Latest / Dr Justin Coulson's Happy Families / #1205 - Your Child Will See Pornography: Here's What You Need to Know

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#1205 - Your Child Will See Pornography: Here's What You Need to Know · Dr Justin Coulson's Happy Families

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  Speaker 1: While not explicit, the content of today's podcast is for
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  Speaker 1: mature audiences. We advise listener discretion. Today's content will be
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  Speaker 1: for mature audiences. Just recently, a mum came to me
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  Speaker 1: after apparent night and while she was upset, in fact,
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  Speaker 1: she was furious. She and her husband were in the
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  Speaker 1: process of splitting. In fact, in the week just previous,
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  Speaker 1: he had been told to pack his things and moved out.
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  Speaker 1: She and their daughter had gone away for the weekend.
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  Speaker 1: Their daughter around about nine or ten years of age.
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  Speaker 1: They came home after he'd moved out. The daughter turned
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  Speaker 1: on the computer and this nine or ten year old
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  Speaker 1: girl was confronted with a hardcore pornography site, breathtakingly explicit
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  Speaker 1: content and she screamed, your children are almost certain to
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  Speaker 1: see pornography today. How to talk to your children about
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  Speaker 1: explicit content on the Internet. Hello, this is the Happy
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  Speaker 1: Families podcast, Real parenting Solutions every day on Australia's most
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  Speaker 1: downloaded parenting podcast. We are justin and Kylie Coulson.
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  Speaker 2: I really wish we didn't have to have this conversation.
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  Speaker 1: Horrible story is.
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  Speaker 2: So important that we find a way to pre arm
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  Speaker 2: our kids.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, and let's just talk about stats so that we
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  Speaker 1: can be clear about why it's so important. Parents often
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  Speaker 1: underestimate their children's exposure to pornography. I've just been writing
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  Speaker 1: about this in my book about Boys, so I'm just
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  Speaker 1: going to read an excerpt from that book right now.
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  Speaker 1: I've written the most active consumers of pornography worldwide or
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  Speaker 1: age between fifteen and twenty years. Pornography is typically, though
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  Speaker 1: not entirely, a boy thing. According to doctor Marshall Valentine Jones,
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  Speaker 1: an Australian researcher on the topic, boys typically encounter it
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  Speaker 1: around age thirteen, though many have their first exposure in
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  Speaker 1: primary school. Experts suggest that the average age of first
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  Speaker 1: exposure is closer to ten or eleven. Girls generally encounter
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  Speaker 1: it later, around age sixteen. Kylie. Here are a couple
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  Speaker 1: of other alarming stats. Number One, by the age of fifteen,
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  Speaker 1: ninety nine percent of boys are estimated to have seen
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  Speaker 1: pornography explicit content. Fifty to seventy percent of fifteen year
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  Speaker 1: old girls have. This is sobering. A twenty seventeen Australian
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  Speaker 1: study revealed that among fifteen to twenty nine year olds,
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  Speaker 1: every male respondent that's one hundred percent of fifteen to
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  Speaker 1: twenty nine year olds in this study reported exposure to pornography.
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  Speaker 1: More concerning the consumption patterns, thirteen nine percent viewed it daily,
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  Speaker 1: another forty six percent viewed it weekly. Wow, which means
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  Speaker 1: that eighty five percent of young men in this age
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  Speaker 1: group are regular consumers of pornography, with only fifteen percent
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  Speaker 1: abstaining from weekly use. Wow. So there's one more thing
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  Speaker 1: that I need to say about this, and I struggle
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  Speaker 1: to bring it up. But I was doing a parent
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  Speaker 1: not a few years ago, and we were going to
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  Speaker 1: be talking about this kind of content. A dad came
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  Speaker 1: up to me ahead of time. He knew what we
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  Speaker 1: had on the agenda, and he said, so this pornography conversation,
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  Speaker 1: I don't get the big deal. It's just boops. And
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  Speaker 1: I responded by saying, I'm not sure if you're familiar
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  Speaker 1: with what intimate pornography is out there, but the pornography
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  Speaker 1: that you're thinking of, the pornograph perhaps from when you
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  Speaker 1: are a young man, it's changed. Here's a quote in
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  Speaker 1: my book from Louise Perry, the author of the Case
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  Speaker 1: Against the Sexual Revolution. She says pornography quote normalizes styles
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  Speaker 1: of sex, which tend to be very aggressive and degrading,
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  Speaker 1: particularly towards women. But it's worse than that. This content
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  Speaker 1: is shaping sexual expectations and understandings at a critical formative
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  Speaker 1: age before they have any sense of what is pleasurable.
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  Speaker 1: I mean, you think about it, Kylie. If kids are
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  Speaker 1: exposed to this content somewhere between nine, ten, eleven, twelve, thirteen,
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  Speaker 1: usually they're not going to have their first kiss until
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  Speaker 1: they're what fifteen, sixteen, seventeen, maybe thirteen if they're early starters,
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  Speaker 1: But on average, Marshall Valentine Jones, researcher in this area,
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  Speaker 1: told me that most kids are seeing explicit content about
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  Speaker 1: three to three and a half years before they have
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  Speaker 1: their first kiss, So it's shaping their beliefs well before
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  Speaker 1: they're engaged in the behaviors, which means that the way
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  Speaker 1: they'll behave is different well.
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  Speaker 2: And the challenging thing is that both males and females
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  Speaker 2: are seeing this and it literally is creating the foundations
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  Speaker 2: of what they think is a loving relationship. Because we
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  Speaker 2: associate sex and sexual intimacy as part of a loving relationship.
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  Speaker 1: Well, pornography changes that, and that's what we need to
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  Speaker 1: talk about. What does it actually do. We could talk
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  Speaker 1: a lot about the content. I don't think that's constructive
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  Speaker 1: for our discussion today. Instead, we want to see with you
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  Speaker 1: a handful of ways, a handful of things that you
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  Speaker 1: need to be aware of so that you can talk
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  Speaker 1: with your children because chances are they're almost certain to
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  Speaker 1: see pornography.
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  Speaker 2: I said at the beginning, the most important thing that
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  Speaker 2: we can do is pre arm our kids. Yeah, start
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  Speaker 2: having conversations. Have it. Literally, it's a natural part of
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  Speaker 2: the relationship you have with your child. They come home
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  Speaker 2: from school, they ask you a question because they've heard
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  Speaker 2: something in the playground being talked about that they don't know.
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  Speaker 1: I still remember one of my sisters came home from
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  Speaker 1: pony camp when my parents sent them off for that,
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  Speaker 1: and she walked into mum, who was working with a customer.
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  Speaker 1: At the time, mom and dad owned a furniture shop.
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  Speaker 1: So my mom's trying to sell like a sofa or
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  Speaker 1: a dining suite to a customer, and my little sister
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  Speaker 1: asks her to explain to her what a certain sex
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  Speaker 1: act is. Now, my sister may not have even known
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  Speaker 1: that it was a sex act, but in front of
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  Speaker 1: this stranger, my sister has said, hey, Mum, what's her
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  Speaker 1: and then she's shared the sex act and Mum has
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  Speaker 1: obviously gone bright red and said, I'll talk to you
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  Speaker 1: about this later. And then look at the look with
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  Speaker 1: the guy that's trying to buy the furniture and s
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  Speaker 1: that I'm so sorry about that. She's just come home
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  Speaker 1: from ponycamp. I wonder what they've been doing at night
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  Speaker 1: when they've been supposed to be sleeping. So the way
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  Speaker 1: that I say it is this talk early talk. Often.
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  Speaker 1: I think that we want to have every difficult conversation
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  Speaker 1: you can imagine with your children before they're too And
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  Speaker 1: it's not because the children will understand it. They won't,
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  Speaker 1: so that you can become comfortable with talking about difficult
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  Speaker 1: things with your children from an early age. And like
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  Speaker 1: you said, Kylie, when they walk in the door and
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  Speaker 1: they've got a tough question, embrace it.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, don't shy away from it. How amazing that your
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  Speaker 2: kid wants to come home and talk to you, the
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  Speaker 2: person they trust to the most, about difficult things, like,
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  Speaker 2: don't shy away from it. Have those conversations, sit down
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  Speaker 2: with them, talk about it. Yeah, they might be a
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  Speaker 2: little bit uncomfortable, but if you can normalize that, then
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  Speaker 2: they'll come to you and talk to you about anything.
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  Speaker 1: Not talking about it isn't protective. I know that that's
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  Speaker 1: a double negative, but you get where I'm going with that.
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  Speaker 1: Not talking about it isn't protective. You need to talk
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  Speaker 1: about it because that's where the protection goes.
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  Speaker 2: We want to bubble wrap them up, right. We don't
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  Speaker 2: want them to know that this stuff exists.
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  Speaker 1: But the reality is it does.
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  Speaker 2: Number one, it does, But number two, they're having conversations.
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  Speaker 2: They're part of conversations that are happening in the playground.
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  Speaker 1: And would you rather day to day basis? Yeah, would
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  Speaker 1: you rather their peers be the ones that are instructing them?
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  Speaker 1: Or Google or the Internet or that pornographic website. Would
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  Speaker 1: you rather that be their education educator or would you
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  Speaker 1: prefer to be the educator yourself? I think that the
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  Speaker 1: answer has to be us.
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  Speaker 2: And I guess the only caveat warning that I would
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  Speaker 2: give is you don't have to give them everything.
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  Speaker 1: Oh yeah, yeah, yeah.
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  Speaker 2: If they come home and ask you where babies come from,
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  Speaker 2: you might have a conversation about the female body.
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  Speaker 1: You might not have to go.
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  Speaker 2: All the way all the way because they're only five
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  Speaker 2: or six.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, don't turn on the fire hose because they're thirsty.
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  Speaker 1: Just give me a couple Just give.
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  Speaker 2: And ask them do they have any other questions? Once
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  Speaker 2: you finish, will tell you where they're at, and you
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  Speaker 2: can answer their questions without bombarding them with information that
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  Speaker 2: they're not ready for.
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  Speaker 1: Okay, Kylie. The second way that we can help our
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  Speaker 1: children to have healthy and useful conversations with us about
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  Speaker 1: explicit content is once the kids are old enough to
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  Speaker 1: be online, and that might be four, or it might
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  Speaker 1: be seven, It depends on every family and how they're
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  Speaker 1: doing this. We need to consistently early and often remind
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  Speaker 1: them that the internet is not always safe for children,
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  Speaker 1: and by virtue of that, if they see anything that's
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  Speaker 1: scary or makes them uncomfortable, that they really do need
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  Speaker 1: to talk to us. They're not going to get in trouble,
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  Speaker 1: but we need to know because sometimes the Internet is
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  Speaker 1: not safe. Third, let's just admit, when you're young, you're
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  Speaker 1: interested in this stuff. Our children shouldn't be punished for
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  Speaker 1: being curious. Our children shouldn't lose privileges for seeing something explicit,
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  Speaker 1: especially if it's unintentional, but even maybe if it is
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  Speaker 1: intentional the first time, because it's normal that kids are
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  Speaker 1: going to be curious about this. We want to normalize
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  Speaker 1: curiosity while still not endorsing or encouraging the behavior. The
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  Speaker 1: best way to do this, I think, is to say
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  Speaker 1: to the kids, of course, this is interesting, but how
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  Speaker 1: does it really make you feel? Because if the kids
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  Speaker 1: are really in tune, not only will they be interested,
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  Speaker 1: but like this mum's daughter who was exposed to something unintentionally,
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  Speaker 1: she also cried out because it was icky and it
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  Speaker 1: affected her. She felt like it was gross and there
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  Speaker 1: was something not right about it. So we want to
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  Speaker 1: be able to normalize the curiosity but also reflect on
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  Speaker 1: the ickiness and talk about why that is the natural
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  Speaker 1: desire that we have for intimacy with another person. That's exciting, right,
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  Speaker 1: That's interesting.
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  Speaker 2: So I guess a beautiful flow on from that is
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  Speaker 2: the acknowledgment that when our kids come and tell us
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  Speaker 2: that they've seen something, discuss what they've seen and, in
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  Speaker 2: the context of a healthy relationship, what that means.
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  Speaker 1: Yeah, what that looks like? A child when you say
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  Speaker 1: what what did you see is unlikely to say, well,
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  Speaker 1: let me tell you all about it, Like they're going
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  Speaker 1: to be reticent, but asking the question and gently prodding
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  Speaker 1: for more information is going to help you to say, Okay,
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  Speaker 1: well what does that mean and how did it make
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  Speaker 1: you feel? And do you think that that's the kind
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  Speaker 1: of thing that people in loving, healthy relationships do. What
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  Speaker 1: messages is this sending to you about gender or about power,
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  Speaker 1: or about what men want or about what women want,
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  Speaker 1: or about what consent is? I mean, you can turn
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  Speaker 1: this into a really really fascinating discussion, and depending on
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  Speaker 1: the age of your child, you may continue the discussion
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  Speaker 1: into ideas around what intimacy really should be like. You
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  Speaker 1: can talk about mutual pleasure, you can talk about things
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  Speaker 1: that women really really do want versus things that they don't,
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  Speaker 1: and how pornography typically depicts things, as Louise Perry said,
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  Speaker 1: that women are not on the whole excited about.
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  Speaker 2: And I think the last thing that's so important is
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  Speaker 2: helping our kids to set boundaries to keep them safe,
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  Speaker 2: whether it be physical boundaries of what they will and
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  Speaker 2: won't accept in the way people interact with them on
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  Speaker 2: an intimate level. Depending on age, obviously it's going to
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  Speaker 2: vary and change, but also the boundaries around internet use
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  Speaker 2: and how to safeguard themselves so that they don't come
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  Speaker 2: across this content on a regular basis.
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  Speaker 1: So again at quick content warning. I'm not going to
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  Speaker 1: go deep here, but in my book, I've written about
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  Speaker 1: what it does to our sons, and this is why
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  Speaker 1: the boundaries need to exist, and I think this is
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  Speaker 1: something to talk to your children about sons and orbs.
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  Speaker 1: I talked with Peggy Orenstein, she's the author of Boys
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  Speaker 1: and Sex, best selling author, and she put it really bluntly.
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  Speaker 1: She said this. She said, if you, as a parent,
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  Speaker 1: are imagining seventies porn, or eighties porn, or even nineties porn,
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  Speaker 1: you're not getting what they're seeing. Her research revealed that
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  Speaker 1: boys routinely acknowledge viewing extreme content like rape, gangbangs, and violence.
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  Speaker 1: But then she went on to say this pornography rewires
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  Speaker 1: sexual behavior in ways that should alarm every parent. Boys
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  Speaker 1: who view pornography become less likely to use condoms, more
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  Speaker 1: likely to share explicit images without consent, more likely to
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  Speaker 1: engage in risky behavior, more likely to engage in delinquent
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  Speaker 1: behavior in substance use, more likely to pursue casual hook
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  Speaker 1: cups on one night stands, more likely to express intentions
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  Speaker 1: to pursue higher numbers of sexual partners. Another study showed
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  Speaker 1: that females reported negative consequences from viewing explicit content, including
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  Speaker 1: lowered body image, experiencing a part in the critical of
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  Speaker 1: their body, increased pressure to perform act scene in pornographic films,
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  Speaker 1: and less actual sex, while males reported being more critical
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  Speaker 1: of their partner's body and also became less interested in
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  Speaker 1: actual sex. Last thing, the pornography script changes beliefs about
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  Speaker 1: what's quote unquote normal, and that shift's behavior. Anal sex
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  Speaker 1: and choking are the two most obvious examples. These sex
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  Speaker 1: practices are no longer fringe. According to Marie Krab's research,
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  Speaker 1: there squarely in the mainstream. I want to re emphasize
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  Speaker 1: the percentage of boys watching this is not trivial and
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  Speaker 1: it's not.
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  Speaker 2: Just you said one hundred percent between fifteen to twenty
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  Speaker 2: nine year.
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  Speaker 1: Olds in that one study. Ye.
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  Speaker 2: Yeah, and then thirty nine percent of them acknowledge daily viewing.
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  Speaker 1: And the people who watch it the most, especially the
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  Speaker 1: violent kinds of explicit content, are much more likely to
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  Speaker 1: endorse what's known as the rape myth. Okay, so this
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  Speaker 1: is becoming desensitized to sexual violence and blaming victims for
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  Speaker 1: their own assaults. The rape myth is basically you must
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  Speaker 1: have been asking for it. It's a sickening cycle. It
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  Speaker 1: needs to be broken. We hope that the things we've
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  Speaker 1: shared with you today, as hard as they are to hear,
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  Speaker 1: will help you to recognize the importance of having the
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  Speaker 1: conversation with your kids, and hopefully we've given you some
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  Speaker 1: useful tips to have useful discussions with them. It matters
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  Speaker 1: so much. There are more resources about this at Marie
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  Speaker 1: Crab's website, It's Time We Talked. You can also check
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  Speaker 1: out the e Safety Commissioner's website e Safety dot gov
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  Speaker 1: dot a U. In fact, if you just google how
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  Speaker 1: to talk about pornography with my kids, you'll find resources
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  Speaker 1: galore to help you fight. The New drug is another
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  Speaker 1: great place to go. Melinda Tankard Reeste's work at Collective
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  Speaker 1: Shout is also helpful. We'll link to all of them
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  Speaker 1: in the show notes. Really, really hope that this has
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  Speaker 1: been helpful. The Happy Families podcast is produced by Justin
• 14:47
  Speaker 1: Roland from Bridge Media. For more information and resources about
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  Speaker 1: keeping your kids safe and helping your family to be happy,
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  Speaker 1: visit happyfamilies dot com dot AU.