Latest / The Wholehearted Enneagram Podcast / In Need of Some Courage? Start Here. | a timely COVID-19 conversation with Rachel Sweatt

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In Need of Some Courage? Start Here. | a timely COVID-19 conversation with Rachel Sweatt · The Wholehearted Enneagram Podcast

• 0:05
  SPEAKER_00: My name is Amy Wicks, and I love to talk about the gospel message your heart was created to hear.
• 0:11
  SPEAKER_00: All things Enneagram and helping you be confident that you are the best mom for your kids.
• 0:18
  SPEAKER_00: I'm a mountain mama who somehow ended up on a cul-de-sac in the Medwest.
• 0:22
  SPEAKER_00: I was alone and without family or community.
• 0:25
  SPEAKER_00: But the Lord, he didn't let me stay there.
• 0:28
  SPEAKER_00: He helped me turn my broken-hearted moment into a wholehearted decision to get intentional with my faith, my marriage, and my kids.
• 0:37
  SPEAKER_00: I share broken-hearted perspective with story, but with wholehearted purpose and plans so you can live a life full of confidence and abundance.
• 0:46
  SPEAKER_00: Think of this podcast as your on-the-go mom pal, mixed with a little bit of Enneagram coaching.
• 0:52
  SPEAKER_00: So get to that pile of laundry or hit the treadmill or load up the kids in the car for that grocery run.
• 0:58
  SPEAKER_00: And be ready to be encouraged and challenged while you listen.
• 1:02
  SPEAKER_00: This is the Simply Wholehearted Podcast.
• 1:10
  SPEAKER_00: Hey friends, I'm so glad you're here today.
• 1:12
  SPEAKER_00: This month we're focusing on how to make the most of our time, or as I like to call it, wholehearted minutes.
• 1:18
  SPEAKER_00: Little did I know that we would be looking back on a week that probably felt like one of the longest of our lives.
• 1:25
  SPEAKER_00: I know it did for me.
• 1:27
  SPEAKER_00: Now, I know we're all saying it, hearing it, reading it, but the reality is we are facing a time unlike anything that we've faced before.
• 1:36
  SPEAKER_00: And while I recorded this conversation with Rachel Sweat about a month ago, I think the words captured are timely and encouraging for you to walk in courage today.
• 1:47
  SPEAKER_00: Now, motherhood is limiting no matter the constraints placed from outside sources.
• 1:52
  SPEAKER_00: Rachel and I want to champion you to not wait for a different season or to wait to make the difference you were created to make.
• 2:01
  SPEAKER_00: I know I've said this before.
• 2:03
  SPEAKER_00: Motherhood is not your highest calling.
• 2:06
  SPEAKER_00: Being a daughter of the king is your first priority.
• 2:10
  SPEAKER_00: As you navigate the unknown with your children, they are watching.
• 2:15
  SPEAKER_00: So remember, this is who you can share your story with.
• 2:19
  SPEAKER_00: Your doubts, your victories, and also whom you're placing your trust in.
• 2:24
  SPEAKER_00: And because we've been thrown into such a unique season, I wanted to highlight a few resources which I normally offer in the summer months.
• 2:32
  SPEAKER_00: But I've revamped them for these next quarantine weeks.
• 2:36
  SPEAKER_00: I'm using them myself for our daily routine and inspiration to connect with my kids, spirit, mind, and body.
• 2:43
  SPEAKER_00: You know I'm all about perspective and purpose.
• 2:46
  SPEAKER_00: But to me, nothing beats a good plan.
• 2:48
  SPEAKER_00: So I want to share a few of mine with you.
• 2:52
  SPEAKER_00: Really, this can be a fabulous time to strengthen the connection we have with those in our home.
• 2:57
  SPEAKER_00: It's amazing when we strip away all the activities and the busyness that we've grown accustomed to.
• 3:02
  SPEAKER_00: We are reminded about what matters most.
• 3:05
  SPEAKER_00: So these resources are not highlighted well on my website.
• 3:09
  SPEAKER_00: But you can find links to the quarantine daily routine, my 50 device-free boredombusters, and seven days around the world guides in the show notes.
• 3:18
  SPEAKER_00: And if you are hanging out with me on my Instagram, you can find all these links in the Simply Wholehearted profile.
• 3:25
  SPEAKER_00: Of course, I am all about using the Enneagram to strengthen our motherhood.
• 3:30
  SPEAKER_00: This is an Enneagram-focused conversation.
• 3:33
  SPEAKER_00: So if you're looking to get some guidance and understanding your dominant Enneagram type, head on over to easy Enneagram.com for more information.
• 3:42
  SPEAKER_00: Now let's dive right into this conversation with Rachel Sweat.
• 3:52
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, I love it.
• 3:53
  SPEAKER_00: I love how you talk about doing it in the cracks of your day because I think for most of us moms, in fact, I on Thursdays I have a moms group that meets in my home, and we're talking about just every aspect of motherhood.
• 4:09
  SPEAKER_00: And one of the things that came up recently was this topic of identity.
• 4:13
  SPEAKER_00: And and a piece of identity too is figuring out, okay, we especially for those moms who've had one, and the one is becoming a little bit less dependent because, you know, natural rhythms of growth and and feeding schedules and all that sort of stuff.
• 4:28
  SPEAKER_00: And then it's the kind of motherhood makes you go, oh, um, now, now what?
• 4:33
  SPEAKER_00: What did I do with myself?
• 4:34
  SPEAKER_00: What does this look like?
• 4:35
  SPEAKER_00: Exactly.
• 4:36
  SPEAKER_00: And I think it's a beautiful time to lose yourself so you can find your identity again in Christ and find out what it is that He has for you.
• 4:43
  SPEAKER_00: But obviously, for you, this you've learned to take this season and those little little moments that you do have and use it towards this ministry and what you feel like your calling is.
• 4:56
  SPEAKER_00: So how did how did you how did that come about?
• 5:01
  SPEAKER_00: How is it birthed?
• 5:02
  SPEAKER_00: A lot of times we talk about it being birthed, whether our book or a story or a ministry, it's birthed from a brokenhearted moment.
• 5:10
  SPEAKER_00: So for you, where did um just this this mission to cultivate courage in women come from?
• 5:17
  SPEAKER_01: So, really what is really cool about what God's kind of been doing in my heart is ever since I was 16, I have been communicating in, I didn't know that's what it was at the time, but basically kind of just had this fire in my bones, and God put me in a place with someone who saw that and was able to cultivate that.
• 5:34
  SPEAKER_01: Really came out of a need, um, just in a need to serve our students and our student ministry.
• 5:38
  SPEAKER_01: And I was able to, you know, kind of basically preach three times a week and I had no idea that's what I was doing.
• 5:44
  SPEAKER_00: That's awesome.
• 5:45
  SPEAKER_01: We just did it because he loved how that works.
• 5:47
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, yes, and it's often just you know how the Lord works, like over those, over those years, like these things just kept being keep kept being developed with me.
• 5:56
  SPEAKER_01: I didn't know it.
• 5:57
  SPEAKER_01: And then it was about six years ago, really, um, we were we were on our way to Dallas uh with my four-month-old baby boy at the time, and we had to go for some medical checkups and things, and I was reading the Bible in the back of my car, and you know, kind of you take every moment you can when you're a mom.
• 6:15
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, and I was reading through, I was really reading through this um devotional by She Reads Truth, who I love.
• 6:22
  SPEAKER_01: I love that as a resource, it's a great resource, yeah.
• 6:25
  SPEAKER_01: Just to kind of, you know, like have specific um direction with Bible study and stuff.
• 6:30
  SPEAKER_01: And I was reading through John 8 and John 8 55, and I came down to the paragraph where Jesus is having this really intense conversation with the Pharisees, and he's saying, like, listen, like you've made your whole life about Jesus, but you don't really know him.
• 6:44
  SPEAKER_01: And all of a sudden, in like in this backseat with my baby beside me, I just had this moment of I like I mean my whole life is knowing him.
• 6:53
  SPEAKER_01: Like, there's not, you know what I mean?
• 6:55
  SPEAKER_01: Every my whole, every being, every cell in my being like aches to know Jesus and to make him known.
• 7:01
  SPEAKER_01: But what is the difference?
• 7:03
  SPEAKER_01: You know, like I've made my whole life about knowing Jesus, and yet, yet in that moment, Jesus looked at these men and said, But you don't even know me.
• 7:10
  SPEAKER_01: So what is it, what is it that gives us confidence in knowing Jesus and experiencing him in our lives?
• 7:15
  SPEAKER_01: And as I began to think about it, I it really came down to how would I say that I know that God is here, He's really good, and it's all the ways that I've experienced Him in my life.
• 7:25
  SPEAKER_01: And so it really came down to this need, if you call it a brokenhearted moment.
• 7:28
  SPEAKER_01: I love that because the three, what I realized kind of at the beginning, and this is just kind of it's it's shaped since then too, but it always does, right?
• 7:36
  SPEAKER_00: There's always life informs ministry and all that.
• 7:41
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, yes.
• 7:42
  SPEAKER_01: But what I realized was this big need was I've I love Jesus with my whole heart, but how would I answer someone?
• 7:48
  SPEAKER_01: How do you know that God is real?
• 7:50
  SPEAKER_01: How do you know that he's here?
• 7:52
  SPEAKER_01: How do you know that he's good?
• 7:53
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, especially in our culture today, the answer, like, oh, it's in the Bible.
• 7:56
  SPEAKER_01: Like, that's just that's not that that doesn't cut it.
• 7:59
  SPEAKER_01: And it shouldn't.
• 8:00
  SPEAKER_01: We should have real um concrete reasons why we believe what we believe, what we're seeing God doing in our life.
• 8:07
  SPEAKER_01: And if we are having this active, growing relationship with God, we're gonna be able to answer these questions with how we're experiencing him.
• 8:14
  SPEAKER_01: And so I had this moment in the car, and ever since then I really wrestled this with the Lord, like first personally, okay, how would I answer this?
• 8:21
  SPEAKER_01: And I began to realize like it's all about my experiences with God, what I've seen him do, feel him do, hear him do um in my own life, and how that really partners with Revelation 12 and God's whole strategy for overcoming darkness, right?
• 8:37
  SPEAKER_01: It's the blood of the Lamb and the words of our testimony, like this is what we're here for.
• 8:41
  SPEAKER_01: And what I'm really excited about, while I'm so grateful to be here too, is because I know this is a big part of your heart, is making every moment count.
• 8:47
  SPEAKER_01: And I just believe without any doubt in my mind that we are here to know God and to make him known.
• 8:54
  SPEAKER_01: And how we do that is by talking about what he's doing in our lives and experiencing him.
• 8:59
  SPEAKER_01: And so over the last couple of years, just kind of long story short, it's really honed into just my whole, my whole passion, my heartbeat is to encourage and equip women to experience God, live the life they were known for as a means to know Jesus and make him known.
• 9:14
  SPEAKER_01: Like, really, really, friend, like I'm about, I'm about that abundant life that Jesus came to give.
• 9:19
  SPEAKER_01: And I think it's our responsibility and our privilege to lean into all these different areas to make the most of our moments.
• 9:25
  SPEAKER_01: And so, um, you know, it's just interesting thinking back on that 16-year-old girl who was like, I I need you to hear what God, like what God, the God's heart for you, you know, and and seeing the Lord's hand kind of shape that and prepare me for this message now of, you know, like we are here to experience God and not just for ourselves, but for the world around us.
• 9:46
  SPEAKER_01: Like this is how we make a difference, right where we are.
• 9:49
  SPEAKER_01: And I loved what you said earlier about motherhood and seasons, because what I've realized, like one thing that I'm so passionate about, kind of just I want to champion the gospel in every season of my life.
• 10:01
  SPEAKER_01: And I want to champ be a champion for the gospel in my friends' lives in every season of life.
• 10:06
  SPEAKER_01: Like I I believe so much with my whole heart that we are equipped, fully equipped to do what we were made to do in every season.
• 10:17
  SPEAKER_01: And something that breaks my heart, talk about another broken-hearted moment that I realized that the Lord has used significantly in my life to call this out of women is like, don't wait.
• 10:27
  SPEAKER_01: Don't wait to do what you're made to do until your baby starts sleeping through the night or until they're in school or until they graduate from school.
• 10:36
  SPEAKER_01: Because too often, one of the things that breaks my heart is when I see women who are waiting for a different season.
• 10:41
  SPEAKER_01: Because we are just we are just not made to wait for a different season.
• 10:45
  SPEAKER_01: You may not get that next season.
• 10:47
  SPEAKER_01: And it is our job to look up and say, like, I am given today.
• 10:52
  SPEAKER_01: How can I be obedient today?
• 10:53
  SPEAKER_01: How can I know Jesus today?
• 10:55
  SPEAKER_01: How can I make him known today?
• 10:57
  SPEAKER_01: And a lot of times it's, you know, I feel like when it's one of the lies that's in our culture is like, oh, you have to wait until you have XYZ or until your life looks XYZ.
• 11:06
  SPEAKER_01: Like there is nothing in scripture that says that.
• 11:09
  SPEAKER_01: He says, you know, I am enough for you today.
• 11:12
  SPEAKER_01: My grace is sufficient.
• 11:14
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, when when you're weak, I I'm strong.
• 11:17
  SPEAKER_01: And it's in these moments where the Lord is most glorified, nothing in my life has made sense logistically.
• 11:23
  SPEAKER_01: Like on a spreadsheet, I mean, I the first book I wrote was when um my little one, he was less than a year old.
• 11:30
  SPEAKER_01: Like he wrote zero, doesn't it you know, like for that, right?
• 11:35
  SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
• 11:36
  SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
• 11:37
  SPEAKER_01: It just doesn't.
• 11:38
  SPEAKER_01: And then, you know, from there I, you know, started, you know, a place where people could talk about stories, and I started a podcast, and I, you know, have God has just continued to make ways um for me to do what I was made to do right where I am.
• 11:52
  SPEAKER_01: And sometimes he changes my capacity, you know, and it's kind of just it's the it's obedience to that capacity that I think is is when is the difference in feeling like okay, like I can do this versus being overwhelmed or burnt out or not, you know, just content, you know.
• 12:08
  SPEAKER_01: I just think that there is something to be said about when we're obedient, right where we are with the capacity that God gives us, we kind of hit the sweet spot.
• 12:16
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's good.
• 12:17
  SPEAKER_01: It does not need to make sense to the rest of the world.
• 12:20
  SPEAKER_01: Like God's power is infinite, so we cannot limit it to the seasons that we're in or the seasons that we're hoping for.
• 12:27
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's it's good, it's really important to understand seasons.
• 12:31
  SPEAKER_00: And I think you even uh one of the downloads that you have available is cultivating a life of rhythms.
• 12:38
  SPEAKER_00: And for me, in understanding how to make our minutes count, so we're not counting down the minutes, is to to be very aware that we have we might be in a season that feels very limiting to us.
• 12:50
  SPEAKER_00: As a type seven, I know you're familiar with that, you know, that wrestle of feeling limited.
• 12:56
  SPEAKER_00: And and that is real.
• 12:57
  SPEAKER_00: And I I think the whole point, even as the women in my room, living room, we're we're talking about finding identity again and finding out what is our purpose as we're having kids and what it is and what is it that we're to put our hands to.
• 13:15
  SPEAKER_00: The big key for a lot of these moms is to hear that motherhood is not your highest calling, it is one of the most amazing things that you get to do, and oftentimes the most rewarding ultimately.
• 13:53
  SPEAKER_00: Especially if you've been in a season where you get that opportunity and then you step into a season where it's not, it can feel like, oh, maybe I'm not doing what the Lord has called me to do.
• 14:04
  SPEAKER_00: But you know, that's when you start a podcast because it's a lot easier to do than get up on the stage or you know, whatever it is.
• 14:10
  SPEAKER_00: Like you can be, you can learn creativity and continue to do and pursue what the Lord has for you.
• 14:17
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 14:18
  SPEAKER_01: And I love that so much.
• 14:19
  SPEAKER_01: It just in God's kindness, it's like He uses all of those things as an equipping to you.
• 14:24
  SPEAKER_01: And I just I just love so much, you know, like it's so it's so interesting because I did, you know, I I did start this, I did have a podcast, and we just talked about this these stories.
• 14:34
  SPEAKER_01: And you know, part of my my equipping is like talk about what God is doing in your life, and that's kind of one of the ways that we did that.
• 14:40
  SPEAKER_01: And um, what's crazy is right after that I got connected with one of our local radio stations and they asked me to start doing some kind of like audio, like teaching moments kind of for Christian radio, which is so fun.
• 14:52
  SPEAKER_01: But I have, you know, I have two kids, I'm with them all the time.
• 14:55
  SPEAKER_01: Like if I were needing to go there, like I'd have to get a sitter, and it just would be, you know, too, it would not be as much of a blessing to my family, you know.
• 15:02
  SPEAKER_01: It would cool.
• 15:03
  SPEAKER_01: And I but what's incredible is because he had already, you know, prepared me in this podcast, like I had the equipment, and the guy was like, That's great.
• 15:12
  SPEAKER_01: You don't even have to come in, you just record it at your house and send it to me.
• 15:16
  SPEAKER_01: That's awesome.
• 15:17
  SPEAKER_01: Who does that?
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_01: Only the Lord.
• 15:18
  SPEAKER_01: Only the Lord does that.
• 15:20
  SPEAKER_01: That is really cool.
• 15:21
  SPEAKER_01: I just love what you're saying about even you know the ways that we are serving the Lord, whether we're cleaning toilets or on a stage or writing books or you know, the unseen and the scene moments.
• 15:33
  SPEAKER_01: I I have the most perfect example, and I hope this is gonna stick with someone, and I hope it's encouraging, but it is hilarious, and I will never forget it.
• 15:41
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I remember the day that my my books came in.
• 15:46
  SPEAKER_01: Um, my you know, my first book, when it came in, I ordered, you know, a shipment to my house or whatever.
• 15:51
  SPEAKER_01: And I hadn't, you know, you don't know when they're coming or whatever.
• 15:54
  SPEAKER_01: But I my my son, my, you know, the little one who it was like, I don't know, 14 months old at the time by the time I got this book in, um, he had just had the worst blowout in the world.
• 16:05
  SPEAKER_01: And everyone was like, oh my gosh, I'm like, are you pleased?
• 16:09
  SPEAKER_01: So then, so then, okay, so I just got done cleaning up this disaster, you know, in that moment where you're like, oh, this is really frustrating, like, oh my gosh, this is terrible.
• 16:19
  SPEAKER_01: And then I get this knock on the door and it's my books.
• 16:25
  SPEAKER_01: You just cannot miss the power of God saying, like, this is significant and this is significant.
• 16:31
  SPEAKER_01: And the the strength in that is the humility in both of those.
• 16:36
  SPEAKER_01: You know, like it wasn't like, oh, look at this book that I got, because the the whole mess of what I just did was too fresh in my mind.
• 16:43
  SPEAKER_01: Like very keeps it grounded.
• 16:47
  SPEAKER_01: Exactly.
• 16:48
  SPEAKER_01: And I laughed and I have never forgotten that.
• 16:50
  SPEAKER_01: And I've almost I almost feel like God kind of used that really as a precedent to the the rest of the way the last few years have unfolded.
• 16:57
  SPEAKER_01: It's been, you know, constantly growing in other areas while he's simultaneously making things fruitful.
• 17:03
  SPEAKER_01: And so it's just really been he's taught me how to be open-handed in motherhood and in ministry.
• 17:09
  SPEAKER_01: Um, obviously, so much growth along the way, and I have so much more to grow, but I'm grateful for what I've learned in those areas about making it count, leaning into those rhythms, and you know, just being open-handed.
• 17:20
  SPEAKER_01: Like it's not just a we don't get to section off our lives.
• 17:22
  SPEAKER_01: Like when we're believers, like you talk about being with your whole heart.
• 17:26
  SPEAKER_01: It's your every area of your life is open to transformation by the gospel, and that's what I hope to say at the end of the day, whether it's, you know, in my in my I call in my team emails once a week where I write out devotionals, or whether it's in creating a resource or a book or preaching somewhere, or whether it's reading stories to my kids and talking about God's grace with them, or you know, at the end of the day, I just wanted, I just want it to resound like like this was well served.
• 17:52
  SPEAKER_01: You know, the Lord was well well served in both of these areas.
• 17:55
  SPEAKER_00: Uh I love it, Rachel.
• 17:56
  SPEAKER_00: One of the reasons why I thought it would be really fun to have you on the podcast is we were a lot of this of what you stepped into, it took an element of courage, as does it really stepping into our identity, our God-given identity, it takes a lot of courage because there'll be nacers, there will be obstacles, there were there, there will be plenty of things to get in the way.
• 18:18
  SPEAKER_00: And to, well, ultimately the enemy doesn't want us to step into what the Lord has for us.
• 18:24
  SPEAKER_00: So we we thought it would be fun to have this conversation about using a Christ-centered approach with the Enneagram, which is what we love to do here at Simply Wholehearted, and to help us understand how we can cultivate courage unique to us so that way when obstacles come up and yet we feel compelled, we can step in faith and in great greater courageousness.
• 18:49
  SPEAKER_00: So I I would love it just to talk about it, give uh a minute or so for each type, just for some food for thought, because some of my friends they're still figuring out what type they lead with, and that's great.
• 19:02
  SPEAKER_00: Sometimes conversations like this can help us understand better.
• 19:05
  SPEAKER_00: And for those of us who are aware, we are always looking for ways we can grow.
• 19:09
  SPEAKER_00: And I think I think this content can help help us, especially when we have those times of needs.
• 19:15
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 19:16
  SPEAKER_01: I love this so much.
• 19:17
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, so Enne Gram and Jesus are two of my favorite things to talk about.
• 19:21
  SPEAKER_01: And me too, sister.
• 19:24
  SPEAKER_01: It's just it's like this is my jam.
• 19:26
  SPEAKER_01: And so I'm so grateful for this opportunity.
• 19:28
  SPEAKER_01: It's so fun for me, and I love how you honed in really on the courage, and because I've experienced this personally in my own life over the last year more than ever before, um, just as I've dove in into the Enneagram and use it really just as a tool for so many things.
• 19:43
  SPEAKER_01: And here's what I found that has been really powerful and freeing is that just the clarity that it brings brings so much courage.
• 19:52
  SPEAKER_01: And here's why I think that when you're able to put words to feelings that you may or may not know about, you know, um, to strengths or weaknesses, you know, triggers, or even whenever it's like, oh, I'm leaning this way, like this, you know, maybe a sin pattern is showing up, or a struggle or a stronghold, or frustration, or a tension.
• 20:12
  SPEAKER_01: Um having words to put to these things brings so much clarity.
• 20:16
  SPEAKER_01: And I feel like when things feel a little bit elusive or kind of unknown, or it's just kind of like, I don't know why these I'm feeling this way or acting this way, or um, these things affect me in this certain way, the enemy really can use it to keep us from doing what we were made to do.
• 20:32
  SPEAKER_01: And so I just 100% God has been showing me like clarity equals confidence.
• 20:39
  SPEAKER_01: And that's good.
• 20:40
  SPEAKER_01: He's used the Enneagram to do that so much in my life.
• 20:43
  SPEAKER_01: And not just here's the thing, too, not just in who we are, although that's one of the benefits of it, but really in who God is.
• 20:50
  SPEAKER_02: Yes.
• 20:50
  SPEAKER_01: And when we partner, when we take this whole-centered approach to um who we are, who we're made to be, who God is growing us to be, who the Holy Spirit is shaping us to be through the filter of who God is, like it's just totally off limits, you know.
• 21:05
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, you talk about like the different triads of like fear or or anger or what's the other one, shame.
• 21:11
  SPEAKER_01: Um yeah, anxiety, shame, and there you go.
• 21:15
  SPEAKER_01: You got it.
• 21:15
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, absolutely that's what it is.
• 21:17
  SPEAKER_01: So whenever it's really cool, just it's been so powerful having that clarification of like, yeah, whenever we like these these things are, you know, whenever we see these things as assets or as strengths, or maybe even some things that we thought are thought of as weaknesses, but we like we can get to the root of that through those really basic root fears.
• 21:37
  SPEAKER_01: Like we get to say, okay, that fear is what the enemy is using to hold me back.
• 21:43
  SPEAKER_01: And how can we even take those weaknesses and really by calling it what it is, let it into the light, let Jesus do the work he needs to do in our heart to deal with that and really transform that into a strength and use that for the glory of God and the good of others in every area of our lives.
• 22:00
  SPEAKER_01: So that's I just I just believe like it's been so incredible in that aspect of courage and what we're made to do because you're able to put words to to what you know about yourself, what you know about God, and put it through this incredible filter where all the pieces really work together, not just like individually, but with others.
• 22:18
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, think about the body of Christ and the church, just like this incredible picture of potential for what we really could do for the kingdom when we lean into that courage.
• 22:27
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, that's good.
• 22:28
  SPEAKER_00: So for you, you lead as a type seven.
• 22:31
  SPEAKER_00: So, what is what is one of the things that on a regular basis that you are mindful of that you know that you need to step through to get to the other side?
• 22:40
  SPEAKER_01: So this is huge for me.
• 22:42
  SPEAKER_01: And one of the things, like as a seven, that that was really a weakness that I really kind of walked through a lot with the Lord was you know, like that commitment to long-term things, like, you know, that fear of like I don't want to be limited, tied down or whatever.
• 22:56
  SPEAKER_01: Long-term things are hard.
• 22:57
  SPEAKER_01: But what's interesting is over the last year, God has been calling me to lean in to disciplines and rhythms and showing up daily for specific things that cultivate this life that honors God.
• 23:11
  SPEAKER_01: It makes God bigger in my life, and it has been life-changing.
• 23:15
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, I'm talking about like spiritual things, non-spiritual things, even from you know, like what I do like early in the mornings, or these affirmations, like biblical affirmations that I can, you know, bring through the filter of my days, or um, you know, these these disciplines of health and you know, making sure like I'm training my body and renewing my mind so that I can be used for the you know, most glory of the Lord and the good of others.
• 23:41
  SPEAKER_01: Um it's interesting because over the last year I feel like him constantly like really calling me to do these hard things every day.
• 23:49
  SPEAKER_01: And that's really hard for me, you know, like saying like I'm gonna lean into these rhythms every day, not just for a period, not just for a couple of months, but like really committing things for the long haul.
• 23:59
  SPEAKER_01: Um, you know, doing year-long reading Bible plans like that's so good.
• 24:04
  SPEAKER_01: That's huge for me, you know.
• 24:05
  SPEAKER_01: I love the Bible with my whole heart, but I also love like I feel like at any given moment I have 500 fires in my bones that I need to get out.
• 24:12
  SPEAKER_01: And so saying, like, I'm gonna sit and stay on this one plan for an entire year, you know, was a big leap for me.
• 24:19
  SPEAKER_01: And I've done it and I'm finishing in May, and it has been life-changing for me.
• 24:23
  SPEAKER_00: That's awesome.
• 24:24
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, and I just have learned so many things.
• 24:26
  SPEAKER_01: Even two of the last Bible studies that I've written have come out of this journey of reading it through the year, you know, and it's cool because it's not like God has taken away those different fires in my bones, but I think he's amplified that by having me lean into these disciplines and stay committed and being like, you know, I'm gonna wrestle through this with the Lord until I get that blessing.
• 24:44
  SPEAKER_01: You know what I mean?
• 24:45
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's what it that's what it feels like.
• 24:47
  SPEAKER_01: Leaning into those things that are not my natural tendencies.
• 24:50
  SPEAKER_01: That's exactly what God's been calling me to.
• 24:52
  SPEAKER_01: Vulnerability.
• 24:53
  SPEAKER_01: Oh my goodness.
• 24:55
  SPEAKER_01: Like I do not like feelings that are not encouraging and conflict and going there because, you know, just all these different reasons.
• 25:05
  SPEAKER_01: But God has called me to that over the last year.
• 25:07
  SPEAKER_01: And I feel like I've experienced so much freedom.
• 25:09
  SPEAKER_01: Oh my goodness, the freedom in going to those places with the Lord and with, you know, my spouse or my friends, and just talking about those vulnerable places has brought so much courage to how I show up to daily life.
• 25:22
  SPEAKER_01: Like I feel like the enemy could have, I mean, it almost made me mad a little bit.
• 25:27
  SPEAKER_01: Like, you have been keeping me back by this illegitimate fear for this long because I didn't want to go there.
• 25:32
  SPEAKER_01: But when I did, it was like ripping off a band-aid.
• 25:34
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 25:35
  SPEAKER_01: And oh my goodness, the freedom on the other side has given me even more courage.
• 25:40
  SPEAKER_01: So that's how I would I think this has played out in my life, just leading it as a seven.
• 25:44
  SPEAKER_00: I think it can look a different different ways, but yeah, I think I think though I you make a really good point because and and each type is going to experience this uniquely.
• 25:54
  SPEAKER_00: I know for me, I actually have mistyped myself twice and uh and am in a journey of discovering a true how I lead.
• 26:05
  SPEAKER_00: And it yeah, I mean part of the the self-awareness journey is just really, really difficult.
• 26:11
  SPEAKER_00: But what's been really fun because I lead people in discovering their dominant type on a regular basis.
• 26:17
  SPEAKER_00: I lead people into the self-awareness journey.
• 26:19
  SPEAKER_00: I was aware it was difficult, but I didn't, I wasn't even aware how unself-aware I was about certain aspects.
• 26:27
  SPEAKER_00: But what's really beautiful is I feel like I'm getting to experience this aha moment all over again and and along with other people.
• 26:37
  SPEAKER_00: And I think one of the big pieces was for me is going how I've even made decisions about this this ministry and about the podcast and about the other things that the Lord is having me step into.
• 26:50
  SPEAKER_00: When I finally realized my correct dominant type, the limitations that I had placed on myself previously now made a lot of sense, or the the obstacles I kept running into, or the fears that I didn't realize were there, and and being able to identify and call it what it is, oh man, that just it takes the lid off, right?
• 27:11
  SPEAKER_00: You know, and then once you have that awareness, yes, you might be tripped up again, but you understand then what's tripping you up, and that's that's such a huge piece.
• 27:22
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, yeah, it's like not in the dark anymore, exactly.
• 27:26
  SPEAKER_00: So I feel for an eight, and I'm I'm wondering, are you a seven wing eight or wing six?
• 27:30
  SPEAKER_00: Would you identify with months?
• 27:32
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely wing eight, a hundred percent.
• 27:34
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, well, you touched on something, and that's what I was gonna say, you know, just to kind of give a heads up for each type or some insight.
• 27:41
  SPEAKER_00: Yes, a type eight, the the need to be vulnerable is gonna be something that takes a lot of courage.
• 27:48
  SPEAKER_00: And I think eights oftentimes get labeled as oh, they don't have any fear, and there's nothing that holds them back, and they're incredibly courageous when honestly, especially because I like in the tenderness and the vulnerability is such a huge way to the heart of God.
• 28:06
  SPEAKER_00: You know, that's that's just a huge thing for a type is to be able to kind of pull back the curtain, let other people in and see what it is that they're really thinking and feeling.
• 28:18
  SPEAKER_00: And they they won't ever do it with a lot of people, though I would say, you know, I think it's powerful when they do, when they do choose to get up on a stage and do it, you know, share in front of a lot of people.
• 28:29
  SPEAKER_00: Right.
• 28:30
  SPEAKER_00: Because for them, that I mean to be betrayed in that moment, it it just runs such a risk for them and takes a ton of courage.
• 28:37
  SPEAKER_00: So I think that's that's something that could get in the way for someone who leads as an eight to be able to step into the fullness of what the Lord has for them.
• 28:45
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 28:46
  SPEAKER_01: I agree, yeah.
• 28:47
  SPEAKER_01: And it's not that they don't have it those feelings, it's they don't want to go there.
• 28:50
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, exactly.
• 28:52
  SPEAKER_00: And I think too, yeah.
• 28:53
  SPEAKER_00: Uh do you know the do you know your husband's dominant type?
• 28:58
  SPEAKER_00: Are you familiar with how he leads?
• 29:00
  SPEAKER_00: Yes.
• 29:01
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, what is it?
• 29:02
  SPEAKER_00: We'll go to his.
• 29:02
  SPEAKER_00: I'll be kind of curious to hear.
• 29:04
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, I love that.
• 29:05
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, so he's a three.
• 29:06
  SPEAKER_01: Oh, awesome.
• 29:07
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, yes.
• 29:08
  SPEAKER_01: And he and he definitely wings too.
• 29:11
  SPEAKER_01: And so we learn, we've learned a lot about like we're kind of um, oh my goodness.
• 29:17
  SPEAKER_01: When I first started, I was looking at the the Enneagram Institute website, and I think one of the words it used, like potentially for us the combination is like volatile.
• 29:26
  SPEAKER_00: Like I can see that that's it's intense, two assertive types.
• 29:32
  SPEAKER_01: It's so intense.
• 29:34
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, and it's so awesome because the work that the Lord has done in us individually and together.
• 29:39
  SPEAKER_01: I mean, think about it in lights of like, okay, if we are gonna use our powers for evil, that's volatile for the kingdom or for us or for our marriage.
• 29:48
  SPEAKER_01: But if we're gonna use our powers for good, like we can really do some damage against darkness together.
• 29:55
  SPEAKER_01: And that's kind of the even any gram talk between us, we realize, like, oh my gosh, like we really, it's worth doing that vulnerable work to, you know, to not hinder the work that God has called us to do, but to really go, you know, kind of link arms and go after darkness and do what we want to do together.
• 30:14
  SPEAKER_01: We're also very independent.
• 30:15
  SPEAKER_01: And so, like this whole, you know, like believing like we are better together really leans into exactly what you were saying about, you know, like this partnership with that.
• 30:24
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, it's beautiful.
• 30:25
  SPEAKER_00: We've learned a lot there.
• 30:26
  SPEAKER_00: I bet.
• 30:27
  SPEAKER_00: I bet.
• 30:28
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah.
• 30:28
  SPEAKER_00: So for what would you say that he has to kind of, you know, what's the fear that he has to stare stare at in the face to come to the other side of stepping into courage?
• 30:42
  SPEAKER_00: Definitely.
• 30:43
  SPEAKER_01: Um, I think you know, as a three, it's it's definitely pleasing other people, yeah, and like not wanting to let people down.
• 30:48
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, especially that's kind of two wing, right?
• 30:51
  SPEAKER_01: Yep, want to help, want to do all the things, be all the things for all the people.
• 30:54
  SPEAKER_01: And he, I mean, he does a really good job of that in most areas, you know, and so it's kind of that courage of like, I'm going to surrender and let Jesus be this to everyone, and you know, know that my value is not on my performance.
• 31:07
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's good.
• 31:08
  SPEAKER_01: And I really be thinking freed in that.
• 31:10
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, and with the two wing in particular, it would be similar in the sense of you know, being able to step into what it is that you are called to do, not what everyone else wants you to do.
• 31:22
  SPEAKER_00: And right, oh, so good.
• 31:25
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, right, you know, or to continue to meet all the needs instead of meeting the needs because the Lord has put that desire in your heart.
• 31:33
  SPEAKER_00: A lot of times, I think uh someone who leads as a type two discounts their desires for the sake of others when the Lord's saying, No, no, no, I put those desires in you to operate in the fullness of who you meet, who I made you to be.
• 31:46
  SPEAKER_00: Now, I some people um understand what type their kids lead as, and uh your your boys are a little bit young, and so you may not have any any inclination, but maybe with some of the women that you you've worked with, or some things like that, how about a type one?
• 32:05
  SPEAKER_00: What would a type one need to overcome, be able to get to the other side of of cultivating their courage?
• 32:12
  SPEAKER_01: I honestly think, oh, that's such a good question.
• 32:15
  SPEAKER_01: And I think honestly, when I see when I think of the type ones and the the nature to really kind of lean into that perfectionism is, you know, really leaning into God's power when when things are not perfect, you know, and and really surrendering that control.
• 32:30
  SPEAKER_01: I'm actually writing a book about the stronghold of control right now, and I see so much of this.
• 32:35
  SPEAKER_01: I think that it is it is crucial to freedom in the life that we were made to live in that courage piece, um, just especially laying down control, surrendering control to really experience all that God has for you.
• 32:47
  SPEAKER_01: Type ones, like you know, uh often typically may lean towards more controlling things um in order to kind of cultivate or shape their um, I don't know what's what ex what they expect, you know, for the the best outcome result.
• 33:02
  SPEAKER_01: But really the ideal.
• 33:03
  SPEAKER_01: But what we have to remember that's true about God is like he really does know what's best for us.
• 33:08
  SPEAKER_01: His perspective is the only one that's whole.
• 33:10
  SPEAKER_01: And so as a one, the challenge to be courageous is to really be open-handed and trust that God is who he says he is.
• 33:16
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, that's good.
• 33:17
  SPEAKER_00: I think grace is huge for a woman, they need to understand the message of grace.
• 33:22
  SPEAKER_00: And I think similar who might struggle with control is someone who leads as a type five and a type six, and I'll I'll kind of share for both of those.
• 33:31
  SPEAKER_00: A type five is gonna want to uh need to know all the elements of it before stepping out in courage, and that can be just a struggle for them if they're well, blind faith is often what we're called to, right?
• 33:47
  SPEAKER_00: The Lord will often just give us the next right thing, the next step, but we may not either have time or be able to find all the answers before we do it.
• 33:57
  SPEAKER_00: And I think someone who leads as a type five, that's that's gonna be difficult.
• 34:03
  SPEAKER_00: And their need for energy, you know, their energy reserves get drained out really quickly and to lean into the power of the cross, the his strength and our weakness, we are made strong because he is made strong.
• 34:16
  SPEAKER_00: And um, I think that's really powerful.
• 34:19
  SPEAKER_00: And you know, talking about the six in control, and I I love this idea of I mean, I think we could talk about control for each type, but the the need to make sure it's safe and everyone is going to accept their decision and they're still gonna be um they're gonna still be affirmed for who they are and and their well-being is gonna be taken care of as they, you know, maybe step out again, stepping out in faith, stepping out in courageousness.
• 34:50
  SPEAKER_00: Yep, yeah, exactly.
• 34:51
  SPEAKER_00: Now, how about for you?
• 34:52
  SPEAKER_00: What would you say?
• 34:53
  SPEAKER_00: I would I would say there's some similarities between the type four and nine.
• 34:58
  SPEAKER_00: Where what would you say um for them?
• 35:01
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, so I was wondering this too.
• 35:02
  SPEAKER_01: One of my dearest friends is a nine, and courage for her, really, what I've seen in real life has been like um the courage to fight for oneness and like courage to fight for the things of the Lord and not just kind of take a take a back seat.
• 35:19
  SPEAKER_01: Um kind of doing the hard work to get to the things that God has for us.
• 35:24
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah.
• 35:25
  SPEAKER_01: Like, you know, and it's not even just not even just conflict, but about like fighting for unity or in friendships and relationships and marriage and fighting for, you know, um abundance in their home and in their children's spiritual growth, like not taking a back seat because things might get dicey or tense or you know, not not so serene, you know, like being willing to being willing to kind of call up that fight in them for the light and for the truth.
• 35:54
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, seven.
• 35:56
  SPEAKER_01: My fight's a lot different.
• 35:57
  SPEAKER_01: Yes, this is the fight for a nine.
• 35:59
  SPEAKER_01: And I am like, if I could pick anyone, it's so funny.
• 36:02
  SPEAKER_01: Nines are the ones that I'm most for this from, but that's the one that I would like like to be more like.
• 36:06
  SPEAKER_00: Oh, totally, totally.
• 36:07
  SPEAKER_00: I yeah, I get it.
• 36:08
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, they need to be reminded that their presence matters and to not withdraw because courageousness is hard work, but it is worth it in the end.
• 36:17
  SPEAKER_00: So that's good.
• 36:18
  SPEAKER_00: Okay, absolutely.
• 36:19
  SPEAKER_00: Well, we've got to wrap up, but I can't forget about the fours because they are unique and special, and I'm just kind of curious, what would you say for a four as they learn to step into their calling and courageousness?
• 36:34
  SPEAKER_01: Okay, so I love I love me some force because they're the ones that are really creative, like you said, and they thrive on being different.
• 36:42
  SPEAKER_01: And so um, I just really honestly would I think I think force could use an encouragement to be instilled courage and to really lean into that within the scope of like of being who you are in a way that is so it is freeing in a way that honors the Lord in partnership.
• 37:02
  SPEAKER_01: Here's the here's the courage part for them in partnership with other believers.
• 37:06
  SPEAKER_01: Yeah, that's because I think whenever we link arms and we pursue unity and like the church needs them and we need their gifts.
• 37:13
  SPEAKER_01: And a lot of times they think like it's that's only for them, and it's very intimate and it's very like personal.
• 37:20
  SPEAKER_01: And I just think that the Lord has gifted them with so many unique things that they only they were made to do.
• 37:27
  SPEAKER_01: Like, and I I think the courage for them is to step out and to share that, and you know, not be afraid that someone else is like them or whatever, whatever that looks like, um, but really see the potential in like you're not because of Jesus, there are no gaps, but with the fours, they have a really unique place in bringing a different perspective on the world around us.
• 37:50
  SPEAKER_01: So and we need that in the body, we need their creativity, we need their gifts, we need it's life-giving, you know.
• 37:56
  SPEAKER_01: And so really just courage to step into community, I think, would be a really good place for that courage.
• 38:02
  SPEAKER_00: Yeah, to believe that really they do have something that no one else can offer, and they need to have a seat at the table and be a part of absolutely the body of Christ.
• 38:12
  SPEAKER_00: Um the uniqueness that God has uh given to them.
• 38:16
  SPEAKER_00: So I love it.
• 38:17
  SPEAKER_00: I loved this conversation, Rachel.
• 38:20
  SPEAKER_00: I think it's not only fun to talk about the Enneagram, but most importantly, to make the most of the God-given opportunity the Lord has given and how He wants to cultivate that in us, no matter what season we're in.
• 38:34
  SPEAKER_00: I I think it's it's just beautiful.
• 38:35
  SPEAKER_00: And I hope that my friends enjoyed listening to this and maybe it has provoked them in some way of been like, oh yeah, I need to stop taking a back seat and you know, letting the enemy get me down and make me be quiet.
• 38:48
  SPEAKER_00: Absolutely.
• 38:48
  SPEAKER_00: And I need to step out in faith and take the courage that the Lord is offering them.
• 38:52
  SPEAKER_01: I love that.
• 38:53
  SPEAKER_01: I love that so much.
• 38:54
  SPEAKER_01: Thank you so much for this conversation.
• 38:56
  SPEAKER_01: It's been so good, so fun, so fun and life-giving to me.
• 38:59
  SPEAKER_01: Absolutely.
• 39:00
  SPEAKER_00: I knew it would be Rachel.
• 39:01
  SPEAKER_00: Thank you so much.
• 39:02
  SPEAKER_00: Have a good day, friend.
• 39:04
  SPEAKER_00: You too.
• 39:12
  SPEAKER_00: Are you ready to face the rest of this day with courage?
• 39:15
  SPEAKER_00: It is really helpful to name the obstacles so our emotions don't take over.
• 39:21
  SPEAKER_00: We don't want to back down from what the Lord has for us in our unique season.
• 39:27
  SPEAKER_00: Remember, get Rachel's Cultivating a Life of Rhythms at her website, rachelsweat.com.
• 39:33
  SPEAKER_00: And I'd love it if you would give her a follow on Instagram and maybe even send her a direct message to let her know what you learned from this conversation.
• 39:42
  SPEAKER_00: Also, if you know a mom who could use some encouragement during these crazy times and a friendly voice encouraging her in her ears, well, it's really easy to share this conversation.
• 39:52
  SPEAKER_00: But to let her know that you're thinking of her and that you want her to be encouraged.
• 39:58
  SPEAKER_00: Next week we'll be back with another new and timely conversation.
• 40:02
  SPEAKER_00: Be sure you are subscribed so you don't miss an episode.
• 40:06
  SPEAKER_00: So, until next week, let's pursue perspective, purpose, and plans for us simply, a wholehearted life.