Latest / Sunlight Matters / Designing with Sunlight: Viktoria Neumueller on Energy-Efficient Homes and Solar-Oriented Planningsode

Transcript

Designing with Sunlight: Viktoria Neumueller on Energy-Efficient Homes and Solar-Oriented Planningsode · Sunlight Matters

• 0:00
  SPEAKER_03: An architect planned a building and a few months later I just saw what they planned.
• 0:08
  SPEAKER_03: It took me just maybe two minutes to have a look at it and I thought, oh my god, you really ignored everything.
• 0:16
  SPEAKER_03: I made some calculations and it was like about 75% less heating costs per year.
• 0:27
  SPEAKER_00: It's bizarre when you actually think about it.
• 0:29
  SPEAKER_00: The building sector has deprioritized the importance of sunlight.
• 0:34
  SPEAKER_00: We kind of lost that.
• 0:35
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, what do you think's going on?
• 0:37
  SPEAKER_03: I'm not sure if I really should say what I'm thinking that's going on.
• 0:43
  SPEAKER_03: Actually, it's really easy to get some zero energy buildings nowadays because we have so good building standards.
• 0:55
  SPEAKER_01: Welcome to Sunlight Matters, the podcast that reconnects us with the sun.
• 1:00
  SPEAKER_01: Join us as we explore the power and influence of our star, the force at the heart of everything.
• 1:06
  SPEAKER_01: Each episode, we speak with leading experts to uncover the ways sunlight shapes our world.
• 1:12
  SPEAKER_00: Welcome to today's episode and I am joined by Victoria.
• 1:19
  SPEAKER_00: Victoria, welcome to the podcast.
• 1:22
  SPEAKER_00: Could you start by just giving a brief introduction to yourself and what you do?
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_00: Hi,
• 1:29
  SPEAKER_03: thank you very much.
• 1:32
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, as you told already, my name is Victoria.
• 1:35
  SPEAKER_03: I'm an Austrian woman and I'm an engineer.
• 1:42
  SPEAKER_03: And I'm here to share my knowledge with a lot of people around energy efficiency and how planning houses to reduce energy and using sunlight and yeah, for reducing heating costs and stuff like that.
• 2:07
  SPEAKER_00: Fantastic.
• 2:07
  SPEAKER_00: Fantastic.
• 2:08
  SPEAKER_00: Well, it's, Brilliant to have you with us.
• 2:11
  SPEAKER_00: So you say your background is engineering.
• 2:15
  SPEAKER_00: Can you just sort of go into a bit more specifically kind of what sort of branch of engineering that was?
• 2:26
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I worked many years in the engineering where...
• 2:36
  SPEAKER_03: I just planned heating systems, cooling systems, ventilation, air conditioning, water supply.
• 2:45
  SPEAKER_03: So all the technical stuff you need in houses.
• 2:49
  SPEAKER_03: And yeah, that was the moment I realized there is a big potential using sunlight much more than we do.
• 3:04
  SPEAKER_03: So that's the reason I started my own business and want to tell that everybody.
• 3:11
  SPEAKER_03: So
• 3:13
  SPEAKER_00: now, in terms of who your kind of customers are, is it businesses or does it tend to be kind of more residential in terms of clients or is it a kind of mixture of
• 3:28
  SPEAKER_02: everybody?
• 3:28
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 3:33
  SPEAKER_03: Honestly, so far it's mostly residentials because they are the winners if they have lower energy costs and having the sun in wintertime and stuff like that.
• 3:47
  SPEAKER_03: But I really hope that also more companies, more architects start to think about that.
• 3:57
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, I mean, it's surprising that To me, because I guess I'm beginning to understand that architects often, you know, when they're thinking about light or, you know, particularly sunlight, it seems to be a kind of secondary consideration in terms of their planning.
• 4:18
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, it's interesting that it's not something that they really think about as a really important thing, isn't it?
• 4:31
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, actually it's poor that they don't do.
• 4:36
  SPEAKER_03: For me, it's one of the basic things they have to think about before they already start to planning a building.
• 4:45
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah, and
• 4:51
  SPEAKER_00: then, I mean, I just, talking about kind of residential customers, right?
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_00: At sort of what stage of the process are they talking to you?
• 5:02
  SPEAKER_00: Is it when they're renovating houses or building new houses?
• 5:08
  SPEAKER_00: You know, what's the sort of typical kind of customer, I guess, in terms of who's talking to you?
• 5:16
  SPEAKER_03: Actually, it's both.
• 5:19
  SPEAKER_03: But of course, especially the sunlight point is, easier if you're building a new house because if you renovate the house you are having already some basic things so you are not that how to say you can't consider everything if you renovate the house but it's in both things it's good to know about that before Yeah, decide what to do or what to build.
• 5:56
  SPEAKER_00: So if you took the example of a new build, would your customers approach you after they've got architectural plans together and just say, look, how do we optimize for kind of sunlight so we can reduce energy and all the other bits and pieces?
• 6:23
  SPEAKER_00: Is it after they've kind of gone through those initial plans?
• 6:32
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, sometimes it's like that.
• 6:34
  SPEAKER_03: But actually, I try to reach people before they start planning, before they start drawing on the paper.
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_03: Because I realized, actually, it doesn't matter if these are residentials or companies.
• 6:51
  SPEAKER_03: Nobody wants to make big changes if they have already a basic plan.
• 7:00
  SPEAKER_03: So it's really good to reach them before they start to planning the house, that they think about sunlight and all the things.
• 7:11
  SPEAKER_00: And then in terms of what you're advising them, is that to do with...
• 7:19
  SPEAKER_00: solar panels and glass and all the other bits and pieces you know I guess what's the output of what you produce for them?
• 7:31
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah so it's actually it's I think the second part solar panels is already the technical part but of course I try to make them think about it so Before they start planning, it's important that they understand how the sun is moving over the day, also over the seasons.
• 7:55
  SPEAKER_03: And then I also try to give them some inputs that they think about where solar panels are good to get more energy in winter times and all these things.
• 8:11
  SPEAKER_03: And yeah.
• 8:14
  SPEAKER_03: how to say.
• 8:15
  SPEAKER_03: I think it's always hard just to explain it with words and that's what shadow map is so helpful for because they just see it with their eyes.
• 8:30
  SPEAKER_03: So they can see the shadow in the different day times and the different times of the year and they also get a feeling for it.
• 8:42
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, so I mean, because we had a chat and I was telling you that one of the reasons I really kind of connected with Shadow Map is because I look at my house and I'm going to ask you to help me in terms of sort of renovating it because, you know, the sun is in, you know, we get good sunlight, but, you know, it's kind of in the wrong place at the wrong time.
• 9:07
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, there's an opportunity for me to kind of change things around.
• 9:11
  SPEAKER_00: But it was by looking at Shadow Map I was able to kind of really understand the kind of problem.
• 9:17
  SPEAKER_00: So when you're with customers and you're sort of showing them using Shadow, I mean, I guess it just brings the whole problem to life, doesn't it, for them?
• 9:28
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 9:30
  SPEAKER_03: It's really important to open their eyes and to look at it consciously, to...
• 9:39
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, see it every day.
• 9:41
  SPEAKER_03: You also see it if you're going through your day, having the eyes open, see the neighbor houses and just realize the shadow and the sun.
• 9:53
  SPEAKER_03: So it's a process.
• 9:56
  SPEAKER_03: It needs time that people realize that.
• 10:00
  SPEAKER_03: And yeah, then the next point is that what you said, then you try to make the best out of it.
• 10:08
  SPEAKER_03: And you think about how you can improve it if you are renovating.
• 10:12
  SPEAKER_03: And if you are starting with planning a new house, then yeah, maybe you think which or where you can place your house, the best position and yeah, things like that.
• 10:30
  SPEAKER_03: So many, many things you have to consider.
• 10:33
  SPEAKER_00: No, I think it's like...
• 10:38
  SPEAKER_00: You know, certainly for me, it was something that, you know, it's almost like I didn't know it was a problem until I realized it was a problem.
• 10:47
  SPEAKER_00: And then I was like, well, how do I address this?
• 10:50
  SPEAKER_00: You know, and that becomes quite a kind of complex problem, particularly, as you say, if you're renovating a house.
• 10:57
  SPEAKER_00: But it's sort of having tools that sort of bring the problem to life are really, really helpful.
• 11:03
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, now I like we spend most of our time in the kitchen and the kitchen actually we have is a bit dark.
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, our aim is to kind of move the kitchen into the lighter part of the house.
• 11:20
  SPEAKER_00: So, you know, we can sort of really...
• 11:24
  SPEAKER_00: enjoy lots of kind of sunlight coming in because that that is the main place that we're in um but you know it almost sounds ridiculous because it it took me to get sort of shadow map to show me what that meant so you know and and the problem is always as you sort of say is around kind of looking at this across the seasons as well so you know i think human beings are very bad at kind of imagining like the future in many ways, and particularly around things like light.
• 11:56
  SPEAKER_00: So bringing that to life more, I think, is super helpful.
• 12:01
  SPEAKER_00: Because I guess the alternative is you sort of keep a sunlight diary of your house or something like that, or take photos across the whole year, isn't it?
• 12:11
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, some people actually do that, but of course it's easier just using a shadow map.
• 12:18
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, most people...
• 12:21
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, most people really understand what I'm telling them and they are happy and it's, oh, yeah, it's logical.
• 12:31
  SPEAKER_03: But they never start to thought about it themselves.
• 12:37
  SPEAKER_03: It's good to make them think about it.
• 12:41
  SPEAKER_03: And then they realize, of course, in the wintertime, I have more sunlight in the rooms, I need less heating.
• 12:48
  SPEAKER_03: And that means less heating costs.
• 12:51
  SPEAKER_03: And maybe that also means I can buy a smaller heating system.
• 13:00
  SPEAKER_03: So you also can reduce not only energy costs, also the technical costs when you're building the house.
• 13:07
  SPEAKER_03: So it's a huge thing, actually.
• 13:12
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and I mean, so there's a, in the UK, there's a huge push for heat pumps at the moment.
• 13:19
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, from what I understand, and you'd be able to tell me better, but heat pumps work better if the house is slightly warmer or better, you know, so if you've got kind of a good sun aspect, then your heat pump might work better.
• 13:34
  SPEAKER_00: And that would then cut your energy bills as well, hey?
• 13:37
  UNKNOWN: Yeah.
• 13:40
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, of course, you need less energy and it's getting cheaper in all ways.
• 13:46
  SPEAKER_03: So that's a long term thing.
• 13:50
  SPEAKER_00: So can I ask, this is going back to you.
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_00: When did you think people aren't taking this sunlight thing seriously?
• 14:02
  SPEAKER_00: What was the thing that kind of really got you thinking about that?
• 14:08
  SPEAKER_00: And what did you then do about it?
• 14:14
  SPEAKER_03: Actually, it was a project in the company I worked for.
• 14:20
  SPEAKER_03: And an architect planned a building for a residential.
• 14:29
  SPEAKER_03: And a few months later, I just saw the...
• 14:35
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, what they planned.
• 14:37
  SPEAKER_03: And I was, oh my God, what did they do?
• 14:39
  SPEAKER_03: And I told them what I really, it took me just maybe two minutes to have a look at it.
• 14:51
  SPEAKER_03: And I thought, oh my God, you really ignored everything.
• 14:56
  SPEAKER_03: And then I just told them, oh no, actually, we don't like to to change something and after that I made some calculations so I did it on the weekends on my own because I really wanted to know what would the change mean and it was like I think about 75% less heating costs per year 75% Yeah, so just one fourth.
• 15:39
  SPEAKER_03: So just 25% heating you need.
• 15:44
  SPEAKER_03: It was a lot.
• 15:48
  SPEAKER_03: So I think it was around, it would have been around 1,000 euros we calculated.
• 15:53
  SPEAKER_03: And if they would have changed the plan, it was around, I don't know, 250 euros.
• 16:03
  SPEAKER_03: It was really a lot on top.
• 16:07
  SPEAKER_03: They could also lower the costs for the technical stuff.
• 16:17
  SPEAKER_03: So I think it was around 30,000 euros.
• 16:20
  SPEAKER_03: They would not need for installing all the heating stuff and water supply and everything you need to...
• 16:32
  SPEAKER_00: So can I ask, what was your, you know, in terms of your calculations, what were you saying that they should be doing?
• 16:41
  SPEAKER_03: Actually, it was quite easy.
• 16:42
  SPEAKER_03: It was just, it was, we had a ground floor and the first floor.
• 16:48
  SPEAKER_03: And the first floor had his windows just to the west side.
• 16:54
  SPEAKER_03: So only windows to the west side.
• 16:56
  SPEAKER_03: And it was kind of like this.
• 16:59
  SPEAKER_03: And I just told them, can you just put them so that they are like this and not like this.
• 17:08
  SPEAKER_00: Basically, change the orientation.
• 17:11
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, so that just all the windows on the south side.
• 17:15
  SPEAKER_03: So that would have been the only thing.
• 17:20
  SPEAKER_03: And just put the floors exactly above the ground floor.
• 17:29
  SPEAKER_03: It would have been much more easier for the technical installation, water supply and stuff like that.
• 17:37
  SPEAKER_03: So, yeah, and also for heating and cooling.
• 17:41
  SPEAKER_03: It would have been perfect.
• 17:44
  SPEAKER_02: Did they listen to you?
• 17:46
  SPEAKER_02: No.
• 17:47
  SPEAKER_03: So, actually, the architect just told me, or it was a young architect, he was like, oh, I will tell, the senior architect, and they just responded, oh, we already changed a few times, so we don't want to change any more.
• 18:09
  SPEAKER_03: And actually, the person who is going to live in the house now never heard about that.
• 18:18
  SPEAKER_00: Really?
• 18:19
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 18:21
  SPEAKER_00: But I mean, I guess in terms of what you're talking about, from a kind of cost point of view.
• 18:28
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, that's a huge amount of money.
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it would
• 18:33
  SPEAKER_03: have been.
• 18:34
  SPEAKER_03: And it's over years, so it's a huge amount.
• 18:39
  SPEAKER_03: The next 20 years or 30 years, I don't know how long they will live in the house.
• 18:46
  SPEAKER_03: But yeah, I think it was the point I decided I don't want to support this idea anymore and yeah that was the start of my own business
• 19:03
  SPEAKER_00: I mean to me it's incredible because not only would they have saved money but they would have probably optimised the sun coming into their house which would you know and we all know that sunshine makes us all happier you know so I find the whole thing incredible so yeah So now you're able as an independent to go in and tell the truth very, very much.
• 19:33
  SPEAKER_00: And I guess customers are paying for you and they will then listen to you, won't they?
• 19:38
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I hope so.
• 19:40
  SPEAKER_03: They do.
• 19:40
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 19:44
  SPEAKER_03: There is another point because I really know how bad it is just having windows on the west side because I lived on my own in an apartment.
• 19:54
  SPEAKER_03: I just had windows on the west side.
• 19:57
  SPEAKER_03: And in wintertime, I think it was maybe from mid-November to, I don't know, February or something like that, I had no sunlight at all.
• 20:10
  SPEAKER_03: in my apartment because before the sun comes in my rooms, yeah, she just goes down.
• 20:20
  SPEAKER_03: She goes away because the days are that short.
• 20:24
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 20:24
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
• 20:25
  SPEAKER_00: And again, this is something, I guess, like if people are looking at a flat or a property, you know, and it is, the orientation is sort of like west east or using something like shadow map then they can factor in things like the the shorter days in winter to see what the reality of uh the sort of sunlight coming in is and you know it's so important like i i was reading recently about uh there's a couple in the uk who are suing a big developer because they've put up a tower block near where they live And now they don't get afternoon sun.
• 21:08
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, they're so passionate about kind of getting sun into their property that they're actually taking the developer to court, you know, and it's in the UK High Court at the moment.
• 21:19
  SPEAKER_00: So this isn't just something which is a nice to have, is it, for many people?
• 21:25
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 21:27
  SPEAKER_03: Actually, for me, it was a reason I always...
• 21:32
  SPEAKER_03: said I won't stay in this apartment forever because I yeah for me it's a must have having some sunlight in winter time
• 21:41
  SPEAKER_00: yeah no I completely get that I completely get that but I think you know what is interesting is that kind of business case for it as well so it again it's not about having a nice this is like Potentially saving people lots and lots of money.
• 22:05
  SPEAKER_03: It will do, yeah.
• 22:07
  SPEAKER_03: But right now it's hard to say.
• 22:11
  SPEAKER_03: Many people think it's the best doing what everyone does.
• 22:20
  SPEAKER_03: But most of the people or actually all the building sector have ignored these things for years or for decades.
• 22:30
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, you have to reach the right people who are open for new things and who want to think about it and then make their own decision and not just do what the others did for years.
• 22:45
  SPEAKER_03: That's a big point, I realise.
• 22:52
  SPEAKER_00: What's going on, though?
• 22:54
  SPEAKER_00: Because it's like literally...
• 22:58
  SPEAKER_00: bizarre when you actually think about it.
• 23:01
  SPEAKER_00: Because as you say, there's an industry, you know, the kind of building sector has deprioritized the importance of sunlight.
• 23:10
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I guess if you go back in time, you'll see that buildings were built to kind of optimize sunlight.
• 23:17
  SPEAKER_00: And, you know, because they weren't heated, they had to kind of really think about how to kind of optimize.
• 23:23
  SPEAKER_00: We kind of lost that.
• 23:24
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, what
• 23:25
  SPEAKER_02: do you think's gone on?
• 23:29
  SPEAKER_02: I'm
• 23:31
  SPEAKER_03: not sure if I really should say what I'm thinking that's going on, but actually it's a kind of lobbyism.
• 23:43
  SPEAKER_03: Of course, if we ignore sunlight longer, if we just do what we always did, it's better for the industries because they can...
• 23:59
  SPEAKER_03: They can, I don't know.
• 24:02
  SPEAKER_00: Make more money, basically.
• 24:03
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, so they can make more money with the heat pumps and all the technical stuff.
• 24:11
  SPEAKER_03: You need to reduce the heat and the cold inside.
• 24:17
  SPEAKER_03: So actually, it's really easy to get some, zero energy buildings nowadays because we have so good building standards but actually we don't use that because yeah we didn't think about how planning our windows and we yeah
• 24:42
  SPEAKER_00: i i mean i i i would say i'm shocked but i'm not because you know i think it's a real Yeah, I can really totally understand that perspective.
• 24:53
  SPEAKER_00: And I think you're absolutely right, is the problem for industry is the sun used in a very sensible way is actually a very cheap resource, isn't it?
• 25:07
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, like on the healthcare side of things, the more I kind of understand about the health of sunlight, the more you realize that you can forget most supplements.
• 25:19
  SPEAKER_00: You know, just getting outside for an hour or two every day is probably what many people need, you know.
• 25:25
  SPEAKER_00: But that kind of flies in the face of an entire industry, which is based around, you know, selling people things to take in little pill forms.
• 25:35
  SPEAKER_00: So...
• 25:36
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I think on the building side, absolutely kind of understand that.
• 25:40
  SPEAKER_00: And I think, you know, someone like you, it's really impressive that you're kind of spending time advocating for sunlight.
• 25:50
  SPEAKER_00: You know, I really, I think we should all really appreciate that.
• 25:54
  SPEAKER_00: And I hope many more people will kind of listen to this.
• 25:58
  SPEAKER_00: You know, particularly young architects, I think, because they're kind of going through architectural school and engineers.
• 26:04
  SPEAKER_00: And think about actually some of the simplest things you can do in terms of orientation of windows, etc.
• 26:11
  SPEAKER_00: You know, can make a real difference and save everybody money.
• 26:17
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, I really agree what you say.
• 26:19
  SPEAKER_03: So I also see the things not only in the building industry.
• 26:27
  SPEAKER_03: I think it's every part of...
• 26:32
  SPEAKER_03: of our system or of our life where it's more important to make money than to save people or to, yeah, to do the best that people stay healthy.
• 26:52
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, look, I think it's a real challenge it it's not a dilemma but it's a real thing this because you know actually what the more I talk to people on this podcast and people who are kind of interested in the sun the more you realize this is almost kind of anti-capitalist in terms of it what it's saying because it's saying actually we need to be kind of much more nature-based in terms of the approach we take and I think you know I guess what is heartening is to to hear people like yourselves who are working in industry to kind of make sure this is something that people realize.
• 27:35
  SPEAKER_00: Because I guess for your customers, you know, there will be a lot who intuitively know that this is something that they need, but don't fully understand it at a kind of completely conscious level.
• 27:50
  SPEAKER_00: And you're bringing it to life for them with facts and figures, which I think is awesome.
• 27:57
  SPEAKER_02: Yeah.
• 27:58
  SPEAKER_02: I
• 28:00
  SPEAKER_03: think it's, in general, a big thing.
• 28:03
  SPEAKER_03: You always want to explain and understand everything, but actually most of the things, we just feel it.
• 28:11
  SPEAKER_03: And it also happens quite often to me.
• 28:15
  SPEAKER_03: Also in the Technik projects, when I'm supporting some residents who want to build a house, I just feel the things.
• 28:27
  SPEAKER_03: And afterwards, I start to think about it because I have to explain it to them.
• 28:34
  SPEAKER_03: I just can't tell them.
• 28:36
  SPEAKER_03: I just feel it.
• 28:38
  SPEAKER_03: But I always find also the technical stuff.
• 28:44
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah, the feeling is right.
• 28:48
  SPEAKER_03: Yeah.
• 28:49
  SPEAKER_03: So it's quite interesting, actually.
• 28:52
  SPEAKER_00: No, it's good.
• 28:52
  SPEAKER_00: It's good.
• 28:53
  SPEAKER_00: I mean, I think it's a good example of listening to your own intuition as well.
• 28:57
  SPEAKER_00: But, you know, I guess that's intuition born of experience.
• 29:02
  SPEAKER_00: So, Victoria, I mean, if I want you to come and help remodel my house, where do I get hold of you?
• 29:08
  SPEAKER_03: I'm on Instagram.
• 29:13
  SPEAKER_03: So with my name, Victoria Neumueller, you find me there.
• 29:21
  SPEAKER_03: Or also some people who are interested what I did so far in my life.
• 29:27
  SPEAKER_03: I'm also on LinkedIn, also with my name.
• 29:30
  SPEAKER_00: Fantastic, fantastic, fantastic.
• 29:33
  SPEAKER_00: Well, listen, thank you so much.
• 29:35
  SPEAKER_00: That's been a really lovely conversation.
• 29:38
  SPEAKER_00: And I really appreciate you talking to us about your views on kind of industry, but also like how you're helping people.
• 29:46
  SPEAKER_00: And I think, you know.
• 29:48
  SPEAKER_00: We kind of, as I say, we really appreciate people like yourself who I think are at the kind of cutting edge of sort of thinking around all of this stuff, you know.
• 29:58
  SPEAKER_00: So thank you so much for joining us.
• 30:01
  SPEAKER_03: Thank you very much for, yeah, inviting me, having me.
• 30:05
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, no, it's our pleasure.
• 30:07
  SPEAKER_00: Our pleasure.