Latest / Bott Podcast Network / The Greg Laurie Show - Cissie Graham Lynch: Why the Church Has Weakened Women

Transcript

The Greg Laurie Show - Cissie Graham Lynch: Why the Church Has Weakened Women · Bott Podcast Network

• 0:08
  Speaker 1: Life Audio.
• 0:11
  Speaker 2: I see this world where I believe the world has
• 0:15
  Speaker 2: lied to women. They've sold them this fake, counterfeit version
• 0:19
  Speaker 2: of strength. But I also believe the church has weakened women.
• 0:23
  Speaker 3: Okay, I'm here with a very special guest. A young
• 0:33
  Speaker 3: lady that I've known since she was a little girl.
• 0:35
  Speaker 3: Sissy Graham Lynch. Sissy, glad you could be here.
• 0:39
  Speaker 2: Thanks for having me, Uncle Greg.
• 0:41
  Speaker 3: And my wife, Kathy.
• 0:42
  Speaker 1: You never called me Aunt Kathy. Thank you.
• 0:44
  Speaker 2: I think in the South, everybody is always uncle.
• 0:49
  Speaker 3: I don't know.
• 0:49
  Speaker 2: I remember calling that as a kid.
• 0:51
  Speaker 3: It's sweet.
• 0:52
  Speaker 2: I like it.
• 0:53
  Speaker 1: It's so sweet.
• 0:54
  Speaker 3: I remember you as a little girl with your little pigtails.
• 0:58
  Speaker 3: You're a delightful little girl. Yes, you are. And now
• 1:01
  Speaker 3: you're a grown woman with so much to say. You've
• 1:04
  Speaker 3: written a brand new book. What is the title of
• 1:07
  Speaker 3: your new book?
• 1:08
  Speaker 2: Stand Steady.
• 1:09
  Speaker 3: And what is that about?
• 1:11
  Speaker 2: I had this after I had my daughter, Georgia, and
• 1:17
  Speaker 2: I had come out of this really dark stage. I
• 1:19
  Speaker 2: am very open about how I suffered with depression during
• 1:24
  Speaker 2: my pregnancy and stuff. But when I looked at what
• 1:26
  Speaker 2: we were in culture, I had gone to a few
• 1:28
  Speaker 2: women's conferences and And I couldn't really find my place
• 1:32
  Speaker 2: in ministry, not so much in work, but where do
• 1:34
  Speaker 2: I find myself in a Bible study and really learning
• 1:38
  Speaker 2: the word of God? And I couldn't really find that.
• 1:41
  Speaker 2: And I looked at what was happening in our culture
• 1:43
  Speaker 2: at that moment. And you looked at Roe versus Wade
• 1:46
  Speaker 2: had just been overturned. And at our Capitol, just women
• 1:50
  Speaker 2: were angry. They were hurt. They were mad. We had
• 1:53
  Speaker 2: a Supreme Court justice who couldn't even define what a
• 1:56
  Speaker 2: woman was. Mm-hmm. And I remember sitting in church and
• 1:59
  Speaker 2: I was coming out of this season of my pregnancy
• 2:01
  Speaker 2: and we had just been hit by a hurricane. And
• 2:04
  Speaker 2: I was exhausted and depleted and seeing disappointment in ministry
• 2:08
  Speaker 2: and seeing what was happening in our world. God just
• 2:09
  Speaker 2: put a question in my heart of what kind of
• 2:12
  Speaker 2: woman are you going to choose to be?
• 2:14
  Speaker 3: Wow.
• 2:15
  Speaker 2: Because it's a choice. We have so many choices to
• 2:17
  Speaker 2: make that every day we're making a choice that will
• 2:21
  Speaker 2: shape us for eternity. And we're all going to face
• 2:24
  Speaker 2: storms in life. We're going to face heartache.
• 2:26
  Speaker 1: Mm-hmm.
• 2:27
  Speaker 2: Brokenness, whether it's a cultural storm, whether we start to
• 2:31
  Speaker 2: see persecution here in America, the other people are facing,
• 2:35
  Speaker 2: whatever it might be. My heart was, I wanted women
• 2:39
  Speaker 2: to have a peaceful assurance that they could stand steady.
• 2:42
  Speaker 2: The storm can knock them around, but they could stand
• 2:44
  Speaker 2: there and face it. And I realized I had that
• 2:47
  Speaker 2: growing up with my grandparents and my mom and my dad,
• 2:51
  Speaker 2: their faith was never shaken. It doesn't mean they didn't
• 2:53
  Speaker 2: have spiritual warfare. It didn't mean that they didn't go
• 2:56
  Speaker 2: through very difficult times, but it was a steadiness. And
• 3:00
  Speaker 2: I've realized a lot of people don't have that. And
• 3:01
  Speaker 2: that's what I wanted in this book.
• 3:04
  Speaker 3: And for people that don't know, you have such a
• 3:07
  Speaker 3: rich spiritual legacy. Your grandfather is Billy Graham. Your grandmother
• 3:11
  Speaker 3: is Ruth Graham. Your father is Franklin Graham. And then,
• 3:14
  Speaker 3: of course, your brothers who are all in ministry today.
• 3:17
  Speaker 3: We have Roy. We have Edward. We have Will. And
• 3:20
  Speaker 3: then your aunt is, and grandmothers. I mean, you're just
• 3:23
  Speaker 3: surrounded by all these godly people. But you grew up,
• 3:28
  Speaker 3: I don't know, did you grow up with a sense
• 3:30
  Speaker 3: of you have to now go into ministry or you
• 3:33
  Speaker 3: have to be a certain person? How did that work
• 3:36
  Speaker 3: out for you?
• 3:37
  Speaker 2: You know, looking back, my grandparents and my parents never
• 3:40
  Speaker 2: put pressure on us. They never put this pressure of perfection.
• 3:43
  Speaker 2: It was, they kind of embraced when we would mess up.
• 3:47
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 3:48
  Speaker 2: Use it to shape us, that I'm so thankful for.
• 3:51
  Speaker 2: There was a lot of grace in my family, especially
• 3:55
  Speaker 2: from my grandmother and my mom. Now looking, you've just
• 3:59
  Speaker 2: mentioned all my family in ministry. I think that's the
• 4:01
  Speaker 2: last place my brothers and I ever wanted to be
• 4:03
  Speaker 2: was in ministry. I know as a teenager, I wanted
• 4:06
  Speaker 2: to be far away from the grand name. I really
• 4:09
  Speaker 2: struggled with what it came under the umbrella of being
• 4:12
  Speaker 2: a gram and all those expectations that came. Now it
• 4:14
  Speaker 2: wasn't put on by my parents, but about around peers
• 4:18
  Speaker 2: and the people around me. And I hated it. I
• 4:22
  Speaker 2: hated that I had a dad gone from ministry all
• 4:24
  Speaker 2: the time. I never wanted to be in ministry, but
• 4:27
  Speaker 2: here we are. And I never wanted to write a book.
• 4:29
  Speaker 2: That was the last thing. I think there's so many
• 4:31
  Speaker 2: Christian books out there, especially for women with very little content,
• 4:35
  Speaker 2: very little meat.
• 4:38
  Speaker 3: What do you think to this?
• 4:40
  Speaker 2: I think we've embraced this world of instead of discipleship,
• 4:47
  Speaker 2: we really just want kind of more companionship with friends
• 4:49
  Speaker 2: and family.
• 4:50
  Speaker 3: More therapeutic than theological. Yes.
• 4:52
  Speaker 2: We're in a therapeutic age. I talk about that in
• 4:55
  Speaker 2: the book.
• 4:56
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 4:57
  Speaker 2: But I did not want to write a book. And
• 4:59
  Speaker 2: also I didn't think like, wow, the world doesn't need
• 5:00
  Speaker 2: one more book from a Graham.
• 5:02
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 5:03
  Speaker 2: And here I am. God put it on my heart.
• 5:05
  Speaker 2: I really kind of put it on the shelf, like
• 5:07
  Speaker 2: didn't want to write it. And here we are.
• 5:11
  Speaker 3: But you have so much to say. I mean, you've
• 5:13
  Speaker 3: lived a unique life already. And I probably shouldn't ask this.
• 5:16
  Speaker 3: I know I shouldn't, but I'm going to ask you.
• 5:17
  Speaker 3: How old are you?
• 5:20
  Speaker 2: I just turned 40. Oh.
• 5:21
  Speaker 3: What is the age where you can't ask a girl
• 5:24
  Speaker 3: that any longer?
• 5:24
  Speaker 2: Is it 40? I don't know. We might be approaching.
• 5:27
  Speaker 3: You think it's 40?
• 5:27
  Speaker 2: I still feel so young. It's so weird. I can
• 5:30
  Speaker 2: remember my dad turning 40.
• 5:32
  Speaker 3: Yes.
• 5:32
  Speaker 2: And his birthday. It's weird to become the age you
• 5:34
  Speaker 2: remember your parents being when you were a kid.
• 5:36
  Speaker 3: Yes.
• 5:37
  Speaker 2: And that's really, that's a tough.
• 5:39
  Speaker 3: Just wait.
• 5:40
  Speaker 1: There's more to come. Those decade years.
• 5:43
  Speaker 2: You two have not aged.
• 5:44
  Speaker 1: Oh, you're kind.
• 5:45
  Speaker 2: I can remember sitting on Kathy's bathroom counter as a
• 5:50
  Speaker 2: little girl and watching her do her hair and makeup.
• 5:52
  Speaker 2: And at the time, I didn't appreciate it.
• 5:53
  Speaker 3: I still sit on the counter while she does it,
• 5:56
  Speaker 3: which is weird.
• 5:56
  Speaker 2: I didn't appreciate it. I probably just wanted to go
• 5:58
  Speaker 2: out and play.
• 5:58
  Speaker 1: I wish you would have said, I remember you pouring
• 6:00
  Speaker 1: over the word of God, sitting at her table, having
• 6:02
  Speaker 1: your devotions. But no, she's doing her hair and makeup.
• 6:06
  Speaker 1: I loved it.
• 6:07
  Speaker 2: And you know what? but it is true because from afar,
• 6:09
  Speaker 2: before we had podcasts and stuff, I remember like the
• 6:14
  Speaker 2: internet coming out and just searching Harvest. Kathy, I have
• 6:17
  Speaker 2: watched your ministry from afar.
• 6:19
  Speaker 1: Oh, thank you.
• 6:20
  Speaker 2: From Virtue Women. I've been following them for years. I
• 6:22
  Speaker 2: feel like I know all your leaders because I follow them.
• 6:25
  Speaker 2: You have created such a strong, when I'm talking about
• 6:28
  Speaker 2: women's ministry, you're one of the few that I truly
• 6:32
  Speaker 2: follow because it is your heart. to have women learn
• 6:35
  Speaker 2: the word of God.
• 6:36
  Speaker 1: A hundred percent.
• 6:37
  Speaker 2: And I've met women that have worked in some of
• 6:39
  Speaker 2: these publishing that have written Bible studies and they're told
• 6:42
  Speaker 2: to write it with less strength than a men's Bible study,
• 6:45
  Speaker 2: less rigor. And it's because women don't want it or
• 6:49
  Speaker 2: they don't think we're capable.
• 6:50
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 6:50
  Speaker 2: That has not been your heart.
• 6:52
  Speaker 1: No, not at all. As a matter of fact, the
• 6:55
  Speaker 1: word of God is what makes us stand steady. If
• 6:57
  Speaker 1: we don't know the word and you never are ready
• 7:01
  Speaker 1: for that unexpected event in your life. They come out
• 7:07
  Speaker 1: of the blue. Sometimes they'll blindside us. But when we
• 7:11
  Speaker 1: lost our son, Christopher, one of the things that I
• 7:13
  Speaker 1: was so grateful for, Sissy, was that I had this
• 7:16
  Speaker 1: foundation that I hadn't just read the passages of scripture
• 7:20
  Speaker 1: that says, God has a beautiful plan for your life.
• 7:23
  Speaker 1: He's thinking good thoughts about you, that all things are
• 7:26
  Speaker 1: going to work together for good. Those passages are absolutely treasures.
• 7:32
  Speaker 1: But I had read enough of the Bible and studied
• 7:34
  Speaker 1: enough of the Bible to know that suffering and tribulation
• 7:39
  Speaker 1: and calamity happened to God's people. And when I found
• 7:44
  Speaker 1: myself that day that we got the news that Christopher
• 7:48
  Speaker 1: had died suddenly in an automobile accident, what flooded my
• 7:54
  Speaker 1: mind almost like on a sped up reel was was
• 7:59
  Speaker 1: all those people in Scripture who had suffered too and
• 8:02
  Speaker 1: that they had made it through. And they became like
• 8:06
  Speaker 1: my companions on that journey. And so I always was
• 8:11
  Speaker 1: passionate about studying the Word of God, and I'm so
• 8:13
  Speaker 1: grateful for your Aunt Anne, Anne Graham Lotz, who really
• 8:19
  Speaker 1: instilled in me not just to read the Bible but
• 8:23
  Speaker 1: to understand it and apply it. But I also had
• 8:25
  Speaker 1: a mentor in Kay Smith who– lifted up the Word
• 8:29
  Speaker 1: of God as essential in a woman's life. And so
• 8:33
  Speaker 1: because of her model and example of teaching her women
• 8:37
  Speaker 1: as a pastor's wife, I just, by osmosis, said, this
• 8:41
  Speaker 1: is what we do as pastor's wives. We disciple women
• 8:44
  Speaker 1: in God's Word. So I had that foundation, Sissy, and
• 8:48
  Speaker 1: my passion for not only my life, my children, my grandchildren,
• 8:53
  Speaker 1: the women in our church, but women at large, is
• 8:56
  Speaker 1: for them to understand God's Word. because that's what helps us,
• 9:00
  Speaker 1: as you say in your book, stand steady. And I
• 9:03
  Speaker 1: so appreciated the fact that you used in your book
• 9:06
  Speaker 1: an illustration of when you were seven months pregnant and
• 9:08
  Speaker 1: the hurricane hit. And what you saw was a visible
• 9:13
  Speaker 1: representation of the things that remained versus the things that
• 9:17
  Speaker 1: were destroyed. Maybe share a little bit about that, because
• 9:20
  Speaker 1: I think that is such a great image for all
• 9:25
  Speaker 1: of us to have about our lives. You know, storms
• 9:27
  Speaker 1: are going to come.
• 9:28
  Speaker 2: I think of, you're talking about Kay Smith, I think
• 9:30
  Speaker 2: in my life, like Kay Arthur. And I had a
• 9:33
  Speaker 2: special relationship with her very late in her life. I
• 9:36
  Speaker 2: didn't know her. And one of the Bible verses she
• 9:39
  Speaker 2: challenged me with was in Daniel. And it said, those
• 9:42
  Speaker 2: who know their God will be able to stand in
• 9:44
  Speaker 2: strength and take action. And we as women in this
• 9:47
  Speaker 2: world and this culture we're facing, We want to be
• 9:50
  Speaker 2: able to stand and we want to be able to
• 9:52
  Speaker 2: stand in strength, but not just that, then be able
• 9:55
  Speaker 2: to take action in that. How do we move our feet?
• 9:58
  Speaker 2: And I remember after the hurricane hit, I've seen a
• 10:03
  Speaker 2: lot of natural disasters, especially with the work of Samaritan's Purse.
• 10:08
  Speaker 2: But when it hits your home and your neighbors and
• 10:12
  Speaker 2: every street around you and your family's homes, and we
• 10:15
  Speaker 2: went to Fort Myers Beach, which was across the bridge,
• 10:18
  Speaker 2: and our home was close to the water. And The
• 10:22
  Speaker 2: water got up to our house, but not in, thankfully,
• 10:25
  Speaker 2: because I was seven months pregnant and just only had
• 10:28
  Speaker 2: to evacuate for about two weeks. But when you went
• 10:30
  Speaker 2: over the bridge to Fort Myers Beach, there was nothing left.
• 10:33
  Speaker 2: I mean, it looked like a bomb had just been dropped.
• 10:35
  Speaker 2: And the only way you could tell that there was
• 10:37
  Speaker 2: a house there was this concrete foundation that was left.
• 10:43
  Speaker 2: And it just reminded me that the world can come
• 10:46
  Speaker 2: after us. The storms of life can shake us and
• 10:50
  Speaker 2: try to rip us apart. Yeah. But the foundation will remain.
• 10:54
  Speaker 2: And that foundation is knowing who God is.
• 10:58
  Speaker 3: So good.
• 10:58
  Speaker 2: And that's knowing his scriptures. And it really challenged me
• 11:01
  Speaker 2: then to really start studying who is God? What are
• 11:03
  Speaker 2: his attributes? What does he love? What is his design
• 11:07
  Speaker 2: for marriage and for family? Because everything the world will
• 11:12
  Speaker 2: teach us will be the opposite of God's word.
• 11:15
  Speaker 1: And sometimes even our own emotions, our own feelings, our
• 11:18
  Speaker 1: own mindset. the way we see and view things, we
• 11:22
  Speaker 1: have to remember that our emotions are not truth detectors.
• 11:28
  Speaker 1: The word of God is our truth detector. And we
• 11:30
  Speaker 1: have to bring what we're feeling at a given time
• 11:34
  Speaker 1: and what we're thinking at this time. And in this culture,
• 11:37
  Speaker 1: you know, we're swimming in it. It's hard not to
• 11:40
  Speaker 1: have some influence coming into your life. But if you
• 11:43
  Speaker 1: have God's word, which is that that straight plumb line
• 11:48
  Speaker 1: of which we take everything we think and feel and
• 11:51
  Speaker 1: we line it with the word of God. And I
• 11:53
  Speaker 1: think you named four kings. I don't know if you
• 11:56
  Speaker 1: remember if you wrote the book, but the four kings
• 12:01
  Speaker 1: that are, if I keep us from obedience, king feeling,
• 12:06
  Speaker 1: king trend, king think. And this one I thought was
• 12:10
  Speaker 1: really good. King comfort. And these are the different things
• 12:15
  Speaker 1: that we can allow to rule our lives, right? Our emotions,
• 12:18
  Speaker 1: our own mindset, what we think and what we evaluate
• 12:21
  Speaker 1: as right, as opposed to the word of God. King trend,
• 12:25
  Speaker 1: what culture is teaching. And then king comfort, which is like,
• 12:30
  Speaker 1: whatever's going to make me feel good and comfortable and
• 12:33
  Speaker 1: loved and all of that, that those things become The
• 12:37
  Speaker 1: guiding principle of our life rather than King Jesus.
• 12:40
  Speaker 2: And keeping us obedient to God's calling.
• 12:42
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 12:42
  Speaker 2: And because it's so easy. Like when we live in
• 12:44
  Speaker 2: a culture right now that I look at what parents
• 12:47
  Speaker 2: and the decisions they're having to make with their children.
• 12:49
  Speaker 2: And you don't want to make your children uncomfortable. You
• 12:52
  Speaker 2: don't want them to lose their spot on their volleyball
• 12:55
  Speaker 2: team or their basketball team because you're going to take
• 12:57
  Speaker 2: a stand. The world is so permissive. They're not going
• 12:59
  Speaker 2: to understand when we choose God's way and his design
• 13:03
  Speaker 2: and to stand on his truth. They won't understand it.
• 13:06
  Speaker 2: They'll mock it and they'll persecute it. And I don't
• 13:10
  Speaker 2: blame anybody for not standing in strength. It's not a
• 13:13
  Speaker 2: judgmental thing because none of us will know what we'll
• 13:16
  Speaker 2: do in that moment when the pressure truly comes. I
• 13:20
  Speaker 2: think of some of the legal cases we've seen in
• 13:22
  Speaker 2: our country, like Jack Phillips, the baker out of Colorado,
• 13:25
  Speaker 2: who just was living his life one day and it
• 13:28
  Speaker 2: flipped upside down just because he's so kind and he
• 13:31
  Speaker 2: was gentle and just didn't want to bake a cake
• 13:34
  Speaker 2: for a same-sex marriage. Maybe bake them anything else, just
• 13:36
  Speaker 2: not for their wedding.
• 13:37
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 13:38
  Speaker 2: Spent 12 years in legal issues. We never know what
• 13:41
  Speaker 2: we'll do in that moment. And the pressure comes after
• 13:43
  Speaker 2: our family and after our children. So that's why in
• 13:46
  Speaker 2: this book, I want them to prepare themselves. So we
• 13:50
  Speaker 2: go over these kind of disciplines, I call them. I
• 13:53
  Speaker 2: didn't know what to call them, attributes or disciplines. But
• 13:55
  Speaker 2: things I've learned from my family. I realized after my
• 13:57
  Speaker 2: grandfather died, I wrote down a list of things I
• 14:00
  Speaker 2: had learned from them.
• 14:01
  Speaker 3: Wow.
• 14:01
  Speaker 2: Because I came so much later.
• 14:03
  Speaker 3: So good.
• 14:04
  Speaker 1: You.
• 14:05
  Speaker 2: you know my grandparents better than I did because you
• 14:08
  Speaker 2: knew them for so long. I came so late and
• 14:11
  Speaker 2: I was just a child that it was after my
• 14:13
  Speaker 2: grandmother's passing is when I got married and I wish
• 14:15
  Speaker 2: I could sit down and ask her questions. I now
• 14:17
  Speaker 2: have to read her writings to learn from her.
• 14:19
  Speaker 3: Wow. Well, thank God they're out there.
• 14:22
  Speaker 2: Yes. So I just wrote these like kind of attributes
• 14:24
  Speaker 2: of disciplines that will prepare us for that moment. Tammy
• 14:28
  Speaker 2: Jo Schultz, who's a pilot, she was the Southwest pilot,
• 14:32
  Speaker 2: when the plane, an engine blew and they lost a
• 14:37
  Speaker 2: passenger had gotten sucked through the window. And in that moment,
• 14:42
  Speaker 2: she said, our habits on a good day will become
• 14:45
  Speaker 2: our instincts on a bad day.
• 14:47
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 14:48
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 14:48
  Speaker 2: And that's what I want. I wanted to prepare women
• 14:51
  Speaker 2: for those moments because we'll never know what's going to happen.
• 14:54
  Speaker 3: I think you really well, we're really well prepared yourself.
• 14:59
  Speaker 3: Not just by your grandparents. And I think the unsung
• 15:02
  Speaker 3: hero in your story is your mother, Jane. You know,
• 15:05
  Speaker 3: because we hear about Franklin. We hear about your brothers.
• 15:08
  Speaker 3: We hear about your grandparents. But Jane, when Franklin was
• 15:12
  Speaker 3: gone so much, she was there raising you. And it's
• 15:15
  Speaker 3: very similar to Ruth. Quite a very similar situation with
• 15:19
  Speaker 3: Billy traveling all the time. And I know Franklin missing
• 15:22
  Speaker 3: his father. But tell us about your mother. In fact,
• 15:27
  Speaker 3: your actual name is Jane.
• 15:28
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 15:29
  Speaker 3: And, but you're known as Sissy. How did the name
• 15:31
  Speaker 3: Sissy come about? And tell us more about your mother.
• 15:34
  Speaker 2: Well, I am named after my mom, Jane, and my grandmother.
• 15:37
  Speaker 2: So it's Jane Austin. We're in the South. So we
• 15:39
  Speaker 2: have double names.
• 15:40
  Speaker 3: That's right. That's a great name.
• 15:42
  Speaker 2: So people that have known my mom, like my dad
• 15:43
  Speaker 2: would call her Jane Austin, but they called me Sissy.
• 15:46
  Speaker 2: I think there was pressure to name me Jane and,
• 15:50
  Speaker 2: but they didn't want that like three Janes walking around.
• 15:52
  Speaker 2: So day one from the hospital and they spell it
• 15:54
  Speaker 2: really funky. Sissy, C-I-S-S-I-E. Nobody gets that right. When I'm
• 15:58
  Speaker 2: here in Southern California and they ask for your name
• 16:01
  Speaker 2: at a restaurant and you say sissy, they're like, what
• 16:03
  Speaker 2: is it? I'm like, sissy, what? And my dad still
• 16:07
  Speaker 2: misspells my name. I think on my birthday card last
• 16:09
  Speaker 2: year it was C-I-S-S-Y.
• 16:12
  Speaker 1: Oh, no.
• 16:13
  Speaker 2: Spelling's not my strength either.
• 16:15
  Speaker 1: That's funny.
• 16:15
  Speaker 2: But you're right. My mom, she, my dad, and it's
• 16:20
  Speaker 2: so sweet because I hear my dad and he'll give
• 16:24
  Speaker 2: her so much of the credit of raising us kids
• 16:26
  Speaker 2: because he was gone. I never heard a mom complain
• 16:30
  Speaker 2: when he was gone, complain about his calling in life. And,
• 16:34
  Speaker 2: you know, when God calls a man to ministry, I
• 16:37
  Speaker 2: believe he calls the wife. And I'm sure you've seen
• 16:39
  Speaker 2: that in your own life. But God called my mom
• 16:43
  Speaker 2: to serve as well. And no, she's not an evangelist
• 16:47
  Speaker 2: on a big stage. She's not an evangelist out in public.
• 16:51
  Speaker 2: But she's been an evangelist in her town.
• 16:52
  Speaker 1: 100%.
• 16:54
  Speaker 2: In her hometown. She is beloved.
• 16:56
  Speaker 3: She's there.
• 16:56
  Speaker 2: She loves well. She has grace. And her yes was yes.
• 17:01
  Speaker 2: Her no is no. She expect us first time obedience.
• 17:04
  Speaker 2: She was a tough cookie. She was tough. You didn't
• 17:07
  Speaker 2: mess around with my mom.
• 17:08
  Speaker 3: Are you a tough cookie too as a mother?
• 17:10
  Speaker 2: Yes. I've had to learn a little more grace.
• 17:12
  Speaker 3: Now we have a man. You're married to Corey. And
• 17:14
  Speaker 3: you have three children. Tell us about your children.
• 17:17
  Speaker 2: Married my husband Corey. We met. He was in. Appalachian
• 17:20
  Speaker 2: State University playing football.
• 17:21
  Speaker 3: Got quarterback, right?
• 17:22
  Speaker 2: And safety, defense.
• 17:25
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 17:26
  Speaker 2: He was the farthest one back on defense, if you
• 17:28
  Speaker 2: want to think about that. He went on to play
• 17:29
  Speaker 2: in the NFL for about seven years. But we have
• 17:32
  Speaker 2: three children. I have a teenager, just one turned a teenager.
• 17:34
  Speaker 3: Wow.
• 17:35
  Speaker 2: And a 10-year-old and then a three-year-old. She's wild. Georgia Graham,
• 17:39
  Speaker 2: you've spent some time with her.
• 17:40
  Speaker 3: Oh, they're wonderful. Yeah, they're so cute. She's so full
• 17:42
  Speaker 3: of personality.
• 17:44
  Speaker 2: She does not lack in that area. But you're right.
• 17:47
  Speaker 2: My mom was just very steady.
• 17:47
  Speaker 3: How old is she now? Three. Three. I have a
• 17:50
  Speaker 3: plush toy yellow dog that I'm going to give to
• 17:53
  Speaker 3: her based on my cartoon character.
• 17:54
  Speaker 2: Well, when we traveled with you last summer, you had
• 17:58
  Speaker 2: a dog in your backpack.
• 18:00
  Speaker 1: Oh, that's right.
• 18:00
  Speaker 2: I can't remember.
• 18:01
  Speaker 1: You were barking all the time.
• 18:02
  Speaker 2: All the time you were barking.
• 18:03
  Speaker 3: And she believed it.
• 18:04
  Speaker 2: There was a little dog.
• 18:05
  Speaker 3: In your backpack. I can do a dog bark. I
• 18:07
  Speaker 3: don't even know if I can do it anymore, but
• 18:10
  Speaker 3: I'll try now. I guess I can still do it.
• 18:14
  Speaker 2: I have memories of you doing that as a kid.
• 18:16
  Speaker 1: I have memories. Oh, he never tires of the same jokes.
• 18:20
  Speaker 3: My grandkids all roll their eyes like, Papa, no. They
• 18:24
  Speaker 3: don't think it's cute anymore. I just embarrass them. But
• 18:27
  Speaker 3: so your mom was a tough cookie, as you said.
• 18:30
  Speaker 3: And so have you been a strong mother as well?
• 18:32
  Speaker 2: I think I saw these strong women in my life.
• 18:34
  Speaker 2: My grandmother, as you mentioned, the men were gone. My
• 18:37
  Speaker 2: grandfather was gone for months at a time. I can remember-
• 18:42
  Speaker 2: you know, both, I have different stories. I tell one
• 18:44
  Speaker 2: of my mom, um, I wasn't there for this story.
• 18:48
  Speaker 2: I think maybe I wasn't born yet. It came later
• 18:50
  Speaker 2: in my parents' life, but I was looking at this
• 18:53
  Speaker 2: old USA today, like magazine of my dad.
• 18:57
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 18:57
  Speaker 2: And it was telling a story of my mom. Wow.
• 19:00
  Speaker 2: I thought hilarious. I'm like, dad, of all the stories
• 19:01
  Speaker 2: you could tell us today, you're telling this one where
• 19:04
  Speaker 2: she shot the snake in the yard. And the little
• 19:07
  Speaker 2: country boy from Western North Carolina says, shoot it again, Jane.
• 19:11
  Speaker 1: Shoot it again.
• 19:13
  Speaker 2: But he was talking about God calling my mom. She
• 19:15
  Speaker 2: was a woman of strength. And she was just never
• 19:19
  Speaker 2: afraid of anything. Nothing really shook her. And I saw
• 19:22
  Speaker 2: that just in the women in my life. And I
• 19:25
  Speaker 2: see this world where I believe. The world has lied
• 19:30
  Speaker 2: to women. They've sold them this fake, counterfeit version of strength.
• 19:34
  Speaker 2: But I also believe the church has weakened women. And
• 19:38
  Speaker 2: what do I mean by that?
• 19:39
  Speaker 3: Interesting.
• 19:40
  Speaker 2: And it's not all churches.
• 19:41
  Speaker 3: Kind of the girl boss from the culture. Like, girls
• 19:43
  Speaker 3: are superheroes. Girls can beat men in fights. Like, come on.
• 19:47
  Speaker 3: But then in the church, it's this therapeutic, emoting feeling.
• 19:52
  Speaker 2: Bonding over traumas all the time.
• 19:53
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 19:54
  Speaker 1: Interesting.
• 19:54
  Speaker 3: Interesting.
• 19:55
  Speaker 2: And so that was really kind of the heartbeat behind
• 19:57
  Speaker 2: this book.
• 19:58
  Speaker 3: Yes.
• 19:59
  Speaker 2: And I don't mean that, not all churches. There's great,
• 20:02
  Speaker 2: wonderful women's ministries that are really teaching the solid word
• 20:05
  Speaker 2: of God. But as I mentioned, I would go to
• 20:08
  Speaker 2: these conferences and there was very little Bible teaching.
• 20:11
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 20:12
  Speaker 2: It was all emotional. Women are crying around me and bonding.
• 20:15
  Speaker 2: I'm like, I'm not feeling it. I'm like, I have
• 20:17
  Speaker 2: no emotion. I'm not feeling it. I just want to
• 20:19
  Speaker 2: study the word of God.
• 20:20
  Speaker 1: I'm here.
• 20:20
  Speaker 2: I'm hungry. I'm thirsty for it.
• 20:22
  Speaker 1: Yeah. Don't give me the emotion. I feel like in life,
• 20:26
  Speaker 1: emotions run this deep, but there has to be a
• 20:30
  Speaker 1: truth that is deeper than our emotion. We have to
• 20:33
  Speaker 1: know when we're feeling certain things, like even if it's
• 20:37
  Speaker 1: a love for the Lord or a good emotion of
• 20:40
  Speaker 1: love or worship or whatever, to recognize what is emotion
• 20:44
  Speaker 1: and what is truth. And are you willing to worship
• 20:47
  Speaker 1: when you're not feeling it? Are you willing to obey
• 20:50
  Speaker 1: when you don't necessarily feel the motivation or the reward
• 20:55
  Speaker 1: at the end of that? But you know it's right.
• 20:57
  Speaker 1: So you have to have that deeper than emotion. And absolutely,
• 21:02
  Speaker 1: the church needs to equip women with that. And the
• 21:05
  Speaker 1: idea of bringing women together to rehearse their past traumas,
• 21:10
  Speaker 1: which very early on in my ministry, there was a
• 21:14
  Speaker 1: speaker who went around and she had been abused. She
• 21:18
  Speaker 1: had gone through some trauma in her youth and that
• 21:21
  Speaker 1: became her whole platform. But what I saw was a
• 21:24
  Speaker 1: red flag for me when I started reading more deeply
• 21:27
  Speaker 1: was she started listing all these symptoms that were very
• 21:32
  Speaker 1: vague and symptoms that could mean that you were also abused.
• 21:39
  Speaker 1: And that if you've had these feelings or outburst of anger,
• 21:42
  Speaker 1: or if you felt, if you were compulsive eater or whatever,
• 21:45
  Speaker 1: that all.
• 21:45
  Speaker 3: Of these things... Why did you gesture toward me when
• 21:47
  Speaker 3: you said compulsive eater? I don't think it's compulsive.
• 21:51
  Speaker 1: You're not a woman, you know, it doesn't apply. This
• 21:54
  Speaker 1: is true. But she had all, and it became this,
• 21:59
  Speaker 1: and I found that I attended a place where she
• 22:02
  Speaker 1: was speaking about And there was no resolution or victory.
• 22:07
  Speaker 1: The only way through this was to continue to dig
• 22:11
  Speaker 1: deeper into your past memories, into your history of hurt
• 22:16
  Speaker 1: and trauma. And it was like, the fruit that I
• 22:19
  Speaker 1: saw as a result of that wasn't taking those things
• 22:22
  Speaker 1: to the cross and taking them to our healer and
• 22:25
  Speaker 1: taking them to the Word of God. It was just
• 22:28
  Speaker 1: this This next step was just this perpetual cycle of
• 22:32
  Speaker 1: hurt and rehearsing. And whatever we get in small groups,
• 22:36
  Speaker 1: you know, it can happen. As we're discussing the word
• 22:39
  Speaker 1: of God, one starts saying this, the next, and you
• 22:42
  Speaker 1: have to.
• 22:43
  Speaker 2: Some of the Bible studies out there have like serious rules.
• 22:46
  Speaker 2: Like you can't say proper pronouns.
• 22:48
  Speaker 1: You have to kind of wrangle all of that back.
• 22:52
  Speaker 1: You say, okay, girls, that's very interesting. We all have experiences.
• 22:56
  Speaker 1: We all have memories. But remember, we're here to study
• 22:58
  Speaker 1: God's word. bring them back to that. So, but yes,
• 23:02
  Speaker 1: emotions and feelings, they're, they're this deep and they are
• 23:06
  Speaker 1: not to be trusted because you can flip your emotion
• 23:09
  Speaker 1: in a day. For us women, it can be hormonal.
• 23:11
  Speaker 1: It can be, we read something, we saw something, a
• 23:14
  Speaker 1: friend didn't invite us to the party. All of a
• 23:16
  Speaker 1: sudden it's like the world is ending and young girls
• 23:19
  Speaker 1: in particular now with social media, it is really, really
• 23:23
  Speaker 1: hard for them because.
• 23:24
  Speaker 3: What alarms me is, There's a story out right now
• 23:28
  Speaker 3: about a young girl just turned 13 years old, raised
• 23:31
  Speaker 3: in a Hollywood home, and she took her own life.
• 23:34
  Speaker 3: Suicide among young girls has like tripled. And this is
• 23:39
  Speaker 3: so scary to me. And I know a lot of it.
• 23:41
  Speaker 3: has influenced the social media. I think you can almost
• 23:44
  Speaker 3: trace it back to when the social media platforms were born.
• 23:49
  Speaker 3: And I think we can dismiss the pain that these
• 23:51
  Speaker 3: young girls are feeling, but it's real to them. Maybe
• 23:54
  Speaker 3: they're being bullied online or they don't feel they measure up.
• 23:58
  Speaker 3: What would you ladies say to the younger girls out
• 24:01
  Speaker 3: there who maybe don't think they're as beautiful as they
• 24:05
  Speaker 3: can be or as smart as they want to be
• 24:08
  Speaker 3: or whatever it is they want to be, It's sort
• 24:11
  Speaker 3: of like an older sissy talking to a younger sissy,
• 24:14
  Speaker 3: an older Kathy speaking to a younger Kathy, or just
• 24:17
  Speaker 3: talking to young girls like, hey, it's okay. And please
• 24:21
  Speaker 3: don't ever think about taking your own life.
• 24:26
  Speaker 2: I was growing up in the 90s and early 2000s,
• 24:28
  Speaker 2: which was the time of like supermodel thin and the
• 24:33
  Speaker 2: pressure to be bold. bone skinny, no muscle on you.
• 24:37
  Speaker 2: And I talk about that in my book a little bit,
• 24:40
  Speaker 2: but my eating disorder that I'd had for years that
• 24:44
  Speaker 2: kept me just a bondage over my life. And I
• 24:47
  Speaker 2: couldn't get out of it. And I knew truth and
• 24:49
  Speaker 2: I would be praying like, Lord, free me from it.
• 24:52
  Speaker 2: And he wouldn't. And just like any addiction, it's self-serving.
• 24:57
  Speaker 2: You're putting yourself first. But I would look at these girls.
• 25:00
  Speaker 2: I really can't fathom with the world of social media
• 25:02
  Speaker 2: what these women or these young girls are facing.
• 25:05
  Speaker 3: Right.
• 25:06
  Speaker 2: I would first start with the parents. And it's kind
• 25:09
  Speaker 2: of the thing is like the world won't understand when
• 25:12
  Speaker 2: you don't want to give your child a phone.
• 25:14
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 25:15
  Speaker 2: There's going to be pressures. The kids can say, no,
• 25:16
  Speaker 2: I can't do this. You've got to give me a
• 25:18
  Speaker 2: phone or I can't go to this practice. My coach can't.
• 25:21
  Speaker 2: There's so many pressures and reasons. And it's easier to
• 25:24
  Speaker 2: give in to some of them. But to really rein
• 25:27
  Speaker 2: it back, it's not too late to rein it back
• 25:28
  Speaker 2: in with our children, to really set closer boundaries and
• 25:35
  Speaker 2: standards for our families and more rules. And it won't
• 25:39
  Speaker 2: make sense. And your kid might be mad at you.
• 25:41
  Speaker 1: It's okay. You're not their best friend. It's okay. You're
• 25:44
  Speaker 1: the parent.
• 25:45
  Speaker 2: So look at parents first to rein it back in.
• 25:48
  Speaker 2: Protect them. Keep them safe. That's your job to protect
• 25:51
  Speaker 2: your child.
• 25:52
  Speaker 3: That's true.
• 25:53
  Speaker 2: That doesn't mean we can protect them from everything. I'm
• 25:55
  Speaker 2: not there yet. I just have a 13-year-old. I'm getting
• 25:58
  Speaker 2: ready to enter all of this hard stage. It's really
• 26:02
  Speaker 2: fun times. But boy, I would look at those little
• 26:05
  Speaker 2: girls and their worth is not in the words of
• 26:10
  Speaker 2: other people. Their worth is not in social media and
• 26:14
  Speaker 2: this comparison world where we're constantly comparing our lives and
• 26:17
  Speaker 2: complaining about what we have and don't have. They are
• 26:22
  Speaker 2: in a battle. And we're in a battle for our
• 26:24
  Speaker 2: children and the heart and souls of our children right now.
• 26:26
  Speaker 1: I think kids are so isolated today. And I think
• 26:28
  Speaker 1: parents are distracted as well as the kids are, that
• 26:31
  Speaker 1: no one's really paying really careful attention when you start
• 26:35
  Speaker 1: seeing these warning signs. But as in every life, we
• 26:41
  Speaker 1: have value. We have purpose. We have gifts. God loves us.
• 26:45
  Speaker 1: He wants to use us. We have a beautiful future
• 26:50
  Speaker 1: that God has designed for us that's unique. And so
• 26:54
  Speaker 1: for me, what I would love to see every young
• 26:57
  Speaker 1: child starting from the time they're very little is to
• 27:00
  Speaker 1: recognize they have sources of strength in their life that
• 27:02
  Speaker 1: is not based on what social media or the current
• 27:05
  Speaker 1: trends or culture is telling them, not based on what
• 27:09
  Speaker 1: their little circle of friends that they might see on
• 27:12
  Speaker 1: social media, but they would know that they have a family.
• 27:15
  Speaker 1: Pouring into family, like you were saying, starting with the parents,
• 27:18
  Speaker 1: giving those children that home is important. The parental love is,
• 27:25
  Speaker 1: they have that no matter what. And then second of all, church,
• 27:29
  Speaker 1: the community of God's people that begins, you know, I'm
• 27:33
  Speaker 1: so grateful for the youth ministries in our church that
• 27:36
  Speaker 1: begin from the time that a baby is born when
• 27:39
  Speaker 1: the children are taken to the nursery so parents can
• 27:42
  Speaker 1: hear the word of God in the sanctuary. They begin
• 27:45
  Speaker 1: to see a family beyond their family. So even if
• 27:48
  Speaker 1: your family, a child's family is shaky, if they can
• 27:53
  Speaker 1: be rooted in a church family, and then as they
• 27:56
  Speaker 1: grow older, that church family becomes significant in friendships. And
• 28:01
  Speaker 1: then as they learn, they have a role, they have
• 28:04
  Speaker 1: a purpose, they have gifts that they can use in
• 28:07
  Speaker 1: the church. And I loved what you said in your
• 28:09
  Speaker 1: book about the importance. This culture is a thing about ageism,
• 28:13
  Speaker 1: that older people, it's all about being young and looking
• 28:16
  Speaker 1: like you're young and staying young and forever 21 and
• 28:19
  Speaker 1: all of that, but that there is such value in,
• 28:22
  Speaker 1: in having older saints, women who have lived life, experienced life,
• 28:28
  Speaker 1: gone through difficult marriages, raised a prodigal child, that in
• 28:31
  Speaker 1: every stage of your life that there's probably a woman
• 28:34
  Speaker 1: in the church, maybe she doesn't have a title, but
• 28:37
  Speaker 1: she might be a small group leader or she might
• 28:39
  Speaker 1: be just a woman that you sit next to in
• 28:41
  Speaker 1: church that has lived. As a younger person, if we
• 28:45
  Speaker 1: can seek out those mentors, and mentoring doesn't have to
• 28:50
  Speaker 1: be a formal program, it can just be Striking up
• 28:53
  Speaker 1: the conversation, asking questions. And then for those of us
• 28:56
  Speaker 1: that are older, to open our hearts and our homes
• 29:00
  Speaker 1: and our lives, especially those of us who have a
• 29:02
  Speaker 1: little more time. We've raised our families that we could
• 29:05
  Speaker 1: just say, hey, come on over. Let's cook. And then
• 29:08
  Speaker 1: you have these conversations side by side where you're not
• 29:13
  Speaker 1: necessarily going through a formal program of mentoring.
• 29:15
  Speaker 2: Mm-hmm.
• 29:16
  Speaker 1: But they are just observing. And there's a young boy
• 29:20
  Speaker 1: that was Christopher's friend. His name was Hank. And he
• 29:24
  Speaker 1: was raised in the family of a single mother. And
• 29:28
  Speaker 1: Christopher really liked him. And his mom was part of
• 29:30
  Speaker 1: the church. And he would come over and have sleepovers.
• 29:33
  Speaker 1: We had no idea that he's in his 40s now. No,
• 29:38
  Speaker 1: maybe almost 50 because Christopher would have been 50. He's
• 29:40
  Speaker 1: the same age. Christopher would have been the same age
• 29:42
  Speaker 1: as Will. And you're the same age as Jonathan, Evan.
• 29:45
  Speaker 1: you have a few siblings in between we have none
• 29:47
  Speaker 1: but anyway um Hank would have been in his 50s
• 29:51
  Speaker 1: and he has reached out and told me he said
• 29:54
  Speaker 1: I didn't know what a father was like I didn't
• 29:57
  Speaker 1: know what a together family was like because his mom
• 30:01
  Speaker 1: was a single mom And he said, but I saw,
• 30:04
  Speaker 1: and we had no idea. He saw us in that
• 30:07
  Speaker 1: role of being mentored. And all he was, was spending
• 30:09
  Speaker 1: time with Christopher in our home. And so for these
• 30:13
  Speaker 1: young ones, it's like, you may feel a little disconnected.
• 30:17
  Speaker 1: Maybe you don't have an intact family or even a
• 30:19
  Speaker 1: Christian home. We can just scoop these kids up out
• 30:22
  Speaker 1: of the schools and bring them into the family of God.
• 30:26
  Speaker 1: And those of us that are older, open our homes
• 30:28
  Speaker 1: and We do have a formal mentoring program here at
• 30:30
  Speaker 1: Harvest for anyone who's out there. We love that. I
• 30:32
  Speaker 1: do love that.
• 30:33
  Speaker 2: I see that in your women's ministry.
• 30:35
  Speaker 1: We love it. And our small groups are really groups.
• 30:39
  Speaker 1: They're a mixture of age, and there's a lot of
• 30:41
  Speaker 1: mentoring that happens.
• 30:42
  Speaker 3: Well, I think that a lot of people are coming
• 30:44
  Speaker 3: from broken homes, like you just mentioned. And when I
• 30:48
  Speaker 3: came into the church, my mother was married and divorced
• 30:51
  Speaker 3: seven times. I had no father. So I was looking
• 30:54
  Speaker 3: for a father figure. And I was effectively looking for
• 30:57
  Speaker 3: a mother figure, but a godly one. And so as
• 31:00
  Speaker 3: a younger person, the funny thing is I didn't necessarily
• 31:02
  Speaker 3: want to hang around people my own age because I thought, well,
• 31:05
  Speaker 3: what do they know? They don't know much more than
• 31:08
  Speaker 3: I know. But these older folks, I want to hang
• 31:11
  Speaker 3: around them. And one of the great privileges of my
• 31:13
  Speaker 3: life was getting to know your grandfather and spend time
• 31:16
  Speaker 3: with them. And certainly he was a father figure to
• 31:19
  Speaker 3: me and many others. But But the Billy Graham privately
• 31:23
  Speaker 3: was even more impressive than the public Billy. What do
• 31:27
  Speaker 3: you mean by that? Well, he, as a preacher, he
• 31:30
  Speaker 3: had no rival. He was, I think, probably the greatest
• 31:34
  Speaker 3: preacher in history. That's my opinion. And I love every
• 31:38
  Speaker 3: phase of him. I love the younger Billy. But my
• 31:41
  Speaker 3: favorite Billy was the older Billy, where he slowed down.
• 31:45
  Speaker 3: The younger Billy, he spoke very quickly. And moved around
• 31:50
  Speaker 3: a lot. But as he got older, he paused more.
• 31:56
  Speaker 3: He was the grandfather figure. But privately, he was such
• 32:01
  Speaker 3: a great listener. Like when you talk to your grandfather,
• 32:06
  Speaker 3: he would say, well, tell me about yourself. And I
• 32:09
  Speaker 3: was always asking him about people he had met. Tell me,
• 32:12
  Speaker 3: you met Golda Meir. You met Muhammad Ali. You met
• 32:15
  Speaker 3: this person. Tell me about them. He'd say a few things.
• 32:18
  Speaker 3: But then he would say, tell me about yourself. And
• 32:20
  Speaker 3: he really was interested in other people. He made you
• 32:24
  Speaker 3: feel very special. And just watching him interact with your grandmother.
• 32:29
  Speaker 2: What was the first time you met him?
• 32:31
  Speaker 3: I met him briefly in the 70s in a hallway.
• 32:34
  Speaker 3: Then I really kind of got to know him better
• 32:37
  Speaker 3: in 1985 when he was doing his crusade in Angel Stadium.
• 32:42
  Speaker 3: And I was a pastor at that point. And I'd
• 32:45
  Speaker 3: become friends with your father. And Billy asked me, I
• 32:49
  Speaker 3: want you to be a friend to my son. And
• 32:52
  Speaker 3: I said, I will.
• 32:53
  Speaker 2: How did you meet my dad?
• 32:54
  Speaker 3: I met your dad through Dennis Agajania. Of course. He said,
• 32:59
  Speaker 3: I want you to meet Franklin. So Franklin came up
• 33:02
  Speaker 3: to a midweek Bible study at our church. And then
• 33:05
  Speaker 3: we had a meal together. And then we became friends.
• 33:08
  Speaker 3: And we've known each other, my goodness, for so long.
• 33:11
  Speaker 3: And I have all these drawings I've done of your father.
• 33:14
  Speaker 3: And now I have to, you know, draw the older Franklin.
• 33:17
  Speaker 2: With the hair.
• 33:18
  Speaker 3: His hair's white now. But, you know, and I draw
• 33:22
  Speaker 3: Dennis Segajanian and Skip Pitek. We've all been friends for
• 33:25
  Speaker 3: so many years. And you kids have been friends with
• 33:28
  Speaker 3: the children, with Nathan and you and Christopher and Jonathan.
• 33:32
  Speaker 3: But just, you know, your grandfather was, he was just
• 33:38
  Speaker 3: such a joy to be around. And it was my
• 33:40
  Speaker 3: privilege to, to help him a little bit with the
• 33:42
  Speaker 3: sermon prep. Because as he was coming toward the end
• 33:45
  Speaker 3: of his crusade ministry, I was just starting mine. He said, Greg,
• 33:49
  Speaker 3: I want you to help me with my illustrations. So
• 33:52
  Speaker 3: I would go through his sermons and I would find
• 33:55
  Speaker 3: current illustrations that said what he wanted to say. I
• 33:59
  Speaker 3: remember one time he was speaking in Minnesota and smashing pumpkins.
• 34:07
  Speaker 3: Was popular at that point. The funny thing, the lead
• 34:10
  Speaker 3: singer of Smashing Pumpkins just came out recently and said
• 34:14
  Speaker 3: he's a Christian. That was interesting. But they had a
• 34:17
  Speaker 3: song called Rat in the Cage. So I wrote the
• 34:19
  Speaker 3: lyrics out. Smashing Pumpkins has a song called Rat in
• 34:24
  Speaker 3: the Cage. I gave some of the lyrics. Then I
• 34:26
  Speaker 3: put a note in the margin. Billy.
• 34:27
  Speaker 2: Billy.
• 34:28
  Speaker 3: This is a rock band. Because I thought, what is
• 34:30
  Speaker 3: he going to think? Smashing pumpkins. What does that even mean?
• 34:34
  Speaker 3: And when he delivered that little part of his message.
• 34:38
  Speaker 2: We need to see if we can find that. I
• 34:39
  Speaker 2: know we have it in our archives somewhere.
• 34:40
  Speaker 3: I listened to your grandfather on Sirius XM. I heard
• 34:44
  Speaker 3: the sermon. He did. And I heard him say it.
• 34:46
  Speaker 3: I was so excited because I thought, I've always wondered.
• 34:49
  Speaker 3: I think it was the 90s, early 90s. We should
• 34:52
  Speaker 3: try to find it. But I had more joy then.
• 34:56
  Speaker 3: Supplying something that helped him than even if I did
• 35:00
  Speaker 3: it in my own sermon, because he was just such
• 35:03
  Speaker 3: a wonderful man and great. And your grandmother, you know,
• 35:08
  Speaker 3: I probably spent more time with her than him because
• 35:11
  Speaker 3: he was gone so often. So we would speak at
• 35:13
  Speaker 3: the cove. And she would always invite us over for lunch.
• 35:16
  Speaker 3: She would order takeout from a Chinese restaurant.
• 35:19
  Speaker 2: And probably Haagen-Dazs vanilla ice cream with hot fudge.
• 35:22
  Speaker 3: Yeah, and she would wash the dishes after. You remember
• 35:25
  Speaker 3: that sign over her sink?
• 35:28
  Speaker 2: Oh no, over the sink?
• 35:29
  Speaker 1: Divine service rendered three times a day.
• 35:32
  Speaker 3: But the best part was the welcome mat. You went
• 35:34
  Speaker 3: up to the home of Billy and Ruth Graham and
• 35:36
  Speaker 3: the mat in front of the door said, not you again.
• 35:40
  Speaker 3: That was her humor though.
• 35:41
  Speaker 1: She had the best sense of humor. I think you're
• 35:45
  Speaker 1: Although I didn't spend a lot of time alone with
• 35:48
  Speaker 1: your grandmother, when we talk about people who have influenced
• 35:52
  Speaker 1: your life, I would say your grandmother influenced my life
• 35:58
  Speaker 1: through her books and her writings. Legacy of a Pack
• 36:01
  Speaker 1: Rat was so charming to read her notes, to read
• 36:04
  Speaker 1: also her biography. But what I really related to was
• 36:09
  Speaker 1: her book, Prodigals and Those Who Love Them.
• 36:11
  Speaker 3: Largely about your dad. Because when I was going through....
• 36:15
  Speaker 1: You know, those phases with Jonathan and then later with Christopher,
• 36:19
  Speaker 1: I found this friend, this amazing woman who, you know,
• 36:24
  Speaker 1: a lot of people want to put your grandmother and
• 36:26
  Speaker 1: grandfather like they're in stained glass, you know, that they
• 36:28
  Speaker 1: never had a problem. Everything was always perfect. But as
• 36:32
  Speaker 1: I read this, I saw the hurt in her own
• 36:36
  Speaker 1: life and where she went with that hurt. And rather
• 36:40
  Speaker 1: than give you a one, two, three formula, this is
• 36:42
  Speaker 1: how you get your prodigal to come back. she gave
• 36:45
  Speaker 1: me stories and illustrations and moments in her life that
• 36:51
  Speaker 1: I could just watch how she handled it and where
• 36:54
  Speaker 1: she took those pains, which you tell the story of St.
• 36:58
  Speaker 1: Augustine and his mother who prayed for him. And I
• 37:02
  Speaker 1: just thought, I'm not alone. I think sometimes when we
• 37:04
  Speaker 1: go through hard things and we were talking about mentoring or,
• 37:08
  Speaker 1: or even the importance of godly friendships is that we
• 37:11
  Speaker 1: learn so much and by just being around and watching.
• 37:16
  Speaker 1: And celebrity culture comes and goes. People disappoint us. They're
• 37:21
  Speaker 1: immediately elevated to great prominence. But when you find a Christian,
• 37:27
  Speaker 1: a leader who has lived enough life and lived a
• 37:31
  Speaker 1: transparent enough life through their writings, through their conversations, those
• 37:37
  Speaker 1: are the people that are worth sitting down at their
• 37:40
  Speaker 1: feet and learning from.
• 37:42
  Speaker 3: And what a wonderful balance she was.
• 37:43
  Speaker 1: Ruth was spiritual, but she wasn't religious.
• 37:45
  Speaker 2: No.
• 37:45
  Speaker 3: And by religious, I mean she was fun-loving. She was
• 37:49
  Speaker 3: quick to laugh. When I was around your grandfather, I
• 37:52
  Speaker 3: was always on my best behavior. Even after I got
• 37:55
  Speaker 3: to know him.
• 37:56
  Speaker 2: Did you ever do one embarrassing thing? You're like, oh,
• 37:58
  Speaker 2: I wish I just hadn't said that or done. Wish
• 38:00
  Speaker 2: I hadn't told that joke.
• 38:02
  Speaker 3: I'm sure I did. I remember once I was speaking
• 38:06
  Speaker 3: at the cove and your grandfather was sitting out there
• 38:08
  Speaker 3: And he just fully fell asleep. His head was back.
• 38:12
  Speaker 3: Slept through the whole sermon. So, you know, maybe I
• 38:15
  Speaker 3: should have given a better sermon than that. That time.
• 38:17
  Speaker 3: But I was always on my best behavior around him.
• 38:20
  Speaker 3: But I was so comfortable around Ruth. I was the
• 38:23
  Speaker 3: real me with the crazy jokes. And she laughed at everything.
• 38:27
  Speaker 2: She did. She had a sense of humor. If you
• 38:29
  Speaker 2: went to her house, you always had to be careful
• 38:30
  Speaker 2: she served you cake. Because she would put things in
• 38:32
  Speaker 2: the cake. And you could, like, choke on it or
• 38:35
  Speaker 2: break a tooth or... She would have little mice hidden
• 38:38
  Speaker 2: in her walls.
• 38:39
  Speaker 1: Oh, she had a bird, like an old bird's nest
• 38:42
  Speaker 1: that she had probably found in the yard somewhere. And
• 38:44
  Speaker 1: she'd have it tucked into her bean.
• 38:45
  Speaker 3: Remember what she gave Jonathan? Jonathan came to her home
• 38:48
  Speaker 3: and the Toy Story film had just come out, the
• 38:51
  Speaker 3: first one. And the Woody character has a little holster,
• 38:54
  Speaker 3: but they didn't give him a gun. And Ruth looked
• 38:57
  Speaker 3: at him and said, well, where's his gun? And so
• 39:00
  Speaker 3: she went out and took a little twig and broke it.
• 39:02
  Speaker 3: just the right size for Woody's little holster. So Woody
• 39:05
  Speaker 3: had a gun.
• 39:06
  Speaker 2: I've never heard that story.
• 39:07
  Speaker 1: It was so adorable. I wish I had the Woody
• 39:10
  Speaker 1: and I wish I had that little twig.
• 39:11
  Speaker 3: How about the time when George Beverly Shea was firing
• 39:14
  Speaker 3: a machine gun into the woods? Your grandfather was gone.
• 39:17
  Speaker 3: I don't know if he would have approved of this,
• 39:19
  Speaker 3: but Franklin had some kind of a machine gun and
• 39:23
  Speaker 3: Bev Shea, the great song leader, firing it into the woods.
• 39:27
  Speaker 1: And I thought, And your grandmother thought it was.
• 39:30
  Speaker 3: She loved it.
• 39:31
  Speaker 2: She loved it. She loved people in her home.
• 39:32
  Speaker 1: She was so spiritual.
• 39:34
  Speaker 3: She's very hospitable.
• 39:35
  Speaker 1: But naturally spiritual in that she didn't.
• 39:38
  Speaker 3: Put on any airs. The best version of spiritual.
• 39:40
  Speaker 2: Yeah.
• 39:40
  Speaker 3: Yeah. And you talk.
• 39:42
  Speaker 2: About her grace.
• 39:42
  Speaker 1: The sanctified humor.
• 39:44
  Speaker 2: She loved people so well. And you talked about the
• 39:47
  Speaker 2: prodigal son earlier. You know, we never felt that pressure.
• 39:51
  Speaker 2: I've always remembered this quote when somebody was asking her
• 39:53
  Speaker 2: about raising my dad. And she goes, well, God had
• 39:56
  Speaker 2: a problem with his own children. Of course we're going
• 39:58
  Speaker 2: to have problems.
• 39:58
  Speaker 1: He had prodigals too.
• 40:00
  Speaker 2: But for you, you've often said, you know, walking through
• 40:03
  Speaker 2: with a prodigal child. And you were just stating it.
• 40:06
  Speaker 2: How do you find that balance? You are in a spotlight. Mm-hmm.
• 40:10
  Speaker 2: You are at a pulpit. You're teaching women's study. And
• 40:16
  Speaker 2: then your heart is breaking because you know you have
• 40:19
  Speaker 2: a son not choosing to walk with the Lord. How
• 40:22
  Speaker 2: did you balance that?
• 40:23
  Speaker 1: It was interesting. Our boys were never outwardly rebellious. They
• 40:28
  Speaker 1: were never disrespectful to our face, ever. And I know
• 40:32
  Speaker 1: that's not the story of a lot of parents. I
• 40:37
  Speaker 1: think our boys loved us and didn't want to hurt us.
• 40:40
  Speaker 1: So they lived their prodigal life.
• 40:42
  Speaker 2: Did you know they were living a prodigal life? 100%.
• 40:45
  Speaker 1: Oh, yeah. 100%, especially with Christopher. When he moved out
• 40:49
  Speaker 1: and was living on his own and he was going
• 40:51
  Speaker 1: to art school and he was working at a graphic
• 40:57
  Speaker 1: design company. And I had no idea the depth of
• 41:02
  Speaker 1: what he was going through and his struggles. I felt
• 41:05
  Speaker 1: like for us living in the spotlight, there was a
• 41:08
  Speaker 1: certain degree of we want to protect our kids. They
• 41:11
  Speaker 1: are not public figures. They're our kids. So we never
• 41:14
  Speaker 1: took them into the pulpit as illustrations or shared their stories.
• 41:19
  Speaker 1: When the time came, they were able to share their
• 41:22
  Speaker 1: own story. And Jonathan has spoken incredibly beautifully and publicly
• 41:27
  Speaker 1: about his prodigal journey. And that's his story to tell.
• 41:31
  Speaker 1: Greg always was very... He always, always wanted to keep
• 41:36
  Speaker 1: that door open of communication, that there was always, we
• 41:40
  Speaker 1: were always there to love and support them and to
• 41:44
  Speaker 1: speak out when they were doing the wrong things and
• 41:46
  Speaker 1: tell them the truth, 100% on that. But, you know,
• 41:49
  Speaker 1: for Christopher, he was an adult. Jonathan, to some degree,
• 41:52
  Speaker 1: was also an adult. He was in his 20s by
• 41:54
  Speaker 1: the time he was really going after, you know, he's
• 41:57
  Speaker 1: trying to live in one foot in both worlds. What
• 42:00
  Speaker 1: is so strange to see is that they were in
• 42:02
  Speaker 1: the church. They were in Sunday. They were in the
• 42:06
  Speaker 1: front row listening to sermons. And I think that's where
• 42:11
  Speaker 1: the wrenching was in their life. They had the truth
• 42:16
  Speaker 1: of the gospel. Thank God they would both say we
• 42:19
  Speaker 1: were never hypocrites in the home. We were not perfect, obviously.
• 42:22
  Speaker 2: Yeah, it says a lot that they wanted to honor
• 42:24
  Speaker 2: you still.
• 42:25
  Speaker 1: They did. And Greg was really— there were times when I
• 42:29
  Speaker 1: would get very angry sometimes. With Christopher and Greg would
• 42:34
  Speaker 1: come to me and say, Kathy, that's not the hill
• 42:36
  Speaker 1: you want to die on. Don't make that the big
• 42:41
  Speaker 1: conflict in the home over whatever. You got home late
• 42:44
  Speaker 1: or you left your room messy or you did whatever.
• 42:47
  Speaker 1: He always wanted Christopher to have an open conversation or relationship.
• 42:52
  Speaker 1: And so, yeah, I mean, when they're little, it's like, oh,
• 42:55
  Speaker 1: clean up after yourself and do your chores and do that.
• 42:57
  Speaker 1: And then they'll come to those years, teenage years where
• 43:00
  Speaker 1: you realize, If you fight at every front, you're going
• 43:04
  Speaker 1: to lose the relationship. So like Dr. Dobson says, you
• 43:09
  Speaker 1: just like the rapids. You're on whitewater rapids as you're
• 43:13
  Speaker 1: going through those adolescent years.
• 43:15
  Speaker 3: You have a teenager now, sissy. Dr. Dobson said, you know,
• 43:20
  Speaker 3: raising a teenager is like, Being in a boat on
• 43:23
  Speaker 3: the rapids, your objective is just survive it.
• 43:26
  Speaker 1: Hold on. And this is the guy who wrote Dare
• 43:29
  Speaker 1: to Discipline.
• 43:29
  Speaker 3: Yes.
• 43:30
  Speaker 2: Right?
• 43:30
  Speaker 1: When they're little.
• 43:31
  Speaker 3: But some are easier than others, so too.
• 43:33
  Speaker 1: 100%.
• 43:34
  Speaker 2: My oldest two are probably the easiest. My third one's
• 43:36
  Speaker 2: to come. She's a tough cookie.
• 43:38
  Speaker 3: Yes.
• 43:39
  Speaker 2: Kathy, I remember you one time told me, and something
• 43:42
  Speaker 2: I've thought about ever since, you one time told me
• 43:44
  Speaker 2: that God had taken one son and gave you back another.
• 43:49
  Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah.
• 43:51
  Speaker 2: Can you explain that?
• 43:52
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 43:53
  Speaker 2: And that's hard. Those are hard words for a mom.
• 43:57
  Speaker 1: I didn't realize it until maybe six months later. The struggle,
• 44:03
  Speaker 1: the deep struggle that Jonathan was in. I mean, he
• 44:07
  Speaker 1: was really struggling. He wanted to walk with the Lord,
• 44:10
  Speaker 1: but he had a circle of friends and he had
• 44:13
  Speaker 1: habits and he would even say addictions to things that
• 44:16
  Speaker 1: he couldn't. And he tried, he would try on his
• 44:19
  Speaker 1: own to stop. But then he would be tempted again,
• 44:22
  Speaker 1: and the very next day, he'd find himself back in
• 44:25
  Speaker 1: that cycle. And so he was going through that. Christopher
• 44:30
  Speaker 1: had settled. He had come through those prodigal years. He
• 44:32
  Speaker 1: was married. He had a child. He had another child
• 44:36
  Speaker 1: on the way. And when the Lord took Christopher suddenly
• 44:39
  Speaker 1: that day, I was so consumed with my thoughts of Greg,
• 44:45
  Speaker 1: number one. Number two, Brittany, my daughter-in-law, who was a
• 44:49
  Speaker 1: relatively young believer, I thought, What if she walks away?
• 44:53
  Speaker 1: What if she just literally says, this is your God.
• 44:56
  Speaker 1: And he takes my husband, leaves me with a two-year-old
• 44:59
  Speaker 1: and I'm pregnant. What kind of a God is that?
• 45:01
  Speaker 1: And so I was just like, I've got to help
• 45:03
  Speaker 1: her stand steady. And then there was Jonathan and he
• 45:08
  Speaker 1: came home that day and he walked in the front
• 45:11
  Speaker 1: door and my mind was on Stella, our two-year-old granddaughter.
• 45:15
  Speaker 1: My mind was on Brittany. I feared that she might
• 45:16
  Speaker 1: lose her child. My fear was that She may walk away.
• 45:20
  Speaker 1: She may drive away in the car this afternoon. I
• 45:22
  Speaker 1: may never see her again. She might say, I don't
• 45:24
  Speaker 1: want anything to do with you or your family. And
• 45:26
  Speaker 1: I thought, what are we going to do? And so
• 45:28
  Speaker 1: I missed what happened, what was happening in Jonathan's heart.
• 45:32
  Speaker 1: But he's shared the story. He went up to his
• 45:34
  Speaker 1: room and took all the things that he knew that
• 45:37
  Speaker 1: were temptations for him. And he gathered them up and
• 45:40
  Speaker 1: he threw them away. And he rededicated his life to
• 45:43
  Speaker 1: the Lord. And it was Levi Lusko who actually came
• 45:46
  Speaker 1: to us and told us, within a week or two
• 45:50
  Speaker 1: of that happening, he says, Jonathan wants to quit his job.
• 45:54
  Speaker 1: He had a great job with a future and a
• 45:57
  Speaker 1: good promising career to make a living for himself that
• 46:01
  Speaker 1: he wanted to quit his job. And he said, I
• 46:04
  Speaker 1: want to quit my job and I want to help
• 46:06
  Speaker 1: my dad. And I was like, we never put on
• 46:10
  Speaker 1: our kids that you will serve God in ministry. We
• 46:12
  Speaker 1: just said, just love the Lord. There was never that expectation.
• 46:16
  Speaker 1: So when he said that, I was like, Lord, I
• 46:19
  Speaker 1: was like, what does that even mean? But I knew
• 46:22
  Speaker 1: that it was this complete 180 in his life that
• 46:27
  Speaker 1: he said that. And in reflecting, you know, there were
• 46:33
  Speaker 1: times in my journal when I wrote, Lord, why did
• 46:38
  Speaker 1: I have to lose Christopher in order to see this
• 46:42
  Speaker 1: transformation in Jonathan? And I don't have an answer to
• 46:45
  Speaker 1: that question. I don't think that's what God does. Oh,
• 46:48
  Speaker 1: I'm going to take this one and give you that one.
• 46:51
  Speaker 1: But that was definitely the good things that come out
• 46:55
  Speaker 1: of the bad things that I could say. The bad
• 46:57
  Speaker 1: is still bad. Losing Christopher was the most traumatic and
• 47:01
  Speaker 1: difficult thing we've ever been through and continues to be
• 47:05
  Speaker 1: a hard thing in my life and a sad thing
• 47:07
  Speaker 1: in my life. But the fact that I've seen this
• 47:11
  Speaker 1: result and And Jonathan one day will stand next to
• 47:16
  Speaker 1: his brother Christopher in eternity and say, you know, when
• 47:19
  Speaker 1: you died, I got new life. Out of that came my,
• 47:24
  Speaker 1: you know, my spiritual life, my ministry, and now my
• 47:28
  Speaker 1: family and my children. And it's a beautiful thing, but
• 47:32
  Speaker 1: it's still a sad thing. I still get a lump
• 47:33
  Speaker 1: in my throat when I say it because, yeah.
• 47:36
  Speaker 3: It's great. I'm sorry.
• 47:38
  Speaker 2: Can I ask you one question?
• 47:39
  Speaker 3: Please.
• 47:39
  Speaker 2: I've always wanted to ask you about this. I remember
• 47:44
  Speaker 2: my dad's conversation with you after Christopher. And you had
• 47:48
  Speaker 2: a lot of conversations, and I'm sure that those days
• 47:50
  Speaker 2: are blurry. You might not even remember it. And I
• 47:52
  Speaker 2: remember when my dad got off. I just can't believe.
• 47:55
  Speaker 2: That was like tough love. Like, Dad, how could you
• 47:57
  Speaker 2: say that? And I remember him telling you.
• 48:00
  Speaker 1: How old were you? Well, Jonathan was.
• 48:03
  Speaker 2: I was the same as Jonathan. We were born the
• 48:05
  Speaker 2: same week.
• 48:05
  Speaker 1: He was 21. You were 21. You were 21.
• 48:09
  Speaker 2: I can't remember if I'd just gotten married or not
• 48:11
  Speaker 2: married yet, but I just remember my dad encouraging you
• 48:16
  Speaker 2: or telling you, Greg, get back in your pulpit this Sunday.
• 48:20
  Speaker 2: Tell your congregation you're hurting, you're in pain, but tell
• 48:25
  Speaker 2: them you're still preaching. And you didn't give a message.
• 48:28
  Speaker 2: I don't believe you gave a message, but you did address.
• 48:31
  Speaker 2: And I remember my dad asking, or when my dad
• 48:34
  Speaker 2: got off, I said, dad, why would you tell him
• 48:35
  Speaker 2: to get up and give him a break? Give him
• 48:37
  Speaker 2: some time off. And he said, no, Satan doesn't need
• 48:40
  Speaker 2: any room to get in Greg's heart. He needs to
• 48:43
  Speaker 2: be reminded God is good.
• 48:45
  Speaker 3: Wow. Well, that was good advice. And that's what I did.
• 48:50
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 48:50
  Speaker 3: I actually, Christopher died on a Thursday. And we were
• 48:55
  Speaker 3: in church on Sunday. Yeah. And I remember people saying,
• 48:58
  Speaker 3: we couldn't believe you were in church. It took so
• 49:00
  Speaker 3: much strength. I thought, gosh, strength. Where else would we be?
• 49:04
  Speaker 3: I was weak. I was weak. I needed church. I
• 49:08
  Speaker 3: needed the Word of God. I needed to worship. There
• 49:11
  Speaker 3: was no place I would rather be. And I did
• 49:14
  Speaker 3: get up in the pulpit. And the last song that
• 49:17
  Speaker 3: was sung by our worship band before I got up
• 49:20
  Speaker 3: there was I Still Believe, a song written by Jeremy
• 49:23
  Speaker 3: Camp after his wife died. i still believe in your
• 49:28
  Speaker 3: faithfulness i still believe in your love and i don't
• 49:31
  Speaker 3: remember what i had planned on saying but i just
• 49:34
  Speaker 3: led with that and i walked up and said i
• 49:36
  Speaker 3: still believe and you know it was a hard moment
• 49:41
  Speaker 3: but A very important moment. And, you know, we have
• 49:45
  Speaker 3: to just, when we're facing this crisis, we have to
• 49:49
  Speaker 3: face the reality of it, but take hold of the
• 49:53
  Speaker 3: promises of God and God will strengthen us and give
• 49:57
  Speaker 3: us the strength we need when we need it. And
• 50:00
  Speaker 3: just a week or two after that, I preached at
• 50:02
  Speaker 3: our crusade. And that was like, people say, was that hard? No,
• 50:07
  Speaker 3: everything else was hard except that. And the reason for
• 50:11
  Speaker 3: that was, You know, prior to that, I'm just dealing
• 50:14
  Speaker 3: with the pain, the loss that, you know, all the
• 50:16
  Speaker 3: things that come with it. And being a public person,
• 50:19
  Speaker 3: everyone comes up to you. Many people you don't know
• 50:23
  Speaker 3: with their words of whatever those words are. Some are
• 50:26
  Speaker 3: meant to be comforting. I heard a lot of crazy
• 50:29
  Speaker 3: things that weren't always that helpful. But when I got
• 50:32
  Speaker 3: on that pulpit, I knew I have a job to do.
• 50:34
  Speaker 3: And it was interesting because Christopher, being an artist, had
• 50:37
  Speaker 3: designed all the art that was on the screen. So
• 50:39
  Speaker 3: I was surrounded by his designs. that he had built
• 50:42
  Speaker 3: for that crusade. That inspired me. And I thought of
• 50:45
  Speaker 3: him in heaven. And I thought there's nothing I would
• 50:49
  Speaker 3: rather do than point people to Christ. And you know,
• 50:53
  Speaker 3: the Bible says that there's joy in the presence of
• 50:55
  Speaker 3: the angels over one sinner that comes to repentance. So
• 50:58
  Speaker 3: as we saw people come to Christ in that crusade
• 51:01
  Speaker 3: in particular in 2008, I thought, well, maybe Christopher's aware
• 51:05
  Speaker 3: of this. There's a shout in heaven as people believe.
• 51:08
  Speaker 3: And maybe he even knows that this was connected to
• 51:11
  Speaker 3: his life. So that was my moment of relief because
• 51:16
  Speaker 3: I had to be, you know, when you're preaching the gospel,
• 51:18
  Speaker 3: you've got to focus. You can't be thinking about yourself
• 51:21
  Speaker 3: or anything else. Like I have a job to do
• 51:24
  Speaker 3: and I've got to do this job well. And so
• 51:28
  Speaker 3: that's what I did. But your father's advice was, was
• 51:33
  Speaker 3: really helpful. Franklin, you know, Franklin's very blunt. He'll always
• 51:40
  Speaker 3: tell you his opinion. And, you know, we've had our
• 51:44
  Speaker 3: little disagreements here and there, but I've never doubted his
• 51:49
  Speaker 3: love for me, his friendship that we have had, and
• 51:52
  Speaker 3: he's been a true friend, and I've tried to be
• 51:54
  Speaker 3: a true friend to him too. And it was good
• 51:59
  Speaker 3: to hear that.
• 52:00
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 52:01
  Speaker 3: But I do remember also that, you know, he wanted
• 52:05
  Speaker 3: to help me in his way. You know, your dad's
• 52:07
  Speaker 3: very strong, but he's very tenderhearted.
• 52:09
  Speaker 1: 100%.
• 52:10
  Speaker 3: You know, and you've seen that. I've seen that. When
• 52:14
  Speaker 3: he goes and ministers to hurting people, I mean, so
• 52:18
  Speaker 3: much of what he does isn't in the press. We
• 52:21
  Speaker 3: see him preaching. We see him making a bold stand
• 52:24
  Speaker 3: on this topic or that topic. But so much of
• 52:26
  Speaker 3: what he does is helping people. people experiencing the worst
• 52:30
  Speaker 3: pain imaginable, but not just hurting. He's doing something. And
• 52:36
  Speaker 3: he's a great strategist, in addition to being a great preacher.
• 52:40
  Speaker 3: He knows how to do, like, let's do this. And
• 52:44
  Speaker 3: he'll come up with a plan, and it will be
• 52:46
  Speaker 3: a practical plan and an effective plan that will help
• 52:50
  Speaker 3: people not only spiritually, but in their immediate needs as well.
• 52:54
  Speaker 2: I think as I get older, I'm so thankful. Yeah.
• 52:58
  Speaker 2: for parents, but also their friends. And y'all are that,
• 53:02
  Speaker 2: and you have been steady through all the tribulations you
• 53:07
  Speaker 2: faced in the heartache. You've never taken your eyes off
• 53:11
  Speaker 2: the cross. And I think that was my heart behind
• 53:14
  Speaker 2: writing these words was that we have a destination and
• 53:17
  Speaker 2: that destination is heaven. And when we have a destination,
• 53:21
  Speaker 2: it gives us a hope. And so, We are to
• 53:25
  Speaker 2: speak it. We are to teach it. We are to
• 53:26
  Speaker 2: live it with urgency. You've always done that. You've been
• 53:29
  Speaker 2: a pastor, but you've been an evangelist. Very little do
• 53:32
  Speaker 2: we see pastors evangelizing behind the pulpit anymore. And I
• 53:36
  Speaker 2: just want to say thank you. It's not just my
• 53:38
  Speaker 2: family's legacy. It's their friends that have walked. I've watched y'all,
• 53:42
  Speaker 2: as you mentioned, Skip, you, we as children, and Dennis.
• 53:47
  Speaker 2: We've watched y'all live faithfully and never taken your eyes
• 53:50
  Speaker 2: off the cross, especially in a world where there's so
• 53:53
  Speaker 2: many pastors. who are fallen with pride or temptation and
• 53:57
  Speaker 2: some kind of sin.
• 54:00
  Speaker 1: I'm so grateful for the friendships we have. I think that,
• 54:04
  Speaker 1: you know, we are called to walk our lives before
• 54:07
  Speaker 1: the Lord in a relationship with him, a personal relationship
• 54:10
  Speaker 1: with Christ. But we are also called to be part
• 54:14
  Speaker 1: of a family and part. I mean, Jesus had Peter, James,
• 54:18
  Speaker 1: and John. He had 12 apostles. Then he also had
• 54:21
  Speaker 1: a multitude of people that followed him, others who served
• 54:24
  Speaker 1: him in ministry, including the women. But he had these
• 54:28
  Speaker 1: three close friends. And I think that today, in a
• 54:32
  Speaker 1: day where we have friends on Facebook or followers on Instagram,
• 54:38
  Speaker 1: these are not people. These are just numbers. Who knows
• 54:41
  Speaker 1: who they are? But we really need to be rooted
• 54:44
  Speaker 1: in communities where we have genuine, authentic, godly friendships and
• 54:49
  Speaker 1: choosing your friends wisely. And we are all influenced. Even
• 54:55
  Speaker 1: though we would like to think we're not, we are
• 54:57
  Speaker 1: going to be influenced by the people that are closest
• 55:00
  Speaker 1: to us. You know, like girls in high school, you'll
• 55:02
  Speaker 1: find them starting to talk like each other. They'll use
• 55:05
  Speaker 1: the same expressions or dress alike. You see it oftentimes
• 55:09
  Speaker 1: in this. But even as adults, we can be influenced.
• 55:12
  Speaker 1: And so to me, really being intentional in finding godly friendships,
• 55:19
  Speaker 1: biblical friendships, friendships, people whose highest priority is to follow
• 55:24
  Speaker 1: the Lord, but also have the love in their hearts
• 55:28
  Speaker 1: to include others and share. It's not a competition. We're
• 55:32
  Speaker 1: not trying to outdo each other. We are trying to
• 55:35
  Speaker 1: encourage each other. What your dad did for Greg saying,
• 55:38
  Speaker 1: you know, get back in the pulpit is like giving
• 55:41
  Speaker 1: Greg a focus because sometimes in grief, you can just
• 55:45
  Speaker 1: get stuck and you just stay sad and you don't see.
• 55:49
  Speaker 1: And the more you indulge in wallowing your sorrows and
• 55:53
  Speaker 1: your sadness. You don't want to leave the room. I
• 55:55
  Speaker 1: can understand that. There were times you just want to
• 55:58
  Speaker 1: pull the shades and just say, I don't want to
• 55:59
  Speaker 1: go out. I don't want to see anybody. I want
• 56:01
  Speaker 1: to do anything. And you just stay stuck. And that's
• 56:04
  Speaker 1: not good. But grief also needs a purpose. And when
• 56:08
  Speaker 1: you say heaven is a destination, but heaven is also
• 56:12
  Speaker 1: a motivation. And God saves us for a reason. He
• 56:16
  Speaker 1: saves us for a purpose. And I see that in
• 56:18
  Speaker 1: your life. I see that in Greg's life. I'm happy
• 56:21
  Speaker 1: to be standing behind him and supporting him in his calling.
• 56:25
  Speaker 1: That's my calling. I'm called to be his wife. So
• 56:29
  Speaker 1: that's a great joy for me and for my ministry
• 56:32
  Speaker 1: to come alongside and complement his ministry, which is obviously
• 56:36
  Speaker 1: leading a church and what he does with evangelism.
• 56:40
  Speaker 3: Coming back to you. Sorry.
• 56:41
  Speaker 1: Oh, just to finish up. But yeah, discovering that calling
• 56:46
  Speaker 1: and that purpose is... It's not just like you're going
• 56:48
  Speaker 1: to be saved and then he's going to pluck you
• 56:50
  Speaker 1: out and take you to heaven one day. It's like
• 56:51
  Speaker 1: you have a path to follow. You have a purpose
• 56:54
  Speaker 1: for your life. You need to find out what that is.
• 56:57
  Speaker 1: God gives you gifts for a reason. He gives you
• 57:00
  Speaker 1: opportunities for a reason. And that we are to leverage
• 57:04
  Speaker 1: those for the kingdom because for me one day it's
• 57:06
  Speaker 1: going to be done. You won't be leading anybody to
• 57:08
  Speaker 1: Jesus when you get to heaven. They'll all be there.
• 57:11
  Speaker 3: I wanted to tell you one more story about your grandfather.
• 57:13
  Speaker 3: He was speaking in Portland, Oregon. And it was almost
• 57:18
  Speaker 3: a revival-like atmosphere, just amazing response. So he comes off
• 57:22
  Speaker 3: the platform, and he's walking to his car, and there's
• 57:25
  Speaker 3: crowds of people on both sides. They're looking at him like,
• 57:30
  Speaker 3: it's Moses. And it was Billy. And I was walking
• 57:33
  Speaker 3: behind him. And so we got into the car. So T.W. Wilson,
• 57:38
  Speaker 3: Billy's longtime friend, was driving. I was riding shotgun, your
• 57:42
  Speaker 3: father and your grandfather in the backseat. So we're driving out.
• 57:46
  Speaker 3: So I wanted to say something to Billy to compliment him.
• 57:48
  Speaker 3: I turned around and I said, Billy, that was a
• 57:50
  Speaker 3: great message tonight. Billy looks at me and says, it's
• 57:54
  Speaker 3: just gospel. I turned back around like, well, okay. I
• 57:59
  Speaker 3: know that. I was just trying to compliment him. And
• 58:02
  Speaker 3: then I thought of another. I'll say something specific. I
• 58:05
  Speaker 3: turned back around. Billy, I loved it when you said
• 58:08
  Speaker 3: Christ can resensitize your conscience. He said, well, he can't.
• 58:13
  Speaker 3: I turned back around. But see, I learned something from that,
• 58:16
  Speaker 3: and that was Billy did not want to bask in glory.
• 58:21
  Speaker 3: He was done. He did his job. And so we
• 58:25
  Speaker 3: went back to the hotel, and someone had given him
• 58:28
  Speaker 3: some sandwiches, some roast beef sandwiches to eat. They were
• 58:32
  Speaker 3: hot when we got them originally, but by the time
• 58:34
  Speaker 3: we got back to the hotel, they were cold. So
• 58:37
  Speaker 3: we go up to Billy's room. He disappears for a
• 58:40
  Speaker 3: little bit, comes out in his pajamas and his dress shoes.
• 58:43
  Speaker 3: I don't think he had slippers. His dress shoes. Well,
• 58:47
  Speaker 3: I guess Billy feels comfortable around me. He's in his pajamas.
• 58:50
  Speaker 3: But he was surrounded by his friends, including TW. And
• 58:54
  Speaker 3: they started telling old stories and laughing. And I was
• 58:57
  Speaker 3: learning as an evangelist. Don't take yourself too seriously. Take
• 59:02
  Speaker 3: your message very seriously. Deliver your message and return to normalcy.
• 59:08
  Speaker 3: And that's exactly what he did. He was with people
• 59:11
  Speaker 3: that loved him. but he could enjoy some laughs. and
• 59:16
  Speaker 3: And he was very down to earth. And your dad's
• 59:19
  Speaker 3: that way, too. Your dad, he's a humble guy. He's
• 59:22
  Speaker 3: very down to earth. He likes basic things. He travels
• 59:25
  Speaker 3: the world in these most amazing places. And he takes
• 59:29
  Speaker 3: pictures of himself at McDonald's. People, they go, that's an act. No,
• 59:34
  Speaker 3: he likes that food. He actually did a post about McDonald's.
• 59:38
  Speaker 3: Bringing back the.
• 59:40
  Speaker 1: Fried apple pie. They are good.
• 59:42
  Speaker 2: And they came back for the 250th anniversary of America.
• 59:46
  Speaker 2: I'm going to thank dad and his social media after
• 59:48
  Speaker 2: all those years of campaigning.
• 59:50
  Speaker 3: But that's just, you know, I just said, I mean, boom,
• 59:53
  Speaker 3: I think it's closed or maybe it's open still. We
• 59:55
  Speaker 3: always went to a place called Woodlands.
• 59:57
  Speaker 2: Okay. So funny story. Woodlands closed down a few years.
• 1:00:01
  Speaker 2: years back. And I mean, we would go as a
• 1:00:04
  Speaker 2: family multiple times a week. I mean, they knew dad
• 1:00:08
  Speaker 2: and they did all the catering anytime. Like I remember
• 1:00:11
  Speaker 2: that for the Billy Graham library opening, the presidents were there,
• 1:00:13
  Speaker 2: they did the catering. So long story short, a barbecue
• 1:00:17
  Speaker 2: place just opened back up in that restaurant. So we
• 1:00:19
  Speaker 2: went down there and they sat us down in the
• 1:00:21
  Speaker 2: basement because we had kids. We realized they were putting
• 1:00:23
  Speaker 2: kids down the basement. We talked about you and we
• 1:00:26
  Speaker 2: were just reminiscing about all the times. And I said,
• 1:00:29
  Speaker 2: do you remember when we brought Greg Laurie here? And
• 1:00:32
  Speaker 2: these are just memories, funny memories that stick out. You
• 1:00:35
  Speaker 2: put Simpsons on the TV. You were watching The Simpsons
• 1:00:37
  Speaker 2: downstairs at Woodlands.
• 1:00:40
  Speaker 3: I was.
• 1:00:40
  Speaker 2: You had bought some kind of gag gifts at a
• 1:00:42
  Speaker 2: toy store and you were playing with Jonathan and I
• 1:00:44
  Speaker 2: and all this. And dad goes, I remember that day.
• 1:00:47
  Speaker 2: And it's just, there's sweet memories and friendships that, and
• 1:00:53
  Speaker 2: a loyal. I mean, dad is loyal to his friends.
• 1:00:56
  Speaker 2: He loves his friends. fiercely and he's there anytime you
• 1:01:00
  Speaker 2: need him but I'm just I've loved watching y'all's ministries
• 1:01:04
  Speaker 2: grow little did y'all know what God had planned for
• 1:01:07
  Speaker 2: Harvest and Perseverance Purse and if you had known you
• 1:01:10
  Speaker 2: probably wouldn't have done it but it's been nice to
• 1:01:13
  Speaker 2: look back just even as children and seeing God's faithfulness
• 1:01:17
  Speaker 2: in our parents lives.
• 1:01:18
  Speaker 3: Well I maybe should be referring to you as Ambassador
• 1:01:22
  Speaker 3: Graham because no not yet well okay but let's Tell
• 1:01:27
  Speaker 3: them why we would even say that. You have been
• 1:01:30
  Speaker 3: nominated by the president to become the ambassador at large
• 1:01:35
  Speaker 3: for the international religious freedom. Am I saying it right?
• 1:01:39
  Speaker 3: That's right.
• 1:01:39
  Speaker 2: Ambassador at large for international religious freedom. It's a position
• 1:01:42
  Speaker 2: that's been held since 1998. And it's really to advance
• 1:01:47
  Speaker 2: religious freedom around the world, to recognize those who violate
• 1:01:51
  Speaker 2: religious freedom, to help the U.S. in foreign policy. on
• 1:01:55
  Speaker 2: where we can hold strong on religious freedom. And, you know,
• 1:01:59
  Speaker 2: just to really hold those accountable. When we look at
• 1:02:01
  Speaker 2: what the world is facing, especially when we look at Christians,
• 1:02:04
  Speaker 2: what's happening right now around the world, we've been blessed
• 1:02:09
  Speaker 2: beyond imagination in this nation that our forefathers recognized the
• 1:02:14
  Speaker 2: need for religious freedom, that that's the bedrock of this nation.
• 1:02:18
  Speaker 3: That's right.
• 1:02:19
  Speaker 2: And this is not a phone call I ever expected.
• 1:02:22
  Speaker 2: It took me by surprise. And something I probably didn't
• 1:02:27
  Speaker 2: even want to do, not because I don't see the need,
• 1:02:30
  Speaker 2: but I have three children at home.
• 1:02:32
  Speaker 3: Yes.
• 1:02:32
  Speaker 2: I'm a mom. And to work in D.C. and to
• 1:02:36
  Speaker 2: travel back and forth, but praying with it with my husband.
• 1:02:39
  Speaker 2: My husband, Corey, was so clear. He says, if the
• 1:02:42
  Speaker 2: President of the United States called and offered you this,
• 1:02:45
  Speaker 2: you accept and we will find a way.
• 1:02:46
  Speaker 3: Good.
• 1:02:47
  Speaker 2: And that I'm thankful for a supportive husband. But it's
• 1:02:50
  Speaker 2: if I'm confirmed by the Senate. So I have to
• 1:02:52
  Speaker 2: have a Senate hearing.
• 1:02:53
  Speaker 3: Does it make you nervous to think about that? Absolutely. Absolutely.
• 1:02:57
  Speaker 2: I wrote this book, Stand Steady, and now I have
• 1:03:00
  Speaker 2: to have a Senate hearing?
• 1:03:02
  Speaker 1: The timing could not be more. I'm like, Lord, what
• 1:03:05
  Speaker 1: are you doing?
• 1:03:06
  Speaker 2: You know, I got that phone call and then nothing
• 1:03:08
  Speaker 2: ever happened. And I prayed about a week before I
• 1:03:12
  Speaker 2: turned in my final manuscript. I said, Lord, why did
• 1:03:15
  Speaker 2: that phone call come about maybe being an ambassador and
• 1:03:17
  Speaker 2: nothing ever happening? He said, I need you to finish
• 1:03:19
  Speaker 2: this project before I give you the next. And here
• 1:03:22
  Speaker 2: it is just coming weeks after I finished the book.
• 1:03:24
  Speaker 2: But I was reading. Does it make me nervous?
• 1:03:29
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 1:03:30
  Speaker 2: My prayer has been Acts 9 through this whole thing
• 1:03:32
  Speaker 2: is that I would walk in the fear of the
• 1:03:35
  Speaker 2: Lord and be comforted by the Holy Spirit. Because I
• 1:03:39
  Speaker 2: look at the job that is before me. I look
• 1:03:40
  Speaker 2: at the rise of anti-Semitism in this world. Yes. I
• 1:03:43
  Speaker 2: look at the weird Muslims in China that have been
• 1:03:47
  Speaker 2: fiercely persecuted. I look at Christians at large being persecuted
• 1:03:51
  Speaker 2: at such a high rate and at this time in history.
• 1:03:56
  Speaker 2: But I worry for my children as a mom being
• 1:03:57
  Speaker 2: gone more. And it was funny.
• 1:04:01
  Speaker 3: I was reviewing.
• 1:04:02
  Speaker 2: I told Kathy before we started, I was reviewing my
• 1:04:04
  Speaker 2: book because as a writer, you know, you write this
• 1:04:06
  Speaker 2: book a long time ago. And then I was studying
• 1:04:09
  Speaker 2: because I was so afraid you might ask me a question.
• 1:04:11
  Speaker 2: I'm like, oh, I don't remember what page that's on,
• 1:04:13
  Speaker 2: if I was to be honest.
• 1:04:14
  Speaker 1: It's funny.
• 1:04:16
  Speaker 2: And I highlighted this because I needed it. And it said,
• 1:04:20
  Speaker 2: it's when the storm hits and all you want to
• 1:04:22
  Speaker 2: do is return to shore. To stay quiet, stay hidden,
• 1:04:25
  Speaker 2: and avoid the fight. We'll do anything to try to
• 1:04:28
  Speaker 2: get back to the normality of yesterday. The tempest tempts
• 1:04:31
  Speaker 2: us to panic and become overwhelmed by our feelings and confusions.
• 1:04:35
  Speaker 2: Have I been overwhelmed at the task ahead of me?
• 1:04:37
  Speaker 3: Absolutely.
• 1:04:39
  Speaker 2: Don't fall for it. Like David, choose to stand steady
• 1:04:42
  Speaker 2: and say, when I'm afraid, I put my trust in you.
• 1:04:45
  Speaker 2: I needed my own words. I shouldn't say my own words,
• 1:04:50
  Speaker 2: the words God had given me to write down.
• 1:04:53
  Speaker 3: You're going to be confirmed, I believe. And I think
• 1:04:55
  Speaker 3: you're going to do a great job. And, you know,
• 1:04:58
  Speaker 3: I've seen you in settings with the president and in
• 1:05:02
  Speaker 3: You know, I'm not surprised at all that he would
• 1:05:04
  Speaker 3: choose you. When I heard it, I was just delighted.
• 1:05:08
  Speaker 3: And I think you're so uniquely qualified because not only
• 1:05:12
  Speaker 3: of your spiritual foundation, but your experience traveling the world
• 1:05:15
  Speaker 3: with your father, you've seen far more than a young lady.
• 1:05:19
  Speaker 3: And you're still a young lady, by the way. Thanks.
• 1:05:21
  Speaker 3: 40 is young. Well, you know what? When you're 40,
• 1:05:24
  Speaker 3: you think, oh, I'm getting old now. But when you're 73,
• 1:05:27
  Speaker 3: like me, you go, oh, 40, I was still young, right?
• 1:05:29
  Speaker 3: So you are young. I just want you to know that.
• 1:05:31
  Speaker 3: But You know, you're a mature young person. Maybe we'll
• 1:05:36
  Speaker 3: call you a very young, older person. But whatever you
• 1:05:39
  Speaker 3: want to say, I think your unique experiences with your grandfather,
• 1:05:44
  Speaker 3: with your father, with your mother, with your upbringing, with
• 1:05:47
  Speaker 3: your travels and all the things you've seen. I can't
• 1:05:50
  Speaker 3: think of a more qualified person around to take this position.
• 1:05:54
  Speaker 2: Thank you. And I say, am I nervous? It's more
• 1:05:56
  Speaker 2: for my family being gone. I'm excited. I am excited
• 1:06:00
  Speaker 2: when God calls us to do things. It's exciting. And
• 1:06:04
  Speaker 2: so I am excited for it. I got to get
• 1:06:06
  Speaker 2: through a Senate confirmation before the Foreign Relations Committee so
• 1:06:10
  Speaker 2: I could use prayers for those listening. My family and
• 1:06:12
  Speaker 2: I will need your prayers, especially as I prep for that.
• 1:06:15
  Speaker 2: That could be a difficult day. But if confirmed by
• 1:06:17
  Speaker 2: the Senate, you know, we got two years left. To
• 1:06:21
  Speaker 2: work hard and to pray that the Lord would give
• 1:06:23
  Speaker 2: me the wisdom and discernment to do this job.
• 1:06:25
  Speaker 1: And he will. That's the kind of prayer he wants
• 1:06:28
  Speaker 1: to answer.
• 1:06:28
  Speaker 3: He'll give you what you need when you need it,
• 1:06:30
  Speaker 3: not before, never after.
• 1:06:31
  Speaker 1: And prayer is that resource that we have when we're
• 1:06:36
  Speaker 1: feeling overwhelmed or uncertain about what the future might hold.
• 1:06:39
  Speaker 1: We have that line to heaven that is our first
• 1:06:43
  Speaker 1: line of defense, as you wrote in your book. Prayer
• 1:06:46
  Speaker 1: is a first line of defense. It is also how
• 1:06:48
  Speaker 1: we fight the battle. It prepares us for the battle.
• 1:06:52
  Speaker 1: And we just will be praying for you to see
• 1:06:55
  Speaker 1: God's going to be with you. And we have to
• 1:06:58
  Speaker 1: look at this as just this incredible opportunity that is
• 1:07:01
  Speaker 1: a season. And whatever it is, and however long that lasts,
• 1:07:06
  Speaker 1: he's going to equip you because he's called you.
• 1:07:09
  Speaker 3: Yes.
• 1:07:10
  Speaker 1: When the Lord opens a door like that. to serve
• 1:07:13
  Speaker 1: on a national level.
• 1:07:14
  Speaker 3: Imagine that little girl on pigtails.
• 1:07:16
  Speaker 2: Playing games with Jonathan.
• 1:07:19
  Speaker 3: Playing games. Do we call you Madam Ambassador? What is
• 1:07:23
  Speaker 3: the right term?
• 1:07:23
  Speaker 2: I'll let you know. I don't know yet.
• 1:07:25
  Speaker 3: I'm still going to call you Sissy. In its formal setting,
• 1:07:28
  Speaker 3: I'll call you Ambassador.
• 1:07:30
  Speaker 1: But before the Senate, you will probably be Jane Austen Lynch.
• 1:07:33
  Speaker 3: It is.
• 1:07:33
  Speaker 2: It's Jane Lynch. It's funny because when they announced it,
• 1:07:36
  Speaker 2: my name had gotten around D.C. that I was going
• 1:07:39
  Speaker 2: to be announced. And that had been around for months, but...
• 1:07:42
  Speaker 2: When they announced it as Jane Lynch, people were calling, saying,
• 1:07:45
  Speaker 2: who's Jane Lynch? Nobody knew.
• 1:07:47
  Speaker 3: I read it and go, wait, this is Sissy.
• 1:07:49
  Speaker 2: People remember me as Sissy Graham.
• 1:07:51
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:07:51
  Speaker 2: Sissy Graham, just like you. I mean, Sissy Graham, I've
• 1:07:53
  Speaker 2: been married for 20 years. People forgot I got the
• 1:07:55
  Speaker 2: last name Lynch.
• 1:07:56
  Speaker 3: Yes, that's right. That's right. Okay, Sissy, we've talked about
• 1:08:00
  Speaker 3: so many profound things, important things. Now let's just talk about, well,
• 1:08:04
  Speaker 3: we might call them fun things like What is your
• 1:08:08
  Speaker 3: favorite food? Like go-to food that you would order above
• 1:08:13
  Speaker 3: everything else?
• 1:08:13
  Speaker 2: Thai food.
• 1:08:14
  Speaker 3: Oh, Thai food.
• 1:08:15
  Speaker 1: Oh, yay!
• 1:08:16
  Speaker 3: Kathy will like that.
• 1:08:17
  Speaker 1: Okay.
• 1:08:18
  Speaker 2: And for dessert, blackberry cobbler with ice cream. Panang curry.
• 1:08:23
  Speaker 2: Chicken panang curry.
• 1:08:24
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:08:24
  Speaker 3: And what was your dessert?
• 1:08:26
  Speaker 2: Blackberry cobbler with ice cream.
• 1:08:27
  Speaker 1: I love cobbler.
• 1:08:28
  Speaker 2: And you can't get blackberry cobbler. Very rarely do you
• 1:08:30
  Speaker 2: find cobbler places.
• 1:08:31
  Speaker 3: There's a place in Boone, North Carolina where you live
• 1:08:34
  Speaker 3: that It's a teacup place. It has amazing cobbler.
• 1:08:39
  Speaker 2: What's the name of that place?
• 1:08:40
  Speaker 1: How do you remember that?
• 1:08:41
  Speaker 3: Backyard Burgers.
• 1:08:42
  Speaker 2: It doesn't exist anymore, and we still talk about it.
• 1:08:43
  Speaker 2: They have another thing, but they don't have the cobbler anymore.
• 1:08:46
  Speaker 3: No way.
• 1:08:46
  Speaker 2: Man, you've got a good memory.
• 1:08:48
  Speaker 3: I always remember food.
• 1:08:49
  Speaker 2: Yes, and that was the only place I could get
• 1:08:51
  Speaker 2: blackberry cobbler. That's where the love started. Good memory.
• 1:08:53
  Speaker 3: So they don't serve it anymore?
• 1:08:54
  Speaker 1: No.
• 1:08:56
  Speaker 2: That restaurant doesn't exist, but they've created another one.
• 1:08:58
  Speaker 3: I love Blackberry Cobbler. No one even makes Cobbler.
• 1:09:01
  Speaker 1: Exactly.
• 1:09:02
  Speaker 3: Where do you get it? It's hard.
• 1:09:03
  Speaker 2: I have to make it, I guess. But the question is,
• 1:09:05
  Speaker 2: do you like it? cake kind or the pie crust
• 1:09:06
  Speaker 2: kind on top?
• 1:09:07
  Speaker 3: Probably the pie crust.
• 1:09:09
  Speaker 1: That's how I am. That's how I am, too. I
• 1:09:11
  Speaker 1: was afraid to say you might say the cake.
• 1:09:13
  Speaker 2: I was like, oh, no, no, no.
• 1:09:15
  Speaker 1: The pie crust.
• 1:09:15
  Speaker 2: That's the easiest one to make, so that's the one
• 1:09:17
  Speaker 2: people make.
• 1:09:17
  Speaker 3: I asked Marco Rubio, who will be your future boss, right?
• 1:09:21
  Speaker 3: What his favorite food was. I mean, under the president.
• 1:09:24
  Speaker 2: Did he say Pop-Tart? No.
• 1:09:25
  Speaker 3: Because he's in the news for Pop-Tart.
• 1:09:26
  Speaker 2: That was so funny.
• 1:09:28
  Speaker 3: He told me chicken parm and pizza.
• 1:09:31
  Speaker 2: Together?
• 1:09:31
  Speaker 3: Well, just one or the other.
• 1:09:33
  Speaker 2: Chicken parm or pizza.
• 1:09:34
  Speaker 3: He likes Italian food.
• 1:09:35
  Speaker 2: That's good to know. Thanks for the hint, but I
• 1:09:36
  Speaker 2: need to.
• 1:09:37
  Speaker 3: Yeah. What is your favorite?
• 1:09:39
  Speaker 1: Thai food? Oh, to eat?
• 1:09:41
  Speaker 3: You should go have Thai food with sissy.
• 1:09:44
  Speaker 2: I'm guessing that is not one of your favorites.
• 1:09:46
  Speaker 3: No.
• 1:09:46
  Speaker 1: They have some good.
• 1:09:48
  Speaker 3: I love fish tacos. I love hamburgers. I love pizza.
• 1:09:51
  Speaker 3: Everything I love is bad for me and is fattening, period.
• 1:09:55
  Speaker 3: I'm like, oh, I love tofu. Okay, so do you
• 1:09:59
  Speaker 3: have a favorite movie? Here's how I define a favorite movie.
• 1:10:02
  Speaker 3: If I'm flipping the channels and I come to this movie,
• 1:10:05
  Speaker 3: maybe I've seen it 50 times. I don't know if
• 1:10:08
  Speaker 3: I've seen any movie 50 times. Maybe I have. But
• 1:10:12
  Speaker 3: I'll stop and wait till the commercial because I like
• 1:10:14
  Speaker 3: the movie so much. Do you have like a movie
• 1:10:16
  Speaker 3: like that?
• 1:10:16
  Speaker 2: Lassimo Higgins.
• 1:10:17
  Speaker 3: I love that movie.
• 1:10:18
  Speaker 2: Daniel Day-Lewis.
• 1:10:19
  Speaker 1: Oh my goodness.
• 1:10:20
  Speaker 3: That is one of the most, you don't think of.
• 1:10:22
  Speaker 1: It, the title doesn't give a clue.
• 1:10:25
  Speaker 2: I know.
• 1:10:26
  Speaker 1: To how romantic that movie is.
• 1:10:28
  Speaker 2: And he says, I will find you no matter how far. Exactly.
• 1:10:32
  Speaker 1: And that music as he's running to.
• 1:10:34
  Speaker 2: Last Mohegan's, hands down, my favorite.
• 1:10:36
  Speaker 3: Yeah, the music.
• 1:10:37
  Speaker 2: Did that surprise you with my answer there?
• 1:10:39
  Speaker 3: That's a good... Okay, I'm going to say, I don't
• 1:10:41
  Speaker 3: want to sound chauvinistic, but for a girl, that's not
• 1:10:46
  Speaker 3: normally the movie that a girl would select. But it
• 1:10:49
  Speaker 3: is incredibly.
• 1:10:49
  Speaker 2: I had three older brothers and a father that.
• 1:10:51
  Speaker 3: I would expect a guy maybe... To say that one.
• 1:10:54
  Speaker 2: I remember going to the theater with my dad to
• 1:10:56
  Speaker 2: watch that movie, which I probably say because I was
• 1:10:58
  Speaker 2: young and I think I was rude at all.
• 1:11:00
  Speaker 3: That's a good choice. I support that choice. Okay, so
• 1:11:04
  Speaker 3: if you can have a meal with three people that
• 1:11:08
  Speaker 3: are living, not including Jesus, we would all invite Jesus
• 1:11:13
  Speaker 3: to that meal. That are living? Living or passed on,
• 1:11:19
  Speaker 3: but just three figures, three people, who would they be?
• 1:11:23
  Speaker 2: Okay, two of them, and you might not know their names.
• 1:11:26
  Speaker 3: Okay.
• 1:11:26
  Speaker 2: I've always said, Corey laughs because in the world of
• 1:11:29
  Speaker 2: social media, you feel like you know people.
• 1:11:31
  Speaker 1: Yeah.
• 1:11:32
  Speaker 2: Jesse Etzler.
• 1:11:34
  Speaker 3: Oh, I don't know that.
• 1:11:34
  Speaker 2: He married the lady that invented Spanx. So Sarah Blakeney.
• 1:11:38
  Speaker 2: I would probably want to have dinner with the two
• 1:11:40
  Speaker 2: of them.
• 1:11:41
  Speaker 1: Short take. She better start there.
• 1:11:43
  Speaker 2: They're an amazing couple, but he's.
• 1:11:45
  Speaker 3: I'm wearing Spanx right now. I'm not.
• 1:11:47
  Speaker 2: He's an entrepreneur in his own right. And they are
• 1:11:51
  Speaker 2: a fascinating couple to me.
• 1:11:53
  Speaker 1: And I just- Wait, of all the people in history-
• 1:11:58
  Speaker 1: Those two, I.
• 1:11:59
  Speaker 2: Say right now, I would want to have dinner with
• 1:12:01
  Speaker 2: those two.
• 1:12:02
  Speaker 3: You're taking two spots up?
• 1:12:04
  Speaker 1: You said three.
• 1:12:05
  Speaker 2: They're two.
• 1:12:05
  Speaker 3: But this is a very special dinner. You're going to
• 1:12:07
  Speaker 3: have two of them?
• 1:12:08
  Speaker 2: Hey, this is my moment. Maybe you'll see this. Jesse Hudson,
• 1:12:11
  Speaker 2: Sarah Blakeney, I want dinner.
• 1:12:12
  Speaker 1: You asked her the question.
• 1:12:13
  Speaker 3: She's answering it.
• 1:12:14
  Speaker 2: It is true. I've sat with some important people in
• 1:12:16
  Speaker 2: this world.
• 1:12:17
  Speaker 3: Yes, you have.
• 1:12:19
  Speaker 2: But those two, they are fascinating. I can tell you
• 1:12:21
  Speaker 2: more about them. The third one, I would go back
• 1:12:24
  Speaker 2: to have dinner. Dinner with my grandmother. Because as I said,
• 1:12:29
  Speaker 2: I wish there were questions I could ask her now
• 1:12:32
  Speaker 2: as an adult that I didn't know to ask.
• 1:12:35
  Speaker 1: So good.
• 1:12:36
  Speaker 3: Good answer.
• 1:12:37
  Speaker 2: I don't know. Where do you think I was going
• 1:12:38
  Speaker 2: with that?
• 1:12:39
  Speaker 3: I get your grandmother. The other two, I missed a point.
• 1:12:44
  Speaker 3: Do you ever go to, I think we all have
• 1:12:45
  Speaker 3: Bible verses we go to often. Are there certain verses
• 1:12:50
  Speaker 3: that you go, I go back to this verse all
• 1:12:52
  Speaker 3: the time. Maybe a time of stress, you know, don't
• 1:12:54
  Speaker 3: worry about anything. Pray about everything. The peace of God
• 1:12:58
  Speaker 3: that passes on understanding will guard your heart and mind.
• 1:13:01
  Speaker 3: Is there a verse that you go back to again
• 1:13:03
  Speaker 3: and again? Or maybe someone says, write a verse of
• 1:13:07
  Speaker 3: my Bible. I like, can you write a Bible verse
• 1:13:10
  Speaker 3: in my Bible?
• 1:13:10
  Speaker 2: I've already mentioned it, but for me it was Daniel
• 1:13:13
  Speaker 2: chapter 11.
• 1:13:14
  Speaker 3: Okay.
• 1:13:15
  Speaker 2: Those who know their God will be able to stand
• 1:13:16
  Speaker 2: in strength and take action. It's kind of been my
• 1:13:18
  Speaker 2: great verse. The verse that I've adopted is if people
• 1:13:21
  Speaker 2: say a life verse. Yeah. Yeah.
• 1:13:24
  Speaker 3: What is your favorite music? What does Sissy listen to
• 1:13:27
  Speaker 3: when she's just driving around? Oh, man. Taking her kids
• 1:13:31
  Speaker 3: to school.
• 1:13:31
  Speaker 2: I have a very wide range.
• 1:13:32
  Speaker 3: Eating Thai food.
• 1:13:33
  Speaker 2: I feel like I like it all. I love it
• 1:13:36
  Speaker 2: when oldie goldies come on.
• 1:13:38
  Speaker 3: Yeah.
• 1:13:39
  Speaker 2: Because it takes me back.
• 1:13:40
  Speaker 3: But what is an oldie goldie to you?
• 1:13:41
  Speaker 2: Okay, I will say, though, I didn't grow up on Beatles.
• 1:13:43
  Speaker 3: No.
• 1:13:44
  Speaker 1: Mm-hmm.
• 1:13:44
  Speaker 2: Um, my mom was never a fan of Beatles. She
• 1:13:47
  Speaker 2: liked more of the Motown.
• 1:13:48
  Speaker 3: Oh yeah.
• 1:13:48
  Speaker 2: And so when that comes on, cause that's what my
• 1:13:51
  Speaker 2: mom raised us on. I can still remember. It was
• 1:13:53
  Speaker 2: like 96.1 oldie goldie. It just takes me back to
• 1:13:57
  Speaker 2: that moment of riding in the car with my mom.
• 1:13:59
  Speaker 2: So I've started turning those on for my kids now.
• 1:14:01
  Speaker 3: Like the Supremes, Diana Russell Supremes.
• 1:14:04
  Speaker 2: The Four Seasons.
• 1:14:05
  Speaker 3: Yeah. Smokey Robinson.
• 1:14:06
  Speaker 1: Yes.
• 1:14:08
  Speaker 3: It was amazing. Cause here's a time in musical history.
• 1:14:11
  Speaker 3: You have the Beatles.
• 1:14:12
  Speaker 2: Yes.
• 1:14:13
  Speaker 3: But then you have Motown happening at the same time.
• 1:14:17
  Speaker 3: And now to this very day, these are the songs
• 1:14:20
  Speaker 3: that people are still listening to over and over again.
• 1:14:23
  Speaker 1: Absolutely.
• 1:14:23
  Speaker 3: So much other music has come and gone.
• 1:14:25
  Speaker 2: And then I'm a product of the 90s. I kind
• 1:14:27
  Speaker 2: of like 90s grunge, too.
• 1:14:28
  Speaker 3: Oh, really? Yeah.
• 1:14:30
  Speaker 1: I don't even know what that is.
• 1:14:31
  Speaker 3: Did you have a favorite band? Like what, Pearl Jam
• 1:14:33
  Speaker 3: or Nirvana?
• 1:14:34
  Speaker 2: Can I say Cranberries? That would be.
• 1:14:35
  Speaker 3: Yeah, sure. Okay.
• 1:14:36
  Speaker 2: I like the Cranberries. I don't know if I like
• 1:14:37
  Speaker 2: the Cranberries. I don't even know what.
• 1:14:39
  Speaker 1: I've got to look that one up.
• 1:14:40
  Speaker 3: No, I know who they are. Are you a morning
• 1:14:42
  Speaker 3: person or are you a night out?
• 1:14:43
  Speaker 2: Morning. I go to bed way too early.
• 1:14:45
  Speaker 3: Always?
• 1:14:46
  Speaker 2: Always morning.
• 1:14:47
  Speaker 3: I used to be a night out. Then I became
• 1:14:48
  Speaker 3: a morning person. I can't stand it. Now I'm an
• 1:14:50
  Speaker 3: inappropriately morning 4.30 even. I can't even text anyone.
• 1:14:55
  Speaker 2: You get up at 4.30?
• 1:14:56
  Speaker 3: Sometimes I do.
• 1:14:59
  Speaker 2: For the evening, not even in college could I pull
• 1:15:02
  Speaker 2: an all-nighter to do a project.
• 1:15:04
  Speaker 1: I know. I'm right with you. It's like, no.
• 1:15:06
  Speaker 2: I put my kids to bed.
• 1:15:07
  Speaker 1: I'm in bed. And then after dinner, it's like, I'm worthless.
• 1:15:10
  Speaker 1: I can't work on anything.
• 1:15:11
  Speaker 3: What's something about you that would surprise people? I've heard
• 1:15:15
  Speaker 3: a couple of things already. Who you would have your
• 1:15:18
  Speaker 3: special meal with. Thai food threw me too.
• 1:15:20
  Speaker 2: Can we do a recap? Well, I lived in Thailand
• 1:15:23
  Speaker 2: for a short time and.
• 1:15:24
  Speaker 1: I took a Thai cooking class.
• 1:15:25
  Speaker 3: When did you live in Thailand?
• 1:15:26
  Speaker 2: My first semester or second, sophomore year in college. I
• 1:15:29
  Speaker 2: took a semester off. I had struggled.
• 1:15:31
  Speaker 1: It was.
• 1:15:33
  Speaker 2: A difficult time in my life. And I worked for–
• 1:15:36
  Speaker 2: it was actually a lady, Rose Martinez, that is out
• 1:15:39
  Speaker 2: of Calvary Chapel.
• 1:15:41
  Speaker 1: I know that name.
• 1:15:42
  Speaker 2: She left in the 70s and started orphanages in Thailand.
• 1:15:47
  Speaker 2: So the Thai food. But I will come– hey, pizza is–
• 1:15:50
  Speaker 2: I mean, I'll take you out for pizza or fish tacos.
• 1:15:53
  Speaker 2: But what was the last question?
• 1:15:55
  Speaker 3: The question was.
• 1:15:56
  Speaker 2: Since I gave disappointing answers so far.
• 1:15:59
  Speaker 3: Yeah, something that would surprise people about you. I don't
• 1:16:04
  Speaker 3: even know what I would say.
• 1:16:05
  Speaker 2: Would you answer that question?
• 1:16:06
  Speaker 3: I don't know. What would surprise... I don't know. What
• 1:16:11
  Speaker 3: would you say? You know, honestly, when I preach, I
• 1:16:15
  Speaker 3: pretty much put it all out there. I don't know
• 1:16:17
  Speaker 3: if there's anything I would say.
• 1:16:18
  Speaker 1: Would surprise anyone?
• 1:16:19
  Speaker 3: Would surprise anyone? I'm not sure. Maybe my prankster.
• 1:16:23
  Speaker 1: I think what.
• 1:16:24
  Speaker 2: Would they be surprised that you would walk out of
• 1:16:26
  Speaker 2: the bathroom with toilet paper hanging out of your pants
• 1:16:29
  Speaker 2: and walk down the hallway so people could see?
• 1:16:32
  Speaker 1: You should do that on.
• 1:16:32
  Speaker 3: They might.
• 1:16:33
  Speaker 1: Maybe not.
• 1:16:34
  Speaker 3: I'm not going to do that at church. It's not
• 1:16:35
  Speaker 3: the time or place. But yes, I've done that more
• 1:16:38
  Speaker 3: than once and you kids have seen it. Yeah. Maybe
• 1:16:42
  Speaker 3: they would... How did it get to me? You.
• 1:16:45
  Speaker 2: Because you ask these questions and people don't have answers.
• 1:16:46
  Speaker 1: And she turned it back on you and said... That's true.
• 1:16:49
  Speaker 3: What would surprise them about you?
• 1:16:51
  Speaker 2: How about you love Seinfeld? Would that... No, that's not surprising.
• 1:16:54
  Speaker 3: I mean, I don't love Seinfeld. I don't dislike Seinfeld.
• 1:16:58
  Speaker 3: I like The Office more than I like Seinfeld. I
• 1:17:02
  Speaker 3: think The Office is hilarious. And apparently I like The
• 1:17:05
  Speaker 3: Simpsons because I watched it downstairs.
• 1:17:07
  Speaker 2: And Woodlands.
• 1:17:08
  Speaker 1: And Woodlands.
• 1:17:08
  Speaker 3: I don't remember that.
• 1:17:10
  Speaker 2: I don't know. I'll have to... When I come back
• 1:17:12
  Speaker 2: for my second round here on your podcast, I'll have
• 1:17:15
  Speaker 2: an answer.
• 1:17:16
  Speaker 1: What was the last book you read?
• 1:17:19
  Speaker 2: A book that I just got to read, Packers, The
• 1:17:23
  Speaker 2: Knowing God. I just re-bought it. I read it in
• 1:17:26
  Speaker 2: a long time. And so that's going to be back
• 1:17:29
  Speaker 2: on my list to read.
• 1:17:29
  Speaker 1: What is your favorite work of fiction? Like a fiction story,
• 1:17:34
  Speaker 1: short story, novel? No, no.
• 1:17:37
  Speaker 2: I'm not a reader.
• 1:17:38
  Speaker 1: Are you a reader, Kathy? No. I like, I like, yeah, I.
• 1:17:42
  Speaker 3: Like to read. She listens to a lot of books on. Audible.
• 1:17:45
  Speaker 3: On Audible now.
• 1:17:45
  Speaker 1: I do because, because my attention.
• 1:17:47
  Speaker 3: Really boring books on my dad.
• 1:17:48
  Speaker 1: I think attention span is like shorter because of all
• 1:17:53
  Speaker 1: the stuff is so fast on phones.
• 1:17:54
  Speaker 3: Wait, what were you just listening to? It was like,
• 1:17:58
  Speaker 3: what was that? Something, not war and peace, but something like.
• 1:18:04
  Speaker 1: It was, it was the Russian novelist. Yeah, it was, um.
• 1:18:10
  Speaker 1: Brothers Karamazov. Yeah, I'm like, why? I haven't read so
• 1:18:14
  Speaker 1: many classics that I'm like, but the way I do
• 1:18:16
  Speaker 1: it now, because I get sleepy when I'm reading, is
• 1:18:20
  Speaker 1: I'll go for a walk or I'm folding laundry or
• 1:18:22
  Speaker 1: I'm doing yard work and I put on an audible
• 1:18:25
  Speaker 1: and listen that way. What would surprise people about me
• 1:18:29
  Speaker 1: is how much I love poetry. I love poetry. I love,
• 1:18:35
  Speaker 1: I bore people with the things I like. I subscribe
• 1:18:38
  Speaker 1: to a podcast called The Daily Poem.
• 1:18:41
  Speaker 2: I would not have guessed that.
• 1:18:42
  Speaker 1: And they're short, but I.
• 1:18:44
  Speaker 3: And what would surprise people about me is I write poetry.
• 1:18:47
  Speaker 1: I don't.
• 1:18:48
  Speaker 3: I don't.
• 1:18:50
  Speaker 1: You know what would surprise people about you? Is how
• 1:18:52
  Speaker 1: much you sing. You sing... all the time at home
• 1:18:57
  Speaker 1: in the shower and when you sang on sunday.
• 1:19:00
  Speaker 2: People were like wow what does he sing.
• 1:19:02
  Speaker 1: Really he sang a hymn he sang a holy spirit
• 1:19:05
  Speaker 1: song we were praying about the you know being filled
• 1:19:08
  Speaker 1: with the holy spirit and at the end of the
• 1:19:09
  Speaker 1: service he led I guess you didn't like the song
• 1:19:12
  Speaker 1: the worship team picked or you wanted another one, but
• 1:19:15
  Speaker 1: you came out with this song. And I was like
• 1:19:17
  Speaker 1: sitting there because we stream live first service to Orange
• 1:19:21
  Speaker 1: County and I was sitting in the eight o'clock service.
• 1:19:23
  Speaker 1: And all of a sudden I hear you're singing acapella
• 1:19:26
  Speaker 1: all by yourself.
• 1:19:27
  Speaker 3: Wow.
• 1:19:27
  Speaker 2: That would be my worst nightmare. I mean, I talk
• 1:19:30
  Speaker 2: about a singing incident in my book.
• 1:19:32
  Speaker 1: Oh, I know.
• 1:19:32
  Speaker 2: No, me too. I'm going up to talk. And they
• 1:19:35
  Speaker 2: have my microphone already on. And there's a song going.
• 1:19:38
  Speaker 2: I won't sing because I'm so afraid.
• 1:19:39
  Speaker 3: Singing is just.
• 1:19:40
  Speaker 2: I still have dreams.
• 1:19:42
  Speaker 1: Oh, I'm with you on that. He loves to sing.
• 1:19:45
  Speaker 3: I do.
• 1:19:46
  Speaker 1: He loves to sing. All the time. Really, all the time.
• 1:19:50
  Speaker 1: It really makes me happy. It's sort of a release.
• 1:19:53
  Speaker 1: You know, sometimes even when you're under stress or going
• 1:19:56
  Speaker 1: through something hard, I'll hear him singing.
• 1:19:59
  Speaker 2: Can we hear it?
• 1:19:59
  Speaker 1: And it's like.
• 1:20:00
  Speaker 2: No. No.
• 1:20:01
  Speaker 1: He sings a lot of Beatles songs. It's not like
• 1:20:04
  Speaker 1: he's being very spiritual.
• 1:20:06
  Speaker 2: I thought one of the questions was he's going to
• 1:20:07
  Speaker 2: have me name all the Beatles.
• 1:20:09
  Speaker 3: Oh, no.
• 1:20:10
  Speaker 2: Can you name them all? Oh, I can't. You asked
• 1:20:13
  Speaker 2: me this one time.
• 1:20:14
  Speaker 1: Oh, that's embarrassing.
• 1:20:14
  Speaker 3: Matthew, Mark, Luke.
• 1:20:16
  Speaker 1: It's embarrassing how much Beatle trivia he knows. It's like
• 1:20:21
  Speaker 1: that is occupying too much space in your brain.
• 1:20:24
  Speaker 2: I did memorize them one time because you did ask
• 1:20:26
  Speaker 2: me that one time when we were in Israel. And
• 1:20:28
  Speaker 2: I forgot one. I forget which one I forgot. We
• 1:20:32
  Speaker 2: were sitting in the King David and you asked me
• 1:20:34
  Speaker 2: that and I failed. I was the millennial that did
• 1:20:36
  Speaker 2: not know.
• 1:20:37
  Speaker 1: Good for you. That's a good thing. It doesn't have
• 1:20:43
  Speaker 1: to occupy any brain space.
• 1:20:45
  Speaker 3: It's been so much fun talking to you. We've talked
• 1:20:48
  Speaker 3: about so many important subjects. We will all be praying
• 1:20:51
  Speaker 3: for you that you will be confirmed by the Senate
• 1:20:55
  Speaker 3: for this amazing position. I think it's so great, Sissy,
• 1:20:59
  Speaker 3: because You know, you're wise beyond your years, and you
• 1:21:03
  Speaker 3: have so much to say to this younger generation. And
• 1:21:06
  Speaker 3: they need to hear clear voices. They need to hear
• 1:21:09
  Speaker 3: biblical voices. They need to hear people that have strong conviction,
• 1:21:14
  Speaker 3: which you have. I think the title of your book
• 1:21:17
  Speaker 3: is Perfect Stand Steady, because that's what you're doing, and
• 1:21:20
  Speaker 3: that's what you will continue to do. And a whole
• 1:21:23
  Speaker 3: young generation, especially young ladies, but young men too, but
• 1:21:27
  Speaker 3: especially young girls. They need to hear your voice. So
• 1:21:30
  Speaker 3: thanks for writing this book. And thanks for your stand
• 1:21:33
  Speaker 3: for Christ all these years.
• 1:21:36
  Speaker 2: Thank you for having me today. And as I just said,
• 1:21:38
  Speaker 2: I'm so grateful. Grateful for y'all's friendship over the years.
• 1:21:41
  Speaker 2: And you and Kathy have meant more to me than
• 1:21:44
  Speaker 2: you'll ever know. In your ministry, you've had a huge
• 1:21:47
  Speaker 2: spiritual impact on my life.
• 1:21:48
  Speaker 3: And I'm grateful.
• 1:21:50
  Speaker 1: Sissy, we are so grateful to be recording this podcast
• 1:21:54
  Speaker 1: with you. You are a delight. It's been a blessing
• 1:21:57
  Speaker 1: hearing how God is using you, and this book is
• 1:22:00
  Speaker 1: going to be amazing. It is needed. And then this
• 1:22:03
  Speaker 1: upcoming appointment and the nomination, God's going to be with you.
• 1:22:07
  Speaker 1: He's going to take care of all the home stuff
• 1:22:09
  Speaker 1: and all the kids' stuff and prepare you for that
• 1:22:12
  Speaker 1: Senate hearing. It's going to be good.
• 1:22:15
  Speaker 3: We'll be watching and praying. Things are coming.