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The New World Order – Affordable Financial Planning for All · Financial Planner Life Podcast

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_02: And today's guest on the Financial Planet Life podcast is Sam Tate from New World Financial Group.
• 0:05
  SPEAKER_02: And um we talk about things like longevity.
• 0:08
  SPEAKER_02: Does retirement have to be reframed?
• 0:11
  SPEAKER_02: We talk about their brand new business, why they set up the New World Group.
• 0:16
  SPEAKER_02: We talk about fees, subscription models, free advice to those that don't fit the typical financial planning mold.
• 0:25
  SPEAKER_02: We talk about wellness, the connection to financial planning.
• 0:29
  SPEAKER_02: We talk about technology, how they've implemented it into their business to improve the time it takes to give good quality financial advice to those that usually don't fit the model.
• 0:41
  SPEAKER_02: It's a fantastic episode about the future of financial planning.
• 0:45
  SPEAKER_02: And guess what?
• 0:46
  SPEAKER_02: Ding ding ding, we talk about AI as well.
• 0:48
  SPEAKER_02: Typical.
• 0:49
  SPEAKER_02: I hope you enjoy it.
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_02: Sam, thank you so much for joining me today on the Financial Planel Life podcast.
• 1:02
  SPEAKER_02: How are you?
• 1:03
  SPEAKER_01: I'm really well, thanks, Sam.
• 1:05
  SPEAKER_01: Thanks for inviting me on.
• 1:06
  SPEAKER_01: It's great to be here.
• 1:07
  SPEAKER_02: That's all right, no problem at all.
• 1:08
  SPEAKER_02: Uh always an absolute pleasure to talk to innovators within the financial planning space.
• 1:13
  SPEAKER_02: I love talking about the future.
• 1:15
  SPEAKER_02: I've got a real interest in the tech space.
• 1:18
  SPEAKER_02: Um I've got a real interest also in uh financial planning firms that want to incorporate tech in their business, that are doing it, and aren't afraid to challenge the norm, to challenge the status quo of um of financial planning and open it up to the masses, not making it an elitist service, uh, if you will.
• 1:40
  SPEAKER_02: And you're one of those innovators.
• 1:41
  SPEAKER_02: So um it's a real pleasure to have you on the podcast.
• 1:44
  SPEAKER_02: I've had your co-founder and partner in business, Lisa Tipton, on the podcast before.
• 1:49
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and that was very much at the beginning of the journey.
• 1:51
  SPEAKER_02: And since then, that's probably been over a year.
• 1:53
  SPEAKER_02: So things have changed, Sam.
• 1:55
  SPEAKER_02: And it's wonderful to get you on here and to talk to you about your journey and the impact that you're having, the things that you're doing.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_02: So welcome.
• 2:03
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you.
• 2:04
  SPEAKER_02: So, co-founder and director of the New World Group, yeah?
• 2:08
  SPEAKER_02: New World Financial Group, isn't it?
• 2:11
  SPEAKER_01: It is, yeah.
• 2:12
  SPEAKER_01: That's right.
• 2:13
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, Lisa and I uh set the business up.
• 2:16
  SPEAKER_01: Uh well, we we formed the company in 2019, 12 months of FCA authorization process, which was um which was mainly Lisa's work, I must admit.
• 2:26
  SPEAKER_01: And um and we started trading in January 2021, right in the middle of COVID.
• 2:31
  SPEAKER_02: Fantastic.
• 2:31
  SPEAKER_02: So what a time to set up a business.
• 2:33
  SPEAKER_02: You know, I did the same with Financial Planner Life, actually.
• 2:35
  SPEAKER_02: I remember thinking like some of the best businesses are set up in the most hardest times.
• 2:39
  SPEAKER_02: And I I saw it as quite an exciting opportunity to do it.
• 2:42
  SPEAKER_02: And obviously, with the dawn of video, it made it um sort of quite uh the thing to do.
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_02: Um Sam, fantastic.
• 2:50
  SPEAKER_02: So look, traditional financial planning practices traditionally have been set up by financial advisors, those that are actually going out giving the financial advice, and they decide to go it alone, whether they become an AR or they become a directly authorized firm.
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_02: But you and um and Lisa, you know, you're not your traditional financial planning business.
• 3:08
  SPEAKER_02: Neither of you were actually client-facing going out and and delivering that financial advice, were you?
• 3:14
  SPEAKER_01: That's that's correct.
• 3:15
  SPEAKER_01: Sam, Lisa, Lisa's a chartered financial planner, she's a fellow, actually.
• 3:19
  SPEAKER_01: Uh she has um her background was mainly power planning.
• 3:23
  SPEAKER_01: So 15, 20 years of that.
• 3:25
  SPEAKER_01: Mine was mainly operational.
• 3:27
  SPEAKER_01: I discovered um quite a long time after, well, I've been in the industry 20 years, but after a short period of time, I discovered that you know, face-to-face advice wasn't my thing.
• 3:37
  SPEAKER_01: I preferred the much broader view of growing the business and innovating financial services.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_01: And I've worked in every area um ultimately, from admin all the way through to face-to-face and now director operations, marketing, finance, a bit of everything.
• 3:53
  SPEAKER_01: But I think what's helpful from Lisa Renee's perspective is we've got a very broad view on the industry generally.
• 3:59
  SPEAKER_01: We're not tied to necessarily what, you know, uh the sale of the product, if that makes sense.
• 4:06
  SPEAKER_01: We are we're looking at things with an eagle eye view ultimately.
• 4:10
  SPEAKER_01: So we are um, yeah, I think it's I think it's an advantage for us.
• 4:15
  SPEAKER_02: So an advantage coming from an operations background, not from that sort of driving client meetings, thinking about the sales process too heavily, more geared around the service and the innovation of the financial planning itself.
• 4:29
  SPEAKER_01: Correct.
• 4:30
  SPEAKER_01: Um, yeah, so I think if you are face-to-face and you are seeing clients, it's not to say that you can't be innovative as well.
• 4:35
  SPEAKER_01: I think it just makes it harder.
• 4:37
  SPEAKER_01: So we can take a step back.
• 4:38
  SPEAKER_01: We can um we work with our financial planning team, obviously, and we help them do that bit.
• 4:43
  SPEAKER_01: We try to coach them and um and put them on the right lines.
• 4:46
  SPEAKER_01: But meanwhile, myself and Lisa, we can take a step back and we can take a view on the industry, and not just today, but in 10 years' time, 20 years' time, you know, things are changing at a rapid pace, and financial services is going to get wrapped up in that.
• 5:00
  SPEAKER_01: How we do things today is very different to 10 years ago, and it will be very, very different in 20 years' time.
• 5:06
  SPEAKER_01: So being able to take a step back and have the time to research and to look at things generally and to be as a as a young business, we can be agile, you know, with our we can be flexible and agile with our um pricing structure, with with the with the offering that we're providing.
• 5:22
  SPEAKER_01: We have, we've evolved already in that short period of time.
• 5:26
  SPEAKER_01: But um, having the space and the time to be able to do that is an advantage for for us personally, I believe.
• 5:34
  SPEAKER_02: So it is an exciting time, the financial planning profession.
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_02: Okay.
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_02: It does feel quite archaic.
• 5:40
  SPEAKER_02: It does feel like it is behind the times.
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, there is an aging population of advisors, for instance, at the helm running these businesses as well.
• 5:49
  SPEAKER_02: It's quite an aging sort of demographic of uh board members and owners of businesses.
• 5:54
  SPEAKER_02: That's, you know, the average age about 57 years old.
• 5:56
  SPEAKER_02: We know there's not enough younger individuals coming into the profession.
• 6:00
  SPEAKER_02: But one thing I am seeing through my conversations and um research is that there are young people coming through quickly now, moving into running their own businesses and looking to innovate and looking to stand out, whether that's embracing things like social media and marketing or partnering with the fintech companies that can um improve processes, for example, create a slicker automated process, make it easier to access those clients that perhaps weren't accessible before for financial planning.
• 6:30
  SPEAKER_02: So just tell us about New World then.
• 6:32
  SPEAKER_02: Tell us why you guys set it up and what's so innovative about it.
• 6:37
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 6:38
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 6:38
  SPEAKER_01: So firstly, what I would say, you you mentioned the 50, the average age there.
• 6:43
  SPEAKER_01: I think there are people there is there's a confusion within the industry about what we're doing, not new world, but generally.
• 6:49
  SPEAKER_01: So some people are still providing traditional financial advice.
• 6:53
  SPEAKER_01: Some people are doing it whilst calling themselves financial planners.
• 6:56
  SPEAKER_01: And then there's a smaller percentage of businesses that are actually financial planning, uh like real financial planning.
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_01: And I do believe that'll flip uh over the next five, 10 years.
• 7:06
  SPEAKER_01: I think that's where we're going.
• 7:07
  SPEAKER_01: But until we get um a complete industry view on, you know, if until we're all pointing in the same direction, I think it's it's one of the challenges that we face.
• 7:17
  SPEAKER_01: As a business, our product is the financial plan.
• 7:20
  SPEAKER_01: So we um we believe that what we do as financial planners, we can that that should be that that should benefit everybody.
• 7:28
  SPEAKER_01: We shouldn't be pricing people out, we shouldn't be putting up barriers to entry.
• 7:32
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so it's our aim to try to take those barriers down ultimately.
• 7:36
  SPEAKER_01: You know, if you think about it at the moment, if you haven't got the money to invest, you can't get financial advice because financial advisors typically they're dependent on the investment being you know taking place.
• 7:50
  SPEAKER_01: And then they will take a fee or a percentage of a fee um from that investment.
• 7:55
  SPEAKER_01: Uh we we see things a little bit different.
• 7:58
  SPEAKER_01: Our product is the financial plan, so we charge a professional fee for a professional service.
• 8:02
  SPEAKER_01: What that allows us to do is speak to people that maybe haven't built up the funds, um, that can't necessarily speak to a traditional uh financial advisor.
• 8:12
  SPEAKER_01: And and that's then ultimately the next generation.
• 8:15
  SPEAKER_01: You know, that you know, people we talk about the the um the great generational uh wealth transfer.
• 8:22
  SPEAKER_01: Um well, if you're not speaking to these people now, I mean it's all going to be redundant, uh, you know, if if if you're just sitting waiting for that to happen because the game's changing and people, younger people want different things and they expect different things.
• 8:35
  SPEAKER_01: So you've got to be agile and and flexible to adapt the model.
• 8:40
  SPEAKER_01: Um and the other thing, of course, is that our competition isn't the financial advisor or the financial planner next door, it's it's this thing.
• 8:50
  SPEAKER_01: You know, younger people today uh are investing on their on their phones relatively cheaply and relative and very, very easily.
• 8:59
  SPEAKER_01: That's if if if your model is based on purely on the investment, and that I would I would class if you are being paid based on the investment, then that is your product.
• 9:10
  SPEAKER_01: If that's where you hang it, where you're hanging your hat, you're going into competition with something that you just cannot compete with.
• 9:17
  SPEAKER_01: So you need to adapt, you need to broaden the product and ultimately offer something that is is gonna help people more, it's gonna make people's lives better, and that's full financial planning.
• 9:28
  SPEAKER_02: That's really, really interesting.
• 9:30
  SPEAKER_02: So, how are you then at New World appealing to that generation of individuals that do want to invest, but typically can't afford to receive the full financial planning?
• 9:42
  SPEAKER_02: And instead are sort of almost being enthused by the TikTok videos, the get rich quick kind of coaches that are out there.
• 9:50
  SPEAKER_02: How are you sort of bridging that gap and almost creating this financial education which shows, look, do invest your money?
• 9:56
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, you don't have to pay crazy fees to do so, but you do need a financial plan.
• 10:02
  SPEAKER_02: And here's where we come in, and this is how we make it affordable to you and beneficial to you.
• 10:09
  SPEAKER_02: So, what are you guys doing there at New World?
• 10:11
  SPEAKER_02: What are you developing to be able to bridge that gap?
• 10:14
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, I mean, this is a journey.
• 10:16
  SPEAKER_01: So this this is this is um this is an evolving um model that we're that we're that we're taking on.
• 10:22
  SPEAKER_01: Um it's changed since day one and it and it and it will change again.
• 10:26
  SPEAKER_01: We we have um a unique offering for under 50s.
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_01: So we do not um we don't we'll find that a lot of people under 50 are um the questions that they have are more related to how do I know what to prioritize?
• 10:43
  SPEAKER_01: Where do I is is this is is X amount to to be saving?
• 10:48
  SPEAKER_01: Questions like that.
• 10:49
  SPEAKER_01: Um so what we do, we built, we built um a tiered service.
• 10:54
  SPEAKER_01: Um I'll come on to the free offering, but um, but it but it basically at 50 pounds a month, 100 pounds a month, and 150 pounds a month.
• 11:01
  SPEAKER_01: And 150 pounds a month is a premium service that you would expect any financial advisor to to provide.
• 11:07
  SPEAKER_01: And that will include full investment management, face-to-face meetings, and a cat and cash flow cash flow modeling, the full range ultimately.
• 11:16
  SPEAKER_01: At the lower range, 50 pounds a month, then it's mainly around guidance and education.
• 11:21
  SPEAKER_01: The take up on that rate at the moment is is is okay, but the middle tier, the£100 a month, that is the that's where the value lies because we're helping people to make financial decisions, we're entering into their lives.
• 11:34
  SPEAKER_01: It's a it's an honor and a privilege, and I think that needs to be spoken about more.
• 11:39
  SPEAKER_01: Sitting in front of clients and allowing them to open up to you is an honor and a privilege, and it needs to be taken seriously, it needs to be professional and it needs to be worthwhile.
• 11:48
  SPEAKER_01: There's a lot of take up on that because a lot of these people haven't got two, three, four hundred thousand pounds.
• 11:57
  SPEAKER_01: That said, those that do, it's a no-brainer for them to use our subscription service because we're not exploiting them because they have money.
• 12:04
  SPEAKER_01: They will pay the same fee as somebody who has maybe uh you know, zero to 10k in investments, but they're getting the same service, they're getting the same, and that's what it's about.
• 12:16
  SPEAKER_01: It's not about exploiting people that have more money.
• 12:18
  SPEAKER_01: So the people that that have got to that stage, great, what a what an offering they've got.
• 12:23
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but it's really about educating people.
• 12:25
  SPEAKER_01: That's where it all begins.
• 12:27
  SPEAKER_01: And for free, we are we're we a couple of weeks, I think, away from unveiling our financial health check 2.0.
• 12:34
  SPEAKER_01: We released version one last year.
• 12:36
  SPEAKER_01: This is a bit of an upgrade, and that's something that we can give to people for free.
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_01: And that is um, it's not too dissimilar from some of the things that the banks are presenting to people, but there's no agenda behind it.
• 12:50
  SPEAKER_01: It's um, you know, they don't need to consent to giving us their their marketing details or anything like that.
• 12:56
  SPEAKER_01: It's just something that they can put through their information and ultimately get some guidance at the end of it.
• 13:01
  SPEAKER_01: You know, if they've got too much debt or they're struggling with debt management, then we can point them in the right direction.
• 13:07
  SPEAKER_01: We can give them budgeting tips.
• 13:09
  SPEAKER_01: And if they're beginning their savings and investment journey, then we can also do the same.
• 13:14
  SPEAKER_01: Ultimately, they're, you know, they will come through our funnel if necessary, but that's not the end game for us.
• 13:20
  SPEAKER_01: Ultimately, it's about education and it's about educating people because there isn't enough of it at the moment.
• 13:27
  SPEAKER_01: And this industry prevents it from happening in so many ways.
• 13:31
  SPEAKER_01: You know, financial advisors and financial planners don't do enough.
• 13:34
  SPEAKER_01: Um, there's a responsibility, in my opinion, to do more.
• 13:37
  SPEAKER_01: Um, we all agree, I think, that the school system doesn't suffice in terms of what people, you know, leave school with in terms of financial knowledge.
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_01: So it's up to us to do more.
• 13:48
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and that is one of our objectives as a as a business.
• 13:52
  SPEAKER_02: I really like that.
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_02: You've got this tiered system which supports anybody at any stage of their journey, and you're not uh disregarding somebody that doesn't have a specific amount of money to invest beyond the basis of the fact that you're not going to make money out of investing their money and that you are offering them something that is a solution at that stage.
• 14:09
  SPEAKER_02: You're not dismissing them.
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_02: I really, really like that.
• 14:11
  SPEAKER_02: It's something I'm doing myself here at the Financial Planner Life.
• 14:13
  SPEAKER_02: It's about educating those next generations.
• 14:15
  SPEAKER_02: Just because you know, my recruitment company makes a lot of money out of placing people who are qualified financial advisors with transferable assets or a power planner because they're highly sought after, those next generations that are coming through, you know, firms aren't willing to pay a top-wack fee, therefore, recruitment companies don't deal with them.
• 14:32
  SPEAKER_02: But what I'm doing is creating a solution.
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_02: I'm nurturing them, I'm giving them the information as best as I possibly can.
• 14:38
  SPEAKER_02: And I don't make a great deal of money, but I am creating a solution that will eventually help me and my business grow.
• 14:45
  SPEAKER_02: Because guess what?
• 14:46
  SPEAKER_02: Those people are going to go through the cycle, aren't they?
• 14:48
  SPEAKER_02: And a bit like in financial planning, you know, the sons and the daughters that get referred down, say to the parents to say, Well don't you do the health check with these guys that we're working with?
• 14:57
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, I will.
• 14:58
  SPEAKER_02: And all of a sudden they're introducing them, aren't they, into your ecosystem?
• 15:02
  SPEAKER_02: And you mentioned there that, you know, they may not tick the box that says they want marketing or anything like that, but at least you're exposing them to good financial practice and good financial education.
• 15:12
  SPEAKER_02: And when you do that, when you put good out, I'm a bit like that anyway, Sam.
• 15:15
  SPEAKER_02: And if you put good out, good comes back to you.
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_02: You get recognized for it.
• 15:20
  SPEAKER_02: And I think it's a really interesting thing that you're doing.
• 15:23
  SPEAKER_02: And it's not something that, you know, you're giving it away for free, but Sam, it's costing you money to make, isn't it?
• 15:28
  SPEAKER_02: It's costing you time, it's costing you money to create that.
• 15:32
  SPEAKER_02: So for you, there has to be an end goal, a purpose based around it.
• 15:37
  SPEAKER_02: And it's funny because not enough financial planners are investing in that.
• 15:40
  SPEAKER_02: They're not investing in that educational side.
• 15:42
  SPEAKER_02: Sam, can I ask you, what part do you think within this structure that you've got, this free and you know, free to£100 to£150 a month?
• 15:50
  SPEAKER_02: At those stages, are you thinking about bringing in things like a financial coach, a virtual coach?
• 15:56
  SPEAKER_02: Is that something you have in the business?
• 15:58
  SPEAKER_02: Is it something that you're bringing in?
• 15:59
  SPEAKER_02: Do you see the value of a coach up against, say, a financial planner, or are they two the same?
• 16:05
  SPEAKER_01: No, uh, it's a very different skill set.
• 16:08
  SPEAKER_01: It's something that we're coaching in-house.
• 16:10
  SPEAKER_01: So our financial planners um have coaching skills.
• 16:13
  SPEAKER_01: I would say that that again, that's a journey and we're we're improving.
• 16:17
  SPEAKER_01: Um we're improving that aspect, but you're absolutely right, Sam, that the people at the lower end, uh, you know, starting the journey, that they need a coach as much as they need a planner.
• 16:28
  SPEAKER_01: So in terms of the product that we provide, you know, financial coaching is part of that service.
• 16:34
  SPEAKER_01: So we'll get some people that um that, you know, that that that maybe they're struggling with their budgeting.
• 16:40
  SPEAKER_01: Um, maybe they maybe things are okay, but they're just struggling with the budgeting because they've never, you know, been taught how to do it.
• 16:48
  SPEAKER_01: They've never thought that they, you know, it's it's a thing that you're expected to just be able to do naturally, isn't it?
• 16:53
  SPEAKER_01: Yes.
• 16:53
  SPEAKER_01: You know, don't spend as much, uh, don't spend more than you're getting in.
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_01: But the reality is quite different, and stresses and life gets in the way, and particularly with with the cost of living crisis at the moment, it's much more of an issue.
• 17:06
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and we're doing a lot of it.
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_01: So there's a lot of value, particularly at the lower end in that regard.
• 17:12
  SPEAKER_01: And it we're 100%, if we're going to open this up to the to everybody as a as an industry, it has to be part of our offering.
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_01: Has to be.
• 17:24
  SPEAKER_02: It's a great entry point, isn't it, into receiving that fee, paying a fee basically for financial planning.
• 17:30
  SPEAKER_02: You know, other professions, okay, where we look after our physical well-being.
• 17:34
  SPEAKER_02: Now, if I go into a gym, you know, sure as shit, a PT is going to come up to me and offer me a free PT session.
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_02: They're going to tell me a little bit about the things that I can do to improve my fitness, improve my health.
• 17:45
  SPEAKER_02: Now, if I sit in front of that PT and I have that PT session and they show me a thing or two about the things I'm doing right, the things I'm doing wrong, and they gave me a simple plan, I'm going to walk away and go, Oh, I want to do that.
• 17:57
  SPEAKER_02: Well, I'm going to have to upgrade, aren't I?
• 17:59
  SPEAKER_02: Instead of paying my£20 a month to go to the gym, all of a sudden it's£40 a session.
• 18:05
  SPEAKER_02: However, I see the value in that.
• 18:07
  SPEAKER_02: Now, it's a great entry point, A, to teach people to help themselves, which is fantastic, but also it's a great put a great way to then transfer those individuals into fee-paying uh clients when the time is right.
• 18:20
  SPEAKER_02: Now, a big part of that obviously is being able to talk to, educate, build relationships with the next generation, because you touched on this great transfer of wealth, okay, which we've talked about it being a bit of a distraction.
• 18:31
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 18:32
  SPEAKER_02: The great transfer of wealth, you're building that relationship now.
• 18:37
  SPEAKER_02: Are you thinking as a business, this is a huge opportunity, the great transfer of wealth?
• 18:41
  SPEAKER_02: I, you know, is that is that in your mind?
• 18:44
  SPEAKER_02: And that's why you're doing it.
• 18:46
  SPEAKER_02: What do you, you know, where's your stance around the transfer of wealth?
• 18:50
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, I see it as um, I think it's it's it's something that I think a lot of people are, even if they're you know subconsciously um waiting for, it doesn't matter to to us because we're not reliant on the amount of money that somebody has.
• 19:06
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 19:06
  SPEAKER_01: You know, um, yeah, in terms of our, you know, if if people need more, you know, for example, an additional rate taxpayer will need more work doing on their, you know, as part of their service.
• 19:18
  SPEAKER_01: So they will pay a slightly more fee, uh higher fee.
• 19:21
  SPEAKER_01: But it but it's not going to be dramatically higher versus somebody that's just in has nothing versus has just inherited a million quid.
• 19:28
  SPEAKER_01: It's um it it the the focus on on the on the monetary value, I think, misses the point.
• 19:35
  SPEAKER_01: And I think the trust element that that is missing from our industry, particularly through from younger people um at the moment, it isn't going to be addressed if if we're really so focused on on how much an individual's worth.
• 19:51
  SPEAKER_01: You know, it's how much value can you bring to those people's lives.
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_01: We provide as much value to people who may be a basic rate taxpayers and are struggling to see a way through to retirement than we do somebody who's you know got seven figures in the bank.
• 20:07
  SPEAKER_01: You know, it's about it our job, in my opinion, as financial planners is to make people's financial lives better, whatever the starting point.
• 20:16
  SPEAKER_01: So because we're not tied to them to numbers, uh, we're tied to service.
• 20:21
  SPEAKER_01: The great transfer, the great wealth transfer is just something that's going to happen.
• 20:26
  SPEAKER_01: And I think we'll be better placed to to benefit from it because we'll be seen, hopefully, as a firm that um that that gives more, you know, provides more than simply manage my investments and pensions, you know.
• 20:39
  SPEAKER_01: That to me is, I think uh Paul Arm Armison says this quite well.
• 20:43
  SPEAKER_01: Things like that are just tools in the bag.
• 20:46
  SPEAKER_01: You know, financial advice is just a tool in the bag for financial planning.
• 20:51
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that if if that's not your view, if you are focused purely on the financial advice side of things, I I think that um you have you have some challenges ahead.
• 21:02
  SPEAKER_02: So can I just get this right?
• 21:04
  SPEAKER_02: You've got the subscription model, okay?
• 21:07
  SPEAKER_02: That's your model, that's your fee-based model, yeah?
• 21:10
  unknown: Yeah.
• 21:10
  SPEAKER_02: So regardless of how much somebody's investing, they always pay let's say top end, they always pay£150 per month.
• 21:20
  SPEAKER_02: So if they invested 10 million quid, it's always£150 a month.
• 21:24
  SPEAKER_02: That's it, right?
• 21:25
  SPEAKER_01: Whilst they're under 50, yeah.
• 21:27
  SPEAKER_02: Whilst they're under 50 years old.
• 21:29
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 21:29
  SPEAKER_01: So we have um we we will evolve.
• 21:32
  SPEAKER_01: So as I've mentioned, that this is an evolution.
• 21:34
  SPEAKER_01: So we have for over 50s, we've we've made um, you know, retirement um it it it this is a challenge.
• 21:41
  SPEAKER_01: So we um at age 55, your retirement options open up.
• 21:47
  SPEAKER_01: Um so commercially speaking, we need to uh make a decision on when is the best time for people to start thinking about this.
• 21:55
  SPEAKER_01: And we have decided that five years prior to your options opening up.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_01: Um, that's when is that's a good time, that's long enough to be able to start thinking about this.
• 22:04
  SPEAKER_01: And it's it's I guess it a phrase that that um or words that that probably make as much sense are accumulation and decumulation.
• 22:11
  SPEAKER_01: So pre-50, under 50, we'd say accumulation, and post-50, we start thinking about decumulation.
• 22:18
  SPEAKER_01: So we we price slightly different for at the at that level, and that is just that we charge an initial fee.
• 22:24
  SPEAKER_01: Um and it's and it's a flat fee.
• 22:27
  SPEAKER_01: Uh and again, it doesn't matter if you've got a hundred thousand or two million quid, you'll pay the same fee.
• 22:33
  SPEAKER_01: Right.
• 22:34
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but there is a there is an initial fee at that level.
• 22:38
  SPEAKER_01: Longer term, uh, we will be removing that.
• 22:41
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and that's a commercial, a commercial decision that we've made.
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_01: And and it's linked to technology, ultimately, there's more work involved.
• 22:48
  SPEAKER_02: Fantastic.
• 22:49
  SPEAKER_02: And that's where I want to go, really, is to talk about the work involved because you've got a model there that if it takes off, could create a huge amount of work.
• 23:00
  SPEAKER_02: And servicing those clients, you mentioned that each person, um, I think I got this right, on the£100 a month, has a human being that will also interact with them, whether it's coaching or financial planning.
• 23:13
  SPEAKER_02: And I believe that's a face-to-face, whether it's over Zoom or uh face-to-face or whatever it might well be.
• 23:19
  SPEAKER_02: It's you know, it's not an AI bot chatting away to them or a video pre-recorded of somebody or anything like that.
• 23:26
  SPEAKER_02: So how do you account for that then?
• 23:29
  SPEAKER_02: Because the growth of your business, the more subscribers that you have, that's how your business grows in value, right?
• 23:35
  SPEAKER_02: And you want to grow more subscribers.
• 23:37
  SPEAKER_02: So how are you countering that?
• 23:39
  SPEAKER_02: Because if all of a sudden you've got 500 subscribers, great place to be, don't get me wrong.
• 23:44
  SPEAKER_02: Have you got sort of like a business model that buys a certain amount of subscribers, you then hire another financial planner?
• 23:50
  SPEAKER_02: Does it kind of work like that?
• 23:51
  SPEAKER_02: Or how how does it work?
• 23:54
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, yeah.
• 23:55
  SPEAKER_01: We we've um scalability is a big, you know, is going to be a challenge for us.
• 24:00
  SPEAKER_01: Um, and the way that I see it is um that in the background, if it takes 15 to 30 hours, depend, you know, depending on the situation, to build a full financial plan of of of of time uh uh uh uh you know on our side, we need to turn that into seven and a half hours to 15 hours.
• 24:23
  SPEAKER_01: We need to turn it into four hours to eight hours.
• 24:26
  SPEAKER_01: That's our responsibility, that's our challenge, and and we're doing that um bit by bit.
• 24:31
  SPEAKER_01: We're working with a technology firm, Mingi, who are based, I think, in Cambridge.
• 24:36
  SPEAKER_01: And we're doing a lot of work with those guys behind the scenes to work on things like simple things like workflow automation, all the way through to um ultimately um AI generated advice, not client-facing AI, but but just to help shorten that period of time between uh, you know, the research side of things.
• 24:59
  SPEAKER_01: So there's a lot of challenges um on that front.
• 25:01
  SPEAKER_01: And and absolutely, you know, if we get 500 clients tomorrow, we're gonna struggle to deal with that today.
• 25:06
  SPEAKER_01: But that's where we want to get to.
• 25:07
  SPEAKER_01: Um, so yeah, we have a scaling, we have a plan to scale in terms of people, but most importantly, the technology that we need to be working with and alongside has to improve.
• 25:20
  SPEAKER_01: And it and that's something that we're very focused on.
• 25:23
  SPEAKER_02: Where do you think?
• 25:24
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and that's great, and it's great that you I've spoken to Ningi before.
• 25:28
  SPEAKER_02: Um, and I'm I've speaking to quite a lot of different technology companies now when it comes to speeding up and improving like the research suitability letters, the time it takes to deliver advice and not make a fee at the end of it.
• 25:41
  SPEAKER_02: And that's the bit that puts off financial advisors, isn't it, giving advice to the wider generation?
• 25:45
  SPEAKER_02: And you know, the investment of being able to reduce that time will clearly be beneficial to the amount of more people that you can see, right?
• 25:52
  SPEAKER_02: I also see that as being a real benefit to the growth of financial planning because new people that are coming into the profession can work on those clients that aren't traditional financial advice clients.
• 26:03
  SPEAKER_02: So somebody who's quite new can cut their teeth on somebody who's got 10,000 quid to invest, right?
• 26:07
  SPEAKER_02: Because they can do a simplified advice process very, very quickly.
• 26:10
  SPEAKER_02: Um I think that's a real uniqueness to helping a firm grow as well.
• 26:13
  SPEAKER_02: And I think you'll see the benefit of that within your business over the years, um, as long as you dedicate that suppose that time and energy into reducing the time it takes to get the advice and not just focusing purely on the end, the end fee, yeah?
• 26:27
  SPEAKER_02: So I think that's really, really interesting.
• 26:28
  SPEAKER_02: Um do you um think that um the financial planning profession right now, with the technology available, is still behind?
• 26:42
  SPEAKER_02: Or do you think the technology is there to deliver that superior, different service that the consumer requires, i.e., quick access to mobile phone, quick uh cash flow forecasting, real simplified uh financial plans.
• 26:58
  SPEAKER_02: Is it there yet or not?
• 26:59
  SPEAKER_02: Or are you sort of are you playing with it?
• 27:01
  SPEAKER_02: Are you seeing it being that good, or do you think it's got a way to go yet?
• 27:05
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, it has a way to go.
• 27:07
  SPEAKER_01: It has a way to go and business models as well.
• 27:09
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, you know, as I've said, we're we're a young agile business, so we can be, we can play around.
• 27:14
  SPEAKER_01: We can um look, we our our aim is to is to grow our subscription service.
• 27:20
  SPEAKER_01: We we're not reliant on initial fees to keep the business afloat, which is an advantage.
• 27:25
  SPEAKER_01: I accept that the larger, more established financial advice firms have, you know, then they need that initial source of income.
• 27:33
  SPEAKER_01: I would uh flip that and say the challenge for those people is that it's it's a dying model because demographics will will burn that technology, will will get that.
• 27:44
  SPEAKER_01: I think you know that the argument would be that people prefer a personal service.
• 27:48
  SPEAKER_01: That's true, but there's a tipping point.
• 27:50
  SPEAKER_01: People would like a personal service, but not they wouldn't like to pay 3% of their investments in return for it.
• 27:56
  SPEAKER_01: It ain't gonna happen.
• 27:57
  SPEAKER_01: So um that's a challenge for the existing industry.
• 28:01
  SPEAKER_01: My challenge is very different.
• 28:02
  SPEAKER_01: It's it's tech technological, and um on that front, the there is there's a lot of good standalone products.
• 28:10
  SPEAKER_01: We use Voyant for our cash flow forecasting.
• 28:12
  SPEAKER_01: It's still, you know, it's a very good product, but it doesn't um it's not very flexible in terms of integration.
• 28:20
  SPEAKER_01: And integration and double keying is a, you know, it's it's that's a challenge.
• 28:25
  SPEAKER_01: It's not it's not um unique to financial services, but it is a challenge for for all of our businesses, I would say.
• 28:32
  SPEAKER_01: Um so there is there are some good individual products, but the integration and the all-encompassing one-stop shop doesn't exist.
• 28:41
  SPEAKER_01: And when it does, then that will make a big difference.
• 28:43
  SPEAKER_01: And that's something that we're working on with Ningi.
• 28:45
  SPEAKER_02: Do you feel like you were going to get there before anybody else?
• 28:48
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, I uh we have we don't have as much money as some some players in this industry.
• 28:54
  SPEAKER_01: So I I would I I would love that to be the case, but for all I know, you know, some of the big boys may be uh spending a lot of money in the background.
• 29:03
  SPEAKER_01: Um we'll see.
• 29:05
  SPEAKER_01: We'll see.
• 29:06
  SPEAKER_01: I would love to our focus is just really on ourselves and to just to try to get the message out.
• 29:11
  SPEAKER_01: And I think the biggest thing for us is just transforming the the image of the profession, who we can provide a benefit to, and that's everybody, not just people that can you can get paid from.
• 29:26
  SPEAKER_01: Um and just ultimately, you know, making lives better, right?
• 29:34
  SPEAKER_01: So um the technology is a byproduct.
• 29:36
  SPEAKER_01: I can't do that without improving the technology, but I can't do it the other way around because the other way around means that I can't, you know, we we're not gonna change anything, we're just gonna continue doing what we do, charging percentages on investments, and that's not gonna help anybody.
• 29:50
  SPEAKER_01: That's that's just a one one-way ticket to to you know ultimately being defunct and uh un unnecessary.
• 29:58
  SPEAKER_01: So I think that businesses without changing the mindset and the the uh and the and the um business model, it doesn't really matter what technologies they're gonna produce because um you know they're gonna struggle to get people to pay those initial fees in the future.
• 30:16
  SPEAKER_02: When you think about, and this is just my my questions to you, really, but where where do you think your competition will be in the future?
• 30:24
  SPEAKER_02: Okay, so you're a you're a quite an innovative chap, innovative business.
• 30:29
  SPEAKER_02: You're creating a subscription model, you've identified and want to work with the clients that aren't traditionally perhaps or are traditionally financial planning clients, and you're giving them a different level of service at a more affordable rate, which bam, you know, you're gonna win clients in that area.
• 30:46
  SPEAKER_02: But you're also your model is to attract those that aren't traditionally clients of financial planning firms, right?
• 30:52
  SPEAKER_02: Fantastic model.
• 30:53
  SPEAKER_02: Where do you see your challenge, you know, in your your competition in the future?
• 30:59
  SPEAKER_02: Do you see it coming from other financial planning firms, or do you see it coming from um something new, like standalone fintech companies, or do you see it even the a resurgence from the bank, the banks offering this level of service through things as simple as a mobile phone um banking app, Monzos, etc.?
• 31:19
  SPEAKER_02: Where do you see your challenges as a financial planner in that space?
• 31:23
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 31:24
  SPEAKER_01: I I think that um I mentioned earlier that the as standalone offerings, so you know, tax planning, uh investment management, pensions, people can get this information.
• 31:45
  SPEAKER_01: They can get, you know, they can go and find out, they can just Google which is the best, you know, um, you know, you know, which is the best savings product, which is uh what should I if you know, if I'm um if I'm earning X, what tax should I pay?
• 32:01
  SPEAKER_01: How can I mitigate that?
• 32:02
  SPEAKER_01: People can get all of this information, but it's pulling it all together.
• 32:05
  SPEAKER_01: So I think if your focus is one of those things and only one of those things, you've got a challenge.
• 32:10
  SPEAKER_01: And the biggest, the biggest challenger to that is going to be technology, and it is today, but it's just it's gonna get way worse.
• 32:16
  SPEAKER_01: Um uh we've seen you know the chat GPT this week, um, and that's just the beginning, you know, where that ends up.
• 32:24
  SPEAKER_01: I've you know it it's it's gonna blow people's minds.
• 32:28
  SPEAKER_01: Um, we have to work with this stuff and we have to think more broadly in terms of who are we, what are we giving, what are we doing, what value are we providing to our clients?
• 32:39
  SPEAKER_01: And what we do at the moment, I don't think you know, any of us are there yet.
• 32:43
  SPEAKER_01: I think we need to be much, much more.
• 32:45
  SPEAKER_01: Uh, we need to be the glue that brings people's life, you know, that that that makes people's lives better, you know, bringing people together, bringing communities together, uh, getting people um thinking about lifestyle and how can we benefit people's lives in that sense, you know, what what further offerings can we provide?
• 33:04
  SPEAKER_01: And then at the heart of it, having their financial lives, um, that that yes, in isolation, they could get answers to all of these things.
• 33:11
  SPEAKER_01: But I think there's real value in in a human being still, but at an affordable rate level, but you know, hold being the glute that holds it all together.
• 33:21
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that's what a financial planner, some of some of us are there already, but I think that's where financial advisors and financial planners need to be and where they need their heads need to be at.
• 33:31
  SPEAKER_01: Um just providing far more value into people's lives.
• 33:35
  SPEAKER_02: Because in reality, we're seeing it already with ChatGPT, you know, they've just released the like the latest version, although it only goes up to 2000 and like 21.
• 33:44
  SPEAKER_02: But if you do um if you do some research into um anything AI, right?
• 33:49
  SPEAKER_02: So if I searched for AI CV writing, okay, or AI content writing, or any kind of thing that where someone's got a laborious task and they're not very good or confident about it, or they procrastinate on it.
• 34:03
  SPEAKER_02: You search Google now, you'll find somebody's created something that uses ChatGPT.
• 34:09
  SPEAKER_02: They're all using the same thing, aren't they?
• 34:11
  SPEAKER_02: Like ChatGPT, but they've built a product around it.
• 34:15
  SPEAKER_02: So Jasper, for instance, for creating content.
• 34:18
  SPEAKER_02: You know, that's a great example.
• 34:20
  SPEAKER_02: Oh, but there's loads of different content writing softwares, but they all use the same.
• 34:24
  SPEAKER_02: But what they do is create a platform for and and a model where you are using it and it's helping you put the right information into it to get the right results back.
• 34:35
  SPEAKER_02: Does that make sense?
• 34:37
  SPEAKER_01: It does, yeah.
• 34:38
  SPEAKER_02: And in essence, every financial planning firm is at the mercy of AI in the future.
• 34:45
  SPEAKER_02: You're all gonna have exactly the same thing.
• 34:47
  SPEAKER_02: And as it becomes far more uh uh sufficient in being able to pull data and information, you've all got access to the same thing.
• 34:55
  SPEAKER_02: So sooner or later, that AI technology will come into play and it will answer the questions that a human has previously been able to answer, and it will do it a lot quicker and a lot more responsive and way more up to date.
• 35:12
  SPEAKER_02: It's the user experience of how that individual puts that information into that system and how they are then supported to understand what the information is coming back to them.
• 35:25
  SPEAKER_02: And I suppose AI could also do that as well.
• 35:29
  SPEAKER_02: And it's that question: are we going to lose the need for that human interaction and that touch?
• 35:34
  SPEAKER_02: And there's the other areas here, and I think where I'm seeing financial planning firms that are now investing heavily in their branding, they're investing heavily in their marketing.
• 35:44
  SPEAKER_02: And this is where I see a huge opportunity.
• 35:46
  SPEAKER_02: You look at the likes of the financial coaches that are out there, building followings, building influence, right?
• 35:53
  SPEAKER_02: If I was a financial planner and I had a financial planning firm, I would be aiming to build within the rules of financial promotions, I would be aiming to build that following, that influence.
• 36:08
  SPEAKER_02: You know, working with top-level influencers to use my product to say how fantastic their financial well-being is, because New World Group technology has made it so easy for me to reach out and get questions answered.
• 36:23
  SPEAKER_02: That's the space, I believe, that as a financial planner, if they want to be the best in the future, need to get into the ability to A, give advice like you guys are doing, you're creating a simplified subscription process that's accessible to the wider audience, not a super duper niche.
• 36:41
  SPEAKER_02: That will still be there and people will still be able to do the super duper niche stuff because not everybody wants to go down an AI route or whatever, you know, they won't want to do it.
• 36:48
  SPEAKER_02: But having that connection to those individuals that are influential and can be advocates of your product, which is good financial planning, yeah, financial plans, I think that's the future as well.
• 37:03
  SPEAKER_02: It's an area that firms should invest in heavily is brand and is the positioning of that brand within the right culture, subcultures of individuals.
• 37:13
  SPEAKER_02: What are your thoughts on that?
• 37:16
  SPEAKER_01: I I completely agree.
• 37:18
  SPEAKER_01: Uh I think that um, you know, we um we do a lot of workplace presentations and we've been doing them for about 12 months now.
• 37:26
  SPEAKER_01: And the main presentation that we do is about financial planning.
• 37:31
  SPEAKER_01: So it's teaching people the basics of everything from um the inner workings of a pension and what the benefits of that are to budgeting and how to budget.
• 37:42
  SPEAKER_01: So they're they're about 45 minutes long.
• 37:44
  SPEAKER_01: And what we're seeing now is more and more businesses are approaching us.
• 37:47
  SPEAKER_01: I think because of the things that we're talking about, to do well-being presentations, because that is such a, you know, for a conscientious employer, it is such a big deal.
• 37:57
  SPEAKER_01: And that's um, and those presentations are what a traditional financial advisor might think, I don't necessarily want to do that because I'm not going to get much from it.
• 38:08
  SPEAKER_01: And that's about debt management and it's about again budgeting, but it's really about it's it's having that empathy, and and that's what I want to come on to.
• 38:16
  SPEAKER_01: It's about having that empathy of being in a room where people, you know, they're struggling at the moment.
• 38:20
  SPEAKER_01: They don't need to be told where the best investment, what their invest best investment might be or how to start saving.
• 38:27
  SPEAKER_01: They're just trying to get by month month by month.
• 38:29
  SPEAKER_01: We're seeing a lot of in interest from employers on that regard.
• 38:34
  SPEAKER_01: Great for us because we've got a model that we can we can commercially build on that.
• 38:41
  SPEAKER_01: And that's something that we've worked on.
• 38:43
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but but empathy is the key thing here.
• 38:46
  SPEAKER_01: So AI is is gonna be amazing, and I think that in the background, it will benefit us as well, and we need to think like that.
• 38:55
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, it's going into competition, but actually it's gonna make the speed, our process speeds go through the roof.
• 39:02
  SPEAKER_01: So, what opportunities does that present?
• 39:04
  SPEAKER_01: I think if I think if you're worried about AI, and I think a lot of people are, um, I think they just need to rethink a little bit.
• 39:11
  SPEAKER_01: And um, you know, human history shows that um, you know, well, spears were were a challenge to people that couldn't make spears, right?
• 39:20
  SPEAKER_01: But people adapted, and that humans have always adapted, and that's exactly what we will do.
• 39:25
  SPEAKER_01: We'll see the a stand uh an improvement in standard, and really at the heart of that is going to be empathy, because that is the one thing that people won't be able to get.
• 39:36
  SPEAKER_01: Well, we'll see about that, but um certainly in the short to medium term, empathy is something that they won't be able to generate a report on or um a computer um can't provide that.
• 39:50
  SPEAKER_01: So, so that as a business, we need to be empathetic and we need to be marketing our message to a wider audience.
• 39:57
  SPEAKER_01: And at the moment, that's cost of living.
• 39:59
  SPEAKER_01: So, you know, that where that takes us is is gonna be really, really interesting.
• 40:04
  SPEAKER_01: But it certainly goes back to the point of trying to talk to as many people as possible, not trying to just appeal to the people at the top end.
• 40:11
  SPEAKER_01: Um, because I just think that's a really narrow, narrow window that's gonna get more and more narrow.
• 40:16
  SPEAKER_02: And it's also like, you know, it doesn't matter how much money you've got or how successful that you are, you know, we've all we're all a slave really to our habits.
• 40:25
  SPEAKER_02: You know, and some of us have good habits and some of us have bad habits, and we all have got good and all have got bad.
• 40:30
  SPEAKER_02: Um when it comes to finances, there are a lot of bad habits, isn't there?
• 40:34
  SPEAKER_02: You know?
• 40:34
  SPEAKER_02: So it's about getting people to identify what those bad habits are and how and what the triggers are, what the routines are and what the rewards are associated with it, and getting them to change those habits because change doesn't happen overnight.
• 40:46
  SPEAKER_02: You know, it's it takes hard work and hard graft to change, to change your habits that ultimately impact your well-being.
• 40:55
  SPEAKER_02: I know that for years of trying to give in up bloody alcohol, you know, four years now I've not done it.
• 41:01
  SPEAKER_02: But I've I've gradually seen the benefits of changing my relationship with that and the impact it's had, but also how it's then opened me up to recognize all the other habits that I had.
• 41:14
  SPEAKER_02: I thought that was the only problem that I had, and that was it.
• 41:16
  SPEAKER_02: But actually, I've got so many habits that I was unpicking and reprogramming myself and reprogramming myself.
• 41:24
  SPEAKER_02: You know, and actually it was a lot, it took me a lot longer to recognise the money side of it with me.
• 41:30
  SPEAKER_02: I buried it and buried it and buried it.
• 41:31
  SPEAKER_02: I didn't really want to even talk about it.
• 41:33
  SPEAKER_02: Even as a person who's worked within the financial planning profession for so long, I've got access to financial planners, yet I didn't want to talk to financial planners about money.
• 41:42
  SPEAKER_02: So, you know, that's one of the things that needs unpicking.
• 41:46
  SPEAKER_02: And if you've got empathy and if you've got a marketing strategy that can connect with somebody to say, look, let's confront this demon, this thing you're hiding, these beliefs that you've got.
• 41:57
  SPEAKER_02: Let's confront it and let's talk about it.
• 41:59
  SPEAKER_02: Because if you actually do and you change those habits, guess what?
• 42:03
  SPEAKER_02: Your life's going to improve.
• 42:05
  SPEAKER_02: And that's the story, isn't it?
• 42:07
  SPEAKER_02: And that's the that's the pitch.
• 42:09
  SPEAKER_02: And because it doesn't matter if you've got 10 million quid in the bank, you still could be suffering, you know.
• 42:15
  SPEAKER_02: You know, it doesn't matter if you're a top-level business owner or whether or not you've got two or three employees or you're a startup company just working out.
• 42:22
  SPEAKER_02: We've all got those problems and all struggles, and we're all on different stages of our journey.
• 42:26
  SPEAKER_02: And identifying what those problems are, the impact it has on us and our well-being, and the connection between good money management and planning, there lies the secret to building the deeper relationship and therefore a laurel client who wants to pay you a subscription, right?
• 42:42
  SPEAKER_01: Correct.
• 42:42
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, um, you you've kind of hit the nail on the head there, Sam.
• 42:46
  SPEAKER_01: We uh clients that come to see us, we generally try to avoid talking about money for a good 20, 30, 40 minutes.
• 42:56
  SPEAKER_01: Everybody comes with one pain point, you know, and that might be um, you know, I want to retire, or um, you know, I've got some money that I want to invest, whatever it might be.
• 43:07
  SPEAKER_01: But it's our job to help them understand that that's that may be what's brought them here, but it's fixing that one problem isn't necessarily the one thing that's going to change their lives and make everything better.
• 43:18
  SPEAKER_01: We need to understand what the real pain points are, and that that involves empathy and it's life planning ultimately.
• 43:27
  SPEAKER_01: Until we know which direction we need to head in, we can't talk about money.
• 43:31
  SPEAKER_01: It's pointless because we may end up, you know, uh building a strategy that's going the wrong way.
• 43:37
  SPEAKER_01: And and at the same time, I won't, we, you know, we as a business won't look at things in isolation.
• 43:42
  SPEAKER_01: So if somebody says, I would like you to just manage this pot of money, we would say, Well, look, that's fine, but we need we need to know everything.
• 43:52
  SPEAKER_01: We can't ethically look after that pot of money and know that we're doing a good job on it without knowing the full picture, and that includes.
• 44:00
  SPEAKER_01: Includes where you want to end up in life, even if they don't know yet, we can help them unpick it.
• 44:05
  SPEAKER_01: And obviously, these things change, and that's why you need um reviews and things like that.
• 44:10
  SPEAKER_01: So we can do that because our business model isn't dependent on that one thing.
• 44:19
  SPEAKER_01: And I think that's a really, really important thing for the future of the industry.
• 44:22
  SPEAKER_01: There's a lot of, don't get me wrong, we're not the only people doing it this way.
• 44:26
  SPEAKER_01: There's, you know, there's there are some very, very good businesses that are working on this uh financial planning um model, so to speak.
• 44:34
  SPEAKER_01: And um and I think, and this is links back to what I said at the beginning, there's a bit of confusion within the industry about what we are and who we are.
• 44:42
  SPEAKER_01: The people that are doing it this way and are talking to people about their lives and really trying to understand their lives.
• 44:49
  SPEAKER_01: I think, in my opinion, they will win the game.
• 44:52
  SPEAKER_01: And those people, you need empathy to be able to be able to do that.
• 44:57
  SPEAKER_01: And you you talked about people with a lot of money.
• 45:02
  SPEAKER_01: Um absolutely, you know, they've got anxieties.
• 45:06
  SPEAKER_01: Uh you know, money doesn't change lives.
• 45:08
  SPEAKER_01: It is it just it it well, it changes lives, but it doesn't necessarily improve lives.
• 45:13
  SPEAKER_01: You know, people still have um, you know, anxieties and worries, and you know, suddenly you've got a lot to lose, and that's you know, that's a you know, that's something to that's a genuine concern.
• 45:26
  SPEAKER_01: So it doesn't really matter if people have nothing or 10 million quid, you need to have that empathy at both ends of the scale.
• 45:33
  SPEAKER_01: And and going back to your your your point before that, that's I I think I think that's probably going to be the key, the thing that really separates us from our competition and the competition being AI ultimately and and new technologies.
• 45:50
  SPEAKER_02: I like that.
• 45:51
  SPEAKER_02: Thanks very much for summing that up.
• 45:53
  SPEAKER_02: Longgev longevity and health, Sam.
• 45:55
  SPEAKER_02: You know, we've had some good conversations, both you and me.
• 45:58
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, I'm 41 years old, can't quite remember how how old you were, but we're around about the same age, aren't we?
• 46:03
  SPEAKER_02: And um and like a lot of my friends around the same age, we've decided to adopt a healthy lifestyle, whether that's giving up booze, stress management, yoga, ice cold swimming, and going on a vegan diet, whatever it might well be.
• 46:20
  SPEAKER_02: So we become this sort of generation, I think, that are obsessed with living longer.
• 46:25
  SPEAKER_02: We want to live longer, we want to be happier, yeah, however, whatever that means, balanced, and we want to be healthier.
• 46:33
  SPEAKER_02: Um, we live in a world where we talk about what food you should eat, what exercise you should do, and all of that.
• 46:39
  SPEAKER_02: And now we're starting to see the financial impact as well, uh, what that does to us on a, you know, uh on a on an emotional level, etc.
• 46:47
  SPEAKER_02: So we're seeing all of that.
• 46:49
  SPEAKER_02: One of the things I just wanted to briefly touch on is that I genuinely believe that financial planning, good financial planning, good financial management, it lends itself to health.
• 46:58
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it lends itself to being connected to the health industry, connected to whether it's a fitness person or a psychologist or whatever.
• 47:05
  SPEAKER_02: I believe it has a place within there.
• 47:07
  SPEAKER_02: And what a wonderful place to position it if you start to partner and network with those types of uh individuals that are trying to improve people's lives.
• 47:16
  SPEAKER_02: And oh, let me introduce you to Sam Tate, who's got a subscription model who's gonna add um the final piece of the puddle, the thing we don't ever want to talk about, money.
• 47:24
  SPEAKER_02: They're gonna he's gonna help you improve that.
• 47:26
  SPEAKER_02: But more importantly, he's gonna give you peace of mind around where you are on your journey with it, whether you've got 10 million quid to invest or you want to get out of debt.
• 47:36
  SPEAKER_02: Either way, he's gonna solve some of your money worries, which will ultimately give you, you know, a balanced well-being.
• 47:43
  SPEAKER_02: So there's that area there.
• 47:44
  SPEAKER_02: But as I said, you know, we're getting healthier, we want to live longer.
• 47:48
  SPEAKER_02: Now, one of the sort of things that we talked about briefly as well was this retirement, the idea of retirement, what it looks like now.
• 47:57
  SPEAKER_02: If someone was to say retirement, Sam, what's that?
• 47:59
  SPEAKER_02: I'd go, oh, um, um, I quit work at 65 and I go to the beach and I sit on the beach for the rest of my life and all that kind of stuff.
• 48:05
  SPEAKER_02: That's like, you know, the typical type of idea of what retirement actually is.
• 48:10
  SPEAKER_02: Whereas I don't know if it is anymore, you know.
• 48:12
  SPEAKER_02: I want to live.
• 48:13
  SPEAKER_02: I want to live a long, healthy, happy life.
• 48:14
  SPEAKER_02: I want to continue lifting weights until I'm in my 80s.
• 48:17
  SPEAKER_02: I love the idea of living to 100.
• 48:20
  SPEAKER_02: Only if I'm only if I'm healthy, only if I'm mentally healthy and I'm physically healthy, right?
• 48:26
  SPEAKER_02: So I'm doing everything I can to live a mentally fit and healthy, physically fit life.
• 48:33
  SPEAKER_02: Should I be thinking about money?
• 48:35
  SPEAKER_02: Should I be thinking about how am I going to pay for this as I get older?
• 48:39
  SPEAKER_02: Because it's going to run out.
• 48:41
  SPEAKER_02: And like most financial plans are based on this idea that the average age is 86, but with the advancements in technology, with the advancements in healthcare, we're going to be surpassing that.
• 48:50
  SPEAKER_02: And my daughter's six and a half.
• 48:51
  SPEAKER_02: She's probably going to live past 100 years old.
• 48:54
  SPEAKER_02: So, what are your thoughts on that, Sam?
• 48:55
  SPEAKER_02: And what you did about that?
• 48:57
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, um, I think that it's a very common line that financial advisors have used from I've been in the industry 20 years, I've heard it a million times.
• 49:05
  SPEAKER_01: You know, you will start spending less money in your 80s.
• 49:09
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's gonna change.
• 49:11
  SPEAKER_01: Um that is gonna change.
• 49:13
  SPEAKER_01: We need to, you know, the cash flow forecasts that we currently prepare are up to age 100, and we always ensure that there's enough money in the bank at that point.
• 49:20
  SPEAKER_01: That needs to change.
• 49:22
  SPEAKER_01: So there's things that people maybe aren't aware of that are that are happening now.
• 49:26
  SPEAKER_01: Um there's a there's a doctor, Dr.
• 49:28
  SPEAKER_01: David Sinclair at Harvard who's doing some incredible work on epigenomes, uh, epigenetic epigenetics.
• 49:35
  SPEAKER_01: And um, and I don't know if people are ready for this, but but life uh health spans and lifespans are going to raise rise exponentially.
• 49:45
  SPEAKER_01: And um, I could say this and talk about this in detail, and I think a lot of people wouldn't believe me.
• 49:49
  SPEAKER_01: It's one of those things.
• 49:50
  SPEAKER_01: Um, but I what you've just said about lifting weights um till you're 80, yeah, absolutely.
• 49:56
  SPEAKER_01: Marathons at 100.
• 49:57
  SPEAKER_01: And there's there's there's depth to why I'm saying that.
• 50:01
  SPEAKER_01: Uh some of the work that's going on is incredible, and that is gonna change lives.
• 50:06
  SPEAKER_01: And what does that mean to retirement?
• 50:08
  SPEAKER_01: Well, at the moment we have this fixed mindset of well, 65 is my or 65 or 67 is is my retirement age.
• 50:16
  SPEAKER_01: So um, so that that's that's the plan.
• 50:18
  SPEAKER_01: That's what we'll work towards.
• 50:21
  SPEAKER_01: I think that's that's gonna naturally evolve, but I think people need to start thinking about it, and financial advisors and planners absolutely need to start thinking about it now.
• 50:29
  SPEAKER_01: What we're gonna start seeing is people reinventing themselves more and more.
• 50:33
  SPEAKER_01: I think um multiple careers, you know, there'll be a lot of jobs that that um that no longer exist as well.
• 50:39
  SPEAKER_01: So all of this, all of this links together, you know, technologies will take jobs, new jobs will arise.
• 50:44
  SPEAKER_01: Um, a lot of Gen Z and millennials are self-employed and they've got an entrepreneurial sort of um mindset, and I think that will become more and more prevalent.
• 50:56
  SPEAKER_01: And it will just be a natural thing, I think, that um that people reinvent themselves, they don't stop working at 65, they keep working, but the main thing, and this is the this is the main thing, they can and they want to and they're fit enough to do it.
• 51:11
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, going back to the you know, the early 50s when the NHS was formed, they did it something, and and at that time there was a boom in in medicines and treatments, and that was that worked wonders for extension of you know, lifespan extension, but it didn't really do much for health span extension.
• 51:30
  SPEAKER_01: What we're gonna see over the next 10, 20, 30 years is those two things now running alongside each other, and and it's going to fundamentally change the advice that we give, and it's gonna change lives.
• 51:44
  SPEAKER_01: It's gonna be uh I'm very I'm an optimist.
• 51:47
  SPEAKER_01: I think it's a I think it's a really exciting time.
• 51:49
  SPEAKER_01: I think we're at a tipping point of of a lot of things coming together.
• 51:53
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, there's there's a lot of dark things going on in the world, but I think you know, it's sometimes dark as before dawn, and that's kind of what my view is.
• 52:02
  SPEAKER_01: And I think we just have to embrace it and work with it, and I think it will be to our benefit.
• 52:07
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, it's crazy, isn't it?
• 52:08
  SPEAKER_02: Because it's like, you know, you do everything you can to live a long and healthy lifestyle, but actually there's gonna be a bill associated with that.
• 52:14
  SPEAKER_02: There's gonna be a cost to doing so, and where's that cost gonna come from?
• 52:17
  SPEAKER_02: Um, it's a very interesting subject, and that's why I do genuinely believe that health, fitness, well-being is intrinsically linked to money as well, and that everything we do, the longer we live, there's gonna there's gonna be a cost associated to it, right?
• 52:34
  SPEAKER_02: And but we shouldn't be sort of negging that.
• 52:36
  SPEAKER_02: We shouldn't then be negging the whole kind of looking after yourself and being healthy and taking advantage of the advancements in technology.
• 52:42
  SPEAKER_02: I mean, some of these things are gonna be outside of our hands anyway.
• 52:44
  SPEAKER_02: Individuals that are unhealthy are still gonna live for a very long time, and then there's that process of like, crikey, if you are gonna live for a very long time, and the law states that you can't just go turn off a bloody uh life support machine or end your own life or whatever you want to do, you've got to you've got to pay for it.
• 53:01
  SPEAKER_02: I was chatting to a friend of mine actually yesterday, he's an investment manager, his dad's very wealthy.
• 53:05
  SPEAKER_02: Um, he was like an HR manager for one of the top private banks in Switzerland, and he had like shares and all sorts and millions, you know, multi- multi-millionaire.
• 53:13
  SPEAKER_02: I mean he said, like, you know, and we were having this conversation, he's 40, and we my friend was like, Gary, yeah, in a way, mate, you've got as much money, you don't have to worry, you know, you don't have to worry about anything.
• 53:24
  SPEAKER_02: And it's like, well, not if you think about it this way, because if if he wants to go into a home, right, care home fees, and they could be a hundred grand a year, it soon it it soon adds up.
• 53:37
  SPEAKER_02: And there is this again, advancement in health.
• 53:40
  SPEAKER_02: The guy's got a fair bit of cash, therefore, you can throw a bit of money at things that he can fix.
• 53:46
  SPEAKER_02: So he could go on for a long, long time.
• 53:48
  SPEAKER_02: So even these individuals that are sitting waiting for a dead man's shoes, you know, perhaps shouldn't.
• 53:54
  SPEAKER_02: And actually should be getting the hell on with their lives and enjoying it and making the most of it themselves to the generation wealth that are sitting there thinking I'm going to inherit a load of money.
• 54:02
  SPEAKER_02: You might be wishing away your life.
• 54:04
  SPEAKER_02: You might be waiting for dead man's shoes, and you might be missing out on your own enjoyment and life if you're putting all that value on the money you're going to inherit, because it might not come at the time you think it is to get the hell on with your life.
• 54:14
  SPEAKER_02: And it was a really interesting conversation that we had about it, you know.
• 54:17
  SPEAKER_02: And it's again, it's about reframing this idea of what money means to you and what you think's coming to you.
• 54:22
  SPEAKER_02: And if it does come to you, is it going to improve my life, or is it just a matter of fact of getting on with it and enjoying yourself is the main thing.
• 54:28
  SPEAKER_02: And I like what you guys are doing there at New World.
• 54:31
  SPEAKER_02: It's teaching people about look, here's good financial management.
• 54:34
  SPEAKER_02: It's not overly complicated, right?
• 54:36
  SPEAKER_02: You've just got to get your head around it and you've got to implement it, and you've got to build a good habit around your spending, you've got to build a good habit around your saving, and you've got to understand also that bad, poor money management is and can be responsible for poor mental fitness and health, right?
• 54:53
  SPEAKER_02: And I like what you guys are doing, and that's what I would want to be a part of.
• 54:58
  SPEAKER_02: You know, I've already told you like I'm I'm interested in financial planning companies, you know, and those are the ones this is the type of company that interests me because you care deeply about creating solutions to the problems that are hurting society, and you're doing it in a really affordable way, and you're doing it for free to some of those people, which I think is admirable, you know, and that will only come back.
• 55:24
  SPEAKER_02: Do good good things come back.
• 55:25
  SPEAKER_02: So I'm all over that, Sam.
• 55:28
  SPEAKER_02: Sam, I'm gonna bring this to a bit of a close today, but it's been a fantastic conversation.
• 55:33
  SPEAKER_02: Thank you for sharing as well, because you've you have shared quite deeply about your business and you know, and you weren't scared to do it, which to me says you're confident about what you're creating, and also as well that you want others to do the same.
• 55:47
  SPEAKER_02: So, again, you know, thank you so much for that, Sam.
• 55:50
  SPEAKER_02: And um we wish you all the best here at the Financial Panel Life with the future of New World.
• 55:55
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you, Sam.
• 55:56
  SPEAKER_01: I think it's just important.
• 55:57
  SPEAKER_01: I think it's important because we can't do this on our own.
• 56:00
  SPEAKER_01: And um, financial advisors, financial planners need to uh, you know, need to look beyond the next 12, 24 months, you know.
• 56:10
  SPEAKER_01: Um so we want to, you know, ultimately what's our our aim it's it's to bring better, you know, make financial lives better across the board.
• 56:21
  SPEAKER_01: Now we can't do that on our own.
• 56:23
  SPEAKER_01: So yeah, hopefully, um hopefully we've opened a few eyes.
• 56:28
  SPEAKER_01: And um and I I feel like we haven't even touched the surface.
• 56:32
  SPEAKER_01: So it's been great to chat to you though, Sam.
• 56:34
  SPEAKER_01: I've really enjoyed it.
• 56:35
  SPEAKER_01: Thanks for thanks for having me on.
• 56:37
  SPEAKER_02: No worries, thanks for time.