Latest / Success Story with Scott Clary / Luke Lintz - Founder of HighKey Enterprises | From 300k in Debt to Deals With The Kardashians

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Luke Lintz - Founder of HighKey Enterprises | From 300k in Debt to Deals With The Kardashians · Success Story with Scott Clary

• 0:00
  We were buying some bikes and TVs in grade 9 of high school.
• 0:04
  It was just to make $50, $100 profit on every single bike.
• 0:07
  Luke Lins didn't just want to follow trends.
• 0:09
  He wanted to set them.
• 0:10
  At just 16 years old, Luke co-founded High Key Technology,
• 0:13
  a company born out of a simple frustration,
• 0:15
  the hassle of corded earphones.
• 0:17
  So then we started a YouTube channel,
• 0:18
  which was a gaming YouTube channel.
• 0:20
  Created that for eight months,
• 0:21
  then it went absolutely nowhere,
• 0:23
  so massive failure.
• 0:24
  Every single entrepreneur has a desire for wanting more.
• 0:28
  All entrepreneurs have certain qualities inside of them,
• 0:31
  and then it's qualities that they develop over time.
• 0:33
  Losing thousands of dollars in high school,
• 0:36
  that was our entire banquil.
• 0:38
  Problems go through every stage of life.
• 0:40
  You can't get away from problems in life, it's not possible.
• 0:42
  From there, Luke and his brother, Jordan,
• 0:44
  turned their vision into a six-figure business
• 0:46
  within six months,
• 0:47
  silencing every doubt or along the way.
• 0:49
  That's when we started up our first company,
• 0:51
  so to speak, which was the first ever wireless ear buds,
• 0:54
  kind of, to be sold across North America.
• 0:56
  So we scaled that up to seven figures of sales.
• 0:59
  Having a focus on one business allows you to catapult way faster
• 1:03
  than having your focus spread across multiple businesses.
• 1:06
  You only lose if you quit.
• 1:08
  But Luke didn't stop at selling ear buds.
• 1:09
  Today, he leads an empire of digital services,
• 1:12
  transforming how personal brands and businesses
• 1:14
  dominate social media and public relations.
• 1:16
  For him, the secret to success isn't flashy campaigns.
• 1:20
  It's about consistency, building emotional connections,
• 1:22
  and creating a legacy that speaks louder than words.
• 1:25
  This is the story of how a teenager
• 1:27
  who started with YouTube inspiration
• 1:29
  and a dream built a seven-figure business
• 1:31
  and why he's only getting started.
• 1:37
  Welcome to success story.
• 1:38
  I'm your host, Scott Clarity.
• 1:40
  The success story podcast is part of the HubSpot podcast.
• 1:43
  Our HubSpot has been a huge supporter of the show,
• 1:45
  and I'm happy they are because I'm a huge believer
• 1:47
  in HubSpot.
• 1:48
  I've used it for everything from this show
• 1:49
  to all the companies that I've ever run in the past.
• 1:51
  And I know there's a lot of entrepreneurs in the audience
• 1:53
  and let me ask you a question.
• 1:55
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• 1:57
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• 1:58
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• 2:01
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• 2:03
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• 2:06
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• 2:09
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• 2:11
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• 2:40
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• 3:02
  Luke, I'm excited you're here, man.
• 3:04
  It's going to be a lot of fun.
• 3:05
  I think that the way that I like to kick these off
• 3:07
  just so people get to know you a little bit better.
• 3:08
  Think it back to an inflection point
• 3:10
  when you were growing up.
• 3:11
  Something that sort of set you on the path that you're on today.
• 3:13
  What do you think that was?
• 3:14
  Yeah, for sure.
• 3:15
  Thanks for having me on here.
• 3:16
  And yeah, the starting point in business
• 3:20
  was actually when we were buying and selling bikes on KGG.
• 3:25
  We were buying and selling bikes and TVs
• 3:28
  in grade nine of high school.
• 3:30
  And I didn't realize at the time that that was like the first business
• 3:32
  endeavor, but that was like the first thing that we ever did
• 3:35
  myself and my older brother.
• 3:37
  And it was just to make $50, $100 profit on every single bike
• 3:41
  that we bought and sold.
• 3:42
  And it really brought us into the entrepreneurial spirit.
• 3:47
  Of making profit off of specific, specific things
• 3:50
  that we were buying and selling, looking at margins,
• 3:53
  all of that.
• 3:53
  It was like arbitrage?
• 3:54
  Yeah, yeah, pretty much.
• 3:59
  This is actually a very controversial clip
• 4:00
  that I put out once.
• 4:01
  And one, there was a guy who was a billionaire
• 4:03
  and was talking now he owns a whole bunch of companies.
• 4:06
  And he said like, if you're going to be a successful entrepreneur,
• 4:09
  like show me your lemonade stand or show me
• 4:12
  when you were buying and selling some shit
• 4:14
  and arbitrage it or show me when you were in grade school,
• 4:17
  like trying to sell packets of gum to your friend,
• 4:19
  whatever.
• 4:20
  Do you think that entrepreneurship is something you're born with
• 4:25
  that you just have like when you were arbitraising bikes off
• 4:28
  Kajichi, why did you do that versus trying to go get a job?
• 4:32
  I think that all entrepreneurs have certain qualities inside of them.
• 4:36
  And then it's qualities that they develop over time.
• 4:38
  So I think every single entrepreneur has a desire for one
• 4:43
  and usually that one anymore is in the monetary sense
• 4:46
  that's usually the easiest, quantifiable answer.
• 4:49
  And so for me it was I just wanted more money.
• 4:51
  And so I was just doing any activity to make more money on the side
• 4:54
  even on top of my jobs.
• 4:56
  And then the second thing was being able to take on risk.
• 5:00
  And so I don't think I was inherently extremely good at taking on risk
• 5:04
  but then I realised in high school I gambled a ton
• 5:07
  when all the money that I made for buying and selling bikes
• 5:10
  and then also the jobs that I had.
• 5:12
  I did demolition, painting work.
• 5:14
  I also worked at an organic food store.
• 5:16
  All of that money, I gambled it.
• 5:18
  And it was just really.
• 5:19
  Yeah, it was my appetite for risk at the time.
• 5:22
  And so I also think that's actually wild.
• 5:24
  That could be problematic, but I actually believe that
• 5:29
  so I believe the people who are entrepreneurs,
• 5:32
  they are like one step away from taking all that energy
• 5:36
  and putting it towards like a very bad vice.
• 5:38
  I think because you have to be addicted to become a good entrepreneur.
• 5:41
  I think you have to be addicted to something that it's positive.
• 5:45
  But if you like veered off and like a little direction
• 5:49
  that could be very neck because it's a personality trait
• 5:52
  of an entrepreneur that puts like everything towards something.
• 5:55
  Yeah, isn't it with that continuum of like love and hate
• 5:58
  being right beside each other?
• 6:00
  Brits very similar.
• 6:01
  The bridge between that is so close together.
• 6:04
  It's kind of like an entrepreneurship,
• 6:06
  value of interest.
• 6:07
  You know, the positive energy that you got with entrepreneurship
• 6:10
  is so close to like there was biases
• 6:12
  that you could potentially be putting.
• 6:13
  Well, I think that's why some entrepreneurs
• 6:14
  can spiral so easily because they all they know
• 6:17
  is to give 110% to something.
• 6:19
  And if it's not business,
• 6:20
  then if it's a bad vice like gambling,
• 6:23
  drugs, like women, like drinking,
• 6:26
  then all of a sudden you spiral because
• 6:28
  entrepreneurs are inherently all or nothing.
• 6:30
  I think most of them are.
• 6:31
  But that's something you did like kind of very early on.
• 6:33
  You were like, I have a high attitude,
• 6:35
  attitude for risk.
• 6:37
  And this is like, I'm going to live my life.
• 6:39
  You're gambling.
• 6:41
  You're earning your money.
• 6:42
  And like what, high school?
• 6:44
  Yeah, yeah, great tent of high school.
• 6:46
  That's why.
• 6:47
  So obviously that doesn't,
• 6:49
  that's not like a way to build a business
• 6:50
  or to live a life.
• 6:51
  So as you like mature and whatnot,
• 6:54
  you still have that attitude for risk.
• 6:55
  But at what point are you like,
• 6:57
  okay, this is obviously not,
• 7:00
  this is not like a secure way to make money
• 7:02
  just gambling on, I don't even know
• 7:03
  where you like betting sites.
• 7:04
  And so it was all sports best sports.
• 7:06
  But yeah, but it was a lot ahead of the curve.
• 7:08
  It was like consistently losing on sports betting.
• 7:12
  Like that's because the house is,
• 7:13
  the house is always in a way.
• 7:14
  I was not good at sports betting.
• 7:16
  But we weren't even betting against the house.
• 7:17
  We were betting against other people.
• 7:18
  Like we were doing draft street,
• 7:19
  draft kings, all of those sites.
• 7:21
  And losing thousands of dollars in high school
• 7:25
  when like that was our entire bank rule.
• 7:27
  And so I think way taught me was that
• 7:31
  it got me completely disconnected
• 7:33
  and really numbed out from money, honestly.
• 7:35
  We're, we're gonna be good and bad.
• 7:36
  Yeah, it can't be good and bad.
• 7:39
  Okay, so that's high school.
• 7:39
  So what did you, what did you start like
• 7:42
  moving on from arbitraising bikes and gambling?
• 7:45
  Yeah, and when did you start like actually building stuff?
• 7:47
  Yeah, so then we started a YouTube channel,
• 7:49
  me and my older brother,
• 7:50
  which was a gaming YouTube channel
• 7:52
  in at the end of grade 10.
• 7:54
  And it's because we were watching like all of these YouTubers,
• 7:57
  mainly like KSI W2S,
• 7:59
  these people who played video games.
• 8:01
  We were like, we could do that.
• 8:02
  We're kind of funny people.
• 8:04
  We played video games like let's just record ourselves.
• 8:06
  So we did that, create very cringey YouTube content.
• 8:10
  I love it.
• 8:11
  Oh, we deleted it all.
• 8:12
  I wish it was still up.
• 8:14
  Yeah, create that for eight months
• 8:15
  and then it went absolutely nowhere.
• 8:17
  So massive failure, eight months of creating YouTube content
• 8:21
  that just went down the drain.
• 8:22
  And then we kind of reflect they were like,
• 8:25
  okay, what do we wanna do next with all of our time?
• 8:27
  And in high school, you have a ton of time.
• 8:29
  Yeah, ton of time.
• 8:30
  How are you?
• 8:31
  Working, paying rent, anything.
• 8:32
  No responsibilities.
• 8:34
  You have all this extra time.
• 8:36
  You're not necessarily working
• 8:37
  because you're in high school.
• 8:39
  And so that's when we started up our first like company,
• 8:42
  so to speak, which was the first ever like wireless earbuds
• 8:46
  kind of to be sold across North America.
• 8:48
  How did you think through that concept?
• 8:50
  Well, we had a buddy who thought of the idea
• 8:53
  of wireless earbuds where it's like,
• 8:55
  there's wireless headphones out,
• 8:57
  why isn't there just wireless earbud?
• 8:59
  Yeah, before like AirPods.
• 9:00
  And so we just did tons of research online
• 9:02
  of like, where can we find prototypes?
• 9:04
  So completely wireless earbuds.
• 9:06
  We found one pair in China
• 9:08
  and we were like, this could be it,
• 9:10
  order the sample, we were like, wow, this is pretty cool.
• 9:13
  So then we bulk ordered it, slapped a low go on it,
• 9:16
  create a name and we were like, okay,
• 9:18
  now we have this sick product.
• 9:20
  How do we sell this?
• 9:21
  And so we used the only platform we knew at the time,
• 9:24
  which was Instagram, which we used personally.
• 9:27
  We're like, okay, well, let's create like,
• 9:29
  you know, some meme content stuff that we consume
• 9:32
  and just like product place that your buds at it.
• 9:34
  I had to do it and it ended up crushing.
• 9:37
  Yeah, it's because it was just a sick product.
• 9:38
  We didn't do any crazy marketing.
• 9:40
  It was just such a sick product.
• 9:41
  And so when you have like a really good product
• 9:44
  and really good timing,
• 9:45
  like you can really do any type of marketing into a crush.
• 9:48
  And so that's a lesson.
• 9:49
  You could see when people try and market really shitty products
• 9:52
  and then you just end up like spinning your wheels.
• 9:54
  Exactly.
• 9:55
  So we scaled that up to seven figures of sales
• 9:58
  before I sat and figured, what was the margins on that?
• 10:00
  Pretty horrible margins because we were selling it for so cheap.
• 10:03
  We were selling it for like $60 per pair of wireless earbuds
• 10:06
  compared to like AirPods that, or yeah, a couple hundred bucks.
• 10:09
  Yeah.
• 10:10
  So you have like seven figures,
• 10:11
  but ultimately at some point you're gonna have cash flow issues
• 10:15
  or it's gonna be like really low margins.
• 10:17
  So it's a business that yeah, it's a business,
• 10:20
  but you're gonna have to scale to like the tens of millions
• 10:23
  if you really wanna have a significant business
• 10:26
  and actually be able to take money out of it.
• 10:27
  We didn't really take that into consideration.
• 10:29
  It was about 10% profit margins.
• 10:31
  That's really low, really low.
• 10:33
  And then we ended up wanting to product diversify
• 10:36
  because we were like, okay, well, we can't bank all
• 10:38
  in all these wireless earbuds,
• 10:39
  especially since AirPods started to come out
• 10:42
  and all of these other earbuds.
• 10:43
  And we were like, okay, if we wanted this business
• 10:46
  to actually grow, we need to go into other product sectors.
• 10:48
  And then what did you do to diversify?
• 10:51
  When we went to other product sectors, speakers, backpacks,
• 10:53
  that's when it went horrible.
• 10:55
  Be because they were just...
• 10:58
  I expected you to say something else.
• 11:00
  I know I kind of know this story.
• 11:02
  We've just spoken a lot,
• 11:03
  but I forgot that there was a point when it just tamed.
• 11:06
  Yeah, horrible.
• 11:07
  It's because there was just so much competition.
• 11:09
  And it's because we weren't as good at marketing.
• 11:12
  Advising, that'd be awesome.
• 11:14
  But that's the curse of getting early success, huh?
• 11:17
  Because then you think you're good
• 11:19
  and you think that you can figure out anything else.
• 11:21
  But I mean, obviously not so much.
• 11:24
  Very true.
• 11:25
  So, okay, so then after that, did you...
• 11:27
  This is still you and your brother.
• 11:29
  Did you kill that business completely?
• 11:31
  Yeah, so we ended up growing actually $300,000 in debt
• 11:35
  from ordering products you couldn't sell.
• 11:37
  Ordering products that we couldn't sell.
• 11:38
  And then all of the increased in cost,
• 11:40
  the fried in shipping to get the shipping
• 11:42
  from China to the US and then the holding cost
• 11:45
  because they weren't selling.
• 11:46
  Subaru, they're sitting in a warehouse somewhere.
• 11:48
  The warehousing fees were just ridiculous
• 11:51
  because backpacks and the batteries inside of them
• 11:53
  because they were charging backpacks.
• 11:54
  We're just like burning cash.
• 11:56
  Burning cash.
• 11:57
  And at one point, we were like, okay,
• 12:00
  well, we need to do something or else we're screwed.
• 12:03
  It wasn't debt that we could go bankrupt on.
• 12:06
  Yeah, because it was debt from our family members.
• 12:09
  And so they invested.
• 12:10
  Yeah, oh my God.
• 12:12
  And so, I would have delivered my eight prep.
• 12:15
  I was so stressful.
• 12:16
  Yeah, I was 18, very.
• 12:20
  Yeah, and so we reflected back.
• 12:22
  We're like, okay, what was something good
• 12:24
  that came up all of this?
• 12:25
  Or like, okay, we knew how to grow an Instagram page.
• 12:29
  That's one thing.
• 12:29
  We had millions of natural views on Instagram.
• 12:32
  We had 250,000 plus followers.
• 12:34
  So we knew one thing from this.
• 12:36
  We were going to a growing Instagram page.
• 12:37
  We were like, can we do this for other people?
• 12:40
  And then we started up an agency.
• 12:42
  And also, agencies are not easy to grow
• 12:45
  because there are also the agency market
• 12:48
  still super saturated.
• 12:49
  There's tons of agencies out there.
• 12:51
  But I mean, you saw that you probably grow Instagram
• 12:54
  better than most people.
• 12:55
  And I also think most agencies don't know what the fuck you're doing.
• 12:58
  But that's two sides of the point.
• 12:59
  So even like at that point when you're 18,
• 13:02
  you just talked to me about like even some,
• 13:04
  because a lot of the stuff that happened to you at 18
• 13:07
  would probably stress out so many people,
• 13:10
  so much that they'd never jump into anything else.
• 13:13
  So when you were 300,000 dollars in debt at 18,
• 13:15
  that's a significant amount of money.
• 13:18
  And then your family's money is on the line too.
• 13:20
  So you're probably stressed about that.
• 13:22
  So what would be the advice for somebody
• 13:25
  who's going through their first business and is in debt
• 13:28
  and owes investors money or owes somebody money
• 13:31
  and they're just trying to figure out,
• 13:34
  how do I keep going when I'm dealing with all this bullshit?
• 13:38
  Because all this bullshit is normal for entrepreneurs,
• 13:41
  for anybody who's taken a risk and built something.
• 13:43
  But for the first time, you're going through it.
• 13:44
  It's very stressful.
• 13:46
  So what's the advice for people like how did you go through it?
• 13:49
  Was it just, because you could have gone in two ways.
• 13:51
  You could have said, I'm never fucking doing this again.
• 13:54
  Your families, they're supportive,
• 13:55
  but they're probably all like a little bit pissed off.
• 13:58
  So what do you suggest to that first time entrepreneur?
• 14:01
  Yeah, the going the two ways is very true.
• 14:04
  It's kind of like with a lot of things.
• 14:07
  Like for example, if you grow up in a household
• 14:09
  that's extremely toxic.
• 14:12
  A lot of the kids grow up two different ways.
• 14:14
  One, they take those toxic attributes
• 14:17
  and they bring that into their adult life
• 14:19
  or the second way is they want to get as far away
• 14:23
  from that as possible.
• 14:24
  And so they do everything they can to get as far away.
• 14:27
  It's usually like very polar opposite.
• 14:29
  And so like I think that's very similar
• 14:31
  with going the two ways when you're under extreme amount
• 14:35
  of stress and entrepreneurship,
• 14:36
  especially when it's your first business.
• 14:39
  For me, just when you're asking that question,
• 14:42
  I was thinking back to the mindset I was in back then.
• 14:45
  And I remember it being so hard every single day.
• 14:49
  I would wake up with so much stress on my mind constantly.
• 14:54
  And what I would do is I would just numb myself out
• 14:57
  from reality by just going straight to my desk
• 15:00
  every single day and literally working 14 to 16 hours a day.
• 15:04
  I wouldn't talk with anybody.
• 15:06
  I wouldn't say anything if people asked
• 15:09
  about how the business was going.
• 15:11
  I wouldn't talk about it because it was just so much pain inside.
• 15:14
  And so I really just thought that I could work through it.
• 15:18
  And if I was working constantly that I would get to a place
• 15:23
  where I was out of this pain of this stress.
• 15:27
  And it very interesting that me and my brother
• 15:31
  have constant conversations now.
• 15:32
  My brothers, so like because our low brothers
• 15:35
  are completely part of the business as well.
• 15:37
  And we actually look back on those times
• 15:39
  and reminisce on those times.
• 15:41
  I laugh at them in a good way, in such a good way.
• 15:45
  It's like wow, because it's such a perspective shift
• 15:49
  of being able to have such a low point in your life.
• 15:53
  Where now I'm able to, like now I go through hard times still,
• 15:57
  you can't get away from problems in life.
• 15:59
  It's not possible.
• 16:00
  Problems go through every stage of life.
• 16:04
  And if you go down a street and look at people
• 16:07
  who are walking down the street,
• 16:08
  every single person is facing their own problems,
• 16:10
  whether they're rich poor, whether they're happily married,
• 16:13
  every single person has their own problems.
• 16:16
  And so being able to have that perspective shift of looking back
• 16:21
  on like what you thought was just, you know,
• 16:23
  just the worst time of your entire life is pretty, pretty fun.
• 16:28
  It was good after he got there.
• 16:31
  It's not good in there.
• 16:33
  Do you think that the way you dealt with it
• 16:38
  is the best way to deal with it?
• 16:40
  And I don't have an opinion or I don't know
• 16:42
  what the best way to deal with it is.
• 16:44
  I've never had, oh, my family, $300,000.
• 16:48
  That to me would be super stressful.
• 16:50
  I don't know how I deal with that.
• 16:51
  I don't know if I deal with it well at all.
• 16:54
  I mean, I've had investor money before,
• 16:57
  but it's like different when it's family
• 16:59
  because you don't wanna lose anyone's money.
• 17:01
  You don't wanna lose investor money either, of course.
• 17:03
  But family is like, family's gonna be with you forever,
• 17:07
  no matter what, no matter what business fails,
• 17:09
  they're gonna be around.
• 17:10
  So how do you think I was like the smartest way?
• 17:12
  And not just, don't answer that question
• 17:15
  just from the perspective of like this specific problem.
• 17:18
  Answer it from the perspective of any time
• 17:21
  you're dealing with something that is a degree
• 17:24
  more stress than you're used to dealing with
• 17:28
  what is like the healthiest way to work through that.
• 17:30
  Even if you owed somebody, family, $300,000,
• 17:33
  or you owed investors $10 million,
• 17:36
  and things aren't going well,
• 17:37
  what's like the way to work through that?
• 17:39
  So you can still be effective,
• 17:42
  but you still protect your mental health.
• 17:45
  Yeah, I personally believe that
• 17:49
  there are so many statistics out there about stress killing
• 17:53
  and stress causing diseases inside of your body
• 17:56
  and stress being the biggest cause of cancer,
• 18:00
  stress being the biggest leading indicator of early death.
• 18:04
  I think stress kills more than any single other thing,
• 18:07
  any workout routines, any health diets,
• 18:14
  all of that, I think stress kills more than that.
• 18:16
  So I think figuring out ways to eradicate stress
• 18:19
  of your life is the number one priority
• 18:22
  that people should be working towards.
• 18:24
  And it's very, very difficult during times like that
• 18:28
  where it is very stressful,
• 18:30
  like being $300,000 in debt at such a young age,
• 18:34
  what I did was I just numb myself out from reality
• 18:37
  as much as possible.
• 18:39
  And I created a safe space with work.
• 18:42
  So everything outside of work wasn't safe and work was safe.
• 18:47
  And so I still have this to this day
• 18:49
  where every single morning, most of the time,
• 18:51
  I wake up with anxiety,
• 18:53
  even though there's not really anything to be anxious about
• 18:56
  and it's because for a four year period of time,
• 18:59
  I train myself to every single day I wake up,
• 19:01
  I wake up with anxiety to get as fast as possible
• 19:05
  to my computer desk to start working.
• 19:08
  And so it's like your brain is a computer
• 19:10
  and it can be trained.
• 19:11
  And when you train and start a way
• 19:13
  for such a long period of time,
• 19:14
  it's very hard to train it out of that.
• 19:17
  Do you think that's healthy?
• 19:18
  No, I don't need to tell you at all, it definitely.
• 19:21
  I didn't know that's how you are.
• 19:22
  Yeah.
• 19:23
  So when you work, when you first start working every morning,
• 19:28
  it's from a place of,
• 19:29
  it's almost from a place of a little bit of fear.
• 19:31
  Very anxiety-based.
• 19:33
  And is that, I mean, that thing that happened with your family
• 19:37
  when you were young and you owed the money?
• 19:39
  How long did that last?
• 19:40
  How long was that period?
• 19:41
  Oh, wow.
• 19:42
  Three years.
• 19:43
  Three years.
• 19:44
  Yeah.
• 19:45
  That's some trauma, dude.
• 19:46
  Yeah.
• 19:46
  That's some trauma.
• 19:47
  Built up trauma.
• 19:48
  So when you talk about stress being like a silent killer,
• 19:52
  have you, I mean, this is, say what you want to say,
• 19:55
  but you've not tried to do work to try and unwind that trauma?
• 19:58
  For sure.
• 19:59
  Because now you don't have these money issues.
• 20:03
  You have business, you have stress,
• 20:05
  but you don't have, like, you have experience.
• 20:08
  You understand that $300,000, first of all,
• 20:10
  is not a lot of money in business context,
• 20:13
  but it can be repaid.
• 20:14
  Any amount of money can be repaid.
• 20:16
  And no problems are so significant enough,
• 20:19
  especially what we're dealing with.
• 20:21
  I mean, maybe there are people that have
• 20:22
  much bigger problems than us than they do.
• 20:24
  But the stuff that we deal with on a day-to-day,
• 20:26
  even in a business, even if it's doing very well,
• 20:29
  you're still going to be alive tomorrow.
• 20:30
  The business is going to keep carrying on.
• 20:32
  So have you tried to, like, go through, like,
• 20:36
  I don't know, like, therapy or anything like that,
• 20:39
  so you don't approach each day with trauma,
• 20:41
  but, like, you have a different perspective.
• 20:43
  Dude, for sure.
• 20:44
  Yeah, I've been in therapy for the past 10 months, weekly.
• 20:48
  So this is more of a new thing.
• 20:50
  For sure.
• 20:51
  And do you find that it's working?
• 20:52
  Yeah, the therapy that I go to wasn't directly for stress.
• 20:57
  It was mainly for relationships.
• 21:00
  And it was because of, like, childhood trauma
• 21:02
  that was built up and created the type of person I am.
• 21:05
  But a lot of things, a lot of the problems that we face today,
• 21:09
  I think, come from childhood experiences.
• 21:12
  And so unpacking a lot of the things
• 21:15
  that I faced as a childhood in my childhood
• 21:18
  was able to, you know, give me more clarity
• 21:21
  in terms of how I operate day to day,
• 21:23
  even so much as, why do I operate from an anxiety-based framework?
• 21:27
  And why do I operate where I feel the need
• 21:30
  to be constantly working?
• 21:32
  And it comes from childhood of the feeling of not being
• 21:35
  good enough or only being good if I perform in a certain way,
• 21:39
  and things that are trained into you.
• 21:41
  I mean, sometimes, sometimes, like,
• 21:45
  someone's dark side can actually help them in their career.
• 21:49
  And it seems like it actually has helped you in your business,
• 21:53
  but it may not be the healthiest way to do what you do.
• 21:58
  And have you thought about that before,
• 21:59
  like, your dark side helping you?
• 22:00
  For sure, yeah.
• 22:02
  I think my childhood and my dark side, like you're saying,
• 22:08
  has helped me tremendously in business,
• 22:10
  but has been a huge detriment in every single other area
• 22:13
  of my life.
• 22:14
  What was the thing in your childhood
• 22:16
  that you think led to this feeling of anxiety?
• 22:18
  It was probably just sort of further doubled down on
• 22:24
  when you owed your family some money.
• 22:26
  I'm sure that didn't help at all,
• 22:27
  but it came from much earlier.
• 22:29
  Well, we get unpacked a lot here.
• 22:32
  Like, I could speak about this for hours.
• 22:34
  Like, I was talking hundreds of hours
• 22:35
  of my therapist, yeah.
• 22:36
  But yeah, my parents went through a divorce
• 22:41
  when I was at a very young age.
• 22:43
  And the thing that was very unique about our situation
• 22:48
  and very difficult was the child custody case.
• 22:52
  And so whenever two parents get divorced with kids,
• 22:55
  like, if they can't work it out themselves,
• 22:58
  then it goes to the court system
• 22:59
  to be able to figure out the child custody.
• 23:02
  And sometimes it goes like 50, 50,
• 23:05
  or sometimes like they can't agree on anything.
• 23:08
  And so we started off 50, 50 between our mom and our dad.
• 23:11
  And then our mom pretty much like completely parental alienated
• 23:17
  us from our dad.
• 23:18
  And so people don't necessarily know
• 23:21
  what parental alienation is,
• 23:23
  but it's basically like instilling beliefs
• 23:26
  and instilling sort of thought systems inside of a kid's mind.
• 23:30
  That's like very susceptible to, you know,
• 23:34
  yeah, influence.
• 23:35
  And so she instilled these thoughts that her dad wasn't safe
• 23:39
  and that the only person that was safe was basically her.
• 23:42
  And pretty crazy thoughts like things like sexual abuse
• 23:47
  inside of our minds when it never really happened.
• 23:50
  And then a good line to so many different things
• 23:52
  where we went into CFS,
• 23:55
  which is basically like child custody services in Canada
• 23:59
  and all of these things.
• 24:00
  And that brought its own set of problems,
• 24:03
  but basically within all of that,
• 24:05
  I was the person who stayed quiet throughout it all.
• 24:08
  So I was like the stationary ones,
• 24:10
  they quiet the majority of brothers.
• 24:13
  Yeah, like my older brother was the one who talked adamantly
• 24:16
  about a lot of things because he was the one who my mom
• 24:20
  like mainly worked with, so to speak.
• 24:23
  And then my little brother acted out throughout all of them.
• 24:28
  And so he basically was deemed that he had ADHD.
• 24:32
  And so he got put on medication at a very young age
• 24:36
  and it led to his own problems with that
• 24:39
  that he has been able to get over tremendously.
• 24:42
  And he's an amazing human being now.
• 24:44
  But myself, what I did was I just stayed quiet.
• 24:47
  And so I went through a period of, you know,
• 24:50
  getting a very lack of attention.
• 24:52
  And this is trauma building up.
• 24:53
  Yeah, I'm not saying anything else,
• 24:55
  speaking out, you're not dealing with that.
• 24:56
  Yeah, and so like my parents,
• 24:58
  well, my dad ended up getting custody of us
• 25:01
  and he grew us into like the people we are today,
• 25:04
  the men we are today.
• 25:06
  And so like my dad is the person who I have to thank
• 25:09
  for the people who me and my brothers are today.
• 25:12
  And the reason we are today, he was an amazing dad
• 25:16
  with the stuff that he was given.
• 25:18
  And you know, the situation that that was.
• 25:21
  But yeah, throughout all that,
• 25:23
  it was the lack of attention that I had.
• 25:25
  It was that I was never really taught
• 25:30
  how to showcase my emotions.
• 25:33
  And to acknowledge my emotions inside of my head
• 25:36
  and then to actually communicate those emotions.
• 25:39
  And so it led to just the ridiculous amount of problems.
• 25:43
  But in business, it was definitely helping you out
• 25:48
  in the business.
• 25:49
  It helps, but I mean, there's a lot there
• 25:51
  that nobody should ever have to go through.
• 25:53
  Like I mean, like it sounds like you're,
• 25:55
  I don't know your whole family scenario,
• 25:57
  but it sounds like your mom like weaponized a court system
• 26:00
  to a degree.
• 26:01
  What, yeah, which is super fucked up.
• 26:04
  And that's a whole other conversation
• 26:06
  that should never happen ever.
• 26:08
  And then when did you, so when did you start sort of
• 26:14
  getting back in touch with your dad?
• 26:16
  Or just to understand like the timeline.
• 26:18
  So like when you were for example,
• 26:19
  like going through all this stress about your business,
• 26:21
  where you close closer with your mom or your dad
• 26:24
  at that point.
• 26:25
  Yeah, so our dad got full custody of us
• 26:26
  when I was about nine.
• 26:28
  Okay, so this point you, so you had trauma.
• 26:31
  Yeah, but then you spent, then you got full cut,
• 26:34
  your dad got full custody.
• 26:35
  So you did have positive influence in your life
• 26:38
  from nine until so that there was still remnants
• 26:43
  of very early childhood trauma that were like playing over
• 26:46
  when you were going through this whole like business failure.
• 26:50
  Okay, I understand, I understand.
• 26:53
  And I'm just more curious than anything
• 26:55
  because you mentioned you've only been going to therapy
• 26:57
  for 10 months.
• 26:59
  Why did this all come to pass?
• 27:01
  And I think that it's actually maybe just tell a little bit
• 27:05
  just briefly how you're sort of entrepreneur, career
• 27:08
  evolved over the years.
• 27:10
  And then even 10 months ago, which I know you were successful
• 27:13
  10 months ago, and I know that you have an incredible business
• 27:16
  10 months ago.
• 27:17
  Why at that point, where you like, now I need to go to therapy?
• 27:22
  Because this is after, this is after a lot of success.
• 27:24
  Yeah, I'll touch on the business journey
• 27:27
  and then we can go on that and just make sure I hit that.
• 27:30
  Okay, I'll remember, yeah.
• 27:31
  So how the business journey went was basically
• 27:35
  start up the wildest year, but it's had a massive amount
• 27:38
  of success with that before graduating high school,
• 27:41
  lost it all, went into debt, had those huge feelings
• 27:44
  of stress, wanted to transition to an agency,
• 27:49
  transition to the agency, start making some money
• 27:52
  and getting clients with the agency,
• 27:54
  start being able to repay back some of the loan,
• 27:58
  start to build up cash flow.
• 28:00
  Then we completely closed out the wildest year
• 28:03
  about business and the product-based business
• 28:05
  because we were like, okay, the thing that we have to do
• 28:07
  is focus.
• 28:08
  We need to make sure we're focusing on things.
• 28:11
  We didn't listen to that advice.
• 28:12
  We end up distract ourselves with so many different things,
• 28:15
  but do you have the right intentions?
• 28:17
  We have the right intentions at the start.
• 28:20
  And then we ended up going into a lot of different services
• 28:24
  within the agency.
• 28:25
  So we started doing social media,
• 28:27
  then we started doing press services for our clients,
• 28:30
  and then we started doing the giveaway for our clients.
• 28:33
  We're basically a partner of wisdom celebrity
• 28:35
  and they would do giveaways to grow our clients followers.
• 28:38
  And that's where things really grew up.
• 28:40
  Well, that was probably a lot of people do social media
• 28:45
  marketing, but I think that working with celebrities
• 28:48
  doing giveaways, that's something that's so niche
• 28:52
  and not a lot of people do,
• 28:54
  and if they do, they don't do it well,
• 28:55
  and that probably gave you.
• 28:56
  And also, that's a massive high-ticket item you're selling.
• 29:02
  So the revenue from that's also incredible.
• 29:07
  But do you still do those as much?
• 29:09
  Because when you look at your business now as it's evolved,
• 29:13
  you still do the social media.
• 29:15
  You still do the giveaways to a degree,
• 29:17
  but not as much, correct?
• 29:18
  Yeah, we do the giveaways once a quarter now.
• 29:21
  So when you look at all the different things
• 29:23
  you sell now as an agency,
• 29:25
  why do you sell things the way that you sell them?
• 29:27
  Why do you only giveaways once a quarter?
• 29:30
  And maybe even explain what those are.
• 29:32
  Because that's very cool.
• 29:33
  You get to work with celebrities and whatnot,
• 29:34
  but then why don't you do them once a month?
• 29:37
  Yeah, so we're even transitioned our business model
• 29:40
  is as much of a retainer model as possible.
• 29:44
  Just because we're trying to get out of the sales,
• 29:48
  where we're trying to get into fulfillment.
• 29:51
  I love fulfillment.
• 29:52
  I love trying to make our product and services better
• 29:56
  to make our clients as happy as possible.
• 29:59
  I'd never really like sales.
• 30:00
  I was never a natural sales person.
• 30:02
  I had to force myself into sales.
• 30:05
  And so being in a retainer model,
• 30:07
  where we create a product and service,
• 30:09
  that's as sticky as possible,
• 30:11
  where people are getting the services
• 30:14
  and getting the results that they're looking for
• 30:16
  and stay on for as long as possible.
• 30:17
  And that's with our social media management services.
• 30:20
  Where we come in, take care of full service, everything,
• 30:24
  from the videography, editing, strategy, post-production,
• 30:29
  the posting, all of that.
• 30:31
  And then when you look at the other side of the business,
• 30:33
  give away side, which is really just
• 30:34
  you partner with the celebrity.
• 30:36
  I think people have seen these giveaways before.
• 30:38
  They have like 10 Berkins or whatever.
• 30:40
  And then they're like,
• 30:42
  or like a whole bunch of like like Macbokes
• 30:45
  or phones or whatever and they're like,
• 30:46
  okay, this is like where they follow.
• 30:48
  And then you do a giveaway and then somebody wins the prize.
• 30:51
  Yeah.
• 30:52
  And why do you do those once a quarter
• 30:55
  and why didn't you just kill them off?
• 30:56
  Yeah.
• 30:57
  So the celebrity partnerships, yeah.
• 30:59
  It's where we give away massive prizes.
• 31:01
  And then we say, the celebrities are basically saying,
• 31:04
  guys, I'm giving away all of these prizes.
• 31:06
  All you have to do is go to At Hike Clote
• 31:08
  and follow everybody that they're following.
• 31:10
  And then our At Hike Clote page,
• 31:12
  we follow a list of our giveaway sponsors.
• 31:14
  They're each paying us to sponsor the giveaway
• 31:17
  and then gain the followers in return.
• 31:20
  And so we used to do those once a month.
• 31:23
  And then we cut it back to once a quarter
• 31:25
  because they still make money
• 31:26
  and there are a great way for us to get very notable
• 31:30
  inside of like the celebrity industry.
• 31:32
  You get association with a very cool people.
• 31:34
  Yeah.
• 31:35
  But we stopped doing them once a month
• 31:36
  because they're a lot of effort,
• 31:38
  a lot of time commitment and they're just one time sales.
• 31:42
  So it's no retainer sales.
• 31:43
  It's all upsells of our past clients.
• 31:46
  And so it's like making some quick money
• 31:48
  but it's not what we're trying to do.
• 31:51
  Where we're trying to increase our enterprise value
• 31:53
  which is done through the recurring revenue
• 31:56
  which makes a lot of sense.
• 31:57
  And also like I think about it for clients
• 32:01
  that actually do participate,
• 32:03
  do you feel like the value of like the actual fault
• 32:06
  because it's like giveaway followers?
• 32:08
  So it's like different than I have been following
• 32:12
  your product or service for like the past six months
• 32:14
  and I'm a big fan of the content you post.
• 32:17
  So do you find that like there's a lot of value still
• 32:19
  for people to like engage with this stuff,
• 32:21
  get giveaway followers like you see a lot of those followers
• 32:25
  like churning or do they actually like retain?
• 32:28
  For sure, yeah, about 20 to 25% of the followers
• 32:31
  drop off after the giveaway
• 32:33
  and really the only people that makes sense
• 32:36
  to enter the giveaways to sponsor them
• 32:39
  and gain a ton of followers are ones with high ticket services.
• 32:43
  And so that's why we primarily focused
• 32:45
  on the aesthetics industry over the past years
• 32:48
  and why we're focusing heavily in the future
• 32:50
  because if you think about like plastic surgeons,
• 32:53
  for example, they have services
• 32:55
  that go all the way up to 30,000 plus dollars
• 32:57
  for these massive surgeries.
• 32:59
  And so they get one client from this giveaway
• 33:03
  of gaining say 60,000 followers,
• 33:06
  which is very reasonable over a period of time.
• 33:08
  60,000 followers come in, you're gonna get one.
• 33:10
  They're gonna get one client over the period of time,
• 33:12
  especially when it's coming from a celebrity
• 33:14
  like Cardibee or Nicki Minaj
• 33:15
  where it's women that-
• 33:17
  Someone in that audience wants plastic surgery.
• 33:19
  For sure, yeah.
• 33:20
  And so then they make back that money times three or four.
• 33:24
  That makes sense.
• 33:25
  So it's like even like when you do like these,
• 33:26
  like kind of like growth hack kind of things,
• 33:30
  like you still have to have a way to monetize them
• 33:32
  and make sure that you're actually capitalizing on it.
• 33:34
  Like it's not just getting followers.
• 33:35
  For sure.
• 33:36
  Yeah, unless it's just some rich kid
• 33:38
  that's wanting to like have vanity metrics.
• 33:41
  Which is, yeah, I mean,
• 33:42
  but that doesn't serve a purpose, like a business purpose.
• 33:44
  Like you actually want to make use of this,
• 33:45
  you have to figure out a way to actually monetize those.
• 33:48
  And I'm sure you probably get that shit
• 33:49
  from people that go participate in the giveaways.
• 33:54
  Like they're like, well, I didn't get results from this.
• 33:56
  I'm like, okay, well, then you have to focus on
• 33:59
  actually building a business around your Instagram,
• 34:01
  not just having an Instagram with followers or followers.
• 34:04
  Say for sure.
• 34:05
  And this is actually probably where you hit them
• 34:06
  with like the other side of the business.
• 34:08
  It's the off sell.
• 34:09
  But yeah, yeah, no, that makes a lot.
• 34:11
  Okay, so now I understand like where your business is at.
• 34:14
  How you sort of grew the business was,
• 34:16
  you did the giveaway that made money,
• 34:18
  but it's super labor intensive.
• 34:21
  And that was like, that was a kind of not high tick.
• 34:24
  And I mean, it could be high tick.
• 34:24
  The sixth grant could be high tick,
• 34:26
  depending on what else you sell.
• 34:28
  And then you took the customers from that
• 34:30
  and then you move them until like a recurring revenue
• 34:33
  retainer model, right?
• 34:35
  And then I mean, that's actually,
• 34:37
  I think that something that most service-based businesses
• 34:39
  should focus on like a retainer-based model.
• 34:42
  But it seems like a lot of agencies
• 34:43
  like still don't get it right.
• 34:45
  I feel like they're still very project-based.
• 34:48
  Or they're retainers.
• 34:51
  I'm curious how you structure your retainers
• 34:53
  and why you've built a successful business
• 34:55
  around a retainer model when I work with a lot of agencies
• 34:58
  that seem to, maybe it's the quality
• 35:01
  of the service you deliver.
• 35:02
  Because I've worked a lot of PR agencies
• 35:04
  and just agencies in general.
• 35:06
  And I honestly find like the retainer
• 35:09
  is too expensive for what I'm getting out of it.
• 35:12
  Or even with like PR,
• 35:13
  it could be five grand, it could be 20 grand a month.
• 35:16
  But then there's like no guarantee
• 35:18
  that I'm even going to get anything.
• 35:19
  When I do get stuff, I feel like it's like bullshit,
• 35:22
  media placement.
• 35:23
  So what are the issues in your industry
• 35:26
  and why do you stand out so much?
• 35:28
  Yeah, so when you're starting up into agency,
• 35:31
  that's a retainer model.
• 35:32
  I'm just going to speak from like our agency.
• 35:34
  So like if you're going to start up like a social media agency
• 35:37
  or any type of marketing agency,
• 35:40
  one of the biggest levers is like the price point
• 35:43
  that you're at based off the service that you're delivering.
• 35:46
  So you have an option.
• 35:47
  You could be the lowest in the market, the cheapest.
• 35:50
  You could be middle in the market somewhere in between
• 35:52
  or you could be the highest price in the market.
• 35:55
  So the only one of those three options
• 35:57
  that give you zero benefit is being right in the middle.
• 36:01
  Because you're going to get outpriced
• 36:03
  by the lowest in the market
• 36:04
  and that you're not going to have enough margin
• 36:06
  to actually pay for good staff.
• 36:09
  And then all of the things that increase your hard cost
• 36:12
  to deliver more value.
• 36:13
  So they kind of want to spend money
• 36:15
  then they'll go to the premium.
• 36:16
  Exactly, okay, exactly.
• 36:18
  And so basically we were choosing between
• 36:21
  the lowest cost option and the highest cost.
• 36:23
  And what we want to do is we want to be working
• 36:26
  with constantly the highest level individuals
• 36:28
  because they're the most enjoyable to work with.
• 36:31
  They don't complain about their bills.
• 36:33
  They want the highest value, the best experience.
• 36:36
  So they're willing to pay for it.
• 36:37
  And working with the highest level individuals
• 36:40
  you actually learn from.
• 36:41
  And I wanted to learn from my clients
• 36:43
  because that's an amazing thing
• 36:45
  and being friends with the clients is awesome.
• 36:48
  And do you think that like when you,
• 36:50
  when now the services you actually sell are PR, social media,
• 36:56
  do you, and then you do the good boys?
• 36:59
  What people, let me actually, let me say this differently,
• 37:03
  is PR for every business owner.
• 37:06
  Do you feel like every business owner should be engaging
• 37:07
  in PR or are there certain people
• 37:09
  where it's not useful for them?
• 37:11
  Because I think there's actually, there's a,
• 37:12
  was it a Bill Gates quote?
• 37:14
  I think so that you said like if I had,
• 37:16
  I was down to my last dollar,
• 37:18
  then I would spend it on PR.
• 37:19
  Yeah, he's talking about the power of PR.
• 37:21
  Yeah, I know you said this quote a few times,
• 37:23
  but do you believe that to be true?
• 37:25
  I think every single business owner
• 37:27
  can have some level of PR.
• 37:29
  I don't think every business owner
• 37:31
  needs to be constantly featured in the media,
• 37:33
  constantly featured in press TV,
• 37:36
  but we've gone the direction of practically
• 37:38
  every single one of the packages that we sell,
• 37:40
  we put a little bit of press on it.
• 37:42
  So getting them featured in some sort of media
• 37:44
  because at the end of the day,
• 37:46
  every single person is searching up on Google
• 37:48
  before making a purchasing decision.
• 37:50
  And so having some level of media on there
• 37:53
  is going to benefit you in the long run.
• 37:56
  Do you feel like traditional PR is starting to die
• 37:59
  compared to social media?
• 38:01
  For sure.
• 38:02
  Yeah, 100%.
• 38:03
  Traditional PR is on the steep decline.
• 38:06
  When you say PR, where are you putting people?
• 38:08
  Are you putting people in Forbes or Inc or on MSNBC?
• 38:12
  Where are you actually putting people
• 38:13
  where it still makes sense?
• 38:14
  Or are you trying to get them on podcasts
• 38:17
  and shit like new idea?
• 38:18
  So PR is a very broad term that encompasses
• 38:21
  even newspapers, no boards, it encompasses
• 38:25
  like pretty much every level of marketing.
• 38:26
  It's just the aspect of leveling up
• 38:28
  somebody's brand and presence pretty much physical
• 38:31
  and digital, where we focus on
• 38:33
  is new age media for the most part.
• 38:36
  So the only type of old age media that we focus on
• 38:39
  is digital based publications.
• 38:41
  Where people are getting only featured in digital media
• 38:44
  that ranks on Google.
• 38:46
  But then outside of that,
• 38:47
  it's like working on getting the featured in podcasts.
• 38:50
  Sometimes working on influencer collaborations,
• 38:52
  which is like PR related.
• 38:54
  Because I think that even in new media,
• 38:58
  people don't know really how to capitalize on PR.
• 39:00
  And like for somebody who's like a business owner
• 39:02
  out there right now, somebody's listening
• 39:04
  and they want to like figure out how to get started in PR,
• 39:08
  should they focus on just getting placements first
• 39:11
  or should they figure out kind of like what you alluded to before,
• 39:14
  they should figure out like the funnel
• 39:16
  of how they're going to use that PR.
• 39:18
  Yeah, it's a good question.
• 39:19
  It depends where they're at in business.
• 39:20
  Like if they're just starting out
• 39:21
  or if they're currently making money,
• 39:23
  an easy way to start with like Crest
• 39:25
  is just going and doing press indications for your business.
• 39:28
  So basically this is where you go on to like access wire,
• 39:31
  Globe and News wire,
• 39:32
  there's tons of press indications where you can go on.
• 39:35
  You write up basically a press release.
• 39:40
  And so this is like a one page outline
• 39:43
  of a major updating your business.
• 39:46
  If you acquired another business,
• 39:47
  if you are maybe just starting your business,
• 39:50
  released a new product line,
• 39:52
  this is where you're running from the perspective
• 39:53
  of your own business.
• 39:55
  You go on to access wire, Globe and News wire,
• 39:57
  there's tons of them.
• 39:58
  Do people have to read that?
• 40:00
  What it does is it ranks on Google
• 40:01
  underneath your name.
• 40:02
  Okay.
• 40:03
  And so that's the primary thing.
• 40:05
  We don't really do press for the purposes
• 40:07
  of gaining a huge new audience
• 40:10
  from the publications that they're being featured on.
• 40:13
  It's mainly for the perspective that ranks on Google
• 40:15
  and how amazing that is when anybody
• 40:17
  searching up their name for that additional authority.
• 40:20
  So it's like social proof.
• 40:22
  Basically it's a social proof.
• 40:23
  They like you've done something impressive.
• 40:25
  When I Google your name,
• 40:27
  which is like your new resume,
• 40:28
  this is what comes up.
• 40:30
  And when you think about social media versus,
• 40:35
  so if I'm trying to create social proof around somebody
• 40:38
  and thought leadership around somebody,
• 40:40
  they have all their socials.
• 40:41
  If I Google their name,
• 40:42
  they're gonna have a couple articles around them.
• 40:44
  But now anybody can pay for verification.
• 40:47
  So what is the signal that I'm cool and no worthy
• 40:52
  and actually know what I'm talking about?
• 40:54
  I'm asking that because now I don't know what to look for.
• 40:57
  When I'm bringing on podcasts, guys,
• 40:59
  it's hard when somebody is verified across all platforms.
• 41:02
  It seems like everybody now is very good at becoming
• 41:05
  like a thought leader and recognized online.
• 41:07
  So outside of Wikipedia,
• 41:10
  which seems to be like the last place
• 41:13
  that nobody can sort of like growth hack their way in.
• 41:15
  I'm sure there's ways to do it anyways.
• 41:17
  It seems like everybody seems famous online now
• 41:20
  if they're focused on it.
• 41:21
  So where do people, that being said,
• 41:24
  if I was a client and I said, listen,
• 41:27
  I wanna really stand out,
• 41:29
  not just pay whatever the seven bucks a month
• 41:31
  for Instagram verification or whatever it is.
• 41:34
  I wanna really stand out.
• 41:35
  What do I have to do so that I look better
• 41:38
  than everyone else who's paying for verifications now?
• 41:41
  Yeah, so one way is that this is kind of like a hack
• 41:45
  for growing any brand and it's the associations
• 41:48
  with credible figures.
• 41:50
  And so you can't really fake a constant association
• 41:54
  with celebrities or leaders within your industry.
• 41:58
  And so if you're going on to somebody's Instagram page
• 42:01
  and like you see that they're associated
• 42:03
  with other credible figures,
• 42:04
  that's high level entrepreneurs, celebrities
• 42:07
  or anything like that,
• 42:08
  that's an indicator that you can't really fake.
• 42:12
  So then if I was gonna, yeah, but so if I'm a business leader
• 42:16
  and I wanna become more of like a thought leader, whatever,
• 42:19
  is there a strategy that you would tell,
• 42:23
  is it starting a podcast and interviewing people
• 42:25
  like what's the strategy that I would have to do?
• 42:27
  Yeah, well, I guess I think the podcast is the best way
• 42:31
  to getting like some sort of interview style.
• 42:35
  Yeah, a podcast is amazing.
• 42:36
  It's actually the first way that we got clients.
• 42:39
  And this is for any single social media agency
• 42:41
  or marketing agency, it's literally the best sales funnel
• 42:44
  out there.
• 42:45
  It should be illegal pretty much.
• 42:47
  Basically what you do is you partner
• 42:49
  with a high-level podcast or you do your own podcast.
• 42:53
  It's easier if you partner with already established podcast
• 42:56
  and you say, listen, I'm gonna give you an affiliate cut
• 42:59
  if you basically refer over guest to me,
• 43:02
  but you don't have to refer over guest
• 43:04
  until we do services for you for free
• 43:06
  and you see the results that we get.
• 43:08
  So this is exactly what we did.
• 43:10
  This is how we got our first, I'm glad it is.
• 43:12
  This is how we got our furry clients.
• 43:13
  Yeah, this is how we got our first clients.
• 43:16
  It is that we partnered with this one podcast
• 43:19
  that was already established.
• 43:21
  We did all of his services for an extremely discount rate
• 43:24
  managed all of his channels.
• 43:25
  After two months, he saw the results that we did.
• 43:27
  He's like, you guys are great.
• 43:29
  And then we're like, you should start referring us
• 43:31
  over to your podcast guests.
• 43:33
  Then we booked podcast guests onto his podcast
• 43:37
  that we knew would be good clients.
• 43:39
  And we gave him a script to say at the end of the podcast.
• 43:42
  So we basically go through an entire podcast
• 43:45
  and then at the end of the podcast,
• 43:46
  they would close down the recordings
• 43:48
  and then they would just talk one on one.
• 43:49
  Of course, as you always do.
• 43:51
  Yeah, and so they would talk one on one
• 43:53
  and always the podcast guests would bring up
• 43:55
  and be like, hey, so you're Instagram, it's pretty good.
• 43:58
  He's like, matter of fact, I have a team that runs it
• 44:01
  and I'd love to give you their information,
• 44:03
  booked up a call with us and we close them.
• 44:06
  That's actually how we got some of our best,
• 44:07
  we have retainer clients that are paying us to this day
• 44:10
  that we're from that funnel.
• 44:12
  Because I mean, it's so funny.
• 44:14
  That conversation about who do you work with
• 44:17
  or like who puts this all together or who runs your social.
• 44:21
  I actually probably have that conversation
• 44:23
  with like 95% of the guests that come on
• 44:26
  because they're all interested, right?
• 44:27
  Especially if you've built something significant.
• 44:30
  And they're like, okay, so like I take a look at your social,
• 44:33
  you're putting out X amount of clips per day
• 44:35
  or look at like I love the production value of your show.
• 44:37
  Like who does this for you?
• 44:40
  And I think that's actually, that's a very smart strategy.
• 44:42
  We started, we're going to start doing this
• 44:45
  in the aesthetics industry where I'm starting up
• 44:47
  a aesthetic space podcast that I'm just going to invite on
• 44:50
  or ideal clients onto the podcast.
• 44:53
  Talk to me about niching down.
• 44:54
  So you've done that very well.
• 44:56
  And I think when did you start niching down recently, right?
• 45:00
  Very recently.
• 45:01
  So you, this whole agency that you built all of Hike
• 45:05
  was just really a, not a generalist agency,
• 45:07
  but you had a general customer profile
• 45:11
  or avatar that you targeted.
• 45:12
  It was anybody that wanted social media PR, basically, right?
• 45:17
  You still take other people outside of aesthetics,
• 45:19
  but now you're niching down.
• 45:20
  What has changed in your business
• 45:22
  since you started to niche?
• 45:24
  Yeah, I'll give some background
• 45:25
  before the niching down.
• 45:27
  And they'll say like what's changed?
• 45:28
  So we were a very generalist.
• 45:31
  When we went into throwing up the agency first,
• 45:34
  we actually focused mainly on real estate.
• 45:36
  And so you're working with real estate investors.
• 45:38
  And then since we did good work for our first real estate
• 45:40
  investor, it brought us to a whole other repertoire
• 45:44
  of real estate investors.
• 45:45
  So we were working with many different.
• 45:47
  And then we started expanding to lawyers,
• 45:50
  cosmetics surgeon, a lot of different industries.
• 45:53
  And so then it was about two years ago.
• 45:57
  And we were looking at our entire client roster
• 46:00
  between the giveaways, press, and social media.
• 46:02
  And there were zero consistencies with our client base.
• 46:06
  And so we were running into a major issue
• 46:10
  on a couple of different levels.
• 46:11
  One was client acquisition.
• 46:13
  So basically with Facebook ads
• 46:16
  that was a huge way that we were attracting leads
• 46:19
  and Instagram DMs, we didn't have a solid approach
• 46:22
  that was getting us a specific type of client tell
• 46:24
  because we were going after really just any business owner.
• 46:27
  And then retaining top level employees
• 46:31
  and training up employees was very difficult
• 46:33
  because we were having to train our sales staff
• 46:37
  on talking with 15 different client avatars.
• 46:40
  That's interesting.
• 46:41
  And yeah, I don't know you ever think about the staff side
• 46:46
  or the employee side of having like
• 46:49
  not a clear vision for the business
• 46:51
  because then they're just as confused as you.
• 46:52
  Very true.
• 46:53
  Yeah.
• 46:54
  And so during this entire time,
• 46:56
  we were listening to so much Alex Ramose.
• 46:59
  Big Alex Ramose fan.
• 47:01
  And during all of this, we were listening
• 47:02
  to all of Alex Ramose's advice
• 47:04
  but besides his major pieces of advice,
• 47:07
  which is focusing and niching down.
• 47:10
  And the main, it was a mental barrier we had to get past
• 47:13
  where it was mainly like if we niche down,
• 47:16
  we're cutting off all of the other clients
• 47:18
  that we currently have.
• 47:20
  And like how would we say no to other clients on sales calls?
• 47:24
  So very, very difficult for our mind to get over.
• 47:28
  Then it got to a point of where we were spending
• 47:31
  around $40,000 per month on Facebook ads
• 47:34
  plus all of our other marketing.
• 47:36
  Literally getting hundreds of book calls per month
• 47:41
  for our sales team.
• 47:42
  We had a massive sales team
• 47:44
  and very little sales coming through
• 47:46
  because the conversion rate was just horrible.
• 47:49
  What was it?
• 47:49
  So you had 40 grand.
• 47:50
  How many leads did that give you?
• 47:52
  Oh, it's a conversion rate on that.
• 47:54
  So it was a non-niche conversion rate.
• 47:56
  Non-niche conversion rate.
• 47:58
  So it was $40,000 per month.
• 48:00
  We were getting over 1,000 leads from Facebook lead in forms.
• 48:04
  So they fill in the Facebook lead form.
• 48:06
  Then we were directing them towards a calendar booking
• 48:08
  to book a calendar.
• 48:10
  Then we got say about 400 to 500 bookings from that per month.
• 48:14
  And then from that we rated the leads.
• 48:17
  So we'd rate them one to five to five to five.
• 48:19
  I would highly suggest that anybody who has CRM
• 48:22
  when leads are coming in,
• 48:23
  even if you're niche down, rate the leads in quality
• 48:26
  because how do you rate the leads in quality
• 48:28
  before you speak to them?
• 48:29
  So we got a VA to basically go through
• 48:31
  and see the form that they filled out.
• 48:33
  Search their Instagram page and search their website.
• 48:36
  And then we rated it based off of qualification factors
• 48:39
  that we had, trained up one VA to do it.
• 48:41
  And so one VA's entire job was just rating the leads.
• 48:45
  So then we would end up getting about 100 to 150
• 48:48
  for our five to five of five leads,
• 48:51
  which are deal client they should close from the 40,000.
• 48:55
  We were making money from it,
• 48:56
  but the operation was just ridiculous.
• 48:58
  We had so many salespeople, so many sellers, so many closers,
• 49:01
  and it was just ridiculous to manage everything.
• 49:04
  And also was it slightly profitable or not?
• 49:08
  For sure, it was, it was profitable,
• 49:09
  but it could be much better.
• 49:11
  Definitely profitable, it could be much better.
• 49:14
  And with much less like staff overall.
• 49:18
  So we looked at this and we just did the 80-20 rule.
• 49:21
  We looked at all of our customer base,
• 49:23
  the customer base took all of the revenue from each customer
• 49:27
  and then took the 20% of the top paying customers,
• 49:32
  longest lasting customers.
• 49:33
  And it was just so eye-opening
• 49:37
  that it was completely in the aesthetics industry.
• 49:40
  So we're talking plastic surgeons, med-spaws,
• 49:43
  all of these people, because they got
• 49:44
  the highest value services from us.
• 49:47
  That's when you niche down.
• 49:48
  That's when we niche down.
• 49:49
  And then completely niche down was it changed,
• 49:50
  because you know, it's so interesting.
• 49:52
  This is we can actually somebody ask the difference
• 49:55
  between growth and scale.
• 49:57
  And I actually looked up the definition and grow,
• 50:01
  because it was a great question.
• 50:02
  And growth is just increasing your revenue,
• 50:05
  but scale is increasing your service delivery
• 50:08
  without increasing your expenses.
• 50:11
  And I think that that's where people really don't think
• 50:13
  about the scale of their business,
• 50:15
  and about growth at all costs.
• 50:17
  How do we hire a ridiculous amount of sales team
• 50:20
  or whatever it is, so we can keep servicing new customers?
• 50:23
  But what if instead of 10% profit margin
• 50:28
  or 15% profit margin, what if all of a sudden we just niche down
• 50:31
  and we can get like a 40 or 50 or 70,
• 50:34
  whatever the number is?
• 50:35
  And I think that business owners,
• 50:36
  there is a point where you have to think how to do that.
• 50:39
  And it's a scary point, because you're having to restructure
• 50:41
  what got you to where you're at.
• 50:43
  And you don't want to just absolutely blow up your business.
• 50:46
  But then you realize, okay, if we keep operating with this,
• 50:48
  we can't have like 300 sales people.
• 50:51
  It's like it's too much.
• 50:53
  It's like, dude, you're literally speaking exactly
• 50:56
  from my head.
• 50:56
  I was doing this math in my head and I was like, okay,
• 50:58
  for us to get to a $100 million business,
• 51:01
  which is like what we're trying to get to,
• 51:04
  we would literally have to have a staff
• 51:06
  of just 300 to 400 sales reps.
• 51:09
  And it's like, I do not want to manage a team
• 51:11
  with 300 to 400 sales reps.
• 51:12
  And there's no way that that's needed in the stayin' eight.
• 51:14
  You know, so then you start to figure out
• 51:17
  like your revenue per head.
• 51:18
  Yep.
• 51:19
  And do you actually have that number?
• 51:21
  Like before and after, if you don't.
• 51:23
  I don't have the revenue per handle,
• 51:24
  but yes, it's improving, is the answer.
• 51:26
  Yeah, that's what you're trying to optimize.
• 51:28
  Very, very.
• 51:29
  So now that you've got this whole switch out,
• 51:30
  like what have you seen in the business?
• 51:32
  Well, we ended up completely liquidating
• 51:35
  and canceling our entire sales team.
• 51:37
  The whole thing, how many people?
• 51:40
  Whole operation.
• 51:41
  There was at its peak, there was like 30 people.
• 51:45
  It's a decent sized.
• 51:46
  Yeah.
• 51:47
  And you were still on sales.
• 51:48
  Just on sale.
• 51:49
  Who were just managing them yourself?
• 51:50
  I had a manager in place,
• 51:52
  and then I was helping manage an aspect of it.
• 51:55
  And then, so this new strategy,
• 51:57
  just focusing on aesthetics,
• 51:59
  which I think is a very smart entrepreneur lesson.
• 52:01
  Like you figure where your customers are coming from,
• 52:05
  find a way to niche down.
• 52:06
  What has it done to the business now?
• 52:07
  Dude, it was crazy.
• 52:09
  It was literally nuts.
• 52:11
  Like the second that we niche down,
• 52:13
  opportunities just start flowing our way.
• 52:16
  We changed up our website
• 52:17
  and like referral started coming in.
• 52:22
  It was crazy.
• 52:23
  Like just natural bookings on our website
• 52:25
  of people in the aesthetics industry.
• 52:27
  Us getting booked on,
• 52:28
  we got booked on five speaking gigs
• 52:30
  in the aesthetics industry
• 52:32
  in the year of the slash few months.
• 52:33
  And now we're specialists in this industry.
• 52:36
  And so it's really unbelievable
• 52:38
  that in terms of like revenue numbers,
• 52:41
  we're at the exact same revenue that we were beforehand.
• 52:45
  If not a little bit less,
• 52:47
  but our profit margins went from about 20 to 25%.
• 52:51
  Now they're at like 50%.
• 52:52
  That's phenomenal.
• 52:54
  That's absolutely phenomenal.
• 52:55
  And how long did you take you to do this whole transition?
• 52:58
  It took us about seven months.
• 53:00
  That's not too bad.
• 53:01
  I have a question.
• 53:03
  What was the, you did an article
• 53:05
  where you had to submit like tax forms.
• 53:08
  Who was that with again?
• 53:10
  What was the whole, what was that article about?
• 53:12
  That wasn't about your transition into a new type of,
• 53:14
  that was just about the entire story
• 53:17
  just going through entrepreneurship journey.
• 53:19
  It was mainly speaking about Gen Zs in entrepreneurship.
• 53:23
  What was it, what were they trying to figure out?
• 53:25
  So tell the story about what happened.
• 53:26
  I think it's actually very interesting too.
• 53:28
  Because I didn't know that when business insider
• 53:30
  does a story on you,
• 53:31
  you have to submit your tax forms.
• 53:33
  So they do their due diligence
• 53:34
  to make sure you're not foolish to it.
• 53:35
  Yeah.
• 53:36
  So some journalists are extremely good at their job
• 53:39
  and take it very, very seriously as they should.
• 53:42
  And what did they reach out to you?
• 53:43
  So they reached out to us.
• 53:47
  Actually, our team reached out to,
• 53:48
  our team reaches out to journalists all the time.
• 53:50
  So our team reached out to them
• 53:52
  and it peaked their interest
• 53:53
  because they were needing to do a story on Gen Z
• 53:56
  within whenever it got published like quarter one, basically.
• 54:00
  And so they're like, this is the story I'm going to do.
• 54:02
  And so they wanted to do an entire basically off
• 54:05
  speaking about our cells
• 54:07
  and our evolution through business as a Gen Z
• 54:11
  and what it meant.
• 54:11
  And then basically threw out a giving tips to like other Gen Z
• 54:14
  who are trying to start up business.
• 54:16
  And so this particular journalist
• 54:18
  who is doing an interview with us
• 54:20
  needed to fact check every single dollar value
• 54:24
  that we were explaining.
• 54:25
  And so when we were talking about our overall revenue numbers,
• 54:28
  she asked us to submit our tax forms.
• 54:31
  I was like, well, I've never experienced this before.
• 54:35
  But it was business inside one of the publications.
• 54:37
  So I asked my Karen, because I have even collected
• 54:40
  all the tax forms in one place.
• 54:42
  And so he collected the tax firms from 2020 to 2024.
• 54:47
  So like about three to four year time span.
• 54:50
  And we submitted them in and yeah,
• 54:52
  total to 23 million in revenue, which was pretty cool.
• 54:55
  That is pretty cool.
• 54:57
  That's pretty, I didn't know the business insider did that.
• 54:58
  What was the purpose of the article?
• 55:00
  Because you've also said, and we had this conversation,
• 55:03
  we could talk about this as well,
• 55:04
  that like younger generations are getting lazier.
• 55:07
  So the article was not about younger generations being lazy.
• 55:11
  No, that was the different, that was the different one.
• 55:13
  Okay, okay.
• 55:13
  Yeah.
• 55:14
  So this one was just about,
• 55:15
  but with like the, it was your story.
• 55:18
  It was meant to be like,
• 55:19
  Hey, this is what you can accomplish.
• 55:21
  What was the article that came out about Gen Z being lazy?
• 55:24
  There was this other interview that we went on
• 55:27
  where this journalist was interviewing me
• 55:30
  just about random things.
• 55:31
  And we were just having basically a chat.
• 55:33
  It was almost like a podcast that was off the air.
• 55:36
  She was just interviewing me about random things.
• 55:38
  And she was asking my thoughts about Gen Z and stuff.
• 55:41
  And I just said this one line of,
• 55:44
  I think the majority of Gen Z and millennials
• 55:47
  are lazy and they're getting lazier.
• 55:50
  And she's like, that's money.
• 55:51
  We're running with that.
• 55:52
  And so we ended up taking that
• 55:54
  and she wanted to build a full story.
• 55:56
  So she just did an interview.
• 55:57
  But basically the outline and premise of that is,
• 56:02
  I think for the most part, Gen Z is extremely lazy
• 56:05
  in comparison to previous generations,
• 56:08
  where previous generations in the 1900s,
• 56:10
  like men were going to war,
• 56:12
  people were working on farms doing hard labor,
• 56:15
  all these things.
• 56:16
  And I see so much complaining around people my age
• 56:20
  and in Gen Z in general, when we have life so easy.
• 56:25
  And I think it's only getting worse
• 56:27
  because now we have AI where people don't even have to think
• 56:30
  for themselves anymore.
• 56:32
  And especially the younger generation,
• 56:34
  like Gen X or wherever,
• 56:36
  where they're growing up,
• 56:37
  literally where they're developing minds
• 56:40
  don't have to think anymore.
• 56:41
  I just want to take a second and thank fresh books
• 56:43
  for supporting today's episode.
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  If you missed January 7th,
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  I still want you to head over to that link
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• 58:00
  because they will always have some great promotions
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  for listeners of success story.
• 58:04
  That is freshbooks.com slash pricing dash offer.
• 58:08
  So I'll tell the story we're talking about.
• 58:10
  We're talking about before we press a quarter thing.
• 58:11
  It's interesting.
• 58:13
  So I use a lot of AI and I also agree.
• 58:15
  So a couple different things we can talk about.
• 58:18
  I also think younger generations are getting lazy.
• 58:21
  I think that I notice it myself and I notice it
• 58:27
  through friends because everybody's
• 58:29
  having a very hard time hiring entry level talent.
• 58:32
  So entry level talent is not seem to want to work.
• 58:35
  And this is going to be a generalization.
• 58:37
  They'll get me wrong.
• 58:38
  But I'll tell you some stories that have happened.
• 58:41
  I think I've told this story before.
• 58:42
  I can't remember if it was even to you.
• 58:44
  But one of my good friends, she's probably
• 58:45
  tried to hire 10 different videographers.
• 58:48
  And I've also tried to hire videographers.
• 58:50
  You try to hire them full time.
• 58:51
  And he's got, he's a, listen, he's a very good guy,
• 58:55
  nice person, like the smart business leader owner, whatever.
• 58:59
  He's not the guy who, if you work for him,
• 59:03
  you get, oh, this is the worst fucking boss in the world.
• 59:06
  No, he's a very nice guy.
• 59:08
  And he's very fair and he pays very well.
• 59:10
  And he's gone through about 10 different videographers,
• 59:14
  mostly because they're quality docs.
• 59:17
  But as like you can't find good talent for like 70 grand
• 59:21
  and so Florida for some reason.
• 59:23
  And he's hired some guy on a W2 full time videographer.
• 59:27
  The guy signs the contract and he comes into work.
• 59:30
  And the first day of work, he's like, I need more money.
• 59:33
  I've never in my life signed like an employment agreement.
• 59:38
  And then after I've signed the employment agreements
• 59:40
  that I need more money, I'm like, you're stupid.
• 59:44
  If you want more money, you negotiate
• 59:45
  before you sign the agreement not after.
• 59:47
  This is not like a contractor.
• 59:49
  This is a W2 employee, like full time employee.
• 59:51
  I know your Canadian W2 is a very merit.
• 59:54
  Yeah, I say it now because I'm down here.
• 59:56
  Got to talk American.
• 59:57
  But I like, it's like you are no more RRSP is down here.
• 1:00:02
  I like, it's a 401k.
• 1:00:04
  But no, it's like, it's full time employment.
• 1:00:07
  It's just full time employment.
• 1:00:08
  You can renegotiate that.
• 1:00:09
  You get a job, go get a salary job.
• 1:00:12
  You don't renegotiate that after.
• 1:00:13
  In the first week of your job, like what are you,
• 1:00:16
  what's wrong with you?
• 1:00:17
  Yeah, wait till you've done some work.
• 1:00:21
  Anyway, that's one thing that pisses me off.
• 1:00:23
  I don't understand that concept at all.
• 1:00:25
  To me, it's just like someone,
• 1:00:28
  that's from an entitlement say, I think it's entitlement.
• 1:00:31
  But it's entitlement plus stupidity,
• 1:00:33
  which is probably the worst kind of person.
• 1:00:34
  Yeah, because if you were smart and entitled,
• 1:00:36
  you would apply for a job and before you sign the contract,
• 1:00:39
  you'd say, actually, I want to make this amount of money.
• 1:00:41
  And then the hiring person can be like, yes or no.
• 1:00:44
  If they think like, I've negotiated salaries
• 1:00:46
  before I've gotten jobs before, it's like fine.
• 1:00:48
  But not after, not in the first week.
• 1:00:50
  And the other thing that I think you mentioned
• 1:00:53
  is really smart is about AI.
• 1:00:56
  And people not having to do the work themselves.
• 1:00:58
  So I notice this because I use AI
• 1:01:00
  in my post-production and some of my content.
• 1:01:02
  And AI, I mean, what do a lot of people
• 1:01:04
  use for the same thing for writing?
• 1:01:06
  A lot of people use it for writing.
• 1:01:07
  And AI is getting very good.
• 1:01:09
  And if you take, for example, if we record a podcast,
• 1:01:13
  or if I even just record into a mic,
• 1:01:15
  and then if I've written pieces in the past,
• 1:01:18
  and I like that writing style, and I can go into a generative chat
• 1:01:21
  tool or an LLM, and I can take the writing style that I like,
• 1:01:25
  and I can take the context that I want to speak about.
• 1:01:28
  And I say record into a mic so that it's not just
• 1:01:32
  a simple one-line prompt, but it's like a topic with context.
• 1:01:39
  It's a significant amount of information
• 1:01:40
  about a certain topic.
• 1:01:41
  I can feed the LLM.
• 1:01:43
  If I take that plus the writing style and put it in,
• 1:01:45
  I could have some tweets.
• 1:01:47
  I could have some posts, like social posts.
• 1:01:49
  I could have captions.
• 1:01:50
  I could have newsletter.
• 1:01:51
  I could have blogs all coming from that particular input.
• 1:01:56
  And I can just probably, I can create unlimited content
• 1:02:00
  with that input.
• 1:02:00
  And I don't really have to do a lot of thinking
• 1:02:02
  and creative writing anymore.
• 1:02:04
  But when I do that, I notice that I never
• 1:02:08
  realized how much writing helped me think,
• 1:02:12
  helped me communicate, helped me pull thoughts quicker.
• 1:02:15
  And when I don't write for significant period of time,
• 1:02:17
  I feel like I'm getting dumber.
• 1:02:18
  I don't know how else to describe it.
• 1:02:19
  I just feel like I'm getting dumber when I don't write.
• 1:02:22
  And I think that writing is just something
• 1:02:24
  that stimulates your brain to think in a different way.
• 1:02:27
  It's different than just consuming YouTube videos, for example.
• 1:02:32
  But I now force myself to actually write my newsletters,
• 1:02:37
  because I find that that allows me to aggregate all the thoughts
• 1:02:40
  and all the things that I've learned in my life,
• 1:02:42
  and then find a way to articulate them and sort of feed them
• 1:02:44
  back and make sure that I actually understand them,
• 1:02:46
  which I think that you mentioned before,
• 1:02:47
  is the real way that you can tell if you've learned something.
• 1:02:50
  But if I don't do that, I find that I just get dumber.
• 1:02:53
  And I mentioned another example.
• 1:02:55
  I interview a lot of people and people
• 1:02:56
  that have had success in the process of building right now.
• 1:03:00
  And then also people that have sold companies
• 1:03:02
  like five or 10 plus years ago.
• 1:03:04
  And the people that have sold companies years ago, listen.
• 1:03:07
  They're not stupid, obviously.
• 1:03:09
  But if you listen to when they were in the process
• 1:03:11
  of building a company versus five or 10 years
• 1:03:14
  into retirement, they are not as sharp
• 1:03:17
  as when they were currently everyday building things
• 1:03:20
  and dealing with problems and basically just operating.
• 1:03:23
  So the less you do and the more that you outsource
• 1:03:26
  or the more you're removed from the work, it impacts your brain.
• 1:03:32
  It impacts your cognitive performance.
• 1:03:33
  And I think that's something that people have to be careful of,
• 1:03:35
  because I'm saying this is, again, you said this very
• 1:03:39
  well, I'm a grown-ass adult.
• 1:03:41
  I brain is fully formed and I'm feeling
• 1:03:43
  and seeing the effects of this.
• 1:03:45
  Whereas somebody who is not, you know,
• 1:03:49
  their brain is not fully formed if they're already lazy
• 1:03:53
  and they're already not taking school seriously.
• 1:03:56
  Because again, I talk shit about the traditional education
• 1:03:59
  system all the time, but it's better than nothing.
• 1:04:01
  It's definitely better than nothing.
• 1:04:02
  Like I rather you go through university
• 1:04:05
  then not do any sort of, you know,
• 1:04:10
  personal development, professional development,
• 1:04:12
  education or anything like that.
• 1:04:14
  But if you are just outsourcing all of your work
• 1:04:16
  and you're learning to AI, I think that you're going to end up
• 1:04:19
  with a pretty stupid society.
• 1:04:21
  And that's more concerning than anything.
• 1:04:23
  If people just get lazy with it.
• 1:04:24
  Now there's the argument to say that like,
• 1:04:29
  if you use AI, you can, for the first pass at creativity,
• 1:04:34
  then you can sort of take it to the,
• 1:04:36
  you can sort of refine it and you can do the like
• 1:04:38
  the last mile of creative work.
• 1:04:40
  But I think that you still have to force yourself
• 1:04:44
  to think and do hard work and solve hard problems
• 1:04:48
  and not just use AI as this approach.
• 1:04:50
  This gets into actually a very scary topic
• 1:04:54
  of what could happen potentially with the entire world.
• 1:04:59
  And this gets into some like conspiracy theories types.
• 1:05:02
  That's okay, let's do it.
• 1:05:04
  But what are the conspiracy theories?
• 1:05:06
  So I might take a topic that's completely of left field
• 1:05:09
  from of this conversation.
• 1:05:11
  But if you look at the pyramids,
• 1:05:13
  Egypt and how they're one of the wonders of the world.
• 1:05:17
  And it's because of how they were built was so unbelievable
• 1:05:25
  in terms of putting these massive ton bricks
• 1:05:28
  that even with today's technology
• 1:05:30
  would be very, very difficult to create.
• 1:05:33
  And that could potentially be because they had technology
• 1:05:37
  that was completely different,
• 1:05:38
  but on a higher scale or unique to what we have today,
• 1:05:42
  and then it was completely eradicated somehow.
• 1:05:45
  And so that's similar to like where we're at today,
• 1:05:47
  where this new generation and even my generation,
• 1:05:50
  potentially even your generation,
• 1:05:53
  don't have the skill sets of the foundational building blocks
• 1:05:56
  to get up to the technology level that we have today.
• 1:05:59
  And there's fundamental building blocks
• 1:06:01
  that evolution built on top of.
• 1:06:03
  So for example, this new generation
• 1:06:06
  is just learning about AI, for example.
• 1:06:08
  So they're going to know how to use AI
• 1:06:09
  better than anybody else.
• 1:06:11
  But do they know how to even build the systems
• 1:06:15
  that created AI?
• 1:06:16
  And then before that, do they even know how to build computers
• 1:06:19
  that build the systems that build AI?
• 1:06:21
  And then do they know how to build the code
• 1:06:23
  that build the systems that all of these things
• 1:06:27
  build on top of each other?
• 1:06:29
  It's like with farming basically.
• 1:06:30
  People don't even know how to farm anymore.
• 1:06:32
  And nobody's even like creating their own food.
• 1:06:36
  And so for example, if there was a worldwide EMP
• 1:06:39
  that wiped out all technology,
• 1:06:41
  which like there's technology for EMPs
• 1:06:44
  that could do a worldwide EMP there was another war
• 1:06:46
  that would be a strategic move by a country.
• 1:06:49
  Yeah, what would happen to every single person?
• 1:06:52
  Every single person would just be beside themselves
• 1:06:55
  not knowing what to do.
• 1:06:57
  I mean, podcasting isn't useful in the world
• 1:06:59
  where there's no electricity.
• 1:07:00
  And I don't know how to farm.
• 1:07:02
  I don't, but I think what happens is
• 1:07:04
  and you have what's the word I'm looking for.
• 1:07:09
  Like the knowledge and wisdom and wealth
• 1:07:14
  is then hyper concentrated in a small group of people
• 1:07:16
  that understand how, like in farming, people still farm.
• 1:07:22
  But you know who makes the most money?
• 1:07:24
  Like huge conglomerates.
• 1:07:25
  It's not the individual farmer
• 1:07:27
  because there's less and less of them.
• 1:07:29
  And in technology,
• 1:07:31
  well, there's gonna be a very like small select group
• 1:07:33
  of people that understand how to code and how to build.
• 1:07:36
  And I think that wealth and knowledge
• 1:07:39
  is just gonna be more concentrated.
• 1:07:41
  And I don't think that's actually a good thing.
• 1:07:43
  I would hope that technology allows people,
• 1:07:48
  allows people to explore and learn and be proficient
• 1:07:52
  whatever, like you mentioned,
• 1:07:54
  like not just in using AI, but building AI
• 1:07:57
  and building sort of like,
• 1:07:59
  building the whole supply chain of AI.
• 1:08:01
  But you have to make sure that people aren't lazy
• 1:08:04
  for that to happen.
• 1:08:05
  Because they have the opportunity to,
• 1:08:08
  but are they actually using it?
• 1:08:09
  I don't know.
• 1:08:10
  I think that their people are ambitious.
• 1:08:12
  And I mean, people are not suit.
• 1:08:14
  I think that, I don't know.
• 1:08:16
  I don't have an answer for that
• 1:08:18
  because I know that more people are entrepreneurs
• 1:08:19
  than before.
• 1:08:20
  And that's sort of like a counterpoint
• 1:08:22
  to people being lazy.
• 1:08:23
  Why are more people entrepreneurs than ever before?
• 1:08:26
  I don't think entrepreneurship is lazy,
• 1:08:27
  but then I also see like somebody who is trying
• 1:08:31
  to get a nine to five and they're talking about
• 1:08:33
  quiet quitting or whatever it is.
• 1:08:35
  So then that person is skewing lazy.
• 1:08:37
  So why are some people more ambitious
• 1:08:39
  and why are some people more lazy?
• 1:08:41
  And I don't have an answer for you.
• 1:08:42
  I just noticed that there's like extremes on both ends.
• 1:08:46
  Maybe because, maybe because people don't want to be,
• 1:08:49
  maybe because life is expensive
• 1:08:51
  and people don't want to be stuck in the middle.
• 1:08:53
  It's kind of like you either want to be ultra rich
• 1:08:55
  and wealthy or you just want to live off government handouts
• 1:08:58
  and there is no more middle class,
• 1:09:00
  which is the sign of like a failing nation.
• 1:09:02
  That could also be.
• 1:09:04
  But the sign of a third world country
• 1:09:05
  is when there's no middle class,
• 1:09:07
  you have these two extremes.
• 1:09:08
  Yep.
• 1:09:09
  I think that's, this is not as important,
• 1:09:11
  political block up, but as I said it,
• 1:09:13
  I think that's actually very interesting
• 1:09:14
  if people like try and stew to one or the other.
• 1:09:17
  Cause I don't, I think the middle class
• 1:09:18
  is starting to disappear.
• 1:09:20
  Middle class now, like what's middle class?
• 1:09:22
  Making even like a hundred grand in most cities.
• 1:09:26
  What is that after tax?
• 1:09:27
  And Canada, you make a hundred grand taxes,
• 1:09:29
  like what 50, some percent can't remember what it is now.
• 1:09:32
  Same as New York, like you live in New York,
• 1:09:34
  you make a hundred grand per year.
• 1:09:36
  It's like at your poor.
• 1:09:37
  So you have to go one or two directions.
• 1:09:39
  Am I going to try and bust my ass for a hundred grand?
• 1:09:42
  Cause that's no longer middle class
• 1:09:43
  doesn't exist with a hundred grand anymore.
• 1:09:45
  Or am I just going to vote for a more socialist country
• 1:09:49
  that gives me some handouts.
• 1:09:51
  It gives me, you know, like minimum, what's this?
• 1:09:58
  Like a guaranteed salary or what?
• 1:09:59
  Oh yeah, I can't remember the term now.
• 1:10:01
  Yeah, but you know what we're talking, yeah.
• 1:10:04
  So am I just going to focus on moving to a country
• 1:10:07
  that's just going to pay me just to exist?
• 1:10:08
  Or am I going to try and break out
• 1:10:10
  and become somebody who's worth tens of millions of dollars
• 1:10:14
  because I see it all over Instagram?
• 1:10:16
  I don't know what, what prompts somebody
• 1:10:18
  to go in one direction versus the others.
• 1:10:19
  Probably was taking it back to how they were raised
• 1:10:21
  and a lot of the shit they went through the kid.
• 1:10:24
  It's also them thinking maybe that they're not capable of it.
• 1:10:27
  There's a story about you finding a mentor as a,
• 1:10:31
  you were young and there's a Canadian mentor
• 1:10:33
  that you had found who I think has passed away now.
• 1:10:36
  What was his name is?
• 1:10:37
  The Stefinario.
• 1:10:37
  The Stefinario.
• 1:10:38
  Now as part of that story, you actually said,
• 1:10:43
  I think your mom introduced you to him.
• 1:10:46
  So going back to, I found this point interesting
• 1:10:50
  after understanding your relationship with your mom
• 1:10:53
  and maybe this will lead to how you evolved
• 1:10:55
  as an entrepreneur and a human.
• 1:10:57
  So there was a point where you became close
• 1:11:00
  with your mother again to the point
• 1:11:01
  where you're spending time with her,
• 1:11:03
  you're trying to repair a relationship.
• 1:11:06
  Why was that?
• 1:11:07
  When my dad got forecasting when I was nine,
• 1:11:09
  we started seeing our mom under supervised visits
• 1:11:12
  from the age of nine basically until I was 18
• 1:11:17
  where I was able to make my own decisions.
• 1:11:20
  And so when I was 18, I saw my mom unsupervised
• 1:11:24
  and was basically just, yeah, trying to maintain a relationship.
• 1:11:32
  I didn't necessarily need her as a mom anymore.
• 1:11:34
  I was 18 and I was living on my own,
• 1:11:36
  story of my own business.
• 1:11:37
  And so I was more so doing it because I felt it was a duty
• 1:11:42
  and felt like it was good to maintain a relationship
• 1:11:45
  with your parents somewhat.
• 1:11:47
  And so that's kind of what it was.
• 1:11:48
  It's like we would go out once a week,
• 1:11:50
  maybe a couple of times a week to lunch
• 1:11:53
  and just talk about life.
• 1:11:55
  And that was one time we were out for lunch
• 1:11:57
  and there was the person saying behind us talking about
• 1:12:00
  just ripping into a social media team
• 1:12:03
  and being like my social media managers,
• 1:12:05
  suck, they're horrible.
• 1:12:07
  And then my mom overheard that
• 1:12:08
  and when he was walking past, she asked,
• 1:12:12
  so I heard you were talking about your social media team.
• 1:12:14
  He's like, yeah, they're horrible.
• 1:12:16
  And then she's like, my sons are actually great at social media.
• 1:12:19
  We're spending time with your mom.
• 1:12:20
  Your dad got full custody.
• 1:12:22
  You try and sort of repair relationship with your mom.
• 1:12:24
  And then you get over this like $300,000 hurdle.
• 1:12:28
  So like it seems like at that point,
• 1:12:30
  like sort of like the trauma in your life
• 1:12:33
  is sort of like fixed and managed at least, right?
• 1:12:36
  Like it seems like all the shit
• 1:12:38
  that you had gone through growing up,
• 1:12:40
  it's you sort of found a way to deal with it to a degree.
• 1:12:43
  You found a way to deal with it in a unhealthy way.
• 1:12:45
  Yeah, sure, sure.
• 1:12:46
  So then this is, I mean, after you've paid your family off,
• 1:12:51
  how many years ago was that?
• 1:12:53
  Yeah, so this kind of gets into what we were talking about previously
• 1:12:56
  of like why went to therapy 10 months ago?
• 1:12:59
  And this kind of like we're at all meets a point.
• 1:13:03
  So I was in a relationship with a girl,
• 1:13:06
  I won't name her for two years, two and a half years.
• 1:13:11
  And we were living together for pretty much all two and a half years.
• 1:13:15
  And this gets into an amazing component of,
• 1:13:19
  yeah, how so many people in entrepreneurship
• 1:13:21
  all they do is focus on the business side of things
• 1:13:24
  and they don't talk about other aspects of their life
• 1:13:26
  when those other aspects of their life
• 1:13:28
  could not be going well.
• 1:13:29
  And so I was in this relationship
• 1:13:31
  where I was pretty bonded to this girl
• 1:13:34
  like over two and a half years,
• 1:13:36
  we only spent three days apart from one another.
• 1:13:41
  So this is like significant, like very significant.
• 1:13:44
  Yeah, I had problems, huge problems
• 1:13:47
  of even thinking about not being with her all the time,
• 1:13:52
  even though like being with somebody for that long
• 1:13:54
  without the periods of breaks is so unhealthy.
• 1:13:58
  And so it got to a point of where I was basically
• 1:14:04
  working all of the time,
• 1:14:05
  pretty much the same way that I was working back
• 1:14:08
  when I was in debt, very, very long hours.
• 1:14:11
  Like second I woke up to the second I went to sleep
• 1:14:15
  where I wouldn't even go down to eat
• 1:14:17
  and this girl would like be bringing me food basically.
• 1:14:21
  And I would have like short interactions
• 1:14:23
  with still this, still because of anxiety.
• 1:14:25
  This was for very similar reasons,
• 1:14:28
  but yes, anxiety based, but what it was
• 1:14:30
  is the same reasons of wanting to numb things out.
• 1:14:33
  So I was wanting to numb myself out to reality
• 1:14:35
  and work was always my safe space.
• 1:14:37
  And so there was problems within our relationship
• 1:14:40
  and instead of addressing them head on
• 1:14:42
  and addressing these problems,
• 1:14:43
  I would just numb myself out with work.
• 1:14:47
  And what it was was there was like in the mindset of being like
• 1:14:51
  if I'm able to work to solve my problems
• 1:14:54
  at least I'm being productive.
• 1:14:56
  That's where it was always going on in my head.
• 1:14:58
  But in reality, like what you need to do
• 1:15:01
  is you just need to address problems face on.
• 1:15:05
  And that will, you just need to live on authentic life.
• 1:15:09
  And that will give you all the happiness that you want.
• 1:15:12
  And so at the end of two and a half years,
• 1:15:14
  this was last year around this time.
• 1:15:19
  I realized that this relationship wasn't going
• 1:15:23
  in the direction that I wanted to
• 1:15:24
  and so I broke things off.
• 1:15:26
  Why was it not going in the direction
• 1:15:29
  like it was something that you could not fix
• 1:15:31
  just by having hard conversations?
• 1:15:33
  Yeah, it's a great question
• 1:15:35
  because it's like I was of the, I'm of the belief system now
• 1:15:38
  that like most things you can get through
• 1:15:40
  with difficult conversations
• 1:15:42
  if both people are willing to change
• 1:15:45
  and if both people have the capacity to change
• 1:15:48
  and if both people have the capacity
• 1:15:49
  of wanting to have the relationship work.
• 1:15:52
  And so like I don't believe in the perfect person anymore.
• 1:15:55
  I don't believe that there's like a perfect soulmate
• 1:15:57
  out there for you.
• 1:15:58
  I believe that those people who are good for you
• 1:16:01
  and people who really like you
• 1:16:03
  and are willing to grow in life together basically.
• 1:16:08
  And so this was a situation
• 1:16:10
  where a hard conversation wouldn't do it.
• 1:16:13
  It was stuff from the past
• 1:16:15
  that I just wasn't able to get over.
• 1:16:17
  And that was probably my detriment for a lot of it,
• 1:16:21
  your past or her past, her past, yeah.
• 1:16:25
  And then it's because it wasn't really in the past
• 1:16:28
  it was still in the present
• 1:16:29
  and it's hard to explain.
• 1:16:31
  But basically, yeah, I won't vote too much into it,
• 1:16:34
  but basically it wasn't where a hard conversation could get past.
• 1:16:37
  So I decided to end things
• 1:16:39
  and it was literally the hardest thing
• 1:16:41
  that I've probably ever done in my entire life.
• 1:16:44
  Harder than going through $300,000 in debt.
• 1:16:46
  I literally was very, I went into a very, very,
• 1:16:50
  I don't wanna say depression
• 1:16:51
  because like depression is like where you can't really acknowledge
• 1:16:55
  where the feelings are coming from,
• 1:16:58
  but I was going into a very dark place
• 1:17:00
  for a period of time very sad.
• 1:17:02
  I was crying every single day.
• 1:17:05
  Yeah, I was very, very difficult.
• 1:17:07
  And then that's what led me to
• 1:17:09
  part of the therapist.
• 1:17:10
  Sorry, bro, I didn't know that.
• 1:17:12
  That's very shitty because this,
• 1:17:15
  I mean, on the surface,
• 1:17:17
  like it looked like this was like the perfect match
• 1:17:19
  because like not many people can deal with somebody
• 1:17:22
  that works that much.
• 1:17:25
  That alone is like a special kind of person.
• 1:17:27
  Somebody who's like cool with you actually putting
• 1:17:29
  that much time into your business.
• 1:17:31
  It's just tough.
• 1:17:32
  I mean, it's just tough.
• 1:17:33
  I do, I agree with you.
• 1:17:34
  I think most people have to know it's perfect.
• 1:17:37
  There is no perfect match.
• 1:17:39
  You have to grow together.
• 1:17:40
  I totally believe that.
• 1:17:41
  I totally, totally believe that.
• 1:17:43
  But that, I mean, you have to know that
• 1:17:48
  and find the person that also believes that
• 1:17:51
  before you start dating.
• 1:17:52
  You can't, not like one person can't discover that
• 1:17:55
  as you're dating and then like trying to take
• 1:17:57
  the other person long for the light.
• 1:17:58
  I didn't just difficult.
• 1:18:00
  And the therapy was,
• 1:18:02
  but I think at this point, like therapy you mentioned before
• 1:18:05
  was like kind of like for a relationship,
• 1:18:07
  but I don't know your whole life.
• 1:18:12
  I just know a little bit of it,
• 1:18:13
  but I feel like there's like a lot
• 1:18:15
  that was wrapped into that therapy
• 1:18:17
  that is probably gonna make you like
• 1:18:19
  feel so much lighter on the other side of it.
• 1:18:23
  So much.
• 1:18:24
  I think that every single person should get therapy.
• 1:18:27
  No matter where you're at, you always believe that?
• 1:18:29
  No, just once I got therapy,
• 1:18:31
  every single person should get therapy.
• 1:18:33
  One thousand percent should be talking with a therapist
• 1:18:35
  that they connect with and that is very, very educated
• 1:18:39
  for a long period of time.
• 1:18:40
  It's like a coach basically.
• 1:18:42
  And yeah, I had extreme benefits from it
• 1:18:47
  and not just the relationship side of things
• 1:18:49
  than many different when I was a kid
• 1:18:51
  and pretty much all the way up until I got therapy,
• 1:18:54
  I was so confused constantly.
• 1:18:58
  I always felt in a state of confusion,
• 1:19:01
  not just about emotions, but a lot of things,
• 1:19:03
  like things that were going on inside my head,
• 1:19:05
  inside my body, I always felt confused
• 1:19:08
  that I wasn't able to answer things myself.
• 1:19:12
  Emotions was definitely a huge thing.
• 1:19:14
  Like I would feel anxious and be like,
• 1:19:15
  why am I feeling anxious right now
• 1:19:17
  and I wouldn't be able to answer it?
• 1:19:18
  I'm feeling stressed, why am I feeling stressed?
• 1:19:20
  I'm feeling fearful.
• 1:19:22
  Why am I feeling that?
• 1:19:22
  I feel like in most people.
• 1:19:24
  Yeah, I think that's most people.
• 1:19:26
  Yeah, and I watched inside out too.
• 1:19:29
  Yeah.
• 1:19:31
  And it was very, very good how that movie deconstructed
• 1:19:35
  and like put in very simple terms,
• 1:19:37
  how people feel emotions.
• 1:19:40
  And so that movie really got to me for sure.
• 1:19:43
  I feel like after I actually have a question
• 1:19:46
  because I've actually tried to find like therapists before
• 1:19:48
  and I've had bad luck.
• 1:19:50
  I've had bad luck with my personality.
• 1:19:52
  Not that I'm like a bad personality,
• 1:19:54
  but I'm also somebody that's working like 14 hours,
• 1:19:58
  whatever, 12, 14 hours of working on stop basically.
• 1:20:01
  And I have a hard time finding somebody
• 1:20:03
  that is a therapist who understands that.
• 1:20:07
  Like as, like, and for me, it's like so obvious.
• 1:20:09
  Like this is like the season of my life right now.
• 1:20:11
  I enjoy it, I enjoy my job, dude.
• 1:20:13
  I enjoy this so much, so much fun.
• 1:20:15
  But I don't mind putting like 14 hours,
• 1:20:17
  but if I had a kid, I wouldn't want to be doing this
• 1:20:20
  for 14 hours a day.
• 1:20:21
  Like I would, there's a different season to my life now.
• 1:20:24
  But I've always had a hard time finding somebody
• 1:20:26
  who's a therapist, who sort of gets the type A
• 1:20:31
  entrepreneur personality.
• 1:20:32
  I think it's some, I've never found one.
• 1:20:35
  And that's actually busy for frustrating.
• 1:20:36
  But you said you found one and was like a one time
• 1:20:39
  like first shot good or no?
• 1:20:41
  No, definitely not.
• 1:20:42
  No, he said to sit out.
• 1:20:43
  And so I treated finding therapists like hiring
• 1:20:45
  inside the business.
• 1:20:46
  And so it's the Alex Hermozia, Laila Hermozia approach
• 1:20:50
  that you do like 100 interviews.
• 1:20:52
  Like you get 100 resumes.
• 1:20:53
  And then you treat the interview process
• 1:20:56
  like the learning process.
• 1:20:58
  So if therapists is a bit more difficult
• 1:21:00
  because people aren't submitting resumes to work for you.
• 1:21:04
  So you do have to pay a significant amount of money
• 1:21:06
  where you're doing like intro sessions with people.
• 1:21:09
  But I just did multiple intro sessions with lots of people,
• 1:21:12
  did lots of research on various people.
• 1:21:14
  And I had the exact same thing of resigning
• 1:21:16
  with somebody that was a business owner.
• 1:21:18
  And so I found a therapist that was actually an influencer.
• 1:21:22
  And so has a very significant following on social media
• 1:21:25
  runs his own business.
• 1:21:26
  And then is very expensive, obviously,
• 1:21:28
  because he's a business owner that is a therapist
• 1:21:31
  but he still gets it, is able to resonate with it heavily.
• 1:21:34
  Yeah.
• 1:21:35
  What was the thing that made you like him
• 1:21:37
  versus anyone else?
• 1:21:39
  Like what did he say?
• 1:21:40
  What was like the...
• 1:21:42
  So I think like a lot of entrepreneurs probably,
• 1:21:44
  if therapy, but I think there'll probably a lot of people
• 1:21:47
  listening will have the same problem as both of us.
• 1:21:49
  That's a very, very good question.
• 1:21:51
  What made him really stand out at the beginning?
• 1:21:55
  I think what made him really stand out at the beginning
• 1:21:58
  is that most therapists, and when you think of therapy,
• 1:22:00
  it's them asking you questions.
• 1:22:03
  And I didn't need that at the start.
• 1:22:05
  I didn't need to be asked a bunch of questions
• 1:22:07
  because I was very confused.
• 1:22:09
  And I didn't even know how to answer certain things
• 1:22:11
  authentically.
• 1:22:13
  And to give...
• 1:22:15
  If he was asking me, like therapists usually ask your emotions
• 1:22:18
  around certain topics and like how you feel around certain things.
• 1:22:22
  And these therapists weren't fucking getting like that.
• 1:22:25
  I don't know how to feel these things.
• 1:22:28
  Like I don't know what I'm feeling right now.
• 1:22:30
  Like I can...
• 1:22:31
  And then I needed a therapist who is basically giving me
• 1:22:36
  variations of answers that I could say yes or no to.
• 1:22:40
  And I could tie myself to and help like go through
• 1:22:44
  the progress of learning.
• 1:22:45
  And so this particular therapist, like when we talk
• 1:22:50
  about particular subjects, he is explaining it heavily.
• 1:22:54
  So I'm getting to understand it.
• 1:22:56
  It's like basically where he's like a teacher instead
• 1:22:59
  of just listening to me and asking questions
• 1:23:04
  that I could ask myself or that I could go on to chat GPT
• 1:23:07
  and ask myself exactly, yeah, you need somebody
• 1:23:09
  to actually explain like context around like what.
• 1:23:11
  And you said like, and I think this is also true,
• 1:23:14
  not just entrepreneurs.
• 1:23:15
  You said you have like a hard time understanding
• 1:23:17
  like why you feel a certain thing at a certain point.
• 1:23:20
  I think most people just kind of go through life
• 1:23:22
  being very reactive to their emotions,
• 1:23:24
  especially you get entrepreneurs.
• 1:23:26
  Like they have, like this mental fortitude
• 1:23:31
  that allows them to get through these emotions.
• 1:23:34
  But I'd be lying if I said that every day
• 1:23:37
  isn't like a fucking roller coaster.
• 1:23:38
  But yeah, I can get through it.
• 1:23:40
  And I can still be a perform at a high level.
• 1:23:48
  But I don't really love the fact that I have to do that
• 1:23:51
  even if I'm stressed or anxiety or angry or whatever.
• 1:23:55
  And sometimes you don't even know where it's
• 1:23:56
  fucking coming from because you have over the past week,
• 1:23:59
  I can't even remember all the things that went right
• 1:24:01
  and went wrong.
• 1:24:02
  And you don't know what was the one thing
• 1:24:03
  that triggered that particular emotion,
• 1:24:06
  but you're just kind of going through life like whatever.
• 1:24:08
  I know that I'm stressed about something,
• 1:24:09
  but I don't even have time to think about what that thing is.
• 1:24:12
  To have a hundred other things I got to figure out right now.
• 1:24:14
  So when you go through this process,
• 1:24:16
  talk to me like sort of like the end results.
• 1:24:18
  It's been 10 months, been like a couple months.
• 1:24:20
  So what's the sort of change like the before and after
• 1:24:23
  as like an entrepreneur is like,
• 1:24:25
  you have another girlfriend now, right?
• 1:24:26
  Yeah, yeah.
• 1:24:27
  Yeah, I mean, you don't know.
• 1:24:28
  No, okay, yeah.
• 1:24:30
  So they can't remember.
• 1:24:31
  Yeah.
• 1:24:32
  So yeah, so they explain like the after.
• 1:24:34
  Cause I think again, this is I love this dude.
• 1:24:36
  This is so good for entrepreneurs
• 1:24:38
  to have a conversation about mental health
• 1:24:40
  and therapy and everything.
• 1:24:42
  It's very little talked about in this industry.
• 1:24:44
  I know that I know it isn't talked about a lot.
• 1:24:46
  And I'll tell you a story and then I want you to answer.
• 1:24:49
  I had a friend on who again,
• 1:24:51
  all it's all entrepreneurs come on the show
• 1:24:52
  and he told me a story about one of his friends
• 1:24:56
  that had a company that a hundred person company
• 1:25:00
  and it was in real estate.
• 1:25:02
  And it's great.
• 1:25:04
  You get a hundred people like these decides
• 1:25:06
  got like tens of millions of dollars in this company.
• 1:25:08
  And I think it was something to do with the real estate settlement
• 1:25:13
  or something to do with like the lawsuit
• 1:25:15
  around how realtor show how I was just
• 1:25:18
  and get commissions.
• 1:25:18
  I'm not a real estate.
• 1:25:19
  So I don't know this.
• 1:25:20
  But there's like a whole thing about like NAR
• 1:25:22
  and like there was like a lot of suits.
• 1:25:24
  Anyway, so it was going to like significantly
• 1:25:26
  impact his business.
• 1:25:27
  He didn't do anything wrong.
• 1:25:28
  But he saw that this was going to impact
• 1:25:30
  like how his business functioned
• 1:25:32
  and how much he could make and his margins.
• 1:25:34
  Basically it would like fundamentally
• 1:25:35
  shipped how he did business.
• 1:25:37
  Anyways, so like the settlement came out of the lawsuit
• 1:25:39
  came out of the result of the lawsuit came out.
• 1:25:43
  And then on Friday, he laid off a hundred people.
• 1:25:45
  No, and then he killed himself.
• 1:25:48
  Oh my God.
• 1:25:49
  Yeah, seriously, very serious.
• 1:25:51
  He killed himself the day after he laid off his entire company.
• 1:25:54
  And in his mind, his whole identity
• 1:25:57
  was wrapped up in his business.
• 1:25:58
  And the guy who told me the story is a good friend.
• 1:26:02
  His name is Colin Campbell.
• 1:26:03
  He's a Canadian entrepreneur.
• 1:26:05
  He didn't name me the name of his friend.
• 1:26:06
  But that's he wasn't in the podcast.
• 1:26:08
  I'll tell you the story himself.
• 1:26:10
  But yeah, so he killed himself because his identity
• 1:26:13
  was so wrapped in his business.
• 1:26:16
  And he felt like he was letting so many people down.
• 1:26:19
  He could not.
• 1:26:20
  You could not deal with it.
• 1:26:21
  And this guy has more money than 99% of the world, right?
• 1:26:25
  And he killed himself.
• 1:26:26
  So it's fucked up.
• 1:26:27
  And it wasn't because he did anything wrong.
• 1:26:30
  It was because he couldn't manage living on this earth
• 1:26:34
  disappointing a hundred people.
• 1:26:36
  It's very sad.
• 1:26:38
  Now that hits, that's so sad.
• 1:26:42
  It did something I work on happily with my therapist
• 1:26:45
  where I think a lot of entrepreneurs
• 1:26:47
  can relate to this of a feeling of only being loved
• 1:26:53
  and getting attention when you have accomplishments in life.
• 1:26:57
  And it's something that comes from childhood
• 1:27:00
  of where you either only got attention
• 1:27:04
  or you only felt love from your parents,
• 1:27:08
  whether it's true or not, if feelings are feelings,
• 1:27:10
  you felt this way.
• 1:27:11
  And so it was a reason you felt this way.
• 1:27:13
  And so you felt the only way you could be loved by other people
• 1:27:17
  is if you performed.
• 1:27:18
  And I had this tremendously of, I felt
• 1:27:22
  that I was only worthy of love if I performed
• 1:27:27
  and if I was successful, whatever that meant in my eyes
• 1:27:32
  of being successful.
• 1:27:34
  And in reality, what parents are supposed to do
• 1:27:37
  and how you're supposed to feel as a child
• 1:27:41
  is that the world loves you
• 1:27:46
  and your parents love you, no matter who you are,
• 1:27:49
  no matter what you do, no matter what you are,
• 1:27:55
  no matter what you become,
• 1:27:57
  and they just love you for being.
• 1:27:58
  We're human beings.
• 1:28:00
  We're supposed to just be and be loved for being
• 1:28:04
  and has nothing to do with what we are tied to.
• 1:28:07
  And I'm not fixed by any means, it's been 10 months,
• 1:28:12
  but I'm starting to get to a place of where
• 1:28:17
  the stuff that I do inside of my work
• 1:28:20
  is separate from the person that I am.
• 1:28:24
  I experienced something this past weekend
• 1:28:26
  which actually threw me off a little bit.
• 1:28:29
  And I don't want this to sound like people
• 1:28:35
  that are like entrepreneurs is bitching about
• 1:28:38
  how they're perceived in the world.
• 1:28:39
  But I know it's going to happen to me
• 1:28:40
  to actually throw me off.
• 1:28:42
  So I was at this event and a great event.
• 1:28:46
  But I've noticed that as I do better in my life
• 1:28:52
  and my business and I put my name out there more,
• 1:28:56
  people also start to look at you
• 1:28:58
  as a little bit of a commodity.
• 1:29:00
  And what I mean by that is,
• 1:29:01
  so I went on stage a couple of times
• 1:29:03
  and spoke and taught whatever.
• 1:29:05
  Then after the session, people would come up
• 1:29:09
  and ask a very tactical advice for their business.
• 1:29:12
  And like I have this problem, how do I solve it?
• 1:29:14
  And then like after I answered those questions,
• 1:29:16
  like nobody talked to me.
• 1:29:18
  And I'm just sitting there.
• 1:29:20
  Like nobody go on that like a casual conversation
• 1:29:23
  and just like see what I was like life,
• 1:29:25
  like what's going on.
• 1:29:26
  It was like everybody was like,
• 1:29:27
  how do I extract information from this like
• 1:29:31
  little walking business and psychopedia.
• 1:29:34
  And it was like kind of like shitty.
• 1:29:37
  I'm not gonna lie.
• 1:29:38
  I was like it threw me off.
• 1:29:39
  It actually really threw me off.
• 1:29:41
  Because I haven't just,
• 1:29:42
  and I think the reason why I noticed it
• 1:29:44
  is because I was hanging out all day.
• 1:29:46
  And again, like I don't mind this.
• 1:29:48
  I love teaching people, but I haven't really hung out
• 1:29:52
  all day at a conference in a long time.
• 1:29:54
  Usually like when you go to speak, you go,
• 1:29:56
  you speak, you leave usually.
• 1:29:58
  And this, it was really just like,
• 1:30:02
  because I was there all day that I noticed it after about,
• 1:30:05
  you know, spoke like the whole,
• 1:30:08
  like a lot of the room.
• 1:30:09
  It wasn't like a huge session, like about like 30 people
• 1:30:12
  asked me questions.
• 1:30:13
  And then after they asked me questions,
• 1:30:15
  it's like, we don't need Scott anymore.
• 1:30:19
  It was just interesting.
• 1:30:20
  Ship, man.
• 1:30:21
  It was just really dark.
• 1:30:22
  No, it was just like, and I was laughing.
• 1:30:25
  And it was like, so this is what celebrities feel like,
• 1:30:28
  like after they take, it was like actually,
• 1:30:29
  like after a couple of people like took a picture with me.
• 1:30:31
  And then I was like trying to talk and they're like,
• 1:30:33
  then I'm busy.
• 1:30:34
  But that can reinforce the belief system.
• 1:30:37
  I know it can reinforce a belief system.
• 1:30:40
  And again, it's just, it's hard to,
• 1:30:42
  it's hard to like explain.
• 1:30:43
  Because I'm like, oh, like, oh, you're cool.
• 1:30:45
  Someone took the picture with you.
• 1:30:47
  Why are you bitching about that?
• 1:30:48
  And it's not that.
• 1:30:49
  It's because at the end of the day, like sometimes like,
• 1:30:50
  you still just want to like have like casual conversation
• 1:30:52
  and not feel like like somebody's just throwing
• 1:30:54
  a picture of you because they like your,
• 1:30:56
  your podcast or like your speech,
• 1:30:58
  or that you gave them like a great piece of business advice.
• 1:31:01
  And they're like, okay, I'm done with that guy.
• 1:31:02
  No, just shitty.
• 1:31:04
  It was just weird.
• 1:31:05
  It was a very fucking weird feeling.
• 1:31:06
  Because usually if you've experienced that before,
• 1:31:09
  never, never experienced that because I've only really started
• 1:31:14
  speaking at conferences in the past like year and a half.
• 1:31:17
  And before that, the podcast wasn't big.
• 1:31:19
  I didn't get like recognized ever.
• 1:31:21
  So this was like a different feeling for me.
• 1:31:24
  Or people recognized me from the show.
• 1:31:27
  And then they, they wanted like a very tactical like thing
• 1:31:29
  from me as opposed to me just going to a conference
• 1:31:33
  as like an attendee.
• 1:31:35
  And we just being like part of like the mass of people
• 1:31:37
  just going to the conference.
• 1:31:38
  Very different dynamic.
• 1:31:40
  It's very, very strange.
• 1:31:42
  It was weird.
• 1:31:43
  It was fucking weird, dude.
• 1:31:44
  I'm not gonna lie.
• 1:31:45
  It was very straight.
• 1:31:46
  It felt like you were super pigeonholed
• 1:31:49
  into like a very specific kind of person.
• 1:31:51
  And because that's how people saw you,
• 1:31:53
  they wouldn't see you as anything else.
• 1:31:56
  I don't know, it was strange.
• 1:31:58
  But I don't know if you've ever experienced that at all,
• 1:32:01
  but I guess if people like,
• 1:32:04
  I've experienced the aspects of that.
• 1:32:06
  And it's similar to what we're talking about.
• 1:32:07
  That's why you went into that.
• 1:32:09
  Yeah, because like growing up,
• 1:32:11
  I didn't feel the pressure that you did about performance.
• 1:32:17
  I don't think.
• 1:32:18
  I may be a little bit from my dad,
• 1:32:19
  but not really.
• 1:32:20
  Not really.
• 1:32:21
  But now I'm feeling it.
• 1:32:23
  And I'll tell you something.
• 1:32:25
  Like when you have a, when you have a,
• 1:32:27
  so podcast is something that everybody wants to get on.
• 1:32:31
  It's, it's very, it's very interesting to understand
• 1:32:37
  like who wants to like talk to you,
• 1:32:40
  because they like you versus who wants to talk to you,
• 1:32:42
  just because they want to eventually get on your show.
• 1:32:45
  And I'm assuming it's the same with people like again,
• 1:32:47
  the people that I know that are worth like hundreds
• 1:32:48
  and millions of dollars.
• 1:32:50
  I don't even fucking know how they make new friends.
• 1:32:52
  It would be so stressful to me to make new friends
• 1:32:57
  because you don't know who's genuine.
• 1:32:59
  You have no idea who's genuine.
• 1:33:01
  Like I don't know how, I don't,
• 1:33:02
  I don't have a playbook on how to do that.
• 1:33:03
  I'm sure if I did this for the next 30 years,
• 1:33:05
  I'd figure it out, but I don't have a playbook on
• 1:33:09
  if you have like achieved some success,
• 1:33:12
  how to have like a filtering system
• 1:33:13
  as to who's full of shit and who's not.
• 1:33:15
  I don't think there is a filtering system with that.
• 1:33:17
  Man, but speaking about friends,
• 1:33:19
  I, this is something I work on happily with my therapist
• 1:33:22
  where like I, I looked at my life
• 1:33:25
  and I realized that all throughout my life,
• 1:33:29
  I never really had any like real like best friends
• 1:33:34
  besides my two brothers and in family,
• 1:33:37
  it doesn't really matter, but it doesn't necessarily count.
• 1:33:41
  And that's another issue.
• 1:33:42
  You want to talk about like problems with technology?
• 1:33:46
  That's a big problem for sure.
• 1:33:49
  Yeah, making genuine connections with people.
• 1:33:51
  That's a huge problem.
• 1:33:53
  Do you, like, I mean, you work with your brothers
• 1:33:56
  and you fuck it, but you, you left the US
• 1:33:59
  to go to Puerto Rico.
• 1:34:00
  Like you like, you like, you asked me before,
• 1:34:02
  like would you ever think about Puerto Rico?
• 1:34:04
  I don't want to like give up on like building like a great
• 1:34:08
  community and network and, and friends and like, yeah,
• 1:34:10
  there's like, there's tactical reasons for a show
• 1:34:13
  why I want to be 10 minutes from Miami Airport.
• 1:34:15
  But at the same time, like, there's a lot of ways
• 1:34:19
  you can make money in this world.
• 1:34:21
  If I wasn't doing it with this podcast,
• 1:34:22
  I'm sure I could figure out another business to have
• 1:34:24
  in the past, right?
• 1:34:25
  But I don't know if I want to go like live,
• 1:34:29
  like in some remote part of the world
• 1:34:31
  for like tax reasons.
• 1:34:33
  You know, I feel like isolated and shit.
• 1:34:35
  Like how do you, like how do you manage it?
• 1:34:36
  I mean, like you have your family.
• 1:34:38
  I would love my brother to work with me.
• 1:34:40
  Yeah, trust.
• 1:34:41
  I would love my brother.
• 1:34:41
  Like I'm, he doesn't know yet, but he's got,
• 1:34:45
  he's in law school right now.
• 1:34:47
  He's very useful.
• 1:34:48
  I have a brand new work with me.
• 1:34:49
  But no, eventually he will.
• 1:34:51
  But like, I think that's why families are great.
• 1:34:53
  But yeah, we have some friends,
• 1:34:55
  but it's like, the friends that I have actually
• 1:35:01
  are people that don't need me for whatever reason.
• 1:35:05
  They've had success.
• 1:35:06
  They've made their money.
• 1:35:07
  They, they, it's not like there's like,
• 1:35:09
  no, they don't need anything from me.
• 1:35:12
  I think that's the best kind of friendship.
• 1:35:13
  Because when you're as an adult,
• 1:35:15
  I think people, especially in Miami, dude,
• 1:35:19
  a lot of people want something from you.
• 1:35:23
  That's just not, it's not, it's like hiring,
• 1:35:26
  like filtered through all the bullshit.
• 1:35:27
  Man, it is something about Puerto Rico.
• 1:35:29
  Like it, it's just me and my brothers
• 1:35:31
  that then also like one of our employees,
• 1:35:35
  well, two of our employees who are out there
• 1:35:37
  in the same area, they're employees.
• 1:35:38
  Yeah.
• 1:35:39
  Well, you can be closer to that.
• 1:35:40
  Close to that, at the end of the day,
• 1:35:41
  it's still like a business relationship.
• 1:35:43
  It's definitely more of a business relationship.
• 1:35:45
  But we saw Puerto Rico as temporary play.
• 1:35:50
  Yeah, like not necessarily, you know,
• 1:35:52
  raising a family on Puerto Rico.
• 1:35:54
  And so yeah, maybe always having a home base out there
• 1:35:58
  and then having other homes outside.
• 1:36:00
  But yeah, definitely like, hopefully before
• 1:36:03
  I get to the thirties that I get a place
• 1:36:06
  that doesn't think I hear so young.
• 1:36:08
  Get a place to the thirt, get a place to the states
• 1:36:10
  and meet people.
• 1:36:11
  But you asked a question about therapy.
• 1:36:13
  I want to make sure that I don't want to talk about it.
• 1:36:15
  So I got into my own shit and like that.
• 1:36:18
  This is what happens when you start opening up.
• 1:36:20
  Like now I have all this like shit
• 1:36:21
  that I got to get off my to do therapist.
• 1:36:24
  Yeah.
• 1:36:25
  Hey, go ahead.
• 1:36:26
  Go ahead.
• 1:36:26
  It's good.
• 1:36:27
  I'm glad you shared that.
• 1:36:29
  Well, because you asked a question about therapy
• 1:36:31
  in terms of like what were the benefits?
• 1:36:33
  Or like, wait, who are you?
• 1:36:35
  Who are you after there?
• 1:36:36
  I think, and I think this is like from a point of view.
• 1:36:38
  Like obviously, I just realized it.
• 1:36:40
  Like sometimes if you if you are any type of whatever
• 1:36:43
  success is successful, it starts to become a little bit lonely.
• 1:36:47
  And I just like experienced it like in the past 48 hours.
• 1:36:49
  So to some degree, not significant, but like a little bit.
• 1:36:52
  So what would be the result of like working through some of your shit?
• 1:36:56
  Like you spoke to a therapist past 10 months.
• 1:36:58
  Like who's like Luke after the top things
• 1:37:01
  that I've experienced from therapy would be one,
• 1:37:05
  just having more clarity of my emotions in general.
• 1:37:09
  And so when I feel something, I'm usually
• 1:37:11
  able to attribute to something.
• 1:37:14
  If I feel not worthy, if I feel anxious,
• 1:37:17
  I'm usually able to tie it back to even a thought of childhood
• 1:37:20
  where it's not necessarily truly myself.
• 1:37:23
  And it gives me a lot of relief where it's like,
• 1:37:26
  I don't have fixed this inside of my head.
• 1:37:29
  And I know how I deal with this.
• 1:37:30
  And it's normal, but I'm feeling this way, basically.
• 1:37:34
  The second one is inside of a relationship.
• 1:37:37
  It communicating just completely authentically.
• 1:37:40
  If I feel a certain type of way, there's a reason why I'm feeling that way.
• 1:37:44
  And if I'm trying to be in relationship with somebody else,
• 1:37:47
  I need to just articulate why I'm feeling that way
• 1:37:50
  and work through it with that other person,
• 1:37:53
  like with my significant other.
• 1:37:55
  And I'm not perfect by any means where I'm communicating.
• 1:37:58
  I'm still absolutely horrible at it.
• 1:38:00
  The thing that I've gone past though
• 1:38:02
  is that when I feel a certain type of way, I communicate it.
• 1:38:05
  I need to work on how I communicate that way better.
• 1:38:08
  What are you here?
• 1:38:08
  So you communicate it, but like the way you're doing it could be rough
• 1:38:12
  or like, Ray, I communicate is very rough.
• 1:38:14
  Yeah, very, very rough, but at least I'm communicating.
• 1:38:17
  So I'm making progress.
• 1:38:19
  But I'm going to work on that because it makes the other person feel a certain type of way.
• 1:38:22
  Obviously, when you communicate and it makes them feel not good enough,
• 1:38:26
  makes them feel unworthy.
• 1:38:28
  And you don't want somebody that you love to feel that way.
• 1:38:32
  And so those are definitely the two biggest things from therapy that I've experienced.
• 1:38:36
  How has it helped?
• 1:38:37
  I mean, now you look at like your life, run a great business.
• 1:38:41
  You have a girlfriend.
• 1:38:43
  How is it just helped the dynamic between like work and life?
• 1:38:45
  And not like I don't like the term work life balance
• 1:38:47
  because everything is integrated when you're building something.
• 1:38:50
  There is no cut off point for work.
• 1:38:52
  But how is it sort of helped the the health of the relationship compare it?
• 1:38:58
  And how does the health of relationship
• 1:39:00
  help with work and all of that?
• 1:39:02
  Well, it hasn't just helped in my relationship with like the girl that I'm with,
• 1:39:06
  but also helped with my relationship with my brothers,
• 1:39:09
  where my brothers have definitely had an aspect of being trauma bonded together with
• 1:39:15
  what we went through within our childhood.
• 1:39:18
  And so we had very hard time being independent of one another.
• 1:39:23
  And so this is something we're actively working on right now
• 1:39:25
  because we're all getting older.
• 1:39:27
  Like my older brother is turning 28.
• 1:39:31
  And so we're going to be starting families like within the next five years,
• 1:39:34
  probably all of us.
• 1:39:36
  And so it's a good idea for us to be independent of one another
• 1:39:41
  even though we run a business together.
• 1:39:43
  Just because it makes it easier for families
• 1:39:45
  and it's not healthy for people of our age to be completely depending on one another.
• 1:39:50
  So things like when we traveled, we always like had to travel together.
• 1:39:54
  We shared bank accounts with everything.
• 1:39:58
  The money situation between us wasn't fully transparent.
• 1:40:02
  There was tons of things that were going to depend on like that could be like,
• 1:40:07
  it's so wild how like everything that it's like could be a negative
• 1:40:10
  also could be a positive because that trust you have in your brothers
• 1:40:15
  for business is phenomenal.
• 1:40:17
  Well, you can't get that you're not going to fucking share a bank account with an employee.
• 1:40:21
  You can't get that level of trust anyone else.
• 1:40:23
  But now you're realizing like, okay, so like like there's some things that are great.
• 1:40:28
  Some things that have to be fixed.
• 1:40:29
  There are pros in cons about everything, honestly, everything.
• 1:40:33
  And like this gets into a deeper stuff of like,
• 1:40:38
  like ultimately what is the meaning of life and stuff, but it's like,
• 1:40:44
  I think it's just a constant progression of working towards
• 1:40:48
  being a better version of yourself.
• 1:40:50
  I want your take on this.
• 1:40:52
  Why do we have such shitty male role models?
• 1:40:55
  And why do all of them focus on kind of, I don't know how to describe it.
• 1:41:02
  It's like, let's like look at tape and the exact, yeah, yeah,
• 1:41:06
  tape and the example of like, yeah.
• 1:41:09
  Current, in my opinion, not great male role model.
• 1:41:13
  It's kind of like he focuses on the end result of being a better man.
• 1:41:20
  But the process, like I find that there's no, there's no steps.
• 1:41:25
  It's almost just like, be better.
• 1:41:27
  Like, like snap your fingers and be better.
• 1:41:30
  And I'm not even be better because that's really not his message.
• 1:41:34
  But he's like, be stronger, be more powerful, make more money,
• 1:41:37
  whatever it is, be in better shape.
• 1:41:39
  But I feel like the, the average male role model now is like,
• 1:41:43
  just painting this picture of what a man should be.
• 1:41:48
  And they're not actually helping men get there.
• 1:41:51
  And I don't really understand why that is because when you talk about your journey,
• 1:41:55
  and you talk about going through therapy and some people,
• 1:41:59
  I think some, I think everybody could at some point talk to somebody,
• 1:42:02
  whether or not it's like a therapist or they have like,
• 1:42:05
  network around them of people that are helping them go through shit.
• 1:42:08
  And you talk about like fixing yourselves.
• 1:42:10
  You operate better in your business and your relationship.
• 1:42:13
  And you want to get married enough kids.
• 1:42:15
  You want to fix like relation with your family.
• 1:42:17
  Like that to me is like a healthy version of a man going through life
• 1:42:23
  and figuring their shit out.
• 1:42:25
  I don't see a lot of people having these conversations.
• 1:42:27
  And, and I don't see a lot of male role models,
• 1:42:30
  like sort of like preaching this stuff.
• 1:42:31
  And I'm just curious if you think you have an idea as to why that is.
• 1:42:36
  Because a couple reasons, there's the reason of why these role models
• 1:42:43
  are preaching the things that they are.
• 1:42:45
  Like, agitating stuff.
• 1:42:46
  And then those are the reason why people are so attracted to listening to that.
• 1:42:50
  So I think all these people, like if you look at agitate,
• 1:42:52
  dambell zeroion, any of these like massive like male role models,
• 1:42:56
  so to speak, that are celebrities, influencers,
• 1:43:00
  and have attracted a huge audience.
• 1:43:02
  I think they do it from a place that that's very, very ego-fueled
• 1:43:06
  for the most part, extremely ego-fueled.
• 1:43:09
  And their ego comes out when they're explain everything.
• 1:43:14
  I can experience that firsthand.
• 1:43:16
  Like, I felt that I wasn't good enough and felt that I was only good
• 1:43:21
  if I was seen as successful in other people's eyes,
• 1:43:24
  only worthy of love and attention,
• 1:43:26
  if I was seen as successful in other people's eyes.
• 1:43:28
  And so that's when I got my first piece of success.
• 1:43:31
  I bought a Lamborghini.
• 1:43:33
  And even though it was a horrible purchase, horrible business decision,
• 1:43:37
  horrible decision for like my future, you know, wealth.
• 1:43:42
  I did it from the standpoint of I wanted people to look at me
• 1:43:45
  when I was driving through the city.
• 1:43:47
  I wanted people to look at me and stare at me.
• 1:43:49
  It'd be like, wow, that guy's cool.
• 1:43:51
  And have that attention that I felt like I was in desperation of.
• 1:43:57
  And I think that's a standpoint where these people come from.
• 1:44:00
  In terms of why they don't,
• 1:44:02
  they don't give you a playbook for it either.
• 1:44:03
  Yeah.
• 1:44:04
  They just talk about the end result.
• 1:44:05
  Like a dambell's there and he's like,
• 1:44:07
  oh, just get jacked and then like you'll have like a whole bunch
• 1:44:09
  of like OF models on your yacht.
• 1:44:12
  Like there's no, there's not like,
• 1:44:15
  there's not even telling people how to get there.
• 1:44:17
  It's just like, I'm the ideal figure it out,
• 1:44:20
  which is stupid.
• 1:44:21
  First of all, the shitty ideal that it's still stupid.
• 1:44:24
  Horrible ideal.
• 1:44:25
  I know.
• 1:44:26
  And he's full of now.
• 1:44:27
  He's going back on it.
• 1:44:27
  He's talking about monogamy.
• 1:44:29
  Dambell's hearing is literally explained.
• 1:44:30
  He's like with all the word stupid as shit, like honestly.
• 1:44:34
  But he's saying with all the women that I've sucked
• 1:44:36
  with thousands of different women,
• 1:44:38
  I actually think that monogamy is the answer.
• 1:44:40
  So silly.
• 1:44:41
  Well, of course it is.
• 1:44:42
  Yeah, I know, because nobody wants to feel like empty
• 1:44:45
  their whole life with no actual legipse of matter.
• 1:44:47
  Yeah.
• 1:44:49
  You want to be building something,
• 1:44:50
  building something with purpose with one individual
• 1:44:53
  and the person who you choose,
• 1:44:55
  as like your relationship and your significant others,
• 1:44:57
  the biggest decision you have in your entire life.
• 1:44:59
  And these people who cheat and are with so many different women,
• 1:45:02
  they're just trying to fill the empty void inside of them.
• 1:45:05
  And men who cheat, I've been around
• 1:45:08
  lots of men who cheat.
• 1:45:09
  And I always ask them, I'm like, why do you cheat?
• 1:45:12
  And like, how do you cheat?
• 1:45:13
  Like, how is it even possible inside of your conscious and stuff?
• 1:45:17
  And they literally just burry down the feelings
• 1:45:20
  and they justify it within their head.
• 1:45:23
  Like the woman made them feel a certain type of way
• 1:45:25
  and it justifies why that they're able to cheat and stuff.
• 1:45:29
  But going into like why Andrew Tade and Dambell's hearing
• 1:45:32
  have been able to get so big,
• 1:45:33
  it's because they sell the dream outcome.
• 1:45:35
  They're great sales people at the end of the day.
• 1:45:37
  And so when you look at selling,
• 1:45:39
  like this Valks or Mosey approach is that
• 1:45:41
  in the selling, you're selling the vacation.
• 1:45:44
  You're not selling the destination to getting there.
• 1:45:46
  And that's exactly what these people are doing.
• 1:45:48
  They're just selling this dream vision
• 1:45:51
  of this fantasy land.
• 1:45:53
  What not that I want to like always just do the cliche,
• 1:45:57
  like take a less than that of like Tade's playbook,
• 1:46:02
  but you're in social, you know social very well.
• 1:46:05
  Your brother is phenomenal.
• 1:46:06
  Your brother like studies a shit every single day too.
• 1:46:09
  You think, yeah, I have no, does he like read like
• 1:46:11
  documentation on like different social platforms?
• 1:46:14
  Like trying like reverse ending your algorithms
• 1:46:16
  and shit like that?
• 1:46:17
  No, but he, he mainly, he watches a lot of content.
• 1:46:21
  Yeah, the question I had was like,
• 1:46:24
  I mean, are there, are there lessons
• 1:46:26
  that we can learn from like their content?
• 1:46:28
  From Andrew Tade and stuff?
• 1:46:30
  Well, of course.
• 1:46:31
  There's infinite lessons that like like things
• 1:46:33
  that are not like rage Bay, that the average person
• 1:46:36
  could like try and understand how to use that
• 1:46:37
  in their own content.
• 1:46:39
  Well, Andrew Tade's approach was very, very unique.
• 1:46:41
  That's why it blew up.
• 1:46:43
  So there's three, there's three reasons
• 1:46:45
  why any piece of content goes viral,
• 1:46:48
  like in terms of topics that things go on.
• 1:46:50
  So if you're posting on social media,
• 1:46:52
  the piece of content either has to be entertaining,
• 1:46:55
  educational or inspirational.
• 1:46:57
  Those are the three topics of any single piece
• 1:47:00
  of social media content.
• 1:47:01
  And the ones that go the most viral
• 1:47:03
  have a combination of all three of some sort.
• 1:47:07
  And so that's what Andrew Tade was giving,
• 1:47:09
  as he was giving the inspirational,
• 1:47:10
  talking about like this dream outcome
• 1:47:12
  for people to go to.
• 1:47:14
  It was entertaining because he's a,
• 1:47:15
  he's actually very funny, it is hilarious.
• 1:47:19
  And then it's somewhat educational
• 1:47:21
  because even though if it's not actually educational,
• 1:47:23
  where he fabricates a lot of data and says a bunch of,
• 1:47:27
  you know, a lot of stuff that's completely fake
• 1:47:30
  in terms of statistics and stuff,
• 1:47:31
  then it comes across as educational.
• 1:47:33
  So a water-pissed content hits all three pillars.
• 1:47:36
  And so that's basically the biggest thing
• 1:47:38
  that could be taken away from his content.
• 1:47:40
  That's why, so that's why it keeps going viral.
• 1:47:42
  So if you, but that's really the framework
• 1:47:44
  that people have to learn from.
• 1:47:45
  Yeah.
• 1:47:46
  Okay, cool.
• 1:47:47
  The last thing that I thought would be interesting
• 1:47:49
  is because it's sort of like tying like all,
• 1:47:52
  you so all the things you've learned
• 1:47:53
  over your life right back to business
• 1:47:55
  and things, we're trying to figure out
• 1:47:58
  how to grow our business, make money, all that shit.
• 1:48:01
  Do you find that like having a steady relationship
• 1:48:06
  is helpful to you, like as a business person,
• 1:48:09
  as a business owner?
• 1:48:10
  For sure.
• 1:48:11
  1,000%.
• 1:48:12
  Yeah, having a steady relationship keeps you grounded.
• 1:48:18
  Keeps you grounded in a,
• 1:48:20
  it a place where business is so much uncertainty,
• 1:48:23
  basically, on a day to day basis,
• 1:48:25
  even if you're doing well, there's so much uncertainty.
• 1:48:28
  That's basically what you're accepting
• 1:48:29
  with entrepreneurship is all of the unknowns
• 1:48:32
  that comes with it.
• 1:48:33
  And so having a relationship that's committed
• 1:48:36
  and certain is a very freeing feeling.
• 1:48:40
  Also just the energy that you're playing into something
• 1:48:42
  is the same thing as a business
• 1:48:43
  that, you know, having a focus on one business
• 1:48:47
  in one specific industry allows you to catapult way faster
• 1:48:51
  than having your focus spread across multiple businesses,
• 1:48:54
  have your focus on one woman,
• 1:48:55
  instead of many different women,
• 1:48:57
  allows you to just progress in that relationship
• 1:49:01
  and progressing yourself way better.
• 1:49:03
  What would be one more,
• 1:49:05
  it could be one more thing you'd like to teach
• 1:49:07
  to the audience or one more like belief that you have,
• 1:49:10
  that you think that, you know, the audience gets wrong.
• 1:49:15
  Like a very commonly,
• 1:49:18
  like a belief is commonly held,
• 1:49:19
  do you think it's incorrect?
• 1:49:21
  To be a business marketing life doesn't matter.
• 1:49:23
  Yeah.
• 1:49:24
  Well, you're fun to chat with, so yeah, I think it,
• 1:49:30
  you can probably do this all day, yeah, literally.
• 1:49:32
  Literally, this is a cliche and it said all the time,
• 1:49:36
  but if you can truly instill this of you only lose
• 1:49:41
  if you quit, like truly, truly instill it,
• 1:49:44
  like it's such a relieving and peaceful feeling.
• 1:49:48
  Like I've genuinely instilled this,
• 1:49:51
  that you only lose if you quit.
• 1:49:54
  And I never quit.
• 1:49:55
  I never have and I never will quit.
• 1:49:57
  And so it's literally impossible for me to lose.
• 1:49:59
  And it really is, like, and over the course of business,
• 1:50:04
  like if you were literally doing business
• 1:50:05
  every single day, the skill sets that you were building
• 1:50:09
  inside of business become invaluable.
• 1:50:11
  Skill sets that you build in life are the one thing
• 1:50:14
  that can't ever be taken from you.
• 1:50:17
  If you get thrown in jail, if you get deported,
• 1:50:19
  if you get taxed for your entire life,
• 1:50:22
  if you go bankrupt, your skill sets are still there.
• 1:50:25
  And so people who are going into business now,
• 1:50:28
  I think should have a focal point
• 1:50:30
  of what are the most high-value skill sets
• 1:50:32
  that I can learn?
• 1:50:33
  They should detach from any monetary value
• 1:50:36
  that they should do and how big that they want to grow,
• 1:50:39
  how much money that they want to make.
• 1:50:40
  And literally just look at what are the most high-value skill
• 1:50:43
  sets I can learn over the next five to 10 years
• 1:50:46
  and it's impossible for you to lose.
• 1:50:47
  I think about, literally, it's impossible
• 1:50:50
  for our company to fail.
• 1:50:51
  Now, it would be impossible.
• 1:50:53
  We would have to do so many crazy things for it to fail.
• 1:50:56
  Well, but you could also, but for to define failure,
• 1:51:00
  that means that you've stopped.
• 1:51:02
  Exactly, yeah, for sure, 100%.
• 1:51:04
  But say we did stop in the business
• 1:51:07
  and everything got completely shut down to business.
• 1:51:09
  The skill sets that I have right now
• 1:51:12
  that I've built purely from building the business,
• 1:51:15
  I could go to any single company with my resume
• 1:51:18
  and my skill sets and get hired in seconds.
• 1:51:20
  I know exactly how to be the best interviewee
• 1:51:23
  to get hired inside of a company.
• 1:51:25
  I could get hired for a six-figure job in two seconds easily.
• 1:51:28
  And that's just from the skill sets.
• 1:51:31
  And it's a very relieving and peaceful feeling,
• 1:51:33
  knowing that that can't be taken away.
• 1:51:36
  You know what you've done,
• 1:51:38
  which a lot of people have trouble with,
• 1:51:40
  is you trust yourself.
• 1:51:43
  And it sounds so easy to say,
• 1:51:46
  but I think that so many people
• 1:51:48
  have problems trusting themselves.
• 1:51:49
  The people that are successful,
• 1:51:51
  that do take the most risk,
• 1:51:53
  they trust themselves explicitly.
• 1:51:55
  Like there's zero, there's zero lack of almost like
• 1:51:58
  to a point of delusion.
• 1:52:00
  Like I'll figure it the fuck out.
• 1:52:02
  It doesn't matter what happens, I'll figure it out.
• 1:52:05
  But that's what attitude you have to have
• 1:52:07
  because we don't trust yourself and you take zero risk.
• 1:52:10
  But that, like I've learned all these skills
• 1:52:13
  and I can go get a six-figure job.
• 1:52:14
  I can start a new business.
• 1:52:16
  Who are you trusting to do that?
• 1:52:17
  It's you.
• 1:52:18
  And I think that's a powerful thing.
• 1:52:19
  I made an entire 15-minute YouTube video
• 1:52:22
  just on confidence and how confidence
• 1:52:24
  is having trust in yourself
• 1:52:26
  and then having trust in yourself
• 1:52:28
  is staying true to your word and your own commitment
• 1:52:31
  and you build trust in yourself
• 1:52:32
  because you build trust in others
• 1:52:34
  by them saying certain things
• 1:52:36
  and following through with it.
• 1:52:38
  And then as soon as they say something
• 1:52:40
  that doesn't match up or that they lie about,
• 1:52:43
  that trust gets broken.
• 1:52:44
  Same thing that happens in your own head
• 1:52:46
  where if you say something that you're going to do something,
• 1:52:48
  if you say you're going to go to the gym,
• 1:52:51
  if you say you're going to work on your business today
• 1:52:53
  and you don't do it,
• 1:52:54
  that trust that you've been building up for months
• 1:52:57
  gets broken because you've created that belief system
• 1:53:01
  that you don't trust yourself anymore.
• 1:53:03
  If people can take one thing away
• 1:53:04
  from like all the lessons that you've learned
• 1:53:07
  over your life, your journey,
• 1:53:09
  you know, the harder time with your family,
• 1:53:13
  the therapy, the wins and the losses in the business,
• 1:53:16
  what would be outside of just being confident,
• 1:53:18
  being yourself, being authentic?
• 1:53:20
  What would be like one last lesson
• 1:53:22
  that you want to leave people with?
• 1:53:25
  And I usually phrase it,
• 1:53:28
  I didn't phrase it this way
• 1:53:29
  because you're already young as hell.
• 1:53:30
  But I usually phrase it and saying like
• 1:53:33
  what would be one lesson you tell your younger self
• 1:53:35
  for your 20-year-old self.
• 1:53:36
  But just one lesson that you think is very useful.
• 1:53:39
  Man, I don't want to say this because it's shit
• 1:53:42
  that Andrew Tate says, but there is a component
• 1:53:45
  of working out that I think is a massive benefit.
• 1:53:50
  It's not a bad lesson.
• 1:53:51
  Working out is a massive benefit
• 1:53:53
  to every single area of life.
• 1:53:55
  I started working out just by chance
• 1:53:58
  because my brother started working at high school.
• 1:54:00
  So I started working out in grade nine
• 1:54:02
  and I've been working out ever since.
• 1:54:04
  And so, weight training.
• 1:54:07
  And so the benefits that I had
• 1:54:09
  from working on a consistent basis was I ate healthier
• 1:54:12
  because I didn't want to work out
• 1:54:14
  and then boost that.
• 1:54:15
  I was extremely dedicated.
• 1:54:18
  I was doing something very difficult
• 1:54:19
  other than business or other than anything in my personal life.
• 1:54:23
  I was staying committed to something.
• 1:54:25
  I was getting more confident
• 1:54:27
  because I was working better.
• 1:54:28
  I was feeling better
• 1:54:30
  because just when you work on a consistent basis
• 1:54:33
  you feel better.
• 1:54:34
  I think that any single person
• 1:54:36
  who are where they're at, whether they're successful,
• 1:54:38
  whether they're not successful,
• 1:54:39
  whether they're young, should just start working out
• 1:54:43
  and be the first stepping stones
• 1:54:45
  to increase in their quality of life.
• 1:54:48
  I think it's very, very smart advice.
• 1:54:51
  I mean, I'm kind of like you.
• 1:54:52
  I've been lifting, I used to play a lot of hockey,
• 1:54:54
  but I've been lifting for forever.
• 1:54:57
  And it's probably like the one thing.
• 1:54:59
  It's probably the one thing
• 1:55:00
  that has outside of having like a really supported
• 1:55:05
  better half a partner.
• 1:55:07
  That's the other thing that sort of like saved my mental health
• 1:55:09
  is when shit doesn't go right,
• 1:55:11
  like going to the gym and lifting.
• 1:55:13
  Outside of all the derivative,
• 1:55:15
  outside of all the other habits
• 1:55:17
  that come with like eating right
• 1:55:18
  and what not and getting good sleep
• 1:55:20
  and making sure that you're healthy
• 1:55:22
  and not getting sick and right self-umentation.
• 1:55:24
  Those are all good things.
• 1:55:25
  But outside of that
• 1:55:26
  is like the act of beating yourself up in the gym
• 1:55:29
  is like the most therapeutic thing
• 1:55:31
  that most people can ever go.
• 1:55:32
  And on a biological level,
• 1:55:36
  there's a lot of benefits
• 1:55:37
  that will help you overcome stress and anxiety.
• 1:55:39
  But I think that that's outside of therapy.
• 1:55:41
  I think that that's probably one of the most useful things
• 1:55:43
  that many people to do.
• 1:55:44
  It's also one thing that's very controllable.
• 1:55:47
  Like the thing like of sleep.
• 1:55:48
  Sometimes people have insomnia
• 1:55:51
  and sometimes people can't control that.
• 1:55:53
  Working out every single day on a consistent basis,
• 1:55:55
  you can control every single person
• 1:55:57
  and you can find 30 minutes to an hour
• 1:55:59
  to work on a consistent basis.
• 1:56:01
  I actually started doing a friend of mine, Chris Cavillini.
• 1:56:06
  I work out with him whenever I go to Tampa Bay
• 1:56:09
  and he runs a nutrition company
• 1:56:10
  and he showed me a different style of workout for entrepreneurs.
• 1:56:14
  That's very, very quick.
• 1:56:16
  And he was explaining, it was hilarious.
• 1:56:19
  He was like the average person goes to the gym.
• 1:56:22
  That goes to the gym and works out.
• 1:56:24
  The average person does the set structure
• 1:56:27
  of basically where they do three sets
• 1:56:29
  rest in between.
• 1:56:30
  This is what I said.
• 1:56:31
  And so he basically broke it down.
• 1:56:34
  And he's like, okay, well,
• 1:56:35
  let's break down the average person that goes to the gym.
• 1:56:37
  So they do three sets of an exercise
• 1:56:39
  and then how many different exercises do they do?
• 1:56:42
  Four to five in the gym.
• 1:56:44
  So they do three sets of, say,
• 1:56:46
  let's say 30 seconds of time under tension
• 1:56:48
  for each one of those.
• 1:56:50
  So you do three times five, which is 15.
• 1:56:54
  So 15 different exercises, three sets of each, 15.
• 1:56:58
  And then 30 seconds for each one of those, 15.
• 1:57:02
  You're in the gym for 45 to 60 minutes on that.
• 1:57:06
  And your time under tension is only seven minutes
• 1:57:08
  and 50 seconds.
• 1:57:09
  Yeah, seven minutes and 30 seconds.
• 1:57:13
  And I was like, oh, wow.
• 1:57:14
  And so his workouts are basically
• 1:57:17
  where you're doing a combination of exercises
• 1:57:19
  where it's a form of like hit training
• 1:57:22
  basically like supersetting or more than that.
• 1:57:24
  Huge supersets basically.
• 1:57:26
  And you're super saying the entire time
• 1:57:28
  and you're only taking breaks
• 1:57:29
  in between a superset of five different exercises.
• 1:57:33
  And so you're working out for about 22 minutes
• 1:57:36
  and your time under tension is about 18 minutes.
• 1:57:39
  And so you're getting two to three times more
• 1:57:43
  than the average person.
• 1:57:44
  That is, like does it work?
• 1:57:46
  Yeah, yeah.
• 1:57:47
  The shirt doesn't really show it,
• 1:57:48
  but I'm pretty shredded for like, eh.
• 1:57:53
  No, but it like you like compared
• 1:57:54
  to traditional bodybuilding for it, it works.
• 1:57:56
  For sure.
• 1:57:57
  It depends which, well,
• 1:57:58
  she was like, I'm not trying to be a bodybuilder.
• 1:57:59
  She's trying to say like, I want to like look good.
• 1:58:02
  Yeah, like in diet plays a huge part of that.
• 1:58:04
  But yeah.
• 1:58:05
  Huge thing about working out is like,
• 1:58:07
  what are your goals with it?
• 1:58:08
  Like those, you're a long, this is a diet too.
• 1:58:11
  Are you going for longevity?
• 1:58:12
  Are you going for looking as aesthetic as possible?
• 1:58:15
  Are you going for strength training?
• 1:58:17
  And so you have to assess like your goals
• 1:58:18
  so that you know the direction you want to go.
• 1:58:20
  For me, I'm trying to be as healthy as possible.
• 1:58:23
  I want to live the absolute longest
• 1:58:25
  and then I'm trying to be aesthetic.
• 1:58:26
  The last thing I want is to be fat.
• 1:58:29
  Like the worst thing that you can possibly be
• 1:58:30
  is like a billionaire that's fat.
• 1:58:32
  What do you, what's the, like the diet?
• 1:58:34
  The, like is it like hit training?
• 1:58:35
  So you're not doing low carb?
• 1:58:37
  Yeah, I do, do high protein diet
• 1:58:39
  and then I medium carbs.
• 1:58:42
  The medium fat.
• 1:58:44
  Yeah, I don't count my calories at all,
• 1:58:46
  but I probably hit somewhere around like 3,000 to 3,500 calories.
• 1:58:52
  And then yeah, that's smart.
• 1:58:53
  I mean, the main thing is just zero for diet,
• 1:58:57
  zero processed food, zero.
• 1:58:59
  Like as minimal amount as possible.
• 1:59:03
  Like I will only have it as like a dessert on occasion
• 1:59:06
  where like I would rather just have homemade ice cream
• 1:59:08
  for example, if I'm going to do a dessert.
• 1:59:11
  But if you have zero processed food,
• 1:59:13
  I think if you look back at videos in the 1900s,
• 1:59:16
  people weren't fat like they are today.
• 1:59:18
  Not yeah, but even like, even like like 1950, 1960, 1970.
• 1:59:24
  I was talking to a dude the other day and he's like,
• 1:59:26
  what was like the, the stereotypical American meal
• 1:59:31
  in like the 1950s?
• 1:59:33
  It's like a diner with like cheeseburger and milkshake.
• 1:59:37
  Yet no one's fat.
• 1:59:38
  Yeah, but if we, cheeseburgers and milkshakes,
• 1:59:40
  now everyone's fat is shit.
• 1:59:41
  Yep, so why is that?
• 1:59:43
  So all this is all the garbage and everyone says it.
• 1:59:45
  Like when I go to Europe, like I don't even work out
• 1:59:47
  and I lose weight.
• 1:59:48
  Dude, that's so concerning.
• 1:59:49
  That's actually so concerning.
• 1:59:51
  So first of all, I'm annoyed because you're telling me
• 1:59:53
  I can eat like whatever the fuck I want.
• 1:59:54
  If it wasn't processed, like it still like keep it off,
• 1:59:56
  I wouldn't get fat.
• 1:59:58
  But also what just because the US is like so bad
• 2:00:01
  at monitoring all these additives into your food,
• 2:00:04
  all this garbage that now you're just putting on weight.
• 2:00:06
  Like eating the same amount of calories as somebody did,
• 2:00:09
  like you know, 40 years ago.
• 2:00:11
  Same type of food now you're just turning obese.
• 2:00:14
  That's horrible.
• 2:00:15
  That's absolutely horrible.
• 2:00:17
  Well, and then you have these influencers like Logan Paul,
• 2:00:19
  KSI and Mr. Beast coming up with lunchies.
• 2:00:21
  Yeah, and they're just completely processed food,
• 2:00:24
  just going for the amount of money that they're making.
• 2:00:27
  But I don't know why they can't put out good food.
• 2:00:29
  I mean, even prime is garbage, not prime.
• 2:00:33
  Yeah, prime hydrant.
• 2:00:34
  Yeah, prime.
• 2:00:35
  Yeah, prime is just sugar.
• 2:00:36
  It's so bad.
• 2:00:37
  Garbage, it says that has coconut water in it
• 2:00:39
  when it's less than 10% coconut water.
• 2:00:41
  There's a million chemicals in it.
• 2:00:44
  It's horrible for kids that are taking that down.
• 2:00:46
  That is disgusting.
• 2:00:48
  I have so much influence too.
• 2:00:50
  Yep, that's what's shitty.
• 2:00:51
  And they're using that influence for that.
• 2:00:53
  Like when I raise kids, I'm going to be raising them
• 2:00:55
  on all organic foods, all whole foods.
• 2:00:59
  It's going to be dull, then even baby food is blocked.
• 2:01:02
  You know, like I rather they not do job.
• 2:01:04
  Like there's so many different kinds of products
• 2:01:07
  that you can launch.
• 2:01:08
  That's what's annoying.
• 2:01:09
  Like there's like with their influence,
• 2:01:11
  they could launch any product they ever wanted.
• 2:01:14
  Why are they doing shitty food?
• 2:01:16
  Why don't you like anything?
• 2:01:17
  Anything support any product.
• 2:01:19
  Make your money.
• 2:01:19
  Like, yo, take, like make your bag.
• 2:01:21
  I don't give a shit.
• 2:01:22
  There's like, this is like why was shitty food?
• 2:01:25
  I don't know.
• 2:01:26
  I don't know, I don't want to answer.
• 2:01:27
  I don't want to do that.
• 2:01:28
  I guess because maybe like this is what they're getting
• 2:01:30
  advised to do or they feel like there's like
• 2:01:33
  a market for it or whatever.
• 2:01:34
  Man, when I was at the aesthetic conference this weekend,
• 2:01:37
  he was, there's this one speaker that was super sick.
• 2:01:40
  He was like carnivoreally astile, like talking about like
• 2:01:43
  all of the whole foods, like red meat, liver,
• 2:01:47
  like all this important things.
• 2:01:49
  And then he runs a clinic of himself.
• 2:01:51
  And he said when people come into his clinic,
• 2:01:54
  he would ask them a very simple question
• 2:01:55
  that got them to tear up basically.
• 2:01:58
  And these people who are coming to his clinic
• 2:02:00
  are usually pretty unhealthy
• 2:02:02
  or they have problems with their body or wellness.
• 2:02:06
  And he just asked him a question.
• 2:02:07
  He's like, what's the last time you taking off your shoes,
• 2:02:10
  taking off your socks and just walked in the grass?
• 2:02:13
  And it's crazy because like even me when I think about,
• 2:02:16
  I intentionally walk in the grass
• 2:02:18
  and I still only do it like once a week.
• 2:02:22
  I don't know how to do it.
• 2:02:23
  I know it's crazy to do it.
• 2:02:24
  I mean, like the layout of this of this property,
• 2:02:28
  I literally have to walk in grass to get to this studio
• 2:02:31
  but I don't take off my shoes, right?
• 2:02:33
  And you're not getting it by,
• 2:02:34
  you're not getting the grounding benefits
• 2:02:36
  by through your shoes.
• 2:02:38
  No.
• 2:02:39
  And as kids, you're frolicking through the grass all the time
• 2:02:42
  and you don't give a shit.
• 2:02:43
  Yeah.
• 2:02:44
  And now I mean, people, like when I was living in a condo
• 2:02:49
  and I worked from home, there'd be like days
• 2:02:52
  where I wouldn't see sunlight.
• 2:02:54
  Well, yeah, it's not good.
• 2:02:56
  But this is like the environment
• 2:02:57
  that a lot of people live in.
• 2:02:59
  First of all, like if you don't force yourself
• 2:03:02
  and I still would go to the gym
• 2:03:03
  and even going to the gym, I threw a condo,
• 2:03:06
  you didn't actually have to go outside.
• 2:03:08
  Yeah, you get in your gym.
• 2:03:09
  Yeah, I know.
• 2:03:10
  Yeah, I know.
• 2:03:12
  Scary man.
• 2:03:13
  It is.
• 2:03:14
  It's interesting though,
• 2:03:15
  because like life expectancy is getting longer
• 2:03:18
  but I don't think quality of life
• 2:03:20
  for a lot of people is increasing.
• 2:03:22
  So the US health system is very reactive, not proactive.
• 2:03:27
  So they're keeping people alive.
• 2:03:29
  Great, but I don't think that people are thriving.
• 2:03:32
  I think that people are their mental clarity,
• 2:03:35
  they're foggy.
• 2:03:36
  I think that testosterone is decreasing
• 2:03:40
  and fertility is increasing.
• 2:03:42
  Like all these things are showing that people are not actually,
• 2:03:44
  they're living, they're not healthy.
• 2:03:47
  They're not living healthy.
• 2:03:48
  We found a way to keep people alive that aren't that healthy.
• 2:03:51
  So I think that it's not just about keeping people alive,
• 2:03:54
  but like how do we keep people alive and healthy
• 2:03:58
  and thriving and feeling good
• 2:04:00
  and not like feeling like shit every day,
• 2:04:02
  which is not normal,
• 2:04:03
  but I think people accept it as normal.
• 2:04:05
  And I'm not a doctor,
• 2:04:06
  but I like even like you go to the gym,
• 2:04:09
  I go to the gym, I already feel like we're like light years
• 2:04:13
  ahead of society.
• 2:04:15
  Like every time like my mom,
• 2:04:17
  she tries to go to the gym, God bless her.
• 2:04:19
  I think she does a little bit more now.
• 2:04:20
  But I mean, every time I go,
• 2:04:23
  she's like you still working out,
• 2:04:24
  I'm like, yeah, like four times better.
• 2:04:27
  And she like goes on and off.
• 2:04:28
  And she's like like periods where she goes and she doesn't.
• 2:04:31
  And even that's better than most.
• 2:04:32
  Yeah, but I mean, people don't pay attention
• 2:04:34
  on what they put into their body.
• 2:04:35
  They don't pay, they don't, they don't lift it.
• 2:04:37
  The health industry is just as fragmented
• 2:04:40
  as like the fucking online guru entrepreneur industry.
• 2:04:44
  Like I was trying to figure out which one's worse.
• 2:04:46
  Like health gurus on Instagram
• 2:04:48
  or like entrepreneurs on Instagram and Lamborghinis.
• 2:04:50
  And I really don't know which one is worse
• 2:04:52
  because they're both like I'm the only person
• 2:04:55
  you should listen to.
• 2:04:56
  You should listen to no one else.
• 2:04:57
  Everyone else is wrong.
• 2:04:58
  I'm right.
• 2:04:59
  Like the internet created all these opportunities
• 2:05:01
  for information, but also disinformation
• 2:05:04
  and incorrect information and fragmented information.
• 2:05:06
  And it's like tribal ideology around different ideas.
• 2:05:10
  And I think that it's just,
• 2:05:12
  I think the average person just shuts off
• 2:05:14
  and it's just confused and it's just overwhelmed.
• 2:05:16
  And I'm getting this,
• 2:05:17
  I'm getting five ideas on how to build a business
• 2:05:19
  from all these click funnel gurus.
• 2:05:21
  And I'm getting five ideas on how to diet
• 2:05:23
  from all these health and wellness influence
• 2:05:25
  on Instagram.
• 2:05:25
  And I don't know what to do.
• 2:05:26
  So you know what?
• 2:05:27
  I'm not going to do anything.
• 2:05:28
  And that's also not useful.
• 2:05:30
  The easiest way to diet besides eliminating all process foods
• 2:05:33
  because that's a limiting all process foods
• 2:05:37
  is for every single person.
• 2:05:39
  But outside of that,
• 2:05:41
  just listening to your body on what to eat.
• 2:05:44
  Is our bodies are so smart.
• 2:05:46
  A great example is my girlfriend was having
• 2:05:49
  a lot of stomach problem
• 2:05:51
  and wanted to go see like a lot of different specialists
• 2:05:54
  and spend a lot of money for it.
• 2:05:56
  And every single time after she would eat
• 2:05:59
  for the most part, her stomach would hurt.
• 2:06:01
  And a lot of women faced a lot of these issues meant to,
• 2:06:05
  but primarily women.
• 2:06:07
  And she ended up just wanting to listen to her body.
• 2:06:10
  And she realized that there was a correlation
• 2:06:13
  whenever she ate red meat that her stomach had a problem.
• 2:06:17
  It was because she was vegetarian for a time,
• 2:06:20
  a long period of time where she wasn't eating red meat.
• 2:06:22
  And then she integrated meat back into her body.
• 2:06:25
  But what happens is it needs very hard
• 2:06:27
  to digest on your body.
• 2:06:28
  And so you need to have enzymes in it.
• 2:06:30
  I eat so much meat, but I always have eaten meat.
• 2:06:33
  I never really stopped.
• 2:06:34
  I stopped for a period of two months to try vegan horrible.
• 2:06:37
  But basically you have enzymes in your body to break it down.
• 2:06:41
  And so she didn't have those enzymes
• 2:06:43
  or as many enzymes as it was.
• 2:06:45
  And that's just one component of it.
• 2:06:47
  And so once she cut that out,
• 2:06:49
  all of her problems went away.
• 2:06:50
  Is there a way to reintroduce enzymes that you can eat me?
• 2:06:53
  That's something I don't know, but that's a huge thing.
• 2:06:56
  But that's just an aspect of how you can just listen
• 2:06:58
  to your body.
• 2:06:59
  And that's how people know that they're lactose intolerant.
• 2:07:02
  Like they drink dairy and it's just horrible.
• 2:07:04
  But they don't do that with other aspects.
• 2:07:06
  Like if people really are conscious
• 2:07:08
  about every single thing that they eat,
• 2:07:10
  they can analyze it.
• 2:07:11
  Like when I eat fast food, I feel like shit.
• 2:07:15
  If I ever eat, I have a name fast food over a year.
• 2:07:19
  But when I did, I felt like shit afterwards.
• 2:07:21
  When I eat a bag of chips,
• 2:07:23
  unless it's just like potato, salt,
• 2:07:25
  and avocado oil type thing, I feel like shit.
• 2:07:29
  Where could people connect with you then?
• 2:07:30
  Yeah, best place is Instagram at Luke Lins.
• 2:07:33
  If people want to work with you,
• 2:07:36
  what are they, where should they go?
• 2:07:37
  Should they go to your IK website?
• 2:07:39
  Or yeah, best place, highkeyagency.com,
• 2:07:42
  or just send me a DM on Instagram, usually a response.
• 2:07:45
  Awesome dude, I appreciate you.
• 2:07:46
  Thank you for coming on to Baking Road.