Latest / GARAGE TO STADIUMS Music History Podcast / The Story of The Eagles: From California country rock to stadium legends

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The Story of The Eagles: From California country rock to stadium legends · GARAGE TO STADIUMS Music History Podcast

• Garage to Stadiums Music History podcast The Story of The Eagles Host: Dave Anthony Guests: Rik Forgo & Steve Cafarelli, Eagles: Up Ahead in the Distance === [00:00:00] Dave Anthony: Hi there. I'm Dave Anthony and this is The Garage to Stadiums Podcast. On each episode, we [00:00:06] Dave Anthony: tell you the story of how one of our music legends rose from obscurity to fame and play some of the songs that mark that journey. [00:00:16] Dave Anthony: Welcome to Garage to Stadiums. Today's episode is the Story of The Eagles. Unlike many bands, the Eagles didn't grow up together. [00:00:24] Dave Anthony: They didn't even come from the same corner of America. But in the late 1960s, their separate roads collided in the music circles of Los Angeles and something unexpected to shape what emerged was a band that would become the quintessential California sound blending, country rock, harmony, and heartbreak. [00:00:46] Dave Anthony: At the exact moment, America was ready for it. The Eagles helped define a new musical movement and then took it to unprecedented heights. Over the decades, they would sell more than 150 million albums. [00:01:00] Craft some of the most enduring songs in American music become one of the most successful bands in history. [00:01:05] Dave Anthony: Here to discuss the Eagles are our two guests, Steve Caparelli and Rick Forgo. Authors of Up Ahead In the Distance. Welcome to Garage to Stadiums. Guys, [00:01:16] Steve Caferelli: thank you for having great to be here. [00:01:21] Dave Anthony: What was it about the Eagles that made you focus on them as your subjects for two coming on three books [00:01:29] Rik Forgo: for me, it was, it was really about the love of the music. I'm a fan and their pursuit of music, musical excellence, and the, you mix that in with the, with the business smarts that they had and, and how they were constantly shifting and, and reinventing themselves in different ways. [00:01:47] Rik Forgo: And once you find that story, it's kind of hard to let it go. It seemed like most of the Eagles books that were out there, they focused more on the drama and less on the artistry. So I wanted to drill down more deeply [00:02:00] on their inspirations and how they worked together to take music that was good and evolve it into something great. [00:02:06] Dave Anthony: This is a band that's interesting. A lot of bands grow up in the same town and they get together in a garage and away they go. These guys are from all over the place. And I wondered if you could go back and tell us a little bit about their, the four original members, Glen Fry Don Henley on drums, Randy Meisner Bass, Bernie Ledon, guitar, where they came from, what kind of families they grew up in. [00:02:30] Dave Anthony: Just to give us a backdrop of who these guys are. [00:02:34] Rik Forgo: Well, I, I would say that Glenn Fry was, if even today, if you ask, uh, Don Henley, he'll tell you that Glenn Fry was the leader of the band, even though they didn't really have a designated leader. And he hailed from suburban, uh, the suburban area around Detroit. [00:02:50] Rik Forgo: He was your typical, your typical high school. Can't wait till I get outta here, kind of guy, uh, who took an interest in music. His mother forced him to take piano [00:03:00] lessons for eight years. So he was better situated to music than most of the, most of his, um, musical contemporaries of the day because he could actually read music. [00:03:09] Rik Forgo: And he performed in a variety of bands around Detroit. He met Bob Seger there who helped him early on. And, uh, I think he had three or four bands there. And then, and then he followed his girlfriend to Los Angeles. Henley was, was feisty in his, in his own way. Although he was, he was I guess more quiet, more introspective, more brooding. [00:03:31] Rik Forgo: And he hailed from east Texas in a little town called Linden. And he got into music when his mother bought him his first drum set in his early teens. And he got his appreciation from music every week when his family would listen to the Louisiana Hayride, uh, which introduced him to, uh, to r and b and, and, and other types of music, [00:03:52] Sample of Louisiana Hay Ride: radio network, Louisiana Hayride from K wk to Louisiana featuring some of the [00:04:00] outstanding in the country. [00:04:02] Rik Forgo: And so he was brought up in a, in a an environment like that. His dad worked in an auto, in an auto parts store, and his, his, uh, his mom was a, was a, uh. A housewife. As he got as he got into his older teens, he formed a, a ban. You contrast that to Bernie Ledin, who was more of a free spirit, and his family was military adjacent. [00:04:25] Rik Forgo: His father worked for an aerospace company and he, um, he traveled around the country. Bernie himself was born in Minneapolis. He and his family went to San Diego and then to Gainesville. And then he, from there, he found his way back to Los Angeles. But each one of those stops brought him into a different, uh, a different musical environment that he learned from. [00:04:48] Rik Forgo: Uh, Randy Meister was the quiet one of the bunch. He grew up in rural Nebraska. Uh, Scots Bluff, Nebraska. Grew up a big Elvis fan in a, in a family that. [00:05:00] Was poor, but, but, encouraged his musical, uh, his musical talent. All of these guys ended up together [00:05:08] Dave Anthony: while the band grew up in different regions of America. [00:05:12] Dave Anthony: Each of them made their way ultimately to Los Angeles to become part of the California scene that was emerging in the late sixties with the Laurel Canyon sound of Crosby, stills and Nash [00:05:26] : nearby you waving [00:05:29] Dave Anthony: the Birds, Joni Mitchell and other LA bands like The Doors, unlike Crosby Stills in Nash, which was considered a super group of individuals who joined forces after each being in a successful band. The Eagles were not well known in their prior careers. They basically played in other groups with some limited success, for example. [00:05:49] Dave Anthony: Glen Fry played acoustic guitar and sang backup vocals on Bob Seeger's Lin Gambling Man.[00:06:00] [00:06:03] Dave Anthony: Meanwhile, Bernie Ledon had caught on with the Flying Burrito Brothers, one of the pioneers of what was to become country Rock. [00:06:20] Dave Anthony: He joined them for their second album and their third album, but left in 1971. The Music Club. The Troubadour was a key place for performers to get their break in la and that's where Don Henley and Glen f Fry bet bringing together two individuals who would go on to become one of the most fruitful partnerships in rock history. [00:06:40] Dave Anthony: In 1971, Linda Ronstadt hires Glen Fry to be in his band. And Fry suggests that she also hire his friend drummer, Don Henley. Linda also hires bassist, Randy Meisner in summer of 71. And in July the Future Eagles play together, not as the Eagles, but simply as four musicians behind [00:07:00] Linda Ronstadt [00:07:10] Dave Anthony: in 71. They tell Linda they're leaving and she is supportive. [00:07:15] Steve Caferelli: It was a pretty brief thing because pretty quickly, uh, as they, after they were assembled as that backing ban, they realized that there's was something there that, you know, we could maybe be our own band. We may have something to offer here. And, uh, to Linda's credit, and they always give her the credit, she, she gave them her blessing and didn't hold them back and said. [00:07:41] Steve Caferelli: Yeah, you know, you're a backing band now, but if you want to take a shot at being your own band, go And from there, uh, you know that that became the start of the Eagles with the original four guys. [00:07:54] Dave Anthony: So ultimately, their first album, simply entitled Eagles, comes out of the Gate, three Memorable [00:08:00] cots that contains the hit. [00:08:01] Dave Anthony: Take It Easy, [00:08:05] Dave Anthony: seven Women. [00:08:14] Dave Anthony: 20 to number 12 on the charts was co-written by Jackson Brown, witchy Woman. Went to number nine, written by Bernie, led and Don Henley [00:08:26] : High. She flies [00:08:33] Dave Anthony: and peaceful, easy feeling at number 22, written by a friend of the band. Jack temp. [00:08:51] Dave Anthony: What are your thoughts on that first album? How was it received? [00:08:55] Steve Caferelli: I like it and I don't necessarily think it's their strongest or most [00:09:00] accomplished record, but there's an innocence about it, uh, that may have been lost on future records. Later it became more of the Glenn and Don show as them as kind of the, you know, the band leaders. [00:09:12] Dave Anthony: Yeah, we'll definitely touch on that 'cause we wanna dive into that later. That's for sure. [00:09:16] Steve Caferelli: It's a more balanced sort of thing. And originally really, there was only one Don Henley song on the record which seems unheard of the fact that you had to make Don Henley almost a second thought. Speaks to what a different animal it was on that first record. [00:09:32] Dave Anthony: Yeah. [00:09:32] Steve Caferelli: When you jumped to Hotel California and Don Henley sings the bulk of everything. [00:09:37] Dave Anthony: Yeah. [00:09:37] Steve Caferelli: Um, which we'll talk about more later as well. [00:09:40] Dave Anthony: You know, it's the thing, it's amazing how these bands that, you know, they start in this collaborative effort, a lot of them. And then of course, one or two strong men emerge over time. [00:09:49] Dave Anthony: And, and, and certainly that's the case here. [00:09:52] Rik Forgo: I don't think enough can be said about the, where they were immersed in Laurel Canyon. Jackson Brown was living in the apartment [00:10:00] above them. And, uh, Glen gets, Glen gets a, um, a, uh, a co-edit with, uh, with Take It Easy. But I think his contribution to the song was [00:10:12] Steve Caferelli: The line about the Ford. [00:10:13] Rik Forgo: The Ford, yeah. Oh my. [00:10:15] Steve Caferelli: To grow my Lord and a flat man. Yeah. [00:10:17] Rik Forgo: And that was his contribution. And, you ask Jackson Brown and you'll say, well, that's what made the song. [00:10:24] Steve Caferelli: Yeah. So I, I think just to, you know, kind of, put the, uh, the dot on that. I think you look at those first three singles, the Jack Hemps song was essentially a cover, although I'm sure they made it completely their own. [00:10:39] Steve Caferelli: Glenn heard where it needed to go, and he brought it there. So whether he's just being polite and, and, and, you know, charitable and putting his ego aside or not, will never really know. But that's the hunch I get. [00:10:52] Rik Forgo: And I think that what they said, uh, what Don said, uh, Henley said was that Glenn was known as the lone arranger. [00:10:59] Rik Forgo: He [00:11:00] was already at that time thinking of ways to take songs and make them better. And he did that throughout his entire career. So, [00:11:07] Dave Anthony: yeah. But there's a great, uh. Line in the documentary, I think it's the long run, the documentary where he talks about how he could hear the work and craftsmanship that Jackson Brown was putting into his songs, and he'd hear the tea kettle go off, and then Jackson Brown would shuffle off to the stove to get the tea ready and then back to the piano to work the chords out. [00:11:32] Dave Anthony: I mean, and he realized right there, the work ethic required to shape a song. [00:11:37] Rik Forgo: Exactly. That's what you need to do to write a song. Yeah, that's, that. Is it? [00:11:42] Garage to Stadiums : Garage to Stadiums ranked as one of the top 5% of podcasts globally. [00:11:47] Dave Anthony: In 73, April, they released Desperado. It contains songs that would become staples of the catalog. [00:11:53] Dave Anthony: Tequila, sunrise, [00:11:55] : te[00:12:00] [00:12:06] Dave Anthony: Desperado, [00:12:07] : desper. [00:12:18] Dave Anthony: But this album didn't do as well commercially in its initial release period. What do you think that was about? [00:12:25] Rik Forgo: I think that the, that the studio wanted another debut album. They wanted another album just like the debut with uh, two or three hit singles and, and just something they could build on from before. [00:12:39] Rik Forgo: I don't think they were looking for anything beyond that. They were just, look, you know, like studios do, they were looking to make money and I think the band was sort of embracing their, uh, their country rock, visage. I think that, uh, that Glenn Johns, their producer, liked it an awful lot and the studio heads at asylum, [00:13:00] uh, were wondering why the hell they got this goddamn cowboy album. [00:13:05] Rik Forgo: They didn't know how to market it and they didn't know what to do with it because it wasn't really country and it wasn't really rock. It was, it was something in between. Right. And we never quite figured out how to market it. [00:13:16] Dave Anthony: So that brings, that's interesting, Rick. 'cause uh, Steve, you touched on it earlier, the influence for the Eagles sound for that first era. [00:13:24] Dave Anthony: I mean, you'd had what, I guess you would've had the band flying Burrito Brothers, these kind of bands that sort of kicked that country. Off the birds, et cetera. What, what would you say influenced their sound for that first era? [00:13:37] Steve Caferelli: I would, I would say you just named a couple of 'em, but definitely, yeah. The birds, the Burrito brothers you know Buffalo Springfield, [00:13:54] Steve Caferelli: and, and you know, Bernie had played with the Burrito brothers and he had played with Gene Clark from the Birds [00:14:00] and, and you know, even the burritos were a bird offshoot. Grand Parsons had briefly come from there, but certainly you gotta talk about Poco. Poco was probably the biggest, you know, example of like the, the people that. [00:14:14] Steve Caferelli: Made the blueprint for the Eagles, [00:14:26] Steve Caferelli: but they weren't successful. Whereas the Eagles were you know, as for why that was, uh, well, you know, just to backtrack for a minute. They'll be the first to admit that Poco was a big influence on them, and Poco knew it as well. Not only did they take their old bass player twice because Timothy Schmidt played in Yeah. [00:14:45] Steve Caferelli: As well. But, um, you know, Richie Fur tell stories about seeing those guys in the front row, checking them out, studying, learning. [00:14:56] Steve Caferelli: In Richie's house and [00:14:58] Rik Forgo: by went [00:14:58] Steve Caferelli: to [00:14:58] Rik Forgo: Richie's house [00:15:00] and watched them, uh, uh, uh, practice. Yeah. [00:15:03] Dave Anthony: Yeah. So Coco Coco's, like the technology company that got usurped by Microsoft that took their ideas and Rosie could roll [00:15:11] Rik Forgo: technology actually. [00:15:12] Rik Forgo: Yeah. [00:15:12] Steve Caferelli: I mean, a huge Boco fan. So I give Poco all the credit in the world too, but the Eagles took the blueprint and kind of one up them because they, they learned from, part of it was timing, you know, when the Eagles came along, it was a few years later than Poco. So, you know, maybe they had a little more time to adjust to that. [00:15:34] Steve Caferelli: Is it country? Is it rock thing? But you gotta give the Eagles credit that they decided this is what worked and this is what didn't work. So for example, there's no full-time. Pedal steel player in the Eagles. You know, they pull it out for one or two songs once in a while, but they didn't have a pedal steel player. [00:15:54] Steve Caferelli: Whereas the Burrito brothers did. Poco did. They decided that's not gonna work. You know, [00:16:00] and, and know everybody's gotta look great. Everybody's gotta sing really well. They knew the importance of a great song and keeping your eye on the business sort of thing. So they, they, they had all those influences of those early country rock guys and then they added their own spin to it and were successful. [00:16:20] Dave Anthony: What I was wondering was, do you think the geographic disparity in these guys, they all came from different corners of America. Did that play a part in the sound that ultimately came forth? [00:16:33] Steve Caferelli: I think it did because you know, you had Glenn from Detroit and sort of like that rock background, Don representing all the. [00:16:45] Steve Caferelli: The great country that came outta Texas. Both of those guys kind of like students of the American songbook, uh, you know, all the classics and things like that. But then you had Bernie, who was actually very accomplished as a bluegrass player. They were [00:17:00] leaning on, uh, you know, his skills as, mandolin, banjo, things like that. [00:17:07] Steve Caferelli: Randy kind of really dug like r and b and stuff like that. He had a real high voice, which did wonderful in the harmonies when you put them all together and stir the pot. You know, especially in those early days where people were able to exert influence and say, you know, I'm Bernie and I'm having a song on this record called Early B Bird, which features the banjo, or I'm gonna have a long banjo playing at the end of Take It Easy. [00:17:37] Steve Caferelli: That eclectic mix made your first couple records. [00:17:42] Dave Anthony: For their third album, March, 1970 Fours on the Border, the Eagles initially brought in legendary producer Glenn Johns, A man whose resume read like the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, the Beatles, the Rolling Stones, the [00:18:00] Who Led Zeppelin, and the Kinks were some of his previous clients. [00:18:04] Dave Anthony: The album delivered the band's first. Number one, single best of my love. [00:18:13] : The best of my love. Get the best of my love. [00:18:20] Dave Anthony: But partway through recording the Eagles made a pivotal move, switching producers to chase a harder rock sound. Bill Simsek, a producer connected to their friend Joe Walsh. Stepped in and helped shape the punchier. Hit Already gone. Already gone [00:18:48] Dave Anthony: on the border. Also marked a turning point in the band's lineup. Introducing Dawn Felder, A rock guitarist from Gainesville, Florida and longtime friend of Bernie Ledon. Bill Simsek had just come off producing Joe [00:19:00] Walsh's album, which contained the hit song Rocky Mountain Way. [00:19:14] Dave Anthony: Simsek adjusted. They needed to add another guitar to toughen up their sound. Glenn Fry invites Don Felder to the studio to put down some slide guitar on the song, and the band is blown away by Felder's ability. Felder had come from the same town as Bernie Ledon and Tom Petty, which was Gainesville, Florida, and had made his way to the LA scene. [00:19:33] Dave Anthony: They asked him to play that guitar solo to already gone, [00:19:44] Dave Anthony: and they're impressed. Felder thinks this is just a session work, but it is actually an audition. Next day, fry invites him to join the band, the hiring of Felder and the switch to Bill Simsek led to the [00:20:00] transition of the Eagles from pure country rock towards more rock oriented music. [00:20:04] Steve Caferelli: Musicly Johns saw them as a understandably as a great little harmony group, a little polite band of, uh, minstrels that make LX sounds, uh, not as rockers, you know, and there's a famous story where. [00:20:20] Steve Caferelli: You know, Henley wanted them, wanted his drums to sound more like John Bonum. And when Simsa came along, they said to him, well, will you mic the drums? How many mics do you put on? And of course he said, well, we put lots of mics, mics on every drums. And they were very excited by that because they were looking to bring out more, uh, you know, rock and roll with their, their country. [00:20:42] Dave Anthony: And so, Steve, that first album with Felder and Tow was June 70. Fives one of these nights contains, uh, lion eyes, [00:20:55] : eyes[00:21:00] [00:21:02] Dave Anthony: take it to the limit. [00:21:15] : One more. [00:21:17] Dave Anthony: Did it deliver on that rock transition objective? Henley joked, it was their Satanic country rock period. 'cause there was a dark time politically and musically in America. And he thought, [00:21:27] Steve Caferelli: yeah, and there's something to be there's a missing part of that. So that was his first full record. [00:21:32] Steve Caferelli: He came in as a late edition and they explored a bunch of different sounds on that. One of these nights. The title track is not at all. Country Rock. One [00:21:51] : one, [00:21:53] Steve Caferelli: Gabby. It's just, it's a rock song. It's mystical. It's, it's, it's dark, but it's not country, [00:21:59] Rik Forgo: [00:22:00] but maybe just a fe. A little bit of disco themes going on in there. [00:22:03] Steve Caferelli: Got some disco going on. [00:22:05] Dave Anthony: Next. One of the founding members has philosophical differences around the direction of the music. The band forges ahead in a new musical direction. [00:22:17] Garage to Stadiums : Do you love Bruce Springsteen, Fleetwood Mac, David Bowie, and the Who Listen to More Garage to stadiums on all podcast streaming platforms. [00:22:27] Dave Anthony: Now we're moving into the Bernie Leadin being, marginalized, not happy. W why did he leave the band? I mean, was this as simple as the music direction or what, what, what did you cut your research tell you? [00:22:39] Rik Forgo: I, when you take a look at Bernie, Bernie really was a free spirit. The Eagles were a business and they made money, and they toured extensively and they toured hard. Bernie was beginning to fray a little bit on the edges from all of the touring and the uh, the emerging presence or dominance [00:23:00] of, don, uh, Don Henley, Glen Fry because they were taking up more of the more space in in the albums in terms of cuts that, that made it to the album and to the cuts that made, uh, that got released. And by the time you got to on the border, that kind of reached a boiling point because he Bernie at the time was dating Patty Davis, who was Ronald Reagan's stepdaughter. [00:23:24] Rik Forgo: Um, and, um, uh, she co-wrote a song with Bernie called I Wish You Peace. And Bernie absolutely wanted it on the album, and none of the other, none of the other members of the band wanted it there. [00:23:37] Steve Caferelli: I didn't think it was up to the standards of the rest of the record. [00:23:40] Dave Anthony: There's a lot going on here at this point, and it's interesting. [00:23:44] Dave Anthony: That's a great description of why Bernie left. Just as the LA scene earlier had featured a lot of tight knit musicians, the band begins to hang out with Joe Walsh, the singer guitarist who had done Rocky Mountain Way. He shared a manager with the Eagles, so the guys began to hang [00:24:00] out, which would inevitably lead to Joe being asked to join the band. [00:24:05] Dave Anthony: In 1976 Eagles, their greatest hits was released without the band's input or approval. The record label rushed it out to cash in on the group's explosive momentum. Ironically, the album The Eagles Didn't Want became the one everyone else did, going on to become one of the bestselling albums in US History and Ranking. [00:24:28] Dave Anthony: Among the top three or four bestsellers worldwide, their greatest hits, 71 to 75, which I still think is in the top five probably in the US ever of sales. Yet here they are transitioning to Joe Walsh to get even more of a rock sound, give us a sense of who Joe Walsh was and where he came from. [00:24:51] Steve Caferelli: So, you know, Joe Walsh was already an established act and a successful one. [00:24:57] Steve Caferelli: Uh, so that is one of the things that made it [00:25:00] kind of curious and, uh, a lot of people didn't particularly think that this was a good fit. Like, wait, Joe Walsh is joining the Eagles, you know, the take it easy guys. And that the guy who you know, um, you know, funk 49, you know, [00:25:23] Steve Caferelli: and he wanted to be in a band, so it's almost understandable that he'd want to join the Eagles. Besides the obvious financial boost, but he was a band guy more than people probably give him credit for. [00:25:38] Rik Forgo: And when you talk about Walsh and how in the world would he ever end up aligning with the Eagles? [00:25:44] Rik Forgo: Um, they shared the same manager. Irving AOV was the manager for both of them. [00:25:48] Dave Anthony: Yeah, that's a great point. [00:25:49] Rik Forgo: And [00:25:50] Steve Caferelli: Bill Simmick too, right? Came from the Wall [00:25:52] Rik Forgo: Street. That's right. Because Bill Simmick was the, was the producer who got the James gang role [00:25:57] Dave Anthony: with the departure of Bernie Ledon, [00:26:00] friend of the band, Joe Walsh joins as a second guitarist as the Eagles are intent on pursuing that harder rock oriented sound. [00:26:08] Dave Anthony: Their next release, hotel California would go on to become one of the bestselling albums of all time. When that release came out, that was monumental. Obviously that album, it's in the top five ever still. December 76, it had new kid in town, [00:26:35] Dave Anthony: went to number one, hotel, California, went to number one. [00:26:49] Dave Anthony: And life in the fast lane. I think reach number 11.[00:27:00] [00:27:05] Dave Anthony: And then they had this interesting song, the Last Resort, about the plight of, uh, native Americans after the push of, you know, white people across America, [00:27:13] : some rich men, the nobody put up a bunch boxes and Jesus people, [00:27:26] Dave Anthony: some interesting stuff. But man, this is the quintessential, Steve, you said it like, it just gets better and better in terms of fame here. [00:27:34] Dave Anthony: This album was everywhere. [00:27:37] Steve Caferelli: Yeah, it was huge. And, and you know, the funny thing about it is it's so, so highly produced and in some ways, is, it represents everything different than say what I love about Desperado, which might be my favorite record, but you can't argue with how good Hotel California is for what [00:28:00] it sets out to be. [00:28:01] Steve Caferelli: That highly produced, perfectly, coughed, manicured record with not a single thing left to chance. And, you know, whether, whether you find that appealing or not, some people don't. But it was successful in doing that, whether you like it or not. It was wonderfully successful in accomplishing all that they intended it to be. [00:28:26] Steve Caferelli: And it's by this point that Henley's really, really taking center stage where at this point Glenn Fry's only singing one song on an Eagles record, which is almost unheard of. But it also speaks to how Glenn was the ultimate kind of, you know, [00:28:41] Rik Forgo: clear [00:28:42] Steve Caferelli: company guy. You know, what's good for the Eagles that he considered. [00:28:47] Steve Caferelli: Uh, you know, I think they all had fantastic voices, including Glenn himself, but he thought of Don as the golden throat. I think that's, you know, that's not a [00:28:57] Dave Anthony: Yeah. [00:28:57] Steve Caferelli: Phrase I made up. That's something he said. [00:29:00] And, uh, you know, when it came time to say, who's the best one to sing all these songs on the record, even, if it means less singing for the rest of us, he pushed for, for, uh, for Don. [00:29:14] Dave Anthony: Everyone recognizes that riff of Hotel California. You guys had an interesting story, uh, about how that song evolved. You want to tell it. [00:29:22] Steve Caferelli: Well it start, it started out with, with a demo that, uh, Felder had made and, uh, he made a bunch of different demos of not completed songs necessarily, but licks and ideas and thoughts and so on. [00:29:36] Steve Caferelli: And he put 'em on a cassette tape and he sent the cassette tape to the guys and said, you know, anything you hear on this that, uh, maybe you think we could use? And, you know, the vast majority of it, it was probably 15 or 16 songs. The vast majority of it they passed by. But Henley wa seemed intrigued by what he called a Ragga, like that one that's kind of like a Mexican [00:30:00] raaga thing. [00:30:01] Steve Caferelli: And then, so that was basically the lick and the intro to Hotel California. [00:30:16] Rik Forgo: He left those tapes at his at his house in Malibu. They got together and they started, they started riffing in the studio, and Henley was like, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. Stop, stop it. It can't be that. It has to be exactly like it was in the demo. Exact, well, Felder had forgotten what it even was. [00:30:37] Rik Forgo: Henley wanted it exactly that way. Um, so he called and the only one at his house was the maid. And he had the maid fish through all the tapes that, uh, that were there and she played it to him over the phone. That entire song in the studio was, was a labor of love. It took weeks and weeks to get that [00:31:00] to get it down to exactly where they wanted. [00:31:02] Rik Forgo: And it wasn't just, it wasn't just sim. Felder and and Walsh in there deciding how all of that fit together. Henley was in there and Fry was in there, and they all, they all had input on, on how every, every single lick went down. And Simic, uh, Simic called it the you know, the the masterpiece of his career. [00:31:26] Dave Anthony: Wow. That's saying something. The, uh, tell us, I'm gonna give you a quiz here, 10 words or less. I want you to describe the personalities of Glen Fry, Don Henley, Bernie Ledon, Joe Walsh, Randy Meisner, and Don Felder. I know that's a lot of people, but I wanna, what I wanna set up for is, you know, you guys touched at the beginning. [00:31:46] Dave Anthony: This band is full of drama because we want to touch on, you know. Some of the stuff that hits the fan here. Tell us about Glen Fry, 10 words or less. Throw any words you want out, and then we're gonna go to Don [00:32:00] Henley. [00:32:00] Rik Forgo: I'd say Glen is mercurial [00:32:03] Steve Caferelli: countless energy, extroverted, [00:32:06] Rik Forgo: Tough [00:32:07] Steve Caferelli: business-minded, [00:32:09] Rik Forgo: And collaborative [00:32:10] Steve Caferelli: and rock and roll lifestyle. [00:32:12] Dave Anthony: Okay, Don handling, [00:32:16] Rik Forgo: uh, brooding, perfectionist, lyricist [00:32:20] Steve Caferelli: little anal retentive, little high strung, uh, immensely talented underrated for his drumming contributions, rightly rated for his gravelly, soulful voice [00:32:37] Rik Forgo: And his songwriting abilities. Were just. Felder wrote all the music for for Hotel California, but it didn't have that cultural pop until until Fry. [00:32:51] Rik Forgo: And mostly Henley built that aura around it with the lyrics. [00:32:56] Dave Anthony: Bernie Ledon, let's go to him next. Since he was an original, [00:33:00] [00:33:00] Steve Caferelli: Bernie was a low, lower key guy. He wanted to go surfing. He wanted to go to the beach, wanted to play some tunes. [00:33:08] Rik Forgo: He wanted to be chill. And when they decided to keep going back on the road and back on the road and back on the road, he was like, we ought to take a little time and just relax and not drive so hard because we're gonna kill each other if we don't. [00:33:21] Rik Forgo: And ultimately, he ended up being right. They would've lasted a lot longer if they had taken a break. [00:33:26] Dave Anthony: Let's go to Randy Meisner next [00:33:28] Steve Caferelli: shy, introverted. Small town from an area called Scotts Bluff, Nebraska. Real sort of small town type of guy. Even in his older years, he loved just hanging out and growing tomatoes. [00:33:43] Rik Forgo: Vulnerable. [00:33:45] Steve Caferelli: Vulnerable. Not a real hardcore rock and roll guy. Sweet guy. [00:33:50] Rik Forgo: He always went with the flow. He was, he wanted to be, uh, a good band mate. [00:33:55] Steve Caferelli: Didn't like the spotlight, [00:33:57] Dave Anthony: And Don Felder, [00:33:59] Steve Caferelli: [00:34:00] Accomplished. He was an accomplished player, dedicated, ambitious musician, and skilled frets. [00:34:08] Steve Caferelli: Man. They used to call him fingers back in the day for his. [00:34:13] Rik Forgo: As a technical guitarist, goes just excellent and versatile. Like very few guitarists of that day were, I mean, he could play it all. And putting him and Walsh together was, was just a great, ended up being a great, uh, musical mix. [00:34:29] Dave Anthony: Let's touch on Walsh and then we're gonna move on. [00:34:33] Steve Caferelli: Talented guy band leader type of capability, even though he wasn't a band leader in the Eagles per se. Funny, humorous, he brought an element of humor to the band that was, say, completely contraindicated compared to say, like Henley, who people would probably accuse of being more humorless and serious and brooding. [00:34:54] Steve Caferelli: Um. A alcohol. He struggled with alcohol a lot in his [00:35:00] life, and you, you can't really leave that out because that kind of informed his personality as well. He was kind of that good time, pour me a drink and let's have a laugh kind of guy. [00:35:12] Rik Forgo: But and you sponge, because he could play, he could play every lick that Eric Clap had ever played. [00:35:19] Rik Forgo: He could play every lick that, that you name the blues guitarist and he couldn't, and he could play their licks and he could play them from memory. And if, and just a, just a great guitarist. And if you've ever looked at the size of his hands, just has huge hands. It's no wonder he could play some of the things he could play because [00:35:38] Steve Caferelli: wow. [00:35:38] Rik Forgo: Farther than anyone else. [00:35:54] Dave Anthony: In 77, 19 77 basis, Randy Meisner leaves the band after an interesting [00:36:00] confrontation. Can you give the audience some insight on what happened here? [00:36:03] Steve Caferelli: So, as we said before, Randy was a very shy guy. He didn't like the spotlight. He really wasn't an alpha male kind of guy. And he had always sung life with the band. [00:36:14] Steve Caferelli: He'd always get a song or two in the early days, he'd be singing a song like, midnight Flyer or, keep on trying off the first record trying. But, um, by the time he got to, they got to one of these nights take it to the limit, hit Big. So that became his signature song. That's a Randy song. [00:36:35] Steve Caferelli: That's him singing the lead on that. And at the end of the song, there's a very high note that he hits it. [00:36:55] Steve Caferelli: And every time he hits it, the crowd goes absolutely crazy. It's the [00:37:00] highlight of the evening. Everybody wants that. He's reluctant to it. He's he's nervous that he's not gonna hit it every night. He doesn't wanna do it. And one particular night he was saying, I have got the flu. I'm sick. I'm under the weather. [00:37:15] Steve Caferelli: I don't wanna do it. I'm not gonna do it. And, uh. Glen ever the kind of band leader, practical businessman says, you, you, you can't let these people down, go out and do it. You have to suck it up and do it and whatever. And they end up getting in a fight about that. And then there's an encore leader that he doesn't want to go out for. [00:37:38] Steve Caferelli: And then at that point, after the show, they, I believe come to blows, you know, a few punches are thrown. And, um, he didn't leave the band that night, but that was the, the night that he decided I will leave the band after the, uh, end of the tour. [00:37:58] Dave Anthony: Next Interband tensions [00:38:00] rise amplified by drug use as the Eagles begin their next album. [00:38:06] Garage to Stadiums : Want more Garage to stadiums? Check out garage to stadiums.com for official playlists, concert footage, and other interesting facts for each episode. [00:38:17] Dave Anthony: We're getting to kind of the, the end of the story here. The, the Eagle. The Eagle's Next Studio album in 1979 is the long run is being recorded. And, uh, it sounds like tensions are rising again. There's some drug use. Maybe you guys can give us some insights of the feelings between band members at that time and the challenges surrounding the band in that elbow. [00:38:40] Steve Caferelli: Well, we're so stressed out about, you know, we mentioned how they topped these uber successful one of these nights with Hotel California. How are they gonna top that? And ultimately they didn't, although by any other bands measure, that was a hugely successful record. Just not as big as Hotel California was. [00:38:59] Steve Caferelli: They were [00:39:00] all absolutely fried. You know, spending all the time together with the diverse personalities didn't help all the money, all the substances, things like that. None of that helped. [00:39:12] Dave Anthony: The Eagles also faced a music industry that by the end of the 1970s had gone through a dramatic transition. The Clash and the Sex Pistols had by the mid seventies driven a spike through the excesses of rock and roll with a stripped down punk sound. [00:39:27] Dave Anthony: And as we discussed in our story of David Bowie episode, Bowie's albums Low and Heroes, both released in 1977, began to influence a new wave movement that would pave the wave for new bands like the Talking Heads Blondie and the cars. [00:39:45] Steve Caferelli: You could point to kind of changing times. There were different things going on musically at the time. [00:39:51] Steve Caferelli: Country Rock and even seventies Rock as a whole was starting to fiscal. There's starting to be evidence that new things are coming. It's almost the [00:40:00] 1980s here we're in 1979. [00:40:02] Dave Anthony: Well, you actually mentioned it earlier, you said that Slickly produced Hotel California the. Punk and New Wave was almost a backlash against that idea, [00:40:11] Steve Caferelli: right? [00:40:12] Steve Caferelli: The long run was still slickly produced in a different sort of way. I think it's not as strong a record as, I think it's the worst of their classic, uh, six, in my opinion. But [00:40:26] Rik Forgo: I think when you, I think what, when you look at the input for it Glen took a decided step backwards when it came time to, uh, develop that album. [00:40:36] Rik Forgo: And you could tell, because, the strong cuts that that Don contributed you didn't see, you didn't see that coming from Glen. They were burnt out. They didn't like each other anymore. They didn't want to hang out with, with each other anymore. And honestly, Bob Seger once said that, uh, uh, the reason for the Eagles breakup could be surmised in two words. [00:40:59] Rik Forgo: Hotel [00:41:00] California [00:41:01] Steve Caferelli: bands and rock and roll bands are finite beasts. They have a peak and then ultimately people, you know, it's like, it's like a 5, 4, 5 way marriage, you know? [00:41:10] Dave Anthony: Yeah. [00:41:11] Steve Caferelli: That's hard to make work and times were changing. They all wanted to kind of probably ultimately try solo careers in the eighties, and they did. [00:41:20] Dave Anthony: The album in the Long Run is finally released in September, 1979, and it is somewhat of an uneven record, but does contain three very big tracks, including Heartache Tonight, which went to number one. Was co-written by Glen Fry's, old Detroit friend, Bob Seager [00:41:42] : Can in Parking Lot. But tonight, [00:41:48] Dave Anthony: another key song was The Long Run,[00:42:00] [00:42:02] Dave Anthony: which went to number eight on the singles chart, and I can't tell you why. Also peaking at number eight. [00:42:18] Dave Anthony: However, this would be the last studio album as the band's tensions boiled over. With even longtime strongmen of the band, fry and Henley at odds with each other. Next, a concert in California turns into a flashpoint for this band as two band members threaten each other with violence on stage, [00:42:44] Garage to Stadiums : enjoying garage to stadiums. Check us out on your favorite socials. Instagram, YouTube X, Facebook, and LinkedIn. [00:42:53] Dave Anthony: There was the 1980, they had a Long Beach, California incident on stage. I mean, that's well documented in the documentary about [00:43:00] the Eagles, but Glenn Fry and Don Felder go at it this time. [00:43:04] Rik Forgo: Uh, they finally, they finally had it. I mean, that, uh, the, you know, what was bubbling underneath there was, that was a benefit concert in San Monica. [00:43:12] Rik Forgo: And, and, um, and, uh. They had, uh, earlier in the day, they had met with, uh, Senator Cranston, uh, and his wife and, you know, that's who the benefit was for. And, you know, as, as Mrs. Cranston was making her way through the band, you know, and thanking them for the concert, uh, they got to Felder and, and she thanked Felder and he said, you're welcome, [00:43:36] Steve Caferelli: yeah. Under his breath, [00:43:38] Rik Forgo: Fry just found that disrespectful and, and he thought it it hurt the brand. It hurt the Eagle's brand to, to do that. And that permit, that's kind of what set the, set everything off for what they called long Night on Long Beach. [00:43:54] Dave Anthony: Because it was that Long Beach. [00:43:56] Dave Anthony: Yeah. Yeah. And so they basically. Threatened to [00:44:00] kick each other's ass on, you know, once they got off stage, I guess was [00:44:03] Rik Forgo: all night long throughout the entire set. [00:44:05] : You're a real pro Don all the way. Yeah. You're too, the way you handle people except the people you pay, nobody gives a shit about it. Fuck you. [00:44:12] : I've been paying you for seven years and stuff. [00:44:15] Steve Caferelli: Yeah, I mean there, there was, there's sometimes question about, you know, why Fry seems to be the one having the confrontations. It was he who got a, a beer port over his head by Bernie Ledon. It was he who had the spat with Meisner and it was he who had the onstage spat with Felder. [00:44:32] Steve Caferelli: Um, I think it again speaks to the idea the role Fry played in the band outside of musically. Of course he, and you know, if it was a job, he was management, you know, he was them and the us and them, and I think some of the other guys felt like, you know, he's the boss and he, you know, he could be a pain in the ass and try to get his way. [00:44:52] Steve Caferelli: And that's evident if you hear the over leaked argument where. You know, he says something to Felder [00:45:00] like, you know, I've been carrying your butt for seven years or something, you know, speaking like a, a boss school baring one of the employees. Again, not to speak disparagingly about fried. Maybe there was a need for someone to be the heavy in the band. [00:45:14] Steve Caferelli: Ultimately, [00:45:16] Rik Forgo: I think that's what it was because there wasn't anybody else in that band who was going to help move them forward. And sometimes these are intractable personalities that are gonna, that, that want to do what they wanna do and to move them forward. You have to have somebody Yeah. [00:45:31] Rik Forgo: Suddenly in the band who's willing to be the bad guy and [00:45:34] Dave Anthony: that, and that gets us. That's a great segue to the two large personalities in the band you've got in the, you know, stones, Jagger, Richards, Beatles, Lennon, McCartney. It's fascinating to consider the evolution of how the two members in those two cases come to the fore. [00:45:52] Dave Anthony: Even though, uh, you know, in Jagger Richards case, they didn't even start the band. But how would you describe the relationship between Glenn Fry [00:46:00] and Henley from beginning to end? Because, you know, what's interesting is on that Desperado album, Steve, that you like so much, tequila, sunrise, and Desperado was the first time they kind of came together as songwriters, but it almost foretold these guys taking control. [00:46:16] Dave Anthony: And I'm, I'm interested to see how their relationship evolved over time as they took control their own with each other. [00:46:23] Steve Caferelli: Yeah. And that, what you just mentioned, taking control on that second record was, was a conscious effort. They actually had a discussion among themselves and said, Hey, look, you and I we're gonna have to steer this ship, uh, so that was the first erosion of sort of like democracy, pure democracy. And I think their relationship. Was very good through most of the band, even though by the end everyone was hating everyone. I think they needed each other. I think they both had the same goals and the same aspirations and the same vision for the band. [00:46:59] Steve Caferelli: But [00:47:00] Henley was a little bit more passive aggressive with his stuff, you know, more of a a, a bookish, he was an English major, he was a thinker. He was a, a little bit more reclusive in that way and just kind of in tuned into his art. Whereas Fry, he was all those things, but he was extroverted. He was, had a big mouth and a big laugh and, and he'd walk into a room and make a, you know, take all the energy. [00:47:29] Steve Caferelli: And I think it was both those personalities were needed. To co-run the band and get it to where it needed to be and where it ultimately went. But by the end, that's a lot of personality on each side of those respective men to put up with. Not everybody's easy to live with, and by the end, they needed a break and they were done [00:47:53] Rik Forgo: From beginning to end, though, when they got together to do the work, it was always to improve the music. [00:47:59] Rik Forgo: It was [00:48:00] always to improve the songs. It was always to improve the albums, and they worked collaboratively that way. [00:48:06] Dave Anthony: On July 31st, 1980, Glen Fry says he has done with the Eagles, the legacy here of this band. I mean, this is probably the, uh, well, one of the, the American bands ever, that's for sure. What, what's the Eagle's place in history? [00:48:21] Dave Anthony: What do you think they'll be remembered for? And then the second part of that is who they influenced. So let's start with their place in history. [00:48:30] Rik Forgo: I think they are the quintessential American band. If you take a look at the billboard chart, uh, the billboard uh, rankings for albums, they're number one and they're number three. [00:48:42] Rik Forgo: Uh, yep. You know, greatest hits in Hotel California are up there and they've been there. [00:48:46] Dave Anthony: That's incredible, isn't it? [00:48:48] Rik Forgo: It's just amazing. And I think the reason I think the reason that happens is because whenever there's a new media, whenever a new media comes around whether it was vinyl or eight trap or cassette or CD [00:49:00] or DVD or, or streaming, whatever it was, uh, the people who bought them came back to buy them again, right? [00:49:06] Rik Forgo: Over and over and over. And when it wore out, they would buy another one. And I think that's what's kept them. Alive. But I think the, I think that the legacy that they bring is the perfectionism in the songs and being able to tie that level of perfectionism with that level of emotional experience. [00:49:28] Steve Caferelli: One thing I think they don't get enough credit for is, um, the, the, the level of artistry that they brought to the songwriting and the production and stuff like that because we know the songs are successful and such and, and made them a lot of money and are well known, but, and some people equate that with them being, you know, commercial sellouts or whatever. [00:49:51] Steve Caferelli: But I don't necessarily agree. I don't really think they sold out. I think they did exactly what they wanted to do, and I think they did it really well. That [00:50:00] was, they didn't compromise the artistry to get that money, in my opinion. [00:50:04] Dave Anthony: Who did they influence, do you think? [00:50:07] Steve Caferelli: Oh, certainly the country rock. Or the country then? [00:50:10] Rik Forgo: Today's country. Today's country. Yeah. I mean, there's a reason Vince Gill's playing with them, [00:50:31] Rik Forgo: and you take a look at, you take a look at at, uh, the bands that are out there now. In fact, the reason they got back together was because country music of, of the late 1990s. Recognized that they were important to their to their evolution when Travis Trit came together for, um, for common threads covered. [00:50:50] Rik Forgo: Take it easy.[00:51:00] [00:51:03] Steve Caferelli: I was just gonna say, I would also think they influence anybody who has a strong eye and ear on harmony singing. They, uh, you know, the Beatles kind of got that going with the two part harmony and everybody was in influenced by that. And then occasionally they'd have a three part like this boy or paperback rider, but the Eagles kind of took what the Beach Boys were doing as well, you know, that really rich layered. [00:51:27] Steve Caferelli: Three and four part harmony. Mm-hmm. And it did it really well. [00:51:43] Steve Caferelli: And that's a sound now, you know, when I think of recording things and I do oohs and ahs, the blueprint is kind of like what the Eagles did so well. [00:51:53] Rik Forgo: Interesting. And I think it's, I think it's really cool that a band that, that built itself on its harmonies, [00:52:00] when they finally broke up the final song that got released as a new single for them with seven Bridges road stars [00:52:08] : in the [00:52:18] : you, [00:52:22] Rik Forgo: which the harmonies in that are just. Off the chart. [00:52:27] Steve Caferelli: Yeah, almost a capel, a little bit of guitar, but the rest is just tho those guys singing. It was recorded in parts of 76 and 79. [00:52:36] Rik Forgo: Brilliant harmonies on that. [00:52:37] Dave Anthony: Today we've been talking to Rick Forgo and Steve Caffarelli, authors of Eagles up ahead in the distance, really illuminated us on the Eagles story, the challenges, the trials, tribulations, but most importantly, some memorable music and an evolution of sound that, uh, remains on the charts, as you both said. [00:52:58] Rik Forgo: Well, we appreciate you having us.[00:53:00] [00:53:03] Dave Anthony: Some closing notes on the Eagles. In 2024, Don Henley alleged that a pair of memorabilia collectors conspired to sell about a hundred pages of his handwritten hotel California album lyric drafts. They were stolen allegedly decades earlier via an author who was in possession of the papers for the purpose of writing a biography of the band, the case spotlighted ownership, rock memorabilia, ethics, and artists defending control over their creative legacy in court proceedings, the criminal case was dismissed amid evidence issues in 2 24 and two months later filed a civil dude, which is still pending. [00:53:42] Dave Anthony: One of the Eagle's most famous song titles has a bizarre origin. Glenn Fry apparently was riding in a Corvette driven by a drug dealer on the way to a poker game. The driver accelerated the car to 90 miles an hour. Fry asked him what he was doing going that fast. The dealer looked at Fry [00:54:00] grinned and apparently said, quote, life in the fast lane and Fry immediately thought, now there's a song title. [00:54:08] Dave Anthony: The Eagle's First single Take It Easy was a song co-written by Glenn Fry and his then neighbor Jackson Brown. Brown had written most of the song up until the line. I'm standing on a corner in Winslow, Arizona. Fry added the next line. It's a girl, my Lord, in a flatbed four, and they worked together on the rest. [00:54:29] Dave Anthony: The Eagles released four consecutive number one elements between 1975 and 1979. One of these nights their greatest hits, 1971 to 75 Hotel California in the long run. These four albums combined totaled 27 weeks At the top of the billboard chart, we discussed how the Eagles were furious that their 1976 compilation their greatest hits. [00:54:55] Dave Anthony: 71 to 75 was released without their consultation. Yet [00:55:00] the album went on to become the bestselling album ever in the United States having sold 38 million copies. Their album, hotel California is also in the top four. As we said in the episode, the Eagles got their start as a backup band for Linda Ronstadt. [00:55:17] Dave Anthony: When they told Linda they wanted to leave to form their own band. In 1971, she was very supportive of their goal. She even recorded one of their songs, Desperado, which helped raise profile of the band. Glenn Fry died on January 18th, 2016, at the age of 67 from complications from rheumatoid arthritis. [00:55:42] Dave Anthony: Acute ulcerative colitis and pneumonia. Randy Meisner. The basis died due to complications associated with chronic obstructive pulmonary disease, COPD on July 26th, 2023. At the age of 77, the most [00:56:00] California of bands was almost to a man. Nothing of the sort. As we said, Glen Fry was from Michigan. Don Henley, Texas fellow co-founders, Randy Meisner and Bernie Ledon were from Nebraska and Minnesota respectively before he became famous Eagle's guitarist Don Felder taught a then unknown fellow Gainesville, Florida resident named Tom Petty. [00:56:24] Dave Anthony: Some chords on the guitar setting, petty on the path to becoming a rock star. We discussed the Eagle's fractious relationships with various beefs between band members over the years. In a happier note, when the band was inducted into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame in 1998, all seven current and past Eagles put their past behind them and perform Hotel California and take it easy. [00:56:50] Dave Anthony: At the ceremony we described the complex relationships and partnership between the Eagle's, pseudo leaders, Glen Fry and Don Henley both went [00:57:00] on to have solo careers, but who was more successful in the end? Henley sold over 10 million albums worldwide producing massive 1980s hits like the Boys of Summer and the End of the Innocence. [00:57:12] Dave Anthony: While prize solo career, despite hits like the Heat is on a smaller impact. We'd like to thank our guest today, Steve Caffarelli and Rick Forgo authors of Eagles up ahead in the distance. Thanks for making Garage to Stadium, one of the top 5% of podcasts in the world. We'd love for you to follow our show on your favorite podcast platform so you can be alerted when our next episode drops. [00:57:38] Dave Anthony: Follow us for some great music history content posted on our social channels, Instagram acts, Facebook, LinkedIn, and YouTube. Our YouTube channel has additional bonus coverage from all our internet. Visit us at Garage to stadiums for more bonus content on all the bands featured and links to great downloadable playlists on Apple and Spotify. [00:57:58] Dave Anthony: Thanks to producers [00:58:00] Amina Bert and Connor Sampson, our program director Scott Campbell, creative Director Chad Raymond, and video director Nigel Campbell. I'm Dave Anthony. See you next time for another Garage to Stadium Story, [00:58:13] Garage to Stadiums : another Blast. Furnace Labs production.