. I get that all the time.
40:18
And I'm on construction sites a lot and you know, I'm in lease
40:22
negotiations. I'm on construction sites and I
40:26
was on a construction site at 7:30 this morning and walked in
40:30
and people are like, who are you?
40:32
What can we do for you? But I think I think in
40:38
internally and externally, it's just demonstrating, inserting
40:45
yourself in the conversations and saying, hey, like, I need to
40:48
be here, I need to be involved in this conversation.
40:51
I'm going to listen, I'm going to contribute.
40:53
And I also think it's just showing up and being consistent.
40:58
And with time, you know, you can, you can always win people
41:01
over and you can always build trust and you can always, you
41:06
know, demonstrate that you're capable.
41:09
What's the craziest, most obtuse thing that somebody has said to
41:13
you when realizing who you were? I'm I the most the most absurd?
41:23
The most absurd I'm I have been introduced to a superior and
41:30
they have asked me why I'm not having babies and why I am
41:38
spending this much time working. Why I've chosen a career over
41:44
having a family. Did this come from an older man?
41:48
Yes, sure did. And this had to have been
41:52
recently. I, I, I would like to, when I
41:55
hear a story like that, I, I almost want to thank, oh, you
41:58
know, the 1960s. You know what, what a time that
42:01
was. But this was clearly very recent
42:04
because you've only been in this role for less than a year.
42:08
I have had a surprising amount of instances where people have
42:15
asked me about childbearing surprise now and I you know, it
42:22
just it's, it's something that's unique to being a woman and
42:27
unique to being a. Female.
42:29
A young woman, especially, probably.
42:31
Right, right, you know, is definitely prioritizing her
42:35
career right now. But every single day it seems
42:39
like people are judging your choices.
42:43
And there's always this kind of whether it's spoken or unspoken,
42:50
you know, question or, you know, looming question of, you know,
42:57
family verse career. Do you find that most of that is
43:01
coming from men? Is is there a percentage that
43:04
comes from women who are sort of casting the same judgement on
43:08
you? I I think it's across the board,
43:12
it's both. Well, it's fascinating.
43:14
Definitely. And you know, I think it's a
43:17
result to this. This country maybe does not
43:22
prioritize childcare and mothers in in industries the way that we
43:34
see other countries. You know, it's, it's just like
43:39
Bulgaria. Bulgaria for example, I spend a
43:43
lot of time there because we have gyms there.
43:46
We have a majority owner who is out of Bulgaria.
43:50
Mothers there have two years, up to two years off from work and
43:54
they're guaranteed their job when they come back.
43:57
And so it's just a different expectation.
43:59
You know, it's a different expectation that you can have
44:01
kids, you can dedicate time to your kids.
44:03
You also have all of these resources and this financial
44:06
package from the government to be able to have children and
44:11
still be guaranteed a job two years from when you leave.
44:13
And in the United States, I mean, I found myself when I
44:17
stepped into this role scrambling because we had a
44:21
pregnant employee at HQ for the first time and we didn't even
44:26
have a maternity package or policy.
44:30
And so many companies, you know, it's, it's up to the discretion
44:34
of the company and some companies don't even have a
44:37
policy. And that's been a really
44:40
interesting thing in my career. I know we just went on a totally
44:43
different tangent, but it's been a really interesting part of my
44:49
time here to assess that. And, you know, consider what
44:53
momentum could be doing better to support families and to
44:57
support women. So, you know, we have a lot of
45:01
young people who work for us who are, I've basically grown up
45:05
with the past decade and people are reaching that point in time
45:10
where they're considering having kids, having families, and what
45:13
is our company doing to enable them to do that and feel
45:16
supported through that process. Big questions to ask and try to
45:20
find answers to for sure for people that are listening that.
45:28
Now, let me phrase this a little bit differently.
45:30
For some of those folks who have you, they've cast that judgement
45:33
upon you who've said inappropriate things or have
45:39
just sort of given that energy and that look about, you know,
45:42
who are you? Who do you think you are?
45:45
What kind of constructive coaching can we maybe offered to
45:49
folks like that so that they can find themselves in a better
45:53
position to to be a better human being going forward?
46:00
Oh, that's a great question. I, I, you know, I think people
46:08
are just, people are just capable of doing whatever they
46:15
want to do and their choices are their own.
46:20
And you know, I, I mean, I don't know, Anthony, mind your
46:23
business. Bite your ton.
46:28
Keep those thoughts to yourself. That's the message here.
46:31
It totally. I mean, I, I have been in those
46:36
scenarios so frequently over my entire career.
46:39
I mean, working in Major League Soccer, I was the only female in
46:42
an office of like 50 guys. And I was young.
46:46
I was early 20s and all these guys are between, you know, 30
46:50
and 60 years old. I've seen it all.
46:52
I have heard it all. It's been a really ever present
46:57
thing for me throughout my entire career.
47:00
And you know, for me, I can handle it.
47:03
It's fine. I'm so used to it.
47:06
It doesn't affect me. But I think people should have
47:10
the perspective and the self-awareness that other people
47:14
are may not take to it so so kindly.
47:18
And other people are impressionable and people should
47:23
just have more self-awareness of the comments they make and how
47:28
that can make somebody feel. Yeah, well, I'm glad that you've
47:32
been able to handle it, but I'm going to disagree with you on
47:35
one thing. It's not fine.
47:37
So I think that's that's an overriding message that I think
47:41
we want people to hear when it comes to, you know, that's those
47:43
sorts of conversations and comments.
47:46
But I, I also now want to look at this from the angle of right,
47:49
you recognize that you're young, you recognize that you're going
47:53
into a lot of experiences that are brand new to you and you're
47:57
already, like you said, drinking from a firehose.
48:00
And so you've got those moments of self doubt that come in
48:04
regularly. And then on top of that, you've
48:06
got other people with these comments with the, you know that
48:09
that can't help with that. And so I'm tell us, Eliza, what
48:15
have you done to be able to, I don't know, sort of soldier up
48:19
to be able to to put the armor up or figure out a way to go
48:23
through as you're dealing with all these uncertainties and and
48:27
trying to figure out navigate new situations in this position
48:30
of leadership? Bravery.
48:33
Bravery really. I mean, you've got to be brave
48:38
and you've got to take chances. And like I said, you know, I
48:42
know I'm not the smartest or the most experienced person in the
48:45
room, but I am not afraid and I'm not afraid to take chances.
48:49
I'm not afraid to insert myself into a conversation.
48:51
And I know that whatever I don't know, I'm capable of learning.
48:56
And I think a good analogy is, you know, you brought up
48:59
imposter syndrome and that's that's so prevalent in our
49:04
industry, even across our own employees.
49:09
You know, a lot of people feel like to work at a climbing gym,
49:13
to work for a climbing company, you need to be a really good
49:18
climber and you need to climb hard and climb hard grades.
49:22
And, you know, while it is, I think, to an extent, important
49:30
to be passionate about the sport and participate in the sport,
49:34
climbing, you know, we preach climbing is for everybody and it
49:38
looks different for people, the benefits and the experience they
49:43
get from climbing. It looks different for different
49:46
people. And you know, I've had to
49:48
overcome my own imposter syndrome in this industry
49:52
because while I climb a lot and climbing is, you know, one of my
49:57
biggest passions, I'm, I'm not a professional athlete, I'm not a
50:02
professional climber. And I can't hang climbing with a
50:07
bunch of our employees. And it's, it's been years of
50:11
just understanding and not only understanding, but also
50:15
appreciating like I am so many of our users, I'm so many of our
50:19
customers. I'm this like middle of the road
50:21
climber who loves to do it and does it with my friends, my
50:26
partner. And it's this really meaningful,
50:29
important thing in my life. And that's so relatable to a
50:34
huge percentage of our users, our members.
50:37
And so just I, I think recognizing that you can
50:44
contribute and you can add value and having the confidence to do
50:48
so, even if from the outside you look like you're young and under
50:55
qualified and not capable. Trying to think where I want to
51:01
go with that next. No, I think that was really
51:04
good. I'm.
51:08
Do you think that you were born sort of with this?
51:11
I'm not going to call it fearless because I, I think
51:14
that's the wrong message to send.
51:15
I think, I think what people need to hear is that we all
51:20
experience fear. It's just not letting that fear
51:23
control you and define you. It's, it's, it's figuring out a
51:27
way to go forward in, in spite of the fear.
51:31
And and so I'm curious to hear, Eliza, do you feel like you were
51:34
sort of born with this tendency? Were you, I don't know, raised
51:41
like in a way that sort of like delivered it into you?
51:45
Were there defining moments growing up that really infused
51:50
you with the spirit? Do you have any sense of where
51:52
that comes from? It's a really good question,
51:56
Anthony. I, I am so fortunate to have
52:01
parents who have from birth told me you're capable and take
52:07
accountability, take accountability, take ownership,
52:10
own your thoughts, own your decisions, own your mistakes, be
52:14
accountable, be brave and you're capable.
52:17
And then throughout my career, I've been so fortunate to have
52:20
mentors and just people come into my life and say, hey,
52:23
you're capable and there's always a solution.
52:27
There's always a solution, You just need to find it.
52:30
And I think that mindset has really helped shape my, like I
52:39
said, my, my leadership style, my approach, but also my, my
52:43
opinion of myself. Just, you know, there's always a
52:48
solution to be found and I I'm capable, you know.
52:54
Putting all humility aside, Eliza, how would you
52:56
characterize your superpower? That's a great question.
53:04
I, I do think, and this is this has just been practiced over
53:09
time, I do think my superpower is just kind of remaining calm
53:14
in the storm and being consistent, just being
53:17
consistent and showing up consistently every single day
53:23
regardless of what comes down the pipe, what we face.
53:28
I think it's, I think it's really important to be rock
53:35
solid for your team and to be the source of optimism and
53:42
support and teamwork for for the crew that you're leading do.
53:50
You have a favorite book or a podcast that's been helpful for
53:53
you, you might like to recommend to our listeners.
53:56
Yeah, absolutely, I do. And I think it it touches on so
54:01
many things we talked about today.
54:03
But Yvonne Shannard, who is the founder of Patagonia, who is
54:08
also a legendary rock climber, he wrote this great book that I
54:12
recommend to everybody that's called Let My People Go Surfing.
54:17
And it's part memoir, but it's part business philosophy.
54:23
He, he talks in this book about ethical leadership and ethical
54:32
business practices, which, you know, is really important for
54:38
all industries, for all companies, you know, to be
54:41
having that conversation, to be thinking of, you know, how can
54:45
we reduce our footprint? How can we contribute less
54:47
waste? How can we, you know, have the
54:51
best ethical practices and culture?
54:54
But he also talks a lot about building a culture of trust and
55:00
flexibility so that people can find balance in their life.
55:06
And like we talked about earlier, I employ climbers.
55:11
I'm sitting in an office filled with climbers right now, and
55:14
they want balance. They want to recreate.
55:16
They want to pursue their passions outdoors and creating a
55:22
work culture where people can be held accountable and produce,
55:27
but also find this work life balance, this flexibility.
55:30
I think it all comes down to trust and having supportive
55:36
systems. But but that would be my
55:38
recommendation. It's a it's a great read.
55:42
What kind of daily habits or practices do you have that help
55:45
you get you started and keep you on track?
55:49
I I wake up at 5:00 AM every morning.
55:53
I I cannot tell you the last time I've used an alarm clock.
55:57
I don't know what is wrong with me, but come 5515, I'm awake.
56:03
The morning is really important for me to, you know, drink my
56:07
coffee, kind of decompress and ease into the day.
56:11
I normally exercise first thing in the morning.
56:14
I find that exercising before I go to work really helps me, you
56:19
know, be calm, cool and collected throughout the day.
56:22
So waking up early, having my coffee routine, exercising
56:26
before I get into work, those are the most important things to
56:31
start my day off on the right note.
56:33
And you know, I travel a lot for work and so there's, there's not
56:39
a lot of control over schedule or flexibility, but at a minimum
56:43
I try and try and exercise and have an hour for my coffee every
56:47
morning. Sometimes mistakes happen in the
56:54
moment we later look back on with appreciation as some of our
56:59
greatest teachers. Can you think of a career moment
57:03
for you early on that seemed like a set back at the time but
57:07
actually helped to propel you forward?
57:13
Yeah, yeah, I'll be, I'll be very vulnerable with this one.
57:18
My first week of work with Momentum, I was working crazy
57:24
hours. We're trying to get this gym
57:26
open. We're working throughout the
57:28
night, getting the gym equipment set up, the furniture built.
57:32
And I'm, I'm exhausted and I'm in, I'm in Houston, I'm in
57:37
Texas, and I get a call from my boss.
57:39
At the time, there had been an accident at one of our gyms in
57:44
Salt Lake in one of our youth programs.
57:47
And it it was a pretty severe accident and it was a youth
57:53
program participant who incorrectly was blaying somebody
57:58
that led to a fall and an injury.
58:00
And I remember going out, I was at the gym at the time and it
58:07
was the evening and I went out to my car and I just had a
58:11
breakdown. And I sobbed and I said, you
58:14
know, I am not in the business of hurting children or, you
58:20
know, having anybody get injured.
58:23
And what am I doing? What am I walking into?
58:26
Because climbing is inherently dangerous.
58:29
And unfortunately, injuries happen all the time.
58:32
Mistakes and climbing happen all the time, whether it's in gyms
58:36
or it's outside at the crack. People make mistakes and people
58:40
fall. And this was a mistake by the
58:45
climber, but ultimately it was our responsibility because
58:48
they're in our programs, they're under our care.
58:50
And it was a really big opportunity for reflection for
58:58
me on, you know, while while we can, we can never prevent
59:07
accidents fully, It from that moment motivated me to put my
59:16
full energy, attention and commitment to making our our
59:21
programs, our coaches as we don't use the word safe in
59:26
climbing because climbing is just not safe.
59:28
It's just not safe. Injuries, accidents happen all
59:31
the time, but doing everything we possibly can to mitigate
59:35
risks and to ensure that no, nobody gets hurt.
59:41
Can you point to a specific example of something that you
59:45
introduced that's made your climbing facilities safer than
59:52
they were before that kind of came about through this moment
59:55
of reflection? We implemented and we this is
1:00:02
something that is still today high priority for us.
1:00:07
So we implemented this pretty robust incident response
1:00:12
training to all of our staff and that included belay takeovers
1:00:17
where somebody's set up incorrectly or if somebody is on
1:00:22
the wall and staff can come in and very quickly take over that
1:00:25
belay. And we have since trained all of
1:00:28
our operations staff to be able to respond to an on the wall
1:00:33
incident. And so I think at the time we
1:00:36
had some procedures in place, but there's so much technical
1:00:41
knowledge and equipment understanding you need to do an
1:00:46
on the wall rescue or respond. And it, it's very, it's very
1:00:51
intense when there's an accident or an injury in the gym.
1:00:54
It is something that's unique to our industry.
1:00:57
We see, we see gross injuries like pretty regularly and our
1:01:04
staff have to respond to, to those incidents.
1:01:07
And so training, implementing training that is so dialed and
1:01:16
having the retaining training being recurring.
1:01:18
So that's an automated response for our staff in theory,
1:01:22
hopefully has reduced and will continue to reduce the the
1:01:26
severity or the likelihood of a severe injury.
1:01:29
But then also resources for our staff if they do have to respond
1:01:34
to a bad accident or injury because that can take a toll on
1:01:38
your mental health for sure. Yeah, absolutely.
1:01:42
Eliza, I just have one more question for you today.
1:01:44
But before I ask it, I want to do a few things.
1:01:47
First of all, anyone looking to get in touch with Momentum
1:01:50
Climbing, Very easy. momentumclimbing.com, very
1:01:54
simple, easy. Remember domain name
1:01:56
momentumclimbing.com. And if you'd like to reach out
1:02:00
to Eliza, she's given us permission to share her personal
1:02:03
e-mail address, which is Eliza, with AZ dot Keegan
1:02:07
sothats.keegansoliza.keegan@momentumclimbing.com. And we'll have links to both of
1:02:15
those things in the show notes for folks.
1:02:18
Also, as a reminder that my company, Add Back Benefits
1:02:20
agency provides telehealth counseling and therapy unlimited
1:02:24
and 190 prescription meds to employees.
1:02:26
That's always free for them to access and does so in a way that
1:02:30
actually puts more money in the company's pockets and the
1:02:32
employees too. Finally, if you take just a
1:02:35
moment to leave us a comment or review on your favorite podcast
1:02:38
app, we will be forever grateful to you.
1:02:41
So last question for you, Eliza. You and I reconnect one year
1:02:44
from today, and you got your fist pumping in the air because
1:02:47
you're super excited about something.
1:02:49
What's that thing you hope to be celebrating one year from now?
1:02:53
More locations, More locations. It is such a gift and an honor
1:02:58
to bring climbing gyms to communities because of the
1:03:04
communities that they built. And it's, it's so special to be
1:03:08
inside one of our facilities. And so I, I think, I think what
1:03:13
we do, it's a good thing to put out to the world.
1:03:15
It's a good thing to bring to cities and communities.
1:03:18
And I just want to do more of it.
1:03:20
Any idea how many more locations we might be looking at one year
1:03:24
from today? One year from today, hopefully
1:03:27
we have two more locations open one year from today with many
1:03:33
more on the way all. Right.
1:03:35
Well, Eliza Keegan, CEO, Momentum Indoor Climbing.
1:03:39
I want to be the first to thank you for sharing both your time
1:03:42
and your story with us today. I really appreciate it.
1:03:45
Thanks, Anthony. Folks, that's a wrap on another
1:03:48
episode of the Inspired Stories podcast.
1:03:50
Thanks for learning with us today.