Latest / Rooted & Real With Keenan / My Conversation with David Chametzky: From Darkness to Resilience
Transcript
- Keenan: What does it actually take to rebuild your life after grief, a suicide attempt, major life transitions, and years of caring pain you thought you already had overcome? In this episode of Rude and Rule Akeenan, I sit down with David Cheminsky, suicide survivor, mental health, wellness, mental wellness advocate, author, speaker, certified peer recovery advocate, and the host of Peace, Love, and Bring It Bat podcast. For an honest conversation about mental health, resilience, grief, therapy, faith, community, and what recovery really looks like. David shares how the sudden death of a woman he planned to marry affected him for decades. How unresolved grief and survivor guilt resurfaced years later. And what he learned after reaching one of the darkest moments of his life. We talk about the difference between simply knowing what is good for your mental health. And actually doing it, putting it into action, why self-awareness matters, how therapy journaling can help us confront the monsters in our heads, and why the right community can make a difference in an enormous way when life becomes heavy. We also explore personal responsibility and mental wellness, navigating change, transition, and learning to accept support instead of always being the person who gives it, and the role of faith and gratitude. Can play in rebuilding a meaningful life. David's story is not about pretending that the painful experiences disappear. It's about learning how to face them differently. If you've ever struggled with grief, hopelessness, isolation, major life changes, or the feeling that you should have gotten over something by now. This is a conversation and a reminder that healing is possible. Resilience can be developed, and sometimes the first step. Forward is simply being willing to have the honest conversation. Suicide is mentioned in this episode. So if this is a trigger warning for you, please know that we are being trying to be sensitive with this. And also, if you have thoughts of hurting yourself, hurting someone else, please call go to your emergen I can't talk. Go to your emergen nearest emergency room, call 911, or if you need more support, call 988. Which is the suicide hop. Hey David, thank you so much for you know fitting us in, your busy schedule. And I'm excited to have you on today, for sure. Dave: Well, thank you for the opportunity. You know, I I at this point and we've already spoken a few times, I'm honored to be on your show. But I you know, I I I love telling my story a little bit, but also the story keeps growing and you're a person who who I've met along the way that I enjoy their story and I just wanna support you any way that I can. Keenan: Yes, for sure. Thank you so much. so ask everybody the same question, kick things off. like every good story, David, what is your story? And like every good story, it's important to start from the beginning. So where does your story begin? How do you become who you are today? Dave: Well, it's like that Campbell h hero's journey in in a lot of ways. You know, started I was born on an air force base in in San Antonio, Texas. my my dad was about to get out of the air force. then came back to Brooklyn, you know, really blue collar lifestyle. My family were, you know, blue collar Keenan: Mm-hmm. Dave: and hard working, did what they could they could to raise a family. I you know, have a sister, have a younger sister. you know, always challenges in our lives that we that we experience, or at least that's how us as children experience. Keenan: For sure, for sure. Dave: and then, you know, I I've gone through life. I'm in in my early twenties, well my my late nineteen my late teens, early twenties, I bust the woman that I was going to marry, by a drunk driver. Keenan: Hmm. Yeah. Dave: over over sort of overcame that and we could talk about that a little bit later. then I got married, got divorced, had two children, you know, work corporate America for, you know, thirty plus years. I also work in I also had some side business with mental wellness. And that's why when you were looking for guests, I was like, man, I not only have I overcome resilience on the human side, on the the Dave side, but I also have l have learned and helped others get through their own mental wellness and how to overcome some of those things. I'm I'm not a therapist, so I don't play one on T V, but I I know some resources where I could help out a little bit and then if not, Keenan: Sure. Dave: hand them back to somebody like you, who can do some things that I I'm not allowed to do, right? Stay in your lane. and then, you know, I you know, at my corporate America career just recently ended, about three years ago. Keenan: Mm-hmm. Dave: I I was asked to leave with ten thousand other close colleagues. Keenan: man. Dave: of a company. You know, Keenan: Yeah. Dave: that's corporate downsizing. It didn't come out to me as a surprise, though Keenan: Okay. Dave: it allowed me to pivot in in a way. And I was running a company for two and a half years until this past April when I had a a heart scare. And, you know, we'll we'll Keenan: Hmm. Yeah. Dave: talk about that as well, that we sometimes don't know the undertow, you know, a and what happens to our bodies. And sin I could tell you as of this morning, I'm down twenty five pounds. I've eliminated twenty five pounds. I'm in great shape. on my on this Keenan: All right. Yeah. Dave: recent trip. There are a couple of days I've been ten thousand steps each one of those days and it's been great. life life is life is wonderful. I I I am blessed on so many levels. Keenan: For sure. So you mentioned, you know, you mentioned like mental wellness and a crisis that happened with someone you were gonna marry. And then even this this heart scare. I mean I mean there's one there's one that I know we've talked about that you didn't mention. Like how did Dave: yeah. A suicide attempt. Yeah, yeah. I a and by the way, you know, like so you know so if all that other stuff wasn't I'm you know, I I'm my own worst enemy, as we all are at times. And Keenan: Sure, sure. Dave: yeah, I and I I I I sorry, I wa I'm not in intentionally skipping over that. Keenan: you're good. Dave: that was almost seven years ago. So at the end of s September, it'll be seven years that I attempted that. And I you know, I was like, Man, I had a good life. I mean, with all those things, even the loss of Sandy, that that that girlfriend, I had a nice life. I got to see a lot of things. I'm out, man. If I'm the one who's causing some problems, I'm out. And that was what I thought about. And, you know, since that point, man, my life is better. I I've built better and, you know, resilience is a real thing. And man, Keenan: Mm-hmm. For sure. Yeah. Dave: I I just I I do love my life. I don't have everything I want. Keenan: Sure. Dave: that's a human piece but Keenan: Yeah. Dave: I am blessed beyond you know, everytime I I wake up almost every morning, thank you God for another day to do your service and and that's how I Keenan: Sure. Dave: believe it. Keenan: Yeah, amen to that for sure. So it seems like these these instances happen at different points in your life where you had different pieces of of wisdom or things you've learned. Like, I mean, how when Sandy died from that drunk driver, like how what was that whole grieving process like? What was that like as someone in the beginning of all this? Dave: Well so so the the the grieving process was horrible. I in fact the grieving process lasted thirty five years, which I didn't know in the Keenan: Yeah. Dave: by pushing it down. you know, I you know, I did get I did get over it in in some ways and and and in some ways I'm still not over it and we'll talk I'll I'll since you're asking. So when she first died, you know, it w it was horrible. Devastation. I didn't want I I I didn't know how I was gonna get up. I was about to I almost bought a ring and there was only Keenan: Mm. Dave: one other person in the world who knew about it. It was her brother and who was again one of the nicest gentlemen that the I I I I wish he was here to to to see where I'm at now, man. I I might Keenan: Absolutely. Dave: not have had my problems. I might not have gone to a suicide attempt, if I had a role model or somebody like that that I can lean on. Keenan: Mm-hmm. Dave: yeah, definitely. just even thinking about Brian. but so you with Sandy, so you know, don't worry, you're young, you'll get over it, blah bah bah, right? That's what they tell you. They tell Keenan: Yeah. Dave: you and yes, I g I I was young and I did get over it in some ways. But Keenan: Mm. Dave: during the pandemic I was going through another it was right after the suicide attempt. So I was alone, right? The worst part that you know, that they had to do, but I'm a little different. worst part was to leave me alone, but they Keenan: Yeah. Dave: We had to leave me alone, right? Everybody had to. It I needed to cook differently. And among the cooking differently was one day I was reading poems I wrote for Sandy, which was in the book b you see behind me, or there was discussions about Sandy. And I broke out into like dirty crying. And you know what I mean by dirty crying is uncontrol but it it happened almost like you breathe, like you don't pay attention when you take a deep breath. Came out that quickly and snotty and like I'm like, where the hell did this come from? And Keenan: Mm. Dave: I I called my therapist. I I had already been in therapy n you know, I didn't use him that often at that point, but I was like, okay, WTF. I don't you know be respectful Keenan: Right. Dave: of your show. You know, like what just happened here? Like I was fine. I was reading a you know some poems and boom what do you do? How do Keenan: Yeah. Wow. Yeah. Dave: I do it? What do I go on? And I was like, okay, but I'm over it. I like I I've been married. I have kids. I'm I'm like, you know, I'm older. I'm almost I'm fifty at that point. Like, what Keenan: Right. Dave: are you talking about? This happened it when I was in my twenties, thirty-five years ago. You know, like, hello what the and it's something they call survivor guilt. Yeah, I'm sure you're you know you're familiar with it, but that's why we need to find ways to heal it while we're doing it versus survivor guilt or some of the other challenges we have and having those conversations is so important. And I didn't know that, truthfully. You know, you Keenan: Right, for sure. Yeah. Sure. Dave: know, the things we don't know, we don't know. there's a lot of things I didn't know that I'm embarrassed that I I didn't learn until I was in my 50s. I'm glad that I've learned them, but I'm embarrassed at times to be like, how'd I not know self-awareness? Like I just thought everybody knew that I they knew what was in my heart. mouth got me in trouble at times. And and through my own challenges that I've experienced, you know, yeah, I get loud a little bit. Well, not everybody likes loud, right? And Keenan: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Dave: and and and what are you saying when you're loud? Like I'm not violent. like I always say, the the only person who could ever say, probably in the past forty years that I've hit them was my sister when I was about twelve. Keenan: Sure. Yeah. Dave: you know, you know, you know, sibling type of thing. you know Keenan: Yeah. Yeah. Dave: never hit an ex wife, never, you know, viol I even my children, they could say I I might have had a sharp tongue and and things that were inappropriate, especially from their point of view. but, you know, people could say that. You know, I I I'm guilty as charge for that. I I didn't Keenan: Mm-hmm. Dave: learn some of those things. But violence, I I I'm not that's not a a Dave thing. Keenan: Yeah. Yeah. So I mean, you know, a lot of people can kind of hear what you're saying and echo, like, yeah, I just sort of suppressed it, pushed it down, Dave: Yeah. Keenan: felt like it was gone. And then this like trigger of reading letters, survival guilt comes up. Like someone hearing that, I would imagine could hear that and be like, my gosh, like that happened to me. I mean, what do you what do you think they need right now? Dave: Yeah, one hundred percent. All all the things that have happened to me happen to most people. You know, I I I'm I mean, again, statistically, you might know the statistics better than I do about suicide, right? We hear about people being successful, but most people are unsuccessful with the attempts, which adds more shame. I mean, you know, then there's multiple attempts and I you know but most people, eighty nine percent if I remember the the numbers correctly are unsuccessful. It's only a a a a small percentage, but it's like memes in in in social media, and I'm not meaning it to to undermine the the significance. It's like, you see a meme, so we can respond quickly. it's it's not. It it's much deeper. And that's where society that's why I want to be on podcasts like yours, have podcasts like mine, that where we get to talk about it to hear regular people, not just the the the s the the survivors. I wanna make sure that people know it, get comfortable around it, so we can talk about it, to heal ourselves, to say, you know, hey, I'm just not feeling well. Like during the pandemic, I I told people truthfully when they said, Hey, how are you doing today? Yeah, today's not a good day And I go, I'm safe. So I made sure that I reiterated that. You know, that's a conversation that people don't wanna hear. And i i it's sad, but It's true. that we need to have conversations like this and, you know, the rusted root and and those things. You know, we we gotta look at those rusted roots in in our life to say is it something that we could is salvageable or is it something that we just need to rebuild with a better ro a better root, you know, or or taking care of the root. Just because it's rusted doesn't mean it's it's bad if it's strong or trees and things like that. Keenan: Yeah, yeah. So I mean, I guess having these conversations can make people uncomfortable. However, I would agree that it is a necessary thing that we need to do to talk about what's going on and how we're feeling. But on the flip side, it's important for us to be truthful about it. Now, I mean, how hard was that for you when you weren't having a good day? 'Cause you just kind of did it now, kind of nonchalantly, but like What's going on inside of you when people ask you back then, like, how are you doing? It's not a good day. Like, what are those feelings like? Dave: Yeah, so those feelings, I mean, again, the feelings today when it's not a good day are different than the feelings then. So we we grow through it. I found healing techniques, I found ways to do it. I had all the healing techniques. Let's I wanna be also honest. I was helping people through some mental wellness challenges before. I wasn't doing it myself. Keenan: Mm. Dave: So, you know, I call it the Icta disease. I know that already. I like using acronyms. I know that already. Right? Keenan: Mm-hmm. Dave: Hey, you know, I know that. I I I know what I have to do. Well, I also knew that I didn't have to eat Big Max, but I did, and it eventually caused me a heart situation. So knowing it and doing it are two separate things. I mean, that's when, you know, I'm proud of myself and I'll celebrate that I reduced twenty five pounds as of this morning as I got on the scale. Keenan: Right. Yeah. Dave: Not with a GLP one and and I'm not about to Have those conversations. You know, health i is is important and it's very personal, but I did it on my own. I know Keenan: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Dave: what it took to do what I needed to do. And the same thing with my mental wellness. I knew what I needed to do. So again, in the pandemic, reading those stories burst me out crying. I then Keenan: Mm. Dave: sought my therapist to like, just keep point me in the right direction. survivor guilt. Okay, now I know what I have to look at. for survivor guilt. And how, you know, not and there's no one way to do it, but I knew how to be my best client, to be the best person to take care of myself and then look for resources when I did. I started acupuncture. In fact, I Keenan: Mm-hmm. Dave: that was where I just came back from. You know, people go to the work. I go, well, one, it's a it's a technique that's three, four thousand years old. Yeah, probably it works. you know, But I know when I walk in and I usually feel good, especially now, but I know when I walk out I feel so much better. Keenan: Yes. Dave: And, you know, part of it is the people that I'm I go to see, right? So it's that doesn't work. I went to one person, it didn't work, and some of it is our mindset. And that's where I work so hard on myself with my mental wellness and I because of that self awareness that I didn't have. I didn't know that when my shoulders hurt that we carry that was one of the locations I I carry the weight of the world, as we all know about. So there's a lot of things that I'm now much more self aware and how I move things differently than I had in the past. So, you know, I think that's really where you you're going for it is finding the resources that work for me. I mean I'm I'm a published author, so I do a lot of writing. When I'm going through some things, I you know, besides journaling, I'll like, okay, What would I want? You know, wha what what's the s how do I want the story to go? And the stories aren't about me, but it's people like me. you I'll I I'll I'll tell you a funny story. So I when I was in the in the darkness, right after that that November, I came up with this story and I I was like, I need a movie of this. I need like i I I can picture it as a movie. Keenan: Yeah. Dave: Yeah, I don't have an extra two hundred K laying around. I don't know if you do, and we can make it a movie. I'll I'll partner with. but I did have enough money to create a comic book and a high end comic book telling my story. And Keenan: Mm. Dave: where I'm going with this, w I moved into a new house around the time of the suicide right after the suicide attempt. I mean, my life completely blew up, other than my my career, but my my personal life blew up in in ways that I don't wish anybody to have that happen. I'm sitting here writing and I got this comic book and again we're we're blessed. There's pe there's angels that walk among us. One of my angels is my i is my next door neighbor well across the street, Connie. She's a ninety-seven. Keenan: Yeah. Dave: Well, right now she's ninety-seven. So she was in her nineties that she was worried about this s single man living across from her. And she'd call me up and be like, Hey, how would you like an extra pasta on Sunday night? she's an Italian woman. And she would give me a little pasta. I didn't need the pasta, but she kept on coming. And you know, she wouldn't go she wouldn't go away, you know. Keenan: Right. Yeah. Dave: at the beginning as I wanted her to. But now I I just you know, she she she's a mom, grandma, well she's a great great grandmother. I mean, I can't even be begin think about that, but she's a friend of mine. Keenan: Right. Yeah, sure. Dave: And yes, she'll give me still pasta and I go, Connie, I'll come to visit you if you don't give me pasta. Don't work extra hard because of anything. But those are the things that show up when we allow people into our our and she wouldn't let me repay that kindness. So I wrote a book for her, and she goes, You made you put me on a pedestal. I don't belong on a pedestal. I go, You do in my world and I and and for the rest of my life I won't have a Sunday night. Well I I don't think about Connie. You know, I I I'm realistic. hopefully I have more Sunday nights than than she does, unfortunately. But there won't Keenan: Hm. Yeah. Dave: be a Sunday night that I won't be like, Man, you know, five o'clock, I know Connie, I gotta be there five o'clock, you know. Keenan: Right. Yeah. It's amazing that she recognized that, like, what you needed. Like she recognized what you needed and knew what how to and knew what she could do. Dave: And and and she she needed it also because even though she has a family, she has, you know, like twenty, thirty great grandchildren and grandchildren and and and and they don't come around often. The and they do. They're a loving family. They're a wonderful family. But when you're ninety seven, you want them all the time. Right? So my parent my children don't live home anymore, you know, I I I I I wanna hear from them every day. I want I want them Keenan: Yeah. Dave: You know, last night I got to celebrate my recent trip with my two girls. and they Keenan: Yeah. Dave: were, you know, really not paying attention, but I got to sit and and be with them and and share some things with them. That's what we all want. And Keenan: Yeah. Dave: so I I was blessed i in in so many ways for those Keenan: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Dave: things. And that's what Connie wants. So she also has me as part of the family and you know, Keenan: For sure. Dave: she goes, Don't tell my my my kids and they all know. You know, because when when it when there's a snor storm that they some live closer, I go, Don't worry about it. I got it. Like it you know, anything that happens, let I'll I'm there. Like, don't worry. Keenan: For sure. Yeah. How important is that to have? So it seems like when you were in the darkness, if I'm if I'm putting this together, like when you were in your darkest moment, you were pretty isolated, alone, experiencing this sadness. And now, and even in that part of your story of with Connie, like she was part of your community, like certain you guys were serving each other. Like, how important is that distinction to have community? versus not having community in as far as mental wellness goes. AI Avatar - Keenan Number 2: Feeling overwhelmed, anxious, disconnected, or just stuck. I'm Keenan Crowley, a registered mental health counselor intern, and I work with children, teens, adults, couples, and families across Florida. My approach is practical, down to earth, and focused on helping you understand what's going on, build real coping skills, and make meaningful changes in your everyday life. I offer in-person counseling in Orlando and Longwood, as well as virtual sessions throughout Florida. I'm currently accept accepting new clients. If you've been thinking about starting counseling, this may be a good time to take that first step. You can learn more about me and my approach through my Psychology Today profile or reach out to schedule a consultation. Dave: Yeah, that's a great question. Community is important. I mean l let's put it this way, you know, no matter what you're going through, but also you have to allow them. I haven't Keenan: Hm. Yeah. Dave: always I haven't always been good to receive. You know, Keenan, you got a problem? I'll be right there. I gotcha. You th that that's my personality. But I haven't been able to receive that or even ask for stuff. So again, suicide attempt, there was a few people who who called on me regularly and My friend Stacy to this day, that's seven years, almost seven years out. You know, we still every morning, even when I travel, good morning, Stacey. Good morning, you know, and and and now nobody worries about that, right? There there's statistics about that. So there's a few friends that I show up in their lives. Hey, good morning, beautiful. How are you doing? Have a great day. That might be the only conversation I have, but there's a com there's a there's statistics about that. Having the community, having the right community. And being willing to reach out to that community when needed. There's a power Keenan: Yeah, for sure. Dave: in there. I part of my confidence is to hey, I'm not perfect. I I have my and and my people know my my weaknesses, you know, my flaws. And and and that's okay also. But having Keenan: Yeah, for sure. Dave: the community and knowing your resources. That's why I would say you want to go through it yourself, you can. I I I did a lot of the work myself because I I had learned resources. It's just stuff that I don't want to talk to people about. And I and I respect that. You know, a lot of the methods that I talk o when I when I assist people, you don't have to tell me anything. We could still work on ways to heal without talking, as long as you're willing to accept. I think exp again with my si with my thing. Look, I'm embarrassed that I attempted suicide. you know, I I I in in two in in one way I I tried it twice. One time a little half ass, right? you know, th the the last time seven years ago you know I researched like I was like I I want this to to work. Obviously it didn't and I'm thrilled that it didn't work. So I I want to also tell people you know all the things that that that have happened to me in the past seven years. You know, I've been a TEDx speaker. I've published Keenan: Yeah. Dave: several books. I have a podcast, a top one percent podcast in the world. Keenan: Yeah. Dave: you know, by listen notes, not just because I say so. You know, like I have facts that that base it man, none of that would have happened. And I know that from my TEDx talk, you know, people are cruel. People are still cruel in in life. So my my performance wasn't that great. it was in an empty room because it was COVID. It was also during COVID. Keenan: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Dave: And you had to pretend that there was a a room full of people. Well, I wasn't so good about that. And also, to be honest, in the morning I woke up I was prepared. But then I I talked myself out of it. Right. Our biggest enemy is the one between our ears. That's Keenan: I mean Yes. Dave: six inches. That's where we a lot of battles are lost. And I lost it that day because I was like, now once I say it, it's out in the world and I can't take it back. Much like this morning I talked about Israel and right, that's a hot bed topic. Keenan: Mm-hmm. Dave: And I was I've been relatively quiet until I attend I I I was there and I see and I got to speak to people. I educated myself in a different way. You Keenan: Yeah. Yeah. Dave: know, that's where we have to do that. Have that education, have those conversations. So I lost that battle that day, but I still won the war. And let me explain to you what that meant. Keenan: Mm-hmm. Dave: Go on now, you look Dave Szymetsky, TEDx, you're gonna like, that isn't a TEDx talk. Well the talk is. The the the words performance wise, nah. No. but the greatest part is having been on podcasts like this, people have reached out, they've they they went to go look at it, especially at the beginning. I used to send everybody there. Well, I had eleven families that reached out to me. Eight Keenan: Wow. Dave: people who were thinking about suicide, who I was able to either offer up some resources that I used or got them to professionals like you that I said, look, this is it's out of my you know, above my pay grade. I I don't feel qualified to do that. And especially then, I wasn't as qualified as I am now. You know, Keenan: Yeah. Dave: I'm still not a therapist, so I still would push people in a serious situation to go to a therapist. But now I can handle it. I know how to do some things. And but but those eight Keenan: Yeah. So I'm curious. Dave: family th th those eight people And their families, that that butterfly. And for the three out of that eleven, there's also people who family members were successful. And they just wanted to understand my mindset. And I always would say, This is my story, not your family members. I don't know why your family. I I don't wanna I don't want you to feel, now I understand somebody else. I only understand but I understand the pain, the darkness that that person went through. And it's not that we wanna die. I I don't I don't know that everybody you hear plenty of stories of jumping off a bridge and the second they jump or they the once they've gone almost too far, they go, man, I shouldn't have done that. I was very comfortable in my in my sp i in my situation. But I don't know everybody's situation. Keenan: Yeah. So I'm I'm curious to know, you know, ever obviously everyone's story around this is different, you know. looking back on it now, where there red flags for you like like in the beginning of you thinking about suicide, or were there the things in the middle, and then what was it like after? Dave: Again, it was it was a situation where my personal life was blowing up in a way that I didn't see happen. So it was when the when you know we come up with all these different diagnoses. So, you know, after a suicide attempt, you need to go to a psychiatrist and one you know, and I was willing to do anything. I you know, again, I knew how to create wellness plans. I created a rap plan. I don't know if you're familiar with the rap wellness plans. So I created Keenan: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Dave: a rap wellness plan. For Dave. And I I assigned people to be observant of what my behaviors were. But I also was observant that I didn't want to be on medication the rest of my life. And again, I'm not going to s suggest if you need medication, do what's best for you. I I don't want to make any I'm not a doctor. But I knew that I had to go into some of that darkness. And the only way I was going to be able to do it is with a clearer head and not to feel that. what many people experience that numbness. I didn't want to feel numb. I wanted to feel better and healed. Keenan: Yeah. Right. Dave: And and that's that's a you know, know, and I was willing to go back if it wasn't working. I wanted to try it my way. And that's it's scary. You know, it i i it was scary to to try to figure it out, but I knew I had the resources. You know, I'd been here in years for years it when I was working in the mental wellness space. Hey man, you're different than everybody else. Keenan: Mm. Dave: but what was I going through? I was going through some personal stuff, a divorce. and I didn't know how to handle transitional disease, right? That's what they diagnosed me with. Keenan: Yeah. Mm-hmm. Dave: most people don't, right? Transition. Humans don't like transition. Animals don't like transitions, right? Right? Keenan: Yeah. We don't change. Yeah. Yeah. Dave: A f a a fish, you gotta prepare the w the the tank before you come in. And same thing with people. So when you don't know those things. not knowing how to do that. So, you know, I've learned the resources. I've also wasn't self-aware. So I I I I now are I'm able to decide differently. I'm able to see things differently, experience things differently. I've since then I've gone through some really dark periods where I didn't allow myself to think that again. So, you know, people I've I've been asked that question. How do you know you're not gonna go back there? You know, almost you know, people we need to learn better language around around things like that. But I Keenan: Sure, absolutely. For sure. Dave: know I won't go back there because I know the darkness. I know what it felt. Now, will I have go through some tremendously painful things? Sure, I've done that. And might there be tremendously painful things in my life in the fo in the future? Yeah, probably also. I Keenan: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Dave: I learn how to manage them as best as I can. And I also know that, you know, so I had this heart scare in April of this past year. Keenan: Yeah. Wow. Dave: And you know, I I I had the coming to Jesus, even though I'm a Jewish faith, I I I I had that moment with God where I said, you know, can you teach me what I'm supposed to learn? I'm not that smart. not a poor me situation. You know, I was like, why is this happening to me? I did say those words, but not in a poor me situation. Like, God, what am I supposed to I'm I know I'm missing something. Okay, eating healthier, check. Like I guilt you know, like I know that. Like that's the easy thing. That's not what you're trying to teach me. That you could have taught me by, you know, making McDonalds go bankrupt. Like that's e you know, that would have been that would have been easy. There was other lessons that I needed to learn. And and also I was working a job. After my corporate career, I was I I loved my friend Morris. He he hired me to run his company and for two and a half years I I did the best I could. but it was Keenan: Yeah, for sure. Dave: stressful. We we we were still struggling and you know, it's a very difficult business. It's a wonderful business, but it's a difficult business and I was commuting a lot and Keenan: Mm-hmm. Dave: it was not healthy for me. So Keenan: Yeah. Dave: I Scott, I I I know you want me to leave as I had been talking about I can't wait to get out of this. I can't wait to get out of this. I couldn't find a way out, right? You have a friend that you to this day I still talk we s we spoke this morning. and I I I I I didn't wanna leave Morris. I I would never I wanted to leave the the place i in in better flowing than I than I did. And and we d and I did. But you know, when I said I I I walked away, I I walked away. And Keenan: Yeah. Dave: there's some power in that. Keenan: Yeah. Dave: And and and I've been, you know, doing this book writing, you know, the executive coaching. That's really what my passion is, Keenan: Yeah. Dave: what brought me. And I I would have done it half ass, if I'm being honest. Keenan: Yeah, for sure. Dave: and and not that the clients would have got half ass work. I just would have been like, all right, I'll fit this into my schedule. Now this is what I do. the between the charity Keenan: Yeah. Absolutely. Dave: work with the philanthropy, the the goons for good, and all of these things, that's what I've been doing since for the past four months. and people are like, man, what what are you doing? Who who who'd you meet? Where where where's that girl? I Keenan: Yeah. Dave: haven't seen you this happy in years. And I go, Keenan: Wow. Yeah. Dave: Man, I I I'm I I I'm here, I just went on a trip where where mostly couples were there. We were ch we' traveling in the in the Holy Land and doing some some real good work. And Keenan: Yeah. Mm-hmm. Dave: I was alone at times, you know, some by choice, which I which I just need space. Again, that self awareness. I wanted to be introspective of of the situation, not just, man, that's beautiful, that this is cool. I wanna make sure that I'm grateful. Right now I'm I'm much more grateful. I know it's a it's a thing we say, but to really have it in our heart. I mean again, I I'll go, you know, try not to be too religious, but you can't fool God. I could fool you, Keenan. I could be like, no matter what's going on, if in my heart I'm not happy and I don't want to be in this podcast, I could fake it. Right. You could fake it till you make it, right? But you can't Keenan: Yeah, for sure. Dave: fake it with yourself. And that's goes back to the mental health. I couldn't fake what Dave did. Unintentionally, right? The so the be the poor choices I made unintentionally. This the the the lack of self awareness. Yeah, those are things that things I said, things I did. Hell yeah. Guilt guilty as charged and Keenan: Yeah, for sure. Yeah. Dave: and I've paid, you know, my punishments in in in ways. So we we need to learn. You can't lie to God, you can't lie to yourself. So again, Keenan: Right. Dave: with that going back to the Sandy story. I wasn't done with Sandy. And today I'm still not done with Sandy. Man, I will love her to the day I die. you Keenan: Mm. Dave: know, I know w when it's my time to close my eyes, I know I get to see her again. And Keenan: Right. Dave: that doesn't mean that I haven't loved anybody since. So I I don't wanna make that, but I I I'm writing a book about Sandy. She knew she was gonna die. You wanna hear weird. She knew for years and they her parents t sent her the therapy and she's like they were she was fine except for the discussion, like To prepare people for her death. And not and she goes, It's not suicide. Don't worry about it. Like it wasn't and she was hit by a drunk driver walking on the sidewalk. So, you know, she didn't know that part. but she she said and she asked me years ago Would I read her diary after Keenan: Hm. Dave: she passed? She goes, It's so important for you to do that. And I go, No, cause shut up, you know, like shut up. Well, you know, all these things. And and part Keenan: Yeah. So I'm Dave: of the guilt, let me just explain part of my guilt was also not only about losing Sandy, I was the last person to talk to her. She wanted to get out of the going to the party. She was running like a four point at Stanford. Like she was a complete moron. Like you're right, she's a complete moron. I I I used to tease her that her biggest mistake was going out with a dumbass like me. Sorry, you know, but but I talked to her, I was like, come on, go to a party. Like, get get out, get away from the books, get like I'll see you in in in Thanksgiving, the first Thanksgiving that we were going to spend together in years because she was so devoted to her work and saving money and and all these things. And it didn't work out. And and sometimes life doesn't work out. But so I'm writing a book called Sandy's Diary, which has some stories that we did, which for me has been also healing because I got to sit with Sandy again. I got to Keenan: Hm. Dave: do that. And that's why journaling, you know, one of the things I I want your your guests to know, you your your audience to know is journaling is powerful, but you don't have to show anybody anything. I will show people Sandy's journal. But when I wrote my TEDx, The first version had it was thirty-six pages of just raw stuff. I call it down when I help people write books as a ghostwriter. I go write down the raw emotions. I don't care about grammar. I don't care about any of those things. That we could fix. But writing up the raw feelings, that's what journaling is. It's not about, keep you know, Dave did this, Dave did that. Yeah, get it out. Or but you also have to communicate to Dave. You know, all of these things don't only communicate to yourself, communicate with others when you ask that question about community. Find Keenan: Mm. Dave: that one person that you can be helpful to talk about. Keenan: Absolutely. Yeah. I love that you said that, like find that one person. How much of this, you know, mental wellness, mental health? like how much of this is like personal responsibility, like on the individual, and how much of it is just situational? And obviously, like what do you think about that? Sure. Dave: Well, I there's definitely situations. I mean th there's there's there's things, right? We live i in a society, we live in a communities. Some stuff happens. I I you know good things bad things happen to good people. Fact. Right? Keenan: Right, absolutely. Dave: you know, I mean, you know, I I I've sat with parents when I was a recovery coach, you know, parents who who who had to put their children in in the grave, who who who had to deal with overdoses. Even when they even when the overdoses were successful and were not successful, but when they were, then you worry about that, right? We worry as parents and and all those things. How do you manage that mental wellness, that the the stresses to let my kids I mean, you know, like now coming back from a war zone, right? you know, it's it's technically a war zone. And it has been for thousands of years, but some of my friends are now going, I'm glad you're back. I was w I was concerned about you Keenan: Hm. Dave: and Keenan: Yeah. Dave: You know, th those concerns, those those things. So do we lean on people? Yeah, we we should. And you know, there's things we keep to ourselves because we don't wanna add extra stress. But you need to f to to do it. You can't figure out. You know, Einstein said, right, the the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, expecting different results. Now you could do some things by yourself, Keenan: Mm-hmm. Dave: but Some things you need to be you know, I can't see it. You know, it's like where are you know, hey hey Keenan, where where where are my glasses? they're on your head, Dave. Keenan: Okay. Dave: right. No, I forgot to do that. Sometimes we can't see the obvious. And that's where having the right people in there and it's not always easy. It's not easy to trust. I I realize as I've gone through in the past seven years, I have trust issues. I have trust issues for a million reasons. Keenan: Mm. Yeah. Dave: And it's tough to trust. But it's also less heavy when I get to hand it to the right people, meaning again, people like yourself, just as a friend, not as a therapist. You and I can have conversations that are just when you lean it off. I don't have to carry everything for me. I don't have to Keenan: Yeah, absolutely. Dave: carry the cross on everything alone. Because even, you know, again, going back to religion, I I I I love weaving that nobody did it alone. Moses wasn't alone. Jesus while he was carrying the cross, didn't do it alone. Right? Keenan: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Dave: You know, disciples, get your disciples, get your people, get your Keenan: Mm-hmm. Dave: community. It could be just one person. It could be a cat. I have my chinchilla. You know, I I had Keenan: Yeah. Dave: dogs and all these things. I talk to every now and then. Bubba will listen to me and unconditionally, I you know, I I've been trained in equine therapy, helping people just tell stories. You don't need to talk to somebody. Go get a pet rock. They might Keenan: Yes. Dave: not get you the answers. So I would say you do need a live person for the answers. But find the right people. Because we all have people in our lives who are the negative people who are all gonna be like, No, Keenan, that won't work. This won't work. I've never seen that work. Until it worked. Right? Everything Keenan: Yeah. Yeah. Dave: doesn't work until it does. Keenan: Yeah. So it's even like it's like we do need people to talk to and there are some things we have to figure out for ourselves, but also the quality of those people are important too. Like you don't want a bunch of negative people around you. You actually need people around you that build you up. Important to you. Dave: One hundred percent. I mean, look, what one of my best friends w when I got divorced with from when I chose my my my best friend was Kevin. and I said, Look, we're going away. We're you know we're we're gonna Arizona. We we we went to go hiking. I go, I know you're not physically able to hike. I go, you you just could do whatever you want. Like we we we we we kinda came up with an agreement of he could just listen to his music and I'm gonna go out and take pictures. But we're gonna Have dinners together, we'll we'll we'll do those things. I Keenan: Mm-hmm. Dave: said, the only trick is no negativity. I don't want to hear about my ex-wife. I don't want to Keenan: Love it. Dave: hear about, you know, I'll call my kids, of course, but I don't want to hear about this, that. I go, I'll leave you on the side of a road, and you know I will. And you're he was de directionally challenged. but and and I said to him, you know, how'd that week feel for you? He goes, It was different. I got him on a horseback, you know, Mr. You know, not coordinated. We got to do some things. We we got to ride Dune B ATVs in the desert. We got to do some some real cool things that that that are still in my heart now. And you know, and I got to have him experience something. Again, physically disabled, you know, not he wasn't disabled, but just not ch he was physically challenged. He wasn't he wasn't athletic. he would give it his all. But we were walking up and this is what I wanna tell the audience. We were walking up Nevada Falls in Yosemite. Now it was a short walk, man. They they said from the beginning of the trail to the top, two miles. I'm like, Kev, could you do two miles? Yeah, sure, no problem. Well, Twiddle D and Twiddledum, us, we didn't realize it was like a two thousand foot ascend. So not so easy, maybe it was a thousand I don't know what it is, but it it it was substantial at some points, regular path, not even climbing a mountain. We didn't climb a mountain. Walking the regular approved path, it was steep. And at one point I saw Kevin struggle through it. And I said, Kev, I know we're getting close to the top, but if you can't do it, it's taking us longer. I I go, I don't care. But if you can't do it, he kept on going, No, no, no. Well, long story, we got to the top. And no matter what, he he died prematurely, but not not because of this walk. But he but anytime I would mention Nevada Falls, he has a smile on his face. So there are things that we have to do with a little support, but within ourselves. And Keenan: Absolutely. Mm-hmm. Dave: he had that smile. And I you know, I I tell this story all the time because I I love to be, you know, not on my watch. He's I'm gonna tell stories about Kevin till the day I die, but it's not on my watch. But he sometimes we need to do those things. We need to do those things that people don't think we can. Keenan: Right. Dave: Not because that to see what we how bad do we want it? How bad do you want it? And for Nevada Falls, that was something real special with Kevin. And I got to share that with Kevin. Not only was he there for me to support me in in some things, but I was there for him. And I remember saying, just enjoy this for a little while. You know, we're Keenan: Mm. Dave: right at the the break where the the water's coming over. We saw rainbows as we're walking up. steep stairs, we saw some things. And Keenan: Yeah. Dave: that's why finding those special people in your life, you'll see some s tough things. No. But it's the guy who has your back, though the woman, the the person who'll have your back and not let you face it alone. That's what you need. So you don't need a big community. You need, you know, an Uncle Dave, which is a different story. Keenan: Yeah. So, okay. thank you for sharing all that. So as we're like kind of coming to a close, couple of questions I I love to ask everybody. so, you know, president president of the world pulls you aside, Dave, and he goes, Hey, like the world needs to hear something. And you have one minute. What do you think the world needs from you right now in that one minute or needs to hear? Dave: We need conversations. We need conversations. Is it a human problem? Right? So is it, hey Keenan, you know, I I need that pen. You know, you stole my pen, right? I know you wouldn't steal my pen. and I'd give it to you greatly. Keenan: Yeah. Dave: but we need to have those conversations. You know, I Keenan: Hmm. Yeah. Dave: always go conversation is is helping understand people, but we need to have conversations that we hear each other, right? Keenan: Yes. Dave: Self-awareness. having the ability to hear, not being afraid to say those tougher things. I always again that the the pre non self awareness person, they would say things, not because I was trying to hurt people, never. But because I some things I needed to say, which were in again inappropriate, but some things it was like, I need you Keenan, I need you to say s I I need you to see what I wanna hear because I know it'll help you get through where you need to go. I Keenan: Mm. Dave: have that that knack where I could see something in people that they sometimes can't see for ourselves. And I need that as well. I I need people to tell me, Dave, stop saying I can't, you know, kick the can'ts down the road and Keenan: That's right. Dave: pick up the can to figure out what you need. Keenan: Yeah, I like that. I like that a lot, actually. Don't stop kicking the cants, pick up the can. for sure. So, you know, a lot of people listening, you know, we talk a lot about mental health. And, you know, some people listening are either like in therapy or they're like thinking about therapy. Some and even some people are like kind of on the fence about starting therapy or getting help like that. Like like what do you think they need to hear to kind of get them like off the fence to decide what to do about that? Dave: If you need to go to therapy, go for it. I I I didn't believe I needed therapy. I was like, Yeah, I'm fine, I'm fine, I'm fine. Then I learned some things in therapy. you don't need to do it for the rest of your life. Keenan: Yeah. Yeah. Dave: and some of the methods I teach is to help people not be in therapy for the rest of their lives. Because, like, nobody wants another job to do. Keenan: Right. Dave: But you have to be willing, like we said earlier, you have to be facing. you know, one of my sayings also is The monsters in our head are so much worse than the monsters we thought were under our beds. Because the monsters in our heads are with us all the time. And Keenan: Mm-hmm. Dave: that's what I I I think you should go to therapy. I think there's opportunities, but be willing to listen. Again, what we were just talking about. Be willing to listen to what they're saying. yeah, you might have had some bad s situations in your life. People might have treated you wrong. 100%. I'm not saying it and and I might have Again, I I'm a nice guy now, right? But I I'm I guarantee you I was the monster in in some people's lives. I don't Keenan: Yeah. Dave: you know, I don't you know, not intentionally, but it's okay, right? so understand that and make peace within ourselves to do that. That's what to me therapy was for, and having the conversations and meeting the right people to work through the magic. That comes out. I mean, when when you see Keenan: Yes, for sure. Dave: now, you know, it goes back to you know, the the Shawshank redemption, you know, right? He crawled through, Keenan: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Dave: you know, 400 yards of of stuff to come out the other side. Same thing in life. Therapy Keenan: Yes. Yeah. Hmm. Yeah. Dave: will help you get through it only if you're doing it. If Sigmund Freud would not help you if you don't want to have help Keenan: Right. Dave: or assistance. So think Keenan: Mm-hmm. Dave: about that word. I love that word, and I'm trying to be as short as I can, I'm sorry. Keenan: You're good. You're good. Dave: but the the you know, where don't look at it as as help. There's some people like, I don't need help. I'm that bravado, right? W woman or or or or men, right? I could do this myself. How about if I assist you? How about Keenan: Yeah. Yeah. Dave: when when things get heavy, can I carry a bag for you? Yeah, you could do that. Right? It's that it's that creating that safe space. creating those moments of Uncle Dave Ness. Keenan: Yes, absolutely. So, you know, any we've talked about a lot stuff today. Like any good books, podcasts, blogs you recommend that if people want to learn more about what we talked about, they can look up. Dave: You know, peace, love and bring bad. That's my podcast. you know, so Keenan: Yes, absolutely. Dave: so for sure, I I tell you that. There is interesting guests. The i the guests aren't all mental wellness. We're not it's not all woe is me stories. It's they they do all have r resources. It's something about leadership. How are you showing up in that community that you you w you want to be? You know, are you a leader at your church? Are you just the the person who picks up all the Bibles at the end of the or or or the books at the end and puts them away? Are you a leader? in that way. It's it's not about a leader saying I'm president of the world or or or something like that. You can lead in so many different ways. So, you know, peace, love, and bring a bat is one. You know, find some books. There's a million books out there. I'm not gonna name it. Look, I again I'm a I'm an author. So look at any of my books. They're they're nice little story books. they weren't written by Ernest Hemingway. I I keep picking on him. he he he's a great author so any of his books are good to read. But these are like homey books. I mean I I I love them. There's some children's books that I've you know, find what works for you. You know, Keenan: Mm. Dave: if you need the education piece, great, go for that. If you need just a nice story, I love nice stories. So that book I wrote about Connie, you know, is the makers of moments. So Keenan: Mm. Dave: be a be a maker of a moment. You know, the book was r about this old woman who took care of him fifty, mid mid fifties, you know. man who showed him what those moments happen. It's a nice little story and it it ends well. And want us to all be that makers of moments. I want Keenan: Yes. Dave: us all to show up and be in in the moment, you know, being Keenan: Mm-hmm. Dave: present and read some books if i if that's what you like. Keenan: Absolutely. For sure. How can people find you in what you do? Dave: The great thing is there aren't any David Schemetskys in the world. there is a cousin with an S, spelling it with an S, but he doesn't carry a bat. so Keenan: That's right. Dave: you know, I'm easy to find. I mean I'm David Schemetzky on Instagram, Facebook, my website, David Schemetzky. so it's it it's as simple. I I try to make things as simple as possible. That's what I I like to cut through the BS and you know, even if you just need somebody to talk to. And you have nobody when we talked about community and you find somebody, reach out. I I have sat with people, not as a business, as a human being, and I'm human first. That's why I keep mentioning this Uncle Dave. That's what it is. It's the good Uncle Dave. anybody who gets to know me, if you're thinking about the negative things, I'm sorry for that because that means You might have experienced some things that weren't so good and I'm sorry for that. But that's not me. My nieces will tell you, my nephews will tell you. I might be a little wacky, but I'm a good guy. Keenan: Well David, thank you so much for being here and sharing your story and all your wisdom. And I will post your links in the description so everyone can find you. thank you so much. Dave: Well, thank you so much. I I I I I appreciate it. And we'll we'll do this again, man. you know, I'd love to have you back on my my podcast as well. Keenan: Absolutely.