Latest / Zone2Speak Podcast / Chris Hall on Using Two Wheels to Change Lives — Including His Own

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Chris Hall on Using Two Wheels to Change Lives — Including His Own · Zone2Speak Podcast

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  Now, let's get into the episode.
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  Welcome back to Zone to Speak, where we explore the human stories in cycling.
• 3:25
  Today's guest is someone who has carved out a truly original space in the cycling
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  world, Chris Hall. You might know him from his YouTube channel,
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  where he documents long rides and personal challenges with honesty and heart.
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  Or maybe you have come across his Zero Lemon podcast and his creative brand,
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  also called Zero Lemon, a space for those who take cycling seriously, but not themselves.
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  Chris' journey is part endurance athlete, part storyteller, and part thoughtful creator.
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  In this episode, I will get into how he built a unique voice on two wheels,
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  how he captures his adventures and vulnerable moments, and how he has turned
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  a love of writing into something that resonates far beyond the saddle.
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  Chris, welcome to Zone 2.
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  Well, that was an introduction that I wasn't expecting and makes me sound really serious.
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  And you are not. It just makes me sound like I know what I'm doing.
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  In reality i think i'm very
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  good at going with the flow and
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  blagging my way through life
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  which is basically what i've seemed to have done since i
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  was i don't know in my early 20s i think to be honest with you well you do know
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  how to capture the story and you stay really authentic and i think you do know
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  what you're doing even if it comes organically with the flow it's funny you
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  You mentioned the emotion thing when you were saying there.
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  And like this last week that's just gone is a, being totally frank,
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  it's a really hard week for me.
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  It's men's mental health awareness week was the last week.
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  And it's a hard week for me just dealing with some demons I've had myself in my life.
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  And I always find it that my emotions are very much on the limit of like last week.
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  And I started watching The Last of Us.
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  I've never seen it before, which is this...
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  I think I've seen this. The name is familiar. Yeah.
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  So it used to be like a PlayStation game and they've made it into a TV series.
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  Oh, that's right. That's right. Yeah, yeah.
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  With Pedro Pascal. yeah okay yeah and lots of people will
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  have probably watched it i think
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  it's on three seasons now and i've never watched it before and i was
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  watching it i've started watching it over the last couple of days and
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  i was watching episode three of
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  season one and it's got i think the guy's name
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  is nick offerman who is in parks and recreation and
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  he plays ron sponsor in parks and recreation
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  who's like a grumpy man with a mustache he'd be
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  just an amazingly talented actor and this whole episode
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  is about him and him meeting his partner
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  and then growing old together and and then i
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  don't want to explain what happens but i spent and the episode is an hour long
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  and i spent an hour crying my eyes out yes no and i was like oh the emotions
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  are very much on the limit they're very much on the surface and i was sitting
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  there just like and i was like why am i crying my guys,
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  this is, first of all, this is fantastic acting and television to make me feel that emotional about.
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  But I was just like, yeah, like, I mean, I'm quite an emotional person anyway,
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  and I don't have any issues with showing that at any point in my life. I never have done.
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  But I was like, oh, like, proper sobbing last night watching that. And it felt very raw.
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  And I woke up this morning, took my dog for a big walk, and I was like,
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  oh, I'm still a bit on my edge.
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  Touched by yeah yeah i i'd really the series has had loads of amazing reviews
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  and stuff i would really recommend watching it it's it's a good one okay i'll
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  check it out yeah i have heard about it and uh thanks for sharing see that's
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  what i'm talking about you are you and.
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  Like you just said you're not afraid of sharing your emotions and and being
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  you and i think like that's a big part of the attraction that you are so popular you know and the,
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  creation of your content it's it's a I
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  think it's important to try and be honest and I think social
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  media is whether that's YouTube Instagram whatever it is there's a lot of things
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  that aren't honest on it and that's also absolutely fine there's nothing wrong
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  with that there's a space for everything but for me I've always felt that it's
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  pretty important to be honest and just say things as they are.
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  But there are obviously points where...
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  I have to have a headspace away from that where I don't necessarily,
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  you know, how do I explain it?
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  Things are more scheduled and done so that I don't have to think about it.
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  And like recently that's what's been going on with my social media personally
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  is I've very much got out of the route of just scheduling things because I've
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  got a lot going on external at the moment.
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  So it's like, okay, things have to give, right?
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  There's an aspect with any form of social media and content creation in any
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  way where you need to have a break from that. It's still a, job, ultimately.
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  And so like the last couple of weeks for me, it's just been about going, okay, cool.
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  I need to pull myself out of that situation for a while, just schedule things,
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  and then come back to it again when it feels appropriate and right.
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  And I think that's actually a thing that a lot of people don't truly understand
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  that they can do when it comes down to anything that's social media focused.
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  Like you can remove yourself from that situation,
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  keep things ticking along and then go back into it when it's appropriate for you,
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  and it it means that it also gives me a
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  mental break from the fact of like I try to
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  share as honestly and openly as
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  possible about stuff going on in my life but also I still
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  have a private life very much so and that that stays private
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  intentionally so yeah I have to share everything but for me it's always been
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  about sort of sharing especially as a i hate to say it now probably coming up
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  for a middle-aged man which makes me feel terrible that there's men are not very good.
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  At talking full stock not very good at it having you know i used to work as
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  an architect and i was pretty successful i did you know i had some amazing projects
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  i worked and stuff all around the world.
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  But ultimately, I was really, really, really depressed.
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  On the cusp of suicidal depressed. Wow.
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  That is the reason why I no longer work in that industry. And I can see those warning signs in me.
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  And I've seen them in other people, very early warning signs,
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  not, you know, there's, there's obviously different levels and scales of this,
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  but I've seen it in other people.
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  And I hope, and I've always wanted to try and allow,
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  sharing things honestly to show that
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  actually there's no weakness in vulnerability there's actually
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  a huge amount of strength in showing that
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  you are vulnerable and open with yourself and
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  with what's going on and i hope i hope i've always
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  hoped that by doing that that helps
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  someone else to be like okay maybe i should open that
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  conversation again or maybe i should reach out
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  to that friend who's been a bit distant for a while because like
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  the the signs that there's so much incredible resources
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  out there from many charities and I
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  do a lot of work with Movember so I always kind of
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  champion them quite a lot but there's so many
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  resources out there which are about supporting people and
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  having helping encourage those conversations which are really tricky conversations
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  to have and as guys we are useless at doing that and I don't I don't really
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  there's a lot of studies into why they think it is but I don't I don't really
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  know what the wrong or right answer to it is but.
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  It's something that to me is, I'm very conscious of it from my own personal experiences.
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  And I feel like if I can somehow help someone else in some way,
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  then that's a positive thing to do is trying to find ways to use social media
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  and any form of platform in a positive way to be able to help others.
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  And that's, that's to me is what we should be doing with it more than anything else.
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  I'm not complaining about, you know, the
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  fact that there's a 30 mile an hour speed limit down a road
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  or whatever rubbish it is it should be used as a
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  positive thing to help support other people or just
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  to be funny like funny stuff is also great because it makes you laugh so
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  that's how I've always tried to use it and I think that that came
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  from early experiences as I say regarding
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  my own mental health and then also like I think because when I was
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  a kid I you know I grew up
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  in the countryside my parents split
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  up when i was really young so i had a lot of i
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  spent a lot of time my grandparents basically because my parents were
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  both still working and quite full-on spent
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  a lot of time my grandparents and they they run an animal charity wow
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  so it was always like the
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  charity aspect always was definitely something that was drilled into me from
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  them it was about like as a kid
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  i'd like mow the lawn or something to help my grandparents
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  out and my granddad would be like okay here's
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  two pounds for mowing the lawn but it'd always be like in reality you need one
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  pound you're a kid you know that's a hundred penny sweets yes it's how he used
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  to explain to me he's like a hundred penny sweets is a lot of penny sweets and
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  he says like okay i'll give you two pounds but i think we should take it would
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  be like i think we should take one pound of that and put it in the charity box.
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  Which was for their charity.
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  And they basically, there was an animal charity and my nan sort of mainly ran
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  it and she had like loads of sisters and they all looked after different types
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  of animals. So like my nan did cats.
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  She had sister that did dogs, a sister that did like farm animals.
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  A sister that did like big animals like horses, donkeys, that kind of thing.
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  Wow and they diversified the charity yeah yeah
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  and then and then one then one other sister did like reptiles.
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  And insects and stuff wow and so
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  they it was i mean it was a tiny charity just run by
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  all these my nan and her sisters but like they all looked after
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  different animals and so like at one point i remember my nan having
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  like 30 cats at her house wow and
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  they're all just like slightly mangled not very like the
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  kind of cats that no one else wants but actually incredibly loving and quite
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  friendly all like quite often
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  old and I think
• 14:18
  because of that having that as a child and kind
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  of having that very early on enforced into me that
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  probably is the best thing I've ever best lesson
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  I've ever had from someone is about you don't
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  have to like you don't always need everything
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  like there's an aspect of like if you can give
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  back in some way shape or form doesn't really matter what it
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  is there's you should try and do something to
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  better other people and to better because in hindsight the selfish
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  way is it betters yourself it makes you feel better in yourself
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  as well and it is such a feel
• 14:51
  good yeah totally it brings you good endorphins
• 14:55
  by yeah back and i you know i think that was
• 14:58
  the best thing you know at the time it
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  was really hard because i was a kid that didn't really see my
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  parents very much but looking being able
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  to look back on it now i owe my grandparents
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  so much for that and to have those lessons i.
• 15:13
  Learned from them that is a beautiful value yeah and
• 15:17
  i was gonna ask because i know you do a lot of your writing for
• 15:20
  charity so you already answered my question
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  of how this you know how the charity work
• 15:26
  started you know what brought you to follow all
• 15:29
  those causes and and and be a speaker person
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  for it i think i tend
• 15:35
  to do a lot for two charities as well one is pace center which is a school for
• 15:40
  kids with cerebral palsy and my connection to them is that my i've got a very
• 15:46
  good friend that has a kid there and then the first cycling club i ever rode
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  with which would be like 2010,
• 15:56
  they they were set up to fundraise for that charity because there's several
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  people in that club, we've got kids at Pace.
• 16:06
  And basically, my friend whose son goes there, I went to go and visit the school and I was,
• 16:14
  so blown away by the amount of, it's a tiny, tiny place, but the amount of how
• 16:20
  staff heavy it is for kids.
• 16:23
  So it's motor-based disorders. So I think cerebral palsy is one example of a motor-based disorder.
• 16:30
  There's many different options out there, but the bit that's quite.
• 16:34
  So my mate's son charlie like he he's actually
• 16:37
  hilarious he's pretty savage he dared
• 16:40
  me to ride to paris once after work
• 16:43
  and then take a photo under the eiffel tower holding a
• 16:46
  croissant and i did it i was like but yeah he's
• 16:49
  pretty savage his his sort
• 16:52
  of cerebral palsy is quite minor really he has
• 16:54
  issues with sort of like controlling his arms
• 16:58
  and his legs so he's quite often and but
• 17:02
  in contrast it could be and like you know he can speak like some
• 17:04
  some kids who have cerebral palsy and other have difficulties
• 17:08
  yeah yeah so they will speak
• 17:12
  using eye movement on a computer effectively
• 17:15
  or sign language is another example so but
• 17:19
  i went and visited the first time i visited there and i was like i
• 17:21
  was so blown away by how how staff heavy.
• 17:25
  It is for you know a class might be six kids and
• 17:28
  there might be seven members of staff in that class because they
• 17:33
  need you know each child might need their own carer
• 17:36
  plus yeah plus then you have support staff it's
• 17:39
  quite it's quite heavy and that and i also
• 17:42
  have a nephew who is highly autistic
• 17:45
  and has sort of my mild motor-based
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  disorder as well so like there's a family connection as well as a friend connection
• 17:54
  to them and they a lot of the challenges quite early on were around the number
• 17:58
  107 because originally Pace could only look after 107 kids and it just it was
• 18:05
  easy to kind of go what can I do on a bike there's 107.
• 18:09
  There's lots oh I know where you're going now I mean there's lots of things
• 18:14
  you could do with that is that what drove the 107 rides in 107 days yeah yeah
• 18:20
  yeah so that was that was done as a fundraiser of a pace and I did it,
• 18:25
  I can't even think when it was, it was quite a long time ago now,
• 18:28
  but it was 107k every day for 107 days and it was, I started it,
• 18:33
  I think four days before my birthday, which was a silly decision.
• 18:38
  And my birthday is in December. Oh, it's cold. Yeah. It's really cold.
• 18:44
  But I was also still working full time. I was still working as an architect
• 18:48
  at that point. And I think it was like in the first week.
• 18:53
  The rule I set to myself was basically like, I have to do the distance before midnight.
• 18:59
  That was the rule I set to myself. So I could do it after work effectively if I needed to.
• 19:03
  I think it was probably like in the first week, it was like very,
• 19:07
  very, I think I finished at like 10 to midnight on one of the nights.
• 19:11
  And I was like, well, then if I, if I didn't do it, that's the challenge. You failed it.
• 19:14
  In reality, I hadn't, but that was just a rule I'd set to myself.
• 19:17
  And I did manage to do it in that timeframe. So it was fine,
• 19:21
  but I was really stubborn about wanting to start it on this particular day.
• 19:26
  Cause I wanted to finish it the day before the Tour of Flanders. Okay.
• 19:31
  Because I'd gone out there at that point most years for a few years.
• 19:37
  So I wanted to go out there and the last day to be the Tour of Flanders Sportif,
• 19:42
  which is 200 and something kilometers, so a lot further.
• 19:46
  And then spend the day and then actually just watch the race with my mates and
• 19:50
  enjoy the day watching the race and like having fun and not having to ride my bike.
• 19:55
  But the irony is is that the 108th
• 19:59
  day as I woke up at four o'clock in
• 20:02
  the morning which was the normal I got on
• 20:05
  my bike and I started riding it for about 10k and
• 20:08
  I was like what the heck am I doing I was just like on autopilot you was autopilot
• 20:14
  wow and my mates I was sharing a room with two of my mates Ant and Francis and
• 20:20
  I came back into the hotel room and they were both awake and they just sat there
• 20:24
  smiling at me and this is like early hours in the morning right,
• 20:27
  and I was like guys did you think about just stopping me and they were like
• 20:32
  nope we thought we'd let you do it they were like we thought we'd let you just
• 20:37
  do it and you can figure it out yourself and I was like great well that was
• 20:40
  appreciated and but yeah doing that while working a full-time job was like,
• 20:47
  It was really hard. I mean, a lot of people have said to me,
• 20:50
  oh, that doesn't sound too bad. The distance isn't that bad.
• 20:54
  It is. It builds up. And when you have to work, no way.
• 21:00
  And I was sort of getting up at sort of four in the morning,
• 21:03
  five in the morning, riding before work, then working a full day of work.
• 21:08
  And as working in architecture, quite often you end up working overtime and
• 21:14
  you could be in the office easily until nine, ten o'clock at night.
• 21:18
  And then try and finish up the distance afterwards. So I always start at the
• 21:22
  start of the week, I'd be doing like, you know, 60, 70K before work.
• 21:26
  Then I'd go out on my lunch break, try and do another like 10K.
• 21:30
  Wow. And then I'd finish it off after work. That would be the start of the week. That was going well.
• 21:34
  Wow. And as it got later on in the week, say like Friday, I mean,
• 21:38
  I'd do like 30, 40K before work because I was tired.
• 21:41
  Another 10K at lunchtime and then finish the distance off after work.
• 21:45
  But and then the weekend I'd have a massive lie-in try
• 21:48
  and catch up on sleep because I haven't had a lot of sleep and then
• 21:51
  ride normally do the ride sort of like 11 o'clock and
• 21:55
  quite often rode because I lived in London at that
• 21:58
  point I'd quite often ride from where I lived out
• 22:01
  into like Windsor and then back
• 22:04
  that was 110 kilometers from where
• 22:08
  I lived to Windsor and back and it's flat so actually
• 22:11
  was quite good for it that's nice yeah but you
• 22:14
  know it was a challenge that like it was long like three and a half months basically
• 22:19
  of dealing with crap british weather and yes those are the toughest months of
• 22:27
  the year december jan feb and half of march yeah exactly,
• 22:33
  and i was i was i didn't think i don't think i realized it but i was severely
• 22:39
  depressed after that challenge which was shouldn't have been that way it shouldn't
• 22:45
  have been that way why do you think it was spending so much time in the dark
• 22:50
  being out in the dark and then spending.
• 22:53
  The daytime in an office locked
• 22:55
  in yeah yeah with very little natural light
• 22:58
  in it and then not eating very well
• 23:02
  because i was so tired so i would just eat you
• 23:05
  know i was eating a lot of takeaway food because it
• 23:08
  was easy it was easy to do or eating
• 23:11
  not you know not good healthy food and like i
• 23:14
  put on weight on that challenge as well like i put on like five kilos
• 23:17
  which everyone a lot of people were like how does
• 23:20
  that make any sense and it's yeah i was explained to
• 23:23
  it by a friend who's a nutritionist and he was saying the problem is is your
• 23:26
  body goes into a survival crisis mode yeah it's just like i need to hold on
• 23:31
  to everything i need to hold on to everything i possibly can and like it dropped
• 23:36
  off pretty quickly afterwards but it was the fact that you know i think during
• 23:40
  that challenge like everything was just like.
• 23:43
  You know survival how do i survive this while trying
• 23:46
  to juggle working while doing all this other stuff how do i just survive
• 23:49
  through this and ultimately in hindsight
• 23:53
  it made it's made an incredible story it's
• 23:57
  probably made a lot of money for pace as well like that's
• 24:00
  the important part and it also probably put
• 24:03
  me kind of in the trajectory of doing what i
• 24:06
  now do so i owe it a lot but it took a lot at the same time yeah i'm sure it
• 24:13
  was so it was tough physically and then you found out it was tough mentally
• 24:17
  but in the long run maybe it was a positive thing because it.
• 24:24
  Triggered this positive lifestyle change
• 24:28
  in your life it wasn't long after that
• 24:31
  challenge when i quit architecture it was
• 24:34
  probably yeah pretty close after that where i
• 24:37
  i went into the office that I worked
• 24:40
  with and I the director that I had at the time we I
• 24:44
  wouldn't say we saw eye to eye very often if
• 24:47
  I if that makes sense we weren't the we
• 24:51
  got on but we both I don't think we really
• 24:53
  liked each other we got on because we worked together and
• 24:57
  yeah yeah and I remember
• 25:00
  going into the office and sitting down with him and turn it
• 25:02
  basically said like look if I don't
• 25:06
  quit this job i don't know if i'm gonna be here
• 25:09
  anymore and i don't think he quite got
• 25:12
  what i meant and then i looked at him and i was like i'm being
• 25:14
  really serious i like i don't think i'm gonna.
• 25:17
  Be here anymore and i think it's something the penny
• 25:20
  dropped at that point and then he turned around
• 25:23
  and was like okay well i'm not gonna let
• 25:25
  you quit i'm gonna make you redundant make your role redundant
• 25:28
  nice or you can have a payout and therefore
• 25:31
  you've got some time to look after
• 25:34
  yourself and work out what you want to do next and like i
• 25:38
  said we didn't get on but purely that was a
• 25:41
  nice gesture a really lovely gesture to have done and he didn't have to do that
• 25:45
  he didn't have to do that at all and that changed my opinion of him massively
• 25:50
  actually you actually are a good person you're who understands the situation
• 25:55
  that i'm currently in but yeah it was i haven't worked in architecture since not properly yeah.
• 26:01
  It's a fascinating industry that's incredibly ruthless and not very,
• 26:10
  from my experiences, not very supportive of people who are struggling a bit.
• 26:18
  And I, but I think that I would like to hope that has changed since I've left
• 26:22
  the industry and I would, I would believe it probably has,
• 26:24
  but it felt very much that there was a lot of people out there for themselves
• 26:28
  and kind of like I guess like quite content with going oh.
• 26:34
  I'm gonna do a one-up on that person because it
• 26:37
  gets me further in my career and I don't care what happens to them
• 26:39
  and unfortunately that happened quite a lot in that industry and
• 26:43
  I think and I put it down to the fact that it's high stress long
• 26:47
  working hours there's a very old school
• 26:50
  mentality which I don't agree with which is quite backwards
• 26:54
  and it's just
• 26:57
  I think that it kind of you know people have this
• 27:00
  perception of like I was treated like that so I can treat someone
• 27:03
  like that which shouldn't be how it is I'm surprised
• 27:07
  because I'm not in my head because
• 27:10
  I'm relating but what makes me surprised
• 27:13
  is because I would think like architecture would be more you
• 27:17
  know it's creative people and then you know of course I'm just making assumptions
• 27:21
  like it's more of a creative environment because I come from finance world which
• 27:26
  is very cutthroat as well and I finally had my corporate freedom day I call it because I also was.
• 27:35
  Done. I couldn't take this anymore. Like, you know, people will sell their moms
• 27:39
  to get ahead, you know, they'll step above anyone if that furthers their career.
• 27:44
  And yeah, I had a moment, I remember so clearly where my husband had a friend
• 27:51
  over staying with us for a few days.
• 27:54
  And, you know, someone with fresh eyes, and he pointed out, I think I was leaving
• 27:59
  for work, I don't know, 7-ish a.m., and I just sighed. He was like, wow, that bad, huh?
• 28:04
  And then that clicked. That was it for me. I was like, oh, my gosh.
• 28:09
  I don't want to lead this life where I'm like, ugh, going to the office.
• 28:14
  And yeah, so I totally relate. And I've been trying to find my path outside, which I'm loving it.
• 28:23
  Of course, it's much less money, but it's also much less the stress
• 28:26
  and living your truth you know
• 28:29
  i created the podcast which is not income
• 28:33
  at all but i'm enjoying it so much
• 28:36
  you know my creative side finally flourishing and you know getting to talk to
• 28:40
  people like you it's really amazing so i completely relate to what you're saying
• 28:46
  the thing is is money there's that there's a couple of old expressions that
• 28:50
  are so true right Like money doesn't buy you happiness. That is so true.
• 28:55
  It can buy you stuff, but that means that, you know, or it can buy you things
• 29:00
  that might be perceived to bring you happiness, but it's not true happiness.
• 29:05
  It's materialistic happiness, right? Yeah.
• 29:08
  You can't, you know, true happiness, you should be able to, you should not need
• 29:15
  anything to force that. You should be able to find it in natural and free ways, right?
• 29:22
  Whether that is like this morning, I got up a...
• 29:26
  Six o'clock in the morning. Really, I'm not good in the mornings.
• 29:30
  I'm terrible in the mornings.
• 29:32
  And what did I do this morning? I took my dog to a field and I threw a Frisbee for him for an hour.
• 29:40
  And the true happiness that comes off that is my dog is having the best time
• 29:44
  of his life this morning.
• 29:47
  And that makes me happy. What did that cost me?
• 29:51
  Nothing, literally nothing. I bought
• 29:54
  a frisbee for him two years ago yeah maybe a
• 29:56
  pound for the frisbee yeah you know like there's
• 30:00
  a special dog one this is a very special dog one it's yellow dogs
• 30:03
  can see yellow oh nice okay i
• 30:06
  didn't know that yeah there's not their dogs are
• 30:09
  like partly colorblind yeah they can
• 30:12
  see the color yellow like it contrasts is they don't
• 30:15
  see it how we see yellow but it's a contrasting color from the
• 30:18
  rest of them so that's why he is
• 30:21
  obsessed with the yellow frisbee because he can see it's why they like tennis balls
• 30:24
  as well because they're yellow oh okay yeah i know they
• 30:27
  have they only see a few colors but not how
• 30:30
  we see it like you said but i forget what the colors
• 30:33
  but now i'll remember yellow and that's you
• 30:36
  know that's that's that is true happiness is
• 30:39
  going and standing in the field chucking a frisbee for an hour for my
• 30:41
  dog who is having the you know the best morning that
• 30:45
  he's i say ever i mean
• 30:47
  we do it quite often but like he then he's had
• 30:51
  a great start to his day i've enjoyed it because i'm
• 30:54
  having fun throwing a frisbee for my dog and
• 30:57
  he's now asleep in his bed snoring with his
• 31:00
  eyes rolled back in his head so he looks great i keep
• 31:04
  looking that way because that's where he is he's in his bed yeah i figured and
• 31:08
  then like you know and that that's true happiness it.
• 31:11
  Hasn't cost anything it's just it's it's something that's natural like well
• 31:16
  you know the sun was coming up it was starting to warm up there was like dew
• 31:20
  on the ground we both got back and we're a bit dirty and a bit muddy and a bit
• 31:25
  wet from all the dew on the ground and like.
• 31:30
  It was just a really nice, happy way to start a day.
• 31:34
  So like, yeah, I mean, same, I don't earn half as much as what I earned in architecture.
• 31:41
  And architecture is not a well-paid job. People perceive it's a well-paid job.
• 31:45
  It's not a well-paid job in the scale of design, unless you're at the very top.
• 31:52
  But am I happy? i'm much more happier
• 31:55
  the majority of the time now compared
• 31:58
  to when i was working in architecture where i was happy
• 32:02
  in the minority of the time you know
• 32:05
  so yes i still have days where
• 32:08
  i i am struggling and i think everyone does and i
• 32:10
  think that's also completely natural but i'm now
• 32:14
  more at peace and happier more of
• 32:17
  the time by doing being lucky to
• 32:20
  do what i do and to see what i
• 32:22
  get to see and experience the things that i'll get to experience i
• 32:26
  saw someone i can't remember who it was but i saw a quote recently
• 32:29
  what was like i had to write it down because it really stuck with me let me
• 32:32
  find it i wrote it on my phone so it won't take a second the and it yeah it
• 32:37
  really i found it already it stuck with me quite a lot and it was the quote
• 32:40
  was just the goal is to die with memories not dreams that's powerful yeah and,
• 32:48
  Because you want to get to that point where whenever that end is,
• 32:52
  to be able to be like, yeah, I've really seen things, experienced things and
• 32:58
  done things I can be proud of.
• 32:59
  And I've got stories and memories and moments I can take with me or I've been
• 33:05
  able to share in whatever way it is that's appropriate.
• 33:08
  But I've been able to, I've got nothing that I've missed. You know,
• 33:12
  that's sort of the ultimate goal, right? Is to kind of be- Absolutely.
• 33:16
  Yeah, live a full life. and true to yourself.
• 33:22
  And I'm so happy you get to share this, you know, most of it.
• 33:26
  Of course, some things you have to keep private, but it's great that a lot of
• 33:32
  us can see this part of your journey and be inspired by, touched by, and maybe, you know,
• 33:38
  with this inspiration, be able to also to make changes.
• 33:41
  Not everyone can quit their day job, obviously. You know,
• 33:44
  people have kids or some other responsibilities and you need
• 33:48
  some type of stability but at least put yourself
• 33:50
  first in certain moments you know find something you love like walking the dog
• 33:55
  doesn't have to be riding a bike it's i think it's important to understand that
• 34:01
  one you know it can be little steps to start with right but making those steps
• 34:05
  that go towards the direction of supporting yourself are really important,
• 34:10
  and and i always think about it like you know
• 34:14
  my one of my best mates is an incredibly successful youtuber
• 34:17
  right and he quite early on into him doing youtube he was filming that 107 kilometers
• 34:26
  every day for 107 days challenge it's funny talking to him about it because
• 34:31
  we spoke about it recently he's like oh yeah you know i rode most of that and
• 34:33
  i'm like and he's mine he rode most of it.
• 34:36
  And I'm like, trust me, mate, you did not. You maybe rode a quarter.
• 34:42
  But I feel incredibly lucky to have so many of these adventures that I've been doing.
• 34:48
  Documented by him and that was
• 34:51
  probably the catalyst for me to start documenting
• 34:54
  more of it myself was because he had
• 34:57
  documented like I've got them to look back on when I'm
• 35:00
  an old man and be like yeah you
• 35:04
  know that was freaking cool I did that
• 35:07
  at one point like we rode across Australia together to be
• 35:10
  able to look back on that and be like me and one of my best
• 35:12
  mates cycled across Australia over a
• 35:15
  month and it was the craziest month I think one
• 35:18
  of the questions of my life so it was just nuts and we're
• 35:21
  doing massive days on the bike like sunrise to sunset days and
• 35:25
  then I have that as a thing I can look back on
• 35:28
  it's not going anywhere it's going to be you know out there on
• 35:31
  the internet for the rest of time right and that
• 35:34
  was quite a catalyst for me to go do you know what actually I
• 35:38
  would like to be in a position where there's
• 35:41
  things which obviously i don't do with him and now he's moving he's
• 35:45
  moving abroad so like it's how can i what can
• 35:48
  i do that allows me to still be able to capture those
• 35:51
  memories and moments and one selfishly that for me to look back on when i'm
• 35:55
  old two hopefully their stories and things that help inspire other people to
• 35:59
  try something out and that was when i started doing it a bit more but like i
• 36:03
  remember when he first started shoving a camera in my face i was like dude i
• 36:06
  don't know but then And it becomes,
• 36:09
  you become so used to it because he would force it that it's become second nature.
• 36:15
  And it meant that it was, it was actually quite easy for me to start doing it
• 36:19
  myself or, you know, I've got incredibly talented, another very,
• 36:23
  very talented friend who is a videographer, a documentary videographer who lives quite near me.
• 36:29
  And like, I will shout him out till the sun dies. It's Jack Hague. It's a legend.
• 36:34
  And, you know, I took him on his first ever bikepacking trip two weeks ago.
• 36:38
  Wow. Yeah. Yeah. That was a thing.
• 36:42
  He loves the outdoors. He's like, he's a documentary person,
• 36:47
  makes documentaries, but he's also a wildlife photographer. So he loves being outdoors anyway.
• 36:53
  Nice. And I'm sure he loved the bikepacking then. Well, it's debatable. Maybe.
• 36:59
  Yeah. He's the guy that's helped film Badlands for three years. Cool.
• 37:04
  And he wanted to do some bikepacking stuff. He'd never done it before.
• 37:11
  And I was like, okay, I will reach out to some of the brands I work with to
• 37:15
  help you out with some good, in my opinion, the best equipment out there.
• 37:20
  So I got him a very good price on a gravel bike.
• 37:25
  I got him a load of cycling kit, a helmet, some tail fin luggage,
• 37:29
  like everything that was literally what I use.
• 37:32
  And and that was me kind of going going to the brands i worked with being like
• 37:36
  look this guy's helped out a lot like help him out a bit as well because like
• 37:40
  he's helped on this stuff like can you help him out a bit and they're all like
• 37:44
  yeah 100 but you know completely completely fair enough,
• 37:48
  and we did we did an event that's called the frontier 300 which is
• 37:51
  a coast to coast bike packing route
• 37:55
  in nice so it's on the board you could
• 37:58
  do it in a day 300k or you could do it in
• 38:01
  two days and it's 180 kilometers
• 38:04
  and then 120 kilometers and you
• 38:07
  you start on the west coast near gatehouse of
• 38:10
  fleet which is like west that is in scotland like the border
• 38:13
  point of scotland and then you ride it's all gravel or cycle paths or very very
• 38:20
  quiet roads and you ride to kilda which is where dirty river is held which is
• 38:25
  like another big gravel event in the uk and i'm gonna to look that up.
• 38:29
  Sounds like something I want to do.
• 38:30
  It's fantastic. It's a fantastic event.
• 38:34
  So it's 180k, and then the first day is definitely the harder of the two days,
• 38:37
  and then the second day is 120k and net downhill.
• 38:42
  They're still climbing in it, but it's net downhill.
• 38:44
  And then on the east coast, so it's west to east.
• 38:48
  The reason they do it west to east is you generally have a tailwind that way as well.
• 38:54
  So we drove up on the – what you do is you drive to the finish,
• 38:58
  then you get a coach to the start.
• 39:00
  And so your car is already at the finish, basically. Nice, okay.
• 39:04
  And then you get the coach to the start and then i booked
• 39:07
  us like a little a room in a above a
• 39:10
  pub before the start but the i said
• 39:13
  to jack i was like oh it's a 10k bonus ride
• 39:16
  to the start and he was like really and i was like yeah but it's fine it's downhill
• 39:19
  kind of not there's a hill in it and so
• 39:24
  we so we ended up right so we rode to the start the starts
• 39:27
  at like five o'clock in the morning so very early so we were
• 39:29
  up at about four you know getting some food
• 39:32
  getting dressed leaving half hour or so for
• 39:35
  that 10k and then got to
• 39:38
  the start and had a coffee because there was a coffee fan
• 39:41
  at the start so that was quite nice and very good
• 39:44
  coffee as well and then we rode that
• 39:47
  100 so we ended up riding 192 kilometers on the
• 39:50
  first day now jack's biggest
• 39:53
  ride before this was 160 kilometers with
• 39:57
  about 2 000 meters of elevation on road
• 40:00
  yeah that's solid that's a solid effort yeah
• 40:04
  now this ride was 192 kilometers
• 40:07
  with 3 500 meters of
• 40:10
  elevation gravel mainly yeah so that's a big it's right he's ever done wow and
• 40:18
  he did brilliant like it was so rewarding for me to have taken him on that journey
• 40:24
  and support him through that journey that's something he's never done before and.
• 40:29
  Like I probably got as much out of it as he did, in all honesty.
• 40:35
  Because for me, it was like, I'm taking, I'm, this guy has seen me suffering
• 40:41
  on events and stuff and has been there.
• 40:44
  You know, he can't do anything because especially with Badlands and stuff,
• 40:46
  there's quite strict rules in terms of filming. Yeah, yeah.
• 40:50
  Because otherwise it gets classed as being supported. Support,
• 40:52
  yeah. He's only allowed to be present with me for a couple of hours a day.
• 40:57
  And like the rest of the time, it's all filmed from a distance.
• 40:59
  Or it's like film with a drone or the filming comes from me talking to like a GoPro basically.
• 41:05
  But he's seen me when I'm really struggling like
• 41:09
  200 300 400 kilometers into things
• 41:12
  you know etc etc and for me
• 41:15
  it was quite nice for him to have ridden it to
• 41:17
  kind of he said to me afterwards like it was quite satisfying to
• 41:20
  understand what it's like to go through the.
• 41:23
  Highs and the lows and he's like I know it's not the same kind
• 41:26
  of distance but to be able to experience and go through that as well
• 41:29
  is really cool but for me to guide
• 41:32
  him through that and support him like his biggest problem was he just
• 41:35
  wasn't eating and drinking enough so like and i'm i'm a
• 41:38
  great i'm always eating when i'm riding and i'm
• 41:41
  just looking at him being like come on eat keep eating and i
• 41:45
  think that probably got him through it but there's 90 kilometers
• 41:48
  into the route which was 100 kilometers for us because of the bonus
• 41:51
  10k there's a hiker bike section which is
• 41:54
  like i don't know a kilometer too long maybe
• 41:57
  30 percent what yeah and
• 42:01
  and i was like i we were riding up
• 42:04
  to it and i did this event last year and the weather for the hiker
• 42:07
  bike was really bad so it's quite i was buzzing because actually
• 42:10
  it was lovely blue skies and we got there and i was like oh i could see
• 42:13
  all the views and stuff i started going
• 42:16
  up it i looked back and i couldn't see jack anywhere
• 42:19
  and i was like where is he and uh so
• 42:22
  i stopped and waited for like five ten minutes and he's he's there pushing the
• 42:25
  bike up much slower than me and uh and he was like he said to me you're like
• 42:31
  a mountain goat how how would you go so like a bike and I was like I've done
• 42:37
  a few of them that is literally it I've done a few of them.
• 42:40
  Have a hiker bike experience that i
• 42:44
  think the hiker bike was the bit that put the nail in
• 42:46
  the coffin so to speak for him because he was toast after
• 42:50
  that he really struggled but i hate the hiker bike
• 42:53
  when you like hit your shin on the pedal you
• 42:56
  do that every time it's like ah i
• 43:00
  found that this i found one of the things i've i always
• 43:03
  try and position the cranks as far
• 43:06
  away from me as i can so normally the if i quite
• 43:09
  often push up on the drive side and then
• 43:12
  i make sure the crank arm is at the back so
• 43:16
  like me too but somehow he finds its way
• 43:18
  back to the front and then bang but the
• 43:22
  other bit i've done is i i which i
• 43:25
  explained to jack was like i think the biggest thing because he
• 43:27
  was starting to really struggle with his back i was like swap sides just swap
• 43:31
  sides go to the other side yeah as in the balance is out and he was like just
• 43:34
  like carrying a bag put it on the other shoulder and he was like really and
• 43:38
  i was like yeah just go to the other side of the bike do that for a bit and
• 43:42
  then if it hurts again go to the other side because that's what i just keep
• 43:45
  doing and uh and he was like i hear that makes complete sense.
• 43:51
  It was yeah it was really there's some lovely photos i
• 43:54
  put them up on instagram the other day of when we crossed the finish
• 43:57
  line the on the second day and you can tell he is like he's proper like yeah
• 44:03
  like proper pleased to himself and like i let i like very intentionally sat
• 44:10
  up so he could roll forward and have that moment because i thought that was really important,
• 44:17
  to let him cross the finish line and sort of let him you know take it all in
• 44:22
  yeah himself have that to himself and then i know then i'll be at the fit and
• 44:27
  then i'll cross the line after him and i'll give him a massive hug and everything
• 44:29
  but i just thought it was really important and And there's these really lovely photos that someone,
• 44:34
  a guy called Matt, I think, took and sent them to me.
• 44:36
  And Jack's really pleased with himself. I'm just smiling in the background like a Cheshire cat.
• 44:42
  I felt like some kind of proud dad.
• 44:45
  Cute i that's another
• 44:48
  thing about happiness what's that cost me yeah i've got
• 44:52
  to show experience an
• 44:55
  adventure with a really good friend of mine who's never done something like
• 44:58
  that before and it's made me really happy and
• 45:01
  proud to see him finish it like that's that's that
• 45:05
  that's what it should be about like and what okay what's
• 45:08
  it cost me a tank of fuel to get there and
• 45:11
  you know the entry to the event and food and a bedroom in a pub for the night
• 45:20
  which was 87 pounds which is yeah but the price of sharing the experience it's
• 45:26
  priceless and see exactly seeing your friend.
• 45:29
  Go through this experience and share this priceless
• 45:33
  can put a price tag on it but also
• 45:36
  it wasn't expensive you know
• 45:39
  in reality wasn't an expensive thing to do it
• 45:42
  wasn't it was you know it's in the UK
• 45:45
  I had to drive there I had to drive back food food and stuff I would be buying
• 45:51
  anyway because I need to eat a bed for the night not really expensive for the
• 45:55
  pair of us then we camped in Kilda for the the middle night and then you know
• 46:01
  it's that whole thing about like
• 46:04
  to me is like happiness shouldn't be
• 46:07
  expensive and should be it shouldn't be
• 46:10
  materialistic and there's nothing materialistic about that we slept in
• 46:13
  freaking tents for a night there's there's not materialistic at
• 46:16
  all it's about as honest the only way that could be more honest
• 46:19
  is if we didn't sleep in a tent and we just slept out in the stars right so
• 46:22
  like those kind of experiences are so
• 46:25
  much they're priceless you can't you can't
• 46:28
  put a value on them you can't at all even though
• 46:31
  they don't end up costing you much you can't put a value on
• 46:34
  them and it goes back to that phrase you said that it's on your phone you just
• 46:40
  created a memory now that is a core memory you're gonna take it with you it's
• 46:44
  no longer a dream yeah and that's something that we both have me and jack both
• 46:49
  have similarly of australia when i did that with francis like that's something that we.
• 46:54
  We talk about we did that in 2019 right and we still talk about it whenever
• 47:01
  we see each other We talk about something will come up from that.
• 47:05
  And we've done a lot of trips together as well, right? But for some reason,
• 47:08
  that particular one, there's something that comes up regularly on that one.
• 47:11
  I think because we spent so many hours,
• 47:14
  riding bikes in australia where to be honest there's not a lot to look at as
• 47:18
  cool and as epic as it sounds there is not a lot to look at in most of it so
• 47:22
  we talk a lot we talked a lot and you know therefore we every time we we don't
• 47:27
  see each other that often now because we live.
• 47:30
  Relatively far apart from each other but whenever whenever we do something
• 47:33
  will come up like something will happen that will like jog
• 47:36
  a memory from australia and having and i
• 47:39
  have that with like several friends and having those kind of moments where
• 47:42
  you can kind of reminisce on something that's happened is
• 47:45
  so valuable so so valuable yeah
• 47:49
  I completely agree and I also have you know those trips with also my best is
• 47:55
  a youtuber and I also love to going back you know sometimes like my brother
• 48:00
  was his visiting and I was like oh let's see the video from you know from Rwanda.
• 48:05
  I'll show you how it went.
• 48:07
  It's so convenient and nice, and it's so cool to relive the memory.
• 48:11
  But I'm so happy, you know, you had this experience, and I mean,
• 48:16
  you were able to shift and find a new meaning and a new lifestyle,
• 48:22
  and that you're doing well.
• 48:25
  And how did everything develop after that? You started creating some videos, because now you have,
• 48:31
  I want to say, a little empire because you
• 48:33
  have zero lemon i knew
• 48:37
  he would laugh but i didn't i don't know what how else to describe but uh i'm
• 48:42
  a media tycoon now i'm like yeah what's that i don't want to say the horrible
• 48:47
  man who has a newspapers i'm not like a horrible man owes newspapers no no no.
• 48:56
  Zero lemon started as a it all
• 48:59
  started as a bit of a joke actually my other
• 49:02
  best mate said to me i got made redundant from a job it was in like pandemic
• 49:07
  times there's a lot of people put on furlough in the uk which meant you still
• 49:12
  had a job but you basically didn't have to go to work and it's paid for by the
• 49:16
  government or you lost my job i lost my job i worked for a small company at that point.
• 49:22
  And my best mate said to me, when life gives you lemons, tell life to get a
• 49:27
  life because lemons are a shit gift.
• 49:30
  Is what he said to me. And then he went, please feel free, please feel free
• 49:35
  to beat my expletive I'm about to say.
• 49:39
  He said, zero fucking lemons, you should start a business named that.
• 49:43
  And I said, I don't think I could start a business named zero fucking lemons.
• 49:48
  I could call one zero lemon. And he was like, do it.
• 49:51
  And I said, well, what does it do? And he's like, whatever you want it to do
• 49:54
  just do things that you think are fun i love that now that i understand the
• 50:00
  the meaning love it zero lemon yeah and i it was a it all started as a joke
• 50:06
  from yeah one of my mates and.
• 50:10
  He and the i did i did the podcast for
• 50:12
  a while and the podcast was kind of like an excuse to have
• 50:15
  interesting conversations with people and just record it that's how
• 50:18
  it started and the podcast started because i was actually
• 50:22
  away with some friends in spain on like
• 50:25
  cycling and that we were away when
• 50:29
  the first lockdown started we were in spain wow we
• 50:33
  were away in calpe we were staying in
• 50:37
  like a little apartment there was what there's
• 50:40
  five of us and we were
• 50:43
  just like sitting in this apartment being and the siren
• 50:47
  started going out and it was like you had to stay indoors it was
• 50:50
  literally the first lockdown in europe wow
• 50:53
  so we couldn't go anywhere and we were all trying to get
• 50:56
  what they called them repatriation flights which was
• 50:58
  basically to get home yeah and it was it was really scary
• 51:02
  behind you know you look back on it and you're like well that
• 51:04
  was that was a pretty scary time and so we couldn't we weren't allowed to go
• 51:08
  out and ride anymore because no one really knew what was going on and we weren't
• 51:11
  allowed to like leave the apartment unless we were getting some food and stuff
• 51:15
  like that right so i just said to one of my mates it's like should we just record
• 51:19
  a podcast and just start recording like record a couple of episodes like why not,
• 51:24
  and so we did we just started chatting absolute rubbish and that's how it started and.
• 51:29
  And I haven't recorded for quite a while. And that's not unintentionally.
• 51:35
  It's more because I've been focusing more on doing more YouTube stuff.
• 51:39
  And it's impossible to do everything.
• 51:42
  Something has to give right. But I think in some way, shape or form,
• 51:47
  a podcast will end up coming back later this year.
• 51:50
  I don't know if it will necessarily be the Zero Lemon one, but I had a very
• 51:54
  good chat with a very good friend of mine last week. and we were talking about
• 51:57
  bringing back a podcast of some form, which would be nice because he's got an
• 52:01
  actual place where we can record it, which would be quite cool, I think.
• 52:06
  But then the other side of 011 was always about just designing things that I thought were cool.
• 52:12
  And then if people wanted to buy them and support it, great. That's amazing.
• 52:17
  It's never been about making any money. It's never made any money.
• 52:22
  In fact, it actually is lost money every single year.
• 52:25
  But it's been a way of me doing some fun
• 52:28
  and things I like like I've done quite a
• 52:31
  few jersey designs now and I've done quite a couple of jersey
• 52:34
  designs for other people where they've been commissioned which is quite cool and
• 52:38
  I did a couple of different paint schemes on a few bikes which we then ruffled
• 52:42
  those bikes off for charity to raise some money for Movember and for Pace they
• 52:47
  were cool and it just sits there as a thing in the background I don't really
• 52:52
  know what it is I don't want to know what it is.
• 52:55
  It's just an excuse to do things and a way that I can slap stickers on signs at the top of hills.
• 53:03
  So it doesn't, yeah, Zero Lemon doesn't really,
• 53:06
  it's never been a thing where I want this to be my, like a big thing because
• 53:11
  it isn't and it doesn't want to be and it doesn't need to be and I don't want
• 53:15
  it to be a massive thing that becomes like hugely, I don't know,
• 53:20
  turning over a profit or anything like that. I just want it to be fun.
• 53:23
  So all the stuff I've done has just been like fun little things.
• 53:26
  Like I try and do at least one jersey a year and try and do a few other little.
• 53:30
  Bits and bobs here and there.
• 53:31
  Then the prince the prince started originally a
• 53:34
  company i used to work for that sadly doesn't exist
• 53:37
  anymore where i started just designing these prints based on
• 53:40
  routes and elevations and stuff and then when that company closed down
• 53:44
  the guy that started it was like well you can keep
• 53:47
  this your designs you can keep doing them it's not a problem with me which
• 53:50
  is really kind of him to let me do and then
• 53:53
  what i like about doing the prince is i a lot there's
• 53:56
  a lot of like ones that i've sort of done a pre-done that
• 53:59
  people can purchase of like Sacralabra or you
• 54:02
  know certain rides and routes and have them as stock effectively but
• 54:06
  the bit I really enjoy is when people order a
• 54:09
  custom one and you get told the story behind why they're doing it
• 54:12
  that's the bit that's really nice and then being able to create something
• 54:16
  that becomes a memory for them to remember
• 54:19
  something is really rewarding same thing yeah not
• 54:22
  a monetary thing really it's something that gives me
• 54:25
  pleasure and happiness because i know it gives someone else pleasure
• 54:28
  and happiness and i get to see and hear the story about
• 54:31
  that route and that ride and you know there's people
• 54:34
  like there's a woman who's bought i think
• 54:37
  five now for i i think
• 54:40
  her partner or son i'm not totally sure and
• 54:43
  i've not asked because it's not my it's none of my business yeah
• 54:46
  she's buying them for a male friend
• 54:50
  a partner family son i'm not sure and every
• 54:53
  now and then she sends me a photo of them all like she bought one
• 54:56
  recently for him and sent me a photo of.
• 54:59
  I think there's five of them all on a wall all custom
• 55:02
  print all done for different things that he's done and that's really seeing.
• 55:07
  Things like that is really nice you know yeah you're a part of something big
• 55:11
  for someone yeah exactly you helped build that that's really hard to be able
• 55:17
  to to create those things to for people to,
• 55:21
  have those memories and then like the jerseys
• 55:24
  like in all honesty a lot of the designs have come from where i've just
• 55:26
  been like mucking around with things in my head and ideas in my head and be
• 55:29
  like oh that looked quite cool in a jersey and you know i've had this like when
• 55:34
  i worked in architecture i had an obsession with like marble and stones and
• 55:38
  finishes i loved finishes i'm obsessed with finishes still like proper like finish snob like i like.
• 55:47
  And uh the i i guess like a lot of the jerseys have this like element which
• 55:52
  was taken from marble and marbling,
• 55:56
  i like that they look good yeah thank you i'm
• 55:59
  really the latest the last two i'm very very
• 56:01
  proud of the they and
• 56:05
  like i don't i i get a
• 56:08
  couple as like samples get photos of them
• 56:11
  and then they're just done as a pre-order because i
• 56:15
  don't want to be sitting on loads of stock and i can't
• 56:18
  afford to sit on loads of stock but if it doesn't the amount
• 56:21
  that sell or the amount that sell and that's it and that's great that's
• 56:24
  that's cool but the bit that's really nice is when
• 56:27
  you see someone riding in it that you i might
• 56:30
  not necessarily know and that's happened a few times really that's
• 56:33
  cool that's really cool and it's happened
• 56:36
  a few times and then i'm like yeah that's that's that's
• 56:39
  freaking sick that is like someone riding along
• 56:42
  in your in a jersey design it just feels cool yeah
• 56:46
  yeah it must be so cool to see your design out in the world live it's not i
• 56:53
  like seeing it when it's not on me if that makes exactly yeah yeah it looks
• 56:58
  like on me on all of them i like seeing it on someone else to be i think as
• 57:03
  well like i've always had this.
• 57:05
  Interest in how these kind of patterns come
• 57:09
  across on the shape of a person as well
• 57:12
  because it's very everyone's such different shape sizes
• 57:15
  and everything like that so it's really interesting to see
• 57:18
  yeah like zero lemon was never it never
• 57:21
  has been serious and i mean actually i'll say one point it was a little bit
• 57:25
  serious because i was being commissioned for a few quite a few different projects
• 57:28
  and i kind of stepped away from that because i was like actually this is getting
• 57:31
  a bit too serious for my liking you know i did a helmet design i did some like
• 57:35
  installations for like a film production company and stuff like that.
• 57:41
  But it was all a bit it sort of felt a little bit too serious
• 57:44
  that it meant that it could be something i don't
• 57:47
  like anymore so i removed myself from that
• 57:50
  and just went back to allowing it to be fun yeah
• 57:53
  i see i see how that can can get
• 57:56
  you know if it starts to have that pressure or feeling too much like
• 57:59
  a job and then it takes away the creative the
• 58:02
  fun the lightness of it it's not worth it totally
• 58:05
  totally you know i'm in the lucky position that you know a good thing about
• 58:11
  not living in london is it's a lot cheaper to live out of london and living
• 58:17
  in the peak district is a huge amount cheaper than living in london i lived
• 58:22
  in london for 12 years and i've lived in the peaks now for.
• 58:25
  Four years maybe five i can't remember and
• 58:29
  so i don't need a lot of money to
• 58:32
  be able to fund a lifestyle which is
• 58:36
  very rewarding in the
• 58:40
  sense of experience experiences and being able
• 58:43
  to do things i don't you know the as long
• 58:46
  as i can you know make sure the bills are paid and the
• 58:48
  dog can eat his food that that's great it's all it's all good and uh so i don't
• 58:54
  need exactly that point i don't need zero lemon to be a serious thing like it's
• 58:59
  if any doesn't make any money but if it ever got to a point where it made a
• 59:04
  lot of money and it becomes too serious,
• 59:06
  I just close it down because it never should be, it shouldn't be it should be fun.
• 59:11
  And I think that's as I've got older that's the thing that has kind of like
• 59:15
  changed in my mind is about like,
• 59:19
  actually as i said about that quote is experiences are the thing that the most
• 59:24
  valuable thing you take them with you at the end of the day you don't take money
• 59:28
  with you at the end of the day.
• 59:30
  Goes to the tax man yeah that's what i'm working towards
• 59:33
  too hopefully i'll be in that place soon yeah
• 59:36
  little by little baby steps and it will start
• 59:39
  to click that's all it is and what's next
• 59:42
  for you any big adventures yeah what
• 59:48
  is next the next i think the next thing that i
• 59:51
  will be at is stone circle which is gravel event down
• 59:53
  in salisbury in the uk it's a
• 59:57
  absolutely fantastic event i
• 59:59
  did it last year and the organizers are some of the nicest people in
• 1:00:03
  the world so i am more than happy to shout
• 1:00:05
  about them as good people so that'll be that'll be
• 1:00:08
  fun that's like a weekend of events and fun
• 1:00:11
  and going to be doing i'm signed up for
• 1:00:14
  the longest route but i don't know if i will do the longest route and
• 1:00:17
  that's also fine it doesn't matter i see how i
• 1:00:20
  feel in the day basically but that's the next big
• 1:00:23
  day out i would say and then
• 1:00:26
  i'm currently working on a plan.
• 1:00:29
  For a very big charity project which would probably start
• 1:00:32
  next month and i haven't announced it
• 1:00:36
  intentionally because i'll announce it at the start of
• 1:00:38
  july but i'm just trying to finalize
• 1:00:42
  everything until it's until i'm kind of like
• 1:00:45
  good to go of it effectively which is always the case with these kind of things
• 1:00:48
  like yes it will be a fundraiser for november and it will probably take me about
• 1:00:53
  28 days so that that's the scale of it effectively but it's the idea is to i'm
• 1:00:59
  just trying to make sure that everything's in place properly before i properly announce it and.
• 1:01:04
  And I want people to come and be part of it, effectively.
• 1:01:09
  And then after that, back at Badlands again for a fifth year, which is all...
• 1:01:16
  Honor to be able to say that it is my favorite
• 1:01:19
  event it's so beautiful i
• 1:01:22
  did the rally and yeah it's one
• 1:01:25
  of the most breathtaking places i've been
• 1:01:28
  to it's just it's so beautifully brutal.
• 1:01:32
  Is how that's true it's very challenging very
• 1:01:35
  very challenging route plus the heat and.
• 1:01:38
  Finding food and water i just.
• 1:01:42
  For me it is so much.
• 1:01:45
  More than the event the organizer the organizers
• 1:01:48
  and david i always i kind of talk about
• 1:01:51
  david quite a lot as the main organizer of it i would say but he
• 1:01:54
  is a very good person doing very
• 1:01:57
  good things you know he works in i don't
• 1:02:01
  want to like get his job incorrect but it is to do
• 1:02:03
  with like environmental climate stuff and
• 1:02:08
  he you know that event people quite
• 1:02:11
  often only see the the race side of it right but first
• 1:02:15
  thing I think the best stories come from the people at the
• 1:02:17
  middle and the back of that event you know the people that are racing it
• 1:02:20
  is incredible how fast they can go but actually I find
• 1:02:24
  it quite unrelatable and I don't maybe five
• 1:02:27
  six years ago I related more to that person that was racing it
• 1:02:30
  and now I probably relate more to people that are doing it for
• 1:02:32
  the experience because i think the experience is
• 1:02:35
  so valuable in that event but they
• 1:02:39
  that the team behind that they do so much
• 1:02:42
  more than just put on the race they do a lot
• 1:02:44
  of work of community outreaching like the
• 1:02:48
  commute women's rallies there's the the supporting
• 1:02:51
  the small towns and villages that are on the route that do actually
• 1:02:54
  are to be honest dying out because young people move to the coast where there's
• 1:03:00
  more work opportunities or to the bigger cities where there's more work opportunities
• 1:03:03
  and they do a lot helping to keep those towns and villages continuing and surviving
• 1:03:08
  and living and growing and those towns and villages do much so much for the event.
• 1:03:13
  And I've seen that having done it over, you know, the last several years now.
• 1:03:18
  Like I've seen it from the first time where you go into these small towns and like, what the heck?
• 1:03:22
  Why is there so many weird people covered in muddling around to now where they've
• 1:03:27
  got like banners and signs outside, bad lanners, you know, food available, drink available.
• 1:03:35
  It's grown so much. And you're seeing how that's helping the economy in these
• 1:03:41
  smaller towns and villages,
• 1:03:42
  which to be frank in Spain need it they need
• 1:03:45
  that support yeah and then this
• 1:03:48
  is the first year that it will finish in Granada
• 1:03:51
  starts in Granada this will be the first year that it finishes in Granada and
• 1:03:54
  that really excites me because the route
• 1:03:57
  there's a few constants that have been on the route over the years
• 1:04:00
  right but I talk to David quite regularly and
• 1:04:03
  he's like oh you know like last year they they didn't go
• 1:04:06
  into one of the cities and that was apparently the the
• 1:04:09
  mayor of the city was quite upset about it because
• 1:04:13
  he liked that it came there and he was like oh the
• 1:04:16
  reason why they didn't go there was because the climb out of it is pretty savage
• 1:04:20
  okay it's rough i actually quite like it but a lot of people didn't like it
• 1:04:24
  it's a rough gravelly climb quite long i like it because it's got beautiful
• 1:04:28
  switchbacks and the views are just incredible looking out to the coast but the
• 1:04:32
  mayor was like we'll resurface it we'll completely redo it and David's like,
• 1:04:36
  he's like, it's not about redoing it.
• 1:04:39
  About, it doesn't need to be tarmac, but like if it was less rough,
• 1:04:43
  it would be more, a better memory for people. So I believe that might have been done now.
• 1:04:49
  Wow. Is that what, by Cabo de Gata? No, so out of Almeria.
• 1:04:54
  Okay, okay. Yeah, so the Cabo de Gata section, I believe, is still in it, as it is.
• 1:04:59
  But they pulled out Almeria last year and missed it and went straight up north.
• 1:05:06
  So they kind of went further east, did Cabo de Gata, and then went further north up towards Tabanas.
• 1:05:13
  Okay. okay so but it's
• 1:05:16
  nice now that it's a loop because i always have a hard time like
• 1:05:20
  when it's a to be the logistics of you
• 1:05:23
  getting your stuff in your bike bag if you
• 1:05:26
  have one or finding another carbon box just
• 1:05:29
  yeah loop is always i i
• 1:05:32
  prefer a loop i do and i also prefer
• 1:05:35
  events where someone's gone down who's designed the
• 1:05:38
  route i don't as opposed to creating your own route
• 1:05:41
  because someone has design that route to tell you
• 1:05:44
  to tell a story for you show you
• 1:05:47
  something and that's that to
• 1:05:50
  me like if you create these events where you create your
• 1:05:53
  own route right and you just have to visit checkpoints fine but
• 1:05:56
  like the chances that you are going to come across
• 1:05:59
  something that is not great or not an ideal
• 1:06:03
  situation to be in or whatever it is a pretty high right.
• 1:06:06
  I think it's much nicer that if
• 1:06:09
  someone if you do one where the route has been created to be able
• 1:06:11
  to experience into that journey that the organizer has wanted you
• 1:06:14
  to experience is so good yeah also i
• 1:06:17
  what i love is passing other cyclists same
• 1:06:20
  it's really nice to be on the same route you know there are
• 1:06:23
  people behind you there's for me there's like a safety
• 1:06:27
  feeling okay there's still people behind me i can
• 1:06:29
  keep going you know if it's night time or
• 1:06:32
  something and and also just nice you
• 1:06:35
  know like oh i see bikes i'm gonna stop here there's people
• 1:06:38
  in this cafe yeah it makes things
• 1:06:41
  feel there's an element of it feeling a bit safer more
• 1:06:45
  of a community you always end up finding someone you end
• 1:06:48
  up riding with for a little bit right yeah that helps
• 1:06:51
  a lot and i think if i was to be doing an
• 1:06:54
  ultra for the first time i would be doing an event where the
• 1:06:57
  route is set definitely and i i
• 1:07:00
  you know i i think badlands may be
• 1:07:03
  to be fair it's not a bad first
• 1:07:07
  ultra event it's not it's not bad because there's
• 1:07:10
  enough points where you're coming across resupply and you're because the first
• 1:07:15
  ultra i did was silk road mountain race right so in comparison badlands is quite
• 1:07:19
  a good first ultra to do in my opinion yeah that was a choice but i think if
• 1:07:26
  you were to do something like Badlands as a first event,
• 1:07:29
  it is tough, of course it is, but it's totally doable in the time limit that they offer.
• 1:07:34
  That's true. That's true. Yeah. I think it's about 100 kilometers,
• 1:07:39
  just over 100k a day to finish in the time cut. Yeah.
• 1:07:43
  If you're training to do something like that, I think would be well within your ability. Yeah.
• 1:07:48
  But then like I always look at things like the Grand Guanches.
• 1:07:51
  I think they're fantastic events for people who want to start to look at doing
• 1:07:55
  these longer bikepacking things.
• 1:07:58
  Because it's not really a race. It's basically a race to get a ferry.
• 1:08:01
  Yeah, don't miss the ferry. Yeah, you ride an island, get a ferry,
• 1:08:05
  ride an island, get a ferry.
• 1:08:06
  And my only downside to them is they do become quite expensive because of the cost of the ferries.
• 1:08:13
  But they are they're really nice
• 1:08:16
  in the sense that you you know you ride the island you get
• 1:08:19
  to the ferry port you end up sitting and chatting with loads of other people waiting
• 1:08:22
  for the ferry you'll get on you'll sit on the ferry
• 1:08:25
  you then ride the next island and some people stop to sleep
• 1:08:27
  some people carry on like i've done all of
• 1:08:30
  the different grand grandches road gravel and mountain bike and i
• 1:08:33
  will probably keep doing all of them because they're so good to do in the winter
• 1:08:38
  months when the weather in the uk is not ideal yeah i haven't done that one
• 1:08:43
  i really would like to do the gravel one for an experience obviously but yeah
• 1:08:48
  you're right those ferries are expensive,
• 1:08:51
  yeah they add up they add up the the gravel one my biggest recommendation for
• 1:08:58
  the gravel one is to have some form of suspension on your bike if you can really
• 1:09:03
  so maybe i'll do the road one.
• 1:09:05
  The road one is absolutely glorious
• 1:09:08
  it's stunning the road one's in january so
• 1:09:11
  i'm gonna i'm definitely gonna do that one again in order of
• 1:09:14
  how hard they are the road in my opinion having done all three of them the road
• 1:09:19
  is the easiest the mountain bike one's the hardest gravel one's kind of in the
• 1:09:23
  middle the reason why i say some form of suspension would be good for the gravel
• 1:09:27
  one is because quite a bit of the surfaces are kind of washboardy so you're just going.
• 1:09:33
  And it just takes your toll doesn't it yeah it does just something like a redshift
• 1:09:38
  stem or something that would help just take a bit of it out but the road one is stunning and,
• 1:09:44
  mountain bike one is pretty damn savage but
• 1:09:47
  the places that route that one
• 1:09:50
  takes you on route pretty spectacular i did
• 1:09:54
  it the mountain bike one is like end of november okay start
• 1:09:58
  of december and i did it last year and afterwards
• 1:10:01
  i was up for i don't know if i do that again and now i'm like actually do
• 1:10:04
  you know what i probably would because time of
• 1:10:07
  year wise what else am i going to be doing
• 1:10:10
  around that time of the year in the uk i'm probably gonna end up
• 1:10:12
  right spending a week the majority of a week riding on a turbo
• 1:10:15
  trainer because the weather's very good yeah
• 1:10:19
  can go and do an event like that which is definitely challenging but also quite
• 1:10:27
  fun quite fun to do like i'm i'm not a great i'm not an amazing mountain biker
• 1:10:32
  at all like some of the stuff was way too technical for me, but I learned a lot.
• 1:10:37
  My skills got better and I really enjoyed the moments that I ended up riding
• 1:10:42
  with other people and the conversations I had with people that I met on the route.
• 1:10:45
  I met a guy who did the whole thing single speed. Yeah.
• 1:10:50
  What? My draw is dropping if you can't see me.
• 1:10:53
  Like, that's insane. Yeah, I know. I mean, it's amazing.
• 1:10:58
  Like there's, and you know, we chat probably every week now.
• 1:11:02
  So like, there's a lot. Like he was running a hardtail, single speed hardtail
• 1:11:06
  and absolutely crushing it.
• 1:11:09
  And then, I mean, he did really start to struggle after about,
• 1:11:12
  I think Tenerife was where he was.
• 1:11:15
  That's the heelist one, right?
• 1:11:17
  Grand Canary and Tenerife, he struggled.
• 1:11:20
  But he freaking did it, and it was awesome. So, like, to me,
• 1:11:25
  like, they're great events at the, you know, in the colder months in the,
• 1:11:30
  you know, northwestern Europe, I would say, so the UK or northern,
• 1:11:34
  you know, northern Europe, should we say, where you're guaranteed to have pretty good weather.
• 1:11:39
  And they do, the mountain bike one is November, December, the road one is January,
• 1:11:43
  and the gravel one is March, I think.
• 1:11:47
  I think so, yeah. Oh, I guess he's woken up. He's a plumber.
• 1:11:52
  What's his name? Marshall. Marshall. That's a great name.
• 1:11:57
  Come here. See a little coming. Let's see Marshall. Come on,
• 1:12:00
  Marshall. You want to be on the podcast?
• 1:12:04
  Oh, God, you're so heavy.
• 1:12:07
  Oh, look at him. So cute. Yeah, he does look like a pointer.
• 1:12:13
  Yeah. Find his other leg. There we go. Hi, Marshall.
• 1:12:17
  How do you feel about your Frisbee session this morning?
• 1:12:22
  So cute. He heard the word Frisbee then and was like, what? Oh,
• 1:12:26
  what? Did you say Frisbee? Yeah, he said Frisbee.
• 1:12:30
  This is...
• 1:12:35
  Now he's talking. Go on.
• 1:12:40
  Welcome to the life of a dog that thinks he's a bigger...
• 1:12:45
  And scarier than he actually is. I have one of those at home. Yeah.
• 1:12:51
  Chris, it's been so great to get to know you a little bit more.
• 1:12:54
  I'm so happy you came on the podcast.
• 1:12:57
  I actually thought we're going to talk more about bike rides and Zero Lemon.
• 1:13:02
  And this conversation really surprised me in a very good way.
• 1:13:05
  Good. You opening up and being so honest.
• 1:13:08
  I'm very happy and honored that you share, you know, so honestly.
• 1:13:15
  With me here on the podcast i'm sure it's going to touch many people.
• 1:13:18
  Thank you very much for inviting me.
• 1:13:21
  It is life is.
• 1:13:24
  More about life is more than riding bicycles right
• 1:13:27
  it's just that happens to be quite literally
• 1:13:31
  the vehicle that allows us to do so much that we get
• 1:13:34
  to do and to see what we get to see but life is bigger than that and
• 1:13:37
  i think sometimes it's important to remember that
• 1:13:40
  there's more out there than just riding your bike like
• 1:13:43
  it's 100% one of
• 1:13:45
  the most important things in my life that's allowed me to to understand
• 1:13:51
  my own mental health much better and to support myself
• 1:13:54
  much better but it's also the
• 1:13:57
  vehicle that allows me to to journey to
• 1:13:59
  explore to see the world and ultimately it's probably
• 1:14:02
  allowed me to be way more open about things
• 1:14:06
  as well bikes are great
• 1:14:08
  but they're not everything right miss walks
• 1:14:11
  i think people need to remember they're not everything it's a
• 1:14:14
  good message yeah yeah it's part of it but
• 1:14:17
  not the main character yeah it's
• 1:14:21
  it's like um trying to think of a great film example like
• 1:14:24
  if you watched iron man i love iron man
• 1:14:27
  so really it's now a classic which is robert dowry jr right
• 1:14:30
  and and you know the relationship that he has
• 1:14:33
  with peter parker spider-man the bike
• 1:14:36
  is peter parker spider-man great
• 1:14:39
  character lovely lovely person but not
• 1:14:42
  the main character should be part of it and yes i am a marvel geek and i'm absolutely
• 1:14:48
  fine about that well chris thank you so much and i can't wait to see what are.
• 1:14:53
  You doing next the big plan for movember and i'll be on the chat and maybe we and chat again.
• 1:15:00
  Yeah, sounds good. Thank you so much for having me. Thanks.
• 1:15:05
  And that's all for today's episode. I want to thank the listeners for tuning in.
• 1:15:10
  Your support means everything. If you enjoyed this episode, please consider
• 1:15:14
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