Latest / Coconut Justice / CJP 86: Dutch Jackson

Transcript

CJP 86: Dutch Jackson · Coconut Justice

• Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Hey, what's good? Dutch Jackson is a creative professional with a wide variety of skills. He has become an AI visual artist blending cinematic storytelling with modern technology to create bold, high-end content for brands and artists. He's also host of the new wildly popular food show called Slaps, and I'm going to leave a link to that show in the description of this video so you can see what I'm talking about. This is my conversation with Dutch Jackson. Before we get into it, remember to go to coconutjustice dot com to get you some clothes that I think would look good on you. Let's go. Here he is everybody here he is Dutch Jackson What's going on, Dutch Jackson: What's up, man? How you doing? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): brother? Dutch Jackson: Hey, man, you know, just living, creating, and loving, man. You know, that's what I'm doing. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Boy. Ever since shout out rookie. Shout out rookie. I love that. That rookie's my brother. Rookie shy. Rookie underscore shy on on Instagram. You guys go check him out. Rookie put me on to you, ma'am. And then when you said, yeah, I'll come out for a talk. Boy, I haven't slept since. Dutch Jackson: Ha ha ha. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I'm so excited about what you're doing. I'm so excited to pick your brain. Dutch Jackson: Man, I appreciate hey yeah, man. That's my brother, man. He's my new brother. When we start talking, we clicked instantly. He told me about you. He said, hey, man, you got to get with my brother. I say, what's up? Whatever, man, because me and you click, me and you click, whatever you tell me, whoever I need to connect with, I'm on it. So shout out, man. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. That's how I that's how I operate too. Like rookie's my sh I I look for my shortcuts in life. Rookie Dutch Jackson: Uh-huh. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): is one of Rookie's my shortcut. When it comes to specif music, Dutch Jackson: Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): that dude. His his his palette for quality hip hop music is I'll put rook up against Damn near anybody, son. Dutch Jackson: Man, he sent me some of his stuff, man. And I got intimidated. I ain't tell him. Cause I used to rap. I've been trying Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: to get back in the studio and rap, dog, but it's I it's been so whack lately. So I just I I stopped. He'd been waiting on a verse with me for six three three months. I can't It's hard. I can rap my bullshit, but when somebody sees some quality, you kinda man, you gotta go back in the bag, you know what I mean? So I'm trying Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): yeah. Dutch Jackson: to man, I'm getting a punching bag trying to get back, you know what I mean? Exactly. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Hell yeah. That's what someone invited you to dinner. You gotta go get your good clothes. Dutch Jackson: Exactly. You know? So no. Shout out, man. Just shout out. To quality people, you know. Yeah, man. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, exactly. Whereabouts in the world are you right now? Dallas. That's cool. How's that working? Dutch Jackson: I'm in Dallas, Texas, man. Dallas, Texas. You know what, man? I'm from St. Louis, Missouri. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, yeah, yeah. Dutch Jackson: moved here about thirteen years ago and it's a different Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Okay. Dutch Jackson: place. It it used to be like Saint Louis. It 'cause Saint Louis ain't that fast. Dallas was just huge and wasn't that Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: fast. But man, the last five, six years, it's shit like little LA or something, you know? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: It's going fast, man. A lot of shit happening, you know. But I love it. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I've never I've never been to Dallas, but everyone that I know from Dallas is Dutch Jackson: Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): black. So is Dallas like one of those black towns? Dutch Jackson: You know what? It is. It is. Yeah, it is. It is Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: it is a black town. But I live in an area called Farmers Branch. It's not that black Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Okay. Dutch Jackson: out there. So I think I think it's like any other city, man. They have their really, really black areas, but then you got your other areas that's that's very mixed, you know. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: It's not like an Atlanta or nothing like that. But this black. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Okay. Yeah. Dutch Jackson: Ain't no DC, but it's black. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. and and and I know some folks sometimes I'll say some outlandish shit and people go, Would you be black city? I don't mean black city like rundown. There are some very fine black cities out there. Yeah. Yeah. Dutch Jackson: Yeah, yeah. And Dallas is one of Like Dallas is the first place I moved to because St. Louis doesn't have a black, like high middle class. It's either poor Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: or rich in St. Louis. Like poor. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: And I ain't talking about black people. Most of the black people just poor. Like Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: when I came out here, I start seeing like black people in white neighborhoods. That's how I can explain. Like, damn, they are Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Like they're supposed to be there. Dutch Jackson: Yeah, waving and shit, washing their cars. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Ha ha ha. Dutch Jackson: Like what other type of place is this? Because I'm from a place, man, St. Louis, everybody it is a very six, very segregated city. I went I just went to Chicago a couple of weeks ago for a my my wife's a professional artist for an art show and the mix of people in Chicago freaked me out. I'm like, why the fuck is these people chip hanging with these people and these cause of the mixture was so crazy. If you speak to anybody from St. Louis, They'll tell you, I didn't come up with anybody other than a black person. I have one white person I went to school with all the way from kindergarten to say to being in 12th grade. One. Yeah, other than that, it was just I've I've been around all black people my whole life until I moved here. It's crazy, bro. Yeah, man. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. I've yeah, especially like when I was a kid, I thought I thought the world was black and white 'cause that's all I ever saw. And I was the I was one of the few in the middle. Dutch Jackson: Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And, you know, I I grew up in black part of town my whole life. And so I th I just I was like, all right, cool. And Dutch Jackson: Right. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): and and then, you know, I I say this to people a lot. After high school, I went to the army. After the army I started working and then I I worked my way into this position at this good neighborhood high school Dutch Jackson: Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): and you start to see the difference. And you're like, wait, wait, wait, y'all but's you guys are in like tenth grade doing college level stuff. Dutch Jackson: Yes, yes, yes, man, yes. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And it and it like the the harder I worked to get to what I wanted to be as a grown up, Dutch Jackson: Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): the more I realized that us as kids, we were like we weren't planned for. Like nobody gives a shit. Nobody Dutch Jackson: Yeah, man. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): gives a shit about your creativity. Nobody Dutch Jackson: No bum. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): gives a shit that you don't have crayons. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. I know, man. I knew it was crazy in high school when I when we all our fucking health books was like from nineteen seventy eight, motherfuckers have We bar we borrowing books. I done checked out a book the whole chapter missing. I'm like, damn, what is we go from chapter five to chapter eight? What just what is going Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: on? You know I thought that was normal. I'm going through metal detectors. Hey, good morning. You know, like I look back, none of that was right, man. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): No. Dutch Jackson: None of it. I was just like, damn, man, but you see you start realizing shit like that when you get older, man. Like, man, but you know, didn't Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: know any better. We thought that was the world, you know? Yeah. And I Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm hmm. Mm-hmm. Cause that's what the world that's the that's what the world was telling us we were supposed to be. Dutch Jackson: Mm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Did you did you have any it like We'll talk about we'll talk about idols and stuff like that later, like creative idols, people that you wanted to be later, but but like more like your parents and your uncles and and the people that you grew up with, like the adults there. Did anyone at all help you figure out that you wanted to be a creative and and like guide you in any way? Dutch Jackson: No, no, no, the hell no, they were trying to guide me. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I told you we are very similar, my guy. Dutch Jackson: And they were trying to guide me to the army or to a job. That was it. Ain't nobody Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: didn't nobody know nothing. Now my not my my dad and what what I can say, they looked at me kind of twisted, but they never told me not to do it. But they went, you know, but my dad later in life after he saw I wouldn't fucking stop. He got on board, you know what I mean? But early, you know, it was just about getting a job, man. Going to the army or getting a job. That was it. That was our options. That was it. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): How early how early did you know that you wanted to be a creative? Dutch Jackson: Man, my whole life. I'ma give y'all some sauce. My real name, Michael Jackson. But I Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Is really? Dutch Jackson: but I go by Dutch Jackson. Cause I get teased even to this day when I go into the anything that's asked for my ID. The they they yell my name, everybody, just beat it, do the moon walk. I hate that. The deal I hate going. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): He Dutch Jackson: I ain't gonna get my license renewed. I hate that shake. Michael Jackson to the front. Who went it? Just be it. hell, he died. He lied. Bro, I've been hearing it Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And you know our people don't let you get away with shit. this boo walking at Dutch Jackson: And then the movie, it almost got better, but then the goddamn movie dropped. So it's back with Avengers. I'm like, damn. And what's crazy, bro? It was cool in the 80s. Before Mike started doing shit, you know, before we start getting the cues. but man, growing up in the 80s with that name, shh. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: So it put creative in me early. I'm watching Thrill. I'm like, wow, his name is my name. I'm supposed to be doing this. Yeah, and it just stuck with me my whole life, man. Music, music. I I'm a hip hop hand. Like I'm a mus you know, a music guy. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. And this is something let me let me point this out real quick because we're on this tip. What people don't realize is folks like us didn't really have a lot of folks like us on TV. A lot of creative folks on TV, right? Dutch Jackson: No, no. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Like when I was a kid, Michael Jackson wasn't even on MTV. And then you said Thriller. That's when they finally put his ass out. Because Thriller took the planet by storm. You better put his ass on MTV. Dutch Jackson: Exactly. Exactly. Yeah, man. We came, I was just telling my wife, we come from the greatest era. I was l I was listening to just some 90s music last night, some 80s music. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Tell them. Dutch Jackson: I said, man, the shit we come from, we come from greatness. Like, Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: so it's hard for us to just go along with bullshit, just go along with mediocre. Because we come from greatness, man. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. Right. Dutch Jackson: Like everything we learnt from was just Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): 'Cause when we were kids, you still had to play instruments to make to be a musician. Dutch Jackson: Yes. Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): You still had to sing like you had to have Dutch Jackson: Yes. And live Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): it. Dutch Jackson: you had to sound like you sound on the radio live. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: You go, you had to pick you had to pick up. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Look at how Millie Vanilli got lit up when they got f when they got busted. Dutch Jackson: Now everybody doing. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, now everybody's doing it. Dutch Jackson: I feel sorry for Milly Vanilli, man. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: Destroyed them young men's lives, man. For shit Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: everybody doing now. But you know, so the first always Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. What was it? Dutch Jackson: sacrifice though. You know, the first people that do things always get sacrificed and then e everybody adapts, you know. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Exactly. Exactly. That's what it is. That's what it is. What was it like growing up in the loo? I know. Dutch Jackson: Mm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I well, I grew up I grew up between Chicago and like the second or third biggest city in Illinois, Rockford. I spent my time between those two. And back Dutch Jackson: Gotcha. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): in the seventies that shit was violent. What was it like in the loo? Dutch Jackson: Man, you know Chicago and St. Louis, man, brother and sisters, brother and brother, sister. Man, that Midwest Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, they are. Dutch Jackson: is a monster, man. And what's crazy, and I was thinking about this, the the toughest part of my childhood, man, I had to act so like I was a gangster, and I was really just a fucking nerd. But I had to act to just protect myself, you know what I mean? I had to act. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. You're like I'm packing heat on these number two pencils. Dutch Jackson: Like because it was either or I I've come from a crippled neighborhood. Like I couldn't be like, hey guys, I'm I'm not claiming that. Like it was protection. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: I had to walk to school, I had to walk home, like man, it was just you know, we came up in NWA colors, the gang, Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Huh? Dutch Jackson: the gang shit, the Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): It was like when the city was telling their s finally start starting to tell their story was right there. Dutch Jackson: Yeah, man. So just I just feel lucky, man, because I feel like I to get out of that and to to to make it out, I just drove through Saint Louis. Like I said, when I went to Chicago, I went through Saint Louis, man, I it was high school partner still on the block. They strung out. They Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm. Dutch Jackson: you know, so it was just it was tough growing up in Saint Louis. I had to hide. I I'm not I'm not gay or nothing, but I I had to hide my creativity because I'm walking to school and shit. I got on headphones. I'm listening to Queen and shit. Looking on this. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: You know, because I my mind, I never accepted where I was. My mind, I was always creating and I was always on other shit, but I had to act and Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm. Dutch Jackson: look like my environment, you know. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: So. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Do you have this weird feeling inside you that like you there's somewhere you need to be? You don't know where it is, but you just keep working because you there's somewhere you need to be. Dutch Jackson: Man, it's driving me crazy. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Me too. Dutch Jackson: I've always and I've always had it. And that's why I haven't Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, me too. Dutch Jackson: somewhere I need to go, somewhere I need Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: to go. I'm working towards something. But I got friends Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: and shit. And then I'll be second guessing like, damn, what am I doing this for? But I just keep. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. Dutch Jackson: And I think somebody said something. Somebody said the journey is the destination. Right? Because Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): The journey makes it a lot more fun. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Dutch Jackson: Yeah, be because I'll be afraid maybe because I reach but I reach my goals, I sit there for a while, like wow, that's cool. gotta I keep moving the ball out there. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): There's another one. Yeah. Dutch Jackson: So it's I don't know what it is. I don't think Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: it's gonna ever stop, man. As soon as I release this, I'll be like, Okay, I gotta get to this point. I get to there, I see something Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: else. See something else. And I don't know where they come from, but I'm just maybe it's something from my generation or something that Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: What is that? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I don't know. I've tried to like the the the most simple thing I can boil it down to is just I'm tired of being poor. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I'm tired of not having shit. What did Eminem say? I'm tired of I'm tired of all the rappers who ain't half as skilled as me. Dutch Jackson: Yes. Yes. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): You know what I mean? Dutch Jackson: Yes. Yes. And no, no, Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Like Dutch Jackson: brother. And and it's the thing is, you probably feel like I feel, like a lot of our generation feel, 70s, 80s. I ain't gonna say 90s, but early 90s. We were taught Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: to be successful in this world. Happiness was going to the army, getting the job, buying a house. And the world's changed. When we were taught the old ways, the world changed. So now everything that we did back then to get to a better life now, that shit ain't working. I did everything I was supposed to do. College, with America, boom, boom, boom. Why am I still in this? Why am I still struggling when I did everything y'all said to Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: be successful and happy? So we realized. Man, fuck that. We they lied. So you gotta get your head around that in your 40s and 50s. That damn, I was lied to them for 50 years. Now I gotta pivot Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: and make some decisions to off-rail the shit that, you know, derail the stuff that I learned. Now I gotta go into a whole nother career and I gotta do other things. Cause your talents and your your creativity the only thing that's gonna make you rich. Them the only things, man. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): One hundred percent. Dutch Jackson: Your imagination. That's why I tell people once you lose your imagination, it's over. That's Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: when you become the zombie to the world, man. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Cause otherwise you're just a machine part. Right? And a machine part, you folks gotta understand this. Especially especially in our community, our communities, they they they they make us be machine parts and then they teach us to do this thing repetitiously. And now they have machines that are learning that repetition. And machines are doing that repetition. So now so now they Dutch Jackson: Ten times better. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): don't need you anymore. So and then you're wondering and you're wondering why they're making rules to like separate you even more. Cause they don't need you as a machine part anymore, but they also don't want to worry about having to take care of you. Dutch Jackson: Exactly. Exactly. I was saying something. People think slavery ended because white people was just like, you know what, let these black people go, man. We we're so we are so strong. Right. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah, fuck off. Meanwhile, everybody has slaves. Dutch Jackson: They don't no, they released the sl they they released the slaves because machinery came and they Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: need physical labor. Like they need it before with the slaves. So they they took off the plantation, but they put in slavery in different ways. But that's what's Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: happening now. They laying everybody ass off, bringing AI in. we don't need your Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: physical You f you keep fucking up payroll. We got Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: IMAC, you know, two thousand who never messes up payroll. So it the same thing happening, man, and and they just they moving it along, man. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Yep. And folks Dutch Jackson: So Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): folks need to realize that. People with money, they're not worried about you. They're worried about their money and they're worried about their kids. They Dutch Jackson: Yes. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): ain't worried about you. They don't have time. They don't have they don't have it it's just they're dis they're disconnected from you. Look at when when folks make money, they pull up, you don't ever see them anymore. Like it's very rare to see anyone make it make it and then go back in the hood and try to make things better. Dutch Jackson: I learned from Nipsey, man. I it's Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): You know what I'm saying? Dutch Jackson: Yeah. No, it's it's and what's crazy, bro, like I just Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): So for folks for folks that don't understand Nipsey, what's Nipsey? Who's who was Nipsey? Dutch Jackson: Nipsey Hussle was a rapper from LA who got on, got pretty big, started bringing good things back to the community, opening up tech schools, putting money back into his community. He was a gang member in LA and he got killed by his own gang member in the hood, doing stuff for the hood. So my point is. It's like a double-edged sword because you try, you get a little big success, and you want to help us. You want to help where you came from. It's like a lot of people from the hood ain't even really ready to accept the help. They'll be j they'll become jealous of you trying to help out and they'll take you out. So it's like It's like the mindset of the poor, man. Like it's a mental thing. It's a sickness, man. It's more than Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: not having money. You have to break that mind state first. You know what I mean? And that's what I try to do to our people. I 'cause I did a lot, man. I was shooting and I don't know where we're going with this conversation, but I was in corporate Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): No, neither. Dutch Jackson: America and first I was a rapper. I was the C Dog back in the eighties, first of all. rapper and I started rapping my whole life to you know up to the the nineties the early two thousands where I was really trying to pursue being a rap artist and I sat down with a with a few labels and I I almost got signed a bunch of times but music music was my love that was my way I thought I was gonna get out the hood you know Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: I thought that was gonna be the way that I was gonna make my money and you know just generational wealth. Well that dream didn't happen. So I start picking up a camera late on and that's when I start filming. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): What about what what time frame what what year roughly was that? Dutch Jackson: so doing a the the rap was like from ninety nine to like two thousand and shit, I just start rapping. Like two thousand and twenty-three. I just chilled Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, yeah, yeah. Dutch Jackson: trying, but the c the times I almost got signed was like early two thousands, around Nelly ninety eight, ninety nine. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Dutch Jackson: The hardest you had Eminem out, ludicrous out, nearly out. Like I w that's why Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, back then the loo was hot 'cause 'cause Nelly Dutch Jackson: I mean Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Nelly owned everything, boy. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. So I was I was in that crowd trying to make it at that time where the competition was just fierce, man. You had fifty cent after that and then, you know, that's when I really tried to pursue music. But I but later in life I realized a lot of us are authors, a lot of us are other things, but growing up in the hood, the first piece of art you attach yourself to a lot of times is hip hop. Because that's the only way you can really express how you feel. But I didn't know I was a author. I I didn't know I was, you know, a teacher. I didn't know all of that. I just connected with rap at a young, young, young age 'cause that was the only example of creativity I saw. You know? So I just attached to that and I've been attached to it ever since. Yeah, man. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): trying to as far as picking up the camera goes Dutch Jackson: Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): right it I'm trying to I'm trying to see at what point in technology we were when you decided to jump in. Dutch Jackson: super super manual. I d I picked up a camera around two thousand seven and it wasn't even a Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Okay. So that's back when that's back when like digital was just starting to catch on. Yeah. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Digital just caught on, was catching on. They didn't have mirrorless yet. So I my cause my first camera, well first I was working off a a phone, a little video phone, Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: Sanyo or some shit. I don't know when it I I don't know that that that's blurry, but I know my first camera was a Canon and it wasn't mirrorless. You know, it was just I was getting all the grain and it wasn't everything manual. I Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): People today are spoiled, man, aren't they? They just Dutch Jackson: Mirror is going out. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): take a phone out and they're I hey, I just made this whole Tahiti video a few months ago. I went to the French Polynesia region. And I wasn't even planning on making a movie at all. And I just took out a phone and I was I was playing around with my Insta360 camera. It's the X three. So it's like old, old. And so I'm playing around and all of a sudden I have a half hour episode of a travel video. Dutch Jackson: Dude. And and like you said, back in the day. So so you're a camera guy. Are you a camera guy? Wow. That's crazy. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Dutch Jackson: I'm I'm a a super camera guy, man. When when Mira came Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): What brand? Dutch Jackson: out, I like Panasonic, man. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Okay. Dutch Jackson: I like Canon was the beginning, but then Panasonic, because I never had enough money to get like lightning and shit. So Panasonic was the best in the dark, you know. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, yeah, yeah. Dutch Jackson: I could get a lot of good lightning, you know what I mean? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): That's funny. That's why I got the Sony A seven S three. They said with this camera you're gonna be able to see the dark, I said, I'm in. Dutch Jackson: Sony is like a upgrade Sony to Sony is to what Panasonic was to Canon. So you had Canon, then you had Panasonic, now you got fucking Sony, man. Like it's ridiculous, man. These cameras and what's crazy, now that I do AI, I don't even need a camera no more. It's the craziest thing, man. So I Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Nuts. Dutch Jackson: it's I don't even die. This shit's scary, man. I just knew I had I'm in here scared learning this shit like I can do that with this. What the hell? You know what I mean? So it this shit Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. Dutch Jackson: really scary. That's why I forced myself to do it because I was always ten ten years ahead, man. I was doing Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: logs 2008 and nine, because I said, Man, technology is gonna take Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yo, I did a I like to I like to reflect. 'Cause here's a for for younger folks that aren't in their fifties yet, when you get to in their in your fifties, everything turns into a reflection, everything turns into a memory. And so when I started vlogging and stuff, I started remembering that when I went to film school, it was ninety seven, ninety eight, ninety nine. And and we still had where you put the cassette in and you had this big ass box on your shoulder, right? I was vlogging with that bitch. I was cause we were supposed to shoot a film about making a film, Dutch Jackson: Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): but nobody nobody wanted like everyone was it was kinda like towards the end of the semester and everything, and nobody wanted to be in my film. So I said, fuck it, I'll just I'll And I've vlogged a director like yelling at all the people in their in their positions, you know? And now I was like, damn, I was I was way before my time. Like Dutch Jackson: Really, man, a lot of times I've missed out because I was too early. And a lot Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: of times people miss out is because they were too early. I was sitting in my room rapping. I had a rap series where I sat in my room and had the microphone and I used to just rap it on YouTube early. People in my comments, what's wrong with this motherfucker? He's crazy. Why is rapping on this? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Lonely ass Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Why is he in his room talking to himself? I had when I started talking to myself, man, you're crazy. And then I'll be like, you guys are right. I'm crazy. Man, I look up everybody in the room talking themselves. Everybody hanging mics everywhere. Right. I was just too early and people wasn't ready for it. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Too early. That's it. Dutch Jackson: And and I've told myself I'm not stopping anymore because what I'm doing is unfamiliar to people because I've always been too early, and I'm not gonna let you know people talk me out of what I'm doing because I see where shit is going. And sometimes Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: when you're early, just stick with it, man. You know? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Yeah, don't be afraid. Cause Dutch Jackson: Man. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): there's like you just never know. You never know what's gonna hit. Because Dutch Jackson: No, never. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): everything the this is what's crazy. Everyone's like, corporate America's gonna take care of everything and you know, 'cause everything is super fast and super easy and stuff like that. But then everything starts to look the same, everything starts to taste the same, everything starts to be the same. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And we're just not supposed to live like that. Dutch Jackson: No man. I I know. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): We're not. Dutch Jackson: I know man. It's crazy, man. But to find out, 'cause this is what it's meant to do. Trick you until you get into your forties and fifties. So all the all Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. And now you're too tired. Now you don't Dutch Jackson: Now that technology Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: is makes it so easy for me. Because I don't have the energy to go out and shoot people and follow rappers and 'cause I shoot used to shoot music videos. Man, I ain't got the energy to come to the project, shoot you, then go to the club for that club scene that night. Man, send me some motherfucking pictures. Dude, I'm too old. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I gotta go get my kid from soccer, goddammit. Dutch Jackson: Yeah, okay. of energy. That's why I tell people our age, you know, this is probably the best time. If you got, if you had a dream, you wanted to do something, make. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Any creative inkling at all. Dutch Jackson: Right now. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right now, this is I keep telling people because I I do want to dig into AI, but a little bit later I want to dig into more of your creative journey. But right now, like when I talk to people I'm always I'm I I love cameras. I love setting up, I love directing, doing all the things. So I will continue to do that. Dutch Jackson: Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): But Whatever it is that folks listening to our voices, if you don't take anything away from this conversation except this, please take this with you. Anything is possible now. Dutch Jackson: Yes. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Anything. I made a rap song, dissing rappers that do their own graphic design. Anything is possible. Dutch Jackson: Man, you see the shit I'm doing. So it yes, you can do anything. The the creative it's a creative creative's world now. This what I've been waiting on. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. Dutch Jackson: My whole life. I was called weird for coming up with crazy ideas, and now you get rewarded for them crazy ideas, man. This is the time to be crazy. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. This is the time. This is a democratization of 'Cause like d I I still have friends in Hollywood. Still. Some but like one of my favorite people on this planet is still down there and he's even thinking about leaving the industry because number one, they're giving the jobs to everybody else except Americans, number one. And number two, it's like we're working on that again, we're working on that again. And then something new is like twenty one jump street, a remake of twenty one jump street, or a remake of Starsky and Hutch, or a remake of you know what I mean? Dutch Jackson: Yeah, yeah. Worth the creep. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Now's the time. Now's the time. Dutch Jackson: Now now is the time, man. You know, the the world was always stealing from the cre the creative. Always the people with money, the people who stuff Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: move, they were stealing from the creator and making things happen and the creative was just in the middle, like you know, now you don't need these middlemen. You don't need you Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. They used to handle distribution. Okay. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And this is a trick, you guys. This is the trick. If you want to make it in Hollywood anymore, if you want to be a director, a writer, anything like that, they want you to build your own audience. Then they give you money to leverage your audience. That's how it works. That's how it that's they used to bring you on and they Dutch Jackson: Uh-huh. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): would do the advertising, they would do all the things, but now they want you to do it. Dutch Jackson: That sounds like a damn rap label. Like that's what they want Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: us to do. Build your we you build your own audience, then we feed off your audience. That's what they do. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. Dutch Jackson: Bitch, I build my own audience. I don't need you. You know what I mean? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Distribution YouTube dot com slash coconut justice. Dutch Jackson: You know day, but Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Collab with Dutch. Look at us distributing. We don't need you, bitch. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Yeah. Why would I why would I build my following? I'm building my following just to hand it over to you. But you can take my following, get sick of me a couple of years in and now I'm gone and yeah, I didn't took Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: took my following. That's why influences are so big now because influencers are like the new That they they the crowd control, they tell you who cool. They controlling traffic. That's Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: why in successful influencers make a lot of money because they telling the b they telling people what brands to follow and that's why streaming is so, you know, popular too. Because it the game just changed, man. I don't know why I'm Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: staying on it. I'm glad I stayed in it though, because Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Meter. Dutch Jackson: I could take advantage of the these new ways that and they're not manual, you know. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. And this is the benefit from us coming up the way that we did. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): We have stories. I can tell you stories about the dude that got in a fight with this lady, and the kid went and took a a post from the stop sign and clocked him in his head. Said, get off my mama. I have stories like that. Kung Fu Panda ain't got shit on me. Dutch Jackson: No camera phones. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): None. Dutch Jackson: That's man, yes, we come from man, we where we come from, it's just sometimes I just reflect on it, man. I I was I look at these kids in their 20s. They so fucking lazy, man. Like, I'm like, man. At 20, 20, early 20s, I had my apartment. I was living on my own. I'm like Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: I mean I know economically things change. It's not as affordable as it was when but I was Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And it's a lack of it's a lack of Focus is almost almost victim blaming. People don't know how to move because there's no steps, there's no steps forward. Like the s society has has been ripping. So there's no, you know, there's there's no step forward. It's it's literally you either have it or you don't. Dutch Jackson: yeah Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): There's no more sca like especially with this administration right now, there's no more scaffolding that's gonna help you be rich. Rich Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): people broke that scaffolding. So now it's every man for themself. Dutch Jackson: Every man for himself, man. And but that's Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Did you ever go to art school or anything like that? Dutch Jackson: You know what, man? I didn't. I never w I never went to art school, man. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): What kind of school did you go to at all? Dutch Jackson: I d I went to IT T tech. Someone Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Okay. Dutch Jackson: that you know, I thought I wanted to become an IT later on. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. Dutch Jackson: and it was cool. You know, I got a I got a little a degree in IT, but it wasn't what I Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): You understand computers and networking and all that stuff. That's valuable. When you're trying to a render farm. Dutch Jackson: Yeah, yeah, yeah. It was crazy. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I I know who to call when I need a render farm. Dutch Jackson: Yeah man, I can Be because I just like man, these was after my rapper days too. I was I turned like twenty eight. I was like, you know what, man, I don't think this shit gonna happen. Let me go get a degree or something. You know. And Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. Dutch Jackson: then I got a little degree and didn't use it, but I didn't realize how valuable it was until later. Like most things. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: But artists, I've been an artist my whole life, man. Rapping, drawing since I was a kid, man. It just I just never let it go. So I always did. When I worked corporate America, I always did it on the side of the, you know. One time I got caught because I was shooting music. I lived a double life for a long time, man. I was a corporate manager. I had over 800 employees. But then on my days off and shit, I did a music video call. You got me fucked up with my partner in St. Check this out. That's obviously. I was working in Kansas City. I got caught in the office. I came in the office. I was like, yes, do we have any problems with budget art? No, Mike, we got another problem. What are you what are you talking about? Is this you on this song entitled You Got You Fucked Up? Thank you. I'm looking, I'm like, what is who is this? This is crazy. So I guess I don't know how one of my employees. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Looks just like my cousin. Dutch Jackson: So man, I never gave up. I played this corporate person. I was rapping the whole time, putting out albums, cause I Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: never let it go. Cause it's something told me that, man, you don't sacrifice your soul for this corporate shit. Cause at the end of the day, this corporate shit gonna spit you out and gonna care for you. All you're gonna have, all you're gonna have for your passions in life. That's it. You know? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): You're just helping someone build build their shit. Dutch Jackson: Exactly. The motherfuckers, they let me work. I'll be like when I first got in the corporate game, I'm like, you know what? The more I do, the more they're gonna like me. The more I do, the more they're gonna like me, and the more I'm gonna move up. I'm gonna finally get that black card, I'm gonna have that suit, I'm gonna have that high position, work myself to Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yep. They're gonna see me for all the hard work that I am and they're gonna reward me. Dutch Jackson: Yes. And they just rewarded they rewarded my ass with more work and less time. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And that check don't ever move. Salary What? Dutch Jackson: Man, great deception. Damn it, they got me again. I thought I figured it out. You know. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): my god, I feel like I'm talking to me. Dutch Jackson: Well Yeah. Didn't see family working crazy hours, you know. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yo. Dutch Jackson: I don't I don't have kids. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: I got I got one son because of marriage, but I didn't have kids because I worked so much and don't nobody believe me, man. I'm like I used Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: to get up, go to work, stay there fifteen hours, sixteen hours, come home. So I never really took relationships serious. I didn't have time. You know? So yeah, man. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. Dutch Jackson: Again, right. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I was telling you right before we hit record, I was working. I got worked. I got worked. I was at one job. They said, okay. So when we originally quoted this job, we said we needed three months to build it. But because they dragged their feet so long, now we only have three weeks. Will you do it? Go back to the part where you said if I work really hard, they're gonna, son, I would be working. I said, I'll do it. But I get to work from home. They Yeah, all right, cool. I'd be on the couch working and then I would fall asleep and I would wake back up and just keep typing. And then another one, I was putting in I didn't ever I didn't when my time sheet went to a hundred hours, I stopped counting because I didn't want to admit to myself that I was giving this company one hundred hours a week. And then when I said, this is killing me, I'm gonna knock it down to like fifty to sixty, then they took me in the office to ask me what was wrong because they wanted me to work as hard as I was working before. Hmm. They're trying to put paperwork on me. Dutch Jackson: Yeah, hey, we you ain't doing these hundred hours. Is that something wrong? Something wrong. That's when they act like right. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah, my check ain't moving, bitch. Dutch Jackson: That's something wrong with home. You're having home issues. Corporate is crazy, man. They are crazy. Don't do just the because that that's what happened to after a while. After I got corporally the burnout, I Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yep. Dutch Jackson: realized just I was just overworking myself and they wasn't stopping me. I start doing what I was supposed to do and I start getting in trouble for doing what I was supposed to do only and not overdoing what I was supposed to do. That's like I said, yeah, I start getting calls in the office, Michael. Your performance is you know, it's normal. We're not used to you killing yourself. What's going on? That's how it sounded when they were talking to me. You know, I'm like, they want you to kill yourself. I had an employee real quick. I worked at the airline. I was I was in airline management. And when you work at the airport, you need these badges, like they security badges. One of my employees, like one of my go-to employee, she was a manager under me. Really hard worker. Did everything she she, you know, for the company. She was more dedicated to me. And I was like, you know, whatever. Unfortunately, she passed. In a co accident, right? So I tell my superiors, hey man, so and so passed. You know, she's supposed to be having a funeral. So and so, what do you guys want to do? They told me, You got a security badge? Where's her security badge? Did anybody get that? I'm like, N I said, no, me maybe because the goddamn security bag badge is in the car wreckage. They're keeping You know what I mean? They did Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): That security badge you shit that day. Dutch Jackson: They didn't care, bro, and that was one thing, no matter how far I moved up, I couldn't stop caring for people. And that gets you in trouble in Clipping America, because they don't care about nobody. You know? So Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): One hundred percent. They don't care. They don't care. Dutch Jackson: when that that got me to that level, and then when I realized me caring for people was just getting me in trouble, it was making me feel a certain type of way, man. I gave up on this shit. I get I I couldn't do it though. No? So Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. And and no no shade to folks that just wanna go to a a job and then go home. No shade to you. No shade to you. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. No. I wish I Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): If that's how you want to do it, do it. Dutch Jackson: I man, I wish I can be that. I wish I can go to work and be normal. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. Dutch Jackson: Because it seemed like sometimes I put myself through so much creating. I need to create, I need to create. It's like a drug. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. Dutch Jackson: I just want I just wanted to just go to work, come home, and be happy with that. No? So it's like a gift Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. Dutch Jackson: and a curse, you know? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. And that's that's where today's day and age is exciting for people like us because you're like wait a minute wait a minute. Now I don't now I get to do what I want, I get to visualize it and deliver. Dutch Jackson: Yes. Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): With limited to no help. Dutch Jackson: Hmm. And it could potentially free me. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. And if you have the tools, like you said, we're manual. If you know how to operate a camera, that all those skills translate. If you know how to draw, all those skills translate. If you know how to work a computer, all those skills translate. Dutch Jackson: Yes. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: And that's why I tell people, 40s, 50s, 60s, those transferable skills right now are more valuable than anything, man. Learn Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: coming from the manual age gives us the craziest advantage now. Cause like you said, learning ISO and ISO and Aperture. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): The what is that? The phot photographer's triangle? what's it called? I think that's something like that. The triangle, the ISO, the aperture and the shutter speed. Dutch Jackson: Yeah, just that alone gives Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: me the advantage when I create videos because I put that in the system. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: The average twenty year old who ain't never picked up a camera, I'm smoking his young ass because Because I got the real life experience that they don't. You know, Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. Dutch Jackson: that makes a big difference. Now, and and you know, don't let's don't let technology intimidate you. You did the hard work already. You did the shit manually. You know, that Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: was hard work. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. And let me tell you how digital influenced my life. I've always been to this day. Dutch Jackson: Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I've been financially strapped to the point where I can't. Like I got a I got a I was into photography and I got a camera and it ran off of film. And then I would set the ISO and shutter speed and I'll click and I would take notes. Dutch Jackson: Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): First picture, this is what I did, this is what the picture is of. Because I didn't I didn't have money to go to photography school. So I'm sitting here like manually teaching myself. I moved the camera somewhere else. This is the spot it there's some sunlight. This is how much light this is the aperture, this is the ISO, this a click, and then you have to take that roll of film to go get you know Dutch Jackson: Hello. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. And then you bring that shit back and then you like look at the picture and you look at your notes and it's been a couple weeks now because it takes them a couple of meeks weeks to develop the shit. So now I'm trying to like okay, cool. that was that picture. Okay. And don't get the pictures mixed up because now your notes don't kind of come. So Dutch Jackson: Right. Wow. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): when digital happened, I was like, okay, click, click, click, click. Now I'm able to see that's how ISO changes things. And maybe I do want a little bit of noise, so maybe I do crank that ISO up just a little. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Maybe I don't want that much blur. Maybe I bring the shutter speed down. But if I bring the shutter speed down, how does that affect the aperture and the ISO? Dutch Jackson: So Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): These are all the conversations that you're having no Dutch Jackson: Yep. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): matter what you're using. Dutch Jackson: No matter what you're using, but see how that manual going through all that manual stuff, technology came, you you would instantly like you know, you Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: caught on it just made your process better. Coming from this step, the technology made your process, and that's all it is. Whatever process you have, the digital age man, it's just gonna make it better. Make it a lot easier, you know. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: It's just learning a new way. Sometimes, like you could have easily said, no, you know what? I don't want that camera. I'm gonna stick with drawing. That works better for me. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: You could have done that, but why? You know? Hey. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Dutch Jackson: Each is own, man, you know. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Who are some of your creative influences? Dutch Jackson: Man, you know, coming from where we came from, man, mostly singers, rappers, Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: dude, I don't know why, like I love Bill Cosby. Like Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: I and I found out early he he had a he had comedy, but it was a realism about him. You know, he always fought for the people. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: And but I I I'm a big Bill Cosby fan. I don't know why, man. Eddie Murphy. Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Yeah. Cause he's talented. Cause he's talented. He's a like I understand people why people are upset with him. I get it. This Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): is the part where you have to separate the artist from the art. Dutch Jackson: Exactly. You know, Prince, of course Michael Jackson, I my one of my favorite movies, The Last Dragon. I'm Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): hell yeah. Dutch Jackson: I'm all over the place, man. Coming from Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): yeah. Dutch Jackson: the eighties, man, the Goonies and Steven Spielberg and man, we had too much, man. We had too much greatness. You know what I mean? Like this Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And it was unbridled too. Like we were back in the eighties, all those movies were just Dutch Jackson: We saw the that's why I don't even Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): If you haven't yet seen Porkies, go see Porkies and that'll wrap up basically what the a lot of the eighties movies That'll wrap it up. Dutch Jackson: Weird science. Dude, Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Weird science. Dutch Jackson: weird science made me, that got me. I think that took my brain to another thing. I'm like, damn, I can create a person. Dude, you I why we on here right now is messing Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Here I come, my TT Tech. Dutch Jackson: with. I'm like, damn, I am bro, I'm real science now. I'm creating the people, the the cars, they created their world on a computer. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. Dutch Jackson: Worm bars on the head. Young people go see it. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Go see the movie. Weird science. Dutch Jackson: yeah, man. Damn, that's a dope name for something. Weird. Yeah, I'm using that. But that's where I come from, man. We come from that age where it was just greatness all everywhere you looked. Greatness, you know. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. Dutch Jackson: We were at the peak of manual talent. You know? So that's where I come from man and I and I ain't been able to let it go since man 'cause Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): How have you been training yourself? How have you been learning like rule of thirds and all that stuff? Dutch Jackson: Well, I really started I'm forty f I'm forty six, but I really started getting out the corporate world around like thirty-five. But as far as just being creative and teaching myself things, I've been doing that my whole life. Like I'm a day trader, but I don't talk about it. You know, so I day trade, I'm a I I fly drones, you know, Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: music audio engineer I mix and master music so I've always just been addicted to learning cameras and Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. Dutch Jackson: I never knew why but I understand now I'm like man I got all these skills and we're in the age of what is it teaching we're in the age of knowledge like selling knowledge is very ext like it's very lucrative now and I'm like shit courses and things like that. So my whole life, man, I just I'm addicted. I've been addicted to learning things. I kept a corporate job though. But Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: they the job was priority in me learning and my my creativity was second second hand. But the is I never let it go and I'm so glad I never did man. And I didn't know why I was doing this all the time. But it makes sense. So my whole life man, just teaching myself, staying up with technology, listening to kids Watching kids online, day trading, cryptocurrency, all the shit the young people do, I do it, but I just I got the age. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: I just kept up with what was going on. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, and you have a you have a a bigger depth of knowledge. You're not just out Dutch Jackson: Exact. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): here all willy nilly. Dutch Jackson: No. No, man. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): That's a and that's important. Like if you build a base and for right now, your base is your knowledge in everything that you've learned, all those things, you're able to then leverage that to figure out. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): 'Cause not for anything, but flying drones is doing taxes and whatever is just just another thing. It's just another Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): thing. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. After it clicked in my head, man, that I we were lied to our whole lives. After that clicked, I started Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: more towards my passions and things, because I'm like, man, really? Your passions and you outthinking the the system, your imagination is the only thing that can really free you. You know, everything. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Feed it. Feed it good information. Dutch Jackson: Rich dad, poor dad. When I read that Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): listen. Dutch Jackson: We'd have you called. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Everybody, everybody, if you read Rich Dad, Poor Dad, right when you finish that book, that next Monday you're gonna wanna quit your job. Dutch Jackson: I'm telling you, man. I'm dude. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And mix in the knowledge that we know that it the game is fixed and they're lying to you. Dutch Jackson: Man. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And now we can do whatever the fuck we want, whenever the fuck we want, however the fuck we want. Dutch Jackson: Cra man, crazy. It it's Rich Dad, Poor Dad. Y'all, if y'all don't get nothing else from this conversation, go read Rich Dad Poor Dad. That's Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): That's it. Yeah. Dutch Jackson: and I'm stopped. I'm that's it, man. That that changed. When I saw that book and it kinda it it gave me verification that I wasn't crazy. You know? For for my whole life, you know, I'm told I'm being crazy. man, why are you trying to do that? Just go get a job. man, why you trying to do that? Just do this. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: Hearing these opinions from people who ain't never done nothing. You know? And I'm listening. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): That's just and that's just it. Like everybody you have to you have to understand everybody is trying to play it safe because nobody wants to rock the boat. Nobody wants to lose their job. Nobody was Dutch Jackson: Why they losing it? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): everyone is very protective of all that shit. And I'm like, at the end of the day, you have to give that desk back. You have to give that cubicle back. That shit ain't yours. I'm obsessed. I'm obsessed until my name is on that door. Dutch Jackson: Yes. Yes. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-mm. Dutch Jackson: Yes. You know the crazy part? It's this this is how the man, they got it, they got it so rigged. You don't realize that a lot of times until you make it to certain corporate or certain positions when you work in a job. Like you think going up higher gonna make you feel better. man, I'm doing this for the company. Man, I got to a point, I'm like, man, we just look at people as numbers. I'm like, nobody cares about shit up here. Like, man, Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: you know, it's almost like going to school to be a lawyer, and then when you finally become a lawyer, you're like, damn, I I don't want to be a lawyer. You know? It's the same thing. It's the same thing, man. So that scarcity thing, they we were trained to be that. You know, raise your hand. Stand in line. We were raised to, I can't. Like you said, they so afraid to lose their house and play it safe while you playing it safe and still losing your damn house. You're you're Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Yeah. Your plane is so safe you're losing it anyway. Dutch Jackson: Losing it anyway, so being scared on to move and group, shit's still getting worse for those Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: type of people who depending on nine to five, like you said, there's nothing wrong Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: with want to go to work and go. I wish that could be me. I wish I could just be happy with going to work and come home, but unfortunately, my name Michael. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, for real. It's way more peaceful that way. Life is way more peaceful. But I'm just not I'm not built for peace. Dutch Jackson: Yeah, man. Mm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I'm Aries, I'm here for the ruckus. Dutch Jackson: You know what I mean? Like, what kind of life is that, man? I watched my dad do it and RP my dad because he put us in a position that I could live a life the type of life I want. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: But that's not me, man. I'm sorry. And and the thing is I can't fight it. I'm I'm really a a middle-aged man rapping online every day. This is me for real. This is not an act and I love it. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Same. Same. Me too. Me too. Dutch Jackson: I fucking love it, man. Dude. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And like you know, referencing AI and how some of these folks are pushing back and and upset when la la la, we can get into that a little bit more too, but you know, I've been hesitant to get into AI and just because Because of the backlash and because of, you know, the the the artists Have valid concerns. The environmentalists have valid concerns. Everyone has valid concerns. But like my boy Rookie said, he said, Man, I'm tired of this shit. Every time it comes time for us to do our thing, every time it comes for us to tell our stories, to do our animations, to do our videos, all of a sudden people want to have an attitude. Dutch Jackson: Been making AI movies since the late 90s, man. Nobody said Marvel, when Marvel came out with shit, they're using AI. This is some bullshit. This is outraged. AI has been around. Smartphones are fucking AI. Websites for AI. So it's been around, but soon as but can but creators rule the world. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. And and and and think of this. This is where this is where my pushback and again I haven't I haven't I've been playing with AI. I've been trying to see what I can do with it kind of thing. But where's I going with that? Son of a bitch. ADHD brain just kicked in. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): We're talking Dutch Jackson: Your point. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): about rookie, we're g doing our own thing, pushback. Dutch Jackson: Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I've I've I've been trepidatious moving into this world because I'm still connected to people in LA and I'm still listening to the stories about how we're losing our jobs and all this other stuff. And finally, listen you guys, I'm sorry. I lost my job eight years ago and y'all didn't call me to see what the fuck was up with me. Dutch Jackson: Every man for themselves, man. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): That's where we are. That's where we are. Like I I didn't I didn't reach the glass ceiling. I smashed into that bitch. And my life came to a screeching halt when you guys continue to give the jobs to people that don't fucking live here. So now something like an AI, something like when you guys go see what Dutch is doing, you guys are gonna be fucking mind blown. It's gonna be fucking mind blowing. And I'm looking at this and I'm like, how do I not play? Dutch Jackson: Wanna keep writing out? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I got stories, I got those manual skills, I got the experience in LA, I'd I've written movies, I've shot movies, I've done all the things. Dutch Jackson: It's just like when you went from writing your ISO on the camera. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. Dutch Jackson: The same same annihil analogy, man. It's the same thing. Like I never, man, I used to be so discouraged because I was like, I never had money to make a $200,000 film or $200 million. Now I just enter it. I want a $200 million film. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: You know, so whether we like what's happening or not, it doesn't matter. The world's still gonna change. When Zap and Roger came out with computer love, you know how many musicians hate that motherfucker, that ain't a real song. They went from the you know record Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): All them funk bands are like, fuck you. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. When all the instruments went digital in the 80s, bam, bam, bam, boom, boom, bam. You know how many musicians from the 70s was like, that's bullshit, that ain't real music, man. Just wonderful Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: playing a keyboard like a guitar. That ain't gonna work. Yeah. You know what I mean? You know what I mean? But people don't realize Prince was a he he went to the digital sound. Prince brought Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: in Michael Jackson went with those cinematic visuals. They Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: took advantage of the changing times and it made them iconic. Don't, you know, cause shit gonna change whether you like it or not. You know. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Hey, if it wasn't is if it wasn't for technology, disruptive technology, hip hop would have never been turned into a thing. Dutch Jackson: Exactly. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): That MPC? What do Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): you what do you see what do you think that is? That's leveraging computers, you guys. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Yeah. So you can't get mad because your your generation benefited off of technology. You can't be mad at the next generation that the technology changes again. Just move with it. You know, because like we said before, those skills from the NPC, you code on the NPC, man. You know how much how crazy you be on the shit they got now? Those skills are transferable. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): You see them you see them big ass soundboards that Dr. Dravey fucking fuck with? How many Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): buttons do you need to make a beat? Dutch Jackson: Exactly. And that shit just for show. Man, Dre probably got all kind of digital. He just did a statement the other day that people got mad about. He was like he embraces AI and music or something. Drake says something, everybody's in a uproar, you know, but the shit gonna happen whether you want it to or not. You know? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Listen, my just yesterday my mom shared with me this Spanish love ballad. Dutch Jackson: Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): My mom my mom's love language is music. I grew up listening to Everything from the gap band. Earth Wind and Fire is my Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): favorite band. Period. Period. Prince. All those things. So I don't you know, I've been surrounded by music. I know Dutch Jackson: Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): what music is playing at my mom's house when it's time to clean the house. That's how much music I've been around. Like fuck. This is this is clean cleaning house theme music. Dutch Jackson: Exactly. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): But she shared with me this song and this man's voice was beautiful. And the lyrics were on point. And I said, Who is this? Doop doop doop doop doop doop doop doop. AI. Dutch Jackson: I know man. I know. I know, man. Cause you know, you know what, man? This this is what a lot of creators don't get. The normal consumer don't give a fuck if it's AI or not. It's just creators. We fighting amongst each other. that that ain't the way to do it. That ain't the way to do it. Average consumer don't give a. They don't care. They well if it look good, it Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): They don't. Hey, I'ma go I'ma go even further. The average business owner doesn't give a flying fuck. They wanna know, hey, I have a certain amount of time and I have a certain amount of budget. Can you do it? And if you don't Dutch Jackson: Yes. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Find somebody else to do it. You need to understand when good enough is good enough. Dutch Jackson: Yes. Yeah. So people we like you say, we creators, we fighting amongst man, amongst the AI and amongst the original and then the manual. That's a bunch of creators. You know, the average person, Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: shit, man, they don't give a damn about how some Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): They don't care. They don't care how long it takes for me to edit a travel video. They don't give a shit that it took me a month and a half for a 35 minute video about getting scuba certified. They watch it, they're like, cool, they push. They don't sit there and they ask, wow, what equipment did you use? How long did it take for you to edit this video? How do you find music for this thing? Da da da da. They don't give a shit about none of that. Dutch Jackson: all I wanna see using a one point four lens on this. This looks like a one shit, his aperture. Hey man, his eyes saw this thing's a Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): There your aperture is always on point. Dutch Jackson: So I've so I've been really good at reading. I've staying in my creative head, but still realizing to the public they don't give a fuck about certain shit. And a lot of times us as creators, we get in our own ways, you know, being so creative and man, I wonder people gonna think of this and think of that when they don't give a shit about nothing, you know. So that's been a hard thing for me to kind of do what I do what I really love to do, but still realize people don't give a fuck about a lot of shit. That's when my comment Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: comes in. At first, it just usually be what I wanted to do. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: But as creators, a lot of times we over people's heads, man. Because if I really Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: talked about what I wanted to talk about all the time and did what I wanted to do all the time, man, that shit'll be crazy. Cause I I I'm all about aliens and technology and I'm speaking of a you know what Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): For real, for real. Dutch Jackson: I mean? So for people to even enjoy my content, I gotta bring it down some, you know, I Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: gotta come down to that level because a lot of people just don't care about a lot of shit, man. You know. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Have you ever heard of that dude Beeple? B E E P L E Beeple? Dutch Jackson: I haven't heard of him. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): He he's some artist. I think he's from Wisconsin. Dutch Jackson: Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): and he like his his claim to fame is he'll create a piece of artwork every day. And he started he started doing it as a challenge. I think he wanted to do it for like a month and that turned into a year. That turned into it's been a long time now. Dutch Jackson: A piece of art every day. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. But like not just like a little drawing, like a fully rendered kind of thing. And he was doing things like I wanna say he was using Blender, maybe not, but he was using some sort of 3D package to Dutch Jackson: Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): create these things. And it's and it's you know, it's outlandish, really wild shit. His h he popped in my head 'cause of what you said, like you're all over the place. and that's okay. I think that's that's what as as you know, older me looking at little younger brother being like, it's okay to be weird. Like Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): we're at the point now where where people are coming to you to see how you do things. You know? So if you're weird and outlandish and and and for and for the fans Be open minded. Like it it ain't always gonna make sense. Like Dutch Jackson: No. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): we're just translating we're translating thoughts into something that you can understand. And not all of them are gonna hit. Dutch Jackson: No, no. You were super wacky. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Sometimes they're gonna be wacky. Dutch Jackson: No, super wacky dude. Like I said, I go too far. I man, I don't I can't I don't even have like friends that I can conversate stuff with anymore because my my mind is so far out there, but I realize my mind has always been out there. I just Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: I've been holding back to the world. And now we at an age where you don't have to hold back. Almost the weirder you are, the better it is. Cause I think a lot of people look at me and they be like, Man, damn, I wish I could be weird me. You get to be weird. I want to be weird me, Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. Dutch Jackson: man. I gotta put on this mask that I don't like watching cart at cartoons from the eighties and reminiscing on Tecmo Bowl and Tiger Hand games. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Blowing into the cartridges. Now they got now they got downloadables. That's all they got. No more blowing into cartridges. Dutch Jackson: That's whack. That's the bro to go to the store and get the game and ride home. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And bump into people that you know like that or maybe not know, but at least you have you have a shortcut to building Dutch Jackson: Yes. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): a relationship with someone because gaming is a thing that you can talk about. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. It is okay to be yourself. I'ma stop saying weird. I'ma stop saying strange. Okay to be yourself, man. We came up. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right, right, right. Right. And to express yourself. And this is a like, so I live in California and supposedly we got a we got a monopoly on supposedly crazy people. It's just the expression. Some people wanna make movies, some people wanna make drawings, some people wanna pierce their shit, some people want to color their hair. Hey, and I'ma go as far as this. Some people that live over in Florida, over by the orange clown's house, they express Dutch Jackson: Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): themselves by stretching them fucking faces and making their lips big as shit. That's an expression. To me, in my brain, there's no difference. From people out here living their life as their natural self, whether you're gay or you're trans or anything like that, there's no difference from them than those idiots over there in Palm Beach. It's the same Dutch Jackson: No. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): shit. Dutch Jackson: It's all expression, man. And Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): It's all expression. Dutch Jackson: guess what? It ain't got shit to do with you. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): At all. Dutch Jackson: So Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Change his channel. Dutch Jackson: You know I mean like man if you don't let people be people and shut up. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: That I I don't understand it, man. That's why I say I judge people off how people treat me. I don't give a fuck if you was a gr a gray alien, a sloth, a Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Exactly. If a sloth brought his slow crawlin's ass over and started talking shit, I will punch a sloth dead in his face. Dutch Jackson: slot up. You know me? These are the principles I live by, man. Like Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Hell yeah. Dutch Jackson: me with respect. I treat you with respect. Your lifestyle nothing to do Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): One hundred percent. Wanna be in my movie? That's Dutch Jackson: You know, Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: that's that's how I that's how I live life, man. I just I worry about my happiness and I love to see other people having their happiness and I promote that. Be happy, man. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Same. Yeah. Dutch Jackson: Life's short as hell. Like, man. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): in a blink of an eye. Dutch Jackson: And then you get to your forties and fifties, and you see you you got you have friends dropping off, they do something to you too. Well Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. Dutch Jackson: you man, fuck I'm not worried about. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And then you start reflecting, you start reflecting on you remember how we were talking about putting in all that time in corporate America? We didn't even touch traffic. How much life is wasted sitting in traffic? And then that's just to get to this bitch that you don't want to be at in the first place. And then they whip your ass for at least eight hours, and then you gotta sit in traffic. And this is LA. I've sat in traffic in LA for two, three hours. And that's just to get there. Dutch Jackson: yeah, brother, you are so also you are you close to LA still now? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I'm up north. I'm closer to San Francisco. Yeah. Dutch Jackson: Closer to San Francisco. Okay. I got family in LA, man. We're gonna have to we're gonna have to meet up, man. I'm out there a lot. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I go down there I go down there all the time. Dutch Jackson: Okay. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, yeah, yeah. I got family down there. I got close friends down there. I still go down there quite a bit. So yeah, like we'll we'll connect connect. Yeah, yeah, yeah. We got shit we got shit to do. Dutch Jackson: Definitely. Most definitely. Okay. Yeah, we got to now. background with what I know how to do, we got shit to do. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Fuck yeah. Sprinkle in some rookie boy It's a wrap We Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Yes. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): gotta catch you up on some of the shit we've been working on too, man. Dutch Jackson: Yeah man, you guys your your your group is new to me. but what I've beaten you make meeting rook, I'm like, damn, this my circle, 'cause I don't it's hard to find my circle, man, 'cause I it's it's a lot. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. Right. Listen, I live I live in the country. I live in the country. And everybody's like, damn, Carlos is always creating videos. I'm like, what else do you want me to do? I live in the country. There's only so many times I'm gonna chess check the compost pile. Dutch Jackson: Exactly. But that's man, living in a country though, I mean and this is off s off topic, but dude, at this age, having your peace is everything. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, yeah, one hundred percent. One hundred percent. One hundred percent. Dutch Jackson: Is everyone? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): 'cause now I can focus. I can focus and actually work and actually put in the work that it needs to like build this momentum. Cause listen, you guys, black and brown community, they're not coming to help us. They're doing everything within their power to take it away. So, like I told Rookie, like I told another friend of mine, Nancy, so we're building in the daylight. And if you touch it, you will be punished. We tried to work for corporate America and you continued to push us out. We tried to bring our talents. We tried to do all those things. So now we're gonna do it for ourselves. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Now we're gonna do it for ourselves. Like I said, I'm hell bent on having my name on the door. That's the focus. And like you keep saying, time flies. Just yesterday. Just yesterday I remember being in film school. And the day before that, I remember seeing graffiti on the walls in the streets of Chicago when I was walking to school. Just yesterday all these things happened. Time flies. Dutch Jackson: I just had a bad jheri curl. It was What I tell you, man. Man, I had to fuck man, it the shit wouldn't curl up. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Well listen. Dutch Jackson: It didn't curl, so I went to school with straight hair, I had to tell everybody I was Native American and shit. Like, yeah, man, you know, sometimes my Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: sometimes it doesn't, you know what I mean? And Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: yeah, man. Time time flies, man. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Explain to me, 'cause I I I'm glad I'm glad you said that, 'cause I've never Why a Jerry Curl? That shit was messy. Dutch Jackson: Man Hey man LA, dude, the West Coast had to influence, especially in the Midwest. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: Man, we weren't LA Kings, Trent Colts, started coats, and Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: we got the curls, and we just trying to imitate LA. You know, the Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Okay. Dutch Jackson: culture. So we man, DJ Quick, NWA, they hit the Midwest, whatever. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, Easy E did have his shit. Dutch Jackson: See, I give it up to Chicago. Chicago, you guys music scene, because I didn't realize how big Chicago was. I didn't realize Chicago Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: was really New York in the Midwest, right? St. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. Dutch Jackson: Louis is very small, so we never had our own identity. We always adopted what was big and mainstream. You Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: know, the West Coast head, the East Coast head. You know, we had time where everybody was in Tim's, you know, and we just a gap. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): You go you had your you had your minute. You had your minute where everybody had a little band aid under their you know, their cheek. You had the minute Dutch Jackson: Yeah. I was already in my 20s. You know, when that happened, we did have a we had a little minute where we finally got our own identity with Nelly. And but before then, man, we was taking everything the mainstream was giving us. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Dutch Jackson: Yeah, man. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): There's a there's y you know, the there was a couple girls I thought looked cute with Jerry Crow, you know. You know. I was like, okay, cool. So you know, you let a couple of things slide, but then you're just like Why you ruining my Dutch Jackson: Okay. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): seats? Like like Dutch Jackson: Jerry Curl. For sure, the Jerry Curl didn't last that long, man. The Jerry Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): No. Dutch Jackson: Curl was a good five to ten after everybody caught on like, nah, this ain't it. You know what I mean? It didn't last. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Especially down in LA. Could you imagine the heat? Imagine being a hundred and ten degrees and you got Jerry Curl. Dutch Jackson: Right. Sweating activator. That's crazy. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, you got that sizzling sound. Dutch Jackson: yeah. But Jerry Curl, man. Wow. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): That is a throwback. Dutch Jackson: We need to I need to research where the Jerry Curl came from, man. Like, now that Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I know. Dutch Jackson: we talk about it, like what made gangsters hey man, I'm finna just you know, let it Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I'm gonna relax my curl and now I'm gonna put juice on it. I'm gonna put gonna put Dutch Jackson: Yeah. The Cherry Crow documentary by Dud Jackson. I'm a see that's the shit Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I'm in. I'm in. Let's do it. Dutch Jackson: That's the shit I would watch. If I'm on YouTube, Jerry Curl. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: watching this shit. And this those scenes, Carlos, it's those things that people don't think about with that that give you advantage online. This crazy conversation, man, we did the documentary documentary of the Jericho. It's so different. It's like it's like what? People Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: wanna watch this shit because I people really are tired of what they're seeing, man. Like same, like you said before. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. It was like the same thing. Dutch Jackson: I'm sick of it. I can't take it no more, man. I start Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: creating, I start creating the things I started creating with strange fruit because I was just tired of seeing the same shit. I was like, man, let me create something different. You know? and I Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: think if more of us start creating what we wanted to see, things will get a lot more interesting. Because Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I agree. Dutch Jackson: you you will be surprised who wanna see the same shit you want to see. You know? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Right. And there's some people that are and there's some people like there's some people that'll just window shop too. You know what I mean? Yeah. Dutch Jackson: Yeah, yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Come take a look. If it don't fit, like come back later. I'ma have something new. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Yeah, man. I'm telling you, it's this is the time, man. I love it. Well Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: one of my favorite movies, have you seen Step Brothers with Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yes, sir. Will Farrell and what's his name? Not George Dutch Jackson: I forgot I forgot his name. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): C. Scott, but anyway, yeah, yeah, yeah. Dutch Jackson: But one of my favorite lines, the guy says is, What's better at having it at 13? Having it at 40 You know. That's one of my favorite lines because he's right. Like, man, if I had this shit when I was a kid, I would love it. But going all this time with just having imagination makes it ten times better now. You know what I mean? Because learning the manual way, learning the way to do it the hard way, you know, so valuable. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): That is so important to being creative. If you're constantly on Instagram, constantly on YouTube, constantly online, constantly tapped in like that, your brain is just going to regurgitate the same shit that you've been watching. Turn it off. Go outside. Let yourself be bored and see what happens. Dutch Jackson: Boredom is the key, man. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: Boredom. Get off this shit, man. It's the imagination, man. They people don't have it anymore. Their Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: imagination is given to them by these platforms. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Exactly. Dutch Jackson: You know, you know how many times a day I watch the same clip with different people doing trends. I see a clip that I think was funny. I'm like, that was a funny clip. But then I'm seeing other people just steal the idea of that clip. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: Other people, that's all the internet is. They just steal like Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: content. That's why I ain't on it like that. I post and get off, man. I'd say what I'm doing at that minute and I go back to creating everything off. Writing me a story, thinking about a film, a short film, thinking about something I've never seen before. What I want to see something I've never seen before. You know, and I'm creating for me things I've never seen before. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Let's talk about your process. How do you come up with an idea and then how do you foster that idea? Dutch Jackson: Well, first of all, I'm a nut and ideas run through my mind all day. Dude, my wife Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, I'm telling you. Dutch Jackson: can stand me. I man, I've been like Dude, Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): We were separated at birth. Dutch Jackson: I can't control it, man. When I tell you, I have to control myself because I come up with twenty, twenty, thirty ideas a day. So to be the idea that really, really sticks out. I'm like, okay. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: Write that down. I gotta make a note. I do that all Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Yeah. Dutch Jackson: the time, man. I'm just full of ideas and I go off of what is it? I prioritize. Okay, this I could do this, I could do this, you know. Cause now with the with the AI age, I've become a program developer now, app developer. You know? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yes. I wanted to get into that too, yeah. Dutch Jackson: Yeah, a lot cause a lot of things I'm learning, just like when you said writing the ISO down. I'm being creative, but I'm starting to figure out, damn, I can create an app to help me do that. I can create an app to help me do this. I can create an app. So it's making my process a lot easier. And I'm starting to build work. It used to take me two weeks to do a a episode. Now it takes me three days. because I'm building things to help my process. You know. I just I come up with stuff, I I I put put notes down and I prioritize what I want to build. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, I have I have a system on my phone. It's notes and reminders. I have an iPhone. And Dutch Jackson: Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): when I figured out that you can attach reminders to notes and vice versa, boy. Dutch Jackson: You know, 'cause you know how many million dollar ideas you done just forgot about. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): This is how I describe my ideas. Like this is how I describe my brain and how they interact with ideas, right? In Star Wars, you know when they hit the light speed and the stars turn into those lines and they go like this, Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): right? For me, that's that's what I see every day. Like all day long, is like these ideas are those stars and they're just whipping like this. Dutch Jackson: Mm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And then I and then I joint, I slow down, I grab Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): one, I put it in the chamber, I put it in the machine, and then it just goes like this. And then I work on this one until it's done. Or I work on it plus like three or four other things. Cause I'm I always have dishes spinning. yeah. And then I just go from there. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Damn. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): But that's a like when you have a brain like this, if you have a creative slash ADHD brain, one of the biggest things that you can teach yourself is focus. And sometimes you need exterior assistance. Sometimes you just need to sit down and shut the fuck up and get to work. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Damn, so you got the ADH crazy brain too. Man, that is man, it is a gift and Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): It's a superpower. Dutch Jackson: it is due. I'm telling you. I was I'm in here, so I'm creating courses now. Right? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Nice. Dutch Jackson: I'm creating a course, and while I'm creating the course. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Real quick so we don't forget where where can people find these courses? Dutch Jackson: Well look, Dutch Jackson, everything is at Dutch Jackson. Look me Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Okay. Dutch Jackson: up. Instagram, TikTok, Facebook, YouTube, everything is Dutch Jackson. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Okay. Dutch Jackson: you gonna see the ADHD shit the minute you find me. So just know that down. You know what I mean? Like don't even it's that's what it is, you know. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: But like I say, I just create, I just create I'm addicted to creating. I'm addicted Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Same. Dutch Jackson: to turning an idea into something physical. It's an addiction of me. It's an addiction of mine and I've embraced it and yeah, that's what you get from me. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And it is what it is. We keep it pushing. Dutch Jackson: Some stick is stick. If it don't, I'll enjoy it. You know? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. When you're developing a story, is there a set way you develop the story? Are you right from right from beginning to end or can you like write the parts in the middle and then just put it together? Dutch Jackson: You know what? I start from the beginning. That's how I used to write raps. Like now I've been writing raps so long, I write my stories the same way. You know, first of all, a crazy idea come and it have to be interesting enough for me to write a write a story about it. and I wanna run a story by you too when we get off of here, which is fucking crazy. I love to have your expertise on it and your Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, yeah, yeah. Dutch Jackson: yeah guy. But I just write from beginning to end. But if I start writing a story, the idea of the story is what make me write it in the first place. I say, Man, I got this idea. This shit is crazy. Cause and then I just start from front all the way till I get to the end, man. I d like I said, I don't have the training of being a movie creator and the different processes that probably make me better, I just go from where I what I know. I just started, you know, from what I know. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): From what I've what I've noticed is that it's not necessarily better, it's just different. Dutch Jackson: Mm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Some people shop at Best Buy, some people shop at Circuit City. They're not around anymore, but whatever. Dutch Jackson: I say it all the time. Like, that's not around anymore. I'm like, yeah, Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): We all heads. Dutch Jackson: you're right. So I don't I'm living in the nineties, man. My bad. Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah, 'cause at the end of the day, I know a lot of people that work in Hollywood and they know the process, but they don't get anything done. You you live in the process. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I know people I know people that are self proclaimed independent musicians but refuse to they went to school to learn this one thing and that's all they wanna do. And I'm like, no, independent means you do all the work until Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): further notice. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): So what good is what good is knowing a the process if you ain't getting things done? Dutch Jackson: Yeah man. I mean, we talked about public schooling and how they trained us to need people to survive, to need a job. There's a lot of creative people. Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Mm hmm. To to ask for jobs and they don't teach you how to make the jobs. Dutch Jackson: And unfortunately, it's a lot of creatives with the same mind. They're good at creating, but somebody got to tell them what to create and what to create it for. So some people are good at just being a pianist to be told, play these keys. So people like us don't get the credit. Just because you're a creator, make you the mind to want to create your own. Like you said, it's Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: a lot of talented people. Who know how to do it but won't do it. So those are different categories. You got your creator who can but gotta be told to create. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: But then you got your creators who can't stop creating. That's what I am. Like I tell me shit that you know. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Me too. Yeah. There's a there's I don't know what it's I don't know the proper word for it, but story, a lesson, whatever you want to call it. But there's a tale been told about a pottery class that was split into two. You had the one half, they were told you're gonna research. You're gonna research how to make the most beautiful perfect pot. And then the other half was told make fucking pots. And then at the end of it, for your final, everyone is gonna get together, you're gonna do the pots, you're gonna make the pots, and then you'll be graded. accordingly. Everyone Dutch Jackson: Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): who just rolled up their sleeves and got in there and started making pots their pots were better. It doesn't matter the research that you do. You gotta get your hands dirty. If you're trying to make things, you have to get your hands dirty and just keep making them. And understand Dutch Jackson: Press. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): and understand and I'll shut up for a second after this. Understand that Dutch Jackson: yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): when you make something and you put it on social media, if it's in the beginning parts of it, that's just where you are. People might you can make the b you can make the most perfect movie. My favorite movie is Disney's Robin Hood. You know how many people Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): hate that fucking movie? It to me is perfect. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. They go yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): They're gonna say it. They're gonna say it. It don't matter. Dutch Jackson: It don't matter. Nothing matters, bro. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: Like nothing. People that's why I say you have to create for you. Like it's Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: like art for me. I I'm I'm this is my art. I'm putting out an expression of me. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): This is where I am at this time and place, at this moment. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): This is where I am. Dutch Jackson: My give a fuckness of people thoughts just went out the window. That's all we did. We had to you know, perception. my perception Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: be this way. My percep I don't give a fuck what your perception is of me no more. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: And that helps you create. Like you said, the people in that pot class, just create. They shit was better than the other side. Man, let me create no restrictions. Let me do my thing and I'm gonna do I'm gonna do the best work. you know, that I can that I believe that to my capabilities. But man. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. And that blends in perfectly with rich dad, poor dad. Blends in perfectly. Hand and glove. Go read that book, Dutch Jackson: Handy. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): you guys. I'm telling you Dutch Jackson: Wait. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): you're gonna show up with a attitude on Monday morning and be like, fuck this place Dutch Jackson: And look, and if you don't have time, right. I'll be lying to you. And and the thing is, poor dad, man, I know so many poor dads in my life. Like Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: All my friends that think like poor dad. Like all everybody, you know. So guys, read the book and you can go on YouTube and put on the audio book. That's how I read it. Because I was Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): nice. Dutch Jackson: I just went to YouTube, put on the audio book, and listened as I drove, went to work, listened to it as I worked out, listened to it as and and you know, I retained it like that, but man, yeah, it changed my life. Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Let's get into how did you how did you start playing with AI? What tool did you start with? What tool are you working with now? How long ago Dutch Jackson: so Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): how long ago was it that you started Dutch Jackson: This was about a year and a half ago. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Okay. Dutch Jackson: About a year and a half ago. I was working overnights, and a friend sent me a music video. I had done a song with him like years ago. He sent me a music video in the middle of the night, and I was in it. This completely fucked me up, man. I was at work. I almost he sent me a music video. I'm in a suit rapping. I'm like, what the hell is this? My rap career was over. But now I'm in this music video with Lamborghinis and hoes and everything. I say, hey boom. You just I'm talking, I couldn't even work no more, man. It blew my mind that something I thought was dead was alive right there in front of my face, like a video. So then he told me to get Suno. Suno is a music creation app. I got Two to three hundred, two to five hundred songs that I've been recording at home that I never put out, rap songs. So when I got Suno, I started feeding Suno my old songs, and Suno was remix remixing them. I was just like, what in the world? Updating songs from the early 2000s, you know, it's a shit sounding like 2025, 2026. And I it blew my mind. I say, So you telling me all these old ideas, I can remake all my old ideas and make them into something? Because the ideas to me were always good, but I never could get it to that polished $10,000 session sound, $20,000 session. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: But with AI, it remixed these old songs and made them sound expensive. And when I heard them remix, I said, Dog, this is a hit today. I'm like, I wonder how many hits I got. So it started with music. And I started remixing all my shit. Like, we just remixing songs, remixing. And I thought, I was like, you know what? AI is gonna bring my music career back. Now I'm gonna be heard in the way that I always heard it in my head. So I started doing all my songs, remixing all my songs with AI. One thing they don't tell you though when you get into AI, it's a rabbit hole. I'm like, okay, so now I can remix AI. Damn, he put me in a music video. So I learned how to remix my music and now create myself in music videos. Man, I can make me anything. I can make, I can recreate it, I can have this passion back. So then I went from music to video. And as I start creating rap videos for myself. Start experimenting doing other type of videos. And then I was like, man, wait a minute. If I can make video anything I want, I'm like, I can make a movie. So it kept you know, I'm thinking of the AI for one thing, music, but it just grew like, wait a minute, why movie? I can create a series and a TV shows and That's where it starts spewing from, you know, but it all started with the music. Grew, it grew, and it's still growing today on the things that I can create. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And this is something that that I've been trying to share with people that I know in the creative Dutch Jackson: Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): community, specifically my friends that are rappers and producers and all that stuff. I say I understand that you're trying to sell music to for movies and stuff like that, but there's some of us in the grind that are making movies that we can use your music in. I have a film I have a film that has two Chicago artists. One of them is Rita J and the other one is a a group called Rubber Room. Reached out to them. They said, Yeah, use it for the film. Now I have a film that was in film festivals and now it's featuring some of my friends' music. I can go Dutch Jackson: Mm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): to Epidemic Sound. I can go to Suno. I can I I've never been to Suno, but that's impressive. But When I tell you that I there's this it people like Dutch and I, we're going to be making shit no matter what. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): If this whole fucking thing explodes and we're out here with sticks and fire, we're going to make something. Dutch Jackson: Yes. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I want to work with you because you're my people. Because I want to bring light to the work that you're also doing. Because that's how we're going to get through this together. Let's go make some cool shit. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. The industry ain't fuck with us. You know what I mean? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah Yeah How hard do I have to work to fit in the industry? It's obvious they don't want me there. It's obvious Fine, Dutch Jackson: Yes. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I'll bu I'll build my own. Thanks for the tools. Dutch Jackson: And you gotta think about it. Exactly. The industry don't do nothing but take shit that's people built and build on top of it anyway. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. Right. You want to talk about gatekeepers. They're not trying to tell our stories. Look how hard look how hard Peel I can't remember his his first name right now. Dutch Jackson: Jordan Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Jordan. Look how hard Jordan Peel has had to work just to make black people music or movies. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. And they wanted that to fail. He didn't get the biggest Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And they wanted that. Dutch Jackson: the biggest budget, you know, like get that shit out. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. They told him he said he said I knew I had to get go into directing and and producing movies for myself when they offered me the Mr. Potato Head role. He said ain't no fucking way. Dutch Jackson: Yeah, that's I'm telling you, man. It don't stop. People think it stops at Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I don't know what yeah. Dutch Jackson: some levels. It doesn't, man. It's the shit. You're gonna get shit as far as you go up as long as it ain't for you and your business and your purpose. You're gonna always run into shit, man. Always. Nowhere. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Always. Always. And don't be making don't be don't make decisions with your career and your life based off of someone else's opinion or someone else's bag or someone else's anything. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Cause what we've learned is right when they find out a cheaper way to do it, they're gonna do it. Dutch Jackson: Yes. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): It's either gonna be the Mexicans that are coming to cut the grass. And take all the apple picking jobs, everyone's gonna be upset. Now we have, now we've learned that there's a lot of Indian folks and Chinese folks that are taking all the technology jobs. You guys, they're not hiring people. I live an hour and a half away from Silicon Valley. They don't hire Americans unless you're white, then you get to be a project manager. Dutch Jackson: This I know I know man. It's shit. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): We have to build our own industry. Dutch Jackson: We we got to. We got to. I d I did, I took and a lot of people not really aware because they didn't teach it, but I went to Oklahoma a couple of weeks ago and I went to Greenville Avenue and this is where Black Wall Street was. And a lot of guys don't are not familiar with Black Wall Street. It was a town in Oklahoma they called Black Wall Street. Because it was a town full of blacks and they were like wealthy blacks. What happened was, I've been doing research because I'm about to do some episodes on it. They redlined these black people in this Oklahoma town. They redlined them. All right, y'all can't leave this area. But what they didn't realize, they redlined them on land with oil. So they locked them in. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: Land were oil. We bought the oil. We got rich. We built banks, hotels, everything. Since it was redline, the money stayed in the community. They didn't even, we couldn't, they couldn't spend it if they wanted to. That's what created them. That's what got them rich. The money circulated, stayed in the community. Of course, they came, it was burned down because The others finally came up with a reason to come take it back. You know, Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: it was burned down, but a lot of times in the stories, they don't realize that Black Wall Street came back better than it was before. And it's the reason they don't talk about this. That couldn't stop Black Wall Street. But I'm gonna tell you what stopped Black Wall Street: desegregation. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: Money left. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: That's what killed Black Wall Street. So until we can start circulating money within us, spending with us, not spending with the industry, we'll never have our freedom if we do not support each other and spend with each other, man. so yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. And think of it like getting even more philosophical with it. If it's only the people with money that get to tell the stories When does your story kick in? So like in a hundred years, all we're gonna hear about is the Trumps and the Kushners and all these guys? But what about like we're here too? Like I take it personally when I look at Star Trek and they don't have fucking Puerto Ricans and Cubans and that bitch. You're not planning for us? Okay, cool. We're gonna make our own goddamn Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): spaceship. Dutch Jackson: Yes. Yes. That's the man. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Fuck you bitch, you ain't leaving me here by myself. Dutch Jackson: Yeah, and and that's why I make, you know, the episodes of Strange Fruit I make where the little white girl is holding a black Barbie down. Like I flipped, I switched worlds in one of my episodes because all I was used to seeing is something one type of way. And we had a point now where you can create anything you want, man. I'm tired of seeing what I've been seeing my whole life. I want to see what I see. Just like four Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: poor reads. So you know what I'm Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. Dutch Jackson: who wouldn't watch that? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. Dutch Jackson: Who wants to see that but don't know they wanna see that? You know what I mean? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. How do you know This the this is my other thing that I always tell creatives. Don't hesitate to make. Don't hesitate to fail. Don't hesitate to do any of that stuff. Cause number one, you're just you're building up your skills. All the mistakes you make today, you're not gonna make tomorrow. Then How do you expect people to know what to look for or what to like or whatever if they haven't seen what you're trying to make? They haven't seen your story. Dutch Jackson: Exactly. Exactly. Yeah. Most people don't even know what they want. They're giving until they see it. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. Until they see it. How many tim you're you're you're you're a creative. How many times have you heard someone say whether it's I don't know if you get into like making logos or d website designs. I don't know how deep your creativity goes, but how many times have you heard someone say, I don't know what I'm looking for, but I'll know it when I find it? Dutch Jackson: Everybody. It's very rare that somebody can tell me what to create. I was in a Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Imagine pitching boondocks. All right, look, it's gonna be like it's gonna be like Brady Bunch, but the two little kids are are are like Michael from good times. They're very educated, very smart in black things, and they're gonna be talking mad shit not just about the white community, but they're also gonna reflect on the black community too and kind of call folks out on the black community. People are gonna be like, nah, fuck that. No. Dutch Jackson: Yeah, you ain't doing that shit. You all you you trying as banned. Like Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): No. Two little big hat boys talking shit. Nah, we good. Meanwhile, is what is what one of my favorite comics. One of my favorite cartoons. One of my favorite topics of discussion. It's so good. Dutch Jackson: Man. man. Like I say, I and this innovative, man. We like I say, coming from a world we came from when it was so many innovators, like you couldn't sound the same. You got called out for being the same. Like, Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. Dutch Jackson: no, this shit sounds like this. Move on, man. I wanna hear that. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, get out here. Biter. Dutch Jackson: So we strive we had to strive to be different. And Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. Dutch Jackson: now it's funny how time how things come back around to we're we're there again. I mean, in the mainstream, you see a lot of people copying. And I know how to go viral copying what everybody else doing. But I I quick I quickly stopped doing that because I realized I was getting a large following, but it wasn't a loyal following. Because they could find this shit Everywhere. Same thing on Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: my channel is on a other thousand channels. So the minute I say, hey guys, hey, you guys like me, I got a million views on this bodies, crickets. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: I'm gonna buy from you from you just doing what everybody else is doing. That made me realize it ain't how many people that watch is who watches. Because you can make a living having three to five thousand followers online Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: if they're royal, you know what I mean. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, listen, Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I remind people there is a girl out here on the internet selling farts in a jar. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): You mean to tell me I can't write a little story get a little attention? You I farting in a jar, my guy? They got girls out here selling bath water. Dutch Jackson: Yes. Yeah. It it it is who your loyal followers. My wife is a professional artist and she don't she doesn't cater to nobody. She do what she loves. She don't care about what you Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): What's her website so people can follow up with her? Dutch Jackson: at Candy Apple Tree with a K. So Candy. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Candy apple tree. Dutch Jackson: She's an artist, man, and Her following, I got like I got a lot of followers, but these are years of me doing imitation shit a lot of times, you know? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: So my high amount of followers equals nothing to her low amount of loyal followers. I'm seeing the difference. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: Like those loyal followers, that's what's important. Forget everybody else. Make something, create something. Let your tribe find you. Because there's other people who think like you think. You just don't know. And Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: it's people that'll love your work. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): One hundred percent. Dutch Jackson: But people understand, and even if they don't know it when they're watching it, people can read with somebody authentic over the screen. They be like, man, this got something about this person, you know? So do yourself a favor, man. Give yourself a fucking chance on your ideas. What you got to lose? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. And understand that everything ain't for everybody. And it's cool. And Dutch Jackson: And it's cool. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): it's cool. But there's so many people in this planet you just don't know. Like what was it? David Hasselhoff, if you remember him. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): When he was when he was, you know, like the he was hot shit back in the day, but then like he turned into just kind of like an another normal just dude. You know what I mean? He was an actor and shit like that, but he just he wasn't he wasn't like Tom Cruise kinda, right? Dutch Jackson: Right. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Meanwhile in Germany, this motherfucker came out with the album and was killing it. You don't know where your audience is. You have to give them time to find you. Dutch Jackson: Yes. People cheese selling farts in a jaw. You know what I mean? Like Give yourself a chance, man. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Another thing I wanted to make sure that I talked to you about, I saw you developing games and shit. Dutch Jackson: Yeah, well i I haven't developed developed the game yet, but I'm Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: at the idea I am about to develop a a game called Slaps, where I slap the shit out of people. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): That series of short boy Dutch Jackson: I have a I have a foodie series where I go in restaurants and I eat and the food's so good I start slapping the shit out of everybody and I use AI to do it. And I don't know where this idea came from. I was actually just eating in a restaurant. I go out, me and my wife go eat a lot. And I was like, man, this damn pork stuff's so good. Well I should slap the shit out this. I should slap the shit out of the cook. So me one night, I'm at home, you know, I'm making AI music video. I'm like, you know what? I can make a video of me stopping the shit out the cook. Won't I try? made the episode, people start going crazy. Like I said, people don't know what they like until they see. Well, I Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I'm telling you that shit. Dutch Jackson: don't so I'm starting to develop a game called Slaps. You know what I'm saying? Where you could like a mobile app where you could put your head on the body or you could play as me. We're walking through and it's gonna look like I might have to look like Kung Fu or some old shit or something, you Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: know. Slapping, you know, slapping people around, but that's just the age we in where I can literally create everything I like to do. I ain't gotta use nobody else's shit no more. I can create my own games, I can create my own apps, and I I I I I recently just completed an application for my AI video creations. So I created my own software to make AR films. And that came from me spending so much money using this tool and that tool and this tool. So Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: I put it together. Got on ChatGPT and Claude. I want to build my own software. And took a little bit of coding that Claude and Chat took me through. It wasn't super easy, but a little bit of coding here and there, built the platform, and that, you know, functions perfectly. And I save a lot of money. Using my own software. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And and for folks that think that this is cheating, this isn't this isn't cheating. I worked in the game industry as well. they there's such a thing number one, there's different levels. There's such a thing as vaporware. And that's vaporware is you kind of starting a development process and you have a little bit put together. Dutch Jackson: Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And then you go to money people and you pitch them, hey, this is what this is the idea, this is the software, and this is a little bit that we have, and it boom. And then you see if they get bought up or not. So then you have different levels of that. Dutch Jackson: Gar to Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): So this thing that you're doing, you're just basically you're creating a playable demo. Dutch Jackson: Yes. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): That you can then show money people. But the cool thing is, if you show money person and they're like, nah, we good, you can still go back to the not the drawing board, but you go back into your lab and you'd be like, All right, fine, I finish this bitch by myself. The cool thing is, Dutch Jackson, is not only do I have a background in creativity, but I also have a background in programming. Dutch Jackson: Yes. It's the crazy thing. And and and like you said, even if people say, fuck your idea. We don't we don't need that. Guess what? It's still making my workflow better. Because I'm creating these apps to help me and my creative process. If if people want to buy them, that's cool. But it's still helping so it's a it's a win-win for me anyway. It's still Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: helping my process. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And again, if you think that he's cheating for using AI, I know some folks in Hollywood that have built their own apps for storyboarding and all that shit. Dutch Jackson: Hey. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): They're using it, they're just not saying that they're using it. Dutch Jackson: No. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Just like you said, they've been using AI and and movies for a long time. Dutch Jackson: I got a friend who he's in a music industry. He said, hey man, they've been using Suno since like 2013. He told me this. So what they were doing, they were letting the software build the song, Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: and then having the real artists sing what the software created. See, right now it's the other way around. Now Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: you program Suno and the AI sings it, wraps it. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: They've been using technology to have the advantage. Like this is nothing new, you know? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: So it's almost like big tobacco industry coming out on alcohol or other different things that people could be addicted to. to, you know, I don't know where I went with this. I just went blank. It's the ADHD. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, it happens. Dutch Jackson: Okay, I forgot. Next. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): It happens. People watching this podcast right now, they're like, Yep, got him too. They've seen me do that shit. And sometimes I'll try to like I'm like, all right, fine, I'm gonna catch it back, I'm gonna catch it back and then like I'm like, I'm just digging the hole deeper. Let me just pull out. It's fine. Dutch Jackson: Here we go. Yeah, man. I i you know, I I just Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: everywhere my head been spinning since I've been on this talking with you, man. Like, it's really Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: a good thing, it's really an honor to meet other people that think like you. And I really think that while the internet and social media is in a stupid phase of a lot of stupidity being, you know, shown, it's also a stage where It's easier to find your tribe with so much dumb shit out. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: This is the time to find like-minded people because it's so social media is so duplicated. It's easy. This is different. man, it's you Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: know. So this is the time to be creative, man, and be you. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And and and stepping away from the established studio system, that's why A twenty four became so successful, 'cause they were doing shit differently. A twenty four went and said, What would happen if instead of the suits, we let the creative people make the decisions? And all of a sudden all these dope ass movies. Tell me X Machina didn't blow your mind. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Yes, because not Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: used to seeing this type of movie. It was different. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Uh-huh. Dutch Jackson: A twenty-four you could tell come from the creators. You know Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: what I mean? They ain't trying to water shit down. It's like it is. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Could you imagine? I I think this is a eight twenty four film, but when I I think it was Obsession when O boy went and licked the bottom of the bathtub. Dutch Jackson: What's that obsession? He licked the bottom of the bathtub. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Like it it was I forg Dutch Jackson: Should have been. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): it's the movie where where He was I think it was obsession because he was obsessed with wanting to be a part of this family, I believe. And he like really, really liked this dude, but then he really really liked the I don't know if it's the sister, the cousin, whatever. I it's been a minute since I saw him. But then he was thinking about them and he squeezed one out in the bathtub or something was Dutch Jackson: Mm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): happening. And then he was like, I have to watch it again to get grossed out again. But boy was at the drain just like licking the drain because the other guy had like Squeezed one out in the thumb. Imagine Dutch Jackson: Man Damn. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): trying to pitch that shit. Like, hey Hollywood. All right. And then th this one guy's gonna jerk off at the bathtub and then the other one's gonna come and like lick off the residue because he really likes him. Hollywood's gonna be like, What the fuck? Dutch Jackson: Yes. Yes, man. Hollywood has never been innovative. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): They don't yeah, they don't keep it pushing. Dutch Jackson: The music industry has never been innovative. They capitalize off the innovative. Capitalize off of creators. That's Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: why now it's so important because now you don't need anybody capitalizing off of you no more. You know what I mean? Create Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: until your fucking fingers fall off. Create until you can't Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: no more. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): salt burn. It was salt burn. My bad. Dutch Jackson: Sober. I've never seen that. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, that's a wild ass movie. That's a wild ass movie. Old boy goes down in the bathtub and starts looking at the drain, you're like, what the fuck? He did not just Yep, he's whoa, he's right there and he likes it. Wow. Dutch Jackson: Is that a eight tw is that an eight twenty four movie? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I don't know if it is Sawburn directed by Emerald Fennel. Where's my mouse? I'll find out, Dutch Jackson: That's Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): but yeah, anyway. What what happens is there's so much money behind all these projects in in Hollywood. Their teams are so big that the investment in in any project has so much money behind it that they have to be careful with it. They Dutch Jackson: Mm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): can't have a bomb because that you're gonna lose a lot of money. So that's why they're not taking chances on Dutch Jackson. That's why they're not taking chances on Co Carlos Gomez. Because that shit could be expensive. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): That's why they wait for you to build up your audience, you build your brand, you do all the things and they're like, hey, by the way, Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): let's see what you got. Dutch Jackson: We like what you're doing, man. We've been we're big fans. Man, please. That bag have to be so damn big. I'm so I'm so up on an independent tip at this point, bruh. Like, you're gonna have to give me a bag, bag, bag. Cause I already understand too much. I see you create something good. Just for for for instance, rappers. If you got a fan base of five to ten thousand people. And you live in comfortable off of that? Man, just continue to grow it. Live comfortable because once these people start giving you all this money, now they control you. They control your ideas. Now they're gonna say, Doug Jackson, you can't make a movie on that. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: And me being restricted as a creative, I might as well not be a creative at all. I can't be restricted. I can't stop my brain from wanting to make this project or The minute you start critiquing my projects and critiquing how I create, it's not my creation anymore. So yeah, the bag gotta be ridiculous for me to to to wanna sell the way I Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And even then I don't want you to tell me what the fuck to do. Dutch Jackson: No. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I don't need that. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I don't need that. Because if you knew what the fuck you were doing, you wouldn't have come to me in the first place. Dutch Jackson: And that's you. The people with the power, with the money comes and pays off the innovator for their ideas. That's been Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: the world since America started. Capitalized. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Look at products. Look at products. TVs, Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): furniture used to be made out of wood. Now everything is made out of plastic. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): They take they'll take your idea and then they'll shave and shave and shave and shave it down to something that they think is fits what they're wanting it to be and we good, son. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. I sued I sued ESPN like 10 Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): For real? Dutch Jackson: years ago. Yeah, they they I had a demo out. I had some I had like three or four songs and I gave it some some guy who was like, Yeah man, I give people placements and this and that and I guess I thought I didn't know what I was doing, if I was some new jack, I had been doing music for a long time. Dude, my my nephew calls me and said, Hey man, congratulations on making a new AN1 tape. This was back when AN1 was popping hot songs. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: And I'm like, What are you talking about? He's like, Yeah, your song's on the all on the AN1 song DVDs. I'm like, what? So I get the AN One DVD, and it's my song, I'm the greatest, under Lil' Scrappy. And I was like, What the hell? So I took it. I took it to a lawyer. I was like, hey, my songs are on this DVD, but it's under a different artist's name. Is is it anything I can do? And he was like, I guess, you know, entertainment lawyers heard stuff all the time. He was like, Okay, what did they steal? A phrase you said, was it the hook? Did the beat sound similar? I'm like, nah, bitch, it's me. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): My fucking song. Dutch Jackson: Dog, when he heard the the D V D and I played my song, instantly changed. Mr. Jackson, do you want some champagne, some lobster? like a champagne. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): They're about to get paid. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Audit for a while and ESPN was like, You know what? Instead instead of getting the money we can set you up with a meeting with Dre. I was like, fuck Dre. Give me my Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): With who? Dutch Jackson: money. Dr. Dre. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Is he bringing me a cheque? Dutch Jackson: What I'm gonna do have this meeting, y'all settle with Dr. Dre just so he can turn me down? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Huh. Dutch Jackson: Man, fuck Dre, give me my money. I fought man for nine months and I end up getting Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. I wouldn't have enough money to hang out with Dre whenever the fuck I want. Dutch Jackson: Got my you know, nice little hunk, paid some stuff off, man. It was a victory for me, man. But so a lot of people don't understand a lot of rappers. Your your sessions hold up in court is copyrighted. A lot of artists don't know that. So if you were hearing bigger artists, Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Free game right there. Dutch Jackson: yeah, you're hearing bigger artists, you're like, man, that's my idea. Okay, this. Go to an entertainment lawyer and make sure you have your session because that would save me. I can't fight against ESPN. My session, my Fruity Loop session or whatever it was back then, saved me in court. Yeah. Talking they looked at the timestamp. Can't have Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: those can't have those timestamps. All that shit y'all been hearing, or copyright, you gotta go through this, go through that. Another lie, they trying to take advantage of you, cause that that discouraged me. You know how many orders probably shit got stolen? They was Man, I can't fight Drake. Damn, I just lost. When you Could have went to court with your time stamp session. So just take that take that with ya. Take Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: with you. You know? So yeah, Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: that was that was crazy. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): That's the same way like back in the day they used to tell you when you have a cartoon character, mail it to yourself. You remember that? Mail it Dutch Jackson: Yeah, but how Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): to yourself. Dutch Jackson: to ourselves, we hey man, I melt that music. No, yeah, that man, please. Your session timestamp, your project timestamp. If somebody wants to steal one of my projects, if I'm seeing something similar to what I created and I see it, I'm taking that shit with my timestamps and I'm going to talk to somebody because those hold up. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Take that Jay Z. We don't need ten ninety nine to drop game. Dutch Jackson: Man, timestamps, man. That's why keep your sessions. Don't stop erasing beats and stop sending shit out and stop erasing songs. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: Hard drives are cheap now. And then now you Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Drives are cheap now. Dutch Jackson: now you could just I wouldn't I I keep a hard drive because I don't trust the cloud because shit, if you stop paying the cloud, you don't have access no more. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yo, I have a Synology. I have my own Google Drive. And I've been saving at and I don't I don't shoot at I shoot video at high quality. Dutch Jackson: Gigabyte or terabyte. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Gigabytes. And it's all on my Synology. Google don't have access to it. So if I don't feel like paying Google Drive prices, I don't pay Google Drive prices. Dutch Jackson: Exactly. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I have access, I can send people, I can send people links to people. I'll control all that shit. No, thank you. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): No, thank you. Cause now look Dutch Jackson: Yes. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): at, now look at. We're learning that they're going through and reading your mail and what's on the Google hard drive and all that stuff. They're reading all that shit. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): You have you guys have to remember, the c a couple years ago, Apple wanted to look through all your photos to see if you had what they considered kitty porn. Who the fuck are you d and again I I'm not I I'm totally against kid porn one hundred percent. One hundred percent. I'm not even I'm not trying to defend them. Only white people can be can be kiddie porn folks and and make it to the presidency. Only them. I have zero, zero interest in that life. Dutch Jackson: Right. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): But I'm saying is you can't look through my shit and then tell me what the fuck I'm thinking. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Yes. That's what the world is, man. That's that's what it is. Protect protect your thoughts, man. They shit on creatives and everything come from creators. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. I've been in conversations. I've I've been in the room. I'm I'm starting to tell I'm starting to snitch on everybody, man. I'm getting old and I'm running out of time, so I'm snitching on everybody. I have been Dutch Jackson: yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): in the room where they say he's a creative. He'll he'll he'll make sure to give you a good price. What? What? Okay. My good price is full price. Dutch Jackson: Right. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And if you don't like it, Okay. I got shit to do anyway. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): You're interrupting me. I'm trying to make movies and cartoons and shit. You're interrupting me. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. No, I'm in it, man. I I I all that low baller shit is over with me. Like Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: you're not paying my you're not getting my concepts for pennies because the concepts is the most important thing. Like that Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: this that's the hardest thing for people to come up with is concepts. People can create videos, songs. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah, yeah, yeah. Dutch Jackson: It's the concept that make them Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And again, it goes back Dutch Jackson: You could. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): to the point that you made earlier. Like there's there's some creatives that you have to tell them what to do. Yeah. I I have all Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): the creative all the creativity in the world, but I need something to draw. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): The best thing you can do for yourself is have your own ideas and execute on those. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. I had a when I used to shoot music videos, people used to call me cameraman at the shoot. That shit used to piss me off. Hey, cameraman, come over here, man. get this and get that. I'm like, I've come to a shoot where you motherfuckers have no idea what y'all want to shoot. I'm directing people. I'm telling you what scenes to do. I'm telling you. What acting parts to do? I'm directing your video. I'm not a cameraman. Go Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: get a cameraman and that goddamn camera just gonna stand still. It's a difference between directing and being a cameraman. Those are two jobs. You know Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: what I mean? So yeah, man. Everything they try to downplay creators so bad, man. Like it was so hard for me to sell videos because it's hard to sell things to people that they don't physically touch. You know. like to have things and I think that's another reason why creators get shitted on because a lot of our things that we create content creators anyway, you can't touch those. So it kind of in people's mind they've been programmed to only value things that they can hold when the most valuable things are the shit you can't hold. You know what I mean? We've been we've been miseducated and you know told lies to only value things you can hold and the most valuable things you can't hold, memories, loving, laughing, ideas, Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Ideas feelings. Dutch Jackson: feelings. You can't hold that shit in that time. You can't hold that shit. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Time you can't hold that shit at all. And time is the most valuable, son. Dutch Jackson: Yes. Yes. So I'm starting. I'm in an age of my life where I value all the shit I can't hold. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: And anything else? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Everything that I have everything that I can hold I have to move when I move to a new house any fucking way. And that should get that shit's getting heavy. Dutch Jackson: Exactly. Like I'm I'm the other way around. Now I devalue shit I can't hold. That damn car that's lose value. You know? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. That's a pain in the ass. I gotta take and get the oil changed every three months. God damn Dutch Jackson: All this physical shit, the most the physical sh a lot of the physical shit is the most worthless. And we idolize those things the most. Because Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: it's education, man. We've been groomed since we were kids to only value material. Like, think about it when we were growing up. man, you ain't got on a new Jordans. Ha ha ha ha ha. man, this dude whack. We were being Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: trained to be materialistic even back then. Damn, Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: I don't have whatever think about it. You got 200 kids in school. you got on the same shoes, beat two. yeah, you got on the same. You got on the same shirt. shit, you in, you on the in-crowd. It was programming, Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: you know? And that shit followed us until adulthood. you got the Porsche. I got the Porsche too. You got the. It was training for us to be materialistic. And that's why a lot of us only value. That's why you see rap videos, cats in the projects. I got this on, this work 200, this work. Like we've attached our work to material. And that that's why you see me in slaps episodes wearing Crocs, slapping the shit out of people with Hawaiian shorts on. That's a statement. This is a statement of mine. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): You guys have to go check out the slabs. It's ridiculous. Dutch Jackson: I'm fighting different stereotypes. I know you see me in you see me in videos with. Tank tops on and no jewelry because I'm showing people you don't need that shit, man. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: All you need is a good idea. Good plan to execute it. You know what I mean? That's what you need. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Focus on the process and I've been calling it the machine. I've been working on my machine. Cause in that way it doesn't matter what I put in there, if it's a video game, it's if it's an illustration, if it's if it's a movie, if it's a interview on a podcast, it all Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): goes into the machine. Doesn't matter what I'm working on. It just it just really doesn't. Same equipment, same equipment, same software, same everything. And now, you know, with the you can schedule shit now. Duh You work Dutch Jackson: Pro if Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): on the machine. Dutch Jackson: it and if and that to a good point, if you don't like if you hate AI for anything else. The process making with it, the systems, Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: the systems you can make to better your process. That Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: alone, you know, when people say AI, they think of AI video. That's the only thing you think about. I hate AI, man. They use it up all the Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm mm mm mm mm AI slop. Dutch Jackson: water. Hey, they use it up all the water. Ain't nobody gave a fuck about water, the environment. Captain Planet been saying this shit since ninety two. I mean so now AI come out now, everybody invite, you know, worry about the water and I'm man, I don't give a fuck about none of that shit. Look, I'm trying to create. I wanna be I wanna create some memorable some things. I wanna create things I wanna watch. I wanna create some things that are, you know, and it's it's stress relieving too, man. I I Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: realize when I didn't create, I physically got sick. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Mm-hmm. Dutch Jackson: I was one, I'm like, man, wow I'm not feeling good, man. It was it was I wasn't creating. So yeah. Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. You got backed up. You're like a you're you're like a faucet. And if you're not Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): doing faucet shit, you don't you're not gonna be you're not gonna feel like a good faucet. Dutch Jackson: Yes. Yes, it's true. So I can't stop if I wanted to. I'm just I'm built. This is what I'm built for. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Yeah. Same. Dutch Jackson: Yeah. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Same. And I know I got you on here for two and a half hours. Dutch Jackson: Damn, that shit went quick. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I d I'm I tell people all the time. I'm telling you like Dutch Jackson: Thanks. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I've been on this and I'm like, all right, we've been talking for two hours and people like what? I have still have plenty to say. okay, fine, fuck it. And then you did and then you get people like Deadman Rashawn, he said, What's it? Dutch Jackson: Mm-hmm. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): He said What's the record? I said, Three and a half hours. He said, But And I talked Dutch Jackson: He double. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): to his ass for six hours and thirteen minutes. Dutch Jackson: Man. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. And mostly I mostly want to wrap up with this interview because I'm just I'm I'm ready to get on with this friendship. I'm ready to get on with this friendship. Dutch Jackson: Okay. Sounds good to me. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): is there anything we need to make sure that we talk about? Dutch Jackson: well I am like I said, I told you before. I am working on some courses to put out. AI, I got a course for AI for beginners that I'm gonna put out for people who don't even have a clue, you know. But then I got technical shit for filmmakers that I'm also gonna put out a course for AI filmmaking and people want to try to take those transferable skills, you know, to the other side. So I got I got a couple of courses that are coming. Yep. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Cool. And if people want to find you online, where can they find you? Dutch Jackson: At Dutch Jackson. You're gonna see me somewhere. You might see some music from two thousand and two. People 'cause I've been online a long time, man. You know, so you gonna see a lot of shit. Just follow me, man. Send me a message. You know, I'll respond back and I got no problems, man. I appreciate anybody who appreciates me. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): yeah. Man, I am so excited. When people say don't meet your hero, and I understand that I just met you, but the fact that you're doing everything to a certain extent, you're my hero, and they say, Don't meet your heroes, they're gonna disappoint you. This is you the fake news. You my guy. You my guy. God damn it. I I feel so like Dutch Jackson: Met free. You just you know what I mean? Like Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Like there's there's another me. Dutch Jackson: Yes. And there's a lot of us, you know, we just don't Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: know. It's because we we come from that generation where it was we couldn't be ourselves and a lot of us carry that we're still carrying it today. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Yeah. Dutch Jackson: And I'm trying to show us it's okay to be middle-aged and be different. Fuck we we've tried that way, it don't work. Let's do it our way. You know what I mean? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): Right. Right. And we can have our parents tell you about all the I grew up with the phone attached to the wall and all that shit, but they you know, they s they're not as exciting as we are. Dutch Jackson: Yeah, we created hip hop. What the fuck? What are you c talking about? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): You know what I'm saying? Dutch Jackson: You know what I mean? Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): We survived Y two K, goddammit. Dutch Jackson: So man, I appreciate you for bringing me on, man, and I know we're gonna make some incredible things together, bro. Yep. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): I think so. I think so. This is what it looks like. Hey, for real, for real. This is you guys watching this, this is what it looks like when you give it time and you find your people. This is exactly what it looks like. Dutch Jackson: Worth the wait, man. Yep. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): That's it. It's so good to meet you, Dutch. Dutch Jackson: Good to meet you too, my brother. Carlos Gomez (Coconut Justice): And with that everybody, we're out.